generally stande in England and come after vnto those former articles which conteine your association wherein ye conioyne your selues and enter into couenant with God as ye say to set vp all the ordinances of Christ for I take this to bee the fittest order Your syxt article which now must be first being expressed in these words And now that our forsaking and vtter abandoning these disordered assemblies as they generally stand in England may not seeme strange or offensiue to anye man that will iudge or be iudged by the word of God we alledge and affirme them heinouslie faultie and wilfullie obstinate in these foure principall transgressions To this I answered That Elias did sée outward idolatrie practised and saw none which did mislike and therefore complained of all It was an error but whereas Gods word is imbraced and multitudes abhorre Idolatrie and labour with sorrowfull teares to bee purged from their sinnes it is an intollerable pride and presumption of men to set themselues in Gods iudgement seat and to condemne all of wilfull obstinacie Let it be shewed where euer any led by Gods spirit haue dealt in this sort and especially in charging them most falslie as shall appeare The Brownists HEre you verye vehemently charge vs with vntollerable pride presumption and intrusion into Gods iudgment seate to be voide of Gods spirite to charge and condemne you most falsely as you say shall appeare How iustly you charge vs with these crimes or discharge your selfe and your assemblies of these present transgessions vpon the scanne of your answeres shall appeare c. G. G. All such as take vpon them to iudge and condemne whole assemblies that professe the Gospell and that with slanderous accusations as you do may right well be charged with intollerable pride presumption and intrusion into Gods iudgement seate séeing the Scriptures do cleerely warrant it For he that iudgeth one man to be no true Christian which holdeth the place of a brother and laboureth to please God professing the faith soundly in all fundamentall points either for some errors in iudgement or frailties committed in life proudlye aduanceth himselfe into Gods office who alone searcheth the heart and trieth the raines of the children of men What shall we say then of those which condemne whole multitudes amongst whom there be many vnspotted with grose errors and offenses But the ground of your dooing is from hence that such as commit principall transgressions and be wilfullye obstinate in the same the word of God dooth condemne them And then yée say that the assemblies in England be heinously faulty and wilfully obstinate in foure principall transgressions Ye boldly alledge and affirme but ye make proofe neither of the transgressions nor of the wilfull obstinacie Touching the transgressions what meane ye by principall If yée vnderstand great faults and grosse errors and holde withall that there is no faith nor regeneration among those which erre grosely commit great faults ye maintaine heresie which is conuinced by infinit places and examples of the Scriptures The best that euer were did know but in part 1. Cor. 13. The godliest were regenerate but in part Rom. 7. Of the strongest it was said who can tell his errors Psal 19. and in manye things we sinne all Iam. 3. If Noah Abraham Lot Dauid Solomon Samson and other holy men greatly replenished with the holy Ghost and with faithe did sometime fall into great sinnes howe many will be the errors the diuisions the frailties and offenses among the multitude in the church where with the stronger and such as haue the greater knowledge and godlinesse there are heaped vp together multitudes of weake and such as be carnall and but babes in Christ besides hipocrites and countersait brethren If by principall transgressions ye meane onely such as be fundamentall then ye doo most falsely accuse the Church of England which holdeth not any heresie or blasphemie against any one ground or principle of the holy Christian faith Yée must then either mainteine this heresie which is that where the true faith is there can breake foorth no great faults errors and abuses or this absurd manner of spéech which afterward yée vse that all errors and deformities in religion be heresies blasphemies and abhominations or els confesse that with intollerable pride presumption and intrusion into Gods iudgement seate yée haue taken vpon yée to iudge and condemne whole assemblies which professe the faith of Christ sincerely in all fundamentall points among whom there be many particular persons which study earnestly to please God mourning for their owne sinnes and are like iust Lot 2. Pet. ◠vexed and tormented to behold the wickednesse of others And now touching wilfull obstinacie how will yée prooue that to be in all the assemblies and in all members of the assemblies of England If ye say there be apparant transgressions in which they continue and therefore they be wilfully obstinate and so to be vtterly abandoned I answer that your conclusion doth not follow because the continuance in all sorts of errors and offenses in such as professe the faith doth not warrant men vtterly to cast them out as Heathen but where after admonition and conuiction the censure of the Church is despised The rule of discipline giuen by our Sauiour Christ maketh this verye cléere If thy brother sinne against thée tell him of it betwéene him and thée alone If he heare thée thou hast wunne thy brother if he heare thée not take one or two with thee that by the mouth of two or thrée witnesses euery word may be confirmed If he heare not them tell it to the Church if he heare not the Church let him be as an Heathen or as a Publican Math. 18. We sée that priuate members may not vtterly abandon and cast foorth any one brother that is one which professeth the true faith and for his profession hath the place and dignitie of a Christian nor iudge him so wilfully obstinate that he must be accounted as an Heathen vntill the Church haue so iudged and cast him foorth The same orderly course and rule of discipline is to be obserued in admonishing accusing conuincing condemning and vtter abandoning any particuler assembly which hath the dignity of a Christian church and doth offend so gréeuously and shew such obstinacie that it deserueth so heauy a censure In a particular Church there be errors and sinnes I will not saye in many but in all in as much as euery one hath his blindnesse and corruption erreth and sinneth continuallye one waye or other From hence it commeth that of necessitie there be alwaies in the Church diuersities of opinions discord diuision and dissention with many corruptions and abuses For if it be most manifest that the learnedest and godliest that liueth doth carrie with him his errors defects and corruptions what shal we looke for where the multitude is of learned vnlearned strong and weake altogether how innumerable will the frailties and corruptions now among all be
is written Ierusalem from aboue is the mother of vs all and is free with her children They boast of such freedome as that touching outwarde orders the Prince and Church hath no power to impose any thing by Lawes and Constitutions Which is one thing wherein they do not onely abridge the power of the Christian Magistrates denying them the authoritie to reforme the Church and to compell their subiects to the true worship spoyling the Church of that comfortable ayd but also condemne all reformed Churches which haue orders and prescript formes of prayers imposed which these Brownists tearme Idolatrie a tradition bringing Christian libertie into bondage and therefore a thing most detestable Moreouer they hold such a perfect freedome from all spirituall bondage of sinne that they affyrme S. Paule neuer consented to wicked thoughts after he was regenerate But in an other place they affyrme that all men be Idolaters and can keepe no one Commaundement where they are both contrary to themselues vttering that which ouerthroweth the whole Brownisme and also speake grosely For albeit there is no man perfect in any Commaundement yet the holy Scriptures do not call them Idolaters nor adulterers They boldly gayne say the holy Ghost by affirming that the Psalmes were not to be sung vnto God And touching the discipline which is the thing they most glorie of as if they suffered for it let all men know for certaintie that they be not only ignorant what it is but also do in their practise breake and ouerthrow the very pith and substance thereof in the chiefe rules For they take vpon them to abandon and cast foorth whole assemblyes which professe the Gospell and haue their estimation and dignitie among all godly Churches without obseruing the rule giuen by our Sauiour Christ Math. 18. They intrude themselues without calling beeing meere priuate men to the erecting and establishing of a publike gouernment forgetting that which is written I haue not sent them and yet they runne They cut off also the power of the Church in a great part of the discipline as namely in ordeyning constitutions in things that are variable Finally touching this poynt I may say boldly the Diuell can no way almost more disgrace Ecclesiasticall gouernment then he doth by them for it is the Sterne of Christes Ship and requireth men of the greatest wisedome learning experience and sobrietie that may be for to guide it Now when the common Artificer the Apprentise and the Bruer intrude themselues and they will guide the same being ignorant rash and headie what worldlie wise man will not take it that discipline her selfe is but a bedlem Who will aduenture himselfe in that Ship where presumptuous ignorance and bold frensie doth sit at the Helme Shall that Ship escape the rockes If it would please God to giue Browne the grace to repent and to speake the truth he could best declare this thing For when he had with certayne other drawne some both men and women ouer the Seas and there spread his Sayles how soone did his silly Boate dash vppon the rocke and was clouen in two or three peeces Let not men be deceyued with euery vayne shewe for vndoubtedly he that obserueth shall finde that the end of Brownisme is infinite Schismes Heresies Atheisme and Barbarisme For what other fruites can followe of the disgracing and condemning the liberall Artes of bringing the ministerie of Gods Word by which the religion and godlines that is in men hath been â—rought into vtter contempt What can followe from immoderate outragious rash furie wrath and bitter zeale and vainglorious contention which are earthly sensuall and diuelish If men could stay themselues but a while and see whether the same things spring not foorth which came from the Donatists and Anabaptists it were well For it is to be wondred at that any which professe the Gospell should be seduced and called away not only from the Ministers of the Church of England that haue taught them but from all the most worthy men and Churches vnder heauen and that by the voyce of the Deuill in such furious blinde Schismatikes In deede there be two speciall causes of it the one that sundry men receyue not the holy Word of God in humilitie with feare and trembling with conscience to practise but are puffed vp and swell with opinion of their knowledge as soone as they can vtter a fewe words and growe vnto vayne iangling yea vnto bitter zeale and contention in stead of being quiet as S. Paule willeth and medling with their own busines 1. Thes 3. and also in stead of following after righteousnes faith and loue 2. Timoth. 3. He that seemeth most zealous in religion and refraineth not his toong hath but bitternesse in steed of heauenly zeale For wheras in steed of gentlenesse meekenesse patience mercie and loue yee finde wrath fiercenesse intemperat rage vncharitable condemning and slaundering know for certainty that the true zeale is not there The other cause of mens seducing is that in this corrupt age there be many stumbling blockes and greeuous offences where indeed it is the part and duty of euery true Christian man beside the taking heede to his owne wayes most instantly to offer vp praiers and supplications to God to intreate him to shew mercie and compassion vpon vs by increasing all heauenly graces and giftes of his holy spirit in our most noble Queene and in all Gouernours both ciuill and ecclesiasticall that there may be feruent zeale to purge the house of God and to take away the causes of contention that we may not alwaies seeke to deuoure one an other but that vnity and concord may florish holding this withall that it is also euery mans dutie that will feare God to giue him hearty thanks for the inestimable treasures and blessings which he hath bestowed vpon vs by meanes of the happy raigne of our gratious Soueraigne and to take heed of that malignant spirite of Brownisme which would carry vs to this wicked opinion that she bearing the Sworde of God hath doone no more for vs then an Heathen Prince might doo For if we haue no word of God no ministery no Sacraments nor visible Church but all idolatrous and antichristian what hath she done what honor can she haue for defence of the Gospell This is no small dishonour and iniurie to a Christian Prince thus to diminish the loue of the subiects The Lord giue them repentance and grace to cease from such impietie and let all men with modestie reuerence and subiection and not with reproch and contempt seeke the redresse of abuses at their hands which be in Authoritie and not aduenture like Corah Dathan and Abiram to intrude themselues without calling and warrant from God They cryed out are not all the Lords people holy and therefore Moses and Aaron yee take too much vppon yee The Brownist proclaymeth that all the Lords people are free and therefore freely to deale and not to haue any thing imposed by any Be
vsed vpon them in publike assemblyes Diuers Churches also among vs are called by the names of those Saincts which they were dedicated vnto but to say that we do therefore dedicate Churches vnto them is very ridiculous In the City Athens there was a place of Iudgement which bare the name of Mars S. Luke calleth it by the same name doth he therefore dedicate it also vnto that heathen God of battaile When we call S. Peters Church or Paules Churchyard it is but to distinguish them by the names by which they are commonly knowne and called Then follow our Comminations Rogations Purifications Touching Comminations they be a part of the Canonicall Scripture which is to be read in the Church Rogations I take to be the compassing in of the limits and bounds of Parishes which is commaunded only to auoide contention and strife that might growe and there is nothing in the booke of Common Prayer touching these that euer I could finde Purifications are annexed only to make vp your riming figure for neither the booke nor the doctrine of the Church of England doth speake of any Purification but only in the bloud of the Lambe There is a Thanksgiuing prescribed for Women after Childbirth but neyther for Iewish Purification or Popish Superstition therefore not in such sort to be condemned After comes in our Tithes Offerings Mortuaries For the Tithes and Mortuaries I do not finde them once named in the booke the Offrings in déede are But ye will say that is no great matter séeing they be in our Church That is true but yet they are but for maintenance of the Ministerie not as a matter tyed of necessitie vnto a Priesthoode as in the time of the Lawe and if they were the error could not be fundamentall In the next place are brought in our manner of visiting the sicke and howsling them with the Sacrament our Absolution blasphemous Dirges and Funerall Sermons ouer and for the dead There is prescribed a manner of visiting the sicke and so is there in the leiturgies of some other Churches that professe the Gospell but where haue ye séene it practised or the practise vrged by those that haue the gouernment of our Church at their hands which are able and diligent Pastors Whereby your iniurious dealing may appeare in charging all the assemblies as they generally stand in England with matters which the greater part do not practise nor yet are required For if the sicke man be by the Minister of the word instructed exhorted comforted and strengthened in faith and repentance yea euery way prepared to depart ioyfully in the Lord it is that which the booke aimeth at neither is there any more required although he vse no prescript forme set downe By your phrase of howsling with the Sacrament ye would make the simple beleeue that the Popish Howsling is retained among vs. This is but a false kind of packing seeing our Church vtterly condemneth all the wicked blasphemous corrupt doctrine of the Papists touching the Lords Supper and also denyeth that a man is of necessitie to receiue this Sacrament at his death If yes replie that howsoeuer we teach yet the booke implyeth a necessitie which appeareth by that it doth appoint a priuate Communion I answer that euen the booke doth denie it to be a matter of necessitie and doth appoint it but to relieue the trouble which might arise in weake consciences through the want thereof for these be the words of the booke The Curates shall diligently from time to time but specially in the Plague time exhort their Parishioners to the often receiuing in the Church of the holy Communion of the bodie and bloud of our Sauiour Christ which if they doo they shall haue no cause in their suddaine visitation to be disquieted for lacke of the same And if any sicke person that would receiue this Sacrament hath any impediment that he can not the Booke willeth the Minister to instruct him that if he do truly repent him of his sinnes and stedfastly beléeue that Iesus Christ hath suffered death vppon the Crosse for him and shead his bloud for his redemption earnestly remembring the benefites he hath thereby and giuing him hartie thanks therefore he doth eate and drincke the Bodie and Bloud of our Sauiour Christ profitably to his soules health although he do not receiue the Sacrament with his mouth How maliciously then do you charge the assemblies in England with howsling the sicke with the Sacrament when all the learned faithfull diligent Pastors do as the booke requireth exhort those that be of their flockes to the often receiuing of this holy Sacrament in the publike assemblie as the due place for publike seales and the people by instruction being growen so strong that they do not in their sicknesse require it and so in the most Congregations which are well taught the thing is not practise◠The Sinagog of Antichrist deuised a purgatorie which is blasphemous against the bloud of Christ They had indéed their Dirges euen blasphemous prayers for the dead That Purgatorie do we vtterly deny as a wicked inuention we condemne prayer for the dead and therfore where ye tearme those prayers which are read at burials blasphemous Dirges ouer and for the dead yee are more then impudent in lying Funerall Sermons I finde not inioyned by the booke nor commaunded by any Lawe Ye adde further our corrupt manner of administring the Sacraments the Font the Crosse in Baptisme Baptisme by women Gossippings the blasphemous Collects that we vse vnto this Sacrament Byshopings with all the hereticall Collects of the Booke which as ye say is a wearines vnto ye to repeate though not to vs both to tollerate and defend When ye shewe some reason why the Font is an abhomination I shall knowe what to say Touching the Crosse it must needes be confessed that it was blasphemously and horribly abused in Poperie they ascribing vnto it power to driue out and expell Deuils and worshipping it with deuine honour In my iudgement also the holy Church of God within short time after the blessed Apostles and the reuerend godly Pastors did offend in taking ouermuch libertie to ordeine Ceremonies Symbolicall as that and such like yet no doubt very reuerend godly learned men led by the example of those holy Fathers of olde haue iudged it lawfull for the Church to ordeine such Ceremonies Touching the Baptisme by women it is condemned both by the chéefe gouernours in our Church and others and is not practised vnlesse it be among the popish and supersticious ignorant sort By Gossyppings I suppose yée meane the witnesses at baptisme a thing vsed in the best reformed churches and thought to be expedient so that yée doo not heerein condemne the Church of England but all Churches Bishoping of children is little practised for vnlesse the people require it by offering their children few Bishops doo vrge them thervnto onely this excepted that they be taught and instructed in the Catechisme The
the Pastour doth keepe backe some for ignorance c. Heere you confesse that very many Churches in England want godly Pastours and that there all are admitted and that he that admitteth them is the worste of the company Thus you make the most Chuches in England in a very bad estate and so farre foorth you affirme your article But yet you know some Churches c. I did confesse and doo still with gréefe that in very manye assemblies in England all are admitted to the Table of the Lord which offer themselues euen the most prophane and grosse sinners I shewed also the reason of this gréeuous offence namely that the ministers which should repell such open offenders are many times the worst or at least negligent in that behalfe And moreouer that the Church of England dooth neither approoue such admission of prophane men to the Sacrament nor yet suffer it in practise wholy For touching practise there be many congregations in the land where sundrie for ignorance and open wickednesse are by the ministers kept backe and not suffered to communicate vntill they shew repentance And for not approouing such admission I said the booke of Common prayer dooth prescribe and commaund the repelling of notorious wicked offendours and also that some are excommunicated iustly not admitted to publike praier This was the first part of mine answer wherein I prooue your accusation false The other is that the godly are not polluted by the companye of the wicked which are suffered to communicate with them in Gods worship and the thing not in their power to redresse And for example I alledged the Church of the Iewes By which I prooue that if your accusation were true yet it destroyeth not the Church Now let vs examine how you ouerthrowe this by your replye Yée aske whether there were no more prophane in the parish besides those twenty or thirty which are repelled And whether those other prophane were not admitted I answer If there were yet the repelling of twenty or thirty in a flock dooth shew that you accuse falsely when yée say all the prophane without exception of any one person are reteined in the body and bosome of our Church But to prooue your article at once as yée say by a more direct course yée bring an argument And yée demand if I know anye in all the realme of England vnbaptized Is not Baptisme say you a Sacrament belonging to the Church by which all the faithfull and their séed doo enter into it Wherevpon yée argue thus All being baptized it followeth that all are receiued into the body of your Church Now being once receiued in they can no way be cast out but by excommunication And it is manifest that the Parson and all his parish hath not the powre which Christ hath left vnto his Church to excommunicate any offender be he neuer so obstinate or notorious c. This being the onely reason by which ye stand to prooue the truth of your accusation I must bestow the more paines about it Thus it must be set in forme Where all are receiued in by Baptisme and no power to cast foorth any by excommunication there all the prophane multitudes are without exception of any one person receiued into reteined in the bosome and body of the Church But in the Church of England all are receiued in by Baptisme and there is no power to cast foorth any by excommunication Therefore in England all the prophane multitudes without exception of any one person are receiued into and reteined in the bosome and body of the Church In your proposition there are to be excepted such as are repelled from the Sacrament who are in some sort for the time remooued out of the bosome of the Church And also such Papists Heretikes and Scismatikes as depart out of themselues It is further also to be considered in it that all the baptized continuing outwardly obedient they cannot be iustly called the prophane multitudes Your presumption in which ye charge the Church of England with a principall transgression for receiuing in all by Baptisme and hauing no power to cast foorth any by Excommunication is with foule error and falsehood Touching the Baptisme of Infants this appeareth to be your iudgement that the children of prophane men which remayne in the Church and professe the faith of Christ belong not to the couenant and therefore ought not to be Baptised No doubt the Church doth offend when open notorious sinners are not Excommunicate and brought to repentance or at the least to such a shewe of repentance as that men can not further iudge them but as Brethren It is also an offence where such not being cast foorth their children are receyued vnto Baptisme and that without care to sée them brought vp and instructed in the Christian Religion and to leade a Godly life agréeable to the same But to say that the children of prophane men taking prophane men as you doo which professe Christianitie and remayne in the Church are not to be Baptised is a very wicked iniurie to Gods people and contrarie to the manifest doctrine of the holie Scriptures and can not without Heresie be mayntayned First touching prophane people it is certayne that all Heathen Heretikes all Scismatikes open contemners of the holie Religion and all obstinate wicked men whiche despise the censure of the Church that hath passed vppon them may be called prophane But you Brownists go further and condemne them all as Infidels and prophane which professe the faith of Christ because notwithstanding they doo it in some weakenes and infirmities which is a wicked presumption and intrusion into Gods seate and in which as I haue shewed before yée breake the rule of discipline giuen by our Sauiour Christ by which no brother that is none which professeth the true faith is for his sinnes and impenitencie to be iudged as heathen vntill he haue despised the admonition of the Church and so be cast foorth You take vppon yée to plucke vp all the Darnell yée are commaunded the contrarie least yée plucke vp the Wheate Math. 13. You dare and that in most sauage and desperate manner rend and teare vp the weake plants yée doo it vnto whole assemblyes in which there be many that vnfaynedly sorrow and mourne for their sinnes and studie to please God all that feare the Lord may tremble at this your intollerable wickednes But now to procéede Ye will not allowe the children of prophane men the Sacrament of Baptisme And what is your reason they bée not the séede of the faithfull In déede in this yée say true that none are in theyr infancie to be admitted to this Sacrament but the séede of the faithfull but when yée take it that the children whose next parents are hypocrites or wicked and prophane persons which yet remayne in the Church and professe Christ be not the séede of the faithfull at all and in any respect and so within the couenant and to be baptized
This man dooth obey the Commaundement come out from among them separate your selues and touch no vncleane thing c. For he toucheth not their sinne but the holy things of God for the seperation from the wicked cannot be alwaies in body Where there is idolatrie practised and the faith and true worship ouerthrowne we must depart both in minde and bodye but from wicked men in the Church we cannot depart in bodye vnlesse we will also depart from Christ If it were otherwise how should the faithfull without pollution worship as they did in the Temple among so many prophane men and how should those few at Sardi Reuel 3 haue kept their garments vnpolluted among that heape of vngodly men Now let the reader iudge whether I haue in a frantike manner as you accuse me blasphemed the name of Christ by comparing yée vnto Anabaptists and Donatists in this your condemning and forsaking the Church for the euil men which be in it I would to God both you and others could consider that which is written of King Saul when as the holy Ghost saith he was zealous for the Children of Israel and Iuda 2 Samuel 21. and would roote out the Gybeonites Did not the Lorde declare by the thrée yeares famine and by causing some of the house of Saul to be hanged how curssed his cruell zeale was which yet hee had some colour of from the lawe which willed them to roote out the Heathen The cruell zeale of Brownists which séemeth to bee for the Church is more without excuse when they will néedes roote vp the naturall plants as now they may be called yea euen the whole assemblies both old and yoong The third accusation The Brow FOr that they haue a false Antichristian Ministerie imposed vpon them c. The third fault is an Antichristian ministerie imposed and maintained Héere is no reason rendred why it is a false and Antichristian ministery which is imposed If yée be Prophets raised vp of God then wee must beléeue that which you say but they did not lie in any matter but euery man may sée that you haue in the former article lyed wee may not therefore giue c. The Brow Heere you say is no reason rendered by vs why it is a false and Antichristian ministery which is imposed But if you had better weighed these two former transgressions wherewith we charge you or duly considered of this or of your owne answer before you had put penne to paper you might haue gained this labour you haue taken and shame you are like to suffer by these your friuolous and indirect answeres c. What reasons yée haue brought in your two former accusations or in this third to prooue the Ministerie of England Antichristian let all wise men iudge Indéed if we will admit false accusations and hereticall opinions for reasons then haue yée said somewhat for in them yée are prompt and plentifull The shame yée speake of that I am like to sustaine by mine aunswers I doo not feare at all It appeareth plainely by your words it dooth not please yée that yée are not encountred in disputation by some famous learned men so desirous yée are of that glory But is it méete or is there any reason that presumptuous bold and rash ignorance should not be incountred but with great learning Sophisters nay poore artificers and Husbandmen are the euenest matches to dispute with yée If I had counselled with my learned brethren yée say they would haue counselled me not to write You haue put on the Lions skinne and so imagine that all the learned doo tremble at yée and the truth is they haue espied your long eares But rather to haue vsed my discretion in the Pulpit as they doo where wee may saye what wee lust without controulement for they consider an euill matter is to bee raked in c. If I did not know the contrary yée are so confident in your spéeches that I should almost beléeue yée But now that I know as sure as anye thing may be knowne that you doo impudently slaunder and belie the learned who though they disdaine to deale with mad frensie yet they like well in respect of the poore people which are ready to be seduced that your matters should be aunswered how will yee perswade me or others that yée are not without care what yée speake And if there be any sparke of modestie leaft in yée I will not say make some due proofe but euen a colourable shew that the learned of this land if I had conferred with them would haue giuen that counsell vnto me which you affirme and for that cause which you mention Now come your reasons you are perswaded by the worde of God that a true minister of Christ cannot be a minister of idolatrous and false worship Yee are rightly perswaded and I am fully of your minde in this point But where yée say ye haue prooued our worship to be such therein yée faile for ye haue falsely accused but not prooued Then yee were also perswaded by the word of God that a true Pastor cannot stand an heard to the Lords Goates and Swine blessing them with the blessing of the faithfull and deliuering to them the holy things of God as the Sacraments c. I haue shewed also in that your second accusation how presumptuously and heretically yée haue dealt in iudging Christian men to be Heathen and Swine In this third accusation your reason is in the word imposed That ministerie which is imposed vpon the flockes is Antichristian because they be not fréely chosen by the Lords faithfull people c. But the Ministrie of the Church of England is imposed c. I take exception against both the proposition and assumption of this argument For the proposition albeit the imposing of a minister vpon the flocke may carry an iniurie to the Church depriued of hir priuiledge and right yet it dooth not followe that the same minister or his ministery is Antichristian Our Sauiour in the place ye alledge Iohn 10. speaketh onely of Heretikes and false Prophets which clime ouer into the shéepefold he speaketh not of any which lead the shéepe to the doore that is to Christ whether their calling to the office haue béene such in all respects or not as it ought to be Secondly if by frée choise of the faithfull you meane that in the choosing of a Pastor the people or priuate members of the flocke are to giue their voices or else the minister is imposed and Antichristian then doo yée condemne all the Ministers of France of Geneua and other Churches For they are not chosen by the voices of the people neither doe they hold that way the most conuenient for the people to declare their consent but rather theyr silence as yée may sée in diuerse Epistles of Maister Beza and namely in the last But when a flocke is destitute of a Pastor their choise is after this sort The Prebyterie or Senate of Pastors