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A16170 A courteous conference with the English Catholikes Romane about the six articles ministred vnto the seminarie priestes, wherein it is apparantly proued by their owne diuinitie, and the principles of their owne religion, that the Pope cannot depose her Maiestie, or release her subiectes of their alleageance vnto her. And finally, that the bull of Pius Quiutus [sic] pronounced against her Maiestie is of no force eyther in lawe or conscience, all Catholicke scruples to the contrarie beeing throughly and perfectly cleared and resolued, and many memoriall matters exactly discussed, which haue not beene handled by man heeretofore. Written by Iohn Bishop a recusant papist. Bishop, John, d. 1613.; Frewen, John, 1558-1628. 1598 (1598) STC 3092; ESTC S102284 61,282 90

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Lords Is this the speach of a soueraigne or a subiect And a little after Ad hac per me se●uum vltimum suum vestrum respondebit Christus dicens ego te sacerdotes meos manus tua commisi tu a meo seruitio milites tuos subtrahis And ego indignus famulus vester sci● c. vnto this will Christ himself answere by me his vilest bondman and yours saying I haue aduanced thee from c. vnto the empyre c. I haue committed my priestes into thy handes and thou doest withdraw thy souldiours from my seruice And I your vnworthy seruant doe knowe And at the foote of the letter he writeth that which striketh this present controuersie stone dead Ego quidem Ius●ioni subiectus eandem legem per diuersas terrarum partes transmitti feci quia lex ipsa omnipotenti Deo minimè concordat ecce per suggestionis meae paginam serenissimis dominis meis nunciaui vtribique ergo quae debui exolui qui imperatori obedientiam pribus pro Deo quae sensui minimè tacui I beeing subiect to commandement haue caused the same lawe to be sent through diuers partes of the world and because the same lawe doth nothing agree with God behold I haue signified it vnto my renowned Lorde by the letter of my suggestion wherefore I haue in both thinges discharged that which I ought who haue shewed obedience vnto the Emperour and yet haue neuer a whit left vnspoken that which I thought in Gods behalfe In this authoritie I note first that the Pope doth acknowledge himselfe subiect and seruant vnto the Emperour beeing a Christian and doth call him his leige Lord. Secondlie he doth affirme that God had subiected the priestes and clergie vnto the Christian princes for to serue them for otherwise it can not answere the other member and thou doest withdrawe thy souldiours from my seruice And thirdly that Gregorie a Pope doth acknowledge and affirme himselfe to be subiect vnto the Emperours commaundement yea and thought himselfe so bounde to obey him that he might not with a safe conscience refuse to publish such decrees of his as he thought in his conscience vngodly M●lanus diuini ie that Gregorie offended not in obeying a wicked an ●ngodly commandement the which thing if any cunning Catholique thinke that Gregorie might not lawfully doe let him reade Molanus a learned Catholique of Louayne his booke de fide hereticis rebellibus seruanda of keeping promise with heretickes and rebels and there he shall finde his fact defended moreouer the like subiection of himselfe and the clergie vnto the Emperiour doth he acknowledge writing of this verie same matter and Lawe vnto Theodorus the Emperours physition in these wordes words Valde autem mihi durum videtur vt ab eius seruitio milites suos prohibeat qui ei omnia tribuit dominarie● non solùm militibus Eplapelib 2. Ind●● in eplape●●lt sed etiam sacerdotibus concesset In english this But it seemeth to me to be harde that he should forbid his souldiours his seruice who hath both giuen him all that he hath and also granted him to be Lorde ouer not onely the souldiours but also the priestes In the same letter also he doth call the king my Lord and our Lord. But although I hope that this assertion and iudgement of Grego●●e surnamed the great a Pope a canonized saint and one of the foure approued Doctors of the latine Church will satisfie all reasonable Catholickes Romane Yet I will proceede further with the ecclesiasticall practise Anone after Gregorie and about the yeare of our Lord. 608. Bonifacius the third was a very earnest suter vnto Phocas the Emperour Bonifacius Paulus diaconus to decree that the sea of Rome shoulde be the heade Church of Christendome the which at length he obtained with much a doe but in good faith he might haue saued much labour if he had beene Monarch of the world for then he could haue done it of himselfe without once God haue mercy to the Emperour Paulus diaconus And his successor Bonifacius the fourth put vp a supplication to the same Phocas that he would vouchsafe to commaund that the Temple of Pantheon at Rome which had beene dedicated to all the Pagan Gods should be conuerted to the Church of the virgin Mary and of all the holy Martyrs Seuerinus I trow this example is of some moment Anno. 636. Seuerinus was chosen Bishop of Rome to ratifie the which election saith Sabellicus there must be had the assent of the Emperours Lieuetenant in Italy called the Eparch Isaac that then had that charge came therefore to Rome as he saide but because he woulde be paide for his paines he tooke out all the treasure out of the vestrie of the Laterane Church deuiding parte of it among his souldiours and sending parte vnto the Emperour and least he shoulde be called an ill cooke hee also licked his owne fingers and yet the Pope stirred not one whit such powerlesse princes were Popes in those daies Sabell and such seruile subiectes vnto Emperours Againe aboute Anno Domini 650. Constans the Emperour commaunded his Eparch Olympius to cōmaund vpon their allegeance Martin the Bishop of Rome and all the rest of the Italian Bishops to embrace the heresy of the Monothlites Martin which if they should refuse to doe that then hee shoulde take order that the Bishop of Rome might be taken prisoner or if that could not be done without great vprore by reason of the good will and defence of the people for much was the authoritie and maiestie of the Emperours decayed with the people of Rome by there farre distance there small Empyre in Italie beeing cooped in a narrowe corner by the Lomberdes their heresies and vngodlinesse and finally because they had made the seate of their Lieuetenant to be at Rauenna that then he shoulde cause him sodenly to be slayne by some sleight he came to Rome declared the Emperours commaundement the which the Bishop refused to accomplish but to apprehende him the Eparch durst not and of murdering him he missed But two yeares after Theodorus the Eparch entered the Citie apprehended him sent him in Irons vnto the Emperour who confined him into the Chersonesus of Thrace where for pouertie he perished Anno 667. Diac. Constans the Emperour after he had vnfortunatelie fought in Italy with the Lombardes came vnto Rome the Bishoppe Vitalian with all the clergie going forth sixe miles to receiue him who shortly after deceiued them for hee spoyled the Church called Pantheon of all the sacred ornamentes Vitalian and vncouered it taking of the tile of copper yea and all the auncient pieces of worke eyther of copper or marble that he could finde in the whole Citie and sent to Constantinople so that he defaced Rome more in seauen daies then all the Barbarians had euer done since the declination of the Empyre and the like
hauock he made in all the the Churches subiect vnto him in Italy Sicileye and Sardinia and yet for all this Peter drewe not the sworde for hee yet remembred how bitterly his master had once checked him before for fighting Anno Dom. 700. Iustinianus the Emperour saith Diaconus commaunding Constantine the Pope to come vnto him honourably receiued him Constantine and sent him backe whom he beeing prostrated on the ground desired to be an intercessor vnto God for his sinnes renewed all the priuiledges of his Church why then the priuiledges were first giuen by the Emperour and not by God himselfe But that the Emperour fell downe at the Bishops feete it was done in respect not of his greatnesse but of his godlinesse a thing vsually done by great princes vnto ancient Monkes and Hermites renowned for their strict life and rare pietie whereof all Christian histories yeelde vs store of examples and this to be soe doth his request of intercession vnto GOD for his sinnes manifestly shewe But to returne againe to our practise about Anno Domini 690. another Iustinian the Emperour sent Zacharias his Protospatharius or high Constable into Italy for to bring Sergius the Bishop of Rome Sergius vnto him in Irons because he woulde not subscribe vnto a lewde counsell helde by him at Constantinople Sabell and he had done it if that the Emperiall Armie in Italy what for hatred of the Emperour and the good will of the Pope and his cause had not speedily marched to Rome to withstand his apprehension yet this Emperour did afterwarde renewe for Constantine the Bishop a confirmation of all the p●iuiledges of the Sea of Rome This Constantine was the first Bishop of Rome saith Omphrius the newe Chronicler of the Popes Qui in os ausus est resistere which durst resist the Emperours of Constantinople to their faces for he at the importunate petition of the people of Rome who requested it with great outcries decreede that the name of Philippicus the Emperour shoulde not be mentioned at the Aulter nor in anie writing or recordes nor his image set vp in their Churches because he had commaunded the Bishop to consent vnto his Arrianisme and the abolishing of the Images of Saintes But Paulus Diaconus who liued neare that time writeth that statuit populus the people decreede and not the Pope About Anno Domini 7●5 Leo Isauricus the Emperour commaunded Gregory the Bishop of Rome Gregorie the second to destroy all the images of the Saintes the which he refused to doe But although the Emperour did execute many therefore and about that matter banished the patriarch of Constantinople and had sundry times practised the Popes death both couertly and also by open forces causing the Eparch to bring his Armie before the Citie of Rome where he was repelled by the Lombardes yet woulde the Pope by no meanes be wonne to consent that a new Emperour should be chosen in Ital●e the which was now in a good forwardnesse the people hauing slaine Martin the gouernour of the Citie of Rome and his sonne the Lieuetenant of Campania and the Citizens of Rauenna the Eparch and had chosen them almost in euerie Citie newe officers But Gregorie woulde by no meanes consent thereunto but wonne them to be quiet with much a doe But when the Emperour woulde not desist from forcing of his edict for the abolishment of Images vppon the Romanes and the Italians Gregorie the third successor vnto the other helde a Counsell in Italie wherein he excommunicated the Emperour and then the Citizens of Rome and all the teritorie about called by the name of the Duchy of Rome reuolted from the Emperour who was negligent in defending them against the Lombardes that had sweeped him almost out of all Italie from Rome to the Alpes and soe the Pope became prince of the Citie and Duchie of Rome S. Sigon de regno Italiae and subiect vnto no man about the yeare 730. And to establish the state of the Romane principalitie by stopping of titles Zacharias the Pope wonne his Creator Pepine the french king to spoyle Aistulfus the king of the Lombardes of Rauenna by right whereof beeing the siege of the Gotish kingdome and the emperiall exarchate in Italy The Pope cannot depose princes he claimeth tribute of the Romanes and for to bestowe it vppon him and his successors for to take away all quarrell for euer Thus ye see that the Bishoppes of Rome were alwaies subiect vnto the temporall princes of the Citie vntill such time as the reuolting people had created him their prince as all other Bishops in ciuill soueraigne so that the Popes are not exempted of temporall subiection by the institution of GOD but by the election of men as the high priestes became to be soueraignes after the returne of the Iewes from Babylon there beeing ordained to be the temporall prince Then seeing by the ordinance of God the Pope was a subiect and by the creation of men beeing made a soueraigne onely ouer some certaine prouinces I cannot see howe eyther by Gods Law or mans hee can rightly claime anie authoritie to depose Christian princes at his pleasure no more then any other subiecte can his soueraigne or seuerall soueraignes one another to grant eyther of which is soe absurde that I shoulde shewe my selfe to haue verie little witte if I shoulde goe aboute to refute eyther as though any man that had common sense woulde doubte of them For to reason that Sixtus Quintus because hee is secular soueraigne ouer these prouinces which are called the patrimonie of Peter may therefore depose all other Christian princes is as good an argument as if I shoulde saie ELIZABETH is Queene of England therefore she may depose the prince of the patrimonie and all other Christian princes So that by prouing my first proposition that Christ gaue vnto Peter and his successors no soueraignetie secular I haue also conuinced the seconde that they can not depriue Christian princes of their principalities The Pope cannot depose the temporall soueraine Neyther is the Popes claime anie thing aduanced by those two sayinges of Christ vnto Peter which I doe finde alleadged by Gregorie the seuenth when hee first of anie Pope deposed Henry the fourth Emperour as the warrant of his doings Plati The first is feede my sheepe wherein hee did not sayde Gregorie exempt Kinges And the other whatsoeuer thou shalt binde on the earth shall be bound in Heauen and whatsoeuer thou doest loose in the earth shall be loosed in Heauen For I haue proued before that Christ his kingdome was spirituall and soe a spirituall charge of soules hee committed to Peter and the rest of the Apostles and their successors and noe Empyre ouer the bodies and goods of anie men But Doctor S●u●ders takes greate holde of the Greeke woorde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Poimaine which the Apostle vseth when Christ bad Peter the second time to feede his sheepe for that
happely they could bring him within the compasse of treason by denying the paiment of tribute vnto the Emperour and so procure his death by the Romaine president as seditious And therefore he asked them why they tempted him and willed them to shew him a peny and then he demaunded of them whose image was stamped on the peece and they answered the Emperours then saide he giue the Emperour that which is his and so likwise ynto god that which is gods a very obscure sentence giuen by a iudge in a sute but a wise and wittie answere for such false traterous Interrogants And with the like trisles doth the same Felisius also trouble vs when he goeth about to proue the exemption of the clergy frō free subiection of secular princes because Melchisdech was both a king and a priest so likewise Moses a priest supreme gouernor of the Iseralites And finally Hely was both high priest and also secular Prince or iudge of the Iewes For if Melchisedech were both a King and a Priest what is that to the controuersie that we haue now in hand whether that Priestes be subiect vnto the temporall Prince but perhaps it touched the matter if we had disputed whether that a Bishop may be also a temporall Prince See Fenestella As for a King to be a Priest was an vsual thing in many countries among the heathen Yea all the Romaine Kings had the chiefe charge of the sacrifices temples and worshippe of the gods and therefore when the Kinges were expelled they ordained a priest whom they called the sacrificing King who should execute those publicke sacrifices which did of right belong vnto the Kings function but for hatred of their kings made him subiect vnto the chiefe Priest or Pontifiex Maximus the which office of Pontifiex Maximus all the heathen Romaine Emperours continually had See Dion c. But that Moses was both the ciuill magistrate and also a priest it maketh very much against himselfe for although we doe grant that Moses was a Priest yet it is most manifest that he was not high Priest but his brother Aaron whome yet to be subiect vnto Moses all men seene in the sacred scriptures do knowe so that nothing can make more for the superioritie of the ciuill magistrate then this example that Aaron being high Priest and head and chiefe of all Priestes was yet subiect to Moses an ordinary Priest Moses was a prophet and not a priest because he had the soueraigntie temporall Likewise what is it to the purpose if that Hely the high Priest was also created secular magistrate for so were all the high Priestes after the returne of the people from Babilon vntill they were conquered by the Romaines and the kingdome was giuen by them vnto Herodes a stranger and Idumean Now seeing we haue aboundantly prooued in generall the superioritie of the ciuill magistrate ouer all men liuing within their dominions both by expresse places of scripture and authorities of auncient fathers and also conuinced the subiection of the high Priest in the olde law vnto the ciuill Prince and clearely shewed Christs kingdom to be spirituall and that he gaue none other to Peter and the rest of the Apostles and their successors and haue fully answered all obiections of the aduersaries I will descende vnto practise and prooue the superioritie of Emperours and Italian Kings ouer the Popes and Bishoppes of Rome by the prescripsion of seauen hundreth yeares after Christ 〈◊〉 kinde of proofe which we Catholickes Romaine exact of the Protestants crying vnto them to shew their successiion But because Pighius the Popes proctor in the secular primacy doth subiect his client vnto the heathen Emperours The Pops subiect to the Emperours and Italian kings I neede fetch my limmitation noe higher then Constantine the greate the first Christian Emperour Now to shew how he banished Bishoppes perhappes will be thought to small purpose because they doe giue this earthly Empire not vnto the Clergy but onely vnto the Bishoppe of Rome as Christs lieuetenant generall in all causes as well spirituall as temporall See for these histories Paul Dia● Platina and Sabellicus But I doe finde that his sonne and successor Constantius did banish Liberius the Bishoppe of Rome because he would not subscribe to the deposition of Athanasius and caused another to be c●osen in his place Moreouer when the Cytie of Rome and the Country of Italy came by conquest into the possession of the Ostrogothes in Anno Domin 483. Liberius Theodoricus the King of the Ostrogothes or of Italy commanded to come before him to Rauenna whether he had transferred the seate of the Empire of Italy leauing the city of Rome in the gouernement of the Senate Symmachus And least some man vnskilfull of antiquities should dreame that it was then the Popes by the donation of Constantine Theodoricus I say summoned before him at Rauenna Symmachus and Laurentius who contended for the Bishopperickes of Rome to the diuision of the whole Cytie I●hn that he as soueraing might determine the controuersy vpon hearing of the matter And afterward when Iustinus Emperour of Constantinople had banished the Arrians out of all his dominions Theodoricus sent Iohn the byshoppe of Rome and their Senatours Embassadours vnto Iustinus willing them in threatning sort to tell the Emperour from him that vnlesse hee did spedily restore to the Arrians theire Churches and suffer them to liue in peace that he would extinguish 〈…〉 Italy They comming to 〈…〉 honorably receiued by him did with 〈…〉 beeing very hoofull for the safetie of themselues and 〈◊〉 countrymen entreat the Emperour gratiously to graunt the ●●nor of their Embassage although it were vniust and to haue regard and compassion of Italy which otherwise would vtterly perish with whose teares the Emperour beeing mooued granted them their request But when the Bishoppe with his associates were returned to Rauenna to make relation vnto the King of the Emperours answere Theodoricus mooued with malice because 〈◊〉 a defender of the Catholicke pietie had receiued him so honorably killed him and his fellowes with painefull imprisonment Then Theodotus annother king of the Ostrogothes sent Agapetus Agapetus the Bishoppe of Rome Embassadour as his subiect vnto Iustinian the Emperour which Iustinian not long after hauing recouered Rome from the Ostrogothes did not by his Lieuetenant but by his Lieuetenant Belsarius his wife spoyle Siluerius Silberius the Bishoppe of Rome of his Bishopprick● Bishoppes robes and putting him in monasticall needes confined him into an out Iland Charging him that he would haue betrayed the gate Asmaria that adioyned vnto his house vnto the Ostrogothes but in deed perhappes there was some other priuie grudge hidden in the Empresse her heart But the manner of the doing doth manifestly declare for how smale Princes Popes were reputed in those daies for Belsarius sending an officer for him the Bishoppe was brought into his bedde Chamber because Belsarius sate by his
wife who being that day come from Naples wary was laide downe on her bedde But the proude Dame had no sooner sene the Bishoppe but she began to 〈◊〉 and saide oh sirrha wherein haue I or my Belisarius so so●e offended your maistershippe that you should betraye vs vnto the Gothes and immediatly b●d away with him not suffering him to speake one word And in his roome was one Vigilius Vigilius placed who not long after refusing to restore vnto his seate Anthenius who had bene depriued of the Bishopbricke of Constantinople for the heresy of Eutiches Th●odora the Empresse who fauoured Anthenius commanded to be arrested at Rome and sent prisoner to Constantinople where when being vrged with this vniust request he had broken out into this impatient speach that he had thought he had come to Iustinian but that now he well perceyued it was to Dioclesian He was so well whipped for forgetting his lesson in the two and twentith of Exodus Non maledices principi populi tui thou shalt not speake ill to the prince of thy people that he was almost slaine I doe thinke noe Christian or ciuill Emperour much lesse Iustinian woulde so seruilely haue v●ed him whom he reputed the monarch of the world and anone after was ignominiously drawen along the cyty in a halter and then put in prison where he continued many yeares with onely breade and water Anno Domini 591. Pelagius Pelagius the Byshoppe of Rome sent Gregory who succeded him in the see vnto Mauritius the Emperour of the east to desire him not to be offended for that he had suffered himselfe to be denounced Byshoppe before hee had obtained his consent and confirmation for he coulde not sende before that time to Constantinople because the cytie of Rome had bene straitely beseiged by the Lombards Now in those dayes saith Platina and all other Historians writing of those times and affaires the election of the Byshoppe of Rome was voide without the Emperours assent and conformation And now we are come to Gregory himselfe surnamed the greate a man in such credit with the Popes of latter times and the Catholickes Romaine Greg●●y the great that they and wee doe more follow him in the diuine seruice and ceremonies then all the rest that euer satte in that see before him and therefore I doe hope that you will the more willingly allowe and embrace his opinion and iudgement of the secular soueraignytye As I doe not doubte but yee will cauell at manye of my former examples as vniust and tyrannicall the which I will not greately sticke to grant you and yet they doe strongly prooue the superioritie of those princes and that they were there lawfull although lawlesse soueraignes for as substantially doe the banishmentes of the Catholicke Byshoppes by the hereticall Emperours conuince the soueraignetie of the Emperours ouer the Byshoppes as the confining of the heriticall Byshoppes by the Catholicke Emperours Neyther am I lesse assured of the subiection of the Byshoppes of Asia vnto the Emperour of Constantinople for that I reade that Valens banished the Catholicke Byshoppes thereof then I am when I finde that Theodosius banished the Arrian Byshoppes of Asia For neuer shall wee finde that when the Empire was deuided that euer the Emperours of the East of what Religion soeuer they were did bannish the Byshoppes of the West nor contrarye wise but eyther dealte onely with them that were vnder their owne Empire and who would haue a better proofe that this Island was subiect vnto the Romane Empire then the hauocke that Dioclesian made here of the Christians and there Church and doth not he as sufficientlie shew himselfe to be a lawefull iudge that hangeth vp twenty true men a● hee that executeth as many theeues Neither doe wee reade that these Emperours and Kinges were reprooued for iniuriously punishing them ouer whome they had noe authoritie by right but because they punished them against law and right for matters that deserued noe punishment But leauing this let vs goe to Gregorie who had not learned to date his let●ers as the Popes doe now with Anno Pontificatus nostri in the yeare of our Popedome but regnante domino nostro Mauritio Tiberio piissimo Anno decimo quarto post Consulatum eiusdem domini nostri decimo tertio in the yeare of the raigne of our Lord Mauretius Tiberius the most godly Emperour the fourtenth and after the consulshippe of the same Lord of ours the thirtenth as his foure letters in the ecclesiasticall history of Beda are dated wherein I doe nore three thinges first that he doth not write the date of his owne creation or inauguration as soueraignes doe and secondly as subiectes doe that he writteth the date of the raigne of their Prince and thirdly that he called him Lord a worde so hautie and high that Augustus made an edict that noe man shoulde call him so noe nor woulde not suffer his Children nor Childrens Children to call him so Suetonius neither in earnest nor in sporte Moreouer with what duetifull humilitie are all his letters fraught that he directeth vnto the Emperour calling him in the plurall number after an vnwonted manner to declare his vnwonted lowlinesse and wonted subiection Domini my Lordes and yet because noe man shoulde thinke hee called him so rather of humilitie then of duetie it is apparant he vseth not that tearme to anye other But writing vnto Ethelbert the King of Kent he calleth him in Beda sonne a name of obedience and duetifulnesse but yet also of loue as hee also calleth Ch●lderbert the King of Fraunce ●plaplib 4. Indicto 12. eplam 96. et 97. But omitting many of his letters I will onely rehearse somewhat out of his threescore and one of the seconde booke wherein he finding greate fault with the Emperour for making an vniust Lawe as hee saith that noe Souldiour shoulde enter into Religion the which woulde haue made him to haue forgotten all humilitie if hee had beene as proudly spirited as some of his successors haue beene he thus beginneth his letters Omnipotenti Deo reus est qui serenissimis Dominis in omni quod agit loquitur purus non est Ego autem indignus pietatis vestrae famulus c. He is guiltie vnto God that is not pure vnto my renowned Lordes in all thinges that he doth and speaketh but I an vnworthie seruant of your godlinesse c. And anone after Fatemur Dominis meis and Dominorum pietas sanxit I doe confesse vnto my Lordes and the godlinesse of my Lordes hath decreed And againe Ego vero Dominis meis loquens quid sum nisi puluis verniis sed tamen quia contra authorem omnium Deum hanc intendere constitutionem sentio Dominis tacere non possum But I speaking vnto my Lordes what am I but dust and a worme but because I do perceiue that this constitution doth tende against God the creator of all I cannot holde my peace vnto my
with him the curse pronounced in that place by the Prophet Ieremy The practise of deposing Princes neuer came of charitie Cursed is the man that trusteth in man and maketh flesh his arme And because Cardinall Hosius will haue Luthers doctrine tried whether it bee good or bad by the roote that bredde it I pray let vs also see from what roote this practise of deposing of Princes did spring There be two rootes saith Agustine vppon Iohn and out of him Hosius which two husbandmen the holie Ghost and the deuill set in mans hart the one charitie or loue the other inordinate desire Henry of the one commeth all good of the other all ill now whether of these rootes brought forth deposition of Princes I praye let vs consider The first Pope that did it in practise about Anno Domini 108● was Gregory the seuenth against Henry the fourth Emperour because he being exasperated against the Pope for excommunicating of fiue of his chiefe counsellours whome he thought ruled him to much and for commaunding him vppon paine of excommunication to appeare before him at Rome the twesday in second weeke of Lent to purge himselfe of such chrimes as his rebellious subiectes the Saxons had accused him of See Platina and Sigonius had called a counsell in Germany where Gregory was deposed being accused there by Hugh Blancke a Cardinall and many Italian Byshoppes of Necromancy heresy lecherie symony tiranny and I know not what else nor force how truely but most true it is that this was the cause of the Emperours deposing as it doth appeare by the Popes bull wherein wee finde these wordes Because he hath too audaciously and rashly laid hands on the Church the Pope speakes to Peter and because he hath not obeyed my authoritie as becommeth a Christian c. therfore in thy name I do accurse him depose him discharge all men of obedience towardes him and forbid them to obey him that all nations may know that thou art Peter c. Now to depose the Emperour because he had caused him to be deposed was this charitie or inordinate desire of reuenge did any of his predecessors before him the like God saith reuenge is mine I will repey it and S. Paul charitie seeketh not hir owne I pray you tel me what Charity was it towards the Church Christendom rather then he would forsake his sea yea or reuoke his cholericke censure that he would see all Germany and Italy See Sabel almost vtterly destroyed by ciuill warres his fauourers in Germany broken in seauen blody battelles his two Idol Emperours slaine and all the forces of his Italian staffe stay the mightie countesse Mawde vtterly defayted great part of the Citizens of Rome consumed by three yeares seige the Burgo San Pietro twise sacked and defaced all the house of the Corsy the noblest Citizens of Rome and his fastest friendes raced to the grounde the miracle of the world the septisolium taken and deformed his nephew taken prisoner the cyty of Rome twise sette on fire by Suiscardo whom being excommunicated now reconciled he had procured to come to discharge him out of the castle of San. Angelo with two huge wastes remaine yet to be seene at this day in the fayrest part of the Cytie for a perpetuall reproch for the first deposing of Princes yet woulde not his stoute heart stoupe but when at the importunate prayers of the oppressed Romaines hee had graunted to receiue the Emperour into grace vppon his submission he afterward vtterly refused it because the Citizens requested that the Emperour might doe it in his imperiall robes and fled first into the Castle San Angelo and afterward vnto Salerne where he died in voluntarie banishment not daring to abide at Rome for feare of the Citizens who for these manifolde calamities with which he had ouerwhelmed them did deadly hate him What an hard heart had he that would not relent at so many and extreeme mischieues and miseries Did he not blush to remember how the noble Quintus Metellus a pagane being wrongfully forbididden fyre and water by Apulieus the Tribune of the commonaltie to be reuenged on Meitellus for putting him out of the senate for his lewde life chose rather willingly to go into bannishment hauing the stronger faction then that any tumult should be stirred vp in the Citie for him Againe how many of his predecessors did for righteousnes sake suffer banishment imprisonment yea and painfull death when they might haue shrowded and saued themselues we haue alreadie shewed by many examples And also Marcellinus a pagane doth report that Constantius the Emperour coulde hardlie in the dead time of the night carrie Liberius out of the Citie of Rome with great difficulty for the good will of the people that burned in his loue so that it is likelie that if the Bishop would with force haue resisted he woulde haue beene to hot and to heauy for the Emperour to carry away But neyther God nor Deuill had yet reueeled vnto the Bishop of Rome this newe dignitie of Gregories See Platina and Sigon that they could by Apostolicall power binde all men not onely in spirite but also in bodie and all the goods of fortune that they might depose Emperorus for their pride cōtumacy in not obeying of their commaundementes as Gregorie did Henry and giue the Empyre vnto another for his humilitie and obedience as Gregorie did to Rodulph because he had promised to giue his sonnes pledges for assurance that he wolde stand to the Popes arbiterment for they yet knewe not this reason that Gregorie alleadged quite voyde of reason in these wordes Wherefore O Peter and Paule the most holy and chiefe of the Apostles confirme by your authoritie that which I haue spoken that all men may nowe at the length vnderstand that if ye can binde and loose in heauen that then we also can in earth take away and giue Empieres and Kingdomes and whatsoeuer else men haue For if ye can iudge those thinges which doe appertaine to God what is to be thought we may doe in these inferior and prophane thinges And if it belong to you to iudge Angels that raigne ouer proude princes what is it seemely that we doe with their bondmen Therefore let kinges and all princes of the worlde learne by this Emperous example what ye can doe in heauen and how great ye are with God and henceforth feare to contemne the commaundementes of the holy Church Doubtlesse these words now at length may learne and henceforth may feare were very significantly put in by G●●gorie for indeed before this time this doctrine was vnknowen to the world as also that learned Hermite of Rome the Popes Chronicler Omphrius a man inferior to none in the knowledge of the Romane antiquities doth confesse in his booke of Cardinals in these wordes Bishops cardinales did at the first take their place among other Bishoppes according to the anciency of their creation but afterward
displeasures of himselfe his friendes and vassalls At the same time the french king Philip le Beau had spoyled Edward the fi●st king of England iniuriously of the greatest parte of Guienne and also Guy the Eare of Fuaunders almost of his whole Earldome and was not deposed therefore The cause is apparant Sicily was held of the Church of Rome and so was neither Guienne nor Flaunders But although he escaped scot-free for these wronges and the long detayning in prison the Earle of Flaunders and two of his sonnes yet he was depriued of his kingdome by Pope Boniface the eight Philip the faire for imprisoning of a french Bishop that rayled at him and menaced him when he coulde not winne him to grant to goe with an Army into the holy land on the which message the Pope had sent him vnto the king as saith Platina But the french Chronicles report that the king caused him to be apprehended at home at his owne house for that he vnderstoode that he vsed often to speake very ill of him and to rayle outragiously on hm and deliuered him vnto his primate the Bishop of Tolouse to punish him with his aduise The kingdome of France was giuen vnto Albert the Emperour perhappes for a reward of his wickednesse in slaying of his soueraigne Adolph the Emperour for other punishment I doe not finde that Pope did put him vnto therefore See Mun●ter cos●●●mog lib. 3. in Al. 2. But yet I doe not doubt but the fault was more heinous then emprisoning of a Bishop for rayling against his prince and Lord. Yea and that God did so account it he made it manifest vnto the worlde by his seuere punishment of all the conspiratours For Albert himselfe was murdered by his owne Cosen germane the Archbishop of Ments founde deade sitting in his chaire The Bishop Stasburge was slaine by a pesant at F●●●●nge in Brisgow The Earle of Linengen died ma●de The Earle of Sweibrucken was drowned in a riuer The Earle of Ochsenstein had his deaths wound in the battell And the Earle H●●gerloch was slaine on the way by Otho the Duke of Danao But to proceede Lewes th 12 of France was excommunicated denounced a scismatike and his kingdome and goods exposer for a common spoyle to all Christians and the like penalty pronounced on all them that did or should take his part or ayde him Lewes the twelfih And therefore Iohn the king of Nauarre lost his kingdome for procuring of a generall counsell to be called and held without the consent of the Pope against the Pope that there his infestious foe Iul●us the second might be deposed an other more frendly placed in his roome And doth not this altogether smell of priuate reuenge and not of charity But perhaps you will say it was a foule part of him that would be called the most Christian king to sow sedition and scisme throughout all Christendome for his owne priuate quarrell and that this doing of his was so ill thought of by most of the pri● 〈…〉 of Christendome that they entred therefore into league against him and had almost set him besides his saddle In truth I can neyther prayse the practise nor the pollicie of the French who sought to represse the iniurious attemptes of the Pope against him rather by colour of lawe to the disturbance of all Christendome then by armes and inuading the Popes territories as Philippe the moderne king of Spayne wisely did in the like case and fondely thought it lesse enuyous Anno Domini 556. and more agreeable vnto his surname of the most Christian king which his ancest●rs had purchasesed by defending the Popes and Peters patrimony with armes to rayse vp a scisme then to force the Pope to frindship by materiall force But that the Pope compelled him to this outrage all writers doe confesse For first contrary to the league made at Cambray betweene him the Emperour the French king the king Spaine and the Duke of Ferara against the Venetians who had encroched vpon thē all he hauing gotten all that he claimed ●ee Iouius ●n vita Al●hons ●●uiciardi●●o not onely made peace with the Venetians without the consent of his confederates but also excōmunicated and with armes enuaded the fast friend of the French the Duke of Ferara because that he not hauing yet recouered all his right of them would not cease to molest the Venetians And also he left no stone vnturned to turne the French out of Milan an Genna the which he at the length brought to passe And was not he then the author of all his tragedie Moreouer this Popes brothers sonne Duke of Vrbine cruelly murdered of emulation Alidosius a Bishop a Cardinall See Iouius ●n vit Alphons Guic. Boleslaw and Legate of Bologna almost in the Popes sight and was put to no penance therefore But Boleslaw the hardie king of Poland was depriued by Pope Gregorie the seuenth of his kingdome and also the country of the honour to haue a king in the which dishonour it continued 200 yeares f●●●●ying with his owne hande in his fury Stanislaw the Bishop of Craccow for excommunicating him yea and interdicting the whole Citie of Craccow to make him the more odious because he openly kept another mans wife and for adultery a thing which as it should seeme by Cromerus as common in Poland in those daies as the cart way Yea those noble women that were honest were forced to forsake there owne howses See Cromerus hist Pola lib. 4. for feare of force and rauishment yea and it was common in Italy and passed vnpunished in meaner men then princes But yet in verie trueth the kinges fact was verie foule and made worse by the furie of his fellowes that chopped in peeces the slayne corpes and cast it to the crowes And yet perhaps Dauid did almost all ill in defiling of a noble mans bed while he was in his seruice in the fielde and afterward commaunding him to be murdered for his amendes but so dealt not Bolislawe with Stanislaw and if the qualities of the persons be not equall then the manner of the doing doth ouermatch the one being done without any prouocation and of aduised malice the other vppon a greate ignominy vnwonted with kinges offered him and vpon a sodaine while his blood was hotte which seauen yeares continuall absence from his countrie in forraine warres a little before had ouerheated And yet Dauid lost not his Kingdome therefore Neither doe we reade of any realme interdicted for murdering of their Kinges whereof we haue almost infinite examples or any man deposed for intruding into them by such wickednesse vnlesse perhappes the murdered Prince were the Popes vassall Soe that this zeale in seuere punishing of princes for misusing them of the clergy I feare me may be imputed rather to a partiall fauour towardes them of their owne coate and done for their owne securitie then for zeale of Iustice Like as our Sargeants at
of the very mouth of God himselfe And if Christ saide he came into the world not to d●stroy the law but to fulfill it by what right can the Pope who deriueth his authoritie from Christ as his substitute and deputy in the earth claime the authoritie to make that voide which God hath ordained And faine would I know of you what faultes you finde in the word of GOD that subiectes may reuolt from their Prince and take them to another And I am sure you cannot name me one for doubtlesse there can be noe greater faultes in a Prince then Idolatry and tyranny and yet wee haue expresse commaundementes of GOD from his owne mouth vnto the people of Israell for to bee obedient vnto two notorious Idolaters and triumphes An obiection of controuersie with the wicked a●swered the one by the Prophet Ieremy Chap. 27. that they should serue Nabuchadonisor the other by Christ himself that they should pay tribute vnto Cesar But ye will say that Christ saide if thy brother will not heare the Church let him bee vnto thee as an Ethnicke and Publicane or customer and that we are commaunded by Paule not to keepe company with the wicken and by Saint Iohn not to say good morrow to an heretike And now I would fayne know of you howe the Iewes did shunne an Ethnike and a publicane did they not pay tributes and customes vnto ethnike Emperours did they they not serue them in warre finally did they not doe all dueties of loyall subiectes did they not also come vnto the publicans to pay their customs and towlles although they were nor familiar with them did vsually keepe them company Againe when Sant Paule did charge the Corinthians not to keepe company with a brother that was a whoorhunter or couetous or an idolatour or euill tongued or a dunkard or a violent taker away of other mens goods and not to eate meate with any such Doe you thinke the wife that had an husband the childe a father the bondmand a Lord or master infected with any of these faultes were thereby incontinently discharged of all duety towardes them yea and bound in conscience speedily to runne away from them and neuer to doe them more seruice nor come at them I am sure ye will say no for by the canon law they are bound to abide with them being excommunicated for any other faulte then for heresy And that is a latter edition of the Popes for there is no such distinction to be found in the cōmandement of God nor his Apostles But all excommunicated and wicked persons are alike commaunded to be shunned and no difference to be put betweene the Idolater and the whooremonger So then if Christ and his Apostles did not discharge the wife the childe or bondman of their dueties towardes the excommunicated neyther did they also the subiectes of their alleageance to their prince for they be as fast tyed to their prince by a bond and lawe which onely death can vndoe as the wife is to hir husband and therefore included in this word Lex of the canonicall verse that shewes who may communicate with excommunicated persons Vtile lex humile res ignorata necesse and also aswell vnder and subiected to their soueraigne as the childe vnto his father and the bondman vnto his Lord and master and so are comprised also in the word humile of the same verse But let vs returne where we left The Pope deposed Boleslaw the king of Polen for slaying in his rage Stanislaw the Bishop of Craccow yet when Saule had without cause vniustly and tyrannically slayne Achimelech the high priest and all his whole house saue one that fortunately escaped yea priestes in number fourescore and seuen all the men women little children sucking babes oxen asses and sheepe that were in the Citie of the priestes called Nob Yet Dauid whom God had annointed king and Saul did causelesse cruelly persecute from place to place sought by all meanes to bereaue of life yet thought not himselfe discharged of his allegeance by this detestable murder of the sacred priestes of God but when hee had him twise at aduantage saued his life and tolde Abisri who desired him to dispatch the tyrante with one blowe slewe him not for who shall stretch foorth his hande against the annoynted of the Lorde and shall be innocent As sure as the Lord liueth vnlesse the Lorde shall strike him or his day shall come that he die or perish in sight God neuer be mercifull vnto me if I doe stretch forth mine hande against the annoynted of the Lorde Yee see heere a playne assertion of Dauid that subiectes are not released of their alleageance if that their princes fall to vngodlinesse and tyranny much lesse doth he allowe that euerie priuate man murder him shamefullie yea when a younge man brought Dauid newes of Saules death and presented him with Saules diademe and bracelette Dauid put him to death because he had tolde him that at the Kinges great instance and entreatie that he might not fall into the handes of his enemies who enuironed him rounde about hee beeing no Israelite but an Amalachite had killed him saying why didst thou not feare to sende thy hande that thou mightest kill the annoynted of the Lorde And againe the bloode be vpon thy heade for thy mouth hath spoken against thee saying I haue slaine the annoynted of the Lord. Wherefore seeing Dauid doth allowe no cause of reuoulte and doth thinke that the subiectes are loosed of their alleageance by no fault and wickednesse of their prince by what warrant of the worde can the Pope at his pleasure release subiectes of their alleageance And whereas we reade in the 34 of Iob that GOD doth make the hypocrite man to raigne for the sinnes of the people or as other translate it to afflict and plauge the people what a malapart parte is it of the Pope to pull the rodde out of Gods hande by violence and to chase him away whome God hath specially sente to chastice his people Neyther haue I sucked this sentence out of mine owne fingers endes but learned it of a learned greate Pope Gregorie the greate who interpreting in his moralles the late rehearsed place of Iob and alleadging vnto it the thirteenth of Osee I will giue Kinges in my furie hath these wordes Quid ergo illos nobis praesse despicimus quorum super nos regimina ex Domini furore suscepimus Why then doe we despise them to be our princes whose raignes and gouermentes ouer vs wee haue receiued from the wrath of GOD So that the Pope may not displace the good princes because they are good princes nor the euill because they are placed by GOD to punish his people And if the Canonistes holde that no man can iudge the Pope because he sitteth in the chiefest chaire Who then shall iudge the king who is saide in 2. Paralip 9. to be ordained of God to set vpon his owne throne and shall