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country_n church_n city_n diocese_n 1,863 5 11.6964 5 true
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A27035 A second true defence of the meer nonconformists against the untrue accusations, reasonings, and history of Dr. Edward Stillingfleet ... clearly proving that it is (not sin but) duty 1. not wilfully to commit the many sins of conformity, 2. not sacrilegiously to forsake the preaching of the Gospel, 3. not to cease publick worshipping of God, 4. to use needful pastoral helps for salvation ... / written by Richard Baxter ... ; with some notes on Mr. Joseph Glanviles Zealous and impartial Protestant, and Dr. L. Moulins character. Baxter, Richard, 1615-1691. 1681 (1681) Wing B1405; ESTC R5124 188,187 234

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justinian_n and_o of_o seven_o after_o and_o proconsular_a and_o the_o church_n call_v africa_n caput_fw-la as_o august_n ep_n 162._o the_o six_o and_o seven_o carthage_n council_n tell_v we_o of_o the_o distribution_n of_o the_o province_n decree_a three_o judge_n to_o be_v send_v out_o of_o each_o province_n viz._n carthage_n numidia_n byzacena_n mauritania_n etc._n etc._n yea_o leo_n 9_o p._n in_o epist_n ad_fw-la thom._n etc._n etc._n say_v that_o the_o bishop_n of_o carthage_n be_v post_n pont._n rom._n primus_fw-la archiepiscopus_fw-la &_o totius_fw-la africa_n maximus_fw-la metropolitanus_n though_o yet_o binnius_n true_o say_v that_o in_o cyprian_n time_n he_o be_v not_o a_o archbishop_n that_o be_v no_o proper_a governor_n of_o bishop_n because_o they_o conclude_v in_o council_n nemo_fw-la nostrum_fw-la dicitur_fw-la episcopus_fw-la episcoporum_fw-la but_o he_o be_v the_o chief_a of_o that_o great_a province_n and_o the_o dr._n himself_o out_o of_o victor_n mention_v one_o 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so_o to_o save_v herself_o what_o be_v it_o in_o he_o to_o destroy_v or_o abuse_v she_o if_o we_o be_v forbid_v to_o take_v poison_n and_o one_o will_v causeless_o command_v we_o to_o take_v a_o doubtful_a thing_n as_o nightshade_n hemlock_n a●ripigmentum_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o then_o condemn_v we_o as_o disobedient_a for_o refuse_v he_o be_v the_o unfit_a person_n to_o condemn_v we_o if_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o avoid_v a_o house_n that_o have_v the_o plague_n a_o man_n be_v excusable_a that_o mistake_v the_o spot_a fever_n for_o it_o be_v your_o congregation_n but_o full_a of_o person_n that_o have_v the_o scab_n of_o the_o small_a pox_n not_o dry_v away_o and_o one_o go_v to_o a_o sound_a congregation_n for_o fear_n of_o infection_n not_o at_o all_o condemn_a you_o he_o may_v be_v bear_v with_o
1._o the_o eunuch_n baptize_v in_o his_o travail_n acts._n 9_o be_v only_o a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n universal_a 2._o those_o that_o be_v convert_v by_o frumentius_n and_o edesius_n when_o there_o be_v no_o particular_a church_n and_o all_o that_o be_v first_o convert_v in_o any_o infidel_n or_o heathen_a land_n before_o any_o church_n be_v form_v 3._o those_o that_o by_o shipwreck_n be_v cast_v on_o heathen_a country_n where_o no_o church_n be_v 4._o traveller_n that_o go_v from_o country_n to_o country_n as_o lythgow_n do_v nineteen_o year_n and_o other_o many_o and_o i_o think_v he_o unhappy_o name_v jerusalem_n where_o traveller_n come_v that_o be_v of_o no_o fix_a church_n unless_o he_o in_o that_o also_o be_v a_o superindependant_a and_o think_v that_o man_n may_v be_v many_o year_n member_n of_o a_o church_n many_o hundred_o mile_n off_o which_o they_o have_v no_o personal_a communion_n with_o 5._o merchant_n and_o factor_n who_o be_v call_v to_o dwell_v long_o among_o infidel_n where_o be_v no_o church_n 6._o ambassador_n who_o by_o their_o prince_n be_v send_v to_o reside_v among_o such_o much_o of_o their_o life_n 7._o wanderer_n that_o have_v no_o fix_a habitation_n as_o many_o pedlar_n and_o other_o poor_a wander_a tradesman_n and_o loose_a beggar_n that_o have_v no_o dwelling_n 8._o those_o that_fw-mi live_v among_o papist_n or_o any_o other_o christian_n who_o impose_v some_o sin_n as_o a_o condition_n of_o communion_n 9_o those_o that_o live_v among_o such_o christian_n as_o have_v no_o true_a pastor_n who_o be_v constitutive_a part_n of_o particular_a church_n some_o be_v incapable_a through_o insufficiency_n some_o by_o heresy_n and_o some_o for_o want_v of_o a_o true_a call_n such_o as_o by_o mr_n dodwells_n doctrine_n most_o of_o the_o christian_a world_n be_v for_o want_v of_o uninterrupted_a rrue_a episcopal_a ordination_n 10._o those_o who_o be_v subject_n to_o such_o as_o permit_v they_o not_o to_o be_v fix_v member_n as_o wife_n hinder_v by_o husband_n child_n by_o parent_n and_o some_o subject_n violent_o hinder_v by_o prince_n who_o yet_o allow_v they_o transient_a communion_n and_o very_o a_o man_n will_v think_v by_o the_o write_n of_o many_o conformist_n that_o they_o take_v it_o for_o a_o duty_n to_o obey_v a_o prince_n in_o such_o a_o case_n 11._o those_o who_o live_v where_o church-corruption_n be_v not_o so_o great_a as_o to_o make_v transient_a communion_n unlawful_a but_o so_o great_a as_o to_o make_v fix_v communion_n seem_v to_o be_v a_o culpable_a consent_n if_o i_o come_v in_o travel_n to_o a_o church_n of_o stranger_n i_o be_o not_o bind_v to_o examine_v what_o their_o discipline_n be_v what_o their_o life_n be_v or_o how_o their_o pastor_n be_v call_v but_o where_o i_o be_o fix_v i_o be_o more_o bind_v to_o know_v these_o and_o if_o i_o find_v they_o exclude_v discipline_n live_v wicked_o and_o have_v unlawful_a pastor_n i_o may_v in_o some_o case_n be_v a_o partaker_n of_o the_o sin_n if_o i_o fix_v among_o they_o 12._o they_o that_o live_v in_o a_o time_n and_o place_n of_o schism_n and_o distraction_n strive_v who_o shall_v prevail_v and_o condemn_v each_o other_o all_o follow_v several_a faction_n and_o need_v reconciler_n it_o may_v for_o a_o time_n become_v in_o prudence_n the_o duty_n of_o peacemaker_n to_o own_v no_o faction_n nor_o to_o be_v more_o of_o one_o church_n than_o of_o another_o while_o he_o see_v that_o it_o will_v do_v more_o hurt_n than_o good_a and_o those_o that_o wait_v in_o hope_n as_o the_o nonconformist_n now_o do_v to_o see_v whether_o their_o ruler_n will_v restore_v they_o to_o reform_a parish_n church_n may_v at_o once_o in_o prudence_n find_v it_o needful_a neither_o to_o fix_v as_o member_n in_o some_o parish_n church_n till_o reform_v in_o the_o teacher_n at_o least_o nor_o to_o seem_v to_o be_v separatist_n by_o gather_v new_a church_n in_o none_o of_o all_o these_o case_n be_v a_o man_n unchristened_a nor_o schismatical_a for_o be_v no_o fix_a member_n of_o any_o church_n beside_o the_o universal_a and_o as_o it_o be_v the_o ill_a hap_n of_o these_o man_n common_o to_o strike_v themselves_o i_o doubt_v they_o will_v prove_v grotius_n himself_o no_o christian_n by_o this_o rule_n who_o for_o many_o year_n before_o he_o die_v they_o say_v join_v with_o no_o particular_a church_n as_o a_o fix_a member_n and_o i_o know_v not_o well_o what_o particular_a church_n they_o make_v the_o king_n a_o member_n of_o sect._n 2._o to_o his_o question_n pag._n 3._o be_v we_o not_o baptise_a into_o this_o church_n and_o do_v you_o not_o renounce_v membership_n this_o be_v scarce_o a_o civility_n i_o answer_v 1._o this_o church_n which_o church_n do_v you_o mean_v i_o be_v not_o baptise_a into_o st._n giles_n nor_o st._n andrew_n parish_n church_n but_o into_o one_o above_o a_o hundred_o mile_n off_o and_o yet_o my_o removal_n make_v i_o no_o culpable_a separatist_n or_o do_v he_o mean_v this_o diocesan_n church_n no_o i_o be_v baptise_a in_o the_o diocese_n of_o lichfield_n do_v he_o mean_v this_o national_a church_n as_o it_o be_v suppose_v a_o political_a body_n constitute_v of_o the_o ecclesiastical_a govern_n and_o govern_v part_n he_o say_v there_o be_v no_o such_o church_n of_o england_n but_o that_o it_o infer_v popery_n to_o assert_v such_o but_o if_o he_o equivocate_v here_o and_o mean_v not_o by_o a_o church_n as_o in_o the_o rest_n but_o either_o a_o christian_n kingdom_n or_o a_o agree_v association_n of_o many_o church_n i_o be_o still_o a_o fix_a member_n of_o such_o a_o kingdom_n and_o of_o such_o a_o association_n in_o all_o thing_n necessary_a to_o church_n and_o christian_a communion_n 2._o but_o baptism_n as_o such_o enter_v i_o only_o into_o the_o universal_a church_n much_o less_o do_v it_o fix_v i_o in_o any_o other_o i_o be_v baptise_a where_o i_o be_v to_o stay_v but_o a_o little_a while_n and_o this_o phrase_n of_o be_v baptise_a into_o our_o church_n be_v to_o i_o of_o ill_a sound_n or_o intimation_n bellarmine_n say_v that_o all_o that_o be_v baptize_v be_v interpretative_o thereby_o engage_v to_o the_o pope_n i_o be_v baptize_v in_o a_o parish_n and_o in_o a_o diocese_n and_o in_o a_o christian_a kingdom_n but_o not_o so_o into_o they_o as_o to_o be_v oblige_v to_o continue_v under_o that_o priest_n or_o bishop_n or_o in_o that_o kingdom_n and_o my_o baptism_n i_o hope_v do_v not_o oblige_v i_o to_o every_o canon_n ceremony_n form_n or_o sin_n of_o the_o associate_v church_n in_o england_n abusive_o by_o he_o call_v one_o church_n 3._o and_o unhappy_o it_o be_v not_o mere_a independency_n that_o he_o be_v still_o plead_v for_o but_o some_o extreme_n which_o the_o moderate_a independent_n disclaim_v viz._n that_o a_o member_n of_o their_o church_n be_v so_o tie_v to_o they_o that_o they_o may_v not_o remove_v to_o another_o without_o their_o consent_n and_o be_o i_o so_o tie_v to_o what_o to_o parochial_a or_o to_o the_o diocesan_n or_o to_o the_o association_n of_o english_a church_n if_o it_o have_v be_v to_o the_o species_n i_o will_v fain_o know_v whether_o their_o thing_n call_v by_o they_o indifferent_n specify_v they_o sect._n 3_o p._n 111_o 112._o he_o yet_o more_o plead_v as_o for_o separation_n why_o then_o above_o once_o or_o twice_o why_o shall_v i_o so_o countenance_v defective_a worship_n and_o not_o rather_o reprove_v it_o by_o total_a forbearance_n of_o communion_n etc._n etc._n answ_n my_o reason_n i_o tell_v he_o because_o the_o accident_n may_v continue_v which_o make_v it_o a_o duty_n but_o i_o can_v hinder_v other_o from_o yield_v to_o his_o argument_n let_v he_o make_v his_o best_a of_o they_o only_o i_o must_v tell_v he_o yet_o 1._o that_o if_o he_o lie_v his_o cause_n on_o this_o that_o their_o parochial_a or_o diocesan_n church_n be_v not_o defective_a 2._o or_o that_o the_o defect_n can_v by_o other_o be_v avoid_v he_o will_v quite_o mar_v his_o matter_n and_o undo_v all_o by_o overdo_v 3._o and_o if_o he_o indeed_o think_v that_o all_o defective_a church_n must_v be_v forsake_v he_o will_v be_v one_o of_o the_o great_a schismatic_n in_o the_o world_n but_o who_o can_v reconcile_v this_o with_o the_o scope_n of_o his_o whole_a book_n sect._n 4._o p._n 112._o he_o say_v here_o be_v no_o bound_n set_v to_o people_n fancy_n of_o pure_a administration_n answ_n have_v i_o so_o oft_o and_o copious_o name_v the_o bound_n and_o now_o be_v the_o answer_n hear_v be_v none_o be_v there_o none_o in_o all_o the_o same_o book_n he_o cit_v 2._o scripture_n be_v their_o bound_n as_o he_o well_o open_v in_o his_o desence_n of_o bishop_n laud._n sect._n 5._o p._n 114._o he_o complain_v of_o my_o leave_v out_o the_o best_a part_n of_o his_o argument_n viz._n the_o people_n may_v go_v
more_n and_o more_o untruth_n 1._o where_o do_v i_o say_v that_o own_v itself_o to_o be_v independent_a as_o if_o that_o be_v necessary_a to_o its_o be_v 1._o do_v he_o not_o confess_v that_o i_o own_o general_a visitor_n or_o archbishop_n and_o appeal_n 2._o that_o i_o own_o association_n which_o he_o make_v the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n 3._o that_o i_o own_o synod_n for_o oblige_a concord_n 4._o that_o i_o own_o the_o magistrate_n government_n of_o all_o be_v there_o no_o dependency_n in_o any_o of_o these_o or_o all_o what_o dependency_n more_o do_v he_o assert_v 2._o as_o to_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n dare_v he_o come_v into_o the_o light_n and_o tell_v we_o whether_o any_o power_n of_o the_o key_n that_o be_v of_o the_o government_n of_o his_o particular_a church_n be_v essential_a to_o the_o pastor_n of_o a_o true_a organise_v govern_v church_n or_o not_o if_o not_o be_v it_o not_o a_o contradiction_n to_o call_v it_o a_o govern_v church_n if_o yea_o than_o be_v he_o a_o pastor_n that_o want_v what_o be_v essential_a to_o a_o pastor_n but_o if_o they_o will_v call_v a_o force_a power_n or_o the_o present_a secular_a mode_n of_o their_o court_n by_o the_o name_n of_o the_o key_n i_o never_o say_v that_o these_o be_v essential_a to_o a_o church_n nor_o desirable_a in_o it_o but_o be_o a_o nonconformist_n because_o i_o will_v not_o by_o oath_n or_o covenant_n renounce_v just_a endeavour_n to_o amend_v it_o sect._n 12._o p._n 121_o 122._o the_o next_o accusation_n be_v they_o leave_v it_o in_o the_o people_n power_n notwithstanding_o all_o legal_a establishment_n to_o own_o or_o disown_n who_o they_o judge_v fit_a answ_n he_o tire_v i_o with_o put_v i_o on_o repetition_n 1._o they_o can_v unjust_o judge_v of_o none_o and_o disow_v they_o without_o sin_n it_o be_v not_o i_o that_o give_v man_n power_n to_o sin_n no_o more_o than_o power_n to_o die_v or_o be_v sick_a which_o be_v but_o impotency_n will_v i_o can_v give_v they_o power_n against_o it_o 2._o it_o be_v not_o power_n to_o reject_v any_o choose_v by_o king_n or_o patron_n from_o be_v public_a teacher_n or_o to_o have_v the_o tithe_n and_o temple_n nor_o to_o be_v a_o pastor_n to_o other_o but_o it_o be_v to_o have_v a_o discern_a judgement_n whether_o one_o choose_v by_o the_o patron_n be_v a_o person_n to_o who_o he_o himself_o ought_v to_o trust_v the_o pastoral_a conduct_n of_o his_o soul_n either_o the_o dr._n think_v that_o layman_n have_v this_o discern_a power_n and_o duty_n or_o not_o if_o yea_o be_v it_o nothing_o to_o he_o to_o seem_v thus_o serious_o to_o plead_v against_o his_o conscience_n if_o not_o i_o ask_v he_o 1._o what_o mean_v christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n to_o call_v man_n to_o beware_v of_o false_a teacher_n to_o avoid_v the_o leven_n of_o their_o doctrine_n to_o mark_v they_o and_o avoid_v they_o and_o turn_v away_o from_o they_o and_o not_o bid_v they_o good_a speed_n 2._o what_o mean_v all_o the_o ancient_a church_n to_o forbid_v communion_n with_o heretic_n and_o even_o some_o pope_n and_o council_n to_o hear_v mass_n of_o fornicator_n ●_o what_o mean_v all_o those_o father_n and_o council_n that_o make_v he_o no_o bishop_n that_o come_v not_o in_o with_o the_o people_n consent_n if_o not_o election_n 4._o why_o will_v he_o not_o be_v entreat_v to_o tell_v we_o in_o what_o country_n or_o with_o what_o limitation_n the_o contrary_a doctrine_n must_v be_v receive_v must_v all_o the_o people_n trust_v only_o such_o pastor_n as_o the_o prince_n or_o patron_n choose_v all_o over_o england_n or_o also_o in_o ireland_n france_n spain_n italy_n germany_n among_o lutheran_n calvinist_n greek_n etc._n etc._n suppose_v the_o law_n be_v on_o that_o side_n must_v we_o all_o be_v of_o the_o king_n or_o patron_n religion_n 5._o be_v this_o agreeable_a to_o his_o old_a doctrine_n cite_v chap._n 1._o sect._n 13._o p._n 122._o he_o add_v mr._n baxter_n speak_v his_o mind_n very_o free_o against_o the_o right_n and_o patronage_n and_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n in_o such_o case_n and_o plead_v for_o the_o unalterable_a right_n of_o the_o people_n as_o the_o old_a separatist_n do_v ans_fw-fr be_v this_o true_a 1._o what_o be_v it_o against_o the_o right_n of_o patronage_n or_o magistrate_n power_n for_o i_o to_o choose_v who_o i_o will_v trust_v the_o guidance_n of_o my_o soul_n with_o while_o i_o contradict_v not_o his_o power_n to_o choose_v public_a teacher_n and_o give_v the_o tithe_n and_o temple_n and_o confess_v that_o for_o order_n sake_n i_o ought_v to_o consent_v to_o such_o as_o he_o choose_v thus_o unless_o he_o put_v on_o i_o a_o true_a necessity_n of_o a_o better_a choice_n if_o the_o king_n choose_v all_o the_o hospital_n physician_n what_o wrong_n be_v it_o to_o he_o if_o i_o at_o my_o own_o charge_n choose_v a_o better_a for_o myself_o when_o i_o think_v else_o ignorance_n or_o malice_n will_v murder_v i_o do_v he_o that_o desire_v as_o i_o ever_o do_v that_o in_o so_o great_a a_o case_n there_o may_v be_v many_o lock_n to_o the_o church_n door_n deny_v any_o one_o of_o they_o viz._n the_o ordainers_n consent_n the_o magistrate_n and_o patron_n and_o the_o people_n be_v this_o the_o same_o that_o the_o old_a separatist_n do_v shall_v glocesier_n take_v goodman_n a_o papist_n for_o their_o bishop_n because_o the_o king_n choose_v he_o abundance_n of_o patron_n in_o the_o begin_n of_o q._n elizabeth_n reign_n present_v papist_n it_o seem_v if_o they_o be_v impose_v by_o law_n and_o patron_n you_o will_v have_v the_o people_n submit_v to_o those_o that_o cry_v down_o bishop_n liturgy_n and_o ceremony_n too_o father_n paul_n sarpi_n translate_v by_o dr._n denton_n will_v tell_v you_o how_o new_a a_o way_n this_o be_v sect._n 14._o p._n 122._o he_o add_v the_o people_n be_v make_v judge_n of_o the_o competency_n of_o their_o minister_n answ_n they_o be_v discern_v judge_n do_v not_o your_o charge_n imply_v that_o you_o think_v otherwise_o and_o yet_o you_o dare_v not_o say_v so_o must_v they_o not_o judge_v when_o foreigner_n heretofore_o be_v set_v over_o they_o whether_o they_o speak_v english_a or_o no_o or_o if_o a_o socinian_n deny_v christ_n godhead_n or_o the_o in_o mortality_n of_o the_o soul_n whether_o he_o be_v competent_a or_o not_o or_o if_o they_o have_v a_o ignorant_a curate_n that_o when_o necessary_a advice_n for_o the_o soul_n be_v ask_v of_o he_o will_v say_v no_o more_o but_o trouble_v not_o your_o head_n about_o such_o matter_n but_o cast_v away_o care_n and_o live_v merry_o if_o when_o the_o blind_a lead_v the_o blind_a both_o fall_n into_o the_o ditch_n must_v we_o not_o note_v the_o difference_n alas_o how_o little_a will_v some_o man_n have_v a_o man_n care_n for_o his_o soul_n in_o comparison_n of_o care_v what_o physic_n what_o food_n what_o wife_n what_o servant_n what_o trade_n he_o choose_v trust_v one_o to_o the_o conduct_n of_o such_o as_o all_o the_o patron_n of_o england_n will_v choose_v for_o you_o but_o not_o any_o of_o the_o other_o as_o to_o the_o not_o causeless_a forsake_v former_a pastor_n he_o know_v that_o it_o be_v the_o strict_a charge_n of_o the_o old_a canon_n of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o bishop_n themselves_o do_v hold_v the_o same_o i_o think_v they_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v forsake_v because_o man_n thrust_v they_o out_o the_o church_n at_o antioch_n alexandria_n and_o many_o more_o do_v oft_o and_o long_o cleave_v to_o those_o pastor_n who_o the_o christian_a emperor_n cast_v out_o and_o reject_v those_o who_o they_o impose_v when_o i_o have_v prove_v this_o so_o full_o in_o my_o first_o plea_n and_o church-history_n what_o a_o unsatisfactory_a answer_n be_v it_o for_o such_o a_o dr._n to_o repeat_v it_o and_o say_v this_o be_v plain_a deal_n be_v the_o judgement_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n so_o light_a with_o he_o sect._n 15._o p._n 123._o the_o next_o charge_n be_v they_o give_v direction_n to_o the_o people_n what_o sort_n of_o minister_n they_o shall_v own_v and_o what_o not_o answ_n we_o do_v so_o and_o i_o have_v think_v all_o christian_n have_v be_v of_o the_o same_o mind_n it_o be_v sad_a with_o the_o church_n when_o this_o doctrine_n need_v a_o public_a defence_n dare_v he_o say_v that_o all_o impose_v must_v be_v own_v then_o either_o salvation_n be_v at_o the_o magistrate_n will_v or_o it_o be_v the_o privilege_n of_o such_o country_n as_o have_v good_a one_o or_o a_o man_n may_v be_v save_v in_o any_o country_n religion_n contrary_a to_o the_o article_n which_o they_o all_o subscribe_v sect._n 16._o next_o the_o accuser_n fall_v on_o my_o general_a rule_n the_o ministry_n that_o tend_v to_o destruction_n more_o than_o to_o edification_n and_o to_o do_v
more_o such_o may_v have_v deceive_v a_o man_n that_o judge_v by_o his_o word_n and_o his_o argue_v that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o preach_v to_o they_o because_o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o hear_v what_o be_v the_o meaning_n of_o all_o this_o if_o not_o silence_v we_o sect._n 34._o p._n 140._o the_o next_o crime_n be_v plea_n p._n 42._o as_o long_o as_o they_o suppose_v the_o term_n of_o our_o communion_n to_o be_v sinful_a they_o say_v the_o schism_n do_v not_o lie_v on_o those_o that_o separate_v but_o on_o those_o that_o do_v impose_v such_o term_n and_o therefore_o they_o may_v lawful_o separate_v from_o such_o imposer_n ans_fw-fr it_o be_v hard_a to_o know_v what_o word_n to_o use_v to_o detect_v all_o these_o historical_a untruth_n without_o be_v think_v passionate_a 1._o i_o never_o say_v that_o suppose_v they_o sinful_a will_v justify_v a_o false_a supposer_n but_o have_v oft_o say_v the_o clean_a contrary_n their_o suppose_n be_v of_o his_o forge_n 2._o i_o say_v not_o the_o schism_n do_v not_o lie_v on_o those_o that_o separate_a but_o only_o that_o its_o schism_n in_o the_o imposer_n this_o also_o be_v his_o fiction_n 3._o and_o i_o say_v not_o and_o therefore_o they_o may_v lawful_o separate_v from_o such_o imposer_n but_o all_o reader_n will_v not_o stay_v to_o find_v out_o his_o forgery_n but_o how_o much_o of_o this_o he_o say_v once_o himself_o see_v in_o my_o chap._n 1._o sect._n 49._o but_o here_o he_o come_v to_o some_o close_a distinction_n which_o shall_v have_v go_v before_o between_o term_n of_o communion_n plain_o and_o in_o themselves_o sinful_a and_o such_o as_o be_v only_o fancy_v to_o be_v so_o through_o prejudice_n or_o wilful_a ignorance_n or_o error_n of_o conscience_n ans_fw-fr what_o a_o deal_n of_o labour_n may_v he_o have_v spare_v himself_o and_o we_o if_o he_o have_v here_o fix_v the_o controversy_n in_o the_o beginning_n we_o thankful_o accept_v your_o late_a distinction_n we_o ever_o desire_v here_o to_o put_v it_o to_o the_o issue_n if_o it_o be_v through_o prejudice_n wilful_a ignorance_n or_o error_n that_o we_o judge_v conformity_n a_o sin_n not_o only_a separation_n but_o nonconformity_n be_v a_o sin_n if_o we_o do_v not_o prove_v some_o part_n of_o conformity_n for_o one_o be_v enough_o to_o be_v plain_o sinful_a which_o be_v impose_v as_o condition_n of_o our_o ministerial_a communion_n and_o somewhat_o impose_v on_o the_o people_n as_o condition_n 〈◊〉_d all_o that_o part_n of_o your_o communion_n which_o i_o ever_o dissuade_v they_o from_o let_v the_o blame_n be_v we_o sect._n 35._o he_o pass_v next_o to_o they_o that_o deal_v more_o ingenuous_o than_o i_o in_o own_v separation_n and_o then_o return_v to_o i_o p._n 151._o and_o he_o over_o and_o over_o repeat_v his_o false_a accusation_n that_o i_o think_v it_o lawful_a to_o communicate_v with_o they_o occasional_o but_o not_o as_o church_n as_o think_v they_o want_v a_o essential_a part_n viz._n a_o pastor_n with_o episcopal_a power_n but_o as_o oratory_n and_o so_o that_o i_o renounce_v communion_n with_o their_o church_n as_o church_n answ_n if_o these_o untruth_n have_v be_v make_v without_o evidence_n only_o and_o not_o also_o against_o evidence_n they_o have_v be_v the_o more_o excusable_a in_o a_o man_n of_o consideration_n but_o now_o they_o be_v not_o so_o when_o i_o have_v so_o often_o declare_v that_o i_o take_v the_o parish_n church_n that_o have_v true_a pastor_n for_o true_a govern_v church_n and_o prove_v that_o they_o have_v true_a bishop_n episcopos_fw-la gregis_fw-la whether_o the_o diocesan_n will_v or_o not_o because_o god_n will_v and_o not_o the_o invester_n institute_v their_o office_n and_o measure_v their_o power_n and_o the_o people_n show_v their_o consent_n by_o constant_a communion_n sect._n 36._o then_o because_o i_o never_o gather_v a_o church_n nor_o baptize_v any_o in_o 20_o year_n nor_o give_v the_o sacrament_n in_o 18_o he_o will_v know_v what_o church_n i_o have_v be_v of_o all_o this_o time_n and_o he_o suppose_v of_o no_o church_n ans_fw-fr i_o think_v he_o have_v do_v with_o this_o before_o but_o he_o think_v it_o a_o advantage_n not_o to_o be_v so_o easy_o let_v go_v will_v he_o know_v 1._o what_o my_o thought_n be_v 2._o or_o my_o church-covenant_n 3._o or_o my_o actual_a communion_n he_o shall_v know_v all_o 1._o i_o think_v divers_a minister_n where_o i_o live_v true_a pastor_n and_o the_o church_n true_a church_n i_o can_v say_v so_o of_o every_o curate_n 2._o i_o make_v no_o covenant_n with_o any_o of_o they_o if_o i_o have_v mr._n cheny_n will_v have_v condemn_v i_o of_o atheism_n infidelity_n and_o what_o not_o 3._o with_o divers_a of_o they_o i_o go_v constant_o to_o the_o liturgy_n sermon_n and_o sacrament_n as_o with_o true_a church_n with_o some_o of_o they_o i_o only_o join_v in_o prayer_n and_o hear_n i_o hear_v dr._n rieves_n till_o he_o cause_v i_o to_o be_v send_v to_o jail_n and_o then_o i_o can_v not_o and_o though_o i_o be_v accuse_v by_o many_o for_o hear_v a_o swearer_n i_o tell_v they_o he_o swear_v not_o in_o the_o pulpit_n i_o hear_v his_o poor_a curate_n constant_o when_o i_o be_v accuse_v for_o hear_v a_o drunkard_n and_o tell_v they_o that_o he_o be_v not_o drink_v in_o the_o pulpit_n but_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o i_o communicate_v also_o with_o some_o nonconformist_n and_o now_o account_v i_o of_o a_o church_n or_o no_o church_n as_o you_o please_v i_o doubt_v you_o be_v renew_v the_o independent_a question_n with_o i_o which_o i_o be_o loath_a to_o dispute_v 1._o qu._n whether_o a_o ordain_a minister_n must_v be_v a_o private_a member_n of_o another_o man_n church_n q._n 2._o whether_o when_o a_o nonresident_a dean_n leave_v his_o parish_n to_o a_o ignorant_a drunken_a curate_n the_o parish_n church_n be_v essentiate_v by_o its_o relation_n to_o the_o resident_n curate_n or_o the_o nonresident_a dean_n q._n 3._o whether_o a_o minister_n not_o degrade_v but_o silence_v live_v in_o such_o a_o parish_n be_v bind_v to●ke_v that_o curate_n for_o one_o that_o have_v the_o pastoral_a charge_n of_o his_o soul_n and_o a●_n the_o rest_n of_o the_o flock_n to_o commit_v his_o soul_n to_o his_o pastoral_n conduct_v in_o personal_a private_a and_o public_a office_n 4._o but_o i_o will_v ask_v the_o dean_n himself_o whether_o a_o man_n may_v not_o be_v a_o fix_a member_n of_o two_o or_o three_o church_n at_o once_o the_o reason_n of_o the_o quaere_fw-la be_v 1._o because_o by_o they_o a_o man_n may_v be_v the_o sixed_a pastor_n of_o two_o or_o three_o parish_n church_n at_o once_o and_o a_o integral_a member_n of_o many_o be_v not_o so_o hard_a a_o case_n as_o to_o be_v a_o constitutive_a regent_n part_n of_o many_o 2._o because_o a_o man_n may_v have_v two_o house_n in_o two_o parish_n at_o once_o as_o many_o londoner_n have_v half_a their_o family_n at_o a_o near_a country_n house_n and_o half_a at_o a_o city_n house_n and_o be_v themselves_o part_n of_o the_o week_n or_o day_n at_o one_o and_o part_n at_o the_o other_o and_o they_o make_v covenant_n with_o neither_o but_o what_o actual_a communion_n intimate_v q._n ●_o and_o if_o so_o why_o may_v not_o i_o at_o once_o be_v judge_v a_o member_n of_o two_o church_n at_o once_o so_o far_o as_o i_o communicate_v oft_o with_o both_o i_o therefore_o answer_v his_o question_n further_o what_o church_n i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o 1._o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o christ_n universal_a church_n be_v that_o none_o and_o yet_o be_v in_o the_o creed_n 2._o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o reform_a church_n if_o you_o will_v call_v that_o one_o because_o associate_v in_o one_o reform_a religion_n 3._o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n both_o as_o a_o christian_a kingdom_n and_o as_o the_o church_n in_o england_n agree_v in_o the_o christian_a reform_a religion_n 4_o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o provincial_a church_n of_o canterbury_n so_o far_o as_o live_v peaceable_o in_o it_o and_o submit_v both_o to_o such_o power_n as_o they_o have_v from_o the_o king_n as_o magistrate_n and_o a_o mere_a general_n help_v instruct_v care_n of_o many_o church_n can_v make_v i_o 5._o so_o far_o also_o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o diocesan_n church_n where_o i_o live_v 6._o and_o i_o be_v a_o member_n of_o some_o parochial_a church_n so_o far_o as_o constant_a communion_n can_v make_v or_o prove_v i_o and_o of_o other_o two_o at_z once_o so_o far_o as_o partial_a and_o movable_a communion_n can_v prove_v i_o if_o this_o will_v not_o satisfy_v you_o i_o have_v prove_v before_o and_o oft_o to_o some_o independent_n that_o many_o man_n be_v under_o no_o obligation_n to_o be_v fix_v member_n of_o any_o parish_n church_n whether_o the_o
superstition_n etc._n etc._n i_o name_v many_o case_n in_o which_o a_o image_n may_v be_v use_v and_o say_v that_o it_o be_v not_o unlawful_a to_o pray_v before_o or_o towards_o a_o image_n in_o a_o room_n where_o they_o be_v place_v only_o for_o ornament_n etc._n etc._n be_v this_o to_o say_v worship_n may_v be_v direct_v to_o it_o or_o that_o we_o may_v kneel_v before_o a_o crucifix_n when_o i_o have_v before_o except_v the_o image_n of_o god_n christ_n etc._n etc._n in_o worship_n on_o several_a reason_n do_v any_o protestant_a doubt_n of_o what_o i_o assert_v my_o parlour_n have_v on_o all_o four_o side_n the_o picture_n of_o our_o live_a friend_n must_v i_o not_o pray_v in_o that_o room_n because_o my_o face_n will_v be_v still_o towards_o some_o of_o they_o do_v he_o doubt_v of_o this_o or_o be_v not_o his_o cite_n one_o half_a of_o the_o word_n as_o he_o do_v to_o deceive_v his_o credulous_a reader_n if_o not_o worse_o §_o 10._o he_o say_v kneel_v before_o a_o crucifix_n be_v lawful_a to_o he_o suppose_v the_o mind_n be_v only_o excite_v by_o it_o answ_n a_o calumny_n make_v up_o by_o set_v together_o two_o scrap_n of_o remote_a sentence_n 1._o because_o i_o say_v it_o be_v lawful_a to_o pray_v in_o a_o room_n where_o picture_n not_o any_o be_v before_o i_o for_o meet_v ornament_n therefore_o he_o feign_v i_o to_o say_v it_o be_v lawful_a to_o kneel_v before_o a_o crucifix_n 2._o and_o elsewhere_o i_o say_v it_o be_v lawful_a to_o be_v excite_v to_o a_o good_a thought_n by_o see_v a_o deaths-head_n or_o any_o of_o god_n work_n and_o so_o it_o be_v by_o see_v a_o crucifix_n which_o no_o sober_a christian_a doubt_n of_o he_o feign_v i_o to_o make_v it_o a_o exciting_a sign_n to_o he_o that_o kneel_v before_o it_o §_o 11._o yea_o he_o make_v so_o much_o use_v of_o his_o own_o calumny_n as_o p._n 354._o to_o prove_v i_o strange_o partial_a allow_v it_o to_o be_v lawful_a to_o pray_v before_o a_o crucifix_n as_o a_o medium_n excitans_fw-la as_o a_o object_n that_o stir_v up_o in_o we_o worship_v affection_n and_o so_o excuse_v all_o papist_n from_o idolatry_n that_o profess_v they_o use_v a_o crucifix_n for_o no_o other_o end_n answ_n mere_a repeat_v forgery_n not_o become_v his_o profession_n i_o never_o speak_v for_o pray_v before_o it_o much_o less_o as_o a_o object_n to_o stir_v up_o worship_v affection_n but_o only_o that_o i_o be_o not_o bind_v to_o fly_v at_o prayer_n from_o a_o room_n that_o have_v only_o ornamental_a picture_n and_o that_o as_o in_o the_o geneva_n bible_n there_o be_v historical_a picture_n and_o few_o but_o turk_n be_v against_o they_o it_o be_v lawful_a i_o say_v not_o kneel_v before_o they_o at_o prayer_n but_o out_o of_o case_n of_o scandal_n and_o danger_n to_o be_v excite_v by_o they_o to_o good_a affection_n and_o indeed_o good_a affection_n be_v worship_v affection_n dare_v any_o christian_a say_v that_o it_o be_v a_o sin_n to_o think_v reverent_o of_o god_n when_o we_o see_v his_o work_n or_o see_v but_o a_o picture_n of_o scripture_n history_n as_o abraham_n offer_v isaac_n christ_n die_v and_o rise_v etc._n etc._n nonconformist_n have_v still_o take_v they_o for_o liar_n that_o say_v they_o be_v against_o historical_a picture_n and_o show_v it_o in_o the_o geneva_n bible_n i_o have_v see_v in_o many_o pious_a country_n house_n all_o the_o story_n of_o dives_n and_o lazarus_n paint_v over_o their_o table_n and_o never_o hear_v the_o good_a use_n of_o it_o accuse_v but_o i_o desire_v the_o reader_n to_o peruse_v my_o word_n which_o he_o cit_v quest_n 113._o and_o judge_v with_o what_o honesty_n we_o be_v accuse_v i_o there_o say_v 1._o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o make_v any_o image_n of_o god_n 4._o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o make_v place_n or_o use_v a_o image_n as_o be_v like_a to_o do_v more_o hurt_n than_o good_a or_o to_o tempt_v to_o sin_n and_o all_o such_o image_n of_o creature_n as_o other_o use_v to_o give_v unlawful_a worship_n or_o honour_n to_o when_o like_a to_o tempt_v other_o to_o the_o like_a as_o among_o the_o papist_n the_o image_n of_o the_o crucifix_n the_o virgin_n mary_n and_o angel_n may_v not_o be_v make_v place_v or_o use_v so_o as_o may_v tempt_v any_o to_o worship_v they_o sinful_o as_o they_o do_v 11._o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o place_v image_n in_o church_n or_o in_o secret_a before_o our_o eye_n when_o we_o be_v worship_v god_n when_o it_o tend_v to_o corrupt_v the_o mind_n which_o be_v the_o ordinary_a effect_n of_o image_n 12._o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o use_v image_n scandalous_o as_o any_o of_o the_o aforesaid_a sinner_n use_v they_o though_o we_o do_v it_o not_o with_o the_o same_o intent_n that_o be_v so_o as_o in_o outward_a appearance_n be_v the_o same_o with_o their_o use_n because_o so_o we_o shall_v dishonour_v god_n as_o they_o do_v and_o harden_v they_o in_o sin_n therefore_o image_n in_o church_n or_o in_o oratory_n in_o those_o country_n where_o other_o use_v they_o sinful_o or_o near_o such_o country_n where_o the_o same_o may_v harden_v man_n in_o their_o sin_n be_v evil_a 21._o i_o think_v it_o unlawful_a to_o make_v a_o image_n or_o any_o equal_a institute_v sign_n to_o be_v the_o public_a common_a symbol_n of_o the_o christian_a religion_n though_o but_o a_o profess_v sign_n as_o they_o make_v the_o cross_n do_v this_o doctrine_n justify_v the_o papist_n and_o p._n 876._o §_o 14._o i_o large_o prove_v the_o use_n of_o a_o crucifix_n as_o they_o do_v the_o cross_n in_o baptism_n to_o be_v unlawful_a which_o he_o answer_v not_o be_v it_o not_o consistent_a with_o all_o this_o that_o i_o say_v that_o it_o be_v not_o unlawful_a to_o pray_v before_o or_o towards_o a_o image_n in_o a_o room_n where_o image_n be_v place_v only_o for_o ornament_n and_o we_o have_v no_o respect_n to_o they_o as_o a_o medium_n or_o object_n of_o our_o worship_n except_o as_o by_o accident_n it_o be_v make_v unlawful_a and_o that_o not_o kneel_v to_o they_o nor_o in_o prayer_n but_z in_o transient_a meditation_n it_o 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