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death_n	body_n	flesh_n	spirit_n	5,367	5	5.2461	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A65868	The he-goats horn broken, or, Innocency elevated against insolency & impudent falshood in answer to two books against the people of God called Quakers : the one intituled, A fuller discovery, which is stuffed with such a multitude of lyes, slanders, and perverting the truth, as the like hath not been extant : the authors of which are John Horn, Thomas Moore Senior, and Thomas Moore Junior : and the other book is falsely called truth's triumph by John Horn : which are answered for the information of the people, and the clearing of the servants of God, and the way of truth to the simple hearted from the lyes, delusions and fallacies that have proceeded from the spirit of Antichrist and blasphemy, in these men aforesaid, who profess themselves ministers of Christ but are proved ministers of Satan and unrighteousness / by a witness of Christ and his work against all the works of darkness, G.W.	Whitehead, George, 1636?-1723.	1660 (1660)	Wing W1933; ESTC R38606	53,172	64

again ascended are no local places but some Conditions or Conceits in men 5. That neither the Souls nor Bodies of the Wicked shall rise again to Judgment This with several other Lies J. Horne and Thomas Moor charge us called Quakers with maintaining or asserting insome Queries I sent to them when as I only queried them to try their belief in these things without asserting them so what unreasonable men these are is easie to see who distinguish not between Questions and Assertions who proceed in their lies thus 6. That we agree with Himneus and Philetus that said the Resurrection is already past 7. That Christ came not to Redeem men from out of the natural bodily Death 8. That such Faith as that of the Elect mentioned Rom. 8. 33 34 35. is by our Doctrines to be rooted up 9. That by our Doctrine Christ is not the Author and procurer of all good to men both natural and spiritual 10. That we deny Justification by a Righteousness imputed to us 11. That to endeavour to detect and make manifest the delusions of any to preserve people from them is a being impatient under and raging against Gods Judgments which they falsely charge us called Quakers with maintaining And with maintaining 12. That these Teachers whose Hearers do sleight and neglect the Truth Preached by them and remain sloathful formal Covetous are false Prophets whenas the words were not so spoken by us but we spoke rather in particular against them and such as being false Prophets and Hypocrites who being neglecters of Christ and abusers of the Truth themselves as they have confessed they have not profited the People Again these abusers of the Truth viz. 13. J. Horne and T. Moor charge us falsely with plainly denying Judgment after the natural Death and with denying and jearing at Christ that Holy and Innocent man that was born of the Virgin Mary as having the form and body of a man 14. That we set up another thing in his stead viz. an imaginary seed within every man 15. That we plead for a Christ without any body of man distinct from others or out of them but a certain seed with an imaginary flesh and blood dying and bearing sin in every man having no other body but what is in some men dying yea in every man in its time 16. That our Christ hath been alwayes dying and rising in men from the beginning of the World and so will be to the end 17. That we make nothing of the coming again of Christ but scoffs at him that dyed 1600. years ago 18. That we account Christ's Death and Resurrection but a shaddow 19. That the seed which we speak of in men is but a conceited Spirit that is within them with a conceited flesh and blood in them too of which they say such an Idol was scarce ever in any Generation of men set up before Wherein J. Horne and these two Moors have both lyed shamefully and blasphemed for the seed which we spake of is Christ whom the Apostles Preached which the promise was to in them and this is not an Idol as they heve blasphemed nor his flesh and blood a conceited and an imagined thing but our meat and drink without the eating and drinking of which a man hath no life in him 20. Again J. H. and T. M. falsely accuse us with maintaining that our Christ in all the reality of his body with his flesh and blood is wholy within us sensibly bearing our sins though not willingly 21. That the coming of Christ to raise the dead bodies of all that sleep in Jesus c. and the Resurrection of the dead and Judgment afterdeath is by us altogether denyed 22. That whatsoever is said of the true Christ or of his Church in the Scripture we apply to a false Christ and to our selves 23. That we come in our own Name and Authority boasting of our selves and witnessing to and of our selves and obtruding things upon men not by and in the Light and evidence of the Spirit 24. That we say our sayings are better than the sayings of the holy Spirit in the Scriptures 25. That George Fox said in Bury at Goal of one Disbrough Brother-in-law to Joseph Hagger being a Tradesman in London that he was Priest and Hireling and took Tyths which with the rest is an odious lie and slander and denyed by George Fox as also are these viz. 26. That we count our selves Lords and disdain to have any over us and revile and likely would destroy if in our power at our pleasure 27. And that our principle leads to it 28. That I wilfully played the Jesuite or Sophister to delude the ignorant with seeming like tearms 29. That Christopher Wade clearly proved a whole dozen of notorious lies against George Fox 30. And that in my Answer I give the goe-by most egregiously and in none of them reproves C. Wade Which also are filthy lies against both G. F. and me as may be seen in my Book intituled Truth defending the Quakers so that these things here mentioned against us called Quakers which John Horn and T. Moor have accused us with which are inserted in their Epistle I return back upon them as wicked lies and slanders proceeding from the envious Spirit of the wicked one in them and yet they are but a few in comparison of many more which they have uttered against us which we are clear of and more of their lies and slanders in their Book are as followeth viz. 31. That some of us say we are Christ 32. That we cast mists and cloudes in our expressions 33. That we turne Scripture sayings into fables perverting the whole Scripture to a corrupt sense 34. That by dead in Christ we mean but the spiritually dead in some some fancyed death sleeping in him the Trumpet and shout and Resurrection all Allegorical 35. 36. That we are denyers of the Resurrection Preached by the Apostles And that all men may see us to be so 37. That we count the Preaching of the Cross foolishness and turn it into a Fable or Allegory 38. That we confess not Christ come in the flesh but make him a figure of a spiritual wickedness or mysterious deceit that works in them that perish 39. 40. That we turn the words of Truth into a lie Not only neglecting but wholly trampleing the true Christ under our feet 41. That we deny the God above In these slanders also with many others against us have they shewed themselves to be frequent and common lyers all which we return back upon them as things never owned by us which if they further assay to make them good we shall know further how to make our defence that our innocency may be clear from them as we are clear in the sight of God But in these they have but done by our words as they use to do by the Scriptures of Truth perverted them and raised lies from them which is the manner of their Preaching And

Answer to my Queries thou seemest ●o be Resolved to say something although it be absolute contrary to the Truth and to that which thou knowest to be Truth as will appear in what followes In Answer to my first thou sayst Christ in his Spirit Ascended up to Heaven when his Body was upon Earth is this an Answer to the Question is the minde or Spirit called the Son of man according to John 3. 13. which came down from Heaven and no man doth Ascend up to Heaven but the Son of man which was then in Heaven so by this thy Answer it appears then that the Spirit is the Son of man and that there is no other Son of man that Ascends into Heaven but the Spirit then what becomes of that Body thou speaks of if the Spirit onely be that Son of man In thy Answer to the 2. and 3d. Queries thou provest In thy way that Mary did that which was forbidden by Christ when she held him by the Feet and worshipped him but in Mat. 28. 9. there is no forbiding of her to touch him but this is plainly manifest that thou art in a snare and cannot tell how to get out and yet thou wilt be saying something though thereby thou more ensnare thy self but this Scripture thou wilt once know fulfilled the wicked shall be silent in darkness When thou shouldst Answer to the Fourth thou telst of its being a secret and of prying into things above what is written although the ground of my Query is grounded upon that which is written in Luke 24. 4. To the Fifth thou saist that the Women did distinguish which was Christ was certain but how they did so is a foolish curious Question what certainty is there that they did know when thou knowest not how but this is like the rest of the Priests Doctrine beating the Ayre and leaving all People in uncertainties and yet would be paid for so doing but the Lord hath made thee manifest with the rest that you cannot deceive much longer To the Sixth thou sayest the two Angels were seen visibly but were not bodies nor Persons of men but in thy Answer to the Fourth sayst that they both saw them as men and heard them speak and had two Individual Forms Now if thou were but simple and not wilfully blind thou mightst be the more excused In thy Answer to the Seventh thou art more lost and confused then in all the rest for when thou shouldst Answer who were the 11. Disciples that were met together mentioned Luke 24. 33. Thou saist that Thomas might occasionally be gone out Answ. If he was gone out then the 11. was not together as Luke 24. Again thou sayst that Matthew was chosen before the Evangelist wrote this Book what Darkness and Ignorance is this thou art not Questioned when the Book was written nor when Matthew was chosen but who was the Eleven that was together and whether was Matthew one of the Eleven seeing he was not then chosen when Christ did arise from the dead but there needs not much be said to thee onely to let thee see thy own folly least thou should say thou art wise To the Eight thou seemst to Affirm that the Scripture are to be taken as they speak and not otherwise a Mystery Answ. Then why dost thou and the Priests give meanings to the Scriptures and do not let People take them as they speak but makes them such a Mystery without your meanings and so plain with them but this is thy Practice and Doctrine to condemn thy self in the thing that thou allowest and builds again that which thou hast destroyed and so makes thy self a Transgressor Lastly in thy conclusion thou falsely chargest me that I do not believe that any of these things mentioned in these Scriptures to be really done which is not my Faith for I do believe that those things mentioned were really done and fulfilled as the Scripture speaks but it is no new thing with thee to accuse falsely and to make Lyes thy refuge but what in all those things thou hast done against me I do forgive thee and do warn thee for the time to come that thou go not on to commit the unpardonable Sin against God and his Spirit never to be forgiven Again in thy last Paper thou declarest thy Ignorance of the two Seeds and askest what be those two Seeds Answ. These two the Scripture speaks of the Seed of the Woman and the Seed of the Serpent 2. Who did or doth sow them Seeds Answ. God doth sow the one and the wicked one the oher 3. Where be they sown Answ. In man 4. When be they sown Answ. When man had a being and a body to receive them 5. What be the bodies they shall rise with Answ. Their own bodies according to their own natures the one pure and the other defiled 6. Whether be these two Seeds and two bodies in all the world or two Seeds in every man and the two bodies to or in every man Answ. The Seeds are but two in the whole world having each Seed its own body and in every o 〈…〉 e one be cast out 7. When shall those Seeds arise or be raised whether after the bodily death or after spiritual death Answ. Every one in Its own order after the death of that which is born of the Flesh and also after the death of the spirituall wickedness which is yet alive in all hirelings and Deceivers such as thou art where the Seed of God is yet in its grave 8. What are the graves these are in and out of which they shall arise These of which the Scripture speaks which when thou comest to understand it thou wilt understand both the Seeds and graves of which we speak Christ the Seed made his grave in the wicked and in the rich in his death and out of that grave shall rise with his Body into everlasting Life if thou canst receive it thou maist be satisfied And as to thy 9. Query Why I say that the one shall rise into everlasting Life and the other into Condemnation Answ. Because it is so therefore I say so and if thou say to the contrary make it manifest but in this as in other things thy folly and Ignorance is manifest to ask why I speak the Truth which thou thy self darest not to be Truth R. HUBBERTHORNE A POST-SCRIPT AND T. M. Sen. Thou hast taken a bad work in hand now in thy old age to joyn thy self and to appear so publickly with a lying Spirit as thou hast done But how wast thou liks to do better when thou hast denyed the Lord in thy turning into the way of the coveteous Tyth-taking-Parish-Priests whose deceit thou formerly hadst a sight of and in part wast made to witnes against them but that zeal and that simplicity which thou hadst then is turned into darkness and betrayed and thou become as sottish and as dark an Earth-worme as the Priests whom thou hast witnessed against And thou art become a respecter of persons and canst bow and cring under such as be great in the Earth as they do for their own ends and thou art by many taken notice of to be more sottish dead and dark since so much thou hast partaken of the Priests iniquity then ever thou wast and the same enemy and betrayer in thee and thy two Disciples viz. J. H. and thy Son leads you out to deceive others with your dreams and imaginations and to betray the simplicity and to murder the innocent in others for which you have a sad account to give and if thou returnest not to that principle which once brought thee in part to see the deceit of the Priests but continuest in thy deceit hypocrisie and accusing the innocent and so remainest in sottishness and hardness of heart thou will be cut off perish in thy iniquity in thy old age Alas What silly men are ye You are never like to gain to your selves any honour and credit among any that are honest hearted by your Books and aspersions against the poor Quakers so called for it is so common a thing for them to undergo revilings and aspersions even from the vilest of men as Drunkards Covetous Idolaters and the like that in what you have done you have not shewn your selves any whit more eminent or famous than such but have meerly rancked your selves in the Dragons Army with them in belying and slandering the iunocent THE END * Though we own that which brings them to Confesse their Lying and Faults and can forgive but we cannot own their Dissembling and feiguedness in it * which is as much as to say not Christ in them but Christ in men and that his riches is not the possession what folly is this * That which is humane is earthly as humanus homo are of hhmus the ground from whence man was taken so that a humane Soul is an earthly Soul what then hath Christ both an earthly Soul and a divine Soul in him J. H. T. M. I. H. T. M. J. H. T. M. J. H. T. M. T. M. J. H. P. 104. J. H. T. M. * But what is the beloved City and the Camp of the Saints which Gogg and Magogg do compass about when the 1000. Years are ended Revel. 20. 8 9. whether is it an outward City or not And where shall it be and whether any be yet come to that beloved City * This is another such a reason as I Horns saying that he is not a dumb dog for he could worry me c. J. H.

now to some of J. Horns and T. Moors Doctrines in their Epistle wherein they have belyed and grosly perverted the Truth with their false constructions and inferences as to our saying that the seed of God which is Christ wherever he is known in such a low measure as a seed that suffers and is burthened in man by corruption there he desires to be free from the burthen of sin and alwayes to do his Fathers will and this seed the Power reaches to where it is begotten and in the Power it arises in them that believe in the Light for their Redemption to which J. H. and T. M. Scornfully say of this seed Christ which we speak of that he hath not ceased from sin in them nor can do in all things his Fathers will but needs a Power to reach to him where he is begotten And that we represent him as one not able to do his Fathers will in some men To which I reply that Christ cannot in all things do his Fathers will is their own words and not ours neither does it follow from what we said for his desiring to do his Fathers will in that suffering state does no more argue that he is unable to do it than when he prayed to the Father not my will but thine be done who could do nothing without the Father as also the Heir as long as he is a Child differeth nothing from a Servant though he be Lord of all Gal. 4. 1. and Christ came into the World to do his Fathers will which is the sanctification of them that believe which he desired to do before it was done and as for the Power reaching the seed which so much these men have scoffed at and counted what we said of it confused stuff in page 63. They have shewed themselves ignorant of the seed of God which the promise is to and that they never knew the work of that Power which reaches that seed as also they are ignorant of the Scriptures for it is written Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive Power Riches Wisdome and Strength and Honour and Glory and Blessing Revel. 5. 12. so that they might as well have scoft at the Angels of God who spake these words as at us and have said that the Power that reaches to the seed is Christ and then Christ is worthy to receive Christ as also they have done in like manner in their scorn in page 63. wherein they have shewed their gross ignorance of the several manifestations of Christ the seed in his People who are of the seed of Abraham which Christ took upon him to redeem his own and to bring to his own Power and promise which he receives of the Father And our saying that this Seed which is Christ where he suffers and is burthened in man by corruption there he desires to be free from the burthen of sin does not argue as falsely as these men infer that it cannot be said of the Seed of God that in it is no sin for Christ hath suffered by mens sins and been pressed with them and born them Amos 2. 13. Ezek. 6. 9. and yet in him is no sin and if these men were not past feeling they might feel how the Spirit of the just in them they have often grieved burthened and afflicted by their own sins and yet in that Spirit there is no sin but in them who resist it J. Horn and Thomas Moor say their Christ by that his death once suffered and in his Resurrection in that his Body c. hath overcome Death and the Devil slain the enmity and taken out of the way all that was contrary to them redeemed them from the Curse of the Law I Answer Herein have they stollen the Saints words which they are out of the like of for if the enmity were taken out of the way Sin would not be their natural heritage as they have pleaded for it and they would not have uttered so many lies and falsehoods as they have done for one of which J. Horne hath craved forgivness and if all that 's contrary to them be taken out of their way then its evident that sin and the Nations pollutions are not contrary to them for they have confessed themselves too much to have a share in them and that they are abusers of the Truth And to that 1 John 4. 17. as he is so are we in this World J. H. and T. M. give their meaning and say as Christ is unknown despised hated persecuted in his Doctrine and judged by any of the World so are we Answ. In this have they apparently lyed for Christ was persecuted to Death of the World but so are not J. Horne not T. Moor neither are they unknown of the World as Christ was for Christ was never known to Preach in a Steeplehouse by an Hour-glass for Tyths or so much in the Year in Leiw of them like the Parish Priests and Deceivers who are out of the steps of the true Ministers who walked after Christs example not after the hireling Priests example who Preach for hire and gifts and reward as these men do And rather than J. Horne will freely suffer by the World as Christ did take heed that he fall not to the Common-prayer-book And to our calling J. Horne a Priest he sayes if we mean he is a Priest of the order of Aaron a Levitical Priest we say evidently false Answ. If he be not a Priest of the order of Aaron then he plainly appears to be a false Priest seeing that in Page 70. he hath pleaded for his taking Tyths as neither repugnant to Gods Law nor Mans as also his practises therein he instances that the Priests had their several Subburbs and Quarters when as they that had these were of the Levitical Priesthood Numb. 35. Which Priesthood J. Horne hath plainly denyed himself to be one of and yet pleads for Tyths which pertained to that Priesthood which Christ ended and disanulled the commandment which gave the Tyths Heb. 7. So what hypocrisie is this J. H. in who claimes a right to Tyths as both being according to the Law of God and Man and yet upon that account denies to be called Priest when as the Law of God calls them Priests that took Tyths and does not the Law of Man the like And does not the Book of Common-Prayer call them Priests So that upon this account may J. Horne be called a false Priest he claiming a right to Tyths as by the Law of God when as the service of the Tabernacle for which they were given to the Prists of Levie he is out of Numb. 18. As also he is guilty of the false Priests practises who Preached for hire and divined for money Mica 3. 11. J. H. and T. Moor the elder and the younger say that the false Apostles it seems by what the Apostles writes of them 2 Cor. 11. 12. they use to boast of their free Preaching and in Page 71. They

{non-Roman} Rom. 8. 29. and was not Isaiah one of these Bretheren Who also had been as with Child Isaiah 26. 17. Jer. 30. 6. And where in P. 19. thou chargest R. H. and me with counting Christ's coming in the flesh to be but a figure in this thou hast belyed us for it was never so affirmed by us J. H. saith Some did believe in the Light before they believed that Jesus is the Christ as Nathaniel and Cornelius and divers others Answ. Where proves he that by Scripture For Christ is that Light which Cornelius and others believed in who is not devided His words here implyes as if they that believe in the Light believed in they knew not what If they believed not Jesus to be the Christ when they so believed And my saying a man must believe that Jesus is the Christ and believe in him too before he be born of God as Christ said believe in the Light that ye may be the Children of the Light of this J. H. sayes what is this but to fight against the Apostle John 1 John 5. 1. and sayes I stick not to make John a lyer P. 21. In which he hath shamefully lyed for I own what John said and I spoke according to Christ's Testimony who put believing in the Light before being Children of it for they received Christ and believed in his name that they might become the Sons of God John 1. 22. and 12. 36 So that J. H. in not owning and believing in Christ before being born of God implyes that while the birth which is of God is but in bringing forth in man before it be born man is but in the unbelief while that work of God is but in effecting and not effected which shews J. H. his ignorance of the new birth which is not conceived without faith in the Light before it is brought forth J. H. saith P. 24. That the Creatures deliverance into the liberty of the Sons of God and the Redemption of the Sainte body which they groaned and waited for Rom. 8. 19. 20 21 22 23. could not be before those Saints deceased for saith he the Apostle vers. 17 18 speaks about their sufferings with Christ and reigning with Christ and speaks of the sufferings with him as first and the reign as a thing afterward the sufferings are of this present time or life but the glory is to be after revealed and therefore spoken of as in the future to this present time Answ. Here you may see the liberty of the Sons of God and the redemption of the body which the Saints in their life time groaned and waited for and the reigning with Christ and the revealing of his glory in the Saints all these hath J. Horne put afar off as things not attained by any in this life in all which he hath shewed himself voyd of understanding and hath denyed the Sons of God their liberty and priviledges and so hath denyed the end and effect of the Saints travail and sufferings and the work of the Spirit of adoption which was sent into their hearts and of the Son of God who was made of a woman made under the Law to redeem them that were under the Law that we might receive the adoption of Sons Gal. 4. 4 5 6. and that adoption reacheth to the body of the believers and was its redemption which for a time it groaned and waited for Rom 8. and the Saints were brought to reign with Christ upon the Earth and made pertakers of his glory being made more than conquerers in Christ thorow their sufferings and even then the Spirit of glory and of God did rest upon them Rom 8. 37. 1 Pet. 4. 14. And what gross darkness is it for him to say the Creatures deliverance into the glorious liberty of the Sons of God could not be before the Saints deceased as if it were not possible to be so And whereas from J. Horn's not owning that the Saints may attain to the redemption of the body before the bodies be raised out of the grave according to his wores I said from this then Paul is not yet come to the redemption of his body which so many hundred years since he groaned and waited for seeing that the Resurrection of the bodies is not yet come Oh! how J. Horne is vexed at me ' for thus discovering his blindness as in P. 25 he shews his venome in calling us wicked and corrupt and poor shifting for he saith the Fathers that dyed in the faith received not as then the promises and that Abraham hath not yet received all the promises for which he hoped which is another case than Pauls groaning and waiting for the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption for the Scripture does not say that Abraham groaned and travelled for that which he hath not yet received for it s said that these all dyed in the faith not having received the promises but having seen them afar oft and were perswaded of them and imbraced them Heb. 11. 12 13. but hath not Abraham now received the promises which was to him viz. seen the increase of his seed and received the Heavenly City and Country which he and the Martyrs spoken of in Heb. 11. dyed in the hope of Since th●●Abraham yet liveth and is in the everlasting Kingdome but 〈◊〉 is besides J. H. his matter about Pauls not yet being come to the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption which so many hundred years since he groaned and waited for which bondage of Corruption J. H. and T. M. have accounted to be the Corruption of mortality in which the body corrupteth in Death and in the Grave as also they have called it rottenness in their other Book P. 48. from which it follows that Paul groaned and waited for his body to be redeemed from the corruption and rottenness in the Grave before ever the body was either Dead or laid in the Grave or corrupted there And thus their sottishness appears so that this we may lay down as their principle that the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption which so many hundred years since Paul groaned and waited for when he lived he hath not yet attained to it Alas then they would make poor Paul have a long travail and suffering as also according to what they say in their other Book Page 47. 48. viz. That it was the Apostles part to groan after the redemption till Christ's descending from Heaven which they say is not till after the decease And whereas I said that Asa's heart was perfect with the Lord while he did that which was right in the sight of the Lord which might be all his dayes till that was written in 2 Cron. 15. 17 18 19. but not when his heart was departed from the Lord and he turned into the Rage Oppression and Persecution nor when he was in the natural state which is clear ●●cording to 2 Chron. 16. 7 8 9 10 11 12. J.