feare and nurture of the Lord and to the prayse of God for the preseruation and kéeping of theyr bodyes vndefiled members of Christs body and for the mutuall society helpe and comfort that maryed persons ought to haue the one of the other Your extreame vnction we doo not onely denie to bée a Sacrament because we finde in Histories that Pope Foelix the fourth of that name that occupied the place of the Papacie about 525 yéeres after the incarnation of our Sauiour Christ was the first that tooke order for the anoynting of the bodyes of such as lay in dying with oyle But also because the manner of the vsing of it is too too full of superstition We allowe of a religious visiting of the sicke according to the councell of S. Iames chap. 5. And wee doo vnderstand by the annoynting with oyle that S. Iames speaketh of the applying of naturall remedies to the sicke persons which beeing ioyned with prayer must néedes bee the more effectuall as by that place of S. Iames it may verie well be gathered And thus much I haue thought méete to write concerning the Sacramentes which Christ hath instituted and are now vsed in that Church wherof we Protestantes are and haue béene vsed in that Church euer since they were first instituted by Christ himselfe And because your sorte doo make accounte of fiue other Sacramentes in déede I haue written bréefely of them also The Catholique Church whereof we Protestantes are members hath from tyme to tyme had the hearing of matters in controuesie and so hath it still so farre foorth as the same may appertaine vnto her to iudge of them That is where and when the parties that be at controuersie do submit themselues to her iudgement For what hath she to doo with them that be without As S. Paule wrote to the Corrinthians 1. Cor. 5. 1 Cor. 5. Such as are not of the societie of the members of Christ are not to be iudged by the church of Christ And as touching the orderly succession of Bishops wee are able to shewe by the Histories of the Church that our Church hath had aboue 60. Bishops in Rome successiuely one after another whereof the greatest number were good men and carefull to gouerne the flocke committed to their charge as S. Paule wished the Elders or Bishops of Eph. to doo Act. 20. But here the Offerer must note that none of these was called or would be called vniuersal Bishops or vniuersal heads Acts 20. of the vniuersal church of Christ They knew that the charge that was committed vnto them in Roome and in the Churches of the prouince was great enough for them they sought for no more charge But when any other Bishops dyd séeke to them for councell they were readye to helpe them to the vttermost of theyr power but none of them did claime any power or authority ouer the rest The rest of the Bishoppes in Roome that succéeded Gregorie the first namely Boniface the third and such as succéeded him were Antichristian Bishops and therefore wee refuse them as none of ours Neither is it so necessarie a matter to haue so orderly a succession of Bishoppes in any one Cittie in the christian worlde as in the first 600. hundreth yéeres after Christ there was in Roome But because the cittie Roome was then and had béene of long tyme before the chéefe cittie of the whole world the peoples that inhabited in other Citties and partes of the world owing seruice to the state of Roome had occasion to repaire thether and therefore euen the christians that had theyr dwelling else where had the Bishoppes and other Church ministers that were in Roome in greater estimation then they had those men that were of the lyke calling euen in the citties wherein they themselues had theyr aboade and dwelling And hereof it might come that greter account was made of the succession of those Bishops that were Bishoppes of Roome then of those that were in Millen Constantinople Ierusalem Hippo or in any other part of the whole world But if this orderly succession of bishops that so great accoūt is made of were well weighed it would not bee founde so certaine as thys Offerer and his fellowes would faine haue it séeme to bée S Austine whose anthoritie is not to bee contemned hauing occasion to make mention of this succession placeth Linus next vnto Peter and maketh no mention at all of Cletus and so he maketh in this succession lesse by one then the common account is Some others doo suppose that Linus and Cletus were but Peters coadiutors and not Bishops of Roome at all For Peter him selfe sayd vnto Clement I giue vnto thée the same power of binding and loosing that Christ left vnto me and so he made Clement hys immediate successour Yea there be some that doo thinke and I doo thinke that they haue some good cause so to thinke that Peter him selfe was neuer Bishop of Roome But let the succession of Bishops in the first 600. yéeres be euen such as this Offerer and his fellowes doo suppose it to be yet the succession that hath bene since the end of those first 600 yeres is not so currant as they do auouch it to be For it appeareth in Histories that the seate of Roome hath béene voyde for the space of whole yéere togeather yea for the space of two yéeres and more and that there haue béene two Popes yea thrée Popes at one time where of one hath excommunicated the other and no man was able to say which of them shold by the right successour of Peter I would gladly vnderstand by this Offerer and his fellowes what manner of succession that was when aboute the yéere of our Lord 855. Ioane English borne at Mensse béeing a woman in sexe and nature was made Pope and continued so for the space of two yéeres I thinke they will not say that this was an orderly succession To bée bréefe the succession of the Romane Bishoppes since the time of Bonifacius 3. hath béene such as the succession of high Préests was in the kingdome of Israell from the time of the falling away of the tenne kindreds from the house of Iuda euen to the time wherein they were caried away by the Assirians and lyke the succession of high Préests amongst the Iewes from the first beginning of the Sects of the Phariseis and Saduces amongst them euen to that time wherein that kingdome was vtterly ouerthrowne by the Romanes And as the right professours of the lawe of God in Israell and Iuda which vndoubtedly were many had in al this tyme no succession of highe Préestes so such as in these latter 1000 yéeres haue béene the right Catholiques haue had no succession of Bishops but haue receiued theyr spirituall foode at the hands of such pastors as God hath from time to time stirred vp as he stirred vp Prophets in Iuda Israel in those times wherof I haue spoken before as often as it hath pleased
whom Volateran saith that hee was Vir plane probrosus infamis A man altogither worthy of reproches and euill reports and infamous And Platina saith that after his death hee was séene in an horrible shape and that hee said thus Iusto Dei iudicio damnatus sum quia sine lege vixi I am damned euen by the iust iudgement of God bicause I liued without law These gouerned your church one of them nine yeeres another foure yeeres and the third fifteene yeeres Now if that did saying bee true as in very déede it is alwaies founde to true Regis ad exemplum totus componitur orbis the whole world doo frame them selues after the example of the Ruler how could it otherwise bée but that in the daies wherein those men ruled your church you had great plenty of such men as they were But you will say this is not to be ascribed to the religion but to the persons that professed the religion Well then I hope you will be contented that we doo say that the falts wherewith you doo charge our religion are the falts of such persons as professing our religion be of no religion and are not to be imputed to our religion but to those irreligious persons Wee wish after and seeke for concord in true Catholike religion wée detest and abhorre licentiousnes of life Wée â—raue and beg both of God and of men the reuiuing of that discipline that God him selfe commaunded to bee exercised by his people Wée embrace true and vnfained repentance which is as Dauid teacheth Psal 34. Psalm 34. to turne away from euill and to doo the thing that is good We loue and practize true fasting such as Esay the prophet requireth in the people of God Esay 58. Esay 58. which consisteth in mercifull dealinge towards such as bee in our daunger and in mercifull relieuing of such as doo lake thinges necessarie that wee are able to help them to Wée call vpon God for encrease of zeale deuotion grounded vpon knowledge Wée obay all Magistrats in the Lord for the Lord. But how standeth your religion with obedience to magistrats when you dare assure them of euerlasting life that will enterprize to murther a prince as bisides your practizes of olde whereof wée reade in histories you did of late assure him that murthered the Prince of Orendge and such as should haue murthered our soueraigne Lady that now raigneth ouer vs Yea that Bull that Felton fixed to the bishop of Londons gate dooth make it manifest what obedience men of your minde doo vse to shew vnto Magistrats Sacriledge wée doo detest but you haue taught our Patrons Princes to rob churches and parishes of tythes and so consequently of the foode of the soule by due administration of the woord and sacraments and of the relife of the poore by liberall hospitalitie Apostacie wée leaue to men of your sort which are fallen away from the auncient true and Apostolike catholike church of Christ and doo obstinatly stand in defence of that schimne that you are fallen into notwithstanding that your falling away is made as manifest vnto all men as those things are that lie open in the cleare light of the day We are carefull to kéepe and performe that vowe that was made in our names when wée were baptized but if any of vs haue made an vnlawfull or a rash vow the performance whereof should tend to the dishonoring or displeasing of God any way wée doo earnestly repent that euer we made such a vow choosing rather to stand to the mercie of God in not performing such a rash and wicked vow then to commit greater wickednes in the perfourming thereof as Herod did in cutting of the head of Iohn Baptist Math. 14. Mat 14. As for vnlawfull lusts and wantonnes of lyfe maners wée doo flée from as it is seemely for Christians Wée haue learned to possesse our vessells that is our bodies in holines and in honor Which in déede many of vs coulde not doo without that remedie that God him selfe hath appointed which is honorable and holy Matrimony Heb. 13. Hebr 13. Such therfore amongst vs as otherwise can not haue chast mindes in chaste bodies doo choose to liue with chaste wiues in chaste marriage for we haue learned that it is better to marrie then to burne 1. Cor. 7. 1. Cor. 7. And wée know what saint Paule hath written to the Ephes concerning the dealing of some of your sort Ephes 5. Ephe 5. It is a shame euen to speake of those things that they doo in secret If the indifferent reader will not say that the vices that you haue charged our profession and religion with doo more clearely agrée to the popish Catholikes then to the protestants bee in them plaine signes and fruites of false religion then will I recant and not before The two and twenty Offer Offerer Two and twenty Let the learned proue vnto mee that their church and congregation might rightly bee called Catholike which for the space of a thousand yeeres togither was so particuler that no man coulde name any certaine place where their church was or that it might bee called holy which had for so longe time and space neyther the doctrine of Christes gospell taught in it neyther baptisme nor any other sacrament of Christ vsed to sanctifie them withall or that it could bee called one church which as soone as it grew vp shewed selfe to the world was deuided into so many and sundry sectes of Lutherans Zuinglians Iliricans Caluinists Svvenfeldians Anabaptists and such other or that it might bee called Apostolike which could neuer make an account by orderly succession and discent from any one of Christ his Apostles or any other Apostolike man or that their secret hid vnknowne congregation was euer of that maiesty or authority that it had at any one time or season the true obedyence of all christian nations or that it was euer of that maiesty or authority that it had at any one time or season the true obedyence of all christian nations or that it was euer able to assemble gather vniuersall and generall counselles of all nations and Christian people or to exercise any discipline or correction vpon offenders throughout all kingdomes and regions professing Christ or that these titles following properly applied by the scriptures and doctors to the true church of Christ could euer bee challenged by any right to their hyd and vnknowne congregation I meane these titles namely Corpus Christi the body of Christ Sponsa Christi the spouse of Christ Amica Christi the louer of Christ Vnice dilecta Christo dearely beloued of Christ Columba speciosa the beautifull Doue Domus Dei the house of God Columna veritatis the Piller of truth Ciuitas Dei the city of God Ciuitas super montem posita a city set vpon an hill Fons signatus a Spring or Fountaine surely signed and sealed Sponsa agni the spouse of
Emperor the murdred Mauricius his wife and children was the first that gaue the title of vniuersall bishop to Bonifacius the 3. then bishop of Rome And this was 600. yéeres after the birth of our sauiour Christ Your church was in hatching the later 300. yéeres of the 600. but neuer perfected before Phocas time Wherefore your antiquity is nothing Your vniuersalitie was neuer so large as the Romain Empire your vnity diuided into moe sects then euer the heathen Philosophers were Your succession of Bishops is such that no man can iustly prooue that Peter was the first nor that euer hee was Bishop of Rome Or if hée were Bishop of Rome no man can certainely say how longe he was there Bishop nor who it was that was the next Bishop after him And by the testimony of your owne Hystorians some in the succession of your Bishops were as wicked men as euer liued vpon earth and one was a woman an arrant whore And bisides all this your Apostolike seate of Rome that you bragge so much of hath bin voyde for the space of one yea two yeeres togither more You haue had also two yea three Popes at one time and much blood hath bin shed about the triall of their titles But our vniuersality is and euer hath bin as large as the whole world yea when in the iudgement of men of the best sorte our Church seemed to bée cleane rooted out as in the daies of king Achab it séemed to bée in the kingdome of Israell yet had God his number knowne vnto him although not knowne vnto men And therefore when Elias complayned and said The children of Israell haue forsaken thy couenant they haue ouerthrowne thine alter they haue slaine thy prophets I alone doo remaine and they seeke after my life 3. Reg. 19. 3. Reg. 19. Then did the Lord answere and saide vnto him I haue reserued for my selfe 7000. men that haue not bowed their knees to Baall As then and there so at all times and in all places the Lord hath had hath still and still will haue in despight of all Turkish and Popish enimies his number knowne vnto him selfe that number is his Catholique knowne church And this church hath God made able at all times to conuince all heresies and Heretikes And at this day hée dooth for euer hereafter hee will make the same church able to conuince all turkish popish Heretikes Heresies although not by the sword yet by the word as at this day you M. Offerer and all your popish Catholique brethren may sée if you haue eyes to sée willes to consider of that which you doo and must néedes sée Our vnitie also in the substance of religion is the same that was taught by the Patriarches by the Prophets and by Iesus Christ and his Apostles and was by the first Christians that were in Roome and in the rest of the Citties that then were vnder the dominion of the Romane Emperours receiued holden and professed That is with one full consent wée beléeue holâ—e and confesse all the Articles that are conteyned in the three Créedes namely the Apostles Créede the Nicene Creede and the Créede of Athanasius We beléeue as S. Paule hath taught the Ephes to beléeue that there is but one Lorde one faith one Baptisme one God and Father of all which is aboue all Ephe 4. and in vs all Ephe. 4. Our succession of Bishops is such as the succession of the Prophets was We make no account of that succession of Bishops in Rome which you doo bragge so much of for the Scribes and Pharisies might haue bragged of such a succession as well as you doo and might haue sayd to our Sauiour Christ as you do to vs where was your Gospel 400. yéeres past But we doo make account of that succession wherein God hath in his good times stirred vp some in the spirite of Elias to deale in doctrine with men of all sortes as Elias dyd with Achab and the Isralities and as Iohn Baptist dyd with Herode and with the Iewes in his time The high Préestes had theyr succession euen from Aaron as your Popes haue had from Peter some of them asspiring to that estate by one sinister meane and some by an other as by the Histories it appeareth But in the meane while God stirred vp Prophets but now and then for the worde of God was precious in the dayes of Elie the high Préest when the Lord stirred vp Samuel to bee a Prophet And when Iohn Baptist was stirred vp there had béene no Prophet amongst the Iewes for the space of many yéeres together This was the execution of Gods iust iudgement vpon the Iewes because they had not regarded those Prophets which he had styrred vp amongst them In like manner in the time that hath béene since the Incarnation of our Sauiour Christ because men had giuen ouer themselues to beleeue lies did not regard the trueth God tooke from them such as had laboured to leade them in the waie of trueth and gaue them ouer to the efficacie of error Yea béeing wilfully blinde hee gaue them blinde guides that might leade them the right way into the ditch of distruction Thus you may sée if you haue a lust to behold the truth that not your new found Popish Catholique Church but our most auncient Christian Catholique Church is that Church that hath continued thoroughout firme and stedfast whiles all other couenticles and congregations aswell of Arians c as of Mahumetans and Popish Antichristians and the rest of Heretickes of all sortes haue decayed and béene conuinced and ouerthrowne and that by none other Church then by the knowne Catholique Church of Christ builded vpon the rocke Christ which Peter confessed Math. 16. Math. 16. And vpon none other foundation Wherefore I doo require you now to yéelde and recant according to your promise The fifte Offer Offerer Fifte if it may sufficiently be prooued that any other Church then the common knowne Catholique Church of Christ hath instituted and ordayned all goodly ceremonies and solemne obseruations in the same daily practised and vsed as the festiuall daies of Christmas Candelmas Easter Whitsontyde the feastes of the Apostles and holy Euangelistes Saint Michael the Archangell and of all hallowes and blessed Saintes the obseruation of the holy fast in lent and Ember dayes the fast of th'apstoles and of all the aforefayd festâ—uall Euens besides the weekely fast of Fridayes and Saterdayes and the rest yet obserued and allowed on both sides to the honor and glory of God then I will recant and not before Crowley Vnder the name of goodly ceremonies you comprehend all manner of ceremonies good and badde such as are daylie practised and vsed in your Church Your Baptising of Churches or buriall places of Belles and of Shippes to sayle on the Seas are goodly ceremonies Your hallowing of bread water or salte of Waxe and Wax candles bowes beades garmentes fire and
third about the ende of that 600. yéeres They that were in the tyme of the first 600 yéeres were persecuted by the dragan that is by the estate of Roome vnder the tirrannous Emperours And they that haue béene since and are now haue béene and styll are persecuted by the beast that hath two hornes lyke a Lambe that is the estate of Roome vnder the Papacie Apoc. 13. Apoc 13 These Prophets of booth sortes haue béene and are still styrred vp by him that is the giuer of all good giftes at hys pleâ—sure to worke his wyll in such tymes as he hath fore appoynted But there hath not béene at any time any continuall and orderly succession of them such as you require the Protestants to prooue neither dooth it help any thing at all for the proofe of true and right Religion to haue any such continuall and orderly succession except all the successors doo hold the same Religion and doo walke in the same steps that their first Predecessor held and walked in Amongst your Popes very few or none can bée founde that haue held the religion of Peter walked in his steps Your Boniface the third which was the first of your Apostatat Popes shewed him selfe to bée of a far other minde then Peter was otherwise hee would neuer haue sought for and with great contention haue obtained that name of vniuersall Bishop which Gregorie the first refused as a prophane name and a signe of the fore runner of Antichrist This would haue bin a lusty lad if hee might haue continued in the estate of a Pope many yéeres but hée was cut of by death in the ninth moneth after hee was made Pope The rest that haue succeeded euen vntill this day haue in one point walked in the steps of this Bonifacius for they all haue taken vpon them and kept the title of vniuersall Bishop and so dooth hee that dooth now enioy that place And so by good consequence it may bee said that they are all Antichristian But to returne to our purpose That church whereof the Protestants bee members hath had Apostles as longe time as th' office of an Apostle was necessary for hir In like maner shee hath had Prophets of both sortes Euangelists also shee hath had and hath still whose office is to water that which the Apostles haue planted Of this sorte was Timoth. and so was Apollos and others that were when they were and in the first 600. yeeres after Christs ascention And such bee they in these dayes which are able to instruct and doo labour to instruct Christians how to leade a christian life and to bee assured of Saluation onely by the mediation of Christ Iesus that promised Seede through whom all the nations of the world are promised to be happy and blessed Pastors and doctors also our Church hath alwaies had and now hath The Popes catholiques neuer had the like These are they that God hath made able to breake the breade of life to the flocke of Christ and to teach instruct them in all necessary knowledge to saluation And these as the others are made able stirred vp to worke in the Lords Haruest by him that as oft as néede is sendeth forth laborers into his Haruest Hée is not bound to maintaine a coÌ„tinuall orderly succession but when it pleaseth him to punish the vnthankfulnes of his people by taking from them such as hee hath made méete and able to execute these offices amongst them hee may and in iustice hée dooth That so his people may learne to vse such good gifts better when they shall againe enioy them And as for that popish-Catholique church which your sort doo call the knowne Catholique church neuer had such Apostles Prophets Euangelists Pastors and Doctors as S. Paule ment of in his writing to the Ephes For that Church was not hatched before the dayes of Boniface the third And therefore that church neither had nor could haue any such Apostles Prophets or Euangelists as our church had in the six hundreth yeeres next after the ascention of our sauiour I conclude therefore that neither our Church which is the right Catholique church nor yours which is the right Antichristian church hath had any such continuall and orderly succession as you require the Protestant to prooue by the Ecclesiasticall hystories I see no cause therefore why you should not recant and relent although you haue hitherto refused so to doo The ninth Offer Offerer Ninth Where as the Protestants by the drift of reason and Argument are forced of the Catholiques to acknowledge and confesse their Church and Congregations to haue lien hidden vnknowne for the space of one whole thousand yeeres togither without all the foresaid functions and ministrations of Apostles Prophets Euangelists Pastors and Doctors of their gospell faith and religion at the least wise to be openly perceiued knowne if therefore they shall be able for the space of that whole time to prooue by auncient writers of Ecclesiasticall hystories any other word gospell or doctrine to be vniuersally openly taught any other sacraments to be ministred any other discipline or correction to be practised any other iudgements decrees Canons or lawes to be executed then those which were daily practised in the common knowen Catholique Church of Christ I will then recant and not before Crowley This Offerer would beare vs in hand that wée Protestants are by the drift of reason and argument enforced to confesse c. Hée dooth vs great wrong in that hée auoutcheth that wée confesse that for the space of a thousand yéeres togither wée had no maner function or ministration c. As though wée should confesse that wée had no gospel no faith no religion And yet his owne conscience driueth him to say thus At the least wise to be openly perceiued known Well then his owne conscience telleth him that wée had those ministrations and that it was knowne that wée had them but not openly It appéereth that this man vnderstandeth nothing of the mysterie of that woman that the Apostle Iohn saw in his vision Apoc. 12. Apoc. 12. If these Antichristian Catholiques could content them selues to bée taught by such as God hath stirred vp made able to open the meaning of this mystery they should sée that the right Catholique church of Christ hath bin in Wildernesse euer since the Male childe that shee brought foorth was taken vp into heauen Yea although shee bee clad with the sunne and hath the Moone vnder hir feete yet doo not these men so sée hir that they may discerne hir from the congregations of the heathen bicause their sight is such as the sight of Howlets and such other night fowles that cannot endure the brightnes of the sunne Immediately after our sauiour Christ was ascended into heauen the Dragon that olde serpent the deuill Satan being vanquished by Michael and his Angels expelled out of heauen and cast downe to the earth did persecute the
Christ which was 70. yéeres after as it is supposed that Peter was made bishop of Rome So that the church vsed none of those things that were diuised by him for the space of those 70. yéeres of the first 300. yeeres After this Alexander Sixtus 1. was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 121. after the incarnation of our sauiour Christ if the hystories bee true and the fourescore yeere after the supposed entring of Peter into the Byshopricke of Rome This man diuised sundrie things as Sanctus sanctus sanctus to bée songe in the celebration of the Lords supper But heere I must note how vnlikely this is to bée true for as saint Augustine hath written in the 7. August li. 9. Conf. Ca. 7. Chapter of the 9. booke of his confessions the custome of singing in churches was not begun in the Latine church before the dayes of Ambros who liued about the yeere of our Lord 380. And more ouer it can not bee prooued by any hystories that the Christians had any liberty to builde any church in the citie Rome before the time of Constantine the Emperoure who builded at his owne charges the first churches that the Christians had in Rome But let it bée as Platina hath written in the life of Sixtus the first Hée commanded that Sanctus sanctus sanctus that is holy holy holy should bee songe in the celebration that is in the ministration of the cōmunion But I pray you marke what Platina saith further Nuda primo haec erant c. At the first those things were bare and naked and all thinges were handled simply For when Peter did consecrate hée vsed the prayer Our father Iames the bishop of Hierusalem encreased or enriched these mysteries and so did Basill and other For Celestinus gaue the Introite of the Masse Gregorie the Kyrie eleison Telesphorus the Gloria in excelsis Deo Gelasius the first gaue the Collations and Hierome the Epistle and the Gospell Haleluia was taken from the church of Hierusalem The Credo from the counsell of Néece Pelagius inuented the cōmemoration of the deade Leo the third inuented the Incense Innocent the first inuented the kissing of the Paxe And Sergius ordained that Agnus Dei should bée songe But séeing that in the daies of Sixtus fewe were founde by reason of the often murders or slaughters of Christians that durst professe the name of Christ and the Christians in France did desire to haue a bishop Sixtus did send vnto them one Peregrinus a citizen of Rome c. Thus far Platina By these woords of Platina it appeareth that during the first 80. yeeres after saint Peters supposed entring into the bishopricke of Rome there was no more vsed in the ministration of the Lords supper but the Lords prayer which beginneth thus Our father which arte in heauen c. Celestinus that gaue the Introite of the Masse was not bishop in Rome before the ende of 420. yeeres after Christ so that for the space of 420. yéeres your Masse had no Introite That Gregorie that appointed the Kyrie eleison was made bishop of Rome in the yéere 590. after Christ so that your Masse lacked that parte for the space of 600. yeeres almost Telesphorus added the Gloria in excelsis about 130. yeeres after Christ so that your Masse did lack that parte so longe time Gelasius the first that diuised the Collations was bishop of Rome about 490. yeeres after Christ so that your Masse lacked hir Collations almost 500. yéeres Hieronimus that added the Epistle and Gospell was neuer bishop either in Rome or else where Hee liued in Bethlehem about 380. yéeres after Christ so that your Masse had no Epistle or Gospell for 380. yeeres after Christ And your Halleluia was taken from the church of Hierusalem by Gregorie the first who was bishop of Rome about the yéere of our Lord 590. The Nicene Créede could not be vsed before that councell wherein it was agréed vpon which was 330. yeeres after Christ And Pelagius that inuented the remembrance of the deade was made bishop of Rome in the yeere of our Lord 556. so that for the space of so many yeeres after Christ there was no remembrance of the deade in your Masse Leo the third that inuented the burning of Incense was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 796. after Christ so that for the space of so many yeeres there was no burning of Incense in churches Innocent the first was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 406. hée inuented the kissing of the Paxe at Masse so longe therefore was your Masse without that ceremonie And Sergius that appointed the singing of Agnus Dei was made bishop of Rome in the yeere after Christ 694. or there about so that your Masse lacked hir Agnus Dei for the space almost of 700. yeeres after Christ Now M. Offerer consider with your selfe I pray you whether the learned Protestant may not as easily prooue the antiquitie of his communion booke euen from the Apostles time as you may prooue your Authenticall seruice and ministration of sacraments now daily openly practized If you would with indifferent iudgment weigh al that I haue here written I doo not doubt but you would cōfesse that during the first 90. yéeres after Christs ascention there was no prescribed order set downe in any booke for publike seruice or ministration of sacramēts other then that which is contained in the scriptures Wherefore there is none so great a cause of misliking in oure common booke as that there be so many of your latter inuētions allowed of in it And surely if our princes people would yéelde to a perfect reformation wee might make our communion booke a great deale lesse then it is by blotting out of it all that hath bin inuented by your bishops of Rome Thus I doo thinke I haue said enough to cause you to recant although you would not before The twelfth Offer Offerer I demaund of the learned Protestant to know cause and reason why their congregations doo admit and receiue all bishops priests deacons and other officers spirituall ordered by our Catholike church as men lawfull and sufficient to preach the word of God to minister the Sacramēts to exercise all spirituall iurisdiction in no lesse wise but rather more then if they had bin ordred in their owne congregations whereas the Catholike church of Christ dooth not acknowledge any man of their ordering and calling to be any whit the more fit for any spirituall function in Christ his church then other cōmon lay men When therefore the learned Protestant shal be able to shew good cause and reason why our Catholike church hauing by their owne consent and approouing lawfull priestes bishops and spirituall ministers not to be also the lawfull true and Catholike church of Christ I will then recant and not before Crowley This Offer is altogither friuolous and foolish For what reason was it that mooued this vnreasonable Offerer to require the learned
orderly succession of Bishops the vniformitie of solemne Ceremonies and the vnitie of faith that hath in her selfe all holy functions of the spirite as working of miracles remission of sinnes the true cence and interpretation of Gods word that is beautified with diuersity of states commended by Christ as with Martirs with Confessors holy virgins and such other Let the Protestant prooue vnto me that this is not the true Church and that we are not bound to obey and beleeue this Church and none other in al controuersies doubts vprising eyther by the difficulty of Scripture or by vayne contention and pride of Heretickes and I wyll yeelde and recant and not before Crowley The Protestant hath already prooued that the Church whereof this Offerer is a member hath not béene of so long continuaunce as fiftéene hundreth yéeres Yea and that there be not yet a full thousand yéeres past since that Church became of such power and estimation in the world as now it dooth challendge to it selfe and as this Offerer dooth bragge of That Church which is Catholique in déede whereof all right Protestāts be members hath bad continuance euen euer since this promise was made in the daies of the first man I wyll put enimitie betwixt thée and the woman betwixt thy séede and her séede her séede shall breake thy heade and thou shalt assalt his héele Gen 3. These wordes dyd God him selfe speake to the sperpent and this promise dyd the first man and his wyfe beléeue and they and theyr faithfull posteritie dyd from time to time looke for and long after the performaunce of this promise euen tyll our Sauiour Christ which is that blessed séede of the woman had in déede performed it Our Sauiour Christ speaking of this looking for and longing after sayd thus to his disciples Many Prophets and Princes haue desired to sée those things that you sée and haue not séene them and to heare those wordes that you heare and haue not heard them Luc. 10. Lucae 10 And againe speaking to the Iewes he sayd Your father Abraham dyd aduaunce him selfe that he might sée my day and he dyd sée it and reioyce in it Iohn 8. Iohn 8. And this Catholique Church hath continued still in all troubles and persecutions and dooth continue to this day and so shall to the ende still reioysing in the day of Christ that is already past and looking and longing after that day of his that is yet to come which is the day of his appearing in glory when all his shall appeare with him in glorie Colo 3. Coloss 3 This Church hath had the vse of Sacraments euer since Sacraments were instituted But before Abrahams time there was not any Sacrament ordayned for the first Sacrament was Circumcision and the other Sacrament was the Passe-ouer which was instituted in the dayes of Moses By this it appeareth that the Church was before the sacramentes were and so it followeth by good consequence that Sacramentes are not necessarily required to the constituting of a Church Yea and after those Sairamentes were instituted the vse of them was by occasion intermitted and yet the Church that dyd intermit the vse of those Sacramentes was still the Church of God notwithstanding the intermitting of the vse of the Sacraments As in the time of the people of Isralites béeing in the wildernes which was fortie yéeres both Circumcission and the Passeouer were intermitted and yet that people were styll accounted to bée and were in déede the Church of God Euen so our Sauiour Christ haueing fulfilled the lawe did institute two Sacramentes in the place or stéede of those two that were before hys incarnation namely Baptisme and the Sacrament of his body and blood and left them to hys Church with commaundement that they should bee vsed in hys Church and therfore the Church of Christ may not refuse to vse them But yet if by iust occasion the Church shal be enforced to intermit the vse of them for as long or longer tyme then the Isralites dyd intermit the vse of theyr Sacramēts this may not be thought to be a iust cause to account that Church to be no Catholique Church which hath for a tyme intermitted the vse of Sacramentes But that Catholique Church whereof we Protestants be members hath not any at time intermitted the vse of these two Sacraments that Christ hath ordayned no not in the tyme of most bloody persecution as in most auncient Histories it dooth appeare And after the ende of those bloody persecutions which dyd continue almost to the ende of the first 300. yéeres after Christes ascention the same Church dyd continue the vse of the same Sacramentes publiquely and openly which before that time bloodie Tirrannie would not suffer them to doo But when the tyme of Apostacie was come and the man of sinne of whom S. Paule wrote 2 Thessa 2. 2 Thessa 2 had gotten the vpper hand then this Church was inforced to leaue that open vse that of Sacraments that it had continued for the space almost of 300. yéeres and to vse them as before shee had doone in the time of the first bloody persecutions For the Romane Church béeing fallen away from the Catholique Church became as bloodily minded as euer the Romane Empire had béene Thus the Catholique Church whereof wee bée members hath continued and dooth stil continue the vse of those Sacraments that Christ hath instituted As for confirmation order and that which you call penaunce matrimony and extreame vnction wée doo not acknowledge to bée Sacraments because they agrée not with the definition or discription of a Sacrament which is a visible signe of an inuisible spirituall grace instituted by Christ him selfe we knowe and doo confesse that confirmation is a good order and may bée vsed to the edification of the Church and therfore it is appointed by publique Authority that when younglinges shal be instructed so that they shal be able in some measure to make profession of the Christian fayth they shal bée brought to the Bishop that by prayer to God for them and laying on of his handes vpon them they may bée the better confirmed in that faith which they haue learned and professed The ordering of ministers we allowe of also as of a good profitable order in the Church for we know that no man may take vpon himselfe that honour but such as shal be called thereunto as Aron was And therefore as great care as may be is taken in the chosing of such as shal be admitted to the ministry and as great circumspection in the admitting Heb. 5. If any fault be in this behalfe it is not in the lawe that prescribeth a good and perfect order to be obserued herein but in the lacke of care that may be in such as haue the execution of the law As touching that which you cal penance wée doo neither accept of it as of a Sacrament because we knowe that it is none neyther doo we take
gospell and haue imbraced and professed and doo still professe most vnpure Popish religion The booke was first written by the aboue named Iohn de Albine as it may be thought either in the Latine or in the French tonge Wherefore I meane not to bestow any time in the answering of it supposing that either Beza or some other French Protestant hath already dealt therein sufficiently But because the offers séeme to be made by some English man and haue not as I thinke béene aunswered by any man I haue thought good to supply the place of that learned Protestant that the Popish Catholique ment to make the offers vnto And that the Offerer if hee be yet liuing or any fréende of his if he be departed this lyfe may not haue any cause to mislike with my dealing herein I minde to setfoorth to the view of the Reader all the words of the Offerer euen as I finde them and as I haue them to shew in his printed Coppie which I haue and doo mind to kéepe in a readinesse to shewe not abiding or dimnishing altering or changing one sentence worde sillable letter or title The Offerer beginneth thus The Offerer First seeing it cannot bee denied that our sauiour Christ before his departure and ascension did commit the charge and gouernment of his Church the testimony of his worde the truth of his gospell the ministration of his Sacraments to his Apostles and Disciples and that not only for them selues but to their successors Bishops and Priests and to none other saying only to them Euntes docete omnes gentes Math. 28. Marc. 16. Goe yee and teach all people and nations of the world baptizing them in the name of the father and of the sonne and of the holy ghoste teaching them to obserue and keepe all things which I haue commaunded you Further the Apostle Saint Paule being at Miletum in executing of his charge gouernment gaue this admonition to the Bishops and Priestes there assembled before him saying Attēdite vobis et vniuer so gregi Act. 20. Take heed vnto your selues and vnto the whole flocke of Christ in the which the holy ghost hath ordayned you Bishops Regere ecclesiam Dei To gouerne the Church of God And in the thirteenth Chapter of his Epistle to the Hebrews hee dooth commaunded all other sortes of men without exception of Emperours Kings Queenes and Princes to obay their Bishops and priestes saying Heb. 13. Obedite praepositis vestris subiacete eis ipsi enim peruigilant quasi rationem pro animabus vestris reddituri Obey your Prelates and doo what they appoint you for they doo watch as men that shall render accomptes for your soules Seeing that by the testimonies before alleadged it can not bee denyed but that the charge and gouernment of Chryst his Church the preaching of his doctrine the admninistration of his Sacramentes was by him committed to his Apostles and Dysciples and to all Byshoppes and Priestes as Successours of them to plante Chrystian fayth and Religion in his Catholique Church vniuersally throughout all Nations Coastes and Quarters of the world Seeing this is by the playnnesse of the sayd testimonies of such an vndoubted truth that it cannot bee denyed now let the learned protestant affirming princes to bee the supreme heades of the Church eyther shew by some such other like playne testymonies of the Scriptures that our Sauiour Chryst did commit the chyefe charge and supreme gouernement of his Church to Emperours Kings Queenes and Princes to plant Christian fayth and Religion in the same or that any one of Chryst his Apostles or Disciples did conuert any people Lande or Countrey from their Idolatrie and Ethnike kinde of liuing to Christian faith and Religion by preaching the doctrine of the Protestants as of onely faith to iustifie the contempt of good workes and that they be all vncleane in sight of GOD the deniall of free will of the real presence of Christes body in the holy Eucharist of the Sacrifice of the most blessed Masse the abolishing Christ his Sacramentes and of all grace and goodnesse by them conferred vnto vs then I shall yeelde and recant and not before Thus farre the first part of the Offer Crowley This Offerer hath deuided this offer of his into 22. parts adding to the last part six certaine and assured signes and tokens of false Prophets Heretickes Schismatickes This diuision I meane to follow in mine answer To this first part therfore I say thus maister Offerer I cōfesse that our Sauiour Christ dyd as you haue sayd committe the charge and gouernement of his Church the testimonye of his worde the trueth of his Gospell and the ministration of his Sacramentes to his Apostles and Scholers and to theyr successors But not to such successours onely as you do name that is to Bishops and Préestes onely and to none other For S. Paule in the 12. Chapter of his first Epistle to the Corinthians and in the 4. to the Ephesians writing of the same matter sayth thus Et ipse dedit quosdam quidem Apostolos Eph 4. quosdam autem Prophetas alios vero Euangelistas alios autem Pastores Doctores And he hath giuen some Apostles or Messengers and some Prophettes and other some Euangelistes and some others Pastors and teachers And againe in the 12. of the first to the Corinthians hee writeth thus 1 Cor 12. Et quosdam posuit Deus in Ecclesia primum Apostolos secundo Prophetas tertio Doctores deinde virtutes exinde gratias curationum opitulationes gubernationes genera linguarum God hath place in his Church certaine degrees of men first Apostles secondly Prophets thirdly teachers then powers after that giftes of healings helpes gouernements kindes of tongues Least you should quarell about the translating of S. Paules wordes out of the Gréeke I haue set them downe as I finde them in that translation that your Tridentine councell hath allowed of But I pray you good M. Offerer what meant S. Paule that in the rehearsall of those sundry degrées of men that God hath placed in his Church he would make no mentiion at al of your Bishops and Préestes to whom onely as to the onely successours of his Apostles and Disciples Christ spake if you haue written truely when he sayd thus Math. 28 Euntes docete omnes gentes Goe ye and teach all nations of the worlde c. Without all doubt S. Paule dyd know and so doo wée that God dyd neuer place in his Church or appoint to succéede his Apostles and Disciples any such Bishops and Préestes as you meane of That is Lording and loitring Bishops exercising dominion ouer the peoples that are alotted vnto them and sawsie sacrificing Préests which presume to occupie the place of Christ himselfe and to execute his office in offering sacrifice for the sinnes of the people S. Peter disaloweth the one 1. Pet. 5. and S. Paule the other Hebr. 10. Hebr 1◠1 Peter ◠Yea if our
Sauiour Christ dyd speake only to such Bishops and Préests as you doo appoint to be the successours of the Apostles and disciples of Christ when he sayd Euntes c. Goe and teach all nations of the worlde c. Howe hath that his commaundement béene or howe is it executed sith they commonly neither doo nor can teache those thinges that our Sauiour commaunded his Apostles and scholers to teach and to doo The successors of the Apostles and scholers of our Sauiour Christ to whome those wordes were at the first and be still spoken must bee such as God hath dooth and shall make méete to doo his message to men of all sortes to foreshewe vnto them by the Scriptures what hangeth ouer theyr heades if they will not regarde the message to comfort them with the assurance of the performaunce of the swéet promises which God hath made in the blood of his sonne Christ Iesus to foster féede and nourishe them with the foode of his heauenly worde and to teach and instruct them in the way of the trueth so that they may be able to discerne betwéene the broad way that leadeth to destruction and that narrowe way that leadeth to lyfe euerlasting and to continue walking in that way euen to the ende of their life in this transitorie state Thus much doo those wordes signifie which I haue cited out of the fourth Chapter of S. Paules Epistle to the Ephesians And in the wordes that I haue cited out of the 12. Chapter of the first to Corinth Saint Paule hath added that these wordes of our Sauiour Christ were spoken to them also whom God hath dooth or shall make mighty endueinge them with power from aboue making them able to stande against and to withstand yea and vanquishe the ghostly enimies that is the deuill the world and the fleshe to cure sicknesses and diseases to succour helpe and comfort the weake and féeble to gouerne the simple and to vnderstand and speake diuers languages All this may be vnderstanded in these wordes of S. Paule God hath placed in his Church certaine degrées of men first Apostles secondly prophets thirdly teachers after that powers after that giftes of healing helpings gouernementes and diuersities of tongues So that these words go and teach all nations c. Were spoken first to the Apostles and Scholers of our Sauiour Christ and then to all such their successours as God hath dooth or shall make méete any way to teach those thinges that he hath commaunded to be taught practised But now M. Offerer hath found that S. Paule being at Miletum hath admonished the Bishops Priestes that were assembled before him there saying AtteÌ„dite vobis c. Take héede to your selues and vnto the whole flocke of Christ in which the holy Ghost hath ordained you Bishops Act. 10. Regere Ecclesiam Dei. To gouerne the Church of God And againe in the 13. Chapter of his Epistle to the Hebrewes Saint Paule dooth commaund all other sortes of men without exception of Emperours Kings Quéenes and Princes to obay their Bishops and Préestes saying Obedite praepositis vostris subiacete eis ipsi enim peruigilant quasi rationem pro animabus vestris reddituri Obey your Prelates and doo what they appoint you to do for they doo watch as men that shall render an account for your soules Héere is subtile Sophistrie in the stéede of probable reasoning and profound Diuinity These testimonies bée so plaine that it can not be denied but that as the charge gouernement of Christes Church c. was committed to Christs Apostles and Disciples so the same is committed to Popish Bishops and Préestes as to their successors But I pray you good M. Offerer let vs consider of these two places that you haue cited Saint Luke reporting the Actes or déedes of the Apostles sayth that Saint Paule hasting towardes Ierusalem would spend no time in Asia and therefore determining to passe by Ephesus sent messengers thether to require the Elders of the congregation to repayre vnto him being then in the Iland Milâ—tâ— which is now called Mâ—lâ—a These Elders you doo name Bishops and Préestes But the Gréeke worde that S. Luke vseth there can not by any meanes signifie eyther a Bishoppe or Préest of that sorte that you speake of For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dooth signifie one that is elder or more auncient in yéeres or more honorable then they be amongst whom he liueth And such were they that commonly were chosen in those dayes to be teachers instructours and gouernours in the congregations or Churches of Christians and therefore they were called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Obseruers watchmen searchers such as had the ouersight of things committed to them But your Bishops and Préestes most bee such as the Grecians doo call by the name of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 That is a Préest that offereth sacrifices But héere I will make you one offer M. Offerer which shal be thus If you can finde in any of the Bookes of the newe Testament that eyther our Sauiour Christ speaking of the ministers of the new Testament or any of the Apostles writing of the seuerall sortes of ministers that our Sauiour Christ hath ordayned to serue or minister in his Churche haue vsed eyther of these Gréeke woordes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which doo signifie a sacrificing Preest then will I recante the Protestants doctrine and subscribe to your Papisticall doctrine and not before In the place that you haue cited out of the 20. Chapter of the Acts of the Apostles S. Paule calleth the ministers of Ephesus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is watch men or ouerséers appointed by the holy Ghost 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is to gouerne the Church of God in such sorte as a shéepheard dooth gouerne and féede his flocke but not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is to exercise lordlike authority ouer them as your meaning must néedes bée that your Bishoppes and Préestes should For you say that S. Paule dooth commaund all other sorts of men without exception c. To obay their Bishops and Préestes saying Obedite c. Obay your prelates c. And here I must néedes note your corrupt manner of handling of this place of S. Paule He himselfe dooth beséech those Hebrewes that he worte vnto to suffer or to take in good part that short exhortation that he gaue them but you say that hee commaunded them yea though they were Emperours Kings Quéenes or Princes to obaye theyr Prelates and to doo what they appoint In the Latine you cite the wordes Hebr 13. as they are in the vulgare translation allowed in the Tridentine councell Obedite c. It pleaseth you to set downe for Praepositis Prelates minding as it séemeth to make vs beléeue that such Prelates as you call Bishops and Préests must by S Paules commaundement be so obeyed of all Emperours Kings Quéenes and Princes and so by
good consequence of all persons that are inferiour to these that whatsoeuer these Prelats shall appoint to be doone must of necessitie be doone by all men and women of euery degrée as though such Prelates onely and none other might be in the Latine called Praepositi and in the Gréeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Which Latine and Gréeke wordes doo signifie all manner of superiours whether they be of the ecclesticall or ciuill state Yea and that dutie of watching as men that shall render an account for the soules of men is common to all those superiours of all sortes wherefore you haue dealt very iniuriouslie in that you haue restrayned that duety of watching to your Prelates onely Saint Paule in his Epistle to the Romanes the 13. Chapter writeth thus Omnis anima Rom. 13. potestatibus sublimioribus sub dit a sit Let euery soule be subiect to the higher powers c. If you had séene and considered what Chrysostome writteth vpon these woords of Saint Paule I think you would neuer haue written as you haue done affirming that saint Paule hath commaunded all manner men without exception yea though they were Emperours Kings Quéenes or Princes so to obey your Prelates as to doo whatsoeuer they shall appoint them to doo Chrysost in Rom. 13. for Chrysostome wryteth thus Etiam si Apostolus sis si Euangelista si Propheta siue quisquis tandem fueris Neque enim pietatem subuertit ista subiectio Et non simpliciter dicit obediat sed subiecta sit Although thou shouldst be an Apostle an Euangelist or a Prophet or what maner of man soeuer thou shouldst bée For this subiection dooth not subuert pietie or godlines And hée dooth not simply say Let euery soule obay but hée saith Let it bee in subiection Thus much Chrysostome writing vpon the first words of the thirteenth to the Romaines And in the same Chapter that you cite out of the Epistle to the Hebrewes saint Paule seemeth to haue the same meaning that hée had when hée wrote to the Romaines For thus hée writeth to the Hebrews in the latter end of the thirtéenth Chapter Salutate omnes qui praesunt vobis omnes Sanctos Salute all them that are your Rulers and all the Saintes If these Rulers that saint Paule willeth the Hebrews to salute were such as you say they were when hée commaundeth them to obey that is to say Bishops Priests then was not this Epistle written to them but to the inferiour sorte amongst the Hebrews which is a thing too absurd to bée graunted For what ciuilitie honestie or wisedome may that man bée thought to haue that would write such an Epistle as this to the inferiours of any congregation of Christians and not to the superiours of the same congregation These Hebrews were Christians and dwelt as my bée thought in sundrie Cities within the Dominions of the Emperour of Rome As in Hierusalem or in any other of those Cities that had belonged to the kingdome of Israel or in any other kingdome or prouince And it is like that the Apostle being in Italy when hée wrote this Epistle had some occasion to admonish them of that opinion which commonly the posteritie of Abraham held which was that they ought not to liue in subiection to any rulers that were not of the same posteritie And therefore hée wrote vnto them as before Obedite c. Obey your Superiours and submit your selues vnto them And as in this place Salutate c. Salute all those that be in authority ouer you As though hée should haue said thus I know that you would gladly bée gouerned as you are Hebrews borne by such as bée Hebrews as you are and as you are Christians by Christians as your selues bée But sith you sée that God will haue it otherwise let such as God hath set ouer you haue their due honour at your hands Obey them honour them serue them giue them all tributes and customs due vnto them and pray to God for them that you may leade a peaceable and quiet life vnder them And that they may the rather bée mooued to bée fauourable to you salute them in my name and in like maner salute all saitns that is all Christians though they bée of the Gréekes that they may know that both I and you doo estéeme of them as of fellow members of that one body whereof Christ is the head This may bée the meaning of the Apostle in those woords that you haue cited and in the other that follow But it may bée that some of your sorte will say that in the seuenth verse of the same Chapter the Apostle hath written thus Hebr 13. Memores estote c. Bée mindefull of those your rulers that haue spoken vnto you the woorde of God and follow their faith considering what the end of their conuersation was Here you will say that these rulers must néedes bée preachers of the woorde I confesse that the Apostle dooth in these woords meane of such But shall wée therefore say that they were Bishops and Priests such as you haue affirmed them to bée It appéereth manifestly by the Apostles words that they were the same that had preached the gospell vnto them and had continued constant in preaching the same doctrine to the end of their liues and had sealed it with their blood For the Apostle saith thus Considering what the end of their conuersation hath bin which can not bée ment of any that did then presently gouerne or teach them Yea and how could the Apostle take vpon him to commaund Emperours Kings Quéenes and Princes to obey such Bishops and Priestes as the Hebrews being a simple sort of Christians could haue to rule and teach them The testimonies therefore that you alleage M. Offerer may right well bée denyed for they testifie not that which you would affirme by them For although the charge and gouernment of the Church of Christ the preaching of the doctrine of the gospell and the ministration of the sacraments of Christ were committed to the Apostles and Disciples of Christ and to their successours yet are not the same committed to your Bishops and Priests for they are not the successours eyther of Christ or any Apostle or Dysciple of Christ except you will néedes haue them the successors of Iudas Iscariot or of Simon Magus But now the learned Protestant that you make your offer vnto must either prooue by some such other like plaine testimonies of the Scriptures that our Sauiour Chryst did commit the chiefe charge and supreme gouernment of his Church to Emperours Kinges Quéenes Princes to plant Chrystian fayth and Religion in the same or else that some one of Chrystes Apostles or Disciples did conuert some one People Land or Countrey from their Idolatrie and Ethinke kinde of liuing to Christia◠faith and Religion by preaching the doctrine of the Protestants c. For Protestants to prooue by plaine testimonies of the Scriptures that our Sauiour Christ did
canonicall mo bookes then these In the olde testament saith hée the fiue bookes of Moses that is Genesis Exodus Leuiticus Numbers Deuteronomium After these Iesus Naue of the Iudges togither with Ruth After these foure bookes of the raignes of kings which the Hebrews doo account but two Paralipomenon which is called the booke of dayes and two of Esdras which they doo receaue each by it selfe and the booke of Hester And of the Prophets Esaie Ieremie Ezechiell Daniell bisides these one booke of the xii Prophets Iob also and the Psalmes of Dauid are each of them one booke Salomon also hath giuen vnto the churches thrée bookes the Prouerbs Ecclesiastes and Cantica canticorum In these bookes haue the fathers shut vp the number of the bookes of the old testamēt And of the New testament there are foure Gospelles of Mathew Marke Luke and Iohn The Acts of the Apostles which Luke dooth describe Fouretéene Epistles of Paule the Apostle of Peter the Apostle two of Iames the brother of the Lord an Apostle one Epistle of Iudas one of Iohn thrée and the Apocalyps of Iohn These bée the volumes which the fathers haue shut vp within the canon whereof the father would that the assertions of our faith should consist Notwithstanding it is néedefull to bée knowne that there be other bookes also which are not canonicall but our auncestors haue called them Ecclesiastical That is to say wisdome which is said to bée Salomons And another Wisdome which is said to bée of the sonne of Sirach which is by the Latinists named by the same generall name Ecclesiasticus By which name not the author of the booke but the qualitie of the scripture is named And of the same Order is the booke of Tobias Iudith and the bookes of Machabies Thus far Ruffinus in his creede or confession of beliefe set foorth by saint Hierome And not many liues after this hée writeth thus These volumes haue the fathers deliuered vnto vs which as I haue said it hath séemed to mée méete to note out for the instruction of such as doo take vpon them the first rudimēts of the church of faith that they may know out of what fountaines the cups of the woord of God must bée drawne Now M. Offerer I pray you confer these words of Ruffinus with that decrée that was made by your fathers of the Tridentine councel in their 4. Session wherein they allow for canonicall all those bookes that haue bin are cōtained in that booke which is cōmonly called the Bible With them the bookes of Tobias Hester Iudith Wisdome Ecclesiasticus the two bookes of the Machabies are of as great authoritie as the rest and they doo denounce accursed all such as doo not or shall not receiue for canonicall all those books and euery part of them making no diffrence betwixt these and the other which Ruffinus hath said the fathers haue deliuered vnto vs as fountaines out of which the cups of the word of God must be drawn Let your fathers therfore denounce accursed this Ruffinus and those fathers that he speaketh of for they be of one minde with vs. Let them accursse S. Hierome that hath set foorth this Créede of Ruffinus as a sound confession of the Christian faith Let them excōmunicate S. Gregorie Grego Morali in 29. lib. Cap. 19. Hiero. in praefacio prou that in the 19. of his morall exposition of the 29. Chapter of Iob dooth confesse that the first booke of the Machabies is not canonicall Yea let them accursse S. Hierome as black as a pot for that in his preface to the prouerbes of Salomon he saith thus The church dooth read the bookes of Iudith Tobie the Machabies for th'edification of the people but not to confirme the authority of the doctrines of the Church This Hierome such other were the fathers the Ruffinus saith haue deliuered to vs the other bookes of the Bible not these to bee fountaines for vs to draw the cups of Gods word out of them And with these would wée rather bée accursed then blessed with your popish Catholique fathers in your Tridentine counsell You frame an argument after this maner If the Catholique church had the true spirite of God in discerning iudging the true scriptures of God from the rest not scriptures why should not we belieue the same Catholike church gouerned led by the same spirit in giuing the true sence meaning vnderstanding of the scriptures To this I answere That the romish Catholique church which now is hath continued for the space almost of a thousand yéeres is not neither hath bin led by the true spirit of God either in discerning or iudging the true scriptures of God from the rest c. Nor yet in giuing the true sence c but it hath bin and is still led by the spirite of Antichrist And that neuer more apparantly then at the Tridentyne counsell as by the canons of the same counsell dooth most manifestly appéere to as many as with indifferent iudgement can and will reade them Thus haue I shewed you sufficient reasons whereby you might bée mooued to yeelde and ioyne with vs in religion and no longer to depend vpon the iudgement of that Antichristian church which you call Catholique for that you may sée if you bee not altogither blinded that it is not the true spirite of God that hath and dooth leade your Catholique church but in déede the false spirite of Antichrist The fourth Offer Offerer Fourth Let the Protestants make sufficient proofe by auncient writers of the Ecclesiastiall histories what church it is that al these fifteene hundreth yeeres past hath continued through out firme and stedfast while all other conuenticles and cōgregations as well of Arians as of the Nestorian Maniches Nouatians Vigilians Iouinians and the rest of Heretikes of all sortes haue decayed bin conuinced and ouerthrowne and that by any other Church then by the common knowne Catholique church of Christ and I shall then yeelde and recant and not before Crowley It is very true that the knowne Catholike church hath bin and still is as for these fiftéene hundreth yéeres last past it hath bin the meane that God hath vsed in the conuinsing ouerthrowing of Arians Nestorians and the rest of the Heretikes that you speake of It is most true also that the same Catholike church hath all this time continued firme and stedfast but how can you prooue that your popish Catholike church is that knowne Catholike church of Christ that you speake of Héerein lieth the difficulty It is not enough for you to say that your romish church is the Catholike church but you must prooue it Your antiquity your vniuersality your vnity with your continuall succession of Bishops will not serue your turne Your antiquity is not so auncient as ours by 4600. yéeres almost For ours began in Adam hath continued euer since yours began to florish in the daies of Phocas the
it if he were caught or else béene enforced to abiure and so goeth it with such at this day and so is it lyke to continue so long as your Antechristian mother shal be able to doo any thing The thousandes which that mother of your hath in this tyme of the last thousand yéeres murdered in Italie in Bohemie in Germany in Portinggale in Spaine in England in Scotland and in the late massacre in Fraunce doo all with one voice crie vnder our Alter Christ saying How long Lord thou that art holy and true doost thou not iudge and reuenge our bloode vpon them that that dwell on the earth Apoc 6. Apocal. 6. If you had not altogether lost your inwarde sight you might sée that the crie of these holy Martyrs is hearkened vnto for sixe of the seauen Angelles to whom were giuen seauen Vialles sull of the wrath of God haue already powred out theyr Vialles at the commaundement of God and the seuenth is ready to power out his Viall and shall shortly power it out into the ayre And then shal that great voice procéede out from the temple of Heauen euen from the throne saying Factum est It is finished Apoc 16. Apoc 16 This voyce shal be terrible to your Popish Catholique mother and to all you her children But most comfortable to the true Catholique Church of Christ our mother and to all vs her children I say therefore vnto you as Christ Iesus sayd to the Angell of the Church of Laodicea Apoc 3. annoynt thine eyes with eye salue that thou maiest sée c. Apoc 3 Thus I hope I haue made it plaine enough to as many as will sée that the Church whereof all right Protestantes are members hath brought foorth all those thousandes of Martirs that you speake of when you say that not one of them was of our congregation fayth or beléefe whiles they liued in this transitorie estate And that she hath brought foorth and nourished vp thousands moe in the tyme of thesâ— latter 1000. yéeres which your mother the Popish Catholique Church hath murdered and made Martirs Wherefore submit your selfe now and recant although you would not before The eight Offer Offerer Eight Wheras the Apostle S. Paule testifieth that Christ gaue vnto his church some Apostles some Prophets some Euangelists some Pastors and Doctors ad consummationem sanctorum in opus ministerij and so to continue to the edifiing of the bodie the Catholique Church vntill his comming againe Now if the Protestants shal be able to prooue by ecclesiastical histories of all ages the continuance vse of the sayd functions and degrees in theyr congregations and that by some orderly succession and plaine account made from Christ his tyme hetherto they haue neuer lacked the sayd appointed officers or that any other Church of Christ hath had at all times and the continuance of the same I shall then recant and relent and not before Crowley Ephe 4 It is a strang matter to sée how impudently this Offerer dare set downe the wordes of the Apostle Paule in the 4. Chapter of his Epistle to the Eph. as testifying that for an in fallible trueth which is as false as God himselfe is true That is that our Sauiour Christ hath appointed that hys Church shall haue Apostles Prophets Euangelists Pastors and Doctors continually tyll his comming againe and that in a continuall and orderly succession Amongest the learned interpreters there is not one that hath noted anie such meaning in those wordes of the Apostle It is verie true that our Sauiour Christ made choyse of such men as he had made méete to be his messengers and sent them foorth first into those Citties that belonged to the Kingdome of Israel and after his resurrection he sent them into al the world commaunding them to teach all nations Baptising the beléeuers in the name of the father of the sonne and of the holie Ghost And by the ministerie of those and a fewe others whome he dyd afterward stirre vp and ioyne in commission with those hée planted hys Church in all quarters of the world Those were the Apostles of whome Saint Paule wrote to the Ephesian 4. saying Hée gaue some Apostles These contynued in executing theyr offyce fathfully and painefullie tyll they had runne out the rase of theyr naturall lyfe Which course God dyd not suffer to bée ended béefore the sounde of them had béene hearde all the world ouer as appeareth by the wordes of Saynt Paule Rom 10 Rom 10 When these had executed theyr office and were taken out of this lyfe it was not néedefull that other should bée sent from God to doo that worke which these men had alreadie finished and so it was altogeather vnnecessarie that there should bée an orderly succession of Apostles in the Church But when God shall sée cause hee may at hys pleasure stirre vp and sende foorth such messengers as hée shall make méete to doo hys message And such hée hath styrred vp sence the tyme of those fyrst Apostles and such hee dooth and wyll styr vp send foorth at his â—leasure and such may bée called Apostles of Christ béecause they be styrred vp by hys spirit and are sent of hym But this can not bée called a continuall and orderly succession Such Apostles our Church did not lacke in the time of the first 600 yéeres next after the ascention of our Sauiour Christ as by your owne histories it dooth most plainely appeare And euer since you fell from vs we haue had and haue styll as many as our good God knoweth to be needeful for vs as by the regesters kept in your consistories may bée séene for therein are written the horrible sentenses of excommunication that you haue pronounced against them because they would not worship the image of the Beaste nor take hys marcke in theyr handes nor forehead Our Sauiour Christ gaue vnto our Church Prophets also such as he made able to foretell of thinges to come as Agabus Ac. 11. Acts 11. the daughters of Phillip the Euangelist Act. 21 Act 21. S. Paule himselfe Act 20 1. Timoth 4 2 3. Act 20. 1. Timot. 4. 2 Timo 3. And Iohn that wrote the Reuelations with many moe Yea when hys pleasure is he can and dooth foreshewe vnto men things to come by the ministerie of such as it pleaseth him to foreshewe those thinges vnto Yea and he hath alwayes furnyshed and dooth styll furnish our Church with such Prophets as S Paule writeth of 1. Cor. 14. to whom hee giueth the gifte of interpretation so that they are able to make plaine the darke speaches that are some times vsed by the Prophets that speak of things to come 1 Cor 14 Of these Prophets our Church had many in the time of the first sixe hundreth yéeres that were next after the ascention of our Sauiour but not so many as since the time of your Apostacie which was in the dayes of Bonifacius the
fiue hundreth yéeres haue kept themselues within their bounds and therefore they haue not lied If Caluin had said that the Church whereof wée bée had continuance for no longer time then the first thrée hundreth yéeres where Luther had said before that it had continuance for the space of foure or fiue hundreth yéeres And M. Iewell comming after them both should haue said the continuance was for the space of the first sixe hundreth yéeres in such perfection as in the first thrée hundreth yéeres then this Offerer might haue taken some oecasion to note disagréement such as is to bée séene amongst Heretikes But now hée hath no iust occasion at all Caluin considered that during the time of the first 300. yeeres the Church of Christ was still vnder tyrants and was persecuted and was thereby kept occupied in better exercises then in such pompous and ceremonial diuine seruice as now is vsed in your popish Catholique church And therefore hee is bolde to say that the Church whereof wee Protestants bee is the same that was in the first 300. yeeres after Christ for wee haue abandoned as farre foorth as wee may all those superfluous ceremonies as haue bin diuised by men and enforced vpon the Church of Christ since the ende of the first 300. yeeres which are in deede too too many as by the woords of saint Augustine Epist. 119. August in Epist 119. Ad Ianuarium Seruilibus oneribus premunt vt tolerabilior fit conditio Iudeorum c They oppresse vs with seruile burdens so that the condition or estate of the Iewes was more tollerable then ours is None of all those burdens were layde vpon the Church before the ende of the first 300. yeeres but the Christians being vnder the crosse of persecution serued God in fréedome of conscience were not tied to any necessity of ceremonies but vsed a few such ceremonies as séemed to serue best for their edification in their exercise of religion and so doo wée and that congregation also amongst whom Caluin liued which might mooue him to say that the faith and religion that is professed by vs was practized in the first 300. yeeres after the incarnation of our sauiour Christ But this Offerer requireth some better staied certaine tale c. bicause Luther and other doo differ from Caluin He must know where when this sodaine change from the protestants religion to the papists was made as in what yéere of our Lord c. If it shal please him to read it aduisedly to weigh euery part of it hee shall haue heere as plaine a tale concerning this matter as euer hée did read or heare And thus it beginneth When Christ Iesus had giuen so large a commission to his Apostles as to go into all the world to teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the father of the sonne of the holy Ghost they executed that cōmission with al painefull diligence not fearing what man either would or could doo against them And so in short time the knowledge of the gospell was spred all the world ouer as the Apostle Paule writeth to the Romaines Cap. 10. Rom. 10. citing the woords of the Prophet Dauid Psal 19. Psal 19. Jn omnem terram c. The sound of them is gone out into all the world c. But the doctrine of the gospell which they preached was not so regarded in the city of Rome as it should haue bin as it séemeth that this Offerer and his fellowes bée persuaded that it was at that time wherein saint Paule was brought prisoner to Rome which was in the tenth yeere of the raigne of Nero but foure yéeres before S. Paule ended his life At that time the chiefe amongst the Iewes that then liued in Rome being called togither by S. Paule and being occasioned by him to speake of the christian Religion they said thus Wee are willing to heare of thee what thine opinion is for we doo know that this sect is euery where spoken against Act. 28 Act 28 Yea and when S. Paule was first called to his answere before the Emperor the Christians then in Rome were so faint hearted that they did leaue him alone as he him selfe hath written to Timoth. 2. Timoth. 4. 2. Timot. 4. In prima mea defensione nemo mihi affuit sed omnes dereliquerunt me non illis imputetur c. In my first defence no man did take part with mee but all did forsake mee God grant that it bee not laid to their charge but the Lord did assist strengthen me c. And this was more then thirty yeeres after our Sauiour Christ had sent foorth his Apostles to preach If Peter were bishop of Rome at the time that S. Paule speaketh of in that 4. Cap. 2. Timoth. surely then hee performed not the parte of a good bishop neither yet of a good christian For amongst all hee must needes bee one And S. Paule saith that all did forsake him But let this passe The estate of the whole Church was no better in those daies yea it was not much better at any time during the first 300. yeeres after Christes ascention For when Constantinus the first christian Emperor began his raigne Syluester then bishop of Rome had not his aboade then in Rome but made his dwelling place in some caue in a mountaine named Soracte xx myles distant from Rome that so hée might bée more safe from the tyrannie of the Romaine Emperor But when hee vnderstoode that Constantinus was likely to bee fauorable to the Christians hée repaired to the City By this it may appeare of what account the Romaine bishops had bin what publike open preaching of the gospell there had bin in the City of Rome during that time of the first 300. yeeres It appeereth in Hystories that they had their places wherein they met and had the preaching of the woorde ministration of the Sacraments but those places were not such as Saint Peters Church which is now in Rome For that Church with the rest of the Churches in Rome were not then builded as in Platina and in other Hystories it appeereth By this you may see what cause Caluin had to say that the Catholique Religion which is the same that wee protestants doo now professe was practized for the space of the first 300. yeeres after Christ From that time forward Religion began to decline by litle and litle from that perfection that it had continued in vnder persecution and to grow towards that great decay that it came vnto in the dayes of Bonifacius the third Martin Luther therefore and M. Iewell with the rest of the authors of the Apologie of the Church of England had iust cause to say that it continued in the Romish church for the space of the first foure fiue yea sixe hundreth yéeres after Christs ascention for the Romish church was not altogither fallen away from the Catholique Religion before shee had taken
vpon hir the title of Antichrist which was in the dayes of Phocas the Emperor at whose hands Bonifacius obtained the prophane title of vniuersall bishop whereof Gregorie the first surnamed the great writeth thus Grego Epi. 66. Epist 66. ad Mauricium imperatorem Sed absit a cordibus christianorum nomen istud blasphemiae in quo omnium sacerdotum honor adimitur dum ab vno sibi dâ—mâ—nter arrogatur But let this name of blasphemie bee far from christian hearts wherein the honor of all Priests is taken away whils one Priest dooth like a mad man arrogate the same vnto him selfe And againe Episto 68. Grego Epi. 68. Ad Iohn Episc Constantinopol Tu quid Christo vniuersalis scilicet Ecclesiae capiti in extremi iudicij es dicturus examine qui cuncta eius membra tibimet conaris vniuersalis appellatione supponere What wilt thou say vnto Christ that is to the head of the vniuersall Church saith Gregorie to Iohn bishop of Constantinople in the triall of the last iudgement which doost by the name of vniuersall goe about to make subiect vnto thy selfe all his members who can write or speake more plainely in this matter then this Gregorie hath written both to Mauricius the Emperour and to Iohn Bishop of Constantinople I hope therefore you will take this for a stayed certaine tale and bée therewith satisfied Considering that after Constantine the first christened Emperor had endued the Church with some possessions and so poysoned the Church as by a voice that was heard from heauen it was signified which voice vttered this speach Hodie datum est venenum in Ecclesiam This day is the Church poysoned that poyson did not presently worke the effect but by litle and litle So that the change from the Protestants religion to Poperie was not sodaine although meruailous but brought to passe by leysure and yet with as much spéede as the Dragon could by his members and ministers bring it to passe As for gainesayers it lacked none amongst whom I thinke you will allowe Gregorie the first to bee one of the chiefest Now therefore I require your promise which is to recant and yéelde although you haue hitherto refused so to doo The eleuenth Offer Offerer Let the learned Protestant shew me what order of seruice or coÌ„mon prayer what order of ministration of sacraments their Church had before Papistrie as they call it preuailed in the world Let him shew mee one booke or copie of any communion or what els you list that was in English or in any vulgar or coÌ„mon tongue beside the Hebrew Greeke and Latine or that lacked prayer for the foules departed or inuocation to saints or sacrifice for the sinnes both of the quicke and the dead or that charged a number to receiue with the priest or that he could not els consecrate or say Masse receiuing alone or that the people should take the sacrament for bread and wine and not for the reall body blood of Christ or that they should giue no honor to it or not reserue the same for the comfort of the sicke and diseased people or that denied extreme vnction with the rest of the sacraments to bee behoufull or necessarie for them let the learned Protestant bring forth and shew such a communion booke or any leafe line or word of any such doctrine or any Church or congregatition that euer had authenticall seruice or ministration of the sacraments other then that which is yet daily and o-openly practized in the common knowne Catholique church of Christ and I shall then recant and not before Crowley It séemeth by this Offer that this Offerer and his fellowes are perswaded that what soeuer is now openly practized in the popish diuine seruice and ministration of sacraments hath bin so openly practized as now it is euen euer since the Church of Christ was first planted in the City of Rome Which is a wronge persuasion For the greatest number of the ceremonies yea well nigh all that are now vsed in that ministration haue bin diuised since the ende of the first 300. yéeres as by their owne Hystories it dooth most plainly appeere I will therefore answere this offer with another not much vnlike to this and thus I say Let this Offerer shew mée what order of seruice or common praier what order of ministration of sacraments the Church had before the end of the first 300. yéeres Let him shew mée one booke or copy of any communion or what els you list that was in Hebrew Gréeke Latine or in any other language that had in it prayer for the soules departed or inuocation to saints or sacrifice for the quicke and the deade or that did not coÌ„mand a number to receiue with the priest or that did teach the people not to take the sacrament for breade and wine but for the reall body and blood of Christ or that they shoulde giue honor to the outwarde sacrament or that they should reserue it for the sicke diseased people or that taught extreme vnction Confirmation Order Penance and Matrimony to bée Sacraments behooufull or necessarie for Christians let this learned Offerer bringe foorth and shew such a communion booke or any leafe line or word of any such doctrine or any Church or congregation that euer had any such authenticall seruice or ministration of sacraments as is now openly practized in the coÌ„monly knowne popish Catholique church before the ende of the first 300. yeeres And then will I recant and bée a Papist as this Offerer is and not before I thinke I haue offered you faire play If you like the offer take it I will not flée from it If not for shame bragge no more of the antiquitie of your authentike seruice that is now practized in your Antichristian Catholike church But recant as you haue promised The first bishop of Rome that was bolde to diuise any thing to bée added to that which the Apostles vsed in the ministration of the Lords supper was Alexander the first And what did hée Platina saith that this man added Qui pridem quam pateretur vsque ad hanc clausulam hoc est Corpus meum Which is thus in English Which a day before hee suffered euen vnto this clause This is my body And Platina saith that Alexander did this that there might bee a remembrance of the passion of Christ Hée deuised also the making of holy water the vse whereof was to driue diuells out of Temples and chambers He ordained also that water should bée mixed with the wine in the ministration of the Sacrament and that the breade should not bée leauened but vnleauened to take away the occasion that the Ebionits tooke to finde fault in that behalfe Thus much writeth Platina in vita Alexandri primi This Alezander was the sixt bishop of Rome after Peter Plantina in vita Alexandri primi if Platina haue written truly and was made bishop in the yéere 110. after the incarnation of our sauiour
points contrary to his lawe theyr circumcission therfore dyd profit them nothing but was turned into vncircumcission Rom 2. Rom 2 Euen so batpisme is vnto vs the seale of the new couenaunt which God hath made with vs and with our fore fathers which couenaunt he neither dooth nor can breake But when we breake the condition which is to serue and honour him in spirit and in trueth Ioh. 4. Iohn 4 then is our baptisme made vnprofitable to vs. For as S. Peter hath written 1. Peter 3. 1 Pet 3 The baptisme that saueth vs is not that which putteth away the filth of the flesh but that whereby we are made bolde with a good conscience to stand before God and to call vpon him This is the baptisme of the spirite whereby we are borne from aboue and made the sons and daughters of God and his spirit giuen vnto vs which spirite dooth certifie our spirites that we are Gods children and the same spirite dooth enbolden vs to repaire vnto God as children to a Father and to say vnto him father father Yea and this spirite dooth leade vs as the children of God and maketh vs able in some measure to serue him in obseruing the commaundementes of God Rom 8. Roma 8 How can you say that you doo obserue this condition of honouring and seruing God in spirit and in trueth when in your outward exercise of religion there is scarsely any one thing to bée séene that sauoreth any thing at all of the spirite but altogeather of the flesh yea very fewe thinges that God hath commaunded are to bee séene in your outward professing of Christ but very many things that God hath flatly forbidden Your temples or Churches stuffed full of images and howe dooth the temple of God agree with images 2 Cor 6. 2 Cor 6 your Churches builded and consecrated to the honor of creatures as of Angels and Saints Your solemne festiuall dayes yerely obserued in the honor of creatures Your inuocations and prayers Your burning of incence before dead images and liuing men and before that Sacrament which our Christ ordayned to be receiued in the remembraunce of his death and passion and not to bée worshipped your offering vp of this sacrament as a sacrifice for the sinnes both of the quicke and of the dead your hanging of it ouer your Alters and your carying of it about in your pompous processions your harmonious musicke with the voices of men and children together and the noise of Organes and other loude instruments of Musicke your ringing of Belles your burning of lightes in the open day-light with I wot not how many other toyishe diuises that are vsed by you in your exercise of religiō what one sparke of spirituall seruing and honouring of God can there be in them But your baptisme although you haue diuised manie madde toyes which you doo vse in the ministration therof remaineth the same in substance that our Sauiour Christ dyd commaund to be ministred to such as should beléeue by the preaching of the Gospell Math 28. Math 28. Goe your way and teach all nations baptising them in the name of the father of the sonne and of the holy Ghost You baptise not in the name of Antichrist but in the name of the holy trinity the Father the Son and the holy Ghost The baptisme therefore that we haue receiued amongst you is as effectuall to vs as the Baptisme that we minister to our infantes is to them Now you doo I hope sée that your two horned argument dooth not stand vpon so sure a ground as you séemed to be perswaded that it dyd Wée may say yea to your question and yet not affirme that there is an other way to saluation then by Christ And wée may say no to your question and not be enforced thereby to deny that any of the people that professed Christ for the space of 1000. yeeres were saued Nowe therefore I require you to remember your promise and to recant which you haue hetherto refused to doo The eighteenth Offer Offeter Eighteenth Let the learned Protestant make proofe vnto me how theyr hidde vnknowen and secret Church not hauing in it the Doctrine of Christs Gospell openlie taught no ministration of Sacramentes no spirite of Prophesieng no discipline or rod of correction no ordering of Bishops Preestes and Ecclesiasticall ministers nor yet any other spirituall function executed in the same for the space of a thousand yeres together Let hym prooue their hidde and vnknowen Church with the lacke of all these thinges to be the true spouse and Catholique Church of Christ and I will recant and not before Crowley I haue already prooued sufficiently that although our Catholique Church was by Antichristian tirannie verie sore oppressed and by Popish supersticion and by blasphemous idolatrie meruailously ouercountenaunced yet in all that time of a thousand yéeres that this Offerer speaketh of it was neuer so hidde so vnknowen or so secret but that it was still the Cittie on the hill the Candle on the candlesticke the salt and the light of the world euen as it was in the time of Christs being on earth in our nature and vnder the first ten horrible persecutions The doctrine of the Gospel of Christ was taught and the sacramentes of Christ were ministred in it as openly as the Tiranny of Antichriste would suffer It had the spirite of prophecie in as large mesure as our head Christ Iesus knew to be méete for vs. The rodde of correction or discipline was as much exercised as it might bée by them that had the power of the sworde taken from them and continually vsed against them They lacked neyther Bishops Préestes nor other ecclesiasticall ministers such as the heauenly father knewe to bée necessarie for them These although they were not ordered after the Antichristian manner by receiuing the marke of the beast had theyr lawfull calling from God by man and dyd execute theyr function faythfully and shewed therin no slacknesse but such as was enforced by open and bloodie Tirannie These thinges haue béene sufficiently prooued before and that our Church was not so hydde vnknowen and secret in the tyme that is past of the .1000 yéeres that this Offerer speaketh of neyther is it at this day in any part of the world so hidde c. As this Offerer would beare vs in hand that it was and is in places where it is persecuted and shal be till the whole time of the deuils libertie shal be complet and ended I doo not therefore sée wherefore you should not recant as you haue promised The ninteenth Offer Offerer Nineteenth Againe on the other side let the learned Protestant prooue that it is not the true Church of Christ that hath in the face of the world for the space of fifteene hundred yeeres past exercised preaching the conuersion of nations to the obedience of the Gospell that hath alwaies had the administration of Sacramentes the hearing of matters in controuersie the
Bishop Fyshar Sir Thomas Moore the Monkes of the charter house with all the rest of the Popes friends that suffered in the daies of King Henry the eight and Edmond Campion with his companie and the rest that haue bene executed in the time of the raigne of our Soueraigne that now is for what cause haue they suffered was it not for that they affirmed that the Popes holines hath the supreme power in this realme that princes haue not the highest power vpon earth ouer such as be their subiectes This cause can not bee Christs cause for Christ did in his humaine nature submit him selfe to the Emperor in that hee him selfe did pay tribute to the Emperor in token of subiection Mat. 17. Mat 17. S. Peter willeth all christians to submit them selues to all estates of men euen for the Lords sake whether it be to the king as to him that hath the preheminence or to the Dukes or captaines as to men whom the Lord hath sent for the punishment of euill dooers but for the praise of such as bée good for so is the will of God that Christians should by well dooing stop the ignoraunce of foolish men c. 1. Pet. 2. 1 Peter 2. S. Paule also wrote thus to the Romaines Omnis anima potestatibus sublimioribus subdita sit c. Let euery soule be subiect to the higher powers c. Rom. 13. Rom. 13. Chrysostome expounding these woords of S. Paule saith thus Etiam si Apostolus sis si Euangelista si Propheta siue quisquis tandem fueris c. Although thou be an Apostle if thou bée an Euangelist if thou be a Prophet and to conclude who or what so euer thou béest For saith Chrysostome this subiection dooth not subuert godlinesse And hée saith not simply hée must obay but hée saith Chrysost in Rom. 13. subdita sit It must bée in subiection By these woords of Chrysostome it appeereth what maner of Martyrs they are that haue died for the mainetenaunce of your Popes supreme powre ouer all Christians vpon earth If Chrysostome were now liuing and would maintaine this that hee hath written your Pope would make him a Martyr in déed if hée might catch him as hee hath and still dooth make Martyrs of all such as hée hath and can catch that bee of one minde with Chrysostome Your Confessors are euen such as your Martyrs and so are your Virgins with the rest that you meane of when you say and such other Now let the Protestant prooue say you that this is not the true Church that we are not bound to obay and belieue this Church and none other in all controuersies and doubts c. The Protestant hath already prooued that the church that you meane of which is the Romaine Antichristian church is not the true Church of Christ and that it hath not in it those things that you doo so much brag of It hath not continuance as yet for the space of 1000. yéeres It hath not neither dooth it exercise preaching to the conuersion of nations to the obedience of the gospell but to the obedience of Antichristian doctrine It hath not had neither hath it the right administration of the sacraments but with such mixture of humaine diuises as is vnséemely in the Church of Christ It hath not had neither hath it any such orderly succession of bishops as you brag of neither any such vniformitie of solemne Ceremonies It hath not had at any time neither hath it now such vnitie of faith as you speake of nor the holy functions of the spirite as working of Miracles remission of sinnes nor the true sense and interpretation of the woord of God Neither is it beautified with that diuersitie of states that you speake of as Martyrs Confessors and Virgins such other wherefore the Protestant concludeth that there is no cause why he should obay and belieue that church of yours no more is there that you should not yeelde and recant The Twentith offer Offerer Twentith Moreouer let the learned Protestant proue that the true and Catholike church of Christ may at any time bee voide of Gods spirit which he hath promised to be with his Church for euer saying Et ego rogabo patrem et alium paracletum dabit vobis Iohn 14. vt maneat vobiscum in aeternū or falsly to interpret any sentence of holy scripture or to induce any erroure among the people or approoue vnprofitable and hurtfull vsages amonge the Christians or that shee suffereth any damnable abuse in her religion without open repredhension thereof Let the learned Protestant prooue any of these points and I will then yeelde and recant and not before Crowley The true Catholique church of Christ in déed is neuer voyde of Gods spirite Yea there is not one member of that church which hath not that spirite dwelling in it in some measure For thus the Apostle Paule hath written to the Romaines Si quis autem spiritum Christi non habet hie non est eius If there be any that hath not the spirite of Christ the same belongeth not to him Rom. 8. Rom. 8 I doo confesse therefore that the true Catholique church of Christ is neuer voide of Gods spirit But according to the words that this Offerer hath cited out of the 14. cha of Iohn Iohn 14 our sauiour Christ hath sent another comforter which is the holy spirit of God to be with his Church for euer But what maketh this for M. Offerers purpose Hee must prooue that the church of Rome being such as now it is hath bin for the space of a thousand yéeres almost is that true Catholique church of Christ and then these pointes will serue him to some purpose otherwise they doo make flatly against him Taking your church to bee the true Catholike church of Christ you offer to yéelde and recant if the Protestant can prooue that your church hath fasly interpreted any one sentence of the holy scripture The Protestant hath alreain his answere to your 19. offer sufficiently prooued that your whole church hath in the 25. session of your Tridentine counsell falsly interpreted or rather flatly denied mo then one two or thrée sentences of the holy scriptures as to the indifferent Reader it may there most euidently apeere wherefore wée doo looke for the performance of your promise in yéelding and recanting That your church hath induced doth still induce errors amongst the people hath approued and doth still approoue vnprofitable and hurtfull vsages amongst Christians hath suffered and dooth still suffer damnable abuses in religion without open reprehention is more manifest then that which lyeth open in the cleare sunne light Wherefore the Protestant néedeth not to spend any time in the proofe therof It may suffice to put the reader in minde of those shamelesse errors that your church hath taught dooth still teach and maintaine concerning the inuocation of Angelles and Saints the praying for the deade
such haue a care to doo as Saint Paule dooth there exhorte when he sayeth Let euery one that calleth vpon the name of the Lord depart from euill And in so dooing they doo in some sorte make it knowen vnto men that they be the elected and chosen children of God But this knowledge can not bée so certaine that any one man may be therby assured of the election of an other because he séeth him depart from euil For gods sercet election can not be certainly knowen by any outward signes therfore the church of Christ as it consisteth of the number that God hath in his secret election appointed to be enheritors of his kingdome may rightly be sayd to be inuisile as knowen onely to God and vnknowen vnto men 2 Timoth cap. 2 But as it followeth in the same text of S. Paule to Timoth As in a great house there are vesselles not onely of golde and of siluer but of timber and of clay also some appoynted to honest vses some to dishonest euen so is it in the Church of Christ which is the housholde of God some are of one sorte and some of an other And this mixed multitude is visible and knowen to bée that number of people that beareth the name of Christ and is called christian And in thys multitude are those elected and chosen children of God that may rightly bée called the church of Christ in this respect may the secret church of Christ be called visible Math 13. This thing dooth our Sauiour Christ set foorth plainely in the parable of the net that being cast into the sea doth drawe together fishes of all sortes but when this nette is drawen to the shore the fisher men doo chuse out the good fishes and cast away the other as vnprofitable And againe in the parable of the fielde both the good graine and the tares doo growe togeather and the féelde is called the corne féeld and not the féelde of tares tyll the tyme of the Haruest bée come but then the good grayne is gathered into barnes and the tares are bound in bundles to bée burnte in the fyer Euen so the open and knowē church which is visible séene and hearde consisting of men women and children of all sortes continueth and shall continue a myxed multitude euen till the haruest which is the ende of the world shall come And then he that now dooth alone knowe his chosen Church shall make the same knowen to all men by receiuing them to himselfe and by refusing of the rest Thus this Offerer and his fellowes may sée howe the Church of Christ may be sayd to bee inuisible and yet not denied to bée visible But it is manifest what stone it is that these men doo stumble at They are perswaded that the Church of Christ must néeds be alwaies in such floorishing estate here on earth as the Church of Roome is now and as it hath continued for many yéeres togeather But they should consider that the woman the S. Iohn sawe Apoc 12. Apoc. 12. was driuen into wildernes by the crueltie of the Dragon as I haue noted in mine aunswer to the ninth offer and yet she is stil cloathed with the Sunne and hath the moone vnder her féete and is crowned with the 12. starres Yea she is the Cittie situated on the hyll the light of the world and the candle set on the candlesticke as she was euen in those daies of horrible persecution when the Bishops of Roome had no dwelling place in Roome nor the Christians in Roome any open Church to méete in for theyr exercise of Christian religion Looke well to that which I haue written in aunswer to the ninth offer and then I hope you will not charge vs as you haue doone As touching the admonitton that S. Paule gaue to the Hebrewes Hebr 13. in the 13 Chapter of that Epistle I wishe you to weighe it well and to consider the time and what doctrine was vsuall in that tyme wherein the wordes of that admonition were written Which if yée would doo you should finde that your doctrine for the real presence of Christs bodie in the holy Eucharist for the Sacrifice of the masse and the propitiation of sinnes both of the quicke and the deade thereby for your penaunce with the fruites thereof your straightnes of lyfe your vowes inuocation of Saintes and your prayer for soules departed and such lyke are the various and strange doctrines that Saint Paule dooth warne you of For all those doctrines were straung in those daies and scarcely was any one of them hearde of Thinke therefore that S. Paule sayeth vnto you be not ledde or caried away with the diuers and straung doctrines of Transubstantiation of massing for the quicke the dead of satisfying for sinnes by penaunce enioyned by a ghostly father by fasting watching praying vowing inuocating of Saints c. For they are not agréeing but contrarie to the receiued and commonly knowen doctrine of Christes Catholique church When the Popish antichristian catholiques can be able to prooue that the high Préests Scribes and Phariseis were not the raysers vppe of those contentions and strifes that were styrred vp in the dayes wherein Christ and hys apostles preached in Ierusalem and Iewrie but Christ his apostles by preaching the doctrine of the Gospell And that the contentions and strifes that haue béene and bee styll styrred vp in our dayes haue not béene nor are styll styrred vp by them by theyr preaching and maintayning of theyr strange doctrines of transubstantiation such lyke but by vs that béeing members of the most auncient Catholike Church doo preach the same catholique doctrine that Christ and hys Apoles dyd preach and none other then wyll I recant and become a Papist and not before And because I haue in the iudgement of all indifferent readers sufficiently prooued that which this Offerer hath in this Offer required the learned Protestant to prooue I doo requyre him to doo as becommeth an honest man in performing his promise Which is to submit him selfe and to recant although hetherto he haue refused so to doo The fourth signe and token of false Prophets Offerer Fourth signe and token of false Prophets Heretiques and Schismatiques is Schisma in Ecclesiam introducere To bring into the Church of Christ by their doctrine schisme diuision and seperation of one member from another and of the whole mistical body from the true head Iesus Christ For where as the health and saluation of Christ hys flocke and people dooth most cheefely consist in peace concord and vnitie they therefore which by Schisme doo deuide and disperse his flocke and of one societie and fellowship before doo make many and diuers they in not spareinge nor preseruing in vnitie the flock of Christ are become rauening Wolues Th'apostle S. Paule knowing the great daunger and hurte vprising of Schisme dooth most humbly beseech vs with all dilligent circumspection to auoide the same saying Obsecro vos
fratres per nomen domini nostri Jesu Christi vt idipsum dicatis omnes nō sint in vobis schismata sitis autem perfecti in eodem sensu in eadem sententia 1. Cor 1. I beseech you brethren by the name of our Lord Iesus Christ that you say all one thinge and that there bee no schisme amongst you but be perfect in one minde and one meaning Nowe if the learned Protestant shal be able to prooue that where as about the time of threescore yeeres and aboue we were all not onely in this realme but vniuersally in al other realmes professing Christ of one church of one fayth and religion and of one vnitie therein if hee shal be able to prooue that this late Schisme whereby wee are so deuided and dispersed that some are become Lutherans some Zuinglians some Caluinists some Puritans and Annabaptists dyd proceede from vs and from the common knowen Catholique Church of Christ and not wholy from theyr priuate Church and congregations and of the deceitfull and false doctrine by them preached and taught I shall then stay no longer but yeelde and recant and not before Crowley They that be the bringers of Schismes and diuisions into the Church of Christ c may rightly be said to be false Prophettes Heretiques and Schismatiques And th'apostle Paule dooth very well and loouingly exhorte and beséech vs euen in the name of our Lord Iesus Christ to be all of one minde and that there be no Schismes amongst vs c. But now the learned Protestant must prooue that the late Schisme whereby the people of all Christian realmes are diuided into Lutherans Zuinglians Caluinistes Puritans and Anabaptists did procéede from the common knowen Catholique Church of Christ and not wholy from the Protestants congregations and from their deceitfull doctrine otherwise there is no hope that euer this Offerer will recant and yéelde Well let vs sée what may be said to this offer First as I doo vnderstand the wordes of this Offerer hee affirmeth that till it was within the space of thréescore and some odde yéeres last past there had béene no Schisme brought into the Church of Christ so that before that tyme al were of one Church of one fayth and religion and of one vnitie therein And thus he hath discharged all those olde Heretiques that troubled the Church of Christ in the beginning of the preaching of the Gospel amongst the nations from thense forth till it was within thréescore odde yéeres before the tyme wherein he made this offer None of them may bée taken for false Prophets Heretiques or Schismatiques if thys bée the meaning of this offerers wordes as I thynke it must néedes bée But how soeuer this offerer and his fellowes doo account of these men that then brought Schismes into the Church of Christ we Protestants doo déeme them to be false Prophets Heretiques and Schismatickes yea and members of antichrist and we doo by all meanes possible shunne theyr doctrine and teach all other Christians to shunne them also It may bée that this offerer meant not of any other false Prophets Heretiques or Schismatickes then such as haue troubled the Church of Christ within these thréescore and odde yéeres last past and therefore hee beginneth with Luther Zuinglius c. But if that were his meaning then I must tell him that he and his fellowes the antichristian catholiques are the false Prophets Heretiques and Schismatiques that haue troubled the Catholique Church of Christ all this while many hundrethes of yéeres before euen euer since the dayes of Phocas the Emperour and the dayes of Boniface the thyrd theyr first Apostatate Bishop of Roome As for Luther Zuinglius and Caluine they dyd but departe from the antichristian Schismaticall Church wherin then had béene fostered and ioyned themselues to the true catholique Church of Christ euen as the Apostle Paule leauing the Hipocriticall profession of a Pharisey wherin he had béene brought vp euen at the féete of Gamaliell the good Pharisey ioyned himselfe to the Church and religion of Christ which was not a forsaking of the lawe but a cleauing vnto him that is the perfection of the Lawe Luther Zuinglius and Caluine dyd not take vpon them to be authors of any new religions but they embraced and laboured to maintayne that olde religion that had béene planted by the Apostles and professed by theyr immediate successors And as they could they dyd endeuour to purge it of al such filth as you M. Offerer and your predissessors had begrimed it with If in this busines they dyd not so well in all poyntes as they wished yet theyr meaning béeing good they are to bée helde excused Though they dyd nowe and then buylde timber strawe and stubble yet so long as they did laye no new foundation but dyd set all theyr building vppon the rocke Christ which is the right foundation and the onely foundation for Christians to build vpon they shal be saued as S. Paule hath assured vs. 1 Cor 3. 1 Cor 3. We Protestant Catholiques doo estéeme of these men none otherwise then as of faithfull labourers in the Lords haruest and carefull followers of Christ Iesus If they did in any poynt goe astray as béeing men they might and vndoubtedly dyd our profession is not to followe them Their profession was to followe Christ and so is ours The learned Protestant therefore may conclude that not the knowē catholique Church of Christ but the knowen antichristian Church of Roome whereof this Offerer and his fellowes are members haue by theyr doctrine brought into the Church of Christ Schisme Diuision and seperation of one member from another and of the whole misticall body from the true heade Iesus Christ For you enforce all such as wyll enioy any outwarde peace in this lyfe to submit themselues to the state of the papasie as to theyr vniuersall heade here vpon earth directly contrarie to the commaundement of Christ Math 23. Math 23 Sée that you do not name any man your common father vpon earth for one is your father which is in heauen Neither be ye called masters for Christ only is your maister If we will enioy peace amōgst you we must learne to say thus Our most holy father the Popes holines is heade of the vniuersall Church of Christ And we must acknowledge that his colledge of Cardinalles and the Prelates that he calleth togeather in hys generall councelles binding them by an oath to maintaine the estate of your antichristian Church are our masters or teachers for suche masters our sauiour Christ spake of at that tyme and what so euer they shall teach that must wée beléeue although we doo knowe and sée that they doo teach directly contrarie to that which is taught by the holy ghost in the Scriptures The peace therefore the concorde and the vnitie that you doo maintaine is not in verity and trueth but in impietie and false religion By your Schisme wherein you are growen excéeding
strong you haue dispersed the flocke of Christ which was at the first but one societie and fellowship In not sparing nor preseruing the vnitie of that flock you haue made your selues knowen to bée the same rauening wolues that the Apostle S. Paule spake of Acts 20. Act 20. Ego scio saith S. Paule I doo knowe that after my departing from you raueninge wolues shall enter in amongest you not sparing the flocke And from amongst your selues there shall rise vp men that shall vtter frowarde speaches that they may drawe schollers after them Not from the common knowen Catholique Church of Christ therefore whereof wée Protestants are members but from the now knowen antichristian Church whereof this offerer and his fellowes are members dyd that Schisme procéede that this Offerer speaketh of For by the deceitfull false doctrine that they haue taught and by theyr bloodie tyranny they haue drawen many from the vnity in Christ which is the verity and ioyned them to the Schisme of Antichristian impietie This matter béeing made so plaine as to mee it dooth séeme to be I doo thinke that euery indifferent reader here of will in hys heart say thus to this Offerer for shame stay no longer but yéelde and recant out of hand lest the heauie wrath of God fall vpon thée for that thou hast not yéelded and recanted before The fift signe and token false Prophets Offerer Fift signe and token of false Prophets Schismatickes and heretiques is disobedience Et non obedire sed resistere eis qui praesunt in Ecclesia Dei And not to obey but resiste those which doo beare rule and gouerne in the Church of God of the which sorte of men the Apostle S. Paule giueth vs warning Quemadmodum Iamnes Mambres restiterunt Moysi ita hi resistunt veritati homines corrupti mente reprobi circa fidem 2. Timot 5. Exodus 7 Like as Iamnes and Mambres dyd resiste Moises euen so doo these resist the trueth beeing men of corrupt minde and reprobates in fayth Now when the learned Protestant shal be able to prooue that this rebellion and disobedience to all Bishops Prelattes and ecclesiasticall gouerners is to be found in the chatholick Church and not in the priuate Church and congregations of the Protestantes then I shall yeeld submit and recant and not before Crowley As obedience is more acceptable in Gods sight then sacrifice 1. Regum 15. 1 Reg. 15 euen so there can nothing displease him more then disobedience dooth But we may not hereof conclude that God is so displeased with euery disobedience as he was with Saules disobedience when he dyd contrary to that which he had commanded him to doo neither euery obedience is so acceptable to God as that obedience shoulde haue béene if Saule had doone in all pointes euen as God had commaunded to him to doo For that obedience onely is acceptable to the Lord that is doone in the Lord and for the Lords cause and obedience in dooing that which the Lord hath forbidden to be doon and in leauing that vndoone which the Lord hath commanded to be doon is not to be accounted for obedience but is in déede disobedience Let vs sée therefore what manner of disobedience it is that this offerer hath charged vs with Euen such as was in Iamnes Mambres when they did resist Moses By coniecture these two that S. Paule nameth in the third Chap. of his second Epistle to Timoth were the Sorcerers that stroue against Moses in Egipt and dyd by theyr sorcerie worke such wonders in outwarde appearaunce as Moses dyd by the mighty power of God in very déede as in the 7. Exod 7 8 and 8. Chapters of Exod it appeareth But Moses dooth not name those sorcerers neyther are they named in any History of the Scriptures wherefore it may bee thought that S. Paule had some other writings then are now extant whereby he gat the knowledge of the names of those sorcerers that dyd so withstand Moses But howe so euer Moses came by theyr names this offerer hath not taken theyr names aright for both the translation that the Tridentine councell hath allowed of and the Greeke text haue Iannes and not Iamnes the Gréeke text hath Iambres and not Mambres But the matter is not great let the Offerer and his fellowes descide this matter at theyr leasure The Apostle S. Paule hauing described such men as by the Spirite of prophecie he did foresée should come in the latter dayes he sayth that they should bée such as resist the trueth euen as Iannes and Iambres did resist Moses Howe those sorcerers did withstand Moses dooth appeare in the two Chapters of Exodus that I haue noted before They dyd what they could to discredit all that was doone by Moses and to stay Pharao and the Egiptians from giuing credite to that messadge that Moses dyd from the Lord God of Israell So long as the Lord would suffer them they made shewes of as great and wonderfull workes as those were that were wrought by Moses Euen so saith S. Paule those men doo withstande the trueth béeing men corrupted in minde and lewde concerning the fayth But they shall preuaile no longer For the madnes of these men shal be made manifest to all men euen as theirs was Now let the indifferent reader iudge who they bée in these dayes that may most rightly be sayd to be lyke vnto Iannes and Iambres the Popish Catholiques or we Protestant Catholiques Wee come in the name of the Lorde God onely do labour to bring the people of God out of the Egiptian darcknes of Rome to serue God in spirite and in trueth for so God delighteth to be serued Iohn 4. Iohn 4. But the antichristian Popish Catholiques doo labour as Iannes and Iambres dyd to kéepe them in that darcknes styll and to that ende they doo what they can to cause vs to be taken for false Prophets Heretiques and Schismatickes and the Gospell of Christ which wée doo preach to be false doctrine Heresie and Schisme Yea let the indifferent reader iudge whether of both the sorts protestants or roomish catholiques may be déemed to be that men that S. Paule did Prophesie of in that third chapter of his second Epistle to Timoth. 2. Timot 3. They shal be saith S. Paule loouers of themselues couetous high minded proude blasphemers disobedient to parentes vnthankfull wicked voyde of affection truse-breakers false accusers incontynent cruell vncurteous traiterous frowarde malicious and such as doo looue pleasures more then God hauing a shewe of Godlines but denying the power thereof The Chronicles or Histories of times doo witnes that no men can bée more lyke vnto these men that saint Paule hath here described then the Popish prelates haue béene for the space of these last 1000. yéeres almost and so they doo continue stil as daily experience dooth shew Whereunto I doo refer the indifferent reader for the trial of the trueth herein Nowe therefore as
God to giue his Church libertie to make publique profession of fayth and religion as now for the space of 29. yéeres togeather he hath doone in this realme of England such as be members of the true Catholique Church doo and haue doone by the permission and commaundement of our Prince whom God hath appointed to gouerne vs as it becommeth Catholike Christians to doo in open praier preaching and administration of Sacramentes And to the ende that all thinges may bée doon orderly and as it beseemeth we haue bishops al other necessary ministers orderly elected admitted to minister vnto vs the word and to exercise publique prayer necessarie discipline suche as the higher powers vnder whome we liue doo thinke méete to be exercised As for the vniformity of your solemne Ceremonies that had not had so long continuance for the space of fiftéene hundreth yéeres nor yet for the space of fifty yéeres For by the confession of your holy father Pope Pius quintus the difference of ceremonies vsed euen in your holy Masse was such before the tyme of your last generall Councell which began at Trident. Anno. 1545. that it was thought méete by them to take order for the reformation thereof But though it had béene as auncient as you would haue it what great matter is there in it to prooue thereby that your Church is the true Church of Christ sith it is an easie matter for any sorte of men to agrée in outward and solemne Ceremonies although the same bee neuer so superstitious vaine and foolish But here is a matter of greater waight that is the vnity of fayth that your Church hath had these 1500 yéeres last past continually I haue already prooued that your Antichristian Church hath not had continuance so long by 600. yeres almost And it shal be an easie matter to prooue that the fayth of your Church hath in the time that it hath had continuance varied very often in some poyntes of greatest wayght as you doo account of them The generall councell of Basill beléeued that theyr authority was aboue the authority of the Pope and that they might depose hym and therefore they dyd depose Eugenius that then was Pope and choose an other in his place And the same Eugenius bolding a Councell at Farrary beléeued that he had authority to excommucate the generall councell And this article was long doubted of Whether the Pope or the generall counsell should haue the supreme authoritie And about the wordes of consecration I thinke your Church is not yet agréede whether the vertue â—hat turneth the substaunce doo lye in the verbe Est or in the sillable vm And whether the substance of breade and wyne bée turned into the substaunce of the body and bloode of Christ or whether that substaunce departing and giuing place the body and blood of Christ doo occupie the place thereof vnder the qualities of bread and wine And whether the mouse that eateth the consecrated rake doo eate the bodie of Christ or no. In these high poyntes of religion and in dyuers other of lyke sorte the vnitie of your fayth hath béene and styll is sore shaken But I perceyue that which followeth in thys conclusion of thys offer that the fayth whych you speake of is that fayth or beleefe that you haue in that Church of yours which you call Catholique You neuer trouble your selfe with the waighting and examining of matters of beléefe for you confesse that you must of necessitie beléeue the Church So that your determination is to beléeue whatsoeuer that Church hath or shall determine and commaund you to beléeue although you knowe not what that Church either hath or shall determine Thus your late prosilite Frier Iohn Frauncis of Nigeon in Fraunce dyd in his letters that he wrote to his mother instruct her to beléeue But here riseth a doubte whether this Church be the general councell the colledge of Cardinalles or the Popes holines alone If it bee the generall councell what shifte would you haue made when two generall councelles were holden at one tyme and decréede contrarie the one to the other the one holden at Basill and the other at Farrarie If it be the colledge of Cardinalles which way would you haue turned your selfe when there were thrée Popes at one tyme and each Pope had his colledge of Cardinalles If it bée the Pope him selfe then tell mée vpon whome you would haue hanged your fayth when there was no Pope for the space of two yéeres togeather and when there were three Popes at one tyme and when haueing but one Pope the same was an Arrian or Saddusey or had giuen hym selfe to the Deuill that hee myght bée made Pope I leaue this to your discretion or to the discretion of some one of your sorte that shall take in hand to replye to this aunswer that I make to these your offers You saye that your Church hath in her selfe all holie functions of the spirite as workinge of miracles remission of sinnes and the true sence and interpretation of Gods worde A straunge manner of ennumeration of partes All the holie functions of the spyrite are innumerable and therefore they are commonlie sayd to bée seuen by which number béeing a perfecte number an infinite multitude is commonly signified But you set downe thrée for all The working of miracles is one of those holye functions that you speake of You meane I am sure of those miracles that haue béene and are wrought in your places of Pilgrimage and by the rotten reliques of your Sayntes whereof I haue heard great boast and some experience I haue séene in England The holy mayd of Kent with her confederates wrought manie myracles in the dayes of King Henrie the eyght as in our Chronicles is to bée séene but in the ende she was founde to bée an arrante Whore and so was the holie made of Lemster that was nothing inferiour to the other in working of myracles The holy Roode of Bostone the holie Roode of Boxley the holie Roode of Chester the holie Roode of Northamton and the holie Roode at the North doore of Paules Church with the holy Roode in Roode Lane in London were not behinde the rest in working miracles by the helpe of knaues that had the kéeping of them I might speake of the holy blood at Hailes which was sayd to bee a portion of the bloode of Christ Saint Thomas of Canterburie S. Thomas of Hereford S. William of Mawuerne S. Ioseph of Shaftesburie and holy King Henrie of Windsore King Kenelme of Cowbadge S. Hugh of Lincolne and S. Robert of Naseborowe and a number of blessed Ladies to many to bée rehearsed by name The knauerie that was practized in these places is so well knowen in England that your miracles can haue no credite amongst such English men as haue not Roomish hartes Yea and our sauiour Christ hath forewarned vs Math 24. Math 24 That in these latter dayes many false Christs and false prophets shal arise shal