be_v easy_a for_o you_o to_o declaim_v as_o you_o do_v than_o to_o dispute_v against_o it_o but_o these_o man_n you_o say_v must_v be_v heretic_n because_o they_o separate_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n and_o therefore_o also_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o that_o which_o they_o say_v be_v invisible_a in_o as_o much_o as_o the_o invisible_a church_n communicate_v with_o the_o visible_a 35._o ans_fw-fr i_o may_v very_o just_o desire_v some_o proof_n of_o that_o which_o so_o confident_o you_o take_v for_o grant_v that_o there_o be_v no_o persecute_a and_o oppress_v maintainer_n of_o the_o truth_n in_o the_o day_n of_o our_o forefather_n but_o only_o such_o as_o dissemble_v their_o opinion_n and_o live_v in_o your_o communion_n and_o true_o if_o i_o shall_v say_v there_o be_v many_o of_o this_o condition_n i_o suppose_v i_o can_v make_v my_o affirmative_a much_o more_o probable_a than_o you_o can_v make_v your_o negative_a we_o read_v in_o scripture_n that_o elias_n conceive_v there_o be_v none_o leave_v beside_o himself_o in_o the_o whole_a kingdom_n of_o israel_n who_o have_v not_o revolt_v from_o god_n and_o yet_o god_n himself_o assure_v we_o that_o he_o be_v deceive_v and_o if_o such_o a_o man_n a_o prophet_n and_o one_o of_o the_o great_a err_v in_o his_o judgement_n touch_v his_o own_o time_n and_o his_o own_o country_n why_o may_v not_o you_o who_o be_v certain_o but_o a_o man_n and_o subject_a to_o the_o same_o passion_n as_o elias_n be_v mistake_v in_o think_v that_o in_o former_a age_n in_o some_o country_n or_o other_o there_o be_v not_o always_o some_o good_a christian_n which_o do_v not_o so_o much_o as_o external_o bow_v their_o knee_n to_o your_o baal_n but_o this_o answer_n i_o be_o content_a you_o shall_v take_v no_o notice_n of_o and_o think_v it_o sufficient_a to_o tell_v you_o that_o if_o it_o be_v true_a that_o this_o suppose_a invisible_a church_n do_v hypocritical_o communicate_v with_o the_o visible_a church_n in_o her_o corruption_n than_o protestant_n have_v cause_n nay_o necessity_n to_o forsake_v their_o communion_n also_o for_o otherwise_o they_o must_v have_v join_v with_o they_o in_o the_o practice_n of_o impiety_n and_o see_v they_o have_v such_o cause_n to_o separate_v they_o presume_v their_o separation_n can_v be_v schismatical_a 36._o yes_o you_o reply_v to_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o they_o with_o who_o they_o agree_v in_o faith_n be_v the_o most_o formal_a and_o proper_a sin_n of_o schism_n answ_n very_o true_a but_o i_o will_v fain_o know_v wherein_o i_o will_v glad_o be_v inform_v whether_o i_o be_v bind_v for_o fear_n of_o schism_n to_o communicate_v with_o those_o that_o believe_v as_o i_o do_v only_o in_o lawful_a thing_n or_o absolute_o in_o every_o thing_n whether_o i_o be_o to_o join_v with_o they_o in_o superstition_n and_o idolatry_n and_o not_o only_o in_o a_o common_a profession_n of_o the_o faith_n wherein_o we_o agree_v but_o in_o a_o common_a dissimulation_n or_o abjuration_n of_o it_o this_o be_v that_o which_o you_o will_v have_v they_o do_v or_o else_o forsooth_o they_o must_v be_v schismatic_n but_o hereafter_o i_o pray_v remember_v that_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n of_o communicate_v even_o with_o true_a believer_n in_o wicked_a action_n nay_o that_o there_o be_v a_o necessity_n herein_o to_o separate_v from_o they_o and_o then_o i_o dare_v say_v even_o you_o be_v their_o judge_n the_o reasonableness_n of_o their_o cause_n to_o separate_v shall_v according_a to_o my_o first_o observation_n justify_v their_o separation_n from_o be_v schismatical_a 37._o arg._n but_o the_o property_n of_o schism_n according_a to_o d._n potter_n be_v to_o cut_v off_o from_o the_o hope_n of_o salvation_n the_o church_n from_o which_o it_o separate_v and_o these_o protestant_n have_v this_o property_n therefore_o they_o be_v schismatic_n 38._o ans_fw-fr i_o deny_v the_o syllogism_n it_o be_v no_o better_a than_o this_o one_o smptom_n of_o the_o plague_n be_v a_o fever_n but_o such_o a_o man_n have_v a_o fever_n therefore_o he_o have_v the_o plague_n the_o true_a conclusion_n which_o issue_v out_o of_o these_o premise_n shall_v be_v this_o therefore_o he_o have_v one_o symptom_n of_o the_o plague_n and_o so_o likewise_o in_o the_o former_a therefore_o they_o have_v one_o property_n or_o one_o quality_n of_o schismatic_n and_o as_o in_o the_o former_a instance_n the_o man_n that_o have_v one_o sign_n of_o the_o plague_n may_v by_o reason_n of_o the_o absence_n of_o other_o requisite_n not_o have_v the_o plague_n so_o these_o protestant_n may_v have_v something_o of_o schismatic_n and_o yet_o not_o be_v schismatic_n a_o tyrant_n sentence_v a_o man_n to_o death_n for_o his_o pleasure_n and_o a_o just_a judge_n that_o condemn_v a_o malefactor_n do_v both_o sentence_n a_o man_n to_o death_n and_o so_o for_o the_o matter_n do_v both_o the_o same_o thing_n yet_o the_o one_o do_v wicked_o the_o other_o just_o what_o be_v the_o reason_n because_o the_o one_o have_v cause_n the_o other_o have_v not_o in_o like_a manner_n schismatic_n either_o always_o or_o general_o denounce_v damnation_n to_o they_o from_o who_o they_o separate_v the_o same_o do_v these_o protestant_n &_o yet_o be_v not_o schismatic_n the_o reason_n because_o schismatic_n do_v it_o and_o do_v it_o without_o cause_n and_o protestant_n have_v cause_n for_o what_o they_o do_v the_o impiety_n of_o your_o church_n be_v general_o speak_v damnable_a unless_o where_o they_o be_v excuse_v by_o ignorance_n and_o expiate_v at_o least_o by_o a_o general_a repentance_n in_o fine_a though_o perhaps_o it_o may_v be_v true_a that_o all_o schismatic_n do_v so_o yet_o universal_a affirmative_n be_v not_o convert_v and_o therefore_o it_o follow_v not_o by_o any_o good_a logic_n that_o all_o that_o do_v so_o when_o there_o be_v just_a cause_n for_o it_o must_v be_v schismatic_n the_o cause_n in_o this_o matter_n of_o separation_n be_v all_o in_o all_o and_o that_o for_o aught_o i_o see_v you_o never_o think_v of_o but_o if_o these_o rigid_a protestant_n have_v just_a cause_n to_o cut_v off_o your_o church_n from_o the_o hope_n of_o salvation_n how_o can_v the_o mild_a sort_n allow_v hope_n of_o salvation_n to_o the_o member_n of_o this_o church_n ans_fw-fr distinguish_v the_o quality_n of_o the_o person_n censure_v and_o this_o seem_a repugnance_n of_o their_o censure_n will_v vanish_v into_o nothing_o for_o your_o church_n may_v be_v consider_v either_o in_o regard_n of_o those_o in_o who_o either_o negligence_n or_o pride_n or_o worldly_a fear_n or_o hope_n or_o some_o other_o voluntary_a sin_n be_v the_o cause_n of_o their_o ignorance_n which_o i_o fear_n be_v the_o case_n of_o the_o generality_n of_o man_n among_o you_o or_o in_o regard_n of_o those_o who_o owe_v their_o error_n from_o truth_n to_o want_v of_o capacity_n or_o default_n of_o instruction_n either_o in_o respect_n of_o those_o that_o may_v know_v the_o truth_n and_o will_v not_o or_o of_o those_o who_o will_v know_v the_o truth_n but_o all_o thing_n consider_v can_v in_o respect_n of_o those_o that_o have_v eye_n to_o see_v and_o will_v not_o see_v or_o those_o that_o will_v glad_o see_v but_o want_v eye_n or_o light_n consider_v the_o former_a sort_n of_o man_n which_o your_o more_o rigid_a censure_n seem_v especial_o to_o reflect_v upon_o and_o the_o heavy_a sentence_n will_v not_o be_v too_o heavy_a consider_v the_o latter_a and_o the_o mild_a will_v not_o be_v too_o mild_a so_o that_o here_o be_v no_o difference_n but_o in_o word_n only_o neither_o be_v you_o flatter_v by_o the_o one_o nor_o uncharitable_o censure_v by_o the_o other_o 39_o your_o next_o blow_n be_v direct_v against_o the_o mild_a sort_n of_o protestant_n who_o you_o say_v involve_v themselves_o in_o the_o sin_n of_o schism_n by_o communicate_v with_o those_o as_o you_o call_v they_o exterminate_v spirit_n who_o you_o conceive_v yourself_o to_o have_v prove_v schismatic_n and_o now_o load_v they_o further_o with_o the_o crime_n of_o heresy_n for_o say_v you_o if_o you_o hold_v yourselves_o oblige_v under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n to_o forsake_v the_o communion_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n by_o reason_n of_o her_o error_n which_o yet_o you_o confess_v be_v not_o fundamental_a shall_v it_o not_o be_v much_o more_o damnable_a to_o live_v in_o confraternity_n with_o these_o who_o defend_v a_o error_n of_o the_o fail_n of_o the_o church_n which_o in_o the_o donatist_n you_o confess_v to_o have_v be_v proper_o heretical_a 40._o ans_fw-fr you_o mistake_v in_o think_v that_o protestant_n hold_v themselves_o oblige_v not_o to_o communicate_v with_o you_o only_o or_o principal_o by_o reason_n of_o your_o error_n and_o corruption_n for_o the_o true_a reason_n according_a to_o my_o three_o observation_n be_v not_o so_o much_o because_o you_o maintain_v error_n and_o corruption_n
cleanse_v themselves_o and_o yet_o continue_v part_n of_o the_o body_n and_o what_o reason_n then_o in_o the_o world_n be_v there_o if_o the_o whole_a visible_a church_n be_v overcome_v with_o tare_n and_o weed_n of_o superstition_n and_o corruption_n but_o that_o some_o member_n of_o it_o may_v reform_v themselves_o and_o yet_o continue_v still_o true_a member_n of_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n and_o not_o be_v make_v no_o member_n but_o the_o better_a by_o their_o reformation_n 50._o we_o acknowledge_v that_o we_o can_v as_o matter_n now_o stand_v separate_a from_o your_o corruption_n but_o we_o must_v depart_v from_o your_o external_n communion_n for_o you_o have_v so_o order_v thing_n that_o whosoever_o will_v communicate_v with_o you_o at_o all_o must_v communicate_v with_o you_o in_o your_o corruption_n but_o it_o be_v you_o that_o will_v not_o perceive_v the_o difference_n between_o be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o church_n and_o be_v in_o external_a communion_n with_o all_o the_o other_o part_n of_o it_o take_v for_o grant_v that_o which_o be_v certain_o false_a that_o no_o two_o man_n or_o church_n divide_v in_o external_a communion_n can_v be_v both_o true_a part_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n 51._o we_o be_v not_o to_o learn_v the_o difference_n between_o schism_n and_o heresy_n for_o heresy_n we_o conceive_v a_o obstinate_a defence_n of_o any_o error_n against_o any_o necessary_a article_n of_o the_o christian_a faith_n and_o schism_n a_o causeless_a separation_n of_o one_o part_n of_o the_o church_n from_o another_o but_o this_o we_o say_v that_o if_o we_o convince_v you_o of_o error_n and_o corruption_n profess_a and_o practise_v in_o your_o communion_n than_o we_o can_v be_v schismatic_n for_o refuse_v to_o join_v with_o you_o in_o the_o profession_n of_o these_o error_n and_o the_o practice_n of_o these_o corruption_n and_o therefore_o you_o must_v free_v yourselves_o from_o error_n or_o we_o from_o schism_n 52._o last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o you_o have_v demonstrate_v against_o we_o that_o protestant_n divide_v themselves_o from_o the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n add_v which_o external_a communion_n be_v corrupt_v and_o we_o shall_v confess_v the_o accusation_n and_o glory_n in_o it_o but_o this_o be_v not_o that_o quod_fw-la erat_fw-la demonstrandum_fw-la but_o that_o we_o divide_v ourselves_o from_o the_o church_n that_o be_v make_v ourselves_o outlaw_n from_o it_o and_o no_o member_n of_o it_o and_o moreover_o in_o the_o reason_n of_o your_o separation_n from_o the_o external_a communion_n of_o your_o church_n you_o be_v mistake_v for_o it_o be_v not_o so_o much_o because_o she_o your_o church_n as_o because_o your_o church_n external_a communion_n be_v corrupt_v and_o need_v reformation_n 53._o that_o a_o pretence_n of_o reformation_n will_v acquit_v no_o man_n from_o schism_n we_o grant_v very_o willing_o and_o therefore_o say_v that_o it_o concern_v every_o man_n who_o separate_v from_o any_o church_n communion_n even_o as_o much_o as_o his_o salvation_n be_v worth_a to_o look_v most_o careful_o to_o it_o that_o the_o cause_n of_o his_o separation_n be_v just_a and_o necessary_a for_o unless_o it_o be_v necessary_a it_o can_v very_o hardly_o be_v sufficient_a but_o whether_o a_o true_a reformation_n of_o ourselves_o from_o error_n superstition_n and_o impiety_n will_v not_o justify_v our_o separation_n in_o these_o thing_n our_o separation_n i_o say_v from_o they_o who_o will_v not_o reform_v themselves_o and_o as_o much_o as_o in_o they_o lie_v hinder_v other_o from_o do_v so_o this_o be_v the_o point_n you_o shall_v have_v speak_v to_o but_o have_v not_o as_o for_o the_o sentence_n of_o the_o father_n to_o which_o you_o refer_v we_o for_o the_o determination_n of_o this_o question_n i_o suppose_v by_o what_o i_o have_v say_v above_o the_o reader_n understand_v by_o allege_v they_o you_o have_v gain_v little_a credit_n to_o your_o cause_n or_o person_n and_o that_o if_o they_o be_v competent_a judge_n of_o this_o controversy_n their_o sentence_n be_v against_o you_o much_o rather_o than_o for_o you_o 56._o but_o your_o argument_n you_o conceive_v will_v be_v more_o convince_a if_o we_o consider_v that_o when_o luther_n appear_v there_o be_v not_o two_o distinct_a visible_a true_a church_n one_o pure_a the_o other_o corrupt_v but_o one_o church_n only_o ans_fw-fr the_o ground_n of_o this_o be_v no_o way_n certain_a nor_o here_o sufficient_o prove_v for_o whereas_o you_o say_v history_n be_v silent_a of_o any_o such_o matter_n i_o answer_v there_o be_v no_o necessity_n that_o you_o or_o i_o shall_v have_v read_v all_o history_n that_o may_v be_v extant_a of_o this_o matter_n nor_o that_o all_o shall_v be_v extant_a that_o be_v write_v much_o less_o extant_a uncorrupted_a especial_o consider_v your_o church_n which_o have_v lat_o all_o power_n in_o her_o hand_n have_v be_v so_o pernitious_o industrious_a in_o corrupt_v the_o monument_n of_o antiquity_n that_o make_v against_o she_o nor_o that_o all_o record_n shall_v remain_v which_o be_v write_v nor_o that_o all_o shall_v be_v record_v which_o be_v do_v last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o suppose_v a_o visible_a pure_a church_n luther_n must_v be_v a_o schismatic_a who_o separate_v from_o all_o visible_a church_n i_o tell_v you_o if_o you_o will_v suppose_v a_o visible_a church_n extant_a before_o and_o when_o luther_n arise_v conformable_a to_o he_o in_o all_o point_n of_o doctrine_n necessary_a and_o profitable_a then_o luther_n separate_v not_o from_o this_o church_n but_o adjoin_v himself_o to_o it_o not_o indeed_o in_o place_n which_o be_v not_o necessary_a not_o in_o external_a communion_n which_o be_v impossible_a but_o by_o the_o union_n of_o faith_n and_o charity_n upon_o these_o ground_n i_o say_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o this_o argument_n be_v no_o way_n make_v certain_a yet_o because_o it_o be_v not_o manifest_o false_a i_o be_o content_a to_o let_v it_o pass_v and_o for_o aught_o i_o see_v it_o be_v very_o safe_a for_o i_o to_o do_v so_o for_o you_o build_v nothing_o upon_o it_o which_o i_o may_v not_o fair_o grant_v for_o what_o do_v you_o conclude_v from_o hence_o but_o that_o see_v there_o be_v no_o visible_a church_n but_o corrupt_v luther_n forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o corrupt_a church_n can_v not_o but_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n well_o let_v this_o also_o be_v grant_v what_o will_v come_v of_o it_o what_o that_o luther_n must_v be_v a_o schismatic_a by_o no_o mean_n for_o not_o every_o separation_n but_o only_o a_o causeless_a separation_n from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n we_o maintain_v to_o be_v schismatical_a hereunto_o may_v be_v add_v that_o though_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v corrupt_v yet_o proper_o speak_v it_o be_v not_o true_a that_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n forsake_v the_o whole_a corrupt_a church_n or_o the_o external_a communion_n of_o it_o but_o only_o that_o he_o forsake_v that_o part_n of_o it_o which_o be_v corrupt_v and_o still_o will_v be_v so_o and_o forsake_v not_o but_o only_o reform_v another_o part_n which_o part_v they_o themselves_o be_v and_o i_o suppose_v you_o will_v not_o go_v about_o to_o persuade_v we_o that_o they_o forsake_v themselves_o or_o their_o own_o communion_n and_o if_o you_o urge_v that_o they_o join_v themselves_o to_o no_o other_o part_n therefore_o they_o separate_v from_o the_o whole_a i_o say_v it_o follow_v not_o in_o as_o much_o as_o themselves_o be_v a_o part_n of_o it_o and_o still_o continue_v so_o and_o therefore_o can_v no_o more_o separate_v from_o the_o whole_a than_o from_o themselves_o thus_o though_o there_o be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o people_n of_o rome_n to_o who_o the_o plebeian_n join_v themselves_o when_o they_o make_v their_o secession_n into_o the_o aventine_n hill_n yet_o they_o divide_v themselves_o from_o the_o patrician_n only_o and_o not_o from_o the_o whole_a people_n because_o themselves_o be_v a_o part_n of_o this_o people_n and_o they_o divide_v not_o from_o themselves_o 57_o ad_fw-la §_o 18._o here_o you_o prove_v that_o which_o no_o man_n deny_v that_o corruption_n in_o manner_n yield_v no_o sufficient_a cause_n to_o leave_v the_o church_n yet_o sure_o it_o yield_v sufficient_a cause_n to_o cast_v they_o out_o of_o the_o church_n that_o be_v after_o the_o church_n public_a admonition_n obstinate_a in_o notorious_a impiety_n neither_o do_v the_o cut_n off_o such_o man_n from_o the_o church_n lay_v any_o necessity_n upon_o we_o either_o to_o go_v out_o of_o the_o world_n or_o out_o of_o the_o church_n but_o rather_o put_v these_o man_n out_o of_o the_o church_n into_o the_o world_n where_o we_o may_v converse_v with_o they_o free_o without_o scandal_n to_o the_o church_n our_o bless_a saviour_n foretell_v you_o say_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v in_o the_o church_n tare_n with_o choice_n
or_o ill_a opinion_n do_v gather_v otherwise_o than_o they_o ought_v for_o to_o this_o church_n for_o a_o more_o powerful_a principality_n it_o be_v necessary_a that_o all_o church_n resort_n that_o be_v all_o faithful_a people_n undique_fw-la of_o what_o place_n soever_o in_o which_o roman_a church_n the_o tradition_n from_o the_o apostle_n have_v always_o be_v conserve_v from_o those_o who_o be_v undique_fw-la every_o where_n answ_n though_o at_o the_o first_o hear_v the_o glorious_a attribute_n here_o give_v and_o that_o just_o to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n the_o confound_a heretic_n with_o her_o tradition_n and_o say_v it_o be_v necessary_a for_o all_o church_n to_o resort_v to_o she_o may_v sound_v like_o argument_n for_o you_o yet_o he_o that_o be_v attentive_a i_o hope_v will_v easy_o discover_v that_o it_o may_v be_v good_a and_o rational_a in_o irenaeus_n have_v to_o do_v with_o heretic_n who_o somewhat_o like_o those_o who_o will_v be_v the_o only_a catholic_n decline_v a_o trial_n by_o scripture_n as_o not_o contain_v the_o truth_n of_o christ_n perfect_o and_o not_o fit_a to_o decide_v controversy_n without_o recourse_n to_o tradition_n i_o say_v he_o will_v easy_o perceive_v that_o it_o may_v be_v rational_a in_o irenaeus_n to_o urge_v they_o with_o any_o tradition_n of_o more_o credit_n than_o their_o own_o especial_o a_o tradition_n consonant_a to_o scripture_n and_o even_o contain_v in_o it_o and_o yet_o that_o it_o may_v be_v irrational_a in_o you_o to_o urge_v we_o who_o do_v not_o decline_v scripture_n but_o appeal_n to_o it_o as_o a_o perfect_a rule_n of_o faith_n with_o a_o tradition_n which_o we_o pretend_v be_v many_o way_n repugnant_a to_o scripture_n and_o repugnant_a to_o a_o tradition_n far_o more_o general_a than_o itself_o which_o give_v testimony_n to_o scripture_n and_o last_o repugnant_a to_o itself_o as_o give_v attestation_n both_o to_o scripture_n and_o to_o doctrine_n plain_o contrary_a to_o scripture_n second_o that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v then_o a_o far_o great_a argument_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o her_o tradition_n when_o it_o be_v unite_v with_o all_o other_o apostolic_a church_n than_o now_o when_o it_o be_v divide_v from_o they_o according_a to_o that_o of_o tertullian_n have_v the_o church_n err_v they_o will_v have_v vary_v but_o that_o which_o be_v the_o same_o in_o all_o can_v be_v error_n but_o tradition_n and_o therefore_o though_o irenaeus_n his_o argument_n may_v be_v very_o probable_a yet_o you_o may_v be_v worth_a nothing_o three_o that_o fourteen_o hundred_o year_n may_v have_v make_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o alteration_n in_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o river_n though_o near_o the_o fountain_n they_o may_v retain_v their_o native_a and_o unmixed_a sincerity_n yet_o in_o long_a progress_n can_v but_o take_v in_o much_o mixture_n that_o come_v not_o from_o the_o fountain_n and_o therefore_o the_o roman_a tradition_n though_o then_o pure_a may_v now_o be_v corrupt_a and_o impure_a and_o so_o this_o argument_n be_v one_o of_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v the_o worse_a for_o wear_v may_v in_o irenaeus_n his_o time_n be_v strong_a and_o vigorous_a and_o after_o decline_v and_o decay_v may_v long_o since_o have_v fall_v to_o nothing_o especial_o consider_v that_o irenaeus_n play_v the_o historian_n only_o and_o not_o the_o prophet_n and_o say_v only_o that_o the_o apostolic_a tradition_n have_v be_v always_o there_o as_o in_o other_o apostolic_a church_n conserve_v or_o observe_v choose_v you_o whither_o but_o that_o it_o shall_v be_v always_o so_o he_o say_v not_o neither_o have_v he_o any_o warrant_n he_o know_v well_o enough_o that_o there_o be_v foretell_v a_o great_a fall_v away_o of_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n to_o antichrist_n that_o the_o roman_a church_n in_o particular_a be_v forewarn_v that_o she_o also_o nay_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o the_o gentile_n may_v fall_v if_o they_o look_v not_o to_o their_o stand_n and_o therefore_o to_o secure_v she_o that_o she_o shall_v stand_v for_o ever_o he_o have_v no_o reason_n nor_o authority_n four_o that_o it_o appear_v manifest_o out_o of_o this_o book_n of_o irenaeus_n quote_v by_o you_o that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o chiliast_n be_v in_o his_o judgement_n apostolic_a tradition_n as_o also_o it_o be_v esteem_v for_o aught_o appear_v to_o the_o contrary_a by_o all_o the_o doctor_n and_o saint_n and_o martyr_n of_o or_o about_o his_o time_n for_o all_o that_o speak_v of_o it_o or_o who_o judgement_n in_o the_o point_n be_v any_o way_n record_v be_v for_o it_o and_o justin_n martyr_n profess_v that_o all_o good_a and_o orthodox_n christian_n of_o his_o time_n believe_v it_o and_o those_o that_o do_v not_o he_o reckon_v among_o heretic_n now_o i_o demand_v be_v this_o tradition_n one_o of_o those_o that_o be_v conserve_v and_o observe_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o be_v it_o not_o if_o not_o have_v iraeneus_n know_v so_o much_o he_o must_v have_v retract_v this_o commendation_n of_o that_o church_n if_o it_o be_v than_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n contradict_v the_o ancient_n and_o account_v it_o heretical_a and_o then_o sure_o it_o can_v be_v no_o certain_a note_n of_o heresy_n to_o depart_v from_o they_o who_o have_v depart_v from_o themselves_o and_o prove_v themselves_o subject_a unto_o error_n by_o hold_v contradiction_n five_o and_o last_o that_o out_o of_o the_o story_n of_o the_o church_n it_o be_v as_o manifest_a as_o the_o light_n at_o noon_n that_o though_o iraeneus_n do_v esteem_v the_o roman_a tradition_n a_o great_a argument_n of_o the_o doctrine_n which_o he_o there_o deliver_v and_o defend_v against_o the_o heretic_n of_o his_o time_n viz._n that_o there_o be_v one_o god_n yet_o he_o be_v very_o far_o from_o think_v that_o church_n be_v and_o ever_o shall_v be_v a_o safe_a keeper_n and_o a_o infallible_a witness_n of_o tradition_n in_o general_a inasmuch_o as_o in_o his_o own_o life_n his_o action_n proclaim_v the_o contrary_n for_o when_o victor_n bishop_n of_o rome_n obtrude_v the_o roman_a tradition_n touch_v the_o time_n of_o easter_n upon_o the_o asian_a bishop_n under_o the_o pain_n of_o excommunication_n and_o damnation_n iraeneus_n and_o all_o the_o other_o western_a bishop_n though_o agree_v with_o he_o in_o his_o observation_n yet_o sharp_o reprehend_v he_o for_o excommunicate_v the_o asian_a bishop_n for_o their_o disagree_v plain_o show_v that_o they_o esteem_v that_o not_o a_o necessary_a doctrine_n and_o a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o excommunication_n which_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n and_o his_o adherent_n do_v so_o account_v of_o for_o otherwise_o how_o can_v they_o have_v reprehend_v he_o for_o excommunicate_v they_o have_v they_o conceive_v the_o cause_n of_o his_o excommunication_n just_a and_o sufficient_a and_o beside_o evident_o declare_v that_o they_o esteem_v not_o separation_n from_o the_o roman_a church_n a_o certain_a mark_n of_o heresy_n see_v they_o esteem_v not_o they_o heretic_n though_o separate_v and_o cut_v off_o from_o the_o roman_a church_n 31._o obj._n s._n austin_n say_v in_o psalm_n count_v partem_fw-la donati_n it_o grieve_v we_o to_o see_v you_o so_o to_o lie_v cut_v off_o number_v the_o priest_n even_o from_o the_o sea_n of_o peter_n and_o consider_v in_o that_o order_n of_o father_n who_o succeed_v to_o who_o she_o be_v the_o rock_n which_o the_o proud_a gate_n of_o hell_n do_v not_o overcome_v where_o he_o seem_v to_o say_v that_o the_o succession_n in_o the_o sea_n of_o peter_n be_v the_o rock_n which_o our_o saviour_n mean_v when_o he_o say_v upon_o this_o rock_n will_v i_o build_v my_o church_n ans_fw-fr i_o answer_v first_o we_o have_v no_o reason_n to_o be_v confident_a of_o the_o truth_n hereof_o because_o s._n austin_n himself_o be_v not_o but_o retract_v it_o as_o uncertain_a and_o leaf_n to_o the_o reader_n whether_o he_o will_v think_v that_o or_o another_o more_o probable_a retr_n l._n 1._o c._n 26._o second_o what_o he_o say_v of_o the_o succession_n in_o the_o roman_a church_n in_o this_o place_n he_o say_v it_o elsewhere_o of_o all_o the_o succession_n in_o all_o other_o apostolic_a church_n three_o that_o as_o in_o this_o place_n he_o urge_v the_o donatist_n with_o separation_n from_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o a_o argument_n of_o their_o error_n so_o elsewhere_o he_o press_v they_o with_o their_o separation_n from_o other_o apostolic_a church_n nay_o more_o from_o these_o than_o from_o that_o because_o in_o rome_n the_o donatist_n have_v a_o bishop_n though_o not_o a_o perpetual_a succession_n of_o they_o but_o in_o other_o apostolic_a church_n they_o want_v both_o these_o scatter_a man_n say_v he_o of_o the_o donatist_n epist_n 165._o read_v in_o the_o holy_a book_n the_o church_n to_o which_o the_o apostle_n write_v and_o have_v no_o bishop_n in_o they_o but_o what_o be_v more_o perverse_a and_o
err_v person_n that_o lead_v good_a life_n shall_v be_v judge_v of_o charitable_o c._n 7.33_o a_o man_n may_v learn_v of_o the_o church_n to_o confute_v its_o error_n c._n 3.40_o we_o do_v well_o to_o forsake_v the_o roman_a church_n for_o her_o error_n though_o we_o afterward_o may_v err_v out_o of_o it_o c._n 5.63_o 64_o 65_o 67_o 87_o 92._o we_o must_v not_o adhere_v to_o a_o church_n in_o profess_v the_o least_o error_n lest_o we_o shall_v not_o profess_v with_o her_o necessary_a doctrine_n c._n 3.56_o the_o example_n of_o those_o that_o forsake_v popish_a error_n have_v deny_v necessary_a truth_n no_o argument_n against_o protestant_n c._n 3.63_o external_n communion_n of_o a_o church_n may_v be_v leave_v without_o leave_v a_o church_n c._n 5.32_o 45_o 47._o f._n whether_o faith_n be_v destroy_v by_o deny_v a_o truth_n testify_v by_o god_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 25._o c._n 6.49_o c._n 7.19_o the_o object_n of_o faith_n of_o two_o sort_n essential_a and_o occasional_a c._n 4.3_o certainty_n of_o faith_n less_o than_o the_o high_a degree_n may_v please_v god_n and_o save_v a_o man_n c._n 1.8_o &_o 6.3_o 4_o 5._o i'faith_o less_o than_o infallible_o certain_a may_v resist_v temptation_n &_o difficulty_n c._n 6.5_o there_o may_v be_v faith_n where_o the_o church_n and_o its_o infallibility_n beget_v it_o not_o c._n 2.49_o faith_n do_v not_o go_v before_o scripture_n but_o follow_v its_o efficacy_n c._n 2.48_o protestant_n have_v sufficient_a mean_n to_o know_v the_o certainty_n of_o their_o faith_n c._n 2.152_o in_o the_o roman_a church_n the_o last_o resolution_n of_o faith_n be_v into_o motive_n of_o credibility_n c._n 2.154_o the_o father_n declare_v their_o judgement_n of_o article_n but_o do_v not_o require_v their_o declaration_n to_o be_v receive_v under_o anathema_n c._n 4.18_o protestant_n do_v not_o forsake_v the_o church_n though_o they_o forksook_v its_o error_n c._n 3.11_o sufficient_a foundation_n for_o faith_n without_o infallible_a certainty_n c._n 6.6_o 45._o what_o protestant_n mean_v by_o fundamental_a doctrine_n c._n 4.52_o in_o what_o sense_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n err_v not_o fundamental_o ans_fw-fr pref._n 20._o to_o be_v unerring_a in_o fundamental_o can_v be_v say_v of_o no_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n c._n 3.55_o to_o say_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v always_o a_o church_n not_o err_v in_o fundamental_o be_v to_o say_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v always_o a_o church_n c._n 3.55_o a_o church_n be_v not_o safe_a though_o retain_v fundamental_o when_o it_o build_v hay_n and_o stubble_n on_o the_o foundation_n and_o neglect_v to_o reform_v her_o error_n c._n 5.61_o ignorance_n of_o what_o point_v in_o particular_a be_v fundamental_a do_v not_o make_v it_o uncertain_a whether_o we_o do_v not_o err_v fundamental_o or_o differ_v in_o fundamental_o among_o ourselves_o c._n 7.14_o g._n the_o four_o gospel_n contain_v all_o necessary_a doctrine_n c._n 4.40_o 41_o 42_o 43._o a_o infallible_a guide_n not_o necessary_a for_o avoid_v heresy_n c._n 2.127_o the_o apostolic_a church_n a_o infallible_a guide_n to_o which_o we_o may_v resort_v c._n 3.69_o the_o church_n may_v not_o be_v a_o infallible_a guide_n in_o fundamental_o though_o it_o be_v infallible_a in_o fundamental_o c._n 3.39_o that_o the_o roman_a church_n shall_v be_v the_o only_a infallible_a guide_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o scripture_n say_v nothing_o concern_v it_o be_v incredible_a c._n 6.20_o h._n the_o difference_n betwixt_o heresy_n and_o schism_n c._n 5.51_o there_o be_v no_o new_a heresy_n no_o more_o than_o new_a article_n of_o faith_n c._n 4.18_o 37_o 38._o separation_n from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n no_o mark_n of_o heresy_n by_o the_o father_n who_o citation_n be_v answer_v c._n 6.22_o 23_o 24_o 25_o 26_o 27_o 2d_o 30_o 31_o 33_o 34._o no_o mark_n of_o heresy_n to_o want_v succession_n of_o bishop_n hold_v the_o same_o doctrine_n c._n 6.18_o 41._o we_o be_v not_o heretic_n for_o oppose_a thing_n propound_v by_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n for_o divine_a truth_n c._n 6.11_o 12._o whether_o protestant_n schismatical_o cut_v off_o the_o roman_a church_n from_o hope_n of_o salvation_n c._n 5.38_o i._o the_o jewish_a church_n have_v no_o infallibility_n annex_v to_o it_o and_o if_o it_o have_v there_o be_v no_o necessity_n that_o the_o christian_a church_n shall_v have_v it_o c._n 2.141_o the_o impose_v a_o necessity_n of_o profess_v know_v error_n and_o practise_v know_v corruption_n be_v a_o just_a cause_n of_o separate_n from_o a_o church_n c._n 5.31_o 36_o 40_o 50_o 59_o 60_o 68_o 69._o indifferency_n to_o all_o religion_n false_o charge_v upon_o protestant_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 3._o &_o c._n 3.12_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o church_n infallibility_n make_v way_n for_o heresy_n pref._n 10._o a_o infallible_a guide_n not_o needful_a for_o avoid_v heresy_n c._n 2.127_o the_o church_n infallibility_n have_v not_o the_o same_o evidence_n as_o there_o be_v for_o the_o scripture_n c._n 3.30_o 31._o the_o church_n infallibility_n can_v no_o way_n be_v better_o assure_v to_o we_o than_o the_o scripture_n incorruption_n c._n 2.25_o &_o c._n 3.27_o the_o church_n infallibility_n be_v not_o prove_v from_o the_o promise_n that_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n shall_v not_o prevail_v against_o it_o c._n 3.70_o nor_o from_o the_o promise_n of_o the_o spirit_n lead_v into_o all_o truth_n which_o be_v make_v only_o to_o the_o apostle_n c._n 3.71_o 72._o the_o church_n infallibility_n not_o prove_v from_o ephes_n c._n 11_o 12_o 13._o he_o give_v some_o apostle_n &c._n &c._n till_o we_o all_o come_v in_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o faith_n etc._n etc._n c._n 3.79_o 80._o that_o god_n have_v appoint_v a_o infallible_a judge_n of_o controversy_n because_o such_o a_o one_o be_v desirable_a and_o useful_a be_v a_o weak_a conclusion_n c._n 2._o from_o 128._o to_o 136._o inclusive_a infallibility_n in_o fundamental_o no_o warrant_n to_o adhere_v to_o a_o church_n in_o all_o that_o she_o propose_v c._n 3.57_o infallible_a interpretation_n of_o scripture_n vain_o boast_v of_o by_o the_o roman_a church_n c._n 2.93_o 94_o 95._o whether_o the_o denial_n of_o the_o church_n infallibility_n leave_v man_n to_o their_o private_a spirit_n reason_n and_o discourse_n and_o what_o be_v the_o harm_n of_o it_o pref._n 12.13_o &_o c._n 2.110_o traditional_a interpretation_n of_o scripture_n how_o ill_o preserve_v c._n 2.10_o interprecation_n of_o scripture_n which_o private_a man_n make_v for_o themselves_o not_o pretend_v to_o prescribe_v their_o sense_n to_o other_o though_o false_a or_o seditious_a endanger_v only_o themselves_o c._n 2.122_o allow_v the_o pope_n or_o roman_a church_n to_o be_v a_o decisive_a interpreter_n of_o christ_n law_n and_o she_o can_v evacuate_v they_o and_o make_v what_o law_n she_o please_v pref._n 10.11_o &_o c._n 2.1_o s._n irenaeus_n account_n of_o tradition_n favour_v not_o popery_n c._n 2.144_o 145_o 146._o his_o say_n that_o no_o reformation_n can_v countervail_v the_o danger_n of_o a_o schism_n explain_v c._n 5.11_o a_o live_a judge_n to_o end_v controversy_n about_o the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n not_o necessary_a c._n 2.12_o 13._o if_o christ_n have_v intend_v such_o a_o judge_n in_o religion_n he_o will_v have_v name_v he_o which_o he_o have_v not_o do_v c._n 2.23_o c._n 3.69_o c._n 6.20_o though_o a_o live_a judge_n be_v necessary_a to_o determine_v civil_a cause_n yet_o not_o necessary_a for_o religious_a cause_n c._n 2._o from_o 14._o to_o 22._o inclus_fw-la if_o there_o be_v a_o judge_n of_o controversy_n no_o necessity_n it_o shall_v be_v the_o roman_a church_n c._n 3.69_o roman_n catholic_n set_v up_o as_o many_o judge_n in_o religion_n as_o protestant_n c._n 2.116_o 118_o 153._o a_o judgement_n of_o discretion_n must_v be_v allow_v to_o every_o man_n for_o himself_o about_o religion_n c._n 2.11_o the_o protestant_a doctrine_n of_o justification_n take_v altogether_o not_o a_o licentious_a doctrine_n c._n 7.30_o when_o they_o say_v they_o be_v justify_v by_o faith_n alone_o yet_o they_o make_v good_a work_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n c._n 7.30_o k._n our_o obligation_n to_o know_v any_o divine_a truth_n arise_v from_o god_n manifest_a reveal_n it_o c._n 3.19_o l._n how_o we_o be_v assure_v in_o what_o language_n the_o scripture_n be_v uncorrupted_a c._n 2.55_o 56_o 57_o to_o leave_v a_o church_n and_o to_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o a_o church_n be_v not_o the_o same_o thing_n c._n 5.32_o 45_o 47._o luther_n separation_n not_o like_a that_o of_o the_o donatist_n and_o why_o c._n 5.33.101_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n do_v not_o divide_v from_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v a_o part_n of_o it_o but_o only_o reform_v themselves_o forsake_v the_o corrupt_a part_n c._n 5.56_o luther_n oppose_v himself_n to_o all_o in_o his_o reformation_n no_o objection_n against_o he_o c._n 5.89_o 90._o we_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o justify_v all_o that_o luther_n say_v
the_o assumption_n of_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n etc._n etc._n other_o again_o mince_v and_o palliate_v the_o matter_n with_o this_o pretence_n that_o your_o church_n undertake_v not_o to_o coin_v new_a article_n of_o faith_n but_o only_o to_o declare_v those_o that_o want_v sufficient_a declaration_n but_o if_o sufficient_a declaration_n be_v necessary_a to_o make_v any_o doctrine_n a_o article_n of_o faith_n than_o this_o doctrine_n which_o before_o want_v it_o be_v not_o before_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n and_o your_o church_n by_o give_v it_o the_o essential_a form_n and_o last_o compliment_n of_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n make_v it_o though_o not_o a_o truth_n yet_o certain_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n but_o i_o will_v fain_o know_v whether_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n know_v this_o doctrine_n which_o you_o pretend_v have_v the_o matter_n but_o want_v the_o form_n of_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n that_o be_v sufficient_a declaration_n whether_o they_o know_v it_o to_o be_v a_o necessary_a article_n of_o the_o faith_n or_o no_o if_o they_o know_v it_o not_o to_o be_v so_o then_o either_o they_o teach_v what_o they_o know_v not_o which_o be_v very_o strange_a or_o else_o they_o teach_v it_o not_o and_o if_o not_o i_o will_v glad_o be_v inform_v see_v you_o pretend_v to_o no_o new_a revelation_n from_o who_o you_o learn_v it_o if_o they_o know_v it_o then_o either_o they_o conceal_v or_o declare_v it_o to_o say_v they_o conceal_v any_o necessary_a part_n of_o the_o gospel_n be_v to_o charge_v they_o with_o far_o great_a sacrilege_n than_o what_o be_v punish_v in_o ananias_n and_o saphira_n it_o be_v to_o charge_v these_o glorious_a steward_n and_o dispenser_n of_o the_o mystery_n of_o christ_n with_o want_n of_o the_o great_a virtue_n requisite_a in_o a_o steward_n which_o be_v fidelity_n it_o be_v to_o charge_v they_o with_o presumption_n for_o denounce_v anathema's_n even_o to_o angel_n in_o case_n they_o shall_v teach_v any_o other_o doctrine_n than_o what_o they_o have_v receive_v from_o they_o which_o sure_o can_v not_o merit_v a_o anathema_n if_o they_o leave_v any_o necessary_a part_n of_o the_o gospel_n untaught_a it_o be_v in_o a_o word_n in_o plain_a term_n to_o give_v they_o the_o lie_n see_v they_o profess_v plain_o and_o frequent_o that_o they_o teach_v christian_n the_o whole_a doctrine_n of_o christ_n if_o they_o do_v know_v and_o declare_v it_o than_o be_v it_o a_o full_a and_o formal_a article_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o contrary_a a_o full_a and_o formal_a heresy_n without_o any_o need_n of_o further_a declaration_n and_o then_o their_o successor_n either_o continue_v the_o declaration_n of_o it_o or_o discontinue_v if_o they_o do_v the_o latter_a how_o be_v they_o such_o faithful_a depositary_n of_o apostolic_a doctrine_n as_o you_o pretend_v or_o what_o assurance_n can_v you_o give_v we_o that_o they_o may_v not_o bring_v in_o new_a and_o false_a article_n as_o well_o as_o suffer_v the_o old_a and_o true_a one_o to_o be_v lose_v if_o they_o do_v continue_v the_o declaration_n of_o it_o and_o deliver_v it_o to_o their_o successor_n and_o they_o to_o they_o and_o so_o on_o perpetual_o than_o continue_v it_o still_o a_o full_a and_o formal_a article_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o repugnant_a doctrine_n a_o full_a and_o formal_a heresy_n without_o and_o before_o the_o definition_n or_o declaration_n of_o a_o council_n so_o that_o council_n as_o they_o can_v make_v that_o a_o truth_n or_o falsehood_n which_o before_o be_v not_o so_o so_o neither_o can_v they_o make_v or_o declare_v that_o to_o be_v a_o article_n of_o faith_n or_o a_o heresy_n which_o before_o be_v not_o so_o the_o supposition_n therefore_o on_o which_o this_o argument_n stand_v be_v false_a and_o ruinous_a whatsoever_o be_v build_v upon_o it_o must_v together_o with_o it_o fall_v to_o the_o ground_n this_o explication_n therefore_o and_o restriction_n of_o this_o doctrine_n whereof_o you_o make_v your_o advantage_n be_v to_o my_o understanding_n unnecessary_a the_o father_n of_o the_o church_n in_o after_o time_n may_v have_v just_a cause_n to_o declare_v their_o judgement_n touch_v the_o sense_n of_o some_o general_a article_n of_o the_o creed_n but_o to_o oblige_v other_o to_o receive_v their_o declaration_n under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n what_o warrant_v they_o have_v i_o know_v not_o he_o that_o can_v show_v either_o that_o the_o church_n of_o all_o age_n be_v to_o have_v this_o authority_n or_o that_o it_o continue_v in_o the_o church_n for_o some_o age_n and_o then_o expire_v he_o that_o can_v show_v either_o of_o these_o thing_n let_v he_o for_o my_o part_n i_o can_v yet_o i_o willing_o confess_v the_o judgement_n of_o a_o council_n though_o not_o infallible_a be_v yet_o so_o far_o directive_n and_o oblige_v that_o without_o apparent_a reason_n to_o the_o contrary_a it_o may_v be_v sin_n to_o reject_v it_o at_o least_o not_o to_o afford_v it_o a_o outward_a submission_n for_o public_a peace_n sake_n 20._o ad_fw-la §_o 7.8_o 9_o i_o come_v now_o to_o show_v that_o you_o also_o have_v requite_v d._n potter_n with_o a_o mutual_a courteous_a acknowledgement_n of_o his_o assertion_n that_o the_o creed_n be_v a_o sufficient_a summary_n of_o all_o the_o necessary_a article_n of_o faith_n which_o be_v mere_o credenda_fw-la 21._o first_o then_o §_o 8._o you_o have_v these_o word_n that_o it_o can_v be_v deny_v that_o the_o creed_n be_v most_o full_a and_o complete_a to_o that_o purpose_n for_o which_o the_o holy_a apostle_n inspire_v by_o god_n mean_v that_o it_o shall_v serve_v and_o in_o that_o manner_n as_o they_o do_v intend_v it_o which_o be_v not_o to_o comprehend_v all_o particular_a point_n of_o faith_n but_o such_o general_a head_n as_o be_v most_o befit_v and_o requisite_a for_o preach_v the_o faith_n of_o christ_n to_o jew_n and_o gentile_n and_o may_v be_v brief_o and_o compendious_o set_v down_o and_o easy_o learn_v and_o remember_v these_o word_n i_o say_v be_v fair_o 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to_o be_v fundamental_a 22._o and_o upon_o this_o grant_n i_o will_v ask_v no_o leave_n to_o conclude_v that_o whereas_o you_o say_v the_o apostle_n creed_n be_v intend_v for_o a_o comprehension_n of_o such_o head_n of_o faith_n as_o be_v most_o befit_v and_o requisite_a for_o preach_v the_o faith_n of_o christ_n etc._n etc._n you_o be_v now_o for_o fear_v of_o too_o much_o debase_v those_o high_a doctrine_n as_o repentance_n and_o charity_n to_o restrain_v your_o assertion_n as_o d._n potter_n do_v he_o and_o though_o you_o speak_v indefinite_o to_o say_v you_o mean_v it_o only_o of_o those_o head_n of_o faith_n which_o be_v mere_o credenda_fw-la and_o then_o the_o meaning_n of_o it_o if_o it_o have_v any_o must_v be_v this_o that_o the_o creed_n be_v full_a for_o the_o apostle_n intent_n which_o be_v to_o comprehend_v all_o such_o general_a head_n of_o faith_n which_o be_v point_n of_o simple_a belief_n be_v most_o fit_a and_o requisite_a to_o be_v preach_v to_o jew_n and_o gentile_n and_o may_v be_v brief_o and_o compendious_o set_v down_o and_o easy_o learn_v and_o remember_v neither_o i_o nor_o you_o i_o believe_v can_v make_v any_o other_o sense_n of_o your_o word_n than_o this_o and_o upon_o this_o ground_n thus_o i_o subsume_v but_o all_o the_o point_n of_o belief_n which_o be_v necessary_a under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n for_o the_o apostle_n to_o preach_v and_o for_o those_o to_o who_o the_o gospel_n be_v preach_v particular_o to_o know_v and_o believe_v be_v most_o fit_a and_o requisite_a nay_o more_o than_o so_o necessary_a to_o be_v preach_v to_o all_o both_o jew_n and_o gentile_n and_o may_v be_v brief_o and_o compendious_o set_v down_o and_o easy_a learn_v and_o remember_v therefore_o the_o apostle_n intent_n by_o your_o confession_n be_v in_o this_o creed_n to_o comprehend_v all_o such_o point_n and_o you_o say_v the_o
you_o know_v all_o protestant_n with_o one_o consent_n affirm_v it_o to_o be_v false_a and_o therefore_o without_o proof_n to_o take_v it_o for_o grant_v be_v to_o beg_v the_o question_n 4._o that_o suppose_v luther_n and_o they_o which_o do_v first_o separate_v from_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v guilty_a of_o schism_n it_o be_v certain_o consequent_a that_o all_o who_o persist_v in_o this_o division_n must_v be_v so_o likewise_o which_o be_v not_o so_o certain_a as_o you_o pretend_v for_o they_o which_o alter_v without_o necessary_a cause_n the_o present_a government_n of_o any_o state_n civil_a or_o ecclesiastical_a do_v commit_v a_o great_a fault_n whereof_o notwithstanding_o they_o may_v be_v innocent_a who_o continue_v this_o alteration_n and_o to_o the_o utmost_a of_o their_o power_n oppose_v a_o change_n though_o to_o the_o former_a state_n when_o continuance_n of_o time_n have_v once_o settle_v the_o present_a thus_o have_v i_o know_v some_o of_o your_o own_o church_n condemn_v the_o low-country-man_n who_o first_o revolt_v from_o the_o king_n of_o spain_n of_o the_o sin_n of_o rebellion_n yet_o absolve_v they_o from_o it_o who_o now_o be_v of_o your_o religion_n there_o be_v yet_o faithful_a maintainer_n of_o the_o common_a liberty_n against_o the_o pretence_n of_o the_o king_n of_o spain_n 5._o that_o all_o those_o which_o a_o christian_a be_v to_o esteem_v neighbour_n do_v concur_v to_o make_v one_o company_n which_o be_v the_o church_n which_o be_v false_a for_o a_o christian_a be_v to_o esteem_v those_o his_o neighbour_n who_o be_v not_o member_n of_o the_o true_a church_n 6._o that_o all_o the_o member_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v by_o charity_n unite_v into_o one_o mystical_a body_n which_o be_v manifest_o untrue_a for_o many_o of_o they_o have_v no_o charity_n 7._o that_o the_o catholic_n church_n signify_v one_o company_n of_o faithful_a people_n which_o be_v repugnant_a to_o your_o own_o ground_n for_o you_o require_v not_o true_a faith_n but_o only_o the_o profession_n of_o it_o to_o make_v man_n member_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n 8._o that_o every_o heretic_n be_v a_o schismatic_a which_o you_o must_v acknowledge_v false_a in_o those_o who_o though_o they_o deny_v or_o doubt_v of_o some_o point_n profess_v by_o your_o church_n and_o so_o be_v heretic_n yet_o continue_v still_o in_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n 9_o that_o all_o the_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n must_v of_o necessity_n be_v unite_v in_o external_a communion_n which_o though_o it_o be_v much_o to_o be_v desire_v it_o be_v so_o yet_o certain_o can_v be_v perpetual_o true_a for_o a_o man_n unjust_o excommunicate_v be_v not_o in_o the_o church_n communion_n yet_o he_o be_v still_o a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o divers_a time_n it_o have_v happen_v as_o in_o the_o case_n of_o chrisostom_n and_o epiphanius_n that_o particular_a man_n and_o particular_a church_n have_v upon_o a_o overvalue_v difference_n either_o renounce_v communion_n mutual_o or_o one_o of_o they_o separate_v from_o the_o other_o and_o yet_o both_o have_v continue_v member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n these_o thing_n be_v in_o those_o seven_o section_n either_o say_v or_o suppose_v by_o you_o untrue_o without_o all_o show_n or_o pretence_n of_o proof_n the_o rest_n be_v a_o impertinent_a common_a place_n wherein_o protestant_n and_o the_o cause_n in_o hand_n be_v absolute_o unconcern_v and_o therefore_o i_o pass_v to_o the_o eight_o section_n 10._o ad._n §_o 8._o here_o you_o obtrude_v upon_o we_o a_o double_a fallacy_n one_o in_o suppose_v and_o take_v for_o grant_v that_o whatsoever_o be_v affirm_v by_o three_o father_n must_v be_v true_a whereas_o yourselves_o make_v no_o scruple_n of_o condemn_v many_o thing_n of_o falsehood_n which_o yet_o be_v maintain_v by_o more_o than_o thrice_o three_o father_n another_o in_o pretend_v their_o word_n to_o be_v speak_v absolute_o which_o by_o they_o be_v limit_v and_o restrain_v to_o some_o particular_a case_n thus_o the_o word_n of_o s._n austin_n cap._n 11._o lib._n 2._o cont_n parm._n that_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n to_o divide_v unity_n be_v not_o speak_v absolute_o that_o there_o never_o be_v nor_o can_v be_v any_o necessity_n to_o divide_v unity_n which_o only_o be_v for_o your_o purpose_n but_o only_o in_o such_o a_o special_a case_n as_o he_o there_o set_v down_o that_o be_v when_o good_a man_n tolerate_v bad_a man_n which_o can_v do_v they_o no_o spiritual_a hurt_n to_o the_o intent_n they_o may_v not_o be_v separate_v from_o those_o who_o be_v spiritual_o good_a then_o say_v he_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n to_o divide_v unity_n which_o very_a word_n do_v clear_o give_v we_o to_o understand_v that_o it_o may_v fall_v out_o as_o it_o do_v in_o our_o case_n that_o we_o can_v keep_v unity_n with_o bad_a man_n without_o spiritual_a hurt_n i._n e._n without_o partake_v with_o they_o in_o their_o impiety_n and_o that_o then_o there_o be_v a_o necessity_n to_o divide_v unity_n from_o they_o i_o mean_v to_o break_v off_o conjunction_n with_o they_o in_o their_o impiety_n which_o that_o it_o be_v s._n augustine_n mind_n it_o be_v most_o evident_a out_o of_o the_o 21._o c._n of_o the_o same_o book_n where_o to_o parmenian_a demand_v how_o can_v a_o man_n remain_v pure_a be_v join_v with_o those_o that_o be_v corrupt_v he_o answer_v very_o true_a this_o be_v not_o possible_a if_o he_o be_v join_v with_o they_o that_o be_v if_o he_o commit_v any_o evil_n with_o they_o or_o favour_v they_o which_o do_v commit_v it_o but_o if_o he_o do_v neither_o of_o these_o he_o be_v not_o join_v with_o they_o and_o present_o after_o these_o two_o thing_n retain_v will_v keep_v such_o man_n pure_a and_o uncorrupted_a that_o be_v neither_o do_v ill_a nor_o approve_v it_o and_o therefore_o see_v you_o impose_v upon_o all_o man_n of_o your_o communion_n a_o necessity_n of_o do_v or_o at_o least_o approve_v many_o thing_n unlawful_a certain_o there_o lie_v upon_o we_o a_o unavoidable_a necessity_n of_o divide_v unity_n either_o with_o you_o or_o with_o god_n and_o whether_o of_o these_o be_v rather_o to_o be_v do_v be_v you_o judge_n 11._o iraeneus_n also_o say_v not_o simple_o which_o only_o will_v do_v you_o service_n there_o can_v possible_o be_v any_o so_o important_a reformation_n as_o to_o justify_v a_o separation_n from_o they_o who_o will_v not_o reform_v but_o only_o they_o can_v make_v any_o corruption_n so_o great_a as_o be_v the_o pernitiousness_n of_o a_o schism_n now_o they_o here_o be_v a_o relative_a and_o have_v a_o antecedent_n express_v in_o iraeneus_n which_o if_o you_o have_v be_v please_v to_o take_v notice_n of_o you_o will_v easy_o have_v see_v that_o what_o irenaeus_n say_v fall_v heavy_a upon_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n but_o touch_v protestant_n nothing_o at_o all_o for_o the_o man_n he_o speak_v of_o be_v such_o as_o propter_fw-la modicas_fw-la &_o quaslibet_fw-la causas_fw-la for_o trifle_v or_o small_a cause_n divide_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n such_o as_o speak_v of_o peace_n and_o make_v war_n such_o as_o strain_v at_o gnat_n and_o swallow_v camel_n and_o these_o say_v he_o can_v make_v no_o reformation_n of_o any_o such_o importance_n as_o to_o countervail_v the_o danger_n of_o a_o division_n now_o see_v the_o cause_n of_o our_o separation_n from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v as_o we_o pretend_v and_o be_v ready_a to_o justify_v because_o we_o will_v not_o be_v partaker_n with_o she_o in_o superstition_n idolatry_n impiety_n and_o most_o cruel_a tyranny_n both_o upon_o the_o body_n and_o soul_n of_o man_n who_o can_v say_v that_o the_o cause_n of_o our_o separation_n may_v be_v just_o esteem_v modicae_fw-la &_o quaelibet_fw-la causae_fw-la on_o the_o other_o side_n see_v the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n who_o be_v contemporary_a to_o irenaeus_n do_v as_o much_o as_o in_o he_o lay_v cut_v off_o from_o the_o church_n unity_n many_o great_a church_n for_o not_o conform_v to_o he_o in_o a_o indifferent_a matter_n upon_o a_o difference_n non_fw-fr de_fw-fr catholico_n dogmate_n sed_fw-la de_fw-la ritu_fw-la vel_fw-la ritus_fw-la potiùs_fw-la tempore_fw-la not_o about_o any_o catholic_n doctrine_n but_o only_o a_o ceremony_n or_o rather_o about_o the_o time_n of_o observe_v it_o so_o petavius_n value_v it_o which_o be_v just_o all_o one_o as_o if_o the_o church_n of_o france_n shall_v excommunicate_v those_o of_o their_o own_o religion_n in_o england_n for_o not_o keep_v christmas_n upon_o the_o same_o day_n with_o they_o and_o see_v he_o be_v reprehend_v sharp_o and_o bitter_o for_o it_o by_o most_o of_o the_o bishop_n of_o the_o world_n as_o 2._o as_o euseb_n hist_o l._n 5._o c._n 24._o perron_n replic_n l._n 3._o c._n 2._o eusebius_n testify_v and_o as_o cardinal_n perron_n though_o mince_v the_o matter_n yet_o confess_v by_o this_o very_a irenaeus_n himself_o
church_n to_o communicate_v in_o her_o corruption_n or_o you_o suppose_v her_o communion_n uncorrupted_a if_o the_o former_a and_o yet_o will_v take_v for_o grant_v that_o all_o be_v schismatic_n that_o leave_v her_o communion_n though_o it_o be_v corrupt_v you_o beg_v the_o question_n in_o your_o proposition_n if_o the_o latter_a you_o beg_v the_o question_n in_o your_o supposition_n for_o protestant_n you_o know_v be_v peremptory_a and_o unanimous_a in_o the_o denial_n of_o both_o these_o thing_n both_o that_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v then_o uncorrupted_a and_o that_o they_o be_v true_o schismatic_n who_o leave_v the_o communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n if_o corrupt_v especial_o if_o the_o case_n be_v so_o and_o luther_n be_v so_o that_o they_o must_v either_o leave_v her_o communion_n or_o of_o necessity_n communicate_v with_o she_o in_o her_o corruption_n 26._o beside_o although_o it_o be_v grant_v schism_n to_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n in_o what_o state_n or_o case_n so_o ever_o it_o be_v and_o that_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n be_v schismatic_n for_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o all_o visible_a church_n yet_o you_o fail_v exceed_o of_o clear_v the_o other_o necessary_a point_n undertake_v by_o you_o that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v then_o the_o visible_a church_n for_o neither_o do_v protestant_n as_o you_o mistake_v make_v the_o true_a preach_v of_o the_o word_n and_o due_a administration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n the_o note_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n but_o only_o of_o a_o visible_a church_n now_o these_o you_o know_v be_v very_o different_a thing_n the_o former_a signify_v the_o church_n catholic_n or_o the_o whole_a church_n the_o latter_a a_o particular_a church_n or_o a_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n and_o therefore_o suppose_v out_o of_o courtesy_n we_o shall_v grant_v what_o by_o argument_n you_o can_v never_o evince_v that_o your_o church_n have_v these_o note_n yet_o will_v it_o by_o no_o mean_n follow_v that_o your_o church_n be_v the_o visible_a church_n but_o only_o a_o visible_a church_n not_o the_o whole_a catholic_n but_o only_o a_o part_n of_o it_o 27._o last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o protestant_n must_v either_o grant_v that_o your_o church_n then_o be_v the_o visible_a church_n or_o name_v some_o other_o disagree_v from_o you_o and_o agree_v with_o protestant_n in_o their_o particular_a doctrine_n or_o acknowledge_v there_o be_v no_o visible_a church_n it_o be_v all_o one_o as_o if_o to_o use_v s._n paul_n similitude_n the_o head_n shall_v say_v to_o the_o foot_n either_o you_o must_v grant_v that_o i_o be_o the_o whole_a body_n or_o name_v some_o other_o member_n that_o be_v so_o or_o confess_v that_o there_o be_v no_o body_n to_o which_o the_o foot_n may_v answer_v i_o acknowledge_v there_o be_v a_o body_n and_o yet_o that_o no_o member_n beside_o you_o be_v this_o body_n nor_o yet_o that_o you_o be_v it_o but_o only_o a_o part_n of_o it_o and_o in_o like_a manner_n say_v we_o we_o acknowledge_v a_o church_n there_o be_v corrupt_v indeed_o universal_o but_o yet_o such_o a_o one_o as_o we_o hope_v by_o god_n gracious_a acceptance_n be_v still_o a_o church_n we_o pretend_v not_o to_o name_v any_o one_o society_n that_o be_v this_o church_n and_o yet_o we_o see_v no_o reason_n that_o can_v enforce_v we_o to_o confess_v that_o you_o be_v the_o church_n but_o only_o a_o part_n of_o it_o and_o that_o one_o of_o the_o worst_a then_o extant_a in_o the_o world_n in_o vain_a therefore_o have_v you_o trouble_v yourself_o in_o prove_v that_o we_o can_v pretend_v that_o either_o the_o greek_n waldenses_n wickliffite_n hussites_n muscovite_n armenians_n georgians_n abyssine_n be_v then_o the_o visible_a church_n for_o all_o this_o discourse_n proceed_v from_o a_o false_a &_o vain_a supposition_n and_o beg_v another_o point_n in_o question_n between_o we_o which_o be_v that_o some_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n and_o one_o communion_n as_o the_o roman_a the_o greek_a etc._n etc._n must_v be_v always_o exclusive_o to_o all_o other_o communion_n the_o whole_a visible_a church_n and_o though_o perhaps_o some_o weak_a protestant_n have_v this_o false_a principle_n settle_v in_o he_o that_o there_o be_v to_o be_v always_o some_o visible_a church_n of_o one_o denomination_n pure_a from_o all_o error_n in_o doctrine_n may_v be_v wrought_v upon_o and_o prevail_v with_o by_o it_o to_o forsake_v the_o church_n of_o protestant_n yet_o why_o it_o shall_v induce_v he_o to_o go_v to_o you_o rather_o than_o the_o greek_a church_n or_o any_o other_o which_o pretend_v to_o perpetual_a succession_n as_o well_o as_o you_o that_o i_o do_v not_o understand_v unless_o it_o be_v for_o the_o reason_n which_o aeneas_n silvius_n give_v why_o more_o hold_v the_o pope_n above_o a_o council_n than_o a_o council_n above_o the_o pope_n which_o be_v because_o pope_n do_v give_v bishopric_n and_o archbishopric_n but_o council_n give_v none_o and_o therefore_o sue_v in_o forma_fw-la pauperis_fw-la be_v not_o like_a to_o have_v their_o cause_n very_o well_o maintain_v for_o put_v the_o case_n i_o shall_v grant_v of_o mere_a favour_n that_o there_o must_v be_v always_o some_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n and_o communion_n free_a from_o all_o error_n in_o doctrine_n and_o that_o protestant_n have_v not_o always_o such_o a_o church_n it_o will_v follow_v indeed_o from_o thence_o that_o i_o must_v not_o be_v a_o protestant_n but_o that_o i_o must_v be_v a_o papist_n certain_o it_o will_v follow_v by_o no_o better_a consequence_n than_o this_o if_o you_o will_v leave_v england_n you_o must_v of_o necessity_n go_v to_o rome_n and_o yet_o with_o this_o wretched_a fallacy_n have_v i_o be_v sometime_o abuse_v myself_o and_o know_v many_o other_o poor_a soul_n seduce_v not_o only_o from_o their_o own_o church_n and_o religion_n but_o unto_o you_o i_o beseech_v god_n to_o open_v the_o eye_n of_o all_o that_o love_v the_o truth_n that_o they_o may_v not_o always_o be_v hold_v captive_a under_o such_o miserable_a delusion_n 28._o let_v we_o come_v now_o to_o the_o argument_n which_o you_o build_v upon_o d._n potter_n own_o word_n out_o of_o which_o you_o promise_v unanswerable_a reason_n to_o convince_v protestant_n of_o schism_n 29._o but_o these_o reason_n will_v easy_o be_v answer_v if_o the_o reader_n will_v take_v along_o with_o he_o these_o three_o short_a memorandum_n 30._o first_o that_o not_o every_o separation_n but_o only_o a_o causeless_a separation_n from_o the_o external_a communion_n of_o any_o church_n be_v the_o sin_n of_o schism_n 31._o second_o that_o impose_v upon_o man_n under_o pain_n of_o excommunication_n a_o necessity_n of_o profess_v know_v error_n and_o practise_v know_v corruption_n be_v a_o sufficient_a and_o necessary_a cause_n of_o separation_n and_o that_o this_o be_v the_o cause_n the_o protestant_n allege_v to_o justify_v their_o separation_n from_o which_o church_n of_o rome_n 32._o three_o that_o to_o leave_v the_o church_n and_o to_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o a_o church_n be_v not_o the_o same_o thing_n that_o be_v do_v by_o cease_v to_o be_v a_o member_n of_o it_o by_o cease_v to_o have_v those_o requisite_n which_o constitute_v a_o man_n a_o member_n of_o it_o as_o faith_n and_o obedience_n this_o by_o refuse_v to_o communicate_v with_o any_o church_n in_o her_o liturgy_n and_o public_a worship_n of_o god_n this_o armour_n if_o it_o be_v right_o place_v will_v repel_v all_o those_o battery_n which_o you_o threaten_v we_o with_o all_o 33._o ad_fw-la §_o 13.14_o 15._o the_o first_o be_v a_o sentence_n of_o s._n austin_n against_o donatus_n apply_v to_o luther_n thus_o if_o the_o church_n perish_v what_o church_n bring_v forth_o donatus_n you_o say_v luther_n if_o she_o can_v not_o perish_v what_o madness_n move_v the_o sect_n of_o donatus_n to_o separate_v upon_o pretence_n to_o avoid_v the_o communion_n of_o bad_a man_n whereunto_o one_o fair_a answer_n to_o let_v pass_v many_o other_o be_v obvious_a out_o of_o the_o second_o observation_n that_o this_o sentence_n though_o it_o be_v gospel_n as_o it_o be_v not_o be_v impertinent_o apply_v to_o luther_n and_o lutheran_n who_o pretence_n of_o separation_n be_v it_o true_a or_o be_v it_o false_a be_v not_o as_o that_o of_o the_o donatist_n only_o to_o avoid_v the_o communion_n of_o bad_a man_n but_o to_o free_v themselves_o from_o a_o necessity_n which_o but_o by_o separate_n be_v unavoidable_a of_o join_v with_o bad_a man_n in_o their_o impiety_n 34._o ad_fw-la §_o 16._o your_o second_o onset_n drive_v only_o at_o those_o protestant_n who_o hold_v the_o true_a church_n be_v invisible_a for_o many_o age_n which_o doctrine_n if_o by_o the_o true_a church_n be_v understand_v the_o pure_a church_n as_o you_o do_v understand_v it_o be_v a_o certain_a truth_n &_o it_o
just_o as_o if_o a_o brother_n shall_v leave_v his_o brother_n company_n in_o some_o ill_a course_n and_o shall_v say_v to_o he_o herein_o i_o forsake_v you_o yet_o i_o leave_v you_o not_o absolute_o for_o i_o acknowledge_v you_o still_o to_o be_v my_o brother_n and_o shall_v use_v you_o as_o a_o brother_n and_o you_o pervert_v his_o speech_n shall_v pretend_v that_o he_o have_v say_v i_o leave_v your_o company_n in_o these_o ill_a course_n and_o i_o do_v well_o to_o do_v so_o because_o you_o be_v my_o brother_n so_o make_v that_o the_o cause_n of_o his_o leave_v he_o which_o indeed_o be_v the_o cause_n that_o he_o leave_v he_o no_o far_o 75._o obj._n but_o you_o say_v the_o very_a reason_n for_o which_o he_o acquit_v himself_o for_o schism_n be_v because_o he_o hold_v that_o the_o church_n which_o they_o forsake_v be_v not_o cut_v off_o from_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n ans_fw-fr this_o be_v true_a but_o can_v you_o not_o perceive_v a_o difference_n between_o justify_v his_o separation_n from_o schism_n by_o this_o reason_n and_o make_v this_o the_o reason_n of_o his_o separation_n if_o a_o man_n deny_v obedience_n in_o some_o unlawful_a matter_n to_o his_o lawful_a sovereign_n shall_v say_v to_o he_o herein_o i_o disobey_v you_o but_o yet_o i_o be_o no_o rebel_n because_o i_o acknowledge_v you_o my_o sovereign_a lord_n and_o be_o ready_a to_o obey_v you_o in_o all_o thing_n lawful_a shall_v not_o he_o be_v a_o egregious_a sycophant_n that_o shall_v accuse_v he_o as_o if_o he_o have_v say_v i_o do_v well_o to_o disobey_v you_o because_o i_o acknowledge_v you_o my_o lawful_a sovereign_n certain_o he_o that_o join_v this_o acknowledgement_n with_o his_o necessitate_a disobedience_n do_v well_o but_o he_o that_o make_v this_o consideration_n the_o reason_n of_o his_o disobedience_n do_v ill_a 76._o obj._n it_o be_v a_o unspeakable_a comfort_n to_o catholic_n you_o say_v that_o we_o can_v clear_v ourselves_o from_o schism_n otherwise_o than_o by_o acknowledge_v that_o we_o do_v not_o nor_o can_v cut_v off_o your_o church_n from_o the_o hope_n of_o salvation_n ans_fw-fr i_o beseech_v you_o to_o take_v care_n that_o this_o false_a comfort_n cost_v you_o not_o too_o dear_a for_o why_o this_o good_a opinion_n of_o god_n almighty_n that_o he_o will_v not_o damn_v man_n for_o error_n who_o be_v without_o their_o own_o fault_n ignorant_a of_o the_o truth_n shall_v be_v any_o consolation_n to_o they_o who_o have_v the_o key_n of_o knowledge_n will_v neither_o use_v it_o themselves_o nor_o permit_v other_o to_o use_v it_o who_o have_v eye_n to_o see_v and_o will_v not_o see_v who_o have_v ear_n to_o hear_v and_o will_v not_o hear_v this_o i_o assure_v you_o pass_v my_o capacity_n to_o apprehend_v neither_o be_v this_o to_o make_v our_o salvation_n depend_v on_o you_o but_o only_o we_o and_o you_o not_o desperate_o inconsistent_a nor_o to_o say_v we_o must_v be_v damn_v unless_o you_o may_v be_v save_v but_o that_o we_o assure_v ourselves_o if_o our_o life_n be_v answerable_a we_o shall_v be_v save_v by_o our_o knowledge_n and_o that_o we_o hope_v and_o i_o tell_v you_o again_o spes_fw-la est_fw-la rei_fw-la incertae_fw-la nomen_fw-la that_o some_o of_o you_o may_v possible_o be_v the_o rather_o save_v by_o occasion_n of_o their_o unaffected_a ignorance_n 80._o ad_fw-la §_o 28.29_o whereas_o d._n potter_n say_v there_o be_v a_o great_a difference_n between_o a_o schism_n from_o they_o and_o a_o reformation_n of_o ourselves_o this_o you_o say_v be_v a_o quaint_a subtlety_n by_o which_o all_o schism_n and_o sin_n may_v be_v as_o well_o excuse_v ans_fw-fr it_o seem_v then_o in_o your_o judgement_n that_o thief_n and_o adulterer_n and_o murderer_n and_o traitor_n may_v say_v with_o as_o much_o probability_n as_o protestant_n that_o they_o do_v no_o hurt_n to_o other_o but_o only_o reform_v themselves_o but_o then_o methinks_v it_o be_v very_o strange_a that_o all_o protestant_n shall_v agree_v with_o one_o consent_n in_o this_o defence_n of_o themselves_o from_o the_o imputation_n of_o schism_n and_o that_o to_o this_o day_n never_o any_o thief_n or_o murderer_n shall_v have_v be_v hear_v of_o to_o make_v use_n of_o this_o apology_n and_o then_o for_o schismatic_n i_o will_v know_v whether_o victor_n bishop_n of_o rome_n who_o excommunicate_v the_o church_n of_o asia_n for_o not_o conform_v to_o his_o church_n in_o keep_v easter_n whether_o novatian_n that_o divide_v from_o cornelius_n upon_o pretence_n that_o himself_o be_v elect_v bishop_n of_o rome_n when_o indeed_o he_o be_v not_o whether_o felicissimus_n and_o his_o crew_n that_o go_v out_o of_o the_o church_n of_o carthage_n and_o set_v up_o altar_n against_o altar_n because_o have_v fall_v in_o persecution_n they_o may_v not_o be_v restore_v to_o the_o peace_n of_o the_o church_n present_o upon_o the_o intercession_n of_o the_o confessor_n whether_o the_o donatist_n who_o divide_v from_o and_o damn_v all_o the_o world_n because_o all_o the_o world_n will_v not_o excommunicate_v they_o who_o be_v accuse_v only_o and_o not_o convict_v to_o have_v be_v traditor_n of_o the_o sacred_a book_n whether_o they_o which_o for_o the_o slip_n and_o infirmity_n of_o other_o which_o they_o may_v and_o ought_v to_o tolerate_v or_o upon_o some_o difference_n in_o matter_n of_o order_n and_o ceremony_n or_o for_o some_o error_n in_o doctrine_n neither_o pernicious_a nor_o hurtful_a to_o faith_n or_o piety_n separate_v themselves_o from_o other_o or_o other_o from_o themselves_o or_o last_o whether_o they_o that_o put_v themselves_o out_o of_o the_o church_n unity_n and_o obedience_n because_o their_o opinion_n be_v not_o approve_v there_o but_o reprehend_v and_o confute_v or_o because_o be_v of_o impious_a conversation_n they_o be_v impatient_a of_o their_o church_n censure_n i_o will_v know_v i_o say_v whether_o all_o or_o any_o of_o these_o may_v with_o any_o face_n or_o without_o extreme_a impudence_n put_v in_o this_o plea_n of_o protestant_n and_o pretend_v with_o as_o much_o likelihood_n as_o they_o that_o they_o do_v not_o separate_v from_o other_o but_o only_o reform_v themselves_o but_o suppose_v they_o be_v so_o impudent_a as_o to_o say_v so_o in_o their_o own_o defence_n false_o do_v it_o follow_v by_o any_o good_a logic_n that_o therefore_o this_o apology_n be_v not_o to_o be_v employ_v by_o protestant_n who_o may_v say_v so_o true_o we_o make_v say_v they_o no_o schism_n from_o you_o but_o only_o a_o reformation_n of_o ourselves_o this_o you_o reply_v be_v no_o good_a justification_n because_o it_o may_v be_v pretend_v by_o any_o schismatic_a very_o true_a any_o schismatic_a that_o can_v speak_v may_v say_v the_o same_o word_n as_o any_o rebel_n that_o make_v conscience_n the_o cloak_n of_o his_o impious_a disobedience_n may_v say_v with_o s._n peter_n and_o s._n john_n we_o must_v obey_v god_n rather_o than_o man_n but_o then_o the_o question_n be_v whether_o any_o schismatic_a may_v say_v so_o true_o and_o to_o this_o question_n you_o say_v just_o nothing_o but_o conclude_v because_o this_o defence_n may_v be_v abuse_v by_o some_o it_o must_v be_v use_v by_o none_o as_o if_o you_o shall_v have_v say_v s._n peter_n and_o s._n john_n do_v ill_a to_o make_v such_o a_o answer_n as_o they_o make_v because_o impious_a hypocrite_n may_v make_v use_n of_o the_o same_o to_o palliate_v their_o disobedience_n and_o rebellion_n against_o the_o lawful_a command_n of_o lawful_a authority_n 81._o obj._n but_o see_v their_o pretend_a reformation_n consist_v in_o forsake_v the_o church_n corruption_n their_o reformation_n of_o themselves_o and_o their_o division_n from_o you_o fall_v out_o to_o be_v one_o and_o the_o same_o thing_n ans_fw-fr just_o as_o if_o two_o man_n have_v be_v a_o long_a while_n companion_n in_o drunkenness_n one_o of_o they_o shall_v turn_v sober_a this_o reformation_n of_o himself_o and_o disertion_n of_o his_o companion_n in_o this_o ill_a custom_n will_v be_v one_o 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a_o opinion_n by_o which_o disobedience_n to_o authority_n or_o impiety_n be_v teach_v or_o licence_v which_o sort_n i_o confess_v may_v just_o be_v punish_v as_o well_o as_o other_o fault_n or_o unless_o this_o sanguinary_a doctrine_n be_v join_v with_o it_o that_o it_o be_v lawful_a for_o he_o by_o humane_a violence_n to_o enforce_v other_o to_o it_o therefore_o if_o protestant_n do_v offer_v violence_n to_o other_o man_n conscience_n and_o compel_v they_o to_o embrace_v their_o reformation_n i_o excuse_v they_o not_o much_o less_o if_o they_o do_v so_o to_o the_o sacred_a person_n of_o king_n and_o those_o that_o be_v in_o authority_n over_o they_o who_o ought_v to_o be_v so_o secure_v from_o violence_n that_o even_o their_o unjust_a and_o tyrannous_a violence_n though_o it_o may_v be_v avoid_v according_a to_o that_o of_o our_o saviour_n when_o they_o persecute_v you_o in_o one_o city_n fly_v into_o another_o yet_o may_v it_o not_o be_v resist_v by_o oppose_a violence_n against_o it_o protestant_n therefore_o that_o be_v guilty_a of_o this_o crime_n be_v not_o to_o be_v excuse_v and_o bless_a have_v they_o be_v have_v they_o choose_v rather_o to_o be_v martyr_n than_o murderer_n and_o to_o die_v for_o their_o religion_n rather_o than_o to_o fight_v for_o it_o but_o of_o all_o the_o man_n in_o the_o world_n you_o be_v the_o most_o unfit_a to_o accuse_v they_o hereof_o against_o who_o the_o soul_n of_o martyr_n from_o under_o the_o altar_n cry_v much_o loud_a than_o against_o all_o their_o other_o persecutor_n together_o who_o for_o these_o many_o age_n together_o have_v daily_o sacrifice_v hecatomb_n of_o innocent_a christian_n under_o the_o name_n of_o heretic_n to_o your_o blind_a zeal_n and_o furious_a superstition_n who_o teach_v plain_o that_o you_o may_v propagate_v your_o religion_n whensoever_o you_o have_v power_n by_o depose_v of_o king_n and_o invasion_n of_o kingdom_n and_o think_v when_o you_o kill_v the_o adversary_n of_o it_o you_o do_v god_n good_a service_n but_o for_o their_o depart_n corporal_o from_o they_o who_o mental_o they_o have_v forsake_v for_o their_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n and_o company_n of_o that_o part_n of_o the_o unreformed_a part_n of_o the_o church_n in_o their_o superstition_n and_o impiety_n thus_o much_o of_o your_o accusation_n we_o embrace_v and_o glory_n in_o it_o and_o say_v though_o some_o protestant_n may_v offend_v in_o the_o manner_n or_o the_o degree_n of_o their_o separation_n yet_o certain_o their_o separation_n itself_o be_v not_o schismatical_a but_o innocent_a and_o not_o only_o so_o but_o just_a and_o necessary_a 99_o ad_fw-la §_o 36._o what_o you_o cite_v out_o of_o optatus_n l._n 2._o cont_n parm._n thou_o can_v not_o deny_v but_o that_o thou_o know_v that_o in_o the_o city_n of_o rome_n there_o be_v first_o a_o episcopal_a chair_n place_v for_o peter_n wherein_o peter_n the_o head_n of_o the_o apostle_n sit_v whereof_o also_o he_o be_v call_v cephas_n in_o which_o one_o chair_n unity_n be_v to_o be_v keep_v by_o all_o lest_o the_o other_o apostle_n may_v attribute_v to_o themselves_o each_o one_o his_o particular_a chair_n and_o that_o he_o shall_v be_v a_o schismatic_a and_o sinner_n who_o against_o that_o one_o single_a chair_n shall_v erect_v another_o all_o this_o be_v impertinent_a if_o it_o be_v well_o look_v into_o the_o truth_n be_v the_o donatist_n have_v set_v up_o at_o rome_n a_o bishop_n of_o their_o faction_n not_o with_o intent_n to_o make_v he_o bishop_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n but_o of_o that_o church_n in_o particular_a now_o optatus_n go_v upon_o s._n cyprian_n ground_n of_o one_o bishop_n in_o one_o church_n prove_v they_o schismatic_a for_o so_o do_v by_o this_o argument_n s._n peter_n be_v first_o bishop_n of_o rome_n neither_o do_v the_o apostle_n attribute_v to_o themselves_o each_o one_o his_o particular_a chair_n viz._n in_o that_o city_n for_o in_o other_o places_z
mad_a than_o to_o the_o lector_n read_v these_o epistle_n to_o say_v peace_n with_o you_o and_o to_o separate_v from_o the_o peace_n of_o these_o church_n to_o which_o these_o epistle_n be_v write_v so_o optatus_n have_v do_v you_o as_o it_o may_v seem_v great_a service_n in_o upbraid_v the_o donatist_n as_o schismatic_n because_o they_o have_v not_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n overthrow_n and_o undo_v it_o all_o again_o and_o as_o it_o be_v with_o a_o sponge_n wipe_v out_o all_o that_o he_o have_v say_v for_o you_o by_o add_v after_o that_o they_o be_v schismatic_n because_o they_o bid_v not_o the_o fellowship_n of_o communion_n with_o the_o seven_o church_n of_o asia_n to_o which_o s._n john_n write_v whereof_o he_o pronounce_v confident_o though_o i_o know_v not_o upon_o what_o ground_n extra_n septem_fw-la ecclesias_fw-la quicquid_fw-la for_o be_v est_z alienum_fw-la est_fw-la now_o i_o pray_v tell_v i_o do_v you_o esteem_v the_o authority_n of_o these_o father_n a_o sufficient_a assurance_n that_o separation_n from_o these_o other_o apostolic_a church_n be_v a_o certain_a mark_n of_o heresy_n or_o not_o if_o so_o than_o your_o church_n have_v be_v for_o many_o age_n heretical_a if_o not_o how_o be_v their_o authority_n a_o great_a argument_n for_o the_o roman_a than_o for_o the_o other_o church_n if_o you_o say_v they_o conceive_v separation_n from_o these_o church_n a_o note_n of_o schism_n only_o when_o they_o be_v unite_v to_o the_o roman_a so_o also_o they_o may_v conceive_v of_o the_o roman_a only_o when_o it_o be_v unite_v to_o they_o if_o you_o say_v they_o urge_v this_o only_a as_o a_o probable_a and_o not_o as_o a_o certain_a argument_n so_o also_o they_o may_v do_v that_o in_o a_o word_n whatsoever_o answer_v you_o can_v devise_v to_o show_v that_o these_o father_n make_v not_o separation_n from_o these_o other_o church_n a_o mark_n of_o heresy_n apply_v that_o to_o your_o own_o argument_n and_o it_o will_v be_v satisfy_v 33._o you_o see_v s._n augustine_n word_n make_v very_o little_a or_o indeed_o nothing_o for_o you_o but_o now_o his_o action_n which_o according_a to_o cardinal_n perrons_n rule_v be_v much_o more_o to_o be_v regard_v than_o his_o word_n as_o not_o be_v so_o obnoxious_a to_o misinterpretation_n cause_n misinterpretation_n you_o do_v ill_a to_o translate_v it_o the_o principality_n of_o the_o sea_n apostolic_a as_o if_o there_o be_v but_o one_o whereas_o s._n austin_n present_o after_o speak_v of_o apostolical_a church_n in_o the_o plural_a number_n and_o make_v the_o bishop_n of_o they_o joint_a commissioner_n for_o the_o judge_n of_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n i_o mean_v his_o famous_a opposition_n of_o three_o bishop_n of_o rome_n in_o succession_n touch_v the_o great_a question_n of_o appeals_n wherein_o he_o and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o african_a bishop_n proceed_v so_o far_o in_o the_o first_o or_o second_o milevitan_n council_n as_o to_o rome_n to_o the_o word_n of_o the_o decree_n which_o 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he_o make_v clear_o and_o evident_o and_o infinite_o against_o you_o for_o have_v boniface_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o african_a bishop_n a_o great_a part_n whereof_o be_v saint_n and_o martyr_n believe_v as_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n that_o union_n and_o conformity_n with_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n in_o all_o thing_n which_o she_o hold_v necessary_a be_v a_o certain_a note_n of_o a_o good_a catholic_n and_o by_o god_n command_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n how_o be_v it_o possible_a they_o shall_v have_v oppose_v it_o in_o this_o unless_o you_o will_v say_v they_o be_v all_o so_o foolish_a as_o to_o believe_v at_o once_o direct_a contradiction_n viz._n that_o conformity_n to_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v necessary_a in_o all_o point_n and_o not_o necessary_a in_o this_o or_o else_o so_o horrible_o impious_a as_o believe_v this_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n true_a and_o her_o power_n to_o receive_v appeal_v derive_v from_o divine_a authority_n notwithstanding_o to_o oppose_v and_o condemn_v it_o and_o to_o anathematise_v all_o those_o african_n of_o what_o condition_n soever_o that_o shall_v appeal_v unto_o it_o i_o say_v of_o what_o condition_n soever_o for_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o they_o conclude_v in_o their_o determination_n bishop_n as_o well_o as_o the_o inferior_a clergy_n and_o laity_n and_o cardinal_n perrons_n pretence_n of_o the_o contrary_a be_v a_o shameless_a falsehood_n repugnant_a to_o the_o plain_a observari_fw-la plain_a the_o word_n be_v these_o praefato_fw-la debito_fw-la salutationis_fw-la officio_fw-la impendio_fw-la deprecamur_fw-la ut_fw-la deinceps_fw-la ad_fw-la aures_fw-la vestras_fw-la hinc_fw-la venientes_fw-la non_fw-la faciliùs_fw-la admittatis_fw-la nec_fw-la à _fw-la nobis_fw-la excommunicate_v ultra_fw-la in_o communionem_fw-la velitis_fw-la recipere_fw-la quia_fw-la hoc_fw-la etiam_fw-la niceno_fw-la concilio_n definitum_fw-la facile_fw-la advertet_fw-la venerabilitas_fw-la tua_fw-la 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to_o we_o in_o africa_n a_o happy_a church_n into_o which_o the_o apostle_n pour_v forth_o all_o their_o doctrine_n together_o with_o their_o blood_n etc._n etc._n now_o i_o pray_v sirtell_n i_o if_o you_o can_v for_o blush_v why_o this_o place_n may_v not_o have_v be_v urge_v by_o a_o corinthian_a or_o philippian_n or_o thessalonian_n or_o a_o ephesian_a to_o show_v that_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o tertullian_n separation_n from_o any_o of_o their_o church_n be_v a_o certain_a mark_n of_o heresy_n as_o just_o and_o rational_o as_o you_o allege_v it_o to_o vindicate_v this_o privilege_n to_o the_o roman_a church_n only_a certain_o if_o you_o will_v stand_v to_o tertullia_n judgement_n you_o must_v either_o grant_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n though_o at_o that_o time_n a_o good_a topical_a argument_n and_o perhaps_o a_o better_a than_o any_o the_o heretic_n have_v especial_o in_o conjunction_n with_o other_o apostolic_a church_n yet_o i_o say_v you_o must_v grant_v 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show_v to_o any_o that_o consider_v they_o well_o that_o the_o church_n can_v never_o be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o you_o mean_v i_o hope_v one_o in_o external_a communion_n or_o else_o you_o dally_v in_o ambiguity_n and_o then_o i_o say_v i_o have_v well_o consider_v the_o allege_a authority_n and_o they_o appear_v to_o i_o to_o say_v no_o such_o thing_n but_o only_o that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o true_a member_n of_o the_o church_n whereas_o i_o put_v the_o case_n of_o two_o such_o society_n which_o be_v divide_v in_o external_a communion_n by_o reason_n of_o some_o overvalue_v difference_n between_o they_o and_o yet_o be_v neither_o of_o they_o heretical_a or_o schismatical_a to_o this_o i_o know_v you_o can_v not_o answer_v but_o only_o by_o say_v that_o this_o supposition_n be_v impossible_a viz._n that_o of_o two_o society_n divide_v in_o external_a communion_n neither_o shall_v be_v heretical_a nor_o schismatical_a and_o therefore_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o prove_v by_o one_o convince_a argument_n that_o this_o be_v impossible_a this_o you_o have_v not_o do_v nor_o i_o believe_v can_v do_v and_o therefore_o all_o your_o place_n fall_v short_a of_o your_o intend_a conclusion_n and_o if_o you_o will_v put_v they_o into_o syllogistical_a form_n you_o shall_v present_o see_v you_o conclude_v from_o they_o sophistical_o in_o that_o fallacy_n which_o be_v call_v a_o dicto_fw-la secundum_fw-la quid_fw-la ad_fw-la dictum_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la thus_o no_o then_o divide_v society_n whereof_o one_o be_v heretical_a or_o schismatical_a can_v be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n therefore_o simple_o not_o two_o divide_a society_n can_v be_v so_o the_o antecedent_n i_o grant_v which_o be_v all_o that_o your_o place_n say_v as_o you_o shall_v see_v anon_o but_o the_o consequence_n be_v sophistical_a and_o therefore_o that_o i_o deny_v it_o be_v no_o better_a nor_o worse_o than_o if_o you_o shall_v argue_v thus_o no_o true_a divide_a society_n whereof_o one_o be_v outlawed_n and_o in_o rebellion_n be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o same_o commonwealth_n therefore_o simple_o not_o two_o divide_a society_n but_o against_o this_o you_o pretend_v that_o the_o allege_a place_n say_v not_o only_o that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o church_n but_o that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o they_o account_v society_n divide_v which_o be_v either_o of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o of_o a_o diverse_a communion_n this_o be_v that_o which_o i_o will_v have_v prove_v but_o as_o yet_o i_o can_v see_v it_o do_v there_o be_v eleven_o quotation_n in_o all_o seven_o of_o they_o speak_v express_o and_o formal_o of_o division_n make_v by_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n viz._n 1.3_o 4._o 7.9_o 10_o 11._o three_o other_o of_o they_o viz._n 5_o 6.8_o though_o they_o use_v not_o the_o word_n yet_o mr._n lewgar_n know_v they_o speak_v of_o the_o donatist_n which_o be_v schismatic_n and_o that_o by_o the_o relative_a particle_n you_o and_o they_o be_v mean_v the_o donatist_n and_o last_o the_o second_o mr._n lewgar_n know_v say_v nothing_o but_o this_o that_o a_o heretic_n can_v be_v account_v of_o that_o one_o flock_n which_o be_v the_o church_n but_o to_o make_v the_o most_o of_o they_o that_o can_v be_v the_o first_o say_v the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n can_v be_v separate_v at_o all_o nor_o divide_v this_o i_o grant_v but_o then_o i_o say_v every_o difference_n do_v not_o in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n divide_v this_o unity_n for_o then_o diversity_n of_o opinion_n shall_v do_v it_o and_o so_o the_o jesuit_n and_o dominicans_n shall_v be_v no_o long_o member_n of_o the_o same_o church_n or_o if_o every_o difference_n will_v not_o do_v it_o why_o must_v it_o of_o necessity_n be_v always_o do_v by_o difference_n in_o communion_n upon_o a_o insufficient_a ground_n yet_o mistake_v for_o sufficient_a for_o such_o only_o i_o speak_v of_o sure_o i_o be_o this_o place_n say_v no_o such_o matter_n the_o next_o place_n say_v the_o flock_n be_v but_o one_o and_o all_o the_o rest_n that_o the_o church_n be_v but_o one_o and_o that_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v not_o of_o it_o which_o certain_o be_v not_o the_o thing_n to_o be_v prove_v but_o that_o of_o this_o one_o flock_n of_o this_o one_o church_n two_o society_n divide_v without_o just_a cause_n in_o communion_n may_v not_o be_v true_a and_o lively_a member_n both_o in_o one_o body_n mystical_a in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n though_o divide_v in_o unity_n in_o the_o sight_n of_o man_n it_o be_v true_a indeed_o whosoever_o be_v shut_v out_o from_o the_o church_n on_o earth_n be_v likewise_o cut_v off_o from_o it_o before_o god_n in_o heaven_n but_o you_o know_v it_o must_v be_v clavae_n non_fw-la errante_fw-la when_o the_o cause_n of_o abscission_n be_v true_a and_o sufficient_a ad_fw-la §_o 3._o if_o you_o say_v so_o you_o say_v no_o more_o than_o the_o father_n but_o what_o evasion_n and_o tergiversation_n be_v these_o why_o do_v you_o put_v we_o off_o with_o if_n and_o and_n i_o beseech_v you_o tell_v i_o or_o at_o least_o he_o that_o desire_v to_o reap_v some_o benefit_n by_o our_o conference_n direct_o and_o categorical_o do_v you_o say_v so_o or_o do_v you_o say_v it_o be_v not_o so_o be_v the_o excommunicate_v church_n of_o asia_n still_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n i_o mean_v in_o god_n account_n or_o be_v they_o not_o but_o all_o damn_a for_o that_o horrible_a heresy_n of_o celebrate_v the_o feast_n of_o easter_n upon_o a_o diverse_a day_n from_o the_o western_a church_n if_o you_o mean_v honest_o and_o fair_o answer_v direct_o to_o this_o question_n and_o then_o you_o
shall_v see_v what_o will_v come_v of_o it_o assure_v yourself_o you_o have_v a_o wolf_n by_o the_o ear_n if_o you_o say_v they_o be_v you_o overthrow_v your_o own_o conclusion_n and_o say_v that_o church_n divide_v in_o communion_n may_v both_o be_v member_n of_o the_o catholic_n if_o they_o be_v not_o then_o shall_v we_o have_v saint_n and_o martyr_n in_o heaven_n which_o be_v no_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n roman_n church_n as_o for_o irenaeus_n his_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o ruffinus_n his_o abscindere_fw-la ab_fw-la unitate_fw-la corporis_fw-la they_o imply_v no_o more_o but_o this_o at_o the_o most_o that_o victor_n quantum_fw-la in_fw-la se_fw-la fuit_fw-la do_v cut_v they_o off_o from_o the_o external_n communion_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n suppose_v that_o for_o their_o obstinacy_n in_o their_o tradition_n they_o have_v cut_v themselves_o off_o from_o the_o internal_a communion_n of_o it_o but_o that_o this_o sentence_n of_o victor_n be_v ratify_v in_o heaven_n and_o that_o they_o be_v indeed_o cut_v off_o from_o the_o mystical_a body_n of_o christ_n so_o far_o be_v irenaeus_n from_o think_v that_o he_o and_o in_o a_o manner_n all_o the_o other_o bishop_n reprehend_v victor_n for_o pronounce_v this_o sentence_n on_o they_o upon_o a_o cause_n so_o insufficient_a which_o how_o they_o can_v say_v or_o possible_o think_v of_o a_o sentence_n ratify_v by_o god_n in_o heaven_n and_o not_o reprehend_v god_n himself_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o inform_v i_o and_o if_o they_o do_v not_o intend_v to_o reprehend_v the_o sentence_n of_o god_n himself_o together_o with_o victor_n than_o i_o believe_v it_o will_v follow_v unavoidable_o that_o they_o do_v not_o conceive_v nor_o believe_v victor_n sentence_n to_o be_v ratify_v by_o god_n and_o consequent_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o these_o excommunicate_v church_n be_v not_o in_o god_n account_n true_a member_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n ad_fw-la §_o 4._o and_o here_o again_o we_o have_v another_o subterfuge_n by_o a_o verbal_a distinction_n between_o excommunication_n and_o voluntary_a separation_n as_o if_o the_o separation_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n make_v in_o victor_n time_n from_o the_o asian_a church_n be_v not_o a_o voluntary_a separation_n or_o as_o if_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n do_v not_o voluntary_o do_v that_o which_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o their_o separation_n or_o as_o if_o though_o they_o sepated_a not_o themselves_o indeed_o conceive_v the_o cause_n to_o be_v insufficient_a they_o do_v not_o yet_o remain_v voluntary_o separate_v rather_o than_o conform_v themselves_o to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o last_o as_o if_o the_o grecian_n of_o old_a or_o the_o protestant_n of_o late_a may_v not_o pretend_v as_o just_o as_o the_o asian_a church_n that_o their_o separation_n too_o be_v not_o voluntary_o but_o of_o necessity_n for_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n require_v of_o they_o under_o pain_n of_o excommunication_n such_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n as_o be_v neither_o necessary_a nor_o lawful_a to_o be_v perform_v ad_fw-la §_o 5._o and_o here_o again_o the_o matter_n be_v straighten_v by_o another_o limitation_n both_o side_n say_v you_o must_v claim_v to_o be_v the_o church_n but_o what_o then_o if_o one_o of_o they_o only_o claim_v though_o vain_o to_o be_v the_o church_n and_o the_o other_o content_a itself_o with_o be_v a_o part_n of_o it_o these_o than_o it_o seem_v for_o any_o thing_n you_o have_v say_v to_o the_o contrary_a may_v be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o certain_o this_o be_v the_o case_n now_o between_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v be_v between_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n for_o i_o believe_v it_o will_v hardly_o be_v prove_v that_o the_o excommunication_n between_o they_o be_v mutual_a nor_o that_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n esteem_v itself_o the_o whole_a church_n 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particular_a church_n divide_v by_o mistake_n upon_o some_o overvalue_v difference_n may_v not_o be_v both_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n ad_fw-la §_o 7._o but_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o tell_v i_o whether_o you_o will_v do_v this_o if_o the_o doctrine_n produce_v and_o confirm_v by_o such_o a_o consent_n of_o father_n happen_v to_o be_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n either_o not_o catholic_n or_o absolute_o heretical_a if_o you_o will_v undertake_v this_o you_o shall_v hear_v far_o from_o i_o but_o if_o when_o their_o place_n be_v produce_v you_o will_v pretend_v as_o some_o of_o your_o side_n do_v that_o sure_o they_o be_v corrupt_v have_v neither_o reason_n nor_o show_v of_o reason_n for_o it_o unless_o this_o may_v pass_v for_o one_o as_o perhaps_o it_o may_v where_o reason_n be_v scarce_o that_o they_o be_v against_o your_o doctrine_n or_o if_o you_o will_v say_v they_o be_v to_o be_v interpret_v according_a to_o the_o pleasure_n of_o your_o church_n 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that_o the_o proof_n pretend_v be_v indeed_o no_o proof_n and_o do_v not_o he_o prove_v no_o proof_n at_o least_o in_o your_o mouth_n who_o undertake_v to_o show_v that_o a_o equal_a or_o great_a number_n of_o the_o very_a same_o witness_n be_v reject_v by_o yourselves_o in_o many_o other_o thing_n either_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n in_o any_o age_n or_o age_n be_v infallible_a and_o then_o you_o be_v to_o reject_v it_o in_o nothing_o or_o it_o be_v not_o so_o and_o then_o you_o be_v not_o to_o urge_v it_o in_o any_o thing_n as_o if_o the_o father_n testimony_n against_o we_o be_v sword_n and_o spear_n and_o against_o you_o bulrush_n ad_fw-la §_o 9_o in_o effect_n as_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v if_o you_o answer_v not_o as_o i_o please_v i_o will_v dispute_v no_o long_o but_o you_o remember_v the_o proverb_n will_v think_v
necessary_a to_o the_o church_n to_o be_v so_o than_o it_o be_v impossible_a the_o church_n shall_v acquire_v this_o essence_n or_o this_o property_n afterward_o and_o therefore_o impossible_a it_o shall_v have_v it_o at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_n necessarium_fw-la est_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la aliquando_fw-la inest_fw-la aliquando_fw-la non_fw-la inest_fw-la alicui_fw-la inest_fw-la alicui_fw-la non_fw-la inest_fw-la sed_fw-la quod_fw-la semper_fw-la &_o omni_fw-la arist_n post_n analyt_v again_o every_o sophister_n know_v that_o of_o particular_n nothing_o can_v be_v conclude_v and_o therefore_o he_o that_o will_v show_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o luther_n rise_v he_o must_v argue_v thus_o it_o be_v always_o so_o therefore_o than_o it_o be_v so_o now_o this_o antecedent_n be_v overthrow_v by_o any_o instance_n to_o the_o contrary_a and_o so_o the_o first_o antecedent_n be_v prove_v false_a the_o 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have_v not_o nor_o can_v prove_v the_o major_a of_o this_o syllogism_n certain_o true_a but_o to_o the_o contrary_n i_o have_v prove_v that_o it_o can_v be_v certain_o true_a by_o show_v divers_a instance_n wherein_o divers_a divide_a communion_n have_v make_v up_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o therefore_o not_o the_o divide_n of_o the_o communion_n but_o the_o cause_n and_o ground_n of_o it_o be_v to_o be_v regard_v whether_o it_o be_v just_a and_o sufficient_a or_o unjust_a and_o insufficient_a neither_o be_v the_o bishop_n or_o church_n of_o rome_n with_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o a_o infallible_a judge_n thereof_o for_o it_o be_v evident_a both_o he_o and_o it_o have_v err_v herein_o divers_a time_n which_o i_o have_v evince_v already_o by_o divers_a example_n which_o i_o will_v not_o repeat_v but_o add_v to_o they_o one_o confess_v by_o mr._n lewgar_n himself_o in_o his_o discourse_n upon_o the_o article_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n pag._n 84._o s._n athanasius_n be_v excommunicate_v though_o by_o the_o it_o the_o how_o by_o the_o whole_a church_n when_o himself_o be_v part_n of_o it_o and_o communicate_v still_o with_o divers_a other_o part_n of_o it_o whole_a church_n yet_o may_v remain_v a_o member_n of_o christ_n body_n not_o visible_a for_o that_o be_v impossible_a excommunicate_v impossible_a what_o not_o to_o they_o who_o know_v and_o believe_v he_o to_o be_v unjust_o excommunicate_v that_o a_o person_n cut_v off_o from_o visible_a communion_n though_o unjust_o shall_v be_v a_o visible_a member_n of_o the_o church_n but_o by_o invisible_a communion_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o invalidity_n of_o the_o sentence_n which_o be_v unjust_a be_v valid_a enough_o to_o visible_a excision_n but_o not_o far_o ii_o a_o discourse_n against_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o a_o answer_n to_o all_o those_o text_n of_o scripture_n that_o be_v allege_v to_o prove_v it_o the_o condition_n of_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n without_o the_o performance_n whereof_o no_o man_n can_v be_v receive_v into_o it_o be_v this_o that_o he_o believe_v firm_o and_o without_o doubt_v whatsoever_o that_o church_n require_v he_o to_o believe_v it_o be_v impossible_a that_o any_o man_n shall_v certain_o believe_v any_o thing_n unless_o that_o thing_n be_v either_o evident_a of_o itself_o as_o that_o twice_o two_o be_v four_o that_o every_o whole_a be_v great_a than_o a_o part_n of_o itself_o or_o unless_o he_o have_v some_o certain_a reason_n at_o least_o some_o suppose_a certain_a reason_n and_o infallible_a guide_n for_o his_o belief_n thereof_o the_o doctrine_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n require_v to_o be_v believe_v be_v not_o evident_a of_o themselves_o for_o then_o every_o one_o will_v grant_v they_o at_o first_o hear_v without_o any_o further_a proof_n he_o therefore_o that_o will_v believe_v they_o must_v have_v some_o certain_a and_o infallible_a ground_n whereupon_o to_o build_v his_o belief_n of_o they_o there_o be_v no_o other_o ground_n for_o a_o man_n belief_n of_o they_o especial_o in_o many_o point_n but_o only_o a_o assurance_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n now_o this_o point_n of_o that_o church_n infallibility_n be_v not_o evident_a of_o itself_o for_o than_o no_o man_n can_v choose_v but_o in_o his_o heart_n believe_v it_o without_o far_a proof_n second_o it_o be_v in_o vain_a to_o bring_v any_o proof_n of_o it_o as_o vain_a as_o to_o light_v a_o candle_n to_o show_v man_n the_o sun_n three_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o bring_v any_o proof_n of_o it_o see_v nothing_o can_v be_v more_o evident_a than_o that_o which_o of_o itself_o be_v evident_a and_o nothing_o can_v be_v bring_v in_o proof_n of_o any_o thing_n which_o be_v not_o more_o evident_a than_o that_o matter_n to_o be_v prove_v but_o now_o experience_n teach_v that_o million_o there_o be_v which_o have_v hear_v talk_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o yet_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o the_o defender_n of_o it_o do_v not_o think_v it_o either_o vain_a or_o impossible_a to_o go_v about_o to_o prove_v it_o and_o from_o hence_o it_o follow_v plain_o that_o this_o point_n be_v not_o evident_a of_o itself_o neither_o be_v there_o any_o other_o certain_a ground_n for_o any_o man_n belief_n of_o it_o or_o if_o there_o be_v i_o desire_v it_o may_v be_v produce_v as_o who_o be_o ready_a and_o most_o willing_a to_o submit_v my_o judgement_n to_o it_o full_o persuade_v that_o none_o can_v be_v produce_v that_o will_v endure_v a_o severe_a and_o impartial_a examination_n if_o it_o be_v say_v the_o roman_a church_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v infallible_a because_o the_o scripture_n say_v it_o be_v so_o 1._o i_o demand_v how_o shall_v i_o be_v assure_v of_o the_o text_n that_o be_v allege_v that_o they_o be_v indeed_o scripture_n that_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o the_o answer_n to_o this_o must_v be_v either_o because_o the_o church_n tell_v i_o 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mr._n chillingworth_n book_n call_v the_o religion_n of_o protestant_n a_o safe_a way_n to_o salvation_n make_v more_o general_o useful_a by_o omit_v personal_n contest_v but_o insert_v whatsoever_o concern_v the_o common_a cause_n of_o protestant_n or_o defend_v the_o church_n of_o england_n with_o a_o addition_n of_o some_o genuine_a piece_n of_o mr._n chillingworth_n never_n before_o print_v isaac_n casaub_n in_o ep._n ad_fw-la card._n perron_n reg._n jac._n nomine_fw-la scripta_fw-la rex_fw-la arbitratur_fw-la rerum_fw-la absolute_a necessariarum_fw-la ad_fw-la salutem_fw-la non_fw-la magnum_fw-la esse_fw-la numerum_fw-la quare_fw-la existimat_fw-la ejus_fw-la majestas_fw-la nullam_fw-la ad_fw-la ineundem_fw-la concordiam_fw-la breviorem_fw-la viam_fw-la fore_fw-la quà m_fw-la fi_fw-la diligentèr_fw-la separentur_fw-la necessaria_fw-la à _fw-la non_fw-la necessariis_fw-la &_o ut_fw-la de_fw-la necessariis_fw-la conveniat_fw-la omnis_fw-la opera_fw-la insumatur_fw-la in_fw-la 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plain_a that_o i_o be_o even_o ashamed_a to_o prove_v it_o for_o he_o that_o deny_v it_o must_v say_v that_o something_o may_v be_v speak_v which_o can_v be_v write_v for_o if_o such_o a_o complete_a and_o evident_a rule_n of_o faith_n may_v be_v deliver_v by_o word_n of_o mouth_n as_o you_o pretend_v it_o may_v and_o be_v and_o whatsoever_o be_v deliver_v by_o word_n of_o mouth_n may_v also_o be_v write_v then_o such_o a_o complete_a and_o evident_a rule_n of_o faith_n may_v also_o be_v write_v if_o you_o will_v have_v more_o light_n add_v to_o the_o sun_n answer_v i_o then_o to_o these_o question_n whether_o your_o church_n can_v set_v down_o in_o write_v all_o these_o which_o she_o pretend_v to_o be_v divine_a unwritten_a tradition_n and_o add_v they_o to_o the_o verity_n already_o write_v
authority_n of_o universal_a tradition_n that_o we_o will_v have_v they_o believe_v scripture_n but_o then_o as_o for_o the_o authority_n which_o you_o will_v have_v they_o follow_v you_o will_v let_v they_o see_v reason_n why_o they_o shall_v follow_v it_o and_o be_v not_o this_o to_o go_v a_o little_a about_o to_o leave_v reason_n for_o a_o short_a turn_n and_o then_o to_o come_v to_o it_o again_o and_o to_o do_v that_o which_o you_o condemn_v in_o other_o it_o be_v indeed_o a_o plain_a impossibility_n for_o any_o man_n to_o submit_v his_o reason_n but_o to_o reason_n for_o he_o that_o do_v it_o to_o authority_n must_v of_o necessity_n think_v himself_o to_o have_v great_a reason_n to_o believe_v that_o authority_n therefore_o the_o confession_n cite_v by_o brere_o you_o need_v not_o think_v to_o have_v be_v extort_a from_o luther_n and_o the_o rest_n it_o come_v very_o free_o from_o they_o and_o what_o they_o say_v you_o practise_v as_o much_o as_o they_o 115._o and_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o a_o protestant_n admit_v of_o father_n council_n church_n as_o far_o as_o they_o agree_v with_o scripture_n which_o upon_o the_o matter_n be_v himself_o i_o say_v you_o admit_v neither_o of_o they_o nor_o the_o scripture_n itself_o but_o only_o so_o far_o as_o it_o agree_v with_o your_o church_n and_o your_o church_n you_o admit_v because_o you_o think_v you_o have_v reason_n to_o do_v so_o so_o that_o by_o you_o as_o well_o as_o by_o protestant_n all_n be_v final_o resolve_v into_o your_o own_o reason_n 116._o nor_o do_v heretic_n only_o but_o romish_a catholic_n also_o set_v up_o as_o many_o judge_n as_o there_o be_v man_n and_o woman_n in_o the_o christian_a world_n for_o do_v not_o your_o man_n and_o woman_n judge_v your_o religion_n to_o be_v true_a before_o they_o believe_v it_o as_o well_o as_o the_o man_n and_o woman_n of_o other_o religion_n oh_o but_o you_o say_v they_o receive_v it_o not_o because_o they_o think_v it_o agreeable_a to_o scripture_n but_o because_o the_o church_n tell_v they_o so_o but_o then_o i_o hope_v they_o believe_v the_o church_n because_o their_o own_o reason_n tell_v they_o they_o be_v to_o do_v so_o so_o that_o the_o difference_n between_o a_o papist_n and_o a_o protestant_n be_v this_o not_o that_o the_o one_o judge_n and_o the_o other_o do_v not_o judge_n but_o that_o the_o one_o judge_n his_o guide_n to_o be_v infallible_a the_o other_o his_o way_n to_o be_v manifest_a this_o same_o pernicious_a doctrine_n be_v teach_v by_o brentius_n zanchius_n cartwright_n and_o other_o it_o be_v so_o in_o very_a deed_n but_o it_o be_v teach_v also_o by_o some_o other_o who_o you_o little_o think_v of_o it_o be_v teach_v by_o s._n paul_n where_o he_o say_v try_v all_o thing_n hold_v fast_o that_o which_o be_v good_a it_o be_v teach_v by_o s._n john_n in_o these_o word_n believe_v not_o every_o spirit_n but_o try_v the_o spirit_n whether_o they_o be_v of_o god_n or_o no._n it_o be_v teach_v by_o s._n peter_n in_o these_o be_v you_o ready_a to_o render_v a_o reason_n of_o the_o hope_n that_o be_v in_o you_o last_o this_o very_a pernicious_a doctrine_n be_v teach_v by_o our_o saviour_n in_o these_o word_n if_o the_o blind_a lead_n the_o blind_a both_o shall_v fall_v into_o the_o ditch_n and_o why_o of_o yourselves_o judge_v you_o not_o what_o be_v right_a all_o which_o speech_n if_o they_o do_v not_o advise_v man_n to_o make_v use_n of_o their_o reason_n for_o the_o choice_n of_o their_o religion_n i_o must_v confess_v myself_o to_o understand_v nothing_o last_o not_o to_o be_v infinite_a it_o be_v teach_v by_o m._n knot_n himself_o not_o in_o one_o page_n only_o or_o chapter_n of_o his_o book_n but_o all_o his_o book_n over_o the_o very_a writing_n and_o publish_v whereof_o suppose_v this_o for_o certain_a that_o the_o reader_n be_v to_o be_v judge_n whether_o his_o reason_n which_o he_o bring_v be_v strong_a and_o convince_a of_o which_o sort_n we_o have_v hitherto_o meet_v with_o none_o or_o else_o captious_a or_o impertinence_n as_o indifferent_a man_n shall_v as_o i_o suppose_v have_v cause_n to_o judge_v they_o 117._o but_o you_o demand_v what_o good_a statesman_n will_v they_o be_v who_o shall_v ideate_v or_o fancy_v such_o a_o commonwealth_n as_o these_o man_n have_v frame_v to_o themselves_o a_o church_n true_o if_o this_o be_v all_o the_o fault_n they_o have_v that_o they_o say_v every_o man_n be_v to_o use_v his_o own_o judgement_n in_o the_o choice_n of_o his_o religion_n and_o not_o to_o believe_v this_o or_o that_o sense_n of_o scripture_n upon_o the_o bare_a authority_n of_o any_o learned_a man_n or_o man_n when_o he_o conceive_v he_o have_v reason_n to_o the_o contrary_a which_o be_v of_o more_o weight_n than_o their_o authority_n i_o know_v no_o reason_n but_o notwithstanding_o all_o this_o they_o may_v be_v as_o good_a statesman_n as_o any_o of_o the_o society_n but_o what_o have_v this_o to_o do_v with_o commonwealth_n where_o man_n be_v bind_v only_o to_o external_a obedience_n unto_o the_o law_n and_o judgement_n of_o court_n but_o not_o to_o a_o internal_a approbation_n of_o they_o no_o nor_o to_o conceal_v their_o judgement_n of_o they_o if_o they_o disapprove_v they_o as_o if_o i_o conceive_v i_o have_v reason_n to_o mislike_v the_o law_n of_o punish_v simple_a theft_n with_o death_n as_o sir_n thomas_n moor_n do_v i_o may_v profess_v lawful_o my_o judgement_n and_o represent_v my_o reason_n to_o the_o king_n or_o commonwealth_n in_o a_o parliament_n as_o sir_n thomas_n moor_n do_v without_o commit_v any_o fault_n or_o fear_v any_o punishment_n 118._o to_o that_o place_n of_o s._n austin_n you_o cite_v lib._n 32._o cont_n faust_n you_o see_v that_o you_o go_v about_o to_o overthrow_v all_o authority_n of_o scripture_n and_o that_o every_o man_n mind_n may_v be_v to_o himself_o a_o rule_n what_o he_o be_v to_o allow_v or_o disallow_v in_o every_o scripture_n i_o shall_v need_v give_v no_o other_o reply_n but_o only_o to_o desire_v you_o to_o speak_v like_o a_o honest_a man_n and_o to_o say_v whether_o it_o be_v all_o one_o for_o a_o man_n to_o allow_v and_o disallow_v in_o every_o scripture_n what_o he_o please_v which_o be_v either_o to_o dash_v out_o of_o scripture_n such_o text_n or_o such_o chapter_n because_o they_o cross_v his_o opinion_n or_o to_o say_v which_o be_v worse_o though_o they_o be_v scripture_n they_o be_v not_o true_a whether_o i_o say_v for_o a_o man_n thus_o to_o allow_v and_o disallow_v in_o scripture_n what_o he_o please_v be_v all_o one_o and_o no_o great_a fault_n than_o to_o allow_v that_o sense_n of_o scripture_n which_o he_o conceive_v to_o be_v true_a and_o genuine_a and_o deduce_v out_o of_o the_o word_n and_o to_o disallow_v the_o contrary_a for_o god_n sake_n sir_n tell_v i_o plain_o in_o those_o text_n of_o scripture_n which_o you_o allege_v for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o your_o church_n do_v not_o you_o allow_v what_o sense_n you_o think_v true_a and_o disallow_v the_o contrary_a and_o do_v you_o not_o this_o by_o the_o direction_n of_o your_o private_a reason_n if_o you_o do_v why_o do_v you_o condemn_v it_o in_o other_o if_o you_o do_v not_o i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o what_o direction_n you_o follow_v or_o whether_o you_o follow_v none_o at_o all_o if_o none_o at_o all_o this_o be_v like_o draw_v lot_n or_o throw_v the_o dice_n for_o the_o choice_n of_o a_o religion_n if_o any_o other_o i_o beseech_v you_o tell_v i_o what_o it_o be_v perhaps_o you_o will_v say_v the_o church_n authority_n and_o that_o will_v be_v to_o dance_v fine_o in_o a_o round_a thus_o to_o believe_v the_o church_n infallible_a authority_n because_o the_o scripture_n avouch_v it_o and_o to_o believe_v that_o scripture_n say_v and_o mean_a so_o because_o they_o be_v so_o expound_v by_o the_o church_n be_v not_o this_o for_o a_o father_n to_o beget_v his_o son_n and_o the_o son_n to_o beget_v his_o father_n for_o a_o foundation_n to_o support_v the_o house_n and_o the_o house_n to_o support_v the_o foundation_n will_v not_o campian_n have_v cry_v out_o at_o it_o ecce_fw-la quos_fw-la gyros_fw-la quos_fw-la maeandros_fw-la and_o to_o what_o end_n be_v this_o go_v about_o when_o you_o may_v as_o well_o at_o first_o have_v conclude_v the_o church_n infallible_a because_o she_o say_v so_o as_o thus_o to_o put_v in_o scripture_n for_o a_o mere_a stale_n and_o to_o say_v the_o church_n be_v infallible_a because_o the_o scripture_n say_v so_o and_o the_o scripture_n mean_v so_o because_o the_o church_n say_v so_o which_o be_v infallible_a be_v it_o not_o most_o evident_a therefore_o to_o every_o intelligent_a man_n that_o you_o be_v enforce_v of_o necessity_n to_o do_v that_o yourself_o which_o so_o tragical_o you_o declaim_v against_o in_o other_o the_o
damn_v he_o for_o error_n that_o desire_n and_o endeavour_n to_o find_v the_o truth_n 15._o ad_fw-la §_o 2._o the_o effect_n of_o this_o paragraph_n for_o as_o much_o as_o concern_v we_o be_v this_o that_o for_o any_o man_n to_o deny_v belief_n to_o any_o one_o thing_n be_v it_o great_a or_o small_a know_v by_o he_o to_o be_v reveal_v by_o almighty_a god_n for_o a_o truth_n be_v in_o effect_n to_o charge_n god_n with_o falsehood_n for_o it_o be_v to_o say_v that_o god_n affirm_v that_o to_o be_v truth_n which_o he_o either_o know_v to_o be_v not_o a_o truth_n or_o which_o he_o do_v not_o know_v to_o be_v a_o truth_n and_o therefore_o without_o all_o controversy_n this_o be_v a_o damnable_a sin_n to_o this_o i_o subscribe_v with_o hand_n and_o heart_n add_v withal_o that_o not_o only_o he_o which_o know_v but_o he_o which_o believe_v nay_o though_o it_o be_v erroneous_o any_o thing_n to_o be_v reveal_v by_o god_n and_o yet_o will_v not_o believe_v it_o nor_o assent_v unto_o it_o be_v in_o the_o same_o case_n and_o commit_v the_o same_o sin_n of_o derogation_n from_o god_n most_o perfect_a and_o pure_a veracity_n 16._o ad_fw-la §_o 3._o i_o say_v purposely_o know_v by_o himself_o and_o believe_v himself_o for_o as_o without_o any_o disparagement_n of_o a_o man_n honesty_n i_o may_v believe_v something_o to_o be_v false_a which_o he_o affirm_v of_o his_o certain_a knowledge_n to_o be_v true_a provide_v i_o neither_o know_v nor_o believe_v that_o he_o have_v so_o affirm_v so_o without_o any_o the_o least_o dishonour_n to_o god_n eternal_a never_o fail_v veracity_n i_o may_v doubt_v of_o or_o deny_v some_o truth_n reveal_v by_o he_o if_o i_o neither_o know_v nor_o believe_v it_o to_o be_v reveal_v by_o he_o 19_o but_o ignorance_n of_o what_o we_o be_v express_o bind_v to_o know_v be_v itself_o a_o fault_n and_o therefore_o can_v be_v a_o excuse_n and_o therefore_o if_o you_o can_v show_v the_o protestant_n differ_v in_o those_o point_n the_o truth_n whereof_o which_o can_v be_v but_o one_o they_o be_v bind_v express_o to_o know_v i_o shall_v easy_o yield_v that_o one_o side_n must_v of_o necessity_n be_v in_o a_o mortal_a crime_n but_o for_o want_v of_o proof_n of_o this_o you_o content_v yourself_o only_o to_o say_v it_o and_o therefore_o i_o also_o may_v be_v content_v only_o to_o deny_v it_o yet_o i_o will_v not_o but_o give_v a_o reason_n for_o my_o denial_n and_o my_o reason_n be_v because_o our_o obligation_n express_o to_o know_v any_o divine_a truth_n must_v arise_v from_o god_n manifest_a reveal_n of_o it_o and_o his_o reveal_n unto_o we_o that_o he_o have_v reveal_v it_o and_o that_o his_o will_n be_v we_o shall_v believe_v it_o now_o in_o the_o point_v controvert_v among_o protestant_n he_o have_v not_o so_o deal_v with_o we_o therefore_o he_o have_v not_o lay_v any_o such_o obligation_n upon_o we_o the_o major_a of_o this_o syllogism_n be_v evident_a and_o therefore_o i_o will_v not_o stand_v to_o prove_v it_o the_o minor_a also_o will_v be_v evident_a to_o he_o that_o consider_v that_o in_o all_o the_o controversy_n of_o protestant_n there_o be_v a_o seem_a conflict_n of_o scripture_n with_o scripture_n reason_n with_o reason_n authority_n with_o authority_n which_o how_o it_o can_v consist_v with_o the_o manifest_a reveal_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o either_o side_n i_o can_v well_o understand_v beside_o though_o we_o grant_v that_o scripture_n reason_n and_o authority_n be_v all_o on_o one_o side_n and_o the_o apparence_n of_o the_o other_o side_n all_o answerable_a yet_o if_o we_o consider_v the_o strange_a power_n that_o education_n and_o prejudices_fw-la instill_v by_o it_o have_v over_o even_o excellent_a understanding_n we_o may_v well_o imagine_v that_o many_o truth_n which_o in_o themselves_o be_v reveal_v plain_o enough_o be_v yet_o to_o such_o or_o such_o a_o man_n prepossess_v with_o contrary_a opinion_n not_o reveal_v plain_o neither_o doubt_v i_o but_o god_n who_o know_v whereof_o we_o be_v make_v and_o what_o passion_n we_o be_v subject_a unto_o will_v compassionate_v such_o infirmity_n and_o not_o enter_v into_o judgement_n with_o we_o for_o those_o thing_n which_o all_o thing_n consider_v be_v unavoidable_a 20._o obj._n but_o till_o fundamental_o say_v you_o be_v sufficient_o propose_v as_o reveal_v by_o god_n it_o be_v not_o against_o faith_n to_o reject_v they_o or_o rather_o it_o be_v not_o possible_a prudent_o to_o believe_v they_o and_o point_v unfundamental_a be_v thus_o sufficient_o propose_v as_o divine_a truth_n may_v not_o be_v deny_v therefore_o you_o conclude_v there_o be_v no_o difference_n between_o they_o answ_n a_o circumstantial_a point_n may_v by_o accident_n become_v fundamental_a because_o it_o may_v be_v so_o propose_v that_o the_o denial_n of_o it_o will_v draw_v after_o it_o the_o denial_n of_o this_o fundamental_a truth_n that_o all_o which_o god_n say_v be_v true_a notwithstanding_o in_o themselves_o there_o be_v a_o main_a difference_n between_o they_o point_n fundamental_a be_v those_o only_o which_o be_v reveal_v by_o god_n and_o command_v to_o be_v preach_v to_o all_o and_o believe_v by_o all_o point_n circumstantial_a be_v such_o as_o though_o god_n have_v reveal_v they_o yet_o the_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o bind_v under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n particular_o to_o teach_v they_o unto_o all_o man_n every_o where_o and_o the_o people_n may_v be_v secure_o ig-norant_a of_o they_o 21._o obj._n you_o say_v not_o err_v in_o point_n fundamental_a be_v not_o sufficient_a for_o the_o preservation_n of_o the_o church_n because_o any_o error_n maintain_v by_o it_o against_o god_n revelation_n be_v destructive_a i_o answer_v if_o you_o mean_v against_o god_n revelation_n know_v by_o the_o church_n to_o be_v so_o it_o be_v true_a but_o impossible_a that_o the_o church_n shall_v do_v so_o for_o ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la in_o do_v it_o it_o be_v a_o church_n no_o long_o but_o if_o you_o mean_v against_o some_o revelation_n which_o the_o church_n by_o error_n think_v to_o be_v no_o revelation_n it_o be_v false_a the_o church_n may_v ignorant_o disbelieve_v such_o a_o revelation_n and_o yet_o continue_v a_o church_n which_o thus_o i_o prove_v that_o the_o gospel_n be_v to_o be_v preach_v to_o all_o nation_n be_v a_o truth_n reveal_v before_o our_o saviour_n ascension_n in_o these_o word_n go_v and_o teach_v all_o nation_n mat._n 29.19_o yet_o through_o prejudice_n or_o inadvertence_n or_o some_o other_o cause_n the_o church_n disbelieved_a it_o as_o it_o be_v apparent_a out_o of_o the_o 11._o and_o 12._o chap._n of_o the_o act_n until_o the_o conversion_n of_o cornelius_n and_o yet_o be_v still_o a_o church_n therefore_o to_o disbelieve_v some_o divine_a revelation_n not_o know_v it_o to_o be_v so_o be_v not_o destructive_a of_o salvation_n or_o of_o the_o be_v of_o the_o church_n again_o it_o be_v a_o plain_a revelation_n of_o god_n that_o 2d_o that_o 1_o cor._n 11_o 2d_o the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o eucharist_n shall_v be_v administer_v in_o both_o kind_n and_o 16.26_o and_o 1_o cor._n 14_o 15_o 16.26_o that_o the_o public_a hymn_n and_o prayer_n of_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v in_o such_o a_o language_n as_o be_v most_o for_o edification_n yet_o these_o revelation_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n not_o see_v by_o reason_n of_o the_o veil_n before_o their_o eye_n their_o church_n suppose_a infallibility_n i_o hope_v the_o denial_n of_o they_o shall_v not_o be_v lay_v to_o their_o charge_n no_o otherwise_o than_o as_o build_v hay_n and_o stubble_n on_o the_o foundation_n not_o overthrow_v the_o foundation_n itself_o 24._o ad_fw-la §_o 5._o this_o paragraph_n if_o it_o be_v bring_v out_o of_o the_o cloud_n will_v i_o believe_v have_v in_o it_o these_o proposition_n 1._o thing_n be_v distinguish_v by_o their_o different_a nature_n 2._o the_o nature_n of_o faith_n be_v take_v not_o from_o the_o matter_n believe_v for_o than_o they_o that_o believe_v different_a matter_n shall_v have_v different_a faith_n but_o from_o the_o motive_n to_o it_o 3._o this_o motive_n be_v god_n revelation_n 4._o this_o revelation_n be_v alike_o for_o all_o object_n 5._o protestant_n disagree_v in_o thing_n equal_o reveal_v by_o god_n therefore_o they_o forsake_v the_o formal_a motive_n of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o have_v no_o faith_n nor_o unity_n therein_o which_o be_v true_o a_o very_a proper_a and_o convenient_a argument_n to_o close_v up_o a_o weak_a discourse_n wherein_o both_o the_o proposition_n be_v false_a for_o matter_n confuse_a and_o disorder_v for_o the_o form_n and_o the_o conclusion_n utter_o in_o consequent_a first_o for_o the_o second_o proposition_n who_o know_v not_o that_o the_o essence_n of_o all_o habit_n and_o therefore_o of_o faith_n among_o the_o rest_n be_v take_v from_o their_o act_n and_o their_o object_n if_o the_o habit_n be_v general_a
be_v a_o shrewd_a sign_n of_o a_o sink_a cause_n 30._o ad_fw-la §_o 13._o we_o be_v tell_v here_o that_o the_o general_a promise_n of_o infallibility_n to_o the_o church_n must_v not_o be_v restrain_v only_o to_o point_n fundamental_a because_o then_o the_o apostle_n word_n and_o writing_n may_v also_o be_v so_o restrain_v ans_fw-fr this_o also_o may_v be_v do_v but_o if_o it_o be_v do_v may_v easy_o be_v confute_v it_o be_v do_v to_o our_o hand_n in_o this_o very_a paragraph_n by_o five_o word_n take_v out_o of_o scripture_n all_o scripture_n be_v divine_o inspire_v show_v but_o as_o much_o for_o the_o church_n show_v where_o it_o be_v write_v that_o all_o the_o decree_n of_o the_o church_n be_v divine_o inspire_v and_o the_o controversy_n will_v be_v at_o a_o end_n beside_o there_o be_v not_o the_o same_o reason_n for_o the_o church_n absolute_a infallibility_n as_o for_o the_o apostle_n and_o scripture_n for_o if_o the_o church_n fall_v into_o error_n it_o may_v be_v reform_v by_o compare_v it_o with_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o apostle_n doctrine_n and_o scripture_n but_o if_o the_o apostle_n have_v err_v in_o deliver_v the_o doctrine_n of_o christianity_n to_o who_o shall_v we_o have_v recourse_n for_o the_o discover_v and_o correct_v their_o error_n again_o there_o be_v not_o so_o much_o strength_n require_v in_o the_o edifice_n as_o in_o the_o foundation_n and_o if_o but_o wise_a man_n have_v the_o order_n of_o the_o building_n they_o will_v make_v it_o much_o a_o sure_a thing_n that_o the_o foundation_n shall_v not_o fail_v the_o building_n than_o that_o the_o building_n shall_v not_o fall_v from_o the_o foundation_n and_o though_o the_o build_n be_v to_o be_v of_o brick_n or_o stone_n and_o perhaps_o of_o wood_n yet_o if_o it_o may_v be_v possible_o they_o will_v have_v a_o rock_n for_o their_o foundation_n who_o stability_n be_v a_o much_o more_o indubitable_a thing_n than_o the_o adherence_n of_o the_o structure_n to_o it_o now_o the_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n and_o canonical_a writer_n be_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o church_n according_a to_o that_o of_o s._n paul_n build_v upon_o the_o foundation_n of_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n therefore_o their_o stability_n in_o reason_n ought_v to_o be_v great_a than_o the_o church_n which_o be_v build_v upon_o they_o again_o a_o dependent_a infallibility_n especial_o if_o the_o dependence_n be_v voluntary_a can_v be_v so_o certain_a as_o that_o on_o which_o it_o depend_v but_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n depend_v upon_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o the_o straightness_n of_o the_o thing_n regulate_v upon_o the_o straightness_n of_o the_o rule_n and_o beside_o this_o dependence_n be_v voluntary_a for_o it_o be_v in_o the_o power_n of_o the_o church_n to_o deviate_v from_o this_o rule_n be_v nothing_o else_o but_o a_o aggregation_n of_o man_n of_o which_o every_o one_o have_v free_a will_n and_o be_v subject_a to_o passion_n and_o error_n therefore_o the_o churehe_n infallibility_n be_v not_o so_o certain_a as_o that_o of_o the_o apostle_n 31._o last_o quid_fw-la verba_fw-la audiam_fw-la cum_fw-la facta_fw-la videam_fw-la if_o you_o be_v so_o infallible_a as_o the_o apostle_n be_v show_v it_o as_o the_o apostle_n do_v they_o go_v forth_o say_v s._n mark_n and_o preach_v every_o where_o the_o lord_n work_v with_o they_o and_o confirm_v their_o word_n with_o sign_n follow_v it_o be_v impossible_a that_o god_n shall_v lie_v and_o that_o the_o eternal_a truth_n shall_v set_v his_o hand_n and_o seal_v to_o the_o confirmation_n of_o a_o falsehood_n or_o of_o such_o doctrine_n as_o be_v partly_o true_a and_o partly_o false_a the_o apostle_n doctrine_n be_v thus_o confirm_v therefore_o it_o be_v entire_o true_a and_o in_o no_o part_n either_o false_a or_o uncertain_a i_o say_v in_o no_o part_n of_o that_o which_o they_o deliver_v constant_o as_o a_o certain_a divine_a truth_n and_o which_o have_v the_o attestation_n of_o divine_a miracle_n for_o that_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o even_o after_o the_o send_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n be_v and_o through_o inadvertence_n or_o prejudice_n continue_v for_o a_o time_n in_o a_o error_n repugnant_a to_o a_o reveal_v truth_n it_o be_v as_o i_o have_v already_o note_v unanswerable_o evident_a from_o the_o story_n of_o the_o act_n of_o the_o apostle_n for_o notwithstanding_o our_o saviour_n express_a warrant_n and_o injunction_n to_o go_v and_o preach_v to_o all_o nation_n yet_o until_o s._n peter_n be_v better_o inform_v by_o a_o vision_n from_o heaven_n and_o by_o the_o conversion_n of_o cornelius_n both_o he_o and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n hold_v it_o unlawful_a for_o they_o to_o go_v or_o preach_v the_o gospel_n to_o any_o but_o the_o jew_n 32._o and_o for_o those_o thing_n which_o they_o profess_v to_o deliver_v as_o the_o dictate_v of_o human_a reason_n and_o prudence_n and_o not_o as_o divine_a revelation_n why_o we_o shall_v take_v they_o to_o be_v divine_a revelation_n i_o see_v no_o reason_n nor_o how_o we_o can_v do_v so_o and_o not_o contradict_v the_o apostle_n and_o god_n himself_o therefore_o when_o s._n paul_n say_v in_o the_o first_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinth_n 7.12_o to_o the_o rest_n speak_v i_o not_o the_o lord_n and_o again_o concern_v virgin_n i_o have_v no_o commandment_n of_o the_o lord_n but_o i_o deliver_v my_o judgement_n if_o we_o will_v pretend_v that_o the_o lord_n do_v certain_o speak_v what_o s._n paul_n speak_v and_o that_o his_o judgement_n be_v god_n commandment_n shall_v we_o not_o plain_o contradict_v s._n paul_n and_o that_o spirit_n by_o which_o he_o write_v which_o move_v he_o to_o write_v as_o in_o other_o place_n divine_a revelation_n which_o he_o certain_o know_v to_o be_v such_o so_o in_o this_o place_n his_o own_o judgement_n touch_v some_o thing_n which_o god_n have_v not_o particular_o reveal_v unto_o he_o 34._o obj._n but_o if_o the_o apostle_n be_v infallible_a in_o all_o thing_n propose_v by_o they_o as_o divine_a truth_n the_o like_a must_v be_v affirm_v of_o the_o church_n because_o protestant_n teach_v the_o promise_n of_o lead_v into_o all_o truth_n to_o be_v verify_v in_o the_o church_n ans_fw-fr it_o be_v true_a that_o to_o the_o apostle_n the_o promise_n be_v make_v and_o to_o they_o only_o yet_o the_o word_n be_v true_a also_o of_o the_o church_n but_o they_o agree_v to_o the_o apostle_n in_o a_o high_a to_o the_o church_n in_o a_o low_a sense_n to_o the_o apostle_n in_o more_o absolute_a to_o the_o church_n in_o a_o more_o limit_a sense_n to_o the_o apostle_n absolute_o for_o the_o church_n direction_n to_o the_o church_n conditional_o by_o adherence_n to_o that_o direction_n and_o so_o far_o as_o she_o do_v adhere_v to_o it_o in_o a_o word_n the_o apostle_n be_v lead_v into_o all_o truth_n by_o the_o spirit_n efficaciter_fw-la the_o church_n be_v lead_v also_o into_o all_o truth_n by_o the_o apostle_n writing_n sufficienter_fw-la so_o that_o the_o apostle_n and_o the_o church_n may_v be_v fit_o compare_v to_o the_o star_n and_o the_o wiseman_n the_o star_n be_v direct_v by_o the_o finger_n of_o god_n and_o can_v not_o but_o go_v right_a to_o the_o place_n where_o christ_n be_v but_o the_o wiseman_n be_v lead_v by_o the_o star_n to_o christ_n lead_v by_o it_o i_o say_v not_o efficaciter_fw-la or_o irresistibiliter_fw-la but_o sufficienter_fw-la so_o that_o if_o they_o will_v they_o may_v follow_v it_o if_o they_o will_v not_o they_o may_v choose_v so_o be_v it_o between_o the_o apostle_n write_v scripture_n and_o the_o church_n they_o in_o their_o writing_n be_v infallible_o assist_v to_o propose_v nothing_o as_o a_o divine_a truth_n but_o what_o be_v so_o the_o church_n be_v also_o lead_v into_o all_o truth_n but_o it_o be_v by_o the_o intervening_a of_o the_o apostle_n writing_n but_o it_o be_v as_o the_o wiseman_n be_v lead_v by_o the_o star_n or_o as_o a_o traveller_n be_v direct_v by_o a_o mercurial_a statue_n or_o as_o a_o pilot_n by_o his_o card_n and_o compass_n lead_v sufficient_o but_o not_o irresistible_o lead_v so_o that_o she_o may_v follow_v not_o so_o that_o she_o must_v for_o see_v the_o church_n be_v a_o society_n of_o man_n whereof_o every_o one_o according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o romish_a church_n have_v freewill_n in_o believe_v it_o follow_v that_o the_o whole_a aggregate_v have_v freewill_n in_o believe_v and_o if_o any_o man_n say_v that_o at_o least_o it_o be_v moral_o impossible_a that_o of_o so_o many_o whereof_o all_o may_v believe_v aright_o not_o any_o shall_v do_v so_o i_o answer_v it_o be_v true_a if_o they_o do_v all_o give_v themselves_o any_o liberty_n of_o judgement_n but_o if_o all_o as_o the_o case_n be_v here_o captivate_v their_o understanding_n to_o one_o of_o they_o all_o be_v as_o likely_a to_o err_v as_o that_o one_o
believe_v they_o for_o every_o obligation_n cease_v when_o it_o become_v impossible_a who_o can_v doubt_v but_o the_o primitive_a christian_n to_o who_o the_o epistle_n of_o the_o apostle_n be_v write_v either_o of_o themselves_o understand_v or_o be_v instruct_v by_o the_o apostle_n touch_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o obscure_a place_n of_o they_o these_o traditive_a interpretation_n have_v they_o be_v write_v and_o disperse_v as_o the_o scripture_n be_v have_v without_o question_n be_v preserve_v as_o the_o scripture_n be_v but_o to_o show_v how_o excellent_a a_o keeper_n of_o the_o tradition_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v be_v or_o even_o the_o catholic_n church_n for_o want_v of_o writing_n they_o be_v all_o lose_v nay_o be_v all_o lose_v within_o a_o few_o age_n after_o christ_n so_o that_o if_o we_o consult_v the_o ancient_a interpreter_n we_o shall_v hardly_o find_v any_o two_o of_o they_o agree_v about_o the_o sense_n of_o any_o one_o of_o they_o cardinal_n perron_n in_o his_o discourse_n of_o tradition_n have_v allege_v this_o place_n for_o they_o hold_v the_o tradition_n etc._n etc._n tell_v we_o we_o must_v not_o answer_v that_o s._n paul_n speak_v here_o only_o of_o such_o tradition_n which_o though_o not_o in_o this_o epist_n to_o the_o thessalonian_o yet_o be_v afterward_o witten_v and_o in_o other_o book_n of_o scripture_n because_o it_o be_v upon_o occasion_n of_o tradition_n touch_v the_o cause_n of_o the_o hindrance_n of_o the_o come_n of_o antichrist_n which_o be_v never_o write_v that_o he_o lay_v this_o injunction_n upon_o they_o to_o hold_v the_o tradition_n well_o let_v we_o grant_v this_o argument_n good_a and_o conclude_v and_o that_o the_o church_n of_o the_o thessalonian_o or_o the_o catholic_n church_n for_o what_o s._n paul_n write_v to_o one_o church_n he_o write_v to_o all_o be_v to_o hold_v some_o unwritten_a tradition_n and_o among_o the_o rest_n what_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o the_o hindrance_n of_o the_o come_n of_o antichrist_n but_o what_o if_o they_o do_v not_o perform_v their_o duty_n in_o this_o point_n but_o suffer_v this_o tradition_n to_o be_v lose_v out_o of_o the_o memory_n of_o the_o church_n shall_v we_o not_o conclude_v that_o see_v god_n will_v not_o suffer_v any_o thing_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n to_o be_v lose_v and_o he_o have_v suffer_v this_o tradition_n to_o be_v lose_v therefore_o the_o knowledge_n or_o belief_n of_o it_o though_o it_o be_v a_o profitable_a thing_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o necessary_a i_o hope_v you_o will_v not_o challenge_v such_o authority_n over_o we_o as_o to_o oblige_v we_o to_o impossibility_n to_o do_v that_o which_o you_o can_v do_v yourselves_o it_o be_v therefore_o requisite_a that_o you_o make_v this_o command_n possible_a to_o be_v obey_v before_o you_o require_v obedience_n unto_o it_o be_v you_o able_a then_o to_o instruct_v we_o so_o well_o as_o to_o be_v fit_a to_o say_v unto_o we_o now_o you_o know_v what_o withhold_v or_o do_v you_o yourselves_o know_v that_o you_o may_v instruct_v we_o can_v you_o or_o dare_v you_o say_v this_o or_o this_o be_v this_o hindrance_n which_o s._n paul_n here_o mean_v and_o all_o man_n under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n be_v to_o believe_v it_o or_o if_o you_o can_v as_o i_o be_o certain_a you_o can_v go_v then_o and_o vaunt_v your_o church_n for_o the_o only_a watchful_a faithful_a infallible_a keeper_n of_o the_o apostle_n tradition_n when_o here_o this_o very_a tradition_n which_o here_o in_o particular_a be_v deposit_v with_o the_o thessalonian_o and_o the_o premitive_a church_n you_o have_v utter_o lose_v it_o so_o that_o there_o be_v no_o footstep_n or_o print_n of_o it_o remain_v which_o with_o divine_a faith_n we_o may_v rely_v upon_o bless_a therefore_o be_v the_o goodness_n of_o god_n who_o see_v that_o what_o be_v not_o write_v be_v in_o such_o danger_n to_o be_v lose_v take_v order_n that_o what_o be_v necessary_a shall_v be_v write_v s._n chrysostoms_n counsel_n therefore_o of_o account_v the_o church_n tradition_n worthy_a of_o belief_n we_o be_v willing_a to_o obey_v and_o if_o you_o can_v of_o any_o thing_n make_v it_o appear_v that_o it_o be_v tradition_n we_o will_v seek_v no_o far_o but_o this_o we_o say_v withal_o that_o we_o be_v persuade_v we_o can_v make_v this_o appear_v in_o any_o thing_n but_o only_o the_o canon_n of_o scripture_n and_o that_o there_o be_v nothing_o now_o extant_a and_o to_o be_v know_v by_o we_o which_o can_v put_v in_o so_o good_a plea_n to_o be_v the_o unwritten_a word_n of_o god_n as_o the_o unquestioned_a book_n of_o canonical_a scripture_n to_o be_v the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n 47._o you_o conclude_v this_o paragraph_n with_o a_o sentence_n of_o s._n augustine_n who_o say_v the_o church_n do_v not_o approve_v nor_o dissemble_v nor_o do_v these_o thing_n which_o be_v against_o faith_n or_o good_a life_n and_o from_o hence_o you_o conclude_v that_o it_o never_o have_v do_v so_o nor_o never_o can_v do_v so_o but_o though_o the_o argument_n hold_v in_o logic_n à _fw-la non_fw-la posse_fw-la ad_fw-la non_fw-la esse_fw-la yet_o i_o never_o hear_v that_o it_o will_v hold_v back_o again_o à _fw-la non_fw-la esse_fw-la ad_fw-la non_fw-la posse_fw-la the_o church_n can_v do_v this_o therefore_o it_o do_v it_o not_o follows_z with_o good_a consequence_n but_o the_o church_n do_v not_o this_o therefore_o it_o shall_v never_o do_v it_o nor_o can_v never_o do_v it_o this_o i_o believe_v will_v hardly_o follow_v in_o the_o epistle_n next_o before_o to_o the_o same_o januarius_n write_v of_o the_o same_o matter_n he_o have_v these_o word_n it_o remain_v that_o the_o thing_n you_o inquire_v of_o must_v be_v of_o that_o three_o kind_n of_o thing_n which_o be_v different_a in_o divers_a place_n let_v every_o one_o therefore_o do_v that_o which_o he_o find_v do_v in_o the_o church_n to_o which_o he_o come_v for_o none_o of_o they_o be_v against_o faith_n or_o good_a manner_n and_o why_o do_v you_o not_o infer_v from_o hence_o that_o no_o particular_a church_n can_v bring_v up_o any_o custom_n that_o be_v against_o faith_n or_o good_a manner_n certain_o this_o consequence_n have_v as_o good_a reason_n for_o it_o as_o the_o former_a if_o a_o man_n say_v of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n what_o s._n austin_n of_o the_o church_n that_o she_o neither_o approve_v nor_o dissemble_v nor_o do_v any_o thing_n against_o faith_n or_o good_a manner_n will_v you_o collect_v present_o that_o this_o man_n do_v either_o make_v or_o think_v the_o church_n of_o england_n infallible_a furthermore_o it_o be_v observable_a out_o of_o this_o and_o the_o former_a epistle_n that_o this_o church_n which_o do_v not_o as_o s._n austin_n according_a to_o you_o think_v approve_v or_o dissemble_v or_o do_v any_o thing_n against_o faith_n or_o good_a life_n do_v yet_o tolerate_v and_o dissemble_v vain_a superstition_n and_o humane_a presumption_n and_o suffer_v all_o place_n to_o be_v full_a of_o they_o and_o to_o be_v exact_v as_o nay_o more_o severe_o than_o the_o commandment_n of_o god_n himself_o this_o s._n austin_n himself_o profess_v in_o this_o very_a epistle_n this_o say_v he_o i_o do_v infinite_o grieve_v at_o that_o many_o most_o wholesome_a precept_n of_o the_o divine_a scripture_n be_v little_o regard_v and_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n all_o be_v so_o full_a of_o so_o many_o presumption_n that_o he_o be_v more_o grievous_o find_v fault_n with_o who_o during_o his_o octave_n touch_v the_o earth_n with_o his_o naked_a foot_n than_o he_o that_o shall_v bury_v his_o soul_n in_o drunkenness_n of_o these_o he_o say_v that_o they_o be_v neither_o contain_v in_o scripture_n decree_v by_o council_n nor_o corroborate_v by_o the_o custom_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n and_o though_o not_o against_o faith_n yet_o unprofitable_a burden_n of_o christian_a liberty_n which_o make_v the_o condition_n of_o the_o jew_n more_o tolerable_a than_o that_o of_o christian_n and_o therefore_o he_o profess_v of_o they_o approbare_fw-la non_fw-la possum_fw-la i_o can_v approve_v they_o and_o ubi_fw-la facultas_fw-la tribuitur_fw-la resecanda_fw-la existimo_fw-la i_o think_v they_o be_v to_o be_v cut_v off_o wheresoever_o we_o have_v power_n yet_o so_o deep_o be_v they_o root_v and_o spread_v so_o far_o through_o the_o indiscreet_a devotion_n of_o the_o people_n always_o more_o prone_a to_o superstition_n than_o true_a piety_n and_o through_o the_o connivance_n of_o the_o governor_n who_o shall_v have_v strangle_v they_o at_o their_o birth_n that_o himself_o though_o he_o grieve_v at_o they_o and_o can_v not_o allow_v they_o yet_o for_o fear_n of_o offence_n he_o dare_v not_o speak_v against_o they_o multa_fw-la hujusmodi_fw-la propter_fw-la nonnullarum_fw-la vel_fw-la sanctarum_fw-la vel_fw-la turbulentarum_fw-la personarum_fw-la scandala_fw-la devitanda_fw-la liberius_fw-la improbare_fw-la non_fw-la audeo_fw-la many_o of_o these_o thing_n for_o fear_n of_o
scripture_n which_o be_v not_o contain_v in_o the_o creed_n when_o once_o we_o come_v to_o know_v that_o they_o be_v write_v in_o scripture_n but_o rather_o to_o lay_v a_o necessity_n upon_o man_n of_o believe_v all_o thing_n write_v in_o scripture_n when_o once_o they_o know_v they_o to_o be_v there_o write_v for_o he_o that_o believe_v not_o all_o know_v divine_a revelation_n to_o be_v true_a how_o do_v he_o believe_v in_o god_n unless_o you_o will_v say_v that_o the_o same_o man_n at_o the_o same_o time_n may_v not_o believe_v god_n and_o yet_o believe_v in_o he_o the_o great_a difficulty_n be_v how_o it_o will_v not_o take_v away_o the_o necessity_n of_o believe_a scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n but_o that_o it_o will_v not_o neither_o for_o though_o the_o creed_n be_v grant_v a_o sufficient_a summary_n of_o article_n of_o mere_a faith_n yet_o no_o man_n pretend_v that_o it_o contain_v the_o rule_n of_o obedience_n but_o for_o they_o all_o man_n be_v refer_v to_o scripture_n beside_o he_o that_o pretend_v to_o believe_v in_o god_n oblige_v himself_o to_o believe_v it_o necessary_a to_o obey_v that_o which_o reason_n assure_v he_o to_o be_v the_o will_n of_o god_n now_o reason_n will_v assure_v he_o that_o believe_v the_o creed_n that_o it_o be_v the_o will_n of_o god_n he_o shall_v believe_v the_o scripture_n even_o the_o very_a same_o reason_n which_o move_v he_o to_o believe_v the_o creed_n universal_a and_o never_o fail_a tradition_n have_v give_v this_o testimony_n both_o to_o creed_n and_o scripture_n that_o they_o both_o by_o the_o work_n of_o god_n be_v seal_v and_o testify_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o thus_o much_o be_v speak_v in_o answer_n to_o your_o first_o argument_n the_o length_n whereof_o will_v be_v the_o more_o excusable_a if_o i_o oblige_v myself_o to_o say_v but_o little_a to_o the_o rest_n 15._o i_o come_v then_o to_o your_o second_o and_o in_o answer_n to_o it_o deny_v flat_o as_o a_o thing_n destructive_a of_o itself_o that_o any_o error_n can_v be_v damnable_a unless_o it_o be_v repugnant_a immediate_o or_o mediate_o direct_o or_o indirect_o of_o itself_o or_o by_o accident_n to_o some_o truth_n for_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o fundamental_a and_o to_o your_o example_n of_o pontius_n pilat_n being_n judge_n of_o christ_n i_o say_v the_o denial_n of_o it_o in_o he_o that_o know_v it_o to_o be_v reveal_v by_o god_n be_v manifest_o destructive_a of_o this_o fundamental_a truth_n that_o all_o divine_a revelation_n be_v true_a neither_o will_v you_o find_v any_o error_n so_o much_o as_o by_o accident_n damnable_a but_o the_o reject_v of_o it_o will_v be_v necessary_o lay_v upon_o we_o by_o a_o real_a belief_n of_o all_o fundamental_o and_o simple_o necessary_a truth_n and_o i_o desire_v you_o will_v reconcile_v with_o this_o that_o which_o you_o have_v say_v §_o 15._o every_o fundamental_a error_n must_v have_v a_o contrary_a fundamental_a truth_n because_o of_o two_o contradictory_n proposition_n in_o the_o same_o degree_n the_o one_o be_v false_a the_o other_o must_v be_v true_a etc._n etc._n 16._o to_o the_o three_o i_o answer_v that_o the_o certainty_n i_o have_v of_o the_o creed_n that_o it_o be_v from_o the_o apostle_n and_o contain_v the_o principle_n of_o faith_n i_o ground_n it_o not_o upon_o scripture_n and_o yet_o not_o upon_o the_o infallibility_n of_o any_o present_a much_o less_o of_o your_o church_n but_o upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n and_o write_v tradition_n which_o as_o d._n potter_n have_v prove_v give_v this_o constant_a testimony_n unto_o it_o beside_o i_o tell_v you_o it_o be_v guilty_a of_o the_o same_o fault_n which_o d._n potter_n assertion_n be_v here_o accuse_v of_o have_v perhaps_o some_o colour_n towards_o the_o prove_v it_o false_a but_o none_o at_o all_o to_o show_v it_o impertinent_a 17._o to_o the_o four_o i_o answer_v plain_o thus_o that_o you_o find_v fault_n with_o d._n potter_n for_o his_o virtue_n you_o be_v offend_v with_o he_o for_o not_o usurp_v the_o authority_n which_o he_o have_v not_o in_o a_o word_n for_o not_o play_v the_o pope_n certain_o if_o protestant_n be_v faulty_a in_o this_o matter_n it_o be_v for_o do_v it_o too_o much_o and_o not_o too_o little_a this_o presumptuous_a impose_v of_o the_o sense_n of_o man_n upon_o the_o word_n of_o god_n the_o special_a sense_n of_o man_n upon_o the_o general_a word_n of_o god_n and_o lay_v they_o upon_o man_n conscience_n together_o under_o the_o equal_a penalty_n of_o death_n and_o damnation_n this_o vain_a conceit_n that_o we_o can_v speak_v of_o the_o thing_n of_o god_n better_a than_o in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n this_o deify_v our_o own_o interpretation_n and_o tyrannous_a enforce_v they_o upon_o other_o this_o restrain_v of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n from_o that_o latitude_n and_o generality_n and_o the_o understanding_n of_o man_n from_o that_o liberty_n wherein_o christ_n and_o the_o apostle_n leave_v they_o much_o they_o this_o persuasion_n be_v no_o singularity_n of_o i_o but_o the_o doctrine_n which_o i_o have_v learn_v from_o divine_n of_o great_a learning_n and_o judgement_n let_v the_o reader_n be_v please_v to_o peruse_v the_o seven_o book_n of_o acontius_n de_fw-fr stratag_n satanae_n and_o zanchius_n his_o last_o oration_n deliver_v by_o he_o after_o the_o compose_n of_o the_o discord_n between_o he_o and_o amerbachius_n and_o he_o shall_v confess_v as_o much_o be_v and_o have_v be_v the_o only_a fountain_n of_o all_o the_o schism_n of_o the_o church_n and_o that_o which_o make_v they_o immortal_a the_o common_a incendiary_n of_o christendom_n and_o that_o which_o as_o i_o say_v before_o tear_n into_o piece_n not_o the_o coat_n but_o the_o bowel_n and_o member_n of_o christ_n ridente_fw-la turcâ_fw-la nec_fw-la dolente_fw-la judaeo_n take_v away_o these_o wall_n of_o separation_n and_o all_o will_v quick_o be_v one_o take_v away_o this_o persecute_v burn_a curse_v damn_v of_o man_n for_o not_o subscribe_v to_o the_o word_n of_o man_n as_o the_o word_n of_o god_n require_v of_o christian_n only_o to_o believe_v christ_n and_o to_o call_v no_o man_n master_n but_o he_o only_o let_v those_o leave_n claim_v infallibility_n that_o have_v no_o title_n to_o it_o and_o let_v they_o that_o in_o their_o word_n disclaim_v it_o disclaim_v it_o likewise_o in_o their_o action_n in_o a_o word_n take_v away_o tyranny_n which_o be_v the_o devil_n instrument_n to_o support_v error_n and_o superstition_n and_o impiety_n in_o the_o several_a part_n of_o the_o world_n which_o can_v not_o otherwise_o long_o withstand_v the_o power_n of_o truth_n i_o say_v take_v away_o tyranny_n and_o restore_v christian_n to_o their_o just_a and_o full_a liberty_n of_o captivate_v their_o understanding_n to_o scripture_n only_o and_o as_o river_n when_o they_o have_v a_o free_a passage_n run_v all_o to_o the_o ocean_n so_o it_o may_v well_o be_v hope_v by_o god_n blessing_n that_o universal_a liberty_n thus_o moderate_v may_v quick_o reduce_v christendom_n to_o truth_n and_o unity_n these_o thought_n of_o peace_n i_o be_o persuade_v may_v come_v from_o the_o god_n of_o peace_n and_o to_o his_o blessing_n i_o commend_v they_o and_o proceed_v 18._o your_o five_o and_o last_o objection_n stand_v upon_o a_o false_a and_o dangerous_a supposition_n that_o new_a heresy_n may_v arise_v for_o a_o heresy_n be_v in_o itself_o nothing_o else_o but_o a_o doctrine_n repugnant_a to_o some_o article_n of_o the_o christian_a faith_n to_o say_v that_o new_a heresy_n may_v arise_v be_v to_o say_v that_o new_a article_n of_o faith_n may_v arise_v and_o so_o some_o great_a one_o among_o you_o stick_v not_o to_o profess_v in_o plain_a term_n who_o yet_o at_o the_o same_o time_n be_v not_o ashamed_a to_o pretend_v that_o your_o whole_a doctrine_n be_v catholic_n and_o apostolic_a so_o salmeron_n non_fw-la omnibus_fw-la omne_fw-la dedit_fw-la deus_fw-la ut_fw-la quaelibet_fw-la aetas_fw-la suis_fw-la gaudeat_fw-la veritatibus_fw-la quas_fw-la prio_fw-la aetas_fw-la ignoravit_fw-la god_n have_v not_o give_v all_o thing_n to_o all_o so_o that_o every_o age_n have_v its_o proper_a verity_n which_o the_o former_a age_n be_v ignorant_a of_o disp_n 57_o in_o ep._n ad_fw-la rom._n and_o again_o in_o the_o margin_n habet_fw-la unumquodque_fw-la saeculum_fw-la peculiares_fw-la revelationes_fw-la divinas_fw-la every_o age_n have_v its_o peculiar_a divine_a revelation_n where_o that_o he_o speak_v of_o such_o revelation_n as_o be_v or_o may_v by_o the_o church_n be_v make_v matter_n of_o faith_n no_o man_n can_v doubt_v that_o read_v he_o a_o example_n whereof_o he_o give_v we_o a_o little_a before_o in_o these_o word_n unius_fw-la augustini_fw-la doctrina_fw-la assumptionis_fw-la b._n deiparae_fw-la cultum_fw-la in_o ecclesiam_fw-la introduxit_fw-la the_o doctrine_n of_o augustin_n only_o have_v bring_v in_o to_o the_o church_n the_o worship_n of_o
in_o particular_a admonish_v that_o for_o so_o small_a a_o cause_n propter_fw-la tam_fw-la modicam_fw-la causam_fw-la he_o shall_v not_o have_v cut_v off_o so_o many_o province_n from_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n and_o last_o see_v the_o eccesiastical_a story_n of_o those_o time_n mention_n not_o other_o notable_a example_n of_o any_o such_o schismatical_a presumption_n but_o this_o of_o victor_n certain_o we_o have_v great_a inducement_n to_o imagine_v that_o irenaeus_n in_o this_o place_n by_o you_o quote_v have_v a_o special_a aim_n at_o the_o bishop_n and_o church_n of_o rome_n once_o this_o i_o be_o sure_a of_o that_o the_o place_n fit_v he_o and_o many_o of_o his_o successor_n as_o well_o as_o if_o it_o have_v be_v make_v purposely_o for_o they_o and_o this_o also_o that_o he_o which_o find_v fault_n with_o they_o who_o separate_v upon_o small_a cause_n imply_v clear_o that_o he_o conceive_v their_o might_n be_v such_o cause_n as_o be_v great_a and_o sufficient_a and_o that_o then_o a_o reformation_n be_v to_o be_v make_v notwithstanding_o any_o danger_n of_o division_n that_o may_v ensue_v upon_o it_o 12._o last_o s._n denis_n of_o alexandria_n say_v indeed_o and_o very_o well_o that_o all_o thing_n shall_v be_v rather_o endure_v than_o we_o shall_v consent_v to_o the_o division_n of_o the_o church_n i_o will_v add_v rather_o than_o consent_v to_o the_o continuation_n of_o the_o division_n if_o it_o may_v be_v remedy_v but_o then_o i_o be_o to_o tell_v you_o that_o he_o say_v not_o all_o thing_n shall_v rather_o be_v do_v but_o only_o all_o thing_n shall_v rather_o be_v endure_v or_o suffer_v wherein_o he_o speak_v not_o of_o the_o evil_a of_o sin_n but_o of_o pain_n and_o misery_n not_o of_o tolerate_v either_o error_n or_o sin_n in_o other_o though_o that_o may_v be_v lawful_a much_o less_o of_o join_v with_o other_o for_o quietness_n sake_n which_o only_o be_v to_o your_o purpose_n in_o the_o profession_n of_o error_n and_o practice_n of_o sin_n but_o of_o suffer_v any_o affliction_n nay_o even_o martyrdom_n in_o our_o own_o person_n rather_o than_o consent_v to_o the_o division_n of_o the_o church_n omnia_fw-la incommoda_fw-la so_o your_o own_o christophorson_n enforce_v by_o the_o circumstance_n of_o the_o place_n translate_v dionysius_n his_o word_n all_o misery_n shall_v rather_o be_v endure_v than_o we_o shall_v consent_v to_o the_o church_n division_n 13._o ad_fw-la §_o 9_o in_o this_o paragraph_n you_o tell_v we_o first_o that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o total_a deficiency_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n maintain_v by_o many_o chief_a protestant_n imply_v in_o it_o vast_a absurdity_n or_o rather_o sacrilegious_a blasphemy_n answ_n but_o neither_o do_v the_o protestant_n allege_v by_o you_o maintain_v the_o deficiency_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n but_o only_o of_o the_o church_n visibility_n or_o of_o the_o church_n as_o it_o be_v visible_a neither_o do_v they_o hold_v that_o the_o visible_a church_n have_v fail_v total_o from_o its_o essence_n but_o only_o from_o its_o purity_n and_o that_o it_o fall_v into_o many_o corruption_n but_o yet_o not_o to_o nothing_o you_o say_v second_o that_o the_o reason_n which_o cast_v they_o upon_o this_o wicked_a doctrine_n be_v a_o desperate_a voluntary_a necessity_n because_o they_o be_v resolve_v not_o to_o acknowledge_v the_o roman_a to_o be_v the_o true_a church_n and_o be_v convince_v by_o all_o manner_n of_o evidence_n that_o for_o diverse_a age_n before_o luther_n there_o be_v no_o other_o but_o this_o be_v not_o to_o dispute_v but_o to_o divine_a and_o take_v upon_o you_o the_o property_n of_o god_n which_o be_v to_o know_v the_o heart_n of_o men._n for_o why_o i_o pray_v may_v not_o the_o reason_n hereof_o rather_o be_v because_o they_o be_v convince_v by_o all_o manner_n of_o evidence_n as_o scripture_n reason_n antiquity_n that_o all_o the_o visible_a church_n in_o the_o world_n but_o above_o all_o the_o roman_a have_v degenerate_v from_o the_o purity_n of_o the_o gospel_n of_o christ_n and_o thereupon_o do_v conclude_v there_o be_v no_o visible_a church_n mean_v by_o no_o church_n none_o free_a from_o corruption_n and_o conformable_a in_o all_o thing_n to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n 14._o ad_fw-la §_o 10._o neither_o be_v there_o any_o repugnance_n but_o in_o word_n only_o between_o these_o as_o you_o be_v please_v to_o style_v they_o exterminate_v spirit_n and_o those_o other_o who_o out_o of_o courtesy_n you_o entitle_v in_o your_o 10._o §_o more_o moderate_a protestant_n for_o these_o affirm_v the_o perpetual_a visibility_n of_o the_o church_n yet_o neither_o deny_v nor_o doubt_n of_o she_o be_v subject_a to_o manifold_a and_o grievous_a corruption_n and_o those_o of_o such_o a_o nature_n as_o be_v they_o not_o mitigate_v by_o invincible_a or_o at_o least_o a_o very_a probable_a ignorance_n none_o subject_a to_o they_o can_v be_v save_v and_o they_o on_o the_o other_o side_n deny_v the_o church_n visibility_n yet_o plain_o affirm_v that_o they_o conceive_v very_o good_a hope_n of_o the_o salvation_n of_o many_o of_o their_o ignorant_a and_o honest_a forefather_n thus_o declare_v plain_o though_o in_o word_n they_o deny_v the_o visibility_n of_o the_o true_a church_n yet_o their_o meaning_n be_v not_o to_o deny_v the_o perpetuity_n but_o the_o perpetual_a purity_n and_o incorruption_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n 17._o ad_fw-la §_o 11._o you_o ask_v to_o what_o congregation_n shall_v a_o man_n have_v recourse_n for_o the_o affair_n of_o his_o soul_n if_o upon_o earth_n there_o be_v no_o visible_a church_n of_o christ_n answ_n if_o some_o one_o christian_a live_v alone_o among_o pagan_n in_o some_o country_n remote_a from_o christendom_n shall_v we_o conceive_v it_o impossible_a for_o this_o man_n to_o be_v save_v because_o he_o can_v have_v recourse_n to_o any_o congregation_n for_o the_o affair_n of_o his_o soul_n will_v it_o not_o be_v sufficient_a for_o such_o a_o one_o salvation_n to_o know_v the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n and_o live_v according_a to_o it_o 18._o obj._n to_o imagine_v a_o company_n of_o man_n believe_v one_o thing_n in_o their_o heart_n and_o with_o their_o mouth_n profess_v the_o contrary_n as_o they_o must_v be_v suppose_v to_o do_v for_o if_o they_o have_v profess_v what_o they_o believe_v they_o will_v have_v become_v visible_a be_v to_o dream_v of_o a_o damn_a crew_n of_o dissemble_a sycophant_n but_o not_o to_o conceive_v aright_o of_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n answ_n what_o be_v this_o to_o the_o visibility_n of_o the_o church_n may_v not_o the_o church_n be_v invisible_a and_o yet_o these_o that_o be_v of_o it_o profess_v their_o faith_n no_o say_v you_o their_o profession_n will_v make_v they_o visible_a very_o true_a visible_a in_o the_o place_n where_o and_o in_o the_o time_n when_o they_o live_v and_o to_o those_o person_n unto_o who_o they_o have_v necessary_a occasion_n to_o make_v their_o profession_n but_o not_o visible_a to_o all_o or_o any_o great_a or_o considerable_a part_n of_o the_o world_n while_o they_o live_v much_o less_o conspicuous_a to_o all_o age_n after_o they_o now_o it_o be_v a_o church_n thus_o illustrious_o and_o conspicuous_o visible_a that_o you_o require_v by_o who_o splendour_n all_o man_n may_v be_v direct_v and_o draw_v to_o repair_v to_o she_o for_o the_o affair_n of_o their_o soul_n neither_o be_v it_o the_o visibility_n of_o the_o church_n absolute_o but_o this_o degree_n of_o it_o which_o the_o most_o rigid_a protestant_n deny_v which_o be_v plain_a enough_o out_o of_o the_o place_n of_o napper_n cite_v by_o you_o in_o your_o 9_o part._n of_o this_o chap_a where_o his_o word_n be_v god_n have_v withdraw_v his_o visible_a church_n from_o open_a assembly_n to_o the_o heart_n of_o particular_a godly_a man_n and_o this_o church_n which_o have_v not_o open_a assembly_n he_o call_v the_o latent_fw-la and_o invisible_a church_n now_o i_o hope_v papist_n in_o england_n will_v be_v very_o apt_a to_o grant_v man_n may_v be_v so_o far_a latent_fw-la and_o invisible_a as_o not_o to_o profess_v their_o faith_n in_o open_a assembly_n nor_o to_o proclaim_v it_o to_o all_o the_o world_n and_o yet_o not_o deny_v nor_o dissemble_v it_o nor_o deserve_v to_o be_v esteem_v a_o damn_a crew_n of_o dissemble_a sycophant_n obj._n but_o preach_v of_o the_o word_n and_o administration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n can_v but_o make_v a_o church_n visible_a and_o these_o be_v inseparable_a note_n of_o the_o church_n i_o answer_v they_o be_v so_o far_o inseparable_a that_o wheresoever_o they_o be_v there_o a_o church_n be_v but_o not_o so_o but_o that_o in_o some_o case_n there_o may_v be_v a_o church_n where_o these_o note_n be_v not_o again_o these_o note_n will_v make_v the_o church_n visible_a but_o to_o who_o certain_o not_o to_o all_o man_n nor_o to_o most_o man_n but_o to_o they_o only_o to_o who_o
the_o word_n be_v preach_v and_o the_o sacrament_n be_v administer_v they_o make_v the_o church_n visible_a to_o who_o themselves_o be_v visible_a but_o not_o to_o other_o as_o where_o your_o sacrament_n be_v administer_v and_o your_o doctrine_n preach_v it_o be_v visible_a that_o there_o be_v a_o popish_a church_n but_o this_o may_v perhaps_o be_v visible_a to_o they_o only_o who_o be_v present_a at_o these_o performance_n and_o to_o other_o as_o secret_a as_o if_o they_o have_v never_o be_v perform_v 20._o obj._n but_o s._n austin_n say_v it_o be_v a_o impudent_a abominable_a detestible_a speech_n etc._n etc._n to_o say_v the_o church_n have_v perish_v answ_n 1._o all_o that_o s._n austin_n say_v be_v not_o true_a 2._o though_o this_o be_v true_a it_o be_v nothing_o to_o your_o purpose_n unless_o you_o will_v conceive_v it_o all_o one_o not_o to_o be_v and_o not_o to_o be_v conspicuous_o visible_a 3._o this_o very_a speech_n that_o the_o church_n perish_v may_v be_v false_a and_o impudent_a in_o the_o donatist_n and_o yet_o not_o so_o in_o the_o protestant_n for_o there_o be_v no_o incongruity_n that_o what_o have_v live_v 500_o year_n may_v perish_v in_o 1600._o 21._o obj._n while_o protestant_n deny_v the_o perpetuity_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n they_o destroy_v their_o own_o present_a church_n answ_n i_o do_v not_o see_v how_o the_o truth_n of_o any_o present_a church_n depend_v upon_o the_o perpetual_a visibility_n nay_o nor_o upon_o the_o perpetuity_n of_o that_o which_o be_v past_a or_o future_a for_o what_o sense_n be_v there_o that_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v in_o the_o power_n of_o god_n almighty_n to_o restore_v to_o a_o flourish_a estate_n a_o church_n which_o oppression_n have_v make_v invisible_a to_o repair_v that_o which_o be_v ruin_v to_o reform_v that_o which_o be_v corrupt_v or_o to_o revive_v that_o which_o be_v dead_a nay_o what_o reason_n be_v there_o but_o that_o by_o ordinary_a mean_n this_o may_v be_v do_v so_o long_o as_o the_o scripture_n by_o divine_a providence_n be_v preserve_v in_o their_o integrity_n and_o authority_n as_o a_o commonwealth_n though_o never_o so_o far_o collapse_v and_o overrun_v with_o disorder_n be_v yet_o in_o possibility_n of_o be_v reduce_v unto_o its_o original_a state_n so_o long_o as_o the_o ancient_a law_n and_o fundamental_a constitution_n be_v extant_a and_o remain_v inviolate_a from_o whence_o man_n may_v be_v direct_v how_o to_o make_v such_o a_o reformation_n but_o s._n austin_n urge_v this_o very_a argument_n against_o the_o donatist_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v good_a i_o answer_v that_o i_o doubt_v much_o of_o the_o consequence_n and_o my_o reason_n be_v because_o you_o yourselves_o acknowledge_v that_o even_o general_a council_n and_o therefore_o much_o more_o particular_a doctor_n though_o infallible_a in_o their_o determination_n be_v yet_o in_o their_o reason_n and_o argument_n whereupon_o they_o ground_n they_o subject_a to_o like_a passion_n and_o error_n with_o other_o man_n 22._o obj._n last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o all_o divine_n define_v schism_n a_o division_n from_o the_o true_a church_n and_o from_o thence_o collect_v that_o there_o must_v be_v a_o know_a church_n from_o which_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o man_n to_o depart_v answer_v i_o may_v very_o just_o question_v your_o antecedent_n and_o desire_v you_o to_o consider_v whether_o schism_n be_v not_o rather_o or_o at_o least_o be_v not_o as_o well_o a_o division_n of_o the_o church_n as_o from_o it_o a_o separation_n not_o of_o a_o part_n from_o the_o whole_a but_o of_o some_o part_n from_o the_o other_o and_o if_o you_o like_v not_o this_o definition_n i_o may_v desire_v you_o to_o inform_v i_o in_o those_o many_o schism_n which_o have_v happen_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n which_o of_o the_o part_n be_v the_o church_n and_o which_o be_v divide_v from_o it_o but_o to_o let_v this_o pass_v certain_o your_o consequence_n be_v most_o unreasonable_a for_o though_o whensoever_o there_o be_v a_o schism_n it_o must_v necessary_o suppose_v a_o church_n existent_a there_o yet_o sure_o we_o may_v define_v a_o schism_n that_o be_v declare_v what_o the_o word_n signify_v for_o defining_n be_v no_o more_o though_o at_o this_o present_a there_o be_v neither_o schism_n nor_o church_n in_o the_o world_n unless_o you_o will_v say_v that_o we_o can_v tell_v what_o a_o rose_n be_v or_o what_o the_o word_n rose_n signify_v but_o only_o in_o the_o summer_n when_o we_o have_v rose_n or_o that_o in_o the_o world_n to_o come_v when_o man_n shall_v not_o marry_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o know_v what_o it_o be_v to_o marry_o or_o that_o the_o plague_n be_v not_o a_o disease_n but_o only_o when_o some_o body_n be_v infect_v or_o that_o adultery_n be_v not_o a_o sin_n unless_o there_o be_v adulterer_n or_o that_o before_o adam_n have_v a_o child_n he_o know_v not_o and_o god_n can_v not_o have_v tell_v he_o what_o it_o be_v to_o be_v a_o father_n certain_o sir_n you_o have_v forget_v your_o metaphysic_n which_o you_o so_o much_o glory_n in_o if_o you_o know_v not_o that_o the_o connexion_n of_o essential_a predicate_v with_o their_o subject_n be_v eternal_a and_o depend_v not_o at_o all_o upon_o the_o actual_a existence_n in_o the_o thing_n define_v this_o definition_n therefore_o of_o schism_n conclude_v not_o the_o existence_n of_o a_o church_n even_o when_o it_o be_v define_v much_o less_o the_o perpetual_a continuance_n of_o it_o and_o least_o of_o all_o the_o continuance_n of_o it_o in_o perpetual_a visibility_n and_o purity_n which_o be_v the_o only_a thing_n that_o we_o deny_v and_o you_o be_v to_o prove_v 23._o ad_fw-la §_o 12.47_o 48_o 49_o 50_o 51_o 52_o 53_o 54_o 55._o the_o remainder_n of_o this_o chapter_n offer_v argument_n to_o convince_v luther_n and_o all_o that_o follow_v he_o to_o be_v schismatic_n 24._o first_o then_o to_o prove_v we_o schismatic_n you_o urge_v from_o the_o nature_n of_o schism_n thus_o whosoever_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v schismatic_n but_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n of_o christ_n therefore_o they_o be_v schismatic_n the_o minor_a or_o second_o proposition_n of_o this_o argument_n you_o prove_v by_o two_o other_o the_o first_o be_v this_o they_o which_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o all_o visible_a church_n must_v needs_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o true_a visible_a church_n of_o christ_n but_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o all_o visible_a church_n therefore_o they_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o true_a visible_a church_n the_o second_o argument_n stand_v thus_o the_o roman_a church_n when_o the_o separation_n be_v make_v by_o luther_n etc._n etc._n be_v the_o true_a visible_a church_n of_o christ_n but_o luther_n etc._n etc._n forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n therefore_o they_o forsake_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o true_a visible_a church_n of_o christ_n the_o proposition_n you_o confirm_v by_o these_o reason_n 1._o the_o roman_a church_n have_v the_o note_n of_o the_o church_n assign_v by_o protestant_n viz._n the_o true_a preach_v of_o the_o word_n and_o due_a administration_n of_o sacrament_n therefore_o she_o be_v the_o true_a church_n 2._o either_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v the_o true_a visible_a church_n or_o protestant_n can_v name_v and_o prove_v some_o other_o disagree_v from_o the_o roman_a and_o agree_v with_o protestant_n in_o their_o particular_a doctrine_n or_o else_o they_o must_v say_v there_o be_v no_o visible_a church_n but_o they_o will_v not_o say_v there_o be_v no_o church_n they_o can_v name_v and_o prove_v any_o other_o disagree_v from_o the_o roman_a and_o agree_v with_o the_o protestant_n in_o their_o particular_a doctrine_n because_o this_o can_v be_v the_o greek_a church_n nor_o that_o of_o the_o waldenses_n wicklifite_n hussites_n nor_o that_o of_o the_o muscovite_n armenians_n georgians_n aethiopian_n which_o you_o confirm_v by_o several_a argument_n therefore_o they_o must_v grant_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v the_o true_a visible_a church_n 25._o now_o to_o all_o this_o i_o brief_o answer_v thus_o that_o you_o have_v play_v the_o unwise_a builder_n and_o erect_v a_o stately_a structure_n upon_o a_o false_a foundation_n for_o whereas_o you_o take_v for_o grant_v as_o a_o undoubted_a truth_n that_o whosoever_o leave_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v schismatical_a i_o tell_v you_o sir_n you_o presume_v too_o much_o upon_o we_o and_o will_v have_v we_o grant_v that_o which_o be_v the_o main_a point_n in_o question_n for_o either_o you_o suppose_v the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o church_n corrupt_v and_o that_o there_o be_v a_o necessity_n for_o they_o that_o will_v communicate_v with_o this_o
corn._n look_v again_o i_o pray_v and_o you_o shall_v see_v that_o the_o field_n he_o speak_v of_o be_v not_o the_o church_n but_o the_o world_n and_o therefore_o neither_o do_v you_o obey_v our_o saviour_n command_n let_v both_o grow_v up_o till_o the_o harvest_n who_o teach_v it_o to_o be_v lawful_a to_o root_v these_o tear_n such_o be_v heretic_n out_o of_o the_o world_n neither_o do_v protestant_n disobey_v it_o if_o they_o eject_v manifest_a heresy_n and_o notorious_a sinner_n out_o of_o the_o church_n 58._o ad_fw-la §_o 19_o in_o the_o 19_o you_o be_v so_o courteous_a as_o to_o suppose_v corruption_n in_o your_o doctrine_n and_o yet_o undertake_v to_o prove_v that_o neither_o can_v they_o afford_v we_o any_o sufficient_a cause_n or_o colourable_a necessity_n to_o depart_v from_o they_o your_o reason_n be_v because_o damnable_a error_n there_o be_v none_o in_o your_o church_n by_o d._n potter_n confession_n neither_o can_v it_o be_v damnable_a in_o respect_n of_o error_n to_o remain_v in_o any_o church_n communion_n who_o error_n be_v not_o damnable_a for_o if_o the_o error_n be_v not_o damnable_a the_o belief_n thereof_o can_v answ_n d._n potter_n confess_v no_o such_o matter_n but_o only_o that_o he_o hope_v that_o your_o error_n though_o in_o themselves_o sufficient_o damnable_a yet_o by_o accident_n do_v not_o damn_v all_o that_o hold_v they_o such_o he_o mean_v and_o say_v as_o be_v excusable_o ignorant_a of_o truth_n and_o among_o the_o number_n of_o their_o unknown_a sin_n repent_v daily_o of_o their_o unknown_a error_n the_o truth_n be_v he_o think_v as_o ill_a of_o your_o error_n and_o their_o desert_n as_o you_o do_v of_o we_o only_o he_o be_v not_o so_o peremptory_a and_o presumptuous_a in_o judge_v your_o person_n as_o you_o be_v in_o judge_v we_o but_o leave_v they_o to_o stand_v or_o fall_v to_o their_o own_o master_n who_o be_v infinite_o merciful_a and_o therefore_o will_v not_o damn_v they_o for_o mere_a error_n who_o desire_v to_o find_v the_o truth_n and_o can_v and_o withal_o infinite_o just_a and_o therefore_o be_v it_o to_o be_v fear_v will_v not_o pardon_v they_o who_o may_v easy_o have_v come_v to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o truth_n and_o either_o through_o pride_n or_o obstinacy_n or_o neligence_n will_v not_o 59_o to_o your_o minor_fw-la also_o i_o answer_v almost_o in_o your_o own_o word_n §_o 42._o of_o this_o chap._n i_o thank_v you_o for_o your_o courteous_a supposal_n that_o your_o church_n may_v err_v and_o in_o recompense_n thereof_o will_v do_v you_o a_o charity_n by_o put_v you_o in_o mind_n into_o what_o labyrinth_n you_o cast_v yourself_o by_o suppose_v that_o the_o church_n may_v err_v in_o some_o of_o her_o proposal_n and_o yet_o deny_v it_o lawful_a for_o any_o man_n though_o he_o know_v this_o which_o you_o suppose_v to_o oppose_v her_o judgement_n or_o leave_v her_o communion_n will_v you_o have_v such_o a_o man_n dissemble_v against_o his_o conscience_n or_o external_o deny_v that_o which_o he_o know_v true_a no_o that_o you_o will_v not_o for_o they_o that_o do_v so_o you_o yourself_o have_v pronounce_v a_o damn_a crew_n of_o dissemble_a sycophant_n or_o will_v you_o have_v he_o continue_v in_o your_o communion_n and_o yet_o profess_v your_o church_n to_o err_v this_o you_o yourselves_o have_v make_v to_o he_o impossible_a or_o will_v you_o have_v he_o believe_v those_o thing_n true_a which_o together_o with_o he_o you_o have_v suppose_v to_o be_v error_n this_o in_o such_o a_o one_o as_o be_v assure_v or_o persuade_v of_o that_o which_o you_o here_o suppose_v that_o your_o church_n do_v err_v and_o such_o only_o we_o say_v be_v oblige_v to_o forsake_v your_o communion_n be_v as_o schoolman_n speak_v implicatio_fw-la in_o terminis_fw-la a_o contradiction_n so_o plain_a that_o one_o word_n destroy_v another_o as_o if_o one_o shall_v say_v a_o live_a dead_a man_n for_o it_o be_v to_o require_v that_o they_o which_o believe_v some_o part_n of_o your_o doctrine_n false_a shall_v withal_o believe_v it_o all_o true_a see_v therefore_o for_o any_o man_n to_o believe_v your_o church_n in_o error_n and_o profess_v the_o contrary_a be_v damnable_a hypocrisy_n to_o believe_v it_o and_o not_o believe_v it_o a_o manifest_a repugnancy_n and_o three_o to_o profess_v it_o and_o to_o continue_v in_o your_o communion_n as_o matter_n now_o stand_v a_o plain_a impossibility_n what_o remain_v but_o that_o whosoever_o be_v suppose_v to_o have_v just_a reason_n to_o disbelieve_v any_o doctrine_n of_o your_o church_n must_v of_o necessity_n forsake_v her_o communion_n unless_o you_o will_v remit_v so_o far_o from_o your_o present_a rigour_n as_o to_o allow_v they_o your_o church_n communion_n who_o public_o profess_v that_o they_o do_v not_o believe_v every_o article_n of_o her_o establish_a doctrine_n indeed_o if_o you_o will_v do_v so_o you_o may_v with_o some_o coherence_n suppose_v your_o church_n in_o error_n and_o yet_o find_v fault_n with_o man_n for_o abandon_v her_o communion_n because_o they_o may_v continue_v in_o it_o and_o suppose_v she_o in_o error_n but_o to_o suppose_v your_o church_n in_o error_n and_o to_o excommunicate_v all_o those_o that_o believe_v your_o own_o supposition_n and_o then_o to_o complain_v that_o they_o continue_v not_o in_o your_o communion_n be_v the_o most_o ridiculous_a incongruity_n that_o can_v be_v imagine_v and_o therefore_o though_o your_o corruption_n in_o doctrine_n in_o themselves_o which_o yet_o be_v false_a do_v not_o yet_o your_o oblige_v we_o to_o profess_v your_o doctrine_n uncorrupted_a against_o knowledge_n and_o conscience_n may_v induce_v a_o obligation_n to_o depart_v from_o your_o communion_n as_o if_o there_o be_v any_o society_n of_o christian_n that_o hold_v there_o be_v no_o antipode_n notwithstanding_o this_o error_n i_o may_v communicate_v with_o they_o but_o if_o i_o can_v not_o do_v so_o without_o profess_v myself_o of_o their_o belief_n in_o this_o matter_n than_o i_o suppose_v i_o shall_v be_v excuse_v from_o schism_n if_o i_o shall_v forsake_v their_o communion_n rather_o than_o profess_v myself_o to_o believe_v that_o which_o i_o do_v not_o believe_v neither_o be_v there_o any_o contradiction_n or_o shadow_n of_o contradiction_n that_o it_o may_v be_v necessary_a for_o my_o salvation_n to_o depart_v from_o this_o church_n communion_n and_o that_o this_o church_n though_o err_v in_o this_o matter_n want_v nothing_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n 60._o that_o there_o may_v be_v necessary_a cause_n to_o depart_v from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n in_o some_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n though_o she_o want_v nothing_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n as_o dr._n potter_n hold_v and_o you_o call_v a_o contradiction_n will_v appear_v by_o set_v down_o his_o word_n which_o be_v these_o to_o forsake_v the_o error_n of_o that_o church_n and_o not_o to_o join_v with_o she_o in_o those_o practice_n which_o we_o account_v erroneous_a we_o be_v enforce_v by_o necessity_n for_o though_o in_o the_o issue_n they_o be_v not_o damnable_a to_o they_o which_o believe_v as_o they_o profess_v yet_o for_o we_o to_o profess_v and_o avow_v by_o oath_n as_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n enjoin_v what_o we_o believe_v not_o be_v without_o question_n damnable_a and_o they_o with_o their_o error_n by_o the_o grace_n of_o god_n may_v go_v to_o heaven_n when_o we_o for_o our_o hypocrisy_n and_o dissimulation_n he_o may_v have_v add_v and_o perjury_n shall_v certain_o be_v condemn_v to_o hell_n 61._o ad_fw-la §_o 20._o obj._n but_o a_o church_n not_o err_v in_o fundamental_o though_o err_v in_o other_o matter_n do_v what_o our_o saviour_n exact_v at_o her_o hand_n do_v as_o much_o as_o lie_v in_o her_o power_n to_o do_v therefore_o the_o communion_n of_o such_o a_o church_n be_v not_o upon_o pretence_n of_o error_n to_o be_v forsake_v the_o consequence_n be_v manifest_a the_o antecedent_n be_v prove_v because_o god_n by_o d._n potter_n confession_n have_v promise_v his_o assistance_n noâ—_n further_o 151.155_o pag._n 151.155_o nor_o be_v it_o in_o her_o power_n to_o do_v more_o than_o god_n do_v assist_v she_o to_o do_v answ_n the_o promise_n of_o divine_a assistance_n be_v twofold_a absolute_a or_o conditional_a that_o there_o shall_v be_v by_o divine_a providence_n preserve_v in_o the_o world_n to_o the_o world_n end_n such_o a_o company_n of_o christian_n who_o hold_v all_o thing_n precise_o and_o indispensable_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n and_o nothing_o inevitable_o destructive_a of_o it_o this_o and_o no_o more_o the_o doctor_n affirm_v that_o god_n have_v promise_v absolute_o yet_o he_o neither_o doubt_n nor_o deny_v but_o that_o a_o far_a assistance_n be_v conditional_o promise_v we_o even_o such_o a_o assistance_n as_o shall_v lead_v we_o if_o we_o be_v not_o want_v to_o it_o and_o ourselves_o into_o all_o not_o only_o necessary_a but_o very_o profitable_a truth_n and_o guard_v we_o from_o
the_o doctrine_n embrace_v by_o he_o consonant_n to_o it_o at_o least_o this_o he_o may_v know_v that_o the_o doctrine_n which_o he_o have_v choose_v to_o he_o seem_v true_a and_o the_o contrary_n which_o he_o have_v forsake_v seem_v false_a and_o therefore_o without_o remorse_n of_o conscience_n he_o may_v profess_v that_o but_o this_o he_o can_v 64._o obj._n but_o we_o be_v to_o remember_v that_o according_a to_o doctor_n potter_n the_o visible_a church_n have_v a_o blessing_n not_o to_o err_v in_o fundamental_o in_o which_o any_o private_a reformer_n may_v fail_v therefore_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n of_o forsake_v the_o church_n out_o of_o who_o communion_n they_o be_v expose_v to_o danger_n of_o fall_v into_o many_o more_o and_o even_o into_o damnable_a error_n answ_n the_o visible_a church_n be_v free_a indeed_o from_o all_o error_n absolute_o destructive_a and_o unpardonable_a but_o not_o from_o all_o error_n which_o in_o itself_o be_v damnable_a not_o from_o all_o which_o will_v actual_o bring_v damnation_n upon_o they_o that_o keep_v themselves_o in_o they_o by_o their_o own_o voluntary_a and_o avoidable_a fault_n beside_o any_o private_a man_n who_o true_o believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o serious_o endeavour_v to_o know_v the_o will_n of_o god_n and_o to_o do_v it_o be_v as_o secure_a as_o the_o visible_a church_n more_o secure_a than_o your_o church_n from_o the_o danger_n of_o err_v in_o fundamental_o for_o it_o be_v impossible_a that_o any_o man_n so_o qualify_v shall_v fall_v into_o any_o error_n which_o to_o he_o will_v prove_v damnable_a for_o god_n require_v no_o more_o of_o any_o man_n to_o his_o salvation_n but_o his_o true_a endeavour_n to_o be_v save_v last_o abide_v in_o your_o church_n communion_n be_v so_o far_o from_o secure_v i_o or_o any_o man_n from_o damnable_a error_n that_o if_o i_o shall_v abide_v in_o it_o i_o be_o certain_a i_o can_v not_o be_v save_v for_o abide_v in_o it_o i_o can_v without_o profess_v to_o believe_v your_o entire_a doctrine_n true_a profess_v this_o i_o can_v but_o i_o must_v lie_v perpetual_o and_o exulcerate_v my_o conscience_n and_o though_o your_o error_n be_v not_o in_o themselves_o damnable_a yet_o to_o resist_v the_o know_a truth_n and_o to_o continue_v in_o the_o profession_n of_o know_a error_n be_v not_o in_o themselves_o damnable_a yet_o to_o resist_v the_o know_a truth_n and_o to_o continue_v in_o the_o profession_n of_o know_a error_n and_o falsehood_n be_v certain_o a_o capital_a sin_n and_o of_o great_a affinity_n with_o the_o sin_n which_o shall_v never_o be_v forgive_v 65._o obj._n but_o neither_o be_v the_o protestant_a church_n free_a from_o corruption_n and_o error_n and_o what_o man_n of_o judgement_n will_v be_v a_o protestant_n since_o that_o church_n be_v confess_o a_o corrupt_a one_o answ_n and_o yet_o you_o yourself_o make_v large_a discourse_n in_o this_o very_a chapter_n to_o persuade_v protestant_n to_o continue_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n though_o suppose_v to_o have_v some_o corruption_n and_o why_o i_o pray_v may_v not_o a_o man_n of_o judgement_n continue_v in_o the_o communion_n of_o a_o church_n confess_o corrupt_v as_o well_o as_o in_o a_o church_n suppose_v to_o be_v corrupt_v especial_o when_o this_o church_n suppose_v to_o be_v corrupt_v require_v the_o belief_n and_o profession_n of_o her_o suppose_a corruption_n as_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n which_o this_o church_n confess_o corrupt_v do_v not_o what_o man_n of_o judgement_n will_v think_v it_o any_o disparagement_n to_o his_o judgement_n to_o prefer_v the_o better_a though_o not_o simple_o the_o best_a before_o that_o which_o be_v stark_o naught_o to_o prefer_v indifferrent_fw-la good_a health_n before_o a_o disease_a and_o corrupt_a state_n of_o body_n to_o prefer_v a_o field_n not_o perfect_o weed_v before_o a_o field_n that_o be_v quite_o overrun_v with_o weed_n and_o thorn_n and_o therefore_o though_o protestant_n have_v some_o error_n yet_o see_v they_o be_v neither_o so_o great_a as_o you_o nor_o impose_v with_o such_o tyranny_n nor_o maintain_v with_o such_o obstinacy_n he_o that_o conceive_v it_o any_o disparagement_n to_o his_o judgement_n to_o change_v your_o communion_n for_o they_o though_o confess_v to_o have_v some_o corruption_n it_o may_v well_o be_v presume_v that_o he_o have_v but_o little_a judgement_n 66._o ad_fw-la §_o 22._o obj._n but_o protestant_n say_v it_o be_v comfort_n enough_o for_o the_o church_n to_o be_v secure_v from_o all_o capital_a danger_n which_o can_v only_o arise_v from_o error_n in_o fundamental_a point_n and_o not_o hope_v to_o triumph_n over_o all_o sin_n and_o error_n till_o she_o be_v in_o heaven_n why_o therefore_o be_v not_o the_o first_o reformer_n content_a with_o enough_o but_o will_v dismember_v the_o church_n out_o of_o greediness_n of_o more_o than_o enough_o answ_n i_o have_v already_o show_v sufficient_o how_o capital_a danger_n may_v arise_v from_o error_n though_o not_o fundamental_a i_o add_v now_o that_o what_o may_v be_v enough_o for_o man_n in_o ignorance_n may_v be_v to_o know_v man_n not_o enough_o according_a to_o that_o of_o the_o gospel_n to_o who_o much_o be_v give_v of_o he_o much_o shall_v be_v require_v that_o the_o same_o error_n may_v be_v not_o capital_a to_o those_o who_o want_v mean_n of_o find_v the_o truth_n and_o capital_a to_o other_o who_o have_v mean_n and_o neglect_v to_o use_v they_o that_o to_o continue_v in_o the_o profession_n of_o error_n discover_v to_o be_v so_o may_v be_v damnable_a though_o the_o error_n be_v not_o so_o these_o i_o presume_v be_v reason_n enough_o and_o enough_o why_o the_o first_o reformer_n may_v think_v and_o just_o that_o not_o enough_o for_o themselves_o which_o yet_o to_o some_o of_o their_o predecessor_n they_o hope_v may_v be_v enough_o this_o very_a argument_n be_v object_v to_o sumus_fw-la to_o s._n cyprian_n ep._n 63._o in_o these_o word_n siquis_fw-la de_fw-la antecessoribus_fw-la nostris_fw-la vel_fw-la ignerant_a vel_fw-la simplÃciter_n non_fw-la hoc_fw-la observavit_fw-la &_o tenuit_fw-la quod_fw-la nos_fw-la dominus_fw-la facere_fw-la exemplo_fw-la &_o magisterio_fw-la svo_fw-la docuit_fw-la potest_fw-la simplicitati_fw-la ejus_fw-la de_fw-la indulgentia_fw-la domini_fw-la venia_fw-la concedi_fw-la nobis_fw-la verò_fw-la non_fw-la potest_fw-la ignosci_fw-la qui_fw-la nunc_fw-la à _fw-la domino_fw-la admoniti_fw-la &_o instructi_fw-la sumus_fw-la s._n cyprian_n upon_o another_o occasion_n and_o also_o by_o the_o peccatis_fw-la the_o wilfridus_n to_o abbot_n colman_n allege_v that_o he_o follow_v the_o example_n of_o his_o predecessor_n famous_a for_o holiness_n and_o famous_a for_o miracle_n in_o these_o word_n de_fw-fr patre_fw-la vestro_fw-la columba_n &_o sequacibus_fw-la ejus_fw-la quorum_fw-la santitatem_fw-la vos_fw-la imitari_fw-la &_o regulam_fw-la ac_fw-la praecepta_fw-la coelestibus_fw-la signis_fw-la confirmata_fw-la sequi_fw-la perhibetis_fw-la possum_fw-la respondere_fw-la quia_fw-la multis_fw-la in_o judicio_fw-la dicentibus_fw-la domino_fw-la quòd_fw-la in_o nomine_fw-la ejus_fw-la prophetaverint_fw-la &_o daemonia_fw-la ejecerint_fw-la &_o virtutes_fw-la multas_fw-la fecerint_fw-la responsurus_fw-la sit_fw-la dominus_fw-la quia_fw-la nunquam_fw-la eos_fw-la noverit_fw-la sed_fw-la absit_fw-la ut_fw-la de_fw-la patribus_fw-la vestris_fw-la hoc_fw-la dicam_fw-la quia_fw-la justius_fw-la multo_fw-la est_fw-la de_fw-la incognitis_fw-la bonum_fw-la credere_fw-la quam_fw-la malum_fw-la vnde_fw-la &_o illos_fw-la dei_fw-la famulos_fw-la &_o deo_fw-la dilectos_fw-la esse_fw-la non_fw-la nego_fw-la qui_fw-la simplicitate_fw-la ructicâ_fw-la sed_fw-la intention_n piâ_fw-la deum_fw-la dilexerunt_fw-la neque_fw-la illis_fw-la multum_fw-la obesse_fw-la paschae_fw-la talem_fw-la reor_fw-la obseruantiam_fw-la quandiu_fw-la nullus_fw-la advenerat_fw-la qui_fw-la eye_n instituti_fw-la perfectioris_fw-la decreta_fw-la quae_fw-la sequerentur_fw-la ostenderet_fw-la quos_fw-la utique_fw-la credo_fw-la si_fw-la qui_fw-la tunc_fw-la ad_fw-la eos_fw-la catholicus_n calculator_n adveniret_fw-la sic_fw-la ejus_fw-la monita_fw-la fuisse_fw-la secuturos_fw-la quomodo_fw-la ea_fw-la quae_fw-la noverant_fw-la ac_fw-la didicerunt_fw-la dei_fw-la mandata_fw-la probantur_fw-la fuisse_fw-la secuti_fw-la tu_fw-la autem_fw-la &_o socii_fw-la tui_fw-la si_fw-la audita_fw-la decreta_fw-la sedis_fw-la apostolicae_fw-la imo_fw-la universalis_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la &_o haec_fw-la literis_fw-la sacris_fw-la confirmata_fw-la contemnitis_fw-la absque_fw-la ulla_fw-la dubietate_fw-la peccatis_fw-la british_a quartodeciman_n to_o the_o maintainer_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o your_o church_n and_o 25._o and_o beda_n lib._n 3._o eccl._n hist_o c._n 25._o by_o both_o this_o very_a answer_n be_v return_v and_o therefore_o i_o can_v but_o hope_v that_o for_o their_o sake_n you_o will_v approve_v it_o 67._o obj._n but_o if_o no_o church_n may_v hope_v to_o triumph_n over_o error_n till_o she_o be_v in_o heaven_n than_o we_o must_v either_o grant_v that_o error_n not_o fundamental_a can_v yield_v sufficient_a cause_n to_o forsake_v the_o church_n or_o affirm_v that_o all_o community_n may_v and_o aught_o to_o be_v forsake_v answ_n we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o no_o church_n may_v hope_v to_o be_v free_a from_o all_o error_n either_o pernicious_a
or_o any_o way_n noxious_a but_o that_o no_o church_n may_v hope_v to_o be_v secure_a from_o all_o error_n simple_o for_o this_o be_v indeed_o true_o to_o triumph_v over_o all_o but_o then_o we_o say_v not_o that_o the_o communion_n of_o any_o church_n be_v to_o be_v forsake_v for_o error_n unfundamental_a unless_o it_o exact_v with_o all_o either_o a_o dissimulation_n of_o they_o be_v noxious_a or_o a_o profession_n of_o they_o against_o the_o dictate_v of_o conscience_n if_o they_o be_v mere_a error_n this_o if_o the_o church_n do_v as_o certain_o you_o do_v than_o her_o communion_n be_v to_o be_v forsake_v rather_o than_o the_o sin_n of_o hypocrisy_n to_o be_v commit_v whereas_o to_o forsake_v the_o church_n of_o protestant_n for_o such_o error_n there_o be_v no_o necessity_n because_o they_o err_v to_o themselves_o and_o do_v not_o under_o pain_n of_o excommunication_n exact_v the_o profession_n of_o their_o error_n 68_o obj._n but_o the_o church_n may_v not_o be_v leave_v by_o reason_n of_o sin_n therefore_o neither_o by_o reason_n of_o error_n not_o fundamental_a in_o as_o much_o as_o both_o sin_n and_o error_n be_v impossible_a to_o be_v avoid_v till_o she_o be_v in_o heaven_n answ_n the_o reason_n of_o the_o consequence_n do_v not_o appear_v to_o i_o but_o i_o answer_v to_o the_o antecedent_n neither_o for_o sin_n or_o error_n ought_v a_o church_n to_o be_v forsake_v if_o she_o do_v not_o impose_v and_o join_v they_o but_o if_o she_o do_v as_o the_o roman_a do_v than_o we_o must_v forsake_v man_n rather_o than_o god_n leave_v the_o church_n communion_n rather_o than_o commit_v sin_n or_o profess_v know_v error_n to_o be_v divine_a truth_n for_o the_o prophet_n ezekiel_n have_v assure_v we_o that_o to_o say_v the_o lord_n have_v say_v so_o when_o the_o lord_n have_v not_o say_v so_o be_v a_o great_a sin_n and_o a_o high_a presumption_n be_v the_o matter_n never_o so_o small_a 69._o ad_fw-la §_o 23._o obj._n but_o neither_o the_o quality_n nor_o the_o number_n of_o your_o church_n error_n can_v warrant_v our_o forsake_v of_o it_o not_o the_o quality_n because_o we_o suppose_v they_o not_o fundamental_a not_o the_o number_n because_o the_o foundation_n be_v strong_a enough_o to_o support_v they_o answ_n here_o again_o you_o vain_o suppose_v that_o we_o conceive_v your_o error_n in_o themselves_o not_o damnable_a though_o we_o hope_v they_o be_v not_o absolute_o unpardonable_a but_o to_o say_v they_o be_v pardonable_a be_v indeed_o to_o suppose_v they_o damnable_a second_o though_o the_o error_n of_o your_o church_n do_v not_o warrant_v our_o departure_n yet_o your_o tyrannous_a imposition_n of_o they_o will_v be_v our_o sufficient_a justification_n for_o this_o lay_v necessity_n on_o we_o either_o to_o forsake_v your_o company_n or_o to_o profess_v what_o we_o know_v to_o be_v false_a 70._o obj._n our_o bless_a saviour_n have_v declare_v his_o will_n that_o we_o forgive_v a_o private_a offender_n seventy_o seven_o time_n that_o be_v without_o limitation_n of_o quantity_n of_o time_n or_o quality_n of_o trespass_n and_o then_o how_o dare_v we_o allege_v his_o command_n that_o we_o must_v not_o pardon_v his_o church_n for_o error_n acknowledge_v to_o be_v not_o fundamental_a answ_n he_o that_o command_v we_o to_o pardon_v our_o brother_n sin_v against_o we_o so_o often_o will_v not_o allow_v we_o for_o his_o sake_n to_o sin_n with_o he_o so_o much_o as_o once_o he_o will_v have_v we_o do_v any_o thing_n but_o sin_n rather_o than_o offend_v any_o man_n but_o his_o will_n be_v also_o that_o we_o offend_v all_o the_o world_n rather_o than_o sin_n in_o the_o least_o matter_n and_o therefore_o though_o his_o will_n be_v and_o it_o be_v in_o our_o power_n which_o yet_o be_v false_a to_o pardon_v the_o error_n of_o a_o err_v church_n yet_o certain_o it_o be_v not_o his_o will_n that_o we_o shall_v err_v with_o the_o church_n or_o if_o we_o do_v not_o that_o we_o shall_v against_o conscience_n profess_v the_o error_n of_o it_o 71._o ad_fw-la §_o 24._o obj._n but_o schismatic_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n or_o any_o other_o church_n with_o this_o very_a answer_n that_o they_o forsake_v not_o the_o church_n but_o the_o error_n of_o it_o may_v cast_v off_o from_o themselves_o the_o imputation_n of_o schism_n answ_n true_o they_o may_v make_v the_o same_o answer_n and_o the_o same_o defence_n as_o we_o do_v as_o a_o murderer_n can_v cry_v not_o guilty_a as_o well_o as_o a_o innocent_a person_n but_o not_o so_o true_o nor_o so_o just_o the_o question_n be_v not_o what_o may_v be_v pretend_v but_o what_o can_v be_v prove_v by_o schismatic_n they_o may_v object_v error_n to_o other_o church_n as_o well_o as_o we_o do_v to_o you_o but_o that_o they_o prove_v their_o accusation_n so_o strong_o as_o we_o can_v that_o appear_v not_o to_o the_o priest_n and_o elder_n of_o the_o jew_n impose_v that_o sacred_a silence_n mention_v in_o the_o act_n of_o the_o apostle_n s._n peter_n and_o s._n john_n answer_v they_o must_v obey_v god_n rather_o than_o man_n the_o three_o child_n to_o the_o king_n of_o babylon_n give_v in_o effect_n the_o same_o answer_n give_v i_o now_o any_o factious_a hypocrite_n who_o make_v religion_n the_o pretence_n and_o cloak_n of_o his_o rebellion_n and_o who_o see_v not_o that_o such_o a_o one_o may_v answer_v for_o himself_o in_o those_o very_a formal_a word_n which_o the_o holy_a apostle_n and_o martyr_n make_v use_v of_o and_o yet_o i_o presume_v no_o christian_a will_v deny_v but_o this_o answer_n be_v good_a in_o the_o mouth_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o martyr_n though_o it_o be_v obnoxious_a to_o be_v use_v by_o traitor_n and_o rebel_n certain_o therefore_o it_o be_v no_o good_a consequence_n to_o say_v schismatic_n may_v make_v use_n of_o this_o answer_n therefore_o all_o that_o do_v make_v use_n of_o it_o be_v schismatic_n but_o moreover_o it_o be_v to_o be_v observe_v that_o the_o chief_n part_n of_o our_o defence_n that_o you_o deny_v your_o communion_n to_o all_o that_o deny_v or_o doubt_v of_o any_o part_n of_o your_o doctrine_n can_v with_o any_o colour_n be_v employ_v against_o protestant_n who_o grant_v their_o communion_n to_o all_o who_o hold_v with_o they_o not_o all_o thing_n but_o thing_n necessary_a that_o be_v such_o as_o be_v in_o scripture_n plain_o deliver_v 72._o obj._n but_o the_o forsake_v the_o roman_a church_n open_v a_o way_n to_o innumerable_a sect_n and_o schism_n and_o therefore_o it_o must_v not_o be_v forsake_v answ_n we_o must_v not_o do_v evil_a to_o avoid_v evil_a neither_o be_v all_o course_n present_o lawful_a by_o which_o inconvenience_n may_v be_v avoid_v if_o all_o man_n will_v submit_v themselves_o to_o the_o chief_a mufty_n of_o the_o turk_n it_o be_v apparent_a there_o will_v be_v no_o division_n yet_o unity_n be_v not_o to_o be_v purchase_v at_o so_o dear_a a_o rate_n it_o be_v a_o thing_n much_o to_o be_v desire_v that_o there_o be_v no_o division_n yet_o difference_n of_o opinion_n touch_v point_n controvert_v be_v rather_o to_o be_v choose_v than_o unanimous_a concord_n in_o damn_a error_n as_o it_o be_v better_a for_o man_n to_o go_v to_o heaven_n by_o diverse_a way_n or_o rather_o by_o divers_a path_n of_o the_o same_o way_n than_o in_o the_o same_o path_n to_o go_v on_o peaceable_o to_o hell_n amica_fw-la pax_fw-la magis_fw-la amica_fw-la veritas_fw-la peace_n be_v dear_a to_o i_o but_o truth_n be_v dear_a 74._o ad_fw-la §_o 26.27_o here_o you_o make_v d._n potter_n to_o say_v that_o protestant_n do_v well_o to_o forsake_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n because_o they_o judge_v she_o retain_v all_o mean_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n answ_n who_o be_v ever_o so_o stupid_a as_o to_o give_v this_o ridiculous_a reason_n d._n potter_n vindicate_v protestant_n for_o schism_n two_o way_n the_o one_o be_v because_o they_o have_v just_a and_o great_a and_o necessary_a cause_n to_o separate_v which_o schismatic_n never_o have_v because_o they_o that_o have_v it_o be_v no_o schismatic_n for_o schism_n be_v always_o a_o causeless_a separation_n the_o other_o be_v because_o they_o do_v not_o join_v with_o their_o separation_n a_o uncharitable_a damn_v of_o all_o those_o from_o who_o they_o do_v divide_v themselves_o as_o the_o manner_n of_o schismatic_n be_v now_o that_o which_o he_o intend_v for_o a_o circumstance_n of_o our_o separation_n you_o make_v he_o make_v the_o cause_n of_o it_o and_o the_o motive_n to_o it_o and_o whereas_o he_o say_v though_o we_o separate_v from_o you_o in_o some_o thing_n yet_o we_o acknowledge_v your_o church_n a_o member_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n and_o therefore_o be_v not_o schismatic_n you_o make_v he_o say_v most_o absurd_o we_o do_v well_o to_o forsake_v you_o because_o we_o judge_v you_o a_o member_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n
other_o i_o hope_v have_v chair_n beside_o s._n peter_n and_o therefore_o he_o be_v a_o schismatic_a who_o against_o that_o one_o single_a chair_n erect_v another_o viz._n in_o that_o place_n make_v another_o bishop_n of_o that_o diocese_n beside_o he_o who_o be_v lawful_o elect_v to_o it_o 100_o obj._n but_o he_o style_v s._n peter_n head_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o say_v that_o from_o thence_o he_o be_v call_v cephas_n answ_n perhaps_o he_o be_v abuse_v into_o this_o opinion_n by_o think_v cephas_n derive_v from_o the_o greek_a word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o head_n whereas_o it_o be_v a_o syriack_n word_n and_o signify_v a_o stone_n beside_o s._n peter_n may_v be_v head_n of_o the_o apostle_n that_o be_v first_o in_o order_n and_o honour_n among_o they_o and_o not_o have_v supreme_a authority_n over_o they_o and_o indeed_o that_o s._n peter_n shall_v have_v authority_n over_o all_o the_o apostle_n and_o yet_o exercise_v no_o one_o act_n of_o authority_n over_o any_o one_o of_o they_o and_o that_o they_o shall_v show_v to_o he_o no_o sign_n of_o subjection_n methinks_v be_v as_o strange_a as_o that_o a_o king_n of_o england_n for_o twenty_o five_o year_n shall_v do_v no_o act_n of_o regality_n nor_o receive_v any_o one_o acknowledgement_n of_o it_o as_o strange_a methinks_v it_o be_v that_o you_o so_o many_o age_n after_o shall_v know_v this_o so_o certain_o as_o you_o pretend_v to_o do_v and_o that_o the_o apostle_n after_o that_o those_o word_n be_v speak_v in_o their_o hear_n by_o virtue_n whereof_o s._n peter_n be_v pretend_v to_o have_v be_v make_v their_o head_n shall_v still_o be_v so_o ignorant_a of_o it_o as_o to_o question_v which_o of_o they_o shall_v be_v the_o great_a yet_o more_o strange_a that_o our_o saviour_n shall_v not_o bring_v they_o out_o of_o their_o error_n by_o tell_v they_o s._n peter_n be_v the_o man_n but_o rather_o confirm_v it_o by_o say_v the_o king_n of_o the_o gentile_n exercise_v authority_n over_o they_o but_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v so_o among_o they_o no_o less_o a_o wonder_n be_v it_o that_o s._n paul_n shall_v so_o far_o forget_v s._n peter_n and_o himself_o as_o that_o first_o mention_v he_o often_o he_o shall_v do_v it_o without_o any_o title_n of_o honour_n second_o speak_v of_o the_o several_a degree_n of_o man_n in_o the_o church_n he_o shall_v not_o give_v s._n peter_n the_o high_a but_o place_v he_o in_o equipage_n with_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o say_v god_n have_v appoint_v not_o first_o peter_n than_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o apostle_n but_o first_o apostle_n second_o prophet_n certain_o if_o the_o apostle_n be_v all_o first_o to_o i_o it_o be_v very_o probable_a that_o no_o one_o of_o they_o be_v before_o the_o rest_n for_o by_o first_o all_o man_n understand_v either_o that_o which_o be_v before_o all_o or_o that_o before_o which_o be_v nothing_o now_o in_o the_o former_a sense_n the_o apostle_n can_v not_o be_v all_o first_o for_o then_o every_o one_o of_o they_o must_v have_v be_v before_o every_o one_o of_o the_o rest_n and_o therefore_o they_o must_v be_v first_o in_o the_o other_o sense_n and_o therefore_o no_o man_n and_o therefore_o not_o s._n peter_n must_v be_v before_o any_o of_o they_o three_o and_o last_o that_o speak_v of_o himself_o in_o particular_a and_o perhaps_o compare_v himself_o with_o s._n peter_n in_o particular_a rather_o than_o any_o other_o he_o shall_v say_v in_o plain_a term_n i_o be_o in_o nothing_o inferior_a to_o the_o very_o chief_a apostle_n but_o beside_o all_o this_o though_o we_o shall_v grant_v against_o all_o these_o probability_n and_o many_o more_o that_o optatus_n mean_v that_o s._n peter_n be_v head_n of_o the_o apostle_n not_o in_o our_o but_o in_o your_o sense_n and_o that_o s._n peter_n indeed_o be_v so_o yet_o still_o you_o be_v very_o far_o from_o show_v that_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o optatus_n the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n be_v to_o be_v at_o all_o much_o less_o by_o divine_a right_n successor_n to_o s._n peter_n in_o this_o his_o headship_n and_o authority_n for_o what_o incongruity_n be_v there_o if_o we_o say_v that_o he_o may_v succeed_v s._n peter_n in_o that_o part_n of_o his_o care_n the_o government_n of_o that_o particular_a church_n as_o sure_o he_o do_v even_o while_n s._n peter_n be_v live_v and_o yet_o that_o neither_o he_o nor_o any_o man_n be_v to_o succeed_v he_o in_o his_o apostleship_n nor_o in_o his_o government_n of_o the_o church_n universal_a especial_o see_v s._n peter_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o apostle_n by_o lay_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v the_o foundation_n of_o it_o and_o according_o be_v so_o call_v in_o scripture_n and_o therefore_o as_o in_o a_o build_n it_o be_v incongruous_a that_o foundation_n shall_v succeed_v foundation_n so_o it_o may_v be_v in_o the_o church_n that_o any_o other_o apostle_n shall_v succeed_v the_o first_o 101._o ad_fw-la §_o 37._o obj._n what_o you_o here_o cite_v out_o of_o s._n austin_n if_o it_o be_v apply_v to_o luther_n separation_n be_v impertinent_a for_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o separate_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n another_o to_o separate_v from_o all_o the_o communion_n in_o the_o world_n one_o thing_n to_o divide_v from_o they_o who_o be_v unite_v among_o themselves_o another_o to_o divide_v from_o they_o who_o be_v divide_v among_o themselves_o now_o the_o donatist_n separate_v from_o the_o whole_a world_n of_o christian_n unite_v in_o one_o communion_n profess_v the_o same_o faith_n serve_v god_n after_o the_o same_o manner_n which_o be_v a_o very_a great_a argument_n that_o they_o can_v not_o have_v just_a cause_n to_o leave_v they_o according_a to_o that_o of_o tertullian_n variasse_n debuerat_fw-la error_n ecclesiarum_fw-la quod_fw-la autem_fw-la apud_fw-la multos_fw-la unum_fw-la est_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la erratum_fw-la sed_fw-la traditum_fw-la but_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n do_v not_o so_o the_o world_n i_o mean_v of_o christian_n and_o catholic_n be_v divide_v and_o subdivide_v long_o before_o he_o divide_v from_o it_o and_o by_o their_o division_n have_v much_o weaken_v their_o own_o authority_n and_o take_v away_o from_o you_o this_o plea_n of_o s._n austin_n which_o stand_v upon_o no_o other_o foundation_n but_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n communion_n 102._o ad_fw-la §_o 38._o obj._n if_o luther_n be_v in_o the_o right_n most_o certain_a those_o protestant_n that_o differ_v from_o he_o be_v in_o the_o wrong_n answ_n but_o that_o either_o he_o or_o they_o be_v schismatic_n it_o follow_v not_o or_o if_o it_o do_v then_o either_o the_o jesuit_n be_v schismatic_n from_o the_o dominicans_n or_o they_o from_o the_o jesuit_n the_o canonist_n from_o the_o jesuit_n or_o the_o jesuit_n from_o the_o canonist_n the_o scotist_n from_o the_o thomist_n or_o they_o from_o the_o scotist_n the_o franciscans_n from_o the_o dominicans_n or_o the_o dominicans_n from_o the_o franciscans_n for_o between_o all_o these_o the_o world_n know_v that_o in_o point_n of_o doctrine_n there_o be_v plain_a and_o irreconcilable_a contradiction_n and_o therefore_o one_o part_n must_v be_v in_o error_n at_o least_o not_o fundamental_a thus_o your_o argument_n return_v upon_o yourself_o and_o if_o it_o be_v good_a prove_v the_o roman_a church_n in_o a_o manner_n to_o be_v make_v up_o of_o schismatic_n but_o the_o answer_n to_o it_o be_v that_o it_o beg_v this_o very_a false_a and_o vain_a supposition_n that_o whosoever_o err_v in_o any_o point_n of_o doctrine_n be_v a_o schismatic_a 103._o ad_fw-la §_o 39_o in_o the_o next_o place_n you_o number_v up_o your_o victory_n and_o tell_v we_o that_o out_o of_o these_o premise_n this_o conclusion_n follow_v that_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n be_v schismatic_n from_o the_o visible_a church_n the_o pope_n the_o diocese_n wherein_o they_o be_v baptize_v from_o the_o bishop_n under_o who_o they_o live_v from_o the_o country_n to_o which_o they_o belong_v from_o their_o religious_a order_n wherein_o they_o be_v profess_v from_o one_o another_o and_o last_o from_o a_o man_n self_n because_o the_o self_n same_o protestant_n be_v convict_v to_o day_n that_o his_o yesterday_n opinion_n be_v a_o error_n to_o which_o i_o answer_v that_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n separate_v from_o many_o of_o these_o in_o some_o opinion_n and_o practice_n but_o that_o they_o do_v it_o without_o cause_n which_o only_o can_v make_v they_o schismatic_n that_o be_v the_o only_a thing_n you_o shall_v have_v prove_v and_o to_o that_o you_o have_v not_o urge_v one_o reason_n of_o any_o moment_n all_o of_o they_o for_o weight_n and_o strength_n be_v cousin-germans_a to_o this_o pretty_a device_n wherewith_o you_o will_v prove_v they_o schismatic_n from_o themselves_o because_o the_o self_n same_o protestant_n to_o
day_n be_v convict_v in_o conscience_n that_o his_o yesterday_n opinion_n be_v a_o error_n it_o seem_v then_o that_o they_o that_o hold_v error_n must_v hold_v they_o fast_o and_o take_v especial_a care_n of_o be_v convict_v in_o conscience_n that_o they_o be_v in_o error_n for_o fear_v of_o be_v schismatic_n protestant_n must_v continue_v protestant_n and_o puritan_fw-gr puritan_fw-gr and_o papist_n papist_n nay_o jew_n and_o turk_n and_o pagan_n must_v remain_v jew_n and_o turk_n and_o pagan_n and_o go_v on_o constant_o to_o the_o devil_n or_o else_o forsooth_o they_o must_v be_v schismatic_n and_o that_o from_o themselves_o and_o this_o perhaps_o be_v the_o cause_n that_o make_v papist_n so_o obstinate_a not_o only_o in_o their_o common_a superstition_n but_o also_o in_o adhere_v to_o the_o proper_a fancy_n of_o their_o several_a sect_n so_o that_o it_o be_v a_o miracle_n to_o hear_v of_o any_o jesuit_n that_o have_v forsake_v the_o opinion_n of_o the_o jesuit_n or_o any_o dominican_n that_o have_v change_v his_o or_o the_o jesuit_n but_o sure_a the_o forsake_v of_o error_n can_v be_v a_o sin_n unless_o to_o be_v in_o error_n be_v a_o virtue_n and_o therefore_o to_o do_v as_o you_o do_v to_o damn_v man_n for_o false_a opinion_n and_o to_o call_v they_o schismatic_n for_o leave_v they_o to_o make_v pertinacy_n in_o error_n that_o be_v a_o unwillingness_n to_o be_v convict_v or_o a_o resolution_n not_o to_o be_v convict_v the_o form_n of_o heresy_n and_o to_o find_v fault_n with_o man_n for_o be_v convict_v in_o conscience_n that_o they_o be_v in_o error_n be_v the_o most_o incoherent_a and_o contradictious_a injustice_n that_o ever_o be_v hear_v of_o but_o sir_n if_o this_o be_v a_o strange_a matter_n to_o you_o that_o which_o i_o shall_v tell_v you_o will_v be_v much_o stranger_n i_o know_v a_o man_n that_o of_o a_o moderate_a protestant_n turn_v a_o papist_n and_o the_o day_n that_o he_o do_v so_o as_o all_o thing_n that_o be_v do_v be_v perfect_v some_o day_n or_o other_o be_v convict_v in_o conscience_n that_o his_o yesterday_n opinion_n be_v a_o error_n and_o yet_o think_v he_o be_v no_o schismatic_a for_o do_v so_o and_o desire_n to_o be_v inform_v by_o you_o whether_o or_o no_o he_o be_v mistake_v the_o same_o man_n afterward_o upon_o better_a consideration_n become_v a_o doubt_a papist_n and_o of_o a_o doubt_a papist_n a_o confirm_a protestant_n and_o yet_o this_o man_n think_v himself_o no_o more_o to_o blame_v for_o all_o these_o change_n than_o a_o traveller_n who_o use_v all_o diligence_n to_o find_v the_o right_a way_n to_o some_o remote_a city_n where_o he_o never_o have_v be_v as_o the_o party_n i_o speak_v of_o have_v never_o be_v in_o heaven_n do_v yet_o mistake_v it_o and_o after_o find_v his_o error_n and_o amend_v it_o nay_o he_o stand_v upon_o his_o justification_n so_o far_o as_o to_o maintain_v that_o his_o alteration_n not_o only_o to_o you_o but_o also_o from_o you_o by_o god_n mercy_n be_v the_o most_o satisfactory_a action_n to_o himself_o that_o ever_o he_o do_v and_o the_o great_a victory_n that_o ever_o he_o obtain_v over_o himself_o and_o his_o affection_n to_o those_o thing_n which_o in_o this_o world_n be_v most_o precious_a as_o wherein_o for_o god_n sake_n and_o as_o he_o be_v very_o persuade_v out_o of_o love_n to_o the_o truth_n he_o go_v upon_o a_o certain_a expectation_n of_o those_o inconvenience_n which_o to_o ingenuous_a nature_n be_v of_o all_o most_o terrible_a so_o that_o though_o there_o be_v much_o weakness_n in_o some_o of_o these_o alteration_n yet_o certain_o there_o be_v no_o wickedness_n neither_o do_v he_o yield_v his_o weakness_n altogether_o without_o apology_n see_v his_o deduction_n be_v rational_a and_o out_o of_o principle_n common_o receive_v by_o protestant_n as_o well_v as_o papist_n and_o which_o by_o his_o education_n have_v get_v possession_n of_o his_o understanding_n 107._o ad_fw-la §_o 41._o obj._n though_o the_o first_o reformer_n have_v conceive_v their_o own_o opinion_n to_o be_v true_a yet_o they_o may_v and_o ought_v to_o have_v doubt_v whether_o they_o be_v certain_a since_o they_o affirm_v that_o infallibility_n be_v not_o promise_v to_o particular_a person_n or_o church_n ans_fw-fr this_o be_v to_o say_v that_o they_o ought_v to_o have_v doubt_v of_o the_o certainty_n of_o scripture_n which_o in_o formal_a and_o express_a term_n contain_v many_o of_o these_o opinion_n and_o your_o reason_n be_v vain_a for_o though_o they_o have_v not_o a_o absolute_a infallibility_n promise_v unto_o they_o yet_o may_v they_o be_v of_o some_o thing_n infallible_o certain_a as_o euclid_n sure_o be_v not_o infallible_a yet_o he_o be_v certain_a enough_o that_o twice_o two_o be_v four_o and_o that_o every_o whole_a be_v great_a than_o a_o part_n of_o that_o whole_a and_o so_o though_o calvin_n and_o melancton_n be_v not_o infallible_a in_o all_o thing_n yet_o they_o may_v and_o do_v know_v well_o enough_o that_o your_o latin-service_n be_v condemn_v by_o s._n paul_n and_o that_o the_o communion_n in_o both_o kind_n be_v teach_v by_o our_o saviour_n obj._n but_o your_o church_n be_v in_o peaceable_a possession_n you_o must_v mean_v of_o her_o doctrine_n and_o the_o professor_n of_o it_o and_o enjoy_v prescription_n for_o many_o age_n ans_fw-fr the_o possession_n which_o the_o governor_n of_o your_o church_n hold_v for_o some_o age_n of_o the_o party_n govern_v be_v not_o peaceable_a but_o get_v by_o fraud_n and_o hold_v by_o violence_n 108._o obj._n you_o say_v that_o a_o pretence_n of_o conscience_n will_v not_o serve_v to_o justify_v separation_n from_o be_v schismatical_a ans_fw-fr this_o be_v very_o true_a but_o little_a to_o the_o purpose_n see_v it_o be_v not_o a_o erroneous_a persuasion_n much_o less_o a_o hypocritical_a pretence_n but_o a_o true_a and_o well_o ground_a conviction_n of_o conscience_n which_o we_o allege_v to_o justify_v protestant_n from_o be_v schismatical_a and_o therefore_o though_o seditious_a man_n in_o church_n and_o state_n may_v pretend_v conscience_n for_o a_o cloak_n of_o their_o rebellion_n yet_o this_o i_o hope_n hinder_v not_o but_o that_o a_o honest_a man_n ought_v to_o obey_v his_o right_o inform_v conscience_n rather_o than_o the_o unjust_a command_n of_o his_o tyrannous_a superior_n otherwise_o with_o what_o colour_n can_v you_o defend_v either_o your_o own_o refuse_v the_o oath_n of_o allegiance_n and_o supremacy_n or_o the_o ancient_a martyr_n and_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n who_o oftentimes_o disobey_v the_o command_n of_o man_n in_o authority_n and_o for_o their_o disobedience_n make_v no_o other_o but_o this_o apology_n we_o must_v obey_v god_n rather_o than_o man_n it_o be_v therefore_o most_o apparent_a that_o this_o answer_n must_v be_v mere_o impertinent_a see_v it_o will_v serve_v against_o the_o martyr_n and_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n and_o even_o against_o yourselves_o as_o well_o as_o against_o protestant_n to_o as_o little_a purpose_n be_v your_o rule_n out_o of_o lyrinensis_n against_o they_o that_o follow_v luther_n see_v they_o pretend_v and_o be_v ready_a to_o justify_v that_o they_o forsake_v not_o with_o the_o doctor_n the_o faith_n but_o only_o the_o corruption_n of_o the_o church_n as_o vain_a altogether_o be_v that_o which_o follow_v that_o in_o case_n of_o uncertainty_n we_o be_v not_o to_o leave_v our_o superior_a or_o cast_v off_o his_o obedience_n nor_o public_o oppose_v his_o decree_n from_o whence_o it_o will_v follow_v very_o evident_o that_o see_v it_o be_v not_o a_o matter_n of_o faith_n but_o a_o dispute_v question_n among_o you_o whether_o the_o oath_n of_o allegiance_n be_v lawful_a that_o either_o you_o acknowledge_v not_o the_o king_n your_o superior_a or_o do_v against_o conscience_n in_o oppose_v his_o and_o the_o kingdom_n decree_n require_v the_o take_n of_o this_o oath_n this_o good_a use_n i_o say_v may_v very_o fair_o be_v make_v of_o it_o and_o be_v by_o man_n of_o your_o own_o religion_n 109_o ad_fw-la §_o 42._o obj._n it_o be_v not_o fit_a you_o say_v for_o any_o private_a man_n to_o oppose_v his_o judgement_n to_o the_o public_a ans_fw-fr not_o his_o own_o judgement_n and_o bare_a authority_n but_o occasion_n may_v happen_v wherein_o it_o may_v be_v very_o warrantable_a to_o oppose_v his_o reason_n or_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n against_o it_o and_o be_v not_o then_o to_o be_v esteem_v to_o oppose_v his_o own_o judgement_n to_o the_o public_a but_o the_o judgement_n of_o god_n to_o the_o judgement_n of_o man_n neither_o will_n mr._n hookers_n word_n you_o cite_v do_v you_o any_o service_n for_o though_o he_o say_v pref._n to_o eccles_n polit_fw-la see_v 6._o pag._n 28._o that_o man_n be_v bind_v to_o do_v whatsoever_o the_o sentence_n of_o judicial_a and_o final_a decision_n shall_v determine_v as_o it_o be_v plain_a man_n be_v bind_v to_o yield_v such_o a_o
faith_n be_v commend_v by_o the_o preach_a of_o the_o apostle_n to_o who_o falsehood_n can_v have_v access_n answ_n for_o s._n cyprian_n all_o the_o world_n know_v that_o he_o ratio_fw-la he_o it_o be_v confess_v by_o baronius_n anno._n 238._o n._n 41._o by_o bellarm_n l._n 4._o de_fw-fr r._n pont._n c._n 7._o §._o tertia_fw-la ratio_fw-la resolute_o oppose_v a_o decree_n of_o the_o roman_a bishop_n and_o all_o that_o adhere_v to_o he_o in_o the_o point_n of_o rebaptising_a which_o that_o church_n at_o that_o time_n deliver_v as_o a_o necessary_a tradition_n so_o necessary_a that_o by_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n firmilianus_n and_o other_o bishop_n of_o cappadocia_n cilicia_n and_o galatia_n and_o general_o all_o who_o persist_v in_o the_o contrary_a opinion_n ibid._n opinion_n confess_v by_o baronius_n a_o 258._o n._n 14._o &_o 15._o by_o card._n perron_n repl._n l._n 1._o c._n 25._o ibid._n be_v therefore_o deprive_v of_o the_o church_n communion_n which_o excommunication_n can_v not_o but_o involve_v s._n cyprian_a who_o defend_v the_o same_o opinion_n as_o resolute_o as_o firmilianus_n though_o cardinal_n perren_n magisterial_o and_o without_o all_o colour_n of_o proof_n affirm_v the_o contrary_a and_o cyprian_n in_o particular_a so_o far_o cast_v off_o as_o for_o it_o to_o be_v pronounce_v by_o stephen_n a_o false_a christ_n again_o so_o necessary_a that_o the_o bishop_n which_o be_v send_v by_o cyprian_a from_o africa_n to_o rome_n be_v not_o admit_v to_o the_o communion_n of_o ordinary_a conference_n but_o all_o man_n who_o be_v subject_a to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n authority_n be_v command_v by_o he_o not_o only_o to_o deny_v they_o the_o church_n peace_n and_o communion_n but_o even_o lodging_n and_o entertainment_n manifest_o declare_v that_o they_o reckon_v they_o among_o those_o who_o s._n john_n forbid_v to_o receive_v to_o house_n or_o to_o say_v god_n speed_n to_o they_o all_o these_o terror_n notwithstanding_o s._n cyprian_n hold_v still_o his_o former_a opinion_n and_o though_o out_o of_o respect_n to_o the_o church_n peace_n 1._o peace_n vide_fw-la con._n carth._n apud_fw-la sur_fw-fr to._n 1._o he_o judge_v no_o man_n nor_o cut_v off_o any_o man_n from_o the_o right_n of_o communion_n for_o think_v otherwise_o than_o he_o hold_v yet_o he_o conceive_v stephen_n and_o his_o adherent_n 18._o adherent_n bell._n l._n 2._o de_fw-fr conc._n c._n 5._o aug._n ep_v 48._o &_o lib._n 1._o de_fw-fr bapt._n c._n 18._o to_o hold_v a_o pernicious_a error_n and_o s._n austin_n though_o dispute_v with_o the_o donatist_n he_o use_v some_o tergiversation_n in_o the_o point_n yet_o confess_v elsewhere_o that_o it_o be_v not_o find_v that_o cyprian_a do_v ever_o change_v his_o opinion_n and_o so_o far_o be_v he_o from_o conceive_v any_o necessity_n of_o do_v so_o in_o submit_v to_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o bishop_n and_o church_n of_o rome_n that_o he_o plain_o profess_v that_o no_o other_o bishop_n but_o our_o lord_n jesus_n only_o have_v power_n to_o judge_n with_o authority_n of_o his_o judgement_n and_o as_o plain_o intimate_v that_o stephen_n for_o usurp_a such_o a_o power_n and_o make_v himself_o a_o judge_n over_o bishop_n be_v little_o better_a than_o a_o tyrant_n and_o as_o heavy_o almost_o he_o censure_v he_o and_o peremptory_o oppose_v he_o as_o obstinate_a in_o error_n in_o that_o very_a place_n where_o he_o deliver_v that_o famous_a say_n how_o can_v he_o have_v god_n for_o his_o father_n who_o have_v not_o the_o church_n for_o his_o mother_n little_a doubt_v it_o seem_v but_o a_o man_n may_v have_v the_o church_n for_o his_o mother_n who_o stand_v in_o opposition_n to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o far_o from_o think_v what_o you_o fond_o obtrude_v upon_o he_o that_o to_o be_v unite_v to_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o to_o the_o church_n be_v all_o one_o and_o that_o separation_n from_o s._n peter_n chair_n be_v a_o mark_n i_o mean_v a_o certain_a mark_n either_o of_o schism_n or_o heresy_n 26._o but_o you_o have_v give_v a_o false_a or_o at_o least_o a_o strain_a translation_n of_o s._n cyprian_n forecited_a word_n for_o cyprian_n say_v not_o to_o who_o falsehood_n can_v have_v access_n as_o if_o he_o have_v exempt_v the_o roman_a church_n from_o a_o possibility_n of_o error_n but_o to_o who_o perfidiousness_n can_v have_v access_n mean_v those_o perfidious_a schismatic_n who_o he_o there_o complain_v of_o and_o of_o these_o by_o a_o rhetorical_a insinuation_n he_o say_v that_o with_o such_o good_a christian_n as_o the_o roman_n be_v it_o be_v not_o possible_a they_o shall_v find_v favourable_a entertainment_n as_o for_o his_o join_v the_o principal_a church_n and_o the_o chair_n of_o peter_n how_o that_o will_v serve_v to_o prove_v separation_n from_o the_o roman_a church_n to_o be_v a_o mark_n of_o heresy_n it_o be_v hard_o to_o understand_v though_o we_o do_v not_o altogether_o deny_v but_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n may_v be_v call_v the_o chair_n of_o s._n peter_n in_o regard_n he_o be_v say_v to_o have_v preach_v the_o gospel_n there_o and_o the_o principal_a church_n because_o the_o city_n be_v the_o principal_a and_o imperial_a city_n which_o prerogative_n of_o the_o city_n if_o we_o believe_v the_o father_n of_o the_o council_n of_o chalcedon_n be_v the_o ground_n and_o occasion_n why_o the_o father_n of_o former_a time_n i_o pray_v observe_v confer_v upon_o this_o church_n this_o prerogative_n above_o other_o church_n 27._o obj._n but_o in_o another_o place_n epist_n 52._o s._n cyprian_n make_v communicate_v with_o cornelius_n the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n and_o with_o the_o catholic_n church_n to_o be_v the_o same_o answ_n this_o do_v not_o prove_v that_o to_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n and_o pope_n of_o rome_n and_o to_o communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v always_o for_o that_o you_o assume_v one_o and_o the_o same_o thing_n s._n cyprian_n speak_v not_o of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n at_o all_o but_o of_o the_o bishop_n only_o who_o when_o he_o do_v communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n as_o cornelius_n at_o that_o time_n do_v than_o whosoever_o communicate_v with_o he_o can_v but_o communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o then_o by_o accident_n one_o may_v true_o say_v such_o a_o one_o communicate_v with_o you_o that_o be_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o that_o to_o communicate_v with_o he_o be_v to_o communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n as_o if_o titius_n and_o sempronius_n be_v together_o he_o that_o be_v in_o company_n with_o titius_n can_v but_o be_v at_o that_o time_n in_o company_n with_o sempronius_n as_o if_o a_o general_n be_v march_v to_o some_o place_n with_o a_o army_n he_o that_o than_o be_v with_o the_o general_n must_v at_o that_o time_n be_v with_o the_o army_n and_o a_o man_n may_v say_v without_o absurdity_n such_o a_o time_n i_o be_v with_o the_o general_n that_o be_v with_o the_o army_n and_o that_o to_o be_v with_o the_o general_n be_v to_o be_v with_o the_o army_n or_o as_o if_o a_o man_n hand_n be_v join_v to_o his_o body_n the_o finger_n which_o be_v join_v to_o the_o hand_n be_v join_v to_o the_o body_n and_o a_o man_n may_v say_v true_o of_o it_o this_o finger_n be_v join_v to_o the_o hand_n that_o be_v to_o the_o body_n and_o to_o be_v join_v to_o the_o hand_n be_v to_o be_v join_v to_o the_o body_n because_o all_o these_o thing_n be_v by_o accident_n true_a and_o yet_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v not_o deny_v but_o the_o finger_n may_v possible_o be_v join_v to_o the_o hand_n and_o yet_o not_o to_o the_o body_n the_o hand_n be_v cut_v off_o from_o the_o body_n and_o a_o man_n may_v another_o time_n be_v with_o his_o general_n and_o not_o with_o his_o army_n he_o be_v absent_a from_o the_o army_n and_o therefore_o by_o like_a reason_n your_o collection_n be_v sophistical_a be_v in_o effect_n but_o this_o to_o communicate_v with_o such_o a_o bishop_n of_o rome_n who_o do_v communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v to_o communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n therefore_o absolute_o and_o always_o it_o must_v be_v true_a that_o to_o communicate_v with_o he_o be_v by_o consequent_a to_o communicate_v with_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o to_o be_v divide_v from_o the_o communion_n be_v to_o be_v a_o heretic_n 28._o obj._n s._n irenaeus_n say_v lib._n 3._o cont_n haer_fw-mi c._n 3._o because_o it_o be_v long_o to_o number_v the_o succession_n of_o all_o church_n we_o declare_v the_o tradition_n of_o the_o most_o great_a most_o ancient_a and_o know_a church_n found_v by_o the_o two_o glorious_a apostle_n peter_n and_o paul_n which_o tradition_n it_o have_v from_o the_o apostle_n come_v to_o we_o by_o succession_n of_o bishop_n we_o confound_v all_o those_o who_o any_o way_n either_o by_o vain_a glory_n blindness_n
it_o not_o as_o well_o as_o you_o and_o whether_o some_o man_n persuasion_n that_o there_o be_v no_o such_o thing_n can_v hinder_v they_o from_o have_v it_o or_o prove_v that_o they_o have_v it_o not_o if_o there_o be_v any_o such_o thing_n any_o more_o than_o a_o man_n persuasion_n that_o he_o have_v not_o take_v physic_n or_o poison_n will_v make_v he_o not_o to_o have_v take_v it_o if_o he_o have_v or_o hinder_v the_o operation_n of_o it_o and_o whether_o tertullian_n in_o the_o place_n quote_v by_o you_o speak_v of_o a_o priest_n make_v a_o layman_n by_o a_o just_a deposition_n or_o degradation_n and_o not_o by_o a_o voluntary_a desertion_n of_o his_o order_n and_o whether_o in_o the_o same_o place_n he_o set_v not_o some_o mark_n upon_o heretic_n that_o will_v agree_v to_o your_o church_n whether_o all_o the_o authority_n of_o our_o bishop_n in_o england_n before_o the_o reformation_n be_v confer_v on_o they_o by_o the_o pope_n and_o if_o it_o be_v whether_o it_o be_v the_o pope_n 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because_o they_o deny_v the_o universal_a infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n can_v have_v no_o certain_a ground_n to_o know_v what_o object_n be_v reveal_v or_o testify_v by_o god_n ans_fw-fr but_o if_o there_o be_v no_o other_o ground_n of_o certainty_n but_o your_o church_n infallibility_n upon_o what_o certain_a ground_n do_v you_o know_v that_o your_o church_n be_v infallible_a upon_o what_o certain_a ground_n do_v you_o know_v all_o those_o thing_n which_o must_v be_v know_v before_o you_o can_v know_v that_o your_o church_n be_v infallible_a as_o that_o there_o be_v a_o god_n that_o god_n have_v promise_v his_o assistance_n to_o your_o church_n in_o all_o her_o decree_n that_o the_o scripture_n wherein_o this_o promise_n be_v extant_a be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n that_o those_o text_n of_o scripture_n which_o you_o allege_v for_o your_o infallibility_n be_v incorrupt_v that_o that_o which_o you_o
what_o wisdom_n be_v it_o to_o forsake_v a_o church_n acknowledge_v to_o want_v nothing_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n endue_v with_o succession_n of_o bishop_n etc._n etc._n usque_fw-la ad_fw-la election_n or_o choice_n i_o answer_v yet_o may_v it_o be_v great_a wisdom_n to_o forsake_v a_o church_n not_o acknowledge_v to_o want_v nothing_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n but_o accuse_v and_o convict_v of_o many_o damnable_a error_n certain_o damnable_a to_o they_o who_o be_v convict_v of_o they_o have_v they_o still_o persist_v in_o they_o after_o their_o conviction_n though_o perhaps_o pardonable_a which_o be_v all_o that_o be_v acknowledge_v to_o such_o as_o ignorant_o continue_v in_o they_o a_o church_n vain_o arrogate_a without_o possibility_n of_o proof_n a_o perpetual_a succession_n of_o bishop_n hold_v always_o the_o same_o doctrine_n and_o with_o a_o ridiculous_a impudence_n pretend_v perpetual_a possession_n of_o all_o the_o world_n whereas_o the_o world_n know_v that_o a_o little_a before_o luther_n arise_v your_o church_n be_v confine_v to_o a_o part_n of_o a_o part_n of_o it_o last_o a_o church_n vain_o glory_v in_o the_o dependence_n of_o other_o church_n upon_o she_o which_o yet_o she_o support_v no_o more_o than_o those_o crouch_a antic_n which_o seem_v in_o great_a building_n to_o labour_n under_o the_o weight_n they_o bear_v do_v indeed_o support_v the_o fabric_n for_o a_o corrupt_a and_o false_a church_n may_v give_v authority_n to_o preach_v the_o truth_n and_o consequent_o against_o her_o own_o falsehood_n and_o corruption_n beside_o a_o false_a church_n may_v preserve_v the_o scripture_n true_a as_o now_o the_o old_a testament_n be_v preserve_v by_o the_o jew_n either_o not_o be_v arrive_v to_o that_o height_n of_o impiety_n as_o to_o attempt_v the_o corruption_n of_o it_o or_o not_o able_a to_o effect_v it_o or_o not_o perceive_v or_o not_o regard_v the_o opposition_n of_o it_o to_o her_o corruption_n and_o so_o we_o may_v receive_v from_o you_o lawful_a ordination_n and_o true_a scripture_n though_o you_o be_v a_o false_a church_n and_o receive_v the_o scripture_n from_o you_o though_o not_o from_o you_o alone_o i_o hope_v you_o can_v hinder_v we_o neither_o need_v we_o ask_v your_o leave_n to_o believe_v and_o obey_v they_o and_o this_o though_o you_o be_v a_o false_a church_n and_o receive_v the_o scripture_n from_o you_o though_o not_o from_o you_o alone_o i_o hope_v you_o can_v hinder_v we_o neither_o need_v we_o ask_v your_o leave_n to_o believe_v and_o obey_v they_o and_o this_o though_o you_o be_v a_o false_a church_n be_v enough_o to_o make_v we_o a_o true_a one_o as_o for_o a_o succession_n of_o man_n that_o hold_v with_o we_o in_o all_o point_n of_o doctrine_n it_o be_v a_o thing_n we_o need_v not_o and_o you_o have_v as_o little_a as_o we_o so_o that_o if_o we_o acknowledge_v that_o your_o church_n before_o luther_n be_v a_o true_a church_n it_o be_v not_o for_o any_o end_n for_o any_o dependence_n that_o we_o have_v upon_o you_o but_o because_o we_o conceive_v that_o in_o a_o charitable_a construction_n you_o may_v pass_v for_o a_o true_a church_n such_o a_o church_n and_o no_o better_a as_o you_o do_v sometime_o acknowledge_v protestant_n to_o be_v that_o be_v a_o company_n of_o man_n wherein_o some_o ignorant_a soul_n may_v be_v save_v so_o that_o in_o this_o balance_a of_o religion_n against_o religion_n and_o church_n against_o church_n it_o seem_v you_o have_v nothing_o of_o weight_n and_o moment_n to_o put_v into_o your_o scale_n nothing_o but_o smoke_n and_o wind_n vain_a shadow_n and_o fantastical_a pretence_n yet_o if_o protestant_n on_o the_o other_o side_n have_v nothing_o to_o put_v in_o their_o seal_n but_o those_o negative_a commendation_n which_o you_o be_v please_v to_o afford_v they_o nothing_o but_o no_o unity_n nor_o mean_n to_o procure_v it_o no_o far_o extent_n when_o luther_n arise_v than_o luther_n body_n no_o universality_n of_o time_n or_o place_n no_o visibility_n or_o be_v except_o only_o in_o your_o church_n no_o succession_n of_o person_n or_o doctrine_n no_o leader_n but_o luther_n in_o a_o quarrel_n begin_v upon_o no_o ground_n but_o passion_n no_o church_n no_o ordination_n no_o scripture_n but_o such_o as_o they_o receive_v from_o you_o if_o all_o this_o be_v true_a and_o this_o be_v all_o that_o can_v be_v plead_v for_o protestant_n possible_o with_o a_o allowance_n of_o three_o grain_n of_o partiality_n your_o scale_n may_v seem_v to_o turn_v but_o then_o if_o it_o may_v appear_v that_o part_n of_o these_o objection_n be_v false_o make_v against_o they_o the_o rest_n vain_o that_o whatsoever_o of_o truth_n be_v in_o these_o imputation_n be_v impertinent_a to_o this_o trial_n and_o whatsoever_o be_v pertinent_a be_v untrue_a and_o beside_o that_o plenty_n of_o good_a matter_n may_v be_v allege_v for_o protestant_n which_o be_v here_o dissemble_a then_o i_o hope_v our_o cause_n may_v be_v good_a notwithstanding_o these_o pretence_n 55._o i_o say_v then_o that_o want_v of_o universality_n of_o time_n and_o place_n the_o invisibility_n or_o not_o existence_n of_o the_o professor_n of_o protestant_a doctrine_n before_o luther_n luther_n being_n alone_o when_o he_o first_o oppose_v your_o church_n our_o have_v our_o church_n ordination_n scripture_n personal_a and_o yet_o not_o doctrinal_a succession_n from_o you_o be_v vain_a and_o impertinent_a allegation_n against_o the_o truth_n of_o our_o doctrine_n and_o church_n that_o the_o entire_a truth_n of_o christ_n without_o any_o mixture_n of_o error_n shall_v be_v profess_v or_o believe_v in_o all_o place_n at_o any_o time_n or_o in_o any_o place_n at_o all_o time_n be_v not_o a_o thing_n evident_a in_o reason_n neither_o have_v we_o any_o revelation_n for_o it_o and_o therefore_o in_o rely_v so_o confident_o on_o it_o you_o build_v your_o house_n upon_o the_o sand._n and_o what_o obligation_n we_o have_v either_o to_o be_v so_o peevish_a as_o to_o take_v nothing_o of_o you_o or_o so_o foolish_a as_o to_o take_v all_o i_o do_v not_o understand_v for_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o this_o be_v to_o be_v chooser_n and_o therefore_o heretic_n i_o tell_v you_o that_o though_o all_o heretic_n be_v chooser_n yet_o all_o chooser_n be_v not_o heretic_n otherwise_o they_o also_o which_o choose_v your_o religion_n must_v be_v heretic_n as_o for_o our_o want_a unity_n and_o mean_n of_o prove_v it_o luther_n oppose_a your_o church_n upon_o mere_a passion_n our_o follow_v private_a man_n rather_o than_o the_o catholic_n church_n the_o first_o and_o last_o be_v mere_a untruth_n for_o we_o want_v not_o unity_n nor_o mean_n to_o procure_v it_o in_o thing_n necessary_a plain_a place_n of_o scripture_n and_o such_o as_o need_v no_o interpreter_n be_v our_o mean_n to_o obtain_v it_o neither_o do_v we_o follow_v any_o private_a man_n but_o only_o the_o scripture_n the_o word_n of_o god_n as_o our_o rule_n and_o reason_n which_o be_v also_o the_o gift_n of_o god_n give_v to_o direct_v we_o in_o all_o our_o action_n in_o the_o use_n of_o this_o rule_n and_o then_o for_o luther_n oppose_a your_o church_n upon_o mere_a passion_n it_o be_v a_o thing_n i_o will_v not_o deny_v because_o i_o know_v not_o his_o heart_n and_o for_o the_o same_o reason_n you_o shall_v not_o have_v affirm_v it_o sure_o i_o be_o whether_o he_o oppose_v your_o church_n upon_o reason_n or_o no_o he_o have_v reason_n enough_o to_o oppose_v it_o and_o therefore_o if_o he_o do_v it_o upon_o passion_n we_o will_v follow_v he_o only_o in_o his_o action_n and_o not_o in_o his_o passion_n in_o his_o opposition_n not_o in_o the_o manner_n of_o it_o and_o then_o i_o presume_v you_o will_v have_v no_o reason_n to_o condemn_v we_o unless_o you_o will_v say_v that_o a_o good_a action_n can_v be_v do_v with_o reason_n because_o some_o body_n before_o we_o have_v do_v it_o upon_o passion_n you_o see_v then_o how_o imprudent_a you_o have_v be_v in_o the_o choice_n of_o your_o argument_n to_o prove_v protestant_n unwise_a in_o the_o choice_n of_o their_o religion_n 56._o it_o remain_v now_o that_o i_o shall_v show_v that_o many_o reason_n of_o moment_n may_v be_v allege_v for_o the_o justification_n of_o protestant_n which_o be_v dissemble_v by_o you_o and_o not_o put_v into_o the_o balance_n know_v then_o sir_n that_o when_o i_o say_v the_o religion_n of_o protestant_n be_v in_o prudence_n to_o be_v prefer_v before_o you_o as_o on_o the_o one_o side_n i_o do_v not_o understand_v by_o your_o religion_n the_o doctrine_n of_o bellarmine_n or_o baronius_n or_o any_o other_o private_a man_n among_o you_o nor_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o sorbon_n or_o of_o the_o jesuit_n or_o of_o the_o dominicans_n or_o of_o any_o other_o particular_a company_n among_o you_o but_o that_o wherein_o you_o all_o agree_v or_o profess_v to_o agree_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o
yet_o our_o own_o brethren_n the_o century_n writer_n acknowledge_v that_o in_o the_o time_n of_o cyprian_a and_o tertullian_n private_a confession_n even_o of_o thought_n be_v use_v and_o that_o it_o be_v then_o command_v and_o think_v necessary_a and_o then_o our_o ordination_n you_o say_v be_v very_o doubtful_a and_o all_o that_o depend_v upon_o it_o answer_v i_o also_o omit_v to_o answer_v 1._o that_o your_o brother_n rhenanus_fw-la acknowledge_v the_o contrary_a and_o assure_v we_o that_o the_o confession_n then_o require_v and_o in_o use_n be_v public_a and_o before_o the_o church_n and_o that_o your_o auricular_a confession_n be_v not_o then_o in_o the_o world_n for_o which_o his_o mouth_n be_v stop_v by_o your_o index_n expurgatorius_fw-la 2._o that_o your_o brother_n arcudius_n acknowledge_v that_o the_o eucharist_n be_v in_o cyprian_n time_n give_v to_o infant_n and_o esteem_v necessary_a or_o at_o least_o profitable_a for_o they_o and_o the_o give_v it_o show_v no_o less_o and_o now_o i_o will_v know_v whether_o you_o will_v acknowledge_v your_o church_n bind_v to_o give_v it_o and_o to_o esteem_v so_o of_o it_o 3._o that_o it_o may_v be_v then_o command_v and_o be_v command_v be_v think_v necessary_a and_o yet_o be_v but_o a_o church_n constitution_n neither_o will_v i_o deny_v if_o the_o present_a church_n can_v and_o will_v so_o order_v it_o that_o the_o abuse_n of_o it_o may_v be_v prevent_v and_o conceive_v it_o profitable_a shall_v enjoin_v the_o use_n of_o it_o but_o that_o be_v command_v it_o will_v be_v necessary_a 4._o concern_v our_o ordination_n beside_o that_o i_o have_v prove_v it_o impossible_a that_o they_o shall_v be_v so_o doubtful_a as_o you_o according_a to_o your_o own_o principle_n i_o answer_v that_o experience_n show_v they_o certain_o sufficient_a to_o bring_v man_n to_o faith_n and_o repentance_n and_o consequent_o to_o salvation_n and_o that_o if_o there_o be_v any_o secret_a defect_n of_o any_o thing_n necessary_a which_o we_o can_v help_v god_n will_v certain_o supply_v it_o 19_o it_o be_v remarkable_a against_o what_o you_o say_v §_o 7._o that_o any_o small_a error_n in_o faith_n destroy_v all_o faith_n that_o s._n austin_n who_o authority_n be_v here_o stand_v upon_o think_v otherwise_o he_o conceive_v the_o donatist_n to_o hold_v some_o error_n in_o faith_n and_o yet_o not_o to_o have_v no_o faith_n his_o word_n of_o they_o to_o this_o purpose_n be_v most_o pregnant_a and_o evident_a you_o be_v with_o we_o say_v he_o to_o the_o donatist_n ep._n 48._o in_o baptism_n in_o the_o creed_n in_o the_o other_o sacrament_n and_o again_o super_fw-la gestis_fw-la cum_fw-la emerit_fw-la thou_o have_v prove_v to_o i_o that_o thou_o have_v faith_n prove_v to_o i_o likewise_o that_o thou_o have_v charity_n initium_fw-la lib._n 5._o prope_fw-la initium_fw-la parallel_v to_o which_o word_n be_v these_o of_o optatus_n among_o we_o and_o you_o be_v one_o ecclesiastical_a conversation_n common_a lesson_n the_o same_o faith_n the_o same_o sacrament_n where_o by_o the_o way_n we_o may_v observe_v that_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o these_o father_n even_o the_o donatist_n though_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n give_v true_a ordination_n the_o true_a sacrament_n of_o matrimony_n true_a sacramental_a absolution_n confirmation_n the_o true_a sacrament_n of_o the_o eucharist_n true_a extreme_a unction_n or_o else_o choose_v you_o whether_o some_o of_o these_o be_v not_o then_o esteem_v sacrament_n but_o for_o ordination_n whether_o he_o hold_v it_o a_o sacrament_n or_o no_o certain_o he_o hold_v that_o it_o remain_v with_o they_o entire_a for_o so_o he_o say_v in_o express_a term_n in_o his_o book_n against_o parmenianus_n his_o epistle_n which_o doctrine_n if_o you_o can_v reconcile_v with_o the_o present_a doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n eris_n mihi_fw-la magnus_fw-la apollo_n 20._o ad_fw-la §_o 8._o obj._n you_o say_v there_o be_v un_fw-fr inevitable_a necessity_n for_o we_o either_o to_o grant_v salvation_n to_o your_o church_n or_o to_o entail_v certain_a damnation_n upon_o our_o own_o because_o we_o can_v have_v no_o be_v till_o luther_n unless_o you_o be_v suppose_v to_o have_v be_v the_o true_a church_n i_o answer_v this_o cause_n be_v no_o cause_n for_o first_o as_o luther_n have_v no_o be_v before_o luther_n and_o yet_o he_o be_v when_o he_o be_v though_o he_o be_v not_o before_o so_o there_o be_v no_o repugnance_n in_o the_o term_n but_o that_o there_o may_v be_v a_o true_a church_n after_o luther_n though_o there_o be_v none_o for_o some_o age_n before_o as_o since_o columbus_n his_o time_n there_o have_v be_v christian_n in_o america_n though_o before_o there_o be_v none_o for_o many_o age_n for_o neither_o do_v you_o show_v neither_o do_v it_o appear_v that_o the_o generation_n of_o church_n be_v univocal_a that_o nothing_o but_o a_o church_n can_v possible_o beget_v a_o church_n nor_o that_o the_o present_a be_v of_o a_o true_a church_n depend_v necessary_o upon_o the_o perpetuity_n of_o a_o church_n in_o all_o age_n any_o more_o than_o the_o present_a be_v of_o peripatetic_n or_o stoic_n depend_v upon_o a_o perpetual_a pedigree_n of_o they_o for_o though_o i_o at_o no_o hand_n deny_v the_o church_n perpetuity_n yet_o i_o see_v nothing_o in_o your_o book_n to_o make_v i_o understand_v that_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o present_a depend_v upon_o it_o nor_o any_o thing_n that_o can_v hinder_v but_o that_o a_o false_a church_n god_n providence_n overwatch_v and_o overrule_a it_o may_v preserve_v the_o mean_n of_o confute_v their_o own_o heresy_n and_o reduce_v man_n to_o truth_n and_o so_o raise_v a_o true_a church_n i_o mean_v the_o integrity_n and_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n with_o man_n thus_o the_o jew_n preserve_v mean_n to_o make_v man_n christian_n and_o papist_n preserve_v mean_n to_o make_v man_n protestant_n and_o protestant_n which_o you_o say_v be_v a_o false_a church_n do_v as_o you_o pretend_v preserve_v mean_n to_o make_v man_n papist_n that_o be_v their_o own_o bibles_n out_o of_o which_o you_o pretend_v to_o be_v able_a to_o prove_v that_o they_o be_v to_o be_v papist_n second_o you_o show_v not_o nor_o do_v it_o appear_v that_o the_o perpetuity_n of_o the_o church_n depend_v on_o the_o truth_n of_o you_o for_o though_o you_o talk_v vain_o as_o if_o you_o be_v the_o only_a man_n in_o the_o world_n before_o luther_n yet_o the_o world_n know_v that_o this_o be_v but_o talk_n and_o that_o there_o be_v other_o christian_n beside_o you_o which_o may_v have_v perpetuate_v the_o church_n though_o you_o have_v not_o be_v last_o you_o show_v not_o neither_o do_v it_o appear_v that_o your_o be_v acknowledge_v in_o some_o sense_n a_o true_a church_n do_v necessary_o import_v that_o we_o must_v grant_v salvation_n to_o it_o unless_o by_o it_o you_o understand_v the_o ignorant_a member_n of_o it_o which_o be_v a_o very_a unusual_a synecdoche_n 21._o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o catholic_n never_o grant_v that_o the_o donatist_n have_v a_o true_a church_n or_o may_v be_v save_v i_o answ_v s._n austin_n himself_o grant_v that_o those_o among_o they_o who_o seek_v the_o truth_n be_v ready_a when_o they_o find_v it_o to_o correct_v their_o error_n be_v not_o heretic_n and_o therefore_o notwithstanding_o their_o error_n may_v be_v save_v and_o this_o be_v all_o the_o charity_n that_o protestant_n allow_v to_o papist_n therefore_o the_o argument_n of_o the_o donatist_n be_v as_o good_a as_o that_o of_o the_o papist_n against_o protestant_n for_o the_o donatist_n argue_v thus_o speak_v to_o the_o catholic_n yourselves_o confess_v our_o baptism_n sacrament_n and_o faith_n good_a and_o available_a we_o deny_v you_o to_o be_v so_o and_o say_v there_o be_v no_o church_n no_o salvation_n among_o you_o therefore_o it_o be_v safe_a for_o all_o to_o join_v with_o we_o 22._o s._n augustine_n word_n be_v cont_n lit_fw-fr petil_o l._n 2._o c._n 108._o petilianus_n dixit_fw-la venite_fw-la ad_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la populi_fw-la &_o aufugite_fw-la traditores_fw-la 108._o cont._n lit_fw-fr petil_n l._n 2._o c._n 108._o si_fw-la perire_fw-la non_fw-la vultis_fw-la petilian_n say_v come_v to_o the_o church_n you_o people_n and_o fly_v from_o the_o traditour_n if_o you_o will_v not_o be_v damn_v for_o that_o you_o may_v know_v that_o they_o be_v guilty_a esteem_v well_o of_o our_o faith_n behold_v i_o baptise_v these_o who_o they_o have_v infect_v but_o they_o receive_v those_o who_o we_o have_v baptise_a where_o it_o be_v plain_a that_o petilian_n by_o his_o word_n make_v the_o donatist_n the_o church_n and_o exclude_v the_o catholic_n from_o salvation_n absolute_o and_o whereas_o you_o say_v the_o catholic_n never_o yield_v that_o among_o the_o donatist_n there_o be_v a_o true_a church_n and_o hope_n of_o salvation_n i_o say_v it_o appear_v by_o what_o i_o have_v allege_v out_o of_o s._n austin_n that_o they_o
yield_v both_o these_o be_v among_o the_o donatist_n as_o much_o as_o we_o yield_v they_o to_o be_v among_o the_o papist_n as_o for_o d._n potter_n acknowledgement_n that_o they_o maintain_v a_o error_n in_o the_o matter_n and_o nature_n of_o it_o heretical_a this_o prove_v they_o but_o material_a heretic_n who_o you_o do_v not_o exclude_v from_o possibility_n of_o salvation_n so_o that_o all_o thing_n consider_v this_o argument_n must_v be_v much_o more_o forcible_a from_o the_o donatist_n against_o the_o catholic_n than_o from_o papist_n against_o protestant_n in_o regard_n protestant_n grant_n papist_n no_o more_o hope_n of_o salvation_n than_o papist_n grant_n protestant_n whereas_o the_o donatist_n exclude_v absolute_o all_o but_o their_o own_o part_n from_o hope_n of_o salvation_n so_o far_o as_o to_o account_v they_o no_o christian_n that_o be_v not_o of_o it_o the_o catholic_n mean_v while_n account_v they_o brethren_n and_o free_v those_o among_o they_o from_o the_o imputation_n of_o heresy_n who_o be_v in_o error_n quaerebant_fw-la cautâ_fw-la sollicitudine_fw-la veritatem_fw-la corrigi_fw-la parati_fw-la cùm_fw-la invenerint_fw-la seek_v for_o truth_n careful_o be_v ready_a when_o they_o find_v it_o to_o correct_v their_o error_n 23._o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o the_o argument_n for_o the_o certainty_n of_o their_o baptism_n because_o it_o be_v confess_v good_a by_o catholic_n whereas_o the_o baptism_n of_o catholic_n be_v not_o confess_v by_o they_o to_o be_v good_a be_v not_o so_o good_a as_o you_o touch_v the_o certainty_n of_o your_o salvation_n ground_v on_o the_o confession_n of_o protestant_n because_o we_o confess_v there_o be_v no_o damnable_a error_n in_o the_o doctrine_n or_o practice_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n i_o answer_v no_o we_o confess_v no_o such_o matter_n and_o though_o you_o say_v so_o a_o hundred_o time_n no_o repetition_n will_v make_v it_o true_a we_o profess_v plain_o that_o many_o damnable_a error_n plain_o repugnant_a to_o the_o precept_n of_o christ_n both_o ceremonial_a and_o moral_a more_o plain_o than_o this_o of_o rebaptisation_n and_o therefore_o more_o damnable_a be_v believe_v and_o profess_v by_o you_o and_o therefore_o see_v this_o be_v the_o only_a disparity_n you_o can_v devise_v and_o this_o be_v vanish_v it_o remain_v that_o as_o good_a a_o answer_n as_o the_o catholic_n make_v touch_v the_o certainty_n of_o their_o baptism_n as_o good_a may_v we_o make_v and_o with_o much_o more_o evidence_n of_o reason_n touch_v the_o security_n and_o certainty_n of_o our_o salvation_n 24._o by_o the_o way_n i_o desire_v to_o be_v inform_v see_v you_o affirm_v that_o rebaptise_v those_o who_o heretic_n have_v baptize_v be_v a_o sacrilege_n and_o a_o profession_n of_o a_o damnable_a heresy_n when_o it_o begin_v to_o be_v so_o if_o from_o the_o beginning_n it_o be_v so_o then_o be_v cyprian_n a_o sacrilegious_a professor_n of_o a_o damnable_a heresy_n and_o yet_o a_o saint_n and_o a_o martyr_n if_o it_o be_v not_o so_o then_o do_v your_o church_n excommunicate_v firmilian_a and_o other_o and_z separate_z from_o they_o without_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o excommunication_n or_o separation_n which_o be_v schismatical_a you_o see_v what_o difficulty_n you_o run_v into_o on_o both_o side_n choose_v whether_o you_o will_v but_o certain_o both_o can_v hardly_o be_v avoid_v 27._o what_o s._n austin_n answer_v to_o the_o donatists_n argument_n fit_v we_o in_o answer_n to_o you_o as_o if_o it_o have_v be_v make_v for_o it_o for_o as_o s._n austin_n say_v that_o catholic_n approve_v the_o doctrine_n of_o donatist_n but_o abhor_v their_o heresy_n of_o rebaptisation_a so_o we_o say_v that_o we_o approve_v those_o fundamental_a and_o simple_a necessary_a truth_n which_o you_o retain_v by_o which_o some_o good_a soul_n among_o you_o may_v be_v save_v but_o abhor_v your_o many_o superstition_n and_o heresy_n and_o as_o he_o say_v that_o as_o gold_n be_v good_a yet_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v seek_v for_o among_o a_o company_n of_o thief_n and_o baptism_n good_a but_o not_o to_o be_v seek_v for_o in_o the_o conventicle_n of_o donatist_n so_o say_v we_o that_o the_o truth_n you_o retain_v be_v good_a and_o as_o we_o hope_v sufficient_a to_o bring_v good_a ignorant_a soul_n among_o you_o to_o salvation_n yet_o be_v not_o to_o be_v seek_v for_o in_o the_o conventicle_n of_o papist_n who_o hold_v with_o they_o a_o mixture_n of_o many_o vanity_n and_o many_o impiety_n 30._o obj._n but_o protestant_n do_v either_o exclude_v hope_n by_o despair_n with_o the_o doctrine_n that_o our_o saviour_n die_v not_o for_o all_o and_o that_o such_o want_n grace_n sufficient_a to_o salvation_n or_o else_o by_o vain_a presumption_n ground_v upon_o a_o fantastical_a persuasion_n that_o they_o be_v predestinate_a which_o faith_n must_v exclude_v all_o fear_n and_o tremble_a and_o you_o add_v though_o some_o protestant_n may_v relent_v from_o the_o rigour_n of_o the_o aforesaid_a doctrine_n yet_o none_o of_o they_o can_v have_v true_a hope_n while_o they_o hope_v to_o be_v save_v in_o the_o communion_n of_o those_o who_o defend_v such_o doctrine_n ans_fw-fr edit_n ans_fw-fr see_v numb_a 4._o in_o the_o fol._n edit_n all_o this_o may_v be_v as_o forcible_o return_v upon_o papist_n as_o it_o be_v urge_v against_o protestant_n in_o as_o much_o as_o all_o papist_n either_o hold_v the_o doctrine_n of_o predetermination_n and_o absolute_a election_n or_o communicate_v with_o those_o that_o do_v hold_v it_o now_o from_o this_o doctrine_n what_o be_v more_o prone_a and_o obvious_a than_o for_o every_o natural_a man_n without_o god_n especial_a prevent_a grace_n to_o make_v this_o practical_a collection_n either_o i_o be_o elect_v or_o not_o elect_v if_o i_o be_v no_o impiety_n possible_a can_v ever_o damn_v i_o if_o not_o no_o possible_a industry_n can_v ever_o save_v i_o now_o whether_o this_o disjunctive_a persuasion_n be_v not_o as_o likely_a as_o any_o doctrine_n 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it_o which_o your_o dominicans_n put_v upon_o it_o neither_o can_v you_o with_o coherence_n to_o the_o receive_a doctrine_n of_o your_o own_o society_n deny_v that_o they_o as_o well_o as_o the_o calvinists_n take_v away_o the_o distinction_n of_o sufficient_a and_o effectual_a grace_n and_o indeed_o hold_v none_o to_o be_v sufficient_a but_o only_o that_o which_o be_v effectual_a 2._o whereas_o you_o say_v they_o can_v make_v their_o call_n certain_a by_o good_a work_n who_o do_v certain_o believe_v that_o before_o any_o good_a work_n they_o be_v justify_v and_o justify_v by_o faith_n alone_o and_o by_o that_o faith_n whereby_o they_o certain_o believe_v they_o be_v justify_v i_o answer_v there_o be_v no_o protestant_n but_o believe_v that_o faith_n repentance_n and_o universal_a obedience_n be_v necessary_a to_o the_o obtain_n of_o god_n favour_n and_o eternal_a happiness_n this_o be_v grant_v the_o rest_n be_v but_o a_o speculative_a controversy_n a_o question_n about_o word_n which_o will_v quick_o vanish_v but_o that_o man_n affect_v not_o to_o understand_v one_o another_o as_o if_o a_o company_n of_o physician_n be_v in_o consultation_n and_o shall_v all_o agree_v that_o three_o medicine_n and_o no_o more_o be_v necessary_a for_o the_o recovery_n of_o the_o patient_n health_n this_o be_v sufficient_a for_o his_o direction_n towards_o the_o recovery_n of_o his_o health_n though_o concern_v the_o proper_a and_o specifical_a effect_n of_o these_o three_o medicine_n there_o shall_v be_v among_o they_o as_o many_o difference_n as_o man_n so_o likewise_o be_v general_o at_o accord_n that_o these_o three_o thing_n faith_n hope_n and_o charity_n be_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n so_o that_o whosoever_o want_v any_o of_o they_o can_v obtain_v it_o and_o he_o which_o have_v they_o all_o can_v fail_v of_o it_o be_v it_o not_o very_o evident_a that_o they_o be_v sufficient_o agree_v for_o man_n direction_n to_o eternal_a salvation_n and_o see_v charity_n be_v a_o full_a comprehension_n of_o all_o
chargeable_a for_o forsake_v that_o guide_n which_o god_n have_v appoint_v i_o to_o follow_v but_o what_o if_o i_o forsake_v it_o because_o i_o think_v i_o have_v reason_n to_o fear_v it_o be_v one_o of_o those_o blind_a guide_n which_o whosoever_o blind_o follow_v be_v threaten_v by_o our_o saviour_n that_o both_o he_o and_o his_o guide_n shall_v fall_v into_o the_o ditch_n then_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v grant_v it_o be_v not_o pride_n but_o conscience_n that_o move_v i_o to_o do_v so_o for_o as_o it_o be_v wise_a humility_n to_o obey_v those_o who_o god_n have_v set_v over_o i_o so_o it_o be_v sinful_a credulity_n to_o follow_v every_o man_n or_o every_o church_n that_o without_o warrant_n will_v take_v upon_o they_o to_o guide_v i_o show_v i_o then_o some_o good_a and_o evident_a title_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v to_o this_o office_n produce_v but_o one_o reason_n for_o it_o which_o upon_o trial_n will_v not_o final_o be_v resolve_v and_o vanish_v into_o 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whole_a world_n wonder_v say_v saint_n hierom_n that_o it_o be_v become_v arrian_n when_o liberius_n bishop_n of_o rome_n as_o s._n athanasius_n and_o s._n hilary_n testify_v subscribe_v their_o heresy_n and_o join_v in_o communion_n with_o they_o or_o in_o the_o division_n between_o the_o greek_a and_o the_o roman_a church_n about_o the_o procession_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n when_o either_o side_n be_v the_o church_n to_o itself_o and_o each_o part_n heretical_a and_o schismatical_a to_o the_o other_o what_o direction_n can_v i_o then_o a_o ignorant_a man_n have_v find_v from_o that_o text_n of_o scripture_n unless_o he_o hear_v the_o church_n let_v he_o be_v to_o thou_o as_o a_o heathen_a or_o a_o publican_n or_o upon_o this_o rock_n will_v i_o build_v my_o church_n and_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n shall_v not_o prevail_v against_o it_o again_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o wonder_v that_o neither_o s._n paul_n write_v to_o the_o roman_n shall_v so_o much_o as_o intimate_v this_o their_o privilege_n of_o infallibility_n but_o rather_o on_o the_o contrary_n put_v they_o in_o fear_n in_o the_o eleven_o chapter_n that_o they_o as_o well_o as_o the_o jew_n be_v in_o danger_n of_o fall_v away_o that_o saint_n peter_n the_o pretend_a bishop_n of_o rome_n write_v two_o catholic_n epistle_n mention_v his_o departure_n shall_v not_o once_o acquaint_v the_o christian_n who_o he_o write_v to_o what_o guide_v they_o be_v to_o follow_v after_o he_o be_v take_v from_o they_o that_o the_o writer_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n shall_v so_o frequent_o forewarn_v man_n of_o heretic_n false_a christ_n false_a prophet_n and_o not_o once_o arm_v they_o against_o they_o with_o let_v they_o know_v this_o only_a sure_a mean_n of_o avoid_v their_o danger_n that_o so_o great_a a_o part_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n shall_v be_v employ_v about_o antichrist_n and_o so_o little_a or_o indeed_o none_o at_o all_o about_o the_o vicar_n of_o christ_n and_o the_o guide_n of_o the_o faithful_a that_o our_o saviour_n shall_v leave_v this_o only_a mean_n for_o the_o end_n of_o controversy_n and_o yet_o speak_v so_o obscure_o and_o ambiguous_o of_o it_o that_o now_o our_o judge_n be_v the_o great_a controversy_n and_o the_o great_a hindrance_n of_o end_v they_o that_o there_o shall_v be_v better_a evidence_n in_o the_o scripture_n to_o entitle_v the_o king_n to_o this_o office_n who_o disclaim_v it_o than_o the_o pope_n who_o pretend_v it_o that_o s._n peter_n shall_v not_o ever_o exercise_v over_o the_o apostle_n any_o one_o act_n of_o jurisdiction_n nor_o they_o ever_o give_v he_o any_o one_o title_n of_o authority_n over_o they_o that_o if_o the_o apostle_n do_v know_v s._n peter_n be_v make_v head_n over_o they_o when_o our_o saviour_n say_v thou_o be_v peter_n etc._n etc._n they_o shall_v still_o contend_v who_o shall_v be_v the_o first_o and_o that_o our_o saviour_n shall_v never_o tell_v they_o s._n peter_n be_v the_o man_n that_o s._n paul_n shall_v say_v he_o be_v in_o nothing_o inferior_a to_o the_o very_a chief_a apostle_n that_o the_o catechumenist_n in_o the_o primitive_a church_n shall_v never_o be_v teach_v this_o foundation_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v guide_n of_o their_o faith_n that_o the_o father_n tertullian_n s._n hierom_n and_o optatus_n when_o they_o fly_v high_a in_o commendation_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n shall_v attribute_v no_o more_o to_o she_o than_o to_o all_o other_o apostolical_a church_n that_o in_o the_o controversy_n about_o easter_n the_o bishop_n and_o church_n of_o asia_n shall_v be_v so_o ill_o catechise_v as_o not_o to_o know_v this_o principle_n of_o christian_a religion_n the_o necessity_n of_o conformity_n in_o doctrine_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n that_o they_o shall_v never_o be_v press_v with_o any_o such_o necessity_n of_o conformity_n in_o all_o thing_n but_o only_o with_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o western_a church_n in_o that_o point_n that_o irenaeus_n and_o many_o other_o bishop_n notwithstanding_o ad_fw-la hanc_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la necesse_fw-la est_fw-la omnem_fw-la convenire_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la shall_v not_o yet_o think_v that_o a_o necessary_a doctrine_n nor_o a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o excommunication_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n though_o to_o be_v so_o that_o s._n cyprian_n and_o the_o bishop_n of_o africa_n shall_v be_v so_o ill_o instruct_v in_o their_o faith_n as_o not_o to_o know_v this_o foundation_n of_o it_o that_o they_o likewise_o be_v never_o urge_v with_o any_o such_o necessity_n of_o conformity_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n nor_o ever_o charge_v with_o heresy_n or_o error_n for_o deny_v it_o that_o when_o liberius_n join_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o arrian_n and_o subscribe_v their_o heresy_n the_o arrian_n than_o shall_v not_o be_v the_o church_n and_o the_o guide_n of_o faith_n that_o never_o any_o heretic_n for_o three_o age_n after_o christ_n be_v press_v with_o this_o argument_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n or_o charge_v with_o denial_n of_o it_o as_o a_o distinct_a heresy_n so_o that_o aeneas_n silvius_n shall_v have_v cause_n to_o say_v ante_fw-la tempora_fw-la concilii_fw-la niceni_n cuique_fw-la sibi_fw-la vivebat_fw-la &_o parvus_fw-la respectus_fw-la habebatur_fw-la ad_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la romanam_fw-la that_o the_o ecclesiastical_a story_n of_o those_o time_n mention_n no_o act_n of_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n over_o other_o church_n as_o if_o there_o shall_v be_v a_o monarchy_n and_o the_o king_n for_o some_o age_n together_o shall_v exercise_v no_o act_n of_o jurisdiction_n in_o it_o that_o to_o supply_v this_o defect_n the_o decretal_a epistle_n shall_v be_v so_o impudent_o forge_v which_o in_o a_o manner_n speak_v nothing_o else_o but_o reges_a &_o monarchas_n i_o mean_v the_o pope_n make_v law_n for_o exercise_v authority_n
over_o all_o other_o church_n that_o the_o african_a church_n in_o s._n augustine_n time_n shall_v be_v ignorant_a that_o the_o pope_n be_v head_n of_o the_o church_n and_o judge_n of_o appeals_n jure_fw-la divino_fw-la and_o that_o there_o be_v a_o necessity_n of_o conformity_n with_o the_o church_n in_o this_o and_o all_o other_o point_n of_o doctrine_n nay_o that_o the_o pope_n themselves_o shall_v be_v so_o ignorant_a of_o the_o true_a ground_n of_o this_o their_o authority_n as_o to_o pretend_v to_o it_o not_o upon_o scripture_n or_o universal_a tradition_n but_o upon_o a_o imaginary_a pretend_a none-such_a canon_n of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a that_o vincentius_n lirinensis_n seek_v for_o a_o guide_n of_o his_o faith_n and_o a_o preservative_n from_o heresy_n shall_v be_v ignorant_a of_o this_o so_o ready_a one_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n all_o these_o thing_n and_o many_o more_o be_v very_o strange_a to_o i_o if_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v indeed_o and_o be_v always_o by_o christian_n acknowledge_v the_o foundation_n of_o our_o faith_n and_o therefore_o i_o beseech_v you_o pardon_v i_o if_o i_o choose_v to_o build_v i_o upon_o one_o that_o be_v much_o firm_a and_o safe_a and_o lie_v open_a to_o none_o of_o these_o objection_n which_o be_v scripture_n and_o universal_a tradition_n and_o if_o one_o that_o be_v of_o this_o faith_n may_v have_v leave_n to_o do_v so_o i_o will_v subscribe_v with_o hand_n and_o heart_n your_o very_a love_a and_o true_a friend_n w._n c._n a_o table_n of_o content_n note_v that_o the_o first_o figure_n refer_v to_o the_o chapter_n the_o other_o to_o the_o division_n of_o each_o chapter_n a._n protestant's_n agree_n in_o more_o thing_n than_o they_o differ_v in_o by_o believe_v the_o scripture_n chap._n 4._o div_o 49.50_o we_o have_v as_o many_o rational_a mean_n of_o agreement_n as_o the_o papist_n c._n 3.7_o 8._o papist_n pretend_v to_o mean_n of_o agreement_n and_o do_v not_o agree_v c._n 3.3_o 4_o 5_o 6._o not_o necessary_a to_o find_v a_o church_n agree_v with_o protestant_n in_o all_o point_n ans_fw-fr pref_o 19_o &_o c._n 5.27_o antiquity_n vain_o plead_v for_o romish_a doctrine_n and_o practice_n since_o many_o error_n be_v more_o ancient_a than_o some_o of_o their_o doctrine_n c._n 5.91_o the_o apostolic_a church_n a_o infallible_a guide_n to_o which_o we_o may_v resort_v be_v present_a to_o we_o by_o her_o write_n c._n 3.69_o 80._o that_o the_o church_n have_v power_n to_o make_v new_a article_n of_o faith_n assert_v by_o the_o romish_a doctor_n c._n 4.18_o this_o one_o article_n i_o believe_v the_o roman_n catholic_n church_n to_o be_v infallible_a if_o their_o doctrine_n be_v true_a will_v secure_v against_o heresy_n more_o than_o the_o whole_a creed_n c._n 4.77_o 78_o 79_o 83._o christ_n assistance_n promise_v to_o the_o church_n to_o lead_v she_o into_o more_o than_o necessary_a truth_n c._n 5.61_o 62._o atheism_n and_o irreligion_n spring_v easy_o from_o some_o romish_a doctrine_n and_o practice_n pref._n 7_o 8._o s._n augustine_n saying_n evangelio_n non_fw-la crederem_fw-la etc._n etc._n how_o to_o be_v understand_v c._n 2.54_o 97_o 98_o 99_o s._n augustine_n testimony_n against_o the_o donatist_n not_o cogent_a against_o protestant_n c._n 2.163_o s._n augustine_n word_n no_o necessity_n to_o divide_v unity_n explain_v c._n 5.10_o the_o author_n vindication_n from_o suspicion_n of_o heresy_n pref._n 28._o the_o author_n motive_n to_o turn_v a_o papist_n with_o answer_n to_o they_o pref._n 42.43_o b._n the_o bible_n which_o be_v the_o religion_n of_o protestant_n to_o be_v prefer_v before_o the_o way_n of_o romish_a religion_n show_v at_o large_a c._n 6._o from_o 56._o to_o 72._o inclusive_a c._n the_o calvinists_n rigid_a doctrine_n of_o predetermination_n unjust_o reproach_v by_o papist_n who_o communicate_v with_o those_o that_o hold_v the_o same_o c._n 7.30_o to_o give_v a_o catalogue_n of_o our_o fundamental_o not_o necessary_a nor_o possible_a ans_fw-fr pref._n 27._o &_o c._n 3.13_o 53._o want_v of_o such_o a_o catalogue_n leave_v we_o not_o uncertain_a in_o our_o faith_n c._n 3.14_o papist_n as_o much_o bind_v to_o give_v a_o catalogue_n of_o the_o church_n proposal_n which_o be_v their_o fundamental_o and_o yet_o do_v it_o not_o c._n 3.53_o our_o general_a catalogue_n of_o fundamental_o as_o good_a as_o they_o c._n 4.12_o c._n 7.35_o moral_a certainty_n a_o sufficient_a foundation_n of_o faith_n c._n 2.154_o a_o protestant_n may_v have_v certainty_n though_o disagree_a protestant_n all_o pretend_v to_o like_a certainty_n c._n 7.13_o what_o charity_n papist_n allow_v to_o we_o protestant_n and_o we_o to_o they_o c._n 1.1_o 3_o 4_o 5._o a_o charitable_a judgement_n shall_v be_v make_v of_o such_o as_o err_v but_o lead_v good_a life_n c._n 7.33_o protestant_n charity_n to_o ignorant_a papist_n no_o comfort_n to_o they_o that_o will_v not_o see_v their_o error_n c._n 5.76_o the_o church_n how_o furnish_v with_o mean_n to_o determine_v controversy_n c._n 1.7_o 11._o command_v in_o scripture_n to_o hear_v the_o church_n and_o obey_v it_o suppose_v it_o not_o infallible_a c._n 3.41_o we_o may_v be_v a_o true_a church_n though_o derive_v ordination_n and_o receive_v scripture_n from_o a_o false_a one_o c._n 6.54_o common_a truth_n believe_v may_v preserve_v they_o good_a that_o otherwise_o err_v c._n 7.33_o conscience_n in_o some_o case_n will_v justify_v separation_n though_o every_o pretence_n of_o it_o will_v not_o c._n 5.108_o concord_n in_o damn_a error_n worse_o than_o disagreement_n in_o controvert_v point_n c._n 5.72_o the_o consequence_n of_o man_n opinion_n may_v be_v unjust_o charge_v upon_o they_o c._n 1.12_o c._n 7.30_o what_o contradiction_n papist_n believe_v who_o hold_v transubstantiation_n c._n 4.46_o all_o controversy_n in_o religion_n not_o necessary_a to_o be_v determine_v c._n 1.7_o 156._o &_o c._n 3.88_o how_o controversy_n about_o scripture_n itself_o be_v to_o be_v decide_v c._n 2.27_o controversy_n not_o necessary_a to_o be_v decide_v by_o a_o judicial_a sentence_n without_o any_o appeal_n c._n 2.85_o that_o the_o creed_n contain_v all_o necessary_a point_n and_o how_o to_o be_v understand_v c._n 4.23_o 73_o 74._o not_o necessary_a that_o our_o creed_n shall_v be_v large_a than_o that_o of_o the_o apostle_n c._n 4.67_o 70_o 71_o 72._o whether_o it_o be_v contrary_a to_o the_o creed_n to_o say_v the_o church_n may_v fail_v c._n 5.31_o d._n s_o dennis_n of_o alexandria_n saying_n explain_v about_o not_o divide_v the_o church_n c._n 5.12_o to_o deny_v a_o truth_n witness_v by_o god_n whether_o always_o damnable_a ans_fw-fr pref._n 9_o the_o apostle_n deposit_v truth_n with_o the_o church_n no_o argument_n that_o she_o shall_v always_o keep_v it_o sincere_a and_o entire_a c._n 2.148_o of_o disagree_v protestant_n though_o one_o side_n must_v err_v yet_o both_o may_v hope_v for_o salvation_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 22._o &_o c._n 1.10_o 13_o 17._o two_o may_v disagree_v in_o a_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o yet_o neither_o be_v chargeable_a with_o deny_v a_o declare_a truth_n of_o go_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 10._o difference_n among_o protestant_n vain_o object_v against_o they_o c._n 3.2_o 3_o 5._o &_o c._n 5.72_o no_o reason_n to_o reproach_v they_o for_o their_o difference_n about_o necessary_a truth_n and_o damuable_a error_n c._n 3.52_o what_o be_v requisite_a to_o convince_v a_o man_n that_o a_o doctrine_n come_v from_o god_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 8._o believe_v the_o doctrine_n of_o scripture_n a_o man_n may_v be_v save_v though_o he_o do_v not_o believe_v it_o to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n c._n 2.159_o the_o donatists_n error_n about_o the_o catholic_n church_n what_o it_o be_v and_o be_v not_o c._n 3.64_o the_o donatists_n case_n and_o we_o not_o alike_a c._n 5.103_o the_o roman_a church_n guilty_a of_o the_o donatists_n error_n in_o persuade_v man_n as_o good_a not_o to_o be_v christian_n as_o not_o roman_a catholic_n c._n 3.64_o papist_n like_a to_o the_o donatist_n than_o we_o by_o their_o uncharitable_a deny_v salvation_n out_o of_o their_o church_n c._n 7.21_o 22_o 27._o e._n english_a divine_v vindicate_v from_o incline_v to_o popery_n and_o for_o want_v of_o skill_n in_o school-divinity_n pref._n 19_o how_o error_n may_v be_v damnable_a ans_fw-fr pref._n 22._o in_o what_o case_n error_n damnable_a may_v not_o damn_v those_o that_o hold_v they_o c._n 5.58_o &_o c._n 6.14_o in_o what_o case_n error_n not_o damnable_a may_v be_v damnable_a to_o those_o that_o hold_v they_o c._n 5.66_o no_o man_n to_o be_v reproach_v for_o quit_v his_o error_n c._n 5.103_o though_o we_o may_v pardon_v the_o roman_a church_n for_o her_o error_n yet_o we_o may_v not_o sin_v with_o it_o c._n 5.70_o error_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o endanger_v salvation_n to_o be_v forsake_v though_o they_o be_v not_o destructive_a of_o it_o c._n 7.6_o
and_o do_v no_o more_o than_o papist_n be_v bind_v to_o justify_v what_o several_a pope_n have_v say_v and_o do_v c._n 5.112_o m._n they_o may_v be_v member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n that_o be_v not_o unite_v in_o external_a communion_n c._n 5.9_o the_o protestant_a doctrine_n of_o merit_n explain_v c._n 4.35_o 36._o the_o author_n motive_n to_o change_v his_o religion_n with_o answer_n to_o they_o pref._n 42.43_o the_o faith_n of_o papist_n resolve_v at_o last_o into_o the_o motive_n of_o credibility_n c._n 2.154_o the_o mischief_n that_o follow_v the_o reformation_n not_o imputable_a to_o it_o c._n 5.92_o n._n what_o make_v point_n necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v c._n 4.4_o 11._o no_o more_o be_v necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v by_o we_o than_o by_o the_o apostle_n c._n 4.67_o 70_o 71_o 72._o papist_n make_v many_o thing_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n which_o god_n never_o make_v so_o c._n 7.7_o all_o necessary_a point_n of_o faith_n be_v contain_v in_o the_o creed_n c._n 4.73_o 74._o why_o some_o point_v not_o so_o necessary_a be_v put_v into_o the_o creed_n c._n 4.75_o 76._o protestant_n may_v agree_v in_o necessary_a point_n though_o they_o may_v overvalue_v some_o thing_n they_o hold_v c._n 7.34_o to_o impose_v a_o necessity_n of_o profess_v know_v error_n and_o practise_v know_v corruption_n be_v a_o just_a cause_n of_o separation_n c._n 5.31_o 36_o 40_o 50_o 59_o 60_o 68_o 69._o o._n a_o blind_a obedience_n be_v not_o due_a to_o ecclesiastical_a decision_n though_o our_o practice_n must_v be_v determine_v by_o the_o sentence_n of_o superior_n in_o doubtful_a case_n c._n 5.110_o a_o probable_a opinion_n may_v be_v follow_v according_a to_o the_o roman_a doctor_n though_o it_o be_v not_o the_o safe_a way_n for_o avoid_v sin_n c._n 7_o 8._o optatus_n saying_n impertinent_o urge_v against_o protestant_n c._n 5.99_o 100_o though_o we_o receive_v ordination_n and_o scripture_n from_o a_o false_a church_n yet_o we_o may_v be_v a_o true_a church_n c._n 6.54_o p._n whether_o papist_n or_o protestant_n most_o hazard_v their_o soul_n on_o probability_n c._n 4.57_o what_o we_o believe_v concern_v the_o perpetuity_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 18._o whether_o 1_o tim._n 3.15_o the_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o truth_n belong_v to_o timothy_n or_o to_o the_o church_n c._n 3.76_o if_o those_o word_n belong_v to_o the_o church_n whether_o they_o may_v not_o signify_v her_o duty_n and_o yet_o that_o she_o may_v err_v in_o neglect_v it_o c._n 3.77_o a_o possibility_n of_o be_v deceive_v argue_v not_o a_o uncertainty_n in_o all_o we_o believe_v c._n 3.26_o 50_o c._n 5.107_o c._n 6.47_o by_o join_v in_o the_o prayer_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n we_o must_v join_v in_o her_o unlawful_a practice_n c._n 3.11_o preach_v of_o the_o word_n and_o administer_a the_o sacrament_n how_o they_o be_v inseparable_a note_n of_o the_o church_n and_o how_o they_o make_v it_o visible_a c._n 5.19_o private_a spirit_n how_o we_o be_v to_o understand_v it_o c._n 2.110_o private_a spirit_n be_v not_o appeal_v to_o i._n e._n to_o dictate_v pretend_v to_o come_v from_o god_n spirit_n when_o controversy_n be_v refer_v to_o scripture_n c._n 2.110_o whether_o one_o be_v leave_v to_o his_o private_a spirit_n reason_n and_o discourse_n by_o deny_v the_o church_n infallibility_n and_o the_o harm_n of_o it_o pref._n 12_o 13._o &_o c._n 2.110_o a_o man_n private_a judgement_n may_v be_v oppose_v to_o the_o public_a when_o reason_n and_o scripture_n warrant_v he_o c._n 5.109_o a_o probable_a opinion_n according_a to_o the_o roman_a doctor_n may_v be_v follow_v though_o it_o be_v not_o the_o safe_a way_n for_o avoid_v sin_n c._n 7.8_o it_o be_v hard_a for_o papist_n to_o resolve_v what_o be_v a_o sufficient_a proposal_n of_o the_o church_n c._n 3.54_o protestant_n be_v on_o the_o sure_a side_n for_o avoid_v sin_n and_o papist_n on_o the_o more_o dangerous_a side_n to_o commit_v sin_n show_v in_o instance_n c._n 7.9_o r._n every_o man_n by_o reason_n must_v judge_v both_o of_o scripture_n and_o the_o church_n c._n 2.111_o 112_o 113_o 118_o 120_o 122._o reason_n and_o judgement_n of_o discretion_n be_v not_o to_o be_v reproach_v for_o the_o private_a spirit_n c._n 2.110_o if_o man_n must_v not_o follow_v their_o reason_n what_o they_o be_v to_o follow_v c._n 2.114_o 115._o some_o kind_n of_o reformation_n may_v be_v so_o necessary_a as_o to_o justify_v separation_n from_o a_o corrupt_a church_n though_o every_o pretence_n of_o reformation_n will_v not_o c._n 5.53_o nothing_o be_v more_o against_o religion_n than_o use_v violence_n to_o introduce_v it_o c._n 5.96_o the_o religion_n of_o protestant_n which_o be_v the_o belief_n of_o the_o bible_n a_o wise_a and_o safe_a way_n than_o that_o of_o the_o roman_a church_n show_v at_o large_a c._n 6._o from_o 56._o to_o 72._o inclus_n all_o protestant_n require_v repentance_n to_o remission_n of_o sin_n and_o remission_n of_o sin_n to_o justification_n c._n 7.31_o no_o revelation_n know_v to_o be_v so_o may_v be_v reject_v as_o not_o fundamental_a c._n 4.11_o a_o divine_a revelation_n may_v be_v ignorant_o disbelieved_a by_o a_o church_n and_o yet_o it_o may_v continue_v a_o church_n c._n 3.20_o thing_n equal_o reveal_v may_v not_o be_v so_o to_o several_a person_n c._n 3.24_o papist_n can_v have_v reverence_n for_o the_o scripture_n whilst_o they_o advance_v so_o many_o thing_n contrary_a to_o it_o c._n 2.1_o no_o argument_n of_o their_o reverence_n to_o it_o that_o they_o have_v preserve_v it_o entire_a c._n 2.2_o the_o roman_a church_n when_o luther_n separate_v be_v not_o the_o visible_a church_n though_o a_o visible_a church_n and_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n c._n 5.26_o 27._o the_o present_a roman_a church_n have_v lose_v all_o authority_n to_o recommend_v what_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v in_o religion_n c._n 2.101_o the_o property_n of_o a_o perfect_a rule_n c._n 2.5.6_o 7._o whether_o the_o popish_a rule_n of_o fundamental_o or_o we_o be_v the_o safe_a c._n 4.63_o s._n right_o administration_n of_o sacrament_n uncertain_a in_o the_o roman_a church_n c._n 2._o from_o 63._o to_o 68_o inclusive_a in_o what_o sense_n salvation_n may_v be_v have_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n ans_fw-fr pref._n 5_o 7._o salvation_n depend_v upon_o great_a uncertainty_n in_o the_o roman_a church_n c._n 2._o from_o 63._o to_o 73._o inclus_fw-la schism_n whence_o they_o chief_o arise_v and_o what_o continue_v they_o c._n 4.17_o schism_n may_v be_v a_o division_n of_o the_o church_n as_o well_o as_o from_o it_o c._n 5.22_o he_o may_v be_v no_o schismatic_a that_o forsake_v a_o church_n for_o error_n not_o damnable_a ans_fw-fr pref._n 2._o no_o schism_n to_o leave_v a_o corrupt_a church_n when_o otherwise_o we_o must_v communicate_v in_o her_o corruption_n c._n 5.25_o not_o every_o separation_n from_o the_o external_a communion_n of_o the_o church_n but_o a_o causeless_a one_o be_v the_o sin_n of_o schism_n c._n 5.30_o they_o may_v not_o be_v schismatic_n that_o continue_v the_o separation_n from_o rome_n though_o luther_n that_o begin_v it_o have_v be_v a_o schismatic_a c._n 5.4_o &_o c._n 6.14_o the_o scripture_n can_v be_v due_o reverence_v by_o papist_n c._n 2._o n._n 1._o the_o scripture_n how_o prove_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n c._n 4.53_o the_o divine_a authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n may_v be_v certain_a though_o it_o be_v not_o self-evident_o certain_a that_o it_o be_v god_n word_n c._n 6.51_o book_n of_o scripture_n now_o hold_v for_o canonical_a which_o the_o roman_a church_n former_o reject_v c._n 2.90_o 91._o whether_o some_o book_n of_o scripture_n define_v for_o canonical_a be_v not_o afterward_o reject_v c._n 3.29_o the_o scripture_n in_o thing_n necessary_a be_v intelligible_a to_o learned_a and_o unlearned_a c._n 2.104_o 105_o 106._o some_o book_n of_o scripture_n question_v by_o the_o father_n as_o well_o as_o by_o protestant_n c._n 2.34_o the_o scripture_n have_v great_a authority_n from_o internal_a argument_n c._n 2.47_o the_o truth_n of_o scripture_n inspiration_n depend_v not_o on_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n pref._n 14._o &_o c._n 6.45_o if_o the_o scripture_n contain_v all_o necessary_a truth_n popery_n be_v confute_v pref._n 30._o to_o 38._o inclusive_a the_o true_a meaning_n of_o scripture_n not_o uncertain_a in_o necessary_a point_n c._n 2.84_o a_o determinate_a sense_n of_o obscure_a place_n of_o scripture_n be_v not_o needful_a c._n 2.127_o 150._o the_o sense_n of_o plain_a place_n of_o scripture_n may_v be_v know_v by_o the_o same_o mean_n by_o which_o the_o papist_n know_v the_o sense_n of_o those_o place_n that_o prove_v the_o church_n c._n 2.150_o 151._o god_n may_v give_v mean_n to_o the_o church_n to_o know_v the_o true_a sense_n of_o scripture_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o necessary_a it_o shall_v have_v that_o sense_n c._n 2.93_o it_o
philosopher_n and_o heresy_n of_o christian_n be_v none_o of_o he_o he_o be_v but_o one_o to_o wit_n the_o catholic_n church_n etc._n etc._n s._n epiphan_n in_o fine_a panar_n 11._o a_o man_n may_v not_o call_v the_o conventicle_n of_o heretic_n i_o mean_v marcionites_n manichees_n and_o the_o rest_n church_n therefore_o the_o tradition_n appoint_v you_o to_o say_v i_o believe_v one_o holy_a catholic_n church_n etc._n etc._n s._n cyrill_n catech._n 18._o and_o these_o testimony_n i_o think_v be_v sufficient_a to_o show_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n that_o this_o title_n of_o the_o church_n one_o be_v direct_o and_o proper_o exclusive_a to_o all_o company_n beside_o one_o to_o wit_n that_o where_o there_o be_v diverse_a profession_n of_o faith_n or_o diverse_a communion_n there_o be_v but_o one_o of_o these_o which_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n church_n upon_o this_o ground_n i_o desire_v some_o company_n of_o christian_n to_o be_v name_v profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n and_o hold_v a_o diverse_a communion_n from_o the_o roman_a which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_n and_o if_o no_o other_o in_o this_o sense_n can_v be_v name_v than_o be_v she_o the_o catholic_n church_n at_o that_o time_n and_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n to_o be_v rest_v in_o and_o her_o communion_n to_o be_v embrace_v upon_o peril_n of_o schism_n and_o heresy_n mr._n chillingworths_n answer_n upon_o the_o same_o ground_n if_o you_o please_v you_o may_v desire_v a_o protestant_n to_o name_v some_o company_n of_o christian_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n and_o hold_v a_o diverse_a communion_n from_o the_o greek_a church_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_v and_o see_v he_o can_v name_v no_o other_o in_o this_o sense_n conclude_v that_o the_o greek_a church_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o that_o time_n upon_o the_o very_a same_o ground_n you_o may_v have_v conclude_v for_o the_o church_n of_o the_o abyssine_n or_o armenians_n or_o any_o other_o society_n of_o christian_n extant_a before_o luther_n time_n and_o see_v this_o be_v so_o thus_o i_o argue_v against_o your_o ground_n 1._o that_o ground_n which_o conclude_v indifferent_o for_o both_o part_n of_o a_o contradiction_n must_v needs_o be_v false_a and_o deceitful_a and_o conclude_v for_o neither_o part_n but_o this_o ground_n conclude_v indifferent_o both_o part_n of_o a_o contradiction_n viz._n that_o the_o greek_a church_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o not_o the_o roman_a as_o well_o as_o that_o the_o roman_a be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o not_o the_o greek_a therefore_o the_o ground_n be_v false_a and_o deceitful_a seem_v it_o never_o so_o plausible_a 2._o i_o answer_v second_o that_o you_o shall_v have_v take_v notice_n of_o my_o answer_n which_o i_o then_o give_v you_o which_o be_v that_o your_o major_n as_o you_o then_o frame_v your_o argument_n but_o as_o now_o your_o minor_a be_v not_o always_o true_a if_o by_o one_o you_o understand_v one_o in_o external_a communion_n see_v nothing_o hinder_v in_o my_o judgement_n but_o that_o one_o church_n excommunicate_v by_o another_o upon_o a_o insufficient_a cause_n may_v yet_o remain_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o that_o church_n which_o upon_o the_o over-value_a this_o cause_n do_v excommunicate_v the_o other_o though_o in_o fault_n may_v yet_o remain_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n which_o be_v evident_a from_o the_o difference_n about_o easter-day_n between_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n for_o which_o vain_a matter_n victor_n bishop_n of_o rome_n excommunicate_v the_o church_n of_o asia_n and_o yet_o i_o believe_v you_o will_v not_o say_v that_o either_o the_o church_n excommunicate_v or_o the_o church_n excommunicate_v cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o church_n catholic_n the_o case_n be_v the_o same_o between_o the_o greek_a and_o the_o roman_a church_n for_o though_o the_o difference_n between_o they_o be_v great_a yet_o it_o be_v not_o so_o great_a as_o to_o be_v a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o excommunication_n and_o therefore_o the_o excommunication_n be_v causeless_a and_o consequent_o brutum_fw-la fulmen_fw-la and_o not_o ratify_v or_o confirm_v by_o god_n in_o heaven_n and_o therefore_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n at_o luther_n rise_a might_n be_v and_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n as_o concern_v the_o place_n of_o father_n which_o you_o allege_v i_o demand_v 1._o if_o i_o can_v produce_v you_o a_o equal_a or_o great_a number_n of_o father_n or_o more_o ancient_a than_o these_o not_o contradict_v by_o any_o that_o live_v with_o they_o or_o before_o they_o for_o some_o doctrine_n condemn_v by_o the_o roman_a church_n whether_o you_o will_v subscribe_v it_o if_o not_o with_o what_o face_n or_o conscience_n can_v you_o make_v use_n of_o and_o build_v your_o whole_a faith_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o father_n in_o some_o thing_n and_o reject_v the_o same_o authority_n in_o other_o 2._o second_o because_o you_o urge_v s._n cyprian_n authority_n i_o desire_v you_o to_o tell_v i_o whether_o this_o argument_n in_o his_o time_n will_v have_v conclude_v a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n or_o no_o if_o not_o how_o shall_v it_o come_v to_o pass_v that_o it_o shall_v serve_v now_o and_o not_o then_o fit_v this_o time_n and_o not_o that_o as_o if_o it_o be_v like_o a_o almanac_n that_o will_v not_o serve_v for_o all_o meridian_n if_o it_o will_v why_o be_v it_o not_o urge_v by_o other_o upon_o s._n cyprian_n or_o represent_v by_o s._n cyprian_n to_o himself_o for_o his_o direction_n when_o he_o differ_v from_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o all_o other_o that_o herein_o conform_v unto_o she_o touch_v the_o point_n of_o rebaptising_a heretic_n which_o the_o roman_a church_n hold_v unlawful_a and_o damnable_a s._n cyprian_n not_o only_o lawful_a but_o necessary_a so_o well_o do_v he_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o that_o church_n quid_fw-la verba_fw-la audiam_fw-la cùm_fw-la facta_fw-la videam_fw-la say_v he_o in_o the_o comedy_n and_o cardinal_n perron_n tell_v you_o in_o his_o epistle_n to_o casaubon_n that_o nothing_o be_v more_o unreasonable_a than_o to_o draw_v consequence_n from_o the_o word_n of_o father_n against_o their_o lively_a and_o actual_a practice_n the_o same_o may_v be_v say_v in_o refutation_n of_o the_o place_n out_o of_o s._n austin_n who_o be_v so_o far_o from_o conclude_v from_o they_o or_o any_o other_o a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o he_o himself_o as_o your_o author_n testify_v live_v and_o die_v in_o opposition_n of_o it_o even_o in_o that_o main_a fundamental_a point_n upon_o which_o mr._n lewgar_n have_v build_v the_o necessity_n of_o his_o departure_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o embrace_v the_o communion_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o be_v the_o supreme_a authority_n of_o that_o church_n over_o other_o church_n and_o the_o power_n of_o receive_v appeals_n from_o they_o mr._n lewgar_o i_o know_v can_v be_v ignorant_a of_o these_o thing_n and_o therefore_o i_o wonder_v with_o what_o conscience_n he_o can_v produce_v their_o word_n against_o we_o who_o action_n be_v for_o we_o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o s._n cyprian_a and_o s._n austin_n be_v schismatic_n for_o do_v so_o it_o seem_v then_o schismatic_n may_v not_o only_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n against_o mr._n lewgar_n main_a conclusion_n but_o canonize_v saint_n of_o it_o or_o else_o s._n austin_n and_o s._n cyprian_a shall_v be_v raze_v out_o of_o the_o roman_a calendar_n if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o the_o point_n of_o rebaptisation_a be_v not_o define_v in_o s._n cyprian_n time_n i_o say_v that_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o bishop_n and_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o their_o adherent_n it_o be_v for_o they_o urge_v it_o as_o a_o original_a and_o apostolic_a tradition_n and_o consequent_o at_o least_o of_o as_o great_a force_n as_o any_o church_n definition_n they_o excommunicate_v firmilianus_n and_o condemn_v s._n cyprian_n as_o a_o false_a christ_n and_o a_o false_a apostle_n for_o hold_v the_o contrary_a and_o urge_v he_o tyrannico_fw-la terror_fw-la to_o conform_v his_o judgement_n to_o they_o as_o he_o himself_o clear_o intimate_v if_o it_o be_v say_v they_o differ_v only_o from_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n and_o not_o from_o the_o roman_a church_n take_v it_o for_o the_o universal_a society_n of_o christian_n in_o communion_n with_o that_o church_n i_o answer_v 1._o they_o know_v no_o such_o sense_n of_o the_o word_n i_o be_o sure_a never_o use_v it_o in_o any_o such_o which_o whether_o it_o have_v be_v possible_a if_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v be_v in_o their_o judgement_n to_o other_o church_n in_o
spiritual_a matter_n as_o the_o city_n be_v to_o other_o city_n and_o country_n in_o temporal_n i_o leave_v it_o to_o indifferent_a man_n to_o judge_v 2._o second_o that_o they_o differ_v not_o only_o from_o the_o particular_a roman_a church_n but_o also_o from_o all_o other_o church_n that_o agree_v with_o it_o in_o those_o doctrine_n 3._o three_o i_o desire_v you_o will_v answer_v i_o direct_o whether_o the_o roman_a church_n take_v it_o for_o that_o particular_a church_n be_v of_o necessity_n to_o be_v hold_v infallible_a in_o faith_n by_o every_o roman_n catholic_n or_o not_o to_o this_o question_n i_o instant_o desire_v a_o direct_a answer_n without_o tergiversation_n that_o we_o may_v at_o length_n get_v out_o of_o the_o cloud_n and_o you_o may_v say_v coram_fw-la quem_fw-la quaeritis_fw-la adsum_fw-la if_o you_o say_v they_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o believe_v so_o than_o it_o be_v no_o article_n of_o faith_n nor_o no_o certain_a truth_n upon_o which_o man_n may_v safe_o rest_v without_o fluctuation_n or_o fear_n of_o error_n and_o if_o so_o i_o demand_v 1._o why_o be_v all_o your_o clergy_n bind_v to_o swear_v and_o consequent_o your_o laity_n if_o they_o have_v communion_n of_o faith_n with_o they_o by_o your_o own_o ground_n bind_v to_o believe_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v the_o mistress_n of_o all_o other_o church_n where_o it_o be_v evident_a from_o the_o relation_n and_o opposition_n of_o the_o roman_a to_o other_o church_n that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v there_o take_v for_o that_o particular_a church_n 2._o second_o why_o then_o do_v you_o so_o often_o urge_v that_o mistake_v say_v of_o iraeneus_n ad_fw-la hanc_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la necesse_fw-la est_fw-la omnem_fw-la convenire_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la false_o translate_n it_o as_o cardinal_z perron_n in_o french_a and_o my_o l._n f._n in_o english_a all_o church_n must_v agree_v with_o this_o church_n for_o convenire_fw-la ad_fw-la signify_v not_o to_o agree_v with_o but_o to_o come_v unto_o whereas_o it_o be_v evident_a for_o the_o aforesaid_a reason_n that_o the_o roman_a be_v here_o take_v for_o that_o particular_a church_n 3._o three_o if_o that_o particular_a church_n be_v not_o certain_o infallible_a but_o subject_a to_o error_n in_o point_n of_o faith_n i_o will_v know_v if_o any_o division_n of_o your_o church_n shall_v happen_v in_o which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n either_o alone_a or_o with_o some_o other_o shall_v take_v one_o way_n the_o church_n of_o spain_n and_o france_n and_o many_o other_o church_n another_o what_o direction_n shall_v a_o ignorant_a catholic_n have_v then_o from_o the_o pretend_a guide_n of_o faith_n how_o shall_v he_o know_v which_o of_o these_o company_n be_v the_o church_n see_v all_o other_o church_n distinguish_v from_o the_o roman_a may_v err_v and_o see_v the_o roman_a church_n be_v now_o suppose_a subject_n to_o error_n and_o consequent_o not_o certain_a to_o guard_v those_o man_n or_o those_o church_n that_o adhere_v unto_o it_o from_o err_a 4._o four_o if_o that_o particular_a church_n be_v not_o infallible_a in_o faith_n let_v we_o then_o suppose_v that_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la it_o do_v err_v in_o faith_n shall_v we_o not_o then_o have_v a_o heretical_a head_n upon_o a_o catholic_n body_n a_o head_n of_o the_o church_n which_o be_v no_o member_n of_o the_o church_n which_o sure_o be_v a_o very_a strange_a and_o heterogeneous_a monster_n if_o to_o avoid_v these_o inconvenience_n you_o will_v say_v that_o roman_a catholic_n must_v of_o necessity_n hold_v that_o particular_a church_n infallible_a in_o faith_n i_o suppose_v it_o will_v evident_o follow_v that_o s._n austin_n and_o s._n cyprian_n notwithstanding_o those_o sentence_n you_o pretend_v out_o of_o they_o be_v no_o roman_a catholic_n see_v they_o live_v and_o die_v in_o the_o contrary_a belief_n and_o profession_n let_v i_o see_v these_o absurdity_n fair_o and_o clear_o avoid_v and_o i_o will_v dispute_v no_o more_o but_o follow_v you_o whithersoever_o you_o shall_v lead_v i_o 3._o three_o i_o answer_v that_o the_o place_n allege_v be_v utter_o impertinent_a to_o the_o conclusion_n you_o shall_v have_v prove_v which_o be_v that_o it_o be_v impossible_a that_o two_o society_n of_o christian_n divide_v upon_o what_o cause_n soever_o in_o external_a communion_n may_v be_v in_o truth_n and_o in_o god_n account_n both_o of_o they_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n whereas_o your_o testimony_n if_o we_o grant_v they_o all_o say_v no_o more_o but_o this_o that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n which_o be_v such_o as_o overthrow_v any_o doctrine_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n and_o of_o schismatic_n which_o be_v such_o as_o separate_v from_o the_o church_n communion_n without_o any_o pretence_n of_o error_n in_o the_o church_n or_o unlawfulness_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n i_o say_v they_o prove_v only_o this_o that_o such_o society_n as_o these_o be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o church_n which_o i_o willing_o grant_v of_o all_o such_o as_o be_v proper_o and_o formal_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n from_o which_o number_n i_o think_v with_o s._n austin_n they_o be_v to_o be_v exempt_v qui_fw-la quaerunt_fw-la cautâ_fw-la sollicitudine_fw-la veritatem_fw-la corrigi_fw-la parati_fw-la cùm_fw-la invenerint_fw-la whereas_o i_o put_v the_o case_n of_o such_o two_o society_n which_o not_o differ_v indeed_o in_o any_o thing_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n do_v yet_o erroneous_o believe_v that_o the_o error_n wherewith_o they_o charge_v one_o another_o be_v damnable_a and_o so_o by_o this_o opinion_n of_o mutual_a error_n be_v keep_v on_o both_o side_n from_o be_v heretic_n because_o i_o desire_v to_o bring_v you_o and_o other_o to_o the_o truth_n or_o to_o be_v bring_v to_o it_o by_o you_o i_o think_v good_a for_o your_o direction_n in_o your_o intend_a reply_n to_o acquaint_v you_o with_o these_o thing_n 1._o that_o i_o conceive_v the_o in_o your_o discourse_n be_v this_o that_o whensoever_o any_o two_o society_n of_o christian_n differ_v in_o external_a communion_n one_o of_o they_o must_v be_v of_o necessity_n heretical_a or_o schismatical_a i_o conceive_v there_o be_v no_o such_o necessity_n and_o that_o the_o story_n of_o victor_n and_o the_o bishop_n of_o asia_n s._n cyprian_n and_o pope_n stephen_n make_v it_o evident_a and_o therefore_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o produce_v some_o convince_a argument_n to_o the_o contrary_a and_o that_o you_o may_v the_o better_a do_v it_o i_o think_v good_a to_o inform_v you_o what_o i_o mean_v by_o a_o heretic_n and_o what_o by_o a_o schismatic_a a_o heretic_n therefore_o i_o conceive_v he_o that_o hold_v a_o error_n against_o faith_n with_o obstinacy_n obstinate_a i_o conceive_v he_o who_o will_v not_o change_v his_o opinion_n when_o his_o reason_n for_o it_o be_v so_o answer_v that_o he_o can_v reply_v and_o when_o the_o reason_n against_o it_o be_v so_o convince_a that_o he_o can_v answer_v they_o by_o the_o faith_n i_o understand_v all_o those_o doctrine_n and_o no_o more_o which_o christ_n teach_v his_o apostle_n and_o the_o apostle_n the_o church_n yet_o i_o exclude_v not_o from_o this_o number_n the_o certain_a and_o evident_a deduction_n of_o they_o a_o schismatic_a i_o account_v he_o and_o facundus_n hermianensis_fw-la have_v teach_v i_o to_o do_v so_o who_o without_o any_o suppose_n of_o error_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o a_o church_n communion_n divide_v himself_o either_o from_o the_o obedience_n of_o that_o church_n to_o which_o he_o owe_v obedience_n or_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o that_o church_n to_o which_o he_o owe_v communion_n 2._o another_o thing_n which_o i_o think_v fit_a to_o acquaint_v you_o with_o be_v this_o that_o you_o go_v upon_o another_o very_a false_a and_o deceitful_a supposition_n viz._n that_o if_o we_o will_v not_o be_v protestant_n present_o we_o must_v be_v papist_n if_o we_o forsake_v the_o church_n of_o england_n we_o must_v go_v present_o to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n whereas_o if_o your_o argument_n do_v conclude_v as_o they_o do_v not_o that_o before_o luther_n time_n there_o be_v some_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n i_o shall_v much_o rather_o think_v it_o be_v the_o church_n of_o greece_n than_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o i_o believe_v other_o also_o will_v think_v so_o as_o well_o as_o i_o but_o for_o that_o reason_n which_o one_o give_v why_o more_o man_n hold_v the_o pope_n above_o a_o council_n than_o a_o council_n above_o a_o pope_n that_o be_v because_o council_n give_v no_o maintenance_n or_o preferment_n and_o the_o pope_n do_v think_v not_o yet_o i_o pray_v that_o i_o say_v this_o as_o if_o i_o conceive_v this_o to_o be_v your_o reason_n for_o prefer_v the_o roman_a church_n before_o the_o greek_a for_o i_o protest_v i_o do_v not_o but_o rather_o that_o conceive_v very_o you_o be_v to_o leave_v the_o church_n of_o england_n to_o avoid_v
trouble_v you_o take_v the_o next_o boat_n and_o go_v to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n because_o that_o bespeak_v you_o first_o you_o impute_v to_o i_o as_o i_o hear_v that_o the_o way_n i_o take_v be_v destructive_a only_o and_o that_o i_o build_v nothing_o which_o first_o be_v not_o a_o fault_n for_o christian_a religion_n be_v not_o now_o to_o be_v build_v but_o only_o i_o desire_v to_o have_v the_o rubbish_n and_o impertinent_a lumber_n take_v off_o which_o you_o have_v lay_v upon_o it_o which_o hide_v the_o glorious_a simplicity_n of_o it_o from_o they_o which_o otherwise_o will_v embrace_v it_o remember_v i_o pray_v averro_n his_o say_n quandoquidem_fw-la christiani_n adorant_fw-la quod_fw-la comedunt_fw-la sit_fw-la anima_fw-la mea_fw-la cum_fw-la philosophis_fw-la and_o consider_v the_o swarm_n of_o atheist_n in_o italy_n and_o then_o tell_v i_o whether_o your_o unreasonable_a and_o contradictious_a doctrine_n your_o forge_a miracle_n and_o counterfeit_a legend_n have_v not_o in_o all_o probability_n produce_v this_o effect_n second_o if_o it_o be_v a_o fault_n it_o be_v certain_o your_o own_o for_o your_o discourse_n intend_v for_o the_o proof_n of_o a_o positive_a conclusion_n that_o we_o must_v be_v papist_n prove_v in_o deed_n and_o in_o truth_n nothing_o but_o even_o in_o show_n and_o appearance_n no_o more_o but_o this_o negative_a that_o we_o must_v not_o be_v protestant_n but_o what_o we_o must_v be_v if_o we_o must_v not_o be_v protestant_n god_n know_v you_o in_o this_o discourse_n i_o be_o sure_a do_v not_o show_v it_o mr._n lewgar_n reply_v §_o 1._o the_o minor_a of_o mr._n chillingworths_n argument_n against_o my_o ground_n be_v very_o weak_a be_v frame_v upon_o a_o false_a supposition_n that_o a_o protestant_n can_v name_v no_o other_o church_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n etc._n etc._n from_o the_o greek_a church_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n for_o if_o he_o can_v not_o indeed_o name_v any_o other_o the_o title_n will_v remain_v to_o the_o greek_a church_n but_o he_o have_v the_o roman_a to_o name_n and_o so_o my_o ground_n can_v conclude_v either_o for_o the_o greek_a or_o abyssine_n or_o any_o other_o beside_o the_o roman_a but_o for_o that_o it_o do_v except_o he_o can_v name_v some_o other_o §_o 2._o his_o second_o answer_n be_v weak_a likewise_o for_o my_o minor_n be_v always_o true_a at_o least_o they_o think_v it_o to_o be_v so_o who_o authority_n i_o produce_v in_o confirmation_n of_o it_o as_o will_v appear_v to_o any_o one_o that_o consider_v they_o well_o how_o their_o force_n lie_v in_o thesi_fw-la not_o in_o hypothesi_fw-la not_o that_o the_o church_n be_v not_o then_o divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o but_o that_o she_o can_v never_o be_v §_o 3._o as_o for_o his_o instance_n to_o the_o contrary_a wherein_o he_o believe_v i_o will_v not_o say_v the_o church_n excommunicate_v by_o victor_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n if_o i_o say_v so_o i_o say_v no_o more_o than_o the_o ancient_a father_n say_v before_o i_o iraeneus_n when_o he_o desire_v victor_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d not_o to_o cut_v off_o so_o many_o and_o great_a church_n and_o ruffinus_n reprehendit_fw-la eam_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la benè_fw-la fecisset_fw-la abscindere_fw-la ab_fw-la unitate_fw-la corporis_fw-la etc._n etc._n §_o 4._o but_o howsoever_o the_o case_n of_o excommunication_n may_v be_v the_o division_n of_o external_a communion_n which_o i_o intend_v and_o the_o father_n speak_v of_o in_o the_o allege_a authority_n be_v that_o which_o be_v make_v by_o voluntary_a separation_n §_o 5._o whereby_o the_o church_n before_o one_o society_n be_v divide_v into_o several_a distinct_a society_n both_o claim_v to_o be_v the_o church_n of_o which_o society_n so_o divide_v but_o one_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n and_o this_o be_v prove_v by_o the_o authority_n allege_v which_o authority_n must_v not_o be_v answer_v by_o disprove_v they_o as_o he_o do_v for_o that_o be_v to_o change_v his_o adversary_n and_o confute_v the_o father_n say_n instead_o of_o i_o but_o by_o show_v their_o true_a sense_n or_o judgement_n to_o be_v otherwise_o than_o i_o allege_v it_o §_o 6._o to_o his_o demand_n upon_o the_o place_n allege_v i_o answer_v that_o i_o do_v not_o build_v my_o whole_a faith_n of_o this_o conclusion_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o those_o father_n for_o i_o produce_v they_o not_o for_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o thing_n but_o of_o the_o exposition_n the_o thing_n itself_o be_v a_o article_n of_o the_o creed_n unam_fw-la catholicam_fw-la ground_v in_o express_a scripture_n columba_n mea_fw-la unica_fw-la but_o because_o there_o be_v difference_n in_o understand_v this_o prophecy_n i_o produce_v these_o authority_n to_o show_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n how_o they_o understand_v it_o and_o the_o proper_a answer_n to_o this_o be_v either_o to_o show_v that_o these_o word_n be_v not_o there_o or_o at_o least_o not_o this_o meaning_n and_o so_o to_o show_v their_o meaning_n out_o of_o other_o place_n more_o pregnant_a §_o 7._o and_o i_o promise_v that_o whensoever_o a_o equal_a consent_n of_o father_n can_v be_v show_v for_o any_o thing_n as_o i_o can_v show_v for_o this_o i_o will_v believe_v it_o as_o firm_o as_o i_o do_v this_o §_o 8._o but_o this_o be_v not_o the_o answerers_n part_n to_o propound_v doubt_n and_o difficulty_n but_o to_o satisfy_v the_o proof_n object_v §_o 9_o and_o if_o this_o course_n be_v any_o more_o take_v i_o will_v save_v myself_o all_o far_a labour_n in_o a_o business_n so_o likely_a to_o be_v endless_a §_o 10._o his_o second_o answer_n to_o the_o place_n be_v whole_o impertinent_a for_o therein_o will_v he_o disprove_v they_o from_o watch_v a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n whereas_o i_o produce_v they_o only_o to_o show_v that_o among_o several_a society_n of_o christian_n only_o one_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n and_o against_o this_o his_o second_o answer_n say_v nothing_o §_o 11._o in_o his_o three_o answer_n he_o make_v some_o show_n of_o reply_n to_o the_o authority_n themselves_o but_o he_o commit_v a_o double_a error_n one_o that_o he_o impose_v upon_o i_o a_o wrong_a conclusion_n to_o be_v prove_v as_o will_v appear_v by_o compare_v my_o conclusion_n in_o my_o paper_n with_o the_o conclusion_n he_o will_v appoint_v i_o §_o 12._o another_o that_o he_o impose_v upon_o the_o authority_n a_o wrong_a interpretation_n no_o way_n ground_v in_o the_o word_n themselves_o nor_o in_o the_o place_n whence_o they_o be_v take_v nor_o in_o any_o other_o place_n of_o the_o same_o father_n but_o mere_o forge_v out_o of_o his_o own_o brain_n for_o first_o the_o place_n do_v not_o only_o say_v that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o church_n but_o that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o they_o account_v society_n divide_v which_o be_v either_o of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o a_o diverse_a communion_n neither_o do_v they_o define_v heretic_n or_o schismatic_n in_o that_o manner_n as_o he_o do_v §_o 13._o for_o a_o heretic_n in_o their_o language_n be_v he_o that_o oppose_v partinacious_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n and_o a_o schismatic_a he_o that_o separate_v from_o the_o catholic_n communion_n never_o make_v any_o mention_n at_o all_o of_o the_o cause_n §_o 14._o and_o if_o his_o definition_n of_o a_o schismatic_a may_v stand_v then_o certain_o there_o be_v no_o schismatic_a ever_o in_o the_o world_n nor_o none_o be_v at_o this_o day_n for_o none_o do_v none_o do_v separate_v without_o some_o pretence_n of_o error_n or_o unlawfulness_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o the_o church_n communion_n §_o 15._o and_o so_o i_o expect_v both_o a_o full_a and_o direct_a answer_n to_o my_o argument_n without_o excursion_n or_o diversion_n into_o any_o other_o matter_n till_o the_o judgement_n of_o antiquity_n be_v clear_v in_o this_o point_n mr._n chillingworths_n answer_n ad_fw-la §_o 1._o the_o minor_a of_o my_o argument_n you_o say_v be_v very_o weak_a be_v ground_v upon_o a_o false_a supposition_n that_o a_o protestant_n can_v name_v no_o other_o church_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n from_o the_o greek_a which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o your_o reason_n be_v because_o he_o may_v name_v the_o roman_a but_o in_o earnest_n mr._n lewgar_o do_v you_o think_v that_o a_o protestant_n remain_v a_o protestant_n can_v esteem_v the_o roman_a church_n to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n or_o do_v you_o think_v to_o put_v trick_n upon_o we_o with_o take_v your_o proposition_n one_o while_n in_o sensu_fw-la composito_fw-la another_o while_n in_o sensu_fw-la diviso_fw-la for_o if_o your_o meaning_n be_v that_o a_o protestant_n not_o remain_v but_o cease_v to_o be_v a_o
of_o it_o occasionem_fw-la quaerit_fw-la qui_fw-la cupit_fw-la discedere_fw-la ad_fw-la §_o 10._o i_o pray_v tell_v i_o be_v not_o therefore_o a_o note_n of_o a_o illation_n or_o a_o conclusion_n and_o be_v not_o your_o last_o therefore_o this_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n be_v to_o be_v rest_v in_o which_o though_o it_o be_v not_o your_o first_o conclusion_n yet_o you_o it_o be_v and_o you_o may_v not_o declaim_v it_o and_o it_o be_v so_o near_o of_o kin_n to_o the_o former_a in_o your_o judgement_n i_o be_o sure_a that_o they_o must_v stand_v or_o fall_v together_o therefore_o he_o that_o speak_v pertinent_o for_o the_o disprove_v of_o the_o one_o can_v speak_v impertinent_o towards_o the_o disprove_v the_o other_o and_o therefore_o you_o can_v so_o shift_v it_o off_o but_o of_o necessity_n you_o must_v answer_v the_o argument_n there_o urge_v or_o confess_v it_o ingenuous_o to_o be_v unanswerable_a or_o if_o you_o will_v not_o answer_v any_o thing_n where_o the_o contradiction_n of_o your_o first_o conclusion_n be_v not_o in_o term_n infer_v then_o take_v it_o thus_o if_o s._n cyprian_n and_o s._n austin_n do_v not_o think_v it_o necessary_a in_o matter_n of_o faith_n to_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o then_o either_o they_o think_v not_o the_o catholic_n church_n judgement_n necessary_a to_o be_v rest_v on_o or_o they_o think_v not_o that_o the_o catholic_n church_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a and_o undeniable_o prove_v so_o by_o their_o action_n and_o the_o consequence_n evident_a therefore_o the_o consequent_a must_v be_v true_a in_o one_o or_o other_o part_n but_o you_o will_v not_o say_v the_o former_a be_v true_a it_o remain_v therefore_o the_o latter_a must_v be_v and_o that_o be_v that_o s._n austin_n and_o s._n cyprian_n do_v not_o think_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n ad_fw-la §_o 11._o but_o i_o tell_v you_o now_o and_o have_v already_o tell_v you_o that_o in_o our_o discourse_n before_o mr._n skinner_n and_o dr._n sheldon_n i_o answer_v your_o major_n as_o than_o you_o frame_v your_o argument_n as_o now_o your_o minor_a thus_o if_o you_o understand_v by_o one_o company_n of_o christian_n one_o in_o external_n communion_n i_o deny_v your_o major_n for_o i_o say_v that_o two_o several_a society_n of_o christian_n which_o do_v not_o external_o communicate_v together_o may_v be_v both_o part_n of_o the_o same_o catholic_n church_n and_o what_o difference_n there_o be_v between_o this_o and_o the_o conclusion_n i_o tell_v you_o you_o shall_v have_v prove_v i_o do_v not_o well_o unstand_a ad_fw-la §_o 12._o and_o be_v it_o possible_a you_o shall_v say_v so_o when_o every_o one_o of_o the_o place_n carry_v this_o sense_n in_o their_o forehead_n and_o 7_o of_o the_o 11_o in_o term_n express_v it_o that_o they_o intend_v only_o to_o exclude_v heretic_n and_o schismatic_n from_o be_v part_n of_o the_o church_n for_o if_o they_o do_v not_o against_o who_o do_v they_o intend_v they_o pagan_n lay_v no_o claim_n to_o the_o church_n therefore_o not_o against_o they_o catholic_n they_o do_v not_o intend_v to_o exclude_v i_o know_v not_o who_o remain_v beside_o but_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n beside_o the_o frequent_a opposition_n in_o they_o between_o one_o church_n on_o the_o one_o side_n and_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n who_o see_v not_o that_o in_o these_o place_n they_o intend_v to_o exclude_v only_o these_o pretender_n out_o of_o the_o church_n unity_n last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o the_o place_n say_v that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v and_o that_o they_o account_v those_o divide_v who_o be_v of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o a_o diverse_a communion_n i_o tell_v you_o that_o i_o have_v read_v they_o over_o and_o over_o and_o unless_o my_o eye_n deceive_v they_o say_v not_o one_o word_n of_o a_o diverse_a communion_n ad_fw-la §_o 13._o whereas_o a_o heretic_n in_o your_o language_n be_v he_o that_o oppose_v pertinacious_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n in_o my_o he_o be_v such_o a_o one_o as_o hold_v a_o error_n against_o faith_n with_o obstinacy_n very_o a_o monstrous_a difference_n between_o these_o definition_n to_o oppose_v and_o hold_v against_o i_o hope_v be_v all_o one_o faith_n and_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n sure_o be_v not_o very_o different_a pertinacious_o and_o with_o obstinacy_n methinks_v may_v pass_v for_o synonimous_a and_o see_v the_o part_n agree_v so_o well_o methinks_v the_o total_a shall_v not_o be_v at_o great_a hostility_n and_o for_o the_o definition_n of_o a_o schismatic_a if_o you_o like_v not_o my_o which_o yet_o i_o give_v you_o out_o of_o a_o father_n i_o pray_v take_v your_o own_o and_o then_o show_v i_o if_o you_o mean_v to_o do_v any_o thing_n that_o wheresoever_o there_o be_v two_o society_n of_o christian_n differ_v in_o external_a communion_n one_o of_o they_o most_o be_v of_o 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church_n require_v of_o they_o some_o unlawful_a thing_n among_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n and_o they_o do_v pretend_v that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a for_o they_o to_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n this_o i_o confess_v they_o do_v pretend_v but_o it_o be_v in_o regard_n of_o some_o person_n in_o the_o church_n with_o who_o they_o think_v it_o unlawful_a to_o communicate_v but_o the_o former_a they_o do_v not_o pretend_v i_o mean_v while_o they_o continue_v mere_a schismatic_n viz._n that_o there_o be_v any_o error_n in_o the_o church_n or_o impiety_n in_o her_o public_a service_n of_o god_n and_o this_o be_v my_o meaning_n in_o say_v a_o schismatic_a be_v he_o which_o separate_v from_o the_o church_n without_o pretence_n of_o error_n or_o unlawfulness_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n yet_o if_o i_o have_v leave_v out_o the_o term_n unlawfulness_n the_o definition_n have_v be_v better_a and_o not_o obnoxious_a to_o this_o cavillation_n and_o so_o i_o do_v in_o the_o second_o paper_n which_o i_o send_v you_o for_o your_o direction_n which_o if_o you_o have_v deal_v candid_o you_o shall_v have_v take_v notice_n of_o ad_fw-la §_o 15._o i_o have_v reply_v as_o i_o think_v full_o to_o every_o part_n and_o particle_n of_o your_o argument_n neither_o be_v the_o history_n of_o s._n cyprian_n and_o s._n augustine_n opposition_n to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n a_o excursion_n or_o diversion_n but_o a_o clear_a demonstation_n of_o the_o contradictory_n of_o your_o conclusion_n viz._n that_o the_o roman_a church_n etc._n etc._n and_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n not_o to_o be_v rest_v upon_o for_o a_o answer_n hereto_o i_o shall_v be_v very_o importunate_a with_o you_o and_o therefore_o if_o you_o desire_v to_o avoid_v trouble_n i_o pray_v come_v out_o of_o my_o debt_n as_o soon_o as_o may_v be_v if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o my_o argument_n be_v not_o contradictory_n to_o your_o conclusion_n because_o it_o show_v only_o that_o the_o roman_a 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hear_v christ_n and_o he_o that_o despise_v he_o despise_v christ_n they_o urge_v out_o of_o john_n 14._o for_o 15_o 16._o i_o will_v ask_v my_o father_n and_o he_o will_v give_v you_o another_o paraclete_n that_o he_o may_v abide_v with_o you_o for_o ever_o even_o the_o spirit_n of_o truth_n but_o here_o also_o what_o warrant_v have_v we_o by_o you_o to_o understand_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n whereas_o he_o that_o compare_v v._o 26._o with_o this_o shall_v easy_o perceive_v that_o our_o saviour_n speak_v only_o of_o the_o apostle_n in_o their_o own_o person_n for_o there_o he_o say_v go_v on_o in_o the_o same_o discourse_n the_o holy_a ghost_n who_o the_o father_n will_v send_v in_o my_o name_n he_o shall_v teach_v you_o all_o thing_n and_o bring_v all_o thing_n to_o your_o remembrance_n whatsoever_o i_o have_v say_v to_o you_o which_o can_v agree_v but_o to_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o in_o person_n and_o not_o to_o their_o successor_n who_o have_v not_o yet_o be_v teach_v and_o 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in_o condemn_v the_o collyridians_n as_o heretic_n 1._o demand_v whether_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v not_o the_o foundation_n of_o their_o faith_n which_o be_v member_n of_o that_o church_n answ_n the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o foundation_n but_o a_o part_n of_o their_o faith_n who_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v hold_v to_o be_v the_o church_n by_o all_o those_o who_o be_v member_n of_o it_o reply_n that_o which_o be_v the_o last_o reason_n why_o you_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n and_o unwritten_a tradition_n his_o unwritten_a word_n and_o this_o or_o that_o to_o be_v the_o true_a sense_n of_o scripture_n that_o be_v to_o you_o the_o foundation_n of_o your_o faith_n and_o such_o unto_o you_o be_v the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n therefore_o unto_o you_o it_o be_v not_o only_o a_o part_n of_o your_o faith_n but_o also_o 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deny_v she_o simple_o to_o be_v the_o object_n of_o this_o action_n when_o you_o mean_v only_o she_o be_v not_o such_o a_o kind_n of_o object_n no_o more_o than_o you_o may_v deny_v a_o man_n to_o be_v a_o live_a creature_n mean_v only_o that_o he_o be_v not_o a_o horse_n second_o i_o say_v it_o be_v not_o require_v of_o roman_a catholic_n when_o they_o offer_v taper_n to_o the_o saint_n that_o by_o a_o actual_a intention_n they_o direct_v their_o action_n actual_o to_o god_n but_o it_o be_v hold_v sufficient_a that_o they_o know_v and_o believe_v that_o the_o saint_n be_v in_o subordination_n and_o near_a relation_n to_o god_n and_o that_o they_o give_v this_o honour_n to_o the_o saint_n because_o of_o this_o relation_n and_o to_o god_n himself_o rather_o habitual_o and_o interpretative_a than_o actual_o express_o and_o formal_o as_o many_o man_n honour_v the_o king_n deputy_n without_o have_v any_o present_a thought_n of_o the_o king_n and_o yet_o their_o action_n may_v be_v 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or_o any_o other_o creature_n for_o the_o object_n of_o their_o devotion_n show_v plain_o that_o they_o give_v it_o she_o for_o her_o relation_n to_o christ_n answ_n the_o collyridians_n can_v not_o say_v this_o as_o appear_v by_o what_o have_v be_v say_v before_o as_o it_o be_v a_o most_o shameless_a slander_n upon_o god_n church_n and_o such_o as_o without_o repentance_n will_v lie_v heavy_a upon_o his_o soul_n that_o utter_v it_o that_o the_o collyridians_n might_n as_o just_o and_o true_o have_v say_v all_o this_o for_o themselves_o as_o papist_n for_o themselves_o reply_n to_o this_o i_o reply_v four_o thing_n 1._o that_o to_o my_o last_o and_o most_o convince_a reason_n you_o have_v answer_v as_o much_o as_o you_o can_v i_o believe_v but_o yet_o you_o have_v answer_v nothing_o and_o i_o be_o well_o content_a you_o shall_v do_v so_o for_o where_o nothing_o be_v to_o be_v have_v the_o king_n himself_o must_v lose_v his_o right_n 2._o that_o if_o i_o have_v think_v or_o speak_v better_a of_o the_o collyridians_n than_o they_o deserve_v yet_o i_o can_v see_v how_o this_o have_v be_v to_o slander_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n 3._o that_o i_o do_v not_o positive_o affirm_v that_o the_o collyridians_n might_n do_v so_o but_o desire_v only_o it_o may_v be_v inquire_v into_o and_o examine_v whether_o for_o the_o reason_n allege_v they_o may_v not_o do_v so_o 4._o and_o last_o upon_o a_o thorough_a examination_n of_o the_o matter_n i_o do_v now_o affirm_v what_o before_o i_o do_v not_o that_o the_o collyridians_n for_o aught_o appear_v to_o the_o contrary_a may_v just_o and_o true_o have_v say_v for_o the_o justification_n of_o their_o practice_n as_o much_o nay_o the_o very_a same_o thing_n that_o the_o papist_n do_v for_o they_o for_o they_o may_v have_v say_v we_o be_v christian_n and_o believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o believe_v there_o be_v but_o one_o god_n we_o offer_v not_o to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n as_o believe_v she_o be_v god_n but_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n our_o worship_n of_o she_o be_v not_o absolute_a but_o relative_a not_o terminate_v in_o she_o but_o give_v to_o she_o for_o her_o son_n sake_n and_o if_o our_o practice_n may_v be_v allow_v we_o be_v content_a to_o call_v our_o oblation_n not_o a_o sacrifice_n but_o a_o present_a neither_o be_v there_o any_o reason_n why_o it_o shall_v be_v call_v a_o sacrifice_n more_o than_o the_o offer_n and_o burn_v a_o taper_n to_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o same_o virgin_n all_o this_o the_o collyridians_n might_n have_v say_v for_o themselves_o and_o therefore_o i_o believe_v you_o will_v have_v more_o cause_n to_o repent_v you_o for_o daub_v over_o impiety_n with_o untempered_a mortar_n than_o i_o shall_v have_v for_o slander_v the_o roman_a church_n with_o a_o matter_n of_o truth_n 9_o demand_v whether_o therefore_o one_o of_o the_o two_o must_v not_o of_o necessity_n follow_v that_o either_o the_o ancient_a church_n err_v in_o condemn_v the_o opinion_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o collyridians_n as_o heretical_a or_o else_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n err_v in_o approve_v the_o same_o opinion_n and_o the_o same_o practice_n in_o effect_n which_o in_o they_o be_v condemn_v that_o be_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n must_v not_o be_v heretical_a with_o the_o collyridians_n or_o else_o the_o collyridians_n catholic_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n answ_n it_o appear_v by_o the_o former_a answer_n that_o neither_o do_v the_o ancient_a church_n err_v in_o condemn_v the_o opinion_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o collyridians_n as_o heretical_a nor_o do_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n approve_v the_o same_o opinion_n or_o the_o same_o practice_n reply_n the_o substance_n of_o the_o former_a answer_n be_v but_o this_o that_o the_o papist_n offer_v to_o the_o virgin_n mary_n and_o other_o saint_n wax_v taper_n by_o way_n of_o gift_n or_o present_a not_o of_o sacrifice_n and_o to_o she_o not_o as_o to_o a_o god_n but_o as_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n but_o that_o the_o collyridians_n offer_v to_o she_o by_o way_n of_o sacrifice_n as_o to_o a_o sovereign_a power_n and_o deity_n to_o this_o i_o have_v reply_v and_o prove_v that_o it_o no_o way_n appear_v that_o the_o collyridians_n do_v believe_v the_o bless_a virgin_n to_o be_v a_o sovereign_a power_n and_o deity_n or_o that_o she_o be_v not_o subordinate_a to_o god_n then_o that_o their_o offering_n may_v be_v call_v a_o gift_n as_o well_o as_o the_o papist_n and_o the_o papist_n a_o sacrifice_n as_o well_o as_o they_o both_o of_o they_o be_v a_o consumption_n of_o a_o creature_n in_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n and_o neither_o of_o they_o more_o than_o so_o and_o therefore_o either_o the_o collyridians_n must_v stand_v with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n fall_n with_o the_o collyridians_n it_o have_v be_v perhaps_o sufficient_a for_o i_o thus_o to_o have_v vindicate_v my_o assertion_n from_o contrary_a objection_n without_o take_v on_o myself_o the_o burden_n of_o prove_v a_o negative_a yet_o to_o free_v from_o all_o doubt_n the_o conformity_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o the_o collyridians_n in_o this_o point_n i_o think_v it_o will_v be_v necessary_a to_o show_v and_o that_o by_o many_o very_a probable_a argument_n that_o epiphanius_n do_v not_o impute_v to_o they_o the_o pretend_a heresy_n of_o believe_v the_o virgin_n mary_n god_n for_o than_o that_o other_o evasion_n that_o their_o oblation_n be_v a_o sacrifice_n and_o the_o papist_n be_v not_o together_o with_o this_o pretence_n will_v of_o itself_o fall_v to_o the_o ground_n now_o a_o opinion_n may_v be_v impute_v to_o a_o man_n two_o way_n either_o because_o he_o hold_v and_o maintain_v it_o express_o and_o formal_o and_o in_o term_n or_o because_o it_o may_v by_o a_o rational_a deduction_n be_v collect_v from_o some_o other_o opinion_n which_o he_o do_v hold_v in_o this_o latter_a sense_n i_o deny_v not_o but_o epiphanius_n may_v impute_v this_o opinion_n we_o speak_v of_o to_o the_o collyridians_n as_o a_o consequence_n upon_o their_o practice_n which_o practice_n they_o esteem_v lawful_a but_o that_o they_o hold_v it_o and_o own_v it_o formal_o and_o in_o term_n this_o i_o say_v epiphanius_n do_v not_o impute_v to_o they_o which_o i_o think_v for_o these_o seven_o reason_n my_o first_o reason_n be_v because_o he_o can_v not_o just_o do_v so_o and_o therefore_o without_o evident_a proof_n we_o may_v not_o say_v he_o do_v so_o for_o this_o be_v to_o be_v uncharitable_a to_o he_o in_o make_v he_o uncharitable_a to_o other_o now_o i_o say_v he_o can_v not_o just_o charge_v they_o with_o this_o opinion_n because_o he_o be_v not_o inform_v of_o any_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v but_o only_o of_o their_o practice_n and_o this_o practice_n be_v no_o sufficient_a proof_n that_o they_o hold_v this_o opinion_n that_o his_o information_n reach_v no_o further_a than_o their_o practice_n appear_v out_o of_o his_o own_o word_n i_o have_v hear_v say_v he_o haeres_fw-la 78._o another_o thing_n with_o great_a astonishment_n that_o some_o be_v mad_o affect_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n endeavour_v to_o bring_v she_o in_o in_o god_n place_n be_v mad_a and_o beside_o themselves_o for_o they_o report_v that_o certain_a woman_n in_o arabia_n have_v devise_v this_o vanity_n to_o have_v meeting_n and_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n the_o same_o practice_n he_o set_v down_o haeres_fw-la 79._o but_o that_o he_o be_v inform_v of_o any_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v he_o have_v not_o a_o word_n or_o syllable_n to_o any_o such_o purpose_n and_o yet_o if_o he_o have_v be_v inform_v of_o any_o here_o have_v be_v the_o place_n to_o set_v it_o down_o which_o certain_o write_v his_o book_n rather_o of_o heretical_a opinion_n than_o practice_n he_o will_v not_o have_v omit_v to_o do_v if_o there_o have_v be_v occasion_n his_o silence_n therefore_o be_v a_o sufficient_a argument_n that_o he_o be_v not_o inform_v of_o any_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v now_o that_o their_o practice_n be_v no_o assurance_n that_o they_o hold_v this_o opinion_n it_o be_v manifest_a because_o they_o may_v ground_v it_o not_o upon_o this_o opinion_n that_o she_o be_v god_n but_o upon_o another_o as_o false_a though_o not_o altogether_o so_o impious_a that_o the_o worship_n of_o oblation_n be_v not_o proper_a to_o god_n alone_o and_o therefore_o though_o epiphanius_n may_v think_v or_o fear_v that_o possible_o they_o may_v ground_v their_o practice_n upon_o that_o other_o impious_a opinion_n and_o therefore_o out_o of_o abundant_a caution_n confute_v that_o also_o as_o he_o do_v oblique_o and_o in_o a_o word_n and_o once_o only_o in_o all_o his_o long_a discourse_n by_o tell_v they_o that_o our_o saviour_n call_v her_o woman_n yet_o he_o have_v no_o