die so 19. But I know what you drive at You were pleased to ask where our Church was before the Reformation It was answer'd in the Catholick Next you inquired whether the Catholick were alwayes visible The reply was affirmative both here and in other places But before the Reformation we communicated with Rome and since we have not That 's no fault of ours yee will no suffer us to communicate with you unlesse we communicate with your errors And yet we shall maugre Satan communicate with the Catholick Church while (u) Ro. 15.6 with one mind and one mouth we glorifie God even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ according to this the Nicene and the Apostles Creed While we pray for the Church Universall and for all Bishops Pastors and Curates thereof While we pray for all Gods people for all that have erred and are deceived even for our enemies persecutors and slanderers While we continue the Apostolick government and while we not onely receive but administer the Sacraments according to Christs holy Ordinance we shall be in the communion of the Catholick Church 20. Truth it is as that judicious Bishop told Mr. Fisher (x) Archbishop Lawd § 21. n. 1. the cause of the Schisme is yours for yee thrust us from you because we called for Truth and redresse of abuses What was then to be done must we swallow untruths and wink at abuses that we may collogue and communicate with you It had not wont to be so every Province had wont to reform it selfe And so she did not transgresse the Faith or Canons of the Church Catholick the reformation was both legall and commendable We did so with our Provinces following therein the ancient Canons of the Church which assure us that (y) Concil Constantinop can 2. every Provinciall Synod is to order all things within the Province And for full satisfaction those Fathers of Constantinople justifie this Canon by the Decrees of the Nicene Councel Indeed sometimes (z) Ib. can 6. it may happen that the businesse will prove to be of such consequence and circumspection that a Provinciall Synod is not fit to determine it What is then to be done That very Canon says (a) Ib. in such a case we must not make our addresse to a Generall Councel but to a greater Synod of the Bishops of that Diocese called together for that purpose But we must observe that in the ancient both Civil and Ecclesiastical acceptation (b) Dixcesis multas sub se habet provincias Balsam in conc Chalced. Can. 9. a Diocese contains in it many Provinces This Councel we ought not to decline by molesting the Emperour or any secular Magistrates with complaints as our late Ministers have done This is not canonicall and the complaint is not to be admitted We are therefore to take notice that (c) Notit Imp. l. 2. c. 48. the three Britains were a Diocese of themselves and had a Praefectus Praetorio for Civil and a Primate for Ecclesiastical affaires (d) Cantuariae prima sedes Archiepiscopi habetur qui est totius Angliae Primas Patriarcha Guil. Malmesbur in Prologo l. 1. de Gest Pontif. Angl. p. 195. The Primate or Patriarch is the Archbishop of Canterbury So then our Reformation is not after any new or lately invented model it is according to the ancient course and canons of the Church and therefore justifiable If we had taken any other course in our Reformation we had done amisse For according to the Councel of Constantinople (e) Concil Constantinop can 6. we had run into an high contempt 1. by slighting all the Bishops of this Diocese 2. by injuring the Canons and 3. by subverting the Ecclesiasticall order and government 21. In submission to these Canons the Church did usually reform both in manners and faith by Diocesan or Provinciall Councels as is to be seen in the Code of the Vniversal Church in the African-Code in Balsamon and Zonaras in the Councels of Spain and in the Councels of England set forth by that pious and worthy Knight Sir Henry Spelman Much in this kind is readily presented to every eye by our learned Archbishop § 24. n. 4. Where you may see this course approved by your own learned men (f) Alb. Mag. in 1. Dist 11. A. 9. Albertus Magnus and that (g) Gerson de Gen. Concil Vnius obedien part 1. p. 222. famous Chancellour of Paris to be not onely lawfull but sometimes necessary Indeed to what purpose is it to justifie that to be (h) Perfecta Synodus illa est cui interest Metropolitanus Episcopus Cod. Eccles univers Can. 95. a full a perfect Synod wherein a Metropolitan is present if it may not upon just occasion amend what is amisse within her own precincts What is it then a perfect Synod for Otherwise Israel must not have reformed without Judah nor Judah without Israel Neither must Laodicea have cast off her wicked courses unlesse the rest of the Churches in Asia would have joyned in the Reformation They that dare say this are wiser then God Almighty For he calls to every one of these in particular to repent and amend with in themselves what is faulty And though Timothy had failed of his duty at Ephesus it had been no excuse for Titus to wink at abuses and disorders in Crete (i) Hos 4.15 Though Israel transgresse yet let not Judah sinne 22. Hitherto my Propositions as you terme them from whence you inferre as a necessary consequence thus Then by your own saying The Inference the Catholick Church must be distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion It must be so just as a reasonable creature is distinct from Socrates the species from the individuum or particular person Socrates is a reasonable creature but not all not the onely reasonable creature every individual person is as much man as much a reasonable creature and hath as much of man in him as Socrates This will be the more easily discerned if we look upon St. Paul's comparison (k) 1 Cor. 12. who likens the Church to a body consisting of many members One member is not the body nor the body one member but many The body receives not life from the members but every member from the body The body can live without the hand or foot or eye indeed without all these but none of these can live when sever'd from the body The Catholick Church hath subsisted without the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome cannot subsist without the Catholick The Church did stand without Rome before Rome was a Church And the Church was visible in the time of Marcellinus Liberius and John 22. when Rome was no member thereof (l) Cypr. de unit Eccles Adulterari non potest Sponsa Christi though Rome defile her selfe the Spouse of Christ is not cannot be made an Harlot The tree is sound though the leaves fall and
AN ACCOUNT OF THE CHURCH CATHOLICK Where it was before the Reformation AND Whether ROME were or bee the CHVRCH CATHOLICK IN ANSWER to II. LETTERS SENT TO Edward Boughen D. D. We write none other things unto you then what yee read or acknowledge 2 COR. 1.13 Evigilate ad salutem amate pacem redite ad unitatem Aug. ep 171. LONDON Printed by E. Cotes for Richard Reyston at the ANGEL in Ivie-lane M.DC.LIII To my Reverend friend Mr. Boughen Doctor in Divinity These humbly present SIR BEcause I see in a conference zeal often turns to choler and because it was desired I would put my mind in writing that I might the more distinctly be understood and thereby the better receive solution I have here beneath set downe what I desire to have shewn viz. the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in communion with her which by your own propositions below is necessary to be shewn to find the Catholick Church If this you doe you may win a soul to your Church If this you cannot doe I hope you will not accuse mee for remaining where I am I have made bold to trouble Mris. M. at her conveniency to present this to you and at your conveniency crave the favour of your Answer and am SIR Your Servant to command T. B. I. You grant the Catholick Church to be alwayes viz. from the Apostles time to this time visible II. You say that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her are not the Catholick Church because they have grievously erred and in one fundamentall at least Then by your saying the Catholick Church must be distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion Wherefore I desire to be shewn the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years and if it cannot be shewn it will necessarily follow those were the Catholick Church or else the Catholick Church was not alway visible To Mr. T. B SIR 1. BY Letter you desire to have shewed unto you the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in communion with her which was at our meeting manifested as plainly as we can distinguish the whole body from a particular member or a particular member from the whole body The body is one thing the member another the body is totum compositum the whole fabrick the member but a part of it And this is the particular Church of Rome to the whole Catholick (a) Chrysost in 1 Cor. 12. Homil. 30. Every member as St. Chrysostome teacheth hath a proper and a common vertue it hath likewise a peculiar and a common form or shape The hand hath not the shape or strength of the whole man and yet by the meer shape we know it is a mans hand And though we know the Church of Rome by her form that is by her Faith and Government to be a Church yet hath she not the form or virtue of the whole Church be she never so Catholick If she have then must the Catholick borrow her life and being from Rome and not Rome from the Catholick If this particular had the virtue of the whole then Timothy and Titus might not have given Orders or censured Delinquents or redressed what was amisse at Ephesus and Crete but by virtue of a Commission from the Church or Bishop of Rome And yet (b) 1 Tim. 1.3 St. Paul besought Timothy to abide at Ephesus that he might charge some those within his Diocese that they teach no other doctrine then St. Paul had delivered And (c) Tit. 1.5 for this cause left he Titus at Crete that he should redresse what was amisse and ordain Presbyters as hee had appointed him not as the Church of Rome directed him And this was before he had visited that City 2. But if the Church of Rome be the Catholick Church Where was the Catholick Church before she became a Church Was there one or was there none If one then was not that the Romane since there was yet no such Church If none what were (d) Act. 9.31 those Churches throughout all Judea and Galilee and Samaria This was before the Apostles parted from one another to teach all Nations hitherto we find them in these quarters and no other And yet at that time the Catholick Church was in being unlesse the Apostles Creed deceive us For (e) Ruffin in Symb. n. 10. that was framed at Jerusalem before the Apostles went about their great work And for this end was it made that it might be (f) Hanc credentibus dandam esse regulam statuunt lb. credentibus regula a rule for beleevers whosoever became Christian he was to beleeve the Catholick Church which he could not beleeve if it were not in being 3. Secondly if Rome be the Catholick Church then if she be Orthodox the Catholick Church is Orthodox if she be Hereticall or Schismaticall the whole Church must be Hereticall or Schismaticall as she is So the Church shall take denomination from her with her she shall stand or fall Great reason then we should have an eye to Rome and relie upon her But this Church hath been miserably Schismaticall and Hereticall Schismaticall as is to be seen in Platina and Onuphrius when she had sometimes two sometimes three Bishops together a double a treble-headed a monstrous Church Whereas (g) Concil Nic. can 8. in one City there ought to be but one Bishop That she hath been sufficiently hereticall is confessed by your own men And as long as she was in this state shee was no Church (h) Cypr. Pompeio Haeresis enim Christi sponsa non est Heresie is no Spouse of Christ (i) Si Haeretici sunt Christiani esse non possunt Tertul. de Praescrip c. 37. her members not so much as Christians if we may beleeve Tertull. and St. Cyprian And St. Austin saith (k) Aug. de Deut. loc l. 5. c. 10. Haeretici non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicam Hereticks doe not so much as belong to the Catholick Church So then they that confesse Rome to be Hereticall grant her to be no Church And yet who dares say that the Catholick Church was Schismaticall or Hereticall because Rome was so This were to deny to destroy the Church For if Schismaticall she is no body but shivers If Hereticall in the chief fundamentalls at least Where 's the Church Unlesse as there were (l) 2 Cor. 11.13 false Apostles so yee will have false Churches Such Churches we will have nothing to doe with unlesse it be to pray for them and to advise them to (m) Apoc. 2.5 remember from whence they are fallen to repent and to doe their first works 4. Thirdly if Rome be the Catholick Church if any thing be amisse in any particular the fault is hers and she ought to mend it If any mans hand fester or foot be lame if a remedy be not
Temptation not from Religion 10. Thus we are Catholicks and our Church will prove so too We beleeve the holy Catholick Church we professe it is but one (q) Cypr. l. 4. ep 2. A Christo una as St. Cyprian speaks but one of Christs making though divided through all Nations into many members per totum mundum in multa membra divisa (r) Item Episcopatus unus Episcoporum multorum concordi numerositare diffusus Ib. So the Episcopacy is but one under that great (s) 1. S. Pet. 2.25 Bishop of our soules but it is diffused by the numerous consent of many Bishops One Church and one Bishoâ—rick and yet many Bishopricks which are called Churches and (t) Concil Nic. Diatyp 2. every Bishop is head as it were of that Communion or Church which is committed to his charge (u) Tertull. de Praescrip c. 20. These many Churches small or great una est illa ab Apostolis prima ex qua omnes are that one first Apostolicall Church of whom come all (x) Sic omnes primae omnes Apostolicae dum omnes unam probant unitatem Ib. Thus they are all prime all Apostolick while they all approve one unity (y) Ib. c. 32. This unity is by Tertullian placed in Faith and Episcopall succession Hitherto then we are right for those Churches that have this faith and this successive government (z) Ib. non minus Apostolicae deputantur pro consanguinitate doctrinae are equally Apostolick with those very Churches which were planted by the Apostles And in the Councel of Ephesus the appeal is not to the Bishop or Church of Rome for tryall of doctrine but to the (a) Vincent Lirin c. 42. consent of the most famous Catholick Bishops that were before them If Rome be judge the work is short we shall quickly have one Religion setled good or bad But the old rule is this (b) Ib. c. 3. Quod ubique quod semper quod ab omnibus that which hath been beleived in all places at all times by all the Fathers that is truly Catholick and nothing else for ought I know 11. This fully manifests that this Nationall Church is as much Catholick and Apostolick as can be desired And yet I cannot expect that this should work upon you who are obstinately prepossessed against all satisfaction I remember A.C. was not ashamed to publish in print (c) A.C. p. 54. that the Lady whom the two Bishops conferred with did not aske the Question as if she meant to be satisfied with hearing what either of them said And was it not is it not so with you Simon Magus will be the old man say St. Peter what he may And (d) 2. Tim. 3.8 as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses so will your corrupt faction resist the truth come what can 12. But you have reason for what you say and this it is (e) n. 3. Because although I said the Church of Rome was a member of the Catholick yet the 19. Article of our Church sayes that the visible Church of Christ is a Congregation of faithfull men in the which the pure Word of God is preached and the Sacraments be duly administred according to Christs Ordinance in all those things that of necessity are requisite to the same What is here to displease you Is not all true Refute it if you can deny it if you have the face (f) Ib. But in divers other Articles our Church condemnes the Church of Rome for not preaching the pure Word of God And that 's it that offends you Sir we undertake not to judge your Church but her doctrine we condemne her errors and yet acknowledge her to be a Church (g) Apoc. 2.13 God blames the Church of Pergamos for enduring the seat of Satan within her Diocese as also (h) Ib. v. 15. for holding that odious doctrine of the Nicolaitans and yet grants her to be a Church such a one as it was St. Paul calls the Corinthians (i) 1 Cor. 1.2 a Church but (k) Ib. v. 11. c. 3. he blames their schismes (l) Ib. c. 5. their carnality (m) Ib. c. 11. their disorders in the Church (n) Ib v. 20 c. their prophaning of the Lords Supper and (o) Ib. c. 15.12 charges them with the heresie of the Sadduces Your errors were crept in among us and shall not we dare to call them errors and to teach our Country-men to avoyd them Foure of these that B. Martyr hath charged you with and proves them to be blasphemous fables and dangerous deceits as I acquainted you § 24. You read and turn over and take no notice of what you read This 't is to be led by other mens eyes and to see no further then your new Masters will give you leave 13. Justly we taxe you Art 30. for maiming the blessed Eucharist and for denying the Cup or Blood of the Lord to Lay men As if our Saviour had not shed it for them as much as for us and had not given it to them as well as to us What is the meaning then of these words (p) St. Mat. 26.27 Drink ye all of this or did not the Church of Christ understand what they did when they gave it to Priest and People And how can I communicate with them that will not suffer me to communicate with Christ according to his own Ordinance who deny me that which Christ hath commanded me to take In denying me the Cup ye admit me by halves in truth ye forbid me the Lords Table I withdraw not my selfe I have proved § 11. that in the judgement of the Catholick Church this Sacrament is to be administred to the Laity in both kinds I shall adde therefore with you that (q) n. 4. the Church of Rome doth neither preach the pure Word of God nor duly administer the Sacraments in those things that are of necessity requisite for the same This appears by our departure or as you name it our separation not from you but from your errors As you are a Church we communicate with you wherein ye are erronious we depart from you And in this we relie not upon our owne judgement but (r) In ipsa vetustate omnium vel certè penè omnium Sacerdotum pariâ—er Magistrorum definitiones sententiasque sectamur Vincent Lirin c. 3. submit to the generall resolution of the ancient Fathers The Jews at Gods command (s) Lev. 13.46 separated the leprous from the sound the clean from the unclean and so doe we Though (t) Num. 12.14 Miriam were Moses owne Sister yet did he withdraw himselfe and the whole Congregation from her while leprous But when she was healed of her foule disease both he and the rest communicated with her Cast off your leprous errors and we are for your communion 14. And whereas you adde that (u) n. 4. Archbishop Lawd says it is not lawfull to make
a separation for points not necessary I freely subscribe to what he says But withall he tells us that (x) Archbishop Lawd §. 23. In the Church of Rome there are errors in Doctrine and some of them such as most manifestly endanger salvation And I hope it is lawfull to separate from these especially since your most able friends grant that (y) A. C. p. 56. Error in the doctrine of Faith is a just cause of Separation But the same Bishop hath proved that (z) Archbishop Lawd §. 33. n. 13. the Church of Rome hath erred in the doctrine of Faith and dangerously too in severall particulars In those his words then which you mention he touches not us but you not us who are separated passively but your Church which hath actually actively separated and excommunicated us for points not necessary not to be endured in an Orthodoxe Church Thus the cause the fault rests upon you not upon us 15. Whereas then you tell us (a) n. 4. If we say we did not make the Separation but the Church of Rome then Luther Tindall c. did not goe out of the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome out of them What consequence is this or what is this to us What Tindall did I know not neither does it concern us What Luther did I know if the History of the Councel of Trent misguide me not He humbly acquainted you with your errors and enormities and desired redresse and for this ye most unchristianly thrust him forth of your communion resolving rather to persevere in error then to amend what was and is amisse For my part I am resolved not to justifie any man or act against the consent and rules of the ancient Church But our Reformation was legall and canonicall as is fully proved § 20.21 We went not out of the Church to make a Reformation but this we did in the Church according to the laudable customes and canons of the ancient Church And whoever condemnes us for this he condemnes himselfe of grosse ignorance or malice I may justly therefore say with Moses (b) Num. 16.7 Ye take too much upon you ye sons of Levi Ye men of Rome ye transgresse the 92. 165. canons of the Catholick Church by medling beyond your bounds as also by imposing upon us and other Countreys the Creed of Pius Quartus which is contrary to the 177. Canon of the same Code 16. Yet as if no satisfaction were given to your demands you proceed thus (c) n. 5. Therefore I had reason still as in my Letter to demand a Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion of which no man that reads your answer can thereby I think receive satisfaction So you think and some that have read it think otherwise and conceive that I have given full satisfaction to your demands though you be resolved to turn your eares another way For I have demonstrated that when the Church of Rome and those in her communion were no members of the Catholick Church there were at that very time severall Orthodoxe Churches in France § 23. in Asia Sardinia Aegypt and at Constantinople All which at the same instant abhorred those heresies which Rome professed and would have no communion with her or her heresies 17. But say you (d) Ib. the whole drift and scope of my Papers is either to prove First that the Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church Secondly that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her and the Church of England are but one that is severall members of one Church To these in their order For the first you speak truth The Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church this is both said and proved § 12 c. There my minde may be fully seen and till that be disproved I shall adde onely thus much If the Church of Rome be not the Catholick as I affirm and yet the Catholick alwayes visible then was there a Church distinct from the Romane Church when Rome it selfe was not Catholick But there was a time when Rome was not Catholick not Orthodoxe as is proved in my former Papers § 18 23 27 29. 18. Your reply to that which I wrote before is this (e) n. 6. For the first That the Church of Rome and those in communion with her was not the Catholick Church for that time I required you shew no proofe that I doe finde but that some of the Popes have been Hereticks or Schismaticks Proofe then is shewed for this and this I take to be proofe enough For if the head be amisse the whole body is out of tune But the Bishop is (f) Concil Nic. Diatyp 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the head or as the head of that Church whereto he is prefer'd over which he is placed For (g) Episcopus est in Ecclesia Ecclesia in Episcopo Cypr. ep 69. n. 31. as the Bishop is in the Church so is the Church in the Bishop and such as the Bishop is such is the Church presumed to be till it renounce the Bishops errors for h by the Bishop every Church communicates with other Churches Hence it is that at the ordination of a Bishop the Metropolitan or other Bishops of that Province acquaint the Primate therewith and he the other Bishops within his Diocese that so they might know with and by whom they ought to communicate with other Churches This is to be seen in St. Cyprian (i) Cyp. l. 4. ep 8. by the ordination of Cornelius as also (k) Euseb hist l. 7. c. 24. by the deposition of Paulus Samosatenus by the ordination of Domnus into the See of Antioch (l) Ib. This intelligence was given that so they might know to whom to write and from whom to receive Letters of communion 19. That some yea divers of your Popes were Hereticks or Schismaticks is throughly manifested out of your own men § 18 32 c. And while Hereticks (m) Cod. Eccl. Vnivers Can. 171. both themselves and all that side with them are secluded from Ecclesiasticall communion every way (n) Ib. All their Episcopall acts are made void and (o) Ib. Can. 172. those Bishops which adhere to them are to be degraded from their Episcopacy While therefore your Bishops were Hereticall your Church was in an ill case it could not possibly be Catholick when all Episcopall acts were void Is not this a main evidence against you (p) § 23. Some proofe there is also from St. Hilary who professeth that in these Western parts there was in his time no Christian communion but in France This touches not onely the Bishop but the whole Church of Rome and all that adhered to him or that 20. For all this as if it were doubtfull whether your Bishops were such you adjoin (q) n. 6. Which if admitted though it is not to
be so in some of them for that time yet it doth not make that whole Church to be Hereticall or Schismaticall Sir though not admitted by you and your Masters yet it is acknowledged by your own learned men Lyra Stella Almain Platina Onuphrius and others that some of your Bishops have been Hereticall and some Schismaticall And that not for a small time as you seem to imply but for many generations (r) Aventin Annal. Boior l. 5. p. 447. for 450 yeers together they were an infamie to their Order as Aventinus testifies God forbid that I should passe sentence upon every particular person but as a City is rebellious when the Governour and the party prevalent withstand and affront the Prince though many loyall subjects be in that City so when the Bishop and the prevailing part with him fall into heresie that Church is adjudged Hereticall and the denomination is taken from the more eminent and potent faction Thus (s) Socrat. l. 3. c. 29. Sozom. l. 4. c. 10. Rome it selfe was accounted Arian while Bishop Felix communicated with Arians and ordained divers of that persuasion Ministers of that Church And yet blessed be God (t) Theodoret. l. 2. c. 17. Rome at that time had many good people that would not communicate with that Bishop 21. But in the words following it is little lesse then confessed that your Bishops were such as I have related (u) n. 6. For as your next words speak I beleeve you will yeeld that the King of England or Archbishop of Canterbury may be an Heretick or Schismatick and yet the Church of England be still part of the Church Catholick Sir we must distinguish between a professed and close Heretick Those that communicate with a professed Heretick are as he is Hence is it that (x) Theodoret. l. 2. c. 17. Sozom l. 4. c. 10. Felix Bishop of Rome though inwardly Orthodox was adjudged Hereticall for holding communion with the Arians But with a close a concealed Heretick we may communicate and be guiltlesse Thus (y) Act. 8.13 St. Philip communicated a while with Simon Magus (z) 1 Tim. 1.20 St. Paul with Hymeneus and the rest of the Apostles with Nicolaus and were blamelesse But this is to perswade us that your Church was Catholick when your Bishop an Heretick Thus the Popes infallibility is shrunk into heresie it is fallen out of the chaire into the body of the Church and the head shall receive health from the members not the members from the head Whereas anciently the Saints of God judged of the Church by the Bishop not of the Bishop by the Church Yea (a) Concil Nic. Can. 5. the communion of the Church is estimated by communicating with the Bishop and (b) Cod. Eccles Univers can 169 if any whether Priest or other shall sever themselves from their Canonicall Bishop and shall call a Congregation against him or without his directions they are censured to be Hereticks The reason is because (c) Concil Nic. Diatyp 2. the Bishop is as it were the head the life of his Church and (d) Concil Nic. Can. 4. ought not to be ordained without the approbation of all the Bishops of that Province And I know Liberius was ordained with this circumspection Thus the Bishop elected is presumed to be of the same Religion with the rest of the Province and the Province with the Metropolitan Provided therefore it is that (e) Cod. Eccles Univers Can. 5.99.104 the Synod of that Province censure him if he faile of their expectation and depart from the Orthodoxe faith And (f) Ib. Can. 171 172. if they do not they are alike guilty and all that adhere to him or them 22. And for the parties instanced the King of England and Archbishop of Canterbury I beleeve that either or both of them may be Hereticks and this Church not so since it is not their being but our complying that makes us hereticall But if all our Bishops be of the same Religion with them this Church is in an ill case You or I may save our owne soules by not communicating with them by dissenting from them and by protesting against their unsound doctrine But the Church is not to be judged of by you or me but by those that sit in Moses chaire and are (g) 2. Cor. 2.16 either the savour of life unto life or the savour of death unto death For (h) St. Mat. 5.13 if the salt lose its savour wherewith shall it be salted how mended how recovered Surely (i) Ib. it is to be cast forth of the Church out of the dignity it is in and trampled upon as good for nothing This was spoken to the Apostles and with them to their successors But when the King and Priest joyne together it hath a strange influence upon the People for good or bad (k) 4. Reg. 16.10 c. When King Ahaz and Vrijah the Priest professed Idolatry with open face though many good men were resident among them yet was that City and People accounted Hereticall The power of the sword drawes some to sympathize and too many to temporize This is to be seen under the reign of (l) Ista edictorum Imperatoris vi quae in partes Occidentis miserat confecta sunt Socrat. l. 2. c. 29. Constantius Julian Valens and others where we see Religion much depend upon the Imperiall breath But if Prince and Bishop concurre in Religion they hardly meet with opposition Look upon Antioch under Constantius the Emperour and Leontius the Bishop upon Constantinople under Valens and Bishop Eudoxius and you shall see how suddenly they were overrun with heresie Now if it should fall out so unhappily with any or all the Cities of this Kingdome the Diocesan or Nationall Church so infected shall be deemed Hereticall Under K. Edward VI. and Queen Mary the Religion of this Church was judged of by the Governors and thus shall we deal with Rome 23. (n) 6. But if it were granted say you that the Popes of Rome being Schismaticks or Hereticks should annihilate that Church yet that could give me no satisfaction who required not where is not the Catholick Church but where it is that I might communicate with it And I say if the Church of Rome bee annihilated by the Popes Heresie or Apostasie she shall be no Church much lesse the Catholick What then shall become of those Churches in her communion surely they are all in an ill in the same case with her Grant but this and the controversie is at an end You have satisfaction and I ease But this will not serve your turn who now require not where is not but where is the Catholick Church Well if this will give you satisfaction I shall tell you this too The Catholick Church is where ever the Catholick faith is preserved and Apostolick government continued (m) Chrysost in 1. Cor. 12. It hath been dispersed through the whole world though not
4.3 those few in Sardis that had not defiled their garments from the multitude that had (i) Ingemuit totus orbis se Arianum esse miratus est Hieron cont Lucifer c. Vincent Lirin c. 6. The world groaned and wondred to see it self all Arian But God sees not as man sees at that time he had a Church and his eyes beheld it though it were very difficult for man to point it out Visible it was to some and those not over many Thus much for the Visibility of the Church 10. It is time now to look toward the second proposition wherewith you charge me which is this You say the Church of Rome The second Proposition and those in communion with her are not the Catholick Church because they have grievously erred and in one fundamentall at least What ever I said I am sure I have manifested that the Church of Rome and those particular Churches in her communion are not cannot be the Catholick Church no more then some parts of man may be said to be the whole man or (k) The Church is called the House of God 1. Tim. 3.15 some parts of an house to be the whole house But as for the reason which you impose upon me I am certain I never gave it I never said these were not the Catholick Church because they have grievously erred and in one fundamentall at least This reason was not could not be given for that purpose neither was it needfull or usefull For had it never erred the Catholick it could not be a Catholick it might be a part but not the whole If these you speak of be the whole all other are excluded and that your party most uncharitably aimes at Take Rome at the best at the highest (l) Concil Nic. can 6. she hath her priviledges among many not over all other Provinces must enjoy theirs And divers Bishops have as large territories as ever justly had your Pope of Rome He that hath a desire to know the truth of this let him consult the 6 Canon of Nice the 2 3 of Constantinople the 28 of Chalcedon with the 28 125 Canons of the African Code and he shall quickly discern that Rome in those days was no such wondrous Church She no lesse then others had her bounds which she might not passe 11. But I remember well I said that if there were no other cause then the maiming of the Lords Supper I could not communicate with the Church of Rome The reason is because our Saviour ordained it to be given in both kinds and ye have most sacrilegiously robbed the Laity of his blood By this means yee make the people unfit for martyrdome if St. Cyprian mistake not (m) Cyp. l. 1. ep 2 Quomodo saith that Father ad martyrii poculum idoneos facimus si non eos ad BIBENDUM prius in Ecclesia POCULUM DOMINI jure communicationis admittimus How can we make them fit for the cup of Martyrdome if first in the Church we doe not by right of communion admit them to DRINK THE CUP OF THE LORD And againe (n) How can we shed our blood for Christ who are ashamed to drink the blood of Christ Cypr. l. 2. ep 3. Quomodo possumus propter Christum sanguinem fundere qui sanguinem Christi erubescimus bibere No may the people say we are not ashamed to drink it but yee are ashamed to give it us to drink at least to acknowledge the wrong that yee have done us We have a right to drink it but yee have barred us from our right Thus yee have gone against the sense and practise of the Primitive Church Yee have also departed from the Institution of Christ (o) Ex Christi institutione Sacramenta virtutem obtinent Tho 3 q 64.3 c from which the Sacraments receive their force and virtue What efficacy then can your half Sacrament be of 12. But for your further satisfaction I adde First The Church of Rome and those in communion with her are not the Catholick Church exclusivè solely excluding others however divers of that faction appropriate that title to them And yet (p) Art 19. we grant Rome herself to be a Church that is a member of the one Catholick though an erronious member as a vicious man is a man or as an ulcerous member is a part of the body Though we see her errors we deny not her essence but wish she were cleansed from her corruptions Secondly a particular Church cannot be styled the Vniversall and Catholick signifies nothing else * Si hominem dicas jam quemvis hominem dixisti Athan. de Definit tom 2. p. 45. no more then Socrates can be said to be Home in specie all or the onely man Neither can we affirm that man is the onely animal the onely sensitive creature though the most excellent Yet in the third place though we deny you to be the Catholick we acknowledge you to be a Church (q) Archbishop Lawd §. 20. n. 3. For that Church which receives the Scripture as a Rule of faith though but as a partiall and imperfect Rule and both the Sacraments as instrumentall causes and seals of grace though they adde more and misuse these yet cannot but be a true Church in essence 13. It is not then every abuse of Scripture and Sacraments but (r) Haeretici de Deo falsa sentiendo ipsam fidem violan Quapropter non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicā Aug. de Deut. locut l. 6. c. 10. the razing of the foundation that ruines a Church and makes that to be none which heretofore was one Of the essence of the Church I take to be these two (s) Omnes haereses ad utramque formam à nostris Ecclesiis provocatae probent se quaquâ putant Apostolicas Tertul. de Praescrip c. 32. the Catholick faith and the Apostolick government The former is the soul of the Church and gives it life the other is as the sinews thereof which knit the members together firmly into one body Without the former it is built upon sand and without the other it cannot last (t) Heb. 11.6 Without the Catholick faith we cannot please God and without a Bishop the Sacraments will quickly cease Yea the very communion of the Church must fail since according to St. Austin's rule (u) Non possunt communicare nisi iis quos sedere in sedebus Episcopalibus audiebant Aug. ep 163. we may not so much as hold communion with any that have not Episcopall Sees Since then yee professe the Catholick faith and continue the Apostolick government though mixt with corruptions and encroachments (x) Archbishop Lawd § 2◠n. 2. we grant you to be a true but not Orthodox Church For (y) Integritatis custodes recta sectantes Aug. de verâ Rel. c. 5. Orthodox Christians are keepers of integrity and followers of right things Of which the Church of Rome is neither 14. If then
according to your charge I did say that the Romane Church had grievously erred and in one fundamentall at least yet as then so now I am have been and ever shall be loath to deny her to be a true Church since without the Church no salvation If you will make her no Church or a false Church and put your selves out of all hope I can pity you but not help it Indeed the pride of that See is such she will be all or nothing either the Catholick or no Church It is not therefore to her content to yeild her to be a Church since that implyes no more then that she is a member of the whole Alas the Universall she cannot be (z) Sicut universa terra ex multis terris unviversa Ecclesia ex multis constat Ecclesiis Aug. de Civ Dei l. 13. c. 13. that consists of many Churches as the whole earth consists of many lands and countreys and yet but one Earth and one Church Neither of them is couped up or confined within the largest Continent For my part I professe with St. Austin that (a) Aug. contr Crescon Gram. l 3. c. 35. I am in that Church cujus membra sunt omnes illae Ecclesiae quas ex laboribus Apostolorum natas atque firmatas simul in literis canonicis novimus the members whereof are all those Churches which in Scripture we know to have been planted and confirmed by the Apostles industry And (b) Earum communionem quantum me adjuvat Dominus sive in Aphricâ sive ubicunque non deseram Ib. their communion with Gods assistance I shall never forsake whether in England or elsewhere unlesse these forsake the truth I shall never leave the Vniversall to side with any particular Church And I would advise your Masters to take heed lest while with the Dogge in the Fable they catch at too much they lose all 15. (c) Cyprian de unit Eccles The Church according to St. Cyprian is like a Tree whose boughs are many but the body one firmly rooted Ab arbore frange ramum fructus germinare non poterit break the best arme from this body it will bear no fruit for heaven the branch it self will wither and rot and come to nothing Hath that Church you speak of been heretofore a glorious and happy Church Glory not too much in that (d) Ro. 11.18 boast not over the rest of the branches that have been lesse successefull thou bearest not the root but the root thee thou art but graffed in as the rest were and (e) Ib. v. 17. with them thou partakest of the root and fatnesse of the olive tree Remember also though there be many branches yet there is but one originall one root that yeelds sap and life and fruit to every bough great or small Suppose thou be the top-bough yet rend not suffer not thy selfe to be rent from this body Take heed of this lest thou become fewell for that dreadfull fire 16. That the Church of Rome hath grievously and dangerously erred I need no witnesses but your own family Stapleton justifies that (f) Stapleton Relect. cont 1. q. 5. A. 3. there is scarce any sin that can be thought by man Heresie onely excepted with which that See hath not been foully stained especially from the 800 years after Christ. But (g) Stella in luc 22.31 Stella and (h) Almain l. 3. D. 24. q. 1. Almain grant freely that some of the Bishops of Rome did fall into heresie and so ceased to be heads of the Church And though some of that Churches errors at this day be dangerous to salvation yet (i) Archbishop Lawd §. 20. n. 23. that judicious Bishop I then spake of would not venture to set down what errors in doctrine may give just cause of separation in this body or the parts of it one from another Neither shall I by Gods grace be over-bold in this point 17. The points fundamentall are contained in the Creed which is as the Councell of Trent speaks (k) Concil Trid. Sess 3. Et fundamentum firmum unicum not the firm alone but the onely foundation And Bellarmine resolves that (l) Bellar. de Verb. Dei non Scrip. l. 4. c. 11. All things simply necessary for all mens salvation are expressed in the Creed and Deealogue If yee have erred in any of these and grown obstinate in this error yee are become an Hereticall Church in battering the foundation And yet we must take notice that (m) Archbish Lawd § 11. n 1. every thing fundamentall is not of a like neernesse to the foundation nor of equall primenesse in the faith For there are (n) The. 2 a. 2 ◠q. 1. Art 7. c. quaedam prima credibilia certain prime principles of faith in the bosome whereof all other Articles lie wrapped and folded up What ever Church denies or disbeleives any of these ceaseth to be not onely Orthodox but Catholick and so no member of the true Church since (o) 1. S. Jo. 4.3 every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God but is that spirit of Antichrist Now if yee have at any time denied (p) Ib. c. 5.20 this Jesus Christ to be the true God and eternall life ye were at that time no Church but an Antichristian Synagogue But this did Marcellinus and Liberius and John 22. all Bishops of Rome In those times therefore yee were no Church but an Antichristian Synagogue (q) Cypr. Pomp. Haeresis enim Christi Sponsa non est since Heresie is not the Spouse of Christ 18. If you doubt of the Minor Stella makes that good for he testifies that (r) Stella in luc 22.31 Marcellinus sacrificed to Idols that Liberius assented to the Arians that is he denyed our Saviour to be of one and the same substance with the Father and that John 22. affirmed that God the Son is greater then the Father and the Holy Ghost These batter and undermine the foundation which what ever Congregation does it apostatizeth and is no Church While then Rome did and beleeved thus neither she nor any of those that communicated with her in these or any of these heresies (s) Nulla societas fidei perfidiae potest esse Qui cum Christo non est adversarius Christi est Cypr. l. 1. ep 3. were so much as a Church much lesse the Catholick Church Especially since all these are contrary to the Creed and Catholick faith (t) Athan. Cre. which faith except every one doe keep whole and undefiled without doubt he shall perish everlastingly This Creed our Church appeals to whether Catholick or not Catholick this is the faith she desires to be saved by He that faithfully beleives this Creed is a Catholick but he that beleives it not is no Catholick neither can he be saved I am one of Athanasius his Catholicks and with Gods blessing I shall live and
one or more branches be broken off The fountain flows comfortably though a rivulet be cut off The reason is because (m) Jer. 2.13 Christ and no particular Church is the fountain of living waters (n) 8. Jo. 4.14 that spring up into everlasting life and they that seek to him for this water as they ought shall be sure to have it Or as St. Cyprian speaks the Church is (o) Cypr. de unit Eccles luce Domini perfusa she hath her light not from Rome but from (p) S. Jo. 1.9 that true light which enlightens every man that comes into the world And we shall be no longer (q) S. Mat. 5.14 the light of the world then we are furnished with this light 23. So then since you will needs have it so the time was when there was a necessity for the Catholick Church not onely to be distinct but diverse from the Church of Rome and those in her communion otherwise there had been no Church I shall give you a satisfactory instance When Liberius Bishop of Rome turned Arian to recover liberty and an honorable Bishoprick when all Italy and Spain sided with him in that heresie then was the Catholick distinct from Rome and those in her communion For these if we may beleive (r) Haeretici non pertinent ad Ecclesiam Catholicam Aug. Locut de Deut. l. 5. c. 10. St. Austin and (s) Si Haeretici sunt Christiani esse non possunt Tertul. de Praescript c. 37. Tertullian had no share in the Church they were not so much as Christians because Hereticks St. Hilary of Poictieurs lamented the infamous lapse of this Bishop professing publickly thus (t) Hilar. Pict de Synodis p. 287. Ex eo intra nos tantum communio Dominica continetur from that time forward the Lords communion is continued AMONG US ONELY Onely us And who are these that he clears suddenly after in these words (u) Ib. p. 288. Quidam ex vobis firmissima fidei constantia INTRA COMMUNIONEM SE MEAM CONTINENTES SEACAETERIS EXTRA GALLIAS ABSTINUERUNT Some of you with a most firm constancy of faith containing themselves within my communion abstained from others without France Here then was no communion with Rome unlesse you can prove Rome to be in France and yet I hope a Catholick communion Boast not then too much of the Romane Church Wee see in what state it hath been and into the same state without Gods great mercy it may fall again And when such cause is given it shall be lawfull for us in like manner to hold communion within our selves in the three Britains even in England onely And now I think I have shewed you the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion such a one as would have nothing to doe with Rome while Hereticall 24. I have done with the Propositions your desire remaines which requires a large library and a younger man for your words are these Wherefore I desire to be shewn the Catholick Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion for the last 1100 years What will no lesse serve the turn then 1100 years and those together what 's the meaning of this I never undertook any such thing neither as I know hath this Church or any of the Fathers thereof said any such thing (x) Art 19. Our Articles acknowledge the Church of Rome to be a Church and call her so But withall we say that (y) Ib. those of her communion have erred not onely in their living and manner of ceremonies but also in matters of faith And this hath been prettily well proved out of your own men So a Church it is though erronious We have never declared her to be no Church neither have our Articles hitherto charged her with Heresie but (z) Art 22. with fond doctrines vainly invented and founded upon no warranty of Scripture Yea something we blame you with (a) Art 29. that is repugnant to the plain words of Scripture Foure opinions of this kind my Lord of Canterbury taxeth you with viz. (b) Archbishop Lawd §. 33. n. 13 1. Transubstantiation 2. The administration of the blessed Sacrament to the Laity in one kind 3. Invocation of Saints and 4. Adoration of Images Ye have not hitherto quitted your selves of this Inditement and while his book stands unconfuted I shall beleeve that ye are justly charged with these unsound and uncatholick doctrines 25. Besides we acknowledge that (c) Art 26. in the visible Church the evill be ever mingled with the good That sometime the evill have chiefe authority in the ministration of the Word and Sacraments These we deny not to be visible members of the Church but grant that (d) Ib. the effect of Christs Ordinance is not taken away by their wickednesse Though these be bad in and to themselves oft-times their calling does good to others like (e) S. Mat. 23.2 c. the Scribes and Pharisees in Moses chaire We are not then so forward to make a separation as ye are taught to beleeve Indeed hardly any but the Church of Rome hath been so touchy as to excommunicate whole Churches upon slight occasions (f) Euseb hist l. 5. c. 24. What a stir did Bishop Victor keep about the observation of Easter He excommunicated divers Churches because they would not stoop to his lure (g) Ib. Verum ista caeteris omnibus parum placebant but this was little pleasing to the rest of the Bishops and among them to that famous Bishop of Lyons Ireneus Who with divers other (h) Victorem graviùs acerbiùs coarguebant Ib. sharply checked and reproved him for it These consider'd that no member can cut off another without mischief to the whole body even to it self And the hand ought not to doe it without a commission from the head For (i) Neque quisquam nostrum Episcopum se esse Episcoporū constituit aut tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitaiem collegas suos adegit Cypr. in Conc. Cart. ag there is no Bishop of Bishops as ye conceive neither may any one Bishop excommunicate another of his own proper authority (k) Apost Can. 34. Cod. Eccles Vnivers Can. 88. This is the work of a Synod of Bishops Whoever does it of his own head offends against the practise of the Church the Canons and Scripture it self 26. Thus also (l) Euseb hist l. 7. c. 4. Bishop Steven though otherwise a good man carried himself very high about re-baptizing Hereticks Whether zeal or that vain conceit of St. Peter's Chair transported him I know not but this I am sure of he excommunicated all those that re-baptized Hereticks But what said that great Bishop of Cappadocia Firmilianus (m) Firmilian apud Cyp. ep 75. Teipsum excidisti noli te fallere mistake not thy self thou Bishop of Rome while thou goest about to cast out others by this
presumption thou hast cut off thy self from the body of Christ which is his Church In those days he had no such power How he since came by it is laid open to your and every bodies eyes by Archbishop Lawd § 25. n. 12. 27. But why for the last 1100 years Is it because ye dare not trust to the former ages Wherein we finde (n) Lira in S. Mat. 16. Zepherinus to be a Montanist Marcellinus an Idolater Liberius an Arian and Vigilius an Eutychian All Bishops of Rome but no Catholicks Needs therefore in their times must the Catholick Church be distinct from the Church of Rome Or is it because for tryall of the truth of Religion I appealed to the 500. years next after our Saviour I professe I did and doe so because it is common in these dayes even with those that conscientiously pretend to truth (o) Tanta est quorundam errandi libido ut contenti non sint traditâ semel acceptâ antiquitus credendi regulâ sâ—d nova ac nova in diem quaerant semperque aliquid gestiant religioni addere mutare detrahere Vinc. Lirin c. 26. not to be content with the rule of faith which was once delivered to the Saints and received from them by the Primitive Church and so transmitted to posterity But we have an itching after new inventions and our glory it is either to adde or alter or pare off something from Religion These courses I abhorre with a perfect hatred and am taught to doe so by Tertullian and Vincent Lirinensis Yea some of your owne Bishops have resolved that (p) Ib. c. 9. Religion admits of no other course but this ut omnia qua fide a Patribus suscepta forent eadem fide filiis consignarentur that all things be preserved for the children with the same faith wherewith they were received from the primitive Fathers And (q) Nosque Religionem non quâ vellemus ducere sed potius quâ illa duceret sequi oportere Ib. we must not lead Religion whither we please but rather we must follow whither that leads This was the resolution of Stephen Bishop of Rome an holy and prudent man as Vincentius termes him (r) Ib. c. 43. Xistus likewise and Celestinus are of the same minde they will endure no innovations no additions to Antiquity Oh that Rome had always kept close to this rule then should we have had no such ruptures in the Church as we now complain of and bewaile 28. And reason good we have to appeal to Antiquity which is not partiall towards you or us but indifferent to both (s) Ib. c. 8. She never held it meet to maintain the faction or conspiracy of any one Province but (t) Apud ipsam Ecclesiae vetustatem non partis alicujus sed universitatis ab iis suscepta est defensio Ib. she stood up in defence of the whole Church and not for any part thereof And he can be no good Christian that does otherwise St. Cyprian is altogether for this course (u) Cypr. Pomp. if any thing be amisse he sends us to the spring head to finde out the fault The like counsell is given by Ireneus (x) Iren. l. 5. c. 4. If difference arise about any small question nonne oporteret in antiquissimus recurrere Ecclesias in quibus Apostoli conversati sunt ab iis de praesenti quaestione sumere quod certum quod liquidum est ought we not to have recourse to the most ancient Churches not to that in being wherein the Apostles themselves conversed and from those to take that which is certain and clear about the present question Observe from thence we shall have that which is certain Why then shall we content our selves with uncertainties That therefore the third Generall Councell might deal clearly and upon sure grounds with Nestorius (y) Vincent Ligrin c. 42. it took this very course holding it to be Catholicissimum foelicissimum atque optimum factu most Catholick most happy and meetest to be done to take into consideration the sentences of those holy Fathers that were before them Those they took to be their Masters their Counsellors Witnesses and Judges Their doctrine they held close to their counsel they followed to their testimony they gave credit to their judgment they submitted and answerably thereto passed sentence upon the difference then in agitation Blame not us then if we appeal to the Fathers and (z) Vt rite atque solenniter ex eorum consensu atque docreto antiqui dogmatis Religio confirmaretur prophanae novitatis blasphemia condemnaretur Ib. by their unanimous writings judge of Religion that so we may keep to the old Rules and avoyd the blasphemies of profane novelty This was the proper the onely way then known and is now readily to discern without prejudice presumption or partiality whether ye or we be in the right what is Orthodox and what not At this tribunall let us stand or fall 29. All this will hardly prevail with you For say you if this cannot be shewn it will necessarily follow those were the Catholick Church or else the Catholick Church was not alway visible Sir if you can distinguish between man in specie and Socrâ—â—â—s you may quickly distinguish between the Catholick Church and Church of Rome For as man is substantially predicated of many differing in number so is the Church Though St. Peter be a man yet is he not the onely man Judas is a man as much as he they both communicate in the same essence in the same definition the one is as much a reasonable creature as the other And it will not excuse the Church of Rome from being erronious because it is called a Church and hath the same definition with other Churches Good and bad Orthodox and Erronious come not into the definition The onely definition or description of the Catholick Church that I find in Scripture is this (a) 1 Tim. 3.15 The Church is the pillar and ground of truth From whence I argue thus That Church which hath erred is not the pillar and ground of truth But the Church of Rome hath erred Ergo The Church of Rome is not the pillar and ground of truth The Major is undenyable the Minor I prove thus That Church which hath professed Montanisme Arianisme Eutychianisme hath erred But the Church of Rome hath professed all these Ergo The Church of Rome hath erred The Major is clear and the Minor is sufficiently proved § 18.27 It follows therefore necessarily that the Church of Rome neither was nor is the Catholick Church And yet the Catholick Church was then visible when the Church of Rome fell from the Catholick faith and ceased to be a Church (b) Euseb hist l. 5. c. 15. Montanus and his Enthusiasmes were censured and condemned by the Bishops of Asia in divers Synods In those dayes when Arianisme prevailed at Rome the Catholick Church was visible (c) Theodoret
Was it possible such Bishops should reforme abroad what they practised and countenanced at home In those drowsie illiterate and Apostaticall times John 22. broached his damnable heresies And in those times in all probability were those strange doctrines hatched and many of those abuses induced we now protest against Somewhere then the Church was visible when invisible at Rome And occasion is given us to presume that in this very Island it was visible since Erasmus professeth that in all his travels he found learned Bishops in England onely And for many yeers we know the Greek Church had small correspondence or communion with the Latines and yet a visible Church for all this Neither can I doubt but in other countries even in Italy there were some learned Bishops that knew the Canons of the Church and full well understood that (a) Conc. Ephes can 1. heresie discharges not onely the Bishop from his Metropolitan but (b) Ib. can 3. the Clark from subjection to his Bishop The Church of Rome then must pardon us if we withdrew our selves from her Bishops when they fell into Apostasie or heresie And all good men will acquit us for reforming abuses at home according to our duty We have good warrant for what we doe even the authority of the whole Church representative Sir I have done If you be offended that I have stirred too much in these loathsome puddles consider I beseech you that you set me upon this unpleasing â—ask What I have done was at your desire and according to your directions Christ knows I have no private or by end in these my writings it is your satisfaction and salvation which I desire and endeavour God of his mercy give a blessing to these my labours and to you an humble and discerning spirit that you may see the truth and embrace it So prayes Your unworthy friend Edward Boughen Ab adversario mota quaestio discendi existit occasio Aug. de Civit. Dei l. 16. c. 2. Where was our Church before Luther It was just there where yours is now One and the same Church still no doubt of that One in substance but not one in condition of state and purity your part of the same Church remaining in corruption and our part of the same Church under reformation The same Naaman and he a Syrian still but leprous with you and cleansed with us The same man still Archbishop Lawd Ep. Ded. § Now one thing For Edward Boughen Doctor in Divinity These are SIR I. YOur papers I received some moneths since and for your great pains therein I humbly thank you The effect of them is this viz. a Resolution that there can be no Church shewed through the whole world for many hundred years before Luther but the Church of Rome and those in her communion for if there could I presume your learning is such you would have known it and your charity such that being desired you would have shewed it me II. My originall doubt was that sith the Catholick Church must be alway visible and that I could not by my best enquiry finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible that that Church was not the nor any part of the Catholick Church To this doubt at our conference you endevoured my satisfaction by attempting to prove that though the Church of England had not been alway visible at least not seen yet seeing she is but a member of the Catholick Church of which the Church of Rome is another it was sufficient that the Catholick Church had been alway visible in the Church of Rome and other particular Churches though not in the Church of England III. That discourse then did give me no satisfaction because although you said that the Church of Rome was a member of the Catholick yet the 19 th Article of your Church sayes That the visible Church of Christ is a Congregation of faithfull men in the which the pure Word of God is preached and the Sacraments be duly administred according to Christs ordinance in all those things that of necessity are requisite to the same And in divers other your Articles your Church condemnes the Church of Rome for not preaching the pure Word of God As in the 22 th concerning Purgatory Pardons Worshipping of Images and Reliques and Invocation of Saints And in the 24 th concerning the Publick prayers in the Church and the ministring of the Sacraments in a tongue not understood of the people In the 31 th concerning the Sacrifice of the Masse for quick and dead which that your Article calls blasphemous fables and dangerous deceits IV. And for not duly administring the Sacraments In the 30 th Article you say The Cup of the Lord is not to be denied to Lay-people For both the parts of the Lords Sacraments by Christs ordinance and commandement ought to be administred to all Christian men alike So then by the Articles of your Church the Church of Rome doth neither preach the pure Word of God nor duly administer the Sacraments and that in those things that are of necessity requisite for the same as appeares by your separation for your beloved * fo 195. or 7. against Fâ—sher Archbish Lawd says it is not lawfull to make a separation for points not necessary And if you say you did not make the separation but the Church of Rome then Luther Tindall c. did not goe out of the Church of Rome but the Church of Rome out of them V. Therefore I had reason still as in my Letter to demand a Church distinct from the Church of Rome and those in her communion of which no man that reads your answer can thereby I think receive satisfaction For the whole drift and scope of your papers is either to prove First that the Church of Rome and those in her communion is not the Catholick Church or else Secondly that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her and the Church of England are but one that is severall members of one Church VI. For the first that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her was not the Catholick Church for that time I required you shew no proof that I doe finde but that some of the Popes have been either Hereticks or Schismaticks which if admitted though it is not to be so in some of them for that time yet it doth not make that whole Church to be Hereticall or Schismaticall For I beleeve you will yeeld that the King of England or Archbishop of Canterbury may be an Heretick or Schismatick and yet the Church of England be still part of the Catholick Church But if it were granted that the Popes of Rome being Schismaticks or Hereticks should annihilate that Church yet that could give me no satisfaction who required not where is not the Catholick Church but where it is that I might communicate with it 2. For the second that the Church of
own men § 3. Thus that Church hath grievously erred and in more then one fundamentall And yet the Catholick hath been alwayes visible though oft-times invisible at Rome unlesse errors and heresies prove Catholick because professed at Rome 5. All this your Tutors reply not to nor hardly take notice of but have directed you to fall from your former desires upon new questions tempting me as the Pharisees did our Saviour but resolving to receive no answer Thus you put me to more trouble not with a mind to be satisfied but meerly to cavill and to slide over those arguments and testimonies which they are not able to answer or disprove Is not this to speak nothing lest you should seem to be silent Are these things which I have delivered true or false If true (k) A quâ—cunque verum dicitur illo inspirante dicitur qui ipse veritas est Aug. ep 28. let truth prevaile If false disprove them if impertinent manifest it Otherwise if you thus seek evasions you will enforce me to acquaint the world with your shifts and shufflings by publishing these papers that every eye may discern what is the weaknesse of your cause and what your obstinacy 6. Your intent being to decline what you cannot answer you divert me from the former businesse thus (l) n. 2. My originall doubt was say you that sith the Catholick Church must be alway visible and that I could not by my best inquiry finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible that that Church was not the nor any part of the Catholick Church What have I to doe with your originall doubt Your Letter and the expression of your desire I looked upon I endeavoured to satisfie your request and I presume a satisfactory answer was given to your demands that so I might win a soul not so much to our Church as to the Communion of Saints and to lead you out of error into the way of truth That the Catholick Church is hath been and must be alway visible is agreed on both hands But by your best enquiry you could not finde that a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of England had been alway visible No more could the Pharisees see the Prophesies that concerned our Saviour though never so visible Alas poore Gentleman little Learning are you troubled with you are not able to search the Scriptures Councels and Fathers as you ought and your enquiry hath been of such as are either ignorant or wilfully blinde and bent to misguide you 7. The doctrine of the Church of England is cleare in our Book of Common-prayer that is the rule for the Laity and such as the true Catholick Church hath alwayes imbraced and continued All therein is positive The Book of Articles is a rule for the Clergy to preserve them from error and much therein is negative He that means sincerely to instruct you so in the right way that you may be a guide to others must give you directions to avoyd the by-paths The positive doctrine of this Church was ever professed and is visible in all Catholick writers But you insist upon no particulars and guile lurks under generalls But I beseech you before you turned over to the Church of Rome why did not you make the like enquiry to finde out a succession of men professing the doctrine of the Church of Rome in those particulars wherein we dissent from them of that Communion If thus you had done you might easily have discerned that that Church is not the nor any part of the Catholick Church if wee goe by your line For the most skilfull of your party are not able to shew such a succession of men in the first 700 years of Christianity 8. But you are pleased to adde that (m) n. 2. to this doubt at our conference I endeavoured your satisfaction by attempting to prove that though the Church of England had not been alway visible at least not seen yet seeing she is but a member of the Catholick Church of which the Church of Rome is another it was sufficient that the Catholick Church had been alway visible in the Church of Rome and other particular Churches though not in the Church of England Good God what foreheads have men Is this could this possibly be my answer Who alwayes justifie that this Church hath been visible since the first or second Conversion though not alwayes under Reformation And for Rome I have demonstrated that the Catholick Church was not alway visible in that City or Diocese § 22 23 29. As also what kind of Church yee had for 450 yeers together § 33. when hardly the form either of Religion or a Church was there to be seen Yet visible it was here when invisible at Rome For you can never shew that this Church was overrun with Montanism Arianism or Eutychianism Yea this was a learned and pious Church when yours was miserably possest with ignorance and impiety Look upon your owne Mr. Pits his Catalogue of our Writers and this will manifestly appeare 9. However then (n) n. 3. that discourse which I sent unto you gave you no satisfaction yet it abundantly clears the questions proposed in your Letter Neither can I possibly expect to withdraw you from that faction who are resolved to receive no satisfaction unlesse we grant that the Church of Rome and those in communion with her are the onely Catholick Church And yet I never reade in Fathers or Councels that to communicate with Rome is either a sure or any token of a good Catholick St. Austine assures us that (o) Aug. quaest Evangel secund Mat. c. 12. they are good Catholicks qui fidem integram sequuntur bonos more 's who hold the undefiled Faith full and whole and observe good manners and those that endevour not to doe this are much to blame While then thus we doe we are good Catholicks But that Faith which we have received from the Apostles and Councels and Fathers we keep whole and undefiled without alteration addition or diminution While they are right we are so If they be out of the way we are content to erre with them Catholicks we are true right Catholicks by Lirinensis rule (p) Vincent Lirin c. 25. Gods truth the Church the body of Christ we love We prefer no mans no Churches authority no affection no wit no eloquence no philosophie nothing whatsoever before Divine Religion and the Catholick Faith These things we set light by and being fixed firme in faith we have determined by Gods grace to hold and beleeve that and that onely which we know to have been held by the Catholick Church universally of old from the beginning of Christianity And whatever new or unheard of doctrine we shall perceive to have been induced by any particular man or Church besides or against all the holy men of God this we understand to proceed from
perchance in all parts of the habitable world at the same time (n) 1. Cor. 12.12 One it is but many members As the body is one and hath many members so is Christ (o) Chrysost in loc Pro Ecclesia posuit Christum for the Church he sets down Christ since the Church is his body (p) 1. Cor. 12.13 into which we are all baptized This body hath many members these members are diffused from sea to sea over the whole earth So the Church is in Greece Italy Spain France England Polonia and * Unus spiritus inesse omnibus infusus membris una anima meritò dicitur quia una in omnibus fides unus ab omnibus colitur Deus atque ex uno ore hymnos omnes concinunt Deo Ruffin hist l. 9. c. 10. whereever the Catholick faith and Apostolicall government are continued Thus we acknowledge Rome to be a Church as St. Paul did Corinth though an erroneous and superstitious Church You see now where you may communicate with the Catholick but it is left to your discretion to choose whether you will communicate with a reformed or a superstitious Church 24. Now to the second where I say That the Church of Rome and those in her communion and the Church of England are but severall members of the one Catholick Church You reply thus (q) n. 7. That I conceive cannot be 1. For the reasons inferred from the Articles of your Church as above 2. For that the Articles of faith of both Churches are directly contradictory as appears by many your negative Articles I look not upon your conceits but upon your reasons inferred from the Articles of our Church which are already satisfied § 12 13. And whereas you adde that the Articles of faith of both Churches are directly contradictory I hope it is not so If it be I am certaine one of these is no Church For then (r) 1. Cor. 3.11 we build not both upon the same foundation (s) Colos 2.19 we hold not the head from which all the body receives nourishment and is knit compacted together by joynts and bands Quid itaque relicto capite membris adhaeres Why then do you leave the head to cleave to the members corrupt putrified members He that builds upon the rock builds upon sure grounds (t) Aug. de verb. Domini Ser. 45. c. 7. Veni ergo mecum si vis superpetram noli mihi velle esse pro petra if then you befor the rock go along with me and seek not to be the rock to me Behold we build upon the rock we beleeve in God the Father in God the Son and God the holy Ghost I hope ye doe so too We also beleeve the Unity in Trinity and Trinity in Unity And do not ye so too Hitherto we are both upon the Rock We beleeve the * We devoutly professe and in all points follow the faith which is contained in the three Creeds that is to say of the Apostles of the Councel of Nice and of Athanasius The Protest of Bishop Scory c. Book of Mart. p. 2119. three Creeds and in the same sense the Primitive Church received them which ye doe not but give some of the Articles a new another sense Here then ye are beside the Rock 25. Thus we agree and yet not agree we agree in the foundation not in the superstruction in the letter not in the exposition And we are sorry to see you forget your selves so much as to infringe so memorable so necessary a Canon as that of the Councel of Ephesus which decrees that (u) Conc. Ephes Can. 7. It is not lawfull for any one to bring to write or compose any other Creed besides that which was agreed upon by those holy Fathers assembled in the holy Ghost at Nice He that offends in this kind against this Canon is deeply censured If a Bishop he is to be deprived of his Cure if a Clergy-man of his function but if a Lay-man he is to be turned out of the Churches communion But ye have imposed a new another Creed of Pius Quartus upon the Church which whosoever will not subscribe to he is at least no good Catholick w th you 26. Say not that these are expositions they are dangerous additions and though I cannot say ye have altered the letter yet I dare be bold to say ye have strangely alter'd the sense (x) Tertul. de Praescrip c. 38. auferendo proprietates singulorum verborum adjiciendo dispositiones non comparentium rerum by taking away the proper sense of severall words and by inserting imaginations of such things as have no footing in holy Writ Whereas we as we ought take the rule of Faith in the literall sense (y) Quae nullas habet apad nos quaesliones nisi quas haereses inferunt quae Haereticos faciunt Ib. c. 14. and that raiseth no controversies with us but such as heresies bring in and such as make Hereticks Your selves your own Church ye may charge with contradictions this Church ye cannot This is the plea we stand upon (z) Ib. c. 21. Communicamus cum Ecclestis Apostolicis quod nulla vel in nullo doctrina diversa hoc est testimonium veritatis we cannot but communicate with the Primitive the Apostolick Churches whose doctrine is in nothing different from theirs This is such a testimony of the truth that it is above all exception And resolved I am with Gods blessing to be no longer of this communion then I shall be able to make this good 27. And whereas (a) n. 7. Mr. Hooker sayes That the Children of the visible Church are signed with this mark One Lord ONE FAITH one Baptisme I presume you make no doubt of this Neither can I think but that you are resolved whoever denies the Lord of life or renounceth the Catholick faith or is baptized into any other Baptism then that one which our Saviour instituted or is a second time baptized he is no childe of the visible Church since that hath taught us to beleeve one Baptism for the remission of sins He then that forsakes this faith forsakes the Church 28. Thirdly you adde that (b) Ib. I my selfe charge the Church of Rome with errors in matters of faith no lesse then in foure points viz. Transubstantiation Communion in one kinde Invocation of Saints and Adoration of images As if I were the first or the onely man that charged you with these errors whereas (c) Art 22 28 30. this is done by our whole Church and the Inditement is made good by that learned Archbishop of B. memory The Church saith that these doctrines are (d) Art 22. fond things grounded upon no warranty of Scripture but rather repugnant to the Word of God The Archbishop hath charged it home and you know not how to shift it off It would well therefore become a Christian Church to redress these and your other
Ordination 6. The Canonicall Books of the Old Testament and some other And yet for all these they grew up together comfortably and continued in the same body Seldome or never any that offer'd to make a breach or to censure other Churches for these or the like different observations and expressions but two or three Bishops of Rome Such were the humility and charity of those glorious Saints In those purer dayes (l) Neminem judicantes aut a jure communionis aliquem si diversum sensevit amoventes Cypr. in concil Carthag one Bishop was not so forward to censure or excommunicate another Bishop for being of a diverse persuasion No no saith St. Cyprian (m) Ib. Neque quisquam nostrum Episcopum se esse Episcoporum constituit aut tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitatem collegas suos adegit No man in those dayes took upon him to be Bishop of Bishops or to enforce any by tyrannicall terror to subscribe his dictates Then was it lawfull for every one to speak his minde freely when reason not power weight and not number bore the sway 41. But you object that (n) n. 8. I say Sect. 19. that since the Reformation we have not communicated with the Church of Rome Very right I doe so But withall I tell you that this is no fault of ours since ye will not suffer us to communicate with you unlesse we communicate with your errors Is not this to deal with us as the Jews did with the poor man that was born blinde (o) St. Jo. 9.34 while he was blinde the Pharisees communicated with him but when he had gained sight they cast him out they excommunicated him But (p) Ib. v. 35. our blessed Saviour took pity on him and received him into his communion Thus while we were blinde and saw not your errors we were your dear friends but when we discerned them and complained of them hell was good enough for us Yet we doubt not but (q) 1. St. Jo. 1.3 we have communion with Christ since we hold communion with the Apostles by their successors not onely in function but in faith and charity For we receive the two Testaments with the three Creeds in the same sense with the Primitive Church We pray for the whole Church for all Jews Turks Infidels and Hereticks yea for our enemies persecutors and slanderers We anathematize not Churches but errors nor any persons but such as are or ought to be members of this Church and Kingdome we presse not beyond our line If this be the right way to heaven surely we are in the right and ye in the wrong 42. Well (r) n. 9. the Church of Rome and England being thus separated both in faith and communion and so not one and the Church of Rome and those in communion with her by your saying not being the Catholick Church For the separation we must thank you for our faith we blesse Christ What that is the Book of Common-prayer manifests in plain terms and I have shewed that the Pope and his Conclave have incurred Canonicall censures by imposing a new Creed upon us and others That we communicate not with you the fault is yours and Catholicks we shall be able to prove our selves when ye will not be found Orthodoxe But such is that typhus Romanus the infinite pride of Rome that none shal be Catholicks none in communion of the Church nor in the way to heaven that will not stoop to their lure that will not erre with Pius Quartus and the Councel of Trent As if the Romanes were the onely at least had been the first Christians and that St. Peter's keyes were tyed to the Popes girdle to let in and to keep out whom he listed Whereas we know (s) St. Jo. 20.22 23. the keyes were given to all the Apostles alike to St. John for Ephesus as much as to St. Peter for Rome Yea (t) Hieron St. Peter himself provided for Antioch before Rome for he was first Bishop of Antioch The same keyes to all the Apostles for all Nations alike that so all might be admitted by the same keyes into the same (u) 1. Tim. 3.15 house of God which is the Church of the living God the pillar and ground of truth And in this house by Gods grace we shall continue while (x) Col. 2.19 we hold the head and from thence receive nourishment by those joynts and bands which Christ hath ordained And * For the judgment of the whole controversie we refer unto the most holy Scriptures and the Catholick Church of Christ The Protest of Bish Scory c. Book of Mart. p. 2120 were your party contented to be ruled by antiquity we might be one as the house is one 43. That the Church of Rome and those in communion with her are not as you would fain have it the Catholick Church is fully manifested in my former answer § 2 c. 12 22 23 29. And yet there was the Catholick Church at all times since it was first constituted (y) Aug. de Gen. ad lit imperfect c. 1. Mater enim Ecclesia Catholica dicitur ex eo quia universaliter perfecta est in nullo claudicat per totum orbem diffusa est the Mother Church is hence called Catholick because she is universally perfect and halts in nothing and is diffused through the whole world She is not Catholick or sound because she communicates with Rome but Rome is Catholick if she communicate with her and so is every Church We shall therefore communicate with this our Mother that so we may continue Catholick We are sure the Mother halts not though some of the Daughters may That Rome hath halted downright in the prime Articles is too notorious as hath been shewed § 18 27 32 c. and then I am sure she was not Catholick (z) Vincent Lirin c. 14. Nemini enim licet praeter id quod Ecclesia Catholica usquequaque evangelizat accipere for it is not lawfull for her or any other to receive or broach any other doctrine then that which the Catholick Church preaches every where much lesse to enforce it as necessary to salvation Where then ye leave the Church Catholick it is our duty to leave you (a) Estnè aliquis tantae audaciae qui praeter id quod apud Ecclesiam adnunciatum est adnunciet vel tantae levitatis qui praeter id quod ab Ecclesiâ accipit accipiat Ib. This Church he speaks of is not the Romane but the Catholick Church As it is audaciousnesse in you to induce or impose any new Article so were it levity in us to embrace it 44. What we have we have received from our good Mother the Catholick Church and though by you yet not from you Christs legacies they are not yours If ye deliver us these legacies in base or counterfeit coin we shall not accept of it Gold ye received from the Testator and not