additional_a discourse_n of_o mr._n chillingworth_n never_o before_o print_v imprimatur_fw-la exit_fw-la aedib_n lambeth_n jun._n 14._o 1686._o guilford_n needham_n r_o r._n in_o christo_n p._n ac_fw-la d._n d._n wilhelmo_n archiep._n cant._n à _fw-la sacr._n domesticis_fw-la london_n print_v for_o richard_n chiswell_n at_o the_o rose_n and_o crown_n in_o s._n paul_n churchyard_n 1687._o content_n i._o a_o conference_n betwixt_o mr._n chillingworth_n and_o mr._n lewgar_o whether_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v the_o catholick-church_n and_o all_o out_o of_o her_o communion_n heretic_n or_o schismatic_n p._n 1._o ii_o a_o discourse_n against_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o a_o answer_n to_o all_o those_o text_n of_o scripture_n that_o be_v allege_v to_o prove_v it_o p._n 26._o iii_o a_o conference_n concern_v the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n prove_v that_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n either_o err_v in_o she_o worship_v the_o bless_a virgin_n or_o that_o the_o ancient_a church_n do_v err_v in_o condemn_v the_o collyridians_n as_o heretic_n p._n 41_o iu._n a_o argument_n draw_v from_o communicate_v of_o infant_n as_o without_o which_o they_o can_v not_o be_v save_v against_o the_o church_n infallibility_n p._n 68_o v._o a_o argument_n against_o infallibility_n draw_v from_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o millenaries_n p._n 80._o vi_o a_o letter_n relate_v to_o the_o same_o subject_n p._n 89._o vii_o a_o argument_n against_o the_o roman_a church_n infallibility_n take_v from_o the_o contradiction_n in_o their_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n p._n 91._o viii_o a_o account_n of_o what_o move_v the_o author_n to_o turn_v a_o papist_n with_o his_o confutation_n of_o the_o argument_n that_o persuade_v he_o thereto_o p._n 94._o ix_o a_o discourse_n concern_v tradition_n p._n 103._o the_o reader_n be_v desire_v to_o take_v notice_n of_o a_o great_a mistake_n of_o the_o printer_n and_o to_o correct_v it_o that_o he_o have_v make_v this_o the_o ruâ—ning_a title_n over_o most_o of_o the_o additional_a piece_n viz._n a_o conference_n betwixt_o mr._n chillingworth_n and_o mr._n lewgar_o which_o shall_v only_o have_v be_v set_v over_o the_o first_o there_o be_v also_o some_o literal_a mistake_n as_o pag._n 65._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d twice_o for_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o such_o like_a not_o to_o be_v impute_v to_o the_o author_n a_o conference_n betwixt_o mr._n chillingworth_n and_o mr._n lewgar_n thesis_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n take_v diffusive_o for_o all_o christian_n communicate_v with_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o judge_n of_o controversy_n at_o that_o time_n when_o the_o church_n of_o england_n make_v a_o alteration_n in_o her_o tenant_n argu._n she_o be_v the_o judge_n of_o controversy_n at_o that_o time_n which_o have_v a_o authority_n of_o decide_v they_o but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n at_o that_o time_n have_v the_o authority_n of_o decide_v they_o ergo._fw-la answ._n a_o limit_a authority_n to_o decide_v controversy_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o scripture_n and_o universal_a tradition_n and_o to_o oblige_v she_o own_o member_n so_o long_o as_o she_o evident_o contradict_v not_o that_o rule_n to_o obedience_n i_o grant_v she_o have_v but_o a_o unlimited_a a_o infallible_a authority_n or_o such_o as_o can_v not_o but_o proceed_v according_a to_o that_o rule_n and_o such_o as_o shall_v bind_v all_o the_o church_n in_o the_o world_n to_o obedience_n as_o the_o greek_a church_n i_o say_v she_o have_v not_o quest._n when_o your_o church_n have_v decide_v a_o controversy_n i_o desire_v to_o know_v whether_o any_o particular_a church_n or_o person_n have_v authority_n to_o reexamine_v her_o decision_n whether_o she_o have_v observe_v her_o rule_n or_o no_o and_o free_a hâ—mself_n from_o the_o obedience_n of_o it_o by_z his_o or_o her_o particular_a judgement_n answ._n if_o you_o understand_v by_o your_o church_n the_o church_n catholic_n probable_o i_o shall_v answer_v no_o but_o if_o you_o understand_v by_o your_o church_n that_o only_o which_o be_v in_o subordination_n to_o the_o see_v of_o rome_n of_o if_o you_o understand_v a_o council_n of_o this_o church_n i_o answer_v yea_o arg._n that_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n which_o do_v abide_v in_o the_o root_n of_o apostolic_a unity_n but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n at_o that_o time_n be_v the_o only_a church_n that_o do_v abide_v in_o the_o root_n of_o apostolic_a unity_n ergo._fw-la quest._n what_o mean_v you_o by_o apostolic_a unity_n answ._n i_o mean_v the_o unity_n of_o that_o fellowship_n wherein_o the_o apostle_n live_v and_o died._n quest._n wherein_o be_v this_o unity_n answ._n herein_o it_o consist_v that_o they_o all_o profess_v one_o faith_n obey_v one_o supreme_a tribunal_n and_o communicate_v together_o in_o the_o same_o prayer_n and_o sacrament_n sclut_fw-la then_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n continue_v not_o in_o this_o apostolic_a unity_n for_o it_o continue_v not_o in_o the_o same_o faith_n wherein_o the_o apostle_n live_v and_o die_v for_o though_o it_o retain_v so_o much_o in_o my_o judgement_n as_o be_v essential_a to_o the_o be_v of_o a_o church_n yet_o it_o degenerate_v from_o the_o church_n of_o the_o apostle_n time_n in_o many_o thing_n which_o be_v very_o profitable_a as_o in_o latin_a service_n and_o communion_n in_o one_o kind_n argu._n some_o church_n do_v continue_v in_o the_o same_o faith_n wherein_o the_o apostle_n live_v and_o die_v but_o tâ—ere_o be_v no_o church_n at_o that_o time_n which_o do_v continue_v in_o the_o apostle_n faith_n beside_o the_o roman_a church_n ergo._fw-la answ._n that_o some_o church_n do_v continue_v in_o the_o apostle_n faith_n in_o all_o thing_n necessary_a i_o grant_v it_o that_o any_o do_v continue_v in_o the_o integrity_n of_o it_o and_o in_o a_o perfect_a conformity_n with_o it_o in_o all_o thing_n expedient_a and_o profitable_a i_o deny_v it_o quest._n be_v it_o not_o necessary_a to_o a_o church_n continue_v in_o the_o apostle_n faith_n that_o she_o continue_v in_o a_o perfect_a conformity_n with_o it_o in_o all_o thing_n expedient_a and_o profitable_a answ._n a_o perfect_a conformity_n in_o all_o thing_n be_v necessary_a to_o a_o perfect_a continuance_n in_o the_o apostle_n faith_n but_o to_o a_o imperfect_a continuance_n a_o imperfect_a conformity_n be_v sufficient_a and_o such_o i_o grant_v the_o roman_a church_n have_v quest._n be_v not_o a_o perfect_a continuance_n in_o the_o apostle_n faith_n necessary_a to_o a_o church_n continuance_n in_o apostolic_a unity_n asw._n it_o be_v necessary_a to_o a_o perfect_a continuance_n in_o apostolic_a unity_n argu._n there_o be_v some_o one_o company_n of_o christian_n at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n but_o there_o be_v no_o other_o company_n at_o that_o time_n beside_o the_o roman_a ergo_fw-la the_o roman_a at_o that_o time_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n answ._n there_o be_v not_o one_o company_n of_o christian_n which_o in_o opposition_n to_o and_o exclusion_n of_o all_o other_o company_n of_o christian_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n argu._n if_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v some_o one_o company_n of_o christian_n in_o opposition_n to_o and_o exclusion_n of_o all_o other_o company_n then_o if_o there_o be_v some_o one_o company_n she_o be_v one_o in_o opposition_n to_o and_o exclusion_n of_o all_o other_o company_n but_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v one_o company_n of_o christian_n in_o opposition_n to_o and_o exclusion_n of_o etc._n etc._n ergo_fw-la there_o be_v then_o some_o one_o company_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n in_o opposition_n to_o and_o exclusion_n of_o all_o other_o company_n the_o minor_a prove_v by_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n both_o greek_a and_o latin_a testify_v that_o they_o understand_v the_o church_n to_o be_v one_o in_o the_o sense_n allege_v 1._o if_o this_o unity_n which_o can_v be_v separate_v at_o all_o or_o divide_v be_v also_o among_o heretic_n what_o contend_v we_o far_o why_o call_v we_o they_o heretic_n s._n cypr._n epist._n 75._o 2._o but_o if_o there_o be_v but_o one_o flock_n how_o can_v he_o be_v account_v of_o the_o flock_n which_o be_v not_o within_o the_o number_n of_o it_o id_fw-la ibid._n 3._o when_o parmenian_n commend_v one_o church_n he_o condemn_v all_o the_o rest_n for_o beside_o one_o which_o be_v the_o true_a catholic_n other_o church_n be_v esteem_v to_o be_v among_o heretic_n but_o be_v not_o s._n optat._n lib._n 1._o 4._o the_o church_n therefore_o be_v but_o one_o this_o can_v be_v among_o all_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n ibid._n 5._o you_o say_v you_o offer_v for_o the_o church_n which_o be_v one_o this_o very_a thing_n be_v part_n of_o a_o lie_n to_o call_v it_o on_o which_o you_o have_v divide_v into_o two_o id_fw-la ibid._n 6._o the_o church_n be_v one_o which_o can_v be_v among_o we_o and_o among_o you_o it_o remain_v
then_o that_o it_o be_v in_o one_o only_a place_n id_fw-la ibid._n 7._o although_o there_o be_v many_o heresy_n of_o christian_n and_o that_o all_o will_v be_v call_v catholic_n yet_o there_o be_v always_o one_o church_n etc._n etc._n s._n august_n de_fw-fr util_fw-la credend_a c._n 7._o 8._o the_o question_n between_o we_o be_v where_o the_o church_n be_v whether_o with_o we_o or_o with_o they_o for_o she_o be_v but_o one_o id._n de_fw-fr unitat_fw-la c._n 2._o 9_o the_o proof_n of_o the_o catholic_n prevail_v whereby_o they_o evict_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n to_o be_v with_o they_o and_o by_o consequence_n not_o to_o be_v with_o the_o donatist_n for_o it_o be_v manifest_a that_o she_o be_v one_o alone_a id._n collat._n carthag_n lib._n â—_o 10._o in_o illud_fw-la cantic_a 6._o 7._o there_o be_v 60_o queen_n and_o 80_o concubine_n and_o damsel_n without_o number_n but_o my_o dove_n be_v one_o etc._n etc._n he_o say_v not_o my_o queen_n be_v 60_o and_o my_o concubine_n etc._n etc._n but_o he_o say_v my_o dove_n be_v but_o one_o because_o all_o the_o sect_n of_o philospher_n and_o heresy_n of_o christian_n be_v none_o of_o he_o he_o be_v but_o one_o to_o wit_n the_o catholic_a church_n etc._n etc._n s._n epâ—phan_n in_o sine_fw-la panar_n 11._o a_o man_n may_v not_o call_v the_o conventicle_n of_o heretic_n i_o mean_v marcionites_n manichees_n and_o the_o rest_n churhce_n therefore_o the_o tradition_n appoint_v you_o to_o say_v i_o believe_v one_o holy_a catholic_n church_n etc._n etc._n s._n cyrill_n catech._n 18._o and_o these_o testimony_n i_o think_v be_v sufficient_a to_o show_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n that_o this_o title_n of_o the_o church_n one_o be_v direct_o and_o proper_o exclusive_a to_o all_o company_n beside_o one_o to_o wit_n that_o where_o there_o be_v diverse_a profession_n of_o faith_n or_o diverse_a communion_n there_o be_v but_o one_o of_o these_o which_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n church_n upon_o this_o ground_n i_o desire_v some_o company_n of_o christians_n to_o be_v name_v profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n and_o hold_v a_o diverse_a communion_n from_o the_o roman_a which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_n and_o if_o no_o other_o in_o this_o sense_n can_v be_v name_v than_o be_v she_o the_o catholic_n church_n at_o that_o time_n and_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n to_o be_v rest_v in_o and_o her_o communion_n to_o be_v embrace_v upon_o peril_n of_o schism_n and_o heresy_n mr._n chillingworths_n answer_n upon_o the_o same_o ground_n if_o you_o please_v you_o may_v desire_v a_o protestant_n to_o name_v some_o company_n of_o christian_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n and_o hold_v a_o diverse_a communion_n from_o the_o greek_a church_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_v and_o see_v he_o can_v name_v no_o other_o in_o this_o sense_n conclude_v that_o the_o greek_a church_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o that_o time_n upon_o the_o very_a same_o ground_n you_o may_v have_v conclude_v for_o the_o church_n of_o the_o abyssine_n or_o armenian_n or_o any_o other_o society_n of_o christian_n extant_a before_o luther_n time_n and_o see_v this_o be_v so_o thus_o i_o argue_v against_o your_o ground_n 1._o that_o ground_n which_o conclude_v indifferent_o for_o both_o part_n of_o a_o contradiction_n must_v needs_o be_v false_a and_o deceitful_a and_o conclude_v for_o neither_o part_n but_o this_o ground_n conclude_v indifferent_o both_o part_n of_o a_o contradiction_n viz._n that_o the_o greek_a church_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o not_o the_o roman_a as_o well_o as_o that_o the_o roman_a be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o not_o the_o greek_a therefore_o the_o ground_n be_v false_a and_o deceitful_a seem_v it_o never_o so_o plausible_a 2._o i_o answer_v second_o that_o you_o shall_v have_v take_v notice_n of_o my_o answer_n which_o i_o then_o give_v you_o which_o be_v that_o your_o major_n as_o you_o then_o frame_v your_o argument_n but_o as_o now_o your_o minor_a be_v not_o always_o true_a if_o by_o one_o you_o understand_v one_o in_o external_a communion_n see_v nothing_o hinder_v in_o my_o judgement_n but_o that_o one_o church_n excommunicate_v by_o another_o upon_o a_o insufficient_a cause_n may_v yet_o remain_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o that_o church_n which_o upon_o the_o over-value_a this_o cause_n do_v excommunicate_v the_o other_o though_o in_o fault_n may_v yet_o remain_v a_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n which_o be_v evident_a from_o the_o difference_n about_o easter-day_n between_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n for_o which_o vain_a matter_n victor_n bishop_n of_o rome_n excommunicate_v the_o church_n of_o asia_n and_o yet_o i_o believe_v you_o will_v not_o say_v that_o either_o the_o church_n excommunicate_v or_o the_o church_n excommunicate_v cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o church_n catholic_n the_o case_n be_v the_o same_o between_o the_o greek_a and_o the_o roman_a church_n for_o though_o the_o difference_n between_o they_o be_v great_a yet_o it_o be_v not_o so_o great_a as_o to_o be_v a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o excommunication_n and_o therefore_o the_o excommunication_n be_v causeless_a and_o consequent_o brutum_fw-la fulmen_fw-la and_o not_o ratify_v or_o confirm_v by_o god_n in_o heaven_n and_o therefore_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n at_o luther_n rise_a might_n be_v and_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n as_o concern_v the_o place_n of_o father_n which_o you_o allege_v i_o demand_v 1._o if_o i_o can_v produce_v you_o a_o equal_a or_o great_a number_n of_o father_n or_o more_o ancient_a than_o these_o not_o contradict_v by_o any_o that_o live_v with_o they_o or_o before_o they_o for_o some_o doctrine_n condemn_v by_o the_o roman_a church_n whether_o you_o will_v subscribe_v it_o if_o not_o with_o what_o face_n or_o conscience_n can_v you_o make_v use_n of_o and_o build_v your_o whole_a faith_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o father_n in_o some_o thing_n and_o reject_v the_o same_o authority_n in_o other_o 2._o second_o because_o you_o urge_v s._n cyprian_n authority_n i_o desire_v you_o to_o tell_v i_o whether_o this_o argument_n in_o his_o time_n will_v have_v conclude_v a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n or_o no_o if_o not_o how_o shall_v it_o come_v to_o pass_v that_o it_o shall_v serve_v now_o and_o not_o then_o fit_v this_o time_n and_o not_o that_o as_o if_o it_o be_v like_o a_o almanac_n that_o will_v not_o serve_v for_o all_o meridian_n if_o it_o will_v why_o be_v it_o not_o urge_v by_o other_o upon_o s._n cyprian_n or_o represent_v by_o s._n cyprian_n to_o himself_o for_o his_o direction_n when_o he_o differ_v from_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o all_o other_o that_o herein_o conform_v unto_o she_o touch_v the_o point_n of_o rebaptising_a heretic_n which_o the_o roman_a church_n hold_v unlawful_a and_o damnable_a s._n cyprian_n not_o only_o lawful_a but_o necessary_a so_o well_o do_v he_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o that_o church_n quid_fw-la verba_fw-la audiam_fw-la cum_fw-la facta_fw-la videam_fw-la say_v he_o in_o the_o comedy_n and_o cardinal_n perron_n tell_v you_o in_o his_o epistle_n to_o casaubon_n that_o nothing_o be_v more_o unreasonable_a than_o to_o draw_v consequence_n from_o the_o word_n of_o father_n against_o their_o lively_a and_o actual_a practice_n the_o same_o may_v be_v say_v in_o refutation_n of_o the_o place_n out_o of_o s._n austin_n who_o be_v so_o far_o from_o conclude_v from_o they_o or_o any_o other_o a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o he_o himself_o as_o your_o author_n testify_v live_v and_o die_v in_o opposition_n of_o it_o even_o in_o that_o main_a fundamental_a point_n upon_o which_o mr._n lewgar_n have_v build_v the_o necessity_n of_o his_o departure_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o embrace_v the_o communion_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n that_o be_v the_o supreme_a authority_n of_o that_o church_n over_o other_o church_n and_o the_o power_n of_o receive_v appeal_n from_o they_o mr._n lewgar_o i_o know_v can_v be_v ignorant_a of_o these_o thing_n and_o therefore_o i_o wonder_v with_o what_o conscience_n he_o can_v produce_v their_o word_n against_o we_o who_o action_n be_v for_o we_o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o s._n cyprian_a and_o s._n austin_n be_v schismatic_n for_o do_v so_o it_o seem_v then_o schismatic_n may_v not_o only_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n against_o mr._n lewgar_n main_a conclusion_n but_o canonize_v saint_n of_o it_o or_o else_o s._n austin_n and_o s._n cyprian_a shall_v be_v raze_v out_o of_o the_o roman_a calendar_n if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o the_o point_n of_o rebaptisation_a be_v not_o
of_o my_o debt_n as_o soon_o as_o may_v be_v if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o my_o argument_n be_v not_o contradictory_n to_o your_o conclusion_n because_o it_o show_v only_o that_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o her_o adherent_n be_v not_o in_o s._n cyprian_n or_o s._n augustine_n time_n the_o catholic_n church_n but_o be_v at_o the_o time_n before_o luther_n i_o say_v to_o conclude_v the_o one_o be_v to_o conclude_v the_o other_o for_o certain_o if_o it_o be_v then_o at_o luther_n time_n so_o it_o be_v always_o so_o if_o it_o be_v not_o always_o it_o be_v not_o then_o for_o if_o it_o be_v of_o the_o essence_n or_o necessary_a to_o the_o church_n as_o be_v pretend_v to_o be_v a_o society_n of_o christian_n join_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n and_o bishop_n of_o rome_n then_o do_v it_o always_o agree_v to_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o in_o s._n cyprian_n and_o s._n augustine_n time_n as_o well_o as_o at_o luhersâ—ising_v â—ising_z if_o it_o be_v not_o always_o particular_o not_o in_o s._n cyprian_n time_n of_o the_o essence_n or_o necessary_a to_o the_o church_n to_o be_v so_o than_o it_o be_v impossible_a the_o church_n shall_v acquire_v this_o essence_n or_o this_o property_n afterward_o and_o therefore_o impossible_a it_o shall_v have_v it_o at_o the_o time_n of_o luther_n rise_n necessarium_fw-la est_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la aliquando_fw-la inest_fw-la aliquando_fw-la not_o inest_fw-la alicui_fw-la inest_fw-la alicui_fw-la non_fw-la inest_fw-la sed_fw-la quod_fw-la semper_fw-la &_o oâ—ni_fw-la arist._n post._n analyt_v again_o every_o sophister_n know_v that_o of_o particular_n nothing_o can_v be_v conclude_v and_o therefore_o he_o that_o will_v show_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o luther_n rise_v he_o must_v argue_v thus_o it_o be_v always_o so_o therefore_o then_o â—t_a be_v so_o now_o this_o antecedent_n be_v overthrow_v by_o any_o instance_n to_o the_o contrary_a and_o so_o the_o first_o antecedent_n be_v prove_v false_a the_o first_o consequent_a can_v but_o be_v false_a for_o what_o reason_n can_v be_v imagine_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o be_v not_o the_o whole_a catholic_n church_n at_o s._n cyprian_n time_n and_o be_v at_o luther_n rise_n if_o you_o grant_v as_o i_o think_v you_o can_v deny_v that_o a_o church_n divide_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o roman_a may_v be_v still_o in_o truth_n and_o in_o god_n account_n a_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n which_o be_v the_o thing_n we_o speak_v of_o than_o i_o hope_v mr._n lewgars_n argument_n fâ—om_n unity_n of_o communion_n be_v fall_v to_o the_o ground_n and_o it_o will_v be_v no_o good_a plea_n to_o say_v some_o one_o church_n not_o consist_v of_o divers_a communion_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n at_o luthersâ—ising_v â—ising_z no_o one_o church_n can_v be_v name_v to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n but_o the_o roman_a therefore_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v the_o catholic_n at_o luther_n rise_n for_o mr._n lewgar_n have_v not_o nor_o can_v prove_v the_o major_a of_o this_o syllogism_n certain_o true_a but_o to_o the_o contrary_n i_o have_v prove_v that_o it_o can_v be_v certain_o true_a by_o show_v divers_a instance_n wherein_o divers_a divide_a communion_n have_v make_v up_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o therefore_o not_o the_o divide_n of_o the_o communion_n but_o the_o cause_n and_o ground_n of_o it_o be_v to_o be_v regard_v whether_o it_o be_v just_a and_o sufficient_a or_o unjust_a and_o insufficient_a neither_o be_v the_o bishop_n or_o church_n of_o rome_n with_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o a_o infallible_a judge_n thereof_o for_o it_o be_v evident_a both_o he_o and_o it_o have_v err_v herein_o divers_a time_n which_o i_o have_v evince_v already_o by_o divers_a example_n which_o i_o will_v not_o repeat_v but_o add_v to_o they_o one_o confess_v by_o mr._n lewgar_n himself_o in_o his_o discourse_n upon_o the_o article_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n pag._n 84._o s._n athanasius_n be_v excommunicate_v though_o by_o the_o it_o whole_a church_n yet_o may_v remain_v a_o member_n of_o christ_n body_n not_o visible_a for_o that_o be_v impossible_a excommunicate_v that_o a_o person_n cut_v off_o from_o visible_a communion_n though_o unjust_o shall_v be_v a_o visible_a member_n of_o the_o church_n but_o by_o invisible_a communion_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o invalidity_n of_o the_o sentence_n which_o be_v unjust_a be_v valid_a enough_o to_o visible_a excision_n but_o not_o far_o ii_o a_o discourse_n against_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o a_o answer_n to_o all_o those_o text_n of_o scripture_n that_o be_v allege_v to_o prove_v it_o the_o condition_n of_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n without_o the_o performance_n whereof_o no_o man_n can_v be_v receive_v into_o it_o be_v this_o that_o he_o believe_v firm_o and_o without_o doubt_v whatsoever_o that_o church_n require_v he_o to_o believe_v it_o be_v impossible_a that_o any_o man_n shall_v certain_o believe_v any_o thing_n unless_o that_o thing_n be_v either_o evident_a of_o itself_o as_o that_o twice_o two_o be_v four_o that_o every_o whole_a be_v great_a than_o a_o part_n of_o itself_o or_o unless_o he_o have_v some_o certain_a reason_n at_o least_o some_o suppose_a certain_a reason_n and_o infallible_a guide_n for_o his_o belief_n thereof_o the_o doctrine_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n require_v to_o be_v believe_v be_v not_o evident_a of_o themselves_o for_o then_o every_o one_o will_v grant_v they_o at_o first_o hear_v without_o any_o further_a proof_n he_o therefore_o that_o will_v believe_v they_o must_v have_v some_o certain_a and_o infallible_a ground_n whereupon_o to_o â—â—â—ld_v his_o belief_n of_o they_o there_o be_v no_o other_o ground_n for_o a_o man_n belief_n of_o they_o especial_o in_o many_o point_n but_o only_o a_o assurance_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n now_o this_o point_n of_o that_o church_n infallibility_n be_v not_o evident_a of_o itself_o for_o than_o no_o man_n can_v choose_v but_o in_o his_o heart_n believe_v it_o without_o far_a proof_n second_o it_o be_v in_o vain_a to_o bring_v any_o proof_n of_o it_o as_o vain_a as_o to_o light_v a_o candle_n to_o show_v man_n the_o sun_n three_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o bring_v any_o proof_n of_o it_o see_v nothing_o can_v be_v more_o evident_a than_o that_o which_o of_o itself_o be_v evident_a and_o nothing_o can_v be_v bring_v in_o proof_n of_o any_o thing_n which_o be_v not_o more_o evident_a than_o that_o matter_n to_o be_v prove_v but_o now_o experience_n teach_v that_o million_o there_o be_v which_o have_v hear_v talk_n of_o the_o infallibitliy_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o yet_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o the_o defender_n of_o it_o do_v not_o think_v it_o either_o vain_a or_o impossible_a to_o go_v about_o to_o prove_v it_o and_o from_o hence_o it_o follow_v plain_o that_o this_o point_n be_v not_o evident_a of_o itself_o neither_o be_v there_o any_o other_o certain_a ground_n for_o any_o man_n belief_n of_o it_o or_o if_o there_o be_v i_o desire_v it_o may_v be_v produce_v as_o who_o be_o ready_a and_o most_o willing_a to_o submit_v my_o judgement_n to_o it_o full_o persuade_v that_o none_o can_v be_v produce_v that_o will_v endure_v a_o severe_a and_o impartial_a examination_n if_o it_o be_v say_v the_o roman_a church_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v infallible_a because_o the_o scripture_n say_v it_o be_v so_o 1._o i_o demand_v how_o shall_v i_o be_v assure_v of_o the_o text_n that_o be_v allege_v that_o they_o be_v indeed_o scripture_n that_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o the_o answer_n to_o this_o must_v be_v either_o because_o the_o church_n tell_v i_o so_o or_o some_o other_o if_o any_o other_o be_v give_v than_o all_o be_v not_o final_o resolve_v into_o and_o build_v upon_o that_o church_n authority_n and_o this_o answer_n than_o i_o hope_v a_o protestant_n may_v have_v leave_n to_o make_v use_n of_o when_o he_o be_v put_v to_o that_o perilous_a question_n how_o know_v you_o the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o scripture_n if_o the_o answer_n be_v because_o the_o church_n tell_v i_o so_o my_o reply_n be_v ready_a that_o to_o believe_v that_o church_n be_v infallible_a because_o the_o scripture_n say_v so_o and_o that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n because_o the_o same_o church_n say_v so_o be_v nothing_o else_o but_o to_o believe_v the_o church_n be_v infallible_a because_o the_o church_n say_v so_o which_o be_v infallible_a 2._o i_o can_v never_o yet_o from_o the_o begin_n of_o genesis_n to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o apocalypse_n find_v it_o write_v so_o much_o as_o once_o in_o express_a term_n or_o equvalent_o that_o the_o church_n in_o subordination_n to_o the_o sea_n of_o rome_n
shall_v be_v always_o infallible_a 3._o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o this_o be_v draw_v from_o good_a consequence_n from_o scripture_n true_o interpret_v i_o demand_v what_o certain_a ground_n have_v i_o to_o warrant_v i_o that_o this_o consequence_n be_v good_a and_o this_o interpretation_n true_a and_o if_o answer_v be_v make_v that_o reason_n will_v tell_v i_o so_o i_o reply_v 1._o that_o this_o be_v to_o build_v all_o upon_o my_o own_o reason_n and_o private_a interpretation_n 2._o i_o have_v great_a reason_n to_o fear_v that_o reason_n assure_v no_o man_n that_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n may_v be_v deduce_v from_o scripture_n by_o good_a and_o firm_a consequence_n 4._o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o a_o consent_n of_o father_n do_v so_o interpret_v the_o scripture_n i_o answer_v 1._o that_o this_o be_v most_o false_a and_o can_v without_o impudence_n be_v pretend_v as_o i_o be_o ready_a to_o justify_v to_o any_o indifferent_a hearer_n 2._o i_o demand_v who_o shall_v be_v judge_n whether_o the_o father_n mean_v as_o be_v pretend_v if_o it_o be_v say_v reason_n will_v tell_v i_o so_o i_o say_v 1._o this_o be_v false_a 2._o this_o be_v again_o to_o do_v that_o which_o be_v object_v to_o protestant_n for_o such_o a_o horrid_a crime_n that_o be_v to_o build_v all_o final_o upon_o reason_n if_o it_o be_v say_v they_o be_v so_o interpret_v by_o the_o catholic_n church_n i_o demand_v whether_o by_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v mean_v that_o only_a that_o be_v in_o subordination_n to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n or_o any_o other_o with_o that_o or_o beside_o that_o iâ—_n any_o other_o it_o be_v false_a and_o impudent_a to_o pretend_v that_o they_o so_o understand_v the_o father_n or_o scripture_n if_o that_o only_a than_o this_o be_v to_o say_v that_o that_o church_n be_v infallible_a because_o it_o may_v be_v deduce_v from_o scripture_n that_o it_o be_v so_o and_o to_o prove_v that_o it_o may_v be_v deduce_v from_o scripture_n because_o the_o father_n say_v so_o and_o to_o prove_v the_o father_n do_v say_v and_o mean_a so_o because_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n say_v they_o do_v so_o and_o then_o what_o a_o stir_n and_o trouble_n be_v here_o to_o no_o purpose_n why_o be_v it_o not_o rather_o say_v plain_o at_o the_o beginning_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v certain_o infallible_a because_o she_o herself_o say_v so_o and_o she_o must_v say_v true_a because_o she_o be_v infallible_a and_o that_o be_v as_o much_o to_o say_v as_o unless_o you_o grant_v i_o the_o question_n i_o neither_o can_v nor_o will_v dispute_v with_o you_o if_o it_o be_v say_v indeed_o the_o father_n do_v not_o draw_v this_o doctrine_n from_o scripture_n but_o yet_o they_o affirm_v it_o with_o a_o full_a consent_n as_o a_o matter_n of_o tradition_n i_o reply_v 1._o tâ—at_a this_o pretence_n also_o be_v false_a and_o that_o upon_o trial_n it_o will_v not_o appear_v to_o have_v any_o colour_n of_o probability_n to_o any_o who_o remember_v that_o it_o be_v the_o present_a roman_a church_n and_o not_o the_o catholic_n church_n who_o infallibility_n be_v here_o dispute_v 2._o i_o demand_v who_o shall_v be_v judge_n whether_o the_o father_n do_v indeed_o affirm_v this_o or_o no_o if_o reason_n than_o again_o we_o be_v falleâ—_n upon_o that_o dangerous_a rock_n that_o all_o must_v be_v resolve_v into_o private_a reason_n if_o the_o church_n i_o ask_v again_o what_o church_n be_v mean_v if_o the_o church_n of_o the_o grecian_n or_o abyssines_n or_o protestant_n or_o any_o other_o but_o the_o roman_a it_o be_v evident_a they_o deny_v it_o if_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n than_o we_o be_v again_o very_a near_o the_o head_n of_o the_o circle_n for_o i_o ask_v how_o shall_v i_o be_v assure_v this_o church_n will_v not_o err_v and_o deceive_v i_o in_o interpret_n the_o father_n and_o the_o answer_n must_v be_v either_o none_o or_o this_o that_o the_o church_n be_v infallible_a obj._n if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n will_v yield_v the_o church_n so_o many_o commodity_n and_o that_o the_o want_n of_o a_o infallible_a church_n to_o guide_v man_n in_o the_o way_n to_o heaven_n will_v bring_v so_o many_o mischief_n upon_o the_o world_n that_o it_o can_v be_v think_v but_o that_o god_n out_o of_o his_o love_n to_o man_n have_v appoint_v this_o church_n as_o a_o infallible_a guide_n to_o all_o other_o church_n see_v it_o be_v so_o necessary_a there_o shall_v be_v some_o such_o guide_n and_o so_o evident_a there_o be_v no_o other_o ans._n i_o answer_v that_o this_o argument_n will_v serve_v the_o church_n of_o greece_n or_o england_n or_o geneva_n to_o prove_v itself_o infallible_a and_o the_o guide_n of_o all_o other_o church_n will_v they_o but_o take_v upon_o they_o to_o be_v so_o for_o every_o one_o may_v say_v for_o itself_o it_o be_v necessary_a there_o shall_v be_v some_o guide_n it_o be_v evident_a there_o be_v no_o other_o ergo_fw-la i_o be_o appoint_v by_o god_n to_o be_v that_o guide_n the_o same_o argument_n any_o man_n may_v use_v to_o make_v himself_o monarch_n of_o any_o popular_a state_n for_o first_o he_o may_v represent_v unto_o they_o the_o commodity_n of_o a_o monarchy_n and_o the_o mischief_n of_o a_o democracy_n then_o he_o may_v say_v that_o god_n sure_o out_o of_o his_o love_n to_o they_o have_v appoint_v some_o remedy_n for_o their_o inconvenience_n and_o last_o that_o he_o have_v ordain_v no_o other_o to_o redress_v they_o but_o himself_o and_o then_o conclude_v that_o he_o alone_o must_v of_o necessity_n be_v the_o man_n appoint_v to_o rule_v over_o they_o i_o answer_v second_o that_o here_o also_o we_o must_v resolve_v all_o into_o reason_n and_o the_o private_a spirit_n or_o that_o we_o be_v still_o in_o the_o circle_n for_o i_o demand_v how_o do_v you_o know_v that_o these_o pretend_a commodity_n be_v to_o be_v compass_v and_o these_o pretend_a mischief_n be_v to_o be_v avoid_v only_o by_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o some_o other_o church_n and_o not_o by_o any_o other_o mean_n which_o god_n have_v provide_v if_o you_o say_v reason_n tell_v you_o so_o i_o say_v 1._o this_o be_v to_o make_v reason_n your_o last_o and_o low_a foundation_n 2._o i_o assure_v you_o reason_n tell_v i_o no_o such_o matter_n and_o yet_o i_o know_v that_o i_o be_o as_o willing_a to_o hear_v it_o as_o you_o be_v if_o you_o say_v the_o church_n tell_v you_o so_o and_o she_o be_v infallible_a this_o i_o say_v be_v to_o prove_v the_o church_n infallible_a because_o she_o be_v so_o three_o i_o demand_v how_o it_o be_v possible_a you_o shall_v know_v that_o these_o pretend_a commodity_n may_v not_o be_v gain_v and_o these_o mischief_n which_o you_o fear_v avoid_v without_o any_o assistance_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n infallibility_n if_o all_o man_n in_o the_o world_n do_v believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o live_v according_a to_o it_o and_o will_v require_v no_o more_o of_o other_o but_o to_o do_v so_o if_o you_o say_v that_o notwithstanding_o this_o there_o will_v be_v no_o unity_n in_o doctrine_n i_o answer_v 1._o it_o be_v impossible_a you_o shall_v know_v this_o consider_v that_o there_o be_v many_o place_n in_o scripture_n which_o do_v more_o than_o problable_o import_n that_o the_o want_n of_o piety_n in_o live_v be_v the_o cause_n of_o want_n of_o unity_n in_o believe_v 2._o that_o there_o will_v be_v unity_n of_o opinion_n in_o all_o thing_n necessary_a and_o that_o in_o thing_n not_o necessary_a unity_n of_o opinion_n be_v not_o necessary_a but_o last_o that_o notwithstanding_o difference_n in_o these_o thing_n of_o lesser_a importance_n there_o may_v and_o will_v be_v unity_n of_o communion_n unity_n of_o charity_n and_o affection_n which_o be_v one_o of_o the_o great_a blessing_n which_o the_o world_n be_v capable_a of_o absolute_a unity_n of_o opinion_n be_v a_o matter_n rather_o to_o be_v desire_v than_o hope_v for_o obj._n against_o this_o it_o have_v be_v object_v that_o the_o scripture_n can_v be_v the_o guide_n because_o many_o man_n have_v use_v their_o best_a endeavour_n to_o follow_v it_o and_o yet_o have_v fall_v some_o into_o arianism_n other_o into_o pelagianism_n other_o into_o other_o damnable_a heresy_n and_o how_o can_v i_o secure_v any_o man_n but_o he_o may_v do_v the_o like_a ans._n to_o this_o i_o answer_v by_o distinguish_v the_o person_n which_o be_v pretend_v to_o have_v make_v use_n of_o this_o guide_n and_o yet_o to_o have_v fall_v into_o heresy_n that_o they_o be_v either_o such_o as_o do_v love_v the_o truth_n sincere_o and_o above_o all_o thing_n as_o do_v seek_v it_o diligent_o and_o with_o all_o their_o power_n to_o this_o intent_n that_o they_o may_v conform_v their_o belief_n and_o
well_o intend_v they_o for_o that_o purpose_n which_o i_o conceive_v as_o for_o that_o which_o you_o conceive_v the_o last_o place_n allege_v tell_v we_o that_o she_o be_v beget_v and_o bear_v as_o other_o man_n and_o woman_n be_v which_o if_o the_o collyridians_n have_v think_v her_o god_n eternal_a and_o absolute_o without_o beginning_n shall_v not_o have_v be_v bare_o say_v but_o prove_v as_o be_v in_o effect_n the_o very_a point_n in_o question_n and_o therefore_o see_v epiphanius_n content_v himself_o with_o say_v so_o without_o proof_n it_o be_v evident_a he_o never_o think_v they_o will_v make_v difficulty_n to_o grant_v it_o and_o consequent_o that_o they_o do_v not_o believe_v she_o to_o be_v god_n eternal_a but_o then_o again_o if_o the_o rule_n be_v good_a which_o part_n of_o your_o proof_n depend_v upon_o that_o whatever_o epiphanius_n deny_v in_o this_o discourse_n that_o the_o collyridians_n hold_v for_o upon_o that_o ground_n from_o non_fw-la &_o deum_fw-la hanc_fw-la efficeret_fw-la &_o non_fw-la tamen_fw-la deus_fw-la you_o conclude_v they_o believe_v she_o god_n if_o i_o say_v this_o rule_n be_v good_a than_o you_o shall_v be_v constant_a to_o it_o and_o now_o that_o he_o say_v non_fw-la tamen_fw-la aliter_fw-la genita_fw-la est_fw-la praeter_fw-la hominum_fw-la naturam_fw-la she_o be_v not_o beget_v in_o a_o different_a way_n from_o other_o man_n you_o shall_v infer_v that_o they_o believe_v not_o that_o she_o be_v god_n but_o that_o she_o be_v otherwise_o bear_v and_o beget_v than_o the_o ordinary_a sort_n of_o men._n and_o so_o whereas_o he_o say_v before_o non_fw-la tamen_fw-la corpus_fw-la de_fw-la caelum_fw-la tulit_fw-la her_z body_n be_v not_o from_o heaven_n you_o shall_v infer_v that_o they_o believe_v her_o body_n come_v from_o heaven_n and_o again_o from_o those_o sanctum_fw-la erat_fw-la mariae_fw-la corpus_fw-la non_fw-la tamen_fw-la deus_fw-la you_o shall_v collect_v that_o they_o though_o not_o only_o her_o person_n but_o her_o body_n to_o be_v god_n or_o if_o these_o be_v wild_a and_o weak_a deduction_n than_o you_o must_v acknowledge_v that_o i_o have_v do_v you_o some_o favour_n in_o vouchsafe_v they_o a_o particular_a answer_n 5._o demand_v whether_o in_o the_o church_n of_o roman_a it_o be_v not_o a_o approve_a and_o perpetual_o practise_v worship_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n that_o incense_n which_o be_v never_o ancient_o offer_v unto_o any_o either_o by_o jew_n or_o gentile_n but_o to_o the_o true_a or_o to_o a_o suppose_a true_a god_n and_o taper_n and_o divers_a other_o oblation_n shall_v be_v offer_v to_o her_o honour_n answ._n a_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o approve_v too_o by_o those_o that_o practise_v it_o belong_v not_o to_o she_o except_o it_o be_v a_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n and_o approve_a by_o she_o what_o her_o practice_n be_v abroad_o i_o know_v not_o here_o at_o home_n i_o see_v no_o such_o practice_n nor_o do_v i_o know_v any_o approbation_n of_o it_o in_o any_o of_o her_o public_a declaration_n but_o this_o i_o know_v that_o there_o be_v nothing_o in_o it_o unlawful_a or_o savour_v of_o the_o collyridian_n superstition_n to_o offer_v wax_n taper_n or_o any_o other_o thing_n at_o the_o memory_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n or_o any_o other_o canonize_v saint_n either_o as_o mean_n to_o procure_v their_o intercession_n by_o these_o outward_a sign_n of_o the_o honour_n and_o devotion_n which_o they_o bear_v to_o they_o as_o of_o old_a we_o find_v by_o s._n austin_n etc._n they_o do_v use_v to_o adorn_v their_o tomb_n with_o flower_n or_o as_o monument_n of_o their_o thankfulness_n for_o some_o benefit_n receive_v by_o their_o intercession_n as_o theodoret_n 8._o tell_v we_o of_o eye_n and_o ear_n and_o haâ—ds_n some_o of_o gold_n and_o some_o of_o silver_n hang_v up_o in_o the_o chapel_n of_o the_o saint_n that_o have_v be_v present_v as_o oblation_n by_o those_o that_o have_v recover_v health_n in_o those_o member_n according_a to_o their_o vow_n make_v to_o that_o purpose_n in_o time_n of_o sickness_n reply_n i_o do_v not_o deny_v but_o a_o practice_n may_v be_v tolerate_v in_o a_o church_n and_o not_o approve_v as_o the_o public_a stew_n be_v in_o italy_n and_o usury_n in_o england_n but_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o tolerate_v with_o condemnation_n another_o to_o tolerate_v without_o condemnation_n nay_o with_o condemnation_n of_o those_o that_o shall_v oppose_v or_o condemn_v it_o and_o such_o i_o doubt_v not_o upon_o examination_n you_o may_v find_v be_v this_o practice_n general_a in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n offer_v taper_n to_o the_o saint_n and_o for_o their_o honour_n i_o say_v not_o only_o to_o god_n at_o the_o memory_n of_o the_o saint_n as_o you_o will_v mince_v the_o matter_n which_o yet_o be_v a_o groundless_a superstition_n god_n have_v appoint_v no_o such_o sacrifice_n to_o be_v offer_v to_o he_o under_o the_o gospel_n but_o to_o the_o saint_n themselves_o and_o to_o their_o honour_n prove_v this_o lawful_a for_o either_o of_o those_o purpose_n you_o mention_v either_o to_o procure_v their_o intercession_n or_o as_o monument_n of_o thankfulness_n for_o benefit_n obtain_v by_o it_o and_o then_o you_o shall_v do_v something_o otherwise_o you_o will_v but_o trifle_v as_o now_o you_o have_v do_v for_o instead_o of_o tell_v we_o what_o may_v be_v do_v de_fw-la jure_fw-la you_o tell_v we_o what_o of_o old_a have_v be_v do_v de_fw-fr facto_fw-la as_o if_o ab_fw-la antiquo_fw-la and_o a_o principio_fw-la be_v all_o one_o or_o as_o if_o the_o church_n as_o we_o pretend_v be_v subject_a to_o corruption_n part_n of_o this_o corruption_n may_v not_o possible_o have_v come_v in_o s._n augustine_n or_o theodoret_n time_n yet_o this_o i_o say_v not_o as_o if_o i_o will_v decline_v the_o trial_n of_o this_o cause_n by_o s._n austin_n or_o theodoret_n but_o because_o i_o be_o sure_a you_o will_v not_o be_v try_v by_o the_o father_n no_o not_o the_o consent_n of_o father_n in_o all_o thing_n and_o therefore_o there_o be_v no_o reason_n nor_o equity_n in_o the_o world_n that_o you_o shall_v serve_v yourselves_o with_o their_o authority_n in_o any_o thing_n but_o now_o what_o be_v it_o which_o be_v do_v in_o s._n augustine_n time_n that_o may_v justify_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v there_o then_o any_o approve_a offering_n of_o wax_n taper_n and_o incense_n to_o the_o queen_n of_o heaven_n or_o any_o other_o saint_n will_v horum_fw-la you_o neither_o do_v nor_o can_v produce_v any_o thing_n out_o of_o s._n austin_n to_o this_o purpose_n but_o what_o then_o be_v it_o why_o forsooth_o they_o be_v use_v to_o adorn_v their_o tomb_n egregiam_fw-la verò_fw-la laudem_fw-la &_o spolia_fw-la ampla_fw-la of_o old_a in_o s._n augustine_n time_n they_o be_v use_v to_o adorn_v their_o tomb_n with_o flower_n therefore_o we_o may_v offer_v taper_n to_o they_o true_o a_o excellent_a enthymeme_n but_o i_o fear_v the_o conceal_a proposition_n which_o shall_v make_v it_o a_o syllogism_n hide_v its_o head_n for_o shame_n and_o dare_v not_o appear_v yet_o we_o will_v for_o once_o make_v bold_a to_o draw_v it_o forth_o into_o light_n that_o you_o may_v look_v upon_o it_o and_o tell_v we_o how_o you_o like_v it_o this_o therefore_o it_o be_v who_o soever_o tomb_n we_o adorn_v to_o they_o and_o to_o their_o honour_n we_o may_v offer_v wax_n taper_n consider_v it_o i_o pray_v you_o and_o if_o you_o approve_v it_o then_o approve_v also_o of_o offer_v taper_n not_o only_o to_o canonize_v saint_n but_o to_o all_o christian_n that_o may_v have_v monument_n in_o church_n for_o all_o their_o tomb_n may_v be_v adorn_v with_o more_o precious_a and_o last_a ornament_n that_o flower_n yet_o if_o you_o have_v prove_v but_o this_o only_a that_o in_o s._n augustine_n time_n they_o adorn_v the_o saint_n tomb_n with_o flower_n by_o these_o outward_a sign_n to_o procure_v their_o intercession_n this_o though_o not_o much_o to_o the_o purpose_n have_v be_v not_o absolute_o to_o delude_v we_o but_o your_o quote_v place_n prove_v not_o so_o much_o as_o this_o and_o yet_o i_o believe_v you_o quote_v the_o best_a you_o can_v find_v nay_o they_o prove_v not_o they_o do_v adorn_v their_o tomb_n with_o flower_n at_o all_o much_o less_o that_o they_o do_v it_o for_o your_o pretend_a purpose_n such_o fool_n you_o think_v to_o deal_v with_o that_o will_v take_v any_o thing_n for_o any_o thing_n your_o first_o place_n i_o say_v prove_v it_o not_o unless_o out_o of_o mere_a courtesy_n we_o understand_v by_o ferebat_fw-la she_o bring_v to_o adorn_v s._n stephens_n tomb._n the_o second_o prove_v it_o not_o unless_o we_o give_v you_o leave_v after_o altari_fw-la without_o warrant_n from_o s._n austin_n to_o put_v in_o s._n stephani_n whereas_o i_o be_o yet_o to_o seek_v for_o any_o place_n in_o s._n austin_n where_o he_o call_v any_o
must_v be_v papists_n if_o we_o forsake_v the_o church_n of_o england_n we_o must_v go_v present_o to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n whereas_o if_o your_o argument_n do_v conclude_v as_o they_o do_v not_o that_o before_o lâ—thers_n time_n there_o be_v some_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n i_o shall_v much_o rather_o think_v it_o be_v the_o church_n of_o greeâ—e_n â—han_fw-mi the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o i_o believe_v other_o also_o will_v think_v so_o as_o well_o as_o i_o but_o for_o that_o reason_n which_o one_o give_v why_o more_o man_n hold_v the_o pope_n above_o a_o council_n than_o a_o council_n above_o a_o pope_n that_o be_v because_o council_n give_v no_o maintenance_n or_o preferment_n and_o the_o pope_n do_v think_v not_o yet_o i_o pray_v that_o i_o say_v this_o as_o if_o i_o conceive_v this_o to_o be_v your_o reason_n for_o prefer_v the_o roman_a church_n before_o the_o greek_a for_o i_o protest_v i_o do_v not_o but_o rather_o that_o conceive_v very_o you_o be_v to_o leave_v the_o church_n of_o england_n to_o avoid_v trouble_v you_o take_v the_o next_o boat_n and_o go_v to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n because_o that_o bespeak_v you_o first_o you_o impute_v to_o i_o as_o i_o hear_v that_o the_o way_n i_o take_v be_v destructive_a only_o and_o that_o i_o build_v nothing_o which_o first_o be_v not_o a_o fault_n for_o christian_a religion_n be_v not_o now_o to_o be_v build_v but_o only_o i_o desire_v to_o have_v the_o rubbish_n and_o impertinent_a lumber_n take_v off_o which_o you_o have_v lay_v upon_o it_o which_o hide_v the_o glorious_a simplicity_n of_o it_o from_o they_o which_o otherwise_o will_v embrace_v it_o remember_v i_o pray_v averro_n his_o say_n quandoquidem_fw-la christiant_fw-la adorant_fw-la quod_fw-la comedunt_fw-la sit_fw-la anima_fw-la mea_fw-la cum_fw-la philosophis_fw-la and_o consider_v the_o swarm_n of_o atheist_n in_o italy_n and_o then_o tell_v i_o whether_o your_o unreasonable_a and_o contradictious_a doctrine_n your_o forge_a miracle_n and_o counterfeit_a legend_n have_v not_o in_o all_o probability_n produce_v this_o effect_n second_o if_o it_o be_v a_o fault_n it_o be_v certain_o your_o own_o for_o your_o discourse_n intend_v for_o the_o proof_n of_o a_o positive_a conclusion_n that_o we_o must_v be_v papist_n prove_v in_o deed_n and_o in_o truth_n nothing_o but_o even_o in_o show_n and_o appearance_n no_o more_o but_o this_o negative_a that_o we_o must_v not_o be_v protestant_a but_o what_o we_o must_v be_v if_o we_o must_v not_o be_v protestant_n god_n know_v you_o in_o this_o discourse_n i_o be_o sure_a do_v not_o show_v it_o mr._n lewgar_n reply_v §_o 1._o the_o minor_a of_o mr._n chillingworths_n argument_n against_o my_o gâ—oâ—nd_n be_v very_a weâ—k_n be_v 〈◊〉_d upon_o 〈◊〉_d false_a supposition_n that_o a_o protestant_n can_v name_v no_o other_o church_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n etc._n etc._n from_o the_o greek_a châ—â—ch_n which_o waâ—_n the_o catholic_n church_n for_o if_o he_o can_v â—ot_n indeed_o name_v any_o other_o the_o title_n will_v remain_v to_o the_o greek_a church_n but_o he_o have_v the_o roman_a to_o name_n and_o so_o my_o ground_n can_v conclude_v either_o so_o the_o 〈…〉_z or_o any_o other_o beside_o the_o roman_a but_o for_o that_o it_o do_v except_o he_o can_v name_v some_o other_o §_o 2._o his_o second_o answer_n be_v weak_a likewise_o for_o my_o minor_n be_v always_o true_a at_o least_o they_o think_v it_o to_o be_v so_o who_o authority_n i_o produce_v in_o confirmation_n of_o it_o as_o will_v appear_v to_o any_o one_o that_o consider_v they_o well_o how_o their_o force_n lie_v in_o thesi_fw-la not_o in_o hypothesi_fw-la not_o that_o the_o church_n be_v not_o then_o divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o but_o that_o â—he_n can_v never_o be_v §_o 3._o as_o for_o his_o instance_n to_o the_o contrary_a wherein_o he_o believe_v i_o will_v not_o say_v the_o church_n excommunicate_v by_o victor_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o true_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n if_o i_o say_v so_o i_o say_v no_o more_o than_o the_o ancient_a father_n say_v before_o i_o iraeneus_n when_o he_o desire_v victor_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d not_o to_o cut_v off_o so_o many_o and_o great_a church_n and_o ruffinâ—_n reprehendit_fw-la cam_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la benè_fw-la fecisset_fw-la abscindere_fw-la ab_fw-la unitate_fw-la corporis_fw-la etc._n etc._n §_o 4._o but_o howsoever_o the_o case_n of_o excommunication_n may_v be_v the_o division_n of_o external_a communion_n which_o i_o intend_v and_o the_o father_n speak_v of_o in_o the_o allege_a authority_n be_v that_o which_o be_v make_v by_o voluntary_a separation_n §_o 5._o whereby_o the_o church_n before_o one_o society_n be_v divide_v into_o several_a distinct_a society_n both_o claim_v to_o be_v the_o church_n of_o which_o society_n so_o divide_v but_o one_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n and_o this_o be_v prove_v by_o the_o authority_n allege_v which_o authority_n must_v not_o be_v answer_v by_o disprove_v they_o as_o he_o do_v for_o that_o be_v to_o change_v his_o adversary_n and_o confute_v the_o father_n say_n instead_o of_o i_o but_o by_o show_v their_o true_a sense_n or_o judgement_n to_o be_v otherwise_o than_o i_o allege_v it_o §_o 6._o to_o his_o demand_n upon_o the_o place_n allege_v i_o answer_v that_o i_o do_v not_o build_v my_o whole_a faith_n of_o this_o conclusion_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o those_o father_n for_o i_o produce_v they_o not_o for_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o thing_n but_o of_o the_o exposition_n the_o thing_n itself_o be_v a_o article_n of_o the_o creed_n unam_fw-la catholicam_fw-la ground_v in_o express_a scripture_n columba_n mea_fw-la unica_fw-la but_o because_o there_o be_v difference_n in_o understand_v this_o prophecy_n i_o produce_v these_o authority_n to_o show_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n how_o they_o understand_v it_o and_o the_o proper_a answer_n to_o this_o be_v either_o to_o show_v that_o these_o word_n be_v not_o there_o or_o at_o least_o not_o this_o meaning_n and_o so_o to_o show_v their_o meaning_n out_o of_o other_o place_n more_o pregnant_a §_o 7._o and_o i_o promise_v that_o whensoever_o a_o equal_a consent_n of_o father_n can_v be_v show_v for_o any_o thing_n as_o i_o can_v show_v for_o this_o i_o will_v believe_v it_o as_o firm_o as_o i_o do_v this_o §_o 8._o but_o this_o be_v not_o the_o answerers_n part_n to_o propound_v doubt_n and_o difficulty_n but_o to_o satisfy_v the_o proof_n object_v §_o 9_o and_o if_o this_o course_n be_v any_o more_o take_v i_o will_v save_v myself_o all_o far_a labour_n in_o a_o business_n so_o likely_a to_o be_v endless_a §_o 10._o his_o second_o answer_n to_o the_o place_n be_v whole_o impertinent_a for_o therein_o will_v he_o disprove_v they_o from_o watch_v a_o necessity_n of_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n whereas_o i_o produce_v they_o only_o to_o show_v that_o among_o several_a society_n of_o christian_n only_o one_o can_v be_v the_o catholic_n and_o against_o this_o his_o second_o answer_n say_v nothing_o §_o 11._o in_o his_o three_o answer_n he_o make_v some_o show_n of_o reply_n to_o the_o authority_n themselves_o but_o he_o commit_v a_o double_a error_n one_o that_o he_o impose_v upon_o i_o a_o wrong_a conclusion_n to_o be_v prove_v as_o will_v appear_v by_o compare_v my_o conclusion_n in_o my_o paper_n with_o the_o conclusion_n he_o will_v appoint_v i_o §_o 12._o another_o that_o he_o impose_v upon_o the_o authority_n a_o wrong_a interpretation_n no_o way_n ground_v in_o the_o word_n themselves_o nor_o in_o the_o place_n whence_o they_o be_v take_v nor_o in_o any_o other_o place_n of_o the_o same_o father_n but_o mere_o forge_v out_o of_o his_o own_o brain_n for_o first_o the_o place_n do_v not_o only_o say_v that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o church_n but_o that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o they_o account_v society_n divide_v which_o be_v either_o of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o a_o diverse_a communion_n neither_o do_v they_o define_v heretic_n or_o schismatic_n in_o that_o manner_n as_o he_o do_v §_o 13._o for_o a_o heretic_n in_o their_o language_n be_v he_o that_o oppose_v partinacious_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n and_o a_o schismatic_a he_o that_o separate_v from_o the_o catholic_n communion_n never_o make_v any_o mention_n at_o all_o of_o the_o cause_n §_o 14._o and_o if_o his_o definition_n of_o a_o schismatic_a may_v stand_v then_o certain_o there_o be_v no_o schismatic_a ever_o in_o the_o world_n nor_o none_o be_v at_o this_o day_n for_o none_o do_v none_o do_v separate_v without_o some_o pretence_n of_o error_n or_o unlawfulness_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o the_o church_n
communion_n §_o 15._o and_o so_o i_o expect_v both_o a_o full_a and_o direct_a answer_n to_o my_o argument_n without_o excursion_n or_o diversion_n into_o any_o other_o matter_n till_o the_o judgement_n of_o antiquity_n be_v clear_v in_o this_o point_n mr._n chillingworths_n answer_n ad_fw-la §_o 1._o the_o minor_a of_o my_o argument_n you_o say_v be_v very_o weak_a be_v ground_v upon_o a_o false_a supposition_n that_o a_o protestant_n can_v name_v no_o other_o church_n profess_v a_o diverse_a faith_n from_o the_o greek_a which_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o your_o reason_n be_v because_o he_o â—ight_a name_n the_o roman_a but_o in_o earnest_n mr._n lewgar_o do_v you_o think_v that_o a_o protestant_n remain_v a_o protestant_n can_v esteem_v the_o roman_a church_n to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n or_o do_v you_o think_v to_o put_v trick_n upon_o we_o with_o take_v your_o proposition_n one_o while_n in_o sâ—nsu_fw-la composito_fw-la another_o while_n in_o sensu_fw-la drviso_fw-la for_o if_o your_o meaning_n be_v that_o a_o prâ—testant_n not_o remain_v but_o cease_v to_o be_v a_o protestant_n may_v name_v the_o roman_a for_o the_o catholic_n so_o i_o say_v also_o to_o your_o discourse_n that_o a_o protestant_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o protestant_n may_v name_v a_o greek_a to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n and_o if_o there_o be_v any_o necessity_n to_o find_v out_o one_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n as_o the_o greek_a the_o roman_a the_o abyssine_n which_o one_o must_v be_v the_o catholic_n i_o see_v no_o reason_n but_o he_o may_v pitch_v upon_o the_o greek_a church_n as_o well_o as_o the_o roman_a i_o be_o sure_a your_o discourse_n prove_v nothing_o to_o the_o contrary_n in_o short_a thus_o i_o say_v if_o a_o grecian_a shall_v go_v about_o to_o prove_v to_o a_o protestant_n that_o hâ—s_v church_n be_v the_o catholic_n by_o say_v as_o you_o do_v for_o the_o roman_a some_o one_o be_v so_o before_o luther_n and_o you_o can_v name_v no_o other_o therefore_o we_o be_v so_o whatsoever_o may_v be_v answer_v to_o he_o may_v be_v answer_v to_o you_o foâ—_n as_o you_o say_v a_o protestant_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o proteâ—tant_n may_v name_v to_o he_o the_o roman_a so_o i_o say_v a_o protestant_n cease_v to_o be_v a_o protestant_n may_v name_v to_o you_o the_o grecian_a if_o you_o say_v a_o protestant_n remain_v a_o protestant_n can_v name_v no_o other_o but_o the_o roman_a for_o the_o catholic_n i_o may_v very_o ridiculous_o i_o confess_v but_o yet_o as_o true_o say_v he_o can_v name_v no_o other_o but_o the_o grecian_a if_o you_o say_v he_o can_v name_v the_o greek_a church_n neither_o remain_v a_o protestant_n i_o say_v likewise_o neither_o remain_v a_o protestant_n can_v he_o name_v the_o roman_a for_o the_o catholic_n so_o the_o argument_n be_v equal_a in_o all_o respect_n on_o both_o side_n and_o therefore_o either_o conclude_v for_o both_o part_n which_o be_v impossible_a for_o then_o contradiction_n shall_v be_v both_o true_a or_o else_o which_o be_v certain_a it_o conclude_v for_o neither_o and_o therefore_o i_o say_v your_o ground_n you_o build_v on_o that_o before_o luther_n some_o church_n of_o one_o denomination_n be_v the_o catholic_n if_o it_o be_v true_a as_o it_o be_v most_o false_a will_v not_o prove_v your_o intent_n it_o will_v destroy_v perhaps_o our_o church_n but_o it_o will_v not_o build_v you_o it_o will_v prove_v peradventure_o that_o we_o must_v not_o be_v protestant_n but_o it_o will_v be_v far_o from_o prove_v that_o we_o must_v be_v papist_n for_o after_o we_o have_v lâ—ft_v be_v protestant_n i_o tell_v you_o again_o that_o â—ou_fw-mi may_v not_o mistake_v there_o be_v yet_o no_o necessity_n of_o be_v 〈◊〉_d no_o moâ—â—_n than_o if_o i_o go_v out_o of_o england_n there_o be_v a_o necessity_n of_o go_v to_o rome_n and_o thus_o much_o to_o show_v the_o 〈◊〉_d of_o your_o ground_n if_o it_o be_v true_a now_o in_o the_o 〈◊〉_d place_n i_o say_v it_o be_v false_a neither_o have_v you_o prove_v any_o thing_n 〈◊〉_d contrary_a 〈…〉_z you_o say_v the_o authority_n you_o have_v produce_v show_v to_o any_o that_o consider_v they_o well_o that_o the_o church_n can_v never_o be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o you_o mean_v i_o hope_v one_o in_o external_a communion_n or_o else_o you_o daily_a in_o ambiguity_n and_o then_o i_o say_v i_o have_v well_o consider_v the_o allege_a authority_n and_o they_o appear_v to_o i_o to_o say_v no_o such_o thing_n but_o only_o that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o true_a member_n of_o the_o church_n whereas_o i_o put_v the_o case_n of_o two_o such_o society_n which_o be_v divide_v in_o external_a communion_n by_o reason_n of_o some_o overvalue_v difference_n between_o they_o and_o yet_o be_v neither_o of_o they_o heretical_a or_o schismatical_a to_o this_o i_o know_v you_o can_v not_o answer_v but_o only_o by_o say_v that_o this_o supposition_n be_v impossible_a viz._n that_o of_o two_o society_n divide_v in_o external_a communion_n neither_o shall_v be_v heretical_a nor_o schismatical_a and_o therefore_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o prove_v by_o one_o convince_a argument_n that_o this_o be_v impossible_a this_o you_o have_v not_o do_v nor_o i_o believe_v can_v do_v and_o therefore_o all_o your_o place_n fall_v short_a of_o your_o intend_a conclusion_n and_o if_o you_o will_v put_v they_o into_o syllogistical_a form_n you_o shall_v present_o see_v you_o conclude_v from_o they_o sophistical_o in_o that_o fallacy_n which_o be_v call_v a_o dicto_fw-la secundura_fw-it quid_fw-la ad_fw-la dictum_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la thus_o no_o two_o diviced_a society_n whereof_o one_o be_v heretical_a or_o schisinatical_a can_v be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n therefore_o simple_o no_o two_o divide_a society_n can_v be_v so_o the_o antecedent_n i_o grant_v which_o be_v all_o that_o your_o place_n say_v as_o you_o shall_v see_v anon_o but_o the_o consequence_n be_v sophistical_a and_o therefore_o that_o i_o deny_v it_o be_v no_o better_a nor_o worse_o than_o if_o you_o shall_v argue_v thus_o no_o true_a divide_a society_n whereof_o one_o be_v outlawed_n and_o in_o rebellion_n be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o same_o commonwealth_n therefore_o simple_o no_o two_o divide_a society_n but_o against_o this_o you_o pretend_v that_o the_o a_o ledged_a place_n say_v not_o only_o that_o the_o society_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v no_o part_n of_o the_o church_n but_o that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v into_o more_o society_n than_o one_o and_o they_o account_v society_n divide_v which_o be_v either_o of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o of_o a_o diverse_a communion_n this_o be_v that_o which_o i_o will_v have_v prove_v but_o as_o yet_o i_o can_v see_v it_o do_v there_o be_v eleven_o quotation_n in_o all_o seven_o of_o they_o speak_v express_o and_o formal_o of_o division_n make_v by_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n viz._n 1._o 3_o 4._o 7._o 9_o 10_o 11._o three_o other_o of_o they_o viz._n 5_o 6._o 8._o though_o they_o use_v not_o the_o word_n yet_o mr._n lewgar_n know_v they_o speak_v of_o the_o donatist_n which_o be_v schismatic_n and_o that_o by_o the_o relative_a particle_n you_o and_o they_o be_v mean_v the_o donatist_n and_o last_o the_o second_o mr._n lewgar_o know_v say_v nothing_o but_o this_o that_o a_o heretic_n can_v be_v account_v of_o that_o one_o flock_n which_o be_v the_o church_n but_o to_o make_v the_o most_o of_o they_o that_o can_v be_v the_o first_o say_v the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n can_v be_v separate_v at_o all_o nor_o divide_v this_o i_o grant_v but_o then_o i_o say_v every_o difference_n do_v not_o in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n divide_v this_o unity_n for_o then_o diversity_n of_o opinion_n shall_v do_v it_o and_o so_o the_o jesuit_n and_o dominican_n shall_v be_v no_o long_o member_n of_o the_o same_o church_n or_o if_o every_o difference_n will_v not_o do_v it_o why_o must_v it_o of_o necessity_n be_v always_o do_v by_o difference_n in_o communion_n upon_o a_o insufficient_a ground_n yet_o mistake_v for_o sufficient_a for_o such_o only_o i_o speak_v of_o sure_o i_o be_o this_o place_n say_v no_o such_o matter_n the_o next_o place_n say_v the_o flock_n be_v but_o one_o and_o all_o the_o rest_n that_o the_o church_n be_v but_o one_o and_o that_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n be_v not_o of_o it_o which_o certain_o be_v not_o the_o thing_n to_o be_v prove_v but_o that_o of_o this_o one_o flock_n of_o this_o one_o church_n two_o society_n divide_v without_o just_a cause_n in_o communion_n may_v not_o be_v true_a and_o lively_a member_n both_o in_o one_o body_n mystical_a in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n though_o divide_v in_o unity_n in_o the_o sight_n of_o man_n it_o be_v true_a indeed_o whosoever_o be_v shut_v out_o from_o
the_o church_n on_o earth_n be_v likewise_o cut_v off_o from_o it_o before_o god_n in_o heaven_n but_o you_o know_v it_o must_v be_v clavae_n non_fw-la errante_fw-la when_o the_o cause_n of_o abscission_n be_v true_a and_o sufficient_a ad._n §_o 3._o if_o you_o say_v so_o you_o say_v no_o more_o than_o the_o father_n but_o what_o evasion_n and_o tergiversation_n be_v these_o why_o do_v you_o put_v we_o off_o with_o if_n and_o and_n i_o beseech_v you_o tell_v i_o or_o at_o least_o he_o that_o desire_v to_o reap_v some_o benefit_n by_o our_o conference_n direct_o and_o categorical_o do_v you_o say_v so_o or_o do_v you_o say_v it_o be_v not_o so_o be_v the_o excommunicate_v church_n of_o asia_n still_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n i_o mean_v in_o god_n account_n or_o be_v they_o not_o but_o all_o damn_a for_o that_o horrible_a heresy_n of_o celebrate_v the_o feast_n of_o easter_n upon_o a_o diverse_a day_n from_o the_o western_a church_n if_o you_o mean_v honest_o and_o fair_o answer_v direct_o to_o this_o question_n and_o then_o you_o shall_v see_v what_o will_v come_v of_o it_o assure_v yourself_o you_o have_v a_o wolf_n by_o the_o ear_n if_o you_o say_v they_o be_v you_o overthrow_v your_o own_o conclusion_n and_o say_v that_o church_n divide_v in_o communion_n may_v both_o be_v member_n of_o the_o catholic_n if_o they_o be_v not_o then_o shall_v we_o have_v saint_n and_o martyr_n in_o heaven_n which_o be_v no_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a roman_a church_n as_o for_o irenaeus_n his_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o russinus_n his_o abscindere_fw-la ab_fw-la unite_v corporis_fw-la they_o imply_v no_o more_o but_o this_o at_o the_o most_o that_o victor_n quantum_fw-la in_fw-la â—e_n â—ut_fw-la do_v cut_v they_o off_o from_o the_o external_n communion_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n suppose_v that_o for_o their_o obstinacy_n in_o their_o tradition_n they_o have_v cut_v themselves_o off_o from_o the_o internal_a communion_n of_o it_o but_o that_o this_o sentence_n of_o victor_n be_v ratify_v in_o heaven_n and_o that_o they_o be_v indeed_o cut_v off_o from_o the_o mystical_a body_n of_o christ_n so_o far_o be_v irenaeus_n from_o think_v that_o he_o and_o in_o a_o manner_n all_o the_o other_o bishop_n reprehend_v victor_n for_o pronounce_v this_o sentence_n on_o they_o upon_o a_o cause_n so_o insufficient_a which_o how_o they_o can_v say_v or_o possible_o think_v of_o a_o sentence_n ratify_v by_o god_n in_o heaven_n and_o not_o reprehend_v god_n himself_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o inform_v i_o and_o if_o they_o do_v not_o intend_v to_o reprehend_v the_o sentence_n of_o god_n himself_o together_o with_o victor_n than_o i_o believe_v it_o will_v follow_v unavoidable_o that_o they_o do_v not_o conceive_v nor_o believe_v victor_n sentence_n to_o be_v ratify_v by_o god_n and_o consequent_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o these_o excommunicate_v church_n be_v not_o in_o god_n account_n true_a member_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ._n ad._n §_o 4._o and_o here_o again_o we_o have_v another_o subterfuge_n by_o a_o verbal_a distinction_n between_o excommunication_n and_o voluntary_a separation_n as_o if_o the_o separation_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n make_v in_o victor_n time_n from_o the_o asian_a church_n be_v not_o a_o voluntary_a separation_n or_o as_o if_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n do_v not_o voluntary_o do_v that_o which_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o their_o separation_n or_o as_o if_o though_o they_o sepated_a not_o themselves_o indeed_o conceive_v the_o cause_n to_o be_v insufficient_a they_o do_v not_o yet_o remain_v voluntary_o separate_v rather_o than_o conform_v themselves_o to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o last_o as_o if_o the_o grecian_n of_o old_a or_o the_o protestant_n of_o late_a may_v not_o pretend_v as_o just_o as_o the_o asian_a church_n that_o their_o separation_n too_o be_v not_o voluntary_o but_o of_o necessity_n for_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n require_v of_o they_o under_o pain_n of_o excommunication_n such_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n as_o be_v neither_o necessary_a nor_o lawful_a to_o be_v perform_v ad_fw-la §_o 5._o and_o here_o again_o the_o matter_n be_v straighten_v by_o another_o limitation_n both_o side_n say_v you_o must_v claim_v to_o be_v the_o church_n but_o what_o then_o if_o one_o of_o they_o only_o claim_v though_o vain_o to_o be_v the_o church_n and_o the_o other_o content_a itself_o with_o be_v a_o part_n of_o it_o these_o than_o it_o seem_v for_o any_o thing_n you_o have_v say_v to_o the_o contrary_a may_v be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o certain_o this_o be_v the_o case_n now_o between_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v be_v between_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n for_o i_o believe_v it_o will_v hardly_o be_v prove_v that_o the_o excommunication_n between_o they_o be_v mutual_a nor_o that_o the_o church_n of_o greece_n esteem_v itself_o the_o whole_a church_n and_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n no_o church_n but_o itself_o a_o sound_a member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o that_o a_o corrupt_a one_o again_o whereas_o you_o say_v the_o father_n speak_v of_o a_o voluntary_a separation_n certain_o they_o speak_v of_o any_o separation_n by_o heretic_n and_o such_o be_v in_o victor_n judgement_n the_o church_n of_o asia_n for_o hold_v a_o opinion_n contrary_a to_o the_o faith_n as_o he_o esteem_v or_o if_o he_o do_v not_o why_o do_v he_o cut_v they_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n but_o the_o true_a difference_n be_v the_o father_n speak_v of_o those_o which_o by_o your_o church_n be_v esteem_v heretic_n and_o be_v so_o whereas_o the_o asian_a church_n be_v by_o victor_n esteem_v heretic_n but_o be_v not_o so_o ad_fw-la §_o 6._o but_o their_o authority_n produce_v show_v no_o more_o than_o what_o i_o have_v show_v that_o the_o church_n be_v but_o one_o in_o 4exclusion_n of_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n and_o not_o that_o two_o particular_a church_n divide_v by_o mistake_n upon_o some_o overvalue_v difference_n may_v not_o be_v both_o part_n of_o the_o catholic_n ad_fw-la §_o 7._o but_o i_o desire_v you_o to_o tell_v i_o whether_o you_o will_v do_v this_o if_o the_o doctrine_n produce_v and_o confirm_v by_o such_o a_o consent_n of_o father_n happen_v to_o be_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n either_o not_o catholic_n or_o absolute_o heretical_a if_o you_o will_v undertake_v this_o you_o shall_v hear_v far_o form_v i_o but_o if_o when_o their_o place_n be_v produce_v you_o will_v pretend_v as_o some_o of_o your_o side_n do_v that_o sure_o they_o be_v corrupt_v have_v neither_o reason_n nor_o show_v of_o reason_n for_o it_o unless_o this_o may_v pass_v for_o one_o as_o perhaps_o it_o may_v where_o reason_n be_v scarce_o that_o they_o be_v against_o your_o doctrine_n or_o if_o you_o will_v say_v they_o be_v to_o be_v interpret_v according_a to_o the_o pleasure_n of_o your_o church_n whether_o their_o word_n will_v bear_v it_o or_o no_o then_o i_o shall_v but_o lose_v my_o labour_n for_o this_o be_v not_o to_o try_v your_o church_n by_o the_o father_n but_o the_o father_n by_o your_o church_n the_o doctrine_n which_o i_o undertake_v to_o justify_v by_o a_o great_a consent_n of_o father_n than_o here_o you_o produce_v for_o instance_n shall_v be_v these_o 1._o that_o god_n election_n suppose_v prescience_n of_o man_n faith_n and_o perseverance_n 2._o that_o god_n do_v not_o predetermine_v man_n to_o all_o their_o action_n 3._o that_o the_o pope_n have_v no_o power_n in_o temporalty_n over_o king_n either_o direct_o or_o indirect_o 4._o that_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n may_v err_v in_o his_o public_a determination_n of_o matter_n of_o faith_n 5._o that_o the_o b._n virgin_n be_v guilty_a of_o original_a sin_n 6._o that_o the_o b._n virgin_n be_v guilty_a of_o actual_a sin_n 7._o that_o the_o communion_n be_v to_o be_v administer_v to_o the_o laity_n in_o both_o kind_n 8._o that_o the_o read_n of_o the_o scripture_n be_v to_o be_v deny_v to_o no_o man_n 9_o that_o the_o opinion_n of_o the_o millenaries_n be_v true_a 10._o that_o the_o eucharist_n be_v to_o be_v administer_v to_o infant_n 11._o that_o the_o substance_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n remain_v in_o the_o eucharist_n of_o her_o consecration_n 12._o that_o the_o soul_n of_o the_o saint_n depart_v enjoy_v not_o the_o vision_n of_o god_n before_o the_o last_o day_n 13._o that_o at_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n all_o the_o saint_n shall_v pass_v through_o a_o purge_a fire_n all_o these_o proposition_n be_v hold_v by_o your_o church_n either_o heretical_a or_o at_o least_o not_o catholical_a and_o yet_o â—n_a this_o promise_n of_o you_o you_o have_v undertake_v to_o believe_v they_o as_o firm_o
as_o you_o now_o do_v this_o that_o two_o diviced_a society_n can_v be_v both_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n ad_fw-la §_o 8._o it_o be_v not_o then_o the_o answerers_n part_n to_o show_v that_o the_o proof_n pretend_v be_v indeed_o no_o proof_n and_o do_v not_o he_o prove_v no_o proof_n at_o least_o in_o your_o mouth_n who_o undertake_v to_o show_v that_o a_o equal_a or_o great_a number_n of_o the_o very_a same_o witness_n be_v reject_v by_o yourselves_o in_o many_o other_o thing_n either_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n in_o any_o age_n or_o age_n be_v infallible_a and_o then_o you_o be_v to_o reject_v it_o in_o nothing_o or_o it_o be_v not_o so_o and_o then_o you_o be_v not_o to_o urge_v it_o in_o any_o thing_n as_o if_o the_o father_n testimony_n against_o we_o be_v sword_n and_o spear_n and_o against_o you_o bulrush_n ad_fw-la §_o 9_o in_o effect_n as_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v if_o you_o answer_v not_o as_o i_o please_v i_o will_v dispute_v no_o long_o but_o you_o remember_v the_o proverb_n will_v think_v of_o it_o occasionem_fw-la quaerit_fw-la qui_fw-la cupit_fw-la discedere_fw-la ad_fw-la §_o 10._o i_o pray_v tell_v i_o be_v not_o therefore_o a_o note_n of_o a_o illation_n or_o a_o conclusion_n and_o be_v not_o your_o last_o therefore_o this_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n be_v to_o be_v rest_v in_o which_o though_o it_o be_v not_o your_o first_o conclusion_n yet_o you_o it_o be_v and_o you_o may_v not_o declaim_v it_o and_o it_o be_v so_o near_o of_o kin_n to_o the_o former_a in_o your_o judgement_n i_o be_o sure_a that_o they_o must_v stand_v or_o fall_v together_o therefore_o he_o that_o speak_v pertinent_o for_o the_o disprove_v of_o the_o one_o can_v speak_v impertinent_o towards_o the_o disprove_v the_o other_o and_o therefore_o you_o can_v so_o shift_v it_o off_o but_o of_o necessity_n you_o must_v answer_v the_o argument_n there_o urge_v or_o confess_v it_o ingenuous_o to_o be_v unanswerable_a or_o if_o you_o will_v not_o answer_v any_o thing_n where_o the_o contradiction_n of_o your_o first_o conclusion_n be_v not_o in_o term_n infer_v then_o take_v it_o thus_o if_o s._n cyprian_n and_o s._n austin_n do_v not_o think_v it_o necessary_a in_o matter_n of_o faith_n to_o rest_v in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o then_o either_o they_o think_v not_o the_o catholic_n church_n judgement_n necessary_a to_o be_v rest_v on_o or_o they_o think_v not_o that_o the_o catholic_n church_n but_o the_o antecedent_n be_v true_a and_o undeniable_o prove_v so_o by_o their_o action_n and_o the_o consequence_n evident_a therefore_o the_o consequent_a must_v be_v true_a in_o one_o or_o other_o part_n but_o you_o will_v not_o say_v the_o former_a be_v true_a it_o remain_v therefore_o the_o latter_a must_v be_v and_o that_o be_v that_o s._n austin_n and_o s._n cyprian_n do_v not_o think_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o adherent_n of_o it_o to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n ad_fw-la §_o 11._o but_o i_o tell_v you_o now_o and_o have_v already_o tell_v you_o that_o in_o our_o discourse_n before_o mr._n skinâ—â—r_n and_o dr._n sheldon_n i_o answer_v your_o major_n as_o than_o you_o frame_v your_o argument_n as_o now_o your_o minor_a thus_o if_o you_o understand_v by_o one_o company_n of_o christian_n one_o in_o external_n communion_n i_o deny_v your_o major_n for_o i_o say_v that_o two_o several_a society_n of_o christian_n which_o do_v not_o external_o communicate_v together_o may_v be_v both_o part_n of_o the_o same_o catholic_n church_n and_o what_o difference_n there_o be_v between_o this_o and_o the_o conclusion_n i_o tell_v you_o you_o shall_v have_v prove_v i_o do_v not_o well_o unstand_a ad_fw-la §_o 12._o and_o be_v it_o possible_a you_o shall_v say_v so_o when_o every_o one_o of_o the_o place_n carry_v this_o sense_n in_o their_o forehead_n and_o 7_o of_o the_o 11_o in_o term_n express_v it_o that_o they_o intend_v only_o to_o exclude_v heretic_n and_o schismatic_n from_o be_v part_n of_o the_o church_n for_o if_o they_o do_v not_o against_o who_o do_v they_o intend_v they_o pagan_n lay_v no_o claim_n to_o the_o church_n therefore_o not_o against_o they_o catholic_n they_o do_v not_o intend_v to_o exclude_v i_o know_v not_o who_o remain_v beside_o but_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n beside_o the_o frequent_a opposition_n in_o they_o between_o one_o church_n on_o the_o one_o side_n and_o heretic_n and_o schismatic_n who_o see_v not_o that_o in_o these_o place_n they_o intend_v to_o exclude_v only_o these_o pretender_n out_o of_o the_o church_n unity_n last_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o the_o place_n say_v that_o the_o church_n can_v be_v divide_v and_o that_o they_o account_v those_o divide_v who_o be_v of_o a_o diverse_a faith_n or_o a_o diverse_a communion_n i_o tell_v you_o that_o i_o have_v read_v they_o over_o and_o over_o and_o unless_o my_o eye_n deceive_v they_o say_v not_o one_o word_n of_o a_o diverse_a communion_n ad_fw-la §_o 13._o whereas_o a_o heretic_n in_o your_o language_n be_v he_o that_o oppose_v pertinacious_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n in_o my_o he_o be_v such_o a_o one_o as_o hold_v a_o error_n against_o faith_n with_o obstinacy_n very_o a_o monstrous_a difference_n between_o these_o definition_n to_o oppose_v and_o hold_v against_o i_o hope_v be_v all_o one_o faith_n and_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n sure_o be_v not_o very_o different_a pertinacious_o and_o with_o obstinacy_n methinks_v may_v pass_v for_o synonimous_a and_o see_v the_o part_n agree_v so_o well_o methinks_v the_o total_a shall_v not_o be_v at_o great_a hostility_n and_o for_o the_o definition_n of_o a_o schismatic_a if_o you_o like_v not_o my_o which_o yet_o i_o give_v you_o out_o of_o a_o father_n i_o pray_v take_v your_o own_o and_o then_o show_v i_o if_o you_o mean_v to_o do_v any_o thing_n that_o wheresoever_o there_o be_v two_o society_n of_o christian_n differ_v in_o external_a communion_n one_o of_o they_o most_o be_v of_o necessity_n either_o heretical_a or_o schismatical_a in_o your_o own_o sense_n of_o these_o word_n to_o the_o contrary_a i_o have_v say_v already_o and_o say_v it_o now_o again_o that_o you_o may_v not_o forget_v it_o the_o roman_a and_o the_o asian_a church_n in_o victor_n time_n the_o roman_a and_o the_o african_a in_o s._n stephen_n time_n differ_v in_o external_a communion_n and_o yet_o neither_o of_o they_o be_v heretical_a for_o they_o do_v not_o oppose_v pertinacious_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o church_n neither_o of_o they_o be_v schismatical_a for_o they_o do_v not_o separate_v never_o make_v mention_n of_o the_o cause_n at_o all_o but_o be_v separate_v by_o the_o roman_a church_n and_o that_o upon_o some_o cause_n though_o it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a ad_fw-la §_o 14._o the_o donatist_n do_v so_o as_o facundus_n hermianensis_fw-la testify_v but_o you_o be_v abuse_v i_o believe_v with_o not_o distinguish_v between_o these_o two_o they_o do_v pretend_v that_o the_o church_n require_v of_o they_o some_o unlawful_a thing_n among_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n and_o they_o do_v pretend_v that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a for_o they_o to_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n this_o i_o confess_v they_o do_v pretend_v but_o it_o be_v in_o regard_n of_o some_o person_n in_o the_o church_n with_o who_o they_o think_v it_o unlawful_a to_o communicate_v but_o the_o former_a they_o do_v not_o pretend_v i_o mean_v while_o they_o continue_v mere_a schismatic_n viz._n that_o there_o be_v any_o error_n in_o the_o church_n or_o impiety_n in_o her_o public_a service_n of_o god_n and_o this_o be_v my_o meaning_n in_o say_v a_o schismatic_a be_v he_o which_o separate_v from_o the_o church_n without_o pretence_n of_o error_n or_o unlawfulness_n in_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n yet_o if_o i_o have_v leave_v out_o the_o term_n unlawfulness_n the_o definition_n have_v be_v better_a and_o not_o obnoxious_a to_o this_o cavillation_n and_o so_o i_o do_v in_o the_o second_o paper_n which_o i_o send_v you_o for_o your_o direction_n which_o if_o you_o have_v deal_v candid_o you_o shall_v have_v take_v notice_n of_o ad_fw-la §_o 15._o i_o have_v reply_v as_o i_o think_v full_o to_o every_o part_n and_o particle_n of_o your_o argument_n neither_o be_v the_o history_n of_o s._n cyprian_n and_o s._n augustine_n opposition_n to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n a_o excursion_n or_o diversion_n but_o a_o clear_a demonstation_n of_o the_o contradictory_n of_o your_o conclusion_n viz._n that_o the_o roman_a church_n etc._n etc._n and_o therefore_o her_o judgement_n not_o to_o be_v rest_v upon_o for_o a_o answer_n hereto_o i_o shall_v be_v very_o importunate_a with_o you_o and_o therefore_o if_o you_o desire_v to_o avoid_v trouble_n i_o pray_v come_v out_o
importune_v god_n for_o the_o send_n of_o the_o messiah_n to_o this_o purpose_n speak_v the_o prophet_n in_o ver_fw-la 1._o for_o zions_n sake_n i_o will_v not_o hold_v my_o peace_n and_o for_o hierusalems_n sake_n i_o well_o not_o rest_v until_o the_o righteousness_n thereof_o go_v forth_o as_o brightness_n and_o the_o gentile_n shall_v see_v thy_o righteousness_n but_o the_o word_n follow_v these_o that_o be_v object_v make_v it_o most_o evident_a which_o be_v you_o that_o make_v mention_n of_o the_o lord_n keep_v not_o silence_n and_o give_v he_o no_o rest_n till_o he_o establish_v and_o till_o he_o make_v jerusalem_n a_o praise_n in_o the_o earth_n the_o 5_o place_n have_v they_o set_v down_o entire_o for_o very_a shame_n they_o can_v not_o have_v urge_v it_o for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n the_o word_n be_v behold_v the_o day_n come_v say_v the_o lord_n that_o i_o will_v make_v a_o new_a covenant_n with_o the_o house_n of_o israel_n and_o with_o the_o house_n of_o judah_n not_o according_a to_o the_o covenant_n which_o i_o make_v with_o their_o father_n but_o this_o shall_v be_v the_o covenant_n that_o i_o will_v make_v with_o the_o house_n of_o israel_n after_o those_o day_n say_v the_o lord_n i_o will_v put_v my_o law_n in_o their_o inward_a part_n and_o write_v it_o in_o their_o heart_n and_o i_o will_v be_v their_o god_n and_o they_o shall_v be_v my_o people_n and_o they_o shall_v teach_v no_o more_o every_o man_n his_o neighbour_n and_o every_o man_n his_o brother_n say_v know_v the_o lord_n for_o they_o shall_v all_o know_v i_o from_o the_o least_o of_o they_o to_o the_o great_a of_o they_o say_v the_o lord_n and_o now_o i_o have_v transcribe_v the_o place_n i_o think_v it_o superfluous_a to_o make_v any_o other_o answer_n the_o same_o answer_n and_o no_o other_o will_v i_o make_v also_o to_o the_o 6_o place_n the_o word_n be_v therefore_o say_v unto_o the_o house_n of_o israel_n thus_o say_v the_o lord_n god_n i_o do_v not_o this_o for_o your_o sake_n o_o house_n of_o israel_n but_o for_o my_o holy_a name_n sake_n ver_fw-la 22._o i_o will_v take_v you_o from_o among_o the_o heathen_a and_o gather_v you_o out_o of_o all_o country_n and_o will_v bring_v you_o into_o your_o own_o land_n v_o 24._o then_o will_v i_o sprinkle_v clean_a water_n upon_o you_o ver_fw-la 25._o a_o new_a heart_n also_o will_v i_o give_v you_o ver_fw-la 26._o and_o i_o will_v put_v my_o spirit_n in_o you_o and_o cause_v you_o to_o walk_v in_o my_o statute_n and_o you_o shall_v keep_v my_o judgement_n and_o do_v they_o ver_fw-la 27._o and_o you_o shall_v dwell_v in_o the_o land_n that_o i_o give_v to_o your_o father_n i_o will_v also_o save_v you_o from_o all_o your_o uncleanness_n and_o i_o will_v call_v for_o the_o corn_n and_o will_v increase_v it_o and_o lay_v no_o famine_n upon_o you_o and_o the_o desolate_a land_n shall_v be_v till_v ver_fw-la 34._o and_o they_o shall_v say_v this_o land_n that_o be_v desolate_a be_v become_v like_o the_o garden_n of_o eden_n the_o seven_o place_n also_o carry_v its_o answer_n in_o its_o forehead_n thus_o say_v the_o lord_n god_n behold_v i_o will_v take_v the_o child_n of_o israel_n from_o among_o the_o heathen_a whether_o they_o be_v go_v and_o i_o will_v make_v they_o one_o nation_n in_o the_o land_n upon_o the_o mountain_n of_o israel_n and_o one_o king_n shall_v be_v king_n to_o they_o all_o etc._n etc._n to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o chapter_n in_o all_o which_o place_n he_o that_o can_v find_v a_o syllable_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n he_o must_v have_v better_a eye_n than_o i_o have_v the_o next_o 8_o place_n will_v be_v very_o pregnant_a for_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n if_o of_o courtesy_n we_o will_v grant_v that_o whatsoever_o be_v promise_v to_o israel_n be_v intend_v to_o they_o as_o you_o may_v see_v in_o the_o place_n at_o large_a from_o ver_fw-la 17._o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o chapter_n the_o 9th_o and_o last_o place_n out_o of_o the_o canticle_n have_v it_o be_v urge_v by_o a_o protestant_n it_o will_v have_v be_v think_v a_o sufficient_a answer_n to_o have_v say_v that_o mystical_a text_n be_v not_o fit_a to_o argue_v upon_o but_o if_o this_o will_v not_o serve_v than_o we_o answer_v 1._o that_o there_o be_v no_o mention_n nor_o intimation_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n 2._o that_o it_o prove_v either_o too_o much_o or_o nothing_o at_o all_o that_o be_v that_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v impeccable_a as_o well_o as_o infallible_a unless_o we_o will_v say_v that_o error_n only_o be_v spot_n and_o impiety_n be_v not_o out_o of_o the_o new_a testament_n they_o allege_v these_o text_n matth._n 16._o 18._o upon_o this_o rock_n i_o will_v build_v my_o church_n and_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n shall_v not_o prevail_v against_o it_o but_o this_o be_v say_v of_o the_o catholic_n not_o of_o the_o roman_a church_n nor_o can_v it_o ever_o be_v prove_v that_o the_o church_n in_o communion_n with_o the_o see_v of_o rome_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n second_o it_o say_v something_o for_o the_o perpetuity_n of_o the_o church_n but_o not_o for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o it_o unless_o you_o will_v take_v for_o grant_v what_o can_v never_o be_v prove_v that_o a_o church_n that_o teach_v any_o erroneous_a doctrine_n be_v a_o church_n no_o long_o which_o be_v all_o one_o as_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v a_o man_n that_o have_v the_o stone_n or_o gout_n or_o any_o other_o disease_n be_v not_o a_o man_n they_o urge_v matth._n 28._o 19_o 20._o and_o i_o be_o with_o you_o all_o day_n even_o unto_o the_o consummation_n of_o the_o world_n and_o here_o also_o if_o we_o will_v grant_v 1._o that_o by_o you_o be_v mean_v you_o and_o only_o you_o of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n 2._o that_o our_o saviour_n have_v here_o oblige_v himself_o to_o assist_v not_o only_o sufficiâ—nter_v but_o also_o irresistibiliter_fw-la not_o only_o to_o preserve_v in_o the_o church_n a_o light_n of_o sufficient_a direction_n as_o he_o provide_v a_o star_n for_o the_o wise_a man_n and_o a_o pillar_n of_o fire_n and_o a_o cloud_n for_o the_o conduct_n of_o the_o israelite_n but_o also_o compel_v or_o at_o least_o necessitate_v they_o to_o follow_v it_o 3._o that_o he_o will_v be_v with_o they_o not_o only_o to_o keep_v they_o from_o all_o damnable_a and_o destructive_a error_n but_o absolute_o form_v all_o erroneous_a doctrine_n if_o these_o thing_n i_o say_v be_v grant_v some_o good_a may_v be_v do_v but_o certain_o these_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d too_o great_a favour_n to_o be_v look_v for_o by_o stranger_n and_o yet_o if_o all_o this_o be_v grant_v we_o shall_v run_v into_o this_o inconvenience_n on_o the_o other_o side_n that_o if_o the_o promise_n be_v absolute_a not_o only_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o rome_n not_o only_o a_o general_a council_n not_o the_o pope_n alone_o but_o every_o bishop_n every_o priest_n every_o one_o who_o be_v send_v by_o christ_n to_o baptise_v and_o preach_v the_o gospel_n may_v claim_v this_o assistance_n by_o virtue_n of_o christ_n word_n and_o consequent_o infallibility_n they_o urge_v matth._n 18._o 17._o if_o he_o will_v not_o hear_v the_o church_n let_v he_o be_v to_o thou_o as_o the_o heathen_a and_o the_o publican_n and_o here_o again_o the_o church_n must_v be_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o we_o be_v as_o far_o to_o seek_v as_o ever_o but_o what_o if_o by_o it_o be_v mean_v which_o be_v most_o evident_a out_o of_o the_o place_n every_o particular_a church_n of_o christian_n whereunto_o any_o one_o christian_a injure_v by_o another_o may_v address_v himself_o for_o remedy_n certain_o whosoever_o read_v the_o place_n without_o prejudice_n i_o be_o confident_a that_o he_o shall_v not_o deny_v but_o that_o the_o sense_n of_o the_o word_n be_v that_o if_o any_o christian_a injure_v another_o and_o be_v first_o admonish_v of_o it_o by_o he_o in_o private_a then_o by_o he_o before_o two_o or_o three_o witness_n last_o by_o the_o church_n he_o live_v in_o and_o yet_o still_o proceed_v on_o obstinate_o in_o do_v injury_n to_o his_o brother_n he_o be_v to_o be_v esteem_v as_o a_o heathen_a or_o a_o publican_n and_o then_o if_o infallibility_n may_v be_v conclude_v what_o a_o multitude_n of_o infallible_a church_n shall_v we_o have_v they_o urge_v matth._n 18._o 20._o where_o two_o or_o three_o be_v gather_v together_o in_o my_o name_n there_o be_o i_o in_o the_o midst_n of_o they_o but_o this_o also_o either_o shoot_v short_a or_o over_o either_o prove_v nothing_o or_o too_o much_o either_o it_o prove_v not_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n or_o it_o prove_v the_o infallibility_n of_o every_o part_n of_o it_o either_o not_o the_o infallibility_n
and_o examine_v whether_o for_o the_o reason_n allege_v they_o may_v not_o do_v so_o 4._o and_o last_o upon_o a_o thorough_a examination_n of_o the_o matter_n i_o do_v now_o affirm_v what_o before_o i_o do_v not_o that_o the_o collyridians_n for_o aught_o appear_v to_o the_o contrary_a may_v just_o and_o true_o have_v say_v for_o the_o justification_n of_o their_o practice_n as_o much_o nay_o the_o very_a same_o thing_n that_o the_o papist_n do_v for_o they_o for_o they_o may_v have_v say_v we_o be_v christian_n and_o believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o believe_v there_o be_v but_o one_o god_n we_o offer_v not_o to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n as_o believe_v she_o be_v god_n but_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n our_o worship_n of_o she_o be_v not_o absolute_a but_o relative_a not_o terminate_v in_o she_o but_o give_v to_o she_o for_o her_o son_n sake_n and_o if_o our_o practice_n may_v be_v allow_v we_o be_v content_a to_o call_v our_o oblation_n not_o a_o sacrifice_n but_o a_o present_a neither_o be_v there_o any_o reason_n why_o it_o shall_v be_v call_v a_o sacrifice_n more_o than_o the_o offer_n and_o burn_v a_o taper_n to_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o same_o virgin_n all_o this_o the_o collyridians_n might_n have_v say_v for_o themselves_o and_o therefore_o i_o believe_v you_o will_v have_v more_o cause_n to_o repent_v you_o for_o daub_v over_o impiety_n with_o untempered_a mortar_n than_o i_o shall_v have_v for_o slander_v the_o roman_a church_n with_o a_o matter_n of_o truth_n 9_o demand_v whether_o therefore_o one_o of_o the_o two_o must_v not_o of_o necessity_n follow_v that_o either_o the_o ancient_a church_n err_v in_o condemn_v the_o opinion_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o collyridians_n as_o heretical_a or_o else_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n err_v in_o approve_v the_o same_o opinion_n and_o the_o same_o practice_n in_o effect_n which_o in_o they_o be_v condemn_v that_o be_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n must_v not_o be_v heretical_a with_o the_o collyridians_n or_o else_o the_o collyridians_n catholic_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n answ._n it_o appear_v by_o the_o former_a answer_n that_o neither_o do_v the_o ancient_a church_n err_v in_o condemn_v the_o opinion_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o collyridians_n as_o heretical_a nor_o do_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n approve_v the_o same_o opinion_n or_o the_o same_o practice_n reply_n the_o substance_n of_o the_o former_a answer_n be_v but_o this_o that_o the_o papist_n offer_v to_o the_o virgin_n mary_n and_o other_o saint_n wax_v taper_n by_o way_n of_o gift_n or_o present_a not_o of_o sacrifice_n and_o to_o she_o not_o as_o to_o a_o god_n but_o as_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n but_o that_o the_o collyridians_n offer_v to_o she_o by_o way_n of_o sacrifice_n as_o to_o a_o sovereign_a power_n and_o deity_n to_o this_o i_o have_v reply_v and_o prove_v that_o it_o no_o way_n appear_v that_o the_o collyridians_n do_v believe_v the_o bless_a virgin_n to_o be_v a_o sovereign_a power_n and_o deity_n or_o that_o she_o be_v not_o subordinate_a to_o god_n then_o that_o their_o offering_n may_v be_v call_v a_o gift_n as_o well_o as_o the_o papist_n and_o the_o papist_n a_o sacrifice_n as_o well_o as_o they_o both_o of_o they_o be_v a_o consumption_n of_o a_o creature_n in_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n and_o neither_o of_o they_o more_o than_o so_o and_o therefore_o either_o the_o collyridians_n must_v stand_v with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n fall_n with_o the_o collyridians_n it_o have_v be_v perhaps_o sufficient_a for_o i_o thus_o to_o have_v vindicate_v my_o assertion_n from_o contrary_a objection_n without_o take_v on_o myself_o the_o burden_n of_o prove_v a_o negative_a yet_o to_o free_v from_o all_o doubt_n the_o conformity_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n with_o the_o collyridians_n in_o this_o point_n i_o think_v it_o will_v be_v necessary_a to_o show_v and_o that_o by_o many_o very_a probable_a argument_n that_o epiphanius_n do_v not_o impute_v to_o they_o the_o pretend_a heresy_n of_o believe_v the_o virgin_n mary_n god_n for_o than_o that_o other_o evasion_n that_o their_o oblation_n be_v a_o sacrifice_n and_o the_o papist_n be_v not_o together_o with_o this_o pretence_n will_v of_o itself_o fall_v to_o the_o ground_n now_o a_o opinion_n may_v be_v impute_v to_o a_o man_n two_o way_n either_o because_o he_o hold_v and_o maintain_v it_o express_o and_o formal_o and_o in_o term_n or_o because_o it_o may_v by_o a_o rational_a deduction_n be_v collect_v from_o some_o other_o opinion_n which_o he_o do_v hold_v in_o this_o latter_a sense_n i_o deny_v not_o but_o epiphanius_n may_v impute_v this_o opinion_n we_o speak_v of_o to_o the_o collyridians_n as_o a_o consequence_n upon_o their_o practice_n which_o practice_n they_o esteem_v lawful_a but_o that_o they_o hold_v it_o and_o own_v it_o formal_o and_o in_o term_n this_o i_o say_v epiphanius_n do_v not_o impute_v to_o they_o which_o i_o think_v for_o these_o seven_o reason_n my_o first_o reason_n be_v because_o he_o can_v not_o just_o do_v so_o and_o therefore_o without_o evident_a proof_n we_o may_v not_o say_v he_o do_v so_o for_o this_o be_v to_o be_v uncharitable_a to_o he_o in_o make_v he_o uncharitable_a to_o other_o now_o i_o say_v he_o can_v not_o just_o charge_v they_o with_o this_o opinion_n because_o he_o be_v not_o inform_v of_o nay_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v but_o only_o of_o their_o practice_n and_o this_o practice_n be_v no_o sufficient_a proof_n that_o they_o hold_v this_o opinion_n that_o his_o information_n reach_v no_o further_a than_o their_o practice_n appear_v out_o of_o his_o own_o word_n i_o have_v hear_v say_v he_o haeres_fw-la 78._o another_o thing_n with_o great_a astonishment_n that_o some_o be_v mad_o affect_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n endeavour_v to_o bring_v she_o in_o in_o god_n place_n be_v mad_a and_o beside_o themselves_o for_o they_o report_v that_o certain_a woman_n in_o arabia_n have_v devise_v this_o vanity_n to_o have_v meeting_n and_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n the_o same_o practice_n he_o set_v down_o haeres_fw-la 79._o but_o that_o he_o be_v inform_v of_o any_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v he_o have_v not_o a_o word_n or_o syllable_n to_o any_o such_o purpose_n and_o yet_o if_o he_o have_v be_v inform_v of_o any_o here_o have_v be_v the_o place_n to_o set_v it_o down_o which_o certain_o write_v his_o book_n rather_o of_o heretical_a opinion_n than_o practice_n he_o will_v not_o have_v omit_v to_o do_v if_o there_o have_v be_v occasion_n his_o silence_n therefore_o be_v a_o sufficient_a argument_n that_o he_o be_v not_o inform_v of_o any_o such_o opinion_n that_o they_o hold_v now_o that_o their_o practice_n be_v no_o assurance_n that_o they_o hold_v this_o opinion_n it_o be_v manifest_a because_o they_o may_v ground_v it_o not_o upon_o this_o opinion_n that_o she_o be_v god_n but_o upon_o another_o as_o false_a though_o not_o altogether_o so_o impious_a that_o the_o worship_n of_o oblation_n be_v not_o proper_a to_o god_n alone_o and_o therefore_o though_o epiphanius_n may_v think_v oâ—_n fear_v that_o possible_o they_o may_v ground_v their_o practice_n upon_o that_o other_o impious_a opinion_n and_o therefore_o out_o of_o abundant_a caution_n confute_v that_o also_o as_o he_o do_v oblique_o and_o in_o a_o word_n and_o once_o only_o in_o all_o his_o long_a discourse_n by_o tell_v they_o that_o our_o saviour_n call_v her_o woman_n yet_o he_o have_v no_o ground_n from_o their_o practice_n to_o assure_v himself_o that_o certain_o they_o do_v hold_v so_o nay_o justice_n and_o reason_n and_o charity_n will_v that_o he_o shall_v incline_v himself_o to_o believe_v that_o they_o ground_v their_o practice_n upon_o that_o other_o opinion_n which_o have_v less_o impiety_n in_o it_o that_o be_v that_o this_o worship_n of_o oblation_n be_v not_o proper_a to_o god_n but_o communicable_a to_o creature_n high_a in_o his_o favour_n my_o second_o be_v because_o if_o epiphanius_n have_v know_v that_o these_o collyridians_n hold_v the_o bless_a virgin_n to_o be_v a_o supreme_a power_n and_o deity_n this_o be_v a_o far_o great_a matâ—er_n than_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o she_o shall_v in_o all_o probability_n rather_o have_v give_v they_o their_o denomination_n at_o least_o when_o he_o set_v down_o what_o their_o heresy_n be_v he_o will_v have_v make_v this_o part_n of_o it_o that_o they_o do_v believe_v so_o but_o to_o the_o contrary_a in_o his_o anacaephaleosis_n p._n 130._o he_o thus_o describe_v they_o they_o that_o offer_v to_o the_o name_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n cake_n who_o be_v call_v collyridians_n and_o again_o p._n 150._o they_o that_o offer_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n cake_n who_o be_v call_v collyridians_n so_o to_o the_o 79th_o heresy_n he_o give_v
lest_o in_o condemn_v the_o collyridians_n he_o may_v seem_v to_o have_v involve_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n in_o the_o same_o condemnation_n my_o seven_o and_o last_o reason_n be_v this_o have_v epiphanius_n know_v that_o the_o collyridians_n hold_v the_o virgin_n mary_n to_o be_v a_o sovereign_a power_n and_o deity_n than_o he_o can_v not_o have_v doubt_v whether_o this_o their_o offering_n be_v to_o she_o or_o to_o god_n for_o she_o whereof_o yet_o he_o seem_v doubtful_a and_o not_o full_o resolve_v as_o his_o own_o word_n intimate_v haeres_fw-la 79._o ad_fw-la fin_n quam_fw-la multa_fw-la etc._n etc._n how_o many_o thing_n may_v be_v object_v against_o this_o heresy_n for_o idle_a woman_n either_o worship_v the_o bless_a virgin_n offer_v unto_o â—â—r_n a_o cake_n or_o else_o they_o take_v upon_o they_o to_o offer_v for_o she_o this_o foresay_a ridiculous_a oblation_n now_o both_o be_v foolish_a and_o from_o the_o devil_n these_o argument_n i_o suppose_v do_v abundant_o demonstrate_v to_o any_o man_n not_o viel_v with_o prejudice_n that_o epiphanius_n impute_v not_o to_o the_o collyridians_n the_o heresy_n of_o believe_v the_o virgin_n mary_n god_n and_o if_o they_o do_v not_o think_v she_o god_n there_o be_v then_o no_o reason_n imaginable_a why_o their_o oblation_n of_o a_o cake_n shall_v not_o be_v think_v a_o present_a as_o well_o as_o the_o papist_n offer_v a_o taper_n or_o that_o the_o papist_n offer_v a_o taper_n shall_v not_o be_v think_v a_o sacrifice_n as_o well_o as_o their_o offering_n a_o cake_n and_o see_v this_o be_v the_o difference_n pretend_v between_o they_o this_o be_v vanish_v there_o remain_v none_o at_o all_o so_o that_o my_o first_o conclusion_n stand_v yet_o firm_a that_o either_o the_o ancient_a church_n err_v in_o condemn_v the_o collyridians_n or_o the_o present_n err_v in_o approve_v and_o practise_v the_o same_o worship_n a_o advertisement_n the_o reader_n when_o he_o meet_v with_o the_o phrase_n catholic_n doctrine_n in_o the_o two_o follow_a discourse_n must_v remember_v that_o it_o do_v not_o signify_v article_n of_o faith_n determine_v in_o any_o general_n council_n which_o may_v be_v look_v upon_o as_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n but_o the_o current_n and_o common_a opinion_n of_o the_o age_n which_o obtain_v in_o it_o without_o any_o know_a opposition_n and_o contradiction_n neither_o need_v this_o be_v wonder_v at_o since_o they_o be_v about_o matter_n far_o remove_v from_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o christian_n and_o have_v no_o necessary_a influence_n upon_o good_a life_n and_o manner_n whatsoever_o necessity_n by_o mistake_n of_o some_o scripture_n may_v be_v put_v upon_o they_o iv._o a_o argument_n draw_v from_o the_o admit_v infant_n to_o the_o eucharist_n as_o without_o which_o they_o can_v not_o be_v save_v against_o the_o church_n infallibility_n the_o condition_n without_o the_o performance_n whereof_o no_o man_n can_v be_v admit_v to_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v this_o that_o he_o believe_v firm_o and_o without_o doubt_v whatsoever_o the_o church_n require_v he_o â—o_o believe_v more_o distinct_o and_o particular_o thus_o he_o must_v believe_v all_o that_o to_o be_v divine_a revelation_n which_o that_o church_n teach_v to_o be_v such_o as_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o trinity_n the_o hypostatical_a union_n of_o two_o nature_n in_o the_o person_n of_o christ._n the_o procession_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n from_o the_o father_n and_o the_o son_n the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n and_o such_o like_a whatsoever_o that_o church_n teach_v to_o be_v necessary_a he_o must_v believe_v to_o be_v necessary_a as_o baptism_n for_o infant_n faith_n in_o christ_n for_o those_o that_o be_v capable_a of_o faith_n penance_n for_o those_o that_o have_v commit_v mortal_a sin_n after_o baptism_n etc._n etc._n whatsoever_o that_o church_n declare_v expedient_a and_o profitable_a he_o must_v believe_v to_o be_v expedient_a and_o profitable_a as_o monastical_a life_n prayer_n to_o saint_n prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a go_v on_o pilgrimage_n the_o use_n of_o pardon_n veneration_n of_o holy_a image_n and_o relic_n latin_n service_n where_o the_o people_n understand_v it_o not_o communicate_v the_o laity_n in_o one_o kind_a and_o such_o like_a whatsoever_o that_o church_n hold_v lawful_a he_o must_v believe_v lawful_a as_o to_o marry_o to_o make_v distinction_n of_o meat_n as_o if_o some_o be_v clean_a and_o other_o unclean_a to_o fly_v in_o time_n of_o persecution_n for_o they_o that_o serve_v at_o the_o altar_n to_o live_v by_o the_o altar_n to_o testify_v a_o truth_n by_o oath_n when_o a_o lawful_a magistrate_n shall_v require_v it_o to_o possess_v riches_n etc._n etc._n now_o be_v it_o impossible_a that_o any_o man_n shall_v certain_o believe_v any_o thing_n unless_o either_o it_o be_v evident_a of_o â—t_a self_n or_o he_o have_v some_o certain_a reason_n at_o least_o some_o supposed_a certain_a reason_n and_o infallible_a ground_n for_o his_o belief_n now_o the_o doctrine_n which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v it_o be_v evident_a and_o undeniable_a that_o they_o be_v not_o evident_a of_o themselves_o neither_o evident_o true_a nor_o evident_o credible_a he_o therefore_o that_o will_v believe_v they_o must_v of_o necessity_n have_v some_o certain_a and_o infallible_a ground_n whereon_o to_o build_v his_o belief_n of_o they_o there_o be_v no_o other_o ground_n for_o a_o man_n belief_n of_o they_o especial_o in_o many_o point_n but_o only_o a_o assurance_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n no_o man_n can_v be_v assure_v that_o that_o church_n be_v infallible_a and_o can_v err_v whereof_o he_o may_v be_v assure_v that_o she_o have_v err_v unless_o she_o have_v some_o new_a promise_n of_o divine_a assistance_n which_o may_v for_o the_o future_a secure_v she_o from_o danger_n of_o err_a but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n pretend_v to_o none_o such_o nothing_o be_v more_o certain_a than_o that_o that_o church_n have_v err_v which_o have_v believe_v and_o teach_v irreconcilable_a contradiction_n one_o whereof_o must_v of_o necessity_n be_v a_o error_n that_o the_o receive_v the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o eucharist_n be_v necessary_a for_o infant_n and_o that_o the_o receive_v thereof_o be_v not_o necessary_a for_o they_o that_o it_o be_v the_o will_n of_o god_n that_o the_o church_n shall_v administer_v the_o sacrament_n to_o they_o and_o that_o it_o be_v not_o the_o will_n of_o god_n that_o the_o church_n shall_v do_v so_o be_v manifest_a and_o irreconcilable_a contradiction_n suppose_v only_o that_o which_o be_v most_o evident_a that_o the_o eucharist_n be_v the_o same_o thing_n of_o the_o same_o virtue_n and_o efficacy_n now_o as_o it_o be_v in_o the_o primitive_a church_n that_o infant_n be_v the_o same_o thing_n they_o be_v have_v as_o much_o need_n be_v capable_a of_o as_o much_o benefit_n by_o the_o eucharist_n now_o as_o then_o as_o subject_a to_o irreverent_a carriage_n then_o as_o now_o and_o last_o that_o the_o present_a church_n be_v as_o much_o bind_v to_o provide_v for_o the_o spiritual_a good_a of_o infant_n as_o the_o ancient_a church_n be_v i_o say_v these_o thing_n suppose_v the_o proposition_n before_o set_v down_o be_v plain_a and_o irreconcilable_a contradiction_n whereof_o the_o present_a roman_a church_n do_v hold_v the_o negative_a and_o the_o ancient_a church_n of_o rome_n do_v hold_v the_o affirmative_a and_o therefore_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o either_o the_o present_a church_n do_v err_v in_o hold_v something_o not_o necessary_a which_o be_v so_o or_o that_o the_o ancient_a church_n do_v err_v in_o hold_v something_o necessary_a which_o be_v not_o so_o for_o the_o negative_a proposition_n viz._n that_o the_o eucharist_n be_v not_o necessary_a for_o infant_n that_o it_o be_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n it_o be_v most_o manifest_a 1._o from_o the_o disuse_n and_o abolition_n and_o prohibition_n of_o the_o contrary_a ancient_a practice_n for_o if_o the_o church_n do_v conceive_v it_o necessary_a for_o they_o either_o simple_o for_o their_o salvation_n or_o else_o for_o their_o increase_n or_o confirmation_n in_o grace_n and_o advancement_n to_o a_o high_a degree_n of_o glory_n unless_o she_o can_v supply_v some_o other_o way_n their_o damage_n in_o this_o thing_n which_o evident_o she_o can_v what_o a_o uncharitable_a sacrilege_n be_v it_o to_o debar_v and_o defraud_v they_o of_o the_o necessary_a mean_n of_o their_o so_o great_a spiritual_a benefit_n especial_o see_v the_o administration_n of_o it_o may_v be_v so_o order_v that_o irreverent_a casualty_n may_v easy_o be_v prevent_v which_o yet_o shall_v they_o fall_v out_o against_o the_o church_n and_o pastor_n intention_n certain_o can_v not_o offend_v god_n and_o in_o reason_n shall_v not_o offend_v man_n or_o if_o the_o church_n do_v believe_v that_o upon_o such_o a_o vain_a fear_n of_o irreverence_n which_o
concern_v the_o millenaâ—ies_n which_o last_v uncontradict_v until_o dionysius_n alexanâ—rinus_n two_o hundred_o and_o fifty_o year_n after_o christ_n and_o if_o they_o tell_v you_o that_o papias_n be_v the_o first_o beginner_n look_v in_o irenâ—us_n and_o he_o will_v tell_v you_o the_o contrary_n loco_fw-la citato_fw-la l._n 5._o c._n 33._o seven_o remember_v that_o if_o i_o ought_v not_o to_o condemn_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n out_o of_o scripture_n because_o my_o interpretation_n may_v deceive_v i_o then_o they_o ought_v not_o to_o build_v their_o infallibility_n upon_o it_o and_o less_o upon_o her_o own_o word_n because_o they_o may_v deceive_v they_o unless_o the_o same_o thing_n may_v be_v a_o wall_n when_o you_o lean_a upon_o it_o and_o a_o bulrush_n when_o we_o do_v eight_o remember_v that_o they_o can_v say_v they_o trust_v not_o their_o interpretation_n in_o this_o but_o a_o consent_n of_o father_n because_o the_o father_n be_v not_o say_v to_o be_v infallible_a but_o as_o they_o tell_v the_o opinion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o their_o time_n which_o be_v infallible_a therefore_o they_o must_v first_o prove_v out_o of_o scripture_n that_o she_o be_v infallible_a or_o else_o she_o who_o be_v herself_o the_o subject_n of_o the_o question_n can_v be_v allow_v till_o then_o to_o give_v a_o verdict_n for_o herself_o nine_o remember_v the_o roman_a church_n claim_n no_o note_n of_o the_o church_n but_o what_o agree_v with_o the_o grecian_a too_o as_o antiquity_n succession_n miracle_n etc._n etc._n but_o only_a communion_n with_o the_o pope_n and_o splendour_n both_o which_o make_v for_o the_o arrian_n in_o liberius_n his_o time_n and_o it_o be_v a_o hard_a case_n that_o because_o the_o greek_n be_v poor_a upon_o earth_n they_o shall_v be_v shut_v out_o of_o heaven_n ten_o remember_v that_o if_o we_o have_v a_o infallible_a way_n we_o have_v no_o use_n at_o lest_o no_o necessity_n of_o a_o infallible_a guide_n for_o if_o we_o may_v be_v save_v by_o follow_v the_o scripture_n as_o near_o as_o we_o can_v though_o we_o err_v it_o be_v as_o good_a as_o any_o interpreter_n to_o keep_v unity_n in_o charity_n which_o be_v only_o needful_a though_o not_o in_o opinion_n and_o this_o can_v be_v ridiculous_a because_o they_o say_v if_o any_o man_n misinterpret_v the_o council_n of_o trent_n it_o shall_v not_o damn_v he_o and_o why_o without_o more_o ado_n may_v not_o the_o same_o be_v say_v of_o scripture_n vii_o a_o argument_n against_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n take_v from_o the_o contradiction_n in_o your_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n chillingworth_n that_o church_n be_v not_o infallible_a which_o teach_v contradiction_n but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v contradiction_n therefore_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v not_o infallible_a mr._n daniel_n i_o deny_v the_o minor_n chill_a that_o church_n teach_v contradiction_n which_o teach_v such_o a_o doctrine_n as_o contain_v contradiction_n but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v such_o a_o doctrine_n therefore_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v contradiction_n mr._n daniel_n i_o deny_v the_o minor_n chill_a the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantion_n contain_v contradiction_n but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n therefore_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n teach_v such_o a_o doctrine_n as_o contain_v contradiction_n mr._n dan._n i_o deny_v the_o major_n chill_a that_o the_o same_o thing_n at_o the_o same_o time_n shall_v have_v the_o true_a figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n and_o shall_v not_o have_v the_o true_a figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n be_v a_o contradiction_n but_o in_o the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n it_o be_v teach_v that_o the_o same_o thing_n viz._n our_o saviour_n present_a in_o the_o sacrament_n have_v the_o true_a figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n and_o have_v not_o the_o true_a figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n at_o the_o same_o time_n therefore_o the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n contain_v contradiction_n mr._n dan._n the_o major_n though_o not_o have_v all_o rule_v require_v to_o a_o contradiction_n as_o boy_n in_o logic_n know_v yet_o let_v it_o pass_v chill_a boy_n in_o logic_n know_v no_o more_o condition_n require_v to_o a_o contradiction_n but_o that_o the_o same_o thing_n shall_v be_v affirm_v and_o deny_v of_o the_o same_o thing_n at_o the_o same_o time_n for_o my_o meaning_n be_v that_o that_o shall_v not_o be_v account_v the_o same_o thing_n which_o be_v consider_v after_o divers_a manner_n mr._n dan._n i_o deny_v the_o minor_a of_o your_o syllogism_n chill_a i_o prove_v it_o according_a to_o the_o several_a part_n of_o it_o and_o first_o for_o the_o first_o part_n he_o must_v have_v the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n in_o the_o eucharist_n who_o be_v there_o without_o any_o real_a alteration_n or_o difference_n from_o the_o natural_a body_n of_o a_o man_n but_o our_o saviour_n according_a to_o the_o romish_a doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n without_o any_o real_a alteration_n or_o difference_n from_o the_o natural_a body_n of_o a_o man_n therefore_o according_a to_o this_o doctrine_n he_o must_v there_o have_v the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n to_o the_o second_o part_n that_o he_o must_v not_o have_v the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n in_o the_o sacrament_n according_a to_o this_o doctrine_n thus_o i_o prove_v it_o he_o must_v not_o have_v the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n in_o the_o eucharist_n which_o must_v not_o have_v extension_n there_o but_o our_o saviour_n â—ody_n according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o transubstantiation_n must_v not_o have_v extension_n there_o therefore_o according_a to_o this_o doctrine_n he_o must_v not_o have_v the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n there_o the_o major_n of_o this_o syllogism_n i_o prove_v because_o the_o figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n can_v not_o be_v without_o extension_n the_o minor_a i_o prove_v thus_o that_o must_v not_o have_v extension_n in_o the_o eucharist_n who_o every_o part_n be_v together_o in_o one_o and_o the_o same_o point_n but_o according_a to_o this_o doctrine_n every_o part_n of_o our_o saviour_n body_n must_v be_v here_o in_o one_o and_o the_o same_o point_n therefore_o here_o it_o must_v not_o have_v extension_n mr._n dan._n answer_v by_o distinguish_v the_o major_a of_o the_o first_o syllogism_n and_o say_v that_o he_o must_v not_o have_v the_o true_a figure_n of_o a_o man_n body_n according_a to_o the_o reason_n of_o a_o figure_n take_v in_o its_o essential_a consideration_n which_o be_v to_o have_v positionem_fw-la partium_fw-la sic_fw-la &_o sic_fw-la extra_fw-la part_n but_o not_o the_o accidental_a consideration_n which_o be_v in_o ordine_fw-la ad_fw-la locum_fw-la and_o this_o answer_n he_o apply_v for_o the_o solution_n of_o the_o minor_a say_v thus_o our_o saviour_n be_v there_o without_o any_o real_a alteration_n intrinsical_v but_o not_o extrinsical_a for_o ho_o be_v not_o change_v in_o order_n to_o himself_o but_o in_o order_n to_o place_n or_o otherwise_o he_o be_v not_o alter_v in_o his_o continual_a existence_n which_o be_v only_o modus_fw-la essentiae_fw-la and_o inseparable_a even_o by_o divine_a power_n though_o alter_v in_o modo_fw-la existendi_fw-la which_o be_v situation_n and_o require_v to_o figure_v take_v in_o order_n to_o place_n chill_n against_o this_o it_o be_v reply_v by_o chillingworth_n that_o the_o distinction_n of_o a_o man_n body_n as_o consider_v in_o itself_o and_o as_o consider_v in_o reference_n to_o place_n be_v vain_a and_o no_o solution_n of_o the_o argument_n and_o thus_o he_o prove_v it_o if_o it_o be_v impossible_a that_o any_o thing_n shall_v have_v several_a part_n one_o out_o of_o another_o in_o order_n and_o reference_n of_o each_o to_o other_o without_o have_v these_o part_n in_o several_a place_n then_o the_o distinction_n be_v vain_a but_o it_o be_v impossible_a that_o any_o thing_n shall_v have_v several_a 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life_n unto_o it_o such_o as_o follow_v s._n paul_n direction_n do_v first_o try_v all_o thing_n deliberate_o and_o then_o choose_v what_o in_o their_o conscience_n they_o think_v be_v best_a or_o they_o be_v such_o as_o for_o want_v of_o the_o love_n of_o the_o truth_n god_n suffer_v to_o fall_v into_o strong_a delusion_n to_o fall_v to_o a_o false_a religion_n because_o they_o bring_v not_o forth_o the_o fruit_n of_o the_o true_a to_o make_v shipwreck_n of_o their_o faith_n because_o they_o have_v cast_v away_o a_o good_a conscience_n to_o have_v their_o eye_n blind_v and_o their_o light_n take_v away_o because_o they_o make_v not_o the_o right_a use_n of_o it_o but_o be_v idle_a and_o unprofitable_a and_o set_v their_o heart_n upon_o vanity_n and_o have_v only_o a_o form_n of_o religion_n but_o deny_v the_o effect_n of_o it_o in_o their_o life_n and_o conversation_n in_o a_o word_n such_o as_o be_v betray_v to_o their_o error_n and_o keep_v for_o ever_o in_o it_o either_o by_o 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i_o answer_v that_o whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o guide_n of_o all_o man_n be_v the_o question_n and_o therefore_o not_o to_o be_v beg_v but_o prove_v that_o the_o man_n we_o speak_v of_o be_v very_o willing_a to_o follow_v this_o guide_n can_v he_o find_v any_o good_a ground_n to_o believe_v it_o be_v his_o guide_n and_o therefore_o the_o reason_n he_o follow_v she_o not_o be_v not_o pride_n but_o ignorance_n that_o as_o it_o be_v humility_n to_o obey_v those_o who_o god_n have_v set_v over_o we_o so_o it_o be_v credulity_n to_o follow_v every_o one_o that_o will_v take_v upon_o he_o to_o lead_v we_o that_o if_o the_o blind_a lead_v the_o blind_a not_o only_o the_o leader_n but_o the_o follower_n shall_v perish_v last_o that_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n pretend_v very_o little_a and_o indeed_o nothing_o of_o moment_n to_o get_v the_o office_n of_o be_v head_n and_o guide_n of_o the_o church_n which_o antichrist_n when_o he_o come_v may_v not_o and_o will_v not_o make_v use_n of_o for_o the_o very_a same_o end_n and_o purpose_n and_o therefore_o he_o have_v reason_n not_o to_o be_v too_o sudden_a and_o precipitate_a in_o commit_v himself_o to_o the_o conduct_n of_o the_o pope_n for_o fear_v of_o mistake_v antichrist_n for_o the_o vicar_n of_o christ._n obj._n but_o in_o all_o commonwealth_n it_o be_v necessary_a there_o shall_v be_v not_o only_o a_o law_n for_o man_n to_o live_v by_o but_o also_o a_o live_n and_o speak_v judge_n to_o decide_v their_o difference_n arise_v about_o the_o various_a interpretation_n of_o the_o law_n and_o otherwise_o controversy_n will_v be_v endless_a therefore_o if_o such_o a_o judge_n be_v so_o necessary_a in_o civil_a affair_n for_o the_o procure_n and_o preserve_v our_o temporal_a peace_n and_o happiness_n how_o much_o more_o necessary_a be_v he_o for_o the_o decide_n of_o those_o controversy_n that_o concern_v the_o save_n and_o damn_v of_o our_o soul_n for_o ever_o ans._n hereunto_o i_o answer_v 1._o that_o if_o it_o be_v as_o evident_a and_o certain_a that_o god_n have_v appoint_v the_o pope_n or_o church_n of_o rome_n to_o be_v the_o guide_n of_o faith_n and_o judge_n of_o controversy_n as_o that_o the_o king_n have_v appoint_v such_o a_o one_o to_o be_v lord_n chief_a justice_n the_o have_v of_o such_o a_o guide_n will_v be_v very_o available_a for_o to_o preserve_v the_o church_n in_o unity_n and_o to_o conduct_v man_n soul_n to_o heaven_n but_o a_o judge_n that_o have_v no_o better_a title_n or_o evidence_n to_o his_o place_n than_o the_o pope_n have_v to_o that_o which_o he_o pretend_v to_o a_o judge_n that_o be_v doubtful_a and_o just_o questionable_a whether_o he_o be_v the_o judge_n or_o no_o be_v in_o all_o probability_n likely_a to_o produce_v clean_o contrary_a effect_n and_o to_o be_v himself_o one_o of_o the_o apple_n of_o strife_n one_o of_o the_o great_a subject_n of_o controversy_n and_o occasion_n of_o dissension_n and_o to_o avoid_v this_o great_a inconvenience_n if_o god_n have_v intend_v the_o pope_n or_o church_n of_o rome_n for_o this_o great_a office_n certain_o he_o will_v have_v say_v so_o very_o plain_o and_o very_o frequent_o if_o not_o frequent_o certain_o sometime_o once_o at_o least_o he_o will_v have_v say_v so_o in_o express_a term_n but_o he_o do_v not_o say_v so_o no_o not_o so_o much_o as_o once_o nor_o any_o thing_n from_o whence_o it_o may_v be_v collect_v with_o any_o sure_a or_o firm_a consequence_n therefore_o if_o it_o be_v not_o certain_a certain_o it_o be_v very_o probabâ—le_a he_o never_o mean_v so_o again_o in_o civil_a controversy_n the_o case_n can_v hardly_o be_v so_o put_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v any_o necessity_n that_o the_o same_o man_n shall_v be_v judge_n and_o party_n but_o in_o matter_n of_o religion_n wherein_o all_o have_v equal_a interest_n every_o man_n be_v a_o party_n and_o engage_v to_o judge_v for_o temporal_a respect_n this_o way_n or_o that_o way_n and_o therefore_o not_o fit_a to_o be_v a_o judge_n but_o what_o then_o if_o he_o which_o be_v with_o so_o much_o clamour_n and_o so_o little_a reason_n vouch_v for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n do_v tell_v you_o plain_o there_o be_v no_o live_a judge_n on_o earth_n appoint_v by_o god_n to_o decide_v the_o controversy_n arise_v among_o christian_n nor_o no_o way_n to_o determine_v they_o but_o scripture_n his_o word_n be_v express_v and_o formal_a and_o need_v no_o other_o commentary_n but_o a_o true_a interpretation_n optatus_n melevit_fw-la lib._n 5._o ad_fw-la princip_n vos_fw-fr dicitis_fw-la licet_fw-la nos_fw-la non_fw-la licet_fw-la inter_fw-la vestrum_fw-la licet_fw-la &_o nostrum_fw-la non_fw-la licet_fw-la nutant_fw-la &_o remigant_fw-la animae_fw-la populorum_fw-la nemo_fw-la vobis_fw-la credat_fw-la nemo_fw-la nobis_fw-la omnes_fw-la contentiosi_fw-la homines_fw-la sumus_fw-la quaerendi_fw-la sunt_fw-la judices_fw-la si_fw-la christiani_n de_fw-fr utrâque_fw-la parte_fw-la dari_fw-la non_fw-la possunt_fw-la de_fw-la foris_fw-la quaerendus_fw-la est_fw-la judex_fw-la si_fw-mi paganus_fw-la non_fw-la potest_fw-la nosse_fw-la christiana_n secreta_fw-la si_fw-la judaeus_n inimicus_fw-la est_fw-la christiani_n baptismatis_fw-la ergo_fw-la in_o terris_fw-la de_fw-la hac_fw-la re_fw-la nullum_fw-la poterit_fw-la reperiri_fw-la judicium_fw-la de_fw-la coelo_fw-la quaerendus_fw-la est_fw-la judex_fw-la sed_fw-la ut_fw-la quid_fw-la pulsamus_fw-la coelum_fw-la cum_fw-la habeamus_fw-la hic_fw-la in_o evangelio_n testaomentum_fw-la quia_fw-la hoc_fw-la loco_fw-la rectè_fw-la possunt_fw-la terrenae_fw-la coelestibus_fw-la comparari_fw-la tale_n est_fw-fr quod_fw-la quivis_fw-la botninum_fw-la habens_fw-la numeroso_n filios_fw-la his_fw-la quamdiu_fw-la presen_v est_fw-la ipse_fw-la imperat_fw-la singulis_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la adbuc_fw-la necessarium_fw-la testamentum_fw-la sic_fw-la &_o christus_fw-la quamdiu_fw-la praesens_fw-la in_o terris_fw-la fuit_fw-la quanivis_fw-la nec_fw-la modo_fw-la desit_fw-la pro_fw-la tempore_fw-la quicquid_fw-la necessarium_fw-la erat_fw-la apostolis_n imperavit_fw-la sed_fw-la quomodo_fw-la terrenus_fw-la pater_fw-la cum_fw-la se_fw-la in_o confinio_fw-la senserit_fw-la mortis_fw-la timens_fw-la ne_fw-la post_fw-la mortem_fw-la svam_fw-la ruptâ—_n pace_fw-la litigent_fw-la fratres_fw-la adhibitis_fw-la testibus_fw-la voluntatem_fw-la svam_fw-la de_fw-la pectore_fw-la morituro_fw-la transfert_fw-la in_o tabulas_fw-la diù_fw-fr duraturas_fw-la &_o si_fw-la fuerit_fw-la inter_fw-la fratres_fw-la contentio_fw-la nata_fw-la non_fw-la itur_fw-la ad_fw-la tumulum_fw-la sed_fw-la quaeritur_fw-la testamentum_fw-la &_o qui_fw-la in_o tumulo_fw-la quiescit_fw-la tacitis_fw-la de_fw-la tabulis_fw-la loquor_fw-la vivus_fw-la be_v cujus_fw-la est_fw-la testamentum_fw-la in_fw-la coelo_fw-la est_fw-la ergo_fw-la voluntas_fw-la ejus_fw-la velut_fw-la in_o testamento_fw-la sic_fw-la in_o evangelio_n inquiratur_fw-la that_o be_v you_o say_v such_o a_o thing_n be_v lawful_a we_o say_v it_o be_v unlawful_a the_o mind_n of_o the_o people_n be_v doubtful_a and_o waver_a between_o your_o lawful_a and_o our_o unlawful_a let_v no_o man_n believe_v either_o you_o or_o we_o we_o be_v
of_o general_n council_n or_o the_o infallibility_n of_o particular_a council_n for_o there_o two_o or_o three_o at_o least_o be_v assemble_v in_o christ_n name_n but_o then_o beside_o these_o two_o or_o three_o for_o aught_o i_o can_v see_v or_o gather_v from_o the_o text_n they_o may_v as_o well_o be_v of_o any_o other_o church_n as_o the_o roman_a they_o urge_v luke_n 10._o 16._o he_o that_o hear_v you_o hear_v i_o and_o he_o that_o despise_v you_o despise_v i_o but_o this_o will_v not_o do_v you_o any_o service_n unless_o of_o favour_n we_o grant_v that_o you_o here_o be_v you_o of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o but_o very_o little_a if_o that_o be_v grant_v for_o then_o every_o bishop_n every_o priest_n must_v be_v infallible_a for_o there_o be_v not_o the_o mean_a of_o the_o messenger_n of_o christ_n buâ—_n this_o may_v be_v verify_v of_o he_o that_o he_o that_o hear_v he_o hear_v christ_n and_o he_o that_o despise_v he_o despise_v christ._n they_o urge_v out_o of_o john_n 14._o ver_n 15_o 16._o i_o will_v ask_v my_o father_n and_o he_o will_v give_v you_o another_o paraclete_n that_o he_o may_v abide_v with_o you_o for_o ever_o eâ—en_o the_o spirit_n of_o truth_n but_o here_o also_o what_o warrant_v have_v we_o by_o you_o to_o understand_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n whereas_o he_o that_o compare_v v_o 26._o with_o this_o shall_v easy_o perceive_v that_o our_o saviour_n speak_v only_o of_o the_o apostle_n in_o their_o own_o person_n for_o there_o he_o say_v go_v on_o in_o the_o same_o discourse_n the_o holy_a ghost_n who_o the_o father_n will_v send_v in_o my_o name_n he_o shall_v teach_v you_o all_o thing_n and_o bring_v all_o thing_n to_o your_o remembrance_n whatsoever_o i_o have_v say_v to_o you_o which_o can_v agree_v but_o to_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o in_o person_n and_o not_o to_o their_o successor_n who_o have_v not_o yet_o be_v teach_v and_o therefore_o not_o forget_v any_o thing_n and_o therefore_o can_v not_o have_v they_o bring_v to_o their_o remembrance_n but_o what_o if_o it_o have_v be_v promise_v to_o they_o and_o their_o successor_n have_v they_o no_o successor_n but_o they_o of_o the_o roman_a church_n this_o indeed_o be_v pretend_v and_o cry_v up_o but_o for_o proof_n of_o it_o desiderantur_fw-la again_o i_o will_v fain_o know_v whether_o there_o be_v any_o certainty_n that_o every_o pope_n be_v a_o good_a christian_a or_o whether_o he_o may_v not_o be_v in_o the_o sense_n of_o the_o scripture_n of_o the_o world_n if_o not_o how_o be_v it_o that_o bellarmine_n shall_v have_v cause_n to_o think_v that_o such_o a_o rank_n of_o they_o go_v successive_o to_o the_o devil_n iii_o a_o conference_n concern_v the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n prove_v that_o the_o present_a church_n of_o rome_n either_o err_v in_o she_o worship_v the_o bless_a virgin_n mary_n or_o that_o the_o ancient_a church_n do_v err_v in_o condemn_v the_o collyridians_n as_o heretic_n 1._o demand_v whether_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v not_o the_o foundation_n of_o their_o faith_n which_o be_v member_n of_o that_o church_n answ._n the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o foundation_n but_o a_o part_n of_o their_o faith_n who_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v hold_v to_o be_v the_o church_n by_o all_o those_o who_o be_v member_n of_o it_o reply_n that_o which_o be_v the_o last_o reason_n why_o you_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n and_o unwritten_a tradition_n his_o unwritten_a word_n and_o this_o or_o that_o to_o be_v the_o true_a sense_n of_o scripture_n that_o be_v to_o you_o the_o foundation_n of_o your_o faith_n and_o such_o unto_o you_o be_v the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n therefore_o unto_o you_o it_o be_v not_o only_o a_o part_n of_o your_o faith_n but_o also_o such_o a_o part_n as_o be_v the_o foundation_n of_o all_o other_o part_n therefore_o you_o be_v deceive_v if_o you_o think_v there_o be_v any_o more_o opposition_n between_o be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o faith_n and_o the_o foundation_n of_o other_o part_n of_o it_o than_o there_o be_v between_o be_v a_o part_n of_o a_o house_n and_o the_o foundation_n of_o it_o but_o whether_o you_o will_v have_v it_o the_o foundation_n of_o your_o faith_n or_o only_o a_o part_n of_o it_o for_o the_o present_a purpose_n it_o be_v all_o one_o 2._o demand_v whether_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v not_o absolute_o overthrow_v by_o prove_v the_o present_a roman_a church_n be_v in_o error_n or_o that_o the_o ancient_n be_v answ._n it_o be_v if_o the_o error_n be_v in_o those_o thing_n wherein_o she_o be_v affirm_v to_o be_v infallible_a viz._n in_o point_n of_o fâ—ith_n reply_n and_o this_o here_o speak_v of_o whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o offer_v taper_n and_o incense_n to_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n be_v i_o hope_v a_o question_n concern_v a_o point_n of_o faith_n 3._o demand_v whether_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o the_o virgin_n mary_n be_v not_o as_o lawful_a as_o to_o offer_v incense_n and_o taper_n and_o divers_a other_o oblation_n to_o the_o same_o virgin_n answ._n it_o be_v as_o lawful_a to_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o her_o honour_n as_o wax-taper_n but_o neither_o the_o one_o nor_o the_o other_o may_v be_v offer_v to_o she_o or_o her_o honour_n as_o the_o term_n or_o object_n of_o the_o action_n for_o to_o speak_v proper_o nothing_o be_v offer_v to_o she_o or_o to_o her_o honour_n but_o to_o god_n in_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n for_o incense_n it_o be_v a_o foul_a slander_n that_o it_o be_v offer_v any_o way_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n for_o that_o incense_a which_o be_v use_v in_o the_o time_n of_o mass_n be_v ever_o understand_v by_o all_o sort_n of_o people_n to_o be_v direct_v to_o god_n only_o reply_n if_o any_o thing_n he_o offer_v to_o she_o she_o be_v the_o object_n of_o that_o oblation_n as_o if_o i_o see_v water_n and_o through_o water_n something_o else_o the_o water_n be_v the_o object_n of_o my_o sight_n though_o not_o the_o last_o object_n if_o i_o honour_v the_o king_n deputy_n and_o by_o he_o the_o king_n the_o deputy_n be_v the_o object_n of_o my_o action_n though_o not_o the_o final_a object_n and_o to_o say_v these_o thing_n may_v be_v offer_v to_o she_o but_o not_o as_o to_o the_o object_n of_o the_o action_n be_v to_o say_v they_o may_v be_v offer_v to_o she_o but_o not_o to_o she_o for_o what_o else_o be_v mean_v by_o the_o object_n of_o a_o action_n but_o that_o thing_n on_o which_o the_o action_n be_v employ_v and_o to_o which_o it_o be_v direct_v if_o you_o say_v that_o by_o the_o object_n of_o the_o action_n you_o mean_v the_o final_a object_n only_o wherewith_o the_o action_n be_v terminate_v you_o shall_v then_o have_v speak_v more_o proper_o and_o distinct_o and_o not_o have_v deny_v she_o simple_o to_o be_v the_o object_n of_o this_o action_n when_o you_o mean_v only_o she_o be_v not_o such_o a_o kind_n of_o object_n no_o more_o than_o you_o may_v deny_v a_o man_n to_o be_v a_o live_a creature_n mean_v only_o that_o he_o be_v not_o a_o horse_n second_o i_o say_v it_o be_v not_o require_v of_o roman_a catholic_n when_o they_o offer_v taper_n to_o the_o saint_n that_o by_o a_o actual_a intention_n they_o direct_v their_o action_n actual_o to_o god_n but_o it_o be_v hold_v sufficient_a that_o they_o know_v and_o believe_v that_o the_o saint_n be_v in_o subordination_n and_o near_a relation_n to_o god_n and_o that_o they_o give_v this_o honour_n to_o the_o saint_n because_o of_o this_o relation_n and_o to_o god_n himself_o rather_o habitual_o and_o interpretative_a than_o actual_o express_o and_o formal_o as_o many_o man_n honour_v the_o king_n deputy_n without_o have_v any_o present_a thought_n of_o the_o king_n and_o yet_o their_o action_n may_v be_v interpret_v a_o honour_n to_o the_o king_n be_v give_v to_o his_o deputy_n only_o because_o he_o be_v his_o deputy_n and_o for_o his_o relation_n to_o the_o king_n three_o i_o say_v there_o be_v no_o reason_n or_o ground_n in_o the_o world_n for_o any_o man_n to_o think_v that_o the_o collyridians_n do_v not_o choose_v the_o virgin_n mary_n for_o the_o object_n of_o their_o worship_n rather_o than_o any_o other_o woman_n or_o any_o other_o creature_n mere_o for_o her_o relation_n to_o christ_n and_o by_o consequence_n there_o be_v no_o ground_n to_o imagine_v but_o that_o at_o least_o habitual_o and_o interpretative_a they_o direct_v their_o action_n unto_o christ_n if_o not_o actual_o and_o formal_o and_o ergo_fw-la if_o that_o be_v a_o sufficient_a defence_n for_o the_o papist_n that_o they_o make_v not_o
the_o bless_a virgin_n the_o final_a object_n of_o their_o worship_n but_o worship_v she_o not_o for_o her_o own_o sake_n but_o for_o her_o relation_n unto_o christ_n epiphanius_n sure_o do_v ill_a to_o charge_v the_o collyridians_n with_o heresy_n have_v nothing_o to_o impute_v to_o they_o but_o only_o that_o he_o be_v inform_v that_o they_o offer_v a_o cake_n to_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n which_o honour_n yet_o they_o may_v and_o without_o question_n do_v give_v unto_o she_o for_o her_o relation_n unto_o christ_n and_o so_o make_v she_o not_o the_o last_o object_n and_o term_v of_o their_o worship_n and_o from_o hence_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o he_o conceive_v the_o very_a action_n itself_o substantial_o and_o intrinsical_o malicious_a i._n e._n he_o believe_v it_o a_o sin_n that_o they_o offer_v to_o she_o at_o all_o and_o so_o by_o their_o action_n put_v she_o in_o the_o place_n of_o god_n by_o give_v unto_o her_o this_o worship_n proper_a to_o god_n and_o not_o that_o they_o terminate_v their_o action_n final_o in_o she_o or_o do_v iâ—_n very_a deed_n think_v she_o to_o be_v a_o god_n and_o not_o a_o creature_n but_o to_o speak_v proper_o you_o say_v nothing_o be_v offer_v to_o she_o or_o to_o her_o honour_n but_o to_o god_n in_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n belike_o than_o if_o through_o henly_n i_o go_v from_o hence_o to_o london_n i_o may_v not_o be_v say_v proper_o to_o go_v to_o henly_n but_o only_o to_o london_n or_o if_o through_o water_n i_o see_v the_o sand_n i_o may_v not_o be_v proper_o say_v to_o see_v the_o water_n but_o only_o the_o saâ—d_n away_o with_o such_o shift_a sophistry_n either_o leave_v your_o practice_n of_o offer_v to_o saint_n if_o it_o be_v naught_o or_o colour_v it_o not_o over_o with_o such_o empty_a distinction_n if_o it_o be_v good_a christ_n say_v to_o his_o apostle_n in_o regard_n of_o their_o relation_n to_o he_o he_o that_o hear_v you_o hear_v i_o and_o he_o that_o despise_v you_o despise_v â—â—e_z and_o yet_o who_o doubt_n but_o they_o that_o hear_v the_o apostle_n do_v proper_o hear_v they_o and_o they_o that_o despise_v they_o do_v proper_o despise_v they_o though_o their_o action_n stay_v not_o in_o they_o but_o reach_v up_o to_o heaven_n and_o to_o christ_n himself_o you_o pray_v to_o saint_n and_o angel_n though_o you_o do_v not_o terminate_v your_o prayer_n in_o they_o and_o yet_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o your_o prayer_n to_o saint_n may_v be_v as_o proper_o call_v prayer_n as_o those_o you_o make_v to_o god_n himself_o for_o though_o these_o be_v of_o a_o more_o excellent_a nature_n than_o they_o yet_o do_v they_o agree_v in_o the_o general_a nature_n that_o they_o be_v both_o prayer_n as_o though_o a_o man_n be_v a_o more_o excellent_a live_a creature_n than_o a_o hoâ—se_n yet_o he_o agree_v with_o he_o in_o this_o that_o both_o be_v live_v creature_n but_o if_o nothing_o be_v proper_o offer_v to_o she_o or_o to_o her_o honour_n why_o do_v you_o in_o your_o six_o answer_n say_v you_o may_v offer_v any_o thing_n to_o the_o virgin_n mary_n by_o way_n of_o present_n and_o gift_n by_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n certain_o he_o that_o offer_v by_o way_n of_o gift_n or_o present_a offers_z as_o proper_o as_o he_o that_o offer_v â—y_a way_n of_o sacrifice_n as_o a_o horse_n be_v as_o proper_o a_o live_a creature_n as_o a_o man._n but_o if_o it_o be_v so_o as_o â—ou_fw-mi say_v which_o be_v most_o false_a that_o you_o do_v not_o proper_o offer_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n but_o to_o god_n in_o honour_n of_o she_o yet_o in_o my_o judgement_n this_o will_v not_o qualify_v or_o mend_v the_o matter_n but_o make_v it_o worse_o for_o first_o who_o teach_v you_o that_o in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o gospel_n after_o the_o accomplishment_n of_o the_o prediction_n sacrifice_n and_o offering_n thou_o will_v not_o but_o a_o body_n have_v thou_o prepare_v i_o after_o this_o interpretation_n of_o it_o in_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o hebrew_n he_o take_v away_o the_o first_o that_o he_o may_v establish_v the_o second_o that_o it_o be_v still_o lawful_a to_o offer_v taper_n or_o incense_n to_o god_n second_o in_o my_o understanding_n to_o offer_v to_o god_n in_o honour_n of_o the_o virgin_n be_v more_o derogatory_n from_o god_n honour_n than_o to_o offer_v to_o she_o in_o the_o honour_n of_o god_n for_o this_o be_v in_o my_o apprehension_n to_o subordinate_a god_n to_o she_o to_o make_v she_o the_o terminate_n and_o final_a object_n of_o the_o action_n to_o make_v god_n the_o way_n and_o her_o the_o end_n and_o by_o and_o through_o god_n to_o convey_v the_o worship_n unto_o she_o but_o for_o incense_v you_o say_v it_o be_v a_o soul_n slander_n that_o it_o be_v offer_v any_o way_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v that_o your_o impute_a slander_n to_o i_o be_v itself_o a_o slander_n forâ—_n in_o your_o 5_o answer_n you_o have_v give_v a_o clear_a intimation_n that_o you_o have_v never_o be_v out_o of_o england_n so_o that_o you_o can_v certain_o know_v what_o be_v the_o practice_n of_o your_o church_n in_o this_o point_n beyond_o sea_n and_o he_o that_o live_v among_o you_o and_o have_v but_o half_a a_o eye_n open_a and_o free_a from_o prejudice_n can_v but_o see_v that_o the_o roman_a religion_n be_v much_o more_o exorbitant_a in_o the_o general_a practice_n of_o it_o than_o it_o be_v in_o the_o doctrine_n publish_v in_o book_n of_o controversy_n where_o it_o be_v deliver_v with_o much_o caution_n and_o moderation_n nay_o cunning_a and_o dissimulation_n that_o it_o may_v be_v the_o fit_a to_o win_v and_o engage_v proselyte_n who_o be_v once_o ensnare_v though_o they_o be_v afterward_o startle_v with_o strange_a and_o unlookt-for_a practice_n yet_o a_o hundred_o to_o one_o but_o they_o will_v rather_o stifle_v their_o conscience_n and_o dash_v all_o scruple_n against_o the_o pretend_a rock_n of_o their_o churchâ—s_n infallibility_n and_o blind_o follow_v those_o guide_n to_o who_o conduct_n they_o have_v unadvised_o commit_v themselves_o than_o come_v off_o again_o with_o the_o shame_n of_o be_v repute_v weak_a and_o inconstant_a so_o terrible_a a_o idol_n be_v this_o vain_a nothing_o the_o opinion_n and_o censure_n of_o foolish_a man_n but_o to_o return_v again_o to_o you_o i_o say_v your_o ignorance_n of_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n beyond_o the_o sea_n do_v plain_o convince_v that_o you_o have_v rash_o and_o therefore_o slanderous_o charge_v i_o with_o the_o crime_n of_o slander_n as_o for_o your_o reason_n you_o add_v consider_v it_o again_o and_o you_o will_v see_v it_o be_v worth_a nothing_o for_o what_o if_o incense_a in_o time_n of_o mass_n be_v understand_v by_o all_o sort_n of_o people_n to_o be_v direct_v to_o god_n alone_o which_o yet_o you_o can_v possible_o know_v yet_o this_o i_o hope_n hinder_v not_o but_o that_o in_o procession_n you_o may_v incense_v the_o image_n of_o the_o saint_n and_o consequent_o according_a to_o your_o doctrine_n do_v this_o honour_n to_o the_o saint_n themselves_o represent_v by_o the_o image_n i_o myself_o unless_o i_o be_o very_o much_o mistake_v be_v present_a when_o this_o very_a thing_n be_v do_v to_o the_o picture_n of_o saint_n benet_n or_o saint_n gregory_n in_o the_o cloister_n of_o saint_n vedastus_n in_o the_o monastery_n in_o douai_n but_o indeed_o what_o a_o ridiculous_a inconsequence_n be_v it_o to_o think_v that_o wax_n taper_n may_v lawful_o be_v offer_v to_o the_o saint_n and_o incense_n may_v not_o or_o if_o incense_n may_v not_o which_o you_o seem_v to_o disclaim_v as_o impious_a that_o wax_v taper_n may_v 4._o demand_v whether_o the_o collyridians_n be_v not_o condemn_v as_o heretic_n by_o the_o ancient_a church_n first_o for_o offer_v a_o cake_n upon_o a_o anniversary_n feast_n to_o the_o bless_a vâ—rgin_n second_o for_o that_o they_o do_v this_o not_o be_v priest_n answ._n the_o collyridians_n be_v condemn_v as_o heretic_n for_o two_o thing_n first_o for_o employ_v woman_n in_o the_o place_n and_o office_n of_o priest_n to_o offer_v a_o cake_n not_o in_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o gift_n or_o present_a but_o in_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o participaâ—t_fw-la sacrifice_n which_o be_v never_o lawful_a for_o any_o but_o 79._o man_n and_o those_o ibid._n consecrate_v second_o for_o offer_v this_o a_o sacrifice_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n i._n e._n unto_o she_o herself_o direct_o and_o terminative_o as_o a_o act_n of_o ibid._n divine_a worship_n and_o adoration_n due_a unto_o she_o as_o unto_o a_o sovereign_a ibid._n power_n and_o deity_n reply_n it_o seem_v then_o these_o woman_n may_v offer_v this_o cake_n to_o the_o honour_n and_o name_n of_o the_o virgin_n mary_n
altar_n the_o altar_n of_o such_o or_o such_o a_o saint_n which_o yet_o i_o think_v they_o forbear_v not_o for_o the_o unlawfulness_n but_o for_o fear_n of_o misconstruction_n then_o for_o theodoret_n he_o tell_v we_o indeed_o of_o vow_n make_v of_o monument_n of_o thankfulness_n dedicate_v for_o benefit_n obtain_v by_o the_o intercession_n of_o the_o martyr_n but_o here_o also_o i_o fear_v your_o conscience_n tell_v you_o that_o you_o abuse_v we_o and_o hide_v yourself_o in_o ambiguity_n for_o to_o who_o do_v theodoret_n say_v these_o vow_n be_v make_v to_o who_o be_v these_o monument_n of_o thankfulness_n dedicate_v what_o to_o the_o author_n or_o procure_v of_o the_o receive_a favour_n to_o god_n or_o to_o the_o martyr_n if_o to_o the_o martyr_n that_o have_v be_v something_o towards_o though_o not_o home_n to_o your_o purpose_n for_o there_o be_v a_o a_o wide_a difference_n between_o offer_v of_o a_o creature_n by_o way_n of_o consumption_n as_o be_v never_o lawful_o do_v but_o to_o god_n alone_o as_o a_o profession_n that_o he_o be_v the_o lord_n of_o the_o creature_n and_o erect_v a_o permanent_a monument_n to_o a_o saint_n honour_n which_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o it_o may_v lawful_o be_v do_v to_o a_o live_a saint_n much_o more_o to_o the_o memory_n of_o a_o martyr_n but_o theodoret_n in_o the_o place_n have_v not_o so_o much_o as_o this_o nay_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o these_o gift_n he_o speak_v of_o be_v both_o vow_v and_o pay_v to_o god_n himself_o his_o word_n be_v piè_fw-la precatos_fw-la ea_fw-la consequi_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o they_o which_o pray_v pious_o obtain_v the_o thing_n which_o they_o desire_v they_o pay_v of_o their_o vow_a present_n in_o the_o sign_n of_o their_o recover_a health_n do_v abundant_o testify_v for_o their_o lord_n accept_v most_o gracious_o these_o present_n how_o mean_a so_o ever_o 6._o demand_v whether_o according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n this_o may_v not_o be_v do_v lawful_o by_o woman_n and_o child_n and_o man_n that_o be_v not_o priest_n answ._n they_o may_v offer_v any_o thing_n by_o way_n of_o gift_n and_o present_n by_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n but_o it_o be_v contrary_a to_o the_o roman_a doctrine_n for_o any_o other_o than_o priest_n to_o offer_v any_o thing_n by_o way_n of_o sacrifice_n as_o the_o collyridians_n do_v reply_n aristotle_n say_v most_o true_o that_o true_a definition_n he_o mean_v i_o think_v of_o the_o term_n of_o the_o conclusion_n to_o be_v demonstrate_v be_v the_o best_a principle_n of_o science_n and_o therefore_o want_v of_o they_o must_v needs_o be_v a_o cause_n of_o error_n and_o confusion_n in_o any_o discourse_n let_v i_o therefore_o here_o request_v you_o to_o set_v down_o what_o be_v a_o sacrifice_n and_o how_o distinguish_v from_o a_o oblation_n by_o way_n of_o gift_n or_o present_a and_o you_o will_v quick_o see_v that_o if_o the_o collyridians_n offering_n a_o cake_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n be_v indeed_o a_o sacrifice_n your_o offering_n a_o taper_n to_o she_o must_v likewise_o be_v so_o for_o a_o sacrifice_n be_v nothing_o else_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v but_o the_o oblation_n of_o any_o creature_n by_o way_n of_o consumption_n to_o the_o honour_n of_o that_o whatsoever_o it_o be_v to_o which_o it_o be_v offer_v for_o if_o you_o include_v in_o the_o definition_n that_o this_o offering_n must_v be_v intend_v to_o the_o high_a lord_n of_o all_o so_o be_v as_o you_o pretend_v your_o offering_n of_o taper_n to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n intend_v to_o god_n final_o though_o not_o immediate_o if_o you_o say_v it_o must_v be_v direct_v immediate_o to_o he_o and_o be_v not_o only_o no_o lawful_a sacrifice_n but_o simple_o no_o sacrifice_n unless_o it_o be_v so_o i_o say_v you_o may_v as_o well_o require_v to_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o sacrifice_n that_o it_o be_v offer_v by_o a_o priest_n and_o from_o thence_o conclude_v because_o the_o collyridians_n be_v you_o say_v no_o priest_n their_o offering_n be_v no_o sacrifice_n for_o the_o object_n of_o the_o action_n be_v as_o extrinsical_a to_o the_o essence_n of_o it_o as_o the_o efficient_a and_o therefore_o if_o the_o defect_n of_o a_o due_a and_o legitimate_a offerer_n can_v hinder_v but_o that_o a_o offering_n may_v be_v a_o true_a sacrifice_n neither_o will_v the_o want_n of_o a_o due_a and_o lawful_a object_n be_v any_o hindrance_n but_o still_o it_o may_v be_v so_o second_o i_o say_v this_o be_v to_o confound_v the_o essence_n of_o thing_n with_o the_o lawful_a use_n of_o they_o in_o effect_n as_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v that_o a_o knife_n if_o misemployed_a be_v a_o knife_n no_o long_o three_o it_o be_v to_o make_v it_o not_o unlawful_a to_o offer_v incense_n which_o yet_o you_o seem_v somewhat_o scrupulous_a of_o or_o burnt-offering_n to_o the_o virgin_n mary_n or_o the_o saint_n or_o even_o to_o live_a man_n provide_v you_o know_v and_o believe_v and_o profess_v they_o to_o be_v man_n and_o not_o go_n for_o this_o once_o suppose_a these_o offering_n will_v be_v no_o long_o sacrifice_n and_o to_o offer_v to_o creature_n offering_n that_o be_v not_o sacrifice_n you_o say_v by_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v lawful_a it_o be_v last_o to_o deny_v which_o be_v most_o ridiculous_a that_o the_o pagan_n do_v indeed_o sacrifice_n to_o any_o of_o their_o inferior_a go_n 7._o demand_v if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o this_o worship_n which_o they_o give_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n be_v not_o that_o of_o latria_n but_o that_o of_o dulia_n or_o hyperdulia_fw-la for_o that_o they_o do_v not_o esteem_v she_o god_n or_o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o their_o worship_n to_o she_o be_v not_o final_o terminate_v neither_o but_o give_v she_o for_o her_o relation_n to_o christ._n i_o demand_v whether_o as_o it_o be_v in_o s._n paul_n judgement_n a_o great_a crime_n for_o he_o that_o know_v god_n not_o to_o worship_v he_o as_o god_n so_o it_o be_v not_o as_o great_a a_o crime_n for_o he_o that_o 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none_o of_o that_o age_n oppose_v or_o condemn_v therefore_o it_o be_v the_o catholic_n doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o those_o time_n the_o proposition_n of_o this_o syllogism_n be_v cardinal_n perron_n rule_v in_o his_o epistle_n to_o casaubon_n 5._o observe_v and_o be_v indeed_o one_o of_o the_o main_a pillar_n upon_o which_o the_o great_a fabric_n of_o his_o answer_n to_o king_n james_n do_v sâ—and_n and_o with_o which_o it_o can_v but_o fall_v and_o therefore_o i_o will_v spend_v no_o time_n in_o the_o proof_n of_o it_o but_o the_o assumption_n thus_o i_o prove_v that_o doctrine_n which_o be_v believe_v and_o teach_v by_o papias_n bishop_n of_o hierapâ—lis_n the_o disciple_n of_o the_o apostle_n disciple_n according_a to_o eusebius_n who_o live_v in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n say_v he_o by_o justin_n martyr_n doctor_n of_o the_o church_n and_o martyr_n by_o melito_n bishop_n of_o sardis_n who_o have_v the_o gift_n of_o prophecy_n witness_n tert._n and_o who_o bellarmine_n acknowledge_v a_o saint_n by_o s._n irenaeus_n bishop_n of_o lion_n and_o martyr_n and_o be_v not_o oppose_v and_o condemn_v by_o any_o one_o doctor_n of_o the_o church_n of_o those_o time_n that_o doctrine_n be_v believe_v and_o teach_v by_o the_o most_o eminent_a father_n of_o that_o age_n next_o to_o the_o apostle_n and_o oppose_v by_o none_o but_o the_o former_a part_n of_o the_o proposition_n be_v true_a ergo_fw-la the_o latter_a be_v also_o true_a the_o major_n of_o this_o syllogism_n and_o the_o latter_a part_n of_o the_o minor_a i_o suppose_v will_v need_v no_o proof_n with_o they_o that_o consider_v that_o these_o here_o mention_v be_v equal_a in_o number_n to_o all_o the_o other_o ecclesiastical_a writer_n of_o that_o age_n of_o who_o there_o be_v any_o memory_n remain_v and_o in_o weight_n and_o worth_n infinite_o beyond_o they_o they_o be_v athenagoras_n theophilus_n antiochenus_fw-la egesippus_fw-la and_o hippolytus_n of_o who_o contradiction_n to_o this_o doctrine_n there_o be_v not_o extant_a neither_o in_o their_o work_n nor_o in_o story_n any_o print_n or_o footstep_n which_o if_o they_o or_o any_o of_o they_o have_v oppose_v it_o have_v be_v impossible_a consider_v the_o ecclesiastical_a story_n of_o their_o time_n be_v write_v by_o the_o profess_a enemy_n of_o the_o millinary_n doctrine_n who_o can_v they_o have_v find_v any_o thing_n in_o the_o monument_n of_o antiquity_n to_o have_v put_v in_o the_o balance_n against_o justin_n martyr_n and_o irenaeus_n no_o doubt_n will_v not_o have_v bury_v it_o in_o silence_n which_o yet_o they_o do_v neither_o vouch_v for_o their_o opinion_n any_o one_o of_o more_o antiquity_n than_o dionysius_n alexandrinus_n who_o live_v say_v eusebius_n nostra_fw-la aetate_fw-la in_o our_o age_n but_o certain_o in_o the_o latter_a part_n of_o the_o three_o century_n for_o tatianus_n because_o a_o heretic_n i_o reckon_v not_o in_o this_o number_n and_o if_o any_o man_n say_v that_o before_o his_o fall_n he_o write_v many_o book_n i_o say_v it_o be_v true_a but_o withal_o will_v have_v it_o remember_v that_o he_o be_v justin_n martyr_n scholar_n and_o therefore_o in_o all_o probability_n of_o his_o master_n faith_n rather_o than_o against_o it_o all_o that_o be_v extant_a of_o he_o one_o way_n or_o other_o be_v but_o this_o in_o s._n hierome_n de_fw-fr script_n eccles._n justini_n martyris_fw-la sectator_n suit_n now_o for_o the_o other_o part_n of_o the_o minor_a that_o the_o foremention_v father_n do_v believe_v and_o teach_v this_o doctrine_n and_o first_o for_o papias_n that_o he_o teach_v it_o it_o be_v confess_v by_o eusebius_n the_o enemy_n of_o this_o doctrine_n lib._n 3._o iâ—ist_n eccles._n c._n 33._o in_o these_o word_n other_o thing_n beside_o the_o same_o author_n papias_n declare_v that_o they_o come_v to_o he_o as_o it_o be_v by_o unwritten_a tradition_n wherein_o he_o affirm_v that_o after_o the_o resurrection_n of_o all_o flesh_n from_o the_o dead_a there_o shall_v be_v a_o kingdom_n of_o christ_n continue_v and_o establish_v for_o a_o thousand_o year_n upon_o earth_n after_o a_o humane_a and_o corporeal_a manner_n the_o same_o be_v confess_v by_o s._n hierome_n another_o enemy_n to_o this_o opinion_n descript_n eccles._n s._n â—9_n papias_n the_o auditor_n of_o john_n bishop_n of_o hieropolis_n be_v say_v to_o have_v teach_v the_o judaical_a tradition_n of_o a_o thousand_o year_n who_o irenaeus_n and_o apollinarius_n follow_v and_o in_o his_o preface_n upon_o the_o commentary_n of_o victorinus_n upon_o the_o apocalypse_n thus_o he_o write_v before_o he_o papias_n bishop_n of_o hieropolis_n and_o nepos_n bishop_n in_o the_o part_n of_o egypt_n teach_v as_o victorinus_n do_v touch_v the_o kingdom_n of_o the_o thousand_o year_n the_o same_o be_v testify_v by_o irenaeus_n lib._n 5._o cont_n she_o c._n 33._o where_o have_v at_o large_a set_v forth_o this_o doctrine_n he_o confirm_v it_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o papias_n in_o these_o word_n 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that_o fragment_n of_o tertullian_n de_fw-fr spe_fw-la fidelium_fw-la irenaeus_n his_o faith_n in_o this_o point_n be_v likewise_o confess_v by_o eusebius_n in_o the_o place_n before_o quote_v in_o these_o word_n he_o papias_n be_v the_o author_n of_o the_o like_a error_n to_o most_o of_o the_o writer_n of_o the_o church_n who_o allege_v the_o antiquity_n of_o the_o man_n for_o a_o defence_n of_o their_o side_n as_o to_o irenaeus_n and_o whosoever_o else_o seem_v to_o be_v of_o the_o same_o opinion_n with_o he_o by_o s._n hierome_n in_o the_o place_n above_o cite_v the_o script_n eccles._n s._n 29._o again_o in_o lib._n ezek._n 11._o in_o these_o word_n for_o neither_o do_v we_o expect_v from_o heaven_n a_o golden_a jerusalem_n according_a to_o the_o jewish_a tale_n which_o they_o call_v duterossis_n which_o also_o many_o of_o our_o own_o have_v follow_v especial_o tertullian_n in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr spe_fw-la â—idelium_fw-la and_o lactantius_n in_o his_o seven_o book_n of_o institution_n and_o the_o frequent_a exposition_n of_o victorinus_n pictavionensis_n and_o of_o late_a severus_n in_o his_o dialogue_n which_o he_o call_v gallus_n and_o to_o name_v the_o greek_n and_o to_o join_v together_o the_o first_o and_o last_o irenaeus_n and_o apollinarius_n where_o we_o see_v he_o acknowledge_v irenaeus_n to_o be_v of_o this_o opinion_n but_o that_o he_o be_v the_o first_o that_o hold_v it_o i_o believe_v that_o that_o be_v more_o a_o christian_a untruth_n than_o irenaeus_n his_o opinion_n a_o judaical_a fable_n for_o he_o himself_o acknowledge_v in_o the_o place_n above_o cite_v that_o irenaeus_n follow_v papias_n and_o it_o be_v certain_a and_o confess_v that_o justin_n martyr_n believe_v it_o long_o before_o he_o and_o irenaeus_n himself_o derive_v it_o from_o presbyteri_fw-la qui_fw-la johannem_fw-la discipulum_fw-la domini_fw-la viderunt_fw-la from_o priest_n which_o see_v john_n the_o disciple_n of_o the_o lord_n last_o by_o pamelius_n sixtus_n senensis_n and_o faverdentius_n in_o the_o place_n