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A16125 A godly consultation vnto the brethren and companyons of the Christen religyon By what meanes the cruell power of the Turkes, bothe may, and ought for to be repelled of the Christen people, Theodore Bibliander beinge the author. Thow shalt also fynde here (most gentle reader) of the reasons wherwyth a firme and sure concorde and peace in the Churche, and the Christen publyke weale may be constytuted, and of the fyrst begynnynge and increacementes of the Turkes domynyon, and also of the superstytyous and damnable lawe of the Mahumetanes, and of other certen thynges moste worthy truly to be red and consydered.; Ad nominis Christiani socios consultatio. English Bibliander, Theodorus, ca. 1504-1564. 1542 (1542) STC 3047; ESTC S111613 144,753 308

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great moūtayne or rocke Taurus / in the which the olde antiquitye dyd proprely fyers a ferce nation / for to be shytte vp wyth in yron gates / with owt dowte signifyinge therby that the Barbarous conditions the fiers and cruell maners of those turkyshe Scythyans sholde be remoued from the costes of christendome by the brasen decreys of godes defence / whiche can none otherwyse be takē awaye / but by the hande of God the reuenger The Lorde also threteueth the people of Idumea / whiche had theyer truste in greate rockes not easye to come to that he wolde caste them downe / yea though they buylded theyer Iere. xlix nestes amongste the clowdes The see called Euxinus / Hellespontus / Aegeus / the ouermoste the nethermoste see from Syria vnto Gades Are they not all knowen for to be occupyed with the turkyshe Nauyes / and do they not sayle in thē at theyer wyll and pleasure How often was Hierusalem the moste valiante cyttye of al the este parte of the worlde / how often was it taken Caste yower eyes rownde abowte the worlde and behoulde what goodly cyttyes lyeth clene extyncte so that there appereth not any sygnes or tokens of the owlde foundations whiche semed some to haue bene inexpugnable Where is Amon / Troye / Tyre / Ninine / Babylon / Cartage Lye they not all flat with the grounde Was not Constantinople beynge fettered wyth the gyues of synne / taken of Mabumet soner then herbes wylbe sodē in a potte / whiche sustayned the violent assautes of Constantinople beseiged of the Paiazites the Paiazites eyght yeres / and was not able to be ouercomne of the Saracenes in the moste greuous seyge of thre yeres whyles a cruell pestilence dyd fyght also with in the walles god defendynge it Shall we stryue with the nation of the Turkes in goodes and ryches But there are fownde priuate mē amongste this people which haue greater riches / iuelles and treasure far awaye then ower kynges Fourthermore what dyd greate tresures proffit Persepolis / Susa / what dyd they proffyt Babylon / Cresus / Darius / and diuerse other Are the leages or couenauntes of peace more sure at this daye amongst christianes then in tymes paste Leages of peace are not to trusted vnto in the whiche we haue bene a pray to ower couetous and ambitious enemye But all the partes of christendome was neuer torne in peces with greater hatredes and more diuisions / namely thorow theyer faute which coueteth nothinge so moche as to blott owte the doctryne of criste the kinge / diuers people kinges not of the meaneste sorte of the chrysten name are confederate with ower enemyes Maye we compare wyth the Turkes in the weapons of warre the multitude The Turkes be equal with vs in strēgth and feates of warre of men Do we excell them in the strēgth of ower bodyes / in the science of warre fare / in the obseruation of the disciplyne ād gouernaunce excercysed in tentes pauilions / in pacience / in vigilancie / in studious diligēce / in al the ●eates of batayle Or elles what dyd those thynges proffit ower elders that they myght haue bene preserued from the subiection of the Turkyshe dominion when bothe ower enemies were lesse instruct in all these thinges ower forefathers dyd far awaye excell There is no thinge that can helpe / but the breakers of Gods lawes must needes be ●laged thē How often haue we proued by playne experience that the lawe of the lorde doth thretē the breakers therof / that the lorde settynge his face agaynste vs / we sholde fall downe before ower enemyes / and be subiecte to them that hate vs How often haue we lerned the same thynge to be true whiche the moste excellent warryoure Dauid wryteth in the Psalme The lorde hathe no delyte in the strength Psalme .cxlvij. of horses nether is he well pleased in the armours of men but the lorde is well cōtented with them that feare hym ād with all them that truste vpon his mercy But we do not truste vnto fleshe nather yet to ● Pet. i. Esa● xli mannes helpe presydye / knowynge very well that all fleshe ys lyke vnto haye and all the glory therof as the flower of the felde / and that he is cursed of the lorde and infortunate which putteth fleshe for to be hys arme We truly set the hope of ower help in the lord We leans to the helpe of the christen religion We looke for celestyall aydes and succoures I am pyttyfullye affrayed leste that many do bragge whith theyer mowthe that they put the truste of theyer healthe in the name of God whiche is the stronge tower Proueth .xviii. of defence from the face of ower enemye But theyer mynde beynge dryuen with the wyndes of affections to be caryed awaye with a carnall securite or saffegarde into an vncerten hauen Of the whyche sorte of men Micheas speaketh / theyer Mich. iii. pryncys dyd gyue sentence for gyftes and theyer preistes dyd teache for lucre / and theyer prophetes dyd prophecye for money / and yet they wylled them self fe to be taken as men that holde vpon God sayinge Is not the lorde amonge vs Tushe there can no mysfortune happen vnto vs. Therfore shall Syon for yower sakes be plowed lyke a felde / and Ierusalem shall become as an heape of stones and the hyll of the temple shall be turned into an hyghe woode Esaye also in the .xxviii. Chapter reproueth the vayne confidence of the people with 〈◊〉 xxxiii a moste weyghtye sentence sayinge heare the worde of the lorde o ye mockers which beare rule ouer the people that is in Ierusalem / because ye haue sayde / we haue made a couenaunt with death / and with hell are we at agremēt / ād though there go forth a sore plage it shall not come vnto vs. For we haue made falsehode oure refuge and vnder vanite are we hyd Therfor thus sayth the Lorde God Beholde I laye in Syon for a foundation a stone / euen a tryed stone / a precious corner stone / asure foūdation Who so beleueth let hym not be to hastie Iugemēt also will I laye to the rule ▪ and righteonsnes to the balance so that the hayle shall take awaye yower lyinge hope / and the pryuye place of yower refuge shall the waters renne ouer / and thus the couenaūte that yow made with death shall be disanulled / and yower agrement that yow made with hell shall not stonde yea All ower ●eu●●rs ● couenauntes be frustrate whiche be deuised agēste the lorde whan the sore plage goeth forth ye shall be troden downe vnder it From that tyme that it goeth forth it shall take yow awaye For early in the mornyng euery daye / yea bothe daye and nyght shall it go thorowe and whan the noyse therof is perceaued it shall gēdre vexatioō Whiche therfor be the sure foūdatiōs
sholde be trobled to moche hauynge no helpe but hym selfe wyth the care and grefe of erthelye thinges But wyth what face dareste thou b● so hardye to laye the cryme of this folye and wyckednes vnto the Turkes charge whych doest thy selfe the same thinges rather warse yf warse maye be For very shame ether take awaye the dumme names of George / Anthonye / Barbara / Erasmus / and of whother he sayntes and she sayntes / or elles it must nedes appere that thou doest styke faste / and arte lykewyse drowned in the same myre / whyche arte called a Christiane and yet thou mylt not aske all thinges in the name of Christ of owre moste lyberall father which haste the noble wyse / and eloquent promyse of the Lorde what so euer yow shall aske the father in my name / he Iohn xv wyll gyne it yow whiche haste the noble precepte of God Psal xlix offer vnto the Psal xlix lorde the sacryfyce of thankes gyuynge paye thy bowes vnto the hyeste and call vpon me in the tyme of trouble / so wyll I heare the and thow shalte honoure me c. But yf the Turkes call Christen men wycked and out of their wyttes / whyche put of their cappes to Images / do inclyne The e●●se● denerat●ou of Images them self fe to do worshyp / bowe their knees / lye flatte on the grounde wyth all theyr bodyes / sett vp tapers / lighte cādels / burne frāckynsence which turne their praiers to a stocke or a stone hauīg their purpose and desyer fulfylled / gyue thankes therfore to a deade thinge wyth oute breathe or lyffe How wylt thou denye the intentiō of a moste greuous cryme By what reason / waye / or meanes wilt thou auoyde it Shall we saye there be none Idoles or vayne carued ymages called simulachres amonge Christianes Men wyll not beleue vs / for the matter is euydent vnto the contrary / and owre tēpels are sene in the face of all the worlde to be fylled / stuffed / and beset rownde aboute with suche maumets and puppets on euery syde But vnto what vse ● wyse question forsothe and a warme ininterrogation Herely to represent the blyssed sayntes that dwell in heauen / vnto whome religion it self fe commaūdeth vs to gyue honoure and worship for as moche as they be patrones / helpers and defenders of all them the whiche requier their helpe and socoure / and will expresse the inwarde loue and kyndenes of the mynde with owtewarde prayer and thankes gyuen vnto them for soche benefytes as they haue receyued and taken at their handes Therfore thy godes O Israell are acordynge to the multitude of thy townes cyttyes as Hieremye saythe / yea Ieremy ij euery man hath mo sayntes well nere for to be his patrones then there be membres of one bodye / seynge that one and his felowe muste defende the heade / an other the hande / an other the bellye and who is able to nombre thē all But thow wilt saye / they teache the laye people and are vnto them in the stede of bookes and as letters be signes to thē that can rede The sophisticall inuētion of Gregorye the greate Herely asharpe reason and a suttle inuention firste to wnde owte / by Gregorye the greate not in the wrightynges of fisshers but in the argumentes of sophysters Neuerthelesse I wolde very fayne lerne of the moste craftye disciples and valiante defenders of these dumme gods whyther the deuyle syrsatane dyd euer teache the people Hethen and Christen more euyll and false in soch ydolles then paynted or grauen Images do teache good trwe But that more is attributed vnto them then they do ether teache or signifye the thinge proueth itselffe many maner of wayes For why Wherfor do mē rūne as thowgh they were moued wyth some ▪ vngracious furye by see and by lāde vnto soche Images why be vowes made to go seke an idole that is so far of Why are Images laden with golde and syluer / and the pore Christen people in the meane tyme sufferde to perysshe for colde and hungare Why is it holden for a greater offence to ouerthrow a rottē poste then to stryke the brother of Christe for whome he wolde be borne and suffer deathe Why doth the braggers of the Christē doctryne put those men to troble as moste vngracious heretykes / which teache that Images owght to haue nether place nor vse in religion / and the whyche with good ordre take them owte of theire temples Vpon the Turkes syde fyghting agenst Images breking them downe Moses standyth vp with all the valiant hoste of the Prophetes whiche do abhorre Images as a thinge moste detestable / addynge also the reasones why they are not to be suffered amongste the worshippers of the lyninge god Nether do the Apostles fyght agaynste the turkes in this behalffe which warnethe men to be ware of Idoles Moses the prophetes the Apostles / the churche and all good reason for byddeth the wycked veneration of Images and teache them no where to worship nor in any wyse to make them any grauen Image The primatiue churche also makethe wyth the Turkes / whiche a longe tyme was clene with oute Images and in the dayes of Tartulliane the signe of the crosse onely was had amongste Christianes wythoute anye worship done vnto it / for a knowlege and token of Tertullia c. the Christen warfare / as the people of Rome hathe bene acustomed in tyme of battell to haue an egle for theyer badge and cūnisance Good and perfit reason doth also consent to the Turkes hatred agaynste deaffe and dumme ydoles / whiche thinge I wyll make playne by the wordes of the moste excellent and famous clerke Origene Origene whiche in the .vij. boke agaynste Celsus rebukynge and checkynge the Christianes / for that they folowed Moses and the Iewes in abhorringe the vse of Images wryghteth in this wise it is an vnworthy thynge / that the creature / whych is subiect to vanite / sholde be settin the stede of god hauyng no nede of any thinge or that it sholde occupye the Rome of the sonne of god the firste begotten of all creatures / that it myght be honoured Moreouer there owght no forged thinge to be in his mynde / whiche wyll worship God truly and in spryte and in veryte Lactantius Firmianus What shulde I recyte Lactantius Firmianus a man far awaye bothe better lerned and more holy then Gregorye the greate whych doth not dowte to affirme that there is no true relygyō nor any maner of vertu / where as is an ymage And he was an excellent wryghter douteles agaynste the heathen people but he that wyll show me the difference betwene the Idoles of the hethen and dumme godes of the Christianes I shall suerly wonder very greatlye at hym I wyll adde this one thinge whiche Caucasus the moste flye montayne rowgh and inhabitable deu dyng
scithe a from the lande of India owght not to be passed ouer Owre enemyes the Turkes whiche in tymes paste dyd springe and come owt of the rockes of Caucasus and afterwarde were made fasshioned after the lawes of Mahumet do holde the name of god in greate reuerence / nether do they vsurpe it except some greate and weyghtye matter constrayne them and in the tyme of warre they bere owtwardely writtē in theyr sheyldes that there is no ouercūmer but god Nether wolde they commyt the fame or ryches of a pryuate man / I wyll not say the publyke weale / vnto the faythe or credit of any man whyche wyth oute moste greate necessite wolde sweare the dredefull name of god But how is it vsed amōge vs I wyll speake no thynge of periurye / whiche truly is a vice more often sene amonge Christians then is ether semyng or ells conuenyent / but I wyll saye that The repre hensyō of periury blasphemous swetynge thinge whiche all men knoweth to be cōtrarye to god / and yet the moste parte of vs do it / and the reste are no thinge greued in theyr myndes therwith as it wolde be seme godly people to be / and those that be iudges and rulares of the lawes do not refrayne it with conuenient grauite in ministringe iustice Tell me I pray yow is there not a light vsurpatiō of the lordes blessed name and a playne cōtempte of his diuine power in the mouthes of children / of them that are aged / of men and womē / of the magistrates the prestes and of the cōmone people If a man shall begynne to make any sporte ther is nothynge delectable / nothynge merye / no thinge pleasante or worthy to be lawght at except some blasphemous othe be added ther vnto If any thinge must be affirmed to be true or otherwyse the wordes and communication can not seme to be weyghtye / full of grauite and worthye to be beleued excepte the name of god taken in vayne be put there vnto In braulynge and chyding / in bostynge and crac liynge / in thretenynge and denyinge / no man can be beleued withowt an othe That man is not worthye to beare the name of a lustye inuentus / a iolye brute / a bolde man of warre / and a gentle man borne of a noble stoke / that can not make the heauenes / the elementes and the throne of god to breake and thonder owte of his mowthe That can not rende the lorde for alachet sroere a pase the bloode / the woundes / the crosse / the precious deathe and bitter passion of Christe Let any godly man standynge by and hearynge the same be offended therwyth and put the blasphemer in the remembrance of a better mynde And then is he ether ready The pagent ● propertye of blasphemous sweaters to playe the iacke braggare and to drawe owte his weapon agayuste hym that was gelous for the lordes sake or elles he wyll coloure his mischeffe wyth this or some other soche lycke scoffynge excuse Holde thy peace good felowe for sayntes are a slepe Why arte thow displeased I do but remembre the name of Christe his holy membres / and thinkest thou that to be euyll done God is an honest mā and knoweth what I meane though thou being a foole arte vtterly ignorant It is a knacke of the courte / sometyme vsed also in dyuerse whother places amonge dyuerse men I wyll not saye of one but of all degrees / an ornamēt of speeche and a poynte of tisthoryke Yea shall I speake the truthe It is one of the moste pestyle ut plages of Egypte / and a coloure of the deuylles facundyous eloguence / wherwith all the wordes and tale is paynted I saye not of a Christiane / but of a man that is madde and owte of hys wytt And yet for all that who is he amōge vs that is so dyspleased with the sayde enorme and vngracyous myscheffe as he ought to be Who bryngeth for the any soche token or sygnyfycatyon of sorow and dyspleasure as the Iewes were wente to do / whych greatly dyspleased hearyng soche abhomynatyon / were acustomed to rende their clothes besyde their backes Where be the lawes of God / which wylleth Leut. xxiii a blasphemer to be correctyd wyth the losse of hys lyffe and punysshement of his heade Where is the constytutyon of the newe cyuyle ordinaunces made by the Emperowre Iustinianus What cyttye in all Christendome doth mynyster soche dewe and indyfferent iustyce as the Persyans / the Scytheans / and owre contremen the Germans were wonte for to do agaynste a lye If god whiche made and conserueth al thinges / if the holy goste / If Christe the sonne of god be owre god tell me where is his religiō If he be owre lorde where is his feare If he be owre father where is his honour If we do beleue hym to be all myghtye and moste wyse / trwe in his wordes why do we not ons bowe at his moste greuous thretes Was it spoken in the gospell to Christianes or to stones / let yower cōmunicatiō be yea yea naye naye / What so euer is Matth. ● added more / commeth of euyll and of the diuyle Thow shalte not take the name of thy god in vayne say the the lorde and he thretenethe no man to scape vnpunisshed that will usurpe his blyssed name vnreuerenly and with owt a iuste cause And do we maruell to se the Christē common wealthe to fall dayly in decaye and owre men of warre to be slaine and ouercomen with the nations of the Turkese Let vs rather gyue thākes truly vnto the goodnes of god that the erthe doth not open from benethe nor the soden stormes of wylde fyer and brymstone fall downe from aboue / and that we do not descende abhomynable whoredome in so greate lybertye with owte any punishemēt how greate and shameull aduowtries bedayle commytted in euery parte of Christendome that I maye houlde my peace and speake neuer a worde of the rauisshement of virgins the whiche of many Christianes is taken now a dayes not for a myscheffe but for a game and sporte That I maye passe ouer the vice of inceste and the corrupte chastite of vnmaryed prestes whiche fayne them self fes to be gelded fo the Kingedome of god and yet they commytte soche vnnaturall abhomination as is not conuenient for to be named leste it shold infecte honeste eares and poyson the paper and breth of the reders / besides other myscheffe where in they excell the Turkes whose propretye is not thowgh they be the enemys of Christes name to kepe many wyues in one house as the prodigious vowe makers of wyueles thastite do kepe many cōcubines and shameles harlottes But if any man amonge them haue manye habitations and is cōstrayned by the diuersyte of bussines to dwell in diuerse places as are merchant men then are they also permitted to kepe the mo wyues and