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A20661 A proufe of certeyne articles in religion, denied by M. Iuell sett furth in defence of the Catholyke beleef therein, by Thomas Dorman, Bachiler of Diuinitie. VVhereunto is added in the end, a conclusion, conteinyng .xij. causes, vvhereby the author acknovvlegeth hym self to haue byn stayd in hys olde Catholyke fayth that he vvas baptized in, vvysshyng the same to be made common to many for the lyke stay in these perilouse tymes. Dorman, Thomas, d. 1577? 1564 (1564) STC 7062; ESTC S110087 184,006 300

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lettres or worde leauing the free election notwithstanding to them to whome of right it apperteineth as this placing of Sadoc in Abiathars office may welbe vnderstande To th'example of Ezechias I answer with the scripture that of all those thinges here rehersed and what so euer elles may be he was onelie the executor the councell and ordering thereof comming alwaies from Esaias the prophete Who as the mouth commaunded the arme that is the prince to doe and put in execution this or that In like māner I answer to the example of Iehu who killed the wicked prophetes but by thaduertisement and sentence as it wer first giuen ageinst them by Haelizeus the prophete sent to Iehu as king by him to be put in execution How Iosias warned the priestes of their office and duety it appeareth in the fourth booke of the kinges where he required the priestes to demaund at goddes handes councell what he and his people should doe so that what so euer he did also he cā be counted no otherwise to haue doen but as a ministre apon the aduertisement and relation of the priestes Nowe as for Iosaphat and Ioas if th'one ouerthrewe the wooddes and hilles where the people lurcked from the temple the other warned the priestes to see better to the reparation of the same what greate matter is this I praie yow or how doeth this proue that kinges ought to haue the chief rule ouer the churche If princes that haue byn in times past had so well looked in this point to their duetie as of right they ought and all good men wishe they had if they had scoured your luskes corners and ouerthrowen the wooddes the blinde cellers and rotten barnes in which yow first vttred your poisoned doctrine neither had that made thē rulers of the church but faithefull and trusty ministers nor yow byn here nowe to trouble the churche of god as yow doe As if on thother side they had also folowed th'example of Ioas in calling apon the reparation of goddes house neither would any good man haue found faulte therewith all nor any wise man haue thought that this should haue made thē the chief gouernours in religion nor finally so many churches lien at this day flat on the ground so many monasteries in which god was serued and the pooer relieued made stables for horses housen for shepe or sties for swine And thus may yow see good readers that all thiese examples alleaged by our aduersaries ar to no purpose as of the which some as of king Dauid who was not a king onely but a prophete also conteine a manifeste fallacie other as that of Iosue that he should receiue especiall commaundemēt of almightie god to meddle with religion an impudent lie some as of Salomon Ezechias and Iehu a figure or phrase of speche as by the scriptures I haue proued and as of Iosias may be also truely answered who enterprised nothing before he had caused the priestes first to goe and consult what he should doe and other some such as of Iosaphat and Ioas as no man euer denied to kinges yea many wishe that in the practising thereof they had in times past and at this daie also would showe them selues much more forward then they haue or doe And last of all yow may see that all wer it so that euery example had plainely concluded their intention that yet it is no good reason to say that therefore our kinges nowe a daies must haue the like auctoritie no more then this that if Moyses had byn no priest it should folow that other temporall gouernours might consecrate bishoppes because he did being none consecrate his brother Aaron or that because Dauid had many wiues therefore our kinges also maie or the cleargie put to death kinges because Samuel did or priestes kille adulterers after th'example of Phinees or one spoile an other I meane of them that be of contrarie opinions in religion because the children of Israel spoiled the Egiptians And here there cōmeth to my remēbraunce an other cause why that reason of theirs should be naught which is this that the priestehod of the Iewes was altogether carnall and fleshelie and might therefore the rather be subiect to the kinges whereas the priesthod of the newe testament is so much more excellent then that as by how much the matter and obiect about which it is occupied the head author and chiefe priest thereof which is no other then Christ him self the eternall priest according to the ordre of Melchisedech doeth far surmount either the matter the priest or priestehod of theirs Which thing S. Petre did not obscurely signify by these wordes vos estis regale sacerdotium yo we ar a kingelie priestehoode as who should say the priestehood before was not kingly for that that kinges ruled ouer priestes but nowe is the priestehod kingly for that to it be subiect euē kinges them selues Which neither is any such greate absurditie if we indifferentlie wey the matter as some men would haue it seme to be considering that Ignatius disciple to S. Iohn the euangelist that all the auncient fathers doe most plainely affirme the same neither yet anie greate reason why thiese wordes should be to any man cause of offence seing that when all is counted this honor of gouernement resteth not in the priestes but goeth farder to god him self whose ministres they ar as contrarywise the dishonor the contumelies and reproches doen vnto them ar doen also to Christ as him selfe witnesseth Qui vos spernit me spernit he that dispiseth yow dispiseth me The which thing I would to god our aduersaries which glory so much of the name of Christians vaunt them selues of the knowledge of the gospell would not thinck scorne to learne by the exāple of a pagane and infidell I meane Alexander the greate Who although he wer by religion an ethnike by nature intollerably proude so that not contentid as Quintus Curtius writeth of him to be born of the race of mortall men he cōueighed his petigrue frō the goddes not suffering but commaunding also that apon peine of his indignation all men should call him the sonne of Iupiter and to encrease the more that naughty humor of his and to poure as the prouerbe is oile in to the fier by fortune so happy that the whole worlde was in a manner by the dent of his sword conquered and brought vnder that at his name the proudest tirants trembled and barbarouse nations stooped he yet all this not withstanding being such and so mighty a Monarche when on a time he should entre in to the citie of Ierusalem as sone as he once perceiued Iaddus the highe priest comming towardes him fell downe and reuerenced him Whereat whē Parmenio one of his trusty friendes marueiling not a little had demaunded of him why he whom all other men worshiped and had in reuerence did worship the prince of the Iewish priestes his answer was
to them thiese perniciouse persuasiōs that they be here in earth by almighty god placed in his churche to be the heads thereof and not membres to be fathers and not children to rule in causes of religion and not to be ruled that to them it belongeth in the right of their crowune to approue doctrine or to condemne it to alter at their pleasure the state of religion by actes of parliament without the consent of their cleargie to depose bishops and put other in their places in their stiles and titles boldely to write them selues gouernours in their realmes in all things and causes aswell ecclesiasticall as temporall and yet no ordre all this while broken because forsoth theie be such as theie beare them in hand they ar that is to say the heades the rulers the shepherdes the fathers maisters and guides in religion Thiese be theie therefore good readers that as the prophete saith call bonum malum malum bonum tenebras lucem lucem ●enebras good euel and euel good darckenes light and light darckenes Thiese be they that as their Idol of Geneua in this poinct trulie giueth answer goe about to make princes iustle with god Finally thiese ar those lowsy brokers that leading as it wer by the hand their good and vertuous princes after this sweete poysoned bait from the most pleasaunt and fertile valeis of humilitie to the toppe of the highe barren and craggy mountaines of pryde and arrogācie showing them when they haue them there the riches and ornaments of the churche the landes and reuenues thereof by good and vertuous princes their predecessors and auncestors long time before for this entent especially thereto giuen that the ministres of Christes most holy word and blessed sacraments being by hauing of their owne deliuered from that comberouse care of prouisiō for them selues that afterward the holy ghost who was the procuror of such almoise and stirred from time to time the deuocion of good men thereto forsaw thorough the decay of pietie and coldenes of charitie towardes the latter ende of the world they wer likelie to fall into might thereby the more quietlie folow their vocation promise of all the same to make them the lordes and maisters if they will doe them homage and fall down and worship them that is to say harckē to their doctrine submit them selues thereto and graunt to it within their realmes and dominions fauorable entreteinement And that this is true good readers that they haue thus shamefully abused and deceiued their princes and not surmised or imagined by me to bring them in to hatred whome god I take to recorde I pity much and hate nothing I hope by his assistāce who is the giuer of all good thinges ●o plainely to proue that yow your selues shall at the eye see it and they if there remain yet in them anie sparcle of grace shall not be hable to denie it The which that I may the better perform I shall truly bring furth as it wer into the face of the open courte all such euidence of importance as either parte hath to alleage for them selfe so truely Itrust that the councel of th'other side shall haue no cause to complaine that either I haue suppressed and cōcealed their necessary proofes one waie or obscured their beauty in the bringing of thē furth on th' other But because an indifferent and vpright iudge must alwaies haue an earnest eye to the issue which is betwene vs who should gouerne in ecclesiasticall causes the prince or the priest it shall not be amisse because to be chief gouernour in thinges and causes ecclesiasticall is nothing elles but to haue the supreme iurisdiction thereto belonging to examine first in what poinctes that consisteth that so by conferring our euidence wyth the same whether it agre with euery parte with none with some and with which we maie at the length by good scanning comme to the knowledge of euery mans owne Iurisdiction therefore ecclesiasticall consisteth especially in thre poinctes in auctoritie to iudge ouer doctrine whych is sound and which is other in the power of the keyes that is to say as our sauiour him self hath expounded it in loosing and binding excommunicating and absoluing in making rules and lawes for the gouernement of the church and in the ministery of the word and the sacraments To the first of thiese three what title Kinges and princes haue it shall if theie haue anie be seene hereafter But for priestes yow shall see to begin withall an auncient commission out of the scriptures where almighty god speking to Aaron vsed thiese wordes Praeceptum sempiternum e●t in gener ationes vestra vt habeatis scientiam discernendi inter sanctum prophanum inter pollutum mundum doc●atisqué filios Israel omnia ●egitima mea that is to say it is a precept that shall euer endure thorough all your generations to haue the knowledge to discern and put difference betwene holy thinges and prophane betwene cleane and polluted and that yow teache the children of Israel all my commaundements To whome gaue almightie god here the power to iudge of doctrine whome commaunded he to teache anie other then Aaron and his race which wer priestes In the booke of Deuterō saieth he not also that if there arise any hard or doutefull question the priest must be consulted that he that of pride will spurn ageinst his ordinance shall suffer death therefore and agein in the same booke in an other place that apon the priestes word all causes shall hang. Ezechiel the prophete doeth he not witnesse the same ▪ and when there is anie controuersy sayth he they shall stay in my iudgements and giue iudgement Aggeus and Malachias prophetes bothe bid they vs enquier for the law of god at the priestes handes or at the kinges No assuredlie they send vs not to kinges which had they bene the chiefe gouernours in those matters without faile they would haue doen but to the priestes whose lippes they promise shall not misse to kepe the true knowledge because theie ar our lordes angels Haue we any such warrant of worldely princes No trulie And wer it not more thē necessary that we should if princes should rule them in matters of religion of whom thiese wordes be spoken But to procede is this auctoritie giue to them onely in the olde testament●ar they not put trow yow in as greate trust in the newe Or ar they thinck yow excluded and kinges admitted the●e●●● If it had bene so neuer would S. Paule t●at bles●ed apos●le haue made his accopte that god had placed in his churche first apostles next to them prophetes then doctours and so furth Emongest all the which although that frantick foole that preaching not many yea●e● sence at Powles crosse went about with his rayling Rhetoricke to make his audience as foolish as he was ma●de in bele●ing that this place should make ageinst the auctoritie of the pope because