all the wordes of the lawe keeping and obseruing are not there referred to his priuate actions as a man but to his publike function as a king and therefore the king in these wordes receiued the charge and ouersight of the whole lawe that is an expresse commaundement from God to see the lawe kept and euerie part thereof obserued of all men within his Dominions and the breakers of it Prophetes Priestes and People to bee duely punished Nowe the Lawe contained all thinges that any way touched the true seruice and worshippe of God ergo the king had one and the selfe-same power and charge to commaund and punish as well for the preceptes of pietie as other pointes of policie neither did God fauour or prosper any of the kinges of Israell or Iudah but such as chiefly respected and carefully maintained the ordinances of Religion prescribed vnto them in Moses lawe In the times of the Prophetes saith S. Augustine all the kinges which in the people of God did not forbid and ouerthrow those thinges which were brought in against the commandementes of God are blamed and they that did prohibite and subuert such thinges are praysed aboue the rest God blessed Salomon with wisedome honour riches and peace so long as hee walked in the steppes of Dauid his father during the which time Salomon did dedicate the Temple in his owne person and cast out Abiathar from being Priest vnto the Lord and set Zadocke in his roome but when his heart once turned from God to builde places also for Idols and to suffer his outlandish wiues to burne incense and offeringes to their Gods then the Lorde was angrie with Salomon and stirred vppe aduersaries against him and threatned to rent his kingdom from him and to giue it to his seruant Asa tooke awaie the Altars of the strange Gods and the high places and brake downe the images and cut downe the groues and commaunded Iudah to seeke the Lord God of their fathers and tooke awaie out of all the cities of Iudah the high places and images therefore the kingdome was quiet before him And hee tooke an oth of all Iudah and Beniamin that Whosoeuer woulde not seeke the Lorde God of Israell shoulde be slaine whether hee were small or great man or woman and hee deposed Maachah his mother from her regencie because she had made an idoll Asa brake downe her idol and stamped it and burnt it and the Lord gaue him rest round about Iehosaphat his sonne walked in the first waies of Dauid and sought the Lord God of his father and walked in his commaundementes and therefore the Lord established the kingdome in his handes so that hee had riches and honour in aboundance In the thirde yeare of his raigne he sent his Princes that they should teach in the cities of Iudah and with them Leuites and Pristes and him selfe went through the people from Beer-sheba to Mount-Ephraim and brought them againe to the Lord God of their fathers In Ierusalem he sent of the Leuites and of the Priests and of the chiefe of the families of Israell for the iudgement and cause of the Lord. And he charged them saying Thus shal ye do in the feare of the Lord faithfully and with a perfect heart Thus shall ye do and trespasse not And behold Amariah the Priest shall be the chiefe among you for al the matters of the Lord and Zebadiah for all the kinges affaires and the Leuites shall be helpers vnto you Be strong and doe it And when the Moabites and Ammonites came against him he proclaimed a fast throughout all Iudah and stood in the congregation of Iudah and Ierusalem in the house of the Lord prayed in his owne person for all the people Ezechiah did vprightly in the sight of the Lord according to all that Dauid his father had done Hee opened the doores of the house of the Lorde and brought in the Priestes and the Leuites and saide vnto them heare mee yee Leuites sanctifie your selues and sanctifie the house of the Lord God of your fathers I purpose to make a couenant with the Lord God of Israell And they sanctified themselues according to the commaundement of the king And the king rose early and gathered the Princes of the citie and went vppe to the house of the Lord. And they brought sinne-offeringes and Ezechiah commaunded to offer the burnt offering vppon the Altar yea hee commaunded the Priestes the sonnes of Aaron to offer them And when they had made an end of offering Ezechiah the king the Princes commaunded the Leuites to praise the Lord with the wordes of Dauid and Asaph the Seer And Ezechiah sent to all Israell and Iudah also wrote letters to Ephraim and Manasses that they should come to the house of the Lord at Ierusalem to keepe the Passouer So the Postes went with letters by the commission of the king and his Princes throughout all Israel and Iudah and with the commandement of the king saying Yee children of Israell turne againe vnto the Lord God of Abraham Isaac and Israell And the hand of God was in Iudah so that he gaue them one heart to doe the commaundement of the King And Ezechiah appointed the courses of the Priestes and Leuites by their turnes euerie man according to his office for the burnt offeringes and peace offeringes to minister and giue thankes to praise in the gates of the tentes of the Lord. And in all the workes that hee beganne for the seruice of the house of God hee did it with all his heart and prospered Hee tooke away the high places and brake the Images and cutte downe the groues and brake in peeces the brasen Serpent which Moses had made for in those dayes the children of Israell did burne incense to it Manasses at the first wēt back built the high places which Ezechiah his father had broken down and set vp altars for Baalim made groues worshipped all the host of heauen serued them but after hee was taken by the king of Babylon put in fetters bound in chaines he hūbled himself greatly before the God of his fathers God was intreated of him and heard his prayer and brought him againe to Ierusalem into his kingdom Then hee tooke awaie the strange Gods and the image out of the house of the Lord and all the Altars that hee had built in the mount of the Lordes house and in Ierusalem and cast them out of the citie Also he repaired the Altar of the Lord and sacrificed thereon peace-offeringes and of thankes and commaunded Iudah to serue the Lord God of Israell Iosiah in the eight yeare of his raigne when he was yet a childe of sixeteene yeares began to seeke after the God of Dauid his father and in the twelfth yeare he began to purge Iudah Ierusalem from the high places the groues and the carued and
no tumults at home no despites abroade able to withdrawe the Princes hart from liking and louing the trueth but the godly reioyce to see so perfect a mirrour of faith and deuotion in a Christian Queene that shee rather chooseth to suffer your wrongs and abide your reproches with patience than to steppe one foote from that Lord which hath graciously blessed and mightily preserued her person Scepter and people from the iawes of his and her enemies Phil. And where no Iewe no Turke no Pagan can by the law of God nature or nations he forced from the manner and perswasion of his owne Sect and seruice to any other which by promise or profession he or his progenitors neuer receiued onely we that neither in our owne persons nor in our forefathers euer gaue consent to any other faith or worship of God but haue in precise termes by protestation and promise bounde our selues in Baptisme to the religion fayth and seruice Catholique alone are against diuine and humane Lawes and against the Protestants owne doctrine in other nations not onely bereaued of our Christian dew in this behalfe but are forced by manifold co-actions to these rites which we neuer knew nor gaue our consent vnto Theo. Fewe men without your cunning could huddle so many so manifest vntruthes in one sentence No Iew no Turke say you may be forced from his religion If that were so what maketh it for your defence which chalenge both the names and roomes of Christian men and are in respect thereof for iust cause required to performe that in deede which you pretend in woorde and by moderate correction driuen to keepe the Christian faith which in Baptisme you professed For heretikes of al sects and sortes may be compelled to followe truth though infidels might not and so your inference fayleth when you say no law forceth Iewes or Pagans from their perswasion therefore not Christians nay rather if we graunt Iewes and Turkes excusable for these two reasons lacke of knowledge and want of promise certainely Papists being neither void of the first nor free from the last may yea must bee compelled of Christian magistrates for dread of punishment tempered with good instruction to forsake their heresies and forbeare their idolatries wherewith Christ is dishonoured and his trueth defaced As the ioynts of your argument bee loose so bee the parts vntrue For king Darius seeing Daniel strangely deliuered from the Lions denne made this decree that all people nations and languages in the worlde should reuerence and feare the God of Daniel Likewise the king of Niniueth at the first denouncing of Gods wrath by Ionas immediatly with the consent of his Counsel caused this proclamation to be made through the Citie that man and beast shoulde put on sackcloth and cry mightily to God and euery man turne from his euill way Lo Sir two kings precisely commaunding their subiects and therefore readie to punish the refusers without delay to worship a strange and vnknowen God albeit the true God whome neither they nor their forefathers made promise to serue and yet I thinke you will not say they brake the Law of God nature or nations in so doing S. Austen will assure you that the King of Niniueh did God good seruice by compelling the whole Citie to please God A thirde instance for this matter is the calling of Paul first as a Iew and so within the limits of your assertion then strooken with blindnes amased with terror from heauen and therefore compelled to Christianitie by corporal violence y touched Paul neerer than impouerishments or imprisonments wherewith you find your selues greeued Behold saith that learned father in Paul Christ first compelling afterward teaching first striking then comforting and hee that entred into the Gospel constrained with bodyly punishment laboured more than all those that were called only by mouth I might refel your idle florish by the later examples of Polonia Russia Lithuania forced at the commaundement of their rulers to forsake their auncient Idoles and receiue baptisme By the long and sharpe warres which diuers good Princes maintained of purpose to compell the Saxons and Vandales to the faith By the sore vexations and afflictions of the Iewes in euery Christian common wealth Al which both old and new first last serue to conuince that Pagans Iewes haue bene forced by rigor of lawes and other meanes to yeeld to the truth without any former promise or farther knowledge which you stifly deny but as I said this is not our question You are no Iewes no Pagans but in shew Catholiques in deed heretikes you were baptized you chalēge an interest in the Church Sacraments by reason of this your first promise and next your outward profession of Christes name you stand in duetie bound and of right may be compelled to serue God not as your owne fansies perswade you nor as the Church of Rome leadeth you but according to the prescript of his word and that tenor of faith which the Prophets and Apostles did teach Phi. We bound our selues in precise termes by protestation in Baptisme to the religion fayth and seruice Catholique alone other faith and worship of God wee neuer consented vnto neither in our owne persons nor in our forefathers Theo. This is your common charme wherewith you bewitch many simple soules bearing them in hand that in Baptisme they vowed to professe your Italian religion which God knoweth is nothing so For in whose name were you baptized Philander In Pius the fift or Gregorie the thirteenth I thinke you were not I knowe you should not no not in Peters or Pauls but in Christes alone Then stande you bound by baptisme to yeelde faith and obedience to no person or place but onely to Christ the first author and ordayner of this sacrament Preach ye the Gospel saith Christ He that beleeueth and is baptized shal be saued What els must you preach what els must they beleeue that will be baptized but the Gospel ergo the preacher and the beleeuer that is the baptiser and the baptised are bound precisely to the Gospel All yee saith Paul that are baptised into Christ haue put on Christ and are the sonnes of God by faith in Christ Iesus hauing one Lord one faith one Baptisme Perceiue you not that in baptisme which no Protestation of yours can frustrate the beleeuers do put on Christ their Lorde not his pretended vicar and are made the sonnes of God not the vassals of Rome by faith which dependeth neither on man nor Angell but directly belongeth to God and his word If thou beleeue with al thine heart sayth Philip to the conuerted Eimuch thou mayest be baptized Now fayth commeth of hearing and that hearing of the worde of God as Paul witnesseth So that when you were Christned you made promise to beleeue nothing saue the word of God whereby faith is engendred and nourished My sheepe heare my voyce
to keepe them he that might commaund not he that must obey Lotharius not Leo. Can you looke for stronger proofes or plainer wordes that the Prince was the Popes superiour in causes Ecclesiasticall If the Bishop of Rome were a SERVANT to christian Emperours then was he not their ruler If a SVBIECT vnder them then no superiour ouer them If SVPPLIANT to their persons and OBEDIENT to their lawes then no deposer of Princes nor reseruer of their edicts to bee short if they were correctors and iudges of his demainour and doinges then his claime to punish and depriue them of their kingdomes is vsurped and wicked and so Princes hauing no superiour but onely God are consequently supreme gouernours ouer all their subiectes be they laie-men or Clerkes to commaund that which is good and prohibite that which is euill not in ciuill affaires only but in matters also concerning diuine Religion Phi. I confesse places somewhat moue me neither can I vppon the suddaine answere them yet are there many both authorities and reasons that make with vs for the contrarie Theo. Shew me but one Scripture Father or Councell all this while that proueth the Pope to bee the Princes superiour and I will aske no further answere Phi. God saith to Ieremie I haue appointed thee this day ouer nations kingdomes to pull vppe to beate downe to disperse to ouerthrow to build and plant Theo. Was Ieremie euer Pope Phi. I doe not saie hee was Theo. Then that which God spake to Ieremie concludeth nothing for the Pope Phi. If a meane Prophet had that power to plant and remoue kingdomes how much more he that is head of the vniuersal church and iudge ouer the whole earth Theo. Your antecedent is false and your consequent foolish For Ieremie had no such power as you dreame of hee was appointed a Prophet to denounce the wrath of God against nations and Countries not a Prince to displace Rulers and translate kingdomes It is a grosse peruerting of the Scriptures to wrest them to that sense Next your consequent supposeth that the Pope is head of the vniuersall Church and iudge ouer the whole earth which vaine presumption is no good illation you must bring vs better conclusions before they wil be currant Phi. The text is plaine I haue appointed thee ouer nations and kingdomes Theo. I haue appointed thee ouer them not a Prince to subdue them but a Prophet to warne them Phi. How proue you that exposition Theo. The text it selfe saith so Prophetam Gentibus dedite I haue made thee a Prophet ouer nations And the verie next wordes before yours are these Ecce posui verba mea in ore tuo ecce constitui te hodie super gentes super regna c. Behold I haue put my wordes in thy mouth behold I haue appointed thee ouer nations and kingdomes that is a Prophet with my wordes in thy mouth not a magistrate with the materiall sworde in thine hand This we likewise proue by the execution of his office For he prophesied the captiuitie of the Iewes the taking of the king and the citie the destruction of the Aegyptians Philistines Moabites Ammonites Idumeans Persians Damascus Babylon and other kingdoms nations but he neuer deposed king nor altered state ergo his coÌ„mission was to foreshew the ruines ouerthrows decaies changes of kingdoms natioÌ„s common-wealthes not to practise them he was the man that foretolde them he was not he meanes to worke them Theodorete saith of these words I haue appointed thee ouer natioÌ„s kingdoms to pul vp beat down disperse ouerthrow build plant for he prophesied not only the Iewes captiuity but their deliuerance by Cyrus He prophesied also to many other nations al kinds of calamities And likewise Bernard Rusticani sudoris quodam schemate labor spiritualis expressus est Disce sarculo non sceptro tibi opus esse vt facias opus Prophetae By a certaine resemblance of the husbandmaÌ„s paines the spirituall labor of the Preacher is expressed Learne that thou must haue an hooke to weed not a scepter to rule if thou wilt do the worke of a Prophet Nicolaus de Lyra 1300. yeares after Christ could hit the right sense of this place I haue appointed thee to roote vp that is to denouÌ„ce the inhabitaÌ„ts shal be remoued out of the laÌ„d to built plaÌ„t that is to denouÌ„ce that the Iewes shal be builded plaÌ„ted again in their own couÌ„try This I take to be the right meaning of the text if that please you not but you will haue the Prophet himselfe to be the workman then Ieremy was sent not to plant and pul vp Priâ—â—es not to build and beate downe kingdomes but as your own gloze saith to roote vp vices to beate downe heresies to build vp vertues Euery plant saith Hierom vpon those words which the heauenly father hath not planted shal be rooted vp the building which hath not his foundation on the rock but in the sand is vndermined ouerthrown by the word of God And Gregory The Prophet is first willed to destroy after to build first to roote vp after to plant because the foundation of truth is neuer wel laid except the frame of error be first subuerted Yea Many saith HieroÌ„ vnderstand this place of the person of Christ which destroied the kingdom of the diuell Take which of these senses you like best so you bestowe not that on Ieremy which is proper to Christ to be king of kings Lord of lords nor allow him the liberty that God reserueth to himselfe to bear rule ouer the kingdom of men to giue it to whome hee will which no Prophet before Christ no Apostle since Christ no mortall creature euer claimed or vsed but onely the whoore of Babilon that raigneth ouer the kinges of the earth Phi. The nations and kings saith God by Esaie that wil not serue thee shall perish Theo. Whose translation is that Phi. The Septuagintes Theo. But the Hebrew is That nation and kingdom which wil not serue thee shall perish And so doth S. Hierom translate Phi. There is no great difference betwixt them Theo. As much as is betweene the Prince and the people Phi. Both Prince and people must serue the church or else they shall perish Theo. Wee reason not what they must doe but what Esaie saith and hee saith the kingdome must serue the king must nurce the church which is a word of more dignitie than seruice is Thou shalt sucke the breastes of kinges And againe Kinges shall bee thy foster fathers and Queenes thy nurcing mothers but I sticke not on this Phi. You neede not for in plaine wordes it is said a little before Reges eorum ministrabunt tibi Their kings shal serue thee Theo. Their kings shall attend thee or minister vnto thee The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth him that is next about a maÌ„
Ecclesiastical causes Theo. Proofes go very low with you when you fal from Princes to inferiour iudges yet mistake your text For Hilarie beseecheth nothing of CoÌ„stantius in that place but that the iudges of euerie Prouince should forbear medling in matters of religioÌ„ with tortures violeÌ„ce The whole book the words before the next part of the same sentence ioyned to this which you bring with a coniunction copulatiue confirme that to bee the true meaning of Hilarie This is the right order of the place We beseech not only with words but also with teares that the catholike churches be no longer oppressed with greeuous iniuries sustain intolerable persecutions coÌ„tumelies that which is shameful eueÌ„ of our brethren Let your clemency prouide appoint that all iudges euery where to whom prouinces are committed which ought to take care charge of commonwealth matters onely refrain from medling with religion Neither let them presume vsurp think they may enter into clergymens causes force vexe innocent men with diuerse afflictions threats violence terrours Your singular admirable wisedome perceiueth it is not seemely it ought not to be that men should be forced coÌ„pelled against their wils harts to yeeld addict themselues through violent oppressioÌ„ to such as cease not to sow the corrupt seeds of false doctrine This was the medling with clergie mens causes that Hilarie ment and which he would haue temporall iudges restrained from and yet were his meaning neuer so generall he required nothing but that which Constantine the father of Constantius had by his publike lawes ordained al christian Princes haue since obserued to wit that Ecclesiasticall persons should be conuented before ecclesiasticall iudges For so Constantine decreed CoÌ„mitting iudgemeÌ„t iurisdiction ouer clearks to Bishops Valentinian the elder would haue priests to iudge of priests Yea Iustinian excludeth all secular iudges from hearing the causes of clergie men except it were for ciuill offences If the crime be ecclesiasticall needing ecclesiasticall reformation punishment let the Bishop determine the same the iudges of the Prouince no way intermedling for we wil not haue temporall iudges enter into such matters where as such faults must be examined ecclesiastically by the sacred and diuine rules and Canons which our lawes take no scorne to follow And though he bar ciuill iudges from the hearing of such causes yet doth not exempt clergie men Bishops nor others from the obedience of his ecclesiastical lawes as the wordes import that bee next to these Omnibus quae iam a nobis sancita sunt siue super sanctiss ecclesus siue super Deo amabilibus Episcopis siue super clericis siue super monachis propriam virtutem habentibus All thinges which we haue already decreed concerning the most holie churches and blessed Bishops and touching clerkes and monks standing in their ful force Hee quiteth clergie men from temporall barres but he bindeth both them and their iudges to the tenor of his ecclesiasticall lawes as well in their Synods as in their Consistories as appeareth at large by his 123. constitution so that this place of Hilarie might well haue been spared saue onely to make vp your tale Phi. Is this your opinion that Princes themselues may lawfully medle with Ecclesiasticall causes and persons though their inferiour iudges may not Theo. We say princes exempted clergie men from secular iudges but not from themselues And that Princes from the beginning haue medled with persons causes Ecclesiasticall wee bring you not onely fiue authorities that shall bee neither maimed nor wrested as yours bee but fiue hundred actes examples lawes and edictes that shall bee strong and effectuall proofes for this purpose Phi. You talke of cost when you saie fiue hundered Theo. Wee coulde far passe that number if the number would moue you to leaue follie but I will go an other waie to worke with you What good king can you name before or after Christ for 1000. yeares but such as medled with Ecclesiasticall matters Phi. Nay what good king can you name that did Theo. They be sooner named than answered Nabuchodonosor in making a law that euery people nation language which spake any blasphemie against the God of Sidrac Misac and Abâ—dnago should bee drawen in peeces their houses made priuies did hee not medle with matters of Religion Phi. Nabuchodonosor was a tyrant The. But being corrected by the diuine miracle he made saith Augustine a religious and commendable law for the truth that who so blasphemed the God of Sidrac Misac and Abednago should with his house perish vtterly Darius vpon the sight of an other miracle wrote to all people nations and languages that dwelt in the world with these words I make a decree that in all the dominion of my kingdome men tremble and feare before the God of Daniell The king of Niniueth hearing of that which Ionas threatned from God proclaimed a fast and charged all men to put on sack-cloath and crie mightily to God and to turne from their euill wayes and the wickednesse that was in their handes I trust you dare not condemne the king of Niniueth for an intruder vpon ecclesiasticall causes whose seruice so well pleased God that he spared the king and his subiectes from destruction hanging ouer their heads and yet fasting praier and repentance be causes meere spirituall in which the king interposed his royall authoritie by the councell of his Nobles and not of Ionas who departed the citie grieued and angrie with God for pardoning the Niniuites vpon their conuersion The factes of these three kinges I alleadge the rather because S. Augustine grounded himselfe vpon them as proofes that christian kinges may medle with matters of Religion and as patternes for them to follow Ye kinges vnderstand be wise ye that iudge the earth serue the Lord with feare and reioyce before him with trembling How do kings serue the Lord in feare but by forbidding and punishing with a religious seueritie those thinges which are done against the precepts of God As the king of Niniueth serued by compelling the whole citie to appease the Lord. As Darius serued by giuing the Idole into Daniels power to bee broken and casting his enemies to the Lions As Nabuchodonosor serued by restraining all that were in his kingdom from blaspheming God with a terrible law And againe WheÌ„ Emperours professe the truth they commaunde for truth against error As Nabuchodonosor proposed an edict for truth against error that whosoeuer blasphemed the God of Sidrach Misaach and Abednago should be destroied and his house dispersed And you Donatistes will not that christian Emperours command any such thing against you If the commaundements of kinges haue nothing to do with the publishing of religion and prohibiting of sacrileges why then do you signe your selues at king Nabuchodosors edict commaunding such thinges For when you heare it doe
as in Heli who was both Iudge and high-Priest but commonly both the Persons were distinct and the offices And hence grew the custome from inferiour ecclesiastical Iudges to appeale to the High-Priest and from inferiour Princes secular Iudges to appeale to the King or Emperour You haue turned into ex and not only debarred the Prince of all his right but subiected him to the Priest In al doubts and differences betwixt Prince and people euen to the losse of his Crowne if the Priest say the word Phi. We follow the latine text as wee found it Theo. You might easily follow that which your selues had framed to your liking but the order of the Iewes common wealth and the circumstances of the text it selfe admitte no such meaning as you make of it For it is more than euident and testified not in a few places of the scriptures that al causes neither were nor might bee referred to the Priest Moses at the counsell of Iethro chose men of courage out of all Israel made them heads ouer the people Rulers ouer thousands Rulers ouer hundreds Rulers ouer fifties Rulers ouer tens And they iudged the people at all seasons but brought the hard causes vnto Moses for they iudged al small or easie matters themselues And though Moses by them was eased of all sauing hard and importing causes yet finding that burden too heauie for one man alone he complained vnto God and saide I am not able to beare all this people alone for it is too heauie for me To whom God made answere Gather me seuentie men of the Elders of Israel and bring them vnto the Tabernacle of the Congregation and I will come downe and talke with them there and take off the spirit that is vpon thee and put it vpon them and they shal beare the burden of the people with thee so thou shalt not beare it alone This distinction of inferiour and superiour iudges God after by his law established in that common wealth for euer In the next chapter before this which you alledge order is taken for inferiour iudge in euery Citie throughout the Land Iudges and officers shalt thou make thee in all thy gates that is in al thy Cities which the Lord thy God giueth thee throughout thy Tribes and they shall iudge the people with righteous Iudgement In this Chapter and these very wordes which here you cite Superiour iudges are prescribed to whom harder causes and matters of greater difficultie were to be referred And so the wordes precisely sound If there fall out an hard matter for thee to iudge betwene blood and blood strife and strife sore and sore that be matters of iudgement in thy gates thou shalt rise and go vp to the place which the Lord thy God shall chose there in the land of promise And goe to the Priests of Leui and to the Iudge which shall be in those dayes and aske them and they shall shew thee the matter of iudgement The iudge of which he speaketh was the tēporal Magistrate for so the copulatiue leadeth vs and by that name were the chiefe Rulers of Gods People called before Kings were ordayned as the Booke of Iudges witnesseth neither was the iudge subiect to the Priest but had his charge besides and aboue the Priest which was to see the law of God exactly kept and obserued in all points of all men and to take vengeance on the breaker of any part thereof when as yet there were no kinges and after the creation of kinges both Priest and Iudge were subiect to the king This fourme of regiment by lower and higher Iudges and those both ecclesiasticall and cyuill king Iehosaphat renewed after he returned safe from the battell wherein Achab was slaine For hee set Iudges in the Lande in all the fensed Cities of Iudah Citie by Citie Also in Ierusalem hee appointed of the Leuites and of the Priestes and of the heades of the houses of Israel for the iudgement of the Lorde and for matters of doubt and they dwelt at Hierusalem And hee commaunded them saying thus shall yee doe in the feare of the Lorde in trueth and in a perfect heart euery cause that shall come before you from your brethren remayning in their Cities betweene blood and blood betweene Lawe and precept statutes and iudgements you shall instruct them therein and they shall not trespasse against the Lorde And beholde Amariah the Priest shall bee chiefe ouer you in euery matter of the Lordes and Zebadiah the captaine of the house of Iudah shall bee chiefe ouer you in euery matter of the kinges and the Leuites shal bee Rulers or ouerseers in your presence or vnder you Iehosaphat put that in execution which GOD prescribed by Moses for the debating and determining of greater and weightier causes among the children of Israel placing a Councell of Priestes and secular Magistrates at Hierusalem to consider of those doubtes of the Lawe and offences against GOD and the king which passed the reache of inferiour Iudges in euery Citie Marke then howe many errors you haue committed in alleaging this one place The gouernement which God setled in their common wealth to supply the want of kinges the defence might both ouer-rule kinges and depose kinges and yet when this was ordained there was no king created nor intended in Israel much lesse included or subiected to this consistorie Againe where obedience in these wordes is commaunded as well towardes the ciuil magistrate as towards the Priest you strike out the magistrate cleane and bring both Prince and people in subiection to the Priest in things and causes that be not spiritual but temporal For the deposing of Princes is a meere temporal act and you haue lesse to doe with Princes Crownes than with priuate mens inheritances which yet the priest may not dispose Thirdly the matters which belonged to them and the iudgements which they should giue were precisely limited to the lawe of God in other thinges they might not presume Nowe resisting and deposing of Princes bee things cleane besides the Lawe which Moses deliuered and therefore not determinable by those that sate to iudge according to that Law Fourthly what question can this bee betweene the Prince and the people whether the Magistrate shal bee deposed since GOD hath expressely commaunded the people to bee subiect to the sworde and not to resist against the which precept no earthly Court may deliberate much lesse determine to breake his lawe or licence the people to frustrate his heauenly wil. It is one thing to disburden the cōscience from obeying the euill that a Prince commaundeth which a Priest may doe and an other thing to take the Princes sworde out of his hand for abusing his authoritie which the Priest may not doe Lastly you force the whole text against the manifest experience of those times For it is euident that kinges commaunded and displaced high Priestes but that euer high Priest iudicially displaced
discent of Phinees Sainct Augustine else-where debating this question of Moses and Aaron resolueth in doubtfull manner Moses and Aaron were both high Priestes or rather Moses the chiefe and Aaron vnder him or else Aaron chiefe for the pontificall attyre and Moses for a more excellent ministerie And in that sense Moses may bee called a Priest if you meane as Saint Augustine doeth an interpreter of Gods will to Aaron and others which is the right vocation of all Prophetes that were no Priestes and common to them all saue that by a more excellent prerogatiue than anie other Prophete of the olde Testament had God spake to Moses mouth to mouth and face to face as a man speaketh vnto his friend But this doth not hinder his ciuill power which was to bee chiefe iudge and soueraigne executor of iustice among thâ—m and by vertue thereof to put them to death that were offend ors against the law of God And in his steede succeeded not Eleazar or Phinees the sonnes of Aaron but Ioshua and Iudah the captaines and leaders of Israel Phi. Your collection of Samuel is not true For God sent him to do sacrifice when he annointed Dauid and therefore Samuel was a Priest Theo. My collection is grounded vpon the law of God Samuel was none of the sonnes of Aaron ergo Samuel was no Priest nor might not come neere the Altar to offer anie sacrifice in his owne person Phi. The Scripture sâ—yeth He tooke a sucking Lambe and offered it for a burnt offering vnto the Lorde Theo. You mistake the speech of the holy Ghost So Iephtah saide That thing which commeth first out of the doores of myne house to meete mee I will offer it for a burnt offering yet Iephtah was neither Priest nor Leuite So the Angell saide to Manoah If thou wilt make a burnt offering offer it to the Lorde and yet Manoah was of the tribe of Dan. Of Dauid that was no Priest the Scripture saith Then Dauid offered burnt offeringes peace offeringes before the Lorde And againe Dauid built there an Altar vnto the Lorde and offered burnt offeringes and peace offeringes and the Lorde was appeased towarde the Lande And likewise of Salomon The king went to Gibeon to sacrifice there a thowsande burnt offeringes did Salomon offer vppon that Altar Thrise a yeare did Salomon offer burnt offeringes and peace offeringes vppon the Altar which hee built to the Lorde and hee burnt incense vppon the Altar that was before the Lorde Nothing is oftener in the Scriptures than these kindes of speeches by the which no more is ment but that either they brought these things to be offered or else they caused the priests to offer them For in their own persons they coulde not sacrifice them because they were no Priests In that sense the Scripture saieth of Saul that He offered a burnt offering at Gilgall before Samuel came not that Saul offered it with his owne handes as you before did fondely imagine and sayde hee was deposed for aspiring to the spirituall function but hee commaunded the Priest to doe it who was then present in the host with the Arke of GOD as the next chapter doth witnesse in two seuerall places Phi. Then was Saul free from sinne when Samuel reproued him Theo. Samuel reproued him for distrusting and disobeying God For when God first aduanced Saul to the kingdom he charged him by the mouth of Samuel to go to Gilgal and there to staie seuen daies before he ventered to do any sacrifice til the Prophet were sent to shewe him what hee shoulde doe but he seeing his enimies gathered to fight against him on the one side and his people shrinking from him on the other side because Samuel came not beganne to suspecte that Samuel had beguiled him and therefore vppon his owne head against the commaundement of God willed the Priest to goe forwarde with his sacrifices and to consult GOD what hee shoulde doe This secrete distrust and presumption against the charge which God had giuen him was the thing that GOD tooke in so euill part and since hee woulde not submitte him-selfe to bee ruled by GOD and expect his leasure God reiected him as vnfitte to gouerne his people Neither did Samuel chalenge him for inuading the Priestes office but for not staying the time that God prefixed him before the Prophet should come Philand Wee reade in the booke of Numbers that the Captaine and all the people were commaunded to goe in and out that is to proceede in warres according to the order of Eleazarus the Priest Such were the warres of Abia other kinges of Iudah that fought most iustly and prosperouslie against the schismaticall Israelites and iustly possessed the Cities which they conquered in those warres As also Edom and Libuah reuolted from king Ioram for Religion euen because hee forsooke the God of their forefathers and coulde neuer bee recouered to the same againe Wherein also the example and zeale of the children of Israell was verie notable that they woulde haue denounced warre against the Tribe of Ruben and Gad onely for erecting as they tooke it a schismaticall altar out of the only place where our Lord appointed that sacrifice should be doone vnto his honor Theo. Yee bee tried men to interprete Scriptures The words which you applie to Eleazar the Priest stande in the text indifferent to be referred either to God or to Ieboshuah or to Eleazar and you lustilie leaue out both GOD and the Magistrate and will haue the Priest to bee the Master of the Musters And did the wordes pertaine to Eleazar no such power as you conceiue is thereby giuen to the Priest to caulme and kindle warres when hee list but onely to consult the Lord before his Arke and to reporte backe to the Captaine and leader of the people what the Lorde saide that no warres might bee vndertaken without expresse warrant from God This kinde of asking counsell at Gods mouth in their warres you should finde exemplyfied in sundrie places of the olde Testament as Iudges twentie first Samuel fourteene first Samuel twentie-three first Samuel thirtie But in this case the Priest had no farther authority than to inquire at Gods mouth and that hee did when the king commaunded him which is far from licencing subiectes to rebell against their king as you woulde haue it The warres of Abia the king of Iudah against Israell were not of Subiectes against their Soueraignes but of a lawfull Prince bearing the sworde and thinking to recouer the kingdome of Israell which Roboam his father lost from his enimies Where you iustifie the warres of Abia against Israell more bouldly than wisely GOD him-selfe prohibiting the children of Iudah and Beniamin in the dayes of Roboam his Father to fight against the children of Israell their brethren and professing the diuision of the Kingdome
eamque nunc Barbarorum nunc aliorum direptions relinquentibus populus ille Romanus qui suo sanguine tantum pararat imperium qui suis virtutibus Monarchiam fundauerat orbis venientem in auxilium eis Carolum magnum Francorum Regem qui vrbem sacraque loca ab omni hostium incursione defendit concurrente summi consensu Pontificis Caesarem salutauit The Princes of Greece beginning to neglect the citie of Rome and to leaue it to the spoile of Barbarians and others the people of Rome which with their blood had gotten so great an Empire and with their vertues established the Monarchie of the world saluted Charles the great king of Germanes as he came to helpe them and had defended the citie and temples from all inuasioÌ„s of enemies for their Emperor not without the consent of the Bishop of Rome So that the wiser sort euen of your owne fellowes do neither pretende religion nor the Popes superemineÌ„t power ouer al kingdoms for the translation of the Empire as you do but set it down as an Act done by the general consent and authoritie of the Bishop Senate and people of Rome for meere ciuill respectes And at the time of their defection from the Grecians they neither depriued Prince nor pretended any Papall censure for the matter but abhorring to see a wicked woman that had thrust the right heire and her own sonne from his throne and pulled out his eyes to inuade and holde the Monarchie of the world by iniurie and tyrannie they reiected her as an vsurper and disposed otherwise of their owne state by electing a new Emperour Phi. They would neuer after bee vnited againe to the Grecians Theo. You range without your bondes The diuision of the Empire so long as it was neither for matter of religion as I haue proued nor doone by the Popes Apostolike power as your owne companions graunt but by the consent of the whole state of Rome either for displeasure to see themselues neglected in their miseries by the Grecians or for disdaine that a wicked Tygresse vsurped the Empire without all right is nothing to your question and therefore whether it were lawfull or vnlawfull for the Romanes so to doe can doe you no more good thaÌ„ it can doe vs to proue that the Queene of England or the king of Fraunce may depose Princes because either Realme had long before that seuered and disioyned themselues from the Romane Empire and had by this time when the Romanes fell awaie peaceable and absolute regimentes of their owne Phi. These Countries were conquered and so by the Lawe of armes diuided from the Empire Theo. So could we say that Italie was conquered first by the Lombards and after by Charles who tooke their king captiue and by the lawe of armes inherited his crowne But wee stand not on that as being without our compasse it sufficeth to confute you that the Empire was diuided by the Romanes for earthly respectes as appeareth by the confession of your owne fellowes not any Prince deposed by the Popes authoritie for default in matter of religion You heard before what Aeneas Syluius said BloÌ„dus Sabellicus Nauclerus and others report the like occasion and reason for the Romanes diuiding the Empire Aistulfus king of the Lombards sayth Blondus inuaded and spoyled the partes of Italie that belonged to the Romanes The Bishop of Rome did his best with giftes and intreaties to pacifie the wicked king and when hee perceiued it did not auaile him hee wrote to Constantine the Emperour and shewed him in what state the Citie of Rome and all Italie stoode assuring him that vnlesse hee did â—ende helpe the Citie and the whole Countrie would bee subdued by Aistulfus The Emperour moued with the earnest petition of Gregorie the thirde wrote to Aistulfus but his Legates brought nothing backe from Aistulfus but wordes and those sharpe enough The Bishoppe hearing this and seeing no good doone called an assemblie of the whole people of Rome and there at their earnest motion and request resolued to deale thus with the Emperour that vnlesse hee woulde succour the Citie and Countrie in this extremitie with his presence and armie they woulde seeke some other waie to saue and defende themselues The messengers were skant gone but Aistulfus sent Heraultes to menace the Bishoppe and people of Rome that vnlesse they woulde yeelde themselues and the Citie hee woulde come and take them by force and kill man woman and childe The Pope did not cease with presents and promises to winne Aistulfus to continue the league which hee had begunne with the Romanes And when hee laboured in vaine and the messenger which was â—ent to the Emperour neither returned nor gaue them any hope of ayde from the Empire TOGITHER WITH THE PEOPLE OF ROME HEE DETERMINED to desire the helpe of the king of France Sabellicus putting Stephen where Blondus doeth Gregorie sayeth Not long after Aistulfus tooke Rauenna which when the Bishoppe of Rome by Legates required to haue restored the Lombarde not onelie refused but with great threates willed them to tell the Bishoppe and people of Rome that except they did render their citie and whole Dominion into his handes hee woulde shortly come and subdue them with armes and kill them euerie one Stephen amazed with these terrours of warre gaue counsell to sende to Constantinople whence they which were sent signified by letters that there was no looking for helpe from Constantine either for that hee would not or coulde not and therefore they must seeke some other waie The Bishoppe appalled with these letters dealt with the people that some might be sent into Fraunce to king Pipine Nauclerus and others saie the same insomuch that when Aistulfus streitly besieged Rome three monethes and wasted all that was rounde about it with fire and sword Blondus saith Dum tantis fluctuat angiturque vel detrimentis velpericulis Roma Italia Constantinus Imperator nullam subueniendi curam suscepit Whiles Rome and Italie tottered and was ready to sinke vnder these ruines and hazards Constantine the Emperor had no maner of care to relieue them This neglect of their calamities not religion made the Romanes seeke and take all opportunities to forsake the Grecians I speake of the people not of the Pope for hee had deeper reaches and other purposes in laying this plotte and those were the bettering his state and inriching him-selfe with the spoyles of the Empire and aspiring to bee free from the Princes checke to whom till that time hee was wholy subiect which were the chiefe intentes of his first ioyning with the Germanes And therfore when he was once sette at libertie from the yoke of the Grecians and indued with a good part of the Emperours reuenues in Italie hee neuer left practising till hee brought the Romane Scepter to nothing and himselfe to this height that we now see him in by the finall ruine and subuersion of the East
not or can not procure the Popes fauour For so the Bishoppes of Rome haue vsed their excommunications against Princes and others as the examples that followe will fully declare To make an ende first with Hildebrand if either the successe that GOD gaue him in his furious attempt or the iudgements of your best and syncerest Stories neere that tyme bee woorthie to bee regarded they condemne this act of Hildebrande as vniust and vngodly Rodolf whome the Pope and the Saxons set vp against his master lost his right hand in the fielde as hee sought to get the Crowne from him and when by reason of that and other woundes hee was readie to giue vp the ghost Vrspergensis reporteth of him that looking on the stumpe of his arme and fetching a deepe sigh hee sayde to the Bishoppes that were about him beholde this is the hande wherewith I sware alleagance to my Soueraigne Lorde Henrie and nowe I leaue you see both his kingdome and this present life you that made me aspire to his throne take you heede that you lead me right I followed your aduise The same yeere that Rodolf was slaine Hildebrand by reuelation from heauen as hee sayde foretolde that that very yeere the false king should die but his coniecture of the false King which hee interpreted to bee Henry deceiued him sayth Sigebert For Henry fighting a set battell with the Saxons Rodolf the false king and many of the Nobles of Saxonie were slaine If this were a reuelation from God as Gregorie pretended then by the foretelling and perfourming of this accident GOD himselfe pronounced him the false King whom the Pope erected and maintained against Henry the fourth If it were no reuelation from aboue but a consortion with spirites from beneath then was Gregorie no such Saint as you make him that had felowshippe with Diuels and his owne master betrayed and beguyled the frantike humour of his infernall disciple Foure yeares after Hildebrande him-selfe was forsaken of his owne people and by their consent depriued of his Popedome and hee faine to flie to the barbarous Normanes for refuge and there in banishment died Romani Imperatorem Henricum recipiunt in vrbe eorum iudicio Hildebrandus Papatu abdicatur The Romanes receiue Henrie Emperour into their citie and by their iudgement Hildebrand is depriued of the Popedome Vrspergensis confirmeth the same Vnde Romani commoti manus Regidederunt Hildebrandum vero Papam vnanimeter abdicarunt whereupon the Romanes being moued that the Pope would not come in the kings presence to haue the matter hearde submitted themselues to the king and with one consent abandoned Pope Hildebrand Who lying at the point of death as Sigebert founde written of him called vnto him of the twelue Cardinals whom hee loued aboue the rest and confessed to God S. Peter and the whole church that hee had greatly sinned in the Pastorall charge which was committed vnto him and that at the instinct of the diuell he had stirred hatred hart-burning amongest men Beno the Cardinall testifieth the same though some of your Romish writers stoutly auouch the contrary This was the successe of Hildebrande and his newe made king the one vppon the losse of his hande and ende of his life remembring his oth and repenting his treason the other seeking to displace the Prince was displaced him selfe and lost his Popedome whiles he laboured to set the Prince besides his throne As touching the fact Frisingensis saith this was the first onset that euer Bishop of Rome gaue to depriue the Emperour I reade and ouerreade saieth he the gestes of the Romane kings and Emperors and I neuer find any of them before this man excommunicated by the Bishop of Rome or depriued of his kingdom Sigebert wisely and truly giueth his iudgement of this and the like interprise To speake with the leaue of all good men this only nouelty I will not say heresie was not crept into the worlde before the daies of Hildebrand that Priestes should teach the people they owe no subiection to euil kinges and that although they haue sworne fidelitie vnto him yet they must yeelde him none neither may they bee counted periures for holding against the king but rather he that obeyeth the king is excommunicated he that rebelleth against the king is absolued frō the blemish of disloyalty periurie Gerochus a great champiō of Gregories is fain to say of him The Romanes vsurp to themselues a diuine honor they wil yeeld no reason of their doinges neither can they abide that any man should say vnto them why doe you so They answere as the Poete writeth so I will and commande Let my will stand for reason Vrspergensis sayeth of the Synode at Mentz where in the presence of the Romane Legates the Bishops that rebelled with Hildebrand against the Emperour were deposed Ibi communi consensu consilio constituta est pax Dei There by common consent and counsell the peace of God was established which concludeth Gregorie to be the author of a diuelish dissention against the Emperour Phi. Wee care for none of these that speake euill of Gregories doing so long as we haue a greater number of stories to commend him Theo. And wee hauing the true reportes of these that liued in the same age with him which neither you nor the rest of your Romish faction can disproue litle regard what men that came after and were more desirous to please the Pope than to write the truth haue published in their stories You nor all the writers you haue shall euer be able to refell the assertions of Sigebert Frisingensis that Hildebrād was the first Bishoppe of Rome which attempted to depriue Princes of their Crownes and that this noueltie or rather heresie was neuer hearde of before Howe lawfull then it was which for a thowsande yeares the church of Rome neuer durst aduenture till Gregorie the seuenth first presumed to doe it leaning rather to wicked and seditious policie than to christian and confessed authoritie the simple may soone discerne or if they looke to the end they shall see the reward that is consequent to all rebellions A good instruction sayeth that auncient reporter of Henries life was giuen to the worlde that no man shoulde rise against his master The right hand of Rodolph cut off shewed a most iust punishment of periurie in that he feared not to violate his fidelitie sworne to the king his Soueraigne and as though other woundes had not beene sufficient to bring him to his death that part also was punished that by the plague the fault might bee perceiued Phi. If you stand on successe Henrie him-selfe was lifted at last out of his kingdome by his owne sonne Theo. Was it not wickednesse enough to arme the subiectes against their Prince to set the sonne to impugne the father but you must also crake of it The way that Hildebrand beganne
cities of Italie doubled tripled to their vtter ouerthrow and by inciting the kinges of Fraunce England Spaine and Scicily to ioine against Frederike which thing Alexander the third a Cardinall of the same conspiracie with Adrian laboured for life to compasse Phi. Could you blame him Did not Frederik set vp Victor an Antipape against him chase Alexander froÌ„ his See Theo. Frederike did not set him vp but when two were chosen in a tumult the councel of Papia discussing the cause pronounced for Victor against Alexander their iudgement did the Emperor follow Phi. He might wel folow it for himself did procure it Theo. It is not true The Bishops of Italie Germany and other Countries were assembled by him and the matter committed as in the sight of God to their integrities and consciences The Princes words in the councell were Though I see the power to cal councels is ours by the office dignitie of our empire especially in so great dangers of the Church for so Constantine Theodosius Iustinian and of later memory Charles the great and Otho are knowen to haue done yet authority to define this weightie and chiefe matter I leaue to your wisedoms and iudgements For God hath made you Priestes and giuen you power to iudge of vs. And because in thinges which pertaine to God it is not for vs to iudge of you we exhort you to behaue your selues in this cause as those that looke for none other iudge ouer you but God This when he had saide he withdrew himselfe from the councell committing the whole examination of the matter to the church and to the persons Ecclesiasticall there assembled which were infinite There were fiftie Archbishops Bishops Abbats and Priors innumerable There were also the Embassadors of diuers nations promising whatsoeuer the Synod decreed should vndoubtedly bee receiued of their Realmes See their proofes and proceedinges of this councell in the chapters that follow and shew vs howe you can infringe them Phi. Alexander had the greater part of the Cardinals Theo. The greater part of the Cardinals had conspired to choose none but one that was and would be an enimie to the Prince to that intent had they taken an othe Adrian yet liuing After his death when they came to choose a successour the people the Clergie were as earnest to haue none but one that shoulde keepe the citie at peace with the Prince Whereupon the conspirators not daring to vtter themselues for feare of some vproare nine of the Cardinals the rest seeing and not contradicting at the importunate clamour of the people and clergie put the Popes mantle or cope vpon Octauian the Cardinall and placed him in S. Peters chaire and perfourmed all other solemnities of his inthronization with the great ioy of the whole citie the conspiratours which were 14 in number beholding al this and not gainsaying it or any part of it though they were present Twelue daies after Victor was immantled and possessed of the Popedom had receiued the obediences of the clergie throughout Rome the conspirators secretly departing the citie not so much as calling the rest of the Cardinals to their election by them-selues without the presence or allowance of the people or clergie set vp Rowland the chief man of their faction to be Pope named him Alexander This garboyle being brought to the Prince by the complaint of both partes he by letters messengers warned both sides to come to the councell that should be kept at Papia and there to heare the iudgement of the Bishoppes for the determining of this strife which Alexander and his adherentes vtterly refused These thinges were iustly proued before the Bishoppes assembled at Papia and sentence pronounced with Victor against Alexander What did Frederike in this case that a Christian Prince might not lawfully do in the like How could he do lesse than cal both parts to the Synod and commit the matter to the iudgement of the Bishops Or how could he but fauour and defend that â—ide which was now cleared and confirmed by the councell Phi. Victors election was faultie from the beginning Theo. If there were any fault in Victors election it was theirs that should haue presently protested against his ordering but in Alexanders there was neither right nor forme of any election They were ioyned in a wicked compact had thereto bound them selues by oth which by law was sufficient to forfeit their voices Againe their own silence drowned their interest when they would not or durst not speake their minds at the time place appointed for the choice Thirdly to their electioÌ„ they called not those who had right to be present to choose as wel as theÌ„selues therefore all that they did was vtterly voide Fourthly they had neither the consent of the clergy nor laity which by order duty they ought to aske Lastly they disdained the summoÌ„s both of the Emperor yâ— councel which by the canoÌ„s they should haue obeied and therefore might be depriued of the right which they had much more discharged from that which they neuer had Phi. The councell was not indifferent The. No more is any iudge to him that offendeth Phi. The Prince had no power to call the councel much lesse to summon the Pope Theo. You speake like your selfe Who called the ancient councels summoned the Popes to be present at them but Princes And why might not this councell cite depriue Alexander for his contempt as wel as the couÌ„cels of Pisa ConstaÌ„ce Basil did other Popes that came after for the like contumacie specially wheÌ„ as Alexander was yet no Pope but in strife with an other for the Popedome Phi. Platina saith Alexander had 22. Cardinals Victor but 3. Theo. So Alexander himselfe craketh whom Platina followeth but the contrary part testified that there were nine on the one side fourteene on the other Howbeit I stande not on these minutes of elections I note first the causes that prouoked the Pope his Cardinals to conspire against Frederike next the meanes they vsed to persue him and wearie him The causes were the setting of the Princes name in his letters before the Popes the requiring of homage of the Bishops stopping the Cardinals from spoiling his churches vnder a colour of visiting them Of these pretences and Frederiks answeres let the worlde iudge The meanes were the Pope did excommunicate the Prince his fautors gate Crema Placentia Verona Millan Brixia to rebel linked fifteene cities of Italie in a league with the king of Scicilie not long before his mortall enimie of purpose to withstand Frederike procured Henrie Duke of Saxonie to forsake his master in the fielde stirred the Princes of Fraunce England Spainei and the Venetians what they coulde to annoy him With these policies he began and with these he continueth euen at this present Thus your holy father with warres rebellions and
against the Emperor as if he had bin a Turke or a Saracene Philand Did not Frederike rather play the Turke with such as fought against him when he cut their heades in fower parts and laide them crossewise on their shoulders and with hoat Irons burnt a crosse in their foreheads whose liues he spared and caused the Clergie mens crownes to bee cut square to the very sculles What Turke or Saracene euer shewed like crueltie The. Al executions not in warre onely but in peace also seeme cruell if you looke to the punishments and not to the offences Phi. What was their offence Theo. They rebelled against him for the Popes pleasure whom by Gods Lawe they shoulde haue honoured and obeyed as their Soueraigne Lord and lawfull Prince and not therwith content they take vp the crosse against him in their badges and banners as if it had beene against a Turke or an Infidel If subiects so farre forget their dueties as to vse their Princes like Infidels because the Pope disfauoureth theÌ„ why should not princes forget their clemencie reward rebels and enemies according to their deserts It was therefore more enormous for the Pope to proclaime the crosse against a Christian Prince though his aduersarie for some priuate respectes as hee doeth against the Turke than for the Prince to inflict some such punishment as should make them repent their follies Phi. Frederike impugning the Pope with all his might why shoulde not the Pope such him-selfe the best way hee coulde Theo. And the Pope bringing rebels into the fielde against the Prince as it had beene against an Infidel why shoulde not the Prince teach them to beware howe they vsed the crosse against Christian Magistrates which was deuised against Turkes and Saracenes Phi. The Prince himselfe was in all the fault Theo. Because he woulde not suffer the Pope to ride on his necke as hee had done on his graundfathers and the rebellious Cities of Lombardie to shut him cleane out of Italie For what other cause had Gregorie the ninth againe to excommunicate and depose Frederike after hee had shewed himselfe so desirous of peace that hee paide a huge heape of golde to content the Popes ambitious spirite What one iniurie done to the Church of Rome can your Italian Sories iustly charge him with after his first absolution If you thinke your holy father may turne and wynd Princes like dishcloutes and curse them and depose them for what causes he lyst then Frederike was in some fault for that hee would not graunt peace to the Cities of Italie which rebelled against him at the Popes motion but if that bee madde diuinitie as in deede it is the Pope himselfe was not wel aduised first to set the subiects vp in rebellion against their Prince and next to depriue the Prince for offering to represse them that resisted him Shewe vs therfore what offence it was against the Popes holynes for the prince to compel his subiects to obedience by force of armes or else wee must conclude your holy father did the prince open wicked wrong to thunder his censures against him for seeking his own by those meanes which God hath allowed vnto magistrats Phi. The Emperour hired some to rebel in Rome against the Pope Theo. Your Italian writers would faine find holes in Frederiks coate if they could tel howe but their tales hang not together Platina runneth one way Blondus an other and Antoninus a thirde Platina sayth that Peter Fregepanes taking part with the Emperour kept the Pope out of Rome and made him decline to Viterbium as hee was going with an armie against the Emperour whome hee vnderstoode to bee within Italie and to oppugne the confederate Cities So that by Platinaes confession the Pope was in armes against the Emperour afore the fautors of Frederike offered him any violence Blondus a deadly persuer of Frederike with his pen reporteth this resistance made by Peter Fregepanes before the Emperor entered Italie addeth as his maner is of meere spite that the Prince had hired him with mony so to doe Antoninus as Nauclerus alleageth him writeth that Frederike hearing the cities of Lombardie Millan Bononia and many others of Romandiola to bee fallen from him and turned to the deuotion of the Church went against them with a great armie And the Citizens of Millan with al their strength and the Popes Legates and the whole confederacie of Lombardie which did cleaue to the Church fought a fielde with the Emperour in a place called New court and the Millanoes with their adherents after a sore conflict were ouerthrowen many of theÌ„ being slaine many taken prisoners with their Carroch where the Ruler of Millan being the sonne of the Duke of Venice and sundrie other Noble men of Lombardie were taken and sent into Apulia the Prince causing the Dukes sonne to bee hanged on a tower by the Seas side the rest to be executed some one way some an other This Florentine conâ—esseth the Popes Legates were in the battayle that was fought with Frederike at his first entrance into Italie and that the very original of the warre was the defection of the Lombardes from the Empire to ioyne with the Pope or as he speaketh with the Church which in deede was the only strife betweene the Pope and the Prince whatsoeuer Blondus others in hatred of Frederike do surmise Uiew now this quarrell tel vs whether Frederike did more than a Christian Prince might doe or whether the Pope rather did not wickedly nourish the conspiracie that the Lombardes made with Adrian the fourth against Frederike the first to driue the Emperour cleane out of Italie which was the point that the Pope pushed at all this while Phi. The Pope required nothing at his hands but the preseruation of that league which his graund-father made at Constans and his father during his life had kept inuiolable Theo. That peace included none but Frederike the first and Henrie his sonne it extended not to their heires and aftercommers as appeareth by the othe of fidelitie which the confederate cities tooke to Frederike then Emperour and king Henrie his sonne no farther and therfore that peace being expired by the death of his father the Prince was at libertie to doe as he sawe cause Phi. But the Pope sought the continuance of that peace Theo. And the Prince perceiuing the Popes fetch in time to exclude the Emperour cleane out of Italie by the renuing of that peace would not assent to it but came with a mind resolued to bring the Lombardes to their former subiectioÌ„ What wrong was this in Frederike Phi. It was hard dealing Theo. None at all And considering the Popes drift to be free from the Emperors force that he might with more safetie quarrel with him when he lysted and depriue him at his pleasure without daunger it was necessarie for the Prince to settle his state keepe his right in Italie it should otherwise
Polydore that king Iohn desirous to eternise the memorie of this good turne made himselfe beneficiarie to the Bishop of Rome with this prouiso that the kings of England after that should receiue the right of their crowne only from the Pope But the kings that followed neuer obserued this forme neither do the Chronicles of England report any such submission Wherfore it is certain that all those burdens were laid on the person of king Iohn that offended and not on his successors Phi. For heresie George king of Boemland was excommunicated and thereupon by the forces of the king of Hungarie at length actually depriued Theo. For the mislike of your Romane vanities your holy father plaied his part with George king of Boemland 1466. yeares after Christ as he had done with other Princes before deiecting him from his kingdome by presumptuous iudgement at Rome and inticing the Princes that were neighbours in hope of his kingdom to inuade him with armes to ioine with the Bohemians that rebelled against him Which offer Mathias king of Hungary first imbraced a proud vnthankfull crafty fraudulent ambitious man as Frederike the 3. then Emperor of Rome complained of him in his embassage to Cazimire king of Pole might well appeare by his behauior to king George who had him in hold when he was chosen king of Hungarie might haue depriued him both of kingdom life would not but yet that inhumane aspiring head of his did not preuaile For George persisted died king of Bohemia notwtstanding the Popes curses Mathias forces and after his death was Vladislaus Cazimires sonne chosen to the kingdome and not onely helde it in spite of Mathias and the Popes grant to him none else but also succeeded Mathias in the kingdom of Hungarie Phi. Yet the Pope gaue the kingdom of Bohemia to Mathias Theo. Hee might haue giuen him the kingdom of Constantinople or Persia with as much right as he did this but howe that gift was esteemed euen by those that otherwise depended on the church of Rome the choice of a new and the next king did declare Phi. Also Iohn Albert had halfe his kingdom of Nauarre taken from him by Ferdinandus surnamed Catholicus of Aragon for that he gaue aid to Lewes the 12. being excommunicated by Iulius the second Theo. The driftes of Princes intertaining the Popes Buls and admitting his keyes so farre as they make for their profit do not proue the Popes power to be good or their persons states to be subiect to his censures by Gods Law Philip the 2. king of Fraunce was earnest to execute the Popes Bull against king Iohn spared no cost for the preparation of the warre The cause was he hoped to get the Crowne of England for his paines but Lodouike his sonne Philip the 4. this Lewes whom you name neither reuerenced nor regarded the Popes Buls which made against them but shewed a manifest contempt of his censures with open Edicts seuered themselues their people from his obedience So Ferdinand king of Spaine when by violent suddain inuasion he had gotten that part of Nauarre which bordered vpon him was content for the keeping of it to pretend the Popes Bul against Lewes the 12. but Charles the fift the next king of Spaine could let his soldiers surprise Rome and desposse it in most cruel maner abusing illuding the Priests Nonnes Bishops Cardinals with all military despites furies keepe the Pope fast lockt in prison till he paied 400000. pounds for his ransome and consented to such other conditions as they listed to prescribe Phi. It was not Charles wil that Rome should be sacked or the Pope thus handled it was the Germanes rage for want of pay Theo. Charles coulde doe litle if he could not dissemble He neither rebuked his armie nor inlarged the Pope nor recompensed any part of the Pillage which his soldiers as well Spaniards as Germanes had committed in Rome leauing nothing behinde them that was worthy the taking And so long though his consent did not appeare yet he made his aduantage of their act and secretly supported them by his protraction to take the whole spoile of the citie Phi. The variance betweene the Pope Charles was for temporal matters Theo. So Lewes the 12. contended with Iulius the 2. for temporall dominion therefore the king of Nauarre ayding the French king in a ciuill quarell was nothing so much to be blamed as Charles but the trueth is Ferdinand had cast his eyes on that kingdom confining so neere lying so commodious the ancient desire of the kings of Spaine to be Lords of Nauarre being wel knowen as Guicciardin confesseth for that cause when he could deuise no better title he took hold of the Popes Bul colouring his iniurious ambitioÌ„ with a semblaÌ„ce of Romish deuotion Phi. It is holden at this day by the same right Theo. This was no right other I knowe none the king of Spaine hath to it besides the sword by the which it was gotten not yet 73. yeares since Phi. Wil you dispute his title Theo. I am not so curious in an other mans common wealth let the Princes whom it concerneth trie their own titles yet this is certaine that neither the kings of England France nor Spaine would suffer the Pope to dispose their kingdoms or any part of their dominions against their likings Phi. For like causes and namely for that he was vehemently suspected of the murther of the blessed Bishop S. Thomas of Canterbury was Henrie the second driuen by Alexander the third to order and penance Theo. The strife betweene the king Thomas Becket then Archbishop of CaÌ„terburie is reported before not now to be iterated The lawes liberties of the church for the which he resisted the king were nothing else but the rescuing of malefactors if they were Clerkes from due punishmeÌ„t exempting themselues from the kings subiection which be quarels of their own nature wicked irreligious therefore well you may call him BLESSED because you be consorted in the same quarell with him against God your Prince otherwise his pride was intolerable his contention with the king detestable his end miserable Phi. Are you not ashamed to staine the glory of that worthy Martyr Theo. First proue him an innocent before you make him a Martyr Phi. Who euer charged him with any crime Theo. The very cause he stood in was crime enough besides his resisting the prince which S. Paul pronounceth to be damnable Phi. Do you make it damnable to defende the liberties of the church Theo. To dreame that the statelines of Popes and licentiousnes of Priests was the perfection happines of Christs church and in that leâ—de conceit to neglect your othes resist the powers which God hath established is a triple damnation Phi. That we do not Theo. That he
for the Pope was not as earnest to haue him gone but he was as glad to go as willing neuer to returne And therfore to take his farewel he sould all the right title that the Emperour had throughout Italy as Blondus saith omâ—ia vbique concessit ex quibus pecunia abra di potuit passed away euery thing in euerie place by the which he might get any mony And as he did in Italy so did he in germany For laboring to haue his son VeÌ„celaus chosen his successor in the Empire wheÌ„ the electors wold not agree to it because the child had nothing in him fit for so great a calling the Emperor offered euery of the Electours a hundred thowsande poundes to goe through with the choice and so they did And not hauing mony sufficient to defraie such an infinite summe hee pawned the Landes and reuenues of the Empire into their handes till they were paied and so they remaine to this day Hence the Romane Empire came to naught neither was it euer after able to stand vpright the Princes Electors keeping al in their handes and swearing the Emperour when he is first chosen that he shall not claime such things as they haue of the Empire in morgage Vencelaus for whom his father paied 600000. pounds to haue him Emperour proued so vnprofitable for the place that the electours when Charles was deade of their authoritie put him from the crowne and set an other in his steede Some Princes of other countries you might repeate which I omit no man doubteth but your holy Fathers pride and arrogance serued him to venter on meaner Princes as well as on Emperours this is it that wee stand on for a thowsande yeares there was no such thing vsed nor offered in the church of Christ and since that time though Popes haue beene very forwarde to depose Princes you shall neuer shewe any Prince that acknowledged or obeyed that sentence yea none of their people vnder them nor of the borderers about them embraced those iudgementes but such as had secrete quarelles against them or sought to gaine some part of their kingdoms from them The rest of their subiects neighbours honoured them as Princes notwithstanding your furious lightning and thundering from Rome as I haue shewed by many specialties from the time of Henrie the fourth to these our dayes and an infinite number of your owne side haue by deedes and wordes boldly and sharpely reproued that insolent presumption And therefore if you doe any good in this cause you must goe higher and bring vs elder examples that Bishops of Rome haue deposed Princes than these violent and tragicall vproares of later Popes blinded with errour and puffed with pride who to compasse their vngodly desires haue ouerwhelmed the earth with fraude and force with periurie and iniquity with battaile bloodshed like furies of hel not like teachers of truth or Pastors of mens soules Could you proue tenne thowsand such attempts it would relieue you litle we may not leaue the manifest commaundements of God constant obedience of Christes church for so many hundreths and allow of those hatefull and heathenish deuises which the sonne of perdition hath lately broched Phi. Will you yeeld to an elder example if it be brought you Theo. Reason we know the man before we reuerence his act Phi. It shal be Gregorie the great first of that name whome you confesse to haue beene both learned and holy He being many hundreth yeares before Gregorie the seuenth and our speciall Apostle practised the poinct we now stand on and therefore likely to be beleeued of all reasonable men Theo. Did Gregorie the great euer depose Princes Phi. That he did Theo. Name the Prince which he deposed and winne the field Phi. He deposed them before hand whatsoeuer they were that shoulde at any time after to the worlds end impugne his priuilege Theo. Then he deposed princes not only before they were Crowned but also before they were conceiued of their mothers Phi. He adiudged they should be deposed that so offended though actually he deposed none In the forme of his priuilege graunted to S. Medardes Monasterie thus he decreeth Si quis Regum Antistitum Iudicum vel quarumcunque personarum secularium huius Apostolicae authoritatis nostrae praeceptionis decreta violauerit cuiuscunque dignitatis vel sublimitatis sit honore suo priuetur If any King Prelate Iudge or what other secular person soeuer shall transgresse this decree of our authoritie and commaundement of what preeminence of highth soeuer he be let him be depriued of his dignitie Theo. Why stoppe you there and goe no farther Phi. I neede not here is enough for my purpose Theo. Yet reade on the rest or if you will not I will Cum Iuda traditore Domini in inferno inferiori damnetur and let him be damned with Iudas the traytour in the nethermost hell Phi. There is nothing in this against vs. Theo. You might the better haue rehearsed it But think you that Gregorie did damne men to hel or reserue you that power only to Christ Phi. None can cast body and soule into hell fire but only God Theo. Doth Gregorie take Gods office from him Phi. No but he meaneth to terrifie them with this kinde of curse and praieth it may fal on their heades if they infringe his godly actes Theo. Then as Gregrie had no power to condemne Princes to hel though he threaten it to them no more had he right to depose Princes though he wish their ouerthrow if they frustrate his decrees It is therefore AN IMPRECATION or curse which in the like case the meanest founder that is may lay on the greatest Prince that shall be borne without any iudiciall authoritie It is no depriuation neither prosecuted nor purposed by the Bishop of Rome Phi. He saith Let him be depriued of his dignitie Theo. And know you not that is the optatiue mode by the which Gregorie wisheth and praieth it may come to passe but neither pronounceth nor perfixeth any such iudgement Phi. If it may come to passe then Princes may be deposed Theo. God hath many wayes to displace the mightie from their seats to whom Gregorie praieth for vengeance though the Pope be not the doer Phi. If this bee but a wish euerie doner may doe as much Theo. They be the verie woordes wherewith euerie doner doth strengthen his endowment And euen in this place Gregorie is not alone Thirtie Bishops of diuers cities subscribed to this graunt and curse in the selfe same wordes that Gregorie did Theodoricus the King and Brunichildis the Queene vsed the same manner of subscription that the Bishop of Rome did and the generall comprisement that presently followeth sheweth the wordes that went before to be but curses Omnium maledictionum anathemate let him be loden with al those heauie curses wherewith Infidels and
brought to betray the truth with their silence What then we thinke of the subiectes dutie to the Magistrate you shall far more certainly and truly learne by this our doctrine than by their slanders which are not ashamed to ioyne vs with the frantike Anabaptistes subuerting the Magistrates authority How the confession of the reformed churches in Fraunce should allow rebellion I see no coniecture in their words vnlesse a rebel may haue them to mistake and depraue at his pleasure Subiectes must obey the lawes pay tribute beare al burdens imposed and sustaine the yoke euen of infidel Magistrates so for all that that the supreme dominion due of God be not violated What mislike you in these words Would you that Infidels should bee serued afore or aboue God Phi. Their meaning is that if Gods due be once violated we must no longer pay tribute nor obey the Lawes of any Prince Theo. How gather you that out of this place Their wordes sound otherwise Subiectes must obey the lawes and sustaine the yoke euen of Infidels so that the supreme dominion of God be not violated Phi. If that be violated they must obey no longer but elect an other Prince Theo. That is your rebellious inclination not their position They say subiectes must obey Princes so farre foorth as the supreme dominion of God bee not violated In any matter if the choice come betweene God and the Prince which of the twaine shal be serued and obeied God must euer be preferred Phi. Surely they meane that if once the Magistrate violate the supreme dominion of God we must account him no longer a magistrate Theo. The diuell himselfe can shew no greater malice than to peruert that which is well spoken and to force a leude sense of his owne on an other mans wordes It is euident they neuer ment that if the Magistrate once violate Gods due the peâ—ple might reiect him for then were it not needeful at al to sustaine the yoke of aâ— infidel as their owne wordes import because he can not be an Infidell except he first violate the supreme dominion of God by commanding against his truth in matters of religion and therefore they ment as their wordes lie that euen Infidels if they bee Princes must be obeyed but so that Gods due bee euer forprised If they presume to violate the dominion which God hath reserued to himselfe we may not rebel that is your Iesuitical doctrine but disobey them in that or any point that is prescribed by man against the will of God and submit our selues to indure persecution for righteousnesse sake which as our Sauiour assureth vs is not without great and happy recompence Phi. Zuinglius likewise a cater-cosen to the Caluinistes in religion writeth thus If the Empire of Rome or what other soueraigne soeuer should oppresse the sincere Religion and we negligently suffer the same wee shal be charged with contempt no lesse than the oppressors thereof themselues whereof we haue an example in the fifteenth of Ieremy where the destruction of the people is prophecied for that they suffered their king Manasses being impious and vngodly to be vnpunished And more plaine in an other place When kinges saith he rule vnfaithfully and otherwise than the rule of the Gospell prescribeth they may with God be deposed as when they punish not wicked persons but specially when they aduance the vngodly as idle Priests c. Such may be depriued of their dignity as Saul was Theo. I vndertake not to discusse or defend ech seueral mans opinioÌ„ or speech The Romanes we know could neuer abide in their citie the name of a king The commonwealthes of Venice Millan Florence Genua are of the same minde Many states haue gouernors for life or for yeares as they best liked that first erected their policies yet a soueraignty still remaning somwhere in the people somewhere in the Senate somwhere in the Prelates Nobles that elect or assist the Magistrate who hath his iurisdictioÌ„ allotted and prefixed vnto him thus far and no further and may be resisted recalled from any tyrannous excesse by the generall and publike consent of the whole state where hee gouerneth In Germanie the Emperour him-selfe hath his boundes appointed him which he may not passe by the lawes of the Empire the Princes Dukes cities that are vnder him haue power to gouerne vse the sworde as Gods ministers in their own charges And though for the maintenance of the Empire they be subiect to such orders as shall bee decreed in the conuent of all their States and according to that direction are to furnish the Emperour with men and monie for his necessarie warres and defences yet if he touch their policies infringe their liberties or violate the specialties which hee by oth and order of the Empire is bound to keepe they may lawfully resist him and by force reduce him to the ancient and receiued fourme of Gouernment or else repell him as a tyrant and set an other in his place by the right and freedome of their Country Therefore the Germanes doinges or writinges can helpe you litle in this question They speake according to the lawes and rights of the Empire theÌ„selues being a verie free state and bearing the sworde as lawfull Magistrates to defend their liberties and prohibite iniurie against all oppressours the Emperour himselfe not excepted In this sense Zuinglius may say that if the Empire of Rome or any other Soueraigne should oppresse the truth they that haue rightful power by the lawes of their country to withstand should negligently suffer the same they shal be charged with contempt no lesse than the oppressors themselues but that subiectes and such as are onely bounde to obey and not by the Lawes of the Lande authorised to vse the sworde shoulde take weapon in hande to displace the Prince and change the state that Zuinglius neuer sayde nor much lesse that the Pope might warrant such priuate violence Phi. For his example he bringeth the men of Iuda and Ierusalem whom God by Ieremie threatned to destroy for that they suffered their king Manasses being impious and vngodly to be vnpunished yet the people of Israel had no such Soueraingty ouer their king Theo. What Soueraignty the whole people of Israel had ouer their kinges is a question amongst the learned Zuinglius might be of opinion they had When Saul would haue put Ionathan his son to death the people would not suffer him so to do but deliuered Ionathan that hee died not When Dauid purposed the reducing of the Arke his speech to the people was If it please you we will send to the rest of our brethren that they may assemble themselues vnto vs. After Salomons death all the congregation of Israell came and said to Roboam make thy fathers yoke which he put vpon vs lighter and we wil serue thee as if it had lien in their choice