Reformation But you may satisfie your self fully in their Books As for our Religion It was where it had been above a thousand years in the Holy Scripture And suppose what is utterly false that soon after its being written all Christian Churches had been so corrupted as to own fifteen hundred years together those Errors which now are amongst you yet still the Scripture had been the same as much to be obeyed and followed as if it had always been so 2 King 22. When Josiah had sound the Book of the Law he did not fling it by because it had been hid and neglected during the reign of Manasseh and Amon his Fathers but he caused it to be read before all the people Ibid. 23. that they might observe what was conteined in it So now we have the Holy Scriptures read and preached to us we must not reject them to follow the Customs of some of our Fore-Fathers in whose time they were hid and disregarded for they are as much the Rule of Faith as if they had never been disown'd But I say farther that our Religion was in those Churches in the East and South which never own'd Popery and even amongst you our Religion was professed you believed all along those three Creeds which you and we do still retein which contein the Articles of our Faith but not the new additions which are particular to Rome The Popes universal Supremacy and his Infallibility Transubstantiation Worshipping of Images Purgatory Indulgences c. These are neither in Scripture nor in the first Councils nor in the Writings of the Antient Fathers not so much as in your Creeds an evident mark of their novelty but in the late Councils and Constitutions of the Popes We confess indeed that there is an universal Church out of which there is no salvation according to that known saying of S. Cyprian Deum non potest c. He can be none of Gods children who is not a son of the Church But that Church is the Christian not the Roman Church and to know which is the Christian Church or which is the purest of Christian Churches for they are all Christian in some measure that own Christ we must not consult humane Histories for they cannot inform us of that and if they could we must not build our faith upon mens report De Sacra l. 2. c. 21. Bellarmin saith of humane Histories Faciunt tantum bumanam fidem cui falsam subesse potest that they only beget a human faith which may be erroneous Wherefore in the Controversie betwixt us which is the purest Church we must not search old Records and Chronicles to see which was the oldest the most visible or the most large and flourishing Church that is not the Question and if it were still human Histories cannot be the ground of a Christian Faith but we must examin which agrees best with Holy Scripture which we all acknowledge to be the Word of God for no doubt the true Church wherein Salvation may be had is that which holds that Doctrin which God himself hath reveled to Mankind whatever her condition may have been in times past P. There may be something considerable in what you say but you Heretics have strange cunnings and subtilties to justifie your Opinions and yet still for all you have said you are no better than Rebels against your spiritual Sovereign you are Schismatics undutiful Children that have forsaken your Mother the Church The true and only Church wherein Salvation is to be obtein'd guided and governed by the Vicar of Christ upon earth our holy Father the Pope Vna est tantum Ecclesia sub regimine unius Christi in terris Vicarii Romani Pontificis Bellar. de Eccl. l 3. c. 2. But pray do not make such a tedious Discourse as you have just now G. Good Sir sometimes short Questions cannot be answered in few words I could propose one to you much like that as you put to me which I believe would take a great deal of your time to answer that is Where your particular Religion your sacrificing of the real and corporal body and bloud of Christ for the sins of the living and the dead your Worshipping Images and Saints and making them your Intercessors your Purgatory Indulgences c. Where was all that in the time of Christ and his Apostles Whereabout can it be found in Scripture or in the antient Creeds or in the four first General Councils or in the three or four first Centuries But I will not put you to so long and impossible a Task As for our forsaking the Communion of the Church of Rome we were absolutely bound and in a manner forc'd to do it because of the many errors which had crept and been brought into it by the Ignorance Pride Avarice and Ambition of the late Popes of Rome and their Partizans and which were confirm'd by your Church and defended with that violence that it was death to any man to speak in the least against them Now you know 't is a Rule agreed on of all sides that he is not guilty of Schism that separates but he that gives a just cause of Separation wherfore I retort the charge upon you of being Schismatics except you can prove by the Word of God those Doctrins of yours we have rejected to be Divine and Orthodox for we have left your Church upon this account that you had perverted the truth of God and added many false opinions to it which ye impos'd upon the people as if they had been Articles of Faith And we find it in Scripture Ro. 16.17 Mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the Doctrin which ye have learned and avoid them 't is not said except it be the Church of Rome And in another place Though we or an angel from heaven preach unto you beyond or over and above in the Greec 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the vulgar praeterquam quod what we have preached Gal. 1.8 let him be accursed the Pope himself you see is not excepted Again we have left the Communion of your Church because it was Schismatic itself in that it had forsaken the Doctrin taught and believed in the Primitive Church We have come out of Rome to return into the more antient and universal Church We have left the Pope to follow Christ and his Apostles and we have forsaken you no farther than you had forsaken the truth The antient Creeds the first Councils many good and Fundamental Doctrins we hold together in these we hold Communion with you We reject your Communion only in those new Doctrins which ye have superadded to the antient and divine Faith of Christians And so likewise we rebel not against the Pope only we set God above him I 'll still acknowledge him to be a Bishop and the Patriarch of the West and perhaps I had been civil enough never to have disputed his Infallibility and spiritual Sovereignty though I find nothing
for it in Scripture had I not found that he hath really erred and that very grosly whence I infer that therefore his Infallibility and supreme Authority are Chimeras mere devices of his own brain the which I am in no wise bound to obey being they pervert and oppose the plainest truths in the New Testament As that Christ is now in heaven by his bodily presence and not on the Altars as it is in the Creed he is ascended into heaven from whence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead and in Acts 3.20 Whom the heavens must contain until the restitution of all things That we are forgiven and cleansed by the death and merits of Christ not by Purgatory and Indulgences 1 Job 1.7 And the bloud of Jesus Christ cleanseth us from all sins ibid. 2.2 He is the propitiation for our sins and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world That the offering of himself on the Cross hath fully satisfied for sin and that his sacrifice needs not be renewed daily and be offered corporally in the Mass for the sins of the living and the dead as you teach and do Heb. 9.26 But now once in the end of the world he hath appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself c. In those things that are evidently against the Word of God we are resolv'd to follow Scripture rather than the head of your Church and we 'll rather for ever break with him than to suffer him to put out our eyes that so he may guide us at his own pleasure P. Yea those be the fruits of translating the Bible and performing Divine Service in the vulgar Tongues every one of you can find fault with the Doctrins and Constitutions of the Church and talk Scripture from morning to night we see among your selves what Disorders it hath caused If your Clergy had been wise enough to have still retein'd the Latin Tongue in all their Ministrations the people could have dislik'd and censur'd nothing 't was sufficient for them to have light enough to follow their guides more submission and obedience with less knowledge had done better Bellar. de Verbo Dei l. 2. c. 15. That hath been the wisdom of our Church to keep the Scripture and the publick prayers of our Church out of the peoples reach by forbidding them to be read in any vulgar tongue Catholica Ecclesia prohibet ne in publico communi usu Ecclesiae Scripturae legantur vel canentur vulgaribus linguis ut in Concilio Tridentino SS 22. Can. 9. Sed contenti sumus tribus illis linguis quas Dominus titulo crucis suae honoravit G. Because some men stumble and fall at noon-day must the Sun be charged with a fault that proceeds from their heedlesness and would it become one to say that therefore 't is safer to grope in the dark because then people tread more warily Or must therefore mens eyes be put out because then they shall be willing to be led and to follow their guides S. Peter saith that the unstable and unlearned in his time wrested some difficult things written by Saint Paul and other Scriptures to their own destruction Yet he doth not say therefore let not the common people read them but rather dedicates his Epistle to all those that were partakers of the Christian Faith and exhorts them to grow in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ ibid. v. 18. S. Paul reckons Idolatry Heresies and Schisms among the fruits of the flesh Gal. 5.20 but doth not any where impute them to the reading of Holy Scripture and it hath been observ'd that the perversness of men of great Learning hath been the cause of Heresies and not the mistakes or ignorance of ordinary people in reading the Bible However we have a whole Chapter in the New Testament against the speaking in an unknown tongue as you do in all your Churches 1 Cor. 15.11 If I know not the meaning of the voice I shall be unto him that speaketh a Barbarian and he that speaketh shall be a Barbarian unto me that 's the relation betwixt your Priests and your people they are Barbarians one to another the whole Chapter is to that purpose and would be too long to be transcrib'd But if Scripture had been silent in this one would think that common Reason would have kept men from a practice so absurd and ridiculous that a man should present a petition and know not what he asks and be taught his duty by words he doth not understand is a strange and incredible thing which Reason alone confutes most strongly And yet for all this I do hugely commend the wisdom of your Church in this particular for that hath maintain'd the Popes Religion and Credit for some hundreds of years the understanding of Mass and Scripture hath already prov'd fatal to his authority and should once the rest of his flock be able to compare both together 't is to be fear'd he that hath rewarded many of his friends with the gift of titular Bishopricks might come to be himself a titular Bishop P. I see you value an universal Council as little as you do Bellarmin alone and have as many things to object against it I wonder how you dare in any wise oppose the authority of such an Assembly and think your Judgment is to be prefer'd to theirs G. And I wonder how you can call the Council of Trent universal when there was none in it of the Clergy of the Reformed Churches which are almost as large and populous here in the West as those of the Roman Religion But especially because none of the Christians of Aethiopia nor of those that are subject to the Patriarchs of Antioch and Constantinople whose Jurisdiction is of a far larger extent than that of the Bishop of Rome were present at it Pray did you never hear that a great Company of Arrians met once together and confirmed their Errors and cursed all those that would not embrace it and call'd themselves an Universal Council just so did that Company of Papists that met at Trent But had they been twice as many more you should not wonder how I dare oppose them but rather consider whether what I say be rational or no and whether what you call my private judgment be not rather the express words of Scripture But pray proceed and tell me what your Church thinks of Images and Saints for we are told that you worship them P. Yes Bellar. de San. beat l. 1. c. 19. and that very devoutly and to our great advantage by making religious Invocations to them whether they be men or angels Sancti sive angeli sive homines pie atque utiliter invocantur G. Now I wonder too how you dare do that for I find that when Cornelius would have worshipped S. Peter the holy Apostle took him up saying Acts 10.26 that he himself was a man also And that when S. John
with her Altars and Images down with her Rags and Reliques they be but Jezabels fragments let them be used as Jezabel was used Help Royal Sovereign to throw her down help to throw her down more and more ye that are of the Honourable Court of Parliament Every one that loves the Lord Jesus Christ help to throw her down never let us halt as we have done betwixt God and Baal 'T is probable that had Royal Sovereign helpt to pull down Jezabel you had not pulled him down with her being he proved refractory to the Church you judged it requisite in ordine ad spiritualia to make him feel that Power of yours he would not acknowledge Nay when there were some hopes of an Accommodation Christopher Love who died a Martyr for your Kirk was so afraid the Holy War should be ended and Christ not set upon his Throne you know what that means that Preaching at Vxbridge before the Commissioners he made use of another mans words as he said to exhort them to go on in fighting for God 'T is the Sword saith he not Disputes nor Treaties must end this Controversie therefore turn your Plowghshears into Swords to fight the Lords Battels to avenge the Bloud of Saints which hath been spilt Cursed is he that doth the work of the Lord negligently and cursed is he that keepeth back his Sword from Bloud Jer. 48.10 Some silly Cavaliers thought indeed that the War betwixt the King and Parliament was about matters of Priviledges but S. Marshall told them soundly of their simplicity in a Sermon before the Parliament and Mayor and Aldermen S Marshal 1643. p. 21. Noble and resolute Commanders fight the Battels of the Lord Jesus Christ All Kingdoms except the Malignants in England do now see that the question here is Whether Christ or Antichrist shall be Lord or King Go on therefore couragiously you can never venture your Bloud in such a Quarrel Christ shed his Bloud to save you from Hell venture yours to set him up upon his Throne So Jos Boden told the Kentish Committee pag. 11. Jos Boden 1644. That they were fighting for the Lamb against the Beast And at the 13 pag. Besides their wondring after and worshipping the Beast Rev. 13.4 Have they not gathered together in Arms and Armies against the Lord and against his Christ belike they did not give that name to their Parliament Priviledges Nay are they not daily more and more mad and desperate in their mischief conceived against the Church Do they not daily beat up their Alarms and bid defiance to the people of the most High I would have every Christian stand upon his reputation and not discover pusillanimity after such proud Challengings What hath Antichrist done for them that they dare be so bold And what hath not Christ done for us that we should now in these days of daring be dastardly hen-hearted and effeminate This Sermon was called An Alarm beat up in Sion to War against Babylon and it well deserves to be transcribed but that it is too long In all these you see we hear of nothing but the Whore the Beast Babylon and Antichrist which were to be destroyed not one word of any Civil matters or differences if there was any it was forgotten your Church-Champions were so intent upon the Lords Work and it prospered so well in their hands that they could think of nothing else Joh. Bond 1644. p. 59. As Sampson with the Philistines saith one of the Saints so let us die with Babylon if we cannot out-live Antichrist and the Enemies of Reformation let us adventure our selves to death in the Cause yea let us take hold of the Pillars of the Church of Dagon of the Temple of Antichrist and say Now let me die with Antichrist Rome and Babylon The War was so wholly and intirely upon Gods account as you said that though betwixt the Inhabitants of the same Kingdom yet you would not have it to be a Civil War It is not a Kingdom divided against it self J. Arrowsmith 1643. p. 69. saith Mr. Arrowsmith to the Parliament but one Kingdom against another the Kingdom of Christ divided against that of Antichrist and this Antichristian Kingdom will rage as much as they can to their power to shed Bloud but the Lord hath them in this Chain and hath sent forth his host against them They were not the Parliaments Forces but the Host of the Lord sent against Antichrist Therefore they were so earnestly exhorted never to shrink but joyfully to lose their very lives in so good a cause Mr. Midhope at the Funeral of Colonel Gold exhorted the Militia thus St. Midh 1644. p. 24. Noble Commanders be active for Christ ye cannot do or suffer too much in his Cause Lay out your Time Strength Parts your All for Christ fear no loss here ye cannot drive a more gainful Trade Could any thing more have been said to the blessed Martyrs Or did ever the Pope recommend his Croisadoes more highly What hath been said proves it to the full that you valued your intended Reformation more than Christianity it self which 't is no thanks to you if it was not quite destroyed by these most nefarious and unchristian actings Now two Witnesses more will make it altogether unquestionable that from the beginning to the end that cursed War was raised and fomented to maintain your new-fashioned Religion and to bring about your Reformation Mr. Cheynell told the Parliament F. Cheynel 1646. p. 32. Consider the cries and out-cries of the Godly Party of this Kingdom for a Reformation they speak plain and tell you that they have fasted prayed and wept for a Reformation they have exhausted their Treasures many of them ventured their Lives lost their Limbs their Bloud their Friends for a Reformation you have promised us a Reformation N. B. we have paid for a Reformation you are therefore indebted to us of a Reformation we are bound to challenge such a Reformation as will quit cost and answer the price we have paid and the pains we have bestowed c. And Mr. Jenisson a Scotch-man in a Sermon at New-castle Rob. Jen. 1648. p. 29. The late designs of the Popish and Malignant Party tending to the utter subversion of our Religion and of our Liberties occasioned the National Covenant between England and Scotland and the joining in Arms for the defence of their Religion N. B. Now I hope it is clear enough that it was you chiefly if not alone that raised and fomented that execrably Holy War to establish your projected Religion and Discipline And if you dare say to the contrary you must give the lye to your own Fellow-labourers for you see I have it from them So I humbly conceive that you and I have made it appear that you are not only not subject to Kings and Princes but ever in some sort their Superiours and that when you judge Religion concerned you will lose the bonds of
the Lord Mr. Tesdale in the same manner p. 15. Honourable Patriots Christ is gone forth with his triumphing Army conquering and to conquer and if you want Arms or Money or Horse for their accommodation God is the great Landlord of Heaven and Earth Art thou then Gods Tenant and dost thou owe him Knight-service and Plough-service and doth he want thy Horse and shall he not have it c. Yea verily it was so meritorious a thing to advance the interest of the holy Covenanteers that that was call'd to help the Lord and people were to do the utmost for it and then an hundred-fold here and eternal life besides was the least as they could have for a recompence Mr. Bond after a long Exhortation to pull down Antichrist Joh. Bond 1644. p. 60. and to do for the Lord in the close of all saith I will recommend unto you these two especial promises Mat. 19.29 Every one that hath forsaken Houses or Brethren c. and Mar. 8.35 Whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the Gospels the same shall find it O that they were written over the doors of the Houses of Parliament If these places do deceive an active Believer at last then let it be written upon my Grave Here lieth that Minister that was mistaken in his God and Gospel Was not the acting for the Cause highly meritorious when the greatest of rewards were to be got by it Wherein then lieth the difference Only in this That among you 't is rebelling against the King and the Church but with us 't is good works only that merit Pr. Well but then good works consist for the most part in being kind to the Fryars those good souls who have vowed forsooth to follow the counsels of perfection poverty chastity and blind obedience and yet preach themselves more than Jesus Christ and in begging about make people believe that the best service they can do to God is to do them good whereas you see by your own Citations that what our Ministers did was out of Zeal for Gods Cause to advance his Honour and not their own Profit Pa. Yea that was a piece of deceit and craftiness whereby they out did the Fryars themselves to call their own Gods interest to give specious names to their own devices as if God and Religion had been much concern'd in the establishing of them and to make the world believe that to pull down the Church was to pull down Antichrist and to set them up was to set up Christ in his Throne yet terminis terminatibus they would speak it out too that they and their followers were to be used kindly and that it was the duty and interest of the whole Nation to do good to the Saints and to make as much of them as they could I confess you never oblig'd your selves to obey the Evangelick counsels but you went as near to it as any bad Copy can resemble a good Original for you vow'd to spend your Lives and Estates upon the work in hand that was poverty to the height You vow'd to reform the Church according to the pattern of the best reformed Churches to extirpate Superstition and Heresie and to preserve the Rights and Priviledges of the Parliament and the Liberties of the Kingdoms All which I am sure was blind obedience for not one of an hundred as took the Covenant understood what these things meant and were therefore to follow you blindfold And if in stead of continency you 'll give me leave to put obstinacy we have found the three Monachal vows in the Covenant for you swore never to suffer your selves directly or indirectly by whatsoever combination perswasion or terrour to be divided or withdrawn from your blessed Vnion or Conjunction as you call'd it but zealously and constantly to continue therein all the days of your lives against all opposition whatsoever And accordingly that renowned Champion of yours who died a Martyr for the Covenant said on the Scaffold Mr. Loves Case 1651. p. 22 I did oppose in my place and calling the Forces of the late King and were he alive again and should I live longer the Cause being as then it was I should oppose him longer The good man would rather venture Damnation than break the Covenant by repenting of his Rebellion against his Sovereign so binding was that Holy League which oblig'd him to be thus ostinate But perhaps you won't believe what I have said that you made the people believe it was a most meritorious thing to be kind to you and that you preacht your selves as much as ever the Fryars did if not at least believe these precious men Mr. Dury having observ'd out of his Text Isai 52.11 that God hath vessels belonging to him tells the House of Commons Dury p. 14 God hath intrusted some with those his Vessels and charged them with the care of them to look to them to bear them up c. and then having extol'd the Covenant up to the Skies he saith pag. 24. This is a new thing in the Christian Church there is a special engagement lying upon us all more than upon other men to bear every one our own vessels to bear the vessels of each other and to bear jointly the Church and Cause of God in our hearts hands and shoulders In all the World there is not a Magistracy so eminently entrusted with such a charge over a people so nearly united unto God as you and the Parliament of Scotland are Mr. Burroughs likewise told the Parliament It hath been the honour of some of you to receive and countenance godly Ministers who suffered under the Tyranny of Prelates Jer. Burr 1645. p. 8. this Christ hath owed you for and we hope it shall be remembred for good to you and yours let not your hearts be changed towards these men And pag. 45. My Lords you are advanced to high power and honour in a Kingdom where Christ hath as many Saints I had almost said as in the World besides he expects you should use them kindly Th. Good 1645. p. 5. and 6. And Mr. Goodwin to the House of Commons observes out of his Text Psal 105.14 Here is the nearness and dearness of the Saints to God they are dearer to him than Kings and States simply considered and here is the danger of Kings and States to deal with his Saints otherwise than well And then towards the latter end pag. 52. and 53. It is not the having Saints and multitudes of Saints but the using them kindly that is the interest of a Nation The Saints of England are the interest of England look to and keep this your interest namely maintain and preserve the Saints among you and make provisions for them as you would preserve this Kingdom And then he repeats it again p. 54. The Saints of England are the interest of England write this upon your walls and have it in your eyes in all your Consultations and have respect