Selected quad for the lemma: church_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
church_n	militant_a	saint_n	triumphant_a	2,884	5	10.8885	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A33770	Theophilus and Philodoxus, or, Several conferences between two friends the one a true son of the Church of England, the other faln off to the Church of Rome, concerning 1. praier in an unknown tongue, 2. the half communion, 3. the worshipping of images, 4. the invocation of saints / by Gilbert Coles.	Coles, Gilbert, 1617-1676.	1674 (1674)	Wing C5085; ESTC R27900	233,018	224

persecutor_n much_o more_o for_o mercy_n and_o favour_n unto_o their_o friend_n and_o brethren_n for_o they_o be_v more_o inflame_v with_o charity_n then_o with_o a_o eager_a thirst_n after_o revenge_n theoph._n i_o perceive_v most_o of_o the_o argument_n be_v probable_a diduction_n from_o analogy_n and_o proportion_n but_o we_o expect_v divine_a authority_n to_o establish_v such_o a_o principle_n part_n of_o worship_n which_o you_o make_v the_o invocation_n of_o saint_n phil._n we_o be_v not_o yet_o arrive_v at_o that_o point_n but_o prepare_v the_o way_n unto_o it_o show_v the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n do_v understand_v our_o affair_n and_o pray_v for_o we_o and_o with_o your_o patience_n i_o will_v give_v other_o text_n to_o prove_v it_o theoph._n more_o pertinent_a i_o beseech_v you_o phil._n that_o passage_n of_o s_o t_o peter_n be_v full_a to_o the_o point_n 2_o d_o of_o pet._n 1._o 15._o i_o will_v endeavour_v after_o my_o decease_n that_o you_o may_v be_v able_a to_o have_v these_o thing_n always_o in_o remembrance_n where_o the_o apostle_n show_v that_o after_o his_o departure_n he_o will_v endeavour_v for_o they_o theoph._n this_o feat_n argument_n be_v bellarmine_n and_o not_o s_n t_o peter_n he_o have_v change_v the_o order_n of_o the_o word_n and_o so_o by_o consequence_n their_o meaning_n the_o original_a text_n manifest_v how_o the_o word_n shall_v be_v read_v not_o as_o you_o transport_v they_o i_o will_v endeavour_v after_o my_o decease_n that_o you_o may_v be_v able_a to_o keep_v in_o remembrance_n etc._n etc._n but_o thus_o etc._n thus_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d etc._n etc._n i_o will_v endeavour_v that_o every_o one_o of_o you_o may_v be_v able_a after_o my_o decease_n to_o have_v those_o thing_n always_o in_o remembrance_n and_o this_o endeavour_n he_o do_v use_v in_o the_o day_n of_o his_o flesh_n in_o preach_v the_o gospel_n until_o his_o death_n and_o leave_v these_o epistle_n as_o remembrancer_n bellarmine_n indeed_o have_v the_o confidence_n to_o add_v to_o the_o text_n his_o paraphrase_n that_o it_o may_v serve_v his_o turn_n obitum_fw-la turn_n dabo_fw-la operam_fw-la habere_fw-la vos_fw-la commendatos_fw-la sive_fw-la in_o animo_fw-la post_fw-la obitum_fw-la i_o will_v endeavour_v to_o have_v you_o recommend_v or_o in_o mind_n after_o my_o death_n and_o yet_o it_o be_v observable_a how_o he_o conclude_v this_o text_n after_o all_o his_o patch_v argumentum_fw-la patch_v quam_fw-la vis_fw-la non_fw-la sit_fw-la evidens_fw-la est_fw-la tamen_fw-la probabile_fw-la argumentum_fw-la to_o be_v no_o evident_a but_o a_o probable_a argument_n whereas_o as_o he_o have_v shape_v it_o it_o be_v clear_a and_o demonstrative_a to_o his_o purpose_n but_o his_o conscience_n check_v he_o for_o his_o addition_n and_o transmutation_n and_o so_o he_o will_v not_o lay_v any_o great_a stress_n upon_o it_o phil._n you_o will_v never_o leave_v your_o sinister_a construction_n of_o his_o fair_a deal_n but_o i_o hope_v his_o next_o argument_n have_v evidence_n enough_o that_o if_o dive_v in_o hell_n be_v solicitous_a for_o his_o brethren_n upon_o earth_n and_o pray_v abraham_n to_o send_v lazarus_n to_o warn_v they_o lest_o they_o shall_v come_v into_o the_o same_o place_n of_o condemnation_n much_o more_o be_v the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n solicitous_a for_o their_o brethren_n the_o church_n militant_a and_o pray_v for_o their_o protection_n and_o assistance_n theoph._n your_o argument_n a_o majori_fw-la will_v not_o hold_v without_o some_o authority_n to_o support_v they_o this_o of_o the_o rich_a glutton_n be_v but_o a_o feeble_a crutch_n chrysost_n crutch_n justin_n eucherius_n cyril_n chrysost_n many_o intepreter_n take_v the_o whole_a passage_n to_o be_v a_o parable_n not_o a_o history_n and_o etc._n and_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d etc._n etc._n theophylact_v upon_o the_o place_n reckon_v the_o other_o that_o it_o be_v a_o history_n a_o foolish_a conceit_n now_o you_o know_v the_o maxim_n argumentativae_fw-la maxim_n parabolae_fw-la non_fw-la sunt_fw-la argumentativae_fw-la parable_n be_v no_o argumentative_a topick_n neither_o be_v they_o narrative_n of_o thing_n do_v but_o similitudinary_a representation_n to_o fix_v some_o doctrine_n more_o sensible_o and_o effectual_o in_o man_n mind_n again_o if_o it_o be_v a_o historical_a relation_n of_o matter_n of_o fact_n it_o will_v not_o prove_v the_o point_n that_o dive_v beindead_o and_o in_o torment_n know_v the_o affair_n of_o this_o world_n only_o he_o be_v sensible_a that_o he_o have_v give_v a_o example_n of_o voluptuousness_n and_o uncharitableness_n unto_o his_o brethren_n and_o that_o their_o sin_n will_v contribute_v unto_o his_o torment_n and_o therefore_o he_o be_v solicitous_a to_o have_v they_o reclaim_v when_o he_o shall_v urge_v his_o example_n for_o the_o invocation_n of_o saint_n i_o will_v answer_v that_o you_o bring_v a_o ill_a precedent_n to_o confirm_v a_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n and_o withal_o when_o abraham_n or_o any_o of_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n shall_v undoubted_o appear_v and_o commune_v with_o you_o you_o may_v desire_v their_o assistance_n phil._n bellarmine_n have_v one_o material_a proof_n that_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n do_v pray_v for_o the_o faithful_a upon_o earth_n because_o the_o church_n militant_a and_o triumphant_a do_v make_v one_o mystical_a body_n whereof_o christ_n be_v the_o head_n and_o so_o there_o juvent_fw-la there_o ibid._n communio_fw-la illa_fw-la exigit_fw-la necessario_fw-la ut_fw-la membra_fw-la pro_fw-la inuicem_fw-la sint_fw-la sollicita_fw-la &_o mutuo_fw-la se_fw-la juvent_fw-la must_v be_v a_o communion_n between_o the_o member_n make_v they_o solicitous_a mutual_o to_o help_v one_o another_o theoph._n he_o may_v have_v spare_v to_o urge_v the_o necessary_a mutual_a assistance_n for_o we_o do_v not_o pray_v for_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n neither_o be_v we_o solicitous_a for_o they_o who_o be_v immutable_o bless_v and_o of_o their_o affection_n towards_o we_o their_o fellow_n member_n militant_a upon_o earth_n we_o do_v not_o doubt_v neither_o of_o their_o prayer_n for_o the_o church_n in_o general_n that_o she_o may_v be_v victorious_a over_o all_o her_o enemy_n as_o also_o for_o the_o fill_n up_o the_o number_n of_o the_o elect_n and_o their_o consummation_n in_o bliss_n but_o this_o will_v not_o infer_v their_o distinct_a knowledge_n of_o thing_n here_o below_o or_o make_v for_o your_o doctrine_n of_o invocation_n for_o you_o know_v the_o saint_n militant_a over_o all_o the_o world_n be_v fellow_n member_n and_o mutual_o solicitous_a for_o one_o another_o and_o yet_o one_o national_a church_n do_v not_o invocate_v another_o in_o her_o public_a office_n phil._n i_o pray_v give_v i_o leave_v to_o make_v the_o inference_n when_o i_o have_v sufficient_o fortify_v the_o premise_n you_o run_v away_o with_o the_o argument_n before_o it_o be_v perfect_a and_o so_o conclude_v it_o be_v invalid_a for_o you_o shall_v find_v that_o our_o doctor_n do_v not_o only_o prove_v how_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n pray_v in_o general_a for_o the_o church_n militant_a and_o for_o the_o saint_n on_o earth_n but_o that_o they_o pray_v particular_o for_o they_o for_o that_o be_v betlarmines_n next_o position_n particulari_fw-la position_n ibid._n sancti_fw-la qui_fw-la regnant_a in_o coele_n crant_fw-la pro_fw-la nobis_fw-la etiam_fw-la in_o particulari_fw-la the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n pray_v for_o we_o in_o particular_a theoph._n be_v please_v to_o let_v we_o here_o his_o argument_n phil._n he_o prove_v the_o angel_n have_v a_o special_a charge_n over_o we_o in_o particular_a and_o pray_v for_o we_o and_o therefore_o much_o more_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n do_v so_o theoph._n how_o do_v he_o prove_v his_o much_o more_o i_o doubt_v it_o will_v prove_v at_o length_n much_o less_o and_o the_o whole_a argument_n a_o non_fw-la sequitur_fw-la phil._n his_o reason_n seem_v demonstrative_a our_o saviour_n say_v the_o saint_n in_o heavin_n be_v as_o the_o angel_n luk._n 20._o vers_fw-la 36._o they_o always_o stand_v in_o the_o presence_n of_o god_n and_o most_o affectionate_o love_v we_o and_o therefore_o want_v neither_o understanding_n or_o will_n to_o be_v assistant_n unto_o their_o brethren_n upon_o earth_n and_o in_o one_o regard_n they_o may_v surpass_v the_o angel_n in_o a_o promtitude_n to_o succour_v we_o in_o that_o they_o have_v a_o near_a relation_n to_o we_o as_o their_o flesh_n and_o blood_n and_o have_v have_v experience_n of_o our_o danger_n and_o sorrow_n and_o so_o be_v the_o rather_o qualify_v to_o compassionate_v our_o infirmity_n theoph._n our_o bless_a saviour_n show_v how_o the_o saint_n in_o glory_n be_v like_a unto_o the_o angel_n and_o equal_a to_o they_o in_o respect_n of_o their_o immortality_n for_o they_o can_v die_v no_o more_o and_o in_o that_o they_o neither_o marry_v nor_o be_v give_v in_o marriage_n as_o you_o may_v observe_v the_o place_n but_o there_o be_v no_o demonstration_n the_o comparison_n shall_v hold_v in_o all_o thing_n and_o doubtless_o before_o the_o resurrection_n

his_o zeal_n for_o your_o church_n and_o that_o in_o he_o i_o shall_v meet_v with_o all_o which_o rational_o can_v be_v suggest_v to_o uphold_v his_o cause_n let_v we_o therefore_o hear_v how_o he_o have_v manage_v these_o controversy_n phil._n concern_v the_o point_n invocation_n of_o saint_n depart_v after_o some_o preliminary_a discourse_n 19_o discourse_n tom._n 2._o controver_n 4._o de_fw-fr eccl._n triumph_n c._n 18_o 19_o bellarmin_n undertake_v to_o prove_v two_o thing_n one_o in_o order_n unto_o the_o other_o 1._o that_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n do_v pray_v for_o we_o 2._o that_o we_o must_v pray_v to_o they_o theoph._n one_o of_o these_o do_v not_o necessary_o follow_v upon_o the_o other_o that_o if_o the_o saint_n triumphant_a be_v solicitous_a for_o and_o do_v pray_v for_o the_o church_n militant_a in_o general_n for_o the_o triumph_n of_o their_o faith_n and_o their_o consummation_n in_o bliss_n who_o be_v fellow-member_n of_o christ_n mystical_a body_n the_o church_n be_v yet_o within_o the_o list_n wrestle_v with_o great_a opposition_n and_o many_o trial_n i_o say_v it_o do_v not_o follow_v that_o if_o the_o saint_n in_o glory_n do_v pray_v for_o the_o church_n militant_a that_o therefore_o we_o shall_v call_v upon_o they_o so_o to_o do_v they_o be_v perfect_a in_o grace_n and_o never_o want_v to_o their_o duty_n or_o unmindful_a of_o their_o concern_v upon_o this_o account_n methinks_v out_o of_o a_o zeal_n to_o the_o glory_n of_o god_n you_o ought_v as_o frequent_o to_o call_v upon_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n to_o laud_v and_o magnify_v the_o god_n of_o heaven_n as_o out_o of_o a_o sense_n of_o your_o own_o want_n to_o pray_v unto_o they_o to_o intercede_v for_o you_o but_o withal_o you_o can_v never_o give_v we_o any_o infallible_a assurance_n that_o they_o do_v hear_v our_o prayer_n that_o so_o in_o faith_n and_o with_o confidence_n we_o may_v call_v upon_o they_o the_o member_n of_o the_o church-catholic_a thro-out_a the_o world_n do_v pray_v for_o one_o another_o and_o yet_o one_o national_a church_n do_v not_o invocate_v another_o except_o it_o be_v by_o enter_v course_n of_o communicatory_a epistle_n direct_v i_o how_o to_o send_v a_o letter_n to_o saint_n peter_n and_o i_o will_v not_o fail_v to_o put_v in_o my_o humble_a request_n that_o he_o will_v help_v i_o with_o his_o prayer_n phil._n this_o great_a point_n concern_v the_o assurance_n that_o the_o saint_n do_v hear_v our_o prayer_n will_v fall_v into_o consideration_n hereafter_o mean_v while_n it_o become_v you_o not_o to_o mock_v and_o play_v the_o droll_fw-fr in_o a_o serious_a concern_v theoph._n you_o may_v excuse_v i_o the_o rather_o see_v you_o shall_v find_v in_o 513._o in_o tom._n 5._o pag._n 513._o binius_fw-la his_o edition_n of_o the_o council_n a_o large_a letter_n send_v to_o pepin_n king_n of_o france_n and_o charles_n and_o carlemain_n his_o son_n from_o s_o t_o peter_n by_o pope_n stephen_n the_o 3_o do_v implore_v and_o require_v their_o speedy_a assistance_n against_o the_o lombard_n in_o the_o behalf_n of_o rome_n his_o episcopal_a see_n and_o of_o his_o sepulchre_n and_o temple_n therein_o and_o you_o may_v suppose_v pope_n stephen_n can_v as_o easy_o have_v return_v a_o answer_n from_o these_o prince_n to_o the_o apostle_n i_o shall_v have_v occasion_n to_o produce_v that_o hereafter_o phil._n these_o be_v strange_a divertisement_n from_o our_o business_n be_v you_o serious_o afraid_a to_o enter_v into_o the_o controversy_n that_o you_o interrupt_v my_o discourse_n with_o such_o impertinency_n theoph._n if_o i_o shall_v answer_v your_o question_n you_o will_v complain_v of_o more_o delay_n take_v your_o course_n therefore_o and_o i_o will_v follow_v you_o phil._n 18._o phil._n ib._n cap._n 18._o bellarmin_n prove_v the_o saint_n do_v pray_v for_o we_o from_o that_o passage_n of_o holy_a scripture_n though_o moses_n and_o samuel_n stand_v before_o i_o yet_o can_v not_o my_o mind_n be_v towards_o this_o people_n therefore_o say_v he_o moses_n and_o samuel_n be_v dead_a do_v usual_o pray_v for_o the_o people_n of_o the_o jew_n theoph._n we_o have_v a_o rule_n in_o logic_n suppositio_fw-la nihil_fw-la point_n this_o supposition_n if_o they_o shall_v pray_v do_v not_o imply_v they_o do_v pray_v the_o text_n only_o design_n to_o show_v god_n great_a indignation_n against_o his_o people_n the_o jew_n at_o that_o time_n insomuch_o that_o if_o those_o two_o holy_a person_n and_o great_o belove_v be_v alive_a and_o shall_v interpose_v for_o they_o they_o shall_v not_o prevail_v 〈◊〉_d prevail_v tom._n 4._o homil._n 1._o in_o primum_fw-la thess_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d hence_o s_n to_o chrysostom_n upon_o this_o text_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d if_o moses_n the_o first_o lawgiver_n who_o often_o deliver_v the_o jew_n by_o his_o intercession_n from_o divine_a vengeance_n if_o he_o be_v now_o in_o be_v he_o shall_v not_o prevail_v the_o like_a passage_n we_o have_v ezek_n 14._o 13_o 14._o son_n of_o man_n when_o the_o land_n sin_v against_o i_o by_o trespass_v grievous_o etc._n etc._n though_o these_o three_o man_n noah_n daniel_n and_o job_n be_v in_o it_o they_o shall_v deliver_v but_o their_o own_o soul_n by_o their_o righteousness_n and_o so_o in_o divers_a passage_n follow_v in_o that_o chapter_n though_o noah_n daniel_n and_o job_n be_v in_o it_o etc._n etc._n now_o as_o this_o supposition_n can_v infer_v these_o three_o man_n be_v in_o the_o land_n for_o noah_n and_o job_n be_v dead_a more_o than_o a_o thousand_o year_n before_o although_o daniel_n be_v then_o live_v so_o neither_o do_v the_o former_a supposition_n prove_v that_o moses_n and_o samuel_n do_v pray_v for_o the_o jew_n after_o their_o decease_n that_o place_n of_o s_o t_o paul_n gal._n 10._o ver_fw-la 8._o though_o we_o or_o a_o angel_n from_o heaven_n preach_v any_o other_o gospel_n to_o you_o etc._n etc._n in_o beauties_n logic_n must_v imply_v they_o do_v preach_v another_o gospel_n let_v the_o reader_n pity_v we_o to_o see_v unto_o what_o a_o drudgery_n we_o be_v put_v to_o answer_v such_o futile_a argument_n phil._n i_o well_o see_v nothing_o will_v prevail_v against_o your_o prejudices_fw-la but_o express_v and_o positive_a text_n and_o therefore_o in_o the_o next_o argument_n bellarmine_n comply_v with_o your_o humour_n in_o the_o second_o book_n of_o maccabee_n and_o the_o last_o chapter_n we_o read_v express_o how_o onias_n former_o their_o high_a priest_n and_o a_o virtuous_a and_o good_a man_n pray_v for_o the_o whole_a body_n of_o the_o jew_n ver_fw-la 12._o and_o that_o jeremiah_n the_o prophet_n of_o the_o lord_n do_v pray_v much_o for_o the_o people_n and_o for_o the_o holy_a city_n when_o judas_n maccabaeus_n be_v engage_v in_o battle_n with_o nicanor_n unto_o who_o we_o read_v the_o prophet_n jeremiah_n give_v a_o sword_n of_o gold_n as_o a_o gift_n from_o god_n wherewith_o to_o wound_v and_o subdue_v his_o enemy_n theoph._n this_o be_v out_o of_o a_o apocryphal_a book_n and_o therefore_o no_o infallible_a proof_n from_o canonical_a scripture_n now_o touch_v the_o canon_n of_o holy_a scripture_n we_o may_v have_v by_o divine_a permission_n another_o occasion_n to_o discourse_n and_o although_o bellarmin_n please_v himself_o that_o calvin_n have_v no_o other_o refuge_n but_o to_o deny_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o text_n yet_o we_o will_v reflect_v upon_o other_o particular_n which_o appear_v to_o weaken_v the_o testimony_n for_o it_o be_v but_o a_o dream_n of_o judas_n maccabeus_n which_o he_o tell_v unto_o his_o soldier_n to_o encourage_v they_o before_o the_o fight_n a_o dream_n worthy_a to_o be_v believe_v as_o if_o it_o have_v be_v so_o indeed_o say_v the_o author_n ver_fw-la 11._o it_o seem_v therefore_o indeed_o it_o be_v not_o so_o and_o so_o the_o whole_a testimony_n be_v from_o a_o dream_n that_o have_v no_o reality_n in_o the_o 12_o the_o verse_n it_o be_v call_v a_o vision_n you_o may_v suppose_v a_o wake_a dream_n and_o therein_o there_o be_v so_o much_o reality_n that_o jeremiah_n give_v a_o golden_a sword_n to_o judas_n to_o wound_v his_o adversary_n but_o a_o golden_a sword_n be_v no_o fit_a instrument_n of_o war_n for_o execution_n and_o it_o be_v much_o we_o never_o read_v it_o be_v lay_v up_o in_o the_o temple_n for_o a_o sacred_a relic_n and_o much_o more_o cause_n we_o have_v to_o wonder_v it_o be_v not_o at_o all_o mention_v in_o the_o first_o book_n of_o maccabee_n which_o be_v the_o more_o perfect_a history_n of_o those_o war_n and_o wherein_o the_o battle_n with_o nicanor_n be_v punctual_o relate_v 1_o macc._n 7._o 41._o and_o judas_n his_o prayer_n to_o god_n before_o the_o fight_n but_o of_o the_o dream_n or_o vision_n ne_o gry_a quidem_fw-la and_o now_o i_o pray_v observe_v how_o your_o doctor_n in_o those_o instance_n be_v inconstant_a to_o their_o own_o principle_n for_o they_o general_o

horn_n have_v little_a strength_n but_o can_v he_o have_v add_v to_o they_o this_o five_o horn_n that_o the_o word_n of_o god_n approve_v the_o invocation_n of_o the_o dead_a as_o of_o the_o live_n we_o must_v have_v flee_v before_o it_o but_o alas_o all_o the_o attemt_n to_o confirm_v this_o doctrine_n of_o your_o church_n out_o of_o holy_a writ_n have_v prove_v so_o unsuccessful_a that_o some_o of_o your_o own_o doctor_n have_v have_v so_o much_o ingenuity_n as_o to_o acknowledge_v that_o it_o be_v not_o express_o deliver_v in_o holy_a scripture_n so_o script_n so_o invocatio_fw-la sanctorum_fw-la non_fw-la express_v traditur_fw-la in_o script_n eccius_n in_o his_o enchiridion_n of_o catholic_a confession_n and_o therefore_o it_o must_v pass_v for_o a_o unwritten_a tradition_n whereof_o martin_n peresius_n confess_v we_o have_v cyprianum_n have_v de_fw-fr trad._n p._n 3._o consid_fw-la 7._o ne_fw-fr vestigium_fw-la ante_fw-la divum_fw-la cyprianum_n no_o footstep_n before_o cyprian_a phil._n peresius_n give_v a_o rational_a account_n together_o with_o other_o why_o the_o holy_a apostle_n do_v not_o lay_v the_o foundation_n of_o this_o doctrine_n it_o be_v say_v they_o facerent_fw-la they_o causa_fw-la erat_fw-la humilitas_fw-la &_o mod_fw-la apostolorum_fw-la nese_n deos_fw-la facerent_fw-la out_o of_o their_o great_a humility_n and_o modesty_n lest_o they_o shall_v appear_v to_o establish_v in_o the_o church_n their_o own_o apotheosis_n make_v themselves_o as_o god_n by_o direct_v the_o people_n of_o god_n to_o put_v up_o their_o supplication_n after_o their_o decease_n to_o they_o theoph._n methinks_v that_o which_o prevail_v with_o the_o apostle_n not_o to_o deliver_v this_o doctrine_n of_o the_o invocation_n of_o saint_n shall_v likewise_o have_v prevail_v with_o the_o church_n never_o to_o have_v establish_v it_o and_o without_o doubt_n have_v it_o be_v according_a to_o the_o will_n of_o god_n and_o profitable_a to_o the_o church_n the_o holy_a apostle_n 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the_o four_o particular_n of_o beauties_n argument_n theoph._n i_o have_v already_o cut_v off_o the_o four_o horn_n with_o one_o blow_n he_o say_v that_o if_o we_o may_v not_o pray_v to_o the_o saint_n depart_v as_o well_o as_o desire_v their_o prayer_n when_o live_v it_o must_v be_v for_o one_o of_o those_o four_o cause_n forementioned_a either_o they_o be_v not_o willing_a or_o be_v not_o able_a to_o pray_v for_o we_o or_o they_o can_v hear_v our_o prayer_n or_o their_o intercession_n will_v be_v injurious_a unto_o christ_n intercession_n but_o i_o say_v be_v enumeration_n be_v lame_a and_o imperfect_a for_o i_o have_v show_v a_o five_o reason_n why_o not_o because_o the_o word_n of_o god_n oblige_v not_o to_o one_o as_o to_o the_o other_o it_o require_v that_o we_o shall_v desire_v the_o mutual_a assistance_n of_o one_o another_o prayer_n living_n but_o not_o after_o our_o decease_n all_o civil_a commerce_n be_v intercept_v by_o the_o will_n of_o god_n between_o the_o live_n and_o the_o dead_a phil._n do_v you_o reckon_v our_o invocation_n of_o the_o saint_n depart_v a_o part_n of_o civil_a commerce_n i_o think_v it_o have_v be_v a_o religious_a act_n and_o duty_n theoph._n i_o grant_v prayer_n to_o be_v such_o and_o therefore_o a_o part_n of_o divine_a worship_n to_o be_v give_v only_o to_o god_n but_o that_o invocation_n of_o holy_a man_n live_v as_o you_o call_v it_o or_o as_o i_o term_v it_o that_o pious_a desire_n and_o request_n which_o one_o christian_a make_v unto_o another_o that_o he_o may_v enjoy_v the_o benefit_n of_o his_o prayer_n from_o whence_o you_o draw_v a_o argument_n for_o invocation_n after_o their_o decease_n that_o doubtless_o be_v a_o civil_a request_n wherewith_o christian_n mutual_o call_v upon_o and_o oblige_v one_o another_o to_o remember_v they_o in_o their_o prayer_n so_o likewise_o the_o honour_n which_o subject_n yield_v unto_o their_o prince_n present_v their_o petition_n with_o bend_a knee_n be_v civil_a and_o so_o child_n beg_v the_o blessing_n of_o their_o parent_n these_o be_v formal_o civil_a not_o religious_a acts._n a_o good_a christian_a indeed_o give_v honour_n to_o his_o prince_n and_o to_o his_o parent_n not_o only_o upon_o a_o civil_a account_n but_o also_o religious_a it_o be_v a_o duty_n require_v in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n yet_o the_o honour_n itself_o be_v civil_a the_o motive_n unto_o we_o wherefore_o we_o give_v it_o be_v religious_a the_o will_n and_o command_v of_o god_n phil._n you_o be_v willing_a to_o involve_v the_o discourse_n with_o subtle_a notion_n and_o nice_a distinction_n such_o honour_n as_o you_o give_v to_o prince_n and_o parent_n vouchsafe_v to_o the_o saint_n in_o glory_n beg_v the_o assistance_n of_o their_o prayer_n upon_o your_o knee_n and_o it_o shall_v suffice_v theoph._n yourself_o cause_v this_o digression_n you_o suppose_v the_o invocation_n of_o saint_n depart_v to_o be_v a_o religious_a act_n and_o so_o in_o truth_n you_o general_o make_v it_o a_o great_a 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relieve_v the_o poor_a nor_o lend_v he_o money_n at_o his_o need_n you_o former_o do_v urge_v there_o be_v a_o communion_n between_o the_o church_n militant_a and_o triumphant_a but_o that_o be_v mystical_a as_o fellow-member_n of_o christ_n body_n but_o the_o civil_a communion_n between_o brethren_n and_o neighbour_n and_o the_o relation_n of_o parent_n and_o child_n master_n and_o servant_n prince_n and_o subject_n husband_n and_o wife_n be_v interrupt_v altogether_o by_o death_n and_o so_o by_o consequence_n all_o those_o act_n which_o depend_v upon_o or_o flow_v from_o that_o communion_n that_o child_n shall_v ask_v their_o father_n blessing_n after_o his_o decease_n i_o never_o yet_o do_v read_v your_o doctor_n have_v assert_v phil._n i_o be_o well_o confirm_v by_o these_o your_o digression_n that_o notwithstanding_o you_o will_v appear_v to_o slight_a beauties_n argument_n and_o pretend_v to_o cut_v off_o all_o the_o four_o horn_n at_o one_o blow_n by_o give_v a_o general_a answer_n yet_o in_o truth_n you_o do_v wary_o decline_v the_o force_n of_o it_o and_o be_v not_o willing_a to_o come_v to_o the_o four_o particular_n whereupon_o he_o have_v insist_v that_o see_v the_o saint_n depart_v be_v as_o willing_a and_o as_o able_a to_o help_v we_o now_o with_o their_o prayer_n as_o when_o they_o be_v live_v among_o we_o and_o see_v they_o know_v our_o state_n and_o can_v hear_v and_o receive_v our_o address_n to_o they_o and_o see_v their_o intercession_n now_o for_o we_o be_v not_o injurious_a to_o the_o intercession_n of_o christ_n therefore_o we_o have_v as_o much_o and_o more_o reason_n to_o invocate_v they_o now_o in_o heaven_n then_o when_o they_o be_v conversant_a with_o we_o upon_o earth_n theoph._n not_o exclude_v the_o confutation_n already_o give_v i_o will_v now_o take_v these_o four_o particular_n into_o consideration_n the_o two_o first_o may_v easy_o be_v grant_v if_o there_o can_v be_v mutual_a communion_n between_o they_o and_o we_o