effects it works in us who are the posterity of Adam S. I have heard that sins and ignorance and also death and infirmities have their origin from it M. Can you shew these things of it S. No indeed Sir for any thing I know as yeâ— but I expect you will make me know it M. Then tell me in a child three or four years old which is stronger Sense or Reason S. Sense without question For give him an apple tell him it will offend God to eat it I make no question but as soon as you have turn'd your back hee 'l eat the apple without regarding the offence of God so that I see Sense in him is stronger than Reason M. Right for he understands not what is the offence of God as yet nay accorâ—â—ng to the ordinary Judgment of Divines not till seven years of age So long therefore sense has the whole government of a child and after seven reason by litle and litle overcomes till the age of thirty The Philosophers not admitting maturity of wisdome and constant Judgment till the standing part of our age which is when we leave growing so that till then wee are on the losing side Now what think you is 't easy to conquer and root out a thing that 's grown in and with us for thirty years together S. It must needs be very hard M. Do you think that hard which evâ—â—y man does S. No Sir that 's easy which all can do and the harder a thing is so much the fewer can do it M. Thâ—n seeing to overcome Sense perfectly is very hard and very few can do it and most men do it not Mankind is subject or slave to sin as being for the most part conquer'd â—y it S. This is very well but you do not shew that this comes from originall sin M. So that it seems you have forgot that by originall sin it first came that Sense has it's proper motion not subject to Reason which if it had not the more it should grow the more vertuous it would make the man because hee would still become more subject to God and Reason S. Sir I see now that all our Sins come from original sin and indeed 't is no wonder that one sin should proceed from an other But I expect how you wilâ— shew that Ignorance Infirmities proceed from the same For if they were then to be born as we are now children and grow to be men I think they must needs also be children in knowledge and so have ignorance so that this cannot be the ofspring of original sin and likewise if then they had eaten to grow and keep themselves a live as we do now they would not avoid but meats should have their effect and so breed diseases when out of season M. You are not well acquainted with the difference of not knowing and being ignorant for not every one is ignorant who does not know but he who knows not what he ought or what 's fitting for him to know For example what Master either of Divinity or Philosophy or any other Art knows all which may be known in his Art yet are they not therefore to be term'd Ignorant So likewise any man who knows what 's fitting is not ignorant Now I pray if any one in that estate knew not what was fitting to know it was either because he could not or would not S. True for whosoever can and will do any thing 't is most clear he does it M. Then what think you in that state could he not or would he not know what was fitting If he could not it was want in himself or in his teacher But Adam was perfect in knowledge could teach him If himself were not capable the knowledge was above him and so not such as was fitting or such as the want thereof induces Ignorance If there was want of will it was because he lov'd some other thing better and that he was not wholy subject to reason which cannot be without original sin and so original sin is cause of Ignorance Now if ignorance be cause of sickness and death you have no more to reply S. No indeed But I hear learned men say that 't is not in the power of nature to keep a man from death and therefore I fear not ignorance should be the cause thereof M. But what if ignorance or sin be the cause why nature cannot keep a man from death let 's see death comes either by violence or sickness violence from man or beast or some dead thing But if men had not sin'd they would neither have falâ— out nor have been surpris'd by chance which proceeds from not foreseeing so that from Man no hurt could have proceeded Beasts would all have been tame and in fear of man as we see those be which use men's company or as others might be made And for Accidents unless a man puts himself in danger they would not arrive likewise if we look into the cause of sickness in Physicians books we shall see it proceeds from some excess or defect which in that state would not have been when man had wit and will to provâ—de against both S. Sir that was an happy age or rather would have been if man had kept his honour in which God had plac'd him M. True but yet this we have would not be miserable if our selves did not make it so by our own fault not seeing what 's before our eyes For consider if you please what 's more cause of fin unto us than pleasure yet no Sin can be without displeasure S. Sir that were hard to perswade since we see men daily think nothing sweet but it which could not be did they experience continual displeasure in it M. Can you doubt but that must needs grieve a man which is against his inclination and nature then if Reason be the nature of man how can he see himself do against reason which nevertheless every sin does without grief and pain Again does not sin set our hearts upon goods which may be taken from us as money meat play and the like it puts us then in perpetual danger of vexation grief for who looses what he 's in love with must needs be grieved according to the measure of his love Again if Reason have fore-cast of what 's to come and memory of what 's past Sense which is the cause of sin onely consideration of the present is 't not manifest that sin by sense precipitates us into future inconveniencies which Reason keeps us out of Again Reason has one conduct and government through all occurrences But Sense as many severall motions as the things desir'd are different which because they are not ever had together make the vitious man now follow one now another and sometimes miss
a love as Adam had must needs have it 's effects in the Body also as indeed it had And as wee see the practice of memory makes men easy to learn without book the practice of discoursing fit to discourse and so in all actions and this by nothing but by the fitting of the bodily instruments and organs So this love did either fit the very corporeal disposition to such love or increase that fitness it found there already by this means making the very corporeall desires subject to Reason that this body being prevented with reason could not incline to any thing before Reason gave it leave and order But tell me farther have you not heard that children be like their fathers S. Yes Sir I know well 't is the ordinary complement of Gossips to say the child is like the father which shews that ordinarily 't is so M. And this likeness is it in the body onely or also in the Soul S. I cannot tell how one should be like another in the soul which has no parts M. Did you not say the Soul works upon the body if then you see those works which come from the soul to bee alike in two can you think but that their souls be alike alsâ— â—s if they discourse alike love like things jeâ—t write a poem or oration alike would you not judge their Souls alike So then 't is not ill conjectur'd that when the body of the Son is like the body of the Father also the Soul of the Son is like the Soul of the Father And I remember to have heard judicious men say of some persons that when they saw them jest or discourse they thought they saw their fathers S. How should the Soul which is made by God come to be like the Soul of the Father which had nothing to do with it M. If there were severall kinds of matter of diversâ— dispositions as wax wood aq a vit â— stuâ—ble brimstone c. of which you intended to make Fiâ—e or as wee say in the schools to introd â—cethe Form of Fire into them Though each would become indeed a thing able to burn or Fire yet would you expect in reason that this active Principle or power of burning call'd the Form of Fire should bee equally in each of them S. No Sir I see plainly by experience 't is not to bee expected each would have power to burn on a different fashion and in a different degree But I am not so wise as to see whence this difference sâ—rings M. You see it springs not from the Form of Fire in each for that has nothing else to do but to make it Fire or a thing able to burn S. True Sir for 't is one thing to bee apt to burn another to bee apt to burn differently I conceive therefore this difference arises from the severall dispositions in the Matter or severall Fuells you spoke of M. You see then 't is the way the All-wise orderer of Nature takes that a diversity in the disposition of the matter determins to a diversity in the active Principle or Form according to certain degrees within the same species or kind The Rational soul then being the Form of man's Body or that which makes him man you see 't is God's method to put like Souls into like bodies therefore the father making the body of the son like his own will not his soul also be made by God like to the father's soul and so the souls of like bodies be like of unlike bodies unlike S. Yes sure sir that must be so seeing the soul doth fit the body M. Then if the soul of Adam had that operation on it's body as to make a special disposition in it by which it was subject to reason and this disposition proceeded from the strong love of Almighty God as on the one side Adam would make a son like himself in that subjection to reason so God Almighty would give his son a soul fit to love God above all things the disposition of the soul proceeding from such a disposition of the body S. Yes Sir 't is evident hee would or else he should not put a fitting soul into the Son's body M. This prov'd you must know that our forefathers call the Love of God above all things Justice and Sanctity which because it was so given to Adam as to descend unto his Heyrs it was call'd Originall Iustice and said to bee a naturall gift and to come unto them by nature who were to bee born with it Besides this gift God Almighty fiâ—ted the place to the man that there should bee no evilâ— ayr or other occasion of harm unto him whence because wisedom kept him from mischance and the place from infection hee could not dy but of Age for remedy against which God had provided the tree of lâ—fe and so he would have liv'd for ever But to proceed yet a little farther If Adam left lovinâ— God would he have this disposition in his body S. No Sir for if the Love of God were the cause of this disposition the contrary would cause the loss of it M. You say well specially if you add that hee could not leave off loving God but because hee lov'd some other thing better which love having it's effect in the body must needs cross the o ther disposition left before and if this bee so that he left off loving God how would it fare with his children S. How but that they would bee born subject to such dispositions as the love of other things bâ—ed in them But Sir I have heard that Adam after his fall did pennance and began to love God a new wherefore me thinks he should again recover the disposition of loving God for himself and his posterity M. What you have heard is true but not the good effect you gather For his second love finding dispositions in the body contrary to it's proper nature cannot on the suddain extirpaâ—e them but with a great deal of pain and labour and as wee experience in our selves never wholly because these Affections are before Reason and alter the temperament of the Body due and req â—sit to Originall Justice which it lyes not in the power of Reason nor of other Bodies being of a different temper exactly to repair Whence it never comes to pass that the father can communicate his whole vertuous disposition to his child though wee see the likeness of a well practiz'd father to be naturally in the son And this is that which Christians call Originall Sin the missing of Grace or Originall Iustice in the child through the fault of our first father so that the want or privation is particular to every one the cause or actuall guilt onely in Adam FOURTH CONFERENCE M. THus far we have declar'd the nature of Originall Sin in it self can you tell me the
both Sometimes also be unquiet and uncertain not knowing what he would have And so we see a man given impotently either to wealth or pleasure never to be at rest but continually in a painfull pursuit of what he never enjoyes You have told mee that all mankind was subject to sin and the Devil and by them to other mischiefs But are you so good an historian as to shew me this to have indeed pass'd according as is declar'd S. No truly Sir for although peradventure in sermons I have heard much thereof yet I carry away but litle M. Wel I am sure you have heard how God was oblig'd in Justice through the wickedness of mankinde to destroy all but Noah his family eight persons onely by the great floud And I may add that Noah might have talk'd with some who knew Adam so that the fresh memory of our loss of Paradise could not hinder the increase of sin Peradventure mens lives being so long the fear of death hope of future life was cold in them therefore God shorten'd our dayes for our greater good Soon after our forefathers grew into the vanity of building Babel tower and not long after into that prodigious luxury which drew fire from heaven upon the five cities whereof Sodom and Gomorrah were the chief Wherefore God seeing all mankind could not be kept in good order without an universal miracle destroying quite the present state of nature and not perfecting it according as the particular natures requir'd which therefore God saw incongruous for the wiâ—e administration of the woâ—ld hereupon hee chose one family for his elected people ply'd them with perpetuall apparitions prophesies rewards and punishments gave them a law in force of miracles and astonishing greatness Yet the books of scripture teach that they were perpetually straying from Gods law till hee was provok'd to transport them to Babylon whence they came after long and severe punishment little amended and therefore still subject to oppositions and oppressions by Greeks and Latins So that with all the means which man could invent it was not possible to keep mankinde out of Sin Can you tell me the reason of it S. Sir you have told it already that it was originall sin which giving our Sense power to work without the command of Reason caus'd all this mischief M. Right But I desire to know what 't is that it works which makes mankind so backward to it's own good Is 't not that man makes no apprehension of Gods law and the good of it S. Yes Sir the Sense following the present good hinders the consideration of the future M. You see then the remedy ought to be to make them believe and deeply apprehend the good of the next world whereto men being not able to attain either by Sense or discourse 't is necessary to give them a Teacher of whom they are assur'd that he knows what he teaches and will not tell them other then truth But what must such a one do to persuade the world S. He must teach them but seeing you say the matter is above reason I kâ—ow not how he should persuade them that things are so as he teaches them M. Will you not beleeve a man in things whose truth you see not if he work strange and miraculous effects in proof of his savings S. Yes Sir or else I were very unreasonable M. If then this Teacher works wonders which wee call Miracles he will deserve credit at your hands S. Yes for none can do miracles but Almighty God M. Neither is there any who may not be suspected ignorant of such high matters or safely held incapable of deceiving but onely God Nor can any one shew the way or bee a convenient Teacher for us but onely Man so that you see our necessity forc'd God to become man or else our whole kind hath been damn'd To which if you add that wee see and converse familiarly with man and easily incline to love him God wee cannot apprehend what hee is so that by by God's becoming man the way and means of loving Him which is our high path to salvation being infinitly plain'd mankind made infinitly more capable of salvation than before you will easily collect hence that it could not stand with the Goodness of God to let usâ—ly in misery since he could remedy it by a way so connaturall to mankind as was his assuming human nature God therefore was made Man FIFTH CONFERENCE M. VVE have discours'd already of God as our Maker Governour Redeemer as Eternall Almighty Al-knowing Al-perfect But have you no other Attribute of God which bears an eminent place in our Beleef S. Yes Sir that God is one three or that there is a Trinity but I dispair of understanding in any measure so high a point so that 't is enough to beleeve 't is so and this I do already M. Doubt not God's Goodness if your self bee not wanting to your self And first tell mee have you any apprehension of God as hee is in himself S. I know not that but I observe that generally I make no apprehension of any thing as 't is in it self which I never heard nor saw nor perceiv'd by some sense M. Your observation is good tell me next what do you apprehend oâ— mean by the words Good just mercifull and such like mean you not such perfections by them as you observ'd in Creatures S. Yes Sir I know not else what I could mean by them for I never converst with any thing else Besides I am perswaded one that never heard of God means the same by those words as I do which shows the meanings of them is taken from creatures But then mee thinks 't is an injury to God to attribute such low perfections to him which fall infinitly short of his dignity M. No harm by the grace of God as long as we hold fast this intention to attribute them to him onely so far as they signify perfection and not as they include imperfection In the mean time you see wee cannot speak of God as in himself but by means of those low conceits borrow'd from Creatures S. By this account wee must not sâ—y hee is one and three for no Creature is such M. You object shewdly but since you have already prov'd God is a Spirit and seen that a Spirit can Know and Will if out of these it be made as plainly follow that God is one and three as out of other considerations that he is Good Iust c. will it not bee a degree of satisfaction above what you could hitherto hope for S. I confess it will and I expect with longing you would lead me to this apprehension of so sublime a mystery which hitherto I knew nothing of M. Answer mee then first what means this word to know S. I am sure I understand what
towards Laws and Superiours Obedience towards your Equalls and Inferiours in honour Courtesy in words Affability But I beleeve you have heard that the Moral or Cardinal Virtues are four Therefore let me have your help Can you tel me what 't is to bee Discreet S. I think it is to be wise M. Well ghess'd although you miss a little for true 't is every wise man is discreet yet not every discreet man wise For if you look upon men's conversation you shall observe some have good skil in human actions yet for passion or other desires follow not their knowledg Others have their desires so as they should bee but litle skill Others have both skill and will good others both bad And these last are both fools and knaves for the most part The formost of the other three are Understanding men but not Discreet the others be discreet but not understanding The third are both that is Wise Now I hope you will not fail to tel mee what makes a discreet man S. Since a discreet man is hâ—â— who hath his affect on s right iâ— human action and the three virtues above nam'd make a man's affections such those three virtues make a man discreet M. 'T is very well say'd For if you note hee who has these three virtues will use the skill he has to the utter most And him we call discreet who according to his understanding carries things well Which virtue by Divines is called Prudence It's office is to judge a right what is to be done by him that has it according to the proportion of the man's knowledge and so you have your 4. Virtues call'd Morall or Cardinall But before I leave you must answer me one question farther which is whether you think that hee who performs his action according to these Virtues need have any scruple of the work done S. No Sir certainly for if his action be vertuous as proceeding from a minde which has these vertues it must needs be good M. And what though he has an affection to do wel yet if he has not skil can the deed be good S. I did not think of that Then indeed it must be naught M. True t is the action is not good Yet he need not make scruple of what is pass'd because hee did his endeavour But before the action bee perform'd what is he to do if hee cannot tel whether part is to be done S. Hee ought to ask some body that knows M. You say well if hee cannot or when he has ask't find no body that can tell he may do whither he lists And whither he miss or no never make scruple of it as long as hâ—â—'s sure that no â—ll affection was guide in his choice 〈◊〉 that he proceeded out of the Love of God and a good conscience In these three Conferences the motives of vertue and good life frequently occurring advertise the Catechist to make his Cathecumen reflect and move himself unto them They be plain of themselves NINTH CONFERENCE M. YOu know by what is said what Christian life is viz. the practise chieftly of the three Theologicall vertues and in consequence of the four Cardinal ones that is of all vertues But can you tell me what 't is that gives life to all the rest S. I Imagin Sir 't is Charity because you said that it gave life to Hope and that all Cardinal vertues were to be practis'd for God's sake But I reach not unto the reason unless you help me M. You know not your own strength For tell me if you should see a dog or a horse new kill'd how would you know whether it were dead or no S. By the stirring For as long as it stirs I should think some life were yet in it When I saw it stir no more then I should take it for dead M. Very well so far then is agree'd that to live is to have a power in it self to move or stir it self Now can you tel me what is the first principle of stirring in you and other men as they are men Do not you see the more in love they are with any thing the more they stir to obtain it so that you see love is that which stirs a man makes him move towards the thing belov'd Wherefore the Love of God or Charity is the thing which first moves the Christian to walk towards him that is to exercise all vertue You see likewise that what takes away from us the love of God brings us death in lieu of life as we are Christians What is that S. That is as I perceive now mortall Sin for I imagin 't is call'd Mortall or deadly because it takes away lâ—fe and life is Charity Therefore that sin is mortall which deprives our soul of the Love of God M. You are a great Divine but what is 't that takes away the Love of God or of any thing else from us S. I think 't is hate for hate is contrary to love yet methinks no body can hate God and so there would be no mortall sin if that were true M. You say wel but do you not remember that who so loves must as you told me do good for him whom he loves if he can whence it comes that the row of all other vertues follow Charity he then who will not do any of those things which necessarily follow upon Love loses his love But no man would neglect those things unless he lov'd some other thing whose love hinder'd him from performance thereof So that you see how not onely hate of God but Love of such things as hinder you to do what you ought in love to him takes away Charity Can you now tel me what Sin is mortall S. Why Sir whoever lovesany thing in such sort that it causes him not to perform to God himself and his neighbour all he owes them that is all which the four Cardinall Vertues command sins mortally for he loses Charity which is the substance of Christian life M. You say wel if you understand what you say For what think you is not stealing against Justice one of the Cardinal vertues and yet you will not say that whosoeuer steals a pin commits a mortall Sin S. No indeed Sir but truly I know not why M. Did you not say that he who commits a mortal sin loses Charity by it Charity you know is the Love of your Neighbour if then not every thing as the taking a pin is sufficient cause for your Neighbour to fall out with you you lose not his Love for taking a pin Such a breach of justice then as is a sufficient cause for ordinary wise men to break of conversation and friendship with you is a mortal sin But what is less than that is not S. This is well Sir for a mans Neighbour but towards God Almighty I think this measure will not
relate and so distinguish the Substance yet not substantially And. a Son being a Living thing proceeding from a Living thing of the same nature as from a Principle remaining in it and Knowledge in God being such in respect of he Divine Essence known That is truly call'd Son This Father Likewise God loving Himself the same thing is Loving and Loved yet as such distinct therefore there is besides in God a a third call'd Divine Love Also Love intelligent things proceeding from their proper Good which is Truth consisting in this that the Object be in the Knowledge Divine Love proceeds from the Divine Essence as Object in the Divine Knowledge that is from Father and Son Whiâ—h Love is call'd Holy Spirit because He makes us Holy by inspiring us with Love of God or Charity as also Comforter Again â— Person being an Individuall or One Intelligent substance and God having no Accidents The distinction in him must bee of Persons There are then in One God three Persons yet not necessarily Three Things Of these the Second took our Nature not by charging God but by joyning Man to God's Person And therefore the Second because 't is proper to Knowledge or Wisedome to teach us or be our Master A shore History of some signal passages belonging to our Saviour Godâ— being made Man to redeem Mankind from Sin and put him in the way to Heaven which consists see in seeing God and Love of God disposing and determining necessarily to this Man is to love God as being All-Good Our most bountifull benefactour and whose Likeness or Image we bear And our Neighbour being made for the same End wee are that is for God we ought to wish him that End and means to it that is love him as our self Also Love of God necessarily disposing to see â—â—m who loves God has great reason to hope to see him grounded in his Goodness and faithfulness to his promise put none can love or hope un ess knowing the things which motives why taught by Faith which se-curely relies On God's Truth saying such things and Tradition or the Infallible Attestation of the Church that he 〈◊〉 them There are then three virtues call'-Theologicall or immedily respecting God necessary to mankind's saluation Faith Hope and Charity Faith being a Knowledge of supernaturall things the way to advance Faith is to increase that Knowledge by Study of such things that is by Prayer of which Mentall has three parts To Know the truth of the point To resolve according to that Knowledge and To raise the heart to God expecting a Blessing Vocall Prayer is better than Mentall as being compos'd by able men and less distractive But worse as â—ess satiating the Soul Less proportion'd to it and Desective the two first parts mention'd Hence of Mental the written are bâ—st for beginners of Vocall Those which are best understood and Well attended to Lastly â— Prayer being the use of Considerations â—â—â—i caâ—ioâ—sly moving to â—ove of God The fruit of Prayer is to advance Charity that iâ— Prayer is the high way to Heaven wheresore without Iâ— Retreat in vertue is inevitable Moreover Charity or â—ove obliging us to give what 's due to those wee love 't will make us render To God Service To our selves what 's best for us that is 't will make us prefer a greater good before a less which is perform'd by Temperance and avoyd a greater harm before a less which is done by Fortitude To our Neighbour If Infeiour or Equall Love Good will If superiour Obedience and Respect which belong to Justice Yet these three Virtues unexcited by Love of Heaven avail not to It though in some sort conformable to Nature They become severall particular Virtues as respecting severall Objects Also Discretion being The right se 〈…〉 of ouâ— Affectiâ—â—â— in oâ—dâ—r to Act on and the three fore and Virtues giving this who has thâ—m has also Dscretion or Prudence There are then â—our Morall or Cardinall Virtues according to which who acts since not byast by ill affections needs not scruple his action though it hap to be imperfect in some other respect Christian Life is a Practice of the three Theologicall and four Morall virtues for God's sake which is done by Chariâ—y Whâ—r fore since the Life of a Christian is to move towards God and Love of God or Charity makes us do so It onely is a Christians Life and he dead without It. Wherefore what causes ibis death is Mortall Sin which springs from love of Creatures above all things bringing neglect of our Duties yet not every such neglect Mortall but In those to our Neighbour such as would absolutely break Friendship In those to our selves such as done us by another would make us fall out with him In those towards God such misrespect as to our Neighbour were want of â—ove Other Neglects are Venial From what 's said follows is most full of Pleasure and Credit Also It fits us for the next world For who loves God or aâ—y thing for it's self is dispos'd to love it ever Wherefore Love of God or desire to see him remaining in a soul separated It shall see him else would bee miserable for loving him and God cruell Further The pleasure of the Mind had by Knowledge infinitly surpassing that of the body and The seeing all Truths in God as in the supreme Cause being the highest Knowledge the Sight of God beatifies a Soul To which is consequent content in our own former Actions and Friend But the things desired by the wicked are temporall fading therefore the dâ—sires of them remaining â—xâ—â—ssively tâ—rments with Greeâ— which inflicted by another is truly Pain Infinit as being in the Soul and Enledss In regard Those Desires must ever remain unchang'd The Soul as indivisible being unaccessive Yet Veniall Affections are changeble therefore may be purg'd Also Souls shal finally receiue their Bodies because Their desires of them are naturall The manner â—ow with The endowments of Glorify'd and contrary Dispositions of damned Bodies Hence A virtuous life finally brings Insinit more Pleasure Honour and Power than a wicked and is above need of wealth The means to bring corrupt Mankind to loue God being Miracles and Teaching and this ineâ—â—icacious unless lively conceited by the Teachers therefore Divine Love or the Holy Ghost was to descend upon the Apostles in virtue of which primitive vâ—gour Christ's doctrin was brought down from them to us that is the Church is truly Apostolical and Catholik as planted by the Apostles universally as having some of her profession in each câ—untry as the only eminent Congregation in Câ—â—istendome Also Having an entire Body of Faith or Doctrin fit to promote Sanctity Laws Customes conformable to that Faith and extraordinary Sanctity attainable by her Principles and practis'd by her children she is likewise Holy Lastly Her rule of Faith Tradition Her externall Profession of Faith and Her Government being the same all ovâ—r She is also One