were by strong fauor of the secular power This is that in substance which Sir Hūfrey alledgeth out of Gerson yea an something more then he him self produceth And yet neuerthelesse as the reader may easily vnderstand there is nothing agreeable to the reformation of Luther and Caluin For Gerson onely reprehends and that iustely some particular persons in some particular countryes and in some particular obseruations which soe exactely and rigorously obserue theit rules lawes soe exorbitantly estreeme of them that they often tymes by indiscreet zeale are more diligent in performing them then they are in keeping the lawes of God and that they some tymes punish more seuerely a religious person offending against one of those monasticall rules or statutes or against one of the Popes preceps or lawes of the decretalls or others then they punish him whoe committeth adulterie or sacrilege Wher as those twoe false reformers Martin and Iohn were not content with this and to procure a reformation in some particular persons rules and statues but they tooke away all monasticall obseruations either of vowe rule or constitution and extingnissed all Ecclesiasticall lawes both of the Pope and Church as much as lay in their power violating euerting and razing the verie buildings of religious houses and consuming by fyre the bookes of the decretals and whole Canon lawes quyte destroying that and much more by rage and furie which Gerson out of a pious Christian zeale onely wished to haue amended Gerson complained of the euill life of fryres and nunnes with desire to haue them reformed and reduced to the obseruation of their ancient rules and constitutions onely excepting against the multiplicie and varietie of religious orders suntque per haec caelestia tonitruasublata prohibita damnata omnia istius generis vota penitissimè Lut. tom 2. fol. 272. But those companions in impietie Luther and Caluin would haue all religious and monasticall discipline wholely extingnished as Sacrilegious damnable and contrarie to the lawe of God vsing opprobrious speaches against all Religious persons their profession Gerson tooke to consideration whether the multitude and varietie of images might not be occasion of idolatrie in the simple people yet did not he reproue the due honor of them But our newe reformers or rather deformers either will haue no images at all in Churches as Caluinists or at the least they will not haue them honored with religious reuerence as Lutheranes reprouing all kinde of veneration or worship of them as superstitious and idolatrous Gerson onely reprehended the excesse as he apprehended in the canonization of soe manie newe saints the more religious obseruation of thers feastes then of the feastes of the Apostles by some particular persons or Churches but these twoe prophane fellowes allowe not of anie religious celebration of the feasts of either ancient or moderne saints neither of Apostles nor Euangelists neither of confessers nor martyres making account onely of the sabaoth day as they cōmonly call the sunday in that nature alsoe houlding the canonization of noe saints for either necessarie lawdable or authenticall desiring rather their memories should be extingiushed rhen reuerenced Gerson likewise comdemneth instely superstitions comitted by particular persons in the worship of saints vaine obseruations ouer great credulitie giuen by them to euerie passage recounted in some inauthentichall legendes yet admitting defending due moderate honor of saints the authentical true histories of their liues But our pretended reformers reiect all religious honor of Saintcts hould the relatiōs of their liues miracles for Apocriphall fabelous at the least of moderne saints Gerson defended the Roman doctrine of indulgences most Catholiquely as his treatice of that matter doth testifye Indulgentiarum cōcessio non est parui pendenda seu contemnenda sed amplectēda deuote in fide spe charitate Domini nostri Iesu Christi qui potestatem lium clauium Ecclesiasticarum dedit hominibus Gerson p. 2. act 23. and onely taxed some particular pardons of sinnes as he relates for saying soe manie pater nosters in such a Church before such an image calling them superstitious opiniōs and friuolous additions as hauing neuer ben approued by the Roman Church But our newe doctors masters Luther Caluin vtterly condemne all sortes of Indulgence graunted by the Pope yea and the power of the Church to graunte them Gersō speaking onely of some vitious Ecclesiastical persons reprehendes preists for that vnder the pretense of maydes they keepe cōcubines yet plainely supposing the lawe of Celibate or single life of cleargie to haue ben in vse in and before his tymes as a thing lawdable and fitting for their vocation quoniā assidue nostri sacerdotes sacris occupantur mysterijs quid diuinius quam vt continua polleant castitate Gers 2. part dialog de celib Act. 4 But those twoe luxurious imps the one a professed fryer the other a vowed priest according to their newe reformation teach it lawfull and laudable for preists not obstanding their vowes of chastitie to chāge the state of chastitie in to the state of mariage they being the first that gaue example of that sacrilegious action and leading the daunce them selues Gerson complaines that Cathedrall Churches are made dennes of theeues and consecrated monasteries markets Innes But by the followers of Luther and Caluin those holie cloysters are not onely made markets and Innes but euen stables and hogstyes Cathedrall Churches as it were common burses or exchanges for relation of newes and negotiations in which manifould iniustices and illicit contracts are plotted and accorded to the great profanation of the house of God ordained for onely prayer seruice and Sacrifyce soe that if Gerson were now aliue doubtlesse he would rather taxe the pretended reformers in this nature then those Catholique profaners of his owne tymes Gerson bids inquirie to be made if ther be not Apocryphall Scriptures and prayers introduced in the Church to the great preiudice of Christian faith not meaning of anie Scriptures or prayers approued for Canonicall and pious by the authoritie of the Roman Church as are the bookes of machibies Sapience Ecclesiasticus Tobie and Iudith and prayers to saints all which Gerson him selfe did receiue for such but he onely reprehendes such false Scriptures or prayers as some newfangled priuate persons had published and inuented with out warrant or authoritie of the prelates and gouernors of the Church But Luther Caluin and their schollers peremptoriely reiected and excluded out of the text and canon of seripture the forosayde bookes and some others as allsoe all manner of prayers to sainrs euen those prayers and kookes of scripture which had ben most anciently approued and read in the seruice of the vniuersall Church at the least since the tyme of Innocēt the first Pope of that name and soe vsed in the dayes of S. Augustin and euer since till the late dayes of Luther And now by this breefe collation or cōparision
witts about him to perceaue he intendeth nothing else but to leade his reader into that same by-way which he still laboureth to finish for himself others of his owne profession Sec. 16. In his sixteenth section the knight makes hoat warre against the Councell of Trent after he had in a couning secret manner spit his poyson at diuers other Councells of more ancient standing in the precedent section he singles this out alone as his most professed enimy most seuere censurer of his faultes crimes vsing all his whole forces art to diminish his strength power that not in hugger mugger but in plaine manifest termes affirming the same to be of smale or no credit as being neyther lawfully called nor free nor eyther generall or generally receiued He sayth it was not lawfully called because it was assembled by the Popes vsurped authority not by the Emperour but this being the firste part of he proofe it is both false in it self also left vnproued otherwise then by his naked affirmation Serenissimo etiam Imperatori gratias agere gratulari iure optimo debemus ille de nostris his rebus pro sua eximia pietate sollicitus mirifice fuit Orat. hab ses 9. so it needes no other confutation then denyall how beit so certaine manifest it is that the Emperour consented vn to that Councell approued both the conuocation proceedings of it as much as lay in his power that I am persuaded the sectaries them selues with all their audaciousnesse haue not the face to deny so playne a truth so plainely expressed in the oration had in the last session of the sacred synod in which great thankes ar rendered vnto him for his zeale care therin imployed The second part of the proofe consists of a false supposition that no Councell can be legitimate except it be conuocated by the Emperour but that this is false it is clearer then the day otherwise it would follow that those Councells which were celebrated before there were any Christian Emperour in the world should haue binne vnlaufully called as euen that of the Apostles themselues Act. 15. more if that position of the nouellists were true what truth or authority can the Councells of the pretensiue reformed Churches haue none of which as yet had euer any Emperour of their religion as I hope in God neuer will haue at least since the daies of Luther euen by their owne confessions which pouerty of their poore ragged flock it seemes Sir Humfrey had quite forgotte when he vttered that false maxime of the reformed doctrine Secondly he sayth the Councell of Trent was not free Hi nuncij Aquilon is partes prope omnes peragrarunt rogarunt obsecrarūt obtestati sunt tuta omnia atque amica promiserūt c Orat. vt supra yet he confesseth in this same place that he denieth not but that safe conduct was promised as well to the Lutherans as to the Romanists yet as it seemes like cowardelie dastardes they feared danger timuerunt vbi non erattimor And if they feared where there was no feare in whome I praye was the fault now for freedome of speech in proposing of matters discussing them Sir Humfrey cannot deny if he will stand to the testimony of his owne Dudithius cited by himself who plainly supposeth freedome in that nature in that he affirmes being a Protestant that the feild had binne theirs if they had not binne ouercome by number Thirdly he affirmes that it was not generall but how could it be more generall then by a generall amicable conuocation of all Princes Prelates learned diuines which the Bull of indiction declares And as for the number of those who came vnto it thou ' the knight doth vse all his art for the diminution of it yet was it farre greater then he vouchsafed to recount as the Catalogue prefixed to the Councell doth plainly declare amounting to the number of 255. Acclam Patr in ◅nc Conc. of those who subscribed to the decrees the truth is if more had come more had binne admitted none reiected which euen of it self alone excepting others is a sufficient note of Generallity Fourthly he saith it was not generally receiued but in this he vseth one of his vsuall equiuocations for althou ' in some places as yet it is not receaued in matters of reformation practise as in those places especially in which it hath neuer binne proclamed Neuerthelesse in matters of faith it is generally receaued of all Roman Catholikes wher soeuer they bee farre or neere in Europe Asia or America or other forreigne Countries conuerted to the christian Catholike faith so the reader may see that this saieng of our aduersaries which they perpetually buzze into the eares of the simple people that the Councell of Trent is not generally receaued by the Romanists themselues is meere cousenage imposture malitiously inuented to auert their mindes from the most wholesome doctrine profitable precepts of the same for the generall reformation of the Church which because the false reformers plainly see it trenches to neere vppon their Copyhold they ioyne heauen hell together to infringe its authority And here I aduertise the reader that our aduersarie vseth the relations of Some histories touching the proceeding of the Tridentine Councel which ar not admitted by the Romanists particularly those passages of Thuanus of whome I haue receiued credible information that dying a Roman Catholike he made a general retractation of all such positions or relations as he had publishedlesse aduisedly or any way dissonant to the doctrine or practise of the Roman Church so all such passages as Sir Humfrey produces out of his workes ar esteemed as voyde of force for confirmation of anie parte of his doctrine The rest which Sir Humfrey vttereth in this section is nothing but certaine hereditarie vntruthes impostures which he receaued from Caluin Illiricus Tertium nonnulla atque etiā quartum discussa summa saepe contentione certatum c. Orat. hab ad finem Concil Sleidan the counterfeit historie of the Councell of Trent published in the English tongue in disgrace of that most renowned Synod whose authoritie will they nill they they must suffer vs to honore imbrace obey at the least till such time as they can showe vs one of their owne of the like generallitie grauitie authenticall exacte proceeding which it hath vsed in discussion determination of the most receaued doctrine of former present ages which if they cānot performe then let thē confesse they haue left the cōmon royall way of the anciēt Church fallen into a by-way of parlamentall or pure consistoriall gouernment in matters of faith not heard of in primitiue ages as neyther was their extrauagant forme of Conuenticles trulie generall nationall or prouinciall as appeeres in their Pseudosinods of Gappe
that it plainely appeereth he doth rather demonstrate his owne bitternesse rancour towards her then with any probable argument shew any such disposition to remaine in her against any such vnion as hee pretendeth to desire Why then doth S. Humfrey complaine of that which is in a farre worse manner practised by himselfe and his owne brothers besides this I pray you doth the supposed bitternesse of F. Cāpian proue the bitternesse of the Roman Church could he alone bee the whole Roman Church who was but one onely member of it Or are his speeches or priuate positions to be attributed to the whole Church he being but one parte thereof and yet not the greatest what a false Metonymie is this if the head of the Church had vsed such speeches you would haue seemed to haue had some reason to haue attributed them to the whole because that which the head doth may induce a denomination vppon the rest of the body of which examples may be found euen in nature but whatsoeuer any other member doth it cannot rightly be attributed to the whole So that we now see that in this allegation S. Humfrey himselfe doth so carrie the matter and giueth the Church of Roome euen in this same section so much occasion of new disgusts as besides the rehearsed calumnies taxing her with creation of 12. new Articles and coyning of new expositions vpō the ould farre different from the doctrine of the Apostles and that she mayntaineth and practiseth manifest idolatry And the like most false and slanderous exprobrations that as I said before it plainely appeereth that he hath rather demonstrated his owne bitternes and rancour towards the Roman Church then shewed any such defect in her by any argument drowen from Father Campians wordes by him produced which wordes allthough by his quotation of Iewell in the margent he will seeme to haue taken them at secōd hand yet certainely it is a plaine imposture and so let them diuide it as they please betwixt themselues it being euer supposed that S. Humfrey and his Iewell are of equall authoritie with the Catholiks I meane of none at all Moreouer S. Humfteys whole drift in this section being to cleere his owne Church from the infamous brand of Apostacy he imposeth the whole cause of separation vpon the Roman Church and produceth Erasmus for a wittnes of the same who being demaunded for sooth of the duke of Saxonie what was Luthers capitall offence that stirred vp so many opposites against him made answer that Luther had committed two greate crimes for he had taken away the Crowne from the Pope and had taken downe the belly of the monkes To which saying of answer that Erasmus is no competent wittnes against the Roman Church especially in a case where his sole testimonie is interposed And if S. Humfrey had ben circumspect he would not haue cited Erasmus his answere for this purpose as containing one manifest lye if not twb. For neither did Luther euer take the Crowne from the Pope which as the world knowes he still enioyeth maugre him and all his adherents neither did Luther euer take downe the bellies of the monkes except it was by iniuste vsurpation and rapin to fill his owne and to leade his lyfe in luxurious concubinate with breach of his vowes to god and man Immediately before this momicall passage of Luther out of Erasmus which although S. Humfrey produced to colour the pretended Reformers diuisiō from the Church of Rome yet doth it farre more strongly argue a cause in the Pope iustely to reiect them then anie excuse of their preposterous separation before this I say he cited a place out of the Prophet Ose which because it makes nothing to this purpose Cap. 4.15.17 but onely vpon his owne false supposition that the Roman Church is wicked and idolatrous therefore vntill I see him prooue his supposition which yet I know he will neuer be able to performe I leaue it as impertinent as also I omit the examples he brings of Abrahams departure out of Caldea and of the Iewes out of Egypt which are as farre from the case we treate of as Egypt is from Europe or Christendome from Iewrye Therefore I will onely giue notice to the reader how grossely he abuseth certaine authours he cytes to testifye that by Babylon is meant the Christian Rome For ther is not one of those authours that affirmes that after it was conuerted to the Christian faith it was called Babylon according as the scripture vsually speakes of Babylon either properly or Metaphorically Neither is ther likewise anie of the same authours which teach that since the conuersion of that Citye to the faith of Christ Christians ought to departe from it as out of a spirituall and idolatrous Babylon which is that our aduersarie here intendes to proue or at the least ought to proue if anie thing he meanes to prooue against the Romanists And to speake first of the ancient authours here cyted by the kinght which are Tertulliā S. Hierome and S. Augustin it is directly impossible that they should meane by Babylon the Roman Church depraued by anie idolatrie of Christian people for that they were all departed out of the world before the supposed departure of the Roman Church from the true Religion is affirmed by our newe sectaries to haue begun which as they most commonly teach was not before the 600. yeare after the tyme of Christ our Sauiour Now as for the moderne authours to wit Orosius Viues Bellarmin and Baronius and Ribera they are all knowne Romanists yea and some of them cheefe defendours of the Roman Church and faith and so it is euident by this reason alone that they had not such a thought as to meane by Babylon the Roman Church Cap. 22. Viues vpon the 18. booke de cuit Dei explicates him selfe plainely saying Petrus Apostolus Roman Babylonem appellat vt etiam Hyeronymus in vita Marci interpretatur qui ad Marcellam scribens non aliam existimat describi à Ioanne in Apocalypsi Babylonem quam Vrbem Romam Bellarmin also speakes yet plainer in the verie place cited by S. Humfrey viz. lib. 2. de Rom. Pont. cap. 2. for he saith Respondeo Babylonem vocari non Romanam Ecclesiam sed Romanā vrbem qualis erat Ioannis tempore Orosius I haue not But let Baronius speake for him selfe and others Baron Adam 45. Nec per somninm quidem quis vnquam inuenit Romanam Ecclesiam esse Babylonis nomine nuncupatam sed ipsā tantummodô ciuitatem ac id quidem non semper sed cum impietate referta aduersus ipsam Ecclesiam bellum gereret Ribera vnderstands by Babylon persecuting Rome not as it is nowe I need not cite his wordes in a case so cleare So that nowe I doe not see why S. Humfrey produced these authors except it were by corruption of them to make them precursors of his corrupted way And hence also the reader may gather how weakely the knight
definitum numerum sacramentoū statuerunt Cass p. 951. To the like purpose or rather to no purpose he citeth also Gregory de Valentia saying that it doth not appeere when the communion in one kinde beganne which saying of Valentia is most true his meaning is that the custome of communicating so is so auncient that it hath no knowne beginning and consequentlie it hath bene euer in the Church of God since the time of Christ and his Apostles and by them practized And therefore Valentia addeth prefentlie after to that purpose that euer from the beginning of the Church ther hath beene some vse of the Eucharist vnder one kinde as he hath showed before Which wordes as makeing plainelie against him he was content to omit So that this testimonie either proueth nothing to the knights purpose or els more then he desires as also want of honest dealing in the citation of it To omitte that when that manner of communion first began in the Church is no article of the Roman faith The same authour is also once againe cited by Sir Humfrey for that in the same place he affirmeth the foresaid manner of communion not to haue bene generallie receiued but a little before the councell of Constance which is no more to the purpose then the other allegation or scarse so much For this and some other testimonies which he citeth page 60. at the most doe but onelie proue that some of the points of doctrine or rather of practice onelie of the Roman Church were not declaredlie knowen and definede successiuelie in all differences of times since the establishment of the Gospell which the Romanists do not denie though they knowe it is a point impertinent to the matter heere in question which is not whether the Reformers can showe a time when the tenets at he termes them of the Roman Church were not certainelie knowne or generallie receiued but also cheefely whether they were erroneous and then if such they were when they were first publikelie knowen and by what authenticall Councell they were condemned Which points because Sir Humfrey hath proued neither of them neither by the testimonies of the authours he cites nor by any other forceable proofe he hath failed of his purpose and promise and no way recouered the reputation in this section which he lost in the former but rather hath much increased his discredit and consequentlie the censure falleth more heauilie vpon him then it hath done before To the testimonie of Scotus aboute transub I will answer in an other place THE VI. PERIOD HEere Sir Hūfrey from a diuine is turned Herold and promiseth the Romanists he will shew them their Pedegree in faith drawne downe from the auncient heretikes and contrarilie the pedegree of his owne faith drawne from Christ and his Apostles So that heere you see the knight hath vndertaken a large peece of worke and how he will be able to performe it I know not It is a double taske and therefore I doubt he will not go through with it without double dealing And I suspect this the more for that he saith he will proceede ordine retro grado that is as I conceaue he will imitate the Crabbe in going backward and therefore I can expect no better of him then a crabbed piece of busines He saith he will performe his worke by ascending vpward but indeed his proceeding is so preposterous that a man can find neither ascent nor descent it it For he begins which lattine seruice as he calleth it and prayer in a straunge tongue the beginning of which he attributeth to Pope Vitalian about the yeere 666. And ends with the restraint of mariage of Priests which he affirmed in the 60. page in his former section not to haue bene altogether established till the time of Gregory the seuenth and so according to this he doth not ascend but descend and yet more then this in the middle of his section he treateth of transubstantiation as first decreed in the Councell of Lateran about foure hundreth yeeres agoe and thus you see one cannot conceiue that he eyther ascendeth or descendeth directlie but rather that he skippeth vp and downe like a mad man without anie order at all but now I will cease to seeke order were none is to be sound and come to the examine of the particular passages of his pedegree He endeauoureth to proue the Roman faith to descend from auncient heretikes first because they teach prayer in an vnknowne language not to be vnlawfull as saith hee Epiphanius affirmeth of the heretikes Osseni in the first age But to this I answer that S. Epiphanius is heere abused by the Knight for he censureth not those people of heresie because they held prayer not to be vnlawfull in an vnknowen language as Sir Humfrey falselie and ignorantlie affirmeth but for other errours of theirs which the same Epipha relates and confutes in his 19. heresie Neither doth he onelie affirme the Osseni to teach there was no need to make prayer in a knowne tongue as Sir Humfrey imposeth vpon him to the end their errour might some to agrree with the doctrine of the Roman Church in this particular Quibus porro vorbis inanibus vocibus postea in ipso libro decipit cum cum dicit nemo quaerat interpretationem sed solum in oratione hoc dicati hac ipsa nimirum ex Habraica lingua transtulis velut ex parte deprehendimus cum nihil sint ea quae imaginatur iubet enim dicere Abar Anid Moib Nochile c. but he further chargeth Elxai the cheefe prophet of that sect that he deceiued men with idle friuolous and strange wordes containing nothing of that which he imagined and commaunding his followers to praye in this manner Abar Anid Moib Nochile c. adding that they should not seek for anie interpretation of them which forme of prayer neuerthelesse holie Epiphanius doth not so much condemne for the strangenesse of the wordes as for the obscuritie and deformitie of the sense as appeareth by his wordes here quoted in Latin All which is farre different from the doctrine and practice of the Roman Church in this point which neither in sense nor wordes vseth anie other prayers then such as are conformable to that originall prayer which Christ him selfe appointed his disciples to vse Neither can Epiphanius with anie showe of probabillitie be thought to haue condemned them for heretikes for that which he knew neither to be contrarie to Gods worde nor anie definition of the auncient Church either before or in his time And as for that which the Reformers commonlie allege out of the fourth to the Corinthians and first epistle I say that if the same Epiphanius had vnderstood it as written against such like prayers infalliblie he would haue alledged the place against those heretikes But he well knew that the Apostles meaning was not to condemne prayer in what language soeuer it were but onelie to preferre prophesie before straunge
fathers of the primatiue Church so the knight by which discourse you may easilie perceiue euen by his owne wordes and the if which he maketh that all which he hath hitherto said hath no greater warrant then his owne suretie which although his authoritie and credit were farre greater then either we haue found it to be or it can be in it selfe yet were it not safe for anie man to relie vpon it but rather to hould it for verie vncertaine and fayleable Especiallie considering that all which he hath produced in proofe of the same are either meere trifles or at the most verie poore arguments grounded vpon false suppositions yea and vpon plaine vntrueths falsifications and corruptions both of scripture and fathers and so partlie through ignorance and partlie through malice he hath shewed himselfe a most partiall and false Herold And now altho' this might suffice for the censure of the section insuing because it pertaineth to the same subiect yet least the knigth should grūble I will a forde it a Period a parte THE VII PERIOD IN his eight section therefore Sir Humfrey promiseth to produce testimonies of his aduersaries touching the antiquitie and vniuersalitie of the Protestant faith in generall So he proceedeth in the title To which he addeth by way of asseueration that if the Roman Church doth not confesse that the reformers are both in the more certaine and Safer waye in the Protestant Church I will saith he neither refuse the name nor the punishment due to heresie Heere we see the knight is as free in his promises as euer he was let vs therefore examen how he performeth them for if he doth not he cannot escape either the name of an heretike or at the least the desert of punishment itselfe euen in this mortall life Hee beginneth thus He that shall question vs where our Church was before Luther let him looke back to the Primatiue Church nay let him but looke into the bosome of the present Roman Church and he shall finde that if euer antiquitie and vniuersallitie were markes of the true Church of right and necessitie they must belong to ours So Sir Humfrey In which wordes as it were by way of generall assertion he briefelie declareth the antiquitie and vniuersalitie of his Church to be found both in the Primatiue Church and also in the present Roman Church in which assertion there being two partes and that no small ones the first he endeauoureth to proue by shewing a conformitie betwene the doctrine of the Church of England with that of the Primatiue Church and descending to particulars he tells vs that his Church teacheth and beleeueth the same three Creedes which were instituted by the Apostles and the Fathers of the Primatiue Church and not created by Luther as also two of the seauen Sacraments which were saith he by the confession of our aduersaries instituted by Christ The same he affirmeth of 22. bookes of Canonicall Scripture which he saith were vniuersallie receiued in all ages Likewise of the seuen generall Councells he affirmeth that foure of them were ratified by the Cannons of the Church of England and confirmed by act of parliament and thus he runneth through the points of doctrine and faith in which they and we agree adding to them the confession of his aduersaries And yet in all his large rehearsall of points of faith he maketh no mention of eyther those in which the Romanists and reformers disagree nor of those new articles of the English Creede which dissent from the doctrine of the Primatiue Church and which indeede are those that make the reformers guiltie of heresie as its the doctrine of Iustification by faith onelie the deniall of the reall presence and such like But craftilie leauing them out as if they were not to the purpose he treateth whereas in trueth by reason of these new errours obstinatelie defended by them there can be no vniuersalitie nor antiquitie in their Church notwithstanding they had neuer so great conformitie both to the auncient primatiue and moderne Roman Church in all the rest of their beleefe Especiallie supposing that anie one errour in matter of faith obstinatelie defended is sufficient to take away all true antiquitie and vniuersallitie of anie Church or congregation whatsoeuer as euen the reformers themselues as I suppose cannot denie for that as the scripture affirmeth that he who offends in one thing is made guiltie of all the rest so he that in one onelie poynt of faith houldeth contrarie to the most vniuersall and auncient Church maketh himselfe presentlie guiltie of want or defect both of vniuersalitie and antiquitie in his beleefe For as Saint Nazianzene saith to this purpose in his 37. oration towards the end the articles of faith are like to a gould chaine from which if you take away anie one link as Saint Ambrose saith Ad cap. 9. Lucae lib. 6. in fine you take away your saluation vnum horum saith he si detraxeris tetraxisti salutem tuam And so we see that the knight by reason he omitteth in his discourse that part vpon which the verie medium of his argument chiefelie or at the least greatelie depended his proofe of antiquitie and vniuersality in his Church falleth to the groūd But besides this defect he fayleth also in that he saith he beleeueth the three Creedes instituted by the Apostles and Primatiue Fathers of the Church For either he meanes that those three Creedes do sufficientlie conteyne all that he is bound to beleeue or no. If the first he meaneth then what will become of his solifidian iustification and of the 39. articles of the English faith the greater parte of which is not to be found in those Creedes If he meanes the second then doth he ill in leauing those particulars out in the rehearsall of his faith Nay more then this for if matters were well examined I doubt not but the knight notwithstanding the protestatiō of his faith of the three Creeds yet he would be founde holting in the true generally receiued or Catholike sēse of diuers of the same as that of the perpetuall virginity of the mother of God in that of the descēt of Christ in to hell of the Catholike Church the cōmunion of Saincts remission of sinnes and the like I say of the doctrine of the 4. first Generall Councels and of the Sacraments in which particulars our aduersaries vnderpresēce of reformatiō maintaine diuers deformed errours specified and confuted by diuines of the Roman Church Moreouer the knight is also defectiue in the proofe of the antiquitie and vniuersalitie of his faith and doth egregiously equiuocate in that he saith that two of the Sacraments which the Church of Rome houldeth are professed by the reformers and confessed by their aduersaries to haue beene instituted by Christ not broached by Luther This I say is equiuocall and doth not prooue his intent for although it neither is nor can be denied but ingenuously confessed by the Roman Church that there are two
attributed by heretikes to ancient and good authours among which we may number one cited by Sir Humfrey in some parte of his worke intitled de fiducia misericordia Dei which Bell. in his booke de Scrip. Eccles declares to be counterfait and suppositious and none of Bishop Fishers on whom it is imposed Neuerthelesse how so euer the matter standes touching the truth of the foresaid homilie and admit it be neuer soe true and authenticall yet I am confidently assured that the wordes by Sir Humfrey cited out of it against the reall presence are not so obscure but that they admitte such a comodious exposition as doth not in any sort fouour the denyall thereof but rather impugne and it confute it First for that there is not one worde which includeth a denyall of the reall presence of Christs bodie in the Eucharist but the wordes onelie showe a differēce betwene the body in which Christ suffered and the bodie which the faithfull receiue which difference is not reallie in the substance of the bodie it selfe it being one and the same in nature in euery place where it existeth but onely in the properties and manner of existence or being in place it hauing beene in the passion visible mortall and with it entire locall extension but in the Sacrament inuisible impassible and vnextended in which sense allso it may rightly be called spirituall yea and not altogether improperly especially taking it with a relation or respect vnto the same body perfectly extended in the manner aboue declared it may be said to be without bloud bone sinn woe limbe or soule that is without extensiō or motion of these partes as the cited wordes doe signifie which by reason of the foresaid maner of being of Christs body in the Sacrament doe call it his spirituall bodie from thence as it were inferring concluding that noething is to be vnderstood there bodily but spiritually all which is noething contrarie to the doctrine of the Romanists in this point but rather most agreeable to the same which teacheth that Christs body though it be truelie in the Sacrament yet without extension and not in a Corporall but in a spirituall manner yea and very cōformable to the doctrine of S. Paul who speaking of the resurrectiō of the flesh douteth not to call one the same humane bodie both corruptible spirituall 1. Cor. 15. Seminatur corpus animale surget corpus spirituale and that not for the difference of the bodie in it nature and substance which it hath not but onelie by reason of the accidentall difference which it hath in it properties and māner of existence which the same bodie receiueth in the resurrection not hauing had them in this mortall life True it is ther is one passage in the homilie which in my opinion hath more difficulty showe of repugnance to the reall presence transsubstantiation then the former wordes to wit where the authour makes a comparison betwixt the manna and water which flowed from the rocke in the desert both which he affirmes to haue beene figures of Christ bodie and bloud as the Eucharist also is Neuerthelesse he hath consequenter an other passage or two which plainely declare that similitude to be nothing contrarie either to the reall presence or transsubstantiation For so he addes The Apostle Paul saith that the Israelists did eate the same gostely meake and drinke the same gostely drinke because that heauenly meate that fed them 40. yeares and shat water which frome the stome did follow had signification of Christs bodie his bloud that now be offered daylie in Gods Church it was the same saith he which we offer not bodily but gostely But which wordes it is euident that Alfric puts a maine difference betwixt that spirituall meate and drinke of the Iewes the spirituall foode which Catholike Christians receiue in the Sacrament that being but a signification as the authour of the Homilie expressely affirmeth of Christs body bloud it being the same not bodilie but onely spiritually or figuratiuelie with that bodie and bloud of Christ which he auerreth Preists to offer daylie and of which he also teacheth the foresaid water to be a representation not the bodie and bloud themselues which as being euerie day sacrificed in the altar euen according to common sense they must of necessitie be reallie and truelie in the Eucharist And altho' the authour of the Homilie calleth if a figure of Christs bodie bloud yet doth he not say it is a figure of thē absent as the water flowing out of the rock was but truelie and reallie present as those his wordes in which he saith and diuers time repeateth that Christs bodie and bloud are offered in the same Eucharist by Preists in sacrifice doe euidently conuince supposing it is impossible to conceiue the authour of the homilie should affirme that Christs bodie and bloud be offered in the altar and yet not beleeue the same to be reallie truelie and substantially present in the Eucharist Moreouer the same Homilie saith in plaine termes the wine which in the supper by the Preist is hallowed shewe one thing without to humane vnderstanding and another thing with in to beleeuing minds without they seeme bread and wine both in figure and tast and they be truely after their hallowing Christs bodie and his blood throu ' gostelie misterie And afterwardes these wordes doe followe we said vnto you that Christ hallowed bread and wine to housell before his suffering and said this his my bodie and my bloud yet he had not then suffered but so notwithstanding he turned trou ' in visible might the bred to his owne hodie the wine to his bloud which wordes how plaine they be for the reall presence and transsubstantiation anie one that is not violently partiall in his owne cause may easilie perceiue considering that for Christ to turne by inuisible might the bread and wine into his bodie and bloud is nothing els but that which both the definitions of the Roman Church and Catholike diuines call by the names of reall presence and transsubantiation Thirdlie it is manifest that the foresaid testimonie cannot in reason be alledged in fauour of the reformers doctrine in this particular for that they denie the bodie of Christ either to exist or to be receaued really in the Eucharist otherwise then by faith figure neither of which neuertelesse is denied by the words aboue cited but contrarilie they expressely and absolutelie auerre that the bodie of Christ is receaued by the faithfull and altho' they call it his spirituall bodie yet doubtlesse they doe it onelie for the reason alledged as also for that it nourisheth the receiuers spirituallie yet they neuer denie it to be a true bodie or to be trulie present in the Sacrament or affirme it to be receiued by faith onelie as the reformers commonlie doe and Sir Humfrey in particular most expresselie in diuerse places of his booke Fourtlie the wordes alledged call
Fathers agree euer actually with her in euery point as it is most cleare in the auncient Father Sainct Cyprian and yet more cleere in Tertullian and origen who by reason of some points of doctrine which either were not in their time sufficiently and expresselie determined by the Church or of which they had not occasion to treate may seeme in some sorte to dissent from the present Church euen in such doctrine as now is knowne and beleeued for matter of faith euen by the nouelists themselues as appeares in the point of rebaptization defended by S. Cyprian his adherēts in those times Which if it were not so its euident that the reformers were yet in farre worse case then either the Romanists should be vpon that supposition or then now they are if in worse they can be imagined to be whoe neither haue nor euer can haue any kinde of vniuersalitie or ātiquity of Fathers either metaphisicall or morall on their side And now this being all in substance are rather more then those three cited authours affirme it hence appeereth how smale reason Sir Hum. had to cite them in his fauour especiallie considering that one of them that is Alfonsus a Castro doth onely say that there is seldome mention made of transubstantiation in the Fathers not denying as it is manifest their agreement in that point but rather insinuating their consent therein tho' not so frequentlie expressed Furthermore the knigth addeth for the conclusion of this pointe that many writers and schoole men in their owne Church are so farre from graūt of antiquity vniuersalitie to this doctrine that they professe the tenet of transubstantiation was latelie receaued in the Church for a point of faith And for this he citeth Scotus as affirming that before the councell of Lateran transubstantiation was not beleeued as a point of faith and that the doctrine of it is not verie auncient in the Church Thus Sir Humfrey Tho which I answer that all tho' Bellarmin affirmes that Scotus sayde transubstantiation was not an article of faith before the councell of Lateran yet I finde he speakes not so absolutely but at the most he saith it was not solēnly declared as an article of faith before that Coūcell not denying but that it minght be also declared in other particular coūcels as in deed it was declared by the Roman coūcell vnder Nicolas the secōd aboue a hundreth fifty yeeres before and more expressely in another Roman councell vnder Gregorie the seuenth yea and maintained in the Church time out of minde Neuerthelesse by way of argument I am content to graūt to the aduersaries that which Bellarmin affirmes of Scotus Et tunc ad tertium vbi stat vis dicendum quod Ecclesia declarauit istum intellectum esse de veritate fidei in illo simbolo edito sub In. 3. in Consilio Later vbi ponitur veritas aliquorum credendorum magis explicite quam habeantur in simboloo rum vel Atha vel Nyceni breuiter quicquid ibi dicitur esse credēdum tenendum est esse de Substantia fidei hoc post istam declarationē solemnem factam ab Ecclesia Paulo post Non enim in potestate Ecclesiae fuit facere istud verum vel non verum sed Dei instituentis Et secundum intellectū à Deo traditum Ecclesia declarauit directa in hoc vt creditur spiritu veritatis Scot. 4. d. 11. q. 3 in resp ad arg yet not withstanding this liberall graunt I doe affirme with all that our Church wanteth neither antiquitie nor vniuersality either in this or any other point of her doctrine and the reason is because allthough some points of her faith were not in all ages and times knowen expresselie for articles of faith yet were they in themselues such indeede and for such beleeued with an implicite faith at the least that is with such a faith as all conteined in the worde of God is belieued by all true Catholikes as an infalible trueth altho' no one particular were knowne vnto them For as it is most certaine that euery faithfull Christian which cannot reade beleeueth many things conteined in scrpture with be knoweth not in regard that altho' he is ignorant of them in particular yet in that he belieueth all that they include he allso belieueth truely euen those particular trueths which he knoweth not so allso it is certaine that euery faithfull Christian beleeuing vniuersally all that which the word of God conteines hath an vniuersall faith of whatsoeuer points of doctrine either was is or shall be declared for matters of faith by the most vniuersall Church in any difference of time and consequently he hath as ancient and vniuersall a faith of those particular points so declared as he hath of those which euen both in the Apostles time in all succeding ages were expressely knowne for articles of faith to all the Christian world And let this suffice to declare that noe point of doctrine definde by the most vniuersall Church as matter of faith conteined in the worde of God can truely be tearmed new but hath as much antiquity and vniuersality as the greatest mysterie of the Christiā faith also that if any noueltie it hath it is onely in the declaration of it quoad nos that is in respect of that new or expresse knowledge which we receiue of it by the proposition of the holy Church Which infalible manner of arriuing to a new knowledge of matters of faith because the sectaries neither haue it nor admitte it it necessarily followes that whatsoeuer doctrine they discouer in these later times must of necessity want both the foresaid properties of antiquitie and vniuersality as we haue declared in regarde they can not show as much as an implicite perpetuallie succeeding faith in the articles they haue newly broched Sir Hūfrey further more citeth allso Hostiensis and Gaufridus out of Durand in 4. d. 10. q. 1. n. 23. whoe as he affirmeth saith there were others in those daies whoe taught that the substance of bread remaines and that their opinion was not to be reiected so the knight relateth But how false and corrupted this relation is I know out of Durand himselfe for that I finde in his 10. d. of the 4. of sent q. 1. n. 15. that this passage cited by him is neither Durandes owne doctrine nor yet theirs whome he cites aboute it but onely related by them and taken out of them by Durand to frame his obiection in the begining of his question as he vseth to doe which he afterwardes solues in plaine termes saying in his 25. number Quod ante inducitur de Glossatoribus Gaufrido Hostiense super decreta dicendum quod licet recitent tres opiniones nullam tamen approbant vt veram nisi illam quod corpus Christi sit in altari per transsubstantiationem panis vim si expresse non dicunt aliquam aliam erroneam non propter hoc non est erronea non
being a matter in this sense either of indifferencie or at the most of greater merit and perfection it might lawfully be altered by an introduction of the contrarie custome or practise of the Church especially the communicating or not communicating of the auditours of euerie Masse being a thing wholelie depending vpon the deuotion of the people themselues Which deuotion although the Church could haue desired it had continued in the same feruour in which it was in those primitiue times neuerthelesse ther was no reason why either she should obledge the people to the same or yet that the Preist for want of deuotion in the people should omitte his owne and cease to exercise so high and profitable a function to the members of the whole Church as is the publique liturgie and common praier of the same And truelie this is a matter so conformable to reason and pietie that if it were not that our aduersaries are quite possessed with a spirit of cōtradiction they would neuer contend so much aboute it as they doe Especially supposing that of all points of controuersie betweene them and vs that is of the least moment and a thing for which they haue the smalest reason to striue as well because they themselues reiect all sorts of Masses as vaine and superstitious whether they be priuate or publique with communion of the people or without as also because euen they themselues after their newe manner celebrate their owne liturgie as they call it oftentimes yea most ordinarily not onely without the comunion of the people but euen with out the comunion of either Priest or clarke as is euident by the most common practise of all the reformed Churches which onely with a drie fothering passe the greater part of the sūdaies of the whole yeere And yet these same Zealous brothers are so Crosse in their proceedinge that they are not ashamed to reprehend in vs the same which they thēselues ordinarily practise in a much worse manner In regard of which preposterous dealing of theirs in my opinion we may not vnaptlie applie vnto them the saying of a certaine ingenious Protestant in his description of a Puritan to wit that they are become so crosse in their teaching that he thinkes verily that if the Roman Church should inioyne the puting on of cleane shirts euery sunday rather then obey her precept they would goe lowsie Ouerb Caract But besides this Sir Humfrey for the proofe of his Irish faith alledgeth scripture out of S. Matth. 26. Marke 14. Luke 22. but the wordes he citeth doe not argue Christs institutiō in both kindes in respect of all sortes of people Accepit Iesus panem benedixit dedit discipulis suis dixit accipite manducate but onely his action manner of administration not his ordination we know as well as the reformers Christ did comunicate his bodie and bloud to all his disciples there present at the institution of the Sacrament euen to the traitour Iudas as many deuines doe hould but we know with all he did not ordeine it so to be administred in all occasions Neither doe we finde one worde of commaund in the whole bible by virtue of which the Priests are inioined to celebrate this misterie alwayes iust in the same manner that Christ did And otherwise if we should be so tied to euery circumstance which Christ himselfe vsed and particularie to giue the communion to all that are present we should be bound to giue it to those also which we know are vnprepared for it nay euen to excommunicated persons and to such traitors as Iudas That which neuerthelesse I persuad myselfe the most pure precisian of them all will scarsely doe though otherwise I hould thē not for very scrupulous in that nature so they know the receiuers to be mēbers of their cōgregation And touching the foresaid citation out of the Euangelists it is to be noted that because Sir Hum. will not haue his reader heare of the consecration of the Sacrament which the reformers neuer vse in their Churches therfore he left out the wordes and he blessed it puting onely the wordes of thākes giuing whereas yet the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies both blessing and giuing thankes therefore when our Sauiour multiplied miraculously the fishes Luc. 9. the Euangelist saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 he blessed them The knight also citeth a place of S. Paule 1. Cor. 11. But the Apostle indeed reprehendeth there the fault of the richer Corinthians in that they did exclude or at the least not expect the poorer sorte to eate the vsuall supper with them when they met to gether to receiue the blessed Sacrament but giueth no precept to them that all that are present should euerie time they did meete in the Church actually receiue the communion with the Preist or that the Preist ougth not in anie case to celebrate without a competent number of communicants which is our question in this place but at the most S. Paule there ordaines that when the people comes together to eate either the vsuall and common supper or the bodie and bloude of Christ in the Sacrament they vncharitablie exclude not or preuent one an other but expect and doe it with order and sobrietie and like brethren together without scisme or separation and as Christ himselfe did who imparted his supper most louinglie to his disciples there present without exception of persons to which altho' I admit the same S. Paule in parte alludes in his first verse of this chapter saying be you followers of me as I also of Christ yet not in that sense as if he had persuaded the Corinthians that our Sauiour commaunded that the Eucharist should neuer be celebrated by the Preist alone with our receiuers as our aduersarie foundlie infers for profe of the article he opposeth to the Councell of Trent Neyther is the doctrine of that article in anie sorte fauoured by S. Augustin in his 118. Epistle cited by Sir Humfrey he onelie there affirming at the most that the Apostle speaketh of the Eucharist when he saith those wordes Propter quod fratres cum conuenitis ad manducandum inuicem expectate c. That is in English Therefore my brethren when you come to eate expect one an other c. Which wordes eyther of S. Augustin or those of the Apostle are not contrarie to the celebration of priuate Masses except it be in the imagination of the Nouellists as I haue sufficientlie aboue declared To omit that the greater parte of diuines both auncient moderne expounde not those wordes of S. Paule rather of the Eucharist but of the common supper the trueth of which exposition the text itselfe in my iudgemēt doth plainely conuince Yet not to stand vpon this it is sufficient for the defence of the doctrine of the Councell of Trent in this particular and confutation of the contrarie position that neyther in the cited place of S. Paule nor in anie other place of scripture priuate communion
or receiuing of the Preist alone without other cōpanie is affirmed to be repugnant to Christs institution nor condemned as vnlawfull eyther by Sainct Augustin or anie other Orthodox writer But yet I must further aduertise the reader that I perceiue Sir Humfrey hath not dealte so faithfully as he ought to haue in his recitall of S. Paules wordes putting in by parenthesis and in the same letter those to eate the lords supper which wordes neuerthelesse S. Paule hath not at the least in that place and then omiting the first wordes of the next verse he connecteth them with the latter parte of the same verse to wit that you come not together to iudgement Procuring by this fraude to persuade his reader that those wordes containe the penaltie due to those whoe communicate not with the Preist and the rest of the people which directly they doe not but rather the punishment amenaced by the Apostle to such as by excluding vncharitably ther fellowes from participation of the oblations or common supper then vsed in the Church and by other abuses and sinnes mentioned in this Epistle indignelie receiue the bodie bloud of Christ in the Eucharist And yet not to stand vpon these particular circumstances certaine it is that none of them could yeald anie warrant at all for Sir Humfrey to alter the tenour of the Apostles wordes either by addition or transposition of them Sir Humfrey addeth also that Sainct Paule 1. Cor. 10. calleth the Eucharist the communion But he might haue saued labour in citing scripture the commonly receiued phrase both by vs and them being sufficient to prooue that And yet he might much better haue spared the interpretation of the worde it selfe for whether his etimology be true or false which I will not stand to examen certaine it is that no iudicious man can thence inferre that all the people present at Masse must of necessity communicate but it onely foloweth that when they actually receiue the Sacramēt they receiue the Communion as a common vnion not onely of Preist people but also and ceefly of the people among themselues according to the wordes of the same Apostle in his next chapter and 33. verse cum conuenitis when you come together to eate expect one-another c. And much like as he did proceede in the former place of S. Paule so doth he in this The cup of blessing which we blesse is it not the communion of the bloud of Christ Where for communication he puts communion And yet the scope and sense of the Apostle in this place is not of the communion of Preist and people nor prescribes he anie rule in that nature but onelie reprehendes those who voluntarily and without ignorance eate idolothytes or meates sacrifyced to Idols saying that as those who receiue the bodie and bloud of Christ comunicate or are ioyned in societie with him so they who of knowledge eate things offered to Idols are made companions of the deuill And therefore the same Apostle in the latter parte of his 20. verse saith thus And I will not haue you become fellowes to deuils And presentlie in the next verse he addes You can not drinke the chalis of our Lord and the chalis of deuils So that the whole tenour of the chapter afordeth not a worde or letter for Sir Humfreyes purpose Wherefore let him examen his conscience diligentlie and he will easilie finde that neyther the one place nor the other proue anie thing else in this matter then his owne dishonest dealing and his abuse of the sacred text of scripture Especiallie considering that in the first place the Apostle reprehendes not the Corinthians so much because they did not communicate together but cheefelie because the rich did vnchristianlie exclude the poore Which case as the reader may easilie perceiue hath no place in the Masses of the Roman Church where none are excluded but rather expresselie exhorted vnto the communion as the verie same decree of the Tridentine Councel which our aduersarie him produces doth sufficientlie declare in these wordes Optaret quidem sacrosancta Synodus c. The Sacrosaint Synod could wish that the faithfull people which assiste at euerie masse would communicate with the Preist not onelie spirituallie but also by Sacramentall reception Thus the Councel Which wordes alone doubtlesse were sufficient not onelie to iustifie the practise of the present Roman Church in this particular but also to satisfie the aduerse parte if their importunitie were not so exobbitant that they will rather suffer pore Christians to passe out of the world without that diuine viaticum ordained by God for the confort of their soules defense against their enimies in that dāgerous trance then suffer them to receiue it without a competent number as they tearme it which impious order of theirs may be seene in their booke of common prayer title of the communion of the sicke not obstanding our Sauiours most strict and generall charge affirming that vnlesse we eate his flesh and drinke his bloud we cannot haue life in vs. But certaine it is that in this as is in other matters the pretensiue reformers may ritelie be compared to the Pharisees exolantes culicem camelum autem glucientes I who straine a gnat and swallowe a camel in that they stande so peremptorilie vpon the communion of the people with the Preist in all occasions which is but a circumstance of the precept and yet make no scruple of violating the precept itselfe euen in time of it greatest necessitie and obligation But this I speake onelie vpon supposition their communion were sounde and according to Christs instition for taking it as it is the want of it is no losse to the not receiuers of it and so I leaue them to the generall liberty they vsurpe as well in this as in other matters of Religion and auncient practise of the Church Furthermore the knight citeth the coūcell of Nāts to proue his tenet but most ridiculously For that there is not a worde touching the cōmuniō in all that text which he citeth Definiuit Sanctum Conciliū vt nullus presbyter praesumat solus missam cantare Cassander p. 83. And the trueth is the councell onely reprehendeth the saying of Masse with out a clarke or Minister as it seemes some cloisters of monkes did accustome to doe in those times so you see this is quite out of the purpose as is also another citation out of Innocent the third libr. 2. c. 24. Illos igitur Angelos quos habemus in oratione participes habemus in glorificatione consortes Innoc lib. 2. 24. fine he onely saying that it is piously to be beleeued that the Angells of God doe assist at Masse accompaning those that praie Not speaking a worde good or bad of the communion of the people in that place Lastlie Sir Humfrey alledgeth the testimonies of diuerse Romanists which hee calleth the confession of his aduersaries that priuate Masse was altogether vnknowne to the primatiue Church
Sacraments was no other then the faith of the vniuersall Church also the verie same which by the generall consent of schoole diuines in later ages hath binne taught preached euen by those of the Grecian Church as by the testimonie of Hieremie the late Patriarch of Constantinople in his answer to the Augustan Confession doth plainelie appeere where the septenarie number of Sacraments is expresselie maintained against the Lutherans as his wordes here quoted in the margent clearelie testifie with shame enuffe to the reformed brothers for thus he saith Sacramēta verò ritusque in hac ipsa Catholica recte sententium Christianorum Ecclesia sunt septem Baptisma Chrysma sancti vnguenti diuina communio manusimpositio matrimonium Paenitentia sacrum Oleum Et statim Quod vero haec sola sint nec plura numero etiā diuisione clarum fit c. Patriarcha Constantinop Res ad Doctores Wittemb fol. 11. Truelie the Sacraments rites in this same Catholike Church of right vnderstanding Christians are seuen Baptisme chrisme of holie oyntment the diuine communion imposition of handes Matrimonie Pennance and sacred oyle c. But the knight goeing yet further in the proofe of his duall number telleth his reader that the two Sacraments which his Church defends are properlie Sacraments because they haue element and institution but the other fine are not such because they want eyther of these But to this I answere that the fiue Sacraments which the reformers reiect haue not onelie this which Sir Humfrey requires to his two defaced Sacraments but also besides this they haue promise of iustificant grace which according to the description he maketh heere his two doe want and so I retort his prrofe vpon him For if our fiue be not properlie Sacraments because in his conceipt they want institution and element surelie neither are his two properlie Sacraments because they want grace as being but signes or elements instituted by God not giuing grace both according to his former declaration Caluin Instit lib. 4. cap. 14. 15. and also in the common doctrine of the reformers And so we see that the knightes discourse touching the propertie of his two ministeriall elements is but a gracelesse peice of doctrine especiallie considering that if he had binne but halfe so conuersant in our diuines as he will needes seeme to be he might most easilie haue found both institution element and grace annexed to all those fiue Sacraments which he renounceth which Catholike diuines altho' they doe not all agree in the assignation of the seuerall matters and formers of the same yet doe they neuerthelesse with great conformitie consent in the number generall definition of them to wit that they are all externall and sensible signes which by diuine institution haue the promise of iustifying grace annexed And least the knight take exceptions and complaine that I doe not satisfiie his argument my selfe but remit him to others for an answere I will breiflie shewe out of scripture both the institution and element of euerie one of the foresaid fiue Sacraments in particular Confirmation therefore was instituted by Christ in those places of scripture where he promiseth to his Apostles the Holie Ghost after his ascension as S. Iohn the 16.5 Luke the 24.48 which collation of the holie Ghost was exercised by the Apostles Act. 10. 19. by imposition of hands after they had receaued the same holie Ghost by that extraordinarie manner which is described Act. 2. which impositiō togither with the words vsed Act. 8. whē they prayed for thē on whom they put their hands are the matter and forme of this Sacrament And now heere we see both the institution and the element in this Sacrament which is all Sir Humfrey requireth of vs and so I will say vnto him that which S. Hierome said to his aduersaries the Luciferians the 4. chap. Si quaeris quare in Ecclesia baptizatus non nisi per manus Episcopi accipit Spiritum Sanctum disce hanc obseruationem exea authoritate descendere quod post ascensionem Domini Spiritus ad Apostolos descendit That is to say If thow doest aske me why he that is baptized doth not receaue the holie Ghost but by the hands of the Bishop learne that this obseruation descended from that authoritie that after the ascension of our Lord the Spirit descended vpon the Apostles Secondlie the Sacrament of Penance hath both element and institution the element is the acts of the penitent declared by sensible words or signes the institution is the collation of power conferred by Christ to remitte sinnes to his Apostles and in them to all true Preistes according to that of the 20. of Saint Iohn Receaue yee the holie Ghost whole sinnes you shall forgiue they are forgiuen and whose sinnes you shall retaine they are retayued In which words both the institution and the element be sufficientlie declared especiallie if we ioyne the declaration of the Church without which euen those two which the reformers hould for Sacramēts cānot be conuinced to be truly and properlie such if one were obstinately disposed Thirdlie in the Sacrament of Extreme Vnction both the element and institution are plainelie enough found in the 5. chap. of S. Iames where the Apostle sayth If anie man be sick among you let him bring in the Priestes of the Church and let them pray ouer him annointing him with oyle in the name of our Lord and the prayer of faith shall saue the sick and our Lord shall lift him vp and if he be in sinnes they shalbbe remitted him In which place to the externall signes of prayer and oyle remission of finnes is annexed as the reader may plainelie perceiue which effect euen according to the doctrine of the reformers themselues as I suppose cannot be found but onelie in such ceremonies as properlie are instituted by Christ himselfe for Sacraments Fourthlie the like I say of Order the substance of which is so plainelie conteyned in the scriptures Vid. Cal. l. 3. Inst c. 4. §. 20. c. 19. §. 31. that some of the greatest reformers haue not had the face to exclude it out of the number of the Sacraments of the new lawe and the places of Scripture which conuince the truth of it are 1. Timo. 4. and 2. Thimothie 1. where both the sensible element which is the imposition of hands and the effect of grace annexed are cleerlie described which effect I thinke our aduersaries confesse cannot be possiblie conferred but onelie by Gods authoritie and institution The wordes of the Apostle are these in the first place Doe not neglect the grace which is in the which was giuen the by prophesie with the imposition of the hands of preisthood In the second place the wordes are these For which cause I admonish the to resuscitate the grace of God which is in the by the imposition of my handes Now lastlie concerning Matrimonie a mā might iustlie maruell that our new Euāgelistes should
make anie question of it in this nature For supposing their extraordinarie affection that way and that single life is so vnsauourie to them that if it lay in their power they would rather suffer the whole quire of virgins to perish then they would make a religious vowe of perpetuall chastitie or liue without a woman supposing this I say in my opinion they ought in all reason sooner to haue honoured matrimonie with the title of a Sacrament then to haue quite depriued it of that which the scripture it selfe doth giue it Yet supposing they be so preposterous that they will rather impugne that which they otherwise loue best then seeme to agree to the Romane doctrine I tell them all and particularilie him with whome I dispute that although mariage was by God himselfe onelie ordayned in paradise as a ciuill contract Neuerthelesse Christe who came not to dissolue the lawe but to eleuate it to a higher degree of perfection amongst other things he pleased to honore the same with the true nature and properties of a Sacrament giuing also tho' not immediatlie by himselfe yet by his Apostle S. Paul the verie name and title of a Sacrament whereas notwithstanding neyther he himselfe nor anie of his Apostles or Euangelists euer gaue that name to anie of the rest of the Sacraments Wherefore to come nearer to the purpose I say that the institution of this Sacrament was by Christe himselfe who in the 19. chapter of S. Mathewe ordayned the coniunction of man wife to be inseperable to the end it so might be a sacred signe of the indissoluble coniunction of Christe and his Church as it is declared by the Apostle Ephes 5. where he expreslie giueth it the name of a great Sacrament in regard of the sacred coniunction partelie by the hypostaticall vnion and partelie by the vnion of charitie betwixt Christe and his spouse the Church which it signifieth Which foresaid coniunction of man and wife explicated by words of the present tense is the element and Christs ordinance and application of the same to the foresaid signification is the institution by virtue of which it also conferreth grace to the receiuers to the end they may liue in that perpetuall vnion of mindes which is required to the representation of the inseperable vnion of Christe and his Church which is all and more then our aduersarie himselfe demaunded of vs before in this particular matter To which if we adde the authoritie of the Church and auncient fathers for the interptetation of those scriptures which we haue produced for proofe of the truth of this and the rest of the foresaid fiue Sacraments which authorities of the fathers if need required and the place did serue for them I could easilie produce it would yet more plainelie appeere with how little reason the pretensiue reformed Congregations doe exclude them out of the number of true and proper Sacraments And so now according to this a verie easie answere may be framed to all that which the knight bringeth against the septenarie number of Sacraments in the rest of this paragraph and particularilie to the testimonies of those Romane authours and Fathers which he produceth in fauour of his cause And first touching the Fathers which hee citeth besides that which hath binne alreadie spoken I further adde that there was not one of them which was of the reformers opinion in this matter as is most apparent in that Sir Humfrey himselfe could not produce so much as one Father that auerreth the onelie duall number of Sacraments Nay they are so farre ftom this that there is not one of them who doth not in one place or other make expresse mention of more then two if professedlie they make mention of anie at all Secondlie I say that as the reformers cannot with anie probabilitie inferre out of those Fathers who affirmed that the two Sacraments Baptisme and the Eucharist haue flowed out of the side of Christe that there are no more nor lesse then two so neyther can they in anie sort thence inferre that the same Fathers taught not the septenarie number of Sacraments And more then this if the reformers stand vpon this so much that the Fathers by the bloud which issued out of our Sauiours side vnderstood the Sacrament of the bloud of Christe then they must consequentlie eyther confesse that the same Fathers held the reall presence of the bloude of Christe in the Eucharist which yet they themselues denie or else at the least that the reformed Churches haue no true Sacrament at all for that according to their confession there is in it neyther bloud nor bone And out of this generall answere to the testimonies of the auncient Fathers we may inferre how falselie Sir Humfrey in the end of his 149. page affirmeth that they did insist sometimes in the number of two and so restrayned the Church to the definite number of two onelie which saying of his is a manifest falsitie and iniurious to those Fathers whome he so chargeth as that which I haue produced out of S. Augustine in this period doth plainelie conuince in these fiue Sacraments which the reformers denie Neyther was he able to produce one testimonie out of anie of them for proofe of his fayned position but so leaueth it vnconfirmed more then with that fame vntruth by which he belyeth most impudentlie the foresaid Fathers all at a clappe Neyther hath that which he further addeth of the same Fathers in the next page anie greater truth or foundation then this where he sayth that had the Fathers beleeued that those fiue Sacraments had binne instituted by Christe they would of necessitie haue concluded them for true and proper Sacraments and haue easilie found in them the number of seuen Thus in effect Sir Humfrey discourseth to which I answere first that doubtles if the Fathers had had but halfe the occasion which the Church hath had since their time and especiallie since the foundation of the reformed Churches they would of necessitie haue treated and spoken expresselie of the septenarie number and haue distinguished as now the Church and diuines doe betwixt proper and improper Sacraments But the occasion fayling they neyther had necessitie nor conueniencie to speake otherwise of them then they haue donne Nay some of them especiallie those who writ against the Gentiles were rather obliged by the course of those times not to mention the secret misteries of our faith at all then to reueale them to the profaners of them more then was preciselie necessarie for the answere of their obiections Vid. Theodoret Dial. 2. which indeed is the true reason why diuerse of the foresaid more auncient Fathers haue spoken so obscurelie and sparinglie euen of some of the cheife misteries of Christian Religion Secondlie I say that howsoeuer the auncient Fathers spoke of the expresse number of the Sacraments certaine it is they eyther expreslie taught or at the least supposed for certaine doctrine of faith that all those which
Councell doe consequentlie affirme that the seruice and prayer in the reformed Churches in the vulgar tongue was better for the edification of the Church For it is manifest out of the verie same place cited by our aduersarie himselfe that the Councell of Trent doth command that the Pastours doe frequently expoūd some parte of those things which are read in the Masse not for that it hauing decreed the contrarie could possiblie hold it better to haue the Masse in a vulgar language then otherwise but because that supposing for other reasons it was better for the Church the Masse should not be in a vulgar tongue and that besides this it includeth matter of great instruction for the faithfull people therefore the Councell prudentlie decreed not for one onelie but for both these causes that it should oftentimes by the Pastours and Preists be declared to the common people for their greater edification and better vnderstanding of the doctrine contayned in it And this is all that in substance the Councell eyther sayth or from the wordes of the decree can be trulie inferred and so that from the Romanists owne confession it can be gathered that the seruice and prayer in the vulgar tongue was better for the edification of the Church is but such a dreame as Sir Humfrey vseth to haue the night before whensoeuer he citeth the Councell of Trent in fauour of the reformed doctrine After this the knight endeuoureth to proue that the Masse ought not to be celebrated in a silent and vnknowne voyce because sayth he the Apostles were cōmanded to showe forth the Lords death till his comming and to this end he citeth Haymo vpon the 14. chapter of the firste to the Corinth and Iustinian the Emperour in Nou. Const out of Cassander also the Greg. Decet Tit. 31. de Off. Iud. Ord. cap. 14. But to this I answere that both the knights reason and the testimonies of these authours are impertinent because the command layd vpon the Apostles was not that in this misterie they should shewe forth Christs death in words but principallie indeedes and therefore our Sauiour in the institution of the Eucharist did not bid his Apostles say it in remembrance of him but doe it in remembrance of him Hoc facite in meam commemorationem Otherwise the Sectaries themselues should be conuinced to violate Christes commaundement since that those who receiue their communion say not one worde In like manner let the reader veiw and vnderstand perfectlie the sense of the the wordes cited out of other authours and he will easilie perceaue there is not one sillable in them against Latine seruice or prayer as condemning it eyther for vnlawfull in itselfe or otherwise contrarie to the commandement of God Haymo doth onelie comment vpon that passage of sainct Paul 1. Cor 14. If I am ignorant of the virtue of the voyce I shall be to him to whome I speake barbarous onelie declaring in playner words that which the Apostle speaketh breiflie and obscurelie but sayth not a worde against the office of the Church in Latin Iustinian if anie such constitution he made of which it is much doubted by reason this clause is not founde in the auncient translation neither is it expounded by Cuiacio ordaineth onelie in generall that Bishops and Preists celebrate the oblation and minister the Sacraments of Baptisme and the Eucharist non tacito modo not secretlie but with a lowde voice but he speaketh not in particular of all partes of the Masse and at the least he speaketh not of the Canon except he meanes of the wordes of consecration which the Romanists doe not denie but the Grecians haue a custome of pronouncing them loude And as for other partes of the Masse the most of them are pronounced commonlie in the Romane Church so that the auditours may heere And according to this Iustinian peraduenture might aduise the Preistes of his time to doe when neuerthelesse it is certaine the Masse was in no vulgar language The decretalls speake not of anie vulgar tongue but onelie of Greeke and Latin as the decree of Innocent the third which may be seene in the ninth chap. of the Generall Councell of Lateran doth declare Neyther doth the Roman Church so strictlie command that the publike seruice be ministred in the Latine tongue that she doth condemne eyther the Greeke or Syrian Church for vsing the Grecian or Caldaian tongue in the diuine offices or publike seruice but onelie commandeth as more couenient that they be not performed in a vulgar language Lastly Sir Humfrey citeth some eight or nine Romanists who confesse sayth he that in the first ages publike prayers were vsed for the vnderstāding of the people But to omit that he vseth no great sinceritie in the citation and translatiō of the testimonies of some of the authours he citeth in this paragraph as may appeere particularlie in the quotation of Waldensis I say not to stand here vpon this which I shall more conuenientlie examen afterwardes I answere that those authours affirme that which we doe not denie to wit that perhaps which worde Sir Humfrey deceitfullie leaues out in his translation of S. Tho. testimonie cited out of his 3. lection vpon 1. Cor. 14. In 1. Cor. 14. lect 3. the case of the primitiue Church was different from the practise of the ptesent time in this matter yet withall the same authours doe affirme that the alteration was made vpon iust causes which causes are so sufficientlie deliuered by Bellarmine and others euen those whome the knight heere citeth that I need not rehearse their reasons they being so easilie to be found as they are to those that reade their bookes And altho ' sainct Thomas aduertiseth his reader that it might haue seemed madnesse in the primitiue Church to haue performed all the Ecclesiasticall offices in the Latine tongue for that they were rude ignorāt in the rites of the Church and ceromonies yet doth he adde that now all are so well instructed that tho' it be in Latine the people vnderstands what is donne in the Church whose saying is most true at least in generall yea and in particular so farre as is necessarie for euerie person state and vocation for that throu ' the diligence of their pastours and preachers and their owne industrie they may haue sufficient instruction Howbeit that if it were necessarie for euerie one that prayes or sings to vnderstand all they say the Puritans themselues might put vp their pipes it being most certainely true that there be manie things in the psalmes which they sing so merilie and in the scriptures which they read so readilie Conscquitur ergo Canonem clare aperte legendū vt ad gratiarum actionem Sacerdotis populus respōdeat Amen Cassander ex Gerardo Lorichio p. 65. which by reason of their great obscuritie they cannot possiblie vnderstand euen in their owne mother tongue And from hence I passe to a breefe Suruey of the rest of the authors cited
in this paragraph among which I finde Cassander in the first rancke of corruption for altho' the testimonies which Cassander cites doe not proue fully his intent yet is it euident by the wordes of those he produceth that he speakes in that places of the Canon of the Masse especiallie when he sayes in the title of his chapter canonicam precem c. And Sir Humfrey translates it not the Canō of the Masse as he ought to haue done but Canonicall prayers so odious and reformidable vnto him is the reporte of that great Canon that he durst not name it Moreouer the testimonie of Cassander is detorted by Sir Humfrey quite from the sense in which he speakes it For he speakes not there of the vulgar tongue one worde but whether the Canon of the Masse ought to be pronounced with a lowde voyce especiallie the consecration that the people may heare it and anser Amen And the same I or Cassander forme me anser to the constitution of Iustinian which Cassander himselfe alledges to that same purpose and in no other sense And so in like manner the wordes of the Decretals are violentlie drawe to a sense repugnant to the authors meaning that is from doctrinall tongues to vulgar languages To the wordes of Lyra if he had dealt sincerelie Sir Humfrey ought to haue added those which immediatlie ensue and explicate his minde more clearelie Sed postquam populus multiplicatus fuit consueuit se conformare ministris Ecclesiae vtpote stando cum dicitur Euangelium deposito caputio adorando Eucharistiam consimilia fiunt in Ecclesia Latina in Latino sufficit quod Clericus respondeat pro populo expeditius enim fit hoc modo quam in vulgati But since the people increased and is accustomed to conforme it selfe to the ministers of the Church to wit by standing at the Gospell by puting of their bonet to adore the Eucharist and such like are done in the Latine Church in Latin and it is sufficient that the clearke ansers for the people for it is thus more readilie performed then in the vulgar tōgue Lyr. in 1. Cor. 14. Which wordes are so plaine against Sir Humfrey in diuers respects that he may be ashamed to heare them Belethus cited out of Cassander to proue that seruice and prayer must be in the vulgar language is abused by them both Inde etiam inoleuit vsus vel laudabilis cōsuetudo in Ecclesia vt pronūtiato literaliter Euāgelio statim in vulgari populo exponeretur Belet in Proae Exp. diuinorum offic For Belethus expresselie supposeth that the Masse and office of the Preist are in Latine and therefore euen in this same place and euen in some of the wordes cited by Cassander he mentioneth a laudable custome of some places an which sayth he the Gospell being pronounced it is presentlie expounded in the vulgar tongue Now if it were read in the Masse by the Preist in the vulgar tongue then it had beene vaine for Belethus yea and impertinent to haue made mention of that custome in the entrance of his worke of expounding the diuine offices for the vse of the lesse learned sorte of the Clergie as he professeth to vndertake It is true he hath in the same passage that it was prohibited to speake with tongues without an interpreter but that is nothing els but the very same which the Apostle himselfe declared 1. Cor. 14. vnderstanding by tongues the miraculous speech of strange languages which the speakers them selues did not vnderstand aboute which saith this author there was in the Primatiue Church a prohibition except it were with an interpreter And this is that which by accomodation Belethus applyes to the argument of his booke by way of Prologue In the rehearsall of D. Hardings wordes Sir Humfrey takes onelie those which testifie that in the Primatiue Church prayers were in the vulgar language But he leaues out the iuste reasons which the Doctor alledges for the alteration of the same made by the authoritie of the Church euen with in the first foure hundreth yeares as also he omits those pregnant proofes which he brings to showe that six hundreth yeares after Christ the seruice of the Church was in no other language then in Greeke or Latine By all which the reader may perceiue this author is not sincerelie dealt with in this passage that which yet will more plainelie appeare if he will please to see his anser to Iewels chalenge the 3. article The testimonie of Waldensis is vsed by Cassander onely to proue that diuine seruice or Masse ought to be pronounced with an intelligible voyce that the people may anser Amen but not to proue that the publike office must be in vulgar language and so it is impertinent Honorius cited by Sir Humfrey page 193. is falsified in regarde he is alledged for the cause of the alteration of the ancient custome of the vse of seruice in a knowne tongue For that author speakes not a word of the vulgar language but onely of the secret pronoūcing of the Canon which was decreed saith he I knowe not howe truely by occasion of a strange accident which happend in times past touching that matter Vnde sinodali decreto sub anathemate est praeceptum vt nullus Canonem nisi in libro in sacris vestibus super altare super sacrificium legat In which words I knowe not what linx except our Egleeyd Humfrey can see seruice in the vulgar tongue Gretzer is abused both in sense and wordes In sense because he speakes onely of the Latin tongue and of that time when it was either vulgar or very common to manie nations and yet the knight applyes his speech to proue that publike seruice ought to be deliuered in the vulgarly knowne tongue of euerie nation and at all times not contenting himselfe with lesse then this In wordes he doth also abuse Gretzerus for that he cites them neither intirely nor consequenter in English omitting or at the least altering those which haue relation to the authors precedent sentence to wit hinc illae exhortationes c. hence are those exhortations of the Fathers c. and also others before them which he ought to haue rehearsed compleatly because they are to the same purpose I will put the whole tenour of his wordes in the margen that the reader may more plainely see the fraude Latini Patres quos citat Whitakerus loqunn tur De eo tēpore quo lingua Latina erat multis gētibus vulgaris aut valde cōmunis hinc omnes simul psallebant Missae linguae populo nota celebātur quia Latina lingua erat omnibus vel plerisque nota Hincillae Patrū exhortationes vt omnes simul psallant vtque faciant attēte intelligibiliter vocēque suam cum Sacerdotum vocibus coniungant Quae admonitiones iustissimae erant quādoquidem lingua auditoribus non ignosa omnia peragebātur cōsuetudo ita ferebat vt tota ecclesia simul
will turne Iewes or Turkes they ought not to take those wordes in that rigorous sense which they doe for so by consequence if they tye themselues so strictlie to the letter of the text they must doe the same in the commaundement of the Sabaoth and so they will be come Sabatizing Iewes indeed Wherefore except Sir Humfrey will turne plaine Talmudist he can proue nothing against Christians out of the foresayd wordes Now touching authorities of auncient Fathers he confesseth that hee for beareth to cite anie in particular and what soeuer he falselie pretendeth the true reason was because he founde none to cite except hee had produced such places as they vse onelie against the idolatrie of Gentils and Ethnikes as Chamier lib. 21. de imag Daniell Chamier and others of the reformed Doctours commonlie doe which places neuer the lesse secluding their owne glosses vpon them doe not in anie sorte fauore their cause And so Sir HuÌ„frey insteede of Fathers hee cites Iewes and Gentils in whose doctrine touching this point hee showeth himselfe to be more conuersant then in Christian writers as finding more for his purpose in them then in these and therefore also as I imagin hee vseth no other answere to Bellarmin affirming that the making of images is not absolutelie prohibited by the lawe of God because God commaunded images to be made the knight I say vseth no other anser then the anser of the Iewes to wit that God did laye a generall commaunde vpon them and not vpon himselfe and so I say no more of it but leaue to the reader to iudge howsolid and good such an ansere may be and whether it sauoreth not much more of Iudaisme then of Christian religion True it is hee cites diuers authours which haue writ since the Councel of Francford but some of theÌ„ as Agrippa Erasmus Cassander Chemnitius are of no authority with vs others are suspected of corruptioÌ„ I meane to haue ben corrupted by malignant publishers as Polidor Virgil and Agobardus Others are impertineÌ„tlie alledged in regarde they eyther speake onelie of the image of God himselfe as Philo Iudeus and S. Augustin or of the manner of worship not of the substance of the honor as Peresius Bellarmin Wicelius Hincmarus for that they eyther onelie condemne the adoration of pictures takeing the word adoration for that kinde of honour which is due vnto God onelie or els they speake onelie of the priuate errous of some simple people of which sorte is Polidor Biel when they reprehend the abuses and superstitions of some simple people who out of ignorance giue more honour to images then eyther they ought to doe or the Church alloweth yet doth Polidor expresselie approue of due honour of the same as his owne wordes declare euen in those places where he vseth that reprehension for thus he saith after he had made relation of diuers images of Christ and his Apostles mentioned by Eusebius and others euen in the most primatiue yeares of the Church Hinc igitur natum vt merito tam ipsi Saluari quaÌ„ eiâ—diuis statuas in templis poni venerationi haberi consueuerit Polid lib. 6. cap. 5. Hence therefore grewe the vse of putting in Churches and honoring as well the statues of our Sauiour as his Saincts And he adds Ecquis igitur tam dissolutus tamque audacia praeditus est qui velit possitne dubitare seu aliter somniare ne dicam sentire vel cogitare de imaginum cultu ac demum sit tot longe Sanctissimorum Patrum decreto constitutum By which wordes it is manifestly conuinced that is other wordes razed by order of the Index haue either beene foisted in by the new sectaries to wit those which auerre that till the time of S. Hierome all the auncient Fathers reiected worship of images for feare of idolatrie or els he meanes onelie that they durst not practice the same least their action might seeme idolatrous either to the ignorant Gentils or to such as were then latelie conuerted from Gentilisme and as yet but infirme in faith and easilie scandalized in this nature All which neuerthelesse cannot possible preiudice the doctrine and practice of the Church it selfe in generall So that neither anie of these authours seuerallie nor all of them together proue that absolutelie to honore the images of Christ and his saints is wicked or blasphemous which is the assertion the knight here maintaines and yet he is not ashamed to call their testimonies the confession of his aduersaries among which also that his impudencie might more clearelie appeare he foysteth in to that rancke Bellarmin and Vasquez which authours if the reader be not ouer grosselie ignorant he will easilie perceiue at the least by the rest of their workes that they cannot truelie fauore Sir Humfreys tenets in this point of Controuersie they hauing both writ professedly of it against the reformers doctrine and in defense of the practise of the Roman Church touching the vse and honour of images And as for the Emperours Valens and Theodosius whome he citeth out of Crinitus saying they made proclamation to all Christians against the images of Christ It is false that those two Emperours euer published anie decree against the images of Christ but expresselie in honour of of the same by establishing by lawe that the image of the Crosse of Christ should not be framed vpon the ground as vpon the stones of sepulchers or graues where it might easilie be prophaned by the feet of those that passed ouer them and that this is the trueth of that passage of those two Emperours or at the least of Theodosius Crinitus his verie wordes would haue plainelie declared if they had not shrunke in the wetting I meane if they had ben intirelie related by the knight who is not the first that hath corrupted the tenour of Theodosius his lawe by leauing out the worde humi vpon the grounde for the wordes of the foresaid lawe being thes let not the Crosse of Christ be painted vpon the grounde or some such like by leauing out the wordes vpon the grounde the sense as you see cometh to be quite contrarie that is the sense falleth out to be this let not the Crosse of Christ be painted which trick of the sectaries was discouered long since by Alanus Copus in his 4. Dialogue the 11. chap. to their vtter shame and discredit And yet besides this I maruell greatelie that either Sir Humfrey or his predecessours offer to make vse of the foresaid wordes of the lawe which as they are cited by him are so generall that they quite coÌ„demne the practice of the reformed brothers themselues none or verie few of them being as yet mounted to that degree of puritie as expresselie to proclame a generall lawe against the pictures of Christ as not to be painted or grauen at all and so I conclude that either those wordes of the two Emperours are to be read as the Romanists doe vse to read them and
the temporall punishment due to sinnes which is that we call the power of Indulgences of which generall power graunted to Preists we haue diuers testimonies of Fathers and particularlie of S. Aug. who vpon those wordes iudicium datum est Apoc. 20. Sayth Non hoc putandum est de vltimo Iudicio dici sed sedes Praepositorum est ipsi Praepositi intelligendi sunt per quos Ecclesia nunc gubernatur Iudicium autem datum nullum melius accipiendum videtur quam id quod dictum est quae ligaueritis in terra ligata erunt in Caelo quae solueritis in terra soluta erunt in Caelo â—ug lib. 2. â—e Ciuit. c. â—9 idem â—…act 49. â—… Ioan. â—…d tract â—… Vide etiaÌ„â—il can â—8 math â—… Hier. in â—…p 18. â—ath The like he hath vpon the Gosp of S. Ioh. Ideo cum processisset mortuus adhuc ligatus confitens adhucreus vt soluerentur peccata eius ministris hoc dixit Dominus soluite illum sinite abire quid est soluite sinite abire Quae solueritis in terra soluta sunt in caelis S. Ambrose also speaking of the same power l. 1. de Paenit c. 2. saith Deus distinctionem non facit qui misericordiam suam promisit omnibus relaxandi licentiam Sacerdotibus suis fine vlla exceptione concessit God saith S. Ambrose makes no distinstion who promised his mercie to all gaue to his Preists licence to release without anie exception Neyther can anie reason be assigned why the pastours of the Church should haue power to applie the merits of the passion of Christ for remission of the guilt of the sinnes themselues with the eternall paine and yet not haue power to applie the same for the remission of the temporall punishment as due vnto them after the remission according to the order of Gods iustice as the eternall punishment was due before it especiallie considering that the temporall paine as being farre inferiour in nature and qualitie to the sinne itselfe it requires much lesse power and fewer conditions for its remission then doth the guilt of the sinne and eternall paine to the guilt annexed The other place of scripture is not onelie for the proofe of the power to graunt Indulgences but also of the practice of the same by S. Paule himselfe the 2. chapter of the second epistle to the Corinth where speaking to the same Corinthians he sayth of himselfe And whome you haue pardoned anie thing I also For my selfe also that which I pardoned if I pardoned anie thing for you in the person of Christ that we be not circumuented of Satam Which wordes altho' they be obscure in the Gramaticall construction yet doe they sufficientlie declare those partes and conditions which are found in such Indulgences as are now practiced in the Roman Church that is to say power in the collator or giuer pietie in the cause and grace in the receiuer S. Paule sheweth his authoritie in that he affirmeth he gaue perdon to the incestuous Corinthian in the person of Christ that is by authoritie from him receiued he sheweth the cause to haue beene the common profit of the Corinthians themselues to wit least they should be circumuented by the deuill so that they in the like occasion might fall in to desperation by ouer much rigour as the incestuous man might haue done if he had not beene pardoned in the performance of some parte of the punishment due to his offense Lastelie he in the precedent wordes sheweth the receiuer to haue beene in the state of grace in that he signifieth his sorowe and pennance to haue beene so great that he was readie to haue beene swalowed vp by the excesse of it And so by this we may perceiue howe deceitfullie Sir Humfrey proceedeth in his 220. page where he insinuateth that S. Paule in the place now cited did onelie release the incestuous Corinthian from the bonde of excomunication whereas indeede the Apostle did not onelie that but also did absolue him from that temporall punishment affliction in which if he had pleased he might haue constreined him to continue longer and so supplyed by his authoritatiue and suffragatorie pardon that parte of satisfaction which otherwise remained to haue beene performed by the continuation of the punishment imposed and due to the penitent according to the exaction of Gods iustice he supplyed it I saie by application of the merits or satisfactions of Christ which application also and not onelie the authoritie by which sainct Paule did it is included in those wordes in the person of Christ Theod. in 2. Cor. 2. That which by the comentarie of Theodoret vpon this passage doth plainelie appeere who discreetlie noteth that saint Paul is said here to pardone the incestuous Corinthians sinne because it was greater then his pennance And S. Ambrose lib. 2. de Paenit cap. 2. speaking of the same matter saith of S. Paule Donauit Corintho peccatum per paenitentiam And a little after Etenim qui de remittenda praedicauit paenitentia debuit de ijs qui iterandum putant Baptismum non silere By which testimonies of these two most famous and auncient authours Sir Humfreys euasion saying that the Apostle did onelie free the incestuous Corinthian from the bond of Excommunication doth euidentlie appeare to be false friuolous And thus we see that not onelie the relaxation of a punishment enioyned as the knight would haue it but also the same or very like forme of pardon which the RomaÌ„ Church vseth at this present tyme was practiced by S. Paule himselfe in the foresayd case And in trueth supposing at the least certaine receiued maximes of diuinitie which might easily be demoÌ„strated by scriptures if the place did serue for it to wit that after the guilt of sinne is remitted some temporall punishment remaineth which according to the exigence of iustice must be remoueed before the soule can attaine to perfect blessednesse either by iust indurance or mercifull remission and more ouer that the same temporall affliction which many suffer in this life euen after their sinnes be intirelie remitted is not for correction and commination onely as the sectaries doe friuolouslie contend as appeareth plainelie in the example of Dauid who altho' he knewe from the mouth of a Prophet that the guilt of his adultry was pardoned yet vnderstanding neuerthelesse by the same Prophet that ther remained no smale punishment behinde to wit no lesse then the death of his dearest child and that as the scripture it selfe testifieth neither for correction nor commination onely but because by his scandalous actioÌ„ he had caused the enimies of God to blaspheme his name and as the text declareth in the 2. Booke of the Kings the 12. chapter propter verbum hoc that is for this thy fact taking word for action as it is most frequently taken in the scriptures and yet besides all this the same Dauid did voluntarie pennance composing
safer way to attribute them wholelie to God because although we will yet it is God that worketh in vs to worke All which is quite out of this matter serueth for nothing but to stoppe holes with a vaneflorish graunded onelie vpon the wordes safe way which the knight founde in S. Augustin to sounde to his owne tune ther vpon founded a verball argument And the like dictionariall maner of proofe doth he vse wherby to showe his safer way in the points of priuate Masse communion in both kyndes but most rediculously For whereas he findeth in some of the Romanists that the Masse as being not onelie a sacrifice but also a Sacrament is both more commendablie administred more frutfullie receiued when both Preist people together are partakers of it Sir Humfrey applyeth this to the Raphsodie of the reformed Churches which neuerthelesse hath not a scrap in it either of true sacrifice or Sacrament but is onely a pore hungerie scamling of bread wine not conformable either to the forme of the ancient Lythurgies of S. Chrysostome or S. Basil nor euer heard on in the Christian world before the dayes of Luther and of so smale estimation euen among themselues that if it chance to fall they will scarce take paines to take it from the grounde as may appeare by a prittie passage of that nature which not manie yeares past I receiued from the mouth of one who was then of the ministrie what he is nowe I knowe not who tould me that coming in to a certaine Church the minister as he deliuered the communion to his parishoners did let a peace fall from him but there was not one in the whole congregation excepting a dogge that showed so much deuotion towardes their vnuenerable Sacrament as once to offer to take it from the grounde It is true he tould me with all that the honest minister by tasting a little to often of the cup was some what distempered in his head but that me thought was but a pore excuse for a man of his coate a teacher of reformed doctrine especiallie at such a tyme in such an occasion Which want of respect in the reformed brothers towards their communion doth yet further appeare if we compare it with the extraordinarie great diligence care which the Preists people vse in the Roman Church for the auoyding of all Kynde of irreuerence towardes the holie Eucharist as both the rubrickes of the Missal the ancient Canons dayly practice testifie in so much that one perhaps the cheefest reason of the restrainte of the Sacramentall Cup to the laytie was for the auoyding of such irreuerences as might easilie haue happened amōg such multitudes of people as vse to Communicate at one tyme in the Roman Church So that now we see it was great absurditie in Sir Humfrey to argue the greater saftie of the doctrine of his Church out of that which the Romanists speake onelie of their owne especiallie considering there is not one worde of safetie to be founde in anie of the places cited by him the authours of them not intending to show anie lesse safetie to be foūde either in the doctrine or practice of the Roman Church concerning priuate Masse single cōmunion but onelie at the most that some more spirituall profit would redounde to the people then nowe doth if either their deuotion were so farre extended as that in euerie Masse some would communicate or that the Church in other respects had greater reason to permit the vse of the Chalis to the laitie then not to permit it alwayes supposing as a certaine trueth that not withstanding in some respects the contrarie to that which is nowe practized might be more profitable yet that all circumstances considered that is the safest for mens consciences which is done according to the present custome of that Church which is knowne euen by our aduersaries to haue visibly succeeded from the Apostles at the least personallie is also knowne euen by Iewes gentils to be the most vniuersall Church in the Christian world And let this be sufficient to redargue the proceedings of the knight in this matter yet not omitting that two of the authours he citeth for Romanists to wit the Apostata Deane Cassander are not such that in the citation of Bellarmin he vseth one of his accustomed trickes whose wordes although he rehearseth them truelie in the margen yet he translateth them corruptedlie For whereas Bellarmin saith that the Masse in which communicants are present is more perfect legitimate ex hac parte that is in as much as it is ordained to the spirituall refectiō of the people the knight omitteth in his translation the wordes ex hac parte by that tricke doth notablie peruert Bellarmin's meaning making the reader beleeue he affirmed that absolutelie which neuerthelesse he did expresselie purposelie vtter with limitation with an intention to showe that altho' in one respect priuate masse is lesse perfect lesse conformable to the ancient custome of the Church in regarde of the profit of the people yet that absolutelie in it selfe it is as perfect lawfull as that in which communicants are present Furthermore touching the mariage of ministers Sir Humfrey sayth it will appeare by the confessions of the Romanists that it is the safer way to liue chastlie in matrimony thē by a single life to hazarde their soules by incontinēcie thus the knight which if he meanes of the ministers of his owne misreformed Church onelie I will easilie graunt that supposing their slipperie inclination to lecherie and the smale meanes they vse for mortification of the flesh conseruation of chastitie it is a safer way in my opinion for them to marrie then to liue a single life especillie considering they are no true Preists but onelie equiuocall Clergie men both in Order function that if they had not wiues it is to be doubted the maydes of their parishes would scarcelie liue with out danger among them But if Sir Humfrey speakes of Roman Preists which haue true vocation true ordination sacred function then I will say with diuers graue authors that if the Preists of the old testament obserued those dayes continencie in which they sacrificed by their turnes then ought the Preists of the new testament to obserue chastitie euerie day because they euerie day offer sacrifice Hier. ◠tit ◅os l. ◅fi c. ◅ ve◅ ◅ ◅ ca. ◅c And therefore the Roman Church hath most religiouslie ordained the lawe of perpetuall chastitie of Preists for that altho' perhaps it may seeme more safe for some particular persons to marrie supposing their negligence frayltie in that nature abstracting from a vowe alreadie made the lawe of the Church in that particular yet althings cōsidered for as much as euen the most inclined to vice may liue chaste with Gods grace if they will make vse of his gifts of such meanes as the
Church hath ordained for that end purpose it is to be iudged better safer greater honour to God that the whole state of Preisthood or Sacerdoce should be tyed with the sacred band of perpetuall chastitie â—…e non â—…ius â—…otes 〈◊〉 pluâ—…â—…orati â—…am 〈◊〉 salâ—…tur â—…cerdoâ—…â—…ugaâ—…â—…i in 〈◊〉 preâ—…atu â—…aÌ„tur â—…as 〈◊〉 l. 2 de 〈◊〉 con 〈◊〉 â—…nder Neither doth all nor anie of the authors which the knight citeth absolutelie confesse the contrarie to be safer then this but onelie they being but three in number one of them with a perhaps it were not worse an other with an it were good holesome the third who yet is no Romanist with a may be thought necessarie but showe their particular dictamens being so fewe as they bee thou ' they were the greatest Oracles in the world they could not possible cause anie safetie in the consciences of those who shall followe them against the streame of all other diuines nor can they in any true sense be sayd to be the confession of the Romanists as the knight doth affirme since that two or three cannot in anie case carie the name of the whole nor iustelie preiudicate the weight of their authority in case they did agree with the misreformed doctrine in this particular as yet they doe not And touching Panormitan whome Sir Humfrey calles a great Canonist I will not examen how great he was in that science yet I doe not see why his authoritie should be accounted great in the Roman Church supposing he was onelie a Scismaticall Cardinall of the scismaticall Pope Felix Secondlie suppose he were as great a Canonist as the author of the Canons himselfe yet doth his great authoritie fauore Sir Humfreyes cause neuer a iot in regarde he doth not affirme as the latter parte of the 32. article of the English Creed doth that it is lawfull also for Bishops Preists Deacons as for all other Christian men to marrye at their owne discretion But Panormitan onelie sayde to vse his owne wordes I beleeued it were a holsome statute for the good health of soules that these who will containe merit more maybe lefte to their owne wills but those that ar not able to containe may marrie Because experience tsacheth that the quite contrarie effect followeth of that lawe of continencie In which saying altho' I must needs confesse he erred in presuming to prescribe a new rule to the Church yet is it plaine he differs frome the faith of Sir Humfrey in this point in diuers respects First in that he vttered not this as a matter either of faith or yet of morall certaintie but onelie deliuered it as his owne priuate opinion How be it Sir Humfrey hearing the sounde of the worde Credo as it seemes he presentlie conceiued it to be as certaine as the Apostles Creed it selfe or at the least desired his reader might so apprehend it Secondlie Panormitan doth not affirme absolutelie that it is either holsome or yet as much as lawfull for Preists to marrie notobstanding the precept of the Roman Church to the contrarie as our nouelists doe who also condemne that lawe of single lyfe for iniuste â—…rte quod â—…erdotiâ—… interâ—…tum fuit â—…iugium â—…factum â—…impia â—…annide 〈◊〉 â—…l Inst l. â—… cap. 12. â—… 23. tirannicall But he was onely of opinion that it were good for the health of the soules of some particular persons that the same Church should alter her course make such a statute for the time to come Thirdly Panormitan if his wordes be duelie ponderd doth not affirme that the Church might doe well to constitute that Preists with the restriction of Sacerdoce or Preisthood I meane after they haue receiued orders may marrie but he meanes onelie that Preists with ampliation that is such persons as intend to be Preists may marrye if they fynde themselues not able to liue chaste wher as the pretented reformers hould it lawfull not onelie for Preists but also euen for such religious persons as haue made a speciall vowe of perpetuall chastitie to marrie at their pleasure as the verie author Antesignane of their sect did both in wordes example teach them By all which particulars it is manifest that Panormitans case is farre different frome the doctrine practise of the moderne sectaries especiallie of the Church of England consequentlie his testimonie can not possible proue anie safetie for Sir Humfrey in this parte of his way as being quite an other extrauagant way which neither meets with his nor ours More ouer for conclusion I wish the reader to take notice that I neither fynde in Panormitan those formall wordes which Sir Humfrey cites nor anie others intyrelie equiualent vnto them nor yet are they intyrelie continuatlie rehearsed by the knight but with interruption as the authors owne wordes which here I truelie quote in the margen will declare Credo pro bono salute animaruÌ„ quod esset salubre statutuÌ„ vt volentes continere magis mereri relinquere voluntati eorum non valeÌ„tes autem continere possint contrahere quia expe rientia docente contrarius prorsus effectus sequitur ex illa lege coÌ„tineÌ„tiae c. Panor 3. p. c. cuÌ„ olim de Cler. coniug And besides this the faithlesse knight in steed of the wordes non valentes puts non volentes for the worde Credo which denotates the weakenesse of the authors dictamen signifying therby that it was onelie a particular credulitie of his owne he translates it were good behouefull attrihutes the surmised Licentiousnesse of the Catholike clergie to the lawe of celibate it selfe whereas the author onelie saith sequitur ex lege the contrarie effect followeth of the lawe And by occasion of this passage the reader may reflect what a pore shifte Sir Humfrey was forced to vse for excuse of the falacitie of his misreformed ministrie when he catched at the authoritie of this one Apochryphal Cardinall who neuerthelesse vpon due examen appeares to haue so much frustate his sinister expectation Now for Aeneas Syluius the doth lesse fauore Sir Humfreys tenet nay not at all as his owne wordes aboue quoted in the margen doe manifest to the reader He onelie speaketh by a perhaps it were not worse that verie manie Preists had wiues yet this he recalled of his owne accorde after his assuption to the cheefe Pontificall seat or Popedome by a speciall Bull of retractation of that some other immature positions vttered in his youth So that the kinght was farre out of his way when for the safetye of this parte of his new diuised way he produced these authors if he haue no better garde defense for it theÌ„ the testimonie of theÌ„ as in truth he hath not then ought euerie one to take heed of it auoide it as a most vnquoth perilous path And so to conclude this I may not vnfitly say with Erasmus quae malum
est ista tanta salacitas in nostris uouis Euangelistis vt sine vxoribus esse non possint what in the mischeefe saith Erasmus a great inclination to lecherie is this in our newe Euangelists that they can not be with out wiues An I say further that if they persuade themselues they can not possible containe therfore must needs be marryed at the least why doe they reprehend Roman Preists who haue the contrarie persuasion for obledging themselues to a single life If they vpon supposition of such carnall conceits hould they can not goe safe to Heauen without wiues at their heels why should those be condemned who hould it safer to goe without them An oculus tuus nequam est quia ego bonus sum wherefore doe the ministers censure the Roman Preists so seuerlie for that which is a virtue in them But in deed it is to be feared that those who can not possible liue chastelie without a woman will hardlie content themselues with one in all cases but rather some times make bould with their neibours or at the least fall to that large axiome of lecherous Luther si non velit vxor veniat ancilla in which I knowe not what safetie can be found for the soule except Sir Humfrey houldeth that for the safest which is most agreable to the delights of the bodie Wherefore if we will discourse rather like men then blatter like beasts the onelie safetie that can be had in this matter especiallie for Preists is to follow that melius facit of S. Paule 1. Chorinth 7. I meane that statute of a chaste harte which there he mentioneth and this statute being once well firmelie made the melius est nubere hath no place but then the spirituall mariage of the soule with Christ her sponse is made then it is to late to vse that violent medicine an other antidote must be vsed for the cure of that surfetting Vri to wit mortification of the bodie which medicine the same Apostle prescribes in an other place saying castigo corpus meum And if the reformed ministers would make vse of this then perhaps they would change their opinion account the way of single life safer then the way of mariage that way which as S. Hierome saith filleth Paradise Contra Iouin not that which filleth the world finallie that which S. Paule counselleth absolutelie not that which hee onelie permitteth as a remedie for a supposed imperfection which permission tho' it be the easier way therefore perhaps is more willinglie imbrased by Sir Humfrey in fauor of his deformed Clergie as a man not ignorant of their imperfections in that nature yet was the other euer commended as the safer way both by God his Saints generallie imbraced by the Church an clergie before the daies of Luther Aboute prayer in an vnknowne language none of the authours the knight citeth affirme that it is the safer way to pray in a vulgar tongue or yet that it is absolutelie better but onelie secundum quid that is for the edification of the Church as Caietan speaketh yet not meaning but that is the best safest all things considered which the Church doth practice which practice as the same Caietan well kewe as being a Cardinall of the Roman Church is to haue the publike seruice in Latin rather then in the mother tongue for such reasons as I haue deliuered in an other place And touching the testimonie of S. Thomas whome here the knight produceth in his commentarie vpon the 14. chapter of the first Epistle to the Corinthians as I suppose for he quotes not the place as affirming it is manifest that he receiues more benefit who prayes vnderstandes what he sayth because the mynde of him who prayes vnderstandes not is without frute refection To this I anser that S. Thomas doth not meane by this that it is better that the publike seruice of the Church be in a vulgar language which is that wee here haue in question not the priuate prayers of euery particular person of which S. Thomas onelie speakes as his owne wordes doe testifie in that place which I haue exactelie read duelie pondered Euer supposing that manie things may be profitable for single persons which yet in cōmon are esteemed much worse yea and in some circumstances absolutelie ill as by examples which passe in the lawes of temporall Republikes may plainelie appeare That which S. Thomas did doubtlesselie persuade him selfe to be true whome the world knowes to haue dailie celebrated Masse in Latin not in anie vulgar language To omit that euen those simple people who praye in the Latin tongue altho' they want that particular instruction of the vnderstanding which the learned receiue in prayer yet sans doubt they often tymes performe that action with greater deuotion feruor in their wills affections then the greatest schollers in the world God almightie by reason of their pious humble desires supplying as it were in one power that which wantes in an other And the same I say to the wordes of Lyra Caietan who speeches to the same purpose which S. Thomas doth vpon the same place of the Apostle 1. Cor. 14. where altho' Caietan extendes his speeh euen to publike prayer of the Church yet is it manifest that the same Caietan doth neither condemne the contrarie practise of the Roman Church nor yet houldes it absolutelie better or safer that publike prayers were especiallie in these our tymes not in Latin but in the vulgar language But he onelie meaneth that it were better in that one respect of edifying the Church if other circumstances did also in like paritie concurre or if there were not more prepondering reasons for the present practise of the Church And therefore Caietan presentlie after the wordes cited by Sir Humfrey addeth others which if they had not ben omitted by him they had quite cleared this difficultie for so he proceedeth saying Et ne intelligeres reprehendi a Paulo eiusmodi diuinas laudes to wit such prayers as are made in an vnknowne tongue subiungit nam tu quidem bene gratias agis by which wordes it is plaine that Caietan was not of knight Humfrey opinion in this particular Lastelie the Rhemes Testament cited by Sir Hūfrey vpon the same passage of S. Paule confesseth the same that S. Thomas sayth of a particular mans priuate deuotion that in deed it is not so fruetfull for instruction to him when he prayes in a stange longuage as when he vnderstandes his prayers yet the authors of the note adde an other clause which if the kinght had proceeded like a freind he ought not to haue omitted to wit that the Apostle forbides not such praying neither confessing that such a mans spirit harte affection prayeth well towardes God tho' his mynde vnderstāding be not profited to instructiō as otherwise it might be if he vnderstood the words neither doth he appointe him
no authoritie But suppose Cephas did indeed not signifie the head yet what great recorde I praye can that be for Sir Humfreys Church And so whether Cephas signifie the head or the feet whether ridiculum est be in or out of the bookes it auayles him nothing but some smale matter to quarell aboute yet the truth is that the most authenticall edition of Anwerpe 1585. hath the same wordes which Sir Humfreyes cites out of the Roman print in such sorte as one may rather much more suspect those wordes it is ridiculous to be falselie added in the Moguntin edition then detracted in the others Finallie whether the wordes of the Councell of Laodicea be that wee ought not to leaue the Church of God inuocate Angells as Sir Humfrey will haue it also some Catholike copies haue or whether in steed of the worde Angells wee reade angles or corners as some other editions haue the matter is not great so the decree be reight vnderstood that is so that the sense bee this we ought not to leaue the Church of God inuocate Angells superstitiouslie as some did in those tymes For this being the true meaning of the Councell as it appeareth by the subsequent wordes which are those and make congregations of abominable idolatrie to the Angells it is more then plaine that no recorde can there be founde for the doctrine of the reformed Churches But onelie it serues Sir Humfrey to make a plausible florish to the simple reader to the end that by working vpon his weaknesse by falselie taxing his aduersaries hee may make his owne impostures saleable which otherwise would putrifie spoile for want of vtterance Lastelie for proofe of his accusation Sir Humfrey after all this sturre he hath made produceth onelie one witnesse that a false one and altho' for the greater credit of his cause he held it expedient to giue him the decree of a diuinitie reader professor Deane of Louaine yet hauing examined the matter I founde by better information then Sir Humfrey can haue that Boxhorne before his reuolte had onelie the place a certaine of obscure Deanrie which function altho' it be a place of some credit yet it is farre inferiour to the dignitie either of a Deane of a Capitall Church or of a publike professour of diuinitie in the vniuersitie of Louaine both in learning honour profit And yet this man as I receiued by authenticall relation of the Deane of S. Gudula Church in Brussels others after some extraordinary familiarity which out of his ouer amorous nature he vsed to a domestike maide seruant of his owne out of an vnsetlednesse of his lubrik mynde began at first to defend that it was not necessarie for the Preist to prononce the wordes of consecration orally but onelie to speake them mentallie afterwardes as nemo repente fit malus Boxorno once a pettie-master by degrees falling into plaine heresie founde oportunitie to passe into the land of libertie I meane into Holand with bag bagage I meane with his Sacrilegious spouse the sacred spoiles of his Church Where from the place of a fugitiue Pedant he is preferred to the dignitie of a new Euangelist is become a blostering trumpeter in the pulpits of the misreformed congregations And this is the onely man which Sir Humfrey could bring for a witnesse against the practice of the Roman Church in her manner of censuring bookes or correcting the same or approuing them according to the order decree of the Councell of Trent which collapsed Deane being so infamous in his life as by this which I haue specified and more which I could relate doth appeare and being also now a professed enimy and Apostata from his mother Church let the reader iudge whether in reason his testimony ought to be admitted against her and let him withall be pleased to consider that Sir Humfrey in lue of conuincing his aduersaries of ill conscience he hath by his owne bad proceeding in this section conuinced his owne to be the worst of all so is fallē in to the same pit he prepared for his enimies incidit in foueam quam fecit by forgeing of false recordes hath incurred a farre deeper dungeon of cēsure then hitherto he did in which he must remaine either till he hath payde a double fine or put in suretie for the amendment of his manners THE XIII PERIOD IN His fourteeneth section Sir Humfrey indeuoreth to conuince his aduersaries of the defence of a desperate cause by their blasphemous exceptions as he calleth them against the scriptures by which we see that as his booke increaseth in number of leaues so he increaseth in multiplication of his malicious and false accusations and these being the cardes he playeth with let vs examen his gaime He continueth confidently his allegation of his false Deane of Louaine for a witnesse against the Romanists whose worde notwithstanding ought not either in reason or according to the course of lawe to be admitted for recorde against those from whose religion he hath reuolted And so whereas he accuseth the Romā Church of poyson in religion tiranny in the common welth it is to be taken as proceeding from a poysonous minde which being once corrupted hateth the truth as much as an ill stomake loathes dainty meates As for the scriptures it is false slaunderous to affirme that the Romanists refuse to be tryed by them so they be taken together with the authoritie of the Church which the same scriptures commende as Saint Augustin speaketh against his aduersaries and in a true sense without which as one of the auncient Fathers saith verbum Dei male intellectum non est verbum Dei that is the worde of God ill vnderstanded is not the word of God Quamuis certum de scripturis non proferatur exēplum tamē earundem scripturarū à nobis tenetur veritas cum id facimus quod vniuersae placet Ecclesia quam ipsarum scripturarum commēdat authoritas Aug. lib. 1. cōtra Cres c. 33. And according to this not that sacred Bible which was in the Apostles till the dayes of Luther without alteration is as you calumniously affirme ranked by the Inquisitors inter libros prohibitos among the prohibited bookes but your execrated Bible I meane your execrable translations and annotations mutilations of the most holy Bible are those that are registred in the censure where whether it haue as you affirme I knowe not certainely but I am sure it deserueth the first place because as the Philosopher saith corruptio optimi pessima and so as your Bible-corruption is in the highest degree of badnesse so ought it in reason to be ranked in the highest station of such false wares as that Catalogue condemnes And of the censure of your owne abuses I graunt you may with shame enough to your selues be eye witnesses but if you meane you are eye witnesses of the censure of the true scriptures
it is most false calumnious that either they or the authours of them be called in question and yet more false slaunderous it is that Christ and his Apostles are arraigned condemned at the Popes assises as you odiouslie affirme of obscuritie insufficiencie in their Gospell Bibliorum versiones tam vet quam noui Test à dictis damnatis authoribus editae generaliter prohibentur Index ex Purgatorius Regul 3. For that neither Pope nor Prelate of the Roman Church euer vttered more of the sacred scriptures in that nature thē that which S. Peter himselfe affirmeth to wit that in the epistles of S. Paule there are manie things hard to be vnderstood or that which S. Augustin saith in generall of the written worde That is that certaine obscure speeches of the scripture bring a most dense or thicke miste vpon them And that they are deceiued with many manifould obscurities ambiguities that rashly reade them vnderstanding one thing for an other Lib. 2. de Doctr. Christ c. 6. And as for the Gospell of Christ his Apostles neither the Pope nor anie other Romanist euer condemned it of anie insufficiencie or defect but onelie teach with the same scripture itselfe that it doth not containe all things necessarie so explicitlie that they suffice for the instruction of the whole Church according to all states of people in all particulars without traditions as appeareth by the saying of sainct Paule 2. Thes 2. Therefore brethren stand houlde the traditions which you haue learned whether it be by worde or by our epistle Which wordes of the Apostle neither can truelie be verified nor his commaund obeyed except we graunt that he deliuered more to the Church of the Thessalonians then he left in writing Neither doe the Pope Romanists anie more condemne the scriptures of insufficiēcie by denying that they containe clearely all things necessarie or by affirming that diuine Apostolicall traditions are also necessarilie required then the reformers them selues who besides scripture professe at the least in wordes to beleeue the Apostolicall nycene Athanasian Creed not no more then that man should be thought to condemne the common lawes of insufficiencie who besides them iudgeth it also necessarie to obserue those ancient customes which the lawes themselues commend as by the legislators first authours of the same deliuered to the people by worde of mouth And so to conclude touching the scriptures thus vnderstood the Romanists are so farre from refusing to be tryed by them that they flye vnto them with sainct Chrysostome in all occasions as to most hight montaines in which they finde a most comodious place to plant their ordinance against the enimies of the faith particularlie against the sectaries of this our present age as is most euident in the late Councell of Trent all the decrees of which renouned Synod are founded vpon those heigh hills of the written worde of God according to the true sense meaning of the same And as for Causabon Agrippa whome the knight citeth he they may goe together for their authoritie viz. in lying Agrippa Causabon are alreadie registred in the Predicament of Nouelists Vide Indicem lib. prohib althou ' the knight as yet is not preferred to that honour yet his deserts are such as he may iustelie expect the like aduauncement You aske vs Sir Humfrey whether the worde of God is subiect to alteration or needeth Index expurgatorious but to this your wise demaunde I anser that the worde of God in itselfe is wholelie immutable so pure that it can need no purifying yet as it is expressed by artificiall caracters for the vse of man so it is not onelie mutable corruptible but also de facto it is hath ben corrupted witnesse your owne Bibles in England And witnesse that renowned King Iames your owne soueraine best defender of your faith who was so ashamed of the translations which he founde at his arriuall to the English Crowne that he presently sought a remedy for the same tho' he founde it not as appeareth by his new translation which yet is not as it ought to be publikelie declaring in the Conference of Hampton Courte Anno Domini 1624. ingenuouslie confessing that he had seene no true translation that the Geneua translation is the worst of all others Neither ought the corruptions founde in the reformed Bibles to be called peccadillos or smale faultes as Sir Humfrey would haue them to the end they may be the more easilie winked at for suppose they were neuer so little in themselues yet are they to be esteemed great horrible abuses in regarde of the great reuerence which ought to be had towardes those sacred volumes of the worde of God it being treason in the highest degree to offer to falsifie or alter them anie way whatsoeuer And let the reader be iudge whether it be but a smale faulte to translate images for idols as the English bible of the yeare 1562. hath in the text or as an other of the yeare 1577. hath in the margen vpon the first chapter of the Epistle of S. Iohn in the last wordes Or as the same or other editions vpon the wordes of Iacob Gen. 37. v. 35. descendam ad filium meum Iugens in infernum hath translated the worde infernum hell into the worde Sepulcher or graue notobstanding both the Hebrewe worde Seol the Greeke worde adis signifie not the graue but either properlie hell it selfe or some parte of the earth farre deeper then the graue And in this manner Beza hath done vpon those wordes of the psalme non relinques animam meam in inferno translating for animam Cadauer for inferno sepulchro so Metamorphizeth Christs soule into his bodie hell into his graue And vpn the 22. of sainct Luke where according to the Greeke text the sentence is This is the cup of my blood which cuppe is shed for you Beza to eneruate the force of the argument for the reall presence purposelie translateth the wordes thus This is the cup of my blood which blood is shed for you Also the English bibles whereas sainct Peter in the first chapter of his second epistle v. 10. saith brethren labore the more that by good workes you make sure your vocation election Least here it should appeare that good workes are auayleable or necessarie to saluation they leaue out in their translations the wordes by good workes notobstanding the Latin copies haue them vniuersallie some Greeke copies also as Beza confesseth And if these be the faults which Sir Hūfrey calleth but peccadillos surelie he hath a conscience as large as a fryers sleeue if these be his smale faults doubtlesse according to due proporrion his greater sinnes are abomination And this is that Bible which the Romanists say needeth an Index expurgatorie not that Sacred Bible which is truelie sincerelie translated according to
that text which hath ben at the least since the tyme of S. Augustin commonlie vsed in the Church as appeareth by the Rhemes Testamēt which because it is founde to haue ben rightlie translated is not arraigned by the Pope but exposed to be read euen by the laitie at the least by licence aduise of their Confessors Further more in regarde of the foresayd corruptions manie other which for breuitie I omitted made by heretikes in the holie scriptures those moderne authours which Sir Humfrey citeth if they be trulie cited haue ben induced to vtter some such speeches concerning the same as if they be not trulie piouslie interpreted may giue occasion of offence to the reader for example when they affirme as he sayth the scriptures to be dead caracters a dead killing letter c. such phrases neuerthelesse as it manifestlie appeareth by the rest of their doctrine discourse in those places are not vsed by those authours with an intent in anie sorte to disgrace or diminish the dignitie of the true worde of God but onelie by those comparatiue speaches to declare how subiect the scriptures are to be corrupted detorted to the defence of heresies errours if they be considered preciselie as they are the externall written letter interpreted otherwise then by the authoritie of the visible Church in all ages the ancient Councells Fathers they haue ben vhderstood Wherefore those Romanists which the knight citeth as if they had spoken irreuerentlie blasphemonlie of the holie scriptures doe no more iniurie vnto them then S. Paule did when 2. Cor. 3. he sayth of them litera occidit the letter killeth Lib. de Synodis or then did S. Hilarie when he teacheth that manie heresies haue their origin from scriptures ill vnderstood or then Martin Luther who called the Bible liber haereticorum the booke of heretikes None of which speeches as I suppose Sir Humfrey will dare to condemne either of blasphemie or irreuerence nay if he haue his senses aboute him he will easilie perceiue that those other such like phrases are not meant actiuelie of the worde of God but onelie passiuelie that is that throu ' the malice of the false interpreter it is so irreuerentlie detorted abused as if indeed it were as flexible as a nose of waxe And according to this we see that none of that which our aduersarie produceth here out of the Romanists is anie argument of irreuerence against the trueth inuiolabilitie of Gods worde but a calumnious accusatiō quite contrarie to the sense meaning of the foresaid authours who had not anie intention to taxe the scriptures but the corrupters false interpreters of them such as you pseudoreformers are your selues And now altho' by this which I haue sayd in generall touching this point of blasphemie against scripture supposed to be perpetrated by the Romanists the authors by the knight cyted remaine sufficientlie cleared from the imputation which he layes vpon them in that nature neuerthelesse because by the particular examen of the places cyted I haue discouered that either all or most of their wordes be either corruptedlie rehearsed or their sense detorted abused therefore I will seuerallie repeate their passages declare in what respects our aduersarie hath deceitfullie traduced them And to begin with Lindanus his stromata in deed I could not haue but I haue read the place cited out of his Panoplia where I finde that when he names the scripture a dead killing letter he onelie alludes to the wordes of S. Paule 2. Cor 3. for the letter killeth but the spirit giue liues Sicut illud eiusdē authoris dogma in mortuas imo ceidentes adeo literas relatum Panop lib. 1. c. 44. Neither speaking nor meaning worse of the same scripture then the Apostle himselfe affirming at the most that the bare letter of the worde of God ill interpreted doth kill the soule but reight expounded according to the tradition of the Church it doth reuiue nourish it brings it to eternall lyfe yea hauing better pondered his wordes in the end of the chapter quoted by Sir Humfrey I perceiue the doth not absolutelie call the scriptures a dead killing letter but onelie that the doctrine of that author meaning the holie Ghost as I conceiue is put in to dead killing letters As his wordes quoted in Latin in the margen declare And in this same sense I may iustelie truelie suppose the same authour speakes in the place quoted out of his other worke if any such saying he hath in regarde that a graue learned man as he is knowne to haue ben is euer iudged to be sutable to himselfe in all times places Which learned diuine is yet further cōuinced neuer to haue spoakē otherwise then reuerentlie of the scriptures in that in euerie seueral place cited by our aduersarie he stileth them sacrae litterae sacred letters And in like manner I conceiue of Charon who as being of the same faith religion he neither did nor dared to speake otherwise then with the same due respect which the Romā Church commaundes the Romanists to vse towardes the holie written worde of God Canus in his 3. chapter of his second booke is abused by the knight Nec esse eas volunt cereum quendā nasum in sensum omnem flexibiles sed potius esse per se expositas in promptu cuique sine magistro docente patere Canus lib. 3. ca. 7. f. 176 edit Louan by his imposing vpon the Romanists that which Canus speakes of the Lutherans saying that they will not haue the scriptures to be like a nose of waxe subiect to diuers senses but rather plaine for euerie one to vnderstand without a master or teacher thus the preposterous kniht doth positiuelie affirmatiuelie impute that to the Romanists which Canus onely relates to be negatiuely asserted of the scriptures by the Lutherans Turrianus agregiously abused in that he is accused to call the scriptures a Delphick sword the riddles of Sphinx and the like for he doth not absolutely say they are such but onely saith that if Christ had left in his Church that rule onely which the pretended reformers receiued from Luther to wit that scriptures are easie to be interpreted and vnderstanded and according as they haue hitherto expounded them in their owne sense then saith Turrian what els should we haue of them then a Delphick sworde In which wordes you see he doth not affirme absolutely that the scriptures are such a sworde but onely that according as the sectories handle them in their false manner of expounding they may be so compared and for this cause he puts for his marginall note how to interpret scriptures according to ones owne proper sense is as to haue a Delphick sworde so by this the authors wordes which I quote in the margen in Latin his meaning is sufficiently declared together with
perfection or their want of frequentation in the primatiue ages which is no principall point of controuersie betweene the Reformers Romanists nay none at all And touching Bellarmins confession contained in the first place viz. That we read not expressely but gather by coniectures that the ancients did sacrifice without communion of some person or persons I say it is impertinent in regarde it inuolues no disproofe of priuate Masses as our aduersarie counningly indeuores to persuade his vnaduised reader It being sufficient for the instification of the practise of them that besides the authoritie of the present Church which approues them not anie worde either of scripture or ancient Fathers can be produced in which they ar condemned for vnlawful or repugnant to Christs institution or commaunde And if more then this were required for matters of practise in this nature certaine it is the pretensiue reformers of the Church would neuer be able to iustifie their owne order and prescription of cōmunicating at Easter or some twise or thrise more in the yeare or their newe prohibition of not receiuing their communion euen at the point of death without a competent number of neyther of which they haue not as much as one pore instance or example in the primatiue Church By which it appeares that Bellarmins confession is in this passage preposterously alledged by the knight both in respect of the Roman Doctrine against which it concludeth nothing as alsoe in respect of the inconuenience which by sequele and illation it induceth to his owne whoe yet offers the Cardinal some further abuse by omission of the worde facile in the recytal of his text Tamen id possumus ex cōiecturis facile colligere Bellar. supra Where the reader may yet once more reflect that altho' Bellarmin in his modestie tearmed the examples of antiquitie which he produceth for the practise of priuate Masses at the least in some particular cases no more then coniectures yet if some of them be duely pondered vrged with their circumstances they may iustely passe for solid reasons as that S. Chrysostome diuers tymes reprehending the people most sharpely vehemently for making the Masses priuate by their not communicating in them yet doth he not once either condemne such Masses in them selues or he him selfe euer ceased to celebrate them dayly euen then when he most preached against the negligence of those whoe were present in them without receiuing the sacrament with the preist Which doubtlesse is a morally concluding argument that Masses without communion of the people were vsed and esteemed lawful euen in those more primatiue ancient ages To which may not vnaptely be added for confirmation of the same discourse by way of aduertisment that S. Chrysostome neuer affirmed in these occasions of complainte of the people that Masses in which communicants ar wanting be euill or contrarie to Christs ordinance or precept but the most he said was that the oblation is frustrate when ther be none to participate which wordes of his ar soe farre from reprouing the practise vse of Masses without comunion of the people that they necessarily implye that the sacrifice was in realitie cebebrated notobstanding the people did frustrate the intention of the preist in that by their want of deuotion they receiued not the Communion which he had prepared for them supposing it is absolutely inpossible to conceiue that the Masse or oblation could be frustrated for wante of partakers except it were in it selfe a Masse or oblation truely really performed by the sacrificer Fourthlie it is true that Bellarmin confesseth that in the primatiue Church because the Christians were but fewe they did all sing ansere in the diuine offices But he affirmeth not that either it then was or now is vnlawfull to haue the publike or priuate prayer in an vnknowne tongue which is the onelie point in controuersie the reformers defending touth naile the affirmatiue the Romanists the negatiue Nay Bellarmin is soe farre from confessing the reformers doctrine in this particular that he expresselie affirmeth in the same place that the diuine offices in those primatiue times were celebrated in Greeke which all the people did not vnderstand yet cleareth this whole question so farre that if Sir Humfrey had vsed anie sparke of sinceritie in citing Bellarmins wordes home truelie they would haue taken away all doubt concerning his meaning Whereas by leauing out deceitfullie the latter parte of his clause he caused in his reader a preuidicate opiniō of the true sense touching which and the faithlesse proceeding of our aduersarie about the same the Cardinals owne wordes intirely recited will tell the truth for thus he speakes At obijcies sicut Apostolus c. But saith Bellarmin you will obiect As the Apostle would that the people might subioine Amen so also he was to ordaine that the diuine offices should be celebrated in the vulgar tongue that the people might answer Amen Bellar. l. 2. de verbo Dei c. 16. I anser by denying the consequence because the diuine offices were performed in the Greeke tongue which manie of the people did vnderstand tho' not all this was sufficient for the Apostles will was not that all should anser Besides this because then the Christians were fewe they all sung together in the Church ansered in the diuine offices but afterwardes the multitude increasing the offices were more diuided it was left to the sole cleargie to acomplish the common prayers Laudes in the Church Thus plainely doth the Cardinall declare himselfe for a ptofessed aduersarie of Sir Humfrey his comperes in this particular euen so farre as to solue their greatest obiection which they vse to frame against the practise of the Roman Church Firstlie touching the allegation of Bellarmins confession of the reformers tenet aboute the Communion in both kyndes it is most false that Bellarmin confesseth it in the point in controuersie Bellarmin l. 2. de verbo Dei c. 16. I meane it is false that he confesseth either Christ to haue commaunded the communion in both Kyndes or that the ancient Church practized the same onelie in both kyndes both which points Bellarmin so expresselie declareth that Sir Humfrey could not possible haue found anie colour to haue alledged his confession for the contrarie if he had not mangled his wordes as he did in truth most shamefullie as may appeare most plainelie to him that will take paines to examen them as they are by him deliuered towardes the end of the chapter cited by the knight where it is euident that the Cardinall proceedeth diametrally contrarie to the reformers doctrine in the principall point of this question according to his owne expresse wordes quoted in this my margen Idcirco quaerendū superest vtrum saltē diuino praecepto positiuo eiusmodi obligatio communicandi sub vtraque specie in Ecclesia sit nos enim negamus illi sectarij asserunt Bellar. lib. 4. de
vniuersall Church of the worlde proposeth vnto them as doctrine to be receiued beleeued or practized by all faithfull Christians And as S. Augustin in the 41. of his fiftie homilies saith Whosoeuer is separated frome the Catholique Church that is to say that Church which spred in ouer the whole worlde as he specifieth in the precedent wordes how laudably soeuer he thinkes he liueth for that onely sinne that he is diuided from the vnity of Christ he shall not obteine life eternall but the wrath of God remaineth vpon him In which wordes as the reader may see according to the sentence of S. Augustin separation from the obedience of the vniuersall Church is sufficient to bring the curse vpon anie man notobstanding in other respects he liueth neuer so virtuously And according to this the Romanists may bouldly say they are accursed whoe deny all merit in workes proceeding from the grace of God Scr. 68. in Cant. they blessed with Sainct Bernard whom Caluin himselfe calleth a holye pious man that affirme with him that it is a pernicious prouertie to want merits yet especially at the houre of their death for humilitie with the same S. Bernard put all their confidence in the mercy of God that which the Romanists doe much more then the reformers notobstanding their defence of meritorious workes They are accursed whoe otherwise then Christ tought or affirmed teach affirme it vnlawfull for the laitye to communicate in one kynde And they blessed whoe with Christ his Church take it for a thing indifferent of it selfe to receiue in one or both kyndes stand to the ordināce of the most vniuersall Church without contention according to the difference of times places persons They are accursed whoe being vnlearned read scriptures interpret them falsely for the maintenance of their errours according to that of S. Peter saying Epist 2. c. 3. ther are certaine places in S. Paules Epistles which the vnlearned depraue to their owne perdition but blessed are they whoe read them as the Eunuch did that is with a S. Philipe I meane with one to shewe them the true sense as S. Basil his brother Nazianzene did Lib. 11. cap. 9. whoe according to Rufinus read the scriptures following the sense of them not according to their owne presumption but according to the writinges of their predecessours notwithstanding they were both verie famous renowned in learning They are accursed whoe either prohibit mariage or meates as ill in them selues as some ancient heretikes did or absteine not frome them both at such times in such cases as God his Church ordaineth them to absteine And they are blessed whoe according to the order of the Church directed by the spirit of God remaine with S. Paule vnmaried refaine from eating flesh at such times as the same Church appointeth Those are accursed for contemning of Christ in his Church whoe contrary to her appointmēt doe schismatically administer the publike seruice Sacraments in the vulgar tongue erroneously defending the same to be commaunded by the scriptures blessed are those whoe for reuerence to the holy scriptures conseruation of the dignity of the diuine offices other iust reasons hould it fitting to administer publike seruice Sacraments in a language most common to all nations to wit in the Latin tongue They are accursed whoe loue Christ his Saints so little as they accounte it idolatrie contrary to the scriptures to honore their images notobstāding ther is no place of scripture truly interpreted to be founde against them those are blessed according to the same scriptures whoe to shewe their exterordinarie affection to Christ duely reuerence both the images of him his blessed seruants They are accursed that refuse either to adore Christs bodie whersoeuer he affirmeth it to bee or account it idolatrie or superstition to honore the Saints who he him selfe saith he honoreth with a crowne of glorie blessed are they that performe his pleasure in both by adoring his pretious bodie blood in the sacrament by honoring his Saints in Heauen where he doth honour them as his seruants freinds Si quis mihi ministrauerit honorificabit eum Pater meus c. They are accursed who contrary to scripture reiect such ancient traditions as the most vniuersall Church approueth blessed are those who with due obedience obserue the same Accursed are they who reiect charitie frome the formall cause of iustification Maior autem horum est charitas 1. Cor. 13. which notobstanding according to the Apostle is greater then either hope or faith blessed are they who admit it in iustification as well as faith preferre it before faith with the same Apostle Accursed are they that by denying with the Iewes the bookes of the Machabies to be Canonicall scriptures denie Purgatory prayer for the soules departed blessed are they who with the Church S. Augustin hould the foresayd bookes for canonicall scripture say with him it is an vndoubted thing that prayer doth profit the dead Non dubiū est oration prodesse defunctis Aug. de cura pro mort c. 1. And in this māner if need were I could passe throu ' all the rest of the points of controuerted doctrine easily showe the curse to fall vpon the misreformed brothers for their obstinacie disobedience to God his Church Sir Humfrey would faine seeme to beare a charitable minde towardes the Romanists in regarde he saith he dares not pronounce damnation vpon their persons and yet he proclaimeth confidently opēly to the whole world that their doctrine is damnable to which it is necessarily consequent that all such as die obstinately in it are directly damned so if Sir Hūfrey proceeds cōsequenter to this his tenet he must necessity iudge the same of at the least in generall of those which dye in the foresaid obstinate manner with out inuincible ignorance end their liues in it But if this be that which he calls greater charitie them Romanists haue all the fauour he doth vs we thanke him not for it such charitie he may better reserue to himselfe his brothers who in my opiniō haue no more thē they can spare And if this be all the difference which can be foūde betwixt the proceeding of the Romanists the reformers in this particular then I say that notwithstanding Sir Humfrey much laboureth to make his reader beleeue that he his reformed brothers are more charitable thē the Romanists in iudging of the state of the soules of such as departe in each religion neuerthelesse it is manifest he quite faileth of his intent supposing that the Romanists doe not vse to iudge but rather suspend their iudgment of particular persons except they haue some speciall reasons prudently morally to persuade themselues that this or that partie died in actuall obstinacie defence of his erroneous faith otherwise
betwixt the nouellists of these our tymes and catholike Romanists As appeareth in the mention they make of masse miracles the signe of the Crosse and other particulars which I haue noted in my censure Thirdly the iudicious reader may easily persuade him self that supposing these writings according to the relation of our aduersaries haue remained in publike places and libraries for the space of aboue 600. yeares if they had cōtained anie doctrine repugnāt to that faith of the Eucharist which I haue historically demonstrated aboue to haue ben professed in our countrie of England euer since and before that tyme it s more then morally euident they would haue receiued long a fore this tyme reprehension or censure according to their desert Finally Supposing it were true that the foresaid writings did in deed containe doctrine contrarie to the reall presence and transsubstantiation as they ar beleeued and defended by the professors of the Roman Religion wheras yet they doe not soe but onely exclude the carnal palpaple or Capharnaitical presence of Christ in the Eucharist and instruct the people in the inuisible presence of his bodie and bloude in the Sacrament in an obuius and easie māner yet in reasō ought not anie iudicious Catholique to alter his faith of the same for anie argument which can be drawne or deduced from such testimonie as is voyde of other credit then is to be giuen to aduersaries in fauor of their owne cause which is iust none at all especially they being no other then these whoe not onely in this particular but alsoe in other matters of controuersie haue vsed much partialitie deceipt as in an other place I haue demonstrated out of their seuerall workes And in particular the publisher of the same pamphlet in which the homilie Epistles of which I heare treate are contained besides diuers vntruthes which he vttereth as well touching the author and tyme of his writing as alsoe his titles and marginall notes and likewise in that he couningly and couseningly publisheth in the same volume a treatise of the ould and new testament in the name of Alfric as if it included a different canon of scripture to that which is now vsed in the Roman Church and agreeable to their now English Bible which is yet most apparently false for that as I remēber it putteth in the number and order of the Canonicall bookes Ecclesiasticus Sapience Tobie Iudith and the Machabeis which yet our aduersaries reiect for Apocryphal As alsoe in that more ouer the same Pampheter addeth a testimonie to shewe that in tymes past the lords prayer the creed and the ten commaundements were extant and vsed in the vulgar tongue a worke most impertinently performed by him and as it seemes onely or cheefely to enlarge the bulke and price of his pamphlet it being certaine that the Romanists neuer neither held that matter vnlawfull or at this present prohibit the vse of the vulgar language for the ten commaundements and priuate prayer of the common people but rather the contrarie as both their Catechismes and their daylie practise most plainely witnesse By all which particulars and the rest of this my aduertissement it is euidently apparent that the glorious which the nouellists of our countrie make by their publication of the homilie epistles and o writings in the name of Alfric be no other then certaine prestigious impostures to persuade the simple sorte of people by these false florishes that their denyall of the reall presence of the bodie and bloud of Christ in the Eucharist and transsubstantiation is not quite voyde of antiquitie but hath ben preached and professed in our countrie before the dayes of luther And now let this suffice to repulse this fictitious and deceitefull calumniation of our aduersaries touching these putatiue wrings of Alfric by the publication of which and the like counterfeit wares they pick simple peoples purses whoe take all for as true as gaspell that is put in print by anie of their owne brothers The second aduertissement I giue to the reader is that wheras the kinght page 205. of his fafe wais cites Agobard for a denyer of honor of image in his booke of that subiect Agobardus Episc Lugdun li. de pict imag I haue dilgently perused the same and finde that in deed this author speaketh more harshely of this matter then anie other catholique writer of these dayes how be it this was the age in which images had their greatest enimies Neuerthelesse it is most certaine this author onely confutes the exhibition of diuine honor and the like vnto images as is sacrifice or confidence in them or prayer vnto them reprehending the error of some particular persons whoe superstitiousely adored them for soe he discourseth a boute the end of his booke saying But none of the ancient Catholiques did euer thinke them to be worshiped or adored yet now the error by increase is become soe perspicuous that it is neare or like to the heresie of the Antropomorphits to adore figments and to put hope in them and that by reason of this error faith being remoued from the harte all our confidence be placed in visible things And a little after Soe alsoe if we see penned or fethered Angels painted the Apostles preaching martyres suffering torments we must not expect anie helpe from the pictures which we behould because they can neither doe good nor ill rightly therfore these are the wordes cited by the kinght to euacuate such superstition it was defined by orthodox Fathers that pictures should not be made in churches least that which si worshiped and adored be painted in the walles which wordes being not his owne but alledged out of a fragment of the Prouinciall councell of Eliberis in Spaine and hauing ioyned them imediately to his owne in which he onely treates of diuine honor as not due to images it is cleare and euident he intendes to proue nothing else by their authoritie then that which he there proposeth To omit that this passage of the Eliberitan coūcell was deliuered in a sense much different from this in which Agobardus construeth it as I haue conuinced in others places and occasions And that this author intendes to teache nothing else but onely that images must not be honored with worship due to God the seuerall testimonies which he largely produceth out of S. Augustin S. Hierome other ancient writers doe manifestly demonstrate not one of which can be taken if they be truely vnderstanded in anie other sense as clearely may appeare to the diligent reader of their wordes which expressely exclude onely honor of Sacrifice prayers directed vnto the images them selues or religion proper to God onely in the worship of saincts and their pictures and alsoe Agobardus him self vppō occasiō of the places which he citeth doth auerre plainely declaring that he graunteth some sorte of honor to images wher thus he exhorteth Let vs behould the picture as a picture destitute of life sense and reason let the eye
is but onelie one in which it can be sayd with anie coulourable probabilitie that sainct Gregorie in anie of the places heere cited doth contradict the doctrine of the Roman Church that is the point of the Canon of the scriptures in which patricular althou ' he refused to giue the bookes of Machabees the title of Canonicall scripture as yet S. Augustine others did before him the rest of the writers for the most parte euer since haue donne whether it were because he ment onelie they were not contained in the Canon of the Iewes or for that the whole Church had not then declared them for Canonicall vnder that name Neuerthelesse he is not to be iudged more repugnant to the doctrine of the present Roman Church in that point then those who notobstanding that in the primitiue Church certaine bookes of the new Testament as the epistle to the Hebrewes others were doubted of yet now with infallible certaintie faith receaue them for diuine sacred scripture althou ' they were not accounted beleiued for such by all the orthodoxall Fathers of the Church in all former ages since the time of the Apostles who firste published them to the world Especiallie considering that the same sainct Gregorie neuer denyed neyther in the place cited nor in anie other of his workes but that as the declaration of the Church was sufficient to assure all faithfull people that those bookes of which before his dayes there had binne doubt were then trulie Canonicall scripture thou ' not knowne for such in euerie age before him so might the same succeeding Church in later times determine the like of those bookes which in his time so generallie vndoubtedlie were not as yet held for such Neyther according to the rules of diuinitie can that man be reputed not to be of the same religion of which another is because he now beleaueth some thing more in the materiall obiect of faith then the other did in that time in which he liued but at the most it can onelie be truelie verified that he hath the same habit of faith thou ' some what more extended in the obiect as neyther the Apostles were of a diuerse faith when they were firste instructed by Christe before his passion from that they had after his resurrection when yet doubtlesse they receaued more expresse extensiue knowledge in matters of faith then before they had receiued And sure I am S. Gregorie without exception cites both the booke of Tobie Ecclesiasticus sapience most frequentlie none of which bookes neuerthelesse the misreformers admit for the worde of God And till Sir Humfrey or some of his associates can produce out of S. Augustin S. Gregorie as plaine pregnant places either for his owne tenets or against the Roman doctrine as the Romanists haue long since produced for theirs as their workes vpon euerie seuerall controuersie make apparent let them for shame neuer claime them for theirs in anie one point of controuersie for notobstanding they make a plausible vse of some fewe patches of their more ambiguous ill construed ill related sentences yet turne but the iudicious vnpartiall reader to the bookes them selues he will ingenuouslie confesse absolutelie crye a loud all is ours And if it would please his maiestie of his royall clemencie to suffer vs freelie to make tryall of our cause by scripture Fathers I knowe which side would be founde minus habens manie graines to light But it is our great miserie yet in one sense our great happines to be so crossed curbed with seueritie of tēporal lawes that we cannot be safe in the most priuate corners much lesse can we appeare in any publike assemblie for defense of our Religion Vid. Bell. in quatuor Cōtr. tom valēt Anales fid But yet supposing that S. Gregorie had binne contrarie in that particular of the bookes of Machabies for touching the rest mentioned by the knight he is sufficientlie cleered from that imputation by Bellarmine other Romanists yet could it not possiblie proue that monstrous great proposition of our aduersarie to wit that S. Gregorie in his vndoubted writings directlie opposeth the Romish faith in the maine pointes thereof consequentlie from hence it manifestlie appeereth how farre Sir Humfrey hath walked by the way when in the end of his eleauenth section he auouched his reader should plainlie discerne how the later Popes Bishops doe differ from the former how these two Fathers of the Church meaning sainct Augustine sainct Gregorie concurre expresselie with the doctrine professed in the reformed Churches different from the Roman it being most apparent by the premisses that by anie thing which he hath heere produced out of the foresayd Fathers he hath neyther proued anie one point of his owne religiō nor disproued ours but hath onelie prestigiouslie deluded the eyes of the reader with a coulorable florish yet in realitie remaineth still in the same byway in which he hath hitherto walked separate from the royall street of the ancient Doctors of the primitiue Church Sec. 14. The next section being the fourteenth is that the ingenuous Romanists confesse that the Councells which they oppose against the Reformers were neyther called by lawfull authoritie nor to the right ends Heere I finde that to be most true which a pleasant Protestant pronounceth of the Puritans sayeing their religion willinglie admitts no founder but Bragger they flourished much about a time And in sober sadnes the best Sir Humfrey can make of his aduersaries confession throu ' out his whole worke in fauour of his doctrine doth nothing more then plainlie conuince him to be of no other progenie Neyther doe their confessions fit his purpose anie better then if he should put his shooes vpon his handes or his hose vpon his head A patterne of this you may see in this verie section in which how soeuer he vaunteth of the confession of his aduersaries that by two principall conditions as he sayth ancientlie in vse for the authoritie of Councells are both acknowledged to be abrogated by later Councells to wit because quoth the knight now a dayes the Pope calls Councells without right he his assemble them in their owne name for their owne ends for proofe of which calumnious position he cites but onely two authors those scarce held for sound mettle among the Romanists neyther yet doth eyther of them plainlie auerre his position as it is vttered by him but they onelie speake by way of reprehension of such abuses as might be practised in that nature by the malice of men without taxing the Pope or anie other in particular as the knight would maliciouslie inferre out of their wordes for the confirmation of the sinister opinion he hath of the Church of Rome her head in earth The rest which he hath in this section is but eyther his owne bare assertions those not true as that from
Vide relat Synod Dordrecht Dort in which the reformed Prelates carryed themselues so zealouslie that as it is crediblie reported they spent 2000. pounds in Renish wine to heat their spirits before euer they had decreed anie one point of their controuersies Sec. 17. In his seauenteenth section Sir Humfrey doth nothing but foyst babble abuse Bellarmine other Romanists about the Church as if they extolled her aboue the scriptures accusing here to haue spoyled herself of them as if it were vncertaine among them whether the Roman Church is the true Church because they teach it hath diuers acceptions which is all false friuolous matter for that altho' the Church according to the heterogeniall partes diuers functions of the persons of which it consists may admit seuerall denominations as are the essentiall representatiue or virtuall Church in which point also peraduenture there may be found some difference among the Romanists in their manner of speech speculations yet in substance they all agree that the visible Church to which the faithfull must seeke in their doubtes is the visiblie perpetuallie succeeding Church from the time of Christe till this day which is the plaine way in which etiam stulti ambulant euen the most simple sort of people may easilie finde walke in all other Churches especiallie the inuisible Congregation of Sir Humfrey his fellowes is but a blinde diuerticle by-way fitter for wanderers vagabonds then for the true honest people of God to walke in Sec. 18. In the title of the 18. section the knight pretendeth to proue that the Plea which the Romanists drawe from the infallible authoritie title of the Catholike Church is false vaine friuolous Althou ' the name authoritie of the Catholike Church hath euer binne so odious to all sortes of sectaries that they made it a cheife parte of their labours to impugne the same of which seuerall instances might easilie be produced yet this practise of theirs hath neuer bin so much vsed or so earnestly pursued as in these present tymes For as it is well knowne that their Captaine Antesignane Luther strucke his firste stroake at the Pope Churches power to graunt indulgences so is it also apparent by experience that all his followers continue the same battle with all their strenght stratagems For proofe of which wee need goe no further then to this our aduersarie Who throu ' his whole workes laboureth nothing more then to diminish the lustre power of the Catholike Roman Church in so much that in this verie section he maketh choise rather to lay violent hands vpon the sacred Bible shamefullie to corrupt three seuerall places of the diuine scripture then faile of his purpose or want colour for his peruerse intent which to the end the reader may more plainelie vnderstand I will particularlie reherse The firste place therefore consists in diuers passages of the epistle to the Romans especially in the firste chapter where that which the Apostle by way of admonition speaketh onely to those particular Christians members of the Church which were then at Rome exhorting them to be constant in their faith humble themselues least God cut them of for their sinnes as he did the Iewes the knight doth violentlie drawe it to the whoâ—… Roman Church as if S. Paul did intimate tâ—…â—t had a possibilitie of falling consequentlie was but a particular Church feygning also that sainct Paul did therefore pray for the continuance stabilitie of the Roman faith as if saith Sir Humfrey he had for seene by the spirit of prophesie they would glorie in their owne merites all which is quite repugnant to the meaning of the text as the reader may easilie perceaue And the like abuse of the knight the reader may see in other places which he cites to the same purpose viz. to proue that the Romane Church is faileable as 1. Thessal 8.2 Thessal 3.1 Tim. 3.15 Ephes 3.14 In all which places he vseth much of his accustomed craft peruerting the sense most sacrilegiouslie in all those sacred texts in the firste to the Corinthians he falsifieth the wordes putting thou for vs the particulars of which I am sorie I cannot stande to examine to the end his grosse cousenage might more cleerlie appeare and how vnder coulour of scriptures the sacred word of God truth is adulterated euen by him who so much braggeth glorieth in it After this same fashion he eludeth two pregnant places of Fathers for the authoritie of the Church the one is of Sainct Cypr. lib. 1. epist 3. the other is of sainct Augustine contra epist fund cap. 5. to coulore his euasion about the wordes of sainct Augustine which are these Praterea Ecclesia quae nunc est in fide errare non potest ergo si credidarit aliquem librum esse canonicum ex eius testimonio â— loneum firmum quo sumetur à Theologis argumentur Canon lib. 2. c. 7. Euangelio non crederem nisi Ecclesiae Catholicae me commoueret authoritas he citeth Canus lib. 2. cap. 8. as if this author did fauore his false interpretation of sainct Augustines meaning who neuerthelesse besides that his wordes are not cited home by Sir Humfrey he onelie affirmes that sainct Augustine did not intend in that place to make rhe Church the formall reason why an infidell or one lately conuerted beleiues the Ghospell but onelie the necessarie condition of his beleife of the Canonicall scriptures which doctrine of Canus makes nothing at all for our aduersaries intent in this place which is to disproue the infallible authoritie of the Catholike Church which Canus doth not denie Lib. 7. de Canon c. 10. but professedlie maintayneth particularlie in the verie precedent chapter in other places in a most Catholike manner To this purpose the knight also cites Durand Driedo Gerson but rehearseth not their wordes which notobstaÌ„ding I haue seene cited by Chamier but if they be truly sincerelie vnderstood they conuince nothing against the infallible authoritie of the Church as neyther the wordes of sainct Thomas who onelie affirmeth that sainct Augustine speakes of the Church as an oueruling cause but not as the foundation of faith which no Romanists denies but all vniformely teach that their faith is founded vpon the word of God whose onelie authoritie is the supreme rule of the same but the Church the proponent onelie In the rest of his section Sir Humfrey makes a diuersion to the vniuersalitie of the Church for which he onely produceth some impertinent reasons of no force with the authorities of the Councells of Ferrara Basill waldensis others none of which proues any thing appertayning to the matter in treaty but onely serue to patch vp this part of his bypath in which I leaue him Sec. 19. The 19. section following affirmeth that the Church is finally resolued into the Pope whome saith the kinght the
Romanists make the husband the spouse the head the bodie of the Church This man is so full of falsity vntruth that it seemes his whole liuing is by lyeing I am perswaded he hath had his breeding in brasen faced College where impudency vntruth are the cheefe lessons in the schooles And heere the kinght hath in a manner gone beyonde if not beside himself in that faculty For I finde no lesse then there lyes euen with in the narrow limits of the title of his section nay there is not any one part or parcell of it true by which alone althou ' the reader might make a strong coniecture of the rest yet will I giue him an instance or two in particular which doubtlesse will quite conuince his iudgment of the authors knauish dealing In his 502. page now at last saith he they haue made him meaning the Pope the whole Church in so much that some are not ashamed to professe that the Pope may dispense against the Apostles yea against the new testament vppon good cause also against all the precepts of the old This lye is so exorbitant monstrous that it seemes he who made it doubted it would not be taken vppon his owne bare word wherfore he fled to the authority of his frend Iewell whome he quotes in the margent to make it more authenticall as if that famous Father of false dealing could sufficiently supply all that which in that nature is wanting in himself But I hope the iudicious reader will register them both in one predicament giue no more credit to the one then the other but send them togeather to the whetstone Another instance I giue the reader out of the 504. page where the knight chargeth Bellarmine to teach that if the Pope should so much erre as to command vices forbid virtues the Church were bound to beleiue that vices are good virtues euill vnlesses she will sinne against her conscience It is true the Cardinall hath the same wordes which Sir Humfrey cites hitherto but yet he vseth most dishonest double dealing in regare that if he had either rehearsed the whole place intirely as it lieth in Bellarmine or else had veiwed his recognition he might easily haue found the authors true meaning to be not that in generall euery matter all occasions but onely that in doubtful cases in things not necessarily good or ill of themselues in matters indifferent such obedience is to be giuen to the Pope least otherwise men should proceed against their consciences therfore saith he Si Papa If the Pope should command that which is cleerly knowne to be a vice or should prohibite that which is cleerly knowne to be a virtue then we ought rather to obey God then men And so we see that taking away the imposture cousinage of the kinght there is nothing in Bellarmines doctrine that may either iustly offend the reader or that makes for the purpose heere intended of prouing that the Pope ought to be obeyed whether his doctrine be true or false as our aduersary doth falsely calumniously affirme All the rest which the knight hath in this section is onely sophisticall fopperies crackes of his crazed braine abusing the doctrine of diuers Romanists framing such sense to their words as cōmeth neerste to his owne purpose is farthest from theirs so falsely fathering it vppon them confounding the faith of the whole Church with matters disputable in opinion he concludes discourse of all which let the reader consider whether the Romanists or he himself rather be not in the by-way he hath fallaciously framed for his aduersaries Sec. 20. In the section followeing which is the 20. in order he affirmes that the Church which he saith is resolued finally into the Pope hath neither personall nor doctrinall succession neyther in matter of faith nor fact It appeeres by the knights proceedings in this whole section that he hath met with his greatest enimie against whome he vseth all his art cunning hoping to haue the mastrie by striking most stronglie at the head that is the Pope whome to make his bloue the fuller he feignes to be the whole bodie like a venemous spider gathering poyson from the fragāt flowers of the Roman doctrine spits the verie quitessence of it against his sacred person Yet a great part of his matter is but loathsome inculcations of that which he hath a hundred times repeated which haue binne as often anseared by my selfe others But because his importunitie is so great I will giue the reader a taste thou ' I confesse it is most tedious vnto me to eate so often of the same Crambe The knights cheife plot in this place is by confronting the doctrine of the ancient Popes not onelie in matters of fact but of faith also with the moderne doctrine of the Roman Churches Popes he beginnes with priuate Masse sayeing that Pope Anacletus did decree that after consecration all present should communicate according as the Apostles set downe the Roman Church then obserued Now this Sir Humfrey compareth with the doctrine of the late Councell of Trent which determines vnder paine of excommunication that Masses in which the Preists alone communicates are not vnlawfull or to be abrogated as if this decree were contrarie to the other which directlie it is not for that althou ' the wordes of Anaclet doe shewe the common custome of his time yea of the Church of his time notwithstanding they also insinuate that the contrarie had binne practised at the least in some places to haue binne that all present at Masse did de facto communicate yea that those that did not should be put out Yet in regard the Councell of Trent doth neyther denie nor dissallowe of that custome nay rather expreslie desires the continuation of it but onelie defineth that such Masses as are celebrated without more communicants besides the Preist are not to be condemned abollishhed as the clamorous sectaries of our daies doe contend it is more then euident that there is no contrarietie to be founde betweene the one the other nor more then if the same Councell had defined that those Communions are not vnlawfull or not to be condemned in which infants are not admitted to receaue the Sacrament notobstanding the custome was in the primitiue Church to admitte them To omitte that Sir Humfrey is verie ignorant in the doctrine of the Roman Church if he knoweth not that althou ' in matters of faith there can be no chaunge yet in matters of manners alteration may be made so that according to diuersitie of times places persons that which once hath binne practised yea commanded by one Pope Councell at one time may be otherwise practised in another that without anie preiudice but rather with great profit in some cases to the vniuersal Church which doctrine because the knight wanteth eyther witt or will
to passe saith he that the number of the faithfull are so few that at all times they cannot easily be discerned His ansere is because it was foretold in the 18. of sainct Luke that when the sonne of man commeth he shall not finde faith vpon the earth marke the wisdome of this great Salomon admire it S. Luke as his wordes doe plainelie testifie speakes prophesies of the time of the comming of our Sauiour to iudge the world at the day of the generall iudgment yet Sir Humfrey most absurdlie abusedlie falselie applyes them to that vast Caos or large space of time which hath passed since the time of the Apostles to the dayes of Luther yea as it seemes by his discourse euen to the time of Christs comming to iudgment in the end of the world as if according to his reformed Logike this were a good consequence when the sonne of man commeth he shall not finde faith vpon the earth therefore the number of the faithfull is so smale that at all times they cannot easily be discerned ô acute subtile Logician in my opiniō much fitter for the carte thē the schoole of Dialect Another example I giue the reader in two places cited by the knight the one out of the 2. of Peter 2. chap. the other out of the 18. of the Reuel 3. verse which he applyeth to Indulgences pardons saying in his page 671. how comes it to passe that Indulgences pardons are graunted for monie made the treasure of their Church Because sayth he it was foretold there shall be false teachers among you by whome the way of truth shall be ill spoken of throu ' couetousnes shall with fayned wordes make marchandise of you Now it is true the place out of sainct Peter thou ' falselie fondlie applyed might farre more fitly be accommodated to the pretensiue reformed Puritanicall Nouellists whose greatest part of schollership si to rayle at the Pope Roman Church yet it is not vntrulie rehearsed but in the place quoted out of the Apocalips there is not one title to this purpose excepting that the Apostle once nameth the word merchants which neuerthelesse according to the true sense of the text maketh no more to the matter in hand then if he had named the word minister The rest of the places of scripture which he cites according to the common current exposition of the Roman Church euen at this present are vnderstood partly of the precursors of Antichrist which are the heretikes persecutors in generall of all ages partly of that great Antichriste properly so called whose comming all true Catholikes haue euer expected onely about the end or consummation of the world howbeit if a man were delighted in trifles trickes he might much more commodiously applie those same places to Luther his sequaces as hauing their pedigree discent from seuerall heretikes of former times then eyther to the Pope or Church of Rome as may also plainly appeere by the 39. articles of the new Creed of England of which excepting those fewe that agree with the doctrine of the Catholike Church there is scarce any that haue not binne defended by other heretikes ef more ancient standing as diuers learned Romanists haue demonstrated in their seuerall treatises By all which it doth appeere that althou ' Sir Humfrey hath vsed no other proofes in this section then the pure text of scripture yet hath he made so bad vse of it that all the world may cleerly perceiue that he is entred much further into his by-way then he was before Sec. 26. The 26. followeing is the conclusion of the treatise in which the author laboreth to showe the safety certainty of his owne way the vncertainty of the Romish way This is the whole drift scope not of this section onely but of the whole worke as being a breife summe of the same I confesse that if the Romanists were bound to giue credit to Sir Humfrey linds bare word in matters of faith maners then they ought of necessity to yeald him the safe way content themselues with the by but they are otherwise taught instructed they knowe that for the space of aboue 14. hundred yeeres togeather they had vnquestionable possession of the safe way to saluation may iustly say with ancient Tertullian Nos prius possedimus we had firste possession why then should we yeald vnto you take the by-way which you haue framed inuented of later yeeres nay why should we not rather with the same Tertullian boldly demaund of you who are according to the sayeing of another ancient father prodigiously borne of your selues Quiestis vos vnde quando venistis vbi tamdiu latuistis who are you from whence when did you come where haue you layne hid so long time with S. Hierome Quisquis es assector nouorum dogmatum queso vt parcas Romanis auribus parcas fidei quae apostolico ore laudata est who soeuer thou art that art a defender of new doctrine I beseech the spare the Roman eares spare that faith which is commended by the Apostles owne mouth in another place Cur post 400. annos docere nos niteris quod ante nesciuimus why after 400. yeeres I may say after 1400. yeeres doe you goe about to teach vs that which before we knew not with optatus vestrae Cathedrae originem ostendite qui vobis vultis sanctam Ecclesiam vendicare Shew the origen of your chaire you that callenge to your selues the holie Church wherfore if you vnder pretence of a reformation will enter into possessiō of the safe way if you will claime the truth leaue falsehood for vs it is not sufficient for you with a plausible flourish of speech as you vse heere Sir Humfrey to say so it is but you most firste proue your claime conuince your title that not by accusation of vs that which you haue onely performed through both your bookes for si accusasse sufficiat quis erit innocens if to accuse be sufficient who will be innocent but by positiue proofes of your owne which as yet neyther you nor any of your copemates haue euer performed You pretend sole scripture for your euidence but in place of Gods word you obtrude vnto vs your owne glosses captious illations sophiticall inferences or deductions you for your part Sir Humfrey you knowe you are ingaged by promise to ansere the Iesuites challenge which is not as you affirme hoping so to scape the brunt of the battell to proue out of some good authors that the Protestant Church so you please to call it for matter of state althou ' yours as I suppose is not truly the Protestant but the Puritan Church was all waies visible which althou ' I knowe I haue made manifest that as yet you haue not performed that taske neyther I am confident euer will be able to performe
the same yet that is not truly the Iesuites challendge but that you produce some which haue professed your religion in euery point in euery age before the daies of Luther This is the charge you haue vndertaken till you haue discharged your selfe of this your honor still remaines at the stake for all your bragges your safe way is to the Romanists all other of mature iudgment but onely a by-way serueth onely for a cowardly excuse of your want of abillitie to performe your promise But now to returne to the contents of this section in particular from which I haue in some sort digressed I say it consists onely in a recapitulation of those seuerall pointes of controuersie which I haue alreadie examined in confirmation of which since the author hath produced nothing which I haue not sufficiently confuted conuinced to be of no force but all eyther false equiuocall or impertinent it is most apparent that what soeuer he from hence collecteth by way of conclusion is noe conclusion nor of any more authority then his owne bare affirmations or negations consequently notobstanding the vaine knight will needes seeme to haue the victorie to haue gained his cause yet I make no doubt but that the prudent reader will rather iudge in fauour of the anserer then of the abiector especially considering how farre more easie a matter it is for any man to impugne the doctrine of another then to defend his owne Wherfore I ioyne issue with myne aduersaries opposing the doctrine of the Roman Church to those same positions of the pretended reformed Churches which the knight hath heere sett downe applying the same to the safe way by-way as he hath donne by-way of antithesis or oppositiue comparison betwixt them both in the manner followeing And firste I say The Romanists teach that not scripture onely but scripture with diuine Apostolicall traditions receaued for such by the vniuersall Church in all ages the approued generall Councells the infallible authority of the perpetually visible Church of God are the onely certaine meanes safe way to saluation But Sir Humfrey with his complices teach that scripture onely interpreted otherwise them by authoritie of the most vniuersallie florishing Church according to perpetual tradition of the Fathers doctors of the same is sufficient to saluation this is a doubtfull by way Secondly the Romanists teach that the scriptures are a most certaine a most safe perfect rule of faith yet in some places obscure ambiguous as euen some of their aduersaryes confesse therfore it is not sufficient alone but requires the authority of the true Church commended in the same scripture as an infallible interpreter this is a safe way to saluation but the Reformers teach that the scripture with the interpretation conference of one place with another by euerie priuate man or woman that can but reade it is a sure euident perfect rule of faith this is an vncertaine by-way Thirdly the Romanists teach that traditions appertayning to faith or manners receaued from Christe by his Apostles or from the Apostles themselues by inspiration of the holie Ghost as such conserued in the Church by continuall succession are to be imbraced reuerenced with like pious affection as the scriptures this is a safe way to saluation but the reformers teach that onelie those traditions concerning faith manners that can be proued by scriptures of which sort they denie anie to be in the Church notobstanding sainct Paul in the scripture expresselie commandeth the Thessalonians to hold his traditions deliuered vnto them by word of mouth or by epistle And this is an vncertaine by way Fourthly the Romanists teach that the vniforme consent of vndoubted Fathers is to be followed in the interpretation of scriptures some certaine persons in the Church as professors of diuinitie some others for the auoyding of noueltie in doctrine take an oath of the same moreouer that where they finde that consent they are to receaue it as a certaine rule for the true expounding of the scriptures without contradiction or inuention of other new sense or glosses this is a safe way to saluation but the reformers teach that the vniforme consent of vndoubted Fathers is to be followed onelie so farre as according to their priuate spirit or iudgment they agree with scriptures which is a captious deceitfull rule of expounding them And this is an vncertaine by-way Fiftly the Romanists teach that the Christian Catholike Church is a congregation or companie of people beleiuing professing the true faith of Christe vnder one cheife head our Sauiour Iesus Christe his vicar in earth the Pope or Bishop of Rome as cheife Pastor visible gouernour of the same vnder Christe sayeing with all that the notes whereby the true Church is knowne from all other hereticall scismaticall conuenticles are not onelie cheiflie exteriour splendour amplitude miracles as our aduersarie doth deceitfullie insinuate but principallie the name Catholike antiquitie continuall succession c. And this is a certaine safe way but the reformers teach the Church is a Congregation of pastours people with out anie certaine infallible authoritie assigning for markes of the same that which is common to all congregations euen of heretikes schismatikes according to their seuerall opinions as all euerie one of them holding they haue the true word Sacraments rightlie preached administred in their conuenticles which consequently can be no certaine markes of the true Church in particular no more then the name of a Christian in generall can be an infallible note of a true beleiuer this is an vncertaine by-way Sixtly the Romanists teach that General Councells by the Popes authoritie or approbation conuocated confirmed are not onelie of great vse in the Church But also of certaine infallible power for the determination of all doubts controuersies in religion which may arise in seuerall times occasions this is a certaine safe way But the Reformers teach that General Councells althou ' they say they be of great vse authority in the Church to determine controuersies in religion yet they hold them of vncertaine authoritie subiect to errour both in faith manners this is an vncertaine by-way Seauenthly the Romanists teach that the cheife rock angular stone vpon which the Church is built is Christe the Sauiour of the world yet they say with Christe himselfe that Peter is also in his kinde a rock vpon which he promised to build his Church this is a certaine safe way But the reformers teach that Christe alone is the onelie rock vpon which he built his Church which is repugnant to the expresse wordes of Christe in the scripture sayeing to Peter vpon this rocke will I build my Church this is a diuerticle or by-way Eightly the Romanists teach that the
first chapter of his Euchyr saith these wordes praestantia huius scripturae c. the excellencie of this scripture doth surpasse the scriptures multis partibus in manie respects or by manie degrees those scriptures which the Apostles left vs in partchement he doth not speake of the vnwritten tradition of the Church but of that scripture which as afterwardes he declareth Spiritus sanctus in cordibus imprimere dignatus est that is which the holie spirit doth digne or voutsafe to imprinte in our hartes Which as he speakes before in the same chapter is nothing els but the spirit of consent of the Catholike Church in faith and the concording doctrine of all faithfull Christians not of those onely which now liue in the whole world but those alsoe whoe by continuall succession haue propagated the faith of Christ from the tyme of the Apostles which is that Scripture which the Apostle saith 2. cor 3. is read by all men and the vnction quaest 2. Io. 2. docet nos de omnibus c. which teaches vs all things which as he further addeth afterwardes hath all truth in it selfe and containeth all faith and mysteries of Christian religion and resolues all doubtes which may aryse in matter of faith and soe costerus compareth not the vnwritten worde with the written precisely but the internall with the externall which internall scripture is iustely preferred by him before the bare written worde or caracter because as he takes it here it includes the true sense of both the one and the other by which it appeares that the exceptions which Sir Humfrey takes at this authors wordes ar captious and voyde of reason Vrspergensis is produced by Sir Humfrey page 400. of his deuia as a witnesse that the second councel of Nyce or seuēth generall synod assembled in the yeare 788. was reiected in the councell of Francford as vtterly voyde and not to be named the seuenth And yet hauing examined this passage in that author I fynde he speakes not a worde of the Nycene councell but of a cettaine councell of Constantinople which he affirmes to haue ben called the seuenth synod general by the Emperatrice Irene and her sonne Constantine his wordes are these Sinodus etiam qua ante paucos annos in Constantinopoli congregata sub Irene Constantino filio eius septima vniuersalis ab ipsis appellata est vt nec septima nec aliquid diceretur quasi superuacua ab omnibus nimirum patribus Concilij Francfordiensis abdicata est Vrsperg pag. 176. in which wordes of what soeuer Councell vrpergensis intended to speake yet none of them mention the Councell of Nyce as all those whoe vnderstand latin may easily perceiue And if Sir Hunfrey will replye and say that tho' that author doth not mention the Nycene Councell in wordes yet doth he sufficiently declare his meaning to be of no other Councell then the seeond Nycene Synod in regarde he affirmes it to haue ben vnder Irenne and her sonne and the same which was condemned in the Councell of Francford I anser that by reason this author doth vtter twoe things which seeme to implye contradictiō to wit that this Councell was assembled at Constantinople and yet that it is the same which was reiected by the Councell of Francford it euidently followeth that no certaine argument can be drawne frō his wordes whatsoeuer his meaning was and this is sufficient to shewe that he is cited in vaine by the knight Secondly I say not obstanding vspergensis hallucination and suppose he did truely meane that the Councell of Nyce concerning the adoration of images was reproued by the Synod of Francford as some other authors admit in their disputatiōs with the sectaries of our tymes yet doth this nothing auaile our aduersaries cause both in respect the Synod of Francford is not accepted by the Romanists for an authenticall Councell in this particular as alsoe for that as some opinate it proceeded vpon false information and persuasion that the foresaid Synod of Nyce had decreed that images were to be adored with diuine honor and by this meanes the Fathers and doctors ther assembled were deceiued and committed an error of fact Which error neuerthelesse neither can nor ought to preiudice that doctrine which was before established by an authenticall generall Councell as was the secōd Synod consisting of a happie cōiunction of both the latin Grecian Church as of sune and moone And the reader may see that Sir Humfrey hath both dealt some thing insincere in the allegatiō of Vspergensis and alsoe hath proceeded preposterously in that he indeuored to infringe the authoritie of the greater Councell by the vncertaine proceeding of the lesse Page 261. of the same deuia he detortes the S. Irenaeus wordes contrarie to his meaning against Apostolicall traditions And yet S. Irenaeus euen in the wordes which are cited by him speakes onely against those who denyed absolutely that the trueth is deliuered by the Scriptures but onely by tradition and soe made them selues or their onwe traditions the rule of faith Of which number of hererikes saith he were Valentinus Marcion Cerinthus Basilides of whome he vttered the wordes cited by Sir Humfrey as affirming that the truth could not be founde by Scriptures by those whoe were ignorant of traditions for say they the truth was not deliuered by writing but by worde of mouth yet notobstanding this the same Irenaeus afterwardes speakes against others whoe doe not denye scriptures or rather against such as follow scriptures onely and reiect traditions receiued from the Apostles by succession of preists and conserued or obserued in the Church saying that they haue founde the pure truth as the pretended reformers nowe commonly babble of whome he saith that They neither consent to scriptures nor tradition and against whome saith the saint we ought euerie way to resist Soe that it is cleare that he disputes here onely against such heretikes as neither yealde to scriptures nor traditions and therfore he putteth for the litle of his chapter in this place quod neque scripturis neque traditionibus obsequantur haretici that heretiques neither obey scriptures nor traditions both which S. Irenaeus doth expressely imbrace And by this lett the reader iudge how intempestiuely the knigh doth produce this testimonie against those I meane the Romanists who neither reiect the scriptures nor approued traditions but like twoe indiuided companions receiue them both and let him alsoe consider whether the doctrine of holye Irenaeus in this place be not farre more contrarie to the tenet of the pretēded reformers then to the doctrine of the Roman Church whoe make onely scriptures expounded according to their owne sense the sole rule of faith Especially considering that the same ancient Father in the next ensuing chapter doth expressely receiue Apostolicall traditions saying in the verie first wordes traditionem itaque Apostolicam in toto mundo manifestam in Ecclesia adest perspicere omnibus qui vera volunt audire habemus
latencie or inuisibilitie of the Church which our aduersarie professeth to prosecute in that his section And this which I say is made plaine by the last clause or conclusion of the epistle which is this At tu ò conspicue Ecclesiae alumne ne ad eos qui naufragio pereunt animum attendas nec cum segnibus ignauis teipsum compares verum scientiae lumen splendidius subinde redde per vitae probitatem ac virtutem ipsum irrigans Atque sponsum expecta ingressum quidem cum ijs qui animis corporihus virgines sunt De ijs autem qui virginitatis sucerdotis dignitati per flagitia sua contumeliam intulerunt supplicium sumpturum By which wordes it is plaine here is nothing of anie reformatiō in Faith made or yet desired in those dayes which is that Sir Humfrey aymeth at Nor is ther anie worde which fauors luthers pretēded reformation of the Church Neuerthelesse if Sir Humfrey and his consociates could but pick vs out one halfe dozen of such chaste and religious monkes as these out of all the seuerall Congregatiōs of their illuminate brothers since the dayes of Luther then would we most willingly giue licence vnto them to reforme the Church at their pleasures Sir Humfrey in the 24. chapter of his deuia cites a great number of Romanists with intention to proue the inuisibilitie of the Church the medium he vseth for his proofe be the testimonies of those authors whoe acknowledge abuses to haue ben in the Church in their seuerall ages euen till the dayes of luther whoe signifye in their writings that they haue desired reformation of such abuses Out of which holting premisses Sir Humfrey inferreth this crooked conclusion to wit that Luther was the man that made the soe long wished reformation Which illation as the reader may easily perceiue is as lame as her parēts neithet is that consequens anie more necessarie then that Mahomet was the reformer of the Church because at the same tyme and before he founded his sect ther were perhaps some things which wanted amēdment And yet much lesse can anie man imagin how out of those twoe propositions viz that diuers learned and pious people complained of abuses and corruption of maners and desired redresse therfore the Church was latent and obscure or inuisible or yet further that that latent and obscure Church was the Church of the pretēded reformers or that those zelous and godly persons who soe complained in seuerall ages were members of the same and not rather virtuous and religious Romanists as in deed they were all which inferences because Sir Humfrey neither doth nor can possible proue to be sounde and legitimate therfore he hath spent much tyme in vaine in that he maketh a large rehearsall of the speeches of such authors as haue noted the common and publike vices of their dayes which and the like sinnes and abuses no Romanist euer denyed but they may be euen in the members of tre true visible Church Now to come to particulars to the end the follie of our aduersarie may more plainely appeare I will examen some passages which he citeth out of Gerson which being those which seeme most plausible for his cause when the reader shall see them declared and rectifyed he will without anie more exacte discussion be able to iudge of others of lesse apparence and color I confesse that Gerson was free in his speaches as being a zelous and plaine man and a sharpe represender of vices neuerthelesse I finde not in his writings but that he was an humble acknowledger of the Popes authoritie yea and an earnest defender of those points of doctrine which luther and the rest of the pretended newe reformants hould for errneous and false opinions for superstions and idolatrie As the vse of images prayer to saints Purgatorie the seuen Sacraments the reall presence and the rest of the matters in controuersie betweene vs and thē de numero Sacramentorū sciendum quod septē sunt Gers 2. part Act. 26. as his workes printed at Strasburg in foure partes or tomes declare neither did he euer desire anie reformation in the substance of these particulars howe be it I denye not but that as he might finde some abuses in the practise of the same soe might he alsoe wish for amendment of them but this is not contrarie to the doctrine and practize of the Romanists but most conformable to the same whoe as they confesse that some things deseruing correction may creepe in to the particular members of the Church yea and into the head and cheefe pastor him selfe soe doe they not onely desire but alsoe procure reformation of the same by all direct and lawfull meanes And soe whatsoeuer Gerson saith in this nature if it be not detorted to a sense contrarie to the true meaning of the author as here it is by Sir Humfrey the Romanists most willingly imbrace it as profitable to the soules of manie and for the good of the vniuersall Church It is true Gerson speakes something harshely and by excesse when he saith euen as wee see in like manner in some countryes touching censures and lawes inuented aboute particular obseruances or rules not necessarie to saluation which are often tymes preferred before the lawes of God and of the Gospell And this same wee see mânifestely in the decrees and decretalls whēce it is that some tymes a monke is more seuerely punished for going without his hood then for cōmitting adultring or sacriledge and he that offendes against one of the Popes commandements then he that sinnes against one of the commaundemēts of God and the Euangell according to that reprehension of our Sauior you haue frustrated the commaundements of God for the traditions of men In an other place the same Gerson complaines of the abuses and sinnes of fryers Nunns and preists of the great varietie of images which he bids the reader consider whether they be not occasion of idolatrie in the simple people of the canonization of newe saints and religious orders of which he saith ther are to manie alreadie and that the feasts of the newe saints are more religiously obserued then the feasts of the Apostles of Apocrypsall Scriptures and prayers superstitious opinions of obtaining remission of sinnes by saying soe manie Pater nosters in such a Church before such an image And in his treatise de Concil Gen. vnius obedientiae he saith thus if the Church may not be reformed according to the state in which it was in the tyme of Christ and his Apostles yet at least it should be brough to the state it was in the tyme of Pope syluester In an other place Gerson as it were by way of complainte saith in hac tempestate meaning in that season in which he liued he did see matters standing as they did that scarce anie due determination or speedie and free execution of iustice was found in doctrine appertaining to faith religion to good and hoalsome manners vnlesse it
had an implicit faith of all those obiects which they nowe confesse them selues to beleeue according to that deductiue manner or else they had noe faith at all of them before they were deduced whence it farther followes that euer since they made their foresaid illations or consequences their faith is newe and quyte distinct from their owne faith in former tymes the absurditie of which most necessarie sequele I remit to the censure of the reasonable and iudicious learned reader to determine By occasion of this I desire the reader to take yet more cleare notice of the great peruersitie of the proposterous Nouellists who as they reueile their violēce in reprouing the foresaid receiued doctrine of implicit or inexpressed faith soe likewise they ar no lesse peremptorie in defending their owne newe distinction of fundamental and not fundamental points in Religion according to which their position they obstinately maintaine the Church can erre in matters of faith that is in such points of faith as in their conceite ar not foundamentall But against the falsitie of this distinction I argue first vpon their owne supposed principle to wit that nothing is to be beleeued in matters of faith which is not founde in scripture either explicitly and clearely or by cleare and certaine consequence wherfore this doctrinal distinctiō of theirs being a matter of faith and yet not founde in scripture in either of those two manners related plaine it is that according to the pretended reformers doctrine it neither deserues faith nor credit More ouer this distinction is soe newely coyned by our aduersaries and soe farre from hauing anie foundation either in scripture or ancient doctors that I neuer read anie mention of it in the first and cheefe establishers of the pretended reformatiō Onely Chamier who is in deed a violent defender of Caluinisme in his booke de natura Ecclesiae Cap. 13. num 11. seemes plainely to suppose the same distinction in substance affirming that the Catholique Church can erre licet non in fundamento salutis tho' not in the foundation of saluation Yet Chamier haueing writ his Panstratia but of late yeares either our English Nouellists receiued it from him or inuented it them selues not long before soe that the noueltie of it a lone were sufficient to conuince it of vntrueth and vanitie And altho' I might iustely take exceptions at the worde it selfe for the newnesse of it according to the Apostles counsel to Timomothie to auoyde profane nouelties of wordes in regarde the worde not fundamentals as it is applyed to matters of faith and thee errors of the Church ther in by our aduersaries it is a kynde of profanation both of diuine faith it selfe which is truely fundamental in al respects and also of the authoritie of the Church which likewise is infallible as much in one matter as an other Neuerthelesse my cheefe intention is not to insiste in the reproofe of wordes which I graunt may vpon occasion and for better declaration of a trueth be inuented and vsed by the Churches authoritie but I onely stande vpon the sense or obiect of them directely conuinceing the matter signifyed by those wordes not fundamental in faith to be repugnant both to scripture and Fathers That which I proue by a seconde argument of the same nature to wit because the scripture expressely teaches that 1. Tim. 3. Ecclesia est the Church is a pallar or firmament of truth And our Sauior promisseth his Father will giue to his Apostles and their successors an other Paraclete the spirit of trueth to remaine with them for euer Ioan. 14. Ioan. 16. which same diuine Spirit as he him selfe declares afterwardes in the 16. chapter will teache them all trueth which vniuersal terme all includes and signifyes both fundamental and not fundamental truethes and consequently it expressely excludeth this vaine distinction of the nouellists To which purpose S. Cyrill vpon the 10. chapter of the same Euangelist speakes most fittly and appositly saying that althou ' in this life we knowe onely in parte as S. Paule affirmes non manca tamen sed integra veritas in hac parua cognitione nobis refulsit yet not a meamed or imperfect but an intyre true faith shined vnto vs in this smale knowledge And the place now cited out of the first to Tim. 3. is by all interpreters of scripture both ancient and moderne expounded of the firmenes and stabilitie which the Church hath by the assistance of the holie Goste in her deliuerie of true doctrine to her particular members conformable to which sense Tertullian to omit the rest for breuitie in the 28. of his prescriptions hath a most fine sentence as it were in derision of those who teach the vniuersal or Catholique Churche can erre in matters of faith Could not saith hee the holie Goste haue respected her soe much as to haue induced her into all truth he hauing ben sent by Christ to this ende hauing ben requyred by his Father to be the Doctor of trueth should villicus Christi vicarius the stewarde the vicar of Christ haue neglected the office of God suffering the Churches in the meane tyme to vnderstande and beleeue otherwise then he him selfe preached by the Apostles Thus plainely generally absolutely ancient Tertullian of the infallibilitie of the Catholique Churche in points of doctrine and faith And nowe farther supposing that al these passages both of the scripture their expositors ar absolute general sans limitation it is most apparent they can admit no such distinction in their true sense interpretation but that at the leaste the catholique Churche can not teache or beleeue anie error at all in such things as ar contained within the total obiect of faith in which ther can not possible be anie parte or partial which is not fundamental by reason that all kinde of diuine faith is the verie foundation of Religion christian iustice according to the saying of S. Augustin Domus Dei fide fundatur the house of God is founded in faith if the foundation of the house of God were faultie it would doubtlesse fall to ruine contrarie to his owne promisse or affiirmation viz. That the gates of hell shal not preuaile against it Neither is it auaileable for our aduersaries to saye that the Church can not erre in the cheefe articles of her faith as ar the Trinitie the Incarnation of Christ which ar fundamentals but in such points as ar not fundamental as ar the reall presence iustification the true quantitie sense of Canonical scriptures other such like matters in controuersie with vs them the Church may teache erroneous false doctrine For thir euasion I replie it is grounded not in inuincible but in vincible grosse ignorance of the nature of true faith which being in it selfe one simple or single entitie or essence as according to the doctrine of the Apostle God Baptisme ar Vna fides vnum Baptisma vnus Deus how different soeuer its obiect be
ornantes expanso super ipsum linteo in die quadam illustri anni per aliquot dies panem ponunt offerunt Mariae Epipha impres Basilicae Iano Corn. interp omnes autem panem participant in ◅tum enim hoc m◅lier◅ opinio est ibidem Continentiam praedicat nuptias autem scortationem putat asserens nihil differre matrimonium a scortatione sed idem esse Epipha ibid. nec recipiunt in suorum numerum coniugio vtentem Aug. haer 25. and restraint of the mariage of Priests he attributeth to the Tatians and Manicheis and for proofe of this he citeth Epiphanius heresie 79. and 46. But he abuseth this authour in both those places And first touching the Collyridians both the same Epiphanius and others doe expresselie teach that they worshipped our blessed Ladie idolatrously by attributing diuinity sacrificying vnto her or her image a cake of bread or tart as the verie worde it selfe in greeke doth signifie and so this superstitious heresie can be no part of the Popish pedegree Moreouer Sir Humfrey doth falselie affirme that Epiphanius calles thes women Idolaters for he doth not in anie place giue them that generall name altho' they iustelie deserued it but he calles them simulachrificae that is sacrifiers to images which is an heresie as much repugnant to the Roman Catholikes doctrine as it is to Protestancie which worde alone is sufficient to cleare the Romanists from the heresie of those profane people but this as it seemes the craftie Cauallier dissembled for the aduantage of his false accusation Secondlie concerning the heresie of the Tatians it is certaine out of that Epiphanius Ireneus and others that they reiected Matrimonie absolutelie and compared it to fornication which as the world knowes the Roman Church doth not but onelie for the greater decencie and reuerence to the seruice of God prohibits it in those onelie who dedicate themselues to the same by receauing holie orders and priesthood And thus you see Sir Humfrey insteede of deducing the succession of the Romanists from auncient heresies he makes but a Pedegree of his owne lyes And the like I say of the Manicheans whome the knight falselie and iniuriouslie affirmes to haue beene our predecessours in that they prohibited mariage in Preists quoting in the margent S. Epiphanius heresie 46. whome neuerthelesse I haue diligentlie read but cannot finde it Yet I finde in Saint Augustin who both followed S. Epiphanius much in his descriptions of heresies and also was better acquainted then anie writer of his tyme with the errours of the Maniches that they did not onelie prohibit matrimonie in Preists but that they absolutelie detested the same for so he saith of those sectaries Verum si ad virginitatem sic adhortamini quemodum hortatur Apostolica doctrina lib. 3. contra faust Manich. cap. 6. qui dat nuptum bene facit qui non dat nuptum melius facit vt bonum esse nuptias diceretis sed meliorem virginitatem sicut facit Ecclesia quae vere Ecclesia Christi est non vos spiritus sanctus ita praenuntiaret dicens prohibentes nubere Ille enim prohibet qui hoc malum tsse dicit non qui huic bono aliud melius anteponit Denique eum vos precipue concubitum detestamini qui solus honestus coniugalis est quem matrimoniales quoque tabulae praese gerunt liberorum procreandorum causa vnde vere non tam concumbere quam nubere prohibetis And presentlie after Nec ideo vos dicatis non prohibere qui multos vestros auditores obedire nolentes in hoc vel non volentes salua amicitia toleratis illud enim habetis in doctrina vestri erroris hoc in necessitate societatis Thus plainelie S. Augustin whose wordes to make them also plaine to those who vnderstand not Latin I will put them in English But if saith he you so exhorte to virginitie as the Apostolicall doctrine dōth exhorte he who giueth in mariage doth well he who doth not giue in mariage doth better so that you should say that mariage is good but virginitie better as that Church doth which is truelie the Church of Crist the holie spirit would not thus prenuntiate you saying prohibiting to marie for he doth prohibit who saith this is euill not he who doth preferre before this good thing an other thing better then it Finallie you doe cheeflie deteste that carnall coniunction which onelie is honest and matrimoniall and which the matrimoniall writings also declare to be for procreation of children whence it is that you doe not so much prohibit carnall copulation as you prohibit mariage And presentlie after the same S. Augustin addeth Neither therefore can you say that you doe not prohibit to marie Because manie of your auditours being not willing or refusing to obey in this you tolerate them for frendship sake for you haue that in your doctrine of your errour this in necessitie of societie By which wordes of this most famous doctour we may plainelie gather that suppose S. Epiphanius had those wordes in sacerdotibus yet he did not meane of Preists onelie when he spoake of the Manichean heresie but of a direct and absolute prohibition of mariage as vnlawfull and detestable in all sortes of persons and consequentlie this passage of Sir Humfrey drawne out of the wordes of S. Epiphanius containeth no kinde of disproofe of Roman Catholike doctrine in this particular but a faule imposture of his owne if he can not produce out of this authour the wordes which he citeth And whereas he affirmes that the Maniches were our predecessours prohibited mariage in Preists quoting S. Epiphanius in the margent Dices mihi omnino in quibusdam locis adhuc liberos gignere presbyteros Diaconos Hypodiaconos at hoc non est iuxta canonem sed iuxta hominum mentem Epiph. Haeres 59. I finde no such heresie in his Cathalogue of the heresies of Manicheus but contrarilie I am sure I finde in an other place of his workes that Preists were by the Ecclesiasticall Canons prohibited to marie For thus he speaketh Doubtlesse you will tell me that euen yet in certaine places Preists Deacons and Subdeacons gette children But this is not according to the Canon but according to the myndes of men c. And with these and other errours which he affirmeth to be taught in the Roman Church but doth not specifie he endeth his Pedegree of the Romanists which though he houlds it to haue descended either from auncient heretikes or at the least to haue as he saith neere affinitie with their adultered issue neuerthelesse presentlie after hauing better examined his conscience and considered more deliberatelie of the matter he seemes to loose some of his former confidence and so addeth that if he hath fayled in calculating the right natiuitie of their auncient doctrine yet sure I am saith hee they are vtterlie destitute of a right succession in persons and doctrine from the Apostles and the auncient orthodox