and bring all things to your remembrance that I haue told you and which he saith presently after i cap. 16.14 He shall glorifie me for he shall receiue of mine and shall shew it vnto you For hereby it is manifest that the holy Ghost which shall leade vs into all truth because he shall speake nothing of himselfe shall therefore k Thophylact in Ioan. 16. Nihil docturus est extra ea quae Christus docuit speake nothing but what Christ hath before spoken As therefore when Christ saith of himselfe l Ioh. 14.10 I speake not of my selfe hee would import that he spake nothing but what the father had before spoken in the Scriptures of the Law and the Prophets as m Chrysost de sanct orando spiritu Quia seductor est habitus dicit Ego à meipso non loquor sed de lege de Prophet is Chrysostome expoundeth it euen so when he saith of the holy Ghost that he shall speake nothing of himselfe we are likewise to conceiue that the holy Ghost shall teach nothing but what Christ himselfe hath first taught in the Scriptures of the Euangelists and Apostles Whereupon we conclude as Chrysostome doth n Ibid. Siquem videritis dicentem spiritum sanctum habee non loquentem Euangelica sed propria is à seipso loquitur non est spiritus sanctus in ipso Et paulò post Siquis eorum qui dicuntur habere spiritum sanctum dicat aliquid à seipso non ex Euangelijs ne credite c. Ex quo non legit haec scripta sed ex seipso loquitur manifestum est quod non habet spiritum sanctum If yee see a man saying I haue the holy Ghost and not speaking the things of the Gospell but matters of his owne he speaketh of himselfe and the holy Ghost is not in him If any of them who are said to haue the holy Ghost do speake any thing of himselfe and not out of the Gospell beleeue him not For that he readeth not those things which he saith in the Scriptures it is manifest that he hath not the holy Ghost Now therefore seeing M. Bishops church contrary to the ordinance of God seuereth o Esay 59.21 the spirit of truth from p Eph. 1 13. Col. 1.5 the word of truth and speaketh many things of her-felfe whereof Christ hath said nothing whereof wee reade nothing in the Scriptures it is manifest that they play the Sycophants as other heretikes haue done pretending to speake by the spirit of Christ when they speake wholly either by their owne or by a woorse spirit But M. Bishop not content with one corruption in substituting his church of Rome in the place of the Catholike Church of Christ addeth another in saying that that article of our Creede doth teach vs to beleeue the Catholike church Which words although being truely meant they expresse the same in English which wee say in Greeke and Latin yet being by the drift of his speech caried to a verie partiall and false construction doe shew him to be a leaud peruerter of our Christian faith For whereas we saie Credo sanctam ecclesiam Catholicam in the accusatiue case the meaning is I beleeue that there is a holy Catholike church namely that God the Father in all ages and at all times and amidst all the defections and corruptions of the world hath still had and shall haue his number of elect and chosen people to whom the benefite of Christs death and resurrection on standeth effectuall and good by the sanctification of the holy Ghost and the same now not of one nation or people onely but of all nations and peoples thorowout the whole world But M. Bishop by the currant of his speech turneth the accusatiue case into the datiue as if it were said in our Creed Credo ecclesiae sanctae Catholicae I giue credit to the holy Catholike church I beleeue it to be true whatsoeuer is taught me by the holy Catholike church that so his Reader thinkeing himselfe bound to beleeue the Catholike church and taking this Catholike church to be meant of the church of Rome may hold himselfe bound by the articles of his Creed in all things to beleeue the church of Rome Thus he and his fellowes most treacherously and leaudly against their owne knowledge and conscience delude simple and ignorant soules and make them slaues to their impious and wicked deuices by bearing them in hand that they are bound thus to obey the Catholike church Now heereof Master PERKINS iustly inferreth that the eternall truth of God the Creatour is heereby made to depend vpon the determination of the creature For let God say what he will wee shall not stand bound to take it for truth if the church shall say the contrary or vnlesse that which he saith be approoned by the Church Verily as Tertullian vpbraided of old the Senate of Rome that q Tertul. Apologet cap. 5. Apud vos de humano arbitratu diuinitas pensitatur nisi homini deus placuerit deus non erit with them Godhead stood at the discretion of men and vnlesse God did please man he should be no God so may it well be said now of the church of Rome that with them the religion of God standeth at their discretion and that onely shall be religion that pleaseth them For the Bishop of Rome whilest hee taketh vpon him to make declaration of Christian faith maketh what he list of Christian faith and hath verified of himselfe that which Hierome said of Antichrist that r Hieron in Daniel 7. Eleuatur supra omne quod dicitur deu◠cunctam religionem suae subijciens potestati he should subiect all religion to his owne power For the colouring of which iniquity M. Bishop according to their maner vseth guilefull words of notable hypocrisie and with a faire tale gloseth a grosse indignity and damnable presumption against God He telleth vs that Gods truth is sincere and certaine in it selfe before any declaration of the Church Well and what hath the church then to doe with this sincere and certaine truth Forsooth we poore creatures are subiect to mistaking and errour and doe not so certainly vnderstand that truth of God But who are those poore creatures of whom he speaketh Marry M. Bishop and such other petites who are but dij minorum gentium they are poore creatures but the Pope and his Cardinals and the Bishops that comply to him they are rich creatures they are the Church they are exempted from mistaking and errour we must thinke all perfection of wit to be lodged in their braines and that they certainely vnderstand and know the truth of God But what assurance can they giue vs in this behalfe Surely the Scribes and Pharisees the high Priests and Elders of the lewes had as much to say for themselues and a great deale more than they They could plead for themselues ſ Ioh. 8.33 We are the
do not beleeue the one Catholike Church because they doe as well not beleeue it as beleeue it And as for the communion of Saints their learned Masters doe commonly cassier it out of the Creed and that not without cause For by the Saints vnderstanding as the Apostles did all good Christans whether aliue or departed this world they that deny praier to Saints and for the soules in Purgatory haue reason to reiect the common society and enter course that is betweene the Saints and the mutuall honour and help which such good Christian soules doe yeeld and afford one to another R. ABBOT The holy Catholike church which wee beleeue in the Creed being the communion of Saints is onely one The Catholike Church only one which is the body of Christ whereof all the faithfull are members being ioyned into this society by one spirit Visible and Inuisible being but circumstances cannot argue any multiplication of the church because the inuisible church importeth all them and them only who are the true members in their time of the visible church For in the visible church the name of the church properly belongeth to them onely who liue by faith and by the spirit of Christ the rest are not members but a August in 1 Ioan. epist tract 3. Sic sunt in corpore Christi quomodo humores mali as euill humours in the body which wait their time to be purged out In the meane time because all professe to seeke Christ and to serue him and our eies cannot distinguish betwixt them that truely doe so and them that doe not therefore visibly and to vs all goe together vnder the name of the church though many there be hypocrites and time seruers who with God and to his sight are no part thereof So then the church visible and inuisible in substance are the same they differ only in respect and M. Bishop knoweth that respects change not the natures of things and therefore those different respects doe nothing hinder but that the church in nature is alwaies one As touching the holinesse of the church M. Bishop in the deliuering of our opinion keepeth his woont He saith The holines of the church imputatiue and reall that we imagine it to be holy by the imputation of Christs holinesse to the elected brethren and not by the infusion of the holy Ghost into the hearts of all the faithful Whereas we doe not imagine only but by the word of God beleeue and know that the church and all the members thereof are holy not onely iudicially by the imputation of Christs holines but also really by the infusion of the holy Ghost begun in this life by b Rom. 8.23 the first fruits of the spirit and fully to be perefected when the promise of Christ shall be fullfilled c Mat. 5.6 Blessed are they that hunger and thirst after righteousnesse for they shal be satisfied Againe he excepteth against vs that we cannot abide the name Catholike in the true sense of it Of the true sense of the name Catholike But what is that true sense That is saith hee they will not beleeue the true church to haue beene alwaies visibly extant since the time of the Apostles But what ancient father did euer set this downe for the true sense of the name Catholike If any let him be brought foorth If none why doth he contrary to his owne prescription introduce a new exposition of an article of our beleefe Cyril in his Catechisme bringeth in all the meanings of the name Catholike that he could learne that the church is so called for that d Cyril Hierosci Catechis 18. Illuminat Catholica vocatur quia per vntuersum sit orâ—em terrarum diffusa c. Et quia doret Catholicè hoc est vniuersalitèr sine vllo defectu vel differentia omnia dogmata quae deberent venire in cognitionem c Et quòd omne genus hominum ipè subiugat et quia in vniuersum curat omne genus peccatorum c. hab turque in illa omne genus virtutis c. it is vniuersally spread thorow the whole world for that it teacheth vniuersally all doctrines that are to be known for that it subiecteth to it alkinde of men for that it healeth all kinde of sinnes for that it hath in it all kind of vertues but of M. Bishops meaning that it should be alwaies visibly extant he had learned nothing Surely S. Ambrose saith e Ambros Hexaem lib. 3. cap. 2. Ecclesia habet tempora sua persecutionis pacis videtur sicut luna deficere sed non deficit obumbrari potest deficere non potest The church hath her times of persecution and peace it seemeth as the Moone to faile but it faileth not it may be ouershadowed but vtterly faile it cannot If the church may be as the Moone so ouershadowed by persecution as not to be seene then it is not necessary to be alwaies visibly extant and if that be not necessary then M. Bishop hath plaied heere the false merchant to tell vs that the church is therefore called Catholike because it is alwaies visibly extant Albeit there is somewhat also to be obserued concerning the name of the true church that we may speake to that time of the visibility of the church which M. Bishop specially intendeth For if wee call that the true Church which truely hath the outward vocation and calling of the church then we deny not but that the church in the time of Antichrist must bee and hath beene alwaies visibly extant because Antichrist was to possesse and hath possessed the visible state of the church But if by the true church we meane those members of the church which are truely correspondent to the vocation and calling of the church in faith and obedience vnto God then the true church is not alwaies visible because the greater part being the woorse doth many times oppresse the better and weaker part and proudly carrying it selfe in the opinion and confidence of it selfe persecuteth and driueth into corners all them that gainesay their traditions and wilworships which by their owne authority they establish to delude thereby and frustrate the word of God And thus we say that the true church in the time of the exaltation of Antichrist was in a sort inuisible the publike state of the church yeelding it selfe in thraldome to his tyranny and persecuting the true members of the church who disclaiming his obedience sought to keepe themselues entire and faithfull vnto God Whereas hee further addeth for the notation of the name Catholike that the church was so called as being generally spred into all countries we willingly acknowledge the same as being before acknowledged by the ancient church and defended against the Donatists who by other expositions sought to draw the name vnto themselues as the Papists now doe Onely wee adde that caution which Bellarmine himselfe hath deliuered as necessary for himselfe that f Beliarm
THE THIRD PART OF THE DEFENCE of the Reformed Catholike Against DOCT. BISHOPS Second part of the Reformation of a Catholike as the same was first guilefully published vnder that name conteining only a large and most malicious Preface to the Reader and an Answer to M. PERKINS his Aduertisement to Romane Catholicks c. Whereunto is added An Aduertisement for the time concerning the said DOCT. BISHOPS Reproofe lately published against a little piece of the Answer to his Epistle to the King with an Answer to some few exceptions taken against the same by M. T. Higgons lately become a Proselyte of the Church of Rome By R. ABBOT Doctor of Diuinitie Cypr. l. 1. epist 3. Haec est verè domentia non cogitare nec scire quòd mendacia non diu fallant noctem tamdiu esse quamdiu illucescat dies c. LONDINI Impensis GEORGII BISHOP 1609. THE PREFACE to the Reader GOOD Christian Reader thou shalt vnderstand that vntill the greater part of this Booke was printed I thought I had giuen thee therein an answer to all that Doct. Bishop had published vnder the name of his Second part But being at Southwell not long since to doe my dutie to the most Reuerend Father the L. Archbishop of Yorke his Gr. being pleased to vse speech to me concerning a point in the said Second part and shewing me thereof the booke it selfe I perceiued a defect in that that I had answered finding there handled the other questions of the Reformed Catholike which he had left vntouched in his former booke and whereof in the booke which I had receiued there was conteined nothing In turning the booke I found a fault of the Print in the answer to the Aduertisement corrected in the end of the questions whereby I presently perceiued that he first printed his vngodly Preface here conteined and the said answer for some cunning deuice what it might be I leaue to thee to ghesse did thus publish the beginning and end of the booke and left the middle part to be added at his pleasure afterward As it first came foorth so I receiued it enquiring after no more because I thought I had receiued all and knowing of no more I haue written to no more and had I knowen of the rest before I had printed so much of this I would haue suppressed this till I had confuted that as I haue done this And heereby thou vnderstandest the cause why I haue in diuers places of this booke taxed M. Preface sect 22 pag. 190. Aduert sect 1. pag. 193. c. Bishop for the omitting of those questions because hee himselfe had then diuulged his book without them neither had I heard that he had written any thing of them which taxations though now I cannot alter yet by this Preface I reuoke and doe wish thee to passe them ouer as if they were not there at all Albeit where I might alter them I haue so done and therefore recalled from the Presse the copie of my Preface and aduertisement heere adioyued wherein I had further noted that omission by meanes whereof and for the adding of an answer to some few exceptions taken against mee by M. Higgons lately reuolted from vs so soone as I could get the sight thereof this booke hath been somwhat longer in comming foorth than otherwise it should haue beene To which being though not by my default thus maimed and vnperfect I haue done some disgrace by withdrawing from it the Dedication which I had intended being notwithstanding good Reader to intreat thy gentle patience to take this in good part till God shall giue me opportunitie heereafter to adde the rest Heereafter I say because it shall first be necessarie for mee to returne a Counterproofe to Doct. Bishops Reproofe lately published against a little peece of my answer to his Epistle Concerning which worke of his being such as I presume will in the end make him odious and hatefull to all men that will take knowledge of it I haue heere added some aduertisement for the time and giuen an answer to his Preface wherein he hath taken vpon him to haue said so much as may suffice to discredit me with all indifferent men that whereas it will require some longer time to examine his Reproofe in that sort as I intend it I may notwithstanding in the meane time somewhat abate the edge and remooue the scandall of it whilest by discouery of some of his iuglings if at least being so grosse and palpable they deserue to be called iuglings the Reader shall be able to conceiue what he is in all the rest I will heere amplifie nothing further but refer thee to those obseruations that I haue giuen thee thereof God giue his blessing both to my writing and to thy reading that we may both grow in hatred of Antichristian error and in the knowledge and loue of the trueth of God Thine in the Lord R. ABBOT THE ANSWER TO Doctor BISHOPS Preface to his second part of the Reformation of a Catholike c. 1. W. BISHOP CHristian Reader I suppose it shall please thee better if I doe entertaine thy studious minde with some serious discourse than if I went about to court it with the ordinary complements of a curious preamble Wherefore I purpose by thy gentle patience to handle here a matter of maruellous great importance which M. PERK towards the latter end of his booke laieth out against vs in maner of a most grieuous complaint it is that we Catholikes among many other capitall crimes by vs as he fableth defended doe bolster and vphold the most haynous sinne of Atheisme The man is not a little troubled to deuise wherein we doe maintaine any such point of impietie For compelled by the cleere euidence of trueth he confessed that we doe rightly acknowledge the vnitie of the God-head in the Trinitie of persons yet that hee may seeme to say something therein against vs he flieth vnto the threed-bare ragges of their common slanders of mans merits and satisfactions and such old stuffe and stretching them on the tenter-hooks yet one nayle further then his fellows striueth to draw out of them a certaine strange kinde of Atheisme in this maner The Roman religion makes the merit of the works of men Rom. 11.6 to concurre with the grace of God therefore it ouerthrowes the grace of God Item they acknowledge the infinite iustice and mercy of God but by consequence both are denied for how can that be infinite iustice which may any way bee appeased by humane satisfaction And how shall Gods mercy be infinite when we by our owne satisfactions must adde a supply to the satisfaction of Christ There needs apretie wit I weene to vnderstand how these points appertaine to Atheisme For suppose that we defended that the merit of the works of man concurred with Gods grace as two distinct agents which wee doe not for we hold that no works of man haue any merit vnlesse they spring and proceed
death confessed that all his life he had doubted of three things whereof now he should be resolued whether there were a God whether the soule be immortall and whether there be any life after this life as Iulius the third who commanded to bring him his Porke in despight of God as Leo the tenth who made but a fable and a toy of all that we beleeue concerning Christ Many other of them haue there been of the same stampe most damnable villaines the very monsters of mankind vtterly deuoid of all remorse and conscience of piety towards God and thereby giuen ouer to all dissolutenesse and abomination of wicked and finfull life From them and their appendants hath this poison spred it selfe not only into the whole Court and City of Rome but into all Italy insomuch that in the Italian tongue the name of f Hespinian de Origine Monachatus lib. 6. c. 66. a Christian is by custome growen to signifie a foole M. Bishop well knoweth what the curse of the Wolfe is a most horrible blasphemy there vsed not fit for the mouth of any Christian to speake or the pen of any Christian to write to which though the Pope for his credits sake haue of later time assigned some kind of punishment yet well he woteth that it is more generall than that his Law can worke the restraint of it Out of Italy or at least from birds of the Popes hatching came the book De tribus mundi impostoribus whereby Moses and Christ as well as Mahomet are made but deluders and deceiuers of the world Out of Italy came Machiauels precepts wherby he hath taught men to cast off all yoke of religion and to vseit only to serue turne which notwithstanding according to that conceipt that he had of religion could say that g Machiauel Disputat de resubl l. 1. c. 12. Nusquam mâ—nus vel pietatis vel religionis est quam in ijs hominibus qui Romae vicinâ—ores habitant there was no where lesse faith or piety than in them that dwell neerest to Rome Whose rules as they are at this day the managing of the Papacy and familiar to all states that are confederated therewith so specially are they entertained and practised by the Iesuits who hauing taken away the honor from Friar Dominick of being the pillar of the Lateran Church and being become the speciall vpholders of the declining kingdome of Antichrist are discouered by the secular Priests and namely by their Proctor Watson to be very Atheists not regarding religion at all but only for a cloke to hide their villanies and for the compassing of their wicked and vngodly designes Thus Atheisme albeit it be not contained in the positiue Doctrine of the Romane Church yet becommeth a sequell thereof whilst hauing no true grounds for the iustifying of it and therfore being driuen to support it selfe by carnall policy it begetteth in the Politicians that practise for it a striuing and fighting against God whereby religion is quite banished out of the heart and only an outward colour remaineth for their maintenance of outward state Now therefore I will not question them of Atheisme vpon M. Perkins grounds but leauing his conclusion will only examine so far as need requireth M. Bishops defense of the propositions from which he draweth that conclusion there being nothing here but what either hath been before or must afterwards be further spoken of First M. Popery ouerthroweth the grace of God Perkins propoundeth that the Church of Rome making the merit of mens works to concur with the grace of God ouerthroweth the grace of God Which to be true appeareth by the words of the Apostle who mentioning k Rom. 11 6. the election of grace inferreth thus If it be of grace it is not of works otherwise grace is no grace or if it be of works it is not of grace otherwise worke is no worke importing plainly that grace and worke cannot be so reconciled as that what is of grace may truely be said to bee of works or what is of works may truely bee said to bee of grace For grace as Hierome expoundeth it importeth i Hieron Rom. ca. 11. Gratuitum munus appellatur a free gift so that k Iden epistâ—ad Vâ—metriad vli gratià non operum retributio sed donatis est largitas where grace is there is not rewarding of works but largesse and bounty of gift For l Leo epist. 84. Quae vtâ—que nisi â—atis detur non est gratia sed merces retributiâ—o meritoâ—uÌ„ grace saith Leo bishop of Rome except it be freely giuen is not grace but the reward and recempense of merits or workes implying that if it be the reward of merits then it is not freely giuen and therefore cannot be calied grace Therefore when the Apostle saith m Rom. 6.23 Eternall life is the grace or gift of God through Iesus Christ our Lord we must vnderstand it according to the words of the Psalme n Vulgat Latin Psal 55.7 Proâ—ihilo saluos facies illos Thou wilt saue them for nothing o â—â—eion ad Pâ—â—â—g lib 2. Hand 〈◊〉 quio iustos qui nou proprâ—â—â—crâ—to sed de saluâ—ntur clementia meaning the iust saith Hierome who art not saued by their owne merit but by the mercy of God To this M. Bishop telleth vs that they doe not make the merit of mans worke and the grace of God two distinct agents but hold that no works of man haue any merit vnlesse they proceed and prinâ— from the very grace of God Where not to question what he meaneth by giuing the name of an agent to the merit of mans worke answer him to the rest that his answer is vnsefficient and vaine because the Apostle knew well that we haue no workes wherewith to mooue God but only such as proceed from the grace of God and yet resolueth that Gods election if it be of works cannot be said to be of grace Whencesoeuer the workes proceed this rule standeth still most firme and sure that that cannot be said to be freely giuen and for nothing that is repaied to the merit of workes But whilest they will haue only workes of nature excluded by the Apostles words and not the workes that are wrought by grace they necessarily fall into the heresie of the Pelagians that the election of grace dependeth vpon the foresight of those works which our free will should doe by the help of grace Which if they will not grant as I trow they will not they must perforce confesse that the Apostle heere excludeth not only workes of nature but generally all workes whatsoeuer And the rather must they so confesse that they may not make the Apostle speake so idlely as by that construction he doth If it be of grace then it is not of workes done without grace and if it be of workes done without grace then it is not of grace as if the Apostle had had to doe with men who
Sunne and in the Moone and vpon the crosse that is in many places and that c Idem in Ioan. er 31. Cùm ad alium locum venerit in eo loco vnde venit non est When he is come to another place he is not in the place from whence he came and therefore that d Vigil cont Eutich lib. 4. Quando in terra fuit caro Christi non erat vtiâ— in coelo nunc quia in coelo est non est vtique in terra The body of Christ when it was vpon earth was not in heauen and now because it is in heauen it is not vpon the earth that e Ambr. in Luc. l. 1. c. 24. Ergo non supra terram nec interra nec secundum carnem ti quaerere debemus si volumus inuenire c. Stephanus tetigit quia quaesiuit in coele If we will find Christ we must not seeke him in the earth nor vpon the earth nor according to the flesh but in heauen They would neuer haue spoken thus without any limitation or exception if they had beleeued that which M. Bishop heere would make vs beleeue out of the doctrine of the church of Rome that the body of Christ may be in infinite places at once that it may be together both in heauen and earth with forme and without forme both visible and inuisible both circumscribed and vncircumscribed that is to say by a plaine contradiction both that that it is and that that it is not Surely they would haue saied as we doe If it be visible it cannot be inuisible or if it be inuisible it cannot be visible if it haue forme then it is not without forme or if it be without forme how should it be said to haue any forme both these cannot stand together True saith M. Bishop in one and the same maner of existence and being And say I if it be but one and the same body it can at once haue but one maner of existing and being for according to the same or totally to be thus not thus cannot agree to one and the same thing As for his instances whereby hee would take away the improbabilitie of this fancie they are altogether ridiculous Christ saith hee when hee was transfigured had another maner of outward forme and appearance then he had before and after his resurrection when it pleased him hee was visible to his Apostles and at other times inuisible And what then Ergo Christs body may be in many places at once it may together be both visible and inuisible and whatsoeuer pleaseth them But a man may euen as well say M. Bishop is sometimes hot and sometimes cold somtimes asleepe sometimes awake sometimes sober sometimes merrie sometimes like a schollar sometimes like a swaggerer sometimes at Rome sometimes in England ergò hee may at one time be together both asleepe and awake both visible and inuisible both at Rome and in England and in many places at once so that though by Parsons procurement he were fast laied vp in prison yet he might at the same time be personally before the Pope to acquaint him with the appeale of the secular Priests and the exorbitant dealing of the Iesuites against them What will he not call him a dreaming Sophister that should conclude thus Well then let him for his paines take his fellow to him and learne to argue more wisely another time But marke heere gentle Reader that M. Bishop maketh Philosophie a witnesse of this matter We haue thought heeretofore that they rested the same wholly and meerely vpon the omnipotent power of God and haue obserued how their schoole-philosophers when they speake of relation of bodies to their places do except this matter of the reall presence as a matter of irregularity not comming within compasse of the rules of Philosophy but farre transcendent aboue all their learning Now M. Bishop will make vs beleeue that it standeth with good Philosophy and that all their Philosophers haue all this while beene deceiued marrie it is woorth the while to note in what termes and how warily he hath set it downe The externall relations of bodies vnto their places do no whit at all destroy their inward and naturall substances as all Philosophy testifieth You say well M. Bishop and very wisely Indeed it is not relation to a place but the want of relation to a place that taketh away the nature of a body For f Aug. epist 50. spatia locorum tolle corporibus nusquam erunt quia nusquam erunt nec erunt take from bodies space of place saieth Austin and they shall be no where and because they shall be no where they shall not be at all g Cyril de Trinit lib. 2. si corpus in loco omninò in magnitudine in quantitaete si quanta facta esset non effugeret cireumscriptionem If it be a body saith Cyrill then verily it is in a place and hath greatnesse and quantitie and if it haue quantitie it cannot be but that it must be circumscribed h Didym de spâ—sancto l. 2. si spiritus veritatis iuxta naturas corporum circumscriptus est certo spacio alium deserens locum ad alium commigrauit It is the nature of a body saieth Didymus to be circumscribed in a certaine space and therefore by comming into one place it must forsake another You therefore affirming the body of Christ vncircumscribed and hauing no commensuration or space of place and comming into one place without the leauing of another doe thereby vtterly destroy the nature of a body i Ibid. Impossibile est impium ista quae diximus in corporalibus credere It is impossible and a thing impious saith Didymus to beleeue these things concerning bodily substances This was the Philosophy that these Fathers had learned They knew by Philosophy and by trueth that a body must haue extension of parts and one part different and distant from another and place correspondent to euerie part so that where one part is there another cannot be and the whole so limited to one place as that without leauing that place it cannot be in another but neither did Philosophy nor Diuinitie teach them that vncircumscribed body which M. Bishop speaketh of 3. W. BISHOP Secondly Master PERKINS chargeth vs with disgrading Christ of his offices saying that for one Iesus Christ the only King law-giuer and head of the Church they ioine vnto him the Pope not only as a Vicar but as a fellow in that they giue vnto him power to make lawes binding in conscience to resolue and determine infallibly the sense of holy Scripture properly to pardon sinne to haue authority ouer the whole earth and a part of hell to depose Kings to whom vnder Christ euery soule is subject to absolue subjects from the oath of allegeance c. Answer Here is a bed-role of many superfluous speeches for not one of all these things if
we admit them all to be true doth conuince vs to haue disgraded Christ of his offices which are these to appease Gods wrath towards vs to pay the ransome for our sinnes to conquer the Diuell to open the Kingdome of heauen to bee supreme head of both men and Angels and such like He may without any derogation vnto these his soueraigne prerogatiues giue vnto his seruants first power to make lawes to binde in conscience as he hath done to all Princes which the Protestants themselues dare not denie then to determine vnfallibly of the true sense of holy Scripture which the Apostles could doe as all men confesse and yet do not make them Christs fellowes but his humble seruants to whom also hee gaue power properly to pardon sinnes Luc. 24. Ioan. 20. Mar. 16. Matt. 28. Whose sinnes you pardon on earth shall be pardoned in heauen and finally to them he also gaue authoritie ouer the whole earth goe into the vniuersall world Ouer part of hell no Pope hath authoritie and when he doeth good to any soule in Purgatory it is per modum suffragij as a suppliant and entreater not as a commander Whether hee hath any authoritie ouer Princes and their subiects in temporall affaires it is questioned by some yet no man not wilfully blinde can doubt but that Christ might haue giuen him that authority without disgrading himselfe of it as he hath imparted to him and to others also faculties of greater authoritie and vertue reseruing neuerthelesse the same vnto himselfe in a much more excellent maner As a King by substituting a Viceroy or some such like deputie to whom he giues most large commission doth not thereby disgrade himselfe of his Kingly authority as all the world knowes no more did our Sauiour Christ Iesus bereaue himselfe of his power or dignitie when hee bestowed some part thereof vpon his substitutes He goes on multiplying a number of idle words to small purpose as that we for one Christ the onely reall Priest of the new Testament ioyne many secondary Priests vnto him which offer Christ daily in the Masse Wee indeed hold the Apostles to haue beene made by Christ not imputatiue or phantasticall but reall and true Priests And by Christ his owne order and commandement to haue offered his body and bloud daily in the sacrifice of the Masse what of that see that question Furthermore he saith for one Iesus the all-sufficient mediatour of intercession they haue added many fellowes to him to make request for vs namely as many Saints as be in the Popes Kalendar yea and many more too For we hold that any of the faithfull yet liuing may bee also requested to pray for vs neither shall hee in haste bee able to prooue that Christ onely maketh intercession for vs though he be the onely mediatour that hath redeemed vs. R. ABBOT Christ by his office is our Prophet our Priest and our King Christ degraded by the Pope As a Prophet he hath declared fully and finally the whole counsell and way of God for the attainment of eternall life As a Priest he hath offered a sacrifice for our redemption and by vertue of that sacrifice is our Mediatour to intreat mercy for vs. As a King he prescribeth lawes whereby to gouerne vs and hauing a Matt. 28.18 All power giuen to him both in heauen and earth exerciseth the same to safegard and defend vs. In all these offices of which M. Bishop speaketh as if he vnderstood not what they meane the Church of Rome offereth most high indignity to the Son of God To take the points spoken of in order as they are first they are iniurious to the kingdome of Christ in that they giue the Pope authority to make lawes to bind in conscience which Christ only hath authority to doe b See hereof part 2. pag. 17.18 To bind in conscience is to tie the conscience and inward man to an opinion of holinesse and spirituall deuotion in the thing which is done so as to account the same a worship of religion whereby God is truly serued and honoured yea and further according to Romish fancies the means of remission of sinnes and the merit of eternall life This whosoeuer doth sheweth himselfe a deceiuer and an Antichrist and the Pope in so doing is found to be he of whom the Apostle prophecied c 2. Thess 2.4 that he should sit as God in the temple of God domineering in the hearts and consciences of them of whom it is said d 2. Cor. 6.16 Ye are the temple of the liuing God If Princes attempt to make lawes in this sort they are therein vniust and presumptuous against God Otherwise to speake of Princes lawes God himselfe bindeth the conscience to yeeld the outward man in subiection to the Prince when notwithstanding the conscience it selfe remaineth free as touching the thing which the Prince commandeth I know that in outward things it is true which the Apostle saith e 1. Cor. 6.12 10.23 All things are lawfull for mee I may doe all things God hath giuen mee no restraint To eat or not to eat to weare such a garment or not to weare it to doe thus or thus it is all one with God I am no whit the better the one way nor the worse the other way Neuerthelesse if my Prince command mee either way God requireth mee to abbridge my selfe of the outward vse of that liberty which he otherwise hath giuen mee and to performe obedience to my Prince yet still retaining inwardly the same opinion and persuasion of the thing in it selfe that I had before and therefore content to tie my selfe outwardly to do thus because I know inwardly that it is indifferent to God either to doe thus or thus The second presumption of the Pope against Christ is in taking vpon him infallibly to determine the sense of holy Scripture By which pretense he most impudently carieth himselfe bringing all abhominations into the Church and corrupting all religion and seruice of God and yet affirming that he doth nothing contrary to the Scripture because whatsoeuer the words of Scripture are yet the sense must be no other but what he list But well might we be thought to be without sense if so senseles a tale should preuaile with vs a thing which in the ancient Church for so many hundreds of yeeres amidst so many questions and controuersies was neuer dreamed of What needed the fathers so much to busie themselues and out of their owne exercise and experience prescribe rules to others for finding out the true sense of Scripture when as a Pope with a wet finger could haue helped them to the certaine and infallible truth thereof Yea why haue we so many Commentatours of the Church of Rome so various and diuers in their expositions and interpretations of Scripture and why doth not the Pope rather by one commentary of his illuminated vnderstanding reconcile all differences dispatch all doubts and resolue at once
habeant notitiam leprosi vel non leprosi possint discernere qui mundus quiuè immundus fit sic hic alligat vel soluit episcopus Et Presbyter non eos qui insontes sunt vel noxij sed pro officio suo cum peccatorum audierit varietates scit qui ligandus sit qui soluendus as the Priest in Moses law did make the Leper cleane or vncleane not for that he did so properly and indeed but only tooke notice who was a leper and who was not and did discerne betwixt the cleane and the vncleane so heere the Bishop or Priest doth bind or loose not bind them which be innocent or loose the guilty but when according to his office he heareth the variety of sinnes he knoweth who is to be bound and who to be loosed Not so then as that in propriety of speech he either remitteth or retaineth sinnes but only discerneth and notifieth who is to be taken for bound with God and who for loosed whose sinnes must be holden either to be remitted or retained y Idem in Mat. 18. vt sciant qui à talibus condemnantur sententiam humanam diuina sententia roborari Which sentence of man they who are thus condemned as Hierome againe saith must know to be strengthened and made good by the sentence of God himself namely when it proceedeth according to those rules and directions which God hath prescribed in this behalfe for otherwise z Idem in Mat. 16. Cùm apud deum non sententia sacerdotis sed reorum vita quaeratur it is not the sentence of the Priest but the life of the parties that is inquired of with God Here then the Pope is a manifest vsurper first against God in that he taketh vpon him a power properly to forgiue sinnes and thereby seateth himselfe in the throne of Iesus Christ secondly against the Church of God in challenging to himselfe a propriety of that which was spoken a Gregor in 1. Reg. l 6. cap. 3. vniuersali ecclesiae dicitur Quodcunque ligaueris c. to the vniuersall Church and wherein euery one that is a successour of the Apostles hath as great power and authority as he Christ saith he gaue his Apostles authority ouer the whole earth Goe into the vniuersall world But by this Christ gaue no more authority to one of them then he did to another and whatsoeuer he gaue them what is it to the Pope that he should thereby challenge b Deecret Greg. de foro competenti cap. Licet de Appellat ca. vt debitus in glossa Papa vnusomnium hominum ordinarius the whole world to be his diocesse and should define that c Extrau de maior obed c. vnam santam subesse Romano Pontifici omni humanae creaturae pronunciamus omninò esse de necessitate salutis it concerneth euery humane creature vpon perill of damnation to be subiect vnto him And what authority did Christ giue them hereby other then S. Mathew expresseth d Mat. 28.19 Goe teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father of the Sonne and of the holy Ghost teaching them to obserue al things whatsoeuer I haue commanded you This was their authority they had no power to command but what Christ had commanded them Let the Pope conforme himselfe to the tenour of this commission and he will then renounce his Popedome and we shall acknowledge him the disciple and seruant of Iesus Christ Ouer a part of hell he saith no Pope hath authority signifying thereby according to their partition the hell of the damned But how then did Clement the sixt not doubt to say in one of his Buls e Bale in Clem. 6. Nolumus quòd paena inferni sibi aliquatenus infligatur we will that the punishment of hell in no sort be laied or inflicted vpon him and how was it that Gregorie deliuered the soule of Traian out hell as f See Bellarm. de purgatorio lib. 2. cap. 8. Damascen hath reported and sundry authours of the Church of Rome as Bellarmine acknowledgeth haue stedfastly beleeued If M. Bishop tell vs that Gregorie did that only by way of intreaty and request he himselfe granteth the Pope to haue no other ouer Purgatory and therefore ouer hell and Purgatory he hath authority both alike When he doth good to any soule in Purgatory it is per modum suffragij as a suppliant and intreater not as a commander saith he But how then did the same Clement the sixt say concerning them who should die by the way as they were comming to his Iubilee at Rome g Bale vt supra Nihilominus prorsus mandamus angelis Paradisi quatenus animam à Purgatorie pentius absolu tam in Paradisi gloriam introducant We command the Angels of Paradise that they bring the soule of such a one into Paradise being fully freed from Purgatorie paines And what is all this power no more now but to supplicate and intreat Haue they mocked the world all this while made men beleeue that the Pope not only hath power to deliuer soules out of Purgatory himselfe but can also impart the same to others and is all come now to supplication and intreaty Why M. Bishop can supplicate and intreat as well as the Pope and what reason haue we but to thinke that God is as readie to heare his praier as the Popes and so by that meanes he shall haue as great power ouer Purgatory as the Pope Such are the mockeries of Poperie such are their doctrines of religion they themselues can not well tell what to make of them Further he saieth Whether the Pope hath any authoritie ouer Princes and their subiects in temporall affaires it is questioned by some The more shame is it M. Bishop for them by whom it is questioned Tertullian reporteth the minde of the ancient Church in this behalfe h Tertul. ad scapul Colimus imâ—eratorem vt hominem à deo secundum quicquid est à deo consecutum solo deo minorem We honour the Emperour as the man next to God and as hauing receiued of God whatsoeuer he is being inferiour to God onely And is it now come to be questioned whether the Pope euen in temporall affaires haue authority ouer Princes who in their kingdomes respectiuely are the same that the Emperour then was But is it questioned onely M. Bishop and not determined Wee may indeed admire their impudency therein that they who so much pretend antiquitie should resolue a matter so contrarie to the doctrine and example of all antiquitie but yet they haue so resolued that either directly or indirectly the Pope hath superioritie ouer Princes euen intemporall affaires i Treatise tending to Mitigation c. in the Preface to the Reader sect 22. The Canonists do commonly defend the first part saith the Mitigatour that is directly but Catholike Diuines for the most part the second that is indirectly and by
consequence but both parts fully agree that there is such an authority left by Christ in his Church They agree in deed but it is like Herod and Pilate against Christ Accordingly as they carrie themselues in this point so they deserue to be credited in all the rest But M. Bishop telleth vs that Christ might haue giuen him that authoritie without degrading himselfe And I answer him that the question is not what Christ might haue done but what he hath done Therefore his instance of a King substituting a Viceroy will not serue his turne for hee that without any commission from the King taketh vpon him to be a Viceroy and vnder pretence thereof impugneth his Princes lawes and maketh construction of them at his owne pleasure and to serue his owne turne howsoeuer he seeme to doe all in his Princes name yet is indeed a traitour and a rebell to his Prince This is the Popes case and therefore vnder the name of the Vicar of Christ he is no other but a traitour and a rebell against Iesus Christ As for those faculties of greater authoritie and vertue because wee reade nothing thereof in the Gospell no not in S. Peter himselfe thove faculties which they attribute to the Pope therefore we hold them and that iustly to bee the Popes owne presumptions the flatteries of Parasites the deuises of ill disposed men k Tit. 1.11 who speake things which they ought not for filthy lucers sake The Popish Priesthood is not true and reall but meerely fantasticall for a true and reall Priesthood such as they boast of requireth a true and reall sacrifice for sinne which they haue not For after the sacrifice which purchaseth forgiuenesse of sinnes l Heb. 10.18 there is no more offering for sinne But in the death of Christ is a full purchase of the forgiuenesse of sinnes Therefore after Christs death there is no more offering for sinne We say then of Priesthood as Cyrill hath taught vs to say m Cyril epist. 10 ad Nestor Nec praeter ipsum alteri cuipiam homini siue sacerdotij nomen siue rem ipsam ascribimus We ascribe not the name of Priesthood or the thing it selfe to any other but to Christ only See that question saith M. Bishop But where for hee himselfe hath said nothing of it and whatsoeuer he would say it is already preuented in n Sect. 27. answer of his Epistle to the King To the last obiection that for one Iesus the all-sufficient Mediatour of intercession they haue made as many as be in the Popes Kalendar he answereth yea and many more to What M. Bishop so many Mediatours when the Apostle saith plainly o 1. Tim. 2.5 There is one God and one Mediatour betwixt God and man euen the man Iesus Christ We hold saith hee that any of the faithfull yet liuing may bee also requested to pray for vs. True M. Bishop yet not as Mediatours as if we may plead any thing that they haue done or can do for vs for our owne accesse to God but onely as fellow-members of one body affected in compassion one towards an other pleading for our selues and ech for other that which Christ hath done for all Wherefore as the greater praieth for the lesse so doth the lesse also for the greater not onely S. Paul for the Romans the Ephesians the Collossians but also the p Rom. 15.30 Romans the q Eph. 6.19 Ephesians the r Col. 4.3 Colossians for S. Paul And although we thus request the praiers one of another yet doe we not pray to God that he will heare vs for their sakes whom we request to pray for vs but all expect mercy onely for Christs sake But Popish praiers are of a farre other nature Å¿ The golden Letany By the holy name of Marie haue mercy vpon vs by the intercession and merits of S. Peter S. Paul S. Iohn the Euangelist and other of thine Apostles haue mercy vpon vs by the vertues and merits of the holy fathers S. Augustine S. Hierome S. Chrysostome S. Ambrose and all other haue mercy vpon vs. This is one of the abhominations of Popery that they do not onely idlely intreat the Saints to pray for them but do also alleage to God their merits and intercessions by vertue thereof to obteine mercy at Gods hands But hee saith it shall be hard for vs to prooue that Christ onely maketh intercession for vs. Yea M. Bishop but why then doth S. Austen say that t Aug. in Psal 64. solus ibi ex his qui carnem gustauerunt interpellat pro nobis in heauen of all that haue beene partakers of flesh Christ onely maketh intercession for vs Did hee speake more then hee could prooue Deceiue not your selfe M. Bishop hee could prooue this matter well enough but you cannot prooue that which so iniuriously to Christ the onely Mediatour you affirme and teach that Mediation of intercession belongeth to the Saints it being a thing vnreasonable and absurd to thinke that Mediatours for vs stand in need of a Mediatour for themselues 4. W. BISHOP Lastly saith M. PERKINS for the only merits of Christ in whom alone the Father is well pleased what was he not well pleased with his Apostles they haue deuised a treasury of the Churches containing besides the merits of Christ the ouerplus of the merits of Saints to be dispensed to men at the discretion of the Pope and thus wee see that Christ and his merits be abolished Answer The good man is somewhat mistaken for we hold not any ouerplus of merits in Saints the which we acknowledge to be by God fully rewarded in heauen but we affirme that some Saints and blessed Martyrs haue suffered more paines in this life then the temporall punishment of their own sins deserued Who therefore might truely say with that iust man Iob Iob. 6.1 would to God my sinnes whereby I haue deserued wrath were weighed with the calamitie that I suffer euen as the sands of the sea this should be the heauier Now part of these sufferings of Gods Saints as being needlesse for their owne satisfaction are reserued in the Churches storehouse and may by the high steward of the Church to whom the dispensation of her treasure belongeth be communicated to others as verie reason teacheth vs for who is fitter to dispose of any mans goods then he to whom the charge thereof is giuen by his testament And thus I hope euery reasonable man doth finde vs Catholikes to be farre off from transforming Christ into an Idoll of mans conceit as M. PERKINS dreameth onely we see a misconceited man labouring in vaine to deface Christs benefits towards vs to calumniate his chiefe seruants and to skirmish against his owne phantasies then against any doctrine of â—â—rs R. ABBOT Whether M. Bishop or M. Perkins doe mistake The Popes storehouse merits lately built let the Reader iudge The Pope saith that a Extrauag de poenit remiss cap.
vnequall to the Father are things incompatible Christ as God how equall and how inforior to the Father and can by no meanes stand together Well yet M. Bishop telleth vs that Caluin in an Epistle to the Polonians in formall termes auoucheth that Christ according to his Godhead is lesse than his father But how vntrue this is may easily be esteemed for that the Polonians to signifie their agreement in faith with Caluin and with other Protestant Churches thereby to cleere themselues of some iealousie that was had of them did in their Synod by Faelix Cruciger write thus to him and others a Foelix Crucig inter epist Caluin 311. Credimus patrem omnipotentem filium ei per omnia aequalem quoad naturam essentiam vel deitatem minorem eo tantum quòd cum in forma Dei esset seipsum exinaniuit seu vt vno verbo complectamur ratione officij mediationis We beleeue the Father to be almighty the Sonne also as touching his nature essence or godhead to be in all respects equall to the Father but inferior only in that when he was in the forme of God he humbled himselfe or in a word to speake it in respect of his office of mediation Now if this were Caluins beleefe and in his Epistle to the Polonians he professe no other but this as indeed b Caluin epist ad Polonos interopuscula Inscitè ex Mediatoru titulo infertur Christum patre esse minorem quando haec optime inter se cohaerent vnigenitum dei filium eundem vnius cum patre essentiae fuisse deum tamen fuisse quasi inter deum creaturas c. he doth not shall we not thinke M. Bishop a man very formall in telling an vntruth who maketh Caluin simply thus to say that Christ according to his Godhead is lesse than his Father But yet by his Master Bellarmine we guesse what the bone is whereupon he gnaweth who mentioneth one c Bellar. in prefat ad controv 2. general de Christo c. Stanislaus Sanricius for a patrone of Arianisme for that he said that in respect of the office of mediation Christ euen in his diuine nature is inferior to the Father From which assertion how the Iesuit should gather Arianisme it is very hard to say inasmuch as Arianisme importeth the Sonne to be intrinsecally and essentially inferior to the Father whereas his wisedom and learning if he would haue vsed it might discerne that there is no meaning here of any intrinsecall and reall minority but only of an extrinsecall a dispensatiue and voluntary demeaning of himselfe whereby he is in some sort inferior to himselfe also reconciling vs in the person of a Mediator to himselfe as he is absolutely God And could he not conceiue this to be as tollerable and true a speech in vs as in Maldonatus his fellow Iesuit who in the same termes affirmeth d Maldonat in Ioan. c. 14. Minor non quoad diuinitatis inequalitatem sed quoad munus voluntatem redemptionis the Sonne to be inferior to the Father not as touching any inequality of Godhead but as touching the office and will of our redemption The same Maldonatus telleth vs also another respect wherin Christ is said as touching his Godhead to be inferior to the Father e Ibid. Non quoad naturam substantiae sed quoad relationem originis not as touching nature of substance but relation of originall and beginning Wherein he is not alone but the Greek Fathers who most vehemently impugned Arius the Heretike yet take part with him as f Sixt. Senens biblioth sanct lib. 6. annot 1705. Obseruandum est Graecos patres non reformidare hanc locutionem qua filius patre minor asseritur non substantia quidem sed origine iuxta quam rationem frequentissimè apud Grecos Theologos pater dicitur principij dignitate authoritate maiestate antecellere filium Sixtus Senensis testifieth and citeth to that purpose Origen Cyrill Chrysostom and Basil and of the Latine Fathers Hilary some of these and beside them g Athanas con Arian orat 2. pater maior non magnitudine aut aetate sed quia filius ex illo ortum habebat Athanasius and h Tertul. adu prax pater filio maior dumalius quigenerat alius qui generatur c. Tertullian in that sense expounding of the diuine nature the words of Christ i Iohn 14.28 The Father is greater than I. Now if in this meaning Caluin should haue said as is secondly alleged that the Father holdeth the first ranke of honour and power and the Sonne the second in which sort Tertullian also saith that k Tertul. vt suprae vt tertium gradum ostenderet in Paracleto sicut nos secundum in filio propter 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 obseruationem the Sonne hath the second degree and the holy Ghost the third not meaning it of any disparity of essence but of the order of the persons would M. Bishop be no wiser but through Caluins side to wound so learned a Iesuit as Maldonatus yea and so many Fathers both Greek and Latine and at once to bring them all within the compasse of Atheisme But thou must vnderstand gentle Reader that M. Bishop very perfidiously abuseth thee in this citation the words of Caluin being spoken of the manhood of Christ being aduanced to sit at the right hand of God l Caluin in Mat. cap. 26. ver 64. Dicitur Christus ad dexteram patris sedere quia rex summus constitutus qui eius nomine mundum gubernet quasi secundam ab eo honoris imperijs sedem obtinet Christ saith he is said to sit at the right hand of the Father because being constituted the highest king in his name to gouerne the world he obtaineth a seat of honour and power as it were second or next to God M. Bishop I trow vnderstandeth the Articles of the Creed and thereby knoweth who it is that is said to sit at the right hand of God There followeth next Melancton who disputing against Stancarus for that he held Christ according to his manhood only to bee our Mediator though hee vse not expressy the words which M. Christ our â—â—diator as he is both God man Bishop hath set down yet acknowledgeth and defendeth that Christ according to his diuine nature was sent of the Father and submitted himselfe in obedience to the Father to performe the office of Mediation betwixt God and man but yet so as that he excepteth out of Cyril that m Melanct. Responâ— aâ—l contro stanc M ssio obedientia non tollunt equalitatem potentiae â—â—ut expresse Cyrilius inquit this sending and obeying doe not take away from the Son equality of power with the Father because they are not matters concerning state of nature but only arbitrary designement of will Surely amongst men in society and equality a man may be sent and may
ait si autem volens deus estendere iram c. when men are said to be deliuered ouer to their owne lusts they must be vnderstood to be left by Gods sufferance and permission not by his power to be forced into sinne Saint Austin answereth As though the Apostle had not set downe both these together both Gods sufferance and his power where he saith If God would to shew his wrath and to make his power knowen suffer with long patience the vessels of wrath prepared to destruction But he goeth yet further r Idid Quid tamen horum dicis esse quod scriptum est Et prophetasi errauerit c. patientia est an potentia An hic dicturus es quòd Ego dominus seduxi Prophetam illuÌ„ intelligendum est deserui vt pro eius meritâ—s seductus erraret Whether of these wilt thou say it is which is written Å¿ Ezec. 14 9. If that Prophet be deceiued when hee hath spoken a thing I the Lord haue deceiued that Prophet and I will stretch out my hand vpon him and I will destroy him out of the middest of my people Israel is this Gods permission or his power Wilt thou heere say that I the Lord haue deceiued that Prophet must be vnderstood I haue forsaken him that according to his deserts being deceiued he might erre Saint Austin thinketh it strange that where God saith I The Lord haue deceiued that Prophet Iulian should construe it I haue forsaken that Prophet and suffered him to be deceiued and why then doth M. Bishop taxe Caluin for reiecting the same construction Caluins words fully accord with the words of Austin t Caluin Instutut lib. 1. cap. 18. sect 2. Haee etiam ad permissionem multi reijciunt atsi dâ—screndo reprobes à satana excaecari sincret sed cum disertè exprimat spiritus iusto dei iudicio iâ—fligi caecitatem amentiam nimis friuola est illa solutio These things many refer to sufferance as if by forsaking the reprobate he suffered them to be blinded of Satan but seeing the holy Ghost plainly expresseth that blindnesse and madnesse is inflicted by the iust iudgement of God that solution is too fond In the censuring of which words M. Bishop through Caluins side woundeth Saint Austin and the whole Church which tooke part with him against the Pelagian heretikes But heere it is to be noted how guilefully Master Bishop suppresseth the reason which M. Caluin alleageth for the reiecting of that solution and whereby he maketh good that it is to be reiected For Gods iudgements are not matters of permission left to the diuell or to men to doe if they will but passe from God by sentence and decree that thus or thus it shal be And therefore Saint Austin expresseth this iudgement by such termes as goe far beyond the words of permission or desertion As where the Apostle saith of idolaters u Rom. 1.27 They receiued in themselues such recompence of their errour as was meet x Aug. cont Iulian lib. 5. ca. 3. Dicit vtique damnatos vt tanta operarentur mala tamen ista damnatio reatus est quo grauius implicantur he meaneth saith he that they were condemned to the working of so great sinnes and this damnation notwithstanding is a guilt wherewith they are more grieuously intangled Surely to be condemned to the committing of sinne is a far greater matter euen in all mens cies then to be only permitted and suffered to sinne But he noteth it as a thing y Ibid. Et quod est mirabilius etiam oportuisse dicit eos istam mutuam mercedem recipere more strange that the Apostle saith it was behoouefull or meet that they should receiue this recompence one of them by another This is much against Master Bishops minde that God did not only condemne them to sin but therein did that that was meet and behoueful to be done Yea he saith afterwards of Ahab z Ibid IniusÌ„tuÌ„ erat qui non crediderat deo vero deciperetur à falso It stood not with iustice but that he who beleeued not the true God should be deceiued by a false diuell Againe sundry places he alleageth to such purpose as haue beene before cited and saith thereof a Ibid. In quibus liquidò apparet occulto dei iudicio fieri peruersitatem cordis â—t non audiatur verum quod dicitur inde peâ—cetur sit ipsum peccatum praecedentis etiam poena peccati Nam credere mendacio now credere veritati vtique peccatum est venit tamen ab ea caecitate cordis quae occulto iudicio dei sed tamen iusto etiam peccati paena monstratur By these manifestly it appeareth that by the secret iudgment of God there is wrought a peruersnes of heart not to heare the truth and thereby to sinne and this sinne is the punishment of former sinne For it is sinne saith he to beleeue lies and not to beleeue the truth and yet this commeth of that blindnesse of heart which by the secret but iust iudgement of God is declared to be the punishment of sinne So againe elswhere he saith that b Idem de grat lib. arbitr c. 21. Quis non ista iudicia diuina contremiscat quibus agit deus in cordibus etiam malorum hominum quicquid vult reddens eis tamen secundum merita ipsorum Et Paulò post Agit omnipotens in cordibus hominum etiam motum voluntatu ecrum vt per eos agat quod per eos agere ipse voluerit qui omnino iniustè aliquid velle non nouit God worketh in the hearts of euill men whatsoeuer he will rendring to them notwithstanding according to their deserts that hee stirreth in their hearts the motion of their will to doe by them what he will doe by them who vniustly can will nothing He goeth on and for proofe heereof alleageth sundry texts of scripture and in the end concludeth c Ibid. His talibus testimonijs satis quantum opinor manifestatur operari deum in cordibus hominum ad inclinandas eorum voluntates quocunque voluerit siue ad bona pre sea misericordia siue ad mala pro meritis eorum iudicio vtique suo aliquando aperto aliquando occulto semper autemiusto It is heereby manifest enough as I suppose that God worketh in the hearts of men to incline their wills whithersoeuer he will either to good for his owne mercy sake or to euill for mens owne merits and that by his iudgement sometimes manifest and apparant sometimes secret but alwaies iust And thus had he said before of that it is said that the Lord spake to Shimei to curse Dauid that d Ibid. cap. 20. Non iubendo dixit vbi obedientia laudaretur sed quòd voluntatem eius proprio suo vitio malam in hoc peccatum iudicio suo iusto occultâ— inclinauit ideò dictum est Dixit ci
Prophecie He presently answereth b Ibid. solutio non difficilâ— est modò expendant lectores noÌ„ tantùm exponi quid Christus contulerit aegrotis sed in quem finem sanaueris ocrum morbos The solution is easie so that the Readers doe weigh that it is not heere declared onely what Christ did to the sicke but to what end hee cured their sicknesses What M. Bishop no more truth no more honestie but to cite Caluins obiection as if it were his resolution when hee himselfe answereth it in the same place Well yet againe Caluin saith that c Idem in Mat. 12.25 Memoria tenendum est vulgò receptis prouerlijs ita vsum Christum vt tantùm essent probabiles coniecturae non autem vt solidè probareut Christ vseth triuiall and vulgar prouerbes as probable coniectures not as sound arguments And what if hee say so What doth M. Bishop thinke the contrarie Will hee imagine that sound arguments may be drawen from triuiall prouerbes We take it for a memorable obseruation which Caluin giueth anone after vpon the same chapter that d Ibid. ver 34. Prouerbiales sententias non exigi debere ad perpetuam normam quia tantum docent quid accidere vt plurimum soleat Prouerbiall sentences must not be drawen to a perpetuall rule but do only teach what for the most part falleth out A prouerbiall speech it is as he there alleageth vttered by our Sauiour Christ e Matt. 12.34 Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh and yet we know that some there are f Psal 62.4 Who giue good words with their mouth and curse with their heart It hath beene a Prouerbe amongst vs a Friar a liar but will M. Bishop hereby prooue as by an infallible argument that euery Friar is a liar It hath beene commonly said concerning the church of Rome The neerer the church the farther from God and doth he hold it a good argument that therefore the Pope is in the high way to the diuell because he is so neere the church Shall euery slanderous rumour be holden for a conuiction because it is commonly vsed for a Prouerbe that there is no smoke but there is some fire If not then let him acknowledge according to Caluins rule that Prouerbiall sentences are good inducements to that which a man will perswade by them but necessary probations they are not And in that nature were they vsed by our Sauiour Christ who would draw on the Iewes by such dictates commonly receaued and approoued amongst them to consider the better of those things which otherwise by firme arguments of truth he made good vnto them Another matter is that where Christ saith to Corazin and Bethsaida and to Capernaum that g Matt. 11 21.23 if the myracles that were done in them had beene done in Tyre and Sidon yea in Sodome they had repented in sackcloth and ashes and Sodome had still remained Caluin saith that he speaketh after the maner of men not out of his heauenly cabinet which saith M. Bishop is no lesse in plaine English then that he spake vntruely as men doe Iust for so the Apostle S. Paul when he saied to the Romanes h Rom. 6.19 I speake after the maner of men because of the infirmitie of your flesh did thereby meane to tell them that hee did lie that he spake vntruely as men doe Caluins words vpon the former verse concerning Corazin and Bethsaida are these i Cal. in Math. 11.21 Ne quis spinosas de arcanis dei iudiâ—ijs quaestiones moneat tenendum est ad communem humanae mentis captum accommodari hunc domini sermonem Comparans ciues Bethsaid a eorum vicinos cum Tyrijs Sidonijs non disputat quid Deus praeuiderit futurum de ijs vel ilâ—is sed quid facturi fuerint alteri quatenus ex re ipsa perâ—â—pi poterat That no man may here mooue any curious questions touching the secret iudgements of God we are heere to resolue that the speech of Christ is applied to the coÌ„mon conceit of mens minds for comparing the Citizens of Bethsaida and their neighbours with the Tyrians and Sidonians he doth not dispute what God did foresee should be either in the one or the other but what the other would haue done so farre as by the very thing it selfe might be esteemed Afterwards comming to the other verse concerning Capernaum he saith again k Ibid. ver 23. supra admonuimus Christum humano more loqui non autem ex caelesti adyto proferre quid deus praeuiderit futurum si Sodomitis prophetam aliquem mississet We haue before admonished that Christ heere speaketh after the maner of men and doth not out of the heauenly sanctuarie declare what God did foresee would haue come to passe if he had sent a prophet to the Sodomites Caluins minde is plaine that when he saith that Christ spake after the maner of men he meaneth that he spake as men might morally esteeme the signes and wonders that he had done in these cities being so admirable and strange as that no man might probably imagine the Tyrians and Sidonians yea the very Sodomites to be so barbarous and gracelesse but that at the sight therof they would haue repented no lesse then the Niniuites did at the preaching of Ionas And that M. Bishops owne Latin interpreter tooke this to bee the true meaning of the words appeareth plainly by that hee translateth as touching the Sodomites l Fortè mansissent vsque in hanc diem Perhaps they had continued till this day He would not haue said perhaps if he had spoken out of the counsell of God but because he spake out of the conceit of men therefore he saith perhaps Why then doth he picke a quarrell against Caluin in that wherein by their owne authenticall text he is forced to subscribe that which Caluin saith But if he will needs vnderstand these words as spoken out of the secret of the counsell of God foreseeing what would haue followed if such meanes had beene vsed then let him heerein acknowledge the secret of Gods decree of reprobation of farre other nature then he hath before deliuered it that m August QuibusaaÌ„ quos nonit acturos poenitentiam non exhibet patientiam to some who he knoweth if meanes be vsed that they will repent yet he doth not yeeld patience that they may repent as S. Austin gathereth according to that construction and because hee will not grant them to beleeue therefore denieth them that whereby they should beleeue Let him leaue the Rhetoricall expostulations of humane wisedome why God being iust and good should abiect men to hell without foresight of their euill works because hee seeth that God abiecteth men notwithstanding the foresight of the good works which they would haue done if hee would haue vouchsafed them the meanes thereof I speake not this as approouing that construction but onely to whip M. Bishop
regnum obtinere caelorum caeterúm dupliet iure illud obtinens dominus meus haereditate scilicet patris merito passionis aeltero ipse contentus alterum mihi donat ex cuius dono iure illud mihi vendicans non confundor I confesse I am not woorthy neither can I by mine owne merits obteine the kingdome of heauen but my Lord Iesus hauing obteined it by double right both by inheritance from the father by the merit of his passion being himselfe contented with the one he giueth me the other by whose gift I am not ashamed to chalenge it for my right In the same maner did the godly martyr speake of right not to distinguish a right in himselfe from the right of Christ but to signify that Christ hath made ouer his right to vs and thereby wee hold as fast as Christ himselfe can hold From hence the other words are deriued by imitatioÌ„ of that which the Apostle saith f 1. Cor. 15.16 If the dead rise not againe then is Christ not risen againe by which he signifieth that there is that strait and inseparable bond betwixt Christ and his members as that to deny to them any thing which Christ hath wrought and purchased for them is to deny the same to Christ himselfe to affirme the failing of any thing to them is to affirme the failing of it to him also And as by allusion to that place of the Apostle Tertullian saith g Tertull. de Resurrect carnis securae estote caro sanguis vsurpastis caelum dei regnum in Christo aut si negent vos in Christo negent in caelo Christum qui vobis caelum negauerunt Care not flesh and blood yee haue in Christ taken possession of heauen and of the kingdome of God or if they deny you to be in heauen in Christ let them also deny Christ himselfe to be in heauen who haue denied heauen to you What will M. Bishop here tearme Tertullian and Bernard together with the Apostle himselfe audacious and sawcie Gospellers Because the Apostle denieth Christ himselfe to be risen vnlesse the faithfull also rise againe will hee returne him a scornfull iest as heere hee doth Christ belike could not liue in blisse without their holy company But their reason saith he seemeth good in the way of their owne religion Well if it be so it is sufficient for the way of their religion hath beene so farre approoued as that neither M. Bishop nor any other aduersaries haue beene able to disprooue it And because he cannot disprooue it therefore let him confesse as the truth is that the firme and stedfast apprehension of the merits of Christ and of being by faith made one with him doth minister vnto the faithfull this sacred resolution that so long as Christ perisheth not they cannot perish and therefore shall bee preserued for euer That that followeth is but an idle repetition of the same matters onely set out with a bold face and bigge looks and some inkehorne termes and therefore I passe it ouer not maruelling that any thing on our part seeme phantasticall to so vaine a man whose intellectuall parts serue him not to prooue any thing substantially for his owne 17. W. BISHOP But to returne to Christs mediatorship and merits Is it not moreouer a great disparagement vnto them to maintaine as the Protestants doe that his best beloued spouse the Church should continue but a small time at least in any sight and should bee penned vp in corners yea and during that time too it should not bee free from many foule grosse errours in the very foundation of faith Furthermore that hee left his holy word the onely rule and square as they hold of Christian religion to bee vnderstood of euery man as his owne knowledge and spirit should direct him and if any doubtfull question did arise thereabout as he fore-sawe thousands should doe yet he tooke no other order for the deciding and ending of them but that euery one should repaire vnto the same his word and doing his diligence to vnderstand it might afterward be his owne iudge As this later opinion would argue our blessed Sauiour who was the wisedome of God to bee the weakest and most improuident law-maker that euer was so the former doth mightily blemish the inestimable price of his most pretious bloud making it not of sufficient value to purchase vnto him an euerlasting inheritance free from all errours in matter of faith and abounding in all good works R. ABBOT The Protestants doe not maintaine that the Church the beloued spouse of Christ should continue but a small time but doe all absolutely affirme the continuance thereof from the beginning to the end The Church how it is visible or inuisible As for the visibilitie and sight of the Church we speake diuersly thereof as we speake diuersly of the Church it selfe Where the Church is a matter of faith there it is not subiect to sight for a Greg. Dialog l. 4. c. 4. Hoc reracitèr dicitur credi quod non potest viders nam quod iam videri potest credi non potest that is truely said to be beleeued saith Gregorie which cannot be seene and that which may now be seene cannot be said to be belecued The Church then which wee professe to beleeue in the articles of our faith is inuisible because as b Aug in Psal 56. Caput separatum est à visione the head is inuisible c 1. Pet 1.8 we beleeue in him but we see him not so is the body also d Greg. in Psal poenitential 5. Tota Ecclesia siue quae adhuc versatur in terris siue quae cum eo iam regnat in coelis c. one part thereof raigning in heauen with the head another part yet vnborne e Aug. vt supra pertinentibus ad eam etiam his qui fuerunt ante nos his qui futnri sunt â—ost nos vsque ad finem seculi because to it belong they also that shall be after vs to the worlds end the third part though visible as they are men yet inuisible according to that they are members of this Church because f Luk. 17.21 the kingdome of God is within and g Aug de Bapt. cont Donat. l. 5. c. 28. Mamfe stuÌ„ est id quod in ecclesia dicitur intus foris in corde non in corpore cogi tandum to be in the Church is not to be conceiued in the bodie but in the heart h 1. King 8.39 2 Tim. 2.19 which God only knoweth and therefore only knoweth who are within according to that seale as the Apostle calleth it of the foundation of God i The Lord knoweth who are his To speake of the Church accordingly as men take notice and knowledge of it it is said to be visible two maner of waies either as touching the persons professing the seruice and worship of God or as touching the congregating
church that is assembling themselues together to performe religion and seruice to their God This was the state of the church in the captiuity of Babylon when Ierusalem was burnt to the ground the temple destroied the people of God carried away into strange lands and heere and there dispersed amongst the heathen nations The like befell them by the tyranny of Antiochus euen in their owne land their temple being defiled their religion interdicted and euery one commanded to be slaine that would not renounce the law of God Now to apply all these things to the state of the church of Christ it was first oppugned by professed enemies who sought wholly to root out the name of Christians and to abandon the faith of Christ vtterly out of the world Thus did the Iewes first and after them the Heathens persecute the whole profession of Christianity and by the importunity of their cruelty did many times so obscure and darken the face of the church as that for the most part it was hardly to be seene Whosoeuer were found to giue open testimony to the name of Christ were martyred and slaine the rest for feare of the like danger either fled into wildernesses and solitary places or else had their meetings very couertly and secretly that they might not be espied Yea their sauage and barbarous fury so far preuailed as that they seemed to themselues to haue gotten a perpetuall victory ouer the name of Christ and did set vp pillars of marble as trophees thereof whereof it is said that some monuments are yet remaining vntill this day Thus albeit many thousands there were who heere and there dispersed and scattered continued steadfast in the faith of Christ and in many places couertly gathered themselues together for the exercise of their faith yet the Church to the sight of the enemies therof was inuisible neither could they in a manner take knowledge of any against whom their malice might any further proceed But when by the prouidence and mercy of God the sword of those tyrants was wrested out of their hands this inuisible church soone came to light againe and began to enioie outward state and honour and the Saints who seemed to haue beene dead and buried in euerlasting reproch and shame became renowmed and glorious in the world and as they were indeed so began they in the opinion of men to be exalted vnto heauen From thencefoorth we affirme that the church hath neuer ceased to be eminently and apparantly visibly to al the world so far are we from saying that which Bellarmine as the master and M. Bishop here as the scholar do impute vnto vs Å¿ Bâ—llarm de notis eccl cap 9. Ecclesiam visibilem a multis seculis perijsse c. docent omnes that the visible church for many ages was quite perished out of the world How can we be taken to say that the church was perished for many ages who doe hold that for those many ages whereof we speake Antichrist according to that that was prophecied of him did t 2. Thess 2.4 sit as God in the Temple that is to say the church of God If we say that Antichrist sate that is dominated and tyrannized in the church the visible church then surely we deny it not to be the visible church wherein Antichrist did sit We confesse that the church in all that time hath beene apparant to the eies of all men the whole world saw it Turkes and Saracens fought against it and did their vttermost to root it out that the name of Christians might no more haue beene heard of amongst men But we say withall that the visible church by the vsurpation of Antichrist was become for the most part as the temple of God in the daies of u 2. King 2â— 4.7 Manasses replenished with idolatries and abhominations or as the church of the Iewes at the comming of Christ euen x Mat. 9.36 like sheepe without a shepheard burdened with humane traditions and wanting the free aire of the word of God whereby hee ministreth the breath of euerlasting life As y Ierem. 3.20 the wife that is rebellious and vnfaithfull to her husband z Prou. 2.17 which forsaketh the guide of her youth and forgetteth the couenant of her God so was the state of the Church shamefully polluting her selfe with manifold fornications whiles she proftituted herselfe to the embracings of the Romane adulterer and yeelded to him the obedience and seruice which she should haue reserued vnto Iesus Christ Shee was the mother indeed by whom God through baptisme brought foorth children to himselfe but being though by nature a mother yet by affection a step-mother when she had brought them foorth shee poisoned them or else hated and put them from her if any refused to drinke of her cup and to approoue those adulteries and sorceries wherewith their father her husband and Lord was dishonoured by her And many such were there through the whole decourse of the desolations of Antichrist whose eies God opened some more some lesse to see the filthinesse of their mother who though happily by education they were not wholly without some aspersion of the errors and superstitions of their times yet abhorred those Idolatries and abhominations whereby the Church had broken her faith to God and made way so much as in her lay for her full diuorce and separation from him For God forbid that we should thinke that the spirit of trueth was wholly departed from the Church or that the couenant of Baptisme was voide on Gods behalfe sealing none vnto him but that amidst those ruines he had still his remnant which not in name onely but in trueth were the Church of Christ For as in a common pestilence though it rage neuer so sore yet it infecteth not all and many whom it doth infect yet are not deadly infected but many by preseruatiues escape and others by strength of nature expel the venime in botches and sores so as that life is still preserued euen so in that generall pestilence and infection which the breath of Antichrist had blowen abroad through the church howsoeuer it were vniuersally dispersed yet it tainted not all and many that were touched with it yet drunke not so deepe of the whore of Babylons cup as to surfet and die thereof and albeit they might seeme in a maner to bee drowned in common errours yet reteined that fundamentall doctrine of true faith in Christ whereby they keept the head aboue water to receiue the breath of life and through the fire of repentance by harty praier vnto God for remission of all their sinnes and ignorances whether knowen to them in their end or remaining vnknowen passed vnto eternall life a See Simon Goulart Catalog test veritatis Many such there were in the bosome of their church euen in their monasteries and religious houses to whom God reuealed the light of his truth Who b Ezech. 9.4 mourned and cried for all the abhominations that were
that the Church according to the true members thereof shall be inuisible in the time of Antichrist it is without question Now that the Bishop of Rome hath beene and is that very Antichrist of whom the Scripture hath foretold and the Church of Rome the whoore of Babylon hath beene otherwhere plentifully shewed and in some part hath beene also handled formerly in the second part of this worke The time then hath been already for the Church to bee inuisible by the meanes of the furie of Antichrist maliciously and cruelly persecuting all that came to light that refused to drinke of his poisoned cup. Now hauing thus at large instructed M. Bishop what our doctrine is of the visibility of the Church I will answer him briefly as touching the other point of this cauill The Church subiect to errour that by the ancient monuments of the Church it plainly appeareth that many foule errors entred into the Church soone after the Apostles times that whilest m Matt. 13.25 the watchmen and husbandmen were sometimes sleepie the enemie came and sowed tares amongst the wheat that the builders built much n 1. Cor. 3.12 hay wood and stubble but yet so as that for the most part they reteined the only true foundatiō which is Iesus Christ so as that by the foundation they thēselues are saued but the fire of the Lord shall consume that trash which they haue builded thereon I haue o Answer to the Epistle sect 13. ex Euseb hist. eccles l. 3. c. 29. before shewed out of Eusebius how Egesippus limited the Virginitie of the Church to the age of the Apostles and that generation which with their owne eares heard the preaching of truth from them I haue there shewed how the shifts and subtilties of Satan for corrupting of the truth which he began to practise euen in their daies though they were then checked by their authoritie yet preuailed mightily when they were gone The errours which then were how farre they extended and whether they were in other places the same that we finde them to haue beene in some it is not apparant to vs but manifest it is that so cunningly and effectually Satan conueied that poison into the Church as that it hath neuer since perfectly recouered those wounds that it receiued then Yea Antichrist the man of sinne the master of abominations finding many of those corruptions in the Church hath bound them together as it were in a bundle and by his edicts and lawes hath obtruded and forced them to be receiued as articles of true faith But this saith M. Bishop doth mightily blemish the inestimable price of the most precious bloud of Christ. And why so Forsooth it maketh it not to be of sufficient value to purchase vnto him an euerlasting inheritance free from all errours in matters of faith and abounding in all good works But the effect of Christs purchase is to be determined by the wil of Christ himselfe and not by M. Bishops wilfull and witlesse dreames by which it may as wel be prooued that man is wholly without sinne as that the Church is without errour But I answer him briefly out of his owne words that as the Church which Christ hath purchased doth not so abound in all good works but that it is subiect to many sinnes so neither doth the same Church so abound in knowledge and truth but that it is subiect to many errors Christ intended not by his mediation to bring his Church in this life to full perfection So long as she continueth a pilgrim from her bridegrome and Lord she shall still carie the marks of mortalitie and corruption The Church in this world is like vnto the Moone which is neuer so cleere but that some fret or spot of darknesse is to bee seene in it and howsoeuer it seeme bright in one part yet is obscured in another But it is worth the while to see to what issue M. Bishop wil bring this conceit of his if he be vrged to reueale the secret of it For let vs question with him If the Church cannot erre how is it that the Church of Ephesus hath erred and quite fallen away p Act. 20.28 which God purchased with his owne blood and of which it was immediately that the Apostle said that q 1. Tim. 3.15 it was the pillar and ground of truth Did not the Church of r Gal. 1.6 Galatia erre The Churches of Corinth of Philippi of Thessalonica of Colossa of Pergamus Thyatira and the rest haue they not all gone astray Yes will hee say these particular Churches may erre but the whole Church vniuersall cannot erre But if euery part of the Church may erre then surely the whole Church may erre because all the parts make the whole which can be no other than the parts are We haue heereof example in the r Exod. 32.1 Israelites when the whole Church erred in setting vp the golden calfe and in the Christian Church which was in a maner ſ Vincent Lirinens Arianorū venenum non iam portiunculam quandam sed penè orbem totum contaminauerat wholly corrupted with the heresie of Arius t Hieron adu Lucifer Ingemuit totus orbis se esse Arianum miratus est the whole world groning as Hierome saith and woondering that it was become Arian Well he will say that the Church seuered and sundred in the parts thereof may erre but being assembled together by her Pastors and Bishops in a generall Councell it cannot erre But this the former instances disprooue for the whole Church of the Israelites was gathered together to Aaron the Christian Church was assembled together by her Pastors and Bishops in the Councell of Ariminum to the number of foure hundred who were moe than before had beene in the Councell of Nice and yet decreed for the Arian heresie So was there a second general Councel holden at Ephesus which affirmed approoued the heresie of Eutyches as there were also sundry other of which M. Bishop will not say but that they did erre True saieth he generall Councels may erre if they be not congregated by the authority of the Pope but being the Popes Councels they cannot erre But the Councels of Constance and Basil were both assembled by the Popes call and both these Councels decreed that the Councelis of greater authority than the Pope and the Pope subiect thereto which M. Bishop for the Popes sake will say is an errour and by the Popes procurement the contrary hath beene since determined in other Councels He will answer vs that the Councell though it be assembled by the Pope yet may goe awry if it become diuided from the Pope but being assisted and directed by him it cannot conclude amisse because the Pope cannot erre But we bring examples of diuers Popes that haue erred as Liberius by the herisie of the Arians Honorius by the heresie of the Monothelites and such like Well the Pope then saith he
as he is a priuate man may erre but as Pope and in his consistory and iudiciall sentence hee cannot erre But what is the church now become an asse to carry a priuiledge for the Pope onely To returne vpon himselfe the skiruie terme that he hath vsed in the former section Is not heere a huge great mill-post fairely thwited into a poore pudding pricke that whereas we are told that it was the effect of the inestimable price of Christs bloud to purchase a church free from all errours in matter of faith The word of God the rule and square of Christian religion we haue this great prerogatiue of the Church resolued finally into a drunken dreame concerning the Pope that it is he onely that cannot erre This is the vpshot of all and to this issue the matter commeth that the church may erre the general councell may erre be the persons neuer so learned neuer so faithfull neuer so holy onely the Pope though hee bee an ignorant beast a very he hound and incarnate diuell yet sitting downe in his chaire of Pestilence to decree a sentence receiueth presently like the Prophets of Apollo some Enthusiasticall impression whereby he pronounceth infallibly a truth howsoeuer he himselfe in his owne priuate opinion bee perswaded otherwise Which being a ridiculous presumption a meere nouelty most impudently deuised by sycophants and parasites a matter which hath no shadow of defense from the beliefe or practise of the ancient church deserueth rather to be reiected with scorne than to haue any question made of it As for that other matter which he adioineth concerning the word of God and interpretation thereof he saith rightlie that we hold for so we doe the holy word of God to be the onely rule and square of Christian religion u Iren adu haeres lib 3. cap. 1. Euangelium per dei voluntatem in Scripturis nobis tradiderunt fundamentum columnam fidei nostrae futurum For it was the will of God that the Apostles should commit the Gospell to writing To be the pillar and foundation of our faith and x Aug. in epist. Ioan. tract 3. contra insidiosos errores ponere voluit deus firmamentum in Scripturis sanctis in the scriptures to appoint vs a fortresse against deceitfull errours so as that y Chrysost op imperfect hom 49. Christiani qui sunt in Christianitate volentes accipere firmitatem fidei ad nullam rem aliam fugiant nisi tantummodo ad scripturas Christians being desirous to receiue assurance of their faith are no whither else to flie but onely to the Scriptures But wheras he affirmeth that we say that Christ hath left his holy word to be vnderstood of euery man as his own knowledge and spirit shall direct him and that in doubtfull questions arising he hath taken no order for the deciding of them but that euery one may be his own Iudge they are but silly deuices of obiection against vs to colour the nouelties absurdities which we in the same behalfe iustly condemne in them Wee euery man vnderstand the Scriptures as his owne knowledge and spirit doth direct him and why Because we reiect that course of vnderstanding the Scripture which they factiously and partiallie haue of late deuised for the seruing of their owne turne z Hosius de expresso dei verbe Siquis habeat interpretatisnem ecclesiae Romanae de loco aliquo scripturae etiamsi nec sciat nec intelligat an quomodo cum scripturae verbis conueniat tamen habet ipsissimum verbum dei If a man forsooth haue the interpretation of the church of Rome concerning any place of Scripture albeit he seeth not how it accordeth with the words yet he hath the very word of God We leaue euery man in doubtfull questions to be his owne Iudge but why Because we refuse the triall of a Iudge presumptuously aduanced and authorised by them Forsooth the Pope being accused of hainous abominations and sacriledge against God must sit as Iudge whether he be guiltie or not and whether they doe iustly that haue accused him But what Scripture what Councell what Father or storie or practise of the Church hath tied the interpretation of the Scriptures to the church of Rome or the deciding of controuersies to the Bishop of Rome And whereas their course in this behalfe hath no maner of iustification from the ancient Church I challenge him on the other side to alleage any course entertained by the same Church for the interpretation of Scriptures and iudgement of controuersies which is not approued and practised by vs. Which because he cannot do he doth but waste his wit by trifling in this sort and renuing idle cauils which a Of Traditions sect 21.22 before haue beene troden vnder foote being not able to relieue them with any further defense or strength 18. W. BISHOP To fold vp this part let me entreate thee courteous reader to be an vpright Iudge betweene the Protestants doctrine and ours in this most weighty matter of Christs dignity vertues and mediation and if thou see most euidently that ours doth more aduance them why shouldest thou not giue sentence on our side They make Christ ignorant many yeares of his life we hold him from the first instant of his conception to haue beene replenished with most perfect knowledge They that he spake and taught now and then as other men did and was subiect to disordinate passions We that he was most free from all such and that he taught alwaies most diuinely They make his very death not sufficient to redeeme vs we hold that the least thing that euer he suffered in his life deserued the redemption of many worlds They that he died onely for the elect we that he died for all though many through their owne fault doe not receiue any benefit by his death They that thereby we are not purged from our sinnes but by imputation we that all are by the vertue thereof inwardly cleansed They that Christ purchased a Church consisting of few not to continue long and subiect to many errours we that he established a Church that should be spread ouer all the world and that should continue to the end of the world visibly and alwaies free from any errour in any matter of faith Finally they hold that Christ left his holy word to the disputation of men not taking any certaine order for the ending of controuersies that should arise about it we teach that he hath established a most assured meanes to decide all doubts in religion and to hold all obedient Christians inperfect vniformity of both faith and manners And because I am entred into these comparisons giue mee leaue to persist yet a little longer in them Consider also I pray you who goe neerer to Atheisme either we that thinke and speake of the most sacred Trinity as the blessed Fathers in the first Councell of Nice taught or they who directly crosse them and by the nouelty
one comming neerer to the truth in one place and another in another one hauing greater vnderstanding in the originall tongue another greater felicitie and dexteritie to expresse his conceit in the tongue into which hee doth translate another hauing greater knowledge in the liberall Sciences in Histories and Antiquities in naturall and morall Philosophie whereby he is able to iudge of some things more probablie or certainely than others can And heerein the incomprehensible wisedome of God most liuely appeareth that hee hath so disposed and ordered the Scriptures as that this variety of translations enforceth no difformity of religon but all tend to the maintaining of one and the same faith contained manifestly in those places of Scripture wherein all translations agree and which without manifest and wilfull impietie cannot be translated otherwise Whereby we see in our owne experience and continual exercise of the Scriptures that though the exact meaning of a place be mistaken yet commonly it conteineth nothing in matter but what is warranted by another place rightly translated and therefore in that place can bee taken for no other but the true word of God Or if any wickedly minded do vpon aduantage of ambiguity translate them somewhere partially in fauour of errour and against the truth yet is he circumuented in his purpose by the euidence of other texts which euery man discerneth to make plainly for the iustification of the truth By meanes whereof it hath come to passe that those translations which haue beene made of the old Testament by Samaritans and Iewes Aquila Symmachus and Theodotion who all carried a sting against the Christian faith yet i Hier. Praefat. in Iob. Iudaeus Aquila IudaizaÌ„tes haeretici Symmachus Theodotio sunt recepti qui multa mysteria saluatoris subdola interpretatione celarunt tamen in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 habentur apud ecclesias explanantur ab ecclesiasticis viris Idem praefat in Esdram Nehem. ad Domn Rogat were receiued and vsed as helpfull and profitable to the Church because by their industry they cleered many things and made that truth good in other places which they concealed in some And woorthy it is in this case to be remeÌ„bred how the heretikes of old notwithstanding their mangling and k Tert. de praescript adu haer Ista haeresis non recipit quasdaÌ„ scripturas siquas recipit adiectionibus detractionibus ad dispositionem instituti sui interuertit Et cont Marcion lib. 4. Emendauit quod corruptum existimauit c. Cotidiè reformant illud Euangelium prout à nobis cotidiè reuincuntur dismembring of the Scriptures and either altering or racing what they saw to be against them as Tertullian declareth yet could not preuaile but that they were still put to their shifts from day to day and forced still to be changing somewhat because there was still somewhat left for their conuiction and reproofe The grand signors of the students at Rhemes thinking good in their traiterous policy not long since to put foorth for the time a translation of the new testament albeit vnder a most hypocriticall pretence of religious care not to swarue from their copy they sought by strange words and phrases and by dismembred sentences to obscure and darken the text the vttermost that they could yet in those places which for shame they could not otherwise translate haue left the same so apparant to iustifie our doctrine as that they dare not suffer it to goe freely abroad without the poison of their annotations and commonly they that doe reade the annotations must by no meanes presume to touch the text And hereby it appeareth what the cause is of their quarrell against our translations not for that they thinke them so faulty as they pretend but onely because they cannot abide the vulgar reading of the Scriptures Or if that be not the cause why doe they not put foorth a true translation of their owne if ours be false that all men hauing free vse thereof may plainly discerne what the truth is But the Reader vnderstanding but the Latin tongue shall easily satisfie himselfe in this behalfe if hee compare our English translations with those which some of their owne men Pagnine Arias Montanus and others haue published in Latin because he shall plainly discerne that there is onely sycophancy and not any solidity or waight in those cauillations whereby they shew themselues agrieued at our Bibles As for the obiection of vncertainety of faith which the Iesuit vrgeth by reason of many translations experience conuinceth the folly thereof because wee haue had sundry translations by Tindall by Couerdale by the Geneuians by the Bishops and yet by them all we haue mainteined but one faith Euen so in the primitiue church there were many translations in Greeke the Latin translations as Austin testifieth l Aug. de doct Christ. l. 2. c. 11 Qui scripturas ex Hebraea in Graecam verterunt linguam numerari possunt Latini autem interpretes nullo modo were without number euen m Hier. praefat in Iosue Apud Latinos tot exemplaria quot codices as many saith Hierome as there were bookes and yet we suppose that the Iesuit wil say that by them all there was taught but one Christian faith Yea there is a benefite to bee made of many translations if we rightly deeme thereof because they are a great confirmation to a man in that wherein they all agree and n Aug. vt supra cap. 12. Quae quidem res plús auiuuat intelligentiam quà m impedit si modò legentes non sint negligentes Nam nonnullas obscuriores senteÌ„tias saepe pluruÌ„ codicum manifestauit inspectio the looking vpon many bookes saith Austin often cleereth many obscure sentences wherein they differ When therefore our new translation shall come foorth the doctrine of faith shall continue the same by the new as it hath been hitherto by the old and thou shalt see gentle Reader that the old Bibles are not thereby condemned as naught as this Friar leudly suggesteth but as they haue beene commended vnto thee for the sacred word of God so thou shalt haue cause to acknowledge them still and shalt finde that a new translation is not the making of a new Bible as hee maliciously termeth it but a iustifying and cleering of the old As for the condemning of our diuine seruice it belongeth not to this place to speake thereof It is true indeed that some of our Ministers by misconstruction of things haue vndiscreetly found great faults where they needed not But yet to stop the mouth of this vpstart Iesuit let him remember that Pope Pius the fift reformed their Missall their Breuiary and other offices and generally all their diuine seruice acknowledging the same o Summar CoÌ„stitut praefix Offic. Beat. Mariae reformat Omnia ferè huiusmodi officiae reserta esse vanis erroribus superstitioâ—um to haue beene stuffed with vaine errours of superstitions Lindan
bloud of our redeemer IESVS Christ Secondly of seauen Sacraments instituted by our Sauiour both to exhibite honour to God and to sanctifie our soules they doe flatly reiect fiue of them And do further as much as in them lieth extinguish the vertue and efficacy of the other two For they hold Baptisme not to be the true instrument all cause of remission of our sinnes and of the infusion of grace in our soules but only to bee the signe and seale thereof And in steade of Christs sacred body really giuen to all Catholikes in the Sacrament of the Altar to their exceeding comfort and dignity the Protestants must be content to take vp with a bitte of bread and with a sup of wine a most pittifull exchange for so heauenly a banquet They doe daily feele and I would to God they had grace to vnderstand what a want they haue of the Sacrament of Confession which is the most soueraigne salue of the world to cure all the deadly and dangerous woundes of the soule Ah how carelesly doe they daily heape sinne vpon sin and suffer them to lie festring in their breasts euen till death for lacke of launcing them inseason by true and due confession Besides at the point of death when the Diuell is most busie to assault vs labouring then to make vs his owne for euer there is amongst them no anointing of the sicke with holy oile in the name of our Lord as S. Cap. 5. vers 14. Iames prescribeth joyned with the Priests praier which should saue the sicke and by meanes whereof his sinnes should be forgiuen and he lifted vp by our Lord and inwardly both greatly comforted and strengthned these heauenly helpes I say many others which our Catholike religion affords vnto all persons and by which rightly administred God is highly magnified are quite banished out of the Protestant territories and consequently their religion for want of them is mightily maymed They haue yet remaining some poore short praiers to be said twise a weeke for fearing belike to make their Ministers surfet of ouer much praying they will not tie them to any daily praiers Mattins Euensong and other set houres they leaue to the Priests sauing that on the Sabboath they solemnely meet together at the Church to say their seruice which is a certain mingle-mangle translated out of the old portaise and Masse booke patched vp together with some few of their owne inuention And though it be but short yet it is the Lord he knowes performed by most of them so slightly that an indifferent beholder would rather iudge them to come thither to gaze one vpon another or to common of worldly businesse than reuerently there to serue God Now as concerning the place where their diuine seruice is said if goodly stately Churches had not beene by men of our religion built to their handes in what simple cotes trow you would their key-cold deuotion haue beene content to serue their Lord if one Church or great steeple by any mishap fall into vtter ruine a collection throughout all England for many yeeres together will not serue to build it vp againe which maketh men of iudgement to perceiue that their religion is exceeding cold in the setting forward of good workes and that it rather tendeth to destruction than to edification Againe whereas our Churches are furnished with many goodly Altars trimmed vp decently and garnished with sundry faire and religious pictures to strike into the beholders a reuerent respect of that place and to draw them to heauenly meditations theirs haue ordinarily bare wals hanged with cob-webs except some of the better sort which are daubed like Ale-houses which some broken sentences of Scripture Besides the ancient custom of Christās being to pray with their faces toward the Sunne-rising to shew the hope they haue of a good resurrection and that by tradition receiued euen from the Apostles as witnesseth Saint Basil their Ministers in their highest mysteries De Spiritu sancto 27. looke ouer their Communiontable into the South to signifie perhaps that their spirituall estate is now at the highest and that in their religion there is no hope of rising towards heauen but assurance of declining R. ABBOT Our Diuine seruice and worship of God is not such as the Church of Rome and the followers thereof would haue it but it is sufficient for vs that it is such as God himselfe hath commanded Of true reall and externall sacrifice I haue answered him before both in the confutation of his a Sect. 27. Epistle more at large and briefly heere in the b Sect. 3. answer of this Preface Here I answer him againe in a word with the words of Iustin Martyr that c Iustin Mart. Dialog cum Tryph. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 prayers and thanksgiuings are the onely perfect and acceptable sacrifices to God and that Christians haue learned to doe these onely euen in the memoriall of their dry and moist foode the bread of the Eucharist and the cup of the Eucharist as hee hath before called it in which is the remembrance of the passion which God by God himselfe suffered for vs. So then we doe not denie all sacrifice but we say as we haue beene taught by the Apostle S. Peter according to the ancient doctrine of the Church of Rome d 1. Pet. 2 5. We are made a spirituall house a holy priesthood to offer vp spirituall sacrifices the sacrifice e Psal 4.5 of righteousnesse the sacrifice f Ps 50.14.23 Heb. 13.15 of praise and thankesgiuing the sacrifice g Psal 51.17 of a broken and contrite heart the sacrifice h Phil. 4.18 of almes the sacrifice i Rom. 12.1 of our own bodies acceptable to God by Iesus Christ By these sacrifices we doe all loialtie and seruice to God and we doe not doubt but that we please God therein If we please not that wiser sort of which M. Bishop speaketh the reason is because they take vpon them to bee wiser than God For that propitiatory sacrifice which he driueth at is beyond Gods deuice God neuer taught it Christ neuer ordeined it the Primitiue Church neuer intended it there is no reason at al for it because the bloud of Christ once shed for vs is a sufficient propitiation and attonement for all our sinnes And because by k Heb. 1.3 10.14 once offering of himselfe hee hath purged our sinnes and made vs perfect for euer therefore it is no despight to Gods true worship but a iust assertion thereof to hold that the pretence of any further sacrifice for sinne is an impious and blasphemous derogation to the crosse of Christ As for his seuen Sacraments Seuen Sacraments a late deuice if he can prooue them to bee as he saith instituted by our Sauiour we are very readie to acknowledge the same But it is worthy to be noted that l Bellarm. de effect sacram cap. 25. Bellarmine standing vpon the proofe thereof
et graues viros reformidat hic noster clerus Now is piety and religion waxen very cold I will not say barefooted but hauing on their hose and buskins they scant vouchsafe to kneele downe to pray They weepe not as they goe or whilest the Sacrifie is in hand but they laugh and that impudently euen of them I speak whom their purple robes make more eminent than others They sing not the hymnes for that seemeth too base a matter but they tell iests and tales to make one another laugh What should I say any more the more pratling and wanton a man is so much the more commendation hath he in this corruption of maners This Clergie of ours is afraid of staid and graue men Now if the Clergy of Rome be such M. Bishop I trow of his courtesie will beare with vs if some such vngracious and retchlesse people be found amongst vs. The best is he is not present to see any such matter and therfore vpon his owne surmise may be likly to tel a lie If he were present in our cōgregations specially in townes cities I doubt not but he should see examples enow of them who say of the Church as Iacob did of Bethel h Gen. 28.16.17 How fearefull is this place this is no other but the house of God and this is the gate of heauen surely the Lord is in this place and therefore addresse themselues as Cornelius did when he was to heare the preaching of Peter i Act. 10.33 We are all heerepresent before God to heare all things that are commanded thee of God Concerning the place where our diuine seruice is said he asketh If goodly stately Churches had not beene built to their hands by men of our religion in what simple cotes trow you would their key-cold denotion haue beene content to serue their Lord And why their Lord What M. Bishop is he not your Lord as well as ours But it is true indeede that you haue another Lord whom you haue stiled k Extrauag Ioan. 22. Cum inter in glossa Dominus deus noster papa Our Lord God the Pope and must we thinke that your seruice is done to him But if we had had no other but simple cotes wherein to serue God we suppose our deuotion should haue beene as well accepted as in goodly and stately Churches The time was when the Apostles and first Christians did serue God in simple cotes and in the times of l Arnob. cont gent. lib. 6. Origen contra Cel. l. 3. 7. Arnobius and Origen the Pagans vpbraided them with the want of stately Churches and yet M. Bishop I thinke will not say but that they serued God as religiously as now they doe in the church of Rome Stately Temples as they are sometimes the fruits of true deuotion so they are sometimes matters of ambitious ostentation and sometimes the dotages of abominable superstition Herod the King euen hee that would haue murthered our Sauiour when hee was but new borne to shew his roialty and magnificence and to gaine fauour of the Iewes builded m Ioseph Antiquit Iuda◠li. 15. c. 14. the Temple of Ierusalem most gloriously and farre more neerely to the paterne of Salomons Temple than when after the captiuity they restored it the second time so as that we see the Disciples in the Gospell admiring n Mar. 13.1 Luk. 21 5. the goodly stones and buildings of it Origen mentioneth o Origen cont Cels li. 3. Splendida sana cum lucis templa cum vestibulis porticibus eximia magnitudine atque pulchritudine mirandis introgressus autem videbit adorari felem aut simiam c. the goodly Chapels and Temples of the Aegyptians with thier entries and porches admirable for thier maruellous greatnesse and fairenesse into which when yee were come yee should see them worship a cat or an ape or a crocodile or a goat or a dogge The Temple p Act. 19.27 of Diana was a most goodly thing and renowmed thorow the whole world And surely what M. Bishop now saith to vs the same might the Pagans haue said to our forefathers when they were first Christians They might haue asked them in what simple cotes they would haue serued Christ if men of their religion had not builded to their hands goodly Temples which by q Greg li. 9. ep 71. Fana idolorum in eadem gente aestrui minin è debent c. si fana eadem benè constructa sunt necesse est vt à cultu dae monum in obsequium veri dei debeant commutari Gregories aduice were turned to Christian Churches as in other places also r Lib. 2. indict 11. ep 19. Loca quondam execrandu erroribus deputata in Catholicae religionis reuerentiam dedicare he signifieth they did the like Now if Pagans in this respect were not inferiour to Papists then it is not to be a question by whom Churches were built but by whom they are rightly vsed By whomsoeuer they were built we now vse them for the exercise of true religion to the glory of God neither is our religion so cold in the setting forward of good workes but that whether by collections or otherwise wee maintaine and vphold both Church and steeple thankes be to God to that vse and we hope shall so doe to their griefe and sorrow vntill the worlds end Neither is it any disgrace to our times that collections are now generally made to such ends and purposes but rather a commendation that so many are now found so ready to contribute to such acts of piety which M. Bishop will haue vs thinke were done in former times only by some few The widowes ſ Mar 12.42 two mites were more with God than the great offerings of the rich men and we hope that the small helpes which we seuerally giue according to our ability for the maintenance of Gods seruice are as well accepted with God as the magnificence of them who out of their abundance and superfluity haue performed so great acts thēselues alone These mites being put together doe that thankes be to God that is necessary to be done and I thinke it is more than M. Bishop can iustifie that they did not in those times wherof he speaketh vse such general collections for the doing of the like things Whether they did or not it skilleth not we know that t Exo. 35.5.21 the Tabernacle of God was built in effect by such collections and God promised to dwell in it and we doubt not but he is also present with vs in our Tabernacles which by such meanes are mainteined to serue him To be short that they by whom churches were built since the faith of Christ heere receiued were all of their religion is but a vaine presumption of M. Bishop and a meere vntruth as in part hath beene declared u Answer to the Epistle sect 31.36 before and heereafter if God will vpon another occasion shall
appeare further As for his other quarrell that we haue in our churches neither Altars nor Images it pleaseth vs the better for that we finde the same also obiected to the first Christians by x Celsus apud Origen cont Cels l. 7. Non ferunt templa aras statuas inspicere lib. 8. Celsus ait nos ararum statuarū templorumque dedicationes fugere Celsus the Pagan We like well to be vnlike to the Church of Rome so that we may be like to them For M. Bishop we know him to be a man much delighted with babies a trimme gilded Rood and a goodly faire Lady they are the ioy of his heart Let God say what he will that y Esay 44 10. the Image is profitable for nothing and that z Ierem. 10.8 the stocke is a doctrine of vanity yet he will not be perswaded but that the sight of these goodly Idols is the only way to procure heauenly meditation As for sentences of Scripture to be set vp vpon the Church walles that is but dawbing it is but Ale-house fashion and no heauenly meditation groweth thereof But may we not thinke that he came from the Ale-house when he wrot this and that he is indeed fitter for an Ale-house than for the Church What must we thinke that the looking vpon a dumbe and dead stocke is fitter to mooue heauenly meditation than the liuelie word of God But we see his meaning well enough it is this Scripture that troubleth him his stomacke can by no meanes brooke this Scripture to haue Gods commandement written vpon the church wals as by order it is appointed a Exod. 20.4 Thou shalt not make to thy selfe any grauen Image nor the likenesse of any thing that is in heauen aboue or in the earth beneath c. Thou shalt not bow downe to them nor worship them c. This is it that galleth him to the soule this is it that vexeth him in behalfe of his faire and religious pictures that no bowing downe no holy and religious worship may bee done to them But it is nothing to vs that wee offend him God himselfe who said of his Commandements b Deut. 6.9 Thou shalt write them vpon the postes of thine house and vpon thy gates did not thinke it Ale-house fashion to haue them written vpon Church-walles but that we should set vp Altars and Images in our Churches wee doe not finde any warrant to haue come from him His last exception is very idle It was the ancient custome of Christians to pray with their faces towards the East So is it ours also as appeareth vsually in all our Churches Yea but our Ministers in their highest mysteries looke into the South Well and so is it alleaged by Bishop Iewell that c Bish Iewel Replie art 3. Diuis 26. at this day in the great Churches at Millaine Naples Lions Mentz and Rome and in the Church of Saint Laurence in Forence the Priest in his seruice standeth towards the West hauing his face full vpon the people and that heereupon Durand saith that in such places the Priest needeth not to turne himselfe round when he saith Dominus vobiscum and saluteth the people as otherwise hee is woont to doe And why not our Ministers towards the South as well as theirs towards the West Will he haue vs to conclude heereof that their religion is now declining and going downe If not let him acknowledg then the folly of his owne collection that our spirituall state is now at the highest and that in our religion there is no hope of rising towards heauen but assurance of declining Albeit I must aduertise him briefely that true religion wherby the Sunne of righteousnesse shineth vnto vs and whereby we rise to heauen hath beene subiect to such condition to bee sometimes rising sometimes at the height and sometimes declining againe yea sometimes woonderfully eclipsed and hidden in a maner quite out of sight yet notwithstanding it neuer had such a fall but that as the sunne it hath had a time to rise againe But the whore of Babylon the persecutour of true religion albeit she haue flattered herselfe in the security of her state and said of herselfe d Reuel 18.7 I sit like a Queene and am no widow and shall see no mourning yet shee hath begun to fall and notwithstanding the props and staies that her louers vse to hold her vp shall fall daily more and more neuer to rise againe God hauing so foretold vs that e Vers 21. as a milstone shee shal be cast with violence into the sea thencefoorth to be found no more 21. W. BISHOP I may not heere omit that of late yeeres they haue caused the Kings armes to be set vp in the place where Christs armes the Crucifix was wont to stand the which I confesse would haue graced their Church better if it had beene elsewhere placed But I hope they will giue mee leaue to aske them how they durst set vp any such Images in their Churches as be in that armes For they haue taught hitherto that it is expresly against the second commandement and a kinde of Idolatry not only to worship Images but also to set them vp in Churches and yet now as it were cleane for getting themselues they fall into that fault themselues that they haue so much blamed in others Neither will it helpe them to say that they reprooued only the setting vp of holy pictures but not of others For the second commandement as they expound it is aswell against the one as the other forbidding generally the making of any kinde of Image And is it not a pitifull blindnesse to thinke that the pictures of Lions and Liberts do better become the house of God than the Image of his owne Son and of his faithfull seruants And may not simple people thinke when they see Christs armes cast downe and the Princes set vp in their place that there dwell men who make more account of their Princes honour then they doe of Christs And that their meeting in that place call it what you will is rather to serue their Prince than to serue Christ But I haue beene longer in their place of praier than I thought R. ABBOT The King is a great mote in M. Bishops eie and therefore he could not heere passe by without a quarrell to the Kings armes The Kings armes lawfully set vp in our Churches and not popish images We haue placed hee saith the Kings armes where Christs armes the Crucifixe was woont to stand But who made M. Bishop a herauld to assigne armes to Christ and that without any priuity or liking of Christ himselfe Did Christ euer tell him or any man else that he meant to giue a Crucifixe for his armes This is a fantasticall imagination neither did Christ take course by a picture but by the word of the Gospell to be a Gal. 3.1 described before our eies as crucified amongst vs. But if the
seruice M. Bishop sheweth himselfe to be a man of a leaud and dishonest tongue that will make any comparison of the Church of Rome to our Church And thus we are come to an end of his long preface wherein what mature iudgement he hath shewed concerning a matter of so great moment it remaineth for the Reader to iudge for my part I iudge he did very ill bestow his time in blotting so many papers with so much folly and vntruth But his transition is woorthy to be noted Now to the rest of his questions saith he according to his own â—â—â—der whereas of twelue questions consequently handled by M. Perkins he speaketh not a word but onely passeth to an aduertisement in the end where hee thought least harme might befall to him Heere is some want of plaine dealing which may iustly cause his Reader to bee suspicious and doubtfull of him A confutation to D. BISHOPS answer to Master PERKINS his Aduertisement W. PERKINS An aduertisement to all fauourers of the Roman religion shewing as he weeneth that the said Religion is against the Catholike principles of the Catechisme that hath beene agreed vpon euer since the daies of the Apostles by all Churches Which principles be foure The Apostles Creed the tenne Commandements the Lords praier the institution of two Sacraments Baptisme and the Lords Supper 1. COR. 11. v. 23. 1. W. BISHOP I Had once determined to haue wholly omitted this goodly post-script because it containeth in manner nothing else but an irkesome repetition of that which hath beene I will not say twice before but more than twenty times handled ouer and ouer in this former small treatise notwithstanding considering both how ready many are when they see any thing omitted to say that it could not be answered and also for that these pointes heere reiterated are the most odious that he could cull out of all the rest to vrge against vs I finally resolued to giue them a short answer And further also by prouing their new religion to be very opposite vnto those old grounds of the true religion to requite him with the like that I die not in his debt Thus he beginneth The Roman religion established by the Councell of Trent is in the principall points thereof against the very grounds of the Catechisme the Creede the tenne Commandements the Lords praier the two Sacraments THe Catholike religion embraced and defended by the Church of Rome was planted and established there by the Apostles Saint Peter and Saint Paul fifteene hundred yeeres before the Councell of Trent and hath been euer sithence by the Bishops of Rome their lawfull successours constantly retained and most sincerely obserued and maintained some articles thereof called into question by the Heretikes of this latter age were in that most learned generall Councell of Trent declared and defined And great meruaile it were if the principall points thereof should be against the grounds of the Catechisme which is in euery point most substantially expounded by the decree and order of the very same Councell Or is it credible that the Church of Rome with which all other ancient Churches and holy Fathers did desire to agree and which hath beene euer most diligent to obserue all Apostolicall traditions should in the principall points of faith crosse and destroy the very principles of that religion that hath been agreed vpon by all Churches euer since the Apostle daies as he saith Is it not much more likely and probable that the Protestants who slander all Churches euer since the time of the Apostles with some kinde of corruption or other and who hold no kinde of Apostolicall tradition to be necessary is not not I say more credible that they should shake those grounds of faith which come by tradition from the Apostles and haue beene euer since by all Churches agreed vpon I suppose that few men of any indifferent iudgement can thinke the contrary R. ABBOT M. Bishop is desirous to seeme to haue omitted nothing because many saith he are ready when they see any thing omitted to say that it could not be answered and yet he hath cunningly omitted the handling of twelue questions as I haue already noted which are more than the third part of the booke which he vndertooke to answer In that which here he hath sent vs he taketh vpon him as to answer M. Our religion and not Popery is the old religion Perkins so by way of requitall to prooue that our new religion as he calleth it is very opposite vnto the old grounds of the true religion But if his eies were open he would easily see that that new religion and the true religion are all one our new religon as to him it seemeth being indeed no other but that onely true religion whereby all the faithfull haue been saued from the beginning and so shal be to the worlds end And if he will haue our religion to be taken for a new religion he must first impeach those grounds of antiquitie wherby we haue hitherto iustified the same against his vaine and wilfull cauilations As for that which he saith that the religion now defended by the Church of Rome was planted and established there by the Apostles Saint Peter and Saint Paul it is the begging of the question a fond presumption an idle headed dreame who but fooles and madde men beleeue it when they see the writings of the Apostles Peter and Paul and therein finde no mention of the religion that is now at Rome neither of the Pope nor of Purgatorie nor Pardons nor Iubilies nor Masse nor Images nor any other of that filth If the successors of that See had constantly reteined the faith that by the Apostles was deliuered we should now haue that religion at Rome which is taught in the Epistle to the Romanes which now is our religion and was then the religion of the church of Rome Of that religion those heretikes whom no otherwise he so nameth but according to the a Act. 24.14 Iewish phrase called nothing into question they only questioned impugned those additions and alterations wherewith the church of Rome hath defiled and disgraced that religion The Councel of Trent a mockerie of the world The Councell of Trent which declared and defined against them was neither learned nor generall It was a base and a vile collusion and meere mockerie of the world partially assembled by the Pope guilefully managed by his Agents directed wholly by his intelligence nothing there to bee concluded but what hee first approued yet all in sine left at his will by that damnable clause neuer heard of in any former Councel b Conc. Trid. sess 7. in princip sess 25. cap. 21. de reformat Salua semper in omnibus authoritate sedis Apostolicae Sauing alwaies and in all things the authoritie of the See Apostolike Some Diuines there were of qualitie and worth who gaue their assistance in that businesse but as for the Bishops of which
the greatest number were Italians they deserued for the most part rather to bee accounted a heard of swine than a Councell of learned men His reason that the principall points of Poperie cannot bee against the grounds of the Catechisme because the same is expounded by the decree and order of that Councell maketh as much for vs as it doth for them For the Catechisme is by order expounded and taught by vs wee open to the people the Creed the ten Commandements the Lords Praier the doctrine of Sacraments M. Bishop therefore doth amisse to say that our religion is opposite to those old grounds of true religion If this argument auaile not for vs then neither shall it auaile for him but wee are still at libertie to conceiue that notwithstanding their expounding of those grounds they teach points of doctrine contrary thereunto And indeed that expounding of theirs was no otherwise begun but in emulation of our doings in that kinde for vntill it pleased God to stirre vp the spirits of some of our men to endeuour the reformation of the Church and to that end to bring the people so much as in them lay out of the thraldome of blindnesse and ignorance wherein they were then holden the vse of Catechisme was quite abolished out of the Church the people knew neither the Creed nor the Lords praier but onely that they spake them like a charme in a strange and vnknowen tongue But when they saw vs recalling them to the ancient order of Catechising and thereby training them to the knowledge of God and of faith towards him they held it necessarie for the satisfaction of the world that they themselues should make some shew of doing the like and thereupon in the Councell of Trent tooke order for a Catechisme to bee published though they neuer meant to make any great vse of it but onely where necessitie should enforce them for the countermining of our labours and the staying of manie whom otherwise the desire of learning and of the knowledge of God would haue caried away from them Into that Catechisme and the rest of theirs how they haue foisted in matters of faith and doctrine which the old expositours of the Catechisme neuer knew nor haue deliuered wee shall somewhat perceiue by examining the processe and particulars of this booke In the meane time we answer M. Bishop that it is verie credible and ready enough to be beleeued of them that are carefull to vnderstand it that the church of Rome albeit while it continued sound in the faith all ancient Churches and holy Fathers did desire to agree with it yet since being gon out of her * The church of Rome hath swaiued from the tradition of the Apostles ancient way doth indeed crosse and destroy those principles of religion which formerly haue beene agreed vpon by all Churches For whereas hee saith that that church hath been euer most diligent to obserue all Apostolical traditions it is a stale iest Bellarmine himselfe perforce acknowledgeth it to bee a lie For it being manifest by the testimonie of Anacletus an ancient Bishop of Rome that c De consecrat dist 2. cap. Peracta Peracta consecratione communicent omnes qui nolin◠eccleasisticis carere liminibus sic enim Apostoli statuerunt sancta Romana tenet ecclesia the Apostles decreed and the church of Rome then obserued that they should be excommunicate whosoeuer were present after consecration and did not receiue the Communion Bellarmine in the behalfe of the now-church of Rome reiecteth the same as a thing d Bellarm. de Missa lib. 2. ca. 10. Cortum est decreta ista quae sine dubio non diuini sed humani iuris erant si ad populum pertinebant progressis temporis abrogata fuisse in processe of time abrogated by the church being but a matter of humane only constitutiō decree So likewise we see in the Councel of Cōstance acknowledging that e Concil Const sess 13. Licèt Christus post coenam instituerit discipulis suis administranerit sub vtraque specie panis vini hoc venerabile Sacramentum tamen hoc non obstante c. Et similitèr quòd licèt in primitiua ecclesia huiusmodi Sacramentum à fidelibus reciperetur sub vtraque specie tamen haec consuetudo ad euitandum aliqua scandala pericula est rationabilitèr introducta quòd à laicis tantummodo sub specie panis suscipiatur c. vnde pro lege habenda est c. Christ administred the holy Sacrament to his disciples vnder both kindes and that in the Primitiue Church it was so receiued of the faithfull and yet this notwithstanding they decree it for a law that lay men shall receiuc only in one kinde Now when thus with our eies we see and they themselues tell vs the contrary will M. Bishop notwithstanding tell vs that the Church of Rome hath been euer most diligent to obserue all Apostolicall traditions Surely if they had failed but in these two they had not obserued al but now how many other things are there wherein they haue apparantly swarued from the example of the Apostles How then can we beleeue M. Bishop any further who doubteth not heere to affirme so grosse and manifest vntruth And to this vntruth he addeth another when hee saith that we slander all churches since the time of the Apostles with some corruption or other It is true that we note the corruptions of some churches and of some men accordingly as the history of the Church and the monuments of antiquity doe lay the same foorth vnto vs but wee cannot say that al Churches or al the Fathers of those times were guiltie of those corruptions For many Churches were there and many Bishops and Pastours of Churches of whom no memoriall is come vnto vs many whom we finde otherwise reported of than was true by the corrupting of those writings which they left vnto the Church and suborning other counterfets in their stead many who haue deliuered some exorbitant opinions of which notwithstanding it appeareth not that they had publike approbation in the Church many who haue left so little in record as touching points of faith as that it is hard by them to esteeme what the doctrine of the Church was As for the corruptions whereof we speake there are many of them such as that I doe not thinke M. Bishop to be so impudent but that hee will acknowledge the same as well as we there are none of them but that either by the word of God or by like warrant of antiquity we prooue them to be such as we report them His other tale that we hold no kinde of Apostolicall traditions to be necessary he himselfe knoweth to be vntrue because he knoweth that we receiue the Creede as necessarie which he saith came by tradition from the Apostles It hath beene also f Of Traditions sect 4. before giuen him to vnderstand that we reiect
not Apostolical traditions which appeare certainely so to be and yet woorthily we reiect those vnwritten doctrines and counterfet traditions of the Papists which are falsely fathered vpon the Apostles It is by these vnwritten doctrines and counterfet traditions that the grounds of our faith are impeached and shaken We therefore cannot be said to shake the grounds of faith who retaine the meere simplicity of those grounds and refuse all other strange and bastard stuffe but they shake the grounds of faith who become patrons of such tradition coloured with the names of the Apostles when notwithstanding they plainely crosse the written doctrine of the Apostles 2. W. BISHOP But let vs descend to the particulars wherein the truth will appeare more plainely Thus beginneth Master PERKINS with the Creede First of all it must be considered that some of the principall doctrines beleeued in the Church of Rome are that the Bishop of Rome is the Vicar of Christ and head of the Catholike Church that there is a fire of Purgatory that Images of God and Saints are to be placed in the Church and worshipped that Praier is to be made to Saints departed that there is a propitiatory sacrifice daily offered in the Masse for the sinnes of the quicke and the dead These points are of that moment that without them the Roman religion cannot stand c. And yet marke the Apostles Creed which hath beene thought to containe all necessary points of religion to be beleeued and hath therefore beene called the key and rule of faith This Creede I say hath not any of these points nor the expositions made thereof by the ancient Fathers nor any other Creed or confession of faith made by any Councell or Church for the space of many hundred yeeres This is a plaine proofe to any indifferent man that these bee new articles of faith neuer knowen in the Apostolike Church and that the Fathers and Councels could not finde any such articles of faith in the bookes of the old and new Testament Answer is made that all these points of doctrine are beleeued vnder the article I beleeue the Catholike Church the meaning whereof they will haue to be this I beleeue all things which the Catholike Church holdeth and teacheth to be beleeued If this bee as they say wee must beleeue in the Church that is put our confidence in the Church for the manifestation and the certainety of all doctrine necessary to saluation And thus the eternall truth of God the Creatour shall depend vpon the determination of the creature And the written word of God in this respect is made insufficient as though it had not plainely reuealed all points of doctrine pertaining to saluation And the ancient Churches haue beene farre ouer-secene that did not propound the former points to be beleeued as articles of faith but left them to these latter times Thus farre Master PERKINS Wherein are hudled vp many things confusedly I will answere briefly and distinctly to euery point The first is that in the Apostles Creede are contained all points of religion necessary to be beleeued which is most apparantly false as the Protestants themselues must needes confesse or else grant that it is not necessary to beleeue the King to be Supreame-head of the Church or that the Church is to be gouerned by Bishops or that we are iustified by Christs iustice imputed to vs or that there be but two Sacraments or that the Church seruice must be said in the vulgar tongue or that all things necessary to be beleeued to saluation are contained in the Scriptures To be short not one article of their religion which is contrary to ours is conteined in this Creede of the Apostles therefore to affirme as he doth all necessary points of religion to be contained in this Creede is to cast their owne religion flat to the ground and to teach that not one point of it is to be beleeued this Creede may neuerthelesse be called the key and rule of faith because it containeth the principall points of the Christian religion and doth open as it were the doore vnto all the rest and guide a man certainely vnto the knowledge of them by teaching vs to beleeue the Catholike Church which being the pillar and ground of truth 1. Tim. 3.15 Ioh. 16.13 directed and guided by the spirit of truth will alwaies instruct her obedient children in all truth necessary to saluation Then saith M. PERKINS The eternall truth of God the Creatour shall depend on the determination of the creature Nothing lesse for Gods truth is most sincere and certaine in it selfe before any declaration of the church but we poore creatures that are subiect to mistaking and error should not so certainely vnderstand and know that truth of God vnlesse hee had ordained and appointed such a skilfull and faithfull Mistris and interpreter to assure vs both what is his word and what is the true meaning of it Like as pure gold is not made perfect in it self by the Gold-smithes touch-stone but other men are thereby assured that it is true and pure gold euen so the word of God doth not borrow his truth from the Church but the true children of God are by the holy Church assured which is the same his word If we did hold as we do not that the written word containeth all points of doctrine necessary to saluation yet were it most necessary to relie vpoÌ„ the Catholike churches declaration both to be assured which books of scriptures be Canonicall which not whereupon Saint Augustine a man of far better iudgement than any of these daies said Con. Epist. Iud. cap. 5. that he would not beleeue the Gospel vnlesse the authority of the church mooued him therunto as also to vnderstand them truly because the words of holy Scripture without the true meaning and sense of them do but deceiue men and lead them into error and to that end haue alwaies beene and yet are by Heretikes abused to draw others after them into destruction The like may be said of other ancient Creeds and confessions of faith which holding the Apostles Creed did adde some few points vnto it namely such as were in those daies called into question by Heretikes of greater fame and who were followed of many not touching in particular diuers other articles generally beleeued of all true Christians or else by soâ—e fewe and obscure men onely questioned Wherefore to argue that no other points of faith are to be beleeued but such as are expressed in ancient Creeds is to cut off a great part of our faith Lastly it is most vntrue to say that those ancient Fathers and Councels knew not of these articles of faith by him mentioned for they haue most plainely taught them in their writings yea and expresly condemned of heresie most of the contrary positions now againe reuiued and holden by the Protestants as in those seuerall questions I haue before prooued R. ABBOT How M. Pirkins vnderstood that all necessary
points in religion to be beleeued are contained in the Creede I doe not well conceiue for my part I rather admit that the Creed is therefore called the key and rule of faith The Creed how the key and rule of faith for that it is a summary Briefe containing the principall and fundamentall points of Christian faith which doe as it weere open the doore to all the rest and by which all preaching and doctrine of faith is to be esteemed so as nothing may be admitted but what holdeth correspondence with this rule according to those vses which the Scripture teacheth vs to make of euery part therof Which the scripture I say teacheth vs to make for if we draw any article of our faith to the maintenance of any doctrine which hath no warrant or testimony of the Scripture we are corrupters of the faith and doe but abuse the name thereof to the cloaking of our owne deuice Thus M. Bishop and his fellowes corrupt the faith as touching the holy catholike church first in wresting the name of the catholike church to the particular church of Rome and secondly in challenging a certain and vndoubted credit to be yeelded to that church for the infallible resolution of all points of faith For as touching the first where hath the Scripture giuen vs any inckling that the name of the Catholike Church should in any peculiar manner be vnderstood of the Church of Rome We regard not their claime we know they haue tongue at will to speake for theÌ„selues but let them giue vs one word of God whereby it may appeare that by the name of the Church we are directed in special maner to that church We are not ignorant that amongst most ancient writers the name of Catholike church is sometimes giuen to the church of Rome but we know withall that it was no otherwise giuen to the church of Rome than to any other church euery Church being called a Catholike church as hath been a Answer to the Epistle sect 3. before shewed that communicated in true faith with the church dispersed thorow the whole world And therefore as Leo wrote himselfe b Leo epist. 12. Leo papa ecclesiae Catholicae vrbis Romae Bishop of the catholike church of the citie of Rome so doth Constantine the Emperour write c Socrat hist. li. 1. ca. 6. Constantinus Catholicae Alexandrinorum ecclesiae to the catholike church of Alexandria and Athanasius accordingly is entituled by his Clergy d Athanas Apolog 2. Theognio c. Presbyteri diaconi sub reuerendissimo episcopo Athanasio Catholicae ecclesiae Alexandrinae Bishop of the catholike church of Alexandria and Austin nameth e August cont Crescon li. 3. ca. 13. Omnis Aphricana Catholica ecclesia the catholike church of Africa and Aurelius writeth himselfe f Collat. cum Donat. cognit 1. ca. 16 Aurelius episcopus ecclesiae Catholicae Carthaginensis Bishop of the catholike church of Carthage and another Aurelius g Ibid. ca. 201. Aurelius episcopus ecclesiae Catholicae Macomadiensits cap. 204. Nouatus episcopus ecclesiae Catholicae Sitifensis Bishop of the catholike church of Macomodia and Nouatus Bishop of the catholike church of Sitif So in the fift councell at Constantinople we reade the holy h Concil Constantinop 5. act 1. Supplicatiâ— Ã Clericis Monachis Apostolici thront Antiochenae magnae â—uitatis Catholicae sanctae ecclesiae catholike church of Antioch and in the subscriptions of the Councell i Dei Act. 8. in subscript Sextiltanus in sericordia Dei episcopus ecclesiae Catholicae Tumensiu Megethius gratia Dei episcopus sanctae dei Catholicae ecclesiae ciuitatis Heracleae c. Sextilianus Bishop of the catholike church of Tunis Megethius Bishop of the holy catholike church of the city of Heracela and Pompeianus Bishop of the holy catholike church of the city of Victoria and sundry other the like By all which and many other examples it may appeare with how little discretion Dureus the Iesuit hath affirmed that k Duraeus cont Whitak li. 3. In nullum planè aliam Catholicae nomen ecclesiae quaerunque de Christiecclesia Prophetae praedixerunt quà m in Romanam conuenire possunt the name of the catholike church and those things which the Prophets haue forespoken of the church of Christ can agree to no other but to the church of Rome And with this madde and witlesse fancy they are all caried away so that there can bee no naming of the church or catholike church but it soundeth in their eares vndoubtedly to haue reference to the Church of Rome According to this fancy it is that M. Bishop heere would haue his Reader to imagine that by the beleefe of the Catholik church he is taught to beleeue the church of Rome And by the same illusion hee wresteth to his purpose the words of the Apostle that the church is the pillar and ground of truth and the promise that Christ maketh vnto his of his spirit to direct and guide them into all truth as if therein were some speciall priuiledge meant to the Roman church The Church how the pillar ground of truth But for the first place if any one church might challenge a prerogatiue therby it should be the church of Ephesus For Timothie was Bishop of Ephesus wished by the Apostle l 1. Tim. 1.3 to abide still there as specially to take vpon him the charge of that place He writeth to him purposely to instruct him how to carry himselfe in that charge m cap. 3.15 That thou maist know saith hee how thou oughtest to behaue thy selfe in the house of God which is the church of the liuing God the pillar grouÌ„d of truth The house of God then wherin Timothie was to conuerse which he was to gouern was the church of Ephesus as the church in general so this church for it own part in particular is called the church of the liuing God the pillar and ground of truth Yea these two goe hand in hand to be the house of God the church of the liuing God and to be the pillar and ground of truth Now of euery church of the faithfull it is said n 1. Pet. 2.5 Yee as liuely stones are made a spirituall house o 2. Cor. 6.16 yee are the Temple of the liuing God p Eph. 2.22 yee are built together in Christ to be Gods habitation Which way then I maruell is it now brought about that to be the pillar ground of truth should be a peculiar dignity of the church of Rome more than of the church of Ephesus or of any other particular church To be the pillar and ground of truth importeth the office and duty of the whole church and euery part thereof and not a speciall prerogatiue of any one church as to bee alwaies found so in act and execution The church is the pillar and ground of truth as the
Priest is q Mal. 2.7 the messenger of the Lord of hosts The Priest though he be by calling the messenger of the Lord yet sometimes neglecteth his calling and forbeareth to doe the message wherewith hee is sent and so the church though by duty it be the pillar and ground of truth appointed to vphold and maintaine the same yet sometimes forgetteth this duery and followeth lies in stead of truth For as the church is now so hath it euer beene from the beginning the pillar and ground of truth and yet we finde that very often the church of the Iewes in the time of the Iudges and vnder the wicked Kings of Iudah and Israel did forsake t Mal. 2.6 the law of truth which God had giuen vnto them went a whooring after strange and false gods and many waies prouoked him by their abominations For no longer doth the church continue to be as it ought to be the pillar and ground of truth than it continueth built vpon the foundations of truth ſ Eph. 2.20 vpon the foundations of the Apostles and Prophets as Saint Paul speaketh t Ambros in Eph. 2. Hoc est supra nouum vetus teslamentum collocati that is vpon the new and old Testament as Ambrose expoundeth it If it once go awry from those foundations truth falleth to the ground and it becommeth a pillar and fortresse of errour and vntruth Thus hath it come to passe in M. Bishops church of Rome which in her pride hath cast off the yoke which she at first tooke vpon her and hath magnified herselfe to be a Queene to giue lawes of her owne in stead of the lawes of Iesus Christ Shee is indeede by duety as all other churches are a pillar and ground of truth but being become the minion of Antichrist and prostituted to his adulterous desires shee hath learned for his sake and for her owne sake by him u 1. Tim. 4.2 to speake lies in hypocrisie and x 2. Pet. 2.3 through couetousnesse with feined words to make merchandise of y Reu. 18.13 the soules of men All which hypocrisie and feined words shee fairly gloseth and cōmendeth to men with this perswasion that she can not erre because she hath a promise of Christ to be alwaies directed and guided by his spirit into all trueth But where hath Christ made any such promise to the Church of Rome Whom and how the spirit of Christ leadeth into all truth Wee read that Christ said to his Apostles z Ioh. 16.13 When he is come which is the spirit of truth he will lead you into all trueth and wee beleeue that what hee spake to his Apostles he intended to the whole Church and to all the faithfull but neither doe we reade nor haue any cause to beleeue that Christ therein intended any thing in speciall to the church of Rome neither did euer any ancient Father or Councell gather any such thing out of those words And surely no otherwise doe they alleage this Scripture for themselues than the Manichees did for themselues and the Montanists for themselues For as the Manichees alleaging these words to colour their heresies against the Scripture appropriated the spirit of truth here spoken of to their Patriarch a August cont Faust Manich. lib. 32. cap. 17. Dicere soletis Ipse vos inducet in omnem veritatem c. de vestro Manichao esse praedictum Manicheus and the Montanistes in like sort to b Tertull. de Veland virginib sub initio Montanus as if in them and by them the spirit should direct the Church into all truth Euen so the Papists howsoeuer they talke of the Church directed by the spirit yet doe indeed put ouer the Church to the Pope placing the residence of the spirit in him that he may bee to the Church the infallible oracle of all truth In which fancie if they will expect to haue more credit than those heretikes had they must bring better warrant for themselues than those heretikes did But because they can bring vs none therefore we reiect them all alike as coseners and deceiuers of the Church pretending the spirit of truth for the maintenance of lies and claiming that credit to be giuen to an vsurping wretch which our Sauiour reserueth as proper to the holy Ghost The promise of the spirit as I said before belongeth to all the faithfull and of them all S. Iohn saith c 1 Ioh. 2.27 The anointing which yee haue receiued of him that is saith Austin d August in 1. Ioan. tract 4. Eadem vnctio id est ipse spiritus domini the spirit of the Lord teacheth you of all things Albeit when it is said all things and all truth we are not to vnderstand absolutely all for the spirit doth not teach vs to know e Idem in actis cum Felice Manich. lib. 1. cap. 10. Si hanc doctrinam putas ad illam veritatem pertinere c. interrogo te qunt sint stellae Ibid. Ego tibi possum dicere ea quae pertinent ad doctrinam Christianam how many starres there be as Austin opposeth to Felix the Manichee but he teacheth all things belonging to the doctrine of Christ as the same Austin there expoundeth Yea and yet further he excepteth by the words of the Apostle f Idem cap. 11. Dicebat Apostolus Ex parte scimus c. quia in i st a vita homo cum est non potest assequi omnia sed ex parte assequitur in hac vita ipse autem spiritus qui ex parte docet in hac vita post hanc vitam introducet in omnem veritatem Vide eund in Ioan. tract 96. We know in part and we prophecie in part that whilest a man is in this life he cannot attaine to all things but attaineth onely in part but the holy Ghost saith he which in this life teacheth in part shall after this life bring vs into all truth Hee therefore giueth vs to vnderstand that notwithstanding this promise of the spirit of truth it is incident to them to whom the same appertaineth to be ignorant in this life of many truthes to be subiect to mistaking and errour albeit the same spirit faileth not to enlighten them to that necessary truth which serueth for introduction finally to all truth And heerein the Apostle comforteth vs that g Phil. 3.15 that if any man be otherwise minded than is right God will reueale the same to him so long as in that whereunto we are come we proceed by one rule that we may minde one thing But wee are specially to note the reason which our Sauiour addeth to the words alleaged When he is come which is the spirit of truth he will leade you into all truth for he shall not speake of himselfe but whatsoeuer he shall beare shall he speake meaning thereby the same that he hath before said h Ioh. 14.26 He shall teach you all things
seede of Abraham t cap. 9.28 We be Moses disciples u vers 41. We see x Ier. 8 8. We are wise and the law of the Lord is with vs y ca. 18.18 The law shall not perish from the Priest nor counsell from the wise nor the word from the Prophet and yet they persecuted Christ the sonne of God who only is the Truth How then may we now be assured that the Church of Rome is not the same to the church of Christ as they then were to Christ himselfe How may we poore creatures certainely vnderstand that those rich creatures are not subiect to error and mistaking as well as we Well if we will not beleeue it we may chuse but assurance M. Bishop can yeeld none He can tell vs a discourse what Christ said to Peter but that Christ euer spake either of Pope or Cardinall he can shew vs nothing And yet as if this matter were cleere he telleth vs of this church of theirs that whereas we are subiect to mistaking and errour God hath ordained and appointed the same to be a skilfull and faithfull mistresse and interpreter to assure vs both what is his word and what is the true meaning of it But againe we aske him where hath God so ordained and appointed in what Scripture hath he written it or by what words hath he expressed it that the church which he meaneth should bee our mistresse to tell vs what is Gods word what is the true meaning of it If he haue euidence authority for it let him shew it if he haue not what shall we thinke of him that dareth thus to bely the maiesty of God But if he considered the matter aright he would conceiue that those rich creatures of his haue no other or better meanes to assure what is Gods word and what is the meaning of it than other poore creatures haue By what touchstone they can make triall thereof by the same can we also as well as they Which comparison of the gold-smith and the touchstone which he himselfe vseth if it be rightly explicated serueth notably to set foorth the fraud and falshood of that church for which he pleadeth True it is that the church in this behalfe may rightly bee compared to the Goldsmith Now the Gold-smith for the discerning of true and perfect gold doth not take his owne fingers ends but goeth to the touch-stone and no otherwise can hee either make triall himselfe or giue assurance thereof to other men In like sort therefore the church which is the Gold-smith must vse a touch-stone for the assuring of that which it propoundeth to bee receiued and beleeued Now then whereas M. Bishop saith that we must rely vpon the churches declaration to be assured which bookes of Scripture be Canonicall I answer him that we cannot be assured thereof by the churches declaration vnlesse the church declare it and manifest it by the touch-stone The touch-stone whereby we are to take assurance heereof is the constant and perpetuall tradition and testimony of the former church And this testimony we first deriue from the church of the Iewes z Rom. 3.2 to whom the words of God were committed and to whose Scriptures a Luk. 24.44 the law and the Prophets and the Psalmes and to no other b Aug. cont Gaudent lib. 2. cap. 23. quibus dominus testimonium perhibet tanquam testibus suis Christ himselfe hath giuen testimony as witnesses of himselfe reckoning them for c Luk. 24.27 all the Scriptures and wherof the Iewes in their dispersion giue acknowledgment vntill this day God so prouiding that d Aust in Psa 58. Per omnes gentes dispersi sunt ludaei testes iniquitatis suae veritatis nostrae ipsi habent codices de quibus prophetatus est Chrislus in Ps 56. Codicem portat Iudaeus vnde credat Christianus Christian faith should be prooued out of those bookes which are acknowledged for true by them that are enemies thereto This testimony the Christian church receiued of the Apostles and hath continued the same together with the acknowledgment of those other bookes of the new testament which by the Apostles and Euangelists were added to the former What bookes then haue had this generall and vndoubted auerment and witnesse of the church continued from time to time those and no other are to be holden for Canonicall bookes and this is the true touch-stone for trial of certaine and vndoubted scriptures By which touchstone the church of Rome is found to bee not a faithfull Mistresse but a false harlot bringing her bastards into the Church and forcing men to take them for lawfully begotten And whereas it is the tradition and declaration of the former church which hath beene from the beginning by which both they and we are to be instructed as touching the true bookes of Canonicall Scripture they force vpon vs the tradition of their owne church now deliuered vpon their owne word howsoeuer contrary to that which the church formerly hath declared If we follow the declaration of the ancient church then are no other bookes to be taken for Canonicall but what are now accknowledged and approoued in our Church the same onely being testified concerning the old testament by the Church of the Iewes concerning both new and old by the whole Christian church both the Greeke and Latine the Easterne and Westerne churches as e Of Traditions sect 17. before hath been declared But the church of Rome perceiuing the authorising of some other writings to be likely to gaine credit to some broken wares whence her thrift and gaine ariseth hath taken vpon her very presumptuously as a Mistresse or rather a goddesse to giue diuine authority to those bookes reiecting the testimony of that church which in this behalfe should bee mistresse both to her and vs. In a word whatsoeuer is to be attributed to the church in this respect it is idlely by M. Bishop referred to the church of Rome as if all other churches must rely vpon her declaration we our selues being able by the touchstone to make triall of true Scriptures as well as the church of Rome and therefore there being no cause why we should rely vpon them more than they vpon vs. And as vainely doth he apply to his purpose the saying of Saint Austin that he should not beleeue the Gospell except the authority of the church mooued him thereunto there being nothing therein meant but what may bee applied to the church England as well as to the church of Rome Saint Austin speaking generally of the vniuersall church thorowout the world without any maner speciall intendment of the church of Rome But how leudly they abuse those words of Austin wholly against his meaning and purpose I haue f Of Traditions sect 22. before sufficiently declared and neede not heere to repeat againe As for the churches declaration for vnderstanding the Scripture that is also to be tried and made
good by the touchstone because no exposition or sense of Scripture is to be admitted the doctrine whereof is not to be iustified by other Scripture and they that bring other senses and meanings do but deceiue men and leade them into errour as other heretikes formerly haue done and as the Papists now doe abusing the Scriptures to draw others after them into destruction Heereof also enough hath beene said g Of Traditions sect 21. before whereof I wish the Reader duely to consider for his satisfaction in this point That which he saith of other ancient Creeds and Confessions of faith that they containe not all points of Christian doctrine I eaily admit but yet let him vnderstand that it is a maine preiudice against them that neither any ancient Creed nor any exposition of the Creed or confession of faith conteineth sundry pointes which they now make to be matters of the meaning of the Creede Let him shew that euer any ancient Creed or expositour of the Creed did vnderstand or deliuer that the name of the Catholike church in the Creed hath any speciall reference to the Church of Rome that the Catholike church is to be defined as they now define it by being subiect to the bishop of Rome that the certaine declaration of the Canonicall bookes and of the true sense of Scripture is alwaies infallibly to be expected from the sentence of that Church that all Christians are fully to beleeue and wholly to relie vpon that Church for resolution of all points of faith necessarie to saluation Which and such other points made by them matters of the Creed because neuer any ancient writer hath found to be conteined or intended in the Creed therefore we iustly affirme them to be new Creed-makers coiners of new articles of faith and thereby peruerters and corrupters of the true Christian faith As concerning the Articles mentioned by M. Perkins now holden by the Romish Church that the Pope is Christs Vicar and head of the Catholike Church that there is a purgatorie fire after this life that images of God and of Saints are to be worshipped that praier is to be made to Saints departed and their intercession to bee required that there is a propitiatorie sacrifice daily offered in the Masse for the sinnes of quicke and dead M. Bishop answereth that the Fathers haue most plainly taught them in their writings and expresly condemned of heresie most of the contrary positions But what Fathers are they and in what writings haue they so done Surely if the Bishop of Rome in the ancient Church had beene taken to bee the Vicar of Christ and head of the Catholike church it cannot be but that we should haue very currant and frequent and memorable testimonie thereof as a matter vniuersally receiued and euery where practised But now let M. Bishop shew vs one let him shew so much as one that for diuers hundreds of yeeres after Christ did euer dreame of any such thing Which though indeed he cannot doe yet hee telleth vs of that and the rest that in those seuerall questions he hath before prooued what he saith whereas hee hath not spoken of any more of these points saue onely one and in that one point cannot be said to haue prooued any thing because whatsoeuer hee hath said standeth hitherto reprooued And surely if he haue no better proofes than hitherto he hath brought in all the questions that hee hath handled the Protestants will but scorne him as a very vnproouing disputer and aduise him to bestow his time a while longer in the Schooles to know what it is to prooue 3. W. BISHOP Touching beleeuing in the Church which he thrusteth in by the way we vse not that phrase as the very Creed sheweth following therein S. Augustine with others who hold that to beleeue in a thing is to make it our Creatour by giuing our whole heart vnto it in which sense we beleeue not in Saints nor in the Church albeit some other ancient Doctors take the words to beleeue in not so precisely but say that we may beleeue in the Church and in Saints that is beleeue certainly that the Catholike church is the onely true company of Christians and that to the lawfull gouernours thereof it appeâ—taineth to declare both which bookes be Canonicall and what is the true meaning of all doubtfull places in them so we beleeue the Saints in heauen to heare our prayers to be carefull to pray for vs and to bee able to obtaine by intreaty much at Gods hands in whose high fauour they liue Thus much in answer vnto that which M. PERKINS obiecteth in generall Now to that he saith in particular R. ABBOT a Greg. Nazia de sp sancto orat 6. Sâ—â—reatuÌ„ est quo pacto in ipsum eredimu c. Non enim idem est in aliquem credere de eo credere nam illud diuimt atis est hoc cuiusuis rei It is one thing saith Gregory Nazianzene to beleeue in any one another to beleeue of or concerning him the one belongeth to the Godhead the other is vsed of euery thing And heereby hee prooueth that the holy Ghost is God because wee beleeue in the holy Ghost By which argument our Sauiour Christ also teacheth vs to acknowledge him to be God when he saith b Ioh. 14.1 Yee beleeue in God beleeue also in me where c Hilar. de Trin. lib. 9. Vniens se fidei dei naturae eius vniuit c. deumse per id docens cum in eum credendum sit ab his qui in deum credant vniting himselfe to the beleefe of God saith Hilarie he vniteth himselfe also to his nature thereby teaching that he himselfe is God for that they who beleeue in God must beleeue in him I might further enlarge this point by the testimonies and expositions of d Aug. in Ioan. tract 29. de ciu dei l. 18. ca. 54. Euseb Emissen Ruffin Venant in symbol Apost Austin Eusebius Emissenus Ruffinus Venantius and others who all acknowledge that that phrase belongeth to God and is not to bee applied to any creature But it shall not neede because the Elucidatour of the Romane Catechisme according to the doctrine of the Catechisme it self as he pretendeth though quite contrary both to their doctrine and practise otherwise doth tell vs that e Elucidat Catech Roman c. 9. q. 5. Cùm dicimus nos credere in deum patrem in filium in sp sanctum phrasis haec loquendi significat nos ita credere deum patrem filium spiritu sanctuÌ„ vt etiam in eis omnem fiduciam nostram collocemus quam in deo solo non autem in creaturis ponere possumus ex quibus tamen ecclesia composita est when wee say wee beleeue in God the Father in the Sonne in the holy Ghost this phrase of speaking doth signifie that wee so beleeue God the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost as that also we place all
our confidence in them which we are to put in God onely and not increatures of which notwithstanding the Church consisteth Which exposition wee acknowledge conteineth the very trueth agreeable to Gods word and doe wish that they would alwaies continue constant therein But they doe heerein as their vsuall maner is what by euidence of truth they are forced to say in one place for the maintenance of their owne traditions and superstitions they vnsay it or qualifie it in another And in this sort M. Bishop heere dealeth who first inclining somewhat to that construction alreadie mentioned and telling vs that to beleeue in a thing is to make it our Creatour by giuing our whole heart vnto it alleageth notwithstanding that some ancient Doctours take the words to beleeue in not so precisely but say that wee may beleeue in the church and in Saints heereby to make way to his absurd conceits which none of the ancient Doctours dreamed of it is true indeed that Epiphanius and Cyril haue vsed that maner of speech by adding the preposition in to the rest of the articles I beleeue in one holy Catholike church in one Baptisme in the remission of sinnes in the resurrection of the body in the life eternal but yet making thereof no other construction than we do as if the article were away To beleeue in the church was with them as M. Bishop saith to beleeue certainly in the Catholike church to be the onely true company of Christians and thereof we contend not wee beleeue the same as well as they though not in M. Bishops meaning which neuer was any part of their meaning that the Catholike church should be meant in any speciall maner of the church of Rome But whereas he addeth it is another part of their construction that to the lawfull gouernours thereof that is as he intendeth to the Pope and his Cardinals and Bishops it appertaineth to declare both which bookes be Canonicall and what is the true meaning of all doubtfull places in them he verie shamefully abuseth the ancient Doctours of whom there is not one that hath noted any such matter to be conteined in the Creed If hee know any let him acquaint vs therewith if hee know none let him confesse to his Reader as he must that he hath sought to deceiue him with a lie The same I say of beleeuing in Saints for which of the ancient Doctours hath taught vs out of our Creed that we are to beleeue in them He telleth vs what they meant by it that wee beleeue the Saints in heauen to heare our praiers to be carefull to pray for vs and to be able to obteine by intreatie much at Gods hands But what a strange man is he that will tell vs what men meant by words which they neuer spake Surely to beleeue in Saints is no antiquitie but nouelty and the deuice of him who by beleeuing in Saints seeketh to draw men away from beleefe in God The Apostle telleth vs that f Rom. 10 17. Faith is by hearing and hearing by the word of God Thereupon Basil gathereth thus g Basil Ethit reg 80. Si quicquid ex fide non est peccatum est fides verò ex auditu auditus autem pâ—r verbum Dei est ergo quicquid extra diuinam Scripturam est cùm ex fide non sit peccatum est If whatsoeuer is not of faith bee sinne and faith commeth by hearing and hearing by the word of God surely whatsoeuer is beside the Scripture of God because it is not of faith is sinne Let M. Bishop then shew vs some word of God some warrant of Scripture that it is one point of faith to beleeue in Saints or if hee cannot so doe we must rest perswaded as we are that to beleeue in Saints is to sinne against God And if we may not beleeue in Saints then neither may we pray vnto them for h Rom. 10.14 how shall they call vpon him saith the Apostle in whom they haue not beleeued And seeing praier is i Grego Moral lib. 22. cap. 13. Vera postulatio non in oris est vocibus sed in cogitationibus cordis not a matter of the lippes but of the heart how can wee beleeue that the Saints in heauen heare our praiers when as the word of God telleth vs that k 1. King 8.39 it is God only which knoweth the hearts of all the children of men Againe seeing God hath himselfe named vnto vs the Mediator by whose intrety l Mat. 3.17 Ephe. 3.12 for whose sake he wil accept vs and in whom he will be m Iohn 14.13 glorified for the granting of our requests who n Rom. 8.34 sitteth at the right hand of God and o Heb. 7.25 euer liueth to make intercession for vs how can we call it faith and not rather impudent presumption that we of our owne heads should set vp euery Saint in heauen to be a Master of requests and disturbe that order which God himselfe hath appointed for our accesse to him Admit that in generality they pray for the consummation of their brethren they pray in fellowship of loue not by authority of mediation as ioined in affection with vs not as by specialtie of fauour appointed to be patrons for vs for in that respect it is true which Saint Austin telleth vs that p August in Psam 64. Solus ibi ex his qui carnem gustaverunt interpellat pro nobis of all that haue beene partakers of flesh it is Christ onely in heauen that maketh intercession for vs. To conclude we haue heard before out of the Catechisme that our beleeuing in God requireth all our confidence and trust to be placed in God onely Accordingly Cyprian saith that q Cyprian de dupl martyr Non credit in deum qui non in eo solo collocat totius felicitatis suae fidutiam he beleeueth not in God that placeth not the confidence of all his happinesse in God onely But beleeuing in Saints cannot be vnderstood but to import putting of trust and confidence in them Therefore we cannot beleeue in Saints but with the ouerthrow of our beleefe and trust in God And that the Popish beleeuing in Saints importeth the putting of their trust and confidence in them it plainly appeareth as by other their offices of deuotion so specially by their Ladies Psalter wherein they blasphemously vse to the Virgin Marie those words whereby Dauid professed his trust in God r Psalter Mariae Psal 7. Domina in te speraui de inimicis meis libera animam meam Psal 10. In domina confido propter dulcedinem misericordiae nominis sui psal 21. Quia ego speraui in gratia tua sempiternum a me opprobrium abstulisti Psal 45. Domina refugium nostrum tu es in omni necessitate nostra Psal 53 Domina in nomine tuo saluum me fac O Lady in thee haue I hoped deliuer my soule from mine enemies I
expresse tearmes teacheth O miracle O goodnesse of God! he that sitteth aboue with his Father at the very same instant is touched with the handes of all men Real presence denied by our beleefe of Christs ascension and giueth himselfe to them that will receiue and embrace him See more of this in the question of the blessed Sacrament where M. PER. citeth the very same authorities which he heere repeateth see my answer to to them there R. ABBOT It is a true argument and very consequent Christ is ascended into heauen and there sitteth at the right hand of God the father therefore hee is not really and locally in the sacrament The connexion is Saint Austins a August in Ioan tract 50. Conuersatus est secundum corporis praesentiam quadraginta diebus cum discipulis suis eis deducentibus videndo non sequendo ascend it in caeluÌ„ non est hîc He is ascended into heauen and is not heere as touching the presence of his body Saint Austin saith that because he is ascended therefore as touching his body he is not heere M. Bishop saith that notwithstanding his ascension he is still heere according to his body Whether now may we thinke is more likely of these two to bee beleeued But M. Bishop to saue himselfe will set Chrysostome and Austin together by the eares Forsooth Chrysostome reporteth it as a miracle that he who sitteth aboue with his father at the very same instant is touched with the hands of all men and giueth himselfe to them that will receiue and embrace him What Chrysostomes minde was in this behalfe appeareth by that which otherwhere he saith that b Chrysost op imperf hom 11. In vasis sanctifacatis non est verum corpus Christi sed mysterium corporis eius continetur in the holy vessels not the true body of Christ but the mystery of his body is contained And by this mystery of his body Saint Austin saith that e August epist 23. Secundum quendam modum sacramentum corporis Christi corpus Christi est after a certaine maner it is the body of Christ and Cyprian saith that d Cyprian de resurrect Christi Quod videtur nonane virtute Christs corpus censetur in name and power it is accounted the body of Christ. As therefore Saint Austin saith that e August in Psal 33. conc 2. Ipse se portabat quodammodo cum diceret Hoc est corpus meum Christ did in some sort beare himselfe in his owne hands when he said This is my body in some sort he saith or after a sort not verily and indeed so Chrysostome intendeth that he who sitteth at the right hand of God is after a sort touched in the Sacrament with the hands of all the partakers thereof not as touching the reality but as touching the mysterie of his body yet so wherein consisteth the miracle which Chrysostome mentioneth as that he indeed giueth himselfe spiritually and by faith to all them that are truely willing to receiue him And in what meaning Chrysostme spake those words we may easily conceiue by other words which he vseth in the very same place f Chrysost de sacerd lib. 3. Dum conspicis dominum immolatum Sacerdotem sacrificio incumbentem ac preces fundentem tum verò turbam circumfusam pretioso illo sanguine intingi ac rubefieri etiamnè te inter mortales versari atque in terra confistere censes annon potiùs evestigiò ad caelum transferris annon omnem ca niâ—câ—gitationem abijcreâ—s mente â—ura circumspieâ—â—quae in ceâ—â— sunt O miraiu um O dâ—â— bemgintatem qâ—â— cum patre sursum sedet in illo ipsotemporis articulo on nium manibus pertractatur aâ— sâ—â—pâ—â— tradit wâ—â—tibus ipsum excipere accâ—mâ—lecti fit autem id nullis praestigijs sed apertis acâ—â—reumspâ—tientibus circumsistentium omnium occutis When thou seest the Lord offered the Priest leaning to the Sacrifice and powring foorth praier and the people round about died and made red with that pretious blood doest thou thinke that thou art amongst mortall men or standing vpon the earth Art thou not foorthwith lift vp to heauen Doest thou not cast away all carnall cogitation and with pure minde behold those things which are in heauen aboue Then vsing the words which M. Bishop hath alleaged he addeth And this is done not by collusion but so as that the standers by with open eies behold all that is done Let M. Bishop now tell vs doe the standers by with open eies see Christ offered Are they made red with the bloud of Christ Must they thinke that they are indeed carried vp to heauen and are not vpon the earth If he cannot deny but that these words are vsed by excesse and vehemencie of speech to drawe the mindes of his hearers to diuine and heauenly meditation of the mysteries then in hand can hee deny but that wee haue iust cause to vnderstand the other words in the very same sort The other testimonies cited by M. PER. out of Vigilius Fulgentius Austin doe make the same good because they shew that Christ according to his manhood is not really vpon the earth M. Bishop biddeth vs see his answeres to those authorities but as yet we doe not see them and if euer we do see them we shall see him as wise or rather as wilfull in them as he hath beene in all the rest 6. W. BISHOP Thirdly he reasoneth thus The Church as it is beleeued is not seene In that we beleeue the Catholike Church it followeth that it is inuisible because things seene are not beleeued We answer that the persons in the Catholike Church are and euer were visible euen to Iewes and Heathens who persecuted them but the inward indowments of those persons that is their faith hope and charity their assistance by Gods spirit and such like Christian qualities are inuisible to be beleeued And euen as a man is truely said to be visible though he consist aswell of an inuisible soule as of a visible body so the Church is visible for the vsible persons visible teaching and administring of Sacraments in it albeit the inward qualities of it be not visible R. ABBOT a Origen in Cant. hom 1. Ecclesiam coetum omnium aduerte sanctoâ—um Et hom 2. Ecclesia ante constitutionem mundi sic enim dicit Paulus sicut elegit nos in Christo c. The holy Chatholike church is the company of Gods saints whom he hath elected in Christ before the foundations of the world and b Gregor in Cantic cap. 3. Secundum praescientiae suae gratiam Christus sanctam ecclesiam de in aeternum permansurissanctis construxit whom he hath by the grace of his foreknowledge appointed to continue with him for euer It is c Ephe. 1.23 the body and d Reuel 21 9. Spouse of Christ e Reuel 5 9. redeemed and f 1. Pet. 1.2 sprinkled with his bloud g
Rom. 8 11. quickened by his spirit h Rom 5.19 iustified by his obedience i 2 Cor. 1.22 Ehâ— 1.13.14 2. Tim. 2.19 sealed to the remssion of sinnes and euerlasting life That God hath such a people we beleeue it we see it not neither can our eies discerne who they are that appertaine to this number it being one of the proper emblemes of Gods honour j The Lord knoweth who are his In this sort doe we in the articles of our Creede professe to beleeue the holy Catholike church That there is a church also visible no man denieth no man doubteth nay we affirme that it is amidst that church which wee see that God gathereth vnto himselfe that church which we cannot see And to speake of this visible church also we cannot see it to be Gods church or that it is Gods word that there is preached or that they are the Sacraments of Christ which are there administred or that there is any fruit or benefite to be reaped thereby We see these things done but the estimation of them is a matter of faith and not of fight we see the persons but we do not by our eies perceiue them to be that that they take vpon them to be But being by faith instructed that these things are of God or professing so to be beleeue we discerue by hearing and seeing who they are to whom we are to adioine our selues for the exercise of our faith So then the church is both visible and inuisible visible as touching the persons visible as touching open assemblies and exercises but not visible to bee the church of God for then Iewes and heathens would see so much and would leaue to persecute which now they doe not because they haue no faith and the church is no otherwise knowen so to be but onely by faith Now what saith M. Bishop to hurt any thing that we say The persons saith he in the Catholike church are visible but their indowments are inuisible Well and men are not true members of the true church by being such and such persons but by hauing such and such inward indowments and therfore though they bee visible as touching their persons yet they are not visible as true members of the church The church therefore which wee professe to beleeue which consisteth in them that are the true members of the visible church must needs be granted to be inuisible Yea I say further that men are not at all members of the visible church by being such and such persons but by profession of the faith and name of Christ and participation of his Sacraments And therfore M. Bishop doth much amisse to compare visible persons and inward qualities with the body the soule because to be a visible person is not to be in part a member of the church as the body is part of a man for then euery Turke and Infidell might be said to be in part a member of the church because he is a man but outward acceptance of the faith and visible communion with the church maketh a man outwardly a member thereof and is as it were the body the life and soule wherof is the inward grace of the spirit whereby he is indeed to the eies of God that which outwarly he seemeth to bee to the eies of men But a further difference also there is for that the soule though in it selfe it be inuisible yet is certainly perceiued and discerned by the actions and motions of the body and therefore well may a man be said to be visible as a man though as touching the soule it selfe he be inuisible whereas there are no such actions or motions of a member of the visible church whereby the eie of man can certainely see that hee hath life within or is spiritually the same to God that outwardly he giueth semblance to men to be Because therefore the true members of the church are not to be discerned with the eie it followeth that the church properly so called consisting of those true members is visible to God onely 7. W. BISHOP His last obiection against vs out of the Creed is That the articles of remission of sinnes resurrection of the body and life euerlasting containe a confession of speciall faith For the meaning of them is thus much I beleeue the remission of mine owne sinnes and the resurrectition of mine owne body to life euerlasting Answer That is not the meaning vnlesse you adde some conditions to wit I beleeue the remission of my sinnes if I haue duly vsed the meanes ordained by our Sauiour for the remission of them which is after Baptisme the Sacrament of Penance Item I beleeue I shall haue life euerlasting if I keepe as Christ willed the yong-man to keepe Gods commandements or at the least if I doe die with true repentance Now whether I haue done or shall doe these things required of me I am not so well assured as that I can beleue it for I may be deceiued therein but I haue or may haue a very goood hope by the grace of God to performe them Neither is there any more to be gathered out of Saint Augustine as some of the words by himselfe heere alleaged doe conuince For he requireth besides faith that we turne from our sinnes conforme our will to Gods will and abide in the lap of the Catholike church and so at length we shall be healed See the question of certainty of saluation Note also by the way the vncertainty of of M. PER. doctrine concerning this point for he holdeth that it is not necessary to haue a certaine perswasion of our owne saluation Pag. 2â—0 275. but that it is sufficient to haue a desire to haue it and that doctrine he putteth there as he saith himselfe to expound the Chatechismes that propound faith at so high reach as few can attaine vnto yet heere and elsewhere the goodman forgetting himselfe chargeth vs to crosse the Creed because we doe not wrest faith vp to so high a straine and so in heate of quarelling often expoundeth this contrary to his owne rule Now for proofe of S. Augustines opinion heerein whom he onely citeth take these two sentences for the two points be speaketh of For the first that we be certaine by ordinary faith of our saluation let this serue Of life euerlasting which God that cannot lie hath promised to his children De bono perseuer cap. 22. De correct grat cap. 13. no man can be secure and out of danger before his life be ended which is a tentation vpon earth Secondly that a man once truely iustified may afterward fall We must beleeue saith this holy father that certaine of the children of perdition doe liue in faith that worketh by charity and so doe for a time liue faithfully and iustly they were then truly iustified and yet afterward doe fall and that finally because be calleth them the children of perdition Thus much in answere vnto that which M. PER. obiecteth
cap. 3. Et nuncille viuit in sinu Abraham He now liueth in Abrahams bosome Now then we are come to this that because Abrahams bosome is in heauen and Christs descending to hell was no other but his going to Abrahams bosome therefore the meaning of Christs descending into hell is that hee ascended vp to heauen It were well that they should first cleere these matters for themselues and make good their owne assertion before they should take in hand to question ours Whatsoeuer the meaning bee of Christs desecending into hell we are sure that that which they bring is vaine and false Now the article of Christs descending into hell being according to their exposition impertinent and idle and no vse to bee made thereof in the Creede some in respect thereof haue thought the same to haue crept into it of latter time and not to haue beene there from the beginning and some it may be for I know it not neither dare I take M. Bishops word for it haue quite omitted it in the Creed Neither doe they want inducements heereunto from the ancient church in which there are many Creedes and confessions of faith in which there is no mention of Christs descending into hell And heerein we are to note Doct. Bishop to be a man singularly impudent who alleageth the article to be in the old Roman Creed expounded by Ruffinus whereas the words of Ruffinus himselfe doe expressely affirme the contrary n Ruffin in exposit symb Apost Sciendum sanè est quòd in ecclesiae Romanae symbolo non habetur additum Descenditad inferna sed neque in Orientis ecclesiis habetur hic sermo We are to know saith he that in the Creed of the Roman church it is not added that he descended into hell neither are those words vsed by the Easterne churches The Nicene Creed saith nothing of it which in likelihood would not haue omitted it if it had beene found in the ancienter Creed of the Apostles Saint Austin hath o Tom. 9. de symb vel reg fidei ad Catechumenos foure expositions of the Creed in one place and p Tom. 3. de fide symbolo one in another and in none of these expositions is it found that Christ descended into hell Tertullian hath q Tertul. de praescript adu Praxean de veland virginib three declarations of the rule of faith and this point is not found in any of them Neither doth Ireneus mention it where r Iren. adu heres lib. 1. c. 2. lib. 3. cap. 4. twice he expresseth the Apostolike faith There is a confession of faith set downe by Å¿ Synod Roma tom 1. Concil a Synod at Rome in the time of Iulius the first another in the t Concil Constantin 1 cap. 7. first Councel of Constantinople another in a Councell at u Synod Aleuand apud Cyril in Concitio Ephes Alexandria confirmed by the Councel of Ephesus and many other moe wherein there is nothing said of Christs descending into hell Thus from many examples and authorities of the ancient church those men parhaps thinke that they haue warrant to leaue out that article without being culpable of any violation of Christian faith And although Athanasius and sundry other in their writings haue deliuered this as a point of faith yet they hold that those acts and instruments of publicke recognition which are very frequent to this purpose do ouerwaigh priuate iudgements and are sufficient to excuse or defend that that is done by them But for our parts wee see no sufficient reason to moue vs to follow them herein We see diuers phrases of Scripture tending to the assertion of this article of our beleefe We read our Sauiour Christ professing his reioycing to his Father x Acts. 2.27 Psal 16.10 for that he would not leaue his soule in hell which is vainely spoken if the soule of Christ were not at all in hell Therefore we admit the article and in the confession of our faith we alwaies recite it neither doth any man make question to doe otherwise But M. Bishop excepteth against the variety of expositions that are found amongst vs concerning the same And what is there no variety of expositions thereof to be found amongst them Doe they all so accord in one as that we can obserue no difference of one from another first that learned deuout Authour Durand as M. Bishop y Preface to the Reader sect 5. before hath stiled him doth hold that z Durand apud Bellarm. de Christianima cap. 15. Christ descended not into hell at all by reall presence but only by effect and power a Tho. Aquin. sum p. 3. q. 52. art 2. in concl Christus secundùm effectum in omnem inferâ—â— locum descendit secùndum verò substantialem praesentiâ—m non descendit nisi ad locum iustorum Thomas Aquinas determineth that by reall presence he went onely to Limbus Patrum but to the other parts of hell he descended by vertue and power Bellarmine setteth it down for b Bellarm. de Christianima c. 16. Probabile est profectò animam Christi ad omnia inferni loâ—a descendisse probable that the soule of Christ did verily descend to all the places of hell Thomas Aquinas resolueth that c Tho. Aqui. vt supra art 4. in concl Animam Christi tamdiu fuisse in inferno credendum est quamdin corpus fuit in sepulchro the soule of Christ was so long in hell as his body was in the graue and so they commonly hold as did Vigilius of old d Vig. â—o Eutyc lib. 2. Anima Christi per illud triduum in inferno that for those three daies space the soule of Christ was in hell But S. Austin holdeth it a thing impious to be affirmed e Augst cont Felic Arian ca. 15. Si mortuo corpore ad paradisum anima latronis mox vocatur quenquamnè adhuc tam impium credimus qui dicere audeat quoniam anima saluatoris nostri triduo illo corporeae mortis apud inferos custodiae mancipetur that the soule of the theefe being foorthwith called to Paradise the soule of our Sauiour should for the three daies space of his bodily death be in custody in hell Thomas Aquinas is of opinion that f Thom. Aquin. sum pa. 3. qu. 52. art 1. in corp Conueniens fuit Christen ad infernum descendere quia ipse venerat portare poenas nostras vt nos a poena eriperet ex peccatâ— autem homo incurrerat non solum mortem corporis sed etiam descensum ad inseros it behooued that Christ should goe to hell because he came to beare our punishments so to deliuer vs from the same and we by sinne had incurred not onely bodily death but also going to hell But Bonauenture saith and to him Bellarmine inclineth that g Bellerm de Christi anima cap. 16. ex Bonauentura Dicit Christi animam
to the Father and the Son that we make the holy Ghost much inferiour to the other persons And how may that appeare Marry in their French Catechismes they teach saith he that the Father alone is to bee adored in the name of his sonne But what because they say the Father alone must they needes be taken to exclude the holy Ghost Hath he not so much diuinity as to know that the name of the Father is sometimes vsed for distinction of persons sometimes indefinitely of God without any such distinction When our Sauiour saith a Matt. 23.9 One is your Father who is in heauen doth not the name of Father there extend to God the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost Doth it not so also where the Apostel saith b Eph. 4 6. There is one God and Father of all who is aboue all and through all and in you all Doth M. Bishop otherwise vnderstand it when he saith Our Father which art in heauen Surely the French Catechisme may say as he rereporteth who yet seldome reporteth truth yet import nothing therby but what Origen saith ChristiaÌ„s of old did namely c Origen cont Cels â— 8 Christiani soli Deo per Iesum preces offerentes to offer praiers to God only by Iesus or in the name of Iesus The next cauil against Calum is of the same kind that the title of Creatour belongeth only to the Father Which M. Bishop might well haue vnderstood in the distinctioÌ„ of the persoÌ„s by their seueral attributes as d Calu. Opus in Explicat perfidiae Valent. Gâ—ntil Certè vnâ— consensu fatemur Christum impropriè vocari creatorem coeli terrae quoad personae distinctionem Neque enim dubium est quin seriptura patri nomen Creatoris vendicans personas distinguat Caluin setteth it down to be very true and the rather for that in the very articles of the Creed he findeth it so applied I beleeue in God the Father almighty maker of heauen and earth For although it be true which S. Austin oftentimes deliuereth that e August de praedest sanctor cap. 8. Inseparabilia dicimus â—sse opera Trinitatis the workes of the Trinity are inseparable and in the act of any of the persons is the concurrence of all yet they so concurre as that they retaine therein their seuerall proprieties so as that of seuerall actions arise seuerall denominations which in common phrase of speech are vsed as in some specialty belonging to one person rather than another As therefore we attribute it to the sonne alone to haue redeemed vs and to the holy Ghost alone to sanctifie vs albeit both the Father and the holy Ghost had their worke in our redemption and the Father and the Sonne haue their worke also in sanctifying vs euen so to the Father alone the title of Creatour is applied not but that the Sonne and the holy Ghost haue their worke in the creation but because f Origen cont Cels lib. 8. Dicimus immediatum opificeâ— esse fiâ—um dei verbum c. Verâ— autâ—m patrem curus mandato munduâ— sit per ipsum filium conditus esse primarium opincem the Father is the primary or principall worker as Origen saith at whose commandement the world was created by the Sonne and g Hilar. de Synod adu Aria Si suis vnum dicens deum Christum autem deum ante secula filium dei obsecutum patri in creatione omnium non confitetur anathema sit wherein as the Syrmian Councel saith and Hilary approoueth the Sonne did obedience to the Father As for the rest that he heere quarelleth at that the Father is called the first degree and cause of life and the Sonne the second and againe that the father holdeth the first ranke of honour and gouernment and the sonne the second not to question the truth of his allegations I would in a word aske his wisdome doth he that saith that the Father is the first person in Trinity and the Sonne the second deny thereby the holy Ghost to be the third or doth hee hereby exclude the holy Ghost from hauing part with the Father and the Sonne Doth the Apostle when in his epistles he saith h Rom. 1 7. 1. Cor. 1.3 et in reliq Grace and peace from God our Father and from our Lord Iesus Christ doth he I say exclude heereby the holy Ghost from being the authour of grace and peace or from hauing part with the Father and the Sonne Or when he saith i 2. Cor. 1.3 Ephe 1.3 Blessed be God euen the Father of our Lord Iesus Christ doth he deny the Sonne and the holy Ghost to be blessed and praised together with the Father If he doe not why then doth this idle headed Sophister thus take exception where there is nothing for him iustly to except against Forsooth at most saith he the holy Ghost must be content with the third degree of honour But what M. Bishop doe not you also place the holy Ghost in the third degree when you name him the third person Doth not your head serue you to vnderstand degree of order only without imparity or minority as all Diuines in this case are woont to do But why doe I thus contend with a blinde buzzard a wilfull and ignorant wrangler and not rather reiect him as a man worthy to be altogether contemned and derided He hath k Preface to the Reader sect 7. before cited the latter of these words to shew that Caluin made the Sonne of God inferiour to the Father but how leaudly he dealeth in the alleaging of it and to how small purpose it is there declared there is no cause here to speake thereof 12. W. BISHOP 9. one I beleeue the holy Catholike Church the communion of Saints First where as there is but on Catholike church as the Councel of Nice expresly defineth following sundry texts of the word of God they commonly teach that there be two churches one inuisible of the elect another visible of both good and bad holy Secondly they imagine it to be holy by the imputation of Christs holinesse to the elected Bretheren and not by the infusion of the holy Ghost into the hearts of all the faithfull Catholike Thirdly they cannot abide the name Catholike in the true sense of it that is they will not beleeue the true Church to haue beene alwaies visibly extant since the Apostles time and to haue beene generally spread into all countries otherwise they must needes forsake their owne church which began with Friar Luther and is not receiued generally in the greatest part of the Christian world Finally they beleeue no Church no not their owne in all points of faith but hold that the true Church may erre in some principall points of faith How then can any man safely relie his saluation vpon the credite of such an vncertaine ground and erring guide may they not then as well say that they
de notis eccles cap. 7. Si solae vna prouincia retineret veram fidem adhuc verè propriè diceretur ecclesia Catholica dummodo clarè ostenderetur eam esse vnam eandem cum illa quae fuit aliquo tempore vel diuersis in toto mundo if one only countrey should retaine the true faith yet the same should truly and properly be called the Catholike church so that it might cleerely be shewed to be one and the same with that which hath been at any time or times ouer the whole world For by this rule nothing hindreth but that our church though now it be not receiued generally in the greatest part of the Christian world yea if it were but in one onely country yet may truely and properly be called the Catholike church if it be prooued to be one and the same with the church which at any time heeretofore was spred ouer all the world But that our church is the same with that which at the first was spred thorowout the world it is very euident as Tertullian teacheth vs to prescribe g Tert. de praescript adu haeret In eadem fide conspirantes non minus Apostolicae deputantur pro consanguinitate doctrinae by consanguinity or agreement of our doctrine with the doctrine of that church For by the Gospell which the Apostles preached the church was founded thorowout the whole world h Iren. lib. 3. cap. 1. Quod quidem tunc praeconiauerunt postea per dei voluntatem in Scripturis nobis tradiderunt fundamentum columnam fidei nostrae futurum The gospell which the Apostles preached they afterwards by the will of God deliuered to vs in the Scriptures to be the foundation and pillar of our faith The same Gospel deliuered to vs in the Scriptures we receiue we adde nothing to it we take nothing from it as we finde it so we teach it Our faith therefore is the same with the faith of that church which at the first was planted thorowout the whole world There is no cause then for vs to forsake our owne church or to thinke that the same began with Friar Luther as this dreamer imagineth which by so plaine deduction is approoued to be the same with the first church and consequently to be truely and properly the Catholike Church Finally saith he they beleeue no church in all points of faith But doth his wisedome finde it in the articles of the Creed that we are to beleeue any church in all points of faith The church how farre to be beleeued in points of faith We are taught there to beleeue that there is a holy catholike Church which is the communion of Saints but nothing doe we finde there of beleeuing any Church in all points of faith We beleeue the Church in points of faith so farre as she yeeldeth herselfe like a faithfull and obedient spouse to be guided by the voice of her Lord and husband Iesus Christ But if the Church preferre her owne will before the word of Christ as the proud harlot of Rome doth it should be a wrong to Christ to beleeue the Church and a way to set vp humane errour in stead of diuine truth It is not the voice of the Church but the word of the written Gospell which God hath appointed as Irenaeus euen now hath told vs to be the foundation and pillar of our faith For the words of the Church are many times the words of errour and vntruth and therefore if we should relie our saluation vpon the credit thereof wee should indeed relie vpon an vncertaine ground and erring guide but the word of the Gospell is alwaies one and the same without any variablenesse or vncertainty and therefore safely may wee relie our saluation thereupon Now therefore it cannot be said but that wee alwaies beleeue one holy catholike Church according to the profession of faith specified in the Creed though sometimes and in some things we doe not beleeue that is credit the visible Church as touching points of faith because the Church sometimes teacheth vs to beleeue otherwise than God hath taught Which though it seeme strange to M. Bishop in that language which he hath learned to speake yet to vs it is not strange who in the Canonicall histories of the Churches both of the old and new Testament do so often see them diuerting and turning from the right way As for that hee saith that our learned masters doe commonly cashiere out of the Creed the addition of the cōmunion of saints it is but a fruit of the harnessing of his face and he is therefore bold to say it because he hath learned not to be ashamed of any thing that he list to say That by the Saints are there meant al good Christians all the faithful whether aliue or dead we will not denie Communion of Saints implieth neither Purgatorie nor praier to saints but that either praier to saints or praier for soules in purgatorie belong to this communion of Saints we neuer yet learned and are too old to learne it now For as for the Saints in heauen i Aug. de vera relig cap 55. Honoramus eos charitate non seruitute honorandi propter imitationem non propter religionem adorandi We honour them with loue as Austin saith but not with seruice to follow them by imitation not to adore them by religion and therefore not to pray vnto them Further entercourse as yet there is none betwixt them and vs because k Esay 63.16 they know vs not nor are acquainted with vs nor can we any way acquaint them what wee say vnto them Now beside the Saints triumphant in heauen wee acknowledge none but those that are militant vpon the earth because the holie Ghost diuideth the whole body of the Church into l Eph. 1.10 Col. 1.20 those that are in heauen and those that are in earth and pronounceth them all m Reu. 14.13 blessed that are dead in Christ as who rest from labours and sorrowes and thereby are discharged from all Purgatorie paines But if there be any soules in Purgatorie to which all good Christian soules should yeeld and affoord their helpe to doe them ease and this be one matter of the entercourse and communion of Gods Saints why doth the Pope violate the communion of Saints by withholding from those tormented soules that helpe and ease which he is able to affoord them Surely if he cannot doe them ease then is he an impudent liar and a notable impostour and cozener of the world If he can do it then is he a cruell wretch that without compassion suffereth poore souls to lie broiling in those fierie flames But we rather approoue the former member of this diuision and take him for a liar both for that without warrant hee thrusteth in Purgatorie into the articles of our faith and with lesse warrant challengeth the same for a iurisdiction to himselfe 13. W. BISHOP 10 The forgiuenesse of sinnes
Thirdly we make no Images to expresse the nature of God which is a spirit and cannot be represented by lines and colours but onely allow of some such pictures as set out some apparitions of God recorded in the Bible not doubting but that such workes of God may aswell be expressed in colours to our eies as they are by words to our eares and vnderstanding Lastly touching religious worship to bee done to Saints or pictures Analogâ—n the Heretikes cauilling consisteth principally in the diuers taking of the word religious For it is ambiguous and principally signifieth the worship onely due to God in which sense to giue it to any creature were Idolatrie but it is also with the best authors taken some other time to signifie a worship due to creatures for some supernaturall vertue or quality in them and in this sense to tearme it detestable Idolatry is either detestable malice or damnable ignorance And whereas he saith that common reason teacheth that they who adore God in Images do binde God his hearing of vs to certaine things and places I say the contrarie that God may be worshipped in all places but we rather chuse to worship him in Churches and before Images than in other places because the sight of such holy things doe breed more reuerence and deuotion in vs and better keepe our mindes from wandring vpon vaine matters If we taught that God could bee worshipped no where els or by no other meanes then he had not lied so loudly R. ABBOT M. All Images generally forbidden to be worshipped Perkins concludeth indeed that the images of God are forbidden in the commandement but neither saith nor meaneth that only the Images of God are there forbidden and therefore hee vseth no euill conscience in vrging the commandement against the images of Saints but M. Bishop with euill conscience defendeth the images of Saints against the commandement And whereas hee saith that thogh God do forbid to worship images yet he doth not therfore forbid vs to worship God in or at Images hee doth but frame himselfe to the guise and woont of all the masters of idolatry it being the common pretence of them al as hath been a Of Images sect 5. before shewed that they doe not worship the Image it selfe which they know to be but mettall or wood or stone but that in the Image or at the Image they worship the diuine essence which they beleeue to bee immateriall and immortall Yea and by what reason M. Bishop heere defendeth the worshipping of God in or at Images for at God is euery where so may he be worshipped in all places and as well at or before an Image as in the Church or before the communion table by the same did Ieroboam perswade the Israelites to worship God at or before or in his golden Calues at Dan and Bethel b Ioseph Ant. Iudaic. l. 8. c. 3. See of Images sect 5. because no place is void of God neither is he included any where and therefore they might as wel worship him neerer hand before those calues as in the temple and before the sanctuary at Ierusalem But as Ieroboam committed damnable idolatrie in worshipping God before the Calues so doth M. Bishop also in worshipping God in or before an image commit idolatry against God who will not be mocked nor can abide to haue honour done to an idoll by pretence of his name His third exception that they make no Images to expresse the nature of God but onely to set foorth some apparitions of God recorded in the Bible how vaine it is hath beene also fully declared in c Of Images sect 4. 7. the handling of that question And very strange it is that M. Bishop should make those apparitions a colour for their idoll-images of God when God himselfe affirmeth that therefore hee did forbeare in the day when hee gaue the Law d Deu. 4.12.15 to appeere in any image or likenesse because he would not haue them to make any image of him Whereas he saith that such works of God may aswell be expressed in colours to our eies as they are by words to our eares and vnderstanding he should vnderstand that it is one thing to speake of the works of God another thing to speake of the person of God Wee question not the expressing of the workes of God but wee condemne the expressing of the person of God And if the expressing of those apparitions by words to our eares and vnderstanding be a reason why we may expresse the same by pictures to our eies then nothing hindereth but that the nature of God also may bee expressed by colours and pictures to our eies because the same is by words according to our capacitie expressed to our eares and vnderstanding But God hath commanded himselfe to be preached to the eare and vnderstanding he hath not commanded nay hee hath forbidden himselfe to be painted to the eie and therefore the one is lawfull and godly the other wicked and vnlawfull His distinction of religious worship is most ridiculous and absurd The verie name of religion as Austin and Lactantius do deriue it impotteth the e Aug. de vera relig ca. 55. Ad vnum deum tendentes eâ— vni religantes animas nostras vnde religio dicta creditur Lactant. Instit li. 4 cap. 28. Hoc vinculo pietatis obstricti deo religati sumus vnde ipsa religio nomen accepit obliging and tying of our soules to God onely and if to God onely then it cannot be truely called religion that is performed to any other Therefore Lactantius saith againe that f Lactan. Instit l. 1. c. 20. Religio ac veneratio nulla alia nisi vnius dei tenenda est there is no other religion to be holden but towards God onely So saith Austin that g Aug. cont 2. ep Pelag. lib. 3. c. 4. Debent obseruari Christiani vt vni deo religionis obsequio seruiatur Christians are with dutie of religion to serue God only and that h Idem cont Faust Manich. lib. 14. cap. 11. Apostolus creaturam laudat ei tamen cultum religionis exhiberi vetat the Apostle forbiddeth worship of religion to be giuen to any creature Hee telleth vs that l IdeÌ„ de eiu dei l. 5. c. 15. Pietas vera non exhibet seruitutem religionis quam latriam Graeci vocant nisi vni vero deo seruice of religion is that which the Greekes call 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which true piety yeeldeth to God onely Therefore hee saith that k Idem de vera relig cap. 55. Non sit nobis religio cultus hominum mortuorum Honorandi sunt propter imitationem non adorandipropter religionem we are not to make a religion of the worship of dead men and that wee are to honour them for imitation not to worship them for religion Now all these so expresse and peremptorie resolutions M. Bishop at once
saluationem tametsi erroneam hominem posse mereri per fidem erroneam etsi contingat vt adoret diabolū that the faith of a lay man worshipping an Host that is not consecrated though it be an erroneous faith yet sufficeth to saluation and that a man by an erroneous faith may merit although it fall out that he worship the diuell This speech is strange but yet M. Bishop now by his distinction teacheth vs how it may very wel stand because though a man materially worship the diuell yet by his intention hee doth formally worship God Now what ill happe had Ieroboam that he was not acquainted with these Romish schoole-trickes for he might well haue answered both for himself and for the people that though materially they errēd in the Calues yet their intention was pure and holy to worship the true God and therefore formally they were true worshippers Yea this distinction wil serue to cleere a great part of the idolatries of the Gentiles and Pagans because albeit the diuels did present themselues at their idols and images to receiue the sacrifices deuotions that were there performed as in Popery they haue also done yet this hindred not but that formally they were true worshippers because though they were materially mistaken as before was said in taking the diuell for God yet their formall meaning and intention was to doe seruice to the onely true and immortall God Thus shall they be excused of whom Christ saith d Ioh. 16.2 The time will come that whosoeuer killeth you will thinke that he doth God seruice Which many vndoubtedly thought in the crucifying of Christ being formally e Act. 22.3 zealous towards God but f Luk. 23.34 not knowing materially what they did So S. Austin saith of the Donatists g Aug. epist 48. Arbitrabantur se pro ecclesiae dei facere quicquid inquieta temeritate faciebant Whatsoeuer they did in their turbulent rashnesse and furie they thought they did it in behalfe of the Church of God The same we say of all schismes and heresies that the followers thereof at least many of them are formally true worshippers of Christ because they haue an vnfained intention and purpose to serue the Lord Iesus Christ howsoeuer materially they be mistaken in some things Thus doth M. Bishop make a hotch-potch and mixture of all religions and by his distinction of materialitèr and formalitèr a man may in any religion bee a true worshipper of God because hee may haue a zealous intention to serue God But if his learning and vnderstanding did not faile him he would remember that h Ioh. 4.23 the true worshippers doe worship God not onely formally in spirit but also materially in truth It was the religion of the Samaritanes i Ibid. vers 22. to worship they knew not what but the religion of the true Iewes of whom was saluation was to know what they did worship Our Sauiour would thereby instruct vs that there is no saluation where men worship they know not what God hath reueiled vnto vs the knowledge of himselfe and of his will that thereby we may be directed to serue him In this k Ioh. 17.3 knowledge is eternall life but l Os◠4.6 in the want of knowledge is perdition and destruction Intention zeale is good and in the seruice of God necessarily required but yet our intention and zeale is no other but furie and madnesse and fighting against God if it haue not knowledge to guide it materially in the way of God Now if it be idolatrie to worship that for God which is no God and yet it followeth not that God is heereby stiled an Idoll then surely it is likewise Idolatrie to worship the Sacrament vnder the name of the body of Christ when it is not the bodie of Christ and yet we doe not thereby stile our Sauiour Iesus Christ an idoll as hee fondly obiecteth against vs for blasphemie in the highest degree 19. W. BISHOP His third obiection is out of the fourth Commandement which as he saith giueth a libertie to worke six daies in the ordinarie affaires of our calling which libertie saith be cannot bee repealed by any creature the Church of Rome therefore erreth in that it prescribeth other set and ordinary festiuall daies to be obserued as straightly and with as much solemnitie as the Sabbath of the Lord. Answ Doth not the Church of England also prescribe the Natiuitie of our Sauiour and of S. Iohn Baptist the feasts of the Apostles and many others to be kept holy and command that no man worke in the affaires of their calling those daies doth their owne church also erre therein How say you then to the church of the Israelites which kept the feasts of Easter Whitsontide and of the Tabernacles as straightly and with as much solemnitie as they kept the Lords Sabbath was it also mis-led to the breach of Gods commandements or must we not rather thereby learne that six daies in the weeke were at the first left vs free to labour in but yet so that by the decree and commandement of our spirituall Gouernours any of them might vpon iust occasion be made festiuall and thereupon euery good christian bound to keepe them by their obedience vnto their Gouernours to thinke the contrarie is a high point of Puritanisme R. ABBOT M. Festiuall daies lawfully prescribed by the church Perkins intendeth nothing against the authoritie of the Church for the prescribing of some solemne and festiuall daies but condemneth the church of Rome iustly for prescribing such daies to be obserued as straitly and with as much solemntie he should haue said more straitly and with much more conscience and solemnitie than the Lords Sabbath day Yea it is a thing impious in the Bishop of Rome that hee taketh vpon him to make such daies in themselues a Bellar. de cultu sanct l. 3. ca. 10. Sunt dies festi verè alijs fanctiores sacratiores pars quaedam diuini cultus more sacred and holy than other daies and a part of the very true worship and seruice of God Whereas M. Perkins saith that it is not in the power of any creature to repeale the liberty of working six daies he saith rightly if we vnderstand it of the libertie of conscience for no creature may binde the conscience from the acknowledgement of a lawfulnesse with God to worke all and euery of the six daies in the affaires of our callings but yet in charitie and obedience we yeeld to our gouernours and to our brethren somewhat vpon occasion to refraine our libertie and to forbeare the doing of those things of which notwithstanding we know and are perswaded that in conscience and with God they are free and lawfull to be done 20. W. BISHOP Fourthly saith M. PER. the fift Commandement enioineth children to obey father and mother in all things specially in matters of moment as in their Marriages and choice of their calling
vs so that we shall see that hee had need of one to remember him that a liar must beare a braine See further what hath beene said heereof to the first section of his answer to M. Perkins his Dedicatorie Epistle 28. W. BISHOP 5. The fift Commandement teacheth that no man be killed by priuate authoritie yet Protestantes hold it lawfull to take armes euen against their lawfull Princes for the aduancement of their Gospell and haueâ—n thâ—â— quarrell killed and caused to be killed millions in Gerâ—anie â—rance Flanders and Scotland R. ABBOT This is a meere slander leudly deuised bâ— some Papists to take from themselues the enuie and iust reproch of that sauage and barbarous crueltie which they haue practised in Germany Popish barbaritie coloured by slandering the Protestants France Flanders in shedding the bloud of so many thousands of innocent persons without respect of time place sex age or degree They haue beene in their Churches togither to pray to God and to heare his word suspecting no harm when these Tygers and Wooles haue come armed vpon them and there slaine them without any difference both man woman and childe It were too long to set foorth the tragedie of those but cheries that haue beene committed in such like sort by the meanes of the Guises in France of the duke of Alba and others in Flanders and in Germany by the impetuous headlong tyrannie of Charles the fift The Protestants armes in this case haue beene onely defensiue when as contrary to publike edicts and proclamations contrarie to lawes rights and priuiledges and without legall course of proceeding they haue beene thus barbarously destroied Neither haue they then taken armes by priuate authoritie but by law and by the publicke direction of them to whom the maintenance and defence of those rights and liberties did belong Now that Papists for the aduancement of their idolatries and superstitions doe hold it lawfull and by their Confessours haue beene resolued that it is lawfull not onely to take armes against their Princes but by secret practise to murther them and by gun-powder to blow vp a whole Parliament house to the vtter confusion and subuersion of a whole state our experience from time to time hath sufficiently made knowen to vs. But a See heereof The difference betwixt Christian subiection and vnchristian rebellion part 3. by D. Bilson then Warden of Winche and now Bishop there that Protestants hold it lawfull as he obiecteth to take armes against their lawfull Princes for the aduancement of the Gospell it is a lie and contrary to the doctrine and profession of al our Churches 29. W. BISHOP 6 The sixt forbiddeth adulterie which is allowed of by Protestants in some case For they permit one party after dinorcement to marrie againe the other yet liuing whereas our Sauiour saith Whosoeuer dimisseth his wife and marrieth another committeth adulterie vpon her And if the wife dimisse her husband and marrie another she commiteth adulterie Moreouer incest is also forbidden in this Commandement now by the Canons of the Catholike Church and the authoritie of the ancient Fathers it is incest for one Cosen germaine to marry with another yet is it not seldome practised yea it is generally allowed of in the church of EnglaÌ„d R. ABBOT Protestants allow neither adultery nor incest Papists doe both The limitation of diuorce which our Sauiour Christ hath set down a Mat. 5.32 19.9 except it be for fornication maketh it lawfull for the party innocent to marry againe the delinquent being left to the censure of the Church vntill satisfaction shall be giuen of true repentance for so hainous sinne The Church of England notwithstanding for the preuenting of some mischiefes that by the wickednesse of men doe arise by abusing the liberty of mariage vpon diuorce vseth a restraint of that liberty that the parties diuorced shall put in caution not to marry againe so long as they both liue But the Church of Rome doth openly admit adultery in this behalfe making it free to the Pope to pronounce of a solemne mariage a nullity and to giue liberty to the husband to marry againe the former wife being neither deceased nor diuorced As for incest so determined by the law of God the Pope hath giuen allowance to it in giuing dispensation to the king of Spaine last deceased to marry his own sisters daughter as also to King Henry the eight of England to marry his own brothers wife But that whereof M. Bishop speaketh for one cousin germain to marry with another is no incest by Gods law nor there determined to be vnlawfull Yet thereof we commend that conceit which of old was had of it as S. Austen noteth b August de ciu dâ—i l. 15. c. 16 â—actum etiamâ—â—â—â—um propter vicinitatem horrebatur illiciti that that which was lawfull to be done yet was abhorred for that it is so neere to that that is vnlawfull Therefore albeit by law we prescribe no other bounds than God hath set yet we disswade such mariages rather than approoue them lest men by taking the vttermost of that that is lawfull should thereby the rather presume to that that is altogether vnlawfull As for the Canons of the Church of Rome we little respect them because we know they make no conscience to permit or prohibit as they themselues list who haue brought in a new deuise of spirituall kindred vnknown to ancient times whereby it is vnlawfull for them to marry ech to other who haue been godfathers and god mothers togâ—ther at the baptisme of a child Let them make Canons for themselues but for vs by the grace of God they shall make none 30. W. BISHOP 7. The seuenth Commandement condemneth with theft vsury and all withholding of our neighbours goods which was gotten vnlawfully yet Protestants commonly make no conscience to take ten in the hundreth which is plaine vsury and as for restitution of euill gotten goods it is cleane out of fashion among them R. ABBOT Hypocrite Our lawes allow no vsury at all as though it were not common amongst Papists also to take ten in the hundred Yet our law alloweth not this but punisheth it if it be informed with the losse of the increase If M. Bishop will say that because there is no execution of this punishment therefore it must be taken to be permitted I answer him that it is permitted as Moses permitted the bill of diuorce only a Mat. 19.8 for the hardnesse of mens hearts who cannot be induced to lend to supply the occasions and necessities of their brethren vnlesse they may be suffered to make benefit of their lending As for restitution of euill gotten goods we say that the wanting thereof wittingly is a token of the want of true repentance without which there is no saluation And albeit I doubt not but that I may say hereof that it is more sincerely practised with vs than it is with them yet I will not
if we see it not how should we remember any thing by it seeing signes of remembrance must be things seen Such was Goliaths sword such was the husbands blood kept by the wines as much pertinent to this purpose as a goose quill to a woodcocks taile The reall presence therfore in this behalfe is altogether idle neither is there any fruit or effect of it because there is nothing thereby to be seen Albeit Christ did not say see this in remembrance of me but do this in remembrance ofme And what he bid vs doe S. Paul telleth vs namely b 1. Cor. 11.26 to eat of this bread and drinke of this cup. And how shall wee eat of this bread in remembrance of him if it be true which they say that in the sacrament there is no bread If he will say that by the forme of bread we may be remembred though the body be not seen we can also say that by the bread we may be remembred though there bee no reall presence of the body and therfore the reall presence because it is needlesse is iustly affirmed to be none at all 54. W. BISHOP Eightly If the reall presence be granted Per. 8. then the body and blood of Christ are either seuered or ioined together if seuered then Christ is still crucified if ioyned together then the bread is both the body and blood of Christ wheras the institution saith the bread is the body and the wine is the blood Answ The body and blood of Christ are by force of Christs words consecrated apart so that if they could be naturally separated they should bee also seuered in that Sacrament as they might haue been at Christs death when all the blood was poured foorth of his body but euer sithence Christs resurrection they are so ioined together that they can bee no more seuered so that we grant vnder one kind of the Sacrament to be both Christs body and blood which is not wrought by the words of the institution but by the necessary and inseparable coniunction of Christs body with his blood euer since his glorious resurrection R. ABBOT To this it shall be needlesse to say any thing here because it commeth more fitly to be spoken of in the next section 55. W. BISHOP Finally M. Perkins condemneth the administration of the Sacrament vnder one onely kind for the commandement of Christ is drinke ye all of this Mat. 26. vers 27. and this commandement is rehersed to the Church of Corinth in these words doe this as oft as ye drinke it in remembrance of me vers 25. and no power can reuerse this commandement because it was established by the soueraigne head of the Church Answ He began to set downe the institution of the Sacrament out of S. Paul 1. Cor. 11. heere he leapeth backe to S. Mathew because he fitteth him better in this point to whom I answer that Christ there spake only vnto his twelue Apostles who were afterward to administer that holy Sacrament to others and so something ther-about is spoken to them which may not bee extended vnto lay-men but vnto Priests onely who were to succeed the Apostles in that ministery All men do confesse these words hoc facite doe yee this that is administer yee this Sacrament to be spoken onely to the Apostles and in them to all of the Clergie alone euen so drinke yee all of this was in like maner spoken vnto them onely as Clergie men and therfore it is a commandement onely to Priests so to do and as for others they may either drinke of it or not drinke of it as it shall bee thought most expedient by their supreame Pastors and this may be gathered out of those very words drinke ye all of this For why should the Apostles haue a speciall charge more to drinke of that cuppe then to eat of that food vnlesse it were to signifie that whereas all men should be bound to receiue Christs body they should bee further bound to receiue that holy cuppe also from which bond other men should stand free But to come to the purpose when they quarrell with vs for taking away from the people one kind of the Sacrament we answer that we doe them no hinderance thereby because we giue them both the blessed body and sacred bloud of Christ together vnder one kinde yea whole Christ both God and man because they be so vnited that they cannot be separated But what can they answer when we complaine vpon them for that they haue defrauded the poore people of both body and bloud of Christ and in lieu of that most pretious banquet doe giue them a cold breake-fast of a morsell of bread and a suppe of wine this is a most miserable and lamentable exchange indeed our blessed Lord giue them grace to see it and deliuer them speedily from it Heere is the place to shew how the Protestants doe not onely bereaue their vnfortunate followers of this most heauenly food of Christs body but that they also depriue them of the manifold and great graces of God deriued vnto vs in siue other Sacraments but because I haue touched it in the Preface I will omit it heere and make an end with M. PER. assoone as I haue requited him by propounding briefly some arguments for the real presence as hee hath done against it R. ABBOT Whether it bee S. Mathew or S. Paul they serue both for the confirming of one truth and doe both condemne the Antichristian and damnable sacriledge of the Church of Rome in maiming the Sacrament of Christ contrary to the institution of Christ himselfe to the very intention and purpose of the Sacrament to the example and practise of all ancient churches Our Sauiour Christ saith a Matt. 26.27 Drinke yee all of this But the Church of Rome saith Not so for there are iust and reasonable causes why it is not fit that all drinke therof but it is sufficient that the Priest alone drinke for all M. Bishop to make this good telleth vs that Christ there spake to his Apostles onely and that some thing thereabout is spoken to them which may not bee extended vnto lay-men but vnto Priests onely But how will hee make it appeare that Christ in the one part of the Sacrament spake to the Apostles onely and not in the other also There were none there present but the Apostles and what direction haue we in the words of Christ to restraine the vse of the cup as peculiar to the Priests and to make the other common to the people And if Christ did so intend how falleth it out that the Apostle S. Paul in the recitall of Christs institution professing b 1. Cor. 11.23 to deliuer precisely what he had receiued of the Lord maketh no mention of this restraint and what presumption was it in the whole primitiue Church contrary to that intendment to make that common to the laitie which Christ had made the prerogatiue of the Priests onely He saith
as he rightly speaketh he would not vnderstand it to be receiued by the body And thus Christ sealing vnto vs in the Lords supper all the fruits of his passion and giuing himselfe vnto vs spiritually to become one with vs and to make vs one with him hee hath without reall presence bestowed as M. Bishop saith an inestimable gift vpon vs such a one as neuer any other did or possibly could doe 63. W. BISHOP Moreouer the institution of a religious rite and ceremonie to be vsed in the whole Church vnto the worlds end and to be receiued of all Christian people of age and discretion did necessarily require that it should bee done in most certaine and cleare tearmes otherwise there might arise great strife and contention about it and be the ruine of thousands And specially great perspicuitie is required in this holy Sacrament where the mistaking of it must needs breeed either idolatrie if wee worship for Christ that which is not Christ or impietie if on the other side we should not giue to it being Christ God and man diuine honour Wherefore no good Christian may thinke but that our prouident Sauiour Christ Iesus who verie well foresaw all these inconueniences did deliuer it in such tearmes as he would haue to be taken properly and not be construed at mens pleasures figuratiuely Adde that hee spake those words to the twelue Apostles onely whom hee was accustomed to instruct plainly and not in parable darkely and who were woont also to aske for the interpretation of obscure speeches who here made no question about this high mysterie because they were sufficiently forewarned that they should eat Christs flesh Ioh. 6. and that his body was truly meat and therefore beleeued Christs words without further question R. ABBOT The institution of a religious rite and ceremonie for the vse of the Christian Church required such termes as had beene formerly accustomed in the institution of such religious rites wherein as hath beene a Sect 48. before noted out of Austin Sacraments commonly beare the names of those things whereof they are Sacraments So is circumcision called b Gen. 17.13 the couenant of the Lord being but the signe and seale of his couenant So is the lambe called c Exod. 12.11 the Lords Passeouer though it were but a signification and remembrance thereof So were the sacrifices of the law called d Leuit. 1.4 4.20 c. attonements or reconciliations for sinne which yet they were not in themselues because e Heb. 10.4 it was vnpossible that the bloud of calues and goats should take away sins but were onely signes and figures of the attonement that should be made by the bloud of Iesus Christ And thus Cyprian saith expresly of the Lords supper that therein f Cyprian de Vnct. Chrismat significantia significata eis dem nomenibus censentur the signes and the things signified are reckoned by the same names being both termed the body bloud of Christ And herein is no occasion of contention but to them only that are contentious will prefer their own absurd fancies before the light and truth of the word of God Who as they do peruersly and wilfully mistake so doe wilfully by mistaking runne into idolatrie g Rom. 1.25 worshiping the creature insteed of the creatour giuing to the signe or sacrament that diuine honour which belongeth properly to Christ himselfe And if it be idolatrie as heere he telleth vs to worship for Christ that which is not Christ then hee hath told vs amisse before that men doe not commit idolatrie though they worship the Host when the Priest hath had no intention of consecration In a word our Sauiour Christ though he spake by a figure yet spake so as that not at mens pleasures but according to the course of Gods word he might easely be vnderstood And as for the Apostles we cannot doubt but that they were so well instructed in those other signes and sacraments wherewith they had beene before acquainted as that they could not make any scruple or question what his meaning was in the institution of this Therefore no cause was there for them to be troubled or to aske interpretation heere as of some darke and obscure matter but there had beene cause for them to haue questioned many things in the words of Christ according to that interpretation which the Church of Rome hath made thereof For though Christ spake to them before of the eating of his flesh and that his flesh was truely meate yet had hee said nothing vnto them that they should eate a whole body in the likenesse of a peece of bread Yea though hee spake to them of eating his flesh and drinking his bloud yet withall he spake enough wherby to giue them instruction how that should bee vnderstood as h Sect. 49. 57. before hath been declared 64. W. BISHOP Finally this holy Sacrament is a principall part of the new Testament and one of the chiefest legacies by Christ bequeathed vnto vs Christians Now what law or conscience will permit that any legacie should be interpreted figuratiuely to wit that for a house goods or lands bequeathed and giuen by last will and testament you should vnderstand a figure of a house to be giuen or the signification and representation of some goods or lands If this be most absurd and ridiculous in the testament of any ordinary man about temporall goods how much more pernicious and intollerable is it to suffer this in the eternall Testament of the Sonne of God and that in his diuine and inestimable treasures And thus at length by the grace of God I come to the end of this booke wherein good Christian Reader if thou finde any thing that may confirme thee in the true Catholike faith or further thy knowledge therein giue God the Father of lights from whom all good gifts descend the whole praise If any thing be amisse impute it partly to my slender skill ouersight or negligence and partly to the want of a conuenient resting-place commoditie of bookes and conference all which these times of persecution doe depriue vs of R. ABBOT He that maketh his last will and testament and giueth thereby great legacies of lands and goods and putteth to his seale for confirmation of the legacies that he hath giuen shall he be said in giuing his seale to bequeath only a peece of waxe or a figure and representation of landes and goods The seale indeed is but wax it is but a signe and token of somewhat but yet it serueth to giue assurance of the legacies for confirmation whereof it is appointed The new testament of Christ is the couenant and promise of forgiuenesse of sinnes purchased by his bloud This hath he published by the Gospell to all that repent and beleeue in him For confirmation heereof he hath put to his Sacrament as a seale thereby to deliuer after a sort and to put into our hands the thing which
he hath promised euen as hee who hath receiued a seale presumeth that thereby hee hath in effect the thing that is sealed vnto him And shall a man say that Christ in giuing vs this seale hath bequeathed to vs no other but a figure a signification or representation of somwhat and not the thing it selfe that is represented thereby If it be absurd to say so in humane testaments and wils what meaneth M. Bishop to transferre such an absurditie to those things that are diuine I need not stand vpon this matter I say briefly that it is idle to say that the Sacrament is the chiefest legacie that Christ hath bestowed vpon vs. He hath bequeathed vnto vs himselfe the fruit of his passion the riches of his grace the inheritance of eternall life which hee will vndoubtedly giue to euerie true beleeuer and in the meane time hath giuen his Sacrament to bee to our faith the pledge and assurance thereof And thus M. Bishop telleth vs that he is come at length to the end of his booke wherein I ghesse he hath taken small ioy because he hath quite left out the middle euen whole twelue questions handled by M. Perkins and which he notwithstanding pretendeth to haue answered as hath beene before obserued We are beholding to him for that he giueth vs leaue if any thing heerein bee amisse to impute it partly to his slender skill ouersight or negligence And surely what betwixt his slender skill one way and his ouersight and negligence another way he hath sent vs so many things amisse as that the Reader hath small cause heereby to bee confirmed in that which he by a wrong name calleth the true Catholike faith Thou hast gentle Reader what hee can say on the one side thou hast what I haue had to answer on the other side it is now left to thee to iudge of both which so doe as being thy selfe to giue answer of thy iudgement to Christ the Iudge of all AN ADVERTISEMENT for the time concerning Doctor Bishops Reproofe lately published against a little peece of the Answer to his Epistle Dedicatory to the King With an answer to some few exceptions taken against the same by M. TH. HIGGONS lately become a Proselyte of the Church of Rome 1 THou maiest well remember gentle Reader that it was full three yeeres in February last since I published an answer to Doctor Bishops Epistle to the Kings Maiesty whom he had thereby solicited to entertaine the now-Romane religion pretending many great and waighty reasons that it should be expedient and necessary for him so to doe Wherein how vnfaithfully and vndutifully he demeaned himselfe towards his liege and Soueraigne Lord seeking by false glosses and colours very trecherously to abuse him I was carefull in the said answer to make it plainly to appeare for the satisfaction of all who in that behalfe were desirous to be satisfied With what conscience of fidelity and truth I haue carried my selfe in all that businesse from the beginning hitherto it is knowen to God who shall be both M. Bishops Iudge and mine and doth appeare to them who without preiudice or forstalled opinion doe take knowledge of the cause betwixt him and me That to M. Bishop himselfe it seemeth not so it is no wonder because by ouerstudying himselfe in the schooles of Rome he is growen squint-eied and can see nothing aright or rather hood-winketh himselfe that he may not see that which indeed he doth see By reason whereof it commeth to passe with him as in the like case with the rest of his consort which Saint Augustine said of the Donatists long agoe a August con epist Parmen lib. 1. cap. 7. Cum eos obmutescere compellit veritas tamen silere non permittit iniquitas Though truth compelleth them to be dumbe yet iniquity suffereth them not to be silent They see themselues ouermastred in the cause but a state they haue to maintaine and somewhat they must say for it whether it be right or wrong From this iniquity it hath proceeded that M. Bishop though conuicted in his conscience that the answer aforesaid was such as that howsoeuer in some things he might cauil at it yet in the maine he could not tell by any meanes how to contradict it yet that he might from his Romish masters receiue the thankes which vpon an infamous ouerthrow and losse of a whole army Terentius Varro receiued by the policy of the Romane senat b Liu Decad. 3. lib. 2 in fine Quòd de rep non desperasset For that he had not despaired of the state of their common-wealth he would make shew by writing some kind of reply be it what it might be to carry still a courage and no whit to distrust the quarrell that he had taken vpon him to defend This is the drift of his Reproofe which he hath lately published which goeth abroad amongst his complices vnder a name and with an applause that I am answered I am now answered as if he had made me some great answer whereas if wee respect them aine question and controuersie of religion saue onely that he hath giuen a snatch at one or two points by the way hee hath written whether it may be said he hath answered it resteth further to be considered onely to foure sections of my first booke the second third fourth and seuenth which he hath inched out with enlarging sundry retorsions and matters of discourse and diuers silly excuses and defences of the traiterous speeches and practises of himselfe and his confederates against the King and the State in answering the Epistle Dedicatory and Preface to the Reader and the first and thirty foure sections but the maine substance of the booke concerning the suggestions and motiues by him pleaded to peruert the King he hath by a figure of preterition quite let goe c Reproofe pag. 259. 286. remitting the points thereof to be handled ad calendas Graecas in their proper questions because hee was loth forsooth first lightly to skimme them ouer in hast as I had done and afterward to recoile and turne backe to them againe 2. But hee should haue remembred that hee wrot that Epistle to his Prince and Soueraigne where being charged to haue dealt perfidiously with his most excellent Maiesty and to haue very leaudly attempted to abuse him with many falsehoods and lies with many broken and lame conclusions and that he could not make good that which he had written he should haue thought that whatsoeuer became of the rest of his booke it concerned him in all loialty and duty to yeeld to his Maiesty a speciall and cleere iustification of that Epistle Againe he knew wel that there were many points handled by occasion of his Epistle which belong not to any question after ensuing and that the rest though handled other where yet being heere written to the King were to be answered by me and therefore maintained by him in the same nature wherein they were written
and would he then thus like a micher steale away from all and leaue the chiefe and principall matters of his suggestion without succour or defense I had often said and he hath now verified it that either he would not reply at all or else would doe it in that patching sort as he hath now done And surely had not I my selfe ministred vnto him the matter whereupon hee hath framed his Reproofe without any necessity thereof arising out of his Epistle I should haue gone for this time without any reproofe at all Vpon mention made of the Catholike faith I tooke occasion further than I was compelled by him to insist vpon the name of Catholike and to shew their abuse thereof Vpon his appeale to the Romane Church when the same was in the best and most flourishing estate I tooke occasion of a comparison of the doctrine of the old and new Church of Rome by sundry sentences of the Bishops and other writers of that Church whereas it had beene sufficient for me to haue disprooued those instances whereby he tooke vpon him to prooue the same faith in both From these two points ariseth the whole substantiall part of his booke and had I omitted these in hard case had he beene for the writing of a booke for for defense of his owne allegations he had had nothing more to say Now gentle Reader to confesse to thee the truth I had determined so soone as time should serue by a speciall treatise to enlarge the said comparison and to remooue their exceptions which they haue to take against it and so more fully to describe The true ancient Romane Catholike What then hath M. Bishop in effect done by his Reproofe but onely giuen me further occasion to doe that that I had beforehand purposed to doe and to consider of sundry matters which happily otherwise not minding I might easily haue ouerpassed For the doing of this I must craue thy patience for a time because it is a matter that will require conuenient time but in the meane time to giue thee some satisfaction as touching that Reproofe I haue thought good by a short Aduerisement to make it appeare to thee that Foxes whelpes are all alike that M. Bishop is no changling but continueth in his proceeding the same man that he was in the beginning 3. And first I would haue thee to obserue what a terrible inscription he hath put in the forefront to fright owles and buzzards that they may keepe them in their corners and not come foorth to see the light A Reproofe saith he of M. Doct. Abbots Defence of the Catholike deformed by M. W. Perkins wherein his sundry abuses of Gods sacred word and most manifold misapplying and falsifying of the ancient Fathers sentences be so plainely discouered to the eie of euery indifferent Reader that whosoeuer hath any due care of his owne saluation can neuer heereafter giue him more credit in matter of faith and religion But not contented heerewith to bombast this skar-crow to the full and to cause the greater terrour taking occasion belike by my comparing him and his fellow Wright to Iannes and Iambres he vnderwriteth to that title the words of the Apostle d 2. Tim. 3.8 As Iannes and Iambres resisted Moses so these men also resist the truth men corrupted in minde reprobate concerning the faith but they shall prosper no further for their folly shall be manifest to all as theirs also was Now is not this a horrible coniuration Gentle Reader and sufficient to make any mans haire to stare Wouldest thou not imagine heereby that there should be cause to cry out vpon me yea to hang me vp for abusing Scriptures and fathers and beguiling the world in such sort as he pretendeth But stay I pray thee a while remember that losers must haue their words and they will crie lowdest that smart most neither doth any thing in being handled make so importunate a noise as the filthy swine doth Saint Austine saith rightly that e August de ciu dei lib. 5. cap. 27. Non ideò plus potest vanitas quà m veritas quia si voluerit etiam plus potest clamara quà m veritas vanity is not therefore stronger than truth because if it list it can cry louder than truth Thou knowest that naughty drabs when they are reprooued for their leaud and vnhonest life doe set themselues with all bitternesse and violence to deuise and frame words and termes to gall and disgrace them by whom they are reprooued Thou maiest well conceiue that the greatest occasion of suspicion lieth on his part who like the silly wood-cocke that thrusteth his head into a hole and leaueth his body to be beaten till both head and all be dead so after three yeeres space leauing the whole body of his Epistle vndefended thrusteth himselfe into one corner of a booke there for a time to shrowd himselfe till his head being crushed in that corner also he shall haue no place left further to yeeld him breath But that thou maiest see from what spirit that title of his booke hath proceeded I haue thought good heere to examine the whole matter of his preface wherein he taketh vpon him to iustifie the same and professeth to haue said so much therein f Page 11. as may suffice to discredit me with all indifferent men Marke well I pray thee the matters which he bringeth consider well the waight and the truth of them and then take knowledge of some other obseruations that I shall giue thee concerning the whole book 4. His Preface he beginneth artificially according to a precept of Rhetoricke which teacheth a man g Quintil. Orator institut lib. 5. cap. 13. Haec simulatio hucusque procedit vt quae dicendo refutare non possumus quasi fastidiendo calcemus a dissembling tricke that what he cannot confute he shall seeme scornefully to reiect and trample vpon He telleth his Reader concerning mine answer that h Pag. 3. he found so little substance in it that a long time he was vnwilling to reply vpon it and could not thinke the time well bestowed which should be spent in so friuolous and vaine altercation Aquil◠non capit muscas The Fox would none And in this veine the man much pleaseth himselfe hauing much in his mouth my i Pag. 45. vnlearned writings k Pag. 94. more meet to stop mustard-pots than likely to stop any meane scholars mouth He calleth me l Pag. 86. shallow and shuttle witted m Pag. 16. one of the most shallow and beggerliest writers of these daies n Pag. 52. one of the shallowest for substance of matter that euer he read and o Pag. 40. if saith he there lie more marrow and pith hidden in my writing than one at the first sight would perhaps suppose spectatum admissi risum teneatis then surely it doth require a man of more substance than he though of lesser shew yea p Pag. 47. if
obed cap. Vâ—am sanctam De ecclesiastica potestate verificatur vatietnium Ieremiae Ecce constitui te hodie c. Decretall of Boniface the eight and M. Bishop with a wile slily passeth by them and telleth me that I lie saying withall that the common opinion of all their Diuines is to the contrary whereas a number of their Diuines haue published it to the world that God hath setled the power of all kingdomes immediatly in the Pope and that the further disposing of them belongeth to him as is to be seene in the a Large Examination of M. Blackwell pag. 27. 28. c. examination of M. Blackwell the Arch-priest by many of their speeches to that effect some of the bookes being approoued and printed in Rome as containing nothing contrary to the Catholike faith The fift lie saith he that he maketh within the compasse of lesse than halfe a side is that the Pope saith By me Kings raigne whereas notwithstanding the Pope saith expresly concerning the Emperour b Auentin vt supra Per not imperat By me he raigneth and I further quoted the place where he doth say so in his booke of ceremonies which he suppresseth as shal appeare anon Now doest thou not thinke gentle Reader that this man hath a great facility in obiecting lies And this is his maner thorowout his whole booke whilest as the drunken man cried fire fire when he saw but the rednesse of his owne nose so doth he cry out euery while a lie a lie when the lie is no other but a giddy apprehension of his owne distempered braine being with anger growen so farre into melancholy that he thinketh euery straw that lieth in his way to be a lie And indeed we know by experience how the subtil thiefe when he is pursued crieth out with all his might stop the thiefe stop the thiefe that whilest he seemeth to cry after another he himselfe may not be taken to be the thiefe So it is with M. Bishop who in policy crieth out vpon me a lier a lier that he in the meane time may lie freely and no man may suspect him But who the lier is the processe shall declare and let him receiue the shame that belongeth therto In the meane time whereas for reprochfull words he hath applied to me those words of Saint Paul c Rom. 3.13 Their throat is an open sepulcher with their tongues they deale deceitfully the venime of serpents is vnder their lips their mouth is full of malediction and bitternesse c. I wish him to consider whether it touch him which is written d Rom. 2.21 Thou which teachest another teachest thou not thy selfe And againe e Luk. 19.22 Out of thine owne mouth will I iudge thee thou euill seruant Consider him I pray thee gentle Reader thorowout his whole booke and thinke with thy selfe whether he be not in this behalfe a sit master for me to be instructed by As touching that he saith that f Pag. 5. if I hold that course of scurrility I shall driue him to giue me ouer in the plaine field I wonder not thereat not for that I giue him cause by any scurrility of mine to leaue the field but for that hee seeth a necessity thereof by the badnesse and wretchednesse of a leaud and vnhonest cause which hee seeth himselfe vnable to defend 6. His next quarrell is that I cite for confirmation and proofe of any doubt our owne writers Bale Fox Iewel Humphrey Holinshed and such other Now if I doe so then I am a foole but if I doe not so then what is he Some of them whom he nameth haue compiled stories of former times collecting what they haue found recorded by others that were before them whose stories standing vncontrolled is it not as lawfull for me to cite as it is for Bellarmine and the rest of his fellowes to cite g Tert. Parsons Respo ad Apolog. pro iuram fidelit Baronius the Cardinall Blondus the Popes secretary Genebrard h Bellarmin de notis eccles cap. 14.15.16 c. Surius Cochleus Staphylus yea Bolsecke a very infamous runnagate and rakeshame and such other of the like stampe or for M. Higgons so often to cite i Motiues Pag. 44. 75. 78. Parsons his three Conuersions or for Parsons there to cite k Three Conuers pa. 2. cha 10. Examen of Fox his calendar chap. 16. passim Waldensis Antoninus Genebrad Surius Prateolus Sanders and such like yea to report what he list vpon hearesay from l Ibid chap. 12. sect 15. Sir Francis Inglefield or for M. Bishop to cite m Of Images sect 20. Bellarmine n Preface 2. part sect 13. Caluino-turcismus o Answer to the Aduer sect 10. Conrad p Ibid. sect 46. Ludolph q Of Traditions sect 16. Gregory Martin yea to report to vs a matter out of r Preface 2. part sect 8. a conference at Paris vpon his owne word yea to write vs a whole booke as he hath done vpon the credit of Bellarmine and some other of his owne side Surely we haue no cause to doubt but that those writers of ours in their relations are men of as great honesty and fidelity as any of theirs though I alledge from them matters of history and fact or doe perhaps cite a sentence of an author mentioned by one or other referring the Reader to the reporter because I haue not the prime authours workes at hand to search the original of it yet very childishly doth M. Bishop conclude heereof that I make their word a confirmation or proofe for any point of faith because I respect not at all what they say but what they haue said or done whose doings or sayings they report and their report I cannot but take to be true so long as I see M. Bishop can say nothing for the disproofe of it Thus haue I alledged out of Å¿ Answer to the epistl sect 4. pag. 26. Holinshed the epistle of Eleutherius Bishop of Rome to Lucius King of Britaine not to prooue any matter of question by Holinsheds word what wizard would so conceiue but to shew by Eleutherius what the duty of a King is towards the Church of God What a iest is this saith M. Bishop how knew this late writer what passed so long before his owne time But I pray thee gentle Reader put the like question to him He telleth thee in great sadnesse that t Reproofe Pag. 248. amongst many other pardons granted by S. Gregory whereof he cannot tell one there is to be seene vntill this day one altar by him erected in the Monastery of S. Andrews in Rome whereat whosoeuer saith Masse for a soule in Purgatory shall deliuer a soule from thence Say now to him What a iest is this how knoweth M. Bishop a new vpstart writer what passed so long before his owne time Would he not thinkest thou take pepper in the nose if a
led by them who thus grosly abuse you and noteth in the margent Doct. Abbot against Doct. Bishop part 2. in fine These words I vsed to withdraw M. Bishop from the Romish religion and yet M. Higgons thought that without offense he might take my words to serue him for an answer why he had now embraced the same presuming it to be the custome of all writers to take words euen out of the aduersaries mouth and to retort them vpon himselfe how ill he hath done it I will not heere say Now therefore in like sort though Saint Bernard had beene mine aduersary professedly writing against me yea though the words had beene M. Bishop words yet nothing could let but that thereby I might thus expresse the benefit of answering their bookes that to vse M. Bishops words though the heretike arise not from his filth yet the Church may be confirmed in the faith But the words as they are deliuered by Saint Bernard doe serue fully and directly to that purpose whereto I applied them He handleth that which is said in the Canticles l Cant. 2.15 Take vs the Foxes where by m Bernard in Cant. Ser. 64. Vulpes haereses vel potius haereticos ipsos intelligamus Capiantur non armis sed argumentis quibus refellantur errores corum ipsi verò si fieri potest reconcilientur Catholicae reuocentur ad veram fidem c. Homo de ecclesia exercitatus doctus si cum haeretico homine disputare aggreditur ille intentionem suam dirigere debet quatenus ita errantem conuincat vt conuertat c. Nec propterea sanè nihil se egisse putet qui haereticum vicit conuicit haereses confutauit verisimilia a vero clarè aperteque distinxit c. nam etsi haereticus non surrexit de faece tamen ecclesia confirmatur in fide Foxes hee vnderstandeth generally all heretikes which annoy and trouble the Church of God whom he will haue to be taken not with weapons but with arguments whereby to refute their errours that so they may be reconciled to the Catholike Church and recalled to true faith He saith that he that disputeth with an heretike should propound to himselfe to conuince his errour that so he may conuert him and thereupon to take away all obiection of losing his labour therein he addeth that though he will not be conuerted yet hee that hath conquered and conuicted him is not to thinke he hath done no good for though the heretike saith he arise not from his filth yet the Church is confirmed in the faith which is fully answerable to the drift of my speech where I vsed the same words What will he tell vs that he is not the heretike and therefore the words are misapplied But then I will deride his folly that chargeth me with misapplication onely vpon his owne conceit of the point in question He saith I am the heretike I say that he is so He saith it only but prooueth it not but he himselfe standeth by me conuicted of many hereticall positions and doctrines deliuered in his epistle and otherwise in his booke so as that he cannot finde how to trauerse the euidence thereof Yea but S. Bernard in that very place describeth those heretikes to be such as denied Purgatory and praier for the dead c. But M. Bishop therein saith vntruly for Bernard in that place speaketh of heretikes in general as I haue shewed and therfore leaueth his words to be applied to M. Bishop who doth patronise and defend so many wicked and damnable heresies True it is that in the two sermons following he speaketh particularly of some heretikes in his time and noteth them for some points by M. Bishop set down as namely Purgatory and praier for the dead but those matters he bringeth in a great way after in the end of the second Sermon and we doubt whether for those onely without greater cause he would haue noted them for heretikes in as much as Petrus Cluniacensis Bernards equall doth testifie as the Centurists haue obserued n Magdeburg Centur. 12. cap. 5. pag. 839. Petrus Cluniacensis ter in ea ipsa epistola fatetur Catholicos quosdam de sacrificijs orationibus pro defunctis dubitare that some Catholikes did then doubt of sacrifices and praiers for the dead and consequently of Purgatory which dependeth thereon He noteth them for other points wherein they are more like to the Papists than to vs as namely first that o Bernard in Cantic ser 65. Firmauerunt sibi sermonem nequam Iura periura secretum prodere noli c. Quod immobili iure sancitū est non peierandum scilicet hoc tanquam indifferens pro sua voluntate dispensant they dispensed with themselues to sweare and forsweare for the concealing of their owne secrets as now the Iesuites and Priests by their equiuocation and mentall reseruation teach their pupils to do They p Ibid. Contubernio faeminarū nemo inter eos qui careat c. Vxornè tua Non inquit nam voto meo istud non conuenit ser 66. In operimentum turpitudinis cōtinentiae se insigniere voto porrò turpitudinem in solis existimant vxoribus reputandam vowed continency but yet would not be without the company of women yea their vow of continency was but for the couering of their filthines thereby forbearing marriage as vncleane but in the meane time committing fornication as Popish Priests and Votaries are accustomed to doe q Ibid. Quidam dissentientes ab alijs inter solos virgines matrimonium contrahi posse fatentur Some of them permitted the first marriage but the second marriage they held vnlawfull and the Church of Rome now denieth to it their sacramentall benediction They also condemned the eating of flesh as a thing vncleane as the Maniches did they thought they might euery day at their owne tables consecrate for themselues the body and bloud of Christ they derided the baptising of infants which things with other like were such as might iustly moue S. Bernard to inueigh against them And these things hee spake as he was aduertised concerning them of whom hee spake but whether hee were truely aduertised it may bee doubted because he himselfe saith that not onely r Ser. 66. in fine Non solum laici principes sed quidam vt dicitur de Clero necno◠de ordine Episcoporum eos sustinent Princes of the laity but some also of the Clergy and of the Bishops were fauourers of them which it is not likely they would haue beene if they had beene men so ill conditioned as he reporteth them howsoeuer he vpon an vnlikely rale impute it to their taking bribes of them As for those matters which M. Bishop nameth it is no wonder that Bernard liuing in a time of so great corruption and declination of Christian faith were somewhat intangled in the superstitions of that time wonder it is rather that in the
most materiall points therof which most neerely concerne our iustification and eternall life he continued so sincere and sound as we finde he did Who although he had a conceit that the church of Rome should not erre in faith as M. Bishop alleadgeth out of his Epistle to Innocentius yet if he liued now would disclaime that conceit because he should see the church of Rome oppugning that Doctrine of the imputation of righteousnesse by Christ which he maintaineth at large in that epistle as I haue Å¿ Of Iustification sect 6.8 before cited him in the handling of that point Yea in sundry points from place to place I haue shewed how Bernard fully accordeth with vs and condemneth the doctrine which the church of Rome hath since drawen out of the puddles of her owne schooles so that howsoeuer hee were misted with some superstitious fancies yet that letteth not but that by his iudgement M. Bishop is one of those heretikes against which hee would haue the church coÌ„firmed in the faith For his further censure of the Bishop church of Rome I refer the Reader to that which hath been before said in the second part pa. 70 72. For conclusion of this point I note how in answering my Epistle to the King he taketh the same exception of misapplication to two other sentences borrowed by mee from S. Austin The one is prefixed vnder the title of the booke t Answer to the Epistle ex August de ciu Dei lib. 2. cap. 1. Eorum dicta contraria si toties refellere velimus quoties obnixa fronte statuerunt non curare quid dicant dum quocunque modo nostris disputationibus contradicant infinitum esset If we would so often refute their gainsayings as they resolue with impudent faces not to care what they say so that they may in any sort contradict what we say there should be no end Forsooth S. Austin pronounced this against infidels and with what countenance could M. Abbot cite it against vs Christians which in S. Austins meaning concerneth vs not Forsoorth M. Bishop because S. Austins words of those Infidels do sitly expresse the dealings of such Christians as you be whâ—se peruersnesse and wilfull obstinacie in error is such 〈…〉 howsoeuer plainly your vntrueths be reprooue â—â—â—d conuinced yet you verifie of your selues those other words of S. Austin concerning other such Christians as you be u Aug. de bapt cont Donat. lib. 2. c. 13. Malunt peruersis vocibus veritati reluctari quà m confessis erroribus paci restitui They chuse rather with froward words to striue against the trueth than by the confession of their errors to be restored to Christian peace In the x Epist dedicat to the ansvver to Doct. Bishops epist other place mentioning M. Bishops threatning the King that if he did not yeeld to them God knowes what that forcible weapon of necessity would driue men vnto at length I said that they thereby verified in themselues that which S. Austin said of their predecessours the Donatists Where they cannot by slie and wily cosenage creepe like Aspes there with open professed violence they rage like Lions Heere M. Bishop noteth that both this sentence and the former out of Bernard I set downe in general not quoting the very place because I knew they made nothing for my purpose But I would haue him to note that I penned that Preface being from my bookes and though I did well remember the words yet I could not by memorie particularly note the place But the words he saith are not to my purpose because they were pronounced against the Donatists Yes they are therefore to my purpose because as they serued to expresse the vsage of the Donatists of old so they serue to set foorth the vsage of Popish Donatists and Circumcellions now S. Austin compareth heretikes to Aspes and telleth that y August in Psal 57. Aspides insidiosè volunt venena immittere spargere Aspes lurkingly seeke to thrust in their poison and to disperse the same This he applieth to the Donatists and declaring how Christian Emperours by barring them from the vse of Churches resisted them in that course he sheweth how these proceedings were iustified against the Donatists by the example of the Donatists dealings amongst themselues so as that their mouthes were stopped they had not to plead further for themselues z Ibid. Non est quod respondeant c. Ideoque vbi non possunt lubrica fallacia serpere vt aspides aperta violentia fremunt vt leones profiliunt saeuiunt armatae turbae Circumcellionum dant stragem quantam possunt And therefore saith he where they cannot by their wiles and subtilties creepe like Aspes to spread their poison being by lawes restrained from their wil there by open violence they rage like Lions the troupes of Circumcellions come foorth armed and they murther and kill all that they can Now doe not these words fitly agree to M. Bishop and his fellowes who because they cannot be suffered like Aspes to spread the poison of their hereticall corruptions do fall therefore to raging and threatning to practises of surprising and blowing vp with gunpowder and if they durst to open tumulting and in the meane time saying both M. Bishop and his father and fellow Parsons for they are both in one note that patience often prouoked is turned into furie heereby to imprint in their followers that it is no wonder being so hardly dealt with as they pretend that they take their opportunitie to play the Lions to rauen vpon them by whom they are so ill intreated that so howsoeuer they cleere it for the time as M. Bishop doth yet they may haue them in affection prepared when time shall serue though their * Reproofe pag 30. Parsons Answer to the Apologie for the oth of allegiance pag. vlt. eies I hope shall rotte the while and they shall neuer see it serue But heere is to be noted that he saith that those words may be applied to the Lutherans in Germany and Protestants in England But how I pray M. Bishop seeing S. Austin knew them not nor meant any thing of them He will haue it thought because the Lutherans and Protestants doe in like maner as the Donatists did But then M. Bishop I pray you vnderstand that the words of Austin concerning those Pagans and Donatists are not misapplied to you when you carrie your selfe in the like sort as did the Pagans and Donatists or else by your owne crooked rule you haue abused S. Austins words which you apply to me p Preface to the Reproofe pag. 16. ex August cont Gaudent lib. 1. cap. 19. Nihil affert praeter lassum quassum He bringeth nothing but what is weared and spent because Austin spake those words against Gaudentius the Donatist and I am not Gaudentius 9. Another tricke no lesse shamefull he obiecteth to me in misconstruing the words of the fathers He maketh it to
be but q Answer to the Epistle sect 12. pag. 103. 104. a fable of mine that Gregory the Bishop of Rome commended the zeale of Serenus Bishop of Massilia who could not endure that any thing should be worshiped that is made with hands or did tell him that he should forbid the people the worshipping of them But what will M. Bishop say that Gregory did Marry r Preface to the Reproofe pag. 8 he did not commend but reprehend the vndiscreet zeale of that Bishop who did breake some pictures set in the Church because some late conuerted heathens not yet well instructed in the Christian religion did adore them as if they had beene Gods Well let Gregory tell his owne tale and then doe thou gentle Reader iudge thereof Å¿ Greg. li. 7. ep 109. Indico dudum ad nos peruenisse quòd fraternità s vestra quosdam imaginum adoratores aspiciens easdem ecclesiae imagines confregit atque proiecit Et quidem zelum vos nequid manu factum adorari possit habuisse laudauimus sed frangere easdem imagines non debuisse iudicamus Iderirco enim pictura in ecclesiis adhibetur vt hi qui literas nesciunt saltem in parietibus videndo legant quae legere in codicibus non valent Tua ergò fraternitas illas seruare ab earum adoratu populum prohibere debuit quatenus literarum nescij haberent vnde scientiam historiae colligerent populus in picturae adoratione minimè peccaret I certifie you saith he to Serenus that it came of late to our hearing that your brotherhood beholding some worshipping images did breake the same Church-images and threw them away And surely I commended you that you had that zeale that nothing made with hands should be worshipped but yet I iudge that you should not haue broken those images for therefore is the picture vsed in the church that they who are not learned by booke may yet by sight read vpon the wals those things which they cannot read in bookes Therefore your brotherhood should both preserue the images and forbid the people the worshipping of them that both the ignorant may haue whence to gather the knowledge of the history and the people may not sinne in the worshipping of the picture In the other epistle written of the same matter he wisheth Serenus t Idem li. 9. ep 9. Conuocandi sunt dispersi ecclesiae filij eisque Scripturae sacrae est testimonijs ostendendum quia omne manufactum adorare non liceat quoniam scriptum est Dominum deum tuum adorabis illi soli seruies to gather together againe the Children of the Church who vpon offense of breaking those images had withdrawen themselues from him and to shew vnto them by testimonies of Scriptures that it is not lawfull to worship any thing that is made with hands because it is written Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God and him onely thou shalt serue Now compare the words of my answer with these words of Gregory and see whether I say any thing but what he saith Consider where thou maist finde those skiruie shifts of late conuerted heathens and of worshipping images as Gods seeing Gregory saith nothing of worshipping them as Gods but meerely and only of worshipping them affirming that worship by the testimony of scripture belongeth to God only Yea it is to be noted that M. Bishop himselfe confirmeth the same by the words of Gregory which he citeth but that I know not how he is blind and seeth not his owne way u Gregor ibid. Frangi non debuit quod non adorandum in ecclesiis sed ad instruendas solummodò menteâ— fuit nescientium collocatum Gregory saith he telleth him plainly that that should not be broken which was not set vp in the Church to be adored but onely to instruct the ignorant Marke what he saith only to instruct the ignorant Surely if they be set there to be worshipped then not onely to instruct the ignorant if onely to instruct the ignorant then they are not to be worshipped Therfore he absolutely opposeth the one to the other not to be adored but only to instruct the ignorant which cannot stand if it be true which M. Bishop saith that in any maner or meaning they be to be adored Yet he telleth vs that though S. Gregory forbid images to be adored as Gods yet doth he teach them to be worshipped as representations of most holy personages But how may this appeare Marry by his letters saith he to Secundinus to whom he sent the images of our Sauiour of the blessed Virgin Mary and of Peter and Paul It is true indeed that Secundinus sent to Gregory for the picture of Christ and Gregory sent it him signifying to him that his request did greatly please him because saith he thou louest him with all thy heart and whole intention whose image thou desirest to haue before thine eies Withall hee sent him those other pictures which M. Bishop speaketh of So then heere we haue pictures and images and thereof we make no scruple but we haue yet nothing for the worshipping of them For the affirming wherof M. Bishop heere very impudently abuseth his Reader by false translation For the words of Gregory are thus x Greg. lib. 7. ep 54 Scio quidem quòd imaginem saluatoris nostri non ideò petis vt quasi deum colas sed ob recordationem filij dei vt in eius amore recalescas cuius te imaginem videre consideras Et nos quidem non quasi ante diuinitatem ante illam prosternimur sed illuÌ„ adoramus quem per imaginem aut natum aut passum sed in throno sedentem recordamur dum nobis ipsa pictura quasi scriptura ad memoriam silium dei reducit animuÌ„ nostrum aut de resurrectione latificat aut de passione demulâ—et I know verily that thou doest not therefore desire the image of our Sauiour that thou maiest worship it as God but for a remembrance of the sonne of God that thou maiest become feruent in his loue whose image thou considerest thy selfe to behold And we verily fall not downe before it as before the Godhead but we worship him whom by the image we remember either as borne or hauing suffered or now sitting vpon his throne And whilest the picture as it were a writing bringeth to our remembrance the Sonne of God either it reioyceth our minde as touching his resurrection or appeaseth it by his passion Now wheras Gregory saith We doe not fall downe or cast downe our selues before it as before the Godhead M. Bishop readeth We doe cast downe our selues before the said Image not as before a Godhead And so he vnderstandeth the former words Thou worshippest the image but thou doest not worship it as a God taking the particle as to import a distinction of the variety of worship which is onely an exemplification of the propriety thereof For Gregory hath no
meaning to instruct Secundinus to worship the image or to kneele to it which we see before is the thing he wholly condemneth but willeth him to vnderstand that these deuotions belong to God onely and therefore that he must beware not to put the image in the place of God to doe to it those duties of religious humiliation which are proper to God alone For as when I say of another man I will not kneele to him as to the king I doe not meane that I will kneele to him though not in that maner as to the king but whereas of dutie I kneele to the king I will not kneele to him so when Gregory saith to Secundinus that he is not to worship the image as God or to kneele before it as before God he meaneth not that hee is to worship the image or kneele before it though not in that maner as before God but that this duty belongeth onely to God and is not to be performed to the image And that this may appeare to be Gregory his true meaning and not any glosse of mine it is vndeniably confirmed by Gregory himselfe where for conclusion of his instructions giuen to Serenus for the quieting of his people he saith thus y IdeÌ„ l. 9. ep 9. Si quis imagines facere voluerit minimè prohibe adorare verò imaginâ—â— omnibus modis deuita sed hoc solicitè fraternitas tua admoneat vt ex visione rei gestae ardorem compunctiunis percipiant in adoratione solius omnipotentis sanctae Trinitatis humilitèr prosternantur If any man will make images forbid him not but by all meanes auoid the worshipping of images but this let your brotherhood carefully aduertise them by the sight of the story to gather feruency of compunction but humbly to fall downe or kneele in the worship of the holy Trinity onely Now if he so forbid the worshipping of images as that he reserueth kneeling or casting downe our selues onely to the worship of the holy Trinity let it be esteemed with what conscience it is that M. Bishop saith that he approoueth the worshipping of images euen so farre foorth as to kneele before them Albeit out of the very words themselues the thing is manifest for if Gregory had intended that images though they were not to be worshipped as Gods yet were in other sort to be worshipped hee would by the aduersatiue haue opposed worship to worship to expresse what that sort of worship should be whereas now he setteth worship on the one side and onely remembrance on the other side not to worship but for remembrance not to fall downe before it but to worship Christ whom we remember by it still appropriating worship to God but attributing nothing to the image saue to be put in minde thereby of him whom it doth represent Surely a senslesse thing it is to imagine that hee who would not haue images to be worshipped as gods and yet would haue them to be worshipped should neuer direct in what sort they should be worshipped but teach absolutely as we haue seene by all means to auoid the worshipping of them M. Bishop saith that he hath diuers other places to make good that meaning of Gregory but he abuseth his Reader therein hee hath not one place more whereby to make any shew of it and therfore I hope it plainly appeareth that I haue not wrongfully alleaged Gregories words but haue iustly affirmed that he in this point directly crosseth the doctrine and practise of the now-church of Rome 10. In the next place he chargeth me with the falsifying of Epiphanius which yet he could not hansomely do but that he must first play a false tricke with me The originall of this matter is from Hierome who inueighing against certaine bishops of Spaine as I take it for that they would admit none to be priests or deacons except they were first married detesting as it seemeth the horrible fruits of forced single life alleageth in preiudice of them the examples of other Churches namely the Churches of the East none else saue onely the Churches of Egypt and Rome Against this allegation of Hierome concerning the Easterne Churches I say z Answer to the Epistle sect 8. pag. 62. that Socrates who wrote his storie within lesse than twentie yeeres after the death of Hierom a Socrat. hist lib. 5. cap. 21. Id adeò cùm omnes illustres presbyteri in Oriente episcopi etiaÌ„ modò ipsi voluerint nulla lege coacti ab vxoribus abstineant nam non pauci illorum dum episcopatum gerunt etam liberos ex vxore legitima procreant affirmeth of those Easterne Churches which Epiphanius also an Easterne Bishop euen in the time of Hierome of some parts thereof acknowledgeth that the Priests and Bishops thereof were not forced by any law to forbeare their wiues and that many of them whilest they were Bishops had children borne vnto them of their lawfull married wiues Now marke I pray thee gentle Reader the bad dealing of this vntowardly wrangler for whereas I rest the maine report heereof vpon Socrates to Socrates he saith nothing standing conuicted heereby that all the * Omnes illustres presbyteri famous Priests of the East and the Bishops also at their discretion had their wiues and being bishops did beget children of them Againe whereas I alleage Epiphanius onely as a party-witnesse he peruerteth my words as if I made him a witnesse of the whole Hee setteth downe my words thus Epiphanius an Easterne bishop saith M. Abbot euen in the time of Hierome acknowledgeth for true those words of Socrates that the Priests and Bishops thereof were not forced by any law to forbeare their wiues c. whereas I say by a parenthesis only thus which Epiphanius also an Easterne Bishop euen in the time of Hierome of some parts thereof acknowledgeth The difference is this that whereas Socrates affirmeth the matter generally of the East I alleage Epiphanius testifying it onely of some places thereof though not concerning bishops as M. Bishop excepteth yet concerning Priests and Deacons which was sufficient for my purpose because Hierome against whom I obiected it spake onely of Priests and Deacons Albeit he doth not wholly except Bishops because saying that b Epiphan haer 59. sed adhuc viuentem liberos gignentem vntus vxoris virum non suscipit c. diaconum presbyerum episcopum hypodiaconum maxime vbi synceri sunt canones ecclesiastici the Church receiueth not amongst the rest a bishop that liueth still the husband of one wife and begetteth children he addeth this limitation specially where the ecclesiasticall Canons be syncere or exact Hee denieth not then but that bishops also were married and begat children but he excepteth that it was not so where the ecclesiasticall Canons were syncere and exact Vpon this he addeth c Ibid. At dices mihi omninò in quibusdam locis adhuc liberos gignere presbyteros
modò in Graecum idioma conuersi sunt sed in Romanam quoque linguam Aegyptiam c. semelque vt dicam in linguas â—mnes quibus omnes gentes in hunc diem vtuntur that the bookes of the old Testament were translated noâ— onely into the Greeke tongue but also the Latine Aegyptian Persian Indian Armenian Scythian all tongues which all Nations vsed at that time But of that that Beda saith that the Latine tongue by meditation of the Scriptures became common to the rest M. Bishop maketh a very poore and simple collection that they needed not to haue learned the Latin tongue for the studying of the Scriptures if the Scriptures had beene translated into their owne mother languages As if he should say that because we haue the scriptures now translated into our English tongue therefore we need not for the studying of the Scriptures learne the Latine Greeke and Hebrew tongues The absurdity of which connexion is such as that we may thinke M. Bishop out of his wits that would so much disgrace himselfe as to be the authour of it 14. Another notorious vntruth and most malicious slander he saith I cast out against Austin the Moonke whom he tearmeth our English Apostle of whom I say in my answer that t Answer to the Epistle sect 31. p. 198. he being offended at the bishops of the Britons for that they refused to be subiect to his Romish authority prouoked against them Ethelbert then King of Kent by whose procurement an army of Infidels was sent to slay them who cruelly and vnmercifully performed the slaughter not sparing them who in their shirts came foorth to them to intreat mercy For the iustifying wherof he saith I can produce no ancient authour but am glad to shroud my selfe vnder an old namelesse Chronicle cited by the Arch-liar and late partiall writer Iewel I doe not maruell that Bishop Iewel in his reckoning is a liar because he knoweth that where Bishop Iewel is not taken for a liar there he and his fellowes must be accounted so to be But as touching the story if his eies had serued him he might haue seene that I cited not the old Cronicle onely alleaged by Bishop Iewel but also Galfridus Monumetensis whom in the beginning of that narration I quoted as a witnesse therof who out of the ancient British story reporteth that u Galfrid Monumetens lib. 11. cap. 12. Augustino petenti ab Episcopis Britonibus subiectionem c. Dinoâ—t diuersis argumentationibus ipsos ei nullam subiectionem debere respondit Et. c. 13. Edelbertus rex Cantiorum vt vidit Britones dedignantes subiectionem Augustino facere c. hoc graâ—issime ferens EdelfriduÌ„ regem Northanumbrorum caeteros regulos Saxonum instimulauit vt collecto grandi exercitu in ciuitatem Bangor Abbatem Dinoot caeteros Clericos qui eos spernerent perditum irent c. Edelfridus ciuitate capta cuÌ„ intellexisset causam aduentus MonachoruÌ„ vt pro salute populi sui orarentâ— iussit in eos primum arma verti et sic mille duâ—enti corum in ipsa die martyrio decorati regni caelestis adepti sunt sedem in the city of Bangor there was a most noble Church of 1200. Monks all liuing with the labour of their hands Their Abbot was named Dinoâ—ch a man maruellously well learned who by diuers arguments made it appeare when Austin required the Bishops to be subiect vnto him that they ought him no subiection Edelbert therefore the King of Kent assoone as he saw them refuse to yeeld obedience to Austin and despise his preaching sturred vp Edelfride other princes of the Saxons to gather a great army and to goe to Bangor to destroy Dinoochand his Clergy Who taking the city commanded the swords of his men to be turned first vpon the Monks and so twelue hundred of them the same day decked with Martyrdome entred the kingdome of heauen By which record it is plaine that though that slaughter were not committed by Ethelbert as M. Bishop saith yet by the procurement of Ethelbert as I affirmed it was done Albeit our English Chronicle cited x Defence of the Apology part 5. in the beginning by M. Iewell deliuereth that both the Kings Ethelbert and Edelfride ioyned their power together and so the murther was committed by them both Austin also meeting them at Leicester as they were going to the place where that act was done Moreouer he citeth a Chronicle written in French by one y Ibid. Thomas Gray aboue two hundred yeeres agoe wherein it is said that Austin being so refused of the Bishops and other learned of the Britans made such complaint thereof to Ethelbert King of Kent that foorthwith he leuied his power and marched against them and slew them in most cruell wise hauing no more regard of mercy then a woolfe hath vpon a sheep So then it should seeme that neither Austin nor Ethelbert were free of that bloudy and cruell murther howsoeuer M. Bishop doe his good will to cleere them both Yea by that which Beda reporteth it may be well coniectured that Austins hands were not free of it for that he threatned them when he saw they would not yeeld to him z Beda hist li. 2. cap. 2. fertur minitans praedixisse quòd si pacem cum fratribus accipere nollent bellum ab hostibus forent accepturi that if they would not accept of peace with their brethren they should finde warre of their enemies But it may better be coniectured by the same answer as in two written Cronicles in the Library of Baliol Colledge in Oxford it is expressed where it is not they should finde warre of their enemies but * Polychron magn Polychron Monachi Cistrensis Quòd qui pacem cum fratribus accipere nollent bellum ab eisdem forent accepturi if they would not accept of peace with their brethren they should ab eisdem of them or from them finde warre and reuenge plainely importing that he himselfe would procure the same For whereas M. Bishop alleageth out of Beda that Austin was dead and buried many yeeres before that slaughter happened Bishop Iewel sheweth that therein they haue for Austins credit falsified the Latine story of Beda because by Beda translated by Alfred seuen hundred yeeres agoe into the Saxon tongue the contrary plainely appeareth that Austin after that slaughter was aliue Yea he produceth a Charter of the Church of Canterbury yet extant and to be seene which was granted and confirmed by King Ethelbert and by Austin accepted and subscribed the same yeare that that was done whereby it is without all controuersie manifest and cleere that it is false which M. Bishop saith that Austin was dead many yeares before And for some further coniecture of this matter I wil not omit to note out of Doct. Powell his history of Wales certaine verses of that famous and renowmed Poet Ambrosius Telesinus or Taliessin surnamed in his time
authour of that discourse was not Proclus but Methodius which being approoued by Epiphanius my former speech is iustified that these two ancient godly Bishops Methodius and Epiphanius did teach as the Protestants doe that sinne is not vtterly rooted out or taken away by baptisme but continueth in the regenerate so long as this life continueth And now I pray you M. Bishop to tell vs whether you or I be more woorthy to be thrust into the Asses skinne and whether you haue not giuen vs iust cause to doubt that you are so hide-bound therewith as that it will very hardly be pulled from you Surely we shall thinke you are no Asse if you giue vs many more such tokens of your discretion and honesty as you haue done heere 17. To returne now to his preface againe he telleth his Reader that * Pag. 11. if he would make a Catalogue of M. Abbots corruptions falsifications and other odde trickes he should hither reduce the gretest part of his booke but this that I haue heere declared saith he cannot but suffice to discredit him with all indifferent men But in thee gentle Reader the iudgement resteth whether he haue said any thing to cast discredit vpon me or whether he hath not rather heaped shame and confusion vpon his owne head Surely he that thus crieth out with a wide mouth of falsifications and corruptions and in a whole booke can bring no better proofes or examples thereof than he hath heere done doth exceedingly iustifie his aduersary and plainly declare that his outcry is not vpon occasion but onely by deuice If saith he he hath wittingly misreported such woorthy authours of purpose to beguile the credulous Reader then he hath a most seared and corrupt conscience vnwoorthy the name of a Diuine and walking aliue is dead in conscience and consequently in credit with all men that loue the truth for the tongue that lieth killeth the soule Be it so I willingly subscribe the sentence the doome is iust and let it so befall to him that dealeth in that sort His vntruthes saith he are so plaine and palpable that you need no more but compare his reports with the authours words and at first sight any meane scholar shall finde his cosinage and deceit But therefore haue I now set downe the authours words which he hath not done and thereby the Reader shall see where the cosinage and deceit is He professeth to haue read the places if he haue done that himselfe which he imputeth to me he hath pronounced his owne doome if God giue him not grace to repent wo be vnto him and better had it beene for him that he had neuer been borne We are come now he saith to the last kind of abuse offered by me to the sacred Senate of those most renowmed ancient fathers And what is that forsooth to deny their authority flatly to controll and censure them as simple men to accuse them of errour and falsehood yea and to preferre the opinions of old rotten heretikes before them and heerein he saith I do most ingenuously discouer the right humour of a true Protestant But I must tell him that the Protestants make more true account of the ancient fathers and doe yeeld them more honour than the Papists doe The Protestants giue all authority to the ancient Fathers saue where the Fathers are ouer-ruled by the word of God The Papists ouer-rule the Fathers by their owne Decrees and the will and pleasure of a buzzardly Pope or of a few blind Bishops depending vpon him must be with them of more account and reckoning than all the Fathers of the Church They doubt not plainly to say that x 24. q. 1. Quotiescunque contra Papae authoritatem nec Augustinus nec Hieronymus nec aliquis Doctorum suam sententiam defendit neither Austin nor Hierome nor any of the Doctours may maintaine his opinion against the authority of the Pope I haue before noted a speech of theirs generally of the Fathers y Index Expurgat Belg. in censur Bertrami Cum in Catholicis veteribus alijs plurimos feramus errores extenuemus excusemus excogitato commento persaepè negemus commodum ijs sensum affingamus dum opponuntur in disputationibus aut inconflictionibus cum aduersarijs In the old Catholike writers we beare with very many errours but we extenuate and lessen them we excuse and make the best of them by some deuised shift we often deny them or set some good meaning on them when they are opposed in disputations or in combates with our aduersaries What and will a Papist now say that there are errours in the Fathers Yes forsooth where the Fathers speake as the Protestants doe there the Fathers must be said to erre yea in very many things and then their authority must be flatly denied they must be censured for simple men accused of errour and falshood and the opinions both of old and new heretikes must bee preferred before them But let vs see in particular of whom he speaketh The first is Eusebius that most famous Historiographer as he calleth him of whom I vse these words z Answer to the epist sect 26. pag. 177. Let him giue me leaue to censure Eusebius a little because the Canons of their owne Church haue censured him much more And what is the censure whereof I spake No lesse than this that a Gelas 1. Decret de Apocryph dist 15. sancta Romana Historia Eusebij Pamphili apochrypha c. Haec omnia his similia c. non solum repudiata verumetiam ab omni Romana Catholica Apostolica ecclesia eliminata atque cum suis authoribus in aternum confitemur esse damnata his story by Gelasius Bishop of Rome with seuenty other Bishops is pronounced Apocryphall and it selfe with the authour abandoned with the rest out of the whole Romane Catholike and Apostolike Church which censure I noted to haue beene by Gratian also transcribed into their Decrees Now is this iudgement pronounced vpon Eusebius in the church of Rome and doth a Romanist thinke much that I touch Eusebius for an iniudicious presumed application of an act of Constantine and that when he himselfe giueth occasion to touch him therein confessing that Constantine said nothing thereof and declaring that Constantine at his death gaue occasion to conceiue the contrary Thus is Ruffinus charged by Bellarmine b Bellarm. de Rom. Pont. lib. 2. c. 13. falsa est expositio Ruffin with expounding falsely the Councell of Nice Socrates to be c Idem de cultu sanct ca. 10. Dico Socratem haereticum fuisse Nouatiamum neque eius testimonium in dogmatibus vllius esse momenti a Nouatianheretike and his testimony nothing worth in matters of doctrine Zozomen to be d Idem de Clericis cap. 20. ex Greg. l 6. ep 31. Ipsam historiā Sozomeni sedes Apostolica reciperc recusat quoniam multa mentitur c. a lier in many things which Gregory hath
noted of him and signified the reiecting of his story by the Church of Rome May they now thus at their pleasure reiect the ancient Historians of the Church and was it so hainous a matter for me to censure Eusebius being knowen to haue beene an Arian heretike for fathering vpon Constantine a superstition which it appeareth by himselfe he gaue him no occasion to conceiue of him 18. There followeth Chrysostome in the next place against whom Sixtus Senensis sticketh not to put in an exception that e Sixt. Senens Biblioth sanct l. 5. in Prafat Chrysostomus impetu disceptandicum Manichaeis Gentibus c. saeponumerò naturae nostrae vires plus aequo attollit by heat of reasoning against the Manicheeâ— and Heathens he doth often too much extoll the power of nature and Andradius condemning Origen of great errour for imputing sinne to the Virgin Mary saith that f Andrad Defens fidei Trident. l. 5. Neque ab hoc Origenis errato Chrysostomus plurimum abfuit c. Chrysostome was not farre from the same errour of Origen when he charged her with importunity and ambition for that shee interrupted her sonne as he was preaching Will they againe at their liberty thus tax Chrysostome and doe I offend in saying that g Answer to the epistle sect 25. pag. 175. as an Oratour hee apprehended a thing to speake according to present occasion which otherwise he approoued not when I giue plaine demonstration and proofe that it is so The place it selfe gentle Reader will satisfie thee neither need I to vse any defense of it So will the other also where I say of a speech of Chrysostome concerning Constantines sonne that h Ibid. pag. 176. howsoeuer it proceeded from him it is much different from the certaine story I show that it is so what a vaine brangler is hee to cauill at my words when as he is not able to controll the proofe 19. The next abuse that he noteth is to S. Austin wherin he plaieth Will Sommers part striking him that is next him but letting him alone by whom he himselfe is stricken My words are these i Answer to the Epistle sect 8. pa. 54. ex Erasm argument in lib. Hieronym aduers Ioninian Diuus Augustinâ—o errores quosdam confert in Iouinianum quos tamen illi non impingit Hieronymus vtique non dissimulaturus siquid tale docuisset c. Verùm apparet diuum Augustinum nec Iouiniani nec in hunc Hieronymi libros legisse tantum rumore populari didicisse quod nouerat de Iouiniano Erasmus obserueth truly that Austin chargeth Iouinian with some errours whereof Hierome maketh no mention who would not haue passed by them if Iouinian had taught them whereby it appeareth as he collecteth that Austin had neither read Iouinians bookes nor Hieromes bookes against Iouinian but onely by peoples rumours and talke had learned that that he knew concerning Iouinian I note what Erasmus collecteth Erasmus himselfe giueth reason of his so collecting and was not this a mortall abuse committed by me towards S. Austin that M. Bishop should say as he doth In like maner he slandereth S. Austin for writing against Iouinian whose opinions saith M. Abbot very audaciously S. Austin knew onely by hearesay and not of any certainty Doest thou not thinke he is well skilled in his art that can so well bombast such a quarrell as this is But there is forsooth another matter that I say Austin was deceiued where he said that no Priests imbraced Iouinians opinion And did I not prooue so much by Hierome himselfe that there were both Bishops Priests of the same minde Yea that the Clergy Monks of the church of Rome notwithstanding the sentence of Siricius then Bishop of Rome retained still their opinion that maried wiues are the same with God as Virgins are the thing is plaine and were M. Bishop so wise as he should be he would neuer trouble vs with such idle stuffe 20. I note Hierome k Ibid. pag. 54. for rude vndecent speeches against mariage He that will know whether he vsed any such or not let him read his epistle ad Gerontiam de Monogamia and his first booke against Iouinian in which his vsage is such in that behalfe as gaue occasion of great offence in Rome so as that the greatest part of his Apology to Pammachius is spent in excusing such speeches which notwithstanding to say the truth very slenderly hee doth That he wrot against Iouinian with l Pag. 57. all indignation and stomacke who doubteth that readeth what he wrot who seeth not that he laboured to the vttermost of his power to disgrace him against whom he wrot As for railing I mention it not by mine owne words but by the words of Erasmus who saith of him against Vigilantius m Answer to the epist sect 9. pag. 67. ex Erasm argum in lib. Hieron aduers Vigilantium In hunc ita conuicijs debacchatur Hieronymus vt plusculum in eo modestiae cogar desiderare Vtinam argumentu duntaxat egisset a conuicijs temperasset He doth so raile at him as that I cannot but wish that hee had shewed more modesty I would he had dealt by argument onely and had for borne railing speeches False doctrine I name not but if there be nothing false in Hierome how commeth it about that Bellarmine mentioning that n Bell. de Rom. Pont. lib. 1. c. 8. Videtur beatus Hieronymus inea sententia fuisse vt existimaret episcopoâ— esse presbyteris maiores iure ecclesiastico non diuino qua sententia falsa est suo loco refectetur Hierome seemeth to be of that opinion that Bishops by the law of God are not superiour to Priests saith that that opinion is false and he will afterwards refute it or how doth Alfonsus De Castro say that o Alphons de Castro aduers haeres l. 6. apud Sixt. Senens Biblioth sanct l. 6. annot 324. Non veretur fateri Hieronymum hac in parte errasse he doubteh not to confesse that Hierome in that behalfe erred as Sixtus Senenfis hath reported of him Thus it appeareth that I haue not taken exception against any father but that they themselues also except against the same as they doe also against the rest Of Iustinus Irenaeus Epiphanius Oecumenius Bellarmine saith p Bellarm. de sanct beatitud c. 6. Iustini Irenaei c. sententiam non video quo pacto possimus ab errore defendere I doe not see how we can defend their opinion from errour q Idem de Rom. Pont. l. 4. c. 7. Videtur mortalitèr peccasse cùm praecepto expresso Apostolico non paruerit Cyprian he saith seemeth to haue sinned mortally for that he obeied not the expresse commandement of the Bishop of Rome In another case he saith r Ibid. cap. 8. Respondeo non esse omninò fidem habendam Tertulliano in hac parte quandoquidem ipse Montanista erat Tertullian
and that vnder the same pretence by which the Papists excuse their praying to Saints and Angels that we may not presume immediately to goe to God himselfe but must by them procure fauour and make way to him This superstition continued he saith in Phrygia and Pisidia They builded Oratories and Chapels in the names of the Angels whither they assembled themselues for the exercise of this deuotion This saith Theodoret was the thing which the Councell condemned Yea but see the Canon saith M. Bishop and you shall finde M. Abbots legerdemaine But why did not hee himselfe set downe the Canon Hee knew well that he wrot to them that would neuer see the Canon and doth he thus let the matter slip with See the Canon Be well assured gentle Rreader that he would neuer haue omitted to set downe the Canon if there had beene any thing in it either to helpe himselfe or to crosse me The Canon is this t Concil Lao. dicen c. 35. Quod non oportet Christianos relicta Dei ecclesia abire 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 angelos compellare vel congregationes facere quod est prohibitum Siquis ergò inuentus fuerit huie occultae idoloatriae vacare sit anathema quia reliquit dominum nostrum Iesum Christum accessit ad idoloiatriam That it behoueth not Christians forsaking Gods Church to goe and call to the Angels or to make assemblies which is forbidden if any man therefore be found to giue himselfe to this secret idolatry accursed be he because he hath forsaken our Lord Iesus Christ and hath resorted to idolatry Marke well the Canon I pray thee and see whether thou canst finde that I haue committed any legerdemaine or whether it be not rather one of M. Bishops trickes of legerdemaine thus to obiect the same to me that he in the meane time may be thought to be free from it with whom indeed is no other but legerdemaine The Councell plainly instructeth vs that to pray to angels is idolatry that the assemblies of those superstitious people to pray to Angels were assemblies of idolatry and that to forsake the Church to goe to pray to Angels is to forsake Christ and to repaire to idolatry leauing vs thereby consequently to vnderstand that to bring inuocation of Angels into the Church as the Papists haue done is to bring idolatry thereinto M. Bishop would make vs beleeue that the Councell meaneth not that it is vnlawfull to pray to Angels but so to pray to them as to forsake Christ and to prefer them before Christ whereas the Councell saieth not a word of preferring the Angels before Christ nor speaketh of forsaking Christ but it saith that to forsake the church to goe to pray to angels is to forsake our Lord Iesus Christ to runne to idolatry plainely resoluing that to pray to angels is idolatry and in no sort to be receiued in the Church of Christ We conclude therefore against M. Bishop that the Church of Rome in praying to angels doth commit idolatry and is not now all one with the ancient Church of Rome that did condemne the same This then is the aduantage that M. Bishop hath gotten by referring his Reader to the Canon that we are to account his talke of legerdemaine but as the preaching of the fox crying out vpon falsehood that he himselfe may the more securely practise it as I might further shew but that for a taste I haue said enough already by his answers concerning Carpocrates and Marcellina and concerning a Canon of the Councell of Gangra in the very same place 31. To shew his treacherie in citing antiquities one or two examples shall suffice To attribute vnto the Bishop of Rome a soueraigne power for the assembling of Councels he allegeth certaine words written by some Easterne bishops as to Damasus bishop of Rome u Reproofe pag. 176. By the commandement of letters sent the last yeere by your reuerence vnto the most roiall Emperour Theodosius we vndertooke the iourney euen to Constantinople whereas those words were not written to Damasus onely but also to Ambrose Britto Valerian Acholius Anemius Basil and other holy Bishops assembled in the citie of Rome neither are as he citeth By the commandement of letters c. but x Theodoret. hist. lib. 5. cap. 9. Concurreramus Constantinopolim ad vestrae reuerentiae literas post conciliū Aquileiēse missas Theodosio summa pietate Imperatori Vpon the letters of your reuerence sent after the councell of Aquileia to Theodosius the most religious Emperour we assembled together at Constantinople Did he heere meane any truth that would bring that as proper to the Bishop of Rome which was common to a whole Synod of Bishops and would translate letters of commandement where there appeareth nothing at all but that they were letters of request In the very next words he committeth the same fraud alleaging that in the Councell of Chalcedon the Bishops of Maesia writing vnto the Emperour Leo doe say that many holy bishops met together in the citie of Chalcedon by the commandement of Leo bishop of Rome who truely is the head of bishops whereas it is not there onely y Concil Chal. ced epist episcop Maesiae ad Leonem Imperat per iussionem Leonis Romani pontificis qui vere caput est episcoporum venerabilis sacerdotis patrairchae Anatolij concilio celebrato by the commandement of Leo bishop of Rome but it is added and of the reuerend Bishop and Patriach Anatolius so that Anatolius the Patriarch of Constantinople is made heere a commander as well as the bishop of Rome ech of them of those bishops which within their seuerall precincts and bounds were subiect vnto them and both by vertue of the Emperours writ as appeareth plainly for that z Ibid. Act. 1. Facta est synodus ex decreto fidelissimorum Imperatorum c. in Epist Concil act 3. Synodus secundum Dei gratiam sanctionem vestrae pietatu congregata the Councell is said to haue beene assembled by the Decree of the Emperours Valentinianus and Martianus and so in an Epistle to the said Emperours professeth it selfe by the grace of God and by their commandement to be there gathered together It were woorth the while but that I am loth heere to be ouer-long to declare how notably he abuseth his Reader concerning Tertullian and the Montanists I will for the time only note first that whereas I set downe Tertullians relation of the arguments vsed by the Catholike Church against him and the rest of his sect the knowledge whereof is very effectuall to giue light of iudgement concerning the point in hand he vnder a lying pretence that I haue * Reproofe pag. 222. 224. mangled them and peeced them together at my pleasure very trecherously suppresseth them as before I shewed he did in the very same sort the words of Methodius concerning originall sinne and secondly that he saith that a Ibid. pag. 223.
men iust occasion to detest him crying out of falsifying and corrupting of cosenage and deceit when hee himselfe intendeth and practiseth nothing else Such as thou hast seene him heere gentle Reader such shalt thou finde him almost in all his answers throrowout his whole booke which when I shall haue stript out of those ragges wherewith he hath clothed them thou shalt see him a poore Doctour and shalt well perceiue that he was put to a cruell shift and streining of conscience for the writing of this booke 34. In the meane time I callenge him to giue an answer to this aduertisement He hath with wide mouth cried out vpon me for false and corrupt dealing I challenge him to make good his accusation against this briefe Defense I know he loueth not to meddle with the answering of long books and when I shall haue giuen checke to his Reproofe he will not be at leisure to giue me at large a countercheck I challenge him therfore to cleere himselfe if he can against those exceptions that I haue heere taken against him and setting downe plainly the authours words in their owne tongue as I haue done to make it appeare if it bee so that in charging me with falshood and lying hee hath done the part of a trusty and honest man being no further so to be taken if hauing made such a clamour against me of lying lying it now prooue to be but a cry of course not for any matter in me but onely of forme in him I pray thee gentle Reader to vrge him by all meanes thereunto Tell his friends and followers that if in these few matters hee cannot better acquit himselfe it shall be a shame for them to suffer themselues any longer to bee deluded by such a shamelesse man If he say he will doe it in his second part vnderstand that he doth but mocke thee The booke that he hath now published was comming foorth without any name of the first part The Presse being then surprised they haue since by some common aduice amongst them reuiewed and better furnished it and now for a colour haue called it The first part Thou hast beene three yeeres and more in the expectation of this little peece let him not hold thee three yeeres more in the expectation of another part But whether it be this peece or that part thou maiest now by thine owne experience iudge of both If God continue my health and strength and the vse of those eies at the distemper and sorenesse whereof hee so often sporteth himselfe I will by the assistance of his grace giue thee further experience of him in the rest Albeit I thinke thou wilt not wish that I either trouble thee or my selfe with all his wandring discourses his idle descants his fond surmises his imagined contradictions Much worke he maketh that I should say n Reproofe pag. 50. I would stop the aduersaries mouth and leaue him nothing to reply But let him remember that to that part whereof I said so he hath yet replied nothing and let him vnderstand withall that I take not euery dogs barking to be a reply He chargeth me with o Ibid. pag. 62. contradiction for that I say that in his dedication he had no hope to preuaile with his Maiestie and yet I say that in his booke he thought himselfe to haue performed some great exploit that is saith he to preuaile maruellous much with his Maiestie But his Commentarie fitteth not my text because his great exploit there intended was not in preuailing with his Maiesty but as I there declared in writing a famous and woorthy worke the marrow and pith of many large volumes contracted and drawen into a narrow roome Another contradiction he fancieth in that I p Ibid. pag 267. 268. c. say that he reuealed a counsell and secret of his owne and his fellowes in saying God knoweth what that forcible weapon of necessitie will driue men vnto at length and yet I bid him be of good cheere and tell his fellowes that we knew their mind before I answer him that in their desire it is a secret which by all means they conceale and hide and which they would not haue vs by any means or in any sort to imagine of thē and yet by experience wee haue learned to iudge of them that they are as there I said trecherous false-hearted faithlesse waiting for time and opportunitie if power would serue to compell his Maiestie to their order Now to what end should I spend either time or paper for the examining of such dreames To the matter and question of religion or if there be any thing else materiall I will answer him if God will the rest which serueth onely for the lengthning of his booke I will passe by with contempt 35. Now then to leaue M. Bishop for the time I come to M. Higgons who hauing vpon meere discontentments lately reuolted from vs and being strangely become a proselyte of the Church of Rome to the great griefe of his father the vntimely death of his mother the wonder of all who haue knowen what formerly he was hath of figtree leaues like Adam made him a mantle to couer this nakednesse and shame deliuering vnder the name of motiues certaine fantasticall apprehensions whence as he pretendeth he tooke the occasion of this reuolt In these motiues taking vpon him to censure the state and proceedings of our church and to tax sundry of our men who by writing haue applied themselues for the defense thereof he picketh heere and there some petit quarels against me amongst the rest as if in writing against Doct. Bishop I had not dealt syncerely and vprightly in the report and allegation of some things The matters are but few and those such as that I shall not need to stand long vpon any of them The matter that chiefly troubled his head gaue him occasiō of this apostasie was as he pretendeth our deniall of Purgatorie and praier for the dead which he now vpon the sudden hath learned to be an Apostolicall tradition And amongst other reasons that haue induced him so to conceiue of it one is a proposition deliuered by Doct. Field that q First Motiue of T.H. book 1 part 1 ch 2. § 2. num 8. whatsoeuer all or the most famous in all ages or at least in diuers ages haue constantly deliuered as receiued from them that went before them no man doubting or contradicting it may be thought to be an Apostolicall tradition This he affirmeth to be true of praier for the dead that the most famous and renowmed in all ages haue constantly deliuered it as receiued from them that went before and none haue gainsaied it but damned heretikes and therefore that it must by Doct. Fields rule be taken to be an Apostolicall tradition Whence saith he I was compelled to inferre that Doct. Abbot doth willingly deceiue himselfe saying that praier for the dead is a tradition and ordinance of the Church to which
purpose he misinforceth the testimony of Epiphanius whereby he would exempt Aerius from the crime of heresie iustly laied vnto his charge by S. Austin and many others But I answer him that though as a man I may be deceiued yet God hath giuen me more grace than that in these matters I will willingly deceiue my selfe In this matter of Epiphanius I do not take my selfe in any sort to be deceiued His conclusion against Aerius as touching praier for the dead is this r Epiphan haer 75. Ecclesia necessâ—râ—ò hoc perficit traditione à patribus accepta quis autem poterit staturum matris dissoluere aut legem patris velut Solomon dicit Audi fili fermones patris tui ne repudies statuta matris tuae ostendens per hoc quòd in scriptu sine scripto decuit pater mater autem nostra ecclesia habet statuta in se posita indissolubilia quae dissolui non pâ—ssuntâ—â— Cùm itaque ordi nata sint in ecclesia statuta benè se habeant omnia mirabâ—ittèr fiant confutaâ—us est tursus etiam hic seductor The Church necessarily doth this by tradition receiued from the Fathers and who may dissolue the statute of his mother or the law of his Father as Solomon saith My sonne heare thy Fathers words and refuse not thy Mothers statutes heereby shewing that both in writing and without writing the Father hath taught and our Mother the Church hath statutes set downe in her which are inuiolable and may not be broken Seeing then saith hee that there are statutes ordeined in the Church and they are well and all things are admirably done this seducer is confuted Now then doe I say that praier for the dead is a tradition Epiphanius saith the same that the Church doth it by tradition from the Fathers Doe I say that he maketh it a statute or ordinance of the Church He himselfe expresly calleth it so and finally presseth the authority of the Church onely for the confuting of Aerius He alleageth no Scripture his words import that he hath none to alledge Onely to grace the ordinances of the Church he wresteth a saying of Salomon nothing pertinent thereto as if we were taught that God without scripture teacheth vs by the Church And if he meane any otherwise but that it is the ordinance of the Church very vainly and idlely doth he heere name the ordinance of the Church But M. Higgons will say that though Epiphanius name it thus a tradition and an ordinance of the Church yet he meaneth it to be such a tradition and ordinance as is from the Apostles But let him meane what he will yet so long as he maketh it a tradition without Scripture my words stand good which I vsed to M. Bishop Å¿ Answer to Doct. Bishops epistle sect 10. pag. 79. 80. Epiphanius resolueth vs that praier for the dead is a matter of tradition and an ordinance of the Church and therefore freeth vs from any trespasse against any thing that Moses or the Prophets or Christ and his Apostles in the Scriptures haue deliuered vnto vs. If it be no matter of Scripture with Epiphanius then I say rightly that he cleereth vs from impugning therein any thing that is deliuered in the Scriptures Albeit because it is by Epiphanius his confession a tradition without Scripture therefore we resolue vndoubtedly that it came not from the Apostles because whatsoeuer they taught concerning faith and saluation is conteined in the Scriptures as before hath beene shewed at large Yea and how vnsoundly Epiphanius vrgeth Apostolike tradition is to be seene in the point which he speaketh of immediately before where he saith that t Epiphan haer 75. Decreuerunt Apostoli quarta prosabbato ieiunium per omnia excepta Pentecoste de sex diebus Paschatis praecipiunt nihil omninò accipere quà m panem salem aquam the Apostles decreed a fast vpon Wednesdaies and Fridaies continually saue betwixt Easter and Whitsuntide and that six daies before Easter men should receiue nothing but bread and salt and water whereas S. Austin professeth that u Aug. epist 86. Quibus diebus non oporteat ieiunare quibus oporteat praecepto Domini vel Apostolorum non inuenio de finitum what daies to fast or what daies not to fast he findeth it not defined or set downe by any commandement of Christ or his Apostles and by Tertullian it appeareth that the Primitiue Church alledged against the Montanists x Tertul. de ieiunio sic Apostolos obsernasse nullum aliud imponentes iugum certoruÌ„ in coÌ„mune â—mnibus obeundorum â—etunorum that the Apostles imposed no yoke of standing and common fasts and of the Lent-fast Socrates resolueth that y Socrat. hist. li. 5. c. 21. Quoniam nemo de ea praeceptum literarum monumentis proditum potest osteÌ„dere perspicuum est Apostolos liberam potestatem in eadem cuiusque menti arbitrio permisisse vt quisque nec metu nec necessitate inductus quod bonum est faceret because no man can shew any written commandement thereof it is manifest that the Apostles left it free to euery mans will and discretion that without feare or necessity euery man should doe what good is Now we cannot wonder that he that would thus vnaduisedly name Apostolike tradition for the one should do the same for the other also Albeit if M. Higgons can iustifie praier for the dead according to Docter Fields rule we will not sticke with him to grant it to be an Apostolicall tradition But he might haue seene that I had put it without the compasse of that rule if he had been desirous to know the truth and had not resolued first vpon other occasions to fall away and afterwards to seeke shifts to excuse his fall I shewed by Origen that the Church at first vsed no praier for the dead by the authour of the ecclesiasticall Hierarchy that when it was first vsed it was vsed onely for iust and holy men of whose soules they were resolued that they were in heauen for what causes I haue expressed there by Epiphanius that they added afterwards to pray for euill men also and publicke offenders by Austin that there was not knowen any definite and certaine vse and effect of praiers and offerings for the dead and that many in his time did plead that if any good were to be done for the soule after death it should rather be by it owne confession of sinnes than by offerings procured by other men And lastly whereas praier for the dead by M. Higgons confession dependeth vpon Purgatory I shewed by Austins expresse words that he had no certaine beleefe or knowledge of any such place which are more cleere to that purpose than that by any Popish sophistications they can be shifted or deluded 36. Albeit I did not only alledge him doubting of Purgatory but also plainly excluding it vpon occasion by denying any third place
and that euen to death and yet the Church of Rome against the intent of this Commandement alloweth that clandestine Marriages and the vowe of religion shall be in force though they bee without and against the consent of wise and carefull parents Answ It is very false to say that children must obey their parents in all things for if parents command them any thing either against Gods law or the Princes they must not obey them therein And touching clandestine and priuie Marriages they are of force aswell in the Church of England as in the Church of Rome yea more too For by the Church of Rome alwaies they haue beene forbidden verie seuerely and since the Councell of Trent are made voide and of no force where the Councell can be published Concerning entring into religion childrens vowes during their minoritie may be annullated and made of no force by their parents marry when they come to riper daies if their father stand not in necessitie of their helpe they may forsake him to follow Christ in a more perfect kinde of life as S. Iames and S. Matth. 4.22 Iohn forsooke their father Zebedee and followed Christ R. ABBOT There is little discretion in M. Bishops first exception because M. Perkins did vse no other but the Apostles words a Col. 3.20 Children obey your parents in all things for that is well pleasing vnto the Lord. When the Apostle saith in all things M. Bishop should not be so rude as to say It is verie false to say in all things howsoeuer wee denie not but that the words haue their limitation and restraint to those things wherein they command in right of parents The validitie of contracts marriages without consent of parents As touching marriages without consent of parents M. Bishop misreporteth the Councell of Trent which though it doe detest and prohibit the contracts of such marriages yet doth also b Conc. Trident. sess 24. Sancta Synodus anathemate damnat eos qui falsò affirmant matrimonia à filijs familias sine consensis parentum contracta irrita esse parentes rata vel irrata facere posse condemne them who say that such marriages when they are contracted are void and that it is in the power of the parents either to ratifie or disanull them The Church of England not meditating contradiction but truth approoueth so farre the sentence of the Councell and albeit it endeuoureth with all good care and circumspection to preuent and to exclude such wilfull and vngodly courses of marriage yet it acknowledgeth that marriages being so acted and done cannot be reuoked lamented they may be and greened at but voided they cannot be M. Perkins seemeth to be of other minde and hee followeth therein the iudgement of sundry late Diuines whom though otherwise we greatly esteeme and honour yet wee cannot subscribe that which they determine in this point Consent of parents belongeth to the honest and orderly proceeding of marriage and it is true that children sinne against the fift Commandement in neglecting their consent but this consent is no part of the essence and being of marriage which therefore being complet and perfect without it must necessarily stand good albeit the parents giue no consent vnto it The very essence of contract and marriage consisteth in the parties actuall giuing of themselues mutually ech to other according to the forme and maner of the countrey and place wherein they liue which being done the want of parents consent cannot vndoe it neither may they be sundred in two who by Gods ordinance though vnlawfully abused are become one By Gods ordinance I say because albeit they haue not vsed that maner of proceeding which God hath ordeined to the fastening of this bond yet the bond it selfe wherewith they are fastened is the ordinance of God to remaine inuiolable betwixt them that are once bound thereby Neither doth it make against this which is obiected that God ioineth not such together that they marry not in the Lord for so may it be said of them that marry only for carnal worldly respects of the beleeuer that matcheth him or her-selfe with an vnbeleeuer that they are not ioined by God nor married in the Lord because God hath forbidden such kinde of marriages to be made But yet as the bond of marriage though vnlawfully entred into holdeth these together and may not bee broken euen so though children may not lawfully marry without consent of parents yet being married they are tied by the couenant of God ech to other as husband and wife and may not shake off the yoke which they haue taken vpon themselues As for those phrases of Scripture which are vrged in this behalfe of parents c Gen. 21.21 Exod. 34.16 Deut. 7.3 taking wiues for their sonnes or husbands for their daughters and giuing their sonnes and daughters in marriage they imply indeed the parents right and power for the bestowing of their children but yet we cannot from thence argue that if the children preuent their parents and doe giue and bestow themselues their gift should bee void and their marriage a meere nullitie as if it had not beene For as wee reade of parents taking wiues for their sonnes so we reade of sonnes also without consent of parents taking wiues for themselues when yet the want of such consent hath been no disanulling of their marriage Esau d Gen. 26.34 tooke him two wiues of the daughters of Heth or Canaan e Ibid. 28.8 contrarie to the liking of his father and mother and yet when he had taken them hey held it not in their power to frustrate his taking of them but with griefe were forced to endure them And if the sonnes taking of a wife be of no force without the parents consent then Rebecca had no such cause of feare f Ibid. 27.46 lest Iacob also should take a wife of the daughters of Heth because his taking had been nothing so long as his father and mother should giue no consent vnto it So is it said of g Gen. 38.2 Iudah that he tooke him to wife a daughter of a Canaanite which wee cannot doubt but that it was as offensiue to his father Iacob as it had beene before to Isaac and yet his marriage was not taken to be of no effect To be short as the one phrase of Scripture may be deemed to import a right in the father to bestow the children so the other may bee thought to import a validitie of that which the childrē do though vnlawfully without the father It is here I know commonly obiected that God by his law prouided that h Num. 30.4 the vow of the daughter should not stand that was disauowed by the father and thereof is inferred that the daughters bestowing of her selfe in marriage cannot stand good without the father But that law if it be duly weighed maketh as little to that purpose as any thing else that is alleaged For the vowes and bonds