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church_n answer_v time_n true_a 2,749 5 4.5472 3 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A28884 The pride and avarice of the clergie, viz. parsons, vicars & curats, hindering the reformation discovered in a plain and familiar dialogue between Philalethes and presbyter / by Abraham Boun, gent. Boun, Abraham. 1650 (1650) Wing B3836; ESTC R30307 53,217 195

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novice_n or_o ignorant_a fellow_n have_v be_v two_o or_o three_o year_n or_o it_o may_v be_v less_o at_o the_o university_n and_o put_v he_o up_o into_o the_o pulpit_n not_o doubt_v of_o his_o call_n to_o the_o ministry_n and_o all_o these_o in_o order_n to_o the_o service_n of_o these_o man_n pride_n and_o covetousness_n pr._n i_o perceive_v you_o find_v fault_n almost_o with_o every_o thing_n although_o never_o so_o ancient_a and_o inoffensive_a what_o can_v you_o say_v against_o marriage_n why_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v account_v to_o belong_v to_o the_o ministry_n have_v be_v so_o long_o use_v in_o the_o church_n ph._n i_o answer_v that_o marriage_n be_v a_o civil_a action_n and_o belong_v to_o the_o magistrate_n to_o see_v it_o orderly_o do_v and_o so_o be_v use_v under_o the_o law_n and_o be_v so_o use_v at_o new-england_n and_o in_o other_o reform_a church_n at_o this_o day_n ruth_n 4._o 9_o lechfield_n news_n etc._n etc._n pag._n 39_o it_o be_v true_a that_o in_o corruption_n 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5._o 19_o whosoever_o shall_v break_v one_o of_o the_o least_o commandment_n and_o teach_v man_n so_o shall_v be_v least_o in_o the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n which_o i_o take_v to_o be_v mean_v of_o the_o church_n of_o god_n under_o the_o gospel_n and_o it_o be_v to_o be_v therefore_o fear_v that_o reformation_n will_v be_v defer_v until_o the_o carcase_n of_o the_o chief_a of_o these_o man_n be_v fall_v in_o the_o wilderness_n that_o they_o may_v never_o see_v the_o promise_a land_n pr._n you_o censure_v the_o faithful_a minister_n of_o the_o church_n very_o uncharitable_o why_o shall_v you_o suspect_v their_o faithfulness_n in_o reform_v god_n house_n see_v they_o be_v painful_a in_o their_o calling_n and_o faithful_a in_o that_o which_o be_v commit_v to_o they_o ph._n i_o honour_v the_o faithful_a minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n and_o i_o beseech_v the_o lord_n to_o increase_v their_o number_n but_o beside_o what_o i_o have_v former_o say_v i_o will_v remember_v you_o of_o what_o pass_v in_o these_o last_o year_n and_o by_o that_o you_o may_v judge_v of_o their_o faithfulness_n who_o you_o so_o much_o commend_v it_o be_v manifest_a in_o what_o condition_n the_o parliament_n find_v this_o whole_a nation_n at_o their_o first_o meeting_n even_o post_v in_o all_o haste_n to_o rome_n long_v after_o the_o garlic_n and_o onion_n of_o egypt_n and_o they_o have_v captain_n make_v to_o lead_v they_o thither_o the_o whole_a rabble_n of_o prelate_n as_o their_o captain_n and_o cheif_n and_o the_o inferior_a clergy_n parson_n vicar_n curate_n priest_n etc._n etc._n with_o the_o rest_n of_o their_o apocryphal_a ecclesiastical_a order_n as_o their_o lieutenant_n and_o inferior_a officer_n and_o these_o faithful_a man_n you_o speak_v of_o serve_v the_o time_n make_v no_o head_n against_o the_o rest_n but_o patient_o bear_v what_o their_o lord_n put_v upon_o they_o and_o so_o march_v with_o the_o throng_n towards_o egypt_n pr._n i_o can_v say_v but_o that_o the_o church_n of_o england_n although_o the_o most_o famous_a church_n in_o the_o world_n furnish_v with_o a_o most_o learned_a and_o orthodox_a clergy_n have_v many_o in_o it_o who_o be_v very_o conrrupt_a and_o superstitious_a but_o these_o be_v remove_v and_o orthodox_a godly_a and_o learned_a divine_n of_o who_o we_o former_o speak_v put_v in_o their_o room_n and_o place_n ph._n you_o glory_n like_o the_o angel_n of_o the_o church_n of_o laodicea_n in_o your_o gift_n and_o grace_n and_o know_v not_o your_o want_n and_o poverty_n rev._n 3._o 17._o it_o be_v partly_o true_a that_o in_o some_o place_n the_o ignorant_a scandalous_a and_o other_o who_o will_v not_o take_v the_o covenant_n have_v be_v remove_v and_o some_o of_o these_o orthodox_a man_n put_v in_o their_o room_n and_o that_o be_v and_o will_v be_v the_o bane_n of_o these_o church_n and_o churchman_n take_v but_o a_o view_n of_o their_o practice_n and_o let_v that_o speak_v how_o well_o they_o have_v carry_v themselves_o within_o five_o 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but_o how_o these_o man_n press_v the_o committee_n for_o plunder_v minister_n for_o augmentation_n and_o removal_n from_o day_n to_o day_n and_o how_o they_o engage_v parliament_n man_n to_o act_v for_o they_o call_v themselves_o in_o their_o certificate_n and_o petition_n godly_a learned_a and_o orthodox_a divine_n and_o it_o be_v observe_v in_o the_o country_n that_o many_o of_o those_o who_o be_v thus_o put_v in_o prove_v more_o proud_a covetous_a and_o contentious_a than_o those_o which_o be_v put_v out_o and_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o when_o these_o man_n belly_n be_v full_a and_o they_o at_o ease_n they_o will_v agree_v to_o make_v a_o golden_a calf_n and_o rise_v up_o to_o play_v as_o their_o predecessor_n do_v and_o i_o do_v believe_v that_o those_o who_o serve_v their_o cure_n as_o they_o call_v they_o by_o a_o deputy_n will_v without_o repentance_n go_v to_o heaven_n by_o a_o deputy_n pr._n although_o i_o will_v not_o excuse_v all_o the_o clergy_n of_o the_o land_n who_o have_v two_o living_n nor_o their_o removal_n from_o place_n to_o place_n where_o they_o have_v sufficient_a maintenance_n before_o nor_o the_o pride_n contention_n or_o avarice_n of_o some_o of_o they_o yet_o i_o know_v many_o of_o the_o clergy_n of_o who_o i_o know_v there_o be_v no_o cause_n to_o fear_v their_o revolt_a or_o fall_v into_o popi●h_a error_n or_o superstition●_n or_o other_o ill_a course_n they_o be_v know_v to_o be_v religious_a and_o godly_a man_n it_o be_v true_a some_o be_v constrain_v to_o take_v two_o living_n for_o that_o one_o will_v not_o maintain_v they_o and_o other_o for_o a_o time_n to_o hold_v two_o living_n because_o they_o be_v not_o sure_o of_o the_o better_a hold_v it_o but_o during_o the_o sequestration_n ph._n sir_n i_o doubt_v you_o have_v be_v a_o little_a tack_v with_o that_o epidemical_a disease_n of_o a_o pluralist_n and_o guilty_a of_o remove_v from_o place_n to_o place_n but_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o your_o excuse_n will_v not_o bear_v you_o out_o at_o god_n tribunal_n the_o very_a popish_a doctor_n and_o cannon_n law_n condemn_v plurality_n of_o benefice_n in_o a_o presbyter_n man_n do_v not_o use_v to_o put_v away_o their_o wife_n nor_o take_v another_o to_o she_o which_o former_o he_o have_v upon_o such_o pretence_n the_o truth_n be_v the_o preach_n of_o the_o gospel_n be_v mere_o make_v a_o trade_n to_o get_v money_n they_o preach_v for_o hire_v run_v before_o they_o be_v call_v come_v in_o at_o the_o window_n like_o a_o thief_n and_o preach_v according_a to_o their_o pay_n provide_v they_o may_v have_v sufficient_a to_o keep_v contempt_n from_o the_o clergy_n be_v as_o powerful_a as_o the_o popish_a doctor_n and_o able_a through_o their_o abundance_n to_o contend_v with_o their_o whole_a parish_n and_o swagger_v in_o their_o silk_n as_o their_o predecessor_n do_v they_o will_v be_v content_a otherwise_o they_o will_v tell_v you_o you_o rob_v god_n in_o not_o pay_v their_o tithe_n and_o do_v not_o allow_v they_o honourable_a maintenance_n pr._n these_o thing_n which_o you_o charge_v the_o minister_n with_o be_v inconsistent_a with_o honesty_n and_o religion_n and_o i_o tell_v you_o many_o of_o the_o clergy_n who_o intend_v the_o reformation_n according_a to_o the_o foundation_n lay_v by_o the_o parliament_n by_o advice_n of_o the_o reverend_a assembly_n of_o divine_n be_v godly_a orthodox_a and_o learned_a man_n who_o in_o charity_n you_o be_v bind_v to_o believe_v can_v never_o fall_v into_o damnable_a error_n heresy_n or_o abominable_a practice_n ph._n touch_v their_o final_a estate_n i_o will_v not_o judge_v but_o leave_v that_o to_o almighty_a god_n yet_o this_o i_o dare_v say_v none_o of_o these_o man_n be_v better_a than_o peter_n who_o once_o act_v the_o devil_n part_n nor_o better_a than_o aaron_n who_o upon_o like_o pretence_n as_o these_o man_n have_v viz._n necessity_n or_o convenience_n join_v to_o make_v the_o golden_a calf_n nor_o be_v they_o better_o than_o their_o predecessor_n who_o mouth_n be_v stop_v and_o their_o judgement_n blind_v with_o honourable_a maintenance_n and_o preferment_n consider_v but_o this_o cranmer_n and_o ridley_n although_o godly_a bishop_n and_o martyr_n be_v two_o of_o those_o who_o oppose_v king_n edward_n the_o six_o and_o his_o council_n in_o the_o case_n of_o mr._n hooper_n when_o he_o will_v have_v omit_v popish_a ceremony_n at_o his_o entrance_n into_o his_o bishopric_n act._n mon._n vo_n pa._n 146._o also_o call_v to_o mind_n jewel_n babbington_n chapel_n mr._n hutton_n davenant_n morton_n whitgift_n ro_n abbot_n pilkington_n and_o hall_n who_o all_o deserve_v well_o of_o the_o church_n of_o god_n and_o better_o than_o most_o of_o these_o orthodox_a man_n who_o you_o so_o much_o admire_v while_o they_o continue_v in_o their_o uprightness_n before_o they_o be_v load_v with_o honour_n and_o honourable_a
in_o the_o church_n until_o the_o harvest_n be_v hypocrite_n profane_a man_n shall_v be_v cashier_v or_o rather_o never_o admit_v into_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n but_o i_o can_v devise_v how_o its_o possible_a these_o parochial_a congregation_n can_v be_v purge_v without_o disband_v there_o be_v so_o few_o who_o be_v fit_a to_o be_v church-member_n and_o so_o many_o of_o the_o wicked_a pr._n although_o we_o have_v not_o the_o discipline_n set_v up_o to_o sweep_v and_o cleanse_v the_o church_n yet_o we_o endeavour_v to_o put_v a_o difference_n between_o the_o precious_a and_o the_o vile_a and_o to_o give_v every_o one_o their_o portion_n and_o to_o order_v thing_n in_o the_o best_a manner_n we_o can_v both_o for_o the_o ministry_n and_o people_n ph._n it_o be_v true_a you_o have_v the_o image_n or_o rather_o counterfeit_v of_o some_o such_o thing_n as_o put_v a_o difference_n in_o he_o popish_a vestry_n but_o i_o pray_v you_o what_o garment_n have_v you_o to_o keep_v there_o that_o the_o vestry_n must_v needs_o be_v uphold_v the_o whore_n smock_n with_o the_o cope_n rochet_n tippet_n and_o other_o trumpery_n be_v go_v and_o i_o know_v not_o any_o of_o baal_n priest_n here_o who_o now_o use_v such_o vestment_n that_o there_o be_v any_o need_n of_o a_o vestry_n to_o put_v they_o in_o or_o that_o so_o many_o man_n need_v be_v trust_v with_o they_o pr._n that_o meeting_n which_o you_o scoff_v at_o be_v no_o such_o vestry_n it_o be_v only_o a_o place_n for_o the_o head_n of_o the_o parish_n to_o meet_v in_o to_o consult_v about_o the_o affair_n and_o order_n of_o the_o church_n and_o for_o settle_v and_o choose_v the_o minister_n when_o there_o be_v need_n and_o provide_v maintenance_n for_o he_o ph._n it_o seem_v then_o that_o those_o vestrie-man_n who_o be_v there_o to_o consult_v be_v more_o worthy_a than_o the_o rest_n who_o be_v without_o and_o may_v not_o intermeddle_v with_o these_o thing_n about_o which_o they_o consult_v these_o do_v very_o well_o resemble_v the_o conclave_n of_o cardinal_n at_o rome_n advise_v about_o the_o choose_n depose_v and_o order_v the_o affair_n of_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o church_n but_o i_o pray_v you_o by_o what_o law_n of_o god_n have_v these_o your_o vestry_n man_n authority_n to_o elect_v and_o put_v out_o the_o minister_n and_o to_o prescribe_v rule_n and_o law_n for_o the_o residue_n of_o the_o people_n i_o protest_v against_o all_o their_o order_n and_o agreement_n how_o just_a soever_o they_o may_v seem_v as_o not_o dare_v to_o submit_v to_o such_o a_o usurp_a power_n be_v contrary_a to_o christian_a liberty_n in_o which_o the_o apostle_n paul_n command_v the_o galatian_n and_o in_o they_o all_o christian_n to_o stand_v fast_o and_o to_o maintain_v the_o same_o as_o be_v purchase_v by_o christ_n himself_o gal._n 5._o 1._o compare_v with_o chap._n 3._o 1._o 3._o chap._n 4._o 10._o pr._n i_o confess_v this_o vestry_n be_v not_o a_o right_a presbytery_n nor_o claim_v they_o any_o such_o power_n by_o colour_n of_o any_o divine_a law_n but_o yet_o for_o order_n and_o conveniency_n i_o think_v they_o ought_v to_o be_v tolerate_v until_o the_o time_n of_o reformation_n but_o sir_n what_o do_v this_o concern_v you_o it_o become_v you_o to_o be_v a_o hearer_n and_o a_o learner_n rather_o than_o a_o teacher_n have_v no_o call_n thereunto_o ph._n it_o concern_v i_o and_o every_o christian_n as_o a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n if_o your_o church_n be_v a_o true_a church_n to_o elect_v our_o own_o minister_n and_o not_o to_o have_v he_o thrust_v upon_o we_o either_o without_o or_o against_o our_o will_n or_o consent_n as_o the_o manner_n now_o be_v and_o he_o that_o come_v in_o otherwise_o then_o by_o the_o suffrage_n of_o the_o people_n enter_v not_o by_o the_o door_n but_o come_v in_o as_o a_o thief_n and_o a_o robber_n and_o have_v no_o lawful_a call_n calvin_n instit._n l._n 4._o ca._n 3._o sect._n 15._o act._n 14._o 23._o pr._n for_o our_o call_n to_o the_o ministry_n we_o doubt_v not_o of_o it_o nor_o ever_o question_v it_o be_v confident_a its_o warrantable_a those_o who_o ordain_v we_o be_v bishop_n and_o lawful_a presbyter_n or_o at_o least_o they_o stand_v in_o the_o place_n of_o such_o and_o act_v do_v by_o they_o be_v valid_a sacrament_n administer_v by_o papist_n and_o other_o heretic_n be_v right_a sacrament_n so_o they_o be_v due_o administer_v for_o the_o matter_n although_o join_v with_o their_o corruption_n and_o i_o h●ld_v it_o unlawful_a for_o any_o man_n to_o take_v upon_o he_o the_o office_n or_o function_n of_o a_o minister_n without_o a_o lawful_a call_n and_o i_o find_v that_o in_o those_o ancient_a canon_n call_v the_o canon_n of_o the_o apostle_n it_o be_v ordain_v that_o one_o bishop_n may_v ordain_v a_o presbyter_n ph._n this_o be_v a_o poor_a and_o insufficient_a call_n if_o a_o bishop_n have_v any_o authority_n to_o ordain_v a_o minister_n or_o to_o judge_v of_o his_o gift_n in_o order_n to_o his_o admission_n to_o a_o church_n which_o i_o deny_v and_o the_o same_o be_v a_o point_n of_o popery_n yet_o that_o thereupon_o the_o church_n suffrage_n or_o assent_n shall_v be_v by_o the_o bishop_n confer_v upon_o the_o minister_n be_v against_o all_o sense_n and_o reason_n much_o more_o against_o religion_n which_o ought_v to_o be_v square_v by_o the_o word_n as_o the_o rule_n mar._n de_fw-fr vulson_n de_fw-fr libert._n de_fw-fr le_fw-fr eglise_n gallican_n pag._n 148._o ca._n 9_o and_o for_o your_o canon_n of_o which_o you_o speak_v none_o regard_v they_o but_o the_o more_o ignorant_a sort_n of_o papist_n they_o be_v know_v to_o be_v of_o a_o late_a date_n than_o the_o apostle_n and_o be_v credit_v as_o much_o as_o lucianus_n scoff_n tobit_n and_o judiths_n story_n or_o jeffery_n munmouth_n his_o tale_n and_o those_o canon_n be_v coin_v just_a at_o his_o time_n some_o four_o hundred_o year_n since_o by_o some_o of_o jeffery_n religion_n but_o can_v you_o show_v no_o more_o than_o this_o for_o your_o call_n then_o give_v 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ridiculous_a offering_n and_o be_v ancient_o give_v as_o a_o amends_o and_o satisfaction_n to_o god_n but_o they_o go_v to_o the_o priest_n to_o purge_v the_o guilt_n of_o the_o decease_a which_o he_o contract_v by_o his_o nonpayment_n of_o tithe_n while_o he_o be_v live_v and_o aught_o as_o well_o as_o other_o offering_n be_v lay_v aside_o according_a to_o that_o thou_o shall_v not_o bring_v the_o hire_n of_o a_o whore_n nor_o the_o price_n of_o a_o dog_n into_o the_o house_n of_o the_o lord_n etc._n etc._n and_o what_o agreement_n have_v the_o temple_n of_o god_n with_o idol_n deut._n 23._o 18._o pr._n but_o now_o i_o pray_v you_o according_a to_o your_o judgement_n what_o must_v become_v of_o all_o our_o church_n it_o seem_v by_o your_o argument_n if_o one_o may_v believe_v you_o they_o must_v all_o be_v pluck_v down_o as_o the_o brownist_n teach_v what_o say_v you_o to_o that_o ph._n touch_v the_o name_n church_n in_o your_o sense_n i_o do_v not_o great_o like_o it_o for_o it_o 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constantine_n and_o theodosius_n will_v stir_v up_o the_o christian_n to_o build_v they_o meet_v place_n beside_o about_o the_o year_n six_o hundred_o when_o augustin_n the_o monk_n false_o call_v the_o english_a apostle_n come_v into_o england_n send_v by_o pope_n gregory_n the_o great_a who_o have_v not_o take_v upon_o he_o the_o title_n of_o universal_a bishop_n he_o find_v the_o relic_n of_o many_o church_n and_o congregation_n of_o christian_n plant_v in_o england_n and_o wales_n fox_n act._n and_o mon._n vo_n pa._n 150._o 151._o and_o he_o dispute_v with_o the_o monk_n of_o bangor_n about_o ceremony_n by_o which_o it_o be_v conceive_v he_o bring_v not_o so_o much_o religion_n with_o he_o 〈◊〉_d he_o do_v superstition_n and_o introduction_n to_o popery_n for_o the_o briton_n have_v learned_a religion_n from_o better_a tutor_n it_o be_v true_a afterwards_o these_o meeting_n place_n be_v general_o all_o pollute_a with_o popish_a idolatry_n all_o which_o with_o the_o relic_n thereof_o 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all_o the_o place_n where_o they_o serve_v their_o god_n and_o break_v down_o their_o altar_n etc._n etc._n deut._n 12._o 2_o 3_o etc._n etc._n pr._n well_o i_o hope_v short_o to_o see_v the_o church-government_n settle_v with_o the_o class_n and_o synod_n and_o that_o thereby_o all_o thing_n will_v be_v well_o reform_v for_o the_o appeal_n will_v regulate_v every_o thing_n which_o be_v irregular_o do_v and_o many_o will_v see_v more_o than_o a_o few_o ph._n i_o shall_v be_v glad_a to_o see_v a_o through_o reformation_n but_o i_o do_v much_o fear_v these_o prudential_a thing_n the_o class_n synod_n and_o appeal_v to_o they_o will_v prove_v but_o imprudentiall_a and_o physician_n of_o no_o value_n and_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o those_o who_o put_v the_o parliament_n upon_o they_o have_v their_o own_o end_n and_o aim_v in_o they_o pr._n why_o say_v you_o so_o the_o church_n of_o antioch_n do_v appeal_v to_o the_o council_n at_o jerusalem_n in_o a_o case_n of_o conscience_n act_n 15._o and_o why_o may_v not_o we_o do_v the_o like_a pr._n i_o deny_v that_o there_o be_v any_o such_o appeal_n as_o you_o mean_v its_o true_a the_o church_n of_o antioch_n in_o a_o case_n of_o conscience_n do_v voluntary_o send_v paul_n and_o barnabas_n and_o other_o brethren_n to_o jerusalem_n to_o advise_v with_o the_o apostle_n elder_n and_o church_n there_o about_o that_o matter_n and_o according_o they_o receive_v the_o sentence_n and_o judgement_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n as_o well_o brethren_n as_o apostle_n and_o elder_n which_o apostle_n have_v extraordinary_a gift_n of_o knowledge_n and_o revelation_n and_o what_o they_o direct_v they_o be_v in_o stead_n of_o the_o write_a word_n we_o have_v no_o person_n so_o gift_v in_o these_o day_n but_o must_v have_v recourse_n to_o the_o law_n and_o the_o testimony_n the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n pr._n but_o do_v you_o not_o think_v that_o these_o class_n and_o appeal_n will_v be_v of_o excellent_a use_n for_o crop_v and_o curb_v of_o 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of_o their_o faction_n and_o so_o in_o conceit_n separate_v the_o precious_a from_o the_o vile_a who_o may_v make_v head_n against_o they_o 8._o eight_o they_o leave_v of_o cause_v the_o corpse_n to_o be_v present_v in_o in_o the_o church_n but_o they_o will_v have_v the_o corpse_n present_a or_o mor●narie_a or_o what_o cover_v the_o corpse_n where_o the_o law_n will_v give_v it_o they_o 9_o they_o say_v the_o church_n and_o chancel_n regard_v the_o material_n have_v no_o holiness_n in_o they_o and_o they_o account_v it_o superstitious_a to_o hold_v otherwise_o but_o you_o shall_v neither_o lift_v up_o axe_n nor_o ham_n to_o break_v the_o ground_n especial_o in_o the_o chancel_n unless_o you_o pay_v to_o the_o parson_n a_o large_a fee_n beside_o what_o will_v repair_v the_o ground_n and_o then_o you_o may_v bury_v the_o dead_a as_o high_a as_o the_o altar_n place_n 10._o ten_o they_o be_v content_a that_o the_o altar_n smell_v of_o idolatry_n shall_v be_v take_v away_o but_o they_o 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be_v without_o you_o have_v nothing_o to_o do_v with_o they_o the_o censure_n of_o the_o church_n be_v god_n ordinance_n for_o that_o end_n and_o be_v most_o effectual_a but_o for_o that_o compulsive_a power_n you_o speak_v of_o it_o savour_v of_o the_o tyranny_n of_o antichrist_n and_o so_o do_v your_o title_n of_o ecclesiastical_a magistrate_n which_o title_n i_o have_v not_o hear_v use_v by_o any_o orthodox_a minister_n since_o the_o lord_n bishop_n those_o popish_a ecclesiastical_a magistrate_n be_v cashier_v who_o be_v indeed_o neither_o magistrate_n nor_o minister_n but_o like_o the_o pope_n between_o both_o pr._n i_o confess_v the_o elder_n former_o choose_v some_o year_n since_o in_o my_o parish_n have_v refuse_v to_o act_v to_o my_o great_a grief_n but_o now_o late_o i_o myself_o and_o the_o churchwarden_n have_v nominate_v other_o and_o the_o parish_n have_v assent_v to_o the_o choice_n and_o although_o the_o person_n choose_v will_v not_o take_v upon_o they_o the_o office_n 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be_v choose_v that_o they_o shall_v only_o assist_v i_o in_o keep_v the_o scandalous_a and_o ignorant_a from_o the_o communion_n and_o do_v nothing_o else_o they_o assent_v and_o i_o hope_v whll_o cheerful_o join_v with_o i_o in_o that_o work_n ph._n now_o do_v you_o think_v this_o be_v a_o sufficient_a reformation_n pr._n it_o be_v a_o principal_a part_n thereof_o we_o must_v wait_v until_o we_o can_v bring_v on_o the_o rest_n ph._n it_o seem_v there_o your_o pretend_a elder_n be_v no_o elder_n but_o assistant_n i_o be_o sorry_a you_o have_v show_v yourself_o so_o bold_a as_o to_o set_v up_o a_o new_a office_n in_o your_o pretend_a parish_n church_n show_v i_o where_o ever_o any_o man_n pretend_v to_o be_v a_o minister_n of_o christ_n by_o himself_o or_o with_o two_o three_o or_o four_o more_o usurp_v that_o power_n over_o a_o thousand_o person_n as_o you_o and_o your_o new_a fashion_n elder_n if_o they_o be_v rule_v by_o you_o intend_v to_o do_v i_o confess_v in_o the_o popish_a congregation_n and_o late_o here_o in_o england_n the_o same_o be_v practise_v the_o bishop_n or_o his_o chancellor_n with_o a_o presbyter_n or_o minister_n do_v excommunicate_a or_o debar_v from_o the_o sacrament_n but_o in_o worst_a time_n no_o man_n can_v be_v suspend_v without_o a_o presbyter_n join_v in_o that_o act_n and_o the_o churchwarden_n which_o be_v yet_o in_o request_n be_v assistant_n to_o the_o priest_n as_o your_o new_a fashion_n elder_n be_v and_o both_o alike_o keep_v christ_n out_o of_o his_o kingdom_n and_o so_o most_o suitable_a to_o your_o parish_n church_n which_o be_v not_o fit_a for_o lawful_a elder_n no_o more_o than_o they_o be_v capable_a of_o lawful_a minister_n pr._n i_o have_v erect_v no_o new_a office_n but_o the_o same_o which_o the_o scripture_n hold_v forth_o only_o their_o power_n be_v limit_v by_o mutual_a assent_n of_o they_o and_o the_o minister_n and_o for_o the_o exercise_n of_o that_o power_n in_o keep_v the_o scandalous_a and_o profane_a from_o the_o sacrament_n it_o be_v include_v within_o and_o be_v part_n of_o their_o office_n mat._n 18._o 17._o where_o the_o church_n signify_v the_o minister_n and_o elder_n who_o be_v the_o representative_a church_n for_o the_o rest_n it_o be_v answer_v before_o ph._n that_o question_n concerning_o the_o church_n i_o will_v not_o enter_v into_o but_o leave_v it_o to_o the_o learned_a who_o have_v sufficient_o discuss_v it_o but_o for_o my_o part_n i_o be_o confident_a no_o such_o construction_n can_v be_v make_v of_o that_o place_n for_o the_o church_n always_o signify_v the_o whole_a body_n minister_n and_o people_n or_o the_o member_n distinct_a from_o the_o officer_n pr._n this_o question_n be_v one_o of_o the_o principle_n upon_o which_o all_o the_o controversy_n between_o we_o and_o the_o independent_n be_v found_v i_o shall_v whole_o wave_v you_o you_o have_v hear_v my_o opinion_n in_o public_a to_o which_o i_o adhere_v and_o shall_v do_v until_o i_o see_v better_a cause_n to_o alter_v my_o judgement_n ph._n let_v that_o pass_n but_o what_o be_v the_o reason_n why_o you_o carry_v the_o business_n of_o choose_v your_o pretend_a elder_n so_o clandestine_o and_o with_o such_o policy_n without_o hear_v other_o man_n opinion_n who_o be_v of_o contrary_a judgement_n pr._n to_o tell_v you_o the_o truth_n i_o fear_v opposition_n and_o that_o the_o work_n may_v be_v hinder_v and_o therefore_o i_o desire_v to_o avoid_v all_o occasion_n and_o to_o carry_v on_o the_o work_n as_o smooth_o as_o i_o can_v and_o i_o be_o glad_a of_o it_o ph._n it_o be_v a_o sign_n you_o think_v your_o metal_n be_v nought_o because_o you_o fear_v the_o touchstone_n the_o truth_n seek_v no_o corner_n but_o in_o light_n shine_v more_o clear_o pr._n the_o truth_n may_v have_v opposition_n and_o yet_o be_v the_o same_o still_o we_o fear_v not_o the_o touchstone_n but_o the_o sleight_n of_o man_n who_o most_o oppose_v those_o thing_n which_o be_v best_a ph._n it_o seem_v now_o you_o have_v your_o desire_n what_o proceed_n have_v you_o make_v towards_o reformation_n do_v your_o pretend_a elder_n act_n according_a to_o your_o mind_n do_v you_o think_v they_o perform_v their_o duty_n pr._n yea_o true_o i_o have_v much_o comfort_n in_o they_o and_o doubt_v not_o but_o we_o shall_v separate_v the_o precious_a from_o the_o vile_a and_o yesterday_o we_o make_v a_o very_a hopeful_a beginning_n insomuch_o as_o they_o undertake_v to_o do_v in_o join_v with_o i_o to_o keep_v the_o scandalous_a and_o profane_a from_o the_o lord_n table_n ph._n what_o course_n do_v you_o take_v to_o make_v that_o separation_n pr._n the_o elder_n refer_v it_o to_o i_o to_o examine_v all_o those_o who_o be_v to_o communicate_v the_o week_n before_o they_o come_v to_o the_o sacrament_n and_o according_o i_o publish_v my_o intention_n not_o to_o admit_v any_o who_o do_v not_o come_v to_o the_o church_n at_o the_o time_n appoint_v to_o be_v examine_v and_o many_o of_o my_o parish_n come_v and_o submit_v 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