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A91787 An ansvver to the London ministers letter: from them to his Excellency & his Counsel of VVar; as also an answer to John Geree's book, entituled, Might overcomming right; with an answer to a book, entituled, The Armies remembrancer. Wherein it appears the accusations of the Army are unjust, and the Armies proceedings justified by the Word of God, and by the light of nature and reason. Also a discovery of that learning, and ordination these ministers have, and the vanity and insufficiencie thereof, by the Word of God, and that those are the things with which they delude and deceive the people. / By Samuel Richardson. Richardson, Samuel, fl. 1643-1658. 1649 (1649) Wing R1402; Thomason E540_8; ESTC R203398 36,328 40

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because God doth in expresse words commend it and reward it v. 11. 12. 13. you use to say it is an extraordinary cause but the Scripture saith not so therefore it s but an extraordinary put off so shift your hands of it tell us how we shall know when we have such an extraordinary cause that we may do so in that cause the Lord doth not say he did well because he was a Magistrate and had jurisdiction and cloathed with authority but he was zealous for his God ought not the Army as well as others to be zealous for God But if after that act of Phineas so such act could be lawfull why is this act of his Recommended to all Generations for evermore Psal. 106. 30. 31. God had appointed such parsons as he slew to death the Magistrate did not do Justice therefore God sent the Plague among the people he knew none else would do it all ealse refusing it fell to be his duty and he did it and the plague ceased and it is recorded for after generations for a righteous act this is the Armies cause and though you condemn it we passe not so long as Gods word warrants it and shall be a righteous act to all Generations for evermore wisdom is justified of her Children I am no Magistrate it belongs not to me to passe sentence upon any man much lesse to put him to death but suppose I be set upon in my journey so as I see not how I can scape with my life but I must kill or be killed now the cause is altered I may murther him as you call it and the Law saith it s no murther I had sinned if I had not done it for that Law that requires me to preserve my Neighbours life bids me preserve my own first charity is to begin at home though not to end there upon this ground if the cause were the same there be them that would put no difference between a Priest and another man 7 If God discover his Will to men and give them hearts and opportunities wisedome and power to doe it it s there calling and commission to doe it I know no calling that I have to take care and provide provision and cloaths for another mans wife Besides it is not of good report but rather a scandall to doe it but suppose her Husband cannot or will not nor any else provide them for her and she cannot help her selfe now the cause is altered I must be mercifull and if I be able to help to provide those things for her and if I suffer her to perish will it not be my sinne also This is the cause of the Kingdome the King should have help't c. but did not then it became the duty of the Parliament to have releeved the Kingdome but they did not her necessities great and many Petitions concerning th●● were sleighted and burnt waited many yeares for help our oppressions not removed all complaine dangers increase no remedy appeares they not help us nor tell us how long it will be before this Parliament will be at an end that we may have another to see if they will help us when all failes no ground of hope of life is left danger eminent and no other meanes of help left this is a cause of necessity Now it 's the duty of the Army to help and if they had not it had been their sinne if not their overthrow if they had suffered it to perish the Kingdome had been well holpen up with a remedy in extremity If the Army had been as the Priest and Levit that allowed no help to the man this the wounded and dying Kingdom I would if I could have done it my selfe alone and not aske no leave God requires me to doe all the good I can to my selfe and others if I can doe good without man I will not ask his leave I need not suppose I see one a robbing of another or hath taken his Cloake c. from him I will require him to give it him againe if he will not if I can I will take it by force and give it the owner If he or any say You are out of your Calling what and who gave you commission to meddle with me So long as I doe that which is just I passe not for such words it is my duty as a man and as a Christian to releeve the oppressed and doe what good I can if I were able I would quickly remove all the oppressions in this Kingdom and the next and if I could the next to that and I should sinne if I did not doe it Who gave Cromwell Commission to doe so much good as he did in Scotland I doubt that the old Cavise and the new ones the Priests are unsatisfied scrupeled and very much doubt of his call into Scotland c. 8 The Army had a cleare call to doe what they did according to the London Ministers Principle as appeares clearly from their owne confession they say A necessity of a Letter must be framed to the Generall c. but observe upon what grounds they make it appeare they have a call from God to doe so We apprehend our selves obliged thus to appear for the maintenance of and setling the Government of the Kingdom to testifie our utter dislike and detestation it is most apparent to us your way and practice is unlawfull and irrigular in zeale for Gods glory we have discharged our duty This is in their Judgements and Conscience a cleare call so that if the Army can say the same things they have the same call they have I should be heartily sorry if they had no better call then the Ministers whose Conscience I appeale to whether if they had power in their hands to reforme all things that in their Consciences are amisse whether they doe not judge that they ought to doe it and should sinne if they did not doe it though they are no Magistrates if they say ye then they justifie the Army for they doe but according as they are perswaded by God in his Word and their owne Conscience if they say no if I did beleeve them I am perswaded their judgements would change the very first day that the power comes in their hands 9 The Army had an expresse command of God to warrant their not disbanding and ceazing on the Members and the sixth Command injoynes that they should doe no murder this generall command comprehends all the particulars under it by way of precept are injoyned I must doe no murder therefore 〈◊〉 must use all the meanes of the preservation of my life and my Neighbours but the ceazing on these Members is a meanes of preventing this evill I see disbanding and permission of these Members is inconsistent to the safety of our lives and others by the Law of Nature every one is to use all lawfull meanes to preserve himselfe and others the blame must rest on them that caused it that is these Parliament Men
it also the people are not made for the Magistrates but the Magistrates for the people therefore they must give place or be forced to do so when it is for the Kingdomes good the Parliaments priviledges are the peoples therefore they did them no wrong when they took them from them and so reserved them for the people as if all that I have is not my own but others when they take it from me they take but their own I know your judgement is contrary to mine but mine is as infallible as yours if you can prove the contrary I will give you leave to judge in the mean time if you will judge what you please I will take the same liberty the Parliaments power which they acknowledged lawfully set over them then their expressions and practises declare they are not enemies to authority If at any time a Precept of God must be suspended with upon a necessity yet we suppose that you will grant that this necessity must be absolute present cleare not doubtfull and conjecturall We grant it and they declare it was cleare to them and their Party though it be not so to you whose eyes the god of this World hath blinded so that you cannot see The Members seized on were not mad nor out of their wits but sober then the greater was their fact and the more necessity there was to seize on them for if they doe so when sober we cannot expect no better but much worse when they are mad We appeale to your conscience if you would not have condemned others if done as you have done if upon the same Grounds and Reasons I doe not beleeve we ought to condemne them it appeares to us they have done well I desire to know if the cause did appeare so to you to be of so great necessity and you were able in the same way to help your selves others whether would you not act according to your understandings consciences If no then you in effect say that if you felinto a ditch there would you lye and not get out If you would use the best way for your self and others safety we doe no more They say The Army are despisers and destroyers of Authoritie injurious and usurpers of it we are as fully perswaded that they are lovers and affectors of it securers and Saviours of an authority from being uselesse in good from being lost You say We are bound by oath to preserve with our lives estates the Priviledges of Parliament and Covenant were you of this minde when you Petitioned the Parliament you might be free in Person and Purse from any part of the charge of this Warre When I heard of that Petition at the beginning of this Parliament I thought it was either covetousnesse or hypocrisie to be freed both in Person and Purse and yet so vehemently presse others to both I desire those in Authority to consider that you may according to your abilitie beare the burthen with the rest Geree asketh If the High Sheriffe because he hath power to rescue one whom he in his conscience knowes is unjustly sentenced to death by the Judge c. I ask him If the people did well or ill in rescuing Jonathan that he dyed not 1 Sam. 14. 45. If a mans life is indangered in a legall way though unjustly he nor others may not rescue him the command of Authority if legall are obligatory to doe or if unjust patient to suffer What for not obeying unlawfull commands God hath given them no such power for they are for the praise of them that doe well therefore it s not Gods will that we should be destroyed for doing well If ye doe well who will harme you 1 Pet. 3. 18. Therefore they have no authority from God to doe it You must submit and suffer not resist as servant duty is 1 Pet. 2. 18 19. So in higher powers we may not resist 1 Pet. 4. 15. if God hath given him no such power if I resist I resist not the ordinance of God nor the power of God If I can avoyd it doe not I increase his sin and am guilty of my owne death If I must suffer and not resist if the Magistrate will take away my life unjustly it s not lawfull for me to make an escape from the present danger if not nor may a servant doe so I according to your opinion must be so New Lights tell us That we need not suffer but when me are evill doers We say He need not if he can help it if he cannot there is necessity for it This was not the Doctrin of the Primitive Churches that you affirme was not the Doctrine of Christ That we are to suffer for for well doing when we may lawfully prevent it Did not Paul use meanes to escape when he was let downe from the window in a basket So the Church met privately because of the Jewes the Saints suffered and they could not help it If a servant in strength can preserve himselfe he runs himselfe into a greater inconvenience by reason of the Magistrates power which he cannot prevent the Christians when but a few were helplesse and so suffered the Waldenses were so persecuted by the Popes power that they fled into the Mountaines where on hundred dyed in a night with hunger and cold and much suffering they had they after gathered themselves together with Bowes and Arrowes and fled and took the vantage of a narrow passage the Popes Army was twenty thousand they were divided in two or three Companies in their pride but the Christians was glad they were not all in a Body At the narrow passage they shot and slew so many of their enemies as they were put to flight In their slight on the Mountaine of Piedimont God sent a thick Mist that they could not see before them so that they fell from the edge of the Mountaine and brake their necks and dyed Horse and Rider Here God appeared from heaven and incouraged them and gave them the victory and at severall times the Popes Army had such ill success that one of the Polititians of the Popes side said that they lost ten to one of the Waldenses and that if the Pope did not cease Warring with them it would in danger the losse of the Popes Dominion so that the Pope was glad to make peace with them and each side consented to Articles See the History of the Waldenses and Abbigenses written by Luther So the Thabirites in Bohemia under Zi●ca John H●…se and Jeremy Pragus were bu●●● for Hereticks at the Councel of Constance they in defence of them and that they fell to warres John Zisca was their Captain he fought eleaven pitcht field Battel● and ever conquered they were good people and God was with them Connade Butherbridge in the word of Orphan●…s these mens practise God owns but you condemne Also suppose a Thief beset me to rob or kill am I not to escape from him if I can Shall I