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A07694 The second parte of the co[n]futacion of Tyndals answere in whyche is also confuted the chyrche that Tyndale deuyseth. And the chyrche also that frere Barns deuyseth. Made by syr Thomas More knyght.; Confutacyon of Tyndales answere. Part 2 More, Thomas, Sir, Saint, 1478-1535. 1533 (1533) STC 18080; ESTC S104273 495,165 594

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of that pystle touched the great goodnes of god that had by the deth of our sauyour Cryste d●lyu●red in the baptysme all the worlde that wolde be good chr●sten people from all the gylte dampnacyon dewe for all maner synne lefte vs in such case that all the relykes leuynges of orygynall synne albeit they be mocyons inclynacions of y e flesh towarde synne therby called synne for the lacke of that perfeccion whych the body shold haue had yf Adam had not by synne fallen for hym self all his posteryte from the state of orygynall iustyce shall haue when y e body shall aryse agayn be gloryfyed yet be they not imputed vnto vs but perdoned remayne as mater of our meryte in case y t we resyst those inclynacyōs of y e fl●sh folowe the mocyons of the scrypture After thys I saye touched in the .vii. chapyter then pursueth he styll vpō the same in the eyghte chapyter declarynge the excellence of grace that god hath powred on vpon his people in y e newe law farre aboue the grace whyche he gaue yet abundauntely in the olde but in the newe farre pa●synge in that he vouchsaufed hym selfe to come in to the worlde in his own persone in the very nature of man and symylytude of a synner and sufferynge here hys paynefull passyon therby to dampne destroye the synne that the deuyll caused Adam to commytte agaynst god to dāpne it I saye and destroye it by the synne that the deuyll caused the iewes to commyt in puttynge our sauyour vniustely to deth And all be it that in the olde lawe suche as were good men receyued theyr grace by the fayth and bylyefe of oure sauyour that after sholde come and were by vertue therof made able to resyste the relyques of orygynall synne and inclynacyons of the flesshe towarde actuall synnes therby were after Crystes passyon saued yet was that ayde helpe of grace by Crystes owne comynge when by the passyon of hys flesshe he dampned the synne in the flesshe so farre encreaced aboue that it was in y e chyldren of Israell before whose flesshely sacryfyces were to feble of them self to iustyfye that suche as are baptysed and receyue the spyryte of god● may yf they wyll farre more easyly folowe the spyryte and resyste the flesshely mocyons and abyde and perseuer the quycke lyuely membres of Crystes mystycall body then myghte of oldetyme before Crystes comynge the chyldren of the synagoge And syth our lorde hath now done so myche for vs as in suche haboundaunce by hys owne comyng to gyue out hys grace vnto vs that we maye wyth helpe therof ●eynge so plentuouse wyth mych lesse dyffycultye myche more resyste the flesshe and myche more folow the spyryte kepe the spyryte wyth vs and for the spyryte inhabytynge with in vs meryte myche more glory fyrste in soule and after in body whyche the father of oure sauy●ur that r●yseh hys shall for the same spyryte inhabytynge in vs reyse and resuscytat to blysse therfore are we doctours sayeth saynte Poule it is our bounden d●wtye to folowe not the fle●he whom we may now by the plentuouse grace of god so well and easyly resys●e and whose affeccyons yf we folowe we shall dye but the spyryte of god and by that spyryt to mortyfye the dedes and wurkes of the flesshe whyche yf we d● we shall lyue For who so sayth saynte Poule be led by the spyryt of god they be the sonnes of god And then to shew vs that we sholde in mortyfyenge the workes of the fleshe and folowynge the spyryte not onely do yt but also do yt gladly not for fere but for loue syth Chrysten people receyue the spyryte of filialll loue and are in suche wyse ascrybed for the sonnes of god that oure sauyour hath hym selfe taught vs to call god our father so that in respecte of our state the Iewes were but in fere and boundage therfore sayth saynte Poule farther vnto the crystened y t were amonge the Romaynes ye haue not receyued agayne the the spyryte of bondage in drede but the spyryte by whiche ye ben adopted chosen into the sonnes of god by whiche spyryte also we crye Abba father Uppon whyche wordes euen by and by folowen the wordes that Tyndale here alledgeth for hys purpose For the same spyryte bereth wytnesse vnto our spyryt y t we be the sonnes of god And then yf we be the sōnes then be we heyres● heyres of god coheyres of Cryste how be it that yt is to be vnderstanden yf we suffre wyth hym that we maye be gloryfyed wyth hym Lo good crysten reders here haue I somwhat recyted vnto you the mater by whyche your selfe maye perceyue to what purpose saynte Paule spake these wordes that Tyndale here alledgeth that is to saye the same spyryte bereth recorde vnto our spyrit that we be the sōnes of god In all whyche wordes I wonder what one worde or what one syllable eyther ye or so myche as one letter Tyndale fyndeth makynge toward a profe of his felynge fayth ye perceyue here that the meanynge of saynte Poule is this that bycause our lord as he by fayth and baptysme choseth and adopteth vs into the sonnes of god and therfore by his holy spirite geueth vs instruccyon to call god our fa●her and by the same spyryte yf we lyste to folowe ledeth vs forth also in good spyrytuall workes whych are as saynte Poule sayth to the Galaties charyte gladnes peace pacyence longe suffrynge goodnes gentlenes fayth mekenes temperaūce by the same spyryte yf we will worke with hym causeth vs to kyll and mortyfye the workes of the fleshe whyche ben as saynte Poule sayeth manyfeste and open that is to wyt adultery whorehuntyng vncle●●●●● wanto●es idolatry wytche craft enmytye lawynge emulacyon and stryfe wrath contencyons sedycyons heresyes enuye manshlaughterr dronkenes bankettynges therfore sayth saynte Poule that thys spyryte bereth recorde vnto our spyryte that we be the sonnes of god as though he wolde saye thus the spyryte of god in that yt hath taught vs to call god our father and in that yt ledeth vs into godly workes and into the mortyfycatyon of the fleshely workys by whyche maner of glad folowynge the spyryte we dwell in Cryste and haue the spyryte dwellynge in vs by these thynges as very good tokens of grace the spyryte of god ●ereth recorde vnto our spyryte that is to wyt geueth our spyryte the comforte of good hope as longe as we so do that we be the sonnes of god But then on the tother syde when so euer we wax vntowarde and lyste no lenger to folow the spyryte but fall vnto the fleshe and walke in the workes therof and therby put the spyryte oute of hys dwellynge th●n ceace we to be the sonnes of god were we neuer so dere derlynges to hym byfore and shall neuer be his sonnes agayne tell we mende agayne leue the fleshe agayne
that be in Iudea lette th●m fle vp in to the mountaye●s that is to saye they that be in chrystendome lette theym gyue them selfe to scrypturs Wherfore commaundeth he that all chrystened men in that tyme shulde flye vnto scrypturs ●or in that tyme in th● whyche heresies haue optayned in to the chyrch there can be no tr●we probacyon of chrystendome nor no nother refuge vnto chrysten men wyllynge to know the veryte of fayth but the scrypturs of god Afore by many wayes● was it shewed which was the chyrche of Cryste and whiche was the congregacyon of g●ntyles ●ut now there is none other waye to knowe vnto them that wyll knowe whiche is the very trew chyrche of Chryste but alonely by scrypture By workes fyrste wa● the chyrche of Cryst knowen whan the conuersacyon of chrysten men other of all or of many were holy the whiche holines ●ad not the wycked men but n●w chrysten men be as euyll o● worse than heretykes or gentylys ye and greater cōtinencye is founde amonge them than amonge chrysten men Wherfore he that wyll knowe whiche is the very chyrch of Cryste how shall he know but by scripturs onely Wherfore our lorde consyderynge that so great confusyon of thynges shulde come in this latter dayes therfore commaundeth he that chrysten men whyche be in chrystendome wyllynge to reserue the stedfastnesse of trewe fayth shulde flye vnto none other thynge but vnto scryptures for yf they haue respecte vnto other thynges they shall be slaundered and shall peryshe not vnderstondynge whiche is the trewe chyrche c. These wordes nede no exposycion they be playne inough they do also exclude all maner of lernynge sauynge holy scrypture wherfore se how you can with honesty saue your holy lawes and defende them agaynst Chrysostome More ouer yf Chrysostom complayne of the incontynency that was in hys dayes how wold he complayne yf he now lyued and sawe the boudry and fornycacyon that is in the chyrche Also he sendyth men to scryptures that wyll know the holy chyrch not vnto the holy chyrch for in the chyrch were heresyes but not in scripture Also saynt Paule wytnessyth the same sayenge you are bylte vppon the fundacyon of the apostels and prophetes here haue you playnely that the very trew chyrche is grounded ye and foundyd of holy scrypture and therfore where so euer that the worde of god is preched that is a good token that there be some men of Christes chyrche But now as to the frutes and workes of this chyrche she doth alonely fetche out hyr maner of lyuynge and all her good workes out of the holy word of god and she fayneth not nor dremyth any other newe holynesse or newe inuented workes that be not in scrypture but she is content with Chrystes lernynge and beleueth that Chryst hath suffi●iently taught hyr all maner of good workes that be to the honour of our heuenly father Therfore inuenteth she none other waye to heuen but folowe●h Chryste onely in suf●erynge oppressyons and persecucyons blasphemynges and all other thynges that may be sayde vnto hy● whyche as saynt Augustayne sayth she lerned of oure mayster Chryste Our holy mother the chyrche thorow out all the world scatered far and longe in hyr trew hed Cryste Iesus taught hath lerned not to fere the contume●ys of the crosse nor yet of deth but more and more is she strengthed not in resystynge but in sufferynge More Here haue ye herde good reders a fayre tale wyth a proper ensample of the soule and then two tokens after by whyche ye maye knowe in whyche company there be some of the chyrche though ye can not know whych the persons be that be of the chyrche And in both these poyntes ye haue herde hys whole tale no worde in the waye lefte out nor one worde hath he not after for any forther profe but spendynge a lefe an halfe in rayly●ge vppon the clergye and seremonyes and sacramentes of the chyrch therewyth he ●ynyssheth and endeth all hys processe And therfore as touchyng the mater ye haue herde all his whole tale garnysshed and made fayre wyth the sample of the soule and the two tokens of the chyrche But now is thys tale fayre as longe as it is in tellynge and goth fayre and smothe by a mannes eare as the water goth ouer the goosys backe for ellys yf it tary styll tyll it we●e well to the skynne and be well felte and consydered then it leseth all y ● grace and wyll appere so folysshe y ● the reader wyll thynke that thys tale hath mo tokens then twayne to make hym knowe that the wryter had almoste no more wyt in his hed then one that had no soule in hys body I lette passe that he noteth in the mergyne these wordes how a man maye knowe the chyrch and then he telleth vs in hys texte not how a man maye knowe it nor any pyece of it but how a man may know in what place it is and yet not so myche neyther For he telleth vs not go to suche a place and there thou shalt fynde it or some membres of it but he byddeth vs go and telleth vs not whyther and sendeth vs to seke telleth vs not where but telleth vs onely by what token we shall knowe whyther in the place where we happen to seke there be any such person or no. But now lette vs suppose that he tolde vs the fyrst tale whyche were yet more to the purpose then the tale that he telleth vs now And yet bycause he maketh vs hys tale so playne by the sample of the soule let vs putte hym agayne for our parte some sample of some symple soule some good merchaunt that were fallen in company wyth frere Barns in the house of hys secret hostes at the sygne of the botell at Botolfes wharfe and fyndynge hym walkynge in a mertchauntes gowne wyth a redde Myllayne bonet and not knowyng that he were ronne out of relygyon but wenyng that he were an honeste man tolde hym that he were goyng toward Excester and for as mych as he muste cary money wyth hym he wolde fayne fynde some good company that were goynge thyther by whome he myghte be bothe conuayed the ryght waye also go the more sure For he hadde herde that there were in many innes many loyterynge felowes that were false shrewes yet semed as honeste as trew as he whych fals shrewes wold fayne them selfe to be merchaūtes saye they were goynge thyderwarde to but when they were gotē in credence taken into cōpany then vsed to lede men out of y ● way robbe them kyll them to Now yf frere Barns wold say to thys man ye be happy that ye haue met wyth me for I wyll sende you to an inne where ye shall be sure and neuer fayle to fynde some honest trew merchauntes that are thyderwarde and than wolde sende hym to a certayne place whyche he wolde name hym If thys merchaunt whan he