substance and essence they are true in every true and lawfull complete societie But as the profession of the truth may be found in all fundamentall points though mixed with many errours so for Truth and existence the Ministerie may be lawfull though in many particulars delinquent and deficient In the true Church then there is a true Ministerie But the true Church hath continued there by the blessing of God where the Election of Ministers hath been given away by the people or taken from them In later times the High Priesthood was bought and sold for monie and somtimes it was made annuall that every yeere new Priests were created as those Governours whom Kings change every yeere that as every man would lay out more or lesse monie he should obtaine or lose the Priesthood Which may be seen in the examples of Iason and Menelaus Neverthelesse so long as the Church of the Jewes continued the Church of God the Priesthood continued also In the Primitive Churches when the people had a voice in the choice of their Teachers oftentimes there were factions in the Church the people stood against their Guides and the Guides against their people and the people were divided one against another And sometimes either through sloth or for peace the Pastors left the election of Officers to the people Ruffin lib. 11. c. 10.11 Theod. hist lib. 4. ca. 6. August Epist 110. 225. Socrat. hist lib. 7. ca. 34 35. 39. Concil Antioch cap. 18. Sozom. hist l. 2. ca. 18 19. Naziatrz in Epit. patris Euagr. l. 2. cap. 5.8 Theodor. l. 5. ca. 23. Gratian. dist 63. ca. 11 12. Cypr. l. 3. epist 14. 10. W.B. The Church plea. §. 8. pag. 90. T.C. repl 2. par 1. p. 212. Cypr. l. 2. epist 5. l. 4. Epist 5. l. 3. epist 22. and the like he did for Optatus Satuus Caesernius Numidicus Calv. Inst l 4. c. 4. §. 10. August epist 223. Theod. l. 1. ca. 23. Socrat. hist. l. 2. ca. 19. Sozom. l. 3. c. 20. Socrat. hist. lib. 7. ca. 28. W.B. The Church plea. § 8. pag. 80. Centur. 1. ca. 4. Centur. 6 7. col 591. Centur. 2. c. 7. p. 134. 135. and the people challenged it unto themselves and sometimes againe they took it from their people and challenged it to themselves But in the mids of these broyles he was accounted a true Minister who was elected whether by the Guides or by the people or by the Emperour so he taught the doctrine of Salvation truely And if this be not admitted what shall be done when the people and their Elders be divided in the choice of a fit Officer or Guide If the people prevaile against their Elders he whom they chuse is no Minister to them because not chosen by their Suffrages if the Elders against the people he whom they approve is no Minister because he wants the peoples voice And if the people dissent they must separate and excommunicate one another because to the one part he is no Minister whom the other approve Though Cyprian teach That Ministers should be chosen by the people yet this forme of Election was not in some Churches in Cyprians time who were esteemed true Churches and true Ministers And Cyprian himselfe appointed Aurelius a Reader without advice of the Church by the authoritie of his fellow-Ministers then present Pinianus was ordained of the people Elder of the Church against Augustines minde and will Athanasius made Frumentius Bishop and sent him to the Indies he created Presbyters in other Churches and when he came into Egypt as many as he knew addicted to the Arian haeresie hee put them out of their place and whose Faith he tryed and approved to them he committed the Churches The Church of Cyzicena gave this honor to Atticus that without his consent it could not chuse a Bishop You will not denie but the Ministerie of the Church for the first second and third and fourth hundred yeeres after Christ was true and might be joyned withall For thus writeth a friend of yours and as it is supposed by your aide It is affirmed by the Centuries of Magdenburg that from Christs ascension unto Trajans time which is about an hundred yeers every particular Church was governed by the Bishops Elders and Deacons and describing the state of Christian Churches from Trajans reigne unto Severus that is from the yeere of Christ 100 to 195 thus they write The order of Government was popular for all Churches had equall power of teaching purely the Word of God administration of the Sacraments excommunication of hereticks and wicked persons loosing the penitent the election and ordination of Ministers and the deposition of them againe for just cause And even unto Constantines time The Primitive purity of Church Government was not yet defloured with the dregges of mans invention â—igâ—em in Apoc. 12. pag. 505. 506. Neither had Satan brought in Prelaticall pride into the sheepfold of the Lord but Pastors looked every one to the health of his owne flock And a litle after he citeth Epiphanius â— â— Ibid. pag. 90. Hierome Ambrose Cyrill Hilarie and Gregorie Nazianzene as making for him in the matter of chusing Ministers But most certaine it is within this space of time many things were done in the election and ordination of Ministers which are directly crosse to that which you require as essentiall in his calling See Iun. eccl l. 3. cap. 1. See Sâ—crat l. 4. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 21. Grâ—e 16 17. c. 35. Gr. lat 29. ca. 36. Gr. ca. 30. lat Sozom. l. 6. ca. 18.20 Evagr. p. 2. c. 8. Socr. hist 13. l. 4. c. 10.33 Theo. l. 4. c. 6. Ambr. offic l. 1. Bils Christian Sub. part 2. pag. 28 2. Sozom. l. 7. cap. 8. Socrat. hâ—st l. 5. ca. 8. Iust in Novel Inst 223. cap. 28.9 Concil Toâ—â—â—an ca. 2â— Greg. epist. lâ—b 40. ca. 78. To Constantia the Empresse The Bishop of Salona was ordered neither â— nor any responsarie witting thereof which thing was never attempted under any of the Princes your predecessors c. Yet I obeying their graces Precepts did from my heart remit unto the said Maximus this his presumption as freely as if he had been ordered by my self c. Concil tom 2. Concil Parisien can 8. if at any time you can prove that all things were observed which I doe not beleeve Ambrose himselfe was chosen Bishop when he was onely Catechumenus before he was baptized so that he was constrained to teach that which himselfe had not learned yesterday catechised to day a Bishop The Election in all things not to be approved as consonant to the rule for the Canons were strong against it and Saint Paul seemeth not willing that a novice should be a Bishop but never thought or esteemed to be none at all Of the election of Nectarius see Sozomene and Socrates Iustinian ordained If any man build a Church or house of prayer and would have Clerkes
to renounce the world the flesh and the Devill they were baptized Justine sometime an Heathen Philosopher but after a famous Martyr of Christ in his second Apologie for Christians reporteth That if any Heathen man desired to be received into the fellowship of the Church he was first r Concil Agathens ca. 25. Iudaei quoruÌ„ perfidia frequenter ad vomitum redit si ad legem catholicaÌ„ venire voluerint octo meÌ„ses inter catechumenos Ecclesiae limen introeant si pura fide no scuntur venire tum demum c. Socrat. lib. 7. hist cap. 30. Hieron ad Pammach Tert. de Baptism Tert. de praescript ca 14. in apolog ca. 47. Ruff. in symbol Math. 28.19 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Basil cont Eunom l. 3. Our Baptisme is according to the tradition of the Lord In the name of the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost catechised in the principles of Religion then hearing further the word of God as it were the Conditions of the Covenant of grace afterwards came into the face of the Congregation and confessed that he did beleeve and promised that he would obey the word of God whereupon he was baptized and received into the fellowship of the Church And that this order might be the better observed the Church appointed certain times and in some places a longer space at other times and in other places a shorter time for catechising of Heathen before they were baptized Socrates writeth that when the Burgonians desired to be initiated into the number of Christian people after they had been catechised seven dayes they were baptized the eighth Hierome saith the custome in his dayes was to catechize them fortie dayes and then to baptize them Tertullian witnesseth that there were two times in the yeare Easter and Whitsontide especially appointed by the Church for Baptisme and strangers from the Covenant were instructed in the principles of Religion all the rest of the yeare against these two times The profession at first required of all that were received to Baptisme was that they beleeved in the Father Sonne and holy Ghost The Creede is honoured of the Ancients with glorious titles as the rule of faith the Summe of faith the body of faith the perswasion of faith But by the Creede they understand the Rule of truth and law of faith and institution of Christ which was then given when he was about to ascend into heaven and commanded his Disciples saying Goe and teach all Nations Baptising them into the name of the Father Sonne and holy Ghost Regulam fidei per Baptismum accipimus Iren. lib. 1. cap. 2. Per ipsam Baptismi traditionem habemus confessionem Basil despir fanct cap. 10. Regula quidem fidei una omnino est sola immobilis irreformabilis Socrat. Hist lib. 1. ca. 5. Niceph. lib. 8. ca. 17. Hist Trip. lib. 2. ca. 9. credendi sc in unicum Deum omnipotentem mundi conditores filium ejus Jesum c. Tertul. de veland virgin The expositions of the Creede which are found in the ancient Fathers Martial Ignatius Justine Jreneus Tertullian Origen de rect fid dialog princ Novatian lib. de Trin. 3. and others of that age goe not beyond the Trinitie within which bounds the Nicene Creede is terminated as it is set downe in History Arius and Euzonius conclude their confession of faith thus Socrat. Hist lib. 2. cap. 7. lib. 1. cap. 19. Sicut Dominus noster cùm Discipules suos ad praedicandum mitteret c. This faith we received from the Gospel the Lord himselfe saying to his Disciples Goe teach all Nations c. Erasm ad censur facult Theolog. Parisien tit 11. Erasmus sheweth how the Creed was encreased by the addition of divers Articles against the heresies that did arise and though for substance it was the very same every where yet in some places it received more enlargement then in others The westerne Churches herein applyed themselves to the capacities of the meaner soâ—t more than the Easterne did using in their Baptisme that shorter forme of confession commonly called the Apostles Creed which in more ancient times was briefer also than now it is as we may easily perceive by comparing the symboll recited by Marcellus Anciranus in the profession of the faith Apud Epiphan in haeres 72. which he delivered to Pope Julius with the expositions of the Apostles Creed written by the Latine Doctors Wherein the mention of the Fathers being maker of heaven and earth the Sonnes death and descending into hell and the communion of Saints is wholly omitted The Creede which the Easterne Churches used in Baptisme was larger than this being either the same Euseb epist apud Socrat. lib 1. ca. 5. et 8. Theodor. lib. 8. ca. 12. or very little different from that which we commonly call the Nicene Creede because the greatest part of it was repeated and confirmed in the first generall councell held at Nice where the first draught thereof was presented to the Synod by Eusebius Bishop of Cesarea with this Preamble As we have received from the Bishops that were before us both at our first catechising and when we received Baptisme and as we have learned from the holy Scriptures and as we have both beleeved and taught when we entred into the Ministery and in our Bishopricke it selfe So beleeving at this present also we declare this our faith unto you To this the Nicene Fathers added a more cleare explication of the deitie of the Sonne against the Arrian Heresie wherewith the Church was troubled professing him to be begotten not made Concil Constan ap Theoder lib. 5. c. 9. and to be of one substance with the Father The second generall Councell which was assembled fifty-six yeares after at Constantinople approving this confession of the faith as most ancient and agreeable to Baptisme enlarged it somewhat in the Article that concerned the Holy Ghost especially which at that time was most oppugned by the Macedonian Heretiques Epipha in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 pag. 518. edit Gr. Cassian de incarn verb. lib. 5. And whereas the Nicene confession proceeded no further than to the beliefe which we have in the Holy Trinitie the Fathers of the Constantinople made it up by adding that which was commonly professed touching the catholique Church and the priviledges belonging thereunto Epiphanius repeating this Creede at large affirmeth it to have been delivered unto the Church by the Apostles Cassianus avoucheth as much where he urgeth this against Nestorius as the Creed anciently received in the Church of Antioch from whence he came The Romane Church after the dayes of Charles the Great added the Article of the procession of the Holy Ghost from the Sonne unto this Symboll In the s See Bellarm. li. 4. de verbo Dei c. 11. Quaedam in doctrina Christiana tam fidei quam morum sunt simpliciter omnibus necessaria ad salutem qualis est notitia articulorum Symboli
sayings in Jolm 10. And thus have the old Writers expounded the places as Iraeneus lib. 4. cap. 4 Clemens Alexan. lib. 1. Strom. Cypr. libs 1. Epist 6. 76. Didimus in Iohn 10. â—upert in Iolm 10. Theodoret ibid. and others But the present Ministeriâ— of the Ecclesiasticall Assemblies of England hath not a true vocation and calling by election approbation and ordination of the Faithfull people where they Administer Therefore none must heare or joyne in Spirituall Communion with the present Ministerie of the Ecclesiasticall Assemblies of England Which of the Propositions the Non-conformists will denie I know not but sure J am they are both theirs Howbeit it may be they doe not so well weigh their owne Principles as they should And hence it is that their practice is not so strictly answerable to their Profession and therefore doe give just occasion I speake it with griefe unto the Prelates and their Parasites to insinuate against them hypocriticall ends in condemning so grievously the Ministerie worship and government of the English Church CAN. Neces separ Epist to the Reader What better should we expect from them who seek to put out the light againe which hath been by themselves chiefly revealed unto many I know what I say and have good experience of this thing and yet to partake in the knowne evills and abuses thereof But for my part I am otherwise minded than the Bishops in this thing and doe thinke that they doe of conscience condemne the state of the Church but doe not maturely consider the responsive conclusions which follow upon their Principles For which cause I have written of purpose this Treatise to prove they cannot justifie their Tenents against that Church and stand members lawfully thereof ANSWER HANNIBAL said once saith M. Parker There was not so much as one in all the enemies campe that was called Gisco In an Epist published in the profane schis of the Brownists Parker of the Crosse part 2. c. y. §. 2. As for those of the Separation who have confuted them more than wee or who have vvritten more against them Some things of truth they hold with which we thinke it no more sinne for us now to agree than Cyprian once to agree with Novatianus in that which hee esteemed right c. So whatsoever stirre or sedition was moved by the unbeleeving Iewes it was imputed to the Iews that were Christians who were thought to be all one with them Caesar Baron Anâ—al in anno 201. The impuritie of the Gnosticks was drawne to the defamation of all other Christians no difference being made between them Cicer. Parad. 2. M Sutel tract de disc ca. 15. pag. 165. Bell of Ch. Govern cap. 12. pag. 151. 152. Bancroft tract of discip cap. 33. pag. 430. 431. 432 Laus Querim Eccles pag. 62. 63. So whereas the Egyptians were diri ventusi fa ibundi jactantes vani liberi nova um rerum cupientes the Christians and all that are there dwelling are thought to be the very same So may it truly be said now Not so much as one of the Godly Ministers that suffer in England about the Discipline that may deservedly be called a Brownist And the Nonconformists doe no more lay the grounds of Separation than the Reformed Churches sowe the seede of Libertimisme and Anabaptistrie which of all others they have most soundly confuted and judiciously laid open to the world without seeking to justifie ought that elsewhere upon good reason they condemned to be evill But it is no new thing to reproach them as the Authors of errors heresies or schismes who principally laboured the suppressing of them No man cryed downe the Errour of the Manichees concerning a good God and an evill so much as Austine and yet their opinion is charged upon them that hold his opinion of absolute Predestination The positions of the Stoicks answere to the opinions of the Remonstrants concerning Free Will and power in Man but the contrary side is burdened therewith The grounds of the Nonconformists stand directly opposite to the speciall grounds of Separation and yet they heare from some that they be Separatists in heart from others that they have laid the foundation and the Separatists build upon it and that such as have made answere to the Separatists doe against conscience put out the light which hath been by themselves chiefly revealed It is true they complaine of abuses in the Church and not to excuse humane frailty sometimes with heat and fervour excessive and humbly sue for reformation But to seek redresse of what is out of order is rather to endeavour the repaire of what is ruinous than the plucking of it down Jt is one thing dutifully to urge the proceeding of our Church unto perfection another schismatically to leave and forsake her Betwixt these two there is as much difference S. B. The rasing of the foundation c Epist to the Reader as is betweene that child that in tender affection reproveth and laboureth the reformation of his Mother whom he seeth by her indiscreet behaviour to become a reproach among women and him that under pretence of the hate of her uncomely behaviour should pluck out her bowells and forsake her They complaine of abuses remaining in the Reformation not denying that a wonderfull and gracious reformation is already made but moving to a through and perfect reformation of what is wanting and out of order For willingly they confesse that next unto the Lord God every one of them is most deeply bound unto the Kings and Princes whom he hath used as excellent instruments to deliver his Church here out of the spirituall Egypt of Poperie T.C. Repl. 1 fel. 155. This they willingly confesse before men and in their prayers daily give most humble thanks to God for And by their earnest suite and humble desires which they have for further reformation they are so farre from unthankfulnesse that they desire the heape of felicitie to the Church and Commonwealth Which of the Prophets doth not cry out against the Priests in time of the law Against their pride oppression covetousnesse tyrannie that they despised knowledge opposed the true Prophets of the Lord countenanced impietie and profanenesse and shewed themselves enemies to all goodnesse Did the Prophets then who knew what it was to worke according to their owne Principles teach a necessitie of Separation or give presidents to others to separate by their example In all ages of the Church Platina in vita Marcellin Hanc autem calamitatem quam nostri passi sunt a Deo permissam refert Euseb c. Cypr. de duplici Martyâ— Hic discrucior quod non paucos Pastores habeat ecclesia qui non solum non opponunt sua corpora adversus luporum inciersus verum etiam ipfilupos agant c. Concil Nic. 1. ca. 2. Gratian. dist 48 ca 1. Leo ad Afri an Epist. 85. Grat. dist 61. ca. 5. Hieron ad Oâ—e an ep ad Nepoti T.C.
Christum And a little after to Bellarmine objecting the dangers which may follow in popular elections hee answereth The danger is not so great ubi conjunctus est Clerus actionem dirigit Presbyterium praesertim consilio auctoritate vicinorum Episcoporum Ecclesiarum accedente And after that Et boni vicini quoque accedant ex ordine Not. 27. fratres alti ex communi officio charitatis si quando opus est prout Ambrosium fecisse Nediolanensi Ecclesiae narrat Theodor. hist lib. 4. cap. 7. In the Primitive times one Church might elect and chuse a Pastor for another and the Governours of one Church were chosen by the confent and suffrage of others Ignatius writeth thus to the Philadelphians It behoveth you as the Church of God to chuse a Bishop Of what Church would Ignatius have the Philadelphians to chuse a Bishop Not of their owne The Church of Christ was guided by the common conâ—enâ— and mutuall agreement of both parts as well East as West as a peares in the case of Athanasiu◠〈…〉 Arian Haec quidem Aegyptii ad omnes ad episcopum Romanâ—â— Iâ—l um scripsâ—â—e 〈◊〉 apol 2. Sozom l. 3. c. 7.10 11. Ignat. ad 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Theod. l. 2. ca. 4. Basil Ep. 48. 〈◊〉 Athan. â—1 occiden◠〈…〉 69. 〈◊〉 Gallis 70. Gall. et Jtal. epâ—se 74. occident ep se See 〈◊〉 〈…〉 Or to fend some sufficient legate to heale the breach that was made and quench the flame that was kindled in his Church at Antioch 〈…〉 Govern ca. 7. pa. 76. 〈…〉 13. Cyyrian meant this of such mutuall aâ—d and concord as might profit the Church and well beseem the servants of Christ but allows not that men should run to 〈◊〉 for helpe against the judgement and acts of their Pastors Cypr. 〈◊〉 Epist 3. 4. for in the beginning of his Epistle he greatly commendeth the Bishop which they had already But he exhorteth them to elect a Pastor of the Church at Antioch as the words before going doe make it evident All Bishops saith Cyprian sunt mutuae comcordiae glutine copulatae that if any one hold haeresie the rest should helpe and therefore he moved Stephanus the Pope to write to the Bishops in France that they should depose the Bishop of Arles and to the people that they should chuse another in his roome Theod. l. 5. c. 23. Cypr. l. 4. epist. 8. See Iun. Eccles l 3. c. 1 Amb epist 82. See what Socrates reporteth of the election of Chrysost Socr. hist l. 6. ca. 2. Theod. hist l. 4. c. 6 See Theod. bust l. 5. c. 8. Sozom. l. 7. c. 8. Socr. l. 6. c. 2. Iun. eccles l. 3. c. 1. Erat sanetum talis politia in Ecclesia sicut membrorum in uno corpore ubi omnia uni compatiuntur prespuiunt medentur Illitici catal test lib. 2. p. 109. Theodoret testifieth In the ordination of a Bishop All the Bishops of a Province ought to be called together Cornelius Bishop of Rome was confirmed of the Bishops of Africk Gregorius Presbyter in the life of Nazianzene affirmeth of the Bishops of Macedonia and Egypt that they contradicted the election of Nazianzene because he was made Bishop before they came Ambrose writeth That his election was confirmed of all the Bishops of the East and West and Theodoret That Valentinian the Emperor confirmed it also Election therefore was not ever made by the particular congregation where the Pastor or Teacher was to administer but other Churches and specially the Guides by common consent were called to assist the Church in that weighty businesse And this the Non-conformists judge not only lawfull but meet expedient necessary in some cases And therefore in many particulars they except against the proposition as none of theirs and against your confident assertion that you were sure the propositions were both theirs when as it is neither found in them nor in any writer ancient or moderne nor in the holy Scriptures And when you peruse the testimonies alledged Rhemists annot in Ioh. 10. §. 1. be judge your selfe whether you did not grossely mistake or abuse your Reader when you cite the Rhemists as if they pleaded for the Parochial election of a Pastour as onely lawfull As for the Assumption It is true the Ministers of the Church of England are not ordained by the particular Congregations where they administer nor is it necessarie to a true and entire calling that it should be so That they be not approved of the particular society is false in many of them for they are chosen by their consent to be their Ministers though not absolutely to the Ministerie it selfe And in case they be not so called it is a maime and defect Parker de polit Eccl l. 1. c. 14. Deducere quidem conantur illi ex majoribus nostris minores quasdam sed absurdas inconsequentes Neque enim si necessaria disciplina sit in verbo Dei tradita idcirco separatio sicubi corrumpatur sacienda sâ—atim est nulla connexionis vi hoc porisina sequitur which should be reformed whether it be through the ignorance of the people or the Lawes of the Kingdome or the pride and covetousnesse of them that thrust themselves into that calling or neglect of Patrons or what else soever But this maime doth not make a nullitie of their calling nor the Word and Sacraments dispensed by them to be ineffectuall For in every Church where the doctrine of salvation is soundly and intirely preached and professed the calling of the Ministerie is for substance true and lawfull The Nonconformists therefore in reproving the abuses of the Ministerie and yet holding communion with the Church of England in the ordinances of worship See Calvin Instit l. 4. c. 1. §. 12 13 14 15 c. doe walke according to their own Principles the doctrine and practice of the Churches of God in all ages and direction of the holy Scritures The Non-conformists reprove the tumults of the people in election without the direction of the Presbyters Whitak de pont Rom. contr 4. qu. 1. c. 2 p. 16. Iâ—a v. admissa est populi multitudo ut vitaretur omnis 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ne ecclesia esset 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ut Act. 19.32 Bilson perpet Gov. Epist to the Read Right Apostolick Bishops were such as were left or sent by the Apostles to be Pastors of the Church and Governors of the Presbyteries in every city that beleeved so long as they ruled well and in their stead as their successors to receive charge of ordaining others for the worke of the Ministerie and guiding the Keyes with the advice and consent of such as laboured with them in the Word and Doctrine Id. ca. 4. Without proofe the Church must not beleeve nor regard thy speech and proofe thou hast none One and the same person cannot be both Accusant and Deponent and in
honor him as our God if we alter that which he hath appointed for himselfe or adde any thing unto it he rejecteth all our service as done not unto him but to the conceit of our hearts which by nature is no God c. Grat. Caâ—s 11. Qu. 3. c. 101. Sats qui praeest Aug. de Conser Evang. l. 1. c. 18. Socratis sententia est Vnumquemque Deum sic coliopercere quomodose ipse colendum esse praeceperit Aug. in Qu. ex veteri Teslam Qu. 43. Constat â—â—den stultam non solum minime prodesse sed etiam obesse Chry. in Matth. hom 51. Discaâ— us Coristum ex ipsius voluntate honorare Nam qui honoratur â—o maximè honore laetatur 〈◊〉 vuit non quem nos optamus Bils dâ—ffer betw Christ Subj part 1 p. 7. Touching the Sacraments I 〈◊〉 Baptisme and the Lords Supper c. We swerve not a jot from the example of Christ and his Apostles the Scriptures vvill not lie let them be judges is fairely passed over with a brave flourish of words and nothing else If you meet with such company as will be ashamed not to see because you cry out so vehemently It is as cleere as the Sun it cannot be denied with any modest face You may lead him blindfold But if a man will build upon his owne faith and not be led by your fansies he shall never see it proved by any evidence that you have or can bring That by communicating in our Assemblies in the ordinances of Religion God is worshipped in any other way or manner than he hath prescribed But seeing this reason is brought so often and for so many purposes I will examine it more particularly If the meaning of your proposition bee That no positive worship or substantiall means of worship is lawfull but what is in speciall appointed or instituted of God and that no duties of Religion be necessary to salvation but what are taught in Scripture then we grant it is true and confirmed by the course of Scripture though many passages cited by you will not reach unto it For the law of nature commandeth all men who have any sense of a Godhead to receive and not give rules of Religion and Worship The holy care of the Patriarchs was to reverence and obey that which they had received and to attend upon further direction but of themselves not to appoint or undertake any thing as necessary to salvation Divine institution of legall and Evangelicall obedience and worship is equally full and complete in all things necessary which it seemed good to divine Wisedome to determine not leaving any thing of this nature more undetermined in time of the Gospel than it was in time of the Law As the Jews had a commandement neither to adde ought unto nor take ought from the law Deut. 4.2 which the Lord gave unto them so the Apostles received a charge to teach whatsoever the Lord commanded them Whence it is truly observed Matth. 28.20 Zanch. de Ecript that men may not teach their own doctrine but whatsoever Christ hath taught them for hee reserveth this authoritie to himselfe to be the onely Teacher and Author of the doctrine Genev. Bible annot in Matth. 28.20 Shew but one word element or action added omitted or altered in either of them c. Galv Instit l. 4. ca. 10. §. 1.2.5 Hon. Ainsw first answ p. 26. That he taught any thing as needfull for salvation without warrant from the Scriptures I denie Harm confess Helvetic confess cap. 24. Ang. confess ca. De discrim ciborum Chamier tom 4. de Sacram. l. 1. c. 13. §. 8. Bils differ betw Christ Suâ—j par 1. p. 25. This is the duty that Baptisme requireth of us to beleeve no teacher but one which is Christ to follow no stranger to regard or obey no Lord or Law-maker in the Church but only the Son whom the Father appointed to be Master Leader and Ruler of the Gentiles Basil ser de fide It is an evident sliding from the faith c. either to depart from that which is written or to receive that which is not written The King of the Church is her only Lawgiver at all times But if the way or manner of Worship be stretched to the circumstances of time place order phrase of speech and such like not determined by God in particular but left to the libertie of Christians so the generall rules of Scripture be observed then the proposition is not true the Scriptures doe not confirm it it was never acknowledged by Divines of any sort or sect that have appeared to the world For what is in generall only Divine but in particular left without determination from God that in it selfe is indifferent and variable of which sort were the houres of the morning and evening sacrifice their Synagogues Oratories and places of Worship throughout the land of Canaan their course of reading and many the like What God hath commanded in his Word that is not left to the libertie of Christians What is prescribed as necessary worship holy that he hath not left undetermined But that which may be done this way or another at this time or another in this forme of speech and method or another that in respect of this order time method or phrase of speech is not necessarie holy or worship Any circumstance as time place or whatsoever else if it be either appropriated or commanded of God it is necessarie in point of conscience holy and worship as in conscience it must be observed and submitted unto But to place necessitie holinesse or worship in these things when they be not determined or commanded is Will-worship or superstition lawfull they be as agreeable to the Word but not necessary because not determined by the Word The time was when it was lawfull to offer sacrifices upon the high places Drus ad dissic loc O at 12. p. 571. Rivet in Hos 4.13 Ainsvv annot in Levit. 17.5 Iun. annot in Levit. 17 5. in 1 Reg. 3.3 Illud in Theologia bonum est quod Deus praecepit lex enim Deiperfecta est bonitatis moralis regula in Theologia prohibitio Divina perfecturest index Theologieus mali iae mâ—ralis Hen. Ainsvv 3. ans p. 151. Explications of Gods Law by them â—â—uâ—h of his Ministers are allowed of God Neh. 8.8 These are not additions such as God forbids Gal. 3.15 15 Our question is of other or moe lavves or Doctrines than God hath taught Scotia Confess art 20. Iua thes theol c. 6. thes 11.12 Quaecunque verò in carcumslantiis posita sant corumtradiâ—iâ—nes in ecclesiâ—◠â esse auâ—â—esse posse verumtamen pat lares temporaliliberas agnoscimus Atque barum quidem traditionum quae in circumstantiis versantur sex sor Paulo 1 Cor. 14 c. Dan. in 1 Tim. 3.15 Calvin Inst 4. l. c. 15 §. 19. 17. §. 45. 〈◊〉 resp ad lib. de pii veri offic p. 413. Th Beza cansess c. 5.
If the Church of Rome were not a Church in some respects but a meere Idoll the Pope could not be that Antichrist a principall rebell a notorious traitor against Christ If we speak absolutely or compare Rome with Churches truly Christian it is no true Church but the Synagogue of Satan But if we speake of it in opposition to the Jewes of Turkes or other professed Infidels it hath so much of a visible Church as a man cannot say it is no Church at all so much true doctrine is in it as sufficeth to support the title of Antichrist and some ordinances are so administred as that it cannot be said they are meer nullities In the true Church many wicked ones are found that are no lesse prophane sacrilegious enemies to peace the vassals of Satan possessed by the Divell dead in sin and accursed of God than heretiks or schismatiks who yet for that they have that order office or degree of ministerie which is holy doe no lesse nor with lesse effect administer the holy sacraments than those who are the samplars of all pietie and vertue The faithfull and holy Ministers administer and receive the Sacraments with good profit and benefit to themselves and others The hypocriticall with benefit to others not to themselves The prophane being not put from their places doe officiate with hurt to themselves scandall to others but to the everlasting comfort of them that partake worthily The hereticall and idolatrous administer the Sacraments that are holy and in their owne nature the meanes pledges and assurances of salvation but without benefit to themselves and others that continue in sin Thus the Prophets Apostles Martyrs and faithfull have held communion in the Ordinances of grace with such whose calling and conversation was not approved of God You say the Martyrs first and last would not receive this distinction lest to save their lives they should lose their soules and you reckon up many who as you write would rather give their bodies to the fire than heare or receive the Sacrament in false Churches or Societies But in this you lavish as in every thing else and hide the truth under the ambiguitie of the phrase The Martyrs laid downe their lives rather than they would defile themselves with idolatry bee present at the Masse or joyne themselves as members of that Antichristian Synagogue in all which they did as becommeth the faithfull servants of Jesus Christ But you cannot produce one Martyr of your opinion who denyed that any thing of God was to be found in those Assemblies or that refused to joyne in the pure ordinances of God with Societies separated from spirituall Babylon because of some defect or may me in their Church constitution In the whole Catalogue of Martyrs try if you can bring forth one who in these things was of your minde And what a vaine thing is it to pretend the example of all the Martyrs when there is not one among them that doth approve your cause If the example of the Martyrs be of any weight with you as here you beare the Reader in hand CAN Neces of separation p. 190 191 192. of necessitie you must condemne your rash and presumptuous censuring your unadvised sinfull separation from the worship and ministerie in our Church as Antichristian and Idolatrous For certaine it is the Martyrs stood members of our Societies and dyed in the defence of that doctrine and worship which we professe and practise Many words you spend in answer to this reason and reproaches you cast upon your adversarie but one word is not to be found that makes directly to take away the force of the Argument It was the answer of Frederick Duke of Saxonie who being prisoner to Charles the fifth and promised releasement if hee would goe to the Masse Summum in terris Dominum agnosco Caesarem in coclis Christum The like did the Prince of Condee but neither of them did refuse to joyne with the reformed Churches because they deemed their Church constitution defective or erroneous in this or that particular To pretend the consent of popish and protestant Divines in this matter is egregious ignorance or impudency for it is well knowne they are all generally of another minde Your instance from a City or Towne Similitudes bee no syllogismes Earthly similitudes of your making may not controll the heavenly precepts of Gods owne giving Bilson Christ part 4. pag. 322. Have you no surer ground of your catholike doctrine for adoring Images than a single similitude taken from the civill and externall reverence that is yeelded to Princes seates and seales Id p. 329. if the Civill power be usurped is not to the purpose nor true in all respects Not to the purpose because what is of God in these Societies is not done by power meerely usurped but by power and vertue from God though in the ministration that which is evill be not approved of God for wheresoever any supernaturall truth of Christian Religion is taught and any ordinances of grace dispensed truly for substance there is some truth of ministery though many wayes polluted And where the intire faith is professed and received and the ordinances of grace administred truly there is a true ministery for substance ordained of God what other defects or maimes soever it may labour under Not true because in the Civill estate That which is done by power usurped and unlawfull in some cases is a nullitie but in other some it is available and stands in force For it is a rule in the Civill law That it is one thing to be a true Magistrate another to bee in the Magistracy or to execute the Magistrates office From which distinction is gathered this generall ruled case or sentence That the acts of him that was a false or unlawfull Magistrate may be lawfull and just And the same may bee said and was ever held in the Church of God of corrupt and ungodly Ministers though they bee not true Ministers that is approved fit and rightly qualified yet so long as they be in the place of Ministers the acts of their ministery be good that is effectuall and of force if they observe the forme of administration prescribed by Christ CAN Stay Sect. 15. pag 133. The Lord hath not promised to them his blessing and acceptance what the Lord may accept or will we dispute not only this I say whosoever heareth in a false Church cannot by any promise that he hath in the word of God expect Gods blessing on that which he doth the reason is because a true constitution of a true Church that is where men are gathered according to the Gospell of Christ is that only lawfull religious societie or communion of Saints wherein God will be honoured whereby hee will bee served and whereto hee hath promised his presence and acceptance so then howsoever we are not bound unto hearing in a true Church necessitate medii as if Gods grace were tyed to the meanes this way
and Idolatrous worship or else you must confesse your great words of false Church and false constitution to bear no weight or to be a meere slander If you will tel us distinctly what you mean by false Churches you shall see your whole building to fall of it self For if you understand therby every Church that labours under some disorder or corruption in gathering and constitution doctrine or discipline it is apparently false If you mean that the better part may not oft ly hid under the worser the true Church in the corrupt which may joyne in the use of Gods holy worship by his approbation and with promise of blessing then the proposition is crosse to the maine current of Scripture If by a false Church you understand that whose doctrine and worship is corrupt in the very maine grounds and essentials of faith and worship necessary to salvation your assumption hath no truth in it May you therefore be pleased here to take notice of that which you observe CAN Stay ag §. 4. p. 33 34. as a cleare difference betweene truth and falshood betweene Christs iustitutions and mens inventions Whatsoever God will have us to doe or not to doe hee layes downe the same openly Prov. 8.7 1 Timothy 4.1 precisely manifestly All the words of his mouth are plaine to him that understandeth The Spirit speaketh expresly c. that the truth is simple and plaine Ethnicks by the light of nature could sufficiently see into such things one of them touching this matter saith thus The truth is simple and plaine and needs not varietie of windlaces Another of them hath these words That phrase or form of speaking hath truth in it Cyp. Epist. ad Pomcont Epist Stepha It commeth of too much presumption and frowardnesse that a man had rather defend his owne though it be false and nought than yeeld to anothers deeds and words Resist not truth to maintain your credit God will surely revenge it Bilson differing part 1 page 69. Contigit saepe ut idem pastor sit vero pastor non sit vere postor secundum vocationeÌ„ ligitimam non vere pastor scundum administrationem operationemque ipsius Hieron ad Heliodor Non omnes Episcopi sunt episcopi attende Petrum sed Iudam considera Grat. 2. q. 7. c. Non omnes Ecclesia aliquandt visibiiis est non tantum cum defectibus multis in doctrina disciplina sacramentis administrandi ratione sed etiam cum variis impuris misturis ita ut Ecclesia sit visibilis cum tamen ecclesia ralis quaew in omnibus sequituto possimus sit invifibilis Ames Bellar enerv tom 2 lib. de Eccles which is common and used of all having in it nothing craftily devised neither cloaking some other thing than is professed Contrariwise when Satan speaketh by his instruments he speaketh so ambignously and cloakedly that one knoweth not how to take it nor which way to apply it And so you goe on in many words to the like purpose which if you will apply to your owne manner of disputing and alledging testimonies You shall discover your selfe to be the deceiver who affect ambiguous and equivocall speeches and seeke by mists and fogs of strange and unusuall arguments and sentences wrested to a contrary sense to blinde the eyes and puzzell the understanding of the simple For you hide your selfe under the termes of false â—â—â—ch false ministery false Prophets false worship flying from 〈◊〉 latry taking heed of idols c. which you have taken uâ—â—n a peculiar sense and running along in that straine you pervert the Scriptures wrong Authors consound things to be distinguished dispute sophistically and whiles you boast of cleare proofe divine precepts example and practice of forefathers from the first age of the world hitherto positions holden in all Schooles written in all books preached every day in Sermons taught in all Churches you doe only raise a dust to daisle the eye for let the matter be looked into and you have neither precept divine nor example of godly forefather to justifie your separation What you teach hath beene evermore condemned in Schooles cryed downe in Sermons disallowed in all Churches of the Saints from the very beginning to this day CAN. Stay Sec. 5. pag. 41 42. Sect. 6. pag. 86 To heare Antichr stian Ministers in their unlawfull assemblies is superstition and will-worship Therefore it is sin to doe it The first proposition is grounded upon Levit. 10.1 2. and the same is without exception The second proposition is thus proved 1. From the nature of superstition which is as Zanchie describes it a taking into the worship of God more than he requires in his worship 2 According to the Schoolemen that is superstition when divine worship is not exhibited either to the person it should be Li. 1 de cult extern oppos col 501 502 Aq. 2. 2 ae q. 92 art 1 or not in the way or manner it ought And this is held to bee a sound truth by all Orthodox Divines 3 This hearing cannot be free of superstition in regard men are present at false worship Jdem sect 5. pag. 75 Whosoever takes to himselfe a practice which is not grounded on Gods word and is strict therein hee is just overmuch and presumeth above that which is written and this is their ease who heare unlawfull Ministers for edification And a little before iâ— the same page The hearing stood for is a spirituall eating with Idolaters and men cannot receive the food without pollution And page 80 81. Herein men worship God bâ—y and in a way and meanes which Idolaters will have instituted The which presence as the learned write is a certaine communication therewith 4 It is a great superstition to approve countenance or give honour to any of the wayes of Antichrist They that are sincere christians saith Bucer cannot abide any thing that is his c. 5 It is vitious and superstitious to symbolize with idolaters The Scriptures forbidâ—t and the Saints in all ages have carefully shunned it 6 Superstition is committed when more estimation is had of a thing more dignitie and excellency placed in it and more regard had to it than God alloweth or can stand with his will ANSWER You rowle the same stone up and downe Is there any thing here for substance but what hath beene repeated oft but not prooved once You talke of superstition false worship idolatry giving honour to the wayes of Antichrist and such like great abominations But if we call for proof of these accusations you are glad to fly off and to play least in sight Superstition false worship idolatry is unlawfull that you can say and no man will deny it But that it is false worship idolatry or superstition to hold communion in our assemblies in the ordinances of grace in this if your bare word will not be received here is nothing to beare you out This reason therefore that is for the substance thereof nothing
any spirituall communion with it Truely it would make a man admire if he should understandingly compare together the writings of these two companies touching a Church ministery For in their opinious about it they are as contrary each to other as light to darkenesse Christ to Belial righteousnesse to unrighteousnesse notwithstanding though so different in judgement yea they will communicate together in one ministery but one of these against knowledge offend surely let them look well to it For to him that knoweth to doe good and doth it not to him it is sinne that is his fault is so much the more and propertionably his condemnation shall be without repentance ANSWER Instead of sound arguments wee have here your rash and unadvised censure the one of these you say against knowledge offend surely But what evidence can you bring to justifie this condemnatorie sentence or how can you reconcile your selfe unto your selfe herein CAN Necess of separat page 30. August de civ Dei lib. 5. c. 17. Nihil est loquacius vanitate quae non ideo potest quod van tas quia si volue it plus etiam clamare potest quam veretas Here you tell us the Conformists many of them at least offend not against their Conscience and formerlie you expresse your Charitie to the Non-conformists that although their practice is not strictsie answerable to their profession and therefore doe give just occasion to the Prelates to insinnate against them hypocriticall ends yet you for your part are other wise minded than the Bishops in this thing and doe thinke that they doe of Conscience condemne the state of that Church but doe not maturely consider the responsive conclusions which follow upon their principles These were your thoughts then and what should occasion this sudden change And if you will weigh what you have written of necessity you must accuse your selfe of grosse inconsideratenesse in saying you know not what and perverting mens words of all sorts or of sinne against Conscience if you write what you know to be false Considering how you deale in both your bookes throughout I scarce know an Author who hath more need to look home than your selfe It is true the Conformists and Non-conformists have written on both sides one against the other in matters of Church Government and Ceremonies and perhaps with bitternesse more than beseemeth wherein alwayes the forwardest men have not been of the greatest judgment or best moderation And therefore every thing that is written must not be interprered as the judgment of all or most of either side but as the private opinion of the pen-man which falleth out in all controversies amongst all sorts But whatsoever outcry you make of contrarieties there is no point of that weight and moment controverted betwixt them as might justly hinder communion together in the Ordinances of Religion If their contention had broken forth to such an head they might have beene answered more justly the one or both sides to offend of furie if not against conscience The Conformists you say keepe much better to their grounds than the other doe Calfeh against Mar. cap. 1. pag. 21. b. Somebuild timber and hey and stubble yet must vvee not take the hope of Gods mercy from such evill car penters as lay so rotten a covering upon so sure a building whereas othervvise they offending in tristes be sound enough in other matters and stick to Christ the only substantiall and true foundation for they consesse down right that their Ministerie is from the Church of Rome It seemeth you did neither much care nor enquire what they professe else you might have seene they say and professe in this point as the others doe The Conformists I use that word because you are pleased so to speake maintaine against the Papists that the first Bishops who laboured reformation in this kingdome did receive their ordination from Romish Bishops and had such calling as was to be found in that Church But doe they only acknowledge so much was not this evermore received for a truth in the ancient Church that ordination received from heretikes not erring in the maine fundamentall truths directly was true and effectuall Doe not all reformed Churches which have separated from the abominations of Rome professe that the first reformers amongst them received some ordinary calling in the Church of Rome which remained in that time of the visible Church corrupted For some of them were Bishops some Priests and Doctors approved of the Vniversities and ordinarie Churches many of them preached the Gospell and administred the Sacraments before excommunication or persecution raised by the Adverfaries in that they were sent unto or set over severall Churches or congregations in which they ought to execute their office or ministration therein they received commandement to preach the Gospel If men that sent them did mix anything else to their calling they must be obedient to divine institution not to humane addition So being after an ordinary manner sent of God singularly they were extraordinarily stirred up of him to promote and set forward his kingdome Rivet Cathol Orthe tract 2. q 8. s 3 Belthaz Lydias no. in disp Tabari c. 11. Whit de ecc q. 5. c. 6. Bucer Siquid boni fuit in successione vocatione ordinatione Ecclesia jum cum primos nostros doctores Deminus excitavit id totum in illis si fuisse dixerimus quid cantra obycient poâ—lificit Num exim cedo vel Judaei vel Turcae vel Barbari ac prophans homines de reformanda Ecclesia prim verba facere ac non potius viri gravissimi doctissimi que Ecclesia passoris Thus Luther Hus Wickliffe and others were called both ordinarilie and extraordinarilie an ordinary calling they received in a corrupt Church and extraordinarily they were stirred up to fulfill the Ministerie they had received according to the commandement of God and not after the traditions of men It is generally received for a truth at this day that Baptisme administred by heretikes who erre not in the maine fundamentall truths of Baptisme In the ordination of bishops it is said Interrogamus te si omnem prudentiam tuam quantum tua capax est natura divinae scripturae sensibus accommoder evolueris vis ea quae ex divinis scripturis intelligis plebem cui ordinanduses verbis docere exemplis Accipe Euangesiâ— vade praedica populo tibi commâ—sso or deny not the essentiall forme of Baptisme is true for substance And if Baptisme be true and must bee reverenced as Gods ordinance deserveth there is some truth of Ministerie amongst them They that thinke the basest of Rome will acknowledge the Baptisme administred by Priests and Jesuites to bee true for substance And if the Baptisme of God may bee received or derived from their Ministerie it is no absurditie to affirme that the first seekers of reformation derived authoritie from God to preach the Word and administer the Sacraments by their Ministerie
or by them as Stewards used of God to set them in office The differences which they put betweene Baptisme and the Ministerie are to no purpose at all to the point in hand For let them disser in what they will herein they agree that in what societie soever the truth of Baptisme is to bee found therein is some truth of Ministerie to bee found though marvellous corrupt and polluted The calling of the Pope and his adherents is earthly false and divellish as they stand in relation to him But so is not the calling of every one that was set in office by them in every respect For some things might bee of men and some things were of God For they derived their authoritie from God and not from them and therefore though the qualitie of the proper calling of Priests and Jesuites bee earthly and carnall it is not necessarie the calling that others receive by them but from God should be of the same nature qualitie or condition And though that calling amongst the Papists was whole corrupt yet not whollie because that which is instituted by God Calfeh art 4 pag. 105. Chry. This is my sacrifice to preach the Gospell my svvord is the Gospell CAN Neces of Separ p. 233. is not made void by the corruptions of men The Ministery of Priests considered in the Masse if I may so speak is corrupt and rotten as they are ordained to offer sacrifices propitratorie for the quick and dead it is the ministerie of the papall apostacie and not Christs but as they are ordained to preach the Gospell and to baptize so we cannot say their ministerie is not of Christ at all or that it is a meere nullitie If you had considered this distinction advisedly you would have beene more sparing in your censure or at least given some weighty reasons of your affirmation But it is easier to blow away an argument with big words than to untie the knot in due order Azor. instit Moral l. 2. c. 19. Ames Bell. enervat tom 2. ca. 2. de vocal minist p. 80. Sadeel deâ—egâ—â— vocat Minist pag. 64. Extraordinaritie dicitur duobus modis aut enim de iis intelligetur qui ita ab ordine vero ac legitime discedunt ut ordinem ipsum violenr c. aut extraordinarium dicitur cum amore solito eoque corrupto ita receditur ut ad verum ordinem qui interruptus fuerat redeatu Quod quidem primis nestris docto thus usa venisse agnoscimus CAN Stay sect 2 p. 51. The papists themselves teach In Episcopo haeretico manere potestatem conferendi ordines quia id facit nomine institutione authoritate Christi ideoque ab haereticis Episcopis ordinatos ad Ecclesiam redeuntes non iterum ordinari Aliqui etiam tenent hariticos Episcopos potestatem quoque jurisdictionis non amittere If the Nonconformists hold any thing extraordinarie in the calling of these prime reformers and servants of God it is not absolutely but in some respect only And the same is affirmed by Conformists also Extraordinariam dicimur quorundam ordinariorum Ministrorum vocationem eo tantum sensu quo Sacerdotes pontificii quaedam ab ipsis Jesuitis dicuntur legitimo jure extraordinario And a little after Sic eo nomine tantum vocatur quia recedit in aliqua parte ab ordine jam depravato ut possit illum restaurare Compare therefore what they have written together and you shall finde nothing which might hinder their communion in the worship of God You say the Scriptures approve not of rending away from true Churches for any corruption I use the word any because so long as we acknowledge the Church to be true whatsoever her sins are a separation from all communion with it is utterly unlawfull But whatsoever the Conformists or Nonconformists have written one against another in this point of the Ministerie they never denied the nature and essence of a true church to bee found among us and therefore cannot bee thought to offend against conscience in that they hold communion together in that which is good and of God SECT 7. CAN Stay ag Sect. 3. pag. 58. THe sinfull office of the Teacher becomes his sin who practiseth will-worship with him For hereby he enwrappeth himselfe into the guilt of his office To heare such a Minicter is to honour approve and uphold his office of Ministeris To yeeld any approbation liking or reverence unto mens institutions in the exercise of religion is sin But in hearing Antichristian Ministers d. §. 4. p. 61. there is approbation liking and reverence yeelded unto mens institution in the exercise of religion Mat. 15.9 Ps 6.4 Col. 2.20 21. De. 5.9 1 Cor. 6.17 Hos 2.16 Exod. 23.13 therefore it is sinne The Major cannot be denyed for the Scriptures teach us the very thing Besides the most judicious Writers affirme it too The Minor is as cleare For first Jt is not possible that men can come to Antichristian Churches to worship God but they must by their precence there shew reverence and honour to the publike falle state and ministerie ANSWER HEre you come over with the same text of Scripture and the same arguments whereunto answer hath beene given already But I must follow you in that path wherein you are pleased to goe before mee 1 Will-worship is unlawful both in the teacher and them that communicate with him in that worship But the preaching of the word and administration of the Sacraments in our assemblies is not will-worship but the ordinance of Christ 2 To yeeld any approbation liking or reverence unto mens institutions devised and to be exercised with opinion of holinesse Babing in Lev. 10 Calv. in loc Iun. anal in loc Piscat ibid. necessitie and worship is sinne And if this be the meaning of your proposition we confesse the Scriptures teach this very thing and judicious learned Divines affirme it And what use there is of heaping up Authors to prove that which is most willingly assented unto I cannot tell The Lord hath laid downe the way and manner of his worship and hath not left it to any creature to meddle with but according to his prescription and appointment CAN Stay § 5. p. 40. The outward worship of God must be strictly done according to his commandement A good intention there hath no place workes devised by mans fancie have not only no promise of reward for doing of them but contrariwise great threatnings and maledictions of God Q. Eliz. Injunct 3. But all institutions of men in the exercise of religion such to wit as be simply matters of order or appurtenances of worship as time place method phrase of speech stinted catechismes formes of blessing and administration of the Sacraments c. bee not of that nature neither doth every thing concerning the qualification and exercise of ministerie belong to the second Commandement So that all institutions in generall are not condemned in Scripture nor
staggerings and grosse delusions in others CAN. Necess of Separ p. 39. 48. c. Bilson Christ Subject part â— page 406. would have occasioned out-cries to raise the Countrey As for that which you alledge against ignorant idle profane Ministers it is not to the purpose for that respects not the office it selfe but the men in the office who may enter unlawfully and continue in the execution of their office The Church of Corinth had then as al other Churches now have or should have both praying preaching annexed and adjoyned to the ministration of the Lords Supper Both these yet are and ever were the meanes which God ordained to prepare us to be fit guests for that Table Bishop Iewel his Sermon on Iosh 6.1 2 3. This care must shew it selfe in removing blinde watch-men which have no knowledge who are but dumbe dogges that cannot bark c. Nonresidence and absence from their cure is a fault that would be amended CAN. Necess of Separ page 44. 45. Admonit 1. page 15. 16. Sold. Barw in the shep-heards of the Lords flocke Though they be never so able to instruct and therefore vvorthy to have roomes in the Church yet if they have not a desire to doe good c. CAN. Necess of Separ page 216. Another fault no lesse hurtfull to the Church of God is the suffering of pluralities when one taketh the profit of two or more Benefices c. when the Ministery it selfe for substance and that which is done by Ministers unlawfully executing their place is not to be condemned as a nullitie It is one thing to justifie an ignorant or idle ministerie another to make use of that which hee doth to our edification according to the Ordinance of God They are not approved of God in their ministration but what they doe administer is effectuall and God approveth that his people when they cannot remove them should make use of their Ministerie This the Non-conformists hold agreeable to their owne principles as hath been shewed at large Parsons Vicars Stipendaries Parish Priests Chapleines are but various Titles given to the same kinde of Ministerie in divers persons which is Evangelicall instituted of Christ and to be exercised and maintained in the Church untill the comming of Christ to judgment You affirm with great confidence that the Non-conformists condemn both their names and offices as wholly from that Roman Antichrist These be your words If you will know say the Non-conformists whence all these came wee can easily answer you that they came from the Pope as out of the Trojan horses belly to the destruction of Gods kingdome It is certaine that their name and office is wholly from that Roman Antichrist never instituted either by Christ or his Apostles For the Church of God never knew them neither doth any reformed Church in the world know them These are cloudes without raine trees without fruit painted Sepulchers full of dead bones fatted in all abundance of iniquity such as seeke not the Lord Iesus but their owne bellies Againe touching their Parsons Vicars Stipendaries Chapleines c. we have proved from their writings that these names and offices came wholly from the Divell and Antichrist and therefore his pleading for Baal is altogether here unusefull as to say All is one kinde of Ministerie and in this respect they are Parsons and in that respect Vicars c. For as much may a Papist say of their Parsons Vicars c. We strive not with you for names and words but about the substance of the Office and Ministery Non enim in nominibus sed in rebus sita est nostra religio ut rectè monet Gregorius Theologus in Orat. quam habuit coram 150. Episcopis in Concil secundo Constantino anno 382. Nihil apud me distat in verbo quod non distat in sensu Ambr. com in Luc. lib. 2. Every godly and learned Minister Pastor of the Church hath more interest right in respect of his office c. for as much as he hath an ordinary calling of God and function appointed in Scriptures which he exerciseth T. C. rep 1. pag. 21. It is observed by the Learned that this hath been not the least of Satans sleights in conveying Popery from step to step and point to point to keep the speech change the sense of the Learned and Ancient Fathers As the Papists deale with the Fathers so doe you with the Nonconformists and as true too If therefore he would have justified those men he should first have manifested that his Brethren have notoriously sâ—andred their ministery and so have quite taken away their reasons better by shewing better c. But we have learned to try before we trust To contend about the bare names and Titles of Parson is vain and frivolous but if we speake of their office and ministery as it is exercised by the godly learned and painefull Ministers in the Church of England for the substance thereof it is instituted of Christ acknowledged by all true Churches in the world ever since the first plantation of the Christian Church knowne by all reformed Churches at this day blessed of God abundantly and so maintained by the Non-conformists Against the Name it may bee some have taken exception and against the pride idlenesse covetousnesse c. of some much hath bin written but that the office it selfe of Parson or Vicar as they preach the Gospell of Iesus Christ or administer the Sacraments according to the Institution and watch over the flock of Christ committed to their charge that this office I say for substance should bee condemned as Anticâ—ristian by the Non-conformists is notoriously false and the contrary is apparently known unto your selfe For many of them have publikely maintained the truth of their ministery in writing others have publikely professed they acknowledge the Church and ministery to bee true and of God and diverse have exercised the functions of Vicars and Parsons in our Assemblies And whether it be probable that so many seeking for reformation would publikely condemne that office as altogether Antichristian which they exercised in the Church let your Conscience judge In that which you alledge out of the admonition to this purpose you grossely play the juggler For it speakes not of the office of Parsons and Vicars at all much lesse of them all Their words let them bee compared with that which you write in their name are these wee should be too long to tell your honours of Cathed Churches the Dens aforesaid of all lovtering lâ—bbeâ—s where M. Deane M Vice-Deane M. Canons or Prebendaries the greater Mr. Pettie Canons or Canons the lesser Mr. Chancellour of the Church M. Treasurer otherwise called Iudas the Pursebearer the chiefe Chaunter Singing men speciall favourers of Religion Squealing Choristers Organ-Players Gospellers Pistelers Pensioners Readers Vergerers c. live in great idlenesse and have their abiding If you would know whence all these came we can easily answer you that they
right Religion Else the Heretiques in England would never have received so much of it For some have avouched it to my face saith the Author of the Curtaine of Church-power that the service there is nothing to the Masse in the English others that it wants nothing but the Popes consecration These things thus retrived it was also thought that popish Kings and Princes would be the lesse offended what marvaile seeing the Jesuites themselves are so well pleased with the ceremonies and service that I heard one of them God is my witnesse herein make it his hope that the maintenance of them against the Puritans would make England the sooner returne to Rome in the rest Quâ—vadis sec 4. Mine eyes and eares saith Bishop Hall can witnesse with what approofe and applause divers of the catholique royall as they are termed entertained the new translated Liturgies of our Church Which is the lesse wonder seeing Pope Pius the fourth sending Vicentio Parpatia Cambd. An. 1560. Abbot of Saint Saviours to Queene Elizabeth offered to confirme the English Liturgie by his Authoritie if shee would yeeld to him in some other things Indeed it pleased them so well Fresh suit l. 1 203. that for the first eleven yeares of Queene Elizabeth Papists came to the English Church and service as the Lord Cooke sheweth L. Cooke de jure Regis Eccles f. 34. Syons plea. 49.91 Others of them affirme the same namely their Church-service pleaseth marveilous well the Romish Beast and his ungodly followers Witnesse the Pacification of the Devonshire-Papists in the time of King Edward the sixth when as they understood it was no other but the very Masse-booke put into English Witnesse also the assertion of Dr Carrier a dangerous seducing Papist The common-prayer-booke saith he and the Catechisme conteined in it hold no point of doctrine expresly contrary to Antiquitie that is Consider pag. 45. sect 8 9. as he explaineth himselfe the Romish-service onely hath not enough in it And for the doctrine of predestination Sacraments grace free-will and sin c. The new Catechismes and Sermons of the Puritan-preachers run wholly against the common-prayer and Catechisme therein conteined c. Motiv Preface to the Answ And thereupon he comforteth himselfe upon the hope of the supply of the rest To this effect speaketh Bristow and Harding If these things be right why not the rest It shall not be amisse to marke one occurrence in Queene Elizabeths time who being interdicted by the Popes Bull Secretary Walsingham tryed a tricke of State-policy to reverse the same He caused two of the Popes Intelligencers at the Popes appointment to be brought as it were in secret into England to whom he appointed a guide being a State Intelligencer who should shew them in Canterbury and London service solemnly sung and said with all their pomp and procession Which order the popish Intelligencers seeing and so much admiring they wondred that their Master would be so unadvised as to interdict a Prince or State whose service and ceremonies so symbolized with his owne So returning it the Pope they shewed him his oversight affirming that they saw no service ceremonies or Church-order's in England but they might have very well beene performed in Rome whereupon the Bull was presently called in That which you alledge against the English-Service-booke in particular Answer you intend against all set-formes of prayer or stinted Liturgies whatsoever For the use of them is a false devised idolatrous antichristian worship in your account Thus you know your Brethren of the Separation have disallowed all set and stinted formes Johnson Ainsworth Robinson Greenewood c. as humane inventions forbidden in the second Commandement Images Will-worship Idol-prayers False-worship Lip-labour c. And you your selfe insist upon this principle of the Nonconformists as the cause of Separation from the Church of England that all formes of worship not prescribed of God are will-worship which if it maketh against one holdeth against all prescribed Liturgies Can. Neces of Separat pag. 114. Id. pag. 115. Againe you confesse that every Church is not to be forsaken or left which hath something in it by participation idolatrous And therefore our Service is not devised worship because it is taken out of the Masse-booke as you alledge but simply because it is devised whencesoever it had its originall if it be devised worship First therefore we must consider the matter in generall Oylsâ—hil speaking of Images brought into the Church saith Wee might justly condemn the whole faithlesse fond invention For it was but a will-worship a naughtie service having no ground of the Word of God and onely spring of errour Calf Preface to the Reader testifieth Bilson Christ subject part 2. p. 297. That Princes may prescribe what faith they list what service of God they please what forme of administration of the Sacraments they thinke best is no part of our thought or point of our doctrine yet that Princes may by their lawes prescribe the right faith to bee preached the right service of God in spirit and truth to be used c. T. C. repl 1. pag. 8. Park of the Crosse par 1. ca. 4. sect 7. pag. 177. A. W. ans to late popish Artic. p. 73. and then try what is alledged against our booke of Common-prayer These words Formes of worship may be taken two wayes First to note the substantiall parts or meanes of worship and in this sense it is most true That all formes of worship not prescribed of God are unlawfull and false worship because devised by men Secondly To note a bare order methode or phrase wherein divine Service is performed And in this sense the Nonconformists never said That all formes of worship not prescribed are false or devised worship For they know that no forme is determined and prescribed of God precisely in all parts of his worship and where none is set apart by his Majestie it is a breach of his Commandement and devised worship to place an opinion of worship in the simple order or phrase of speech used in prayer or administration of holy things The Nonconformists condemne not a Liturgie or stinted forme of prayer but desire that all things therein might be ordered as doth tend most to edification Whatsoever exceptions they have taken against our Booke of Common-prayer they never disliked the use of it so far as they judged it sound and good They doe not condemne it wholly but finde fault with it as in some points disagreeing with the word of God What hath beene their seeking from time to time a razing of the Communion Booke No but a purging and filing of it after the patterne of that care which former examples set us The Booke of Common-prayer they condemne not as a wicked and ungodly Booke much lesse the Service as false devised and idolatrous but they have and doe use the booke and professe their readinesse so to doe onely they desire to
be excused in some things which they judge to be amisse In the admonition presented to the Parliament An. 1570. thus they professe We have at all â—imes born with that which we have could not amend in this Booke and have used the same in our Ministry so farre forth as we might reverencing those times and those persons in which and by whom it was first authorised Though therefore they write Admonit 1. pag. 9. Park of the Crosse part 1. ca. 3. sect 6. pag. 135. that it was taken out of that Popish dunghill the portius and vile Masse-booke that the Papists sucke no little advantage out of our Commumon-Booke which they terme an English translation out of the Masse-booke and out of the difficulty whereby it came in Parsons of the 3. conversions of England pag. 2. many Protestants themselves adjudging that the stable of popish superstition was not throughly purged out of it that Bristow draws the likenesse of our Service-booke to the countenancing of their Masse-booke Brist motiv 34. Rhem. in Iohn 20. sect 5. And the Rhemists the absolution of the sicke prescribed in our Communion-booke to an approbation of their absolution Auricular confession and Sacrament of pennance Howsoever they disallow the service as it is practised in visitations and injoyned in the late Canons which denieth libertie not onely to omit a ceremony but also to adde alter Park of the Crosse par 2. ca. 5. sect 11. pag. 19. or omit any one word of the whole Liturgie when we affirme the words of the Lords prayer and the forme in Baptisme and the Supper may be altered without fault Though in these things they take exception against the Booke and the manner of urging it yet they never disliked the use of it altogether much lesse condemned it as a false devised and idolatrous worship Their profession and practice from time to time both before and since the Controversies were moved about the Booke speake plainly in this matter Can. Neces of Separat pag. 125. Judge then your selfe whether it be not a notorious calumny in you to write That our stinted service devised by the Bishop and translated from the Masse is affirmed by our owne Writers to be a false and forged worship and that it is even so I appeale to many of your consciences For why doe you loath to use the same in your Families but because you know it is not the incense made by fire from the Altar of the Lord. Is it a small thing thus to slander and reproach the servants of Christ contrary to their writings professions and practices and your owne Conscience And what a vaine surmise is this that because they forbeare to use it in their houses therefore in conscience they know it to be strange incense As if many things might not be forborne which in themselves are lawfull In reading the Scriptures a Christian may use one translation when he doth not condemne others as abhomination I may presume in private you make not use of the Lords prayer and so of some others and yet you would not that another should fit in your conscience and judge that you know it is not the incense made by fire from the Altar of the Lord Or if you be so presumptuous sober and well advised men will admit no such conclusions But here you must remember againe that no methode order or phrase of speech in prayer left undetermined of God can truely be called or esteemed the incense made by fire Prayer it selfe and not the phrase of speech whether devised by another or by our selves is resembled thereby But the whole forme you say of the English-Church-service-Book is borrowed out of the Masse-Book picked and culled out of the Dunghill as the Nonconformists write You adde That not onely the forme but the matter also was taken out of the Masse-Booke It is true the Nonconformists say it was in great part picked and culled out of the Masse-booke but it followeth not thence that either it is or was esteemed by them a devised or false worship for many things conteined in the Masse-booke it selfe are good and holy A Pearle may be found upon a Dunghill we cannot more credit the man of sinne than to say that every thing in the Masse-booke is devilish and Antichristian For then it should be Antichristian to pray unto God in the mediation of Jesus Christ to read the Scriptures to professe many fundamentall divine truths necessary to salvation If any have misliked the Booke because it hath too much likelihood to the Masse-booke that hath not beene the judgement of the Nonconformists alone others have said and written as much who never yet condemned the use of the Booke or all things therein conteined Popery is a scab or leprosie which cleaveth unto the Church It standeth mostly in erroneous faultie grosse and abhominable superstructions upon the true foundation whereby they poyson or overthrow the foundation it selfe But take away the superstructions and the foundation remaineth remove the leprosie and the man is sound Many supernaturall divine truths of God are mixed in the Popish Synagogue as pure gold with much drosse or earth which the refiner is to purge and separate but not to cast away Our service was picked and culled out of the Masse-booke you say and so it might and yet be free from 〈…〉 and tincture from all shew and appearance of evill though the Masse-booke it selfe was fraught with all manner of abhominations For if Antichrist fit in the Temple of God and professe himselfe the servant of Jesus Christ of necessitie some treasures riches and jewels of the Church must be gathered into his den which being collected purged and refined might serve to adorne the chaste spouse of Christ Neither in so doing doth the Church honour Antichrist but challenge her owne right If shee retaine ought that belongeth to Antichrist that is her staine and blemish but the recovery of that which Christ the King and Bridegroome of his Church hath given as her wealth or ornament must not be imputed a fault Christs Religion is not so needie or unperfect of it selfe so needy and beggarly that it must borrow Embring dayes of the Heathen Altars of the Pope William Salisbur in his Battery of the Popes Batter An. 1550. or Vestments of the Jewes But as the Church is plentifully furnished by Christ and needeth supply from none other so it is her part to retaine what is freely and graciously vouchsafed of him If it be wholly taken out of the Masse-booke Bilson Christ Subject part 4. p. 490. Eating and drinking are not essentiall parts of the Sacrament but of the Supper they are or of the Lords institution For Christs institutioÌ„ conteineth as well the use as the matter or forme that must be used A Supper is not onely the meat provided but also the act of eating that which is provided And so the Lords institution implyeth the use and action as well as
negligence unjust usurpation or the like The right of government in Christs name belongeth unto them because it flowes from the ordinance and constitution of Christ as a proper adjunct which cannot be separated from the subject But the action it selfe of government may be n A disput part 3. c. 8. p. 189. When we teach that the Pastour or Pastours of every particular Church or congregation with the Elders of the same being met together have power to bind and loose we understand this onely of such places wherein a competent number of understanding and qualified men may be had to make up an Eldership hindred divers wayes when the being of the Church is not destroyed The Pastours and Teachers may be ignorant of their priviledges and so give away that which of right belongeth unto them or they may be negligent in the execution of their office and not heedfully attend to the Ministery committed unto them The greater part may prevaile against the better or some few may usurpe into their owne hands the power which belongeth unto the Societie which being once gained cannot easily be regained or redeemed in which cases the lawfull action of government is hindred when yet the Church remaineth the true Church of Christ Thus it hath been with the o Ambros in 1 Cor. cap. 5. The Apostle decreed that by the consent and in the presence of all men hee should be cast out of the Church c. Church of God in all ages ever since there was a Church upon the face of the earth And from this fountaine have sprung the errors abuses and corruptions which have prevailed in the Church of God For if p Hieron ad Heâ—iodor in Id. ad Reparium advers Vigilantium disorders get head of necessitie the action of government is some way hindred or neglected Now to your Assumption First Every particular q August contr eâ— Parm. lib. 3. c. 2. Societie of beleevers in the Church of England or singular Pastour of this or that Congregation hath not the power of government neither doth it of right or by divine gift belong unto the communitie of the faithfull or one singular Pastour Secondly The power of Government as it consisteth in discerning betwixt the precious and the vile admonishing the inordinate and excommunicating the obstinate is considered either in respect of the substance parts and duties thereof or in respect of the ordering and administration by such persons and in such a course This distinction must be granted or else all the Churches which administer discipline amisse in any circumstance at any time must be charged to have no discipline at all and they that commit the administration of discipline to persons in mens opinion not designed by Christ not to have the discipline of Christ for substance For example they that commit the execution of discipline to the Presbytery or Classis have not the discipline of Christ in the judgement of the Separation because Christ as they say hath committed it to the communitie or body of the Societie And they that commit the power of government to the r Chrysost in Math. Hom. 83. No small vengeance hangeth over your heads if you suffer any hainous offender to be partaker of this Table people or communitie joyntly with the Elders in the judgement of reformed Churches have not the discipline of Christ because he hath committed it to the Presbytery And every act of government may be excepted against as a nullity because in some circumstance or other the order prescribed by Christ is not fully observed This then considered the Church of England is not without the s If any Prince would be baptized or approach to the Lords Table with manifest shew of unbeliefe or irrepentance the Minister is bouÌ„d freely to speak and rather to lay downe his life at the Princes feet then to let the King of Kings be provoked the mysteries defiled his own soule and the Princes endangered for lacke of often and earnest admonition discipline of Christ for substance whether the word be taken largely or strictly whether we respect right or execution but the outward forme and ordering of the discipline is not in all things according to the Word of God Iâ— by divine right the power of government belongeth either to the societie of Church-governours or the communitie of the faithfull it belongeth also to the Pastours Teachers Elders Assemblies among us As for the execution of discipline largely taken all men know the Word is truely preached and the Sacraments are duely and rightly t Bilson Christian subj part 2. p. 302. If you meane they may not minister the Sacraments unto Princes without faith repentance which God requireth of men that shall be baptized or have accesse to his Table we grant they must rather hazzard their lives than baptize Princes which beleeve not or distribute the Lords mysteries to them that repent not Bilson Christ subj part 3 p. 2. part 3. p. 248. If the Prince will not submit himselfe to the rules and precepts of Christ but wilfully maintaine heresie open impurity the Bishops are without flattery to reprove and admonish the Prince of the danger that is imminent from God and if he persist they must cease to communicate with him in divine prayer and mysteries Bils Ch. sub part 3. pag. 63 64. 74. administred and in what societie soever God is truely worshipped of necessitie the discipline of Christ is in some sort observed If we speake of discipline more strictly all men know the Church of England by doctrine professeth by Law hath established and daily practiseth for substance the execution of the very discipline of Christ The ordering and administration of the censures as it is in the Church of England is faultie and corrupt and how the godly have laboured according to their places the redresse of that evill is not unknowne to the world in part But the want of due execution of discipline or disordered administration thereof doth not argue the Church to want discipline but the due ordering of discipline nor to be no Church but to be defective and much out of order In the Church of the Jewes in the old u Jer. 20.1.2 3. 29.26 27 Mat. 10.17 Iude v. 4.7.8.10 Testament there was many times great neglect of discipline and abuse thereof In the Churches of the New Testament as in Corinth Galatia the Churches to which James and Jude wrote and Rome the execution of discipline could not take place or was much neglected Diotrephes usurped over the Church and corrupted the discipline when the Church continued the true Church of Christ and the faithfull abode in that societie This instance Dr Ames truely alledged to shew that the reprovers of abuses doe not lay the foundation of schisme or separation from the Church which x Can. Neces of Separat pag. 163. you doe well to spurne at because you know not how to remove it For
Arian infection both in the reignes of Constantius and Julian the Apostata Athanas Graecolar tom 1. pag. 309. edit Comelit Theodor. hist l. 4. c. 3. Pelagius a Britaine by birth troubled the Churches with his pestilent Doctrine denying the grace of God attributing power and libertie to man to live without sinne and keepe the Commandements if he would This Heresie arose about the yeare 405. or 406. and the Author thereof drew his first breath in Britaine Prudent 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Trim. 13. speaking of Cyprian saith Gallos fovet imbuit Britannos praesidet Hisperiae Christum serit ultimis Hiberis Vsser de prim Eccles Britan. ca. 16. pag. 787. but he sowed not this hereticall doctrine in Britaine And though it must be confessed That these Churches were not altogether free from that infection yet at first it was opposed and after it was banished by the blessing of God About the yeare 420. flourished Fastidius of whom Gennedius in his catalogue of Ecclesiasticall Writers saith Fastidius Bishop of the Britaines wrote to Fatalis one booke of Christian life and another of keeping Widdow-hood in sound doctrine and according to the truth of God And John Trithemius Fastidius Bishop of the Britaines was a man learned in the holy Scriptures and an excellent Preacher of the word of God famous in life and conversation in speech and wit notable Prosper contra collater cap. 41. Vsser de prim pag. 319 320 323 324. He wrote some devout little works c. And by the vigilancy and care of Lopis and Germanus Antisiodorensis the Britaines were delivered from the contagion which had begun to infect the Churches After this the face of things was miserable in that Kingdome by reason of the invasion of the g Repellūt nos barbari ad mare repellit mare ad barbaros Inter haec duo genera funerū aut jugulamur autmergimur Bed hist eccl l. 1. cap. 14. Bilson The true difference betweene Christians Par. 1. pa. 56. That this Land was infected with Arianisme Pelagianisme as many other places then were I find it reported in the story of Beda Eccl. his gent. Angl. l. 1. c. 8. lib. 1. cap. 17. And the Bishops of France our neighbours upon request made unto them by the Britaines sent Germanus and Lupus two French Bishops chosen in a Synod by the generall liking to convert this realm from Pelagius errour which also they did with great celeritie barbarous enemy the terrible famine the direfull contagion of the Pelagian and Arian heresies and the loosenesse negligence drunkennesse contentions and other vices of the Clergie The Christian Religion thus corrupted was restored againe by the second comming of Germannus but after that grievously oppressed by the comming in of the Anglo-Saxons who could not yet so extinguish the truth of God but it did revive spread and grow though sometimes more pure sometimes more corrupt and sometimes with greater sometimes with lesse freedome But to come to the last reformation which was made of Religion in this Land and it was not the conversion of England from infidelitie to the profession of the Gospell but the restoring of it from a corrupt state or profession to a more pure from Christianitie polluted to Christianitie unpolluted Christians they were who inhabited this Land baptized into the true faith of Jesus Christ but Christians defiled with manifold superstitions led aside into manifold errors which errors and superstitions removed they become sound and true Christians indeed The true h Chaloner Credo S 2. part sect 2 It will soone appeare that the Ch◠of Rome for a thousand yeares after our Saviour professed no other faith nor published any other beliefe in points fundamentall either negative or affirmative than we doe c. After a thousand and some few yeares more were expired Transubstantiation and Adoration of the Host with other dregs of Antichrist being established though we cannot say that the Church of Rome was from thence forth absolutely our Church yet we may boldly say that our church was from that time untill Luther both within the Romane Church and without it Church lay hid in Popery as a little oare in a great lump of drosse not refined not purified not coyned but true gold for substance yea that very same for substance which being purified and stamped is currant coyne When the invocation of Saints worshipping of Images the Latine Service and fabulous Legends the sacrifice of the Masse and adoration of the Sacrament with such like abhominations were taken away and in the roome thereof the true worship of one true God in the mediation of Jesus Christ and the right administration of the Sacraments and the reading of the holy Scriptures in a knowne tongue established when the omnipotency of the Pope is abandoned with all corrupt superstitions which did undermine the foundation it selfe and in stead thereof the intire faith of the Lord Jesus in all points necessary to salvation taught professed and received then is the Church refined and separated from that drosse To bring Infidells from the state of infidelitie to the faith it is necessary that instruction goe before either by reading exhortation preaching or report of Christian faith for faith commeth by hearing But where men professe Christianitie abuses may be reformed by the Edict of the Magigrate without such particular instruction going before as in the former case is requisite Many times * Jo. 2.19 heresie departeth from the Church or Heretickes goe out from the Church and sometimes the Church is compelled to goe out from heresie the heresie still remaining * Revel 18.4 Come out of her my people saith the Lord the godly then departing from Babylon according to Gods commandement gathering themselves into Christian societies the religious Magistrate by his Edict or Proclamation going before them are the true churches of Christ The i Raynold orat epist ad fratrem Non semper heresis exit ab ecclesia aliquando manet heresis ecclesia exire cogitur Papacy was not the church but the church lay hid in the Papacy untill the time of separation which being made according to Gods commandement by the authoritie of the Lords Vicegerent the church which was before k August epist 48. ad Vincent Donatist Ecclesia est quae aliquando obscuratur tanquam obnubilatur multitudine scandalorum obscured doth now shine forth Thus our Divines doe soundly and truely answer to the Papists demanding where our Church was before Luther That it was where now it is but unrefined unstamped that it lay l Beza epist 1. ad Duditium et si Papatun non sit Ecclesia voluit Deus in Papatu servare ecclesiam hid among them for the time as some fit stones for the building under a great heap of rubbish and that we have not erected a new Church but repaired and restored a ruinous m See Dr. Feild of the Church lib. 3. c.
c. Is any thing here spoken peculiar to the members of the Church at the first planting thereof which doth not hold true of the members of the Church established and confirmed Are not the wicked at all times forbidden to meddle with the ordinances of God uncapable of the covenant spiritually dead not fit to have place in the house of God And if this hold true against such members of the Church at all times why doe you beare the Reader in hand That you onely plead against the first building of a Church of such wiâ—â—ed and ungodly persons * Can. Neces of Separat pag. 194 195. The Question you say hath ever been about the true and naturall members whereof Gods Church is orderly gathered and planted and not about the degenerate and decayed estate thereof But if any of these Reasons will conclude ought there was never societie to be esteemed the true church of God all whose members were not Saints and holy spiritually enlived fit to performe the duties of members fitted prepared and laid orderly in the building married to the Lord Christ What you hold that is not materiall in this point but what your Arguments conclude for if they inferre one thing and you maintaine another of necessitie they are weake or you are crosse to your selfe or both * Can. Neces of Separat pag. 195. If they shall say thus you write that obstinate and incorrigible sinners may lawfully be suffered therein This we affirme to be untrue But if they say that in a true visible Church there may be great evills committed you and along time tolerated we assent unto it Howbeit it is certaine as Dr. Ames faith This forbearance is a grievous sinne before God Of the lawfull toleration of obstinate and incorrigible persons we have no controversie with you But if any one reason here be brought by you to the purpose it cannot be the true Church of God where any one obstinate knowne offender is suffered or which hath not right to the holy things of God That the members of the Church ought to walke in holinesse you need not prove but that the Congregation cannot be the true Church of God where such things are suffered as ought not to be And yet your Reasons goe higher than so For if they be duely examined whether doe they speake of such as be truly holy or onely visibly holy Saints and faithfull in the fight of God or onely in the eyes and approbation of men Onely the Saints are capable of the Covenant spiritually alive unto God married unto Jesus Christ and have communion with him onely they are hewen fitly prepared and layd truely upon the spirituall foundation onely their service is accepted of God in Jesus Christ It is nothing here to answer the members of the Church are such in the judgement of charitie For in the degenerate state the Church doth not ever consist of such as you confesse and your reasons here speake of them that be such indeed in the judgement of truth quickned by the Spirit acceptable to God Saints by Covenant the living members of Jesus Christ and so heires of salvation And if we looke into this matter more narrowly the conclusion fighteth with the premisses and doth manifestly overturne what you would build Psal 50.16 Moller in Psal 50.16 The wicked are expresly forbidden to meddle with the Covenant But those wicked ones to whom the Lord speaketh at that time more visible members of the true Church The wicked make the Church of God you say a Synagogue of Satan Sodome c. And doth not the Prophet call them Princes of Sodome Isa 1.10 and people of Gomorrah who were the people of God by covenant members of the true Church Doe they provoke God to spew them out of his mouth or to remove his Candlesticke But untill he remove his Candlesticke or spew them out of his mouth they continue his Church and people Ezek. 16.45 46 47 c. Rebellious Judah justified her Sisters Sodome and Samaria and yet shee continued the Church of God when they were cast off A tree unhewen and unprepared is unfit matter for an house and so are tares blasted corne and dry eares to grow together in the field with good corne as wheat c. But the house ceaseth not to be an house though a piece of timber unprepared be put into it or the corne field to be a field of corne because the tares are suffered to abide untill the harvest A dead man cannot perform the office of a living member but instrumentally he may doe the office of a member or he may be an instrument which the head is pleased to use for the good of the body otherwise no hypocrite who is spiritually dead could be any means of good unto the societie No wicked man is spiritually married unto Christ nor hypocrite but hypocrites and wicked men may be members of the societie which in respect of externall covenant is married unto Christ or else the Church of the Jewes was not beloved of him The godly and wicked are lead by different causes and so are hypocrites and sincere Christians but they may be linked together in the same outward societie Hypocrites you confesse are members of the Church untill they be dissevered and cast out But the upright and the double-hearted are contraries lead by different causes and so uncapable of the same forme to use your phrases SECT IV. FOr this we have the judgement of the learned also Can. Neces of Separat pag. 178. In Psal 15. There must be saith Mollerus a profession of true Religion and obedience yeelded thereto at least outwardly to become a member of the visible Church Beza saith Anno. in Act. 2.40 He is rightly joyned to the Church which separates himselfe from the wicked Paul calls the Romanes Saints saith Aretius to put a difference betweene their former estate wherein they lived In Rom. 1.7 Vol. thes theolog pag. 256. which was unholy and impure and the condition to which they were now called Piscator affirmes the matter of a particular Church to be a company of Beleevers c. ANSVVER YOu may easily bring heapes of testimonies for that which these Authors affirme For I suppose there is not Marke what care S. Augustine will have observed how when discipline should bee used August contr Parmenian lib. 3. ca. 2. If contagion of sin have invaded a multitude the mercifull severitie of correction from God himselfe is necessary Nam concilia separationis inania sunt perniciosa atque sacrilega c. nor ever was godly orthodox Divine of another judgement But that which they say and you maintaine are incompatible Their Assertion is taught in Scripture professed by the godly learned in all ages and is most evident to right reason illuminated by faith But that which you contend for is neither taught in Scripture nor confirmed by reason or professed by godly and learned Authors
with the triumphant church And not by all sorts as in outward societie and profession are linked together who yet are not excluded from the societie in respect of profession nor denied to be members of the Church in their kinde or in a sort such as are called onely by externall vocation are members in their kinde of that company called or externally selected but not true members of the Church militant nor militant members of the Church catholique whereof Christ is the head And thus the church is a company of faithfull people sincere upright walking with God which is mixed with hypocrites and wicked livers not as living members of Jesus Christ but as members in a sort of the visible societie as members in the church by outward profession but not of the true militant church SECT V. BEfore I end this point Neces of Separat p. 179 180 181. Babel no Bethel pag. 108. Chall ca. 1. pag 33 34. I will here lay downe some few Syllogismes intirely made up between the Inconformists and Conformists all concluding the forenamed position That Church which hath not a lawfull Ministery is not a true visible Church But the Church of England hath not a true lawfull Ministery Ergo The Church of England is not a true visible Church The proposition is affirmed of the Conformists Sutcl Chal. pa. 40. and answ to the except pag. 65. as Burton Sutcliffe The Assumption is granted by the Nonconformists as we have in the first chapter largely shewed The true visible Church of Christ is a societie of beleeving and faithfull people and a communion of Saints so say the Conformists But the Church of England is not a societie of beleeving and faithfull people a communion of Saints thus write the Nonconformists see page 169. Ergo the Church of England is not the true visible Church The true Church is the Kings daughter described in Psalme 45. But the Church of England is not the Kings daughter so described Therefore the Church of England is not the true Church of Christ Burton answer to Hicholia pag. 100. The proposition is laid downe by the Conformists whereby they prove Rome a false Church The Assumption is the Nonconformists For if they say the truth their members have not those qualities belonging to the Kings daughter neither the Priest nor people See pag. 15.16 39.137 â—â— 69.170 The true Church of Christ is the flocke of Christ 〈◊〉 the Church of England is not the true flock of Christ therefore the Church of England is not the true Church of Christ. The proposition say the Conformists is undeniable BurtoÌ„ in the same Booke pag. 99. Song 1.6 7 Act 20.28 Joh 10.16 Theâ—e Assumption is proved by the Nonconformists Principles compared with Joh. 10.3 4.27 Christs flocke heare his voice and live it and follow it But the Church of England submitting to aâ— unlawfull Minisstery worship and discipline heare not Christs voice nor know nor acknowledge nor follow it but the voyce of Antichrist The Church of God doth keepe the doctrine of the Apostles and Prophets without addition alteration or corruption thus the Conformists Sutcl Chal. cap. 1. pag. 6. arg 9. But the Church of England keepes not the doctrine of the Apostles and Prophets without addition alteration and corruption say the Nonconformists Sec pag 108 Ergo shee is not the Church of God No societie can be tearmed Gods Church which retaineth not Gods true worship this the Conformists But the Church of England doth not retaire Gods true worship say the Nonconformists See pag. 78 to the 213. Ergo The same Booke pag. 13. arg 19. shee cannot be tearmed Gods church The true Church consisteth not of fierce Lyons Wolves Tigres and such like wilde and fierce beasts But of Sheepe and Lambes which learne of Christ and are meeke humble gentle c. So say the Conformists But the English Church doth consist of Lyons Id. pag. 27. arg 〈◊〉 Wolves Tigres and such like wilde and fierce beast's and not of Sheepe and Lambes which learne of Christ and are meeke humble and gentle c. Thus the Nonconformists see pag. 31. c. 145.169 Therefore it is not the true Church Here the Reader seeth cleerely how the Conformists Majors and the Nonconformists Minors make up intire Syllogismes of Separation And how they will be able to loose these knots I know not except by revoking utterly their own grounds which if either of them doe yet I doubt not but we shall be well enough able to maintaine them against men ANSVVER YOu please your selfe with the same Song which here we have over againe and againe tuned with the same art But that which you talke of the Conformists Majors and the Inconformists Minors your slanders set aside is idle and toyish For in that matter there is no difference betwixt the Conformists and the Inconsormists The Conformists Majors as they are truely meant the Inconformists doe assent unto And the abuse of ignorance idlenesse prophanenesse both of Ministers people whereof the Nonconformists complaine the Conformists doe acknowledge and bewaile And your selfe a little after in a matter of the same nature affirme that herein you say no more than what in effect is fully acknowledged Can. Neces of Separat pag. 193. by the Nonconformists Conformists the Church of England the learned generally and all the reformed Churches upon earth and for proofe you quote the same Authors you here all edge And why then doe you trifle thus with the Conformists Major and Inconformists Minor Did the sound of those words please you so well But let the Majors and Minors be whose they will no intire or perfect Syllogismes of Separatisme can be made up of them but such as ignorance in not understanding or an evill conscience in perverting or falsifying their sayings doth conclude They may well stand to their grounds and unloose those knots and if they understand their owne principles they cannot but untie them But how you can free your selfe from the guilt of an evill conscience unlesse you recant what you have written repent of your Separation and acknowledg the wrong you have done to the Nonconformists by misreporting perverting and falsifying their principles as you call them I leave to your serious consideration and the reexamination of what you have done For the right understanding of the Conformists propositions Iâ— speake in your phrase against the Church of Rome we must note That the Romanists hold the Church of Rome to be the catholique Church of Christ here on earth under the Pope the Head in which sense their propositions are to be understood For the true catholique militant Church is a faithfull people a communion of Saints the flocke of Christ that heareth his voyce keepeth the doctrine of the Prophets and Apostles without addition or alteration and worshippeth God truly according to his will And there is truly and properly no member of the militant Church catholique which doth not
and in this you doe not pretend the Nonconformists principles as you did in the former The exceptions also which you take against them are not in respect of gifts learning or diligence nor that they are brought into the Church by Antichrist but chiefly in respect of the office and Ministery it selfe That which you object concerning the name that it is new as you doe before against Parsons Vicars and Curates that they are Popish is too slight to be insisted upon For these and divers other names or titles given to the Preachers of the Word doe not note different Ministeries for substance and kinde but different accidents whereby the Ministers are distinguished and sometimes the employment whereabout they are principally exercised But the Ministery which is exercised under those names is for substance one and the same which Christ hath appointed and set his Church If any man hath not been able to answer this Question when it hath been propounded what kinde of Ministery the Lecturers have taken up it was from his weaknesse not from the difficultie of the matter And this is no marvaile seeing many Questions seeme Riddles to you which very easily untie themselves or be knit in conceit onely As to the Papists many Questions touching the certaintie of our Religion the calling of our Ministers the continuance of the faith seeming indissoluble which a true hearted Christian can quickly dissolve But you write upon certaine knowledge that some have ingenuously confessed that unlesse they be Evangelists they could not see how their Ministery doth accord with any Ministery mentioned in the New Testament I am not so diffident as to distrust every word that is spoken nor must I be so simple as to beleeve every thing In the quoting of mens words in writing and giving the sense of them I finde you trip so often ignorantly or upon set purpose and so many times to quote that as making for you which is as direct against you as can be spoken that without breach of charitie I may suspect some such thing in this particular either that you mistooke their meaning or misrelate their words or set downe your owne consequence for their position or the like Instances of your mistaking enough hath beene formerly mentioned in this very place there be two of no small note nor hard to be disproved First you say The Nonconformists condemne the calling of Parsons and Vicars their office you meane as false and Antichristian But their practice and profession both doth evidence the contrary to the whole world as hath beene shewed And if you will mistake their writings so palpably and againe and againe affirme them from their writings what is not there to be found but is direct contrary to their judgement writing and practice how can we beleeve that you truely report their words Secondly you say The Reformists doe utterly condemne this extraordinary office of Preachers Lecturers you understand by extraordinary Preachers but extraordinary they are not either in respect of their calling or the worke wherein they are imployed And the Nonconformists are so farre from condemning that office that it is well knowne many if not the greatest part of them had none other calling or office in the Church And I presume every reasonable man will conceive it an unlikely thing that so many godly and learned men suffering many and great troubles against other abuses should choose to live in such a calling against the light of their conscience Can. Neces of â—parat pag. 〈◊〉 210. 2â—3 If Dr. And 〈◊〉 not boasted of 〈◊〉 mans booke c. Id. pag. 224 This is the booke which Mr. Paget upbraids us with Arr. against Separat pag. 38. And you know some have maintained whose judgement therein and workes are approved by others of the same ranke That the Ministery of godly Preachers and so of Lecturers in the Church of England in all substantiall and essentiall parts is that very Ministery which Christ hath instituted and ordained in the New Testament and which he hath blessed for the gathering and building forward of his Church in faith and holinesse It is not then the common judgement of the Reformists nor the private opinion of any particular man of that minde that I have seene or heard of that the office or calling of a Lecturer is utterly to be condemned Who the Author is or what the worke which you quote entituled The Necessitie of Discipline I know not nor what he saith Perhaps you alledge him as you have done others wrongfully It may be he speakes of some circumstances not of the substance of the calling If he goe any further it is his private conceit and must not be imputed to the Reformists as you stile them We neede not here dispute of the difference betwixt the Pastour and the Teacher nor to enquire whether of these they are to be esteemed untill the difference betwixt them be exactly defined and substantially proved If for substance of Ministery they doe the worke of the Lord Jesus and by his approbation this sufficeth First then here it is to be noted that the Officers of the Church are not so distinguished by heir speciall limits and bounds but the superiour may doe the office of the rest if necessitie require As if the societie be small meet Officers cannot be had or be wanting for a time or taken away by death The Pastour may supply the roome of the Teacher Elder or Deacon that is he may teach watch over the manners of the people and take speciall care of the poore as the Apostles did for a time Secondly If the Pastour be aged weake sickly unable to beare the burden of his charge alone he may take unto him with consent of the societie and colledge Ecclesiasticall Assisters or Helpers Videl in Ignat ad Mariam exercit 3. Vt tam praesentes in urbe sublevarentur quam ut absentibus ipsis Ecclesiae pastoribus destituta non esset delegerunt scil Apostoli sibi coadjutores Quod nominatim ex Epiphanio heres Sozom. hist lib. 2. cap. 19. Euseb lib. 6. ca. 10. Gr. 27. apparet Tales fuerunt hi tres Clemens Linus Cletus Aut ut noster Author ait Anacletus So Maximus helped Macarius untill his death and Augustine Valerius And if the Pastour be carelesse or negligent it is lawfull for the people to provide for themselves by the best meanes that they can or God is pleased to afford unto them that they might be taught and instructed in the wayes of holinesse Thirdly Pastours are to feede the flocke committed unto their care yet so as many Pastours may be set over one flock which they must feede in common And to this purpose some write A dispute par 3. cap. 8. pag. 170. that the Apostolique and Primitive times knew neither Parishionall nor Diocesan Churches but Christians lived then in Cities onely not in Villages because of the persecution Act. 20.27 28. Phil. 1.1 1 Thes 5.12 Act.
13.2 15.2 Col. 4.11 Iames 5.14 Epiphan haeres 27. Ignat. ad Tralleus Sozom. li. 4. ca. 14. Euseb hist lib. 6. cap. 10 11. Gr. ca. 9. lat Gratian. Decret part 2. cap 7. qu. 1. can 12. And it is to be remembred that in Rome Corinth Ephesus Philippi Colosse Thessalonica and such other Cities inhabited by Christians there were more Pastours than one which did in common governe all the Churches within that Citie and there was not any one Pastour who by himselfe governed a certaine part of the Citie peculiarly assigned to his charge Thus also the Ancients write that Peter and Paul were the first Bishops and Apostles at Rome Paul had Linus and Timothy Peter Clemens and Anacletus Liberius and Felix both governed the Apostolicall Seat Valerius and Augustine Narcissus and Alexander in the Church of Hippo. It is apparent the Apostles ordained many Overseers in one societie and it is not repugnant either to Scripture or reason to thinke there might be many Pastours of one flocke And the flocke might be one under the joynt care of many Shepheards Bilson perpet Gover ca. 10. pa. 155. Every church with them had many Prophets Pastours and Teachers the number and neede of the people and time so requiring T. C. repl l. pa. 34. though they did not ordinarily meete together in one place For to assemble together in one place is meerely accidentall to the unitie of a societie Certaine it is in times of persecution they cannot so meete and it is most probable in the Apostles times many Churches were too populous in that manner to assemble together Those that know the state of France in time of persecution doe well understand that every Church almost was gathered of Townes whereof some were six miles some seven some more from the place of meeting and keeping their Congregations And therefore could not meete so often nor know one another so well as we by the grace of God may doe Fourthly No one Pastour or Teacher hath the power of the censures belonging unto him and whether the power of dispensing the Seales belong to every Minister of the Gospell I leave it to your consideration for I know not what you will resolve but the actuall dispensation of the Seales may be forborne by some to whom the right of dispencing doth appertaine specially when there be others at hand to doe that office The Apostles had power to baptize 1 Cor. 1.14 15 16. Can. Neces of Separat pag. 236. but we may well thinke they did not ordinarily baptize themselves It is possible you say a man may be a true Ecclesiasticall Officer and yet never doe the services thereof Fifthly The Minister of the Gospell is not made absolutely a Minister by the choice or election of this or that people but onely their Minister for the time of his abode and continuance with them Lay these things together and then your exceptions against the office of Lecturers will vanish For if they have not the chiefe charge or cure of soules they be not sole Pastours or Teachers of the flocke but joyned in care or charge with others as Helpers or Assistants or chosen by the people to supply the want of such as should but doe not feed the flocke If they dispence not the Seales neither is that necessary in respect of their standing for right and power from Christ they have to dispence them but in the execution of that power they may be hindred or forbeare it for a time If they leave their place being lawfully called to another flocke it may be with consent of the societie and of the Church and what then doth make it unlawfull or if the charge should be unlawfull it doth not make the Ministery strange or new which is the thing in question SECT II. THat Ministery which is instituted and set up besides those which God hath appointed in his Word Neces of Separat pag. 51 52. is unlawfull and false But the Ministery of Lecturers in England is instituted and set beside these which God hath appointed in his Word Therefore that Ministery is unlawfull and false The proposition is plaine and undeniable and we have their owne words to confirme it For thus they say All the Ministery is by the Word of God and not left to the will of man to devise at their pleasure as appeareth by that which is noted of John where the Pharisees comming to him after that he had denied to be either Christ or Elias or another Prophet conclude if he be neither Christ nor Elias nor of the Prophets why baptizest thou Which had been no good argument if John might have been of other function than of those which were ordinary in the Church T. C. repl 1. pa. 62 63. and instituted of God c. Againe to devise another Ministery than that which God hath appointed is condemned by the second Commandement The Assumption is thus proved First if their Lecturers have taken ordination from the Bishops and exercise by that power onely then is their office false by the reasons before laid downe Secondly If it be objected that they never received the Prelates orders or have repented thereof I answer This proves not that they are therefore true Ministers For as Jehu though he did well to suppresse Ahabs idolatrie yet in that he followed the wayes of Jeroboam he himselfe continued still a grosse Idolater Even so howsoever some may privately report that they stand Ministers by no relation to the Bishops yet are they notwithstanding unlawfull Ministers seeing they were never elected chosen ordained according to Gods Word If any reply that they have their calling of the people I answer the thing is surely otherwise as shall be manifested presently But if this were granted yet I deny that any Church under heaven hath power from Christ to ordaine such a kinde of Ministery and therefore if any people should doe it seeing it is against the Scripture it must needs follow that it is an unlawfull Ministery and so consequently not to be communicated with ANSVVER YOu are strangely taken with this note for you have brought nothing but a bare repetition of what you have said over and over If you speake of the substantiall and essentiall parts of the Ministery it is freely granted that the true Ministery is by the word of God and heavenly But if you extend it to every circumstantiall order whereby in this or that Societie the Minister is to execute the function he hath received of God it is not approved But of this you need not to have made so many words To your assumption answer hath been returned already First That the Ministers of the Gospell receive their office and authoritie neither from the Bishop Patron people or Colledge Ecclesiasticall but from Christ immediately whose servants they are in whose name they minister whose flocke they attend and who hath assigned them their worke And if you receive your Ministery from the people as
the ordinary way and meanes Id. Sect. 15. p. 132. which the Scripture speakes of to beget men to the faith For as a false forged constitution makes a Church a reall and substantiall Idoll So all that comes from it is touched with the Idolatry of that constitution This is a ruled opinion of many Divines The State makes all the publike actions to be formally good or evill For as the Temple sanctifieth the gold Matth. 23.17 the Altar the offerings so the Ordinances of the Church under the Gospell are sanctified unto us Bucer in Mat. 23.17 That is as Bucer truely speaketh in the use of them made lawfull to us in that they have their rise from a true and right power Seeing therefore the Church in Question wants a right Constitution it must follow that all spirituall actions done in it whether Prayer Preaching Sacraments Censures as they are there done are none of Gods Ordinances though true it is in themselves they are of God If the false Churches of whom we disputed CAN. Stay Sect. 15. p. 131.132 Id. Sect. 2. p. 8. be that spirituall Babylon mentioned in the Revelation cap. 18.4 then it is unlawfull for Gods people to goe unto them to performe any spirituall or religious action and so consequently not to heare theâ—e But the first is true Ergo the later is true also The proposition needs no proofe because our opposites and we herein are of opinion alike The assumption is manifest by these reasons Artopaeus in Rev. 18. pag. 198. Flac. Illyric in Rev. 18.4 Par. com in Hos 4. pag. 506. Bulling in Apoc. ca. 18. con 76. 1. The words in the Text prove it plainely Come out of her my people that is remove your selves from all false assemblies covenant together to walk in all the wayes of God serve the Lord among your selves in spirit and truth and returne not from whence you are come But repent rather that yee have suffered your Consciences to bee wrought upon by any unlawfull Officers And thus doe the Learned interpret the place namely of such a coming out as that we may not be bodily present at any of their worship 2 Cor. 6.1 Ioh. 5.21 Zech. 11.17 Botlac prompt allegoriar cap. 21. de Minist It is like that filthy bird which carryeth this Motto Contactu omnia saedat The publisher and others with him have comitted appatant Idolatry maintained it in the Church and sought thereby to pervert the right wayes of the Lord. Jd. sect 1. p. 7. Id sect 15. p. 133. A false Church state is rightly likened to the leprosie spread in the wals of the houses of the Lepers because of the pollution which it causeth to the persons and things Take for instance a Citie or Towne if the civill State or Corporation which they have be usurped aevised or derived from a false power all their publike administrations are unlawfull and every one partaking thereof offendeth So all administrations done in a false Church whether prayer Preaching Sacraments Censures are uncleane actions and doe defile every receiver J say because of the Idoll State which is devised out of a mans braine and used as a meanes to serve God in it and by it All the Ordinances done after the invention and will of Antichrist can no otherwise be judged than a brood common to the nature of the breeders that is the Devill and the Whore of Rome the Father and Mother that did beget them ANSWER THe Faithfull are commanded to come out of spirituall Babylon and not to communicate with her in false worship or Idolatry Revel 18.4 as the Text doth confirme and your opposites grant And therein it was needlesse to muster up the testimonies of the Learned to give evidence in a case maintained and practised notoriously sc that we must flye from the society of Rome and not be present to behold their worship Your labour herein is superfluous but that the Names of Learned men here numbred up might serve to cover your nakednesse when you come to the point in controversie wherein you prove just nothing at all But our Churches wherein the Gospell of Christ is purely preached and professed in all points fundamentall the seales of the Covenant of Grace rightly administred who are separaced from spirituall Babylon in mind and body and have fled from her worship and Idolatry who are built upon Christ the true and firme foundation of his Church and by Christ himselfe acknowledged for his people and graced with his favourable presence Our Churches I say cannot be deemed or reputed spirituall Babylon without great injurie to Christ his truth his Church and Saints By spirituall Babylon in this booke of the Revelation is meant Rome Christian departed from the faith guilty of the blood of Saints stained with manyfold and fearfull Idolatries the mother of fornications who hath made drunke the Kings of the earth with the cup of her poysons as might bee confirmed by the Scripture it self the joynt consent of learned orthodox Divines and the testimonie of Papists themselves But to brand the Churches of Christ since the reformation who have renounced Antichrists doctrine worship and idolatries and embraced the intire faith of the Lord Jesus with that odious hatefull name is contrary to the truth of God evident reason and the judgement of all approved godly learned men You miserably corrupt and pervert the Text when you give this to be the sense thereof Remove your selves from all false Assemblies covenant together to walke in all the wayes of God serve the Lord among your selves in spirit and truth and returne not from whence you are come This is not to interpret Scripture and learne of them what wee are to thinke but to racke Scriptures to our sense and make them speake according to our fansies which is an high point of Antichristianisme If you will stand to your principles within two hundred yeares after Christ or lesse there was not one true Christian societie in the whole world which did walke together in all the wayes of God and serve God in a Church state among themselves And will you say the faithfull are charged of God in this passage of holy writ to remove and separate from all Christian assemblies that then were in the world and to serve God among themselves If corruption in doctrine manners worship government and orders make a false assembly Rome was a false assembly long before the Lord gave commandement to his people to depart thence and separate themselves Israel for a time continued in Egypt and Babylon viz. untill the Lord sent to bring them forth and the Church lay hid in Babylon and that by the providence and approbation of God long after Rome was miserably corrupted and defiled The matter is notorious and therefore to spend more words about it is needlesse Hee that considereth the state of things long before the faithfull separated from Rome and what is written in defence of that separation which
the reformed Churches have made cannot be ignorant thereof If to come out of Babylon then had beene to remove from all false assemblies as you glosse it it was necessarie the commandement had beene given much sooner or the faithfull should have departed without leave or commandement from God I might say to you in your owne words CAN Stay §. 15 pag. 135 This is to gratifie the errour of Montanus who professed that he knew more than the Apostles For the Apostles knew nothing of our removing from all false assemblies as you understand it and covenauting together to walke in all Gods wayes and serve God among themselves If this had beene knowne to John when hee foretold the Apostasie from the faith and the rising of the great Whore he would have made more haste to warne the faithfull to bee gone out of the Churches and to have withdrawn themselvs it being a matter of such weight and importance and so needfull to be done divers hundred years before it was ever once thought upon When the words of a Text are plaine a gree with the circumstances of the place the analogie of faith and other Scriptures for men then to leave the native sense and to force a sense contrary to that the letter expresseth it is to wrest the Scriptures as you say and not to expound them by the true rules and Canons of Divinitie CAN Stay § 15 p 135. Rev. 18.2 3. Exite ab ea pâ—puâ—â— mâ— At agit angelus de Babylone mylica de synagaga nempe Romana quae ipsa fidei Evangelit sundamenta corrasit Park de polit Ecâ—â— l. 1. c. 14. Lay this rule to the present interpretation which you make of this passage in Scripture and whomsoever you accuse you shall finde your self to be a perverter of Scripture in degree farre above him For your interpretation is contrary to the scope and drift of the place the rules of faith and consent of other Scriptures It speakes not of leaving all administrations in false Churches as you speake oâ— false administrations and false Churches but of separation from spirituall Babylon which was the habitation of Divels and cage of every uncleane spirit and of every uncleane and hatefull bird which cannot bee said of all administrations which you are pleased to accuse as false If it may be spare your words and let us heare your reasons for if they be ought they will carry more weight A devised constitution you say is an Idoll Whitak de pontif Rom. cont 4. qu 2. p. 146. Si semel ea consuetudo aut lex obtinuerit in Theologia ut liberum sit cuivis distinctiones comminisci nihil in omni religione certum fixumque remanebiâ— Quis enim non eo modo quid vis labefactare poterit Eaplorandae ergo distinctiones dil genlius â judic ndae sunt eaque magni facienda est regula nullas in in Theologia probandas esse distinctiones nisi quae aperâ—is Scripturarum locâ—s nitantur and all that comes from it is tainted with the idolatry of that constitution You will say it is a false Church constitution if the Minister bee not chosen and ordained by the congregation alone where he is to administer if a man be received into the societie who is not a visible Saint if any idle ignorant carelesse scandalons corrupt usurping Minister be chosen ordained or suffered if any notorious or scandalous person bee admitted to the ordinances if any stinted Liturgie or forme of Catechising administration or prayer be used with sundry the like which in your esteem are arguments of false constitutions Churches Ministerie and Worship Now tell us plainly is every such Church-constitution an Idoll and that which is done in these Societies unholy and uncleane If so then there was never any one age wherein the Church-constitution was not an Idoll and the worship of God performed in that Societie leprous uncleane poysoned with Idolatry The Temple sanctified the Gold and the Altar the offering but the Temple and Altar are not types and figures of externall Church-constitution Where doe you read this in the Law or the Prophets c. And if you read it not how dare you affirme it Besides Lev. 16.20 Num. 7 10. 1 Reg. 8.63 the sanctification of the oblations depended upon one Temple and Altar therein yet so as both Temple and Altar were sanctified by the offering But if we may speake as you doe A devised constitution is twofold 1 Absolute and in every respect when neither Doctrine Ordinances office or persons are of God and this constitution is altogether false a nullitie an Idoll if you please so to call it 2 In part corrupt maimed defective but having something of God and that which is done in such a constitution is not false a nullitie tainted with the idolatry of the constitution This distinction is neither devised strange nor new but that which hath ever more beene acknowledged in the Church of God and is manifest in Scripture if wee take the word devised constitution as this Author doth For Heretikes and Schismatikes though they be not of the speciall number of them that hold the intire profession of divine truth in unitie and in that respect be a false constitution yet as they professe the truth of God revealed in Christ though maimedly or in part only and as they administer the ordinances or Sacraments of God that which they doe is not a meere nullitie Heresie is Idolatry and cannot beare children to God in that it is heresie but heretikes * See D. Feild of the Church l. 1. c. 14. Aug. de Bapt. cont Donat. l. 1. c. 10 See Chamier panst tom 2. l. 16 c. 4. Hieron ad Algasiam Antichristus sedebit in templo Dei vel Hie osolymis ut quidam putant vel in Ecclesiâ— ut verius arbitiamur 2 Thes 2.3 Whitak de poâ—â— Rom. cont 4. q. 5. p. 681. Licet Ecclesia papistica non sit vera ecclesia retinet tamea aliquas pâ—aerogativas reliquias ecclesiae Dei ergo diâ—i potest aliquo modo templâ— Dei misore prophanatum plus quam seâ—uiuâ—tiâ—â—m pene dirutum alque eversum c Habet illa eâ—clesia Scripturas eâ—sicerrupâ—as pâ—erisâ—ue ignotas tamen aliqui allas legunt intelligent hinc doctâ—â—â—am salutarem hauriuâ— Fst apud illos quoddam minisâ—eâ—ium aliqua verbi prad catio quae valet sine dubio nonnâ—llisad saluteÌ„ est ibi baptismus quoad substantiam c. Calv. instit 4. c. 2. par 11 CAN Stay §. 15. p. 136. §. 7 p 93. may beare children to God in that they professe and practice that which Christians should and doe both professe and practise and have received that degree order office Ministery and calling which is holy by vertue whereof they doo administer the holy things of God The Church of Rome is a false constitution but baptisme administred in that Church is not idolatry nor a meere nullitie
long agoe Another in the booke which you pretend to answer and in these very pages He most shamefully and lewdly as a man void of all common honestie and grace maketh the Ministers of Lincoln to affirme that the Prelates are reviled to be great Antichrists and their Ministerie and constitution to be great troublers of the Church at this day and that it cannot but be very sinfull and hurtfull to retaine or communicate with them CAN Stay §. 3. p. 59.69 Raiâ—old de ideloâ—l 2. c. 1. §. 2. Bilson Christ subj part 3. pag. 269. The Divell himselfe can shew no greater malice than to pervert that which is well spoken and to force a lewd senes of his owne or another mans words The Divell himselfe would have beene ashamed in this open manner to have told such a lie and therefore he is to be trusted no further than he is seen This you passe over in silence and if the substance of the accusation bee applyed unto your selfe I know not what apologie you can make Christ saith Rainolds as you quote him the Pastor of his Church doth tell us that he feeds not in Antichristian assemblies in the denne of theeves neither is it his will that his flock should there rest at noone But in the pleasant pasture by the still waters that is in the shadowes of the true Christian Churches detesting Idolatry But D. Rainolds words are not in caetibus papisticis speluncis idolâ—latrarum c. but in untbraculis orthodoxorumcatuum Whether this change of Antichristian Assemblies for popish Assemblies and true Christian Churches for Orthodox Assemblies CAN Stay § 3. p 22. D. 〈◊〉 by words and Letters testimoniall 2â—4 wâ— made in simplicitie be judge your selfe You might easily conjecture your credulous reader might conceit our assemblies to be Antichristian and not true Churches but popish Assemblies and not Orthodox he could not imagine them to be You alledge D. Amos saying It cannot be a true Church that wants order For by this the parts and members thereof are knit together But this is not to bee found in the place mentioned But D. Aines moving the question whether it be lawfull to stick to that Church from whom power of removing scandals and purging out the ungodly is taken away He answereth That power â—jure quoad actum primum cannot be separated from the true Church because immediately and necessarily it floweth from the essence it selfe for it is contained in that covenant whereby the faithfull are gathered into a Church The use of this power cannot be taken away without the great sin of them that take it away and the hainous injurie of them from whom it is taken Neither ought the Church to rest in this that she seeth her selfe unjustly oppressed of others For it belongeth to the office of the Church to defend that libertie where with she is endowed of Christ But yet if the faithfull contending for their libertie cannot obtaine their right in that part nor without grievous inconveniences come to a more free Church and can keepe themselves from the approbation of evill and doe also studie as much as in them lieth to supply that want they sinne not if they joyne themselves to such a Church or continue in it Thus D. Ames cleane contrary to that which you make him affirme Master Baines as you alledge him writes CAN Stay sect 2. p. 55. Bain diocesan That no people can worship God in repairing to any Church or ministery without warrant of the Word Let the Reader note it say you And if it be wisely noted it makes nothing against partaking in our assemblies in the ordinances of Grace because that is warranted approved commanded of God in his holy Word But Master Baines words are No people can worship God in repairing to this place and ministerie without warrant of his Word And he speakes of a Diocesan worship and ministerie peculiarly appropriated to that place as it was at Hierusalem which is nothing to your purpose You pretend that you have taken your principles out of the Nonconformists ever the chiefest of them which for learning CAN Neces of separ To the Read zeale judgement holinesse of life c. have ever held that cause But some things brought in their names is neither the opinion of all nor of the most nor of the best learned nor of many but either the private opinion of some one or the conceit of such indeed as were separated from the communion of the Church of England and not from the abuses only which were in the Church You cite Master Penry saying CAN stay sect 3. p. 57. M. Penry of the Ministerie of the Church of Engl. p. 37.38 CAN Neces of separ p. 16 28.43 Exhortation to the government of Wales 42 46 26 CAN Neces of separation Epist to the Reader CAN Neces of separ p. 252. It is most certaine Satan rules in the consciences of men not only by false doctrine but also by his false power and ordinances his kingdome of darknesse not only consisteth in the lies false doctrin and worship which he hath coined but also in the false and Antichristian ordinances which he hath invented for the ruling of his idolatrous denne And therefore the children and Saints of God ought to avoid both the one and the other But whatsoever his meaning bee in that or other passages cited Master Penry was not a Nonconformist but a Separatist by your owne confession and therefore his sayings are not to bee received for the Nonconformists principles Master Br. saith It is lawfull to communicate in that worship where the ceremonies are used but wee cannot believe him say you for his brethren both affirme and prove the contrary And here now is a fit place to write down the words wherof mention was made in p. 99. partly because the author is a principle Nonconformist and partly to discover the rashnesse and folly of this inconsiderate man which durst without any reason more than boldnesse still justifie the very thing which his brethren by many sound arguments have manifested to be evill and unlawfull and then you goe on to rehearse the words of the author of a dispute upon communicating at confused communions pag. 68.69 Who that Author is I know not the booke I have not seen but by the words which you relate it appeares hee was no English Nonconformist neither doth he speake of communicating in our English societies And if he did he speakes but his private opinion and not what is the judgement of Nonconformists It may be questioned whether Master Br. booke was not penned and published before hee could either see or thinke of the other But whatsoever is to be thought in that particular M. Br. knew it to bee the common practice and uniforme judgment of all Nonconformists in England both heretofore and at that present when he wrote that it is lawfull A dispute against Engl. part 1. ca. 9. sect 3.
p 32. The practice of the greatest part of the reformed Churches in observing holy dayes cannot commend them in the Church of Scotland 1 Because shee did spue them out wiâ—h so great detestation that shee is more bound to abhorre them than other Churches which did not the like I may wel apply that to them which Caivin saith of the ceremonies of some to Valentinus Pacaeus Vt concedam faetidas illas sordes quibus purgatae fuerunt Ecclesiae vestrae in rebus med is posse censeri carum tamen restitutio erit res media CAN Stay sect 5. p 75.76 and in some cases necessarie to receive the Sacrament with them that kneel in our assemblies And now consider to whom the imputation of folly boldnesse inconsideratenesse and if you will falshood is justly to be attributed To these particulars I will adde one more whereby we may learne what we are to expect and looke for at your hands I think to make known unto thee thus you write what hapned about seven years past in England There was a Gentleman of Warwickshire by name M. Edward Greswold a man very religious as many besides my selfe can testifie Hee and I being bosome friends or to use his owne common saying our hearts being as Davids and Ionathans knit together upon just cause we both left the parish assemblies He afterward by the meanes of some craftie men was perswaded unto hearing againe upon this he fell into great trouble of Spirit and could have no feeling assurance of any peace with God remaining thus a while at length he sent a letter by his servant unto me the which I have kept a long time by me in this letter he largely acknowledgeth his offence and among other passages writes thus Ah you are happy but I by my fall am miserable and wretched and for the present time I feele my soule to be no otherwise than if I were in Hell c. ever since I went to their assemblies I have observed the Lords hand against me c. Wherefore I beseech you by the mercies of God set a day apart for me and seeke the Lord by fasting and praying that the water-flood overflow me not c. what his refreshings were after this I cannot say the report is that to his changing he had sad and sorrowfull dayes notwithstanding I am confident that his soule is with Christ in paradise As I am writing this I thinke of the words of the Prophet My flesh trembleth for feare of thee and I am afraid of thy judgements He that is wise will consider of these things For as one saith providing before is better than repenting afterward Psal 119 120. Hal. Antiq. Rom. lib. 11 It is no marvaile that false Churches by some are called officina scelerum carnificina sanctorum shops of wickednesse and shambles of the Saints for what can a tender conscience expect in frequenting them but indeed pricks racks and tortures This is your Relation and the use you make thereof But if you know not how it fared with this distressed Gentleman thus it was He shut up himselfe and his children in his house and would come at no man nor suffer any man to come at him lest hee should communicate with them in their sin Sustenance for himselfe and his Children was brought unto them and put in at some hole or window but hee suffered no man to come in to minister unto them no not when his children and he himselfe lay sick in great misery When by order his house was broken open for the Justices of peace in consideration of his case were constrained thereunto two of his children were found dead in the house and one had lyen so long unburied that the body was corrupted and did annoy the roome The Gentleman himselfe sick on his bed in wofull plight His Bible he had gone thorough and cut out the contents titles and every thing but the very Text it selfe This I have received from credible hands and it is a matter known through that countrie where he lived And if you marke it wisely you may see the originall of his sorrow and heavinesse was not from the hearing of the Word in our assemblies but from your principles which he had too deeply drunk in and out of a desire to keepe and observe made himselfe desolate It is very likely he thought with himselfe that if by hearing the doctring of grace hee did communicate with men in their sins much more was guilt contracted by civill conversings And if you will try it in right reason I cannot see how that consequence from your principles can be avoided Now he desirous to stick to what he had learned and not to delude himself with vaine distinctions as too many of the separation doe fel first into deepe perplexitie and then at last came unto that desperate conclusion to shut up himselfe and his children It is one of your principles That all humane devices whatsoever in the worship of God are idolatrous and therefore conceiving the contents of the Chapters and titles of the bookes to be of men hee cut them out And further it is likely he would have gone if his thoughts had reached further in this matter It was your great sinne to perswade him to separation and it is your great sinne now to impute the cause of his sorrow distresse and anguish to his hearing the Word in our societies when as it was the naturall fruit of his rash and sinfull separation or of those positions whereupon his separation was builded wherein if he was not first instructed he had been built up by you Let false Churches be shops of wickednesse and the shambles of the Saints In our societies the doctrine of faith and pietie is soundly and purely taught our adversaries being judges a thousand thousands can testifie by experience what oule-ravishing comforts and sweet communion with God may be had therein When you wrote these things you had just cause to take shame and sorrow that you had brought a poore soule thus into the snare of your seducements but to take occasion thereby to encourage others harden your selfe in an evill way and to revile and slander the heritage of the Lord is an argument of how great perversnesse You are confident he is with Christ in paradise and I will not goe about to lessen your confidence therein But if you may bee confident of him may not we be confident of the Martyrs who dyed cheerefully for the testimonie of the Lord Jesus being professed members of our societies Infallible knowledge of anothers salvation we challenge not but what you can pronounce confidently of one we may with equall or greater confidence pronounce of many who laid downe their lives for the truth of God And therefore the reason drawne from the practice of the Martyrs professing against Antichrist who lived and dyed members of our Societies and are received into glory to prove that our societies are not Antichristian idolatrous