part of this last Querie is the same with the former for here you speake as if to slight the Independents were a sure way to obtaine favour and applause from Popish Cavaliers truly you flatter your selfe if you thinke your subtill dealing herein is not seene when as it is so notoriously known that any man who speaks against Independents may be scorned but never applauded by Popish or any that are Cavaliers for they applaud the Independents whom they hold to be more subtill and powerfull to effect the thing they chiefly ayms at and desire then themselves and it is well knowne and can be proved that they will run and goe to doe any Malignant a favour yea they will joyne with the wickedest Cavaliers against a Presbyterian to doe him a mischiefe But having cleared this truth in my Reply to your first Querie I hasten to the other part of this where you start the Question Whether the favour I received were not by my courtly compliance with Papists preferring them before Protestants c. To which I answer that my constant perseverance in holding forth the true Protestant Religion where ever I lived at home and beyond the seas is sufficiently knowne to all the godly faithfull orthodox Christians that inhabited in any of those parts where I have dwelt and so farre have I ever beene from any courtly complying with Papists or preferring them before Protestants as some in England at this day can testifie that when I lived in forraine nations my zeale was so great for the Protestant Religion that with no little hazard I have maintained it for all the while I travailed abroad and continued in Popish Countries which was many yeares it fared with mee as with the Apostle Paul while hee waited at Athens Act. 17. 16 17. my spirit was stirred in me when I saw the Cities and all the Countries wholly given to Idolatry therefore carrying my life in my hand I daily disputed with Papists and those they accounted the devout persons Priests and Iesuits against Popery maintaining the Protestant Religion insomuch as it was only the goodnesse of my God that kept me safe giving them no power to hurt mee further J answer you the Bookes that I have written against Popery in Latine and in English are yet extant and they doe witnesse and will to future generations that the Author of them disputed against and disclaimed Popery and earnestly contented for the faith which was once delivered unto the Saints Iud. vers 3. yea the many disputations I have held with Priests Jesuits and people popishly affected in England not onely while I injoyed my liberty but also when by the Prelaticall popish party J was for maintaining the true Protestant Religion and standing for the peace and welfare of my countrey cast into severall prisons viz. in the Gate-house at Westminster in the Castle of Launceston in Cornewall in the Castle in the Isle of Sylly in the Goale of Leicester in the Goale in the Citie of Yorke in Hemsley-Castle in Yorke-shire Lastly in Knasebrough-Castle in Yorke-shire Yet through Gods supporting grace in none of all these prisons could the cruelty pride and fury of men which in Yorke and Sylly was my daily portion either make me forget my integrity or daunt mee in the least for their rage and power I feared not neither did I ever forbeare to justifie godly Protestants nor decline any opportunity to dispute with Papists but improved it to the uttermost to shew the great idolatry and vanity of their Religion as many who were prisoners with mee in some of the fore-named places can testifie And I am confident that the Popish Cavaliers with whom I have beene a prisoner and others of them that have discoursed and reasoned with me in matters of Religion will give this testimony that they ever found me constant to my principles unmoveable in the Protestant Religion and as farre from complying with Papists or preferring them before Protestants what ever I suffered or under-went as light is from darkenesse in its greatest brightnesse Moreover Brother I would not that you should be ignorant how that I have beene as frequent in disputations writ as much in confutation and at all times and in all companies have appeared as forward and earnest against Papists and have ventured my life to maintaine the Protestant Religion as freely as any Independent I know in England and that in the worst of times yea when those who are now the chiefe independent Rabbies to avoyd suffering for truth would not stand to appeare in her behalfe but went out of the Kingdome and like the parents of the man that was borne blind Joh. 9. 21. Left her to speake for her selfe then J helped to maintaine truths cause and was not afraid nor ashamed to suffer in so good a quarrell but resisted her opposers Papists Prelates Arminians and Formalists in their erroneous Doctrines and Popish practises even unto blood I am become a foole in glorying you have compelled me 2 Cor. 12. 11. for so many reproaches which you have cast upon me and such groundlesse Queries could never have proceeded from any that had not beene guided should I say by a traducing spirit truly that word would come short fully to explaine and set forth the sinfull subtilty of them therefore I will not undertake to set down what spirit it was and what name it will beare I shall onely shew what it was not and leave it to such as are godly wife and experienced Christians to spell out the name thereof Now it is very evident that it was not the spirit of brotherly love that would have silenced yea annihilated such thoughts in the first conception for as brotherly love thinks no evill much lesse dares it devise and publish falshood yet more evill and greater falshood then you have not only thought as it plainely appeares but published against me and that deliberately none could ever have imagined for you render me a scandalous Walker as vile as vile can be and here you question whether I have not complyed with Papists and Popish Cavaliers and preferred them before Protestants Thus with your windie Independent policie you blast my good name raise doubts cloud my sincerity darken and overshadow my faithfull constant perseverance in the truth and wayes of God to make me be thought a man infamous and of no Religion but such dealings are absolutely contrary to brotherly love therefore it is very clear to the understanding of all that you were not guided by that spirit And as your quaeries were made without brotherly love so they seem to be altogether voyd of Christian experience being wholly filled with evill surmises scrued up to their height by the hand of carnall reason and uttered by the tongue of sinfull suspicion For I beseech you consider how it comes to passe that you who have been a Prisoner one of my Quondam Fellow Sufferers when you heare that I being a Prisoner under the command and power of
Epistle to the Hebrews ch 13. 7. Remember saith he them that have the rule over you who have spake unto you the Word of God whose faith follow considering the end of their conversation And vers 17. Obey saith he them that have the rule over you and submit your selves for they watch for your soules as they that must give an account c. And in vers 24. Salute all them saith he that have the rule over you and all the Saints Here againe he injoynes all the Churches to yeild obedience and to submit themselves unto the government of the Presbyterie shewing them that it is their place to obey and for their Ministers to rule and that so long as they command in the Lord they out of conscience ought to obey them and that for a double reason For they watch saith he for your souls and they must also give an account of their stewardship And in 1 Peter 5 1 2 3. The Presbyters that are among you saith Saint Peter I exhort who am also a Presbyter and a witnesse of the sufferings of Christ and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed feed the flock of God which is among you taking the over sight thereof not by constraint but willingly c. neither as being Lords over Gods heritage but being examples to the flock And Saint James chap. 5. ver 14. Is any among you sick saith he let him call for the Presbyters of the Church He doth not say of the Churches but of the Church So that the Presbyterian government was in every Church and every Church was to submit it self unto the Presbytery And in Acts 15. it is said that Paul and Barnabas went up to the Apostles and Presbyters c. And when they came to Ierusalem they were received of the Church it is not said of the Churches but of the Church and of the Apostles and Presbyters c. and Verse 6. And the Apostles and Presbyters came together to consider of the matter c. and Vers 22. Then pleased it the Apostles and Presbyters with the whole Church c. and wrote Letters by them after this manner The Apostles and Presbyters and Brethren And Acts 21. 17. And when we were come to Ierusalem saith Saint Luke the Brethren received us gladly And the day following Paul went in with us in to Iames and all the Presbyters were present From all which places and many more which might be produced it is most clear and evident that in all Cities there was a Presbytery and that the Presbyters had the power of order namely of preaching and the power of jurisdiction that is of ruling which was ever to be exercised with others and not alone and that consisted in admitting of members and in conventing men before them upon occasion in admonishing if any offended in suspending them from the holy Communion till reformation or amendment and if they continued obstinate and incorrigble in excommunicating and casting of them out of the Church and upon repentance in receiving of them in again and in ordaining of Officers and in appointing the times of meeting and the places where And within these limits as I conceive is all the power given to the Presbyters terminated and this they are by Gods Ordinance joyntly and by the common-counsell of Presbyters to exercise and it peculiarly belongeth unto them and therefore the Presbyterian government was the order of ruling and governing all Churches that God himself established and is to be continued unto the end of the world neither do I ever read that the people or the congregations were joyned with them in their commission or had any power given them of ruling For Saint Paul professeth of himself in 1 Cor. 14. 37. that whatsoever he writ in his Epistles Were the Commands of the Lord. And the same may be said of all the other Apostles Now Paul writ to Titus that the Churches in all Cities should be governed by a Presbytery And in the first Epistle to Timothy he commands Timothy again and again in chap. 5. vers 21. and in chap. 6. v. 12 13. I give thee charge in the sight of God saith he That thou keep this Command without spot unblameable till the appearing of our Lord Iesus Christ Here Timothy and all Ministers in him are to the end of the world bound to maintain that government unblameable that was appointed by the Apostles and that was the Presbyterian government and the ruling of all Churches by joynt consent and a common counsell or Colledge of Presbyters so that nothing ought to be done or transacted of publick concernment without their joynt and mutuall accord or agreement and common consent of the Presbytery And therfore when Diotrephes assumed unto himself and his particular congregation a power and authority to rule according to his will and pleasure without the consent of the Presbytory opposed Iohn the Presbyter he sharply reproves his proceedings and signifies to the Church Epist 3. That when he came he would remember his words and teach him how to prate against the Presbytery with malicious words For he saith S. Iohn contenteth not himself only to prate maliciously against us but he will not receive his brethren nor suffer others but casteth them out of the Church which is an evill thing in him saith Saint Iohn But for you saith he speaking to the Church follow not that which is evill but that which is good It was evill in him to assume unto himself alone and his particular Congregation that power that belonged unto the colledge or councell of Presbyters and was to be moderated and exercised onely by the conjoynt and common consent of the Presbytery For God had appointed that his Church should be governed by a Presbytery and Diotrephes would have his Congregation Independent and have an absolute jurisdiction within it self Which saith Saint Iohn is an evill thing So that I cannot but wonder our brethren the Independents should call Diotrephes the Patriarch of the Presbyterians as one of them did to me not long since whereas if the place be duâ—ly weighed and considered it will appear that he was the first that opposed the Presbyterian Govenment and for the which he was by Saint Iohn sharply reproved and in him all that follow his steps and will not submit themselves to the Presbytery which is Gods Ordinance and that will not receive the brethren into the Churches but upon their own termes and conditions But of this businesse when I come to the second Question In the mean time I must here make reply to what Mr Knollys by way of Answer hath to say to this Argument drawn from Diotrephes his practise which was occasioned as I related before by reason of a discourse between me and an Independent who affirmed That Diotriphes was the patriarch of all the Presbyterians which opinion of his Mr Knollys doth seem to favour as by his words may appear but I hope to make the contrary
which hee stifly denyed For saith hee The Apostles and all the Beleevers in the Church of Jerusalem met together with one accord in one place to wit the Temple and in Solomons Porch and brake bread from house to house I desire the Reader to take notice of his expression and see if there be not only a flat contradiction of himselfe but a full confirmation of what my Argument proveth viz. that there were many Congregations of Beleevers in the Church at Jerusalem which hee peremptorily denyed For saith hee they met together day by day in the Temple that is one place and in Solomons Porch that is an other place and they brake bread from house to house that is in innumerable places more so that for one place we have many assigned by him for they communicated in all those houses in all acts of worship for they never brake bread or baptized but they had the word also preached for the Word and Sacraments were to goe together so that where the one was there was the other and they neither baptized nor brake bread in the Temple and a few houses could not containe such a multitude of people and therefore sayes Master Knollys they brake bread from house to house and that daily or day by day now wee know that they in those dayes brake bread alwayes in the evening so that about one and the same time there was every day or at least every first day of the weeke innumerable Congregations and severall Assemblies and that at one time in every house at Ierusalem and all this I learne from Master Knollys which saith that they brake bread daily from house to house that is they had severall Congregations in severall houses Ergo if Master Knollys be worthy of credit or if any beliefe may be given to his words there were many if not innumerable Congregations of Beleevers every day in Ierusalem and so hee confirmes my first Proposition which hee hath taken so much paines to confute and declares unto the whole world that hee is a man void of all reason and honesty and truly if such a worthlesse Fellow had his due deserts for his seducing of the poore people hee ought severely to be dealt with and this might suffice to have answered to Master Knollys but there yet remaines one whibling cavill made by him to be answered unto who learnedly distinguisheth betweene 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is betweene house and house and houses by houses and would perswade the world that there were some great Mysterie or at least some vast difference betweene 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 house by house and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 houses by houses vvhereas indeed if vvee consult vvith the Originall and with all Interpreters and translations wee shall find that they are all one and that they translate the word in the singular number after the same manner and with the same expressions or with words equivalent unto them that they do the plurall making no difference betweene them and although I never doubted but that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 house by house or in every house was the same that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 houses by houses or in all houses for so they may be translated if wee stand rigidly upon the word though the sense and meaning be the same as we shall see by by but I say though I never made any scruple about the translation since I had acquaintance with the original yet for farther satisfaction I have consulted with all the Interpretations and translations both in the Latin French Italian Spanish Dutch English that I could meet with and I find them all agreeing in this that they translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the singular and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the plurall after one and the same manner and with the same expressions and in the same words many times or in language intimating as much as they that render and translate the plurall 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 per domos translate the singular likewise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 â—ira domos rendering the word both in the singular and the plurall alwayes in the number of multitude and they that translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the singular domatim translate the plural 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 domatim likewise as they that will consult with all the Latine Translations upon the second of the Acts and the 46. verse and the 5. of the Acts and the 42. verse where the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is used in the singular number may see Again if they will turne but to the 20. Chapter of the Acts and the 20. verse there they shall find 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the plurall translated after the same manner the singular is by all the Latine Interpreters that is as they did render and translate the word in the singular so they translate it in the plurall making no difference in their significations but taking them as all one and so in our English translation Acts the 2. v. 46. there they translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 from house to house and in the 5. Chapter verse the 42. they render 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the singular in every house and in the twentieth of the Acts and the twentieth verse where the word is in the plurall 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they render it there from house to house as they did in the singular never making any difference between the singular and the plurall and so the Italian renders the singular number 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the fift of the Acts vers 4â— per le case and in the 20. of the Acts v. 20. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the plural he translates it likewise per le case making no difference between the singular the plurall as the Holy Ghost doth not and the same I might shew out of all the Interpretations Now it is well knowne that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Greeke when it is joyned with the accusative case it often if not ever signifies in or through and being joyned with a word of the singular number it signifies as much as if it were joyned with the plurall as wee may see it in the 8. of Luke vers the 1. where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is rendred through every Citie Hee went saith the Interpretation through every Citie preaching or hee preached in every Citie or in all Cities or through all Cities and so in the 1. of Titus where Saint Paul saith that hee left Titus in Crete that hee should ordaine Elders 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is translated in English in every Citie and by Master Knollys himselfe oppidatim Citie by Citie which is as much as in every Citie or in all Cities or through all the Cities of Crete and in the fourteenth of the Acts verse 23. it is said when they had ordained them Elders 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Master Knollys himselfe translates the singular there per singulas Ecclesias in
Characters are evidently visible and apparent and those that either countenance vile persons and honour not such as fear the Lord or break their vows promises and covenants with either God or men they in Gods repute are not Saints indeed pretend they what they will but are wicked and ungodly men and such as bring down the wrath of God upon the place where they live For as Solomon saith By the blessing of the righteous the city is saved so by the mouth of the wicked it is overthrown Prov. 11. ver 11. Wicked and ungodly men are the cause of the ruine of Cities and Countryes according to that of Saint Paul the second of Timothy chap. 3. ver 1 2 3 4 5. This know also saith he that in the last dayes perilous times shall come for men shall be lovers of their own selves covetous boasters proud blasphemers disobedient to Parents unthankfull unholy without naturall affection covenant-breakers false accusers incontinent fierce despisers of those that are good traiterous heady high-minded lovers of pleasures more then lovers of God having a forme of godlinesse but denying the power thereof from such turne away For of this sort are they which creep into widdows houses and lead captive silly women laden with sins led away with divers lusts c. In the which words briefly we may take notice that the Apostle setting down the reason of the perilousnesse and danger of the latter times saith not that either in respect of wars or pestilences or famines or earth-quakes or inundations or murthers slaughters and robberies or for any such calamities the lastdayes and times shall be perillous but they shall be perillous times saith he for that men shall be lovers of themselves covenant-breakers false accusers covetous c. So that selfe-love covetousness false accusations of their brethren and covenant-breaking c. are the cause that makes times perillous and brings down the judgements of God upon any city and places where the Inhabitants are practicers of these sinnes And therefore the Apostle after he had forewarned all such as fear God of the cause of all the evills that are comming upon the world commands all the true Saints indeed to take heed of such men and in expresse words sayes from such turne away have nothing to do with such for all covenant-breakers and false accusers and such as countenance vile persons and honour not them that fear the Lord and such as keep not their word and promise with neither God nor men are the cause of the perils and miseryes that shall come upon the world and therefore all such are not Saints indeed but ought to be abhorred and avoyded according to that of Solomon Prov. 4. ver 14 15. Enter not saith he into the path of the wicked and go not into the way of evill men Avoyd it passe not by it turne from it and passe away Here we see the wise man as if he could never have given caution enough to all his schollers by many reduplications of his words gives all the people of God a strict charge not so much as to company with such men and that for the many reasons set down in the following verses but this reason specified by Saint Paul may suffice who saith That all covenant-breakers and false accusers and self-seekers are the causes of perillous times and so are all such in whose eyes a vile person is not contemned and who honour not such as fear the Lord and who keep not their covenant and promise For all such are no Saints in Gods esteem and therefore a wicked generation of men and such as make the times wherein they live perillous and dangerous and therefore ought by all the true Saints and godly to be shunned and avoyded Now if it can be proved that the Independents be such as in whose eyes a vile person is not contemned and such as honour not those that fear the Lord and such as keep not their word and promise neither with God nor man but are notorious covenant-breakers or assenters to all such persons then it will follow that they are not Saints indeed For the Characters of the true Saints are to contemn a vile person to honour those that fear the Lord and to keep their vowes and promises both with God and men for not onely the Psalmist thus describeth the true Saints but Saint John also saith By this men are known to be Saints if they love the brethren by this saith Christ ye shall be known to be my Disciples that is Saints indeed if ye love one another I shall therefore demand of any well grounded Christian Whether they beleeve that those that run from place to place and joyn with any wicked and ungodly men and seeke their advancement that to places of the greatest trust in the Kingdome and prefer them before such as they dayly acknowledg to be godly and truly religious and will run from Committee to Committee to do the most wicked and vile men and known Malignants any courtesie and will both in word countenance and deeds favour and honour them I demand I say whether they think that in such mens eyes as will do all these offices to wicked persons and that in opposition to any of their godly brethren and that will at any time joyn with any such against either the godly and painfull Ministers or their Presbyterian brethren to defame them or do them any mischiefe or to remove them from their places and livelyhoods or for the hindring of their preferments yea and which is more for the hindring of the work of Reformation in the Church I demand I say of any truly godly Christian whether they think that in any such mens eyes as do all these offices and courtesies to wicked and ungodly men a vile person is contemned when he dayly seeth the contrary that they honour them and prefer them before such as fear the Lord I am most assured he will conclude and affirme That in their eyes a vile person is not contemned Now that this is the dayly practice of the Independents I undertake upon my life to prove it by a cloud of witnesses and that there is not the vilest person nor the wickedest wretch that they will not joyn with to do any of their Presbyterian brethren a mischief that they will not give credit to in falsly belying their brethren yea it can be proved that when the Independents have been demanded by some godly and orthodox Ministers why they have left the publick Assemblies seeing there was now no ceremonies nor any thing in their doctrine that they could finde fault with and they have replyed That it was in regard that their Congregations were mixt that tagg ragg and all sorts of men were admitted to the Sacrament with whom they could not joyne Whereupon the Ministers that they might remove this scandall and offence laboured by all means to perswade the people so to behave themselves as they might manifest unto
as hee was President in that Councell in the 15. of the Acts and it stands with very good reason for many yeares after he continued still the prime man in authority there amongst the Presbyters and knew very well the condition of all the Beleevers there and what numbers and multitudes of Disciples there were Inhabitants in that Church all which sufficiently demonstrateth that hee had his residence continually or for the most part in Ierusalem so that Paul comming thither to the Feast as it is related Acts the 21 chapter was informed by him not onely that there were many ten thousands of Beleevers in that Church but what those Disciples had heard concerning his preaching which sheweth not onely that Saint Iames had his aboad in that Citie but that those beleevers likewise were dwellers and inhabitants there and that now hee had very good acquaintance and familiarity with them yea which is more at that very time that Paul and Barnabas were sent to Jerusalem with those almes Peter and Iames were then in that Citie if not other of the Apostles also as the twelfe chapter of the Acts abundantly sheweth and without doubt they all joyned with the Presbyters and in a Common-councell ordered how the Alms should be disposed of by the Deacons to the necessity of the Saints yea it doth most necessarily follow what so ever Mr. Knollys and those of his Fraternity shall be able to say to the contrary for the Scripture recordeth that the reliefe was sent to the Presbyters through Iudaea Ierusalem was the Metropolis citie in Iudaea and in the 12. chapter v. 25. it is related that Barnabas Paul returned from Jerusalem whither they had carried the almes so that many of the Apostles being at that time in Ierusalem and the princiall and chiefe Presbyters in that Church amongst the other Presbyters it may not bee credited that they I say being the prime Magistrates and Governours did sit still and leave the rule ordering and government of that Church to other of their fellow Presbyters and them of inferiour ranke but they also acted their parts in the government at that time as well as at others and therefore I say when the disposing of the treasury of the Church or State is an Act of soveraigne power and belongs only to those that are in authority in either and when all the Apostles and Presbyters governed that Church by a Common-councell and joynt consent and when the almes were sent unto all it necessarily followeth notwithstanding all Master Knollys his garrulity that my Argument out of that Scripture will ever stand good to prove that the sending of the reliefe to the Elders makes good these two things the first that the Presbyters were the onely men in authority there and secondly that the Apostles and Presbyters of that Church governed and ruled it by a Common-councell and Presbytery yea Master Knollys his owne words confirmes mee in my opinion who saith it is not denyed by the brethren that the Presbyters in all Churches were the men in the government of the Churches in which they are Elders so that all businesses of publicke concernment were to bee transacted and managed by the common consent and agreement of them all and not by the determination of any one particular Presbyter in either of those Churches much lesse by any other persons or people in them but the Presbyters And this shall suffice to have spake concerning the confirmation of my first Argument grounded upon that Scripture that the reliefe and almes were sent unto the Presbyters of Ierusalem And now I come to what he hath to say against my second argument by which I proved my third proposition which is this as he himselfe set it down in the 12. Page of his book They that in the holy Scripture are called Presbyters and acted and ordered things in a joynt body and common Councell with the Presbyters and exercised that ordinary power committed to them in the 18. of Matthew they acted as Presbyters But the Apostles in governing the Church of Ierusalem consisting of many Congregations and Assemblies acted and ordered things in a joynt body and common Councell with the Presbytery of that Church as Presbyters Ergo the church of Ierusalem was Presbyterially governed and by a common Councell of Presbyters The Major and Minor of this Syllogisme being proved saith the Doctor the conclusion will necessarily insue Thus Master Knollys relates this Argument wholly passing by all the rest And to this argument he first thus replies I know not saith he that the brethren ever deny ed that the Church of Ierusalem was presbyterianly governed So that he assenteth unto the conclusion which is all I contended for by that argument So that by this it followeth that the people had no hand in the government for they are not Presbyters by office And yet such is his ambition to be thought some body in the art of disputation that he quarrels the forme of my Syllogisme and takes upon him to shew me how I should have framed it aright but all those that know indeed what really belongs to learning will easily perceive the man doth but babble and if I should spend time in trifling with him about forms moodes and figures in Syllogisms who knows no more in Logick then the horse he preaches on I might be thought as vain as himselfe therefore intreating him hereafter to learn his Grand-dame to suck and not mee to make Syllogisms passing by all those his grolleries I will set down what he hath farther to reply to this argument in the 13. page and then answer to that and after I have done with him I will come to I. S. that learned Gentleman and profound Clerk Master Knollys to this argument thus farther answereth Though the Apostles saith he were called Presbyters in the Scripture yet it followeth not that they acted as Presbyters but as Apostles Act. 15. And they cannot therein be a pattern and president for Presbyters First because the Apostles had the care and charge of and over all Churches 2 Cor. 11. 28. But the Presbyters had the care and oversight of some one Church onely as Ephesus Act. 20. 28. or Philippi Phil. 1. 1. and this the Doctor often inserts in his book That all the Churches we read of in the New Testament though they were presbyterially governed were Dependent upon their severall Presbyters page 12. And secondly because this would make the Presbyters Independent indeed for so the Apostles were in the government of all the Churches the Presbyters of Jerusalem of Ephesus and of all the Churches were Dependent upon the Apostles and the Apostles only Dependent on Christ by whose holy spirit they were alwaies guided in the government of their churches and therefore they said Acts 15. 28. It seemed good to the holy Ghost and us And though the Doctor say the Presbyters might say so as well as the Apostles because the Elders and Presbyters are mentioned there The
like manner if they will still persist go on in these wicked and ungodly courses to seduce his people and pretend that they have authority from him for their preaching and practising of all these things notwithstanding they have neither precept nor example for them in all the holy Word of God that he may in justice let the devil loose upon them for the beating of them all out of their TUBS Certain I am they by all these their dealings highly provoke the Lord to jealousie and that daily so that if the Christian Magistrates do not take some speedy course for the vindicating of Gods Honor I do verily beleeve the Lord will from Heaven shew some fearful judgement upon this whole Kingdom and visit it with so many plagues and such sore calamities as all the Inhabitants thereof will desire wish that the Mountains may fall upon them and the Hills cover them from the presence of the Lamb and from him that sitteth upon the Throne the which that they may not happen upon this Nation shal be my daily constant prayer And this shal serve to have spake concerning the Church of Ierusalem the first formed Church and concerning the ordinary admission of members in it I will now come to the Church of Samaria and that of Corinth and Ephesus all formed Churches according to the Gospel-Form and briefly shew how members were admitted into them all and by whom and upon what conditions that all men may see there is no want of presidents to convince the Ildependents of their Grolleries In the eighth of the Acts it is related there that through the miracles of Philip and through his preaching the things concerning the Kingdom of God and the Name of Iesus Christ they were baptized both men and women from the greatest to the least Verse 10 12. And were all admitted unto Church-fellowship and that by Philips sole authority and this his method of gathering of Churches was ratified by the authority of the Apostles Peter and Iohn and the whole Colledge of the Apostles at Ierusalem And this was a true formed Church after the New Testament Form For in this Christ himself had planted a Church and converted many as it is at large set down in the fourth Chapter of the Gospel of Saint Iohn and here it is said That the people with one accord gave heed unto those things that Philip spake and that there was great joy in that City Verse 6 8. And that they were all baptized both men and women Here we have neither any walking required at their hands for he better assurance either of Philip or the Church of the soundnesse of their conversion Here is no publike confession of their faith required before their admittance into Church-fellowship Here is no evidences of their conversion called for Here is no particular explicite covenant demanded of them Here is no consent of the people desired before their admission into Church communion and yet this was a Church established according to the Gospel-form So that according to the practice of the two Mother churches in Iudea and Israel all beleevers were admitted members and received into Church-fellowship without the conditions those of the Congregational way now require of all those of their new gathered Churches Whether therefore it be not a high presumption and arrogancy in all the Independents to slight the Laws of Christ the King of his Church and the example of Christ himself and the example of all the blessed Apostles I leave it to the judgement of all prudent and advised Christians I will now to satisfie my Brother Burtons desire visit some Churches of the Gentiles formed according to the New Testament Form and I will first in this visitation begin with that Church which he himself hath set before all Churches for a patern of imitation viz. the Church of Corinth In the eighteenth of the Acts it is recorded that when Silas and Timothy were come unto Paul to Corinth the Jewes refusing to receive the Gospel of Iesus Christ that hee shooke his rayment against them and said unto them your blood be upon your own heads I am cleare from hence-forth I will goe unto the Gentiles and departing thence hee entred into ones house named Iustus one that worshipped God and preaching the Gospel there it is said that Crispus a chiefe Ruler of the Synagogue beleeved on the Lord with all his house and many of the Corinthians hearing beleeved and were baptized Here wee see in a Church put into a Gospel forme the Members of that church were admitted by the sole authority of Saint Paul and that barely upon their hearing and beleeving for the Apostle required no other conditions of them for their admission into church Fellowship hee said not unto those many that were baptized that before they could be made Members of that church they must walke some time with the church that they might have experience of the truth of their conversion neither did he injoyn them for satisfaction of the people to make a publicke confession of their faith or to bring in the evidences of their conversion or to enter into any particular explicite covenant or to have the consent of the whole church nothing of all this did Paul require of the Corinthians in this church after the Gospel forme but following Christ the Kings commission upon their Faith Repentance and Baptisme hee hy his owne and sole authority admitted them The same way of admitting of Members wee shall find in the Church of Ephesus as it is at large to be seene in the nineteenth chapter of the Acts where the manner of admission of Members there is fully set downe and that was a Church also my Brother Burton sets downe amongst those that must be brought in for the making up of a compleate paterne now in all those Churches they were all admitted upon Christs owne termes and by the Apostles and Ministers sole authority without either walking sometime with the Church or without any publicke confession of their faith to the Congregation or bringing in their evidences or entring into any private explicite Covenant or without the consent of the people How unsufferable a thing therefore is it now then in all those of the congregationall way to demand other conditions of all their Members before they can be admitted into Church-fellowship with them then those that Christ the King of his Church and all his blessed Apostles demanded If this be not the highest point of presumption that was ever heard of I leave it to the consideration of the very ruggedest Independents upon due deliberation desiting they may all seriously lay it to heart and timely repent of it for if they doe not they will indeed be found fighters against God and dis-throners of Christ the King when they shall slight both his Lawes and example and the example of his blessed Apostles and the practise of all those glorious Gospel formed Churches and set up new Lawes and