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city_n	bishop_n	church_n	rome_n	9,289	5	7.3911	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A29779	The late converts exposed, or, The reasons of Mr. Bays's changing his religion considered in a dialogue : part the second : with reflections on the life of St. Xavier, Don Sebastian King of Portugal, as also the fable of the bat and the birds.	Brown, Thomas, 1663-1704.	1690 (1690)	Wing B5061; ESTC R13424	82,114	78

her Blood begun Crites If it is but about two hundred years since the Incarnation I confess we can't pretend to a longer standing in the World than you have assign'd us Mr. Bays But now I have been told all along that we stand two or three Stories higher in Chronology than you pretend Bays Stand as high as you please I 'm sure you 're not a minute older than the German Reformer Your Ancestors were every man of them believers of Transubstantiation that is in your charitable construction rank Idolaters Now if this Allegation be true pray what becomes of your boasted Succession for how an Idolatrous Church should convey true Orders and elsewhere you don't pretend to have received them is as much a Riddle to me as how a man shou'd translate the Psalms well that Copies them at second hand from Hopkins's Burlesque Eugen. Nay we are not at this time of the day to wonder at the conduct of your Catholick Church to ruine our succession Mr. Bays she takes the same Course that Widdow Black-acre did in the Plain-dealer that wou'd have sworn her self a whore upon record only to disinherit her rebellious Son Ierry Crites I find Mr. Bays you 're a meer Indian in History What did you never hear of the famous contest between Austin and the British Bishops about their subjection to the See of Rome and how fatally it concluded Did you never hear of the Wiclevites at home and of the Waldenses abroad which last Herd of Heretics as Reinerus the Inquisitor tells you some people place as high as the times of St. Silvester and others as high as the very Apostles Bays They may run 'em up to Noah's Flood with all my heart and I assure you upon my word Mr. Crites I 'le never grudge you the honour of citing such worthy instances to prove your antiquity Crites That is not the case Mr. Bays for I never mention'd 'em as tho we were descended in a down-right Line from them as they say the Kings of Scotland are descended from Fergus or as tho the merits of the Reformation depended on 'em But only to let you know that in some part of the World or other there never wanted a generation of men even in the darkest and most barbarous times that opposed your innovations and had the bravery to stem the Tide of the Papal Usurpations This might be made appear in every Century since your Church parted with her Maiden-head to the Man of Sin but because it is not to be done without an endless quotation of Authors which is a sort of vanity that I am not naturally very fond of I shall ee'n refer you to the Historia Papatus for your farther satisfaction Some of your Divines have been so civil to us as to allow us the three first Centuries or at least to acknowledge that all those controverted points wherein you and we differ were not clearly established in the earliest times of Christianity The Church it seems had afterwards fuller revelations of all these depending matters and some Christian Doctrines like China-earth were to be buried under ground for a considerable time before they were fit for a discovery and the practice of mankind Thus Mr. Bays in the opinion of your best Authors who to be sure wou'd never pass such extraordinary complements upon us if they cou'd otherwise help it we have as much Antiquity on our side as we can desire 'T is very true that in succeeding times your Popes served the Christian Religion as Dr. Oats served the Popish-plot they found a large Foundation upon which they raised several superstructures of their own now we only removed and pulled 'em down at the beginning of the Reformation so that we constituted no new Church as some of your Dreaming Scriblers pretend but only restored her to her primitive purity and simplicity Bays Ay ay you have restored her with a witness and you are to thank the Wittemberg-Revolter for setting you upon so pious a performance As for my own part by reading Mr. Walkers Book of Oxford I have entertained such prejudices against him that all the World can never remove 'em And I heartily thank that learned Author for making the following observation That whilst the Turk was attacquing Christianity in the Front at Vienna Luther was at the same invading it in the Rear in Saxony Crites I don't know Mr. Bays whether it is worth your while to take notice of such impertinent remarques for at the same time you oblige us of the Reformation to look a little into History and see whether we cannot make the same returns upon you I have read somewhere or other I am certain that at the very same juncture when Boniface set up for Universal Bishop that Mahomet was establishing his Alcoran in Arabia and to pass by the like occurences in former ages the Brussels Gazette acquainted the world that Count Hains the Player and my Lord S-l-s-b-ry were reconcil'd to the Church of Rome together and every body in the City knows that Moll Meggs and my Lord S-nd-rl-nd were admitted into the Popish Chappel at White-hall on the same day Bays However Mr. Crites I can scarce be perswaded that Luther and the other Bell-weathers of the Reformation were ever design'd by providence to restore the Church to what you call her ancient purity and to retreive her from a long habitual course of Superstition and Idolatry for by that cut-throat name you slander the received usages of the Western Church since they came not attended with the power of Miracles which is the usual badge of the Missionaires of Heaven and for his part Luther had nothing in him to distinguish him from the rest of the World but a peculiar talent of reviling Princes aspersing his Superiors and treating all his Adversaries with insupportable insolence and scurrility Crites As for his Heats and Passions we have no more to say Mr. Bays but that your Infallible Guides have not been without 'em witness he that blasphem'd so heartily for having only lost a Peacock Now I wonder that you should fall so severely upon Luther for the freedom he took with King Henry the 8th for I suppose you had your eye upon him when you tax'd the German just now with the reviling of Princes when there 's scarce a Priest or Scribler of your party throughout the Kingdom that has not assaulted that or any other Princes memory with greater boldness and familiarity who has had the hardiness to mortifie the Churchmen you need not be informed how that Haberdasher of Gerunds and Supines Scioppius the Grammarian used King Iames the First But a little warm raillery in a Protestant I find is an unpa●donable sin while the Catholic Cause sanctifies even the vilest ribaldry and ascribes it all to the score of Zeal and Devotion Eugen. But why Mr. Bays should you think the worse of the Reformation for its want of Miracles We don't pretend to have raised a new Church and

to inp●y the same when they are rais'd to the Supream Elevation as I don't question but from the same principle they have practis'd and justify'd the Invocation of Saints to have the same Adoration paid to themselves or their friends another day To conclude then this troublesome tedious discourse about your pious Pastor's Infallibility if ever Mr. Bays you alarm me with it any more I must return you the very same answer that a certain Gentleman gave Dr. Oates about his Narrative and tell you plainly I believe just as much and not a syllable more than he believes of it himself I come now Mr. Bays to consider in the next place the Antiquity of your Church which all of your Pamphleteers take for granted belongs to you and in commendation of which they employ all their little stock of Eloquence when the Novelty of the Reformation has somewhat discompos'd them When I first read Caranza and some others of your Authors of the same strain I was afraid they 'd have carried their Religion an Age or two above the Incarnation as well as their predecessors in Chronology the old AEgyptian Priests made themselves some thousands years older than the Creation They tell us that Anacletus the third Pope after St. Peter Decreed That all difficult questions should receive their final determination from the Apostolic Chair That Alexander his immediate successor recommended Holy Water to the Church That Anicetus commanded the Priests to shave their Heads in fashion of a circle for a certain grave reason which will serve them for changing their Shirts once a Week as well That Pope Fabian pass'd an Order that Bishops should carefully observe to renew the Chrism once a year in their Churches I need not give my self the trouble to pursue these puny Historians any farther because these instances Mr. Bays may serve to give you a taste of the rest only from this blind account of the Primitive times a man would be tempted to think that for the three first Centuries after their receiving Christianity in Rome they had no such thing as a Distinction of time as Pliny tells us that for a hundred and twenty years ab Urbe Condita they had no distinction of hours Now supposing all that I have mentioned out of the Decretal were true as I am sure 't is every syllable an Imposture I can only say this Mr. Bays that the Mystery of Iniquity began to operate very early amongst you and that your Church might with a great deal of justice use the famous Quartilla's saying in Petronius Junonem iratam habeam si me unquam meminero fuisse Virginem But for your comfort and satisfaction Mr. Bays we are able to prove that she was not debauch'd so soon as you pretend but continued in her state of Maiden-hood a good considerable time after tho we expect you 'll no more thank us for such a performance than a she-Cut-purse at the Old-Baily that hopes to save a hanging by pretending a big belly wou'd thank a Iury of Midwives for bringing her in not with Child Alas St. Peter's Successors in those days had other business on their hands than to amuse their Flock with such idle impertinencies and you might as soon perswade me that a man of tolerable sense would send to consult with his Peruke-maker about the newest fashion just an hour before his Execution as that your Bishops wou'd entertain their people in these trifles these No-parts of Christianity when they were to prepare them for Persecution and Martyrdom No no Mr. Bays your Roman Religion was no more perfected in one day than the City was built in one day 't was the labour of several Ages to bring it to its present splendor and condition and part of it like our St. Pauls here in the City was finished and adorned before so much as the foundation of the other end was laid And thus you know Mr. Bays in the business of Tragedy and Comedy Thespis began it in a Cart AEschylus not long after introduced it upon the Stage and in succeeding Ages when the Government was wholly employed in cultivating the Theatre it received the additional beauty of Chorus's Scenes Machines and other decorations After all if your Party cannot be perswaded to drop their pretensions to Antiquity but they must needs continue their claim still I 'd e'en advise them to make the most of the plea as they can they may give out that those two noble Philosophers I mean Zeno that deny'd local motion and Anaxagoras that held Snow to be black were Members of your Church and stiff asserters of Transubstantiation Their principles all the world knows have nothing in them that contradicts a Sense-renouncing Doctrine and I am sure they may be urged upon us with greater show of probability than either a St. Cyprian or a St. Austin I have I cannot tell how run my self into a longer Preface by far than I at first designed whether it is your example Mr Bays that has betrayed me into this extravagance or whether my matter flowed upon me so abundantly that it was impossible to check the tide I know not but I shall make bold to tell you in your own words that when I address my self to you in a discourse of this nature again whatever fault I commit you may rest assured it shall not be that of too much length I have only a word or two to say to the Devotion and Canonization of your Church and then I have done A man has all the reason in the world to entertain but ordinary thoughts of your way of worship when he finds à la veue that your Devotion was altogether fitted to the Ceremonies and not the Ceremonies to the Devotion Thus for instance a show of Candles made a pretty figure in the Church they helped to set off the Pictures and the rich habit of the Priests and for that reason principally they were introduced But after they had continued some years in the Church it was thought expedient to assign a better reason for them so some body stumbled upon Ego sum Lux Mundi and from that time Candles dated themselves Jure Divino Thus likewise the Elevation of the Host was set up not for any Devotion or necessity for every body knows that Transubstantiation was a hundred years old before it was decreed but Holy Church was resolved to bring in that Ceremony whether a pretence cou'd be offer'd for it or no At last a Monk proved it out of Psal. 72. v. 16. There shall be a handful of Corn in the Earth upon the top of the Mountain A man sees nothing like Elevation in our English Version but for your comfort Mr. Bays the word Elevabitur is to be found in the Latin Translation and then the handful of Corn was immediately turned into a Wafer and the top of the Mountain was to pass current for the Priests Head Whether or no these reasons were thought of at the

and at long run to defeat my competitor Crites Why Mr. Bays this is like enjoyning a Painter that has a good fancy at drawing of Saracens Heads and Grotesque Figures only to draw you a Venus or an Adonis where he must certainly miscarry Now I am apt to fancy you trepann'd the honest Translator of Lucretius with this profound piece of policy come confess the truth man Did you not Bays You cou'd not have guess'd better Mr. Crites if you had div'd into my Diaphragma for the secret It was not in my power you must know either to suppress the work or to discommend it because to give the Gentleman his due it was performed beyond all expectation and what was a mighty matter it suited as pat as might be with the Philosophy of the Town that was then in fashion Now to undermine and ruin him to all intents and purposes I took these measures I flatter hugg and caress him like an Achitophel as I was after the strangest manner imaginable profest all the respects and friendship in the world for him tell him that providence had certainly reserv'd him for working Miracles in Poetry and that I had some ancient prophecies by me at home which declared him to be the very person that was to deliver the immortal writers of former ages out of that Algerin captivity they had so long labour'd under Crites Well for dawbing and wheedling I 'le let thee loose to any Poet in Christendom Bays That if by his mighty Feat he cou'd form those Irish Atoms of Lucretius into so regular and well disciplin'd an Army cou'd raise such harmony out of a dull unmusical Philosopher how glorious and exalted wou'd his attempts be upon Horace or what might we not expect from so advantageous so promising an undertaking And so Gentlemen with the help of a little incense and flattery I so cajol'd this AEsops Crow that he presently dropt his Epicurean Cheese out of his Mouth to sing one of his unmusical ill-turn'd Odes of Horace I perswaded this Welch Courser to leave his ragged unaccessible precipices where there was no coming after him to try his strength and feet upon good plain Carpet ground where an English Vinegar-horse I knew wou'd easily distance him Crites To deal plainly with thee little Bays if I were in this injur'd Gentleman's case I should see thee hanged before I could forgive thee Bays But the best jest is still untold To remove all manner of suspicion from him and let him see I dealt sincerely and above board I gave him my paternal Benediction with this advice Quit not for public toyls a College-life Nor take that kind of settlement a Wife The drift of my meaning in disswading him from the Town and advising him to continue still in the University was to keep him at as great a distance as I cou'd lest he should set up for himself here in the City and spoil my own Trade and I never car'd what encouragement he found at Avignon as long as I was the chief man at Rome for let me tell you by the by Parnassus tho they say it has two tops yet I am confident it will but just maintain one Monarch or one incumbent at a time In disswading him from Matrimony I pretended to have a great concern for the young Man's welfare and cunningly insinuated that it was not convenient for the health of his body to be drain'd and suck'd by two insatiable Leeches at a time a Muse and a Wife Eugen. Faith Mr. Bays you took the right course in assming the character of a friend upon this occasion for had you used him severely perhaps the World might have been enclin'd to show him the greater kindness as they say for a Man to cry down his Wife is the infallible way to procure her a kind keeper and we have seen plainly enough that the late immortal sufferers at Oxford fared the better for being so cruelly treated by the Ecclesiastical Commissioners Bays That rule of yours Mr. Eugenius does not always hold for I have used a noble Poet of the other University with all the ill-nature and rigour in the World yet he never had the good fortune yet to meet one single defender to espouse his quarrel 'T is Mr. Cleveland I am now discoursing of You know Gentlemen how I have treated him in my Essay upon Dramatic Poetry a thousand times worse I gad then any of his Presbyterian friends I lash him there for his tall Hyperbole's his affected obscurity his unworthy expressions and wou'd you think it for his ill Husbandry in tacking together too much wit For you must understand I can sometimes quarrel with a man for being guilty of too much wit as well as for having none at all and I am certain that in this frugal Age which is for retrenching all unnecessary expences one single thought well managed shall go farther then twenty of 'em cou'd formerly before we were taught by the Gold-beaters how to extend a fancy for a furlong or two In short a Clevelandism and a Catachresis were with me terms full as conversible as Crites Nay never pump for 't man as Beef and Mustard Pork and Pease Hand and Glove or Brawn and Christmas Bays No no as Protestantism and opiniarete Popery and Infallibility are with me now Upon King Charles the First 's going in disguise to his trusty Subjects the Scots he has this passage Heaven that the Minister of thy person owns Will sue thee for dilapidations Now how do you think I ridicul'd em Why I cou'd never go to my Barber to be shaved for half a dozen years at least but I thus accosted him and all at poor Mr. Cleveland's charges I gad Come Iack said I you must repair the dilapidations of my face for me for I am damnably afraid lest my maker shou'd endite me upon the first Chapter of Genesis verse the 23 for letting his Image run to ruin Crites Well I see Mr. Bays you can be severe with a vengeance when you please Thou art a very Zoilus incarnate Bays Likewise he having the misfortune to call that Domestic animal yclep'd a Cock The Baron Tell-clock of the Night I cou'd never I gad as I came home from the Tavern meet a Watchman or so but I presently askd him Baron Tell-clock of the Night prithee how goes the time Indeed I have of late days since the happy exchange I made of my Religion found some compunctions in my Conscience for being so severe and unkind to him and if he were alive I am confident I should heartily beg his pardon and tender him all the acknowledgments I am capable of Crites Prithee Mr. Bays how comes this qualm of good nature to seize thee on the sudden I am afraid all is not well with thee Come take heart of grace man and ne're be dejected at the matter Bays You can't imagine Mr. Crites how angry I am with my self for treating the aforesaid Author with so much severity