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church_n according_a time_n word_n 3,498 5 3.4534 3 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A04429 The opinion, judgement, and determination of two reverend, learned, and conformable divines of the Church of England, concerning bowing at the name, or naming of Jesus. The one somtime a member of the Vnivertie of Cambridge, in a letter to his Christian freind: the other sometime a member of the Vniversitie of Oxford, in a treatise to his brethren the ministers of the Church of England. Printed at Hambourgh, 1632 H. B., Bachelor of Divinity.; I. H., Bachelor of Divinity.; S. O., fl. 1630-1634.; Ofwod, Stephen, attributed name.; Burton, Henry, 1578-1648, attributed name. 1634 (1634) STC 14555; ESTC S106466 28,118 82

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therefore_o we_o answer_v brief_o unto_o they_o 1._o first_o we_o dislike_v not_o simple_o the_o practice_n of_o this_o external_a reverence_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n for_o we_o condemn_v not_o the_o church_n of_o england_n much_o less_o the_o ancient_a and_o universal_a church_n in_o this_o behalf_n it_o be_v do_v upon_o good_a and_o sufficient_a knowledge_n without_o superstition_n and_o without_o opinion_n of_o necessity_n according_a to_o the_o purpose_n of_o the_o church_n hence_o it_o be_v that_o mr._n hooker_n lib._n 5_o 5_o 30._o confess_v in_o express_a word_n touch_v this_o external_a act_n of_o reverence_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n no_o man_n be_v constrain_v to_o use_v it_o by_o avy_z obligation_n of_o divine_a law_n or_o humane_a 2._o second_o i_o observe_v that_o the_o external_a act_n of_o reverence_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n have_v be_v usual_o practise_v in_o the_o time_n of_o divin_n service_n not_o whensoever_o man_n do_v stand_v &_o when_o in_o the_o time_n of_o their_o stand_v the_o name_n of_o jesus_n be_v sound_v forth_o for_o we_o do_v stand_v at_o the_o recitation_n of_o the_o cr●ed_n where_o mention_n be_v make_v of_o jesus_n with_o no_o bow_n of_o the_o knee_n but_o at_o the_o read_n of_o the_o gospel_n and_o therefore_o the_o canon_n must_v be_v understand_v peculiar_o of_o that_o custom_n when_o it_o require_v a_o reverence_n as_o it_o have_v be_v accustom_v if_o any_o ceremonialist_n will_v contend_v with_o i_o in_o this_o point_n let_v the_o same_o mr._n hooker_n in_o the_o same_o place_n be_v a_o arbitratour_n betwixt_o we_o to_o decide_v the_o controversy_n because_o the_o gospel_n which_o be_v weekly_o read_v do_v all_o historical_o declare_v something_o which_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n do_v or_o suffer_v in_o his_o own_o person_n it_o have_v be_v the_o custom_n of_o christian_a man_n then_o especial_o in_o token_n of_o the_o great_a reverence_n to_o stand_v to_o utter_v certain_a word_n of_o acclamation_n 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this_o diversity_n of_o their_o practice_n contrary_a to_o the_o general_a action_n of_o the_o church_n i_o may_v conclude_v that_o neither_o the_o scripture_n bind_v any_o nor_o that_o the_o canon_n or_o custom_n bind_v all_o to_o the_o observation_n of_o this_o ceremonial_a act_n which_o the_o profound_a ceremonialist_n partly_o by_o virtue_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o partly_o by_o authority_n of_o the_o canon_n will_v enforce_v upon_o their_o brethren_n and_o this_o may_v suffice_v concern_v the_o cannon_n in_o this_o behalf_n but_o if_o i_o shall_v not_o offend_v they_o i_o can_v press_v they_o further_o with_o the_o relation_n of_o a_o ancient_a and_o very_a learned_a bishop_n well_o who_o be_v present_a at_o the_o make_n of_o this_o canon_n do_v free_o and_o confident_o protest_v that_o neither_o he_o nor_o any_o of_o his_o colleague_n do_v ever_o condescend_v unto_o it_o when_o it_o be_v first_o conclude_v nor_o when_o it_o come_v afterward_o to_o the_o birth_n it_o be_v as_o 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the_o say_a b●shop_n and_o shut_v up_o all_o the_o whole_a with_o 3._o observation_n which_o i_o wish_v man_n to_o weigh_v well_o in_o the_o balance_n of_o a_o true_a judgement_n and_o of_o a_o upright_a conscience_n 1._o first_o though_o i_o have_v often_o and_o curious_o note_v the_o behaviour_n of_o the_o principal_a author_n of_o this_o canon_n in_o time_n of_o divine_a service_n and_o especial_o in_o the_o read_n of_o the_o gospel_n yet_o i_o can_v never_o see_v they_o perform_v any_o external_a act_n of_o reverence_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n 2._o second_o though_o many_o good_a christian_n bow_v not_o their_o knee_n or_o bend_v their_o body_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n in_o the_o time_n of_o divine_a service_n or_o sermon_n yet_o this_o omission_n of_o outward_a compliment_n proceed_v not_o from_o a_o want_n of_o due_a &_o hearty_a reverence_n to_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n but_o because_o the_o ceremonialist_n will_v impose_v it_o upon_o they_o by_o a_o plain_a misconstruction_n of_o the_o scripture_n therefore_o they_o be_v not_o willing_a by_o such_o a_o act_n of_o reverence_n to_o give_v testimony_n and_o approbation_n to_o such_o a_o plain_a ignorant_a misconstruction_n of_o the_o text_n though_o otherwise_o they_o may_v be_v tractable_a to_o perform_v it_o according_a to_o knowledge_n and_o to_o show_v their_o obedience_n to_o the_o order_n of_o the_o church_n which_o yet_o do_v not_o compel_v man_n to_o the_o practice_n of_o this_o ceremony_n for_o as_o it_o have_v be_v intermit_v in_o many_o congregation_n and_o by_o disuse_n be_v whole_o lay_v aside_o so_o we_o do_v not_o hear_v that_o by_o virtue_n of_o this_o canon_n either_o any_o minister_n be_v bring_v into_o question_n for_o not_o stir_v and_o provoke_v the_o people_n unto_o it_o nor_o any_o of_o the_o people_n present_v in_o the_o spiritual_a court_n for_o neglect_v thereof_o but_o if_o the_o scripture_n enforce_v it_o and_o the_o canon_n require_v it_o why_o be_v neither_o the_o pastor_n nor_o the_o parishioner_n more_o sharp_o entreat_v in_o this_o behalf_n 3._o three_o b._n many_o yea_o most_o that_o perform_v not_o this_o ceremony_n of_o bow_v the_o knee_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n do_v appear_v by_o the_o best_a effect_n of_o religion_n and_o in_o all_o due_a circumstance_n thereof_o to_o have_v more_o true_a zeal_n devotion_n and_o love_n unto_o the_o the_o lord_n jesus_n than_o many_o yea_o the_o most_o of_o these_o ceremonialist_n who_o seem_v to_o honour_v he_o with_o cap_n and_o knee_n do_v by_o their_o superstition_n rather_o than_o religion_n herein_o prepare_v a_o way_n for_o jesuit_n to_o creep_v in_o with_o the_o serpent_n by_o such_o hole_n into_o the_o gardeu_n of_o eden_n the_o true_a church_n of_o god_n in_o this_o kingdom_n let_v we_o therefore_o not_o so_o much_o affect_v the_o outward_a form_n of_o religion_n as_o make_v true_a demonstration_n of_o our_o love_n honour_n and_o obedience_n unto_o the_o lord_n jesus_n by_o the_o 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that_o especial_o during_o the_o mystery_n of_o the_o mass_n as_o if_o this_o name_n have_v some_o singular_a virtue_n when_o mention_v in_o the_o mass_n more_o than_o out_o of_o all_o the_o mass_n and_o who_o doubt_v but_o this_o superstitious_a institution_n be_v a_o notable_a mean_n to_o mask_v the_o abominable_a idol_n of_o their_o transubstantiate_a breaden_a god_n not_o long_o before_o decree_v by_o pope_n innocent_n 3._o in_o the_o counsel_n of_o lateran_n the_o adore_v now_o of_o the_o very_a name_n of_o jesus_fw-la make_v the_o adoration_n of_o the_o corporal_a presence_n of_o christ_n as_o they_o imagine_v the_o less_o to_o be_v stick_v at_o for_o if_o the_o very_a name_n be_v to_o be_v adore_v much_o more_o the_o body_n itself_o and_o by_o this_o bow_n in_o the_o mass_n i_o take_v it_o our_o ignorant_a people_n in_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o reformation_n have_v learned_a to_o make_v leg_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o gospel_n especial_o when_o 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and_o not_o also_o of_o the_o sermon_n this_o may_v seem_v to_o come_v too_o close_o at_o the_o heel_n of_o popish_a superstition_n second_o it_o be_v not_o say_v as_o in_o the_o papal_a canon_n when_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n be_v name_v but_o when_o the_o lord_n jesus_n be_v mention_v now_o the_o lord_n jesus_n be_v the_o person_n of_o jesus_n and_o not_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n to_o who_o all_o due_a reverence_n be_v to_o be_v do_v by_o what_o name_n soever_o he_o be_v in_o scripture_n make_v know_v unto_o we_o for_o do_v we_o reverence_v the_o person_n for_o the_o namesake_n or_o the_o name_n for_o the_o person-sake_n if_o the_o person_n for_o the_o namesake_n that_o be_v flat_a idolatry_n but_o if_o the_o name_n for_o the_o person-sake_n than_o every_o name_n of_o the_o lord_n jesus_n as_o christ_n immanuell_n etc._n etc._n shall_v draw_v from_o we_o reverence_n to_o our_o lord_n christ._n three_o the_o canon_n will_v due_a reverence_n to_o the_o lord_n jesus_n and_o who_o so_o 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resurrection_n in_o the_o state_n of_o glory_n as_o matth._n 28_o 18_o and_o joh._n 5_o 21._o his_o godhead_n now_o shine_v forth_o in_o its_o full_a brightness_n as_o rom._n 1_o 4_o which_o have_v be_v cloweded_a under_o the_o veil_n of_o his_o flesh_n in_o the_o state_n of_o his_o humiliation_n phil._n 2_o 7_o 8._o excedit_fw-la theophylact_n by_o this_o name_n above_o every_o name_n understand_v the_o son_n of_o god_n which_o title_n surpass_v all_o name_n and_o 4._o gregory_n nazianzen_n understand_v it_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n and_o say_v that_o the_o people_n of_o christ_n to_o this_o day_n never_o understand_v it_o otherwise_o and_o 7._o gregory_n nyssen_n say_v that_o this_o name_n above_o every_o name_n do_v signify_v a_o unspeakable_a power_n and_o nature_n and_o es_fw-la s._n hierome_n in_o this_o place_n understand_v this_o name_n above_o every_o name_n of_o the_o son_n of_o god_n thus_o the_o old_a interpreter_n to_o these_o i_o may_v add_v many_o more_o as_o hilary_n 2._o cite_v by_o sixtus_n senensis_n who_o expound_v that_o in_o the_o second_o psalm_n i_o will_v give_v thou_o the_o heathen_a for_o thy_o inheritance_n etc._n etc._n by_o phil._n 2_o 10._o so_o tertullian_n so_o declarat_fw-la origen_n so_o cyril_n thesauri_fw-la lib._n 3._o cap._n 2._o so_o chrysostome_n de_fw-fr jona_n propheta_fw-la super_fw-la verbis_fw-la zachariae_fw-la ecce_fw-la vir_fw-la oriens_fw-la nomen_fw-la ejus_fw-la so_o cyprian_n expositio_fw-la in_o symbolum_n apostolorum_fw-la christus_fw-la tria_fw-la pariter_fw-la regna_fw-la subjecit_fw-la hoc_fw-la judicat_fw-la ubi_fw-la ait_fw-la quia_fw-la in_o nomine_fw-la jesu_fw-la omne_fw-la genus_fw-la flectatur_fw-la caelestium_fw-la etc._n etc._n so_o athanasius_n de_fw-fr incarnatione_fw-la christi_fw-la et_fw-la contra_fw-la arrianos_fw-la lib._n 2._o nomen_fw-la super_fw-la omne_fw-la nomen_fw-la ut_fw-la regnaret_fw-la in_o coelis_fw-la &_o potestatem_fw-la haberet_fw-la judicij_fw-la
cum_fw-la faciendi_fw-la etc._n etc._n so_o ambr._n in_o phil._n 2._o so_o augustin_n in_o psal._n 109._o so_o gloss._n in●rlin_fw-mi &_o ordinar_n quia_fw-la christus_fw-la ostendi●r_fw-la post_fw-la resurrectionem_fw-la esse_fw-la dominus_fw-la caele●●stium_fw-la &_o terrestrium_fw-la &_o infernorum_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o all_o the_o father_n unanimous_o run_v 〈◊〉_d this_o strain_n and_o among_o popish_a interpreter_n let_v the_o testimony_n of_o aquinas●●d_n ●●d_z anselm_n suffice_v understand_v it_o 〈◊〉_d the_o subjection_n of_o all_o creature_n and_o ●●●uno_fw-it donavit_fw-la nomen_fw-la id_fw-la est_fw-la honorificen●●m_fw-la ut_fw-la ad_fw-la honorem_fw-la jesu_fw-la omne_fw-la genus_fw-la flecta●●●●d_fw-la est_fw-la omne_fw-la ipsi_fw-la plene_fw-la subjiciantur_fw-la ho●●t_fw-la in_o die_v judici●_n and_o that_o this_o be_v the_o ●●e_z sense_n of_o the_o place_n according_a to_o o●●er_v scripture_n the_o church_n of_o england_n 〈◊〉_d testify_v which_o in_o the_o margin_n of_o the_o ●●glish_fw-fr translation_n confer_v phil._n 〈◊〉_d 10._o with_o rom._n 14._o 11._o and_o isaiah_n 45._o 23._o ●sal_n 2._o 10._o for_o the_o latter_a let_v beza_n speak_v name●aith_n ●aith_z he_o signify_v dignity_n and_o renown_n ●t_a join_v with_o the_o thing_n itself_o as_o ephe._n 〈◊〉_d 21._o for_o that_o osiander_n refer_v this_o to_o 〈◊〉_d very_a name_n of_o jesus_n which_o he_o confound_a ●●th_n jehovah_n be_v the_o mere_a doctage_n of_o a_o mad_a ●●utheran_v so_o he_o again_o the_o holy_a ghost_n himself_o expound_v the_o name_n of_o jesus_n here_o of_o 〈◊〉_d person_n of_o jesus_n as_o isa._n 45._o 23._o and_o rome_n 14._o 11._o to_o which_o this_o place_n have_v speci●●_n reference_n as_o also_o mal._n 1._o 1._o and_o joh._n 12._o ●_o as_o also_o of_o the_o power_n of_o christ_n exod._n 2d_o 21._o for_o my_o name_n be_v in_o he_o that_o be_v my_o ●●vine_a power_n be_v in_o he_o that_o angel_n of_o 〈◊〉_d covenant_n to_o protect_v or_o punish_v to_o this_o purpose_n the_o late_a revere●●_n bishop_n babington_n one_o of_o the_o late_a governor_n of_o our_o church_n on_o the_o lo●●_n prayer_n the_o first_o petition_n expound_v these_o word_n that_o at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n ●●●ry_a knee_n shall_v bow_v thus_o that_o be_v say_v 〈◊〉_d not_o when_o the_o word_n be_v pronounce_v we_o sho●●_n make_v a_o courtesy_n but_o we_o shall_v all_o and_o eu●●_n creature_n be_v subject_a to_o his_o power_n authority_n 〈◊〉_d dominion_n the_o place_n be_v worth_a the_o r●●ding_n at_o large_a also_o in_o his_o exposition_n up●●_n the_o creed_n where_o confute_v the_o pop●●●_n superstition_n about_o this_o name_n jesus_n as_o ●mong_v the_o rest_n how_o by_o this_o name_n a_o sowldiour_n be_v help_v out_o of_o s._n patrick_n purgatory_n and_o the_o like_a he_o say_v i_o thi●●_n the_o place_n to_o the_o philippian_n be_v not_o well_o understand_v have_v and_o do_v deceive_v they_o indeed_o ●hey_n be_v easy_o deceive_v that_o will_v not_o ●earch_v ●o●_n truth_n and_o they_o be_v just_o give_v ●ver_o to_o strong_a delusion_n that_o delight_n in_o ●rrou●_n and_o have_v not_o a_o love_n of_o the_o truth_n they_o lie_v do_v love_n that_o ertour_n do_v defend_v and_o he_o be_v virtue_n foe_n that_o be_v error_n friend_n otherwise_o the_o place_n to_o the_o philip●ians_n will_v not_o be_v so_o gross_o mistake_v if_o ●●e_v ma●ke_v whence_o the_o apostle_n take_v it_o use_v compare_v spiritual_a thing_n with_o spiritual_a thing_n the_o place_n be_v borrow_v ●rom_o the_o prophet_n isaih_n and_o therefore_o by_o consequence_n evident_a that_o the_o word_n name_n signify_v power_n glory_n honour_n and_o autho●itie_n above_o all_o power_n glory_n honour_n and_o authority_n and_o bow_v the_o knee_n signify_v subjection_n submission_n and_o obedience_n of_o all_o creature_n to_o his_o beck_n rule_n and_o government_n this_o know_v the_o ancient_a father_n s._n origen_n non_fw-la est_fw-la carnaliter_fw-la hoc_fw-la accipiendum_fw-la quasi_fw-la caelestia_fw-la ut_fw-la sol_fw-la luna_fw-la angeli_fw-la genu●_n aut_fw-la lingua_fw-la habeant_fw-la sed_fw-la genus_fw-la flectere_fw-la significat_fw-la cuncta_fw-la subjecta_fw-la esse_fw-la &_o cultui_fw-la dei_fw-la obe●_n dire_fw-fr who_o upon_o rom._n 14._o 11._o where_o these_o word_n be_v again_o say_v these_o word_n be_v no●_n to_o be_v take_v carnal_o as_o though_o thing_n in_o heaven_n as_o the_o sun_n moon_n angel_n etc._n etc._n ha●_n knee_n or_o tongue_n but_o to_o bow_v the_o knee_n signify_v that_o all_o thing_n shall_v be_v subject_a and_o obedient_a to_o the_o service_n of_o god_n so_o he_o wher●_n he_o also_o allege_v jerome_n theophylact_n ambrose_n the_o carthurianus_fw-la gloss_n beda_n and_o some_o popish_a author_n of_o the_o same_o mind_n and_o gre●gory_n nyssen_n in_o his_o disputation_n de_fw-fr anim●_n &_o resurrectione_n say_v that_o this_o bow_v ●_o the_o knee_n signify_v the_o unanimity_n of_o man_n an●_n angel_n in_o confess_v christ._n hereunto_o let_v i_o add_v what_o jesus_n d._n wille●_n have_v say_v of_o this_o matter_n in_o a_o answer_n to_o the_o rhemist_n cavil_v against_o protestant_n abou●_n it_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n say_v they_o ought_v to_o 〈◊〉_d worship_v by_o cap_v and_o kneel_v there_o unto_o by_o wear_v it_o in_o their_o cap_n und_fw-ge setti●_n it_o up_o in_o solemn_a place_n allege_v for_o the●_n purpose_n that_o of_o s._n paul_n that_o at_o the_o nam●_n of_o jesus_n every_o knee_n shall_v bow_v phi._n 2_o 10_o yea_o they_o say_v that_o protestant_n by_o abolish_n the_o name_n and_o image_n of_o christ_n do_v make_v a_o way_n for_o antichrist_n rhem._n annot._n phil._n 2_o sect._n 2_o and_o rev._n 13._o 7._o to_o this_o he_o answer_v in_o the_o protestant_n name_n say_v the_o bow_v at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n as_o it_o be_v use_v in_o popery_n to_o bend_v the_o knee_n at_o the_o sound_n thereof_o be_v not_o command_v ●n_o this_o place_n which_o show_v especial_o the_o subjection_n of_o all_o creature_n of_o turk_n jew_n infidel_n yea_o of_o the_o devil_n themselves_o to_o the_o power_n and_o judgement_n of_o christ._n second_o protestant_n have_v only_o take_v away_o the_o superstitious_a abuse_n of_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n three_o the_o kneel_v at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n be_v superstitious_o abuse_v in_o popery_n for_o the_o people_n stoop_v only_o at_o the_o sound_n not_o vuderstand_v commit_v what_o be_v read_v and_o so_o make_v a_o idol_n of_o the_o letter_n and_o syllable_n adore_v &_o worship_v the_o very_a name_n when_o they_o hear_v or_o see_v it_o and_o again_o in_o sit_v and_o not_o u●illing_v at_o the_o name_n of_o christ_n immawell_n god_n the_o father_n the_o son_n and_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o bow_v only_o at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n dis_n fulk_n ibid._n four_o due_a reverence_n may_v be_v use_v to_o our_o saviour_n without_o any_o such_o ceremony_n of_o cap_v and_o kneel_v say_v fulk_n neither_o doc_fw-fr we_o bind_v any_o of_o necessity_n to_o use_v this_o reverence_n to_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n as_o the_o papist_n do_v which_o think_v christ_n can_v otherwise_o be_v honour_v neither_o do_v we_o judge_v and_o condemn_v those_o that_o do_v use_v it_o be_v free_a from_o superstition_n and_o ground_v in_o knowledge_n and_o careful_a not_o to_o give_v offence_n for_o superstition_n and_o offensive_a ignorance_n be_v not_o in_o any_o case_n to_o be_v defend_v five_o this_o outward_a reverence_n at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n be_v take_v up_o among_o christian_n because_o of_o all_o other_o name_v it_o be_v most_o deride_v and_o scorn_v of_o the_o pagan_n and_o jew_n and_o therefore_o they_o do_v the_o more_o honour_n it_o but_o now_o there_o be_v great_a danger_n of_o popish_a superstition_n in_o abuse_v holy_a thing_n note_n than_o of_o paganism_n in_o utter_o contemn_v they_o and_o therefore_o there_o be_v not_o such_o necessity_n and_o just_a occasion_n of_o use_v this_o external_a gesture_n as_o be_v in_o former_a time_n it_o be_v not_o use_v of_o necessity_n ●hen_o much_o less_o now_o so_o he_o d._n fulk_n also_o in_o his_o answer_n to_o the_o rhemist_n on_o that_o place_n beside_o that_o allege_v by_o dr._n willet_n from_o he_o say_v in_o particular_a to_o the_o jesuit_n you_o complain_v that_o to_o remove_v such_o impiety_n as_o the_o image_n and_o name_n of_o jesus_n be_v to_o abolish_v all_o true_a religion_n out_o of_o the_o world_n and_o to_o make_v man_n plain_a atheist_n the_o same_o be_v the_o complaint_n of_o the_o pagan_n against_o the_o christian_n but_o to_o worship_n god_n only_o according_a to_o the_o prescript_n of_o his_o holy_a well_o word_n be_v true_a religion_n and_o to_o teach_v man_n to_o worship_v contrary_a thereunto_o it_o make_v man_n either_o idolater_n or_o altogether_o atheist_n and_o when_o you_o say_v the_o popish_a church_n do_v not_o honour_v those_o thing_n nor_o count_v they_o holy_a for_o their_o matter_n colour_n sound_n etc._n etc._n but_o for_o respect_n and_o
profess_v to_o hold_v communion_n with_o they_o in_o all_o holy_a part_n of_o god_n worship_n and_o because_o we_o do_v thus_o practice_v here_o be_v one_o john_n can_n have_v publish_v a_o spiteful_a if_o not_o rail_v book_n against_o al●_n that_o do_v complain_v of_o the_o superstition_n use_v in_o our_o land_n and_o yet_o hold_v communion_n folio_n with_o they_o in_o holy_a grace_n o●_n god_n worship_n for_o this_o cause_n he_o chardge_v we_o to_o be_v pervertour_n of_o the_o truth_n say_v dr._n ames_n of_o famous_a memory_n who_o utter_o deny_v that_o the_o call_n of_o ou●_n have_v minister_n do_v essential_o depend_v on_o th●_n bishop_n call_v yet_o otherways_o have_v a_o lawful_a call_n against_o this_o he_o do_v parentory_o affirm_v the_o minister_n in_o our_o land_n by_o the_o law_n of_o our_o land_n do_v certain_o depend_v on_o the_o bishop_n call_v holy_a an●_n no_o man_n else_n herein_o he_o do_v affirm_v th●●_n this_o pretence_n be_v worse_a than_o the_o family_n o●_n love_n which_o be_v the_o gross_a heretick●_n rise_v in_o this_o adge_n ordain_v therefore_o we_o will_v examine_v his_o accusation_n for_o if_o he_o be_v false_a in_o this_o then_o let_v all_o that_o fear_n god_n judge_v he_o a_o false_a accuser_n like_o his_o father_n the_o devil_n be_v and_o i_o de_fw-fr here_o call_v all_o discreet_a man_n to_o witness_v that_o b●_n the_o law_n of_o our_o land_n the_o bishop_n canno●_n send_v a_o minister_n to_o be_v make_v in_o the_o church_n till_o the_o patron_n do_v first_o choose_v he_o an●_n send_v he_o with_o his_o letter_n to_o the_o bishop_n acuser_n to_o ordain_v he_o and_o it_o be_v well_o know_v there_o be_v sundry_a congregation_n which_o have_v agree_v with_o their_o patron_n that_o they_o choose_v and_o call_v their_o pastor_n and_o sundry_a gentleman_n fear_v god_n which_o be_v patron_n and_o do_v use_v to_o advise_v with_o the_o most_o discreet_a in_o that_o church_n about_o the_o choice_n of_o one_o wherein_o they_o do_v take_v the_o advice_n of_o learned_a divine_v approvin_v he_o and_o he_o be_v choosen_v by_o that_o church_n before_o the_o bishop_n see_v he_o and_o therefore_o dr._n ames_n 234._o his_o sentence_n be_v true_a although_o john_n can_n revile_v he_o for_o it_o and_o he_o after_o in_o the_o same_o book_n do_v justify_v this_o course_n of_o choose_v by_o the_o congregation_n to_o be_v good_a according_a to_o truth_n therefore_o his_o own_o mouth_n do_v give_v sentence_n against_o himself_o 1632._o to_o be_v a_o false_a accuser_n if_o john_n can_n will_v have_v triy_v and_o defend_v his_o cause_n of_o separation_n from_o all_o the_o godly_a minister_n and_o professor_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n against_o doctor_n ames_n he_o shall_v have_v answer_v his_o first_o and_o second_o manuduction_n against_o m._n robinson_n and_o try_v if_o he_o cold_a have_v do_v more_o them_z m._n robinson_n have_v do_v for_o there_o be_v his_o cause_n prove_v erroneous_a &_o it_o be_v in_o other_o book_n proud_a fall_v in_o deny_v the_o grace_n of_o god_n give_v we_o in_o jesus_n christ._n he_o do_v know_v there_o be_v book_n have_v be_v publish_v this_o 16_o year_n which_o have_v prove_v sundry_a artikel_n of_o their_o faith_n false_a and_o erroneous_a yet_o john_n can_v dare_v not_o write_v against_o till_o the_o author_n be_v dead_a it_o appear_v unto_o i_o john_n can_n know_v not_o the_o right_a call_n of_o a_o teacher_n into_o the_o church_n because_o he_o putt_v no_o difference_n betwixt_o election_n approbation_n &_o ordination_n which_o th●_n word_n of_o god_n do_v distinguish_v yet_o in_o his_o book_n he_o count_v they_o all_o one_o thing_n he_o write_v they_o practise_v nothing_o but_o that_o the_o teacher_n of_o our_o church_n have_v affirm_v to_o be_v truth_n which_o i_o manifest_a be_v not_o so_o for_o we_o affirm_v god_n have_v ordain_v school_n to_o educate_v and_o fit_a man_n to_o be_v teacher_n in_o his_o church_n and_o such_o be_v necessary_a instrument_n to_o increase_v heavenly_a grace_n this_o we_o hold_v be_v a_o work_n of_o faith_n for_o we_o to_o hear_v they_o preach_v which_o john_n can_v do_v condemn_v act._n 13._o 15._o we_o do_v believe_v the_o communion_n of_o saint_n and_o thus_o the_o church_n have_v believe_v since_o the_o apostle_n day_n and_o though_o john_n can_n do_v confess_v they_o be_v first_o convert_v by_o our_o ministry_n yet_o he_o condemn_v those_o that_o do_v partake_v in_o that_o holy_a worship_n contrary_a to_o the_o counsel_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n in_o despise_v prophe●ie_n thess._n 5._o 20._o he_o write_v himself_o pastor_n of_o the_o ancient_a english_a church_n they_o and_o he_o do_v condemn_v all_o the_o divine_n of_o our_o nation_n that_o there_o be_v not_o one_o a_o lawful_a teacher_n in_o this_o age_n but_o himself_o yet_o it_o appear_v he_o be_v ignorant_a of_o the_o ground_n of_o religion_n hebr._n 6._o 2._o whereas_o john_n can_v do_v command_v all_o those_o which_o do_v deny_v his_o ground_n to_o set_v down_o their_o name_n and_o the_o place_n where_o they_o dwell_v i_o desire_v of_o he_o to_o show_v his_o commission_n for_o i_o think_v he_o be_v vain_o consait_v and_o one_o that_o do_v not_o know_v himself_o therefore_o fare_v unfit_a to_o reprove_v those_o which_o have_v labour_v more_o year_n in_o study_n than_o he_o have_v mont_n see_v his_o book_n folio_n 60._o the_o publisher_n post-scripe_a to_o the_o reader_n if_o any_o will-worship_n or_o ceremonialist_n say_v that_o this_o bow_v and_o duck_v at_o the_o name_n or_o name_v of_o jesus_n be_v justify_v in_o mr._n widow_n his_o answer_n to_o mr._n prin_fw-mi i_o reply_v first_o let_v we_o observe_v what_o a_o brand_n of_o a_o evil_a conscience_n he_o have_v which_o do_v defend_v this_o superstition_n it_o be_v certain_o know_v that_o mr._n widow_n be_v know_v and_o detect_v to_o be_v but_o a_o drunken_a divine_a a_o kind_n of_o mad-fellow_n and_o pot-companion_n and_o though_o ●e_n use_v often_o as_o be_v credible_o or_o 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