doth not absolutly excuse but sayes How they shall be punished in the last day of judgment for this errour of their false opinion none but the judge himselfe can know Qualiter pro hoc ipso falsae opinionis errore in die Judicij puniendi sunt nullus potest scire nisi Judex as Potter cites him in the margent Which wordes if one take in rigour suppose they are to be punished and that they haue sinned but that none can tell how or how far or how much their ignorance might lessen their punishment Your saying to Ch Ma You yourselfe though you pronounce the leaders among the Artans formall Hereticks which words you put in a different letter as if they were his words though I finde them not in him yet confesse that Salvian was at least doubtfull that at least is your owne word whether these Arians who in simplicity followed their teachers might not be excused by ignorance And about this suspension of his you also seeme suspended for you neither approue nor condemne it Thus you not without some tincture of your Gall. For Ch Ma being only to declare Salvians minde had neither reason nor occasion to declare in this place his owne opinion how far ignorance may excuse some particular persons which he did Part 1. Cap 1. N. 3. and 5. and Part 2. Pag 102. in the Conclusion of his Booke where you will finde but very cold comfort for such as hope to be saved by ignorance 11. That which followes is more against Potter then against Ch Ma who grounds his argument vpon the expresse words of the Doctor That to confine the Church to one part and place as the Donatists did to Africa was an errour In the matter and nature of it properly Hereticall against that Article of the Creed wherein we professe to belieue the Holy Catholick Church To which Major proposition he adds this Minor But Luthers Reformation or Church if one man may be cald a Church was not vniversall but confined to that place which contained Luthers body a lesse compas then Africa Therefore his Reformation or doctrine can not be excused from formall Heresy This Deduction to me seemes no lesse then demonstratiue supposing the express grant of Dr. Potter for the Major proposition and yet you are pleased to call it a rope of Sand and an vnsyllogisticall syllogisme and say it is even cosen German to this To deny the Resurrection is properly an heresy but the preaching of the Ghospell at the beginning was not vniversall Therfore it â—â—nnot be excused from formall heresy For as he whose Reformation is but particular may yet not deny the Resurrection so may he also not deny the Churches vniversality and as the Apostles who preached the Ghospell in the beginning did belieue the Church vniversall though their preaching at the beginning was not so so Luther also might and did belieue the Church vniversall though his Reformation were but particular But good Syr how then do you defend your client the Doctour from this your argument To say the visible Church is confined to one place is properly an heresy as Potter affirmes it to be But the preaching of the Ghospell at the beginning was but in one place therfore it was formall Heresy As also from your other To deny the Resurrection is properly an Heresy c. Be pleased then to doe your Doctor the favour to reflect That considering the Predictions of the Prophets of the Amplitude Propagation and Promise of our Saviour for the stability of his Church to say that after sixteene hundred yeares it was reduced not only to that compass which contained Luthers body but that it was corrupted with many and damnable errours that is in true Divinity to a No-Church yea and that many chiefe Protestants expresly affirme that it wholy perished is a vast Heresy vnles you would rather call it by the name of infidelity the consideration wherof did bring some chiefe learned Protestants to renounce Christian Religion And so your argument drawen from the first preaching of the Apostles is of no force and cosen German to this To deny that divers Churches and Nations did receaue the Faith of Christ as S. Paul testifieth of the Church of Rome in particular is properly an Heresy against the expresse wordes of Scripture but at the very first preaching of the Apostles Rome and many other places did not receaue the Faith of Christ but only some of those who heard their first Sermons Therefore their first preaching was Heresy And for you to say that the Church is only vniversall de jure because it ought to be so is no lesse ridiculous then impious against the promise of our Saviour which was that she was de facto to be vniversall and not that she ought to be vniversall and perpetuall as every man ought to be vertuous and as the Donatists did not deny she ought to be vniversall as Ch. Ma. shewes N. 17. Pag. 242. of which Number you take notice for some other matter but dissemble this point which yourselfe also affirme Pag 300. N. 99. in these words The Truth is the Donatists had set vp at Rome a Bishop of their faction not with intent to make him Bishop of the whole Church but of that Church in particular And although in this you be much deceaved because the intention of the Donatists was not that which you faine for your owne purpose but vnder pretence to take care of their Brethren in that Citty though indeed that the world might account them Catholiks by communicating with the Bishop of Rome with whom to communicate was taken by the Ancient Fathers for an assured signe of being a true Catholik They had also as S. Austin de vnitate Ecclesiae C. 3. witnesseth a pretended Church in the house and territory of a Spanish Lady called Lucilla And the same Saint speaking of the conference he had with Fortunius the Donatist sayth Epist 163. Here did he first attempt to affirme that his communion was spread over the whole earth c. But because the thing was evidently false they got out of this discourse by confusion of Language Whereby neverthelesse they sufficiently declared that they did not hold that the true Church ought necessarily to be confined to one place but only by meere necessity were forced to yield that it was so in fact because their Sect which they held to be the only true Church was not spead over the whole world In which point Fortunius and the rest were more modest than he who should affirme that Luthers reformation in the very beginning was spread over the whole earth being at that time by many degrees not so far diffused as the Sect of the Donatists This is the discourse of Ch. Ma. in the sayd N. 17. whereof you thought safest to take no notice as indeed destructiue of your argument As for your objection that the greater part of the world is not Christian c. every Christian and in
as if the certainty of attayning an end did exclude Meanes of Exhortations Praier and the like or as if God could not effectually moue vs to what he best pleases vnless he also make vs belieue that we may tempt him by omitting all diligence of our owne towards the attaining of that to which he moves vs or interposes a Promise that he will grant it vs. You say if we belieue the Fathers of the Councell of Chalcedon the Prerogatiue of the Church of Rome of being the principall Church was grounded vpon this reason because the City was the principall and imperiall Citie But I conceiue yourself cannot belieue that the Greek Church would or could yeald such a spirituall Prerogatiue to the Latine Church vpoÌ„ so slight a ground though that might be a kind of congruence supposing an other higher and stronger Reason to wit that S. Peter had lived and died Bishop of that Citie which was as I may saie the Primate of Cities Yet I am not sorie to heare you say We do not altogether deny but that the Church of Rome might be called the chaire of Peter in regard he is sayd to haue preached the Gospell there For to omit that you dare not deny that S. Peter was at Rome which some Protestants impudently deny you giue so poore a reason why the Church of Rome hath bene particularlie by the Fathers called the chaire of Peter that every one may see there must be some better ground for it than that which you alledge of his preaching in that Citie as it is graÌ„ted that he not only preached in but was Bishop of the Citie of Antioch and he preached in many other places which yet are not wont to be called the Chaire of Peter I beseech the Reader to peruse that learned Book called Anti-Mortonus against the GraÌ„d imposture of D. Morton § 4. about the Councell of Chalcedon aÌ„d he will find what Power was acknowledged to be in the Bishop of Rome aboue all Bishops through the whole world to say nothing for the present that no Councell without the confirmatioÌ„ of the Pope is of validity 26. Your N. 28. 29. 30. containe long discourses vpon occasion of a place cited by Ch. Ma. out of S. Irenaeus who Lib. 3. Cont. Hoeres Chap 36. saieth Because it were long to number the successions of all Churches we declaring the Tradition of the most great most ancient and most knowne Church founded by the most glorious Apostles Peter and Paul which Tradition it hath from the Apostles comming to vs by succession of Bishops confound all those who any way either by evill complacence of themselves or vaine glory or by blindness or ill opinion do gather conventicles otherwise then they ought For to this Church for a more powerfull principality it is necessary that all Churches resort that is all faithfull people of what place soever in which Roman Church the Tradition which is from the Apostles hath alwayes beene conserved from those who are every where 27. To this authority of S. Irenaeus you giue divers answers which vpon examination will be found insufficient and contrary to yourself You say the words set downe by Ch Ma shew that what Authority in the matter S. Irenaeus attributed to the Roman Church in particular the same for the kind though pâ—rhaps not in the same degree he attributed to all other Apostolique Churches Answer S. Irenaeus is so farre from affirming an equality betwene the Roman and other Churches that he expresly prefers her before the rest in such manner as though the rest had then had no Being yet all Heretiques might haue bene confuted by her sole authority For seing he acknowledges it needless to number the successions of other Churches in order to the force of his Argument he might as well haue supposed them not to exist as not to be necessarily taken notice of which he never saied of any other Apostolique Church Beside since he takes the Roman for as good as all other Apostolique Churches and for the same reason of all other Churches of that tyme whose successours he held it needless to reckon it being impossible that all Churches should faile in Faith we must conclude even out of S. Irenaeus his Reason that the Roman Church cannot faile in points of Belief And as for you I wonder how you would end your N. 28. in these words If v. Irenaeus thought the Testimony of the Roman Church in this point only humane and fallible then surely he could never think either adhering to it a certain marke of a Catholique or separation from it a certain marke of a Heretique For seing Cyou hold hristian Faith te be no more than probable and that the Tradition for which you receyue Scripture is humane and fallible how can you these your assertions supposed affirme that a testimony humane and fallible may not be sufficient to proue one a Catholique or Heretique Vnless you will say he is no Heretique who rejects Scripture and all Christianity nor that he is a Catholique who believes them because you profess that the motives for which you belieue them are fallible 28. You find fault with the noble Translatresse of Cardinall Perron for rendring Ad hane Ecclesiam necesse est omnem convenire Ecclesiam To this Church it is necessary that every Church should agree But if you will but consult Cowpers Dictionary you will find that you haue no reason against that noble Translatresse See I say the word Conveni and you will finde Convenit in eum haec Contumelia Cic. This reproach toucheth him justly Conveniunt hae vites ad quemvis agrum Cato Uarro These vines proue well in all grounds Conveniebat in tuam vaginam machaera militis Plautus The solidours sword was meete for thy Scabbard Convenit optime ad pedem cothurnus Cic. The slippar is as meete for the foote as may be Will you say This reproach resorts to him vines resort to the field the sword resorts to the scabbard the slippar resorts to the foote Neither is that Translation either contrary or different from the Translation of Ch Ma for as much as concernes the matter and meaning of S. Irenaeus To this Church it is necessary that all Churches resort For why should all Churches resort to this Roman Church but that they may be instructed by her and agree with her in matters concerning Faith not that they may correct controll and disagree from her Otherwise it had bene a strang Argument to convince Heretiques by the Roman Church if he had not taken that Church as a modell and Rule with which they ought to agree Neither doth resort signify a corporall going to Rome but a recourse for instruction either by going thither themselves or by other meanes as you must say of those who are round about But you say if S. Irenaeus had saied By shewing the tradition of the Roman Church we confound all Heretiques For to this Church all Churches must agree what had
ventis vocatur Ecclesia Quomodo vocatur Vndique in Trinitate vocatur Non vocatur nisi per baptismum in nomine Patris Filij Spiritus Sancti Will you now limit vndique to places round about or adjacent and not grant that it signifies the whole world The learned Fevardentius in his Annotations vpon this place of S. Irenaeus not only affirmes that by eos qui sunt vndique fideles all Churches of the whole world are vnderstood but proves it with much clearness and erudition observing among other things that it is saied Ad hanc Ecclesiam not ad vrbis amplitudinem populorum frequentiam non ad imperij culmen non ad Caesarum majestem sed ad hanc Ecclesiam Thus your first objection being proved to be grounded meerely vpon a confidence that vndique must be taken in this place as you would haue it and withall perceiving that even this will not come home to your purpose without an other voluntary alteration for it is no less difficult a sense to say The Apostolike Tradition hath alwayes bene conserved there froÌ„ those who are euery where than to say The Apostolike Tradition hath alwayes bene conserved there from those who are round about you fall vpon a conjecture that in all probability in stead of conservata it should be observata although no copie either printed or manuscript reads it in that manner and suppose it were observata the difficulty would still remaine what observata might signifie whether observed that is kept and maintayned and then it were all one with conserved or observed that is marked found perceived or the like as you would haue it not considering that by this conceypt you wholy alter the Argument of S. Irenaeus and substitute an other For whereas that holy Bishop and Martyr grounds his proofe against Heretiques vpon the Authority and succession of the Roman Church you make him vrge these Heretiques only by the Testimony of people round about that Citie because they never observed any alteration of doctrine in that Church which therefore according to this your fiction must be judged by the neighbouring people and not they directed by her which kind of reasoning had bene a meere begging the Question and no effectuall confutation of those Heretiques who would instantly answer that both Rome and the adjacent people had altered the Apostlike Tradition by holding doctrines contrary to theirs nor could they haue bene confured otherwise than by supposing that the Roman Church was by the Promise of our Saviour Christ secured from all errour against Faith and to vse your owne lately recited words to say that the people about Rome would haue observed it if there had bene any alteration in the Church of Rome had bene but to giue for a reason that which was more questionable then the thing in question as being still to vse your owne words not evident in it self according to the principles of Protestants who de facto hold that many errours crept into the Church without being observed and plainly denied by S. Irenaeus his adversaries and not proved by him especially if we consider that as yourself speak The Church of Rome had a Powerfull principality over all the adjacent Churches it had bene more probable that she might haue led them into errour which they would haue embraced as an Apostolicall Tradition than that they would or could haue corrected her if indeed she had bene conceyved to be subject to errour no less than the adjacent Churches Now as for the difficulty of those words In which the Tradition which is from the Apostles hath alwayes been conserved from those who were every where yourself must answer it seing you hold your conjecture of observata to be but probable and that all hitherto haue read it and do still reade it conservata and that even though you reade it observata it will be a hard sense to say In which Church the Tradition which is from the Apostles hath alwaies bene observed from those who are every where and if in stead of from you say by hath bene observed by those who are every where though in that acception you must take Ab in a different sense when it is sayd ab Apostolis from and when it is saied ab his qui sunt vndique by we may also say hath bene conserved by those who are every where and the sense will be that in the Roman Church there hath alwaies bene the Tradition from the Apostles which hath also bene conserved in all Churches and in which they must agree with Her propter potentiorem Principalitatem and because she hath an evident and certaine succession as being founded vpon a Rock and in this sense we may also say that the Tradition receyved from all Churches hath bene conserved in the Roman Church as the center of Ecclesiasticall vnity to vse the words of the most learned Perron in his Reply Lib. 1. cap 26. 31. In your N. 30. after other discourses which containe no difficulty which may not be answered by what hath bene saied in divers occasions you come to your old cramben of the Chiliasts or Millenaries of which you say Justine martyr in Dial. cum Tryphon Professeth that all good and Orthodoxe Christians of his time belieued it and those that did not he reckons amongst Heretiques Sr. we haue no â—eason to belieue your word without some proofe And that you may not â—â—use my proofe against you as proceding from one who being a partie may be suspected of partiality I oppose to you a learned ProtestaÌ„t Doctor Ham in his Uiew of c Pag 87.88.89 who convinced by evidence of truth not only confesses and proves the weakeness of that place in S. Iustine to conclude any thing against Catholique Tradition but also demonstrates that your allegation is an egregious falsification while you say Iustine martyr professeth that all good and Orthodox Christians of his time believed it and those that did not he reckons amongst Heretiques For S. Justine expresly affirmes that many doe not acknowledg this doctrine of the 1000. yeares and those many Christians that are of pure and pious opinyon or judgment and that those whom he calls nominall Christians Atheists impious hereticall leaders are they who denyed the resurrection not those that acknowledg the resurrection and denyed the Millennium And the Doctour concludes in these very words By Iustine it cannot be concluded that the 1000. yeares was a matter of Catholike belief in his time but only favourd by him and many others and consequently though that were after condemned in the Church would it not be from this testimony inferred that a Catholick Doctrine much lesse a Tradition were condemned And he gives vs a Rule whereby we may answer all that can be objected out of S. Irenaeus or any other ancient Author saying Pag 91. I confess I acknowledg my opinion that there were in that age men otherwise minded as out of Iustin it appeared I could cite an other highly
but even from the publike Service of Heretiks and will touch and be of the same communion with them If the Apostle sayd to Titus who was a Bishop and in no danger of being perverted avoide an hereticall man could he haue sayd Fly the man but not communion with him If in any case certainly in this we must call to mynd our Blessed Saviours saying He that denyes me I will deny him And what doth it availe a man to gaine the whole world if he loose his owne soule To which purpose Tertullian saieth de Coron Mil Cap 11. Non admittit status Fidei allegationem necessitatis Nulla est necessitas delinquendi quibus vna est necessitas non delinquendi The condition of Christian Faith cannot admitt for excuse of a thing not lawfull to say they were necessitated therto There can be no necessity of sinning for them who acknowledg one only thing to be necessary namely not to sin What is that one thing which our saviour saith is necessary except not to sin Come loss of goods liberty and life let vs remember It is not necessary that we be rich or at liberty or enjoy a long and prosperous life but One thing is absolutely necessary that we do not offend our God If in a morall affaire we would guide soules by metaphysicke the next step will be to take the Zuinglian supper not forsooth as it is receaved by them in nature of a Sacrament but intending only to eate it as it is no more than bread and wine or as Christians may weare the apparell which Infidels vse according to the civill custome of their country But in matters of this nature middle wayes are most dangerous and next to precipices and you must remember those words 3. Reg 18. V. 22. If our Lord be God follow him but if Baal follow him Upon which place the Doway Testament makes this profitable Annotation Such zealous expostulation is necessary to all Neutralls in Religion who are neither hot nor cold but lukewarme such as Angells detest Apoc 3. Less harme it is if we respect the mischiefe which may accrew to others for a man to profess Heresy than professing himselfe a Catholike to be cause that others follow his Doctrine and example in communicating with Heretiks in that which they are wont to call Divine Service What a monster may it justly seeme for Catholiks at home abroad in their pulpits and all other occasions to impugne and speake against Heresyes and the next day to be seene in the same Church at the same publike service with Heretiks This Doctrine of the vnlawfulness for Catholiques to be present at the service or sermons of Heretiques is taught by those incomparable holy zealous and learned Authors of the Annotations vpon the Rhemes Testament Cardinal Alane Richard Bristo Willyam Raynolds Gregory Martin in Matth 10. N. 32. Marc 3. N. 13. 2. Cor 6. N. 14. Ad Tit 3. N. 10. Joan 2. N. 10. And who will not prefer the Authority of these men who opposed themselves against the Heresy Policy and Cruelty of those tymes before any who now should presume to teach the contrary Vpon the whole matter therfore I conclude that it is impossible to propound any Forme of Liturgy in which both sides can hold it lawfull to communicate And therfore Luther and his fellowes did absolutely renounce the Communion of all Churches by professing a contrary Faith and ceasing to communicate with them in Liturgy and publike worship of God which is the thing you denyed in your Objection 83. Object 2. Pag 263. N. 26. You say to your Adversarie That although it were granted Schisme to leaue the externall Communion of the visible Church in what state or case soever it be and that Luther and his followers were Schismatiks for leaving the externall Communion of all visible Churches Yet you faile exceedingly of clearing the other necessary Point vndertaken by you that the Roman Church was then the visible Church For neither doe Protestants as you mistake make the true preaching of the word and due administration of the Sacraments the notes of the visible Church but only of a visible Church Now these you know are very different things the former signifying the Church Catholique or the whole Church The latter a particular Church or a part of the Caâ—holique And therfore suppose we should grant what by Argument you can never evince that your Church had these notes yet would it by no meanes follow that your Church were the visible Church but only a visible Church Not the whole Catholique Church but only a part of it But then besides where doth Dr. Pâ—tter acknowledg any such matter as you pretend Where doth he say that you had for the substance the true preaching of the word or due administration of the Sacraments Or where doth he say that from which you collect this you wanted nothing Fundamentall necessary to salvation 84. Answer Your conscience could not but tell you that Charity Maintayned had evidently cleared this Point and answered your Objections Part 1. N. 47. Pag 221. in these words that the Roman Church I speake not for the present of the particular Diocese of Rome but of all Visible Churches dispersed through the whole world agreeing in Faith with the Chayre of Peter whether that Sea were supposed to be in the City of Rome or in any other place That I say The Church of Rome in this sense was the visible Catholique Church out of which Luther departed is proved by your owne confession who assigne for Notes of the Church the true Preaching of Gods word and true administration of Sacraments both which for the substance you cannot deny to the Roman Church since you confess that she wanted nothing Fundamentall or necessary to salvation and for that very cause you thinke to cleare yourselfe from Schisme whose property as Potter sayeth Pag 76. is to cut off from the Body of Christ and the hope of salvation the Church from which it separates Now that Luther and his fellowes were borne and baptized in the Roman Church and that she was the Church out of which they departed is notoriously knowne And therfore you cannot cut her off from the Body of Christ and hope of salvation vnless you will acknowledg your selfe to deserue the just imputation of Schisme Neither can you deny her to be truly Catholique by reason of pretended corruptions not Fundamentall For your selfe avouch and endeavour to proue that the true Catholique Church may erre in such Points Morover I hope you will not so much as goe about to proue that when Luther rose there was any other true Visible Church disagreeing from the Roman and agreeing with Protestants in their particular doctrines And you cannot deny but that England in those dayes agreed with Rome and other nations with England and therfore either Christ had no Visible Church vpon Earth or els you must grant that it was the Church of Rome A truth so manifest that
this bene but to giue for a reason that which was more questionable then the thing in question as being neither evident in itself and plainly denied by his adversaries and not at all proved nor offered to be proved here or else where by Irenaeus To speak thus therefore had bene weak and ridiculous Answer This your Objection proves too much even in your owne principles and therefore proves nothing For whether you translate it agree or resort you must suppose that S. Irenaeus conceyved that the Tradition of the Roman Church was sufficient to confute all Heretiques and consequently that this sufficiency was not more questionable then the thing in question For if it were so you mak to vse your owne words his speaâ—h weak and ridiculous and worse than a begging of the Question and yet yourself do not deny but that his Argument was probable and sufficient to confound those particular Heretiques surely not by a weak and ridiculous Reason Yea S. Irenaeus affirmes it to be sufficient to confute not only those but all Heretiques all those saieth he who any way either by evâ—ll complacence c. and therefore Hee must suppose as a principle believed by all orthodox Christians that the Tradition of the Roman Church was powerfull against all Heresies And I am glad to see you at length reflect that if S. Irenaeus did not proue that all Churches must agree with the Roman his Argument had bene weak and ridiculous For by this your consideration I infer that the Answer which you and other Protestants are wont to giue to S. Austine or other Fathers is insufficient to wit That they alledg against Heretiques the Authority of the Church not because they believed her to be infallible but because she was at that time pure in her Doctrines which had bene only to begg the Question or as you say to giue for a reason that which was more questionable then the thing in Question and I beseech the Reader to consider well this point as a thing effectuall to make good my confutation of Chillingworths evasions in divers occasions and lately in our debate about S. Optatus And even heere you begg the Question though you reade it resort for the same reason that you say S. Irenaeus had begd the Question if we reade agree In the speach which you faine S. Irenaeus to make as yourself would haue him speak you say To this Church by reason it is placed in the Imperiall Citty whether all mens affaires do necessarily draw them or by reason of the powerfull Principality it hath over all the adjacent Churches there is and always hath bene a necessity â—f a perpetuall recourse of all the faithfull round about who if there hath bene any alteration in the Church of Rome could not in all probality but haue observed it But they to the contrary haue alwaies observed in this Church the very Tradition which came from the Apostles and no other where you make good that powerfull argument of Catholiques against ProtestaÌ„ts That it was impossible so many errors and corruptions should creepe insensibly into the belief of the Roman Church seing as you say to this Church by reason it is placed in the Imperiall Citty whither all mens affares doe necessarily draw them or by reason of the powerfull Principality it hath over all the adjacent Churches there is c. Who if there had bene any alteration in this Church of Rome could not in all probability but haue observed it But they to the contrary haue alwaies observed in this Church the very Tradition which came from the Apostles and no other Which retortion growes to be more strong if we consider that from Christ our Lord and Saviour to the time of S. Irenaeus there passed about the same number of yeares which are numbred betwene S. Austine and S. Gregory the Great and yet Protestants commonly grant that in S. Austines tyme the Church was free from those falsely pretended errours which they say were found in the tyme of S. Gregory and therefore you must either grant That S. Irenaeus did vainely impugne those old Heretiques and that you against reason approue his Argument against them or els that our new sectaries cannot possibly avoide the Argument which we Catholiques vrge to proue that it was impossible so many so great and so manifest corruptions should in so short a tyme possess the whole Church of God especially seing to the contrary all men in all and every one of those Ages did conceyue that they could obserue in the Church of Rome the very Tradition which came from the Apostles and no other And if notwithstanding this you say That betwene the tyme of S. Austine and the Popedome of S. Gregory so manie errours might enter without being espied you make the argument of S. Irenaeus to be of no force at all and so you must either agree with Papists against your Protestant Brethren or disagree both from S. Irenaeus and yourself with whom you cannot agree vnless you relinquish those your pretended Brethren and finally we must conclude that no convincing argument could be brought against Heretiques drawen from the Tradition of the Roman Church if once we grant that she is not infallible in her traditions wherin if she be infallible adhering to her will be a certaine marke of a Catholique and separation from her a certaine marke of an Heretique 29. You tax Ch Ma for translating vndique every where and of what place soever in stead of round about For that it was necessary for all the Faith full of what place soever to resort to Rome is not true That the Apostolique Tradition hath alwaies bene conserved from those who are every where is not sense Now in stead of conservata read observata and translate vndique truly round about and then the sense will be both plain and good for then is must be rendred thus For to this Church by reason of a more powerfull principality there is a necessity all the Churches that is all the Faithfull round about should resort in which the Apostlique Tradition hath bene alwaies observed by those who were round about 30. Answer if you take the freedom to make or create what premises you please you may be sure to infer what conclusion you like best That vndique may signify every where as Ch Ma translates it from all places parts and corners you will finde in Thomas Thomasius and Cowper and who made you Emperour of words to command a restraint of theyr signification as may best suite with your ends S. Austine super Psalm 86. hath thrice Vndique in this signification For having saied Duodecim sedes quid sibi velint videamus he adds Sacramentum est cujusdam vniversitatis quia per totum orbem terrarum futura erat Ecclesia Et ideo quia vndique venitur ad judicandum duodecim sedes sunt sicut quia vndique intratur in illam civitatem duodecim portae sunt And Ab omnibus quatuor
to giue vp his owne And when or where did all Churches vnitedly and joyntly offer vp this vniversall supreme Authority to the Bishop of Rome 32. To the authority cited by Ch Ma out of S. Cyprian Epist 55. Heresies haue sprung and Schismes been bred from no other cause than for that the Priest of God is not obeyed nor one Priest and Judge is considered to be for the time in the Church of God You answer that S. Cyprian spoke not of Cornelius but of Himself and yet you confess N. 91. that Goulartius a learned Protestant grants that it is meant of Cornelius and Pamelius in his Annotations vpon this Epistle of S. Cyprian brings divers Arguments to proue the same Neither can it be denyed but that in his Booke de Vnitate Ecclesiae he affirmes Heresies to spring from not acknowledging one Head S. Peter vpon whom our Saviour builded his Church Super illum vnum aedificat Ecclesiam suam Primatus Petro datur vt vna Christi Ecclesia Cathedra vna monstretur Which is so manifest that the Protestant Chroniclers cent 3. col 84. lin 59. say Passim dicit Cyprianus super Petrum Ecclesiam fundatam esse vr Lib. 1. Epist 3. which is the Epistle cited by C. Ma. and of which we now speak And Lib 4. Epist 9. c. But although it were granted that S. Cyprian in his Epist 55. did speak of a particular Church it is cleare that for avoiding Schisme in the whole Church there is a necessity of one Head if for that cause one Head be necessary in every particular Church as heretofore we cited out of S. Hierom that among the Apostles one was chosen vt capite constituto Schismatis tolleretur occasio And even Dr. Covell a learned Protestant in his examination c. saieth How can they think that equality would keepe all the Pastors in the world in peace and vnity For in all Societies Authority which cannot be where all are equall must procure vnity and obedience Otherwise the Church should be in a farre worse case then the meanest commonwealth To which purpose he alledges that Sentence which we mentioned out of S. Hierom vt capite constituto Schismatis tolleretur occasio You say whether the words of S. Cyprian condemne Luther is another Question Answer If those words condemne Luther of Schisme for withdrawing his Obedience from the Pope which Ch Ma affirmes and you for the present do not deny it evidently implies that the Pope was Superiour to him and all other Christians 33. In your N. 99.100 you labour to elude these words of S. Optatus alledged by C. Ma in the same N. 36. Thou canst not deny but that thou knowest that in the Citty of Rome there was first an Episcopall chaire placed for Peter wherin Peter the head of all the Apostles sat whereof also he was called Cephas in which one chaire vnity was to be kept by all least the other Apostles might attribute to themselves each one his particular chaire aÌ„d that he should be a Schismatique and a sinner who against that one single Chaire should erect an other lib 2. cont Parmen You tell vs That the Donatists had set vp at Rome a Bishop of their faction and that Optatus proves them Schismatikes for so doing vpon this ground of one Bishop in one Church But whosoever reads Optatus will clearly see that he expresly speaks of the Catholique not of a particular Church which he saieth hath quinque ornamenta or dotes the first whereof is a chaire on which chaire of the Catholique and vniversall Church he saith S. Peter first sat whom he calls the Head of all the Apostles whereof he was called Cephas in which one Chaire vnity was to be kept by all Now I beseech you is it not cleare that Optatus speaks of S. Peter and of his Sea not as of a particular Bishop of a particular Church but as Head of the Catholique Church by whose meanes vnity was to be conserved and that Schisme and Heresie are to be discovered by opposition to that chayre which he calls singularem cathedram and may well signify not only a single or particular or individuall chaire but indeed singular by reason of singular preeminence and priviledg aboue all other Churches For this cause he speaks thus to the Donatist Parmenian Contra quas portas inferorum claves salutares accepisse legimus Petrum cui a Christo dictum est Tibi dabo claves regni Caelorum portae inferorum non vincenteas Vnde est ergo quod claves regni vobis vsurpare contenditis qui contra cathedram Petri vestris presumptionibus audacijs sacrilegio militatis To what purpose should he insist vpon these priviledges of S. Peter and his Chaire if he meant no more than what is common to all particular Churches Or how doth he afterward proue that they whom the Donatists opposed were â—in Ecclesia Sancta Catholica per Cathedram Petri quae nostra est But why do I labour to proue that which our Adversaries your Brethren are forced to grant For the Centurists cent 4. col 556. lin 17. alledg Optatus calling Peter Apostolorum caput vnde Cephas appellatur And indeed not only in the place alledged but also lib 7. he calls S. Peter caput Apostolorum And Fulk in his Retentiue Pag 248. chargeth Optatus with absurdity for saying of Peter Praeferri Apostolis omnibus meruit c He deserved to be preferred before all the Apostles You say When Optatus stiles S. Peter head of the Apostles and sayes that from thence he was called Cephas Perhaps he was abused into this opinion by thinking Cephas derived from the greek word Kephale wheras it is a Syriack word and signisies a stone But what imports it vpon what ground he called him head seing he called him so and believed him to be such Beside that which is the stone Rock or Foundation in a materiall Building in a mysticall Body is the Head as the vulgar saying is Homo est arbor inversa The roote is to a tree as the Head is to a man and therefore our Saviour sayd I will build my Church vpon this Rock after he had saied to S. Peter that he was a Rock In this manner the Centurists Cent 3. col 85. say that Origines Tract 5. in Matth dicit Petrus per promissionem meruit fieri Ecclesiae fundamentum and yet that Hom 17 in Lucam Petrum vocat Apostolorum Principem where we see that S. Peter is called both a Foundation and a Prince Chiefe or Head 34. But now giue me leaue to say plainly that it is intollerable in you to impugne by Reasons which you expressie only call probabilityes a matter delivered clearly in Scripture testifyed by Antiquity embraced by Nations and corroborated by the great Plea of Possession peacefull and tyme out of mynd against all which what wisdom is it to oppose meere Topicall Socinian conjectures You saie First That S. Peter should haue authority