in this course When nothing would do but they must come to Excommunication how wisely did they govern the Brethren to bring them to declare their consent * 2 Cor. 10.6 obedientially to their Elders for they deny the Government to be Democratical nor will I own the Fraternity to be the first subject of the Keys In the beginning it was not so as our Lord said in another case Mat. 19.8 and to the beginning we must go and your * Primit Government of Church p. 147. Thorndike speaks excellently to this why the Congregation ought to be concern'd in this Now when all were agreed how dreadful was the sentence what pale faces how many tears did it cause in the Congregation a solemn sight to behold the Church putting the person out of the Congregation Terrible as an army of banners Cant. 6 1◠I have often thought of the Text since After this how excellently did the Church walk towards an Excommunicate person to bring to Repentance And what rare effects have I known of this Ordinance without any Writs de Excommunicato capiendo alas these could never effect what I have known to the humbling of such a person And now Sir do you think that we who have seen these things can join with your Church where this Ordinance so majestical so terrible is so horribly profaned I pray Sir pardon me though I stand off from it But I pray Sir why do your Bishops excommunicate those who were never of your Church why do they not Excommunicate the French or Dutch True they live under your Laws but your Law is they must be admitted by the Cross and being Infants could not help it As to your Discourse about particular Congregations and Diocesan Churches it is not my purpose to meddle with it only I desire you to tell me why a Pastor of a single Congregation may not be as fit to govern that Congregation as your single Bishop to govern a thousand Congregations as it is with your Church where did the Apostles ordain but one single Pastor to a Church we have eight Churches recorded in the Epistles and the Acts but we read in them all several Elders to carry on Church-work As for Timothy and Titus being Bishops in our controverted sense enough hath been said about them Strange that we should have twelve Apostles beside Paul and Barnabas many Elders and several Evangelists and but two Bishops who were Evangelists too recorded in holy Writ to be the pattern for the succeeding Bishops when where and how those two were made Bishops we cannot find And for the large Diocesses so large that 't is impossible for a Bishop to perform the Duties the Lord requires of a Pastor to one quarter of the Diocess Pag. 203 The Petitioners for Reformation in King James's reign tell his Majesty That in Augustine's time there were in one Province under Carthage of the Catholick and Donatist Bishops above nine hundred Of the Catholicks part there were present 286 and absent 120 by reason of sickness and old age Episcopal Churches void 60 in all 466. Of the Donatists there were present 279 absent 120 Churches void 60 in all 459. These come near the matter make him but Episcopus praeses and as to Officers and Churches I may come to agree with you leaving my brethren to their judgments Several other things I took notice of in your Book that may easily be answered as the perplexing scruples you mention pag. 384 385. If we must baptize only by the Parents right that men must run into No none at all But Sir did you not forget your self very much p. 393. when you tell us the differences between the Popish Ceremonies and your Ceremonies viz. That yours are appointed only for decency and order Sir do not your Preface to your Ceremonies tell us another story viz. of a significacy in them to put us in mind of our duty 2. Of an aptness in them to stir up our dull minds to our duty Here is some efficacy in them to help to the performance of duty stirring up dull minds these do not much differ from the efficacy you say the Papists give to theirs for the purging away some sorts of sins I think both alike As for your French Letters who told le Moyne what he writes pag. 404. That we believe that a man cannot be saved in the Church of England I never heard such a word from any Dissenter nor ever had I such a thought Certainly none of our Bishops would write such a line to him So that this must be the figment of a French mans brain which we abhor for the story he writes p. 409. of a Nonconformist that he heard preach I could tell him a story of one of our late Bishops ten times worse but the Press shall not know it but you shall Sir I have given you a few of my thoughts reading over your Book while my Papers were in the Press which have lain by me several years and must tell you I am not yet satisfied with the title of your Book viz. the Vnreasonableness of Separation c. To your Prayer in the end of your Preface I heartily say Amen Amen SIR I am your Servant to love and honour You G. F. THE QUESTIONS Between the CONFORMIST AND Nonconformist Truly stated and briefly discussed IT was not without the ordering of Divine Providence that the day which the Imitators of the Heathens 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 did consecrate to their St. Bartholomew should be the day on which the blood of so many thousand Protestants was poured out in France and the day also on which so many hundreds of Gospel-Ministers to whom Christ had given both will and skill for his work success in his work were turned out of his work in England The crime both there and here which they found was the same the Princes found against Daniel in the Law of his God A day of gladness it was to many but not to all upon the same ground One Conformist and a man of note tells a Captain under his Majesty since his Return that he was glad so many Ministers refused to conform the Captain would know his reason he gives it thus Had all Ministers conformed people would have thought there was nothing in Religion only a thing to talk of in the Pulpit and serve a State-design for these Ministers will turn any way the State turn But by their giving up their livings and exposing themselves and families to outward evils rather than they would conform to things imposed not agreeable as they apprehended to the Gospel they preached they have convinced men there is reality in Religion and given a check to Atheism This was the substance and to be sure he was not more glad than I was when the Captain told me his Discourse How zealous yet some have been to bring us over to Conformity the many Books published for it and against us have declared Some of
be holding up of the hand in token of his owning the Church-Covenant c. Now Sir let me suppose as you do suppose that the Pastors of the Independent Churches should baptize several persons but never admit them into their Churches by this ceremony of holding up the hand let them baptize many thousands and these thousands chuse other Pastors who are rightly qualified and ordained by Prayer Fasting and Imposition of hands of the Eldership The Independents cannot charge these Churches with schism and separation from their Churches for they never admitted them by that ceremony and rite of Admission of holding up the hand into their Churches Now Sir apply it for about twenty years there was publick Baptism administred but not by your Liturgy much less with the Cross How many thousands do you think in the space of so many years may be baptized none of these were ever admitted into your Church by those words VVe receive this child c. and sign him with the sign of the cross But of many such do our Congregations consist who were never your members why then do you call them separatists from you Besides Sir your Liturgy admits of private Baptism and then no such admission by the Cross and abundance have been thus baptized without it to my knowledg For my own particular I cannot tell whither I was so admitted my Parents never told me so and for my godly Father I am sure he hated humane inventions in the Worship of God I was born they told me in winter time extream for cold the house half a mile from Church and I being their only Son at that time it 's a question whether they would carry me forth in such an extream cold season so far As for the Church-Register that nor any other that ever I saw specifies nothing of my being admitted into your Church by the Cross but only of my being baptized but that say you and truly is into the Catholick Church No Registers then recording who were so admitted it will be hard matter for these who are ancient to prove their admission into your Church and if we were not I know not how we can now be admitted For this Rite of Admission is used only at Baptism unless we will yield to be Rebaptized and so to be admitted by the Cross this you will not admit no more than we We read of the Apostles admitting of many believers God added to the Church Act. 2. ult but never that they used this rite of admission the sign of the Cross only this is our happiness we are more wife more holy greater lovers of Christ than ever the Apostles were though we profess we are built upon the foundation of Apostles and Prophets Ephes 2.20 that their examples are too low for us Besides Sir is it not meet that when children come to years of discretion they should then be called before the Church to declare whether they own their Baptismal Covenant and also their admission into the Church they are reputed members of as you say the Independents require their Children to own the Church-Covenant let them now be members of the Church by their own consent Truly Sir if it come to that since we read what your Canons say of the Cross and how it is abused in Popery and how strange this is to the Apostolical admission we should not like it But are not children members of the same Churches with their Parents though we think so yet this is nothing to the practise of your Church For as in your administration of Baptism the Parental Covenant Abraham and his seed which is the ground of the Administration is wholly omitted so the Parent he must stand by as if he were a Heathen the business is only with the God fathers and Godmothers an invention of Higinus Bishop of Rome about 144 years after Christ who first added these to Baptism a person of no great worth of whom it is said Nihil praclari de gubernatione factis ejus commemorari potest So much cause have I to beg pardon for my defects in the education of my own Children that I would not be Sponsor for the child of the best friend I have in England But however this is not it but the sign of the Cross with such words that makes the admission into your Church 2. Q. But if there be a Separation or Schism the question is who is the cause of it A. Schism must needs be theirs whose the cause of it is saith Bishop Land in which you justifie him Ration Account p. 324 325. I humbly conceive that whoever imposes other terms of Communion than Christ hath imposed he or they are the cause of the schism We do not say you necessarily separate from all Churches that have errors or corruptions in them supposing those errors and corruptions be not imposed on us as conditions of communion Ibid. p. 332. I pray do not think that we suppose you impose such gross things upon us as Rome imposed on you No Sir we bless God for that great advance which was made by our first Reformers But whereas you say you retain only such innocent Ceremonies which were in use before the Papal power grew to that height I pray first are you sure that All the Churches did use them 2. Did they use all that are imposed on us I know they used others but did they use to tye up their Ministers to such syllables in prayer or else must not pray Did they kneel at the Lords Supper we know the contrary c. 3. Did they impose these as conditions of Communion But grant there were such Ceremonies and other things as now imposed upon us I will say of them Downh de Antichristo p. 151 what Bishop Downham saith of the opinions and traditions differing from the holy Scriptures which the Pontificians say were received of the Fathers they are to be referred to that Apostasie the Apostle foretold 2 Thes 2.3 when he said the mystery of iniquity already worketh v. 7. And I pray Sir since the examples and practises of those Churches are made so much use of against us let me give you my thoughts in a similitude of your own In your Epistle to your Rational Account c. dedicated to the King you tell his Majesty that the Church of England in the late confusions suffered an Eclipse but since his Majesties Restauration she hath recovered her luster c. Sir we observe when the Sun riseth it doth not suddenly go into an Eclipse but gradually so that common people do not mind it until the light of it be sensibly obscured so nor doth it come out of its Eclipse suddenly at once but gradually but it will not cease its motion till it appears in its glory It is the same with the Gospel-Church it did not presently suddenly fall into that dark Eclipse which it suffered under the Antichristian Papal power but it got into it by degrees the Churches not
discerning it the mystery of iniquity wrought it is no fancy of mine but the Apostles express words The subtil serpent he wrought among the Churches under fair pretences in the second Century some addition made to Worship and Government of the Church in the third Century more in the fourth Century more so increased the Eclipse still under fair reasons till the Serpent had got the man of sin into his Throne and the Prediction fulfilled So hath the Churches coming out of the Eclipse been but gradual in Doctrine Government Worship by our worthy Reformers but as the evil spirit deceived then by Gods permission to bring about the Prophesie so the Spirit of Christ in the hearts of our first Reformers wrought powerfully and so doth the same Spirit still work and will work till the Church be quite out of her Eclipse and comes to be satisfied with the Soveraignty and Wisdom of Christ declared in the simplicity of the Gospel let men call it schism fanaticism or what they please But Sir you tell us of Mr. Ball Mr. Hildersham Mr. Giffard c. worthy men I grant they were so and honour them much and Nonconformists who condemned Separation from your Church and no more was imposed than in their time and this takes up a great part of your Book Sir while some excellent men at home conformed but groaned under the burden as I remember Mr. John Rogers of Dedham an eminent Saint though he did conform I never saw him wear a Surplice nor heard him use but a few prayers and those I think he said Memoriter not read them but this he would do in his Preaching draw his finger about his throat and say Let them take me and hang me up so they will but remove these stumbling-blocks out of the Church How many thousands of choice Christians plucked up their stakes here forsook their dear friends and native Country shut up themselves in Ships to whom a prison for the time had been more elegible went remote into a howling Wilderness there underwent great hardships water was their common drink and glad if they might have had but that which they had given at their doors here many of them and all this suffering was to avoid your Impositions and that they might dwell in the House of God and enjoy all things therein according to his own appointment But what cared your Church for this let Gods people groan at home suffer abroad they shall do it rather than your Church will part with a few trifles as your own Mr. Carre calls the ceremonies Sir is this the spirit of the true Spouse of Christ But as I said the same Spirit will work which acted those holy men till the Church be totally out of her Eclipse what ever those worthy men you mention have said But to speak more close I deny that the state of your Church now is the same it was then when these worthy men condemned Separation from it For 1. There are many thousands now in England who were never admitted into your Church were never members of it then they could not condemn these as Separatists from it This I have proved before from your Interpretation of the sign of the Cross It was not so in their time 2 The Liturgy and the Homilies were then brought in out of necessity because of the want of gifts now it is imposed in scorn and opposition of gifts By what some of your Arch-deacons have spoken in your Courts and others we can conclude no other than it was composed to bring over the Papists to your Church and for several years the Papists did frequent your Divine Service but now it was imposed with such words as in my next that it was made an engine to turn Protestants out of your Church A Member of that Parliament that made the Act for Vniformity visiting his Sister a Lady who told it me related to her what they were about she disliked their Act and told him I see then you are laying a snare in the gate Ay said he if we can find any way to catch the Rogues we will have them 3. Then they were not required to assent and consent c. but now it is imposed with these terms and I am confident that divers who have subscribed with these terms do but lye 4. 'T is true we have the same 39 Articles that was before and those Articles were assented to and assent required in that Church Rational Account p. 54 55. But now you have told the world that Bishop Bramhall gives the sense of the Church of England thus viz. She does not define any of these Questions as necessary to be believed c. Neither do we look upon them as Essentials of saving faith c. Neither do we oblige any man to believe them but only not to contradict them And this is the opinion of the Grandees in this your Church this would have been abhor'd before 5. As those 39 Articles were believed by that Clergy so they did defend them and Preached them but this Clergy can both print and preach against them I mean the great and sound Doctrines in them I do not say all of them I put the question to one of your Clergy and asked him in earnest what he thought of this Clergy as to the Doctrine of the Church of England contained in these Articles he answered me Divide them into three parts he thought two of the three were fallen from it 6. In that Church there were abundance of godly plain-hearted Ministers whose Religion was not confined to a Pulpit but walked among their people as became Ministers seeking the good of their souls I deny not but God hath some such now but for the generality of them I say nothing my self only I can tell you what others have said A learned and pious Divine so far a friend to Conformity that I doubt not but he hath subscribed he told me Though your Church would give him a Living he would not take it because he would not have such an occasion to bring him among your Clergy And discoursing with another of your Clergy whom for learning wit and piety I do honour about Mr. A's Book and his Dialect which you call uncomely writing said he Truly we have such a frothy vain Clergy gone off from that solidity and gravity that become Divine things that if Books come not out in this dress they will but scorn them but in that Book besides wit there is good matter Pridentem dicere verum c. This was his sense of Mr. A's Book But. Sir if such as these be thrust upon us must we own them for our Ministers What Sir will you deny the peoples power of Election which the Papists grant the people had till Charles the Great or till Lewis his Son about 830 years See I pray Pamelius his Annotations upon these words of Cyprian Epist 68. Quando ipsa plebs maxime habeat potestatem vel eligendi dignos
sacerdotes vel indignos recusandi How could a man write plainer for the peoples power of Election But our Protestants tell us that only from the time of Frederick the second who died Ann. 1250 or there about were the people excluded from the power of chusing Pastors and it was the deed of Gregory the ninth as Krantzius reporteth 7. That Church did believe and prove the Pope c. to be the Antichrist Rome-christian to be the Whore Apoc. 17. thus the Bishops and our Professors of Divinity c. but I can meet but with very few of this Church of that opinion Dr. Hammond the Oracle of this new Edition of the Clergy cannot find him in the 2 Thes 2. nor in Apoc. 17. the Pope is an honest man with him Bishop Bramhall tells us Our contest is not with the Church of Rome but the Court of Rome I find that you have declared 1. That the Church of Rome is a true Church 2. That they retain the fundamentals of Religion 3. That salsation is to be had in the Church of Rome Lay all together here is a fair Bridg laid to go over to Rome To say that God hath his people under the Jurisdiction of Rome is one thing Apoc. 18.4 but to say the Church of Rome is a true Church is another thing a Wife and a Whore differ 8. In that Church Re-ordination to the same office was never heard of but exploded as it is in all Churches else but in this Church it is imposed 9. There was no Oath taken nor Covenant made with the great God to reform the House of God in Doctrine Worship and Discipline according to the word of God this ought to be though the Covenant had not been made had the things imposed been according to the Word of God this Covenant had bound us to them that Covenant will not be beaten out of the hearts of them who know God and fear an Oath what ever other persons make of it the least then men can do is to abstain from those things which were once cast out as being unconformable to the word of God and shall those people have no Ordinances for fear of a separation 10. In that Church Quakers were not known but under this Church they swarm that raze the foundation and destroy all Gospel-ordinances And many people being offenced with your imposition and disgusted with your Clergy lay in great danger of being carried away with them and I doubt not abundance had gone but that by our Preaching and administring all Ordinances they have been kept close to Gospel truths Gospel-ordinances and Gospel-ministry The Quakers and Papists are not so hated by your Clergy as we are From all which I conclude the Cause is not the same and had Mr. Ball Mr. Hildersham c. been living in our days they would I doubt not have done as we do But then we are charged with bringing in of Popery and this takes up several leafs of your Preface Heylin one of yours tells us indeed I perswade my self Geograp in Quarto Edit pag 470. had the Reformed party abroad continued an allowable correspondence in some circumstances with the Romish Church as the Church of England doth now it had been far greater and less stomacked and this was the censure of Monsieur de Rhosny when he observed the Majesty and decency of our Church-service in our Cathedrals On the other side Harding Bristow and Carrier seducing Jesuits assured themselves that they might yet convert England to the Catholick Church whose Service and Ceremonies she yet retained Nor do I see any such alteration made in this Edition but if Pope Pius the 4th and Gregory the 13th offered to confirm the former and the Council of Trent affirmed they might do it then the Pope may do this for ought I know But how do we bring in Popery Pref. p 7. you tell us out of Bishop Sanderson the first way is by pulling down Episcopacy c. But Sir Bishops are restored and you tell the King the Church of England is out of her Eclipse that she shines in a firmament above her Adversaries I pray Sir what is the matter that now Popery is coming in as a flood upon us cannot these Bishops the English Banks keep it out I say nothing how strongly they act in Parliament against it the Kingdom talk enough of it I pray Sir tell us what have you Conformists done more against Popery than the Dissenters have done 1. Have you prayed earnestly against it so have we 2. Have you Preached against it so have we 3. Have you Printed against it as you have done excellently and we thank you for it so have ours The first Book I saw was Fiat Lux. I saw a second Impression and wondered I heard of no answer from your Church Dr. Owen was the man that answered it Ann. 1662. so long ours have appeared 4. Have your Clergy kept their monthly Fasts four or five years foreseeing what now is coming upon us if God prevent it not so have several of our Ministers with the hazard of our Estates and Persons by Informers from whom you were free 5. Did you the last year at least for the chief part of the year beside your family-prayers set a part sometime between fix and seven in the morning one day in the week to pray purposely that God would deliver this Nation from these bloody Papists and their cursed Idolatry and Doctrines c. so have we in several Counties and layed the same charge on our people 6. Do you think you shall be put to defend our Legal right to the Protestant Religion by what I am loth to mention the sword since the Lollards-Tower the Bishops Cole-house c. are out of date they are too thirsty and must have larger draughts I believe there will be no distinction then between a true Protestant Conformist and us therefore we must join with you Why then do you charge us with bringing in of Popery I desire your Church would not put us upon temptation we wrong them not in their Tythes but charge our people to pay them exactly and do not grudg us the little that we have to bring us in bread I thank God I am not very lazy in my place but if you will give me twelve pound per Annum for my stipend you shall have it and thank you too But I bless God I may work for so good a Master A little more as to our Communion with your Church Sir some of us have lived in Gods House where we saw the Government hath been carried on by Officers of his own appointment according to his own Rule and what a majesty have we beheld in it Admonitions first privately then publickly by the Elders continuing in this course of admonishing to try if they could bring to repentance sometimes longer sometimes shorter as the sin hath been and they in prudence saw reasons I have known them waste half a year
which have come to my hand but all were not written with the same Spirit As they came to hand so I perused them to see if I could find any thing to convince me And whereas there are five things imposed upon us 1. The Liturgy with stinted forms of prayer 2. Mystical Ceremonies 3. Subjection to such Episcopacy 4. Re-ordination 5. Renouncing the Covenant I applied my self to the three first Questions chiefly For if it can be proved that these are agreeable with and conformable to the Laws of God as the Friendly Debate and Dr. Templer would perswade their Readers then Re-ordination may be admitted and the Covenant renounced As to the two first Quest Mr. Carre was the first man I met with that argued for them after him I met with the Friendly Debate next with the Serious and compassionate Enquiry c. Dr. Goodman the Author as I hear Nemine contradicente but last of Mr. Falkner a man of an excellent spirit whom I shall honour and one that hath said more than all before Before he came forth I had drawn up my answer to all the former and was loth to throw away all I had done because I saw there were some things in these Authors which Mr. Falkner had not else I would wholly have attended him but where I saw they all agreed there I considered them conjunct where one had what the other had not there severally As to the third Quest something I found in a piece Entituled Samaritanism As to the Learned Dr. Stilling fleet by throwing down the Jus Divinum of any form of Church Government he prepared the way for our subjection to such Episcopacy if his principle be sound For the serious and compassionate Enquiry I found little in that piece as to our questions unless a man were so simple to take fine words for strong arguments and Rhetorick for Logick For his Discourse about schism I shall consider it in its place But the chief things I observed in him were his odious comparisons between the Conformist and Nonconformist begun at p. 21. and continued some pages His slighting that worthy Father blessed Austin the contempt he throws upon the Synod of Dort which I did never expect from the pen of a Son of the Church of England But I see this Church of England and the famons Church of England are not the same I need not say any thing there is an acute pen hath given him so full and solid an answer that I ver expect to read his Reply To what he saith pag. 3. That the Nonconformists blame the Doctrine of the Church viz. the 39 Articles are not so punctual in defining the five points debated at the Synod of Dort c. I think I may say I have been in the company of as many Nonconformists as that Author but I have not heard them blame the Articles therefore But this fault I have heard found and do find that we are commanded to affent to the 34 35 36. Articles with the same faith we do to the fundamental Articles of our Faith and Salvation therein contained I thought among the Confessions of Faith these 39 Articles were looked upon as the Confession of the Faith of the Church of England but I find it otherwise now for Dr. Stillingfleet in his defence of Bishop Laud p. 54. being pinched by the Jesuit who in this point is not answered tells us The Church of England makes no Articles of Faith but such as have the Testimony of the whole Christian world in all Ages acknowledged to be such by Rome it self And in other things she requires subscription to them not as Articles of Faith but inferiour truths which she expects a submission to in order to her peace and tranquility Afterwards p 82 104. He distinguisheth between the internal assent of the mind and the external act the Church doth not require the first but the latter To confirm his saying he quotes Archbishop Bramhall often expressing the sense of the Church of England as to her 39 Articles thus Neither doth the Church of England define any of these questions as necessary to be believed either necessitate medii vel praecepti which is much less but only bindeth her Sons for peace sake not to oppose them And in another place more fully We do not suffer any man to reject the 39 Articles of the Church of England at his pleasure neither do we look on them as essentials of saving Faith or Legacies of Christ and his Apostles but in a mean as pious opinions fitted for the preservation of unity neither do we oblige any man to believe them but only not to contradict them Thus the Archbishop And this is not his opinion alone but generally of the Grandees of this Church as an intelligent and sober Conformist tells me When I read these lines first I read them again and again to see if I were not mistaken they were so strange unto me at the first reading when I saw I was not mistaken I turned to the beginning to see who did License it and was amazed when I saw the name According to this Cerinthus Pelagius Arius Socinus Turks Jews yea Vaninus may all subscribe the Articles and be Sons of the Church of England if they can but keep their tongues from contradicting them though they do not believe one of them Though I am a Nonconformist yet I am such a friend to the Church of England as to her Doctrine that I abhor these lines and charge that Bishop Bramhall with doing wrong to the Church It seems when other Churches abroad read these 39 Articles as the Confession of the Faith of the Church of England and suppose we do believe them to be true they are grosly mistaken it may be we believe not one the Church do not oblige her Sons to it but only not to contradict them They are deluded the Church reproached and God is mocked Several things I could say to the disproving of this sense but to what worthy Dr. Stilling fleet hath said I should desire him to name that Book of publick authority to warrant what he saith 1. The Kings Declaration prefixed for the confirmation of them and with that I question not but the Bishops did agree * The Declaration expressed With the advice of so many of our Bishops c. makes no such distinction of superiour and inferiour Truths but speaking of all the 39 Articles jointly taken together thus declareth The Articles of the Church of England do contain the true Doctrine of the Church of England agreeable to Gods word c. requiring all our subjects to continue in the Vniform profession thereof Again requires all Clergy men to submit to every Article in the plain and full meaning thereof and shall not put their own sense and comment to be the meaning of the Article but shall take it in the literal and Grammatical sense Again doth not the fifth Canon say Whosoever shall hereafter affirm that
to other Churches and future times after what way and manner we worship God c. Answ 1. But Sir cannot that be done unless we leave them the words and syllables of our prayers to which we were continually bound up will not the Confession of our Faith and a Directory for Worship if the Assemblies Directory be not sufficient I pray let your party mend it do this sufficiently 2ly If this reason be forcible was it not as strong in the Apostolical Churches and much more than now Why did they not leave their Liturgies that all Churches after them might know their way and man ner of worshipping God all their words in prayer So name you but one argument that was not of as much validity in the Apostles time as now Vniformity prevention of errors of rude and slovenly words and expressions and what else you please Then do but bring us forth their Forms which they imposed upon the Churches and give us but infallible ground for our faith to believe that these they were and no alteration in the least then Sir we shall listen to your reasons From other men I have heard other arguments One I heard from a Learned Physician who had it from Bishop Sparrow in a Sermon and was much taken with the strength of it Suppose said he their own prayers were better than the prayers of the Church yet obedience is better than sacrifice Saul 's obedience had been more acceptable than the fat beasts he spared for sacrifice The strength of this argument let us see Here is a King commanded to give obedience to God immediately and that absolutely without any question Our case is we are called to give obedience to Superiours but creatures and that in such things which concern God immediately concerning which the Lord hath given us Commandments to which all Superiours are as strictly bound as that King was to Gods command Shall not we then first try whether Creatures commands agree with the Creators commands must not obedience to the Potter take place of obedience to the potsheard if not then Ephraim did well when he willingly obeyed the command of Jeroboam Hos 5.11 and Israel did well 2 King 17.8 in obeying the statutes of their Kings Whence in matters of God we are bound to try all things though the Commands be not sub codem gradu yet if we suspect them to be sub codem genere let us have leave to examine But in short were it not for God we could with as much ease give obedience to mens commands as you can But this instance is against the Bishop 2. If there be a Betterness and we deny to give it to God then give us leave to take heed of the curse Mal. 1.14 Another common saying is this All your conceived prayers are Forms to us Ergo these Forms are lawful Ans So is every mans Sermon a man may make one Sermon and in that comprehend all that is requisite to a mans Salvation but if a man should only read that Sermon every Lords day you would discern a difference between this Form and the Sermons you hear daily and think him worthy to be cast out of his Ministry All mens speeches are but Forms in your sense 2ly Therefore you do but Ludere Homonymia in the word Form In every effect there must be a Form though hard to find out But Prayers composed of Confessions Petitions c. in such syllables words sentences to which men are tyed up in the Worship of God this is the Form in question I grant by these your Prayers differ from others and so you make a formal difference So we can allow there will be Forms in every mans Prayer 3ly A man that improveth the gift which Christ hath given him resting upon the promise of the Spirit to help his Infirmities he doth as he ought Let his Prayers seem what they will to you they are not Forms according to the question he is not tyed up to syllables but hath his liberty to vary according to the subject-matter before him Occuring Providences and spirits assistance The Scripture grounds which have made me judg this unlawful are these 1. That Text Ephes 4 8 11 12. Christ when he ascended gave gifts unto men v. 8. and these men amongst others are Pastors and Teachers v. 11. the end of these gifts and officers For the perfecting of the Saints c. v. 12. True indeed these gifts differ very much in men So the 7th v. tells us But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ But though the measure differ yet so much is given to every Pastor and Teacher let him but be saithful in the improvement of it as shall serve the end Christ intended Thus Rom. 12.6 Having gifts c. I am sure among these gifts the gift of Prayer is one so requisite in a Minister and so common to all true Christians yea to Hypocrites But this practise renders Christs act but various and crosses him in what he did and doth in giving gifts for though he doth give them they must not use them nor improve them why then did he purchase them and give them it seems he gave gifts to one or two in a Nation composing of Prayers is not the work of a multitude to compose Prayers and these must be imposed on all the Ministers in a Nation with a stamp of Authority though Christ hath given gifts to all his Ministers and many of them as able and more able than are the Composers and Imposers but their gift must lye dormant they are tyed up to words It was a silly answer he gave They may use their gifts at home The Text confutes him 2ly That Command 2 Tim. 2.2 that Timothy look to it that those whom he admits into the Ministry be faithful men and able to teach others is any man so absurd to think that an ability to pray for others is not included remembring 1 Tim. 2.1 Act. 6.4 and a gift so common to all Christians But this crosseth the Command for though they be never so able to pray they shall not use their gift or ability but be tyed up to other mens words and syllables Why not before Sermons as before Sacraments give us a Text. But your own party think even those prayers are taken away or wish they were even before Sermon 3ly As Christ purchaseth and giveth gifts and requires gifts ability in those whom he calls to his work so no doubt but he will require an account of the use and improvement of those gifts That Ministerial gifts are comprehended in the Talents given forth Mat. 25.15 I think no understanding Divine will deny in the 19 v. he will reckon with them What account then shall we give for this when one Talent we neglected contenting our selves meerly with other mens words 4ly It renders the promise of the assistance of the Spirit in prayer Rom. 8.26 but vain in great
Independents have declared it witness the aforesaid Mr. Norton in the same Book p. 133 who helps us a little to understand circumstances I shall only transcribe his own words Adjuncta cultus licet non praescribuntur in particulari determinantur tamen in generali multiplici ratione How near we and the Friendly Debate shall come we shall see anon 1. Respectu materiae non sunt cultus ipse ne dum circumstantiae a cultu separabiles sed inseparabiles ut tempus locus 2. Respectu finis omnia ad aedificationem fiant 1 Cor. 14.26 3. Respectu modi omnia decenter ordine siant 1 Cor. 14.40 4. Ex natura ipsarum rerum circumstantiis occasionalibus anne natura quidem ipsa nos docet 1 Cor. 11.14 Vbi agit Apostolus de virorum faeminarum decenti habitu in conventibus publicis Ecclesiasticis Porro determinantur aliquo modo in particulari nempe ut fiant tali modo qui circumstantiis omnibus consideratis est maxime conveniens adificationi Si nullus sit error hominis in hac circumstantiarum determinatione constituenda constitutio illa habenda est quasi simpliciter divina Thus Mr. Norton By this we may see the modesty of Dr. Goodman that can tell his Reader so confidently that this is our grand Hypothesis and the Characteristical Doctrine of the Nonconformist party That nothing is lawful in the service of God but what is expresly prescribed in Scripture The contrary to which he might have read in this Author and in others I question not But whether Ceremonies be but such circumstances or only circumstances is the question Let me state the question The Question concerning Ceremonies stated Q. Whether Man may institute Doctrinal-ceremonies or means for a spiritual end impose them upon the Church annex them to Gods own worship yea so that without the use of these God must have no publick worship performed to him That this is the true state of the Question observe the Preface to the Ceremonies in the Common-Prayer Book and the practises of men They tell us in the Preface The Ceremonies they have retained are not dark and dumb ceremonies but are so set forth that every man may understand what they mean and to what they serve and such as be apt to stir up the dull mind of man to the remembrance of his duty to God by some notable and special signification whereby he might be edified Hence we may observe 1. Man owes Duty to God this is expressed 2ly Because the wise God hath not ordained means enough to put us in mind of this our duty to him by his Command Threats Promises and his Ceremonies in both the Sacraments men will institute Ceremonies to signifie and represent to us this our duty to him this is plain for 't is expressed to be the end of these Ceremonies 3ly These Ceremonies are so clear point out and speak so plainly not dark nor dumb our duty that any man may understand what duty or grace they signifie 4ly Whereas our minds are dull to our duty these Ceremonies help to stir up our dull minds to our Duty and so stirring up they help to edifie us These things are clear in the words of the Preface no denying them and in this they speak more and commend more their Ceremonies than ever the great God did speak of his When I have urged the Conformists with these words they would fly off from them what care they for the Preface But in so doing do they shew themselves rational men does any wise man read a Law or Statute of men and not look into the scope of the Law the Preface to the Statute so understand the mind and aim of the Legislators Do they show themselves such Christians as they ought to be by shutting the window for fear light should shine in to hinder them from what they are resolved to do Let the Conformists consider it To proceed 2. That these Ceremonies are imposed upon the Church and annexed to Gods own worship is so visible that there needs no more words about it 3. That they are so annexed as without these God must have no publick worship Witness first Bartholomew-day upon which day so many hundred Ministers were turned out from their publick worshipping of God because they would not subscribe to them 2ly Witness the Parish where I was Minister and divers others where for several weeks yea months the Church-doors were shut up God had no publick worship because I would not conform to these Inventions 3ly Witness a Parish in Suffolk before the unhappy Wars began while Bishop Wren there Domineered because there was no Surplice in the Church the Church-doors were shut up two Lords-days no publick worship performed to God until they got a Surplice to annex to his Worship So that the stating of the Question cannot be denied Now let the Reader observe that worthy Mr. Falkner and tell me which argument of his from Scripture concludes the question If it were no more but the first part I thought it had been only in his power to institute means to a spiritual end and impose them on his Church who is able to make a connexion between the means and the end But it seems mens Ceremonies are so clear bright and speak so plain being not dark nor dumb as they say that they can teach men and help them on to their duty and spiritual ends without the Spirit of God or else the Spirit of God must truckle and come down and make use of their means because they have appointed them which I am sure he hates Do Kings stand upon their Prerogatives shall any man dare to set his own Image upon Copper to have it pass for a farthing in a Commonwealth and yet shall men be so bold to set their stamp or institution upon a ceremony as a means to a spiritual end impose this upon the Church What is this but to incroach upon Gods Prerogative will he not require it But so to annex them to Divine worship that God shall have no worship without them I wonder how such thoughts could enter into the hearts of such men as did own the true God and believed him to be a jealous God and the Holy Scriptures the Law of that God Let me proceed to the further clearing of the Question First These Ceremonies are humane Institutions depending only upon the will and pleasure of man So that all natural Ceremonies such as are found among those that have nothing but the light of Nature to instruct them as lifting up the eyes or hands Bowing of the knees in prayer c. found among Heathen These are excluded this question For these Ceremonies in the question have nothing but some particular mens wills for their ground 2ly These Ceremonies have an Ordained signification though the things in themselves may have some aptness to signifie something yet they do not actually signifie without the Ordination and Institution of man As in
Baptism and the Lords-Supper though there was some aptness in the Elements to signifie yet they did not actually signifie till the Ordination and Institution of Christ Such was the washing of the hands De Oratione and putting off the Cloak before Prayer in Tertullian's time which he charges with superstition Such was the girding of their garments about their loins by the Priests in France in Divine Worship Carang p. 150. Concerning which Pope Caelestinus the first wrote an Epistle to the Bishops in France charging the Priests with superstition telling them they might as well hold a burning light and a staff in their hands these having their mysteries and signification as clear as the other For as in the girding of the loins chastity so in the staff your Pastoral Government In the Light-candles the light of good works shining before men are held forth yet Caelestinus reproves them and charges superstition upon them I am sure then these deserve the same Things that signifie by civil custom as the vail did the Womans subjection 1 Cor. 11. in those times have no place in this question the vail was in use many years even among Heathens before Christ was incarnate 3ly These Ceremonies are ordained to signifie some spiritual duty we owe unto God 4ly They are means helps to our spiritual edification being very apt to stir up our minds to our duty 5ly Lastly they are appropriated to Divine Worship yea so that God shall have no worship if these be not admitted Out of this we may make a description of a Ceremony of the Church of England It is an outward sign ordained by men in the time of Divine worship to signifie some special grace or duty we owe to God unto the performance of which and our edification in so doing this outward sign is a mean by its special signification and aptness to stir up our dull minds Before I proceed I observe Mr. Falkner brings many quotations out of antiqutiy to strengthen his discourse about Ceremonies and with these many are taken but for my part I weigh them not at all they signifie nothing to me For the Spirit foretold Apoc. 17.1 there should be a great Whore c. That the Whore there mentioned is the Pontifician or Papal power now at Rome or thus Rome Chriftian not Rome Ethnick I am ready to prove it if Mr. The Whore got not into her Chair per saltum but gradually as the Churches grew more corrupt Falkner deny it That Whore then must be else the Prophecy must be false which cannot be But had all the Churches of Christ and that of Rome which was once a chaste Spouse kept close to the Rule of the Scriptures in VVorship Government and Doctrine it had been impossible for that VVhore ever to sit there Hence the wise God leaves Ministers to their own wisdom and they thought they acted very wisely when they added this and that in the worship of God and formed their Church-Government according to the civil and thus acting freely and wisely as they thought they brought about by degrees the Decree of God the VVhore is set in her Chair as freely as if God had no Decree about her nor reveal'd any Prophesie concerning her So that all Mr. Falkners and others quotations do but serve to shew us how the Churches acted to bring that Whore to her Chair and so sulfil the Prophesie suitable to what Bishop Downham said of Traditions See the Title page But though Mr. Falkner give us these Quotations is he or any man now able to give us a perfect account of the practise of All the Churches in those times some it may be many were far enough from these practises After Bartholomew-day our Church-doors being shut up for a long time I went to hear the Priest in the next Parish He I found was teaching those few that he had present before there used to be a great Congregation and grounding them in conformity and informed them that as God was pleased to institute significant Ceremonies in his Church so the Church thought it meet to appoint her Ceremonies When I heard this that Text Zach. 13.7 came into my mind where God speaking of Christ calls that man his Fellow Indeed for him who is God-man to be called Gods Fellow we can see a reason but how dirty sinful men come to be his Fellows in taking upon them to institute their Ceremonies in his Church because he had done so I could not understand the reason of this Bishop Davenant on Col. 2.20 speaks notably to this point it is too long to transcribe all The sum is this If you be free from the Rites that God did prescribe then are you free from the Traditions of men It is a most wicked thing they should impose this yoke upon you and you are most foolish to submit your necks to it For God would not have abolished the Ceremonial Law instituted by himself that a new one may be invented by men So he goeth on more fully than I transcribe though still he would have Ceremonies for Decency and Order But this is not the state of the Question for the Preface tells us other things wherefore these Ceremonies are invented and imposed Yet that of Decency will not serve the turn of which more presently But to return to that Priest who was thus instructing his people the truth of what he said and what is now in practise you may see in this Parallel 1st God takes things indifferent in their own nature and ordains them to signifie some spiritual grace or duty of man towards God This cannot be denied of seve ral Ceremonies under the Law 2ly God appropriates these to his own Worship the Priests must put off their garments when the Worship is ended 3ly Gods Ceremonies though they had some aptness to signifie yet did not actually signifie but by his Institution 4ly Gods Ceremonies though in their own nature Indifferent yet being commanded by God are now necessary 5ly Gods Ceremonies were so instituted that no Priest must dare to minister without them Exod. 28.43 6ly God punisheth the Priests and that severely if they observe not his Ceremonies Exod. 28.43 1st Man takes things indifferent in their own nature and ordains them to signifie some spiritual grace or duty of man which he ows to God 2ly Man appropriates his Religious Doctrinal Ceremonies to the Worship of God and there only used 3ly Man's Ceremonies though they had some apmess to signifie did not actually signifie but by his Institution 4ly Mans Ceremonies though in their own nature indifferent yet being commanded by humane Authority are now necessary This is their language 5ly Man's Ceremonies are so instituted that no Minister shall perform the Worship of God without them God shall have no Worship without mans Ceremonies 6ly Man punisheth the Ministers of the Gospel severely for not observing his Ceremonies Casting them out of the Lords work spoiling of their goods Imprisonments Excommunications
c. Thus Man runs even with God but if Mr. Carre gives us the true notation of Superstition that which is supra-statutum if here be not superstition and very great boldness with God I am much mistaken Mr. Falkner once or twice tells us though he allows such Ceremonies yet by no means will allow too many for then they would be burdensome But Sir if your Ceremonies have such a vertue in them to stir up our dull minds to our duty towards God where there is one I pray give us ten our hearts are dull enough and we want helps if these indeed be helps He tells us p 419. That all Ecclesiastical Constitutions must be in themselves certainly lawful By lawful I hope you mean agreeable to the Law of God make but this good and they shall certainly be obeyed But this is the thing we much desire which Law of God do these agree with I see and hear enough of the 1 Cor. 14. ult but that this Text will warrant Ceremonies thus instituted by men in the Worship of God I must see and hear more than ever I saw or heard to this day Bellarmine and Vasquez I see make much use of this Text for all their Popish Trinkets and Bellarmine tells us that Holy garments lighting of Wax-candles and their other Ceremonies may be as well proved from this Text as bowing the knee in Prayer But the Jesuit wanted a Candle here I am sure I have often wondered how men of Learning that had read over the 1 1th and the 14th Chap. of this Epistle where we may plainly see what the Apostle points at by his reproving the undecency and disorder in their Congregation should make this Text a ground to set up humane Ceremonies of Doctrinal or Moral signification in the House and Worship of God I shall add but a sew words 1. Decency and Order are no spiritual graces for though the holiness and majesty of the Worship of God is in some measure violated without them yet they are in themselves but external circumstances common to Civil actions Civil Courts and Societies where undecency and disorder are blamed and must be avoided as well as in the Worship of God 2ly Come to Decency how they serve for Decency I know not I think light of Scripture light of Nature and common approved Civil custom should be rules for Decency not mens bare wills For then some men will appoint such Ceremonies of such a colour and such a Form and he saith the worship of God cannot be decently performed without them Another appoints Ceremonies of a contrary colour and different Form and saith the Worship cannot be performed decently without them So many Heads and VVills so many Rules for Decency that we shall never know when the Worship of God is performed decently For the Woman to be vailed as the note of her subjection was the civil custom before the Worship of God was known in Corinth for the woman now to lay it by was undecent 3ly That is decent the contrary to which is undecens but for a Minister to pray without a Surplice is not undecent You know how many foreign Churches will not use it what then is the Worship of God therefore performed undecently in all those Churches Nay appeal to your own Sons the chief Gentleman in my Parish and a Son of your Church told me I think you are as decent and more decent in your Gown and Cassock than you are in a Surplice I have spoken with several Ministers Conformists and they all tell me they would not care if they were all thrown out of the Church only they are commanded therefore they use them But were they such things as without which the Worship could not be decently performed they would not speak so slightly of them and wish them thrown out they are men of reason fit to judg of decency 4ly Decency is of necessity it must be the command and reason for it are clear then we must have a necessity put upon these if Worship cannot be decently performed without them 5ly Decency is as necessary in the Pulpit as in the Desk I hope there is the Worship of God in Prayer and Preaching as well as in the Desk but always I saw the Surplice put off when the Minister ascends the Pulpit unless a Sacrament were to be administred 6ly Decency is necessary in our Family-worship must we then have a peculiar garment to put on when we pray in our Families 7ly They cannot be used to signifie Decency for the thing signified by any outward sign or ceremony does not come into my eye but my understanding but if Decency lye in the whiteness and fineness of the Linnen I see it with my eye As for Order I know not how these help here what disorder there was in the Church of Corinth Chap. 11.33 34. declares and what disorder among the Prophets is intimated Chap. 14.33 there was very great reason for this Rule but I hope very good Order may be in the Church without a Surplice or Cross or Kneeling Mr. Falkner tells us p. 391. that the Surplice properly signifies the reverence we owe to God and the high esteem we have of his Ordinances This Text then for Decency must be layed by The next Text I find in Mr. Carre is 1 King 8.64 Solomon's Altar For which he had no word A. This is Bellarmine's also who joins Jacob's new Ceremony Gen. 28.18 but yet saith Dee quidem impellente sed non expresse mandante novam Ceremoniam excogitavit that is sufficient but for this of Solomon Bishop Hall saith it was by command and instinct from God Diodati that he was divinely inspired I would have added more but Mr. Falkner lays this extraordinary case by as not cogent p. 309. Mr. Carre's next They had no command for building of Synagogues I answer But they had commands for their holy Convocations on the Sabbath day Levit. 23.3 Place must be a necessary circumstance they must meet some where Levit. 26.31 God threatens their Sanctuaries in the Plural number some Hebrews interpret Synagogues Hence Psal 74.4 8. they burnt All the Synagogues The Temple is mentioned distinct v. 7. Sanctuary in the singular number This before their last Captivity it may well refer to the Babylonish not to Antiochus Mr. Palkner p. 311 as I see Mr. Carre and Bishop Morley in his Letter against Mr. Baxter and all our Conformists make use of Christs discumbing at the Passeover to shew Christ his conformity to the Jewish customs departing therein from the first Institution Bishop Morl. pag. 29. words are these It is certain that Christ and his Disciples sate at the Passover and this no doubt was according to the Jewish Church at that time but it is as certain that this was not the manner according to the first institution which was to eat it standing Read Exod. 12.11 thus he proves we ought to kneel at the Sacrament though Christ and his Apostles sate Answ
to have eat these meats they had sinned in their command nor were they bound to obey them with a doubtful conscience to hazard amnation by obedience to superiors is no good Divinity Yet Sir we do give obedience and will preach up obedience to Princes as much as any other only in the matters of God he is the superior and supreamest Nemini fit injuria cui praponitur Deus For your next Section pag. 442. where you labour to defend your Ceremonies though they have been abused in a corrupt way of worship in Popery As for this Section Mr. Falkner might have spared it for Humane Doctrinal Ceremonies to be annexed to Gods own Institutions we judg them sinful additions intrenching upon the Soveraignty and flighting of the wisdom of Christ though Rome had never known them as if the wise holy God could not have appointed more Doctrinal Ceremonies had he cared for them as well as foolish sinful man but since then these were and are still in the Popish worship and retained here when England threw off the Papal yoke I will consider what he hath said and but touch it briefly 1. Rome then as now it stands is that Whore described Apoc. 17.1 this I doubt not of this judgment were our English Bishops the most learned of them the Professors of Divinity in both Universities and generally of our pious and learned men in this Nation before our troubles began and also of foreign Divines Was it ever known that a chast Virgin as the Church should be to Christ 2 Cor. 11.2 would dress up her self with the reliques of a known Whore Come out of her my people Apoc. 18.4 this is not obedience to that call 2ly It seems very strange that when Gods own Institution came to be abused to Idolatry as the Brazen Serpent 2 King 18.4 that must now be broken in pieces and must a Humane Institution used in superstitious worship in an Idolatrous Church be yet retained in a Reformed Church I shall not write out his Argument at length 1st In Regeneration the bodies and souls once abused to the service of the Devil Lust Idols may yet find acceptance with God in serving of him Ans A strange argument for a learned man If so excellent a Creature as man made after the Image of God under a necessity of obedience to his Creator being fallen from God but by Gods rich mercy the Obedience Blood and Sacrifice of Immanuel and the renewing of the holy Ghost be accepted of God Then a paultry human Ceremony indifferent in its own nature and no necessity for the use if abused in an Idolatrous Church may yet be retained in a chast Church and the use of it acceptable to God This Logick I understand not Consequence denied I could enlarge my answer but will not 2d Arg. From single mersion and threefold mersion in baptizm A. Was the water so baptizing in water a Human Ceremony and Invention or Christs own Institution For dipping in the water or pouring of the water upon the person your Church allow both because the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifie both If any did dip thrice denying the Trinity of persons to be of the same essence that was their Heresie but if any did hold the Trinity of persons in the Unity of the essence and yet would dip thrice though I do not much like it yet I should not condemn them of Heresie the Text mentions nothing whether once or thrice But prove Baptizing in water to be mans invention 3ly The Christians lawfully used those fountains where the Gentiles drew water for their Sacrifices c. A. And why not did the Heathen and Julian make those Fountains or God make them for the use of Man and Beast shall therefore an Idolater deprive the Christians of those which God made for the use and necessity of Man and Beast What is sold in the shambles 1 Cor. 12.25 But this you are to prove if you will make an Argument of it that when the Idolaters had taken water out of those Fountains carried it to their Idol Temples made use of it in their Idol worship that then the Christians would take that water and baptize believers in it though yet there is more to be said for them than for your Ceremonies because to baptize in water was Christs Institution For the fountains Julian might have Dedicated the Land thereabouts to Idols and Devils as well as the Fountains and so the Christians should be afraid to sow Corn to maintain Life 4ly We meet in their Churches or places they built use their Bells Tenths for maintenance of Ministers Ergo. A. 1. For places 1st Place hath no moral signification as your Ceremonies 2. Place is necessary so not your Ceremonies 3. Those places were built for the worship of the true God and Christ though these blind Idolaters might also intend some Saint But if they had been built only for the worship of a Saint in imitation of the Heathens Demons we would not meet in them but done by them as Constantine did by the Idols Temples razed some to the ground and shut up others 2. Bells It seems you use them all the while you are reading Prayers and worshipping God in your Surplice the Bells are Chiming I thought the Bells had done when worship began 2. Something must be done to give notice to the people what time the worship of God begins so the Bell doth this day to morrow it calls the people to a meeting about Town-affairs 3. Bells have no moral signification in them as your Ceremonies 4. I believe few Bells in England but have been cast since the throwing off Popery to make them musical and none use them for that end No such musical tunes did I observe in Spain but a confused jangling in time of Thunder 3. Tenths Ministers maintenance have no moral signification nor annexed to Divine Worship The people tell you Tenths are Levitical not Popish Though by their savour twice we read of Tenths being paid to God before the Levitical Law But for maintenance poor Nonconformists are not concern'd in this argument 4 The Heathens lifted up their eyes when they worshipped their Idols their gods Sun Moon c. A. 1. Did the Heathen call a Convention and there decree That when men did worship God they should lift up their eyes to heaven as your Convocation appointed these or did Natures light teach them this gesture 2. Were the Heathens the first that in worshipping of Idols lifted up their eyes to heaven Did not Adam Abel and the Saints before the Flood and Noah Sem c. after it lift up their eyes in their worshipping of God If the Heathen will imitate the Church must the Church lay by duty because the Heathen worship Devils therefore we must not worship God 5 I dolatrous sacrifices were practised before the giving of the Law yet God continued and commanded saerifices after the Law A. Your Argument speaks thus much If the Devil will
Form then I hope they will not blame us though we refuse to subject unto it as we would refuse subjection to one in the Commonwealth who is not an Officer according to Law Professing withal for my self and I dare say for all the Nonconformists in England that if it can be made good that Christ hath appointed such a Government in his Church we will most willingly subject unto it being glad we are eased of such a burden Pride shall never hinder us though that be so much charged upon us For the first the Doctor meets with several arguments that some have produced to prove there must be a Form appointed and he answers them but his answers do not satisfie I had prepared a reply to his answers but lay it by To their Arguments I would add one or two more First if Christ hath determined no form of Government in his Church then the Form may be Monarchical and Bellarmine's argument to prove it for the prevention of Schism will carry it a simili saith he c. de Rom. Pontif. l. 1. c. 9. Dr. Stillingfleet might have spared the seventh Chapter of his Rational Account wherein he labours to disprove the Jesuit arguing for the Monarchical Form Kings are supream in all cases Ecclesiastical says the Church of England the supream Magistrate may determine the Form says Doctor Stillingfleet then the Ten Kings may give their power to the Beast without any error A Pastor and a Deacon may serve at first while believers are few but when the Church is enlarged to a whole Nation there must be another Form of Government saith the Doctor p. 180. Irenic Go on Sir when the Church is enlarged to many Nations there may be another Form and why not then Monarchical Christ having determined none as the Doctor saith Above one thousand Presbyters in a Diocess may devolve the exercise of that power which Christ hath committed to them actu primo to one person according to Dr. Stillingfleet so may ten thousand as well for ought I know to one Bishop and he may exercise it by his Arch-deacon Chancellor Commissaries as well as now 2ly If God determine a Form of Government in the Jewish Church then Christ in the Christian Church Christs Kingly-Government in the heart is secret none can see that his visible Government by which he is made known to the world is known by his Ordinances Government of his House as our Courts at Westminster Sessions and Assizes shew our Kings Government with the Profession of the Christian Faith and conversation of Christians accordingly He is faithful in his house Heb. 3.6 that House is his Church which he builds not the Commonwealth qua sic 3ly To determine a Form of Government argues more Soveraignty more Perfection more Wisdom in the supream Governour than to appoint only an unformed Government as it were a meer materiae prima If a Prince give a Charter to a Corporation a Patent to a Colony he appoints the form of their Government He that gives the form in other things gives the perfection of the thing Christs Form in the Church carries authority and hath an awe upon the hearts of Believers this notion brings Christ in his wisdom and Soveraignty below an earthly Prince 4ly Dr. Stillingfleet hath affirmed Christ hath appointed a form of Government in his Church for whereas the Jesuit is pleading for the Monarchical form of the Church-Government because wise men have thought that to be best the Doctor answers What is this to the proving what Government Christ hath appointed in his Church for that is the best Government of the Church not which Philosophers and Politicians have thought best but which our Saviour hath appointed in his word Ration Account p. 464. then Christ hath appointed a form in his word and I hope that is Jure Divino else the Jesuit is not answered We need no more proof 2. For the second Quest What then is that form A. I shall lay several Propositions and clear them by Scripture First Prop. In all Churches in the New Testament where we read of Elders we read of several Elders in one Church we never read but of one Elder in a Church that I call to mind 1. In the Church of Jerusalem one Church but divers Elders Act. 15.6 23 v. 16. ch 4. 2ly In the Church of the Romans one Church but several Elders as Rom. 12.6 c. 3ly In the Church at Antioch one Church but more Elders Act. 13.1 4ly In the Church of Corinth there were divers Elders witness the Schism 5ly In the Church of Ephesus divers Elders Act. 20.17 6ly In the Church of Philippi were several Elders Phil. 1.1 So Polycarpus's Epistle to the Church declares 7ly In the Church of the Colossians several Elders Col. 1.7 4.17 Epaphras and Archippus we are sure of the Dutch say Onesimus also from Ch. 4.9 8ly In the Church of the Thessalonians were several Elders 1 Thes 5.12 Let any man that opposes me produce one Church where there was but one single Pastor though if it were so it will not save us for the Churches then had the Apostles living among them and could help that single Pastor if the Church were but new planted 9ly In Act 14.24 The Apostles ordained them Elders not an Elder in every Church Mr. Thorndike one of your own joining this Text with Tit. 1.5 crosses Dr. Stillingfleet's gloss on the Text i. e. saith the Doctor no Church wanted an Elder not that every Church had more Elders but Mr. Thorndike thus not meaning one Elder in a place but Presbyteries Colledg of Presbyters with common advice to order the Churches planted in those cities This agrees with the plain Gramar of the Text 2. with eight examples I gave before 3ly The Syriack is full for our sense The Doctor while he labours to darken this Text forgets himself strangely for p. 239. He lays this for a foundation to clear the Apostolical practise viz. that the Apostles in framing Churches did observe the customs of the Jewish Synagogues And p. 248. Having cleared that there was a peculiar form of Government in the Synagogues and that the Apostles copied out the Government of the Christian Churches by them Now p. 429. he tells us there were divers Rulers in a Synagogue is evident from Act. 13.15 he supposes Ten wise men did jointly concur for ruling the affairs of the Synagogue p. 250. so many Elders to make a Bench. Strange the Doctor should forget his foundation For Act. 20.17 Dr. Stillingfleet Dr. Hammond with Irenaeus darken that Text. I might have shown how cross Dr. Hammond and Irenaeus are one to another Forsooth the Bishops of Asia not only the Elders of Ephesus were sent for according to Hammond Grotius is clear against Hammond de Imper. p. 343 393. But I should answer thus 1. Consider how many miles Philippi was distant from Jerusalem the way Paul sailed c. according to Bunting who gives an account of
all the miles from Port to Port that Paul sailed it was two thousand one hundred and fifty six miles if he mistake not 2ly Consider how many days between the Feast of Unleavened bread and Pentecost for Paul to sail these miles 3ly What time Paul set sail from Philippi 4ly How many days he stayed in several places all which I had cast up 5ly When he came at Miletum thirty days at least were spent he had but twenty days of these he stays eight days by the way besides two days journey going and coming between Miletum and Ephesus as they reckon it from Miletum to Jerusalem 844 miles according to Bunting he stays at Philips house Act. 21.8 10. At Miletum Act. 20.16 He hasted if possible c. yet now he sends for the Bishops of Asia this is the fancy of that learned man Besides if he can prove that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the 17 vers and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 v. 28. be words of the Plural Number then his great learning may perswade us to something For his other notion on Phil. 1.1 the Jewish and Christian Bishop Dr. Stillingfleet hath answered him I add 1. In matter of fact one would think Chrysostom and Ambrose should know a little better than Dr. Hammond of yesterday and they could have given other answers than they have done upon the Text. 2ly When Paul Phil. 4.15 saith O ye Philippians he means the same persons in Ch. 1.4 but if one in France should write to the French Church in London would they write O ye Londoners they are but strangers as the Jews in Philippi 3. In the Church of Thessalonica there were Elders 1 Thes 5.12 but none Jewish Christian Bishops 1 Thes 1.9 These turned from Idols c. not so the Jews So in Ephesus several Elders but no Jewish distinct Elders Ephes 2.11 12. make that clear I could give more answers Prop. 2. The Elders in the Gospel-churches had all of them Ministerial power committed to them alike I mean the ordinary teaching Elders So Bishop Jewel If it be a heresie to say that by the Scriptures of God a Bishop and Priest are all one then many of the Fathers whom he mentions yea Paul himself must be a Heretick Dr. Stillingfleet hath yielded this and we desire no more the truth is the same if he be changed this question Learned Pens have discussed I let it alone Prop. 3. This equality of power which the Elders received from Christ did continue all the time the Apostles lived This I think Dr. Stillingfleet yields p. 275. the Epistle of Clemens to the Corinthians after the Apostles time and of Polycarpus to the Philippians declare the same The Teachers Act. 13.1 2 3. did Ordain so several of the ancient and modern Divines Lutherans and Calvinists so understand it there is a full definition of Ordination If this were Peter's see where is that Bishop had there been an Apostle he had been mentioned The Church of Corinth ought to have Excommunicated the Incestuous person though Paul had not sent to them or here joined with them Chrysostom on the Text speaks fully to the point Prop. 4. The number of the Elders increasing in the Church by reason of the increase of the Believers One of these Elders and most probably that Elder which was first Ordained by the Apostles in the Church had a Primacy as to order and honour but not as to power and jurisdiction over his fellow Elders The Text commands it 1 Cor. 14. ult Order must be and where there is a Plurality to avoid confusion there must be one If there be Twenty Justices of the Peace in a County and the King add Ten more it doth not alter the form of Government At the Sessions one must be for order sake the Judg of the Sessions and the other Justices do not devolve the exercise of their power upon him nor hath he more power than the rest every one exerts his own power So in the Parliament a Speaker must be but no superiority of power nor devolving the exercise of the power of the other Members upon him so it is in the Church That Eminent Servant of Christ Mr. Thomas Hooker alloweth of an Episcopus Humanus in the Consociation of Churches to moderate the actions of the Assembly to propound things to be agitated to gather voices to pronounce the Sentence which passed by common approbation Reason and order saith he forceth such a kind of proceeding Survey Chu Disc p. 1. Cap. 2. p. 22 23. only the constancy of it he denies from experience There is the pinch Prop. 5. This Primacy I humbly conceive did continue in that Elder during his life unless for some default he were cast out by his fellow Elders I shall wrangle with none of my brethren nor differ from them in affection about it but I shall ground my notion on the Angel of the Church Apoc. 2. c. 1st The word doth not connote any superiority of power over the rest no more than when the King wrote from Breda or at any other time to the Speaker of the House of Lords or Commons or to the Judg of the Sessions did or do argue any superiority of power but only order what Isidore saith of the word Angelus Angelorum vox est nomen Officii ne naturae cum mittuntur vocantur Angeli So here all Elders are sent Rom. 10.15 if sent then they are Angels Superiority of power among the ordinary teaching Elders was the first step Antichrist took to get into his Chair 2ly The word is to be taken individually not collectively So famous Reynolds against Hart p. 314. So Beza Piscator Paraeus and many others The instances our brethren give to prove collectively some do not prove it others as the Ram the Goat in Daniel the Antichristian Beast c. in the Revel I humbly conceive give away the Cause for there was ever one superiour in power which I will not yield 3ly That this person was during life c. The Argument brought against it is no Scripture but humane Prudence from experience so Mr. Hooker To which I say keep out but superiority of power and the danger is avoided and no doubt while the Churches kept that out this form of government carried on things very well You cannot then charge me with being cross to Scripture in my opinion 2ly Since you cannot prove me so then I prove my sense from the practice of the primitive Churches of which we have the Histories which to me is of great force in proving the sense of a Text that seems very fair and have no other Scripture to contradict that sense how much the Histories of them speak of a single person who is ignorant and that during life Ambrose or whoever it was as ancient as he in his Comment on the 4 Ephes speaks home to the point see Thes Salmar p. 3. p. 299. 3ly By the Seven Epistles to
the Churches I find him in his Primacy do you prove it was but for one or two Sessions not during his life Certainly that Angel was well known in the Church to whom Christ wrote in some Churches commending him in others discommending though its true the Epistles concerned the whole Church 4ly This Angel is not the Moderator in a consociation of Churches as Reverend Mr. Hooker speaks of whose constancy in the place may be bad but the Primate among the Elders of one particular Church so that his fear does not reach us Q. 3. For the Jus Divinum of this This form Dr. Stillingfleet cannot deny the Apostles did constitute in the Churches but it seems the Apostolical practice though they were guided by the Spirit of Christ is not sufficient to make a Jus Divinum a positive Law for it is demanded 1st There was no positive Law for the change of the seventh-day Sabbath but yet the Dr. tells us the Apostolical practice is sufficient for they were guided by an Infallible Spirit p. 12 13. If so in a matter of far greater moment than in this I hope it is sufficient the Dr. cannot deny it 2ly Dr. Stillingfleet denies the 18. Mat. 15 16. proves Excommunication Then what positive Law hath he for Excommunications Deacons Ordination of Church-Officers 3ly The Apostolical form did best conduce to the end of Government which the Dr. urges much against the Jesuit Rat. Account p. 462. I pray compare that form then and our form now under which did or do ignorance and prophaneness most abound 4ly If not so then one great end of the Acts of the Apostles which Oecumenius calls the Evangelium Spiritus sancti is lost A Lapide in his Preface to that Book speaks excellently 5ly I set up this Form you demand my authority I answer It was the Form they set up who were guided by an Infallible Spirit and Christ owned the Form in writing to it You set up your Form different from it I demand of you shew me your authority and see which is best 6ly If Apostolical practise be not sufficient then you may to Rome for a Form for ought I know I know no stop As to the Author of the Book Samaritanism I am sure the Author was nothing a-kin to the good Samaritan for he shews himself a man of a vinegar-spirit his discourse as to Church-Government is built upon this foundation That Form of Government which appeared for hundreds of years first only and was de facto Instituted of God that only hath Divine right to warrant it p. 10 11. In p. 37. I find this was Episcopacy but this is very false these three terms first only and hundreds of years are not found in Episcopacy The first Governours had power over Bishops and Archbishops if any such Creatures were 2ly They were not the only Governours for the Presbyters governed while the Apostles lived 3ly The first Governours did not last hundreds of years 4ly The first Government was not confined to a narrow Diocess as Episcopacy was In Augustine's time there were in one Province under Carthage of the Catholicks and Donatists above nine hundred Bishops but their first Governours had all Nations for their Diocess and that made their Government Apostolical I am sure there is none such now Again Presbyters were first before Bishops witness your own Tribe that tell the world Episcopacy was set up to prevent Schism among Presbyters after the Schism in Corinth among the Presbyters According to this Author there is no Government at all in the Church for these three Terms are found in no form of Government now therefore I leave him As for his fine language wherewith he courts us as Jack-straws Fools Knaves Peevish c. this Samaritans Oil and Wine we bear it the Disciple is not above his Master There is another Question of very great consequence but for these times not so useful therefore I will only state it and give mens opinion about it and leave it though I had prepared something to speak to it Q. Whether every particular Congregation consisting of one teaching Elder and a number of visible Christians be a particular Church according to the New Testament or may not yea ought not several particular Congregations unite to make up one particular Church By a Church I mean an Organical Church invested with all the power and exercise of the Keys within it self both quo ad actum primum secundum such were the eight Churches I mentioned before Learned and pious Ames Med. Theol. l. 1. c. 39. tells us That a Church in the New Testament is a Parochial Church such a company or congregation as ordinarily meet in one place to worship God Sure I am that ordinarily there is but one teaching-Elder in such a Church And this Church hath as much power as the National Church of the Jews met together Compare his 16 18 Theses great use he makes of the words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 1 Cor. 11.20 so doth a reverend Brother who knew my opinion quote it with a little warmth but my good Brother must prove there was but one Teaching-Elder in that Church else his argument will be guilty of Ignoratio Elenchi five answers more I would have given Mr. Tho. Hooker giving the true sense of Independency saith it imports thus much Every particular congregation rightly constituted and compleated hath sufficiency in it self to exercise all the Ordinances of Christ. Surv. Ch. Dis part 2. pag. 80. But then it seems it must be compleated and to this compleating are required a Pastor Teacher Ruling-Elder Deacon one at least of all these So pag. 4. ib. and without these though a particular Congregation may be called a true Church as a man that hath but one eye one arm or leg may be still defined Animal rationale as having a reasonable soul yet he is but maimed no intire man such is that Church pag. 2. Ibid. I pray how many such Congregations have we The Synod held at Boston in New England Septemb. 10. 1679 the last year pag. 10 11. calling for a full supply of Officers in the Churches speak thus The defect of the Churches on this account is very lamentable there being in most of the Churches only one Teaching Officer for the burden of the whole Congregation to lye upon The Lord Christ would not have instituted Pastors Teachers Ruling Elders nor the Apostles have ordained Elders in every Church Act. 14.23 Tit. 1.5 if he had not seen there was need of them for the good of his people and therefore for men to think they can do well enough without them is both to break the second Commandment and to reflect upon the wisdom of Christ as if he did appoint unnecessary Officers in his Church Thus the Synod Half the question then is gained the Independents yield it men worthy to be listned to for they take up the word of God for their only Rule I know there is a
Therefore one Prelate but of ordinary mission commission and qualification that never converted one Church may be not one person in truth shall have power over many Elders and Congregations where he never Preached over so many that if he Preached every Lords-day he could not preach once in a year to them yea so many that if he Preached every day in the year he could not preach once in a year to them some Diocesses are so large This consequent from such an Antecedent my dull Intellect cannot reach I deny the Consequence What might be said I foresee and would have prevented it but I am in a Postscript and so can only touch things as I pass Arguments he fetches from three Topicks to prove the superiority of one single person over other Elders 1. From Reason p. 23. Though the Vniversal Church be built upon a Rock yet particular Churches are subject to Dilapidations c. Ergo. A. In matters belonging to the House of God I thought the will of him that built the House and is Lord over it should first have been consulted His will hath reason in it we are sure but for our reasons they will put no end to the debate for one thinks his reason is as good as another Quot capita tot sententiae It is Instituted worship we are upon depending upon the positive command of the Law giver But however I deny your consequence And that 1st Mr. Baxter Church-History gives sufficient proof From the woful experience the Church hath found of your Repairers these having been as great causes of the Dilapidations as any other That Bishops have been both great Schismaticks and Hereticks Bellarmine will tell you What woful work these have made in the Church of England in our time we do still remember but I will spare names let them alone in their graves Musculus not an English Nonconformist from the experience the Church had found of the mischiefs it suffered by these Repairers Musc loc Commun p. 195. sound out to prevent and heal Schism as Hierom tells us saith Had Hierom lived to these days to see how this counsel of setting up the Bishop above the Presbyter hath profited the Church he would have acknowledged it was not the counsel of the Holy Ghost to take away Schism as was pretended but the counsel of the Devil c. Thus he with much more he adds 2ly There are other means to repair without such Prelacy as experience hath proved in several Churches where Heresie and Schism have either been kept out or healed when crept in Profaneness suppressed better than ever it was in England by Prelacy 3ly That one Prelate is as subject to corruption in Doctrine and conversation as other Ministers and who shall repair him the Presbyters being inferior to him they must not be so sawcy that kind of Creature whom you call the Metropolitan is as subject to corruption as the other Prelate As to the proof you give p. 26 27. There is a greater probability of an union of judgments when all within a certain precinct lye under an obligation to be determined by the reason of one c. A. I thank you for this saith the now Pope Innocent this helps to strengthen my old worm-eaten Chair weak in the joints and ready to crack Heresie and Schism must be avoided in the Vniversal Church as well as in the Church in your Precinct but if the Bishops in your several Precincts differ in their Judgments about Heresie and Schism as they have done and will do now what more probable way for union of Judgments than to have them lye under an obligation to be determined by the reason of one and who should that one be but my self this is but the same reason that Bellarmine hath given for Pontifex Maximus 2ly In one Diocess are some hundreds of Elders all having the power of Jurisdiction ex aquo from Christ as the Learned Dr. Stillingfleet hath proved but however if this Doctor deny it among these there may be many as godly men of as solid reason and judgment as is this one Prelate yea it may be excel him in all and in years his Elder too yet all these must have their reasons and judgments subject to the determination of the reason of that one Prelate I shall not applaud him for a man of an accuminated Intellect that shall assert such an irrational Proposition 2. His second Topick is Gods Declaration for the perpetuity of Apostolical Government which was over other Elders and Congregations p. 28. Yea Sir this is of moment if you can carry it First Text Mat. 28.20 Teach baptize instruct all Nations to observe whatsoever was commanded them I pray add this And he commanded them to teach That one Prelate while the Church stands should have superior power over other Elders and Congregations then you do something Because you mention commands for Government name two or three Texts to stop the mouths of these Erastians But to the Text. It is not for nothing that our Lord while he mention Teaching Baptizing and under this the Lords Supper yet saith nothing of Government Surely he had a reason for it 2. I yield from the Apostles and other Elders Government recorded in the Scripture that Government belongs to the Eldership with the Erastians leave but from hence to infer that because the Apostles did exercise power over other Elders Ergo now one Prelate over other Elders I shall deny the Consequence For 1. you tell us p. 25. It 's true the Vnction whereby they were qualified for it was not of the vulgar composition But say I the Unction these Prelates have is but of the vulgar composition Hence to argue from extraordinary to ordinary is a kind of fallacy a kin to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 They that exercise Government over other Governours as all Elders are had need be in Wisdom Learning Holiness and fitness for Government as Saul among his brethren higher by head and shoulders so were the Apostles and Evangelists above those Elders over whom they exercised Authority We find no such things amongst the men of the vulgar Vnction 2. Those Elders as well as the people were the Aposties Converts these being but newly brought home to the Faith well may their Fathers have power over them and cause enough to visit them the case is not so here 3ly When the Apostles come to deal with the ordinary Elders there is no intimation left of any such power of one Prelate over the rest You tell us p. 45. that Timothy was Ordained Bishop of Ephesus about the 13th year of Claudius I hope you will not force it from 1 Tim. 1.3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus He must have an illuminated Intellect indeed who can force the ordination of a Bishop out of these words Besides certainly had he been Bishop there Paul need not have besought him to be resident there but however sure I am he must be
ordained before Pauls journey to Jerusalem Acts 20. for he tells Timothy 1 Tim. 3.14 he hoped to come unto him shortly but Act. 20.25 when he sent for the Elders of Ephesus he tells them they shall see his face no more If Timothy then were Bishop of Ephesus before this time then he was there now and was now sent for which I shall never believe that Paul would not mention him in particular whose Name he uses to joyn with his in several Epistles But if Timothy did come with the other Elders here is no difference made of this Prelate from the other Elders but 28. ver he gives the same alike to them all Therefore I deny your Consequence If Timothy were Bishop of phesus what need Paul tell him in his second Epistle to him Chap. 4.12 Tychicus I have sent to Ephesus he might have spared that line for Timothy must needs know it if he came to him there But you add for a further Confirmation p. 28. the words of Christ Joh. 20.21 As my Father sent me so I send you But the Commission of Christ as an Apostle did undoubtedly extend to a superintendency over the Clergy and the particle 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 justifie the same as to the Apostles c. A. Undoubtedly Christs Commission did extend as you say without limiting it to any precincts which you tell us several times the Apostles were and especially in p. 6. you would labour to prove it from 2 Cor. 10.16 Though that Text I conceive will not do it But if the particle 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 will force their superintendency over the Clergy it will as well force it without limitation to such precincts for his Father did not so send him and how their Commission runs we read But I shall not give my thoughts about this now you tell us pag. 34. that among the Bishops Peter leads the Van in the Church of Antioch Pope Innocent this does not make for you I pray tell us in your next in which Church did Paul lead the Van among the Bishops But if Peter were Bishop at Antioch indeed Paul went beyond his Precinct when he dealt so roundly with a Bishop in his own See as he did with this Bishop of Antioch Gal. 2.11.14 2ly I conceive you stretch this Text beyond the intent of our Lord. For the work which our Lord undertook he had a Call from his Father who sent him Heb. 5.4 Joh. 6.27 and 10.36 His Father had Authority to send him and was with him Joh. 16.32 So he the Head and King of his Church having all power given to him in Heaven and in Earth Math. 28.18 had Authority to send forth his Apostles to their work they might show their Commissions or Credentials He promised also to be with them and their Successors to the end and I think all Gospel-Ministers are their Successors but that the Lord intended in these words the setling of a Superiority of one person above his brethren in the Ministry to the end of the world this is but Petitio pincipii your gloss and I deny it for the Reasons and Scriptures before mentioned 3ly Those Apostles had Superiority over Bishops if there were such then as you say there were yea Arch-Bishops who is now over them His third Text is Eph 4.12 13. Apostles were given and their Suffregans as you call them Prophets and Evangelists for the perfecting of the Saints hence pag. 30. you conclude for the duration of Prophets and Evangelists to this day Thus then we have to this day Apostles Prophets and Evangelists in the sense of this Text unless he will abuse the Text a rare sight I would go many miles to see such persons and to their Superiority willingly submit Calvin Gerhard Beza Zanchi the Leyden Professors c. tell us these were Ministri extraordinarii Temporarii but they were men of no Acuminated Intellects their judgements signifie little Well Sir what Apostles were you tell us not neither need you we know them well but where you can find such I know not but such you must find if your proof hold For the Prophets you tell us they were such as had an excellent skill to preach the Gospel out of the Books of the Old Testament 1 Cor. 13.2 Evangelical Doctrines locked up in the Figures of the Law and Predictions of the Prophets If this were all we shall find many such Prophets amongst the Nonconformists But Sir you have spoken very short of the Prophets Dr. Hammond Zanchy and Gerhard add two things more 1. A foretelling things to come 2ly They spake all from the Spirit from a Divine Afflatus These three are somewhat like I pray shew us these Prophets now The Evangelists you tell us are such as had a profound insight into the Gospel as contained in the Writings of the New-Testament and could with singular dexterity open and explain its true importance Such there are also amongst the Nonconformists But Sir what if there were Evangelists before there was any part of the New-Testament writtens how then does your description agree I question not if the Ancients say true of the time when John wrote his Gospel but Timothy was an Evangelist long before and in that Gospel are the deep Mysteries contained more than in the other three If the first Epistle to the Thessalonians were the first Epistle that Paul wrote as Divines generally think Timothy is joyned with Paul in the 1. ver so that very little was written when he first was made an Evangelist I see by some of your own and those Learned men Philip was an Evangelist when he preached the Gospel at Samaria and wrought Miracles Acts 8.5 6 7. but at that time no part of the New Testament was written For Matthew wrote first and that was eight years after the Ascension as our Divines for the generality of them agree But for the Evangelists Eusebius l. 3. Chap. 37. a fitter man to tell us what an Evangelist was than you gives us another description and that which agrees with Philip in Acts 8.5 6 7. and other Scriptures I shall note only these 1. That they watered the Churches every where planted by the Apostles 2. They preached Christ to them which as yet heard not of the Doctrine of Christ 3. Having planted the Faith in new and strange places they ordained there other Pastors committing to them the Tillage of the new ground pressing themselves to other People and Countries 4. By the power of the Holy Ghost they wrought miraculously Show us these Evangelists now His last Text is 1 Tim. 6.14 Keep the Commandments until the appearing of the Lord Jesus c. A. 1. By the appearing of the Lord c. exitus vitae is meant thinks Austin and some others But if not yet this appearing is an Argument used not only to Timothy but to all Christians to look to their duty Col. 3.4 Tit. 2.13 1. Pet. 17. 2. What Commandment this was if we well
observe the 11. and 13. ver going before we may well guess 3. If you refer it to his Office as you do and would thence infer the perpetuity of his Office to the Worlds end I deny that to be the meaning For when the Apostle charges him 2 Tim. 4.5 do the work of an Evangelist c. there the word Evangelist is taken in the same sense with Eph. 4 11. not only Calvin and Gerhard but Scultetus though an Episcopal man yieldeth and it were absurd to think otherwise But that Timothy in the 1. Epistle Chap. 1.3 should be ordained a Bishop as you say and long after this charged to do the work of an Evangelist they must have dull Intellects indeed that know nothing of an Evangelist and a Bishop who beelieve it The Evangelist being one fixed to no place and had the power of Miracles as Eusebius and the Scriptures testifie This was a Commandment so incumbent upon Timothy that his Salvation or miscarrying was concerned in it as he performed it and so it is true of all Ministers but for an Evangelist the French Church the Low Countries Scotland New-England where Mr. Eliot hath more right of Superiority over the Churches of the Indians than any Prelate in the World yet would detest your Doctrine nor any Churches that I know of own an Evangelist As yet then the proof fails Thus we find in Clemens Epistle to the Corinthians a Metropolitan Church forsooth there is no mention made of any such Prelate But pag. 2.62 69. and 73. especially he mentions only Elders without any distinction A Bishop being but Primus Presbyter Primi Presbyteri Episcopi appellabantur Ambros in 4 Eph. as Ambrose calls him it may stand with Episcopus Praeses Thus Polycarpus in his Epistle to the Church in Philippi another Metropolis saith Dr. Hammond there is no menion of any such Prelate but pag. 18. he exhorts them to be subject to the Elders and Deacons answering to Paul Phil. 1.1 For Timothy's being twice ordained and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mentioned 1 Tim. 4.14 which you would have understood of Prophets c p. 45 46. What you aim at in Timothy's twice Ordination I know not whether that we may be twice ordained though first by Presbyters let it first be proved that Timothy was twice ordained to the same Office Timothy first ordained by the Apostle himself you say 2 Tim. 1.6 I pray Sir to what Office say and prove from Divine Writ If the second time ordained not to an inferiour Office I hope the first Ordination by an Apostle the second to a higher Office by Inferiour Officers I pray when was he ordained an Evangelist Nor does your notion of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 take to be meant of any other Prophets different from Paul for we know that Paul excelled in all gifts 1 Cor. 14.18 as of Tongues so no question of Prophesie Why therefore Paul might not be He to whom the Spirit revealed this concerning Timothy as yet so young and so to take him along for his Companion give us a Reason for it seems there was a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 given 1 Tim. 4.14 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and in 2 Tim. 1.6 he bids him stir up the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which was in him 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 That the Apostles did convey gifts we know by their imposing of hands though the Presbitery joyned with the Apostle in his Ordination and so I know not above One Ordination that ever Timothy had and that to an Evangelist His third and last Topick to prove the Superiority of this Prelate is the practise of the universal Church pag. 42. To which add his saying pag. 53. As for Prelacy the Essence whereof lyes in a Superiority of an Ecclesiastical person over Elders in a certain precinct it was ever owned by the Church as agreeable to the Canon of Scripture Sir did you deliver this in the Pulpit for a Truth where be sure no man ought to speak any thing but Truth Have not you read Austins Epistle to Hierom Epistle 18. in which Austin writes thus to him Quanquam enim secundum honorum Vocabula quae jam Ecclesiae usus obtinuit Episcopatus Presbyterio major est c. Surely you have read Hieroms Comment upon Tit. 1. Episcopi noverint se magis consuetudine quam Dispositionis Dominicae veritate Presbyteris esse majores To which A. B. Anselm subscribes in his Comment on the same Chapter What Sir is Ecclesiae usus and Consuetudo the same with Canon of Scripture Have not you read Estius Sent. l. 4. d. 24. calling those Hereticks that are not of your Opinion and undertaking to prove the jus Divinum of Prelacy as you do he saith thus Quod autem jure Divino sint Episcopi Presbyteris Superiores si non ita clarum este sacris Scripturis aliunde tamen satis efficaciter probari potest Have you not read what Medina saith of the Fathers in this point and what our Bishop Jewel naming the same Fathers that Medina did adds Paul himself must be a Heretick if Bishop and Presbyter be not the same according to the Scriptures Much more I might add that I wonder you could write such a line And what Sir will you exclude all those Churches from being parts of the Catholick Church that have not nor do own your Prelacy or what Church do you mean when you say the Church hath owned That so many of the Church were of your Opinion this with your Metropolitan Arch-Bishop brought that Whore in Apoc. 17. to her Chair without which that Prophecy had not been fulfilled to this day so that though it is not true what you say yet if it had been true it had not much prevailed with me but God hath left Testimony against it both in his Word and in the Church As for your notion p. 51. The reason why the Apostles wrote to the Churches that were in the cities which were Metropoles was to shew that all the Churches which were in that Province did depend upon that Metropolis Government and this Bishop was an Archbishop p. 50. I pray Sir which of the Apostles told you this was their reason or where do you find this written The Apostle mentions but but one 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 1 Pet. 5.4 This notion I see you are so taken with that p. 51. you tell us this Hypothesis gives the most intelligible account why all the Churches in Asia are reduced to Seven An Intelligible account then we have of that which I had a desire to know but because the Lord had hidden it it became not me to inquire after his secrets but now we have a reason why all the Churches in Asia are reduced to Seven 1. I pray Sir give us since you are so acquainted with Christs secrets an Intelligible account why since there were so many Churches in Europe and those Churches in the Metropoles yet the Lord writes not to one of
so nothing but Forms which is the sense of your Church I say may I be but as pleasing to God My reason is I observe it would very much please my corrupt lazy unbelieving heart I should not need then to beg of God the presence of his Spirit to help me as to the matter of prayer nor need I act my faith and dependance upon him as conscious of my own insufficiency 2 Cor. 3.5 for all my prayer is prepared to a syllable I should not then labour with my proud heart to submit quietly to Gods pleasure though he doth substract and not afford that presence sometimes which he doth at other times For here are the same words and syllables at all times his absence or presence hath no room here It may be the Friendly Debater that can jeer I see at Christian experiences will jeer at me too because I give this experience of my corrupt heart but I care not As for Dr. Falkner let but the Question be truly stated and I do not find one Scripture-argument he hath brought that concludes the Question for his own humane reasons I little regard them in divine Worship As for private Christians I know your Clergy look on them as the Pharisees did upon the vulgar Joh. 7.49 but Sir I know more of them than you or Dr. Falkner plain Mechanicks have I known well Catechised and humble Christians excellent in practical piety kept their station did not aspire to be Preachers but for gifts of prayer few Clergy-men must come near them I profess I fall short of them I have known some of them when they did keep their Fasts as they did often they divided the work of Prayer the first began with Confession the second went on with Petition for themselves the third Petition for Church and Kingdom c. the fourth Thanksgiving every one kept to his own part and did not meddle with anothers part Such excellent matter so compacted without Tautologies each of them for a good time about an hour if not more apiece to the wondering of those who joyned with them Such answers of prayer I have known to others that they have praised God for assurance that he had heard them before they rose off their knees and at that time it was done a thing of very great consequence but heard not of it till two days after Here was no reading of Liturgies these were old Jacobs sons could wrestle and prevail with God and yet must be punished if they came not to Church and set above an hour in the cold to hear a Minister read that which their boys could do at home and blessed be God that England in this dark day hath many thousands of such plain but praying Christians however despised and punished As for that Question Whether every particular Congregation makes a particular Church which you deny and oppose the Dissenters p. 234. c. I pray Sir why do you not answer Mr. Alsop's Text which he brings p. 45. from 1 Cor. 11.18 compared with 20. that Text deserves an answer and till that be done they are not confuted you have left out the strongest Argument Sir you must state the Question a little closer else you will not carry it I doubt not but there may be one particular Congregation which may be invested with the power and execute all the power of the keys and I think that is a Church For instance take your own Congregation and a few more in London where four or five thousand meet to worship God so large are your places with Galleries also I would suppose in such a Congregation there would be required four Teaching Elders four Ruling Elders Sir I must own that Officer though I think there hath been an error in assigning him that power which is not due to him and four Deacons Let all these Officers ply their work as hard as they will I doubt not but they will find their hands full and hearts full too unless the Four thousand be the better Christians But Sir will you deny this Congregation to be such a Church as we read of in the Gospel compleat as to exercise of all the power of the keys I am sure you will not As for your Reason for Episcopal Government another ground of difference between us which you give us in your Preface pag. 5. quoting Mr. Noyes of New-England in your Treatise pag. 234. agreeing with you viz. It is hard to perswade considering men that the Christian Church should degenerate so soon so unanimously so universally c. Mr. Noyes Would not Elders so many knowing men at least some of them have contended for Truth wherein their own Liberties were so much interessed Aerius his opposing of Bishops so long after their rise and standing is inconsiderable c. Sir much here might be said but I leave it to those with whom you have to deal as for Mr. Noyes I know him very well and know what may cause him to write for Episcopal Government That 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 bear with my words for I am sure it is contrary to Scripture and Reason of the Congregational men That the Fraternity or Plebs is the first subject of the power of the keys have made such work in Congregational Churches to my knowledg that their Elders have felt the need of that principle and made them to think again But good Brother what Episcopacy is it you mean if you mean only Episcopus Praeses I am of your opinion it was the government in the Apostles time when Elders in a particular Church were multiplied And if we would but exercise more meekness and patience one with another Consult the Scriptures more attentively we shall find that the true Government and Constitution of the Church takes in somthing of Episcopacy somthing of Presbytery something of Independency But Sir if you mean Episcopus Princeps which is our Case one that hath a Superiority of power above Presbyters with which these must not meddle and this Bishop such large Diocess as ours are and this Bishop also the Sole Pastor over the Diocess as Bishop Morley checking Mr. Baxter tells him that the Bishop of Worcester and not Mr. Baxter is Pastor of Kidderminster as well as of all other Parochial Churches in that Diocess pag. 2. Sir this Episcopacy you and Mr. Noyes have to prove that it was ever in the Apostles time or of Christs Institution for this we utterly deny The Presidential Episcopacy as I may term it lasted as it is conceived by Learned men till the middle of the second Century or towards the end of it your self does not deny it Iren. pag. 275 276. But for this Princely Episcopacy when that began to be set up then began the Degeneracy of the Apostolical Government Though Mr. Noyes makes little of Aerius yet Medina tells the world that Jerome Austin Ambrose Sedulius Primasius Chrysostom Theodore Theophilacct were all of Aerins his judgment and you say Medinas judgment will prove true Iren. 276. So say Bishop Jewel and Learned Whitaker Quam Epiphanius frigidissimis rationibus refellit saith Whitaker Tom. 1. pag. 149. As for their Diocesses beside what I have said before you tell us they were not very large since all the Parishes could communicate on the same day with what was sent from the Cathedral Church Iren. pag. 370. Sure I am what you plead for now does not agree with the last Paragraph of your Irenicum where you were nearer the Truth How they should come to degenerate so soon is easily understood if we believe the 2 Thes 2 3 4 and 7. ver and the 17. Chap. of the Revelation If positâ permissione infallibiliter sequitur quod permittitur which I am sure is true then it is as true if the Spirit foretels what shall come to pass that must come to pass good Austni good Cyprian and other good Bishops by their Superiority of power and large Diocesses did prepare the way for wicked Boniface the third and he made the Catholick Church his Diocess it was impossible for him else to come there had the Churches kept to the Apostolical Government That Counsel and prediction of God was secretly and severely brought about by men This was once your your Opinion Ire pag. 197 198. Though the Elders had equal power from Christ yet being it was to be exercised but in a co-ordinate way with others you tell us they might devolve the exercise of their power to others Iren. 276. and Dr. Templer tells us there is a greater probability of an Vnion of Judgment when all within a certain precinct lie under an obligation to be determined by the reason of One c. when there is only matter of Right and Liberty which require care pains watch but no profit or gain come into the Purse as here we can easily and readily listen to Reason that may take us off from Duty and part with that Right which hath no profit but only pains annexed to it FINIS