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A34534 Dolus an virtus?, or, An answer to a seditious discourse concerning the religion of England and the settlement of reformed Christianity in its due latitude to which are added, the votes of Parliament. Corbet, John, 1620-1680.; England and Wales. Parliament. House of Commons. 1668 (1668) Wing C6252A; ESTC R19442 23,495 41

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to act all this without regret as things of no moment amongst their momentous progeny Surely had you not already moulded every thing amongst your selves unto your own satisfaction so that you are now ready as you phrase it your self to stand in your stations you would not yet have dropt from your Pen these your most villanous and impious derisions let me prophesie for once however plausible and facile the means you have projected may appear now unto you you will miss of your end as you have once already through the infinite mercie of Almightie God to this poor Nation and fall your selves into these heavie miseries which you mention as slight things by way of derision to the State and Kingdom § 14 To prevent all these inconveniencies and miseries your Legislative prudence tells us That all that are thought fit to abide with security so that it seems there are some you think fit to force again into Exile though you will not now name them may be reduced to three sorts you would first have an established order made up of such as are proportionable to the ends of Church and State secondly a limited Tolleration of some others and thirdly a discreet Connivance to the rest according to charity and safety But who shall be placed in the first and who in the other ranks must be concealed till the time of acting in particular what here you word in general be in season And although a vulgar man can hardly distinguish betwixt Tolleration and Connivance yet distinguished they must be for you will have three sorts I suppose although you never speak it your self in respect to three states of Dissenters Presbiterians Independents and Quakers c. Presbiterians you would have put into the comprehensive state with Episcopal Protestants settled and established and cherished by Law The Independents are only to be tollerated but with careful restrictions that they come not too near the Line The Quakers to be wisely and charitably connived at as rules of safety may suggest And you take this your rule it may be from the consideration of the Rainbow which hath three chief colours in it the Pumicious or Yellow-colour gilds the outward and greater semicircle refracted from the least Opacitie the Green tincture is in the middle refracted from a meaner thickness of matter the Purple is the interior of the least semicircle and therefore so much the darker for stronger is the action of the Luminous bodie in the outward Periphere and greater the Opacitie in the inward and a mean of both in the middle The Presbiterian must be put in the outward and greater Circle with the Episcopal Protestants here called the comprehensive state or established and cherished order as next to the firmament The less lightsom and greenish Independent must be in the middle state of Tolleration as further from God And the Quaker who professeth himself to be the only pure light must be content with the lower Rim of discreet connivance which being nearest the earth hath more of Opacitie in it and less of light If you do not mean this pray tell us what you mean I am sure you would have the fine Yellow Presbiterian to be in the Circle of comprehensive approbation or else your whole Book signifies just nothing § 15 Now to let us know something more of your mind as far as generalities will go concerning this Established Order stated in its due Latitude you tell us here and in your Sixteen and Seventeen Sections three words more The first is That this established Order must be sure to be made wide enough that it may take in so many as may be able to controul all the rest those forms of men which use to be imposed on the Consciences of those who enter in being so far made void that they may neglect them without offence and hold only to indisputable Truths and indispenceable Duties This is in plain English to let the Presbiterians come within the line of Communication and favour with the Episcopal Divines now cherished and all the rest kept out that they may have some bodie under them to controul But why should any be kept out that use the very same Plea for themselves which you now do and if you once proceed so far as to give any reason for their Exclusion you shall find that they have already used the same for yours But you will not be in Heaven except you may have some bodie there to controul and trample on You first were begotten and born with this controuling spirit and if it should once fail you would be no more your selves let me tell you a secret To controul and trample upon Inferiours is but a Presbiterians Propertie but to controul Superiours is his very Essence and Nature § 16 Your second word is That the Dissenters who desire to be included in this Comprehensive state under the paternal favour and care of Magistrates Presbiterians you mean are very capable of such an inclusion as being those whose Principles are fitted for Government and Doctrine according to Godliness and so ready to cement with the Church of England which is true in substance though defective in Discipline and Rules compiled by men which the true Sons of the Church cannot swallow They allow of true Episcopacy as ballanced with Presbiters They admit of a Liturgy and are satisfied in their Judgments concerning the lawfulness of it and Ceremonies too if consonant to the Word and Rules of Scripture the time was when you threw us into blood about it but it is well if the miraculous hand of God in restoring the Church hath convinced your judgments but I doubt 't is but conditionally if you may be admitted And you say It is our misery that the favoured Party will never condescend but still trample upon the rest But Sir we perceived but lately that you would not your selves be otherwise favoured than that you might have some left out to trample on But as to that favoured part unto whose Societie you would be taken you let them know in this word of yours That you mean still to think as you have thought and speak and act as you have done hitherto but yet notwithstanding you are very capable of that their Association because they giving an example of Moderation must condescend to let you the wisest of Dissenters sit upon their Benches whilst you are wilfully resolved to condescend and complie with them in nothing The Church of England never excepted against your Principles and Doctrines which be conform to Government and Godliness What you disavow what you have railed at so unjustly and your implacableness in your own wayes which it is unknown to this day whither they will tend or in what they can rest This is the only impediment of your favour and your general cautation of your own holiness sobriety justice and industry all which we have fully experimented is no recantation of this nor any real way of Sociation § 17 Your
Dissatisfaction disgust and disorder here amongst us Because Reform'd Christianity is not settled and cherished in its due extent O Sir ought you not here to have expressed plainly and cleerly what you mean by Pure reformed Christianity and what is the due and right extent thereof This is the great and only work you had to doe which you dissemble and neglect and only tell us in general That the line of this extent must be the measure of all mens Zeal That this will advance Gods Kingdome and the Churches Glory That this will promote the designes of Gospel being true Protestantisme in its Latitude this is all can be gathered from you what is then the Latitude what the right extent of Reformed Christianity it is say you A measure extended in its right Latitude for God and the Churches Glory what is it It is a Latitude cherished unto its extent according to the designes of Gospel thus you enlighten us what do we hear by all this but what Protestant Conformists and Non-Conformists Papists and all say as well as you and yet the Land is never a whit the wiser But you think more then you speak as wise ones use to doe and speak indeed like an awful Legislator that is modelling a Plat-form of government within himself and we must not know what you doe till you have done it I may indeed conjecture your meaning and think you would only have the Presbiterians included within this line of Communication and true extent of Reformed Christianity so that made equal with the Reverend Bishops they may Preach in Pulpits what now they utter in darkness and by their Vocal Zeal render Episcopacy first unnecessary then inexpedient and at length Antichristian But I will not use any conjecture of my own nor understand any more then you would have me only give me leave to tell you unto your no lesse satisfaction then what you have given us That Reformed Christianity is already settled rooted and cherished in the Land unto its due extent unto its true Latitude unto the right measure of Zeal that will advance Gods Kingdome and the Churches Glory promote virtue and all the designes of Gospel in the very best reformed way which is Protestantisme in its just and proper Latitude What you propose to be done as not done is done already so that all your Discourse Ratiocination and Legislation for ought I see yet is needless § 11 In your Eleventh Sect. you tell us as is before mention'd How momentous in the Nation Non-Conformists are and now we may well expect to hear whether all this momentous People be within the pretended extent of Reformed Chrstianity or no and who these momentous people be but no such matter your discourse is large and wide as they are telling us they are every where spread amongst the Nobility Gentry and Trading party in no small ranks and relations called Fools by some and pitied by others and this is all enough indeed to augment our fears but our knowledge is but where it was § 12 Your Twelfth Section pretends to strike a smart blow and your Thirteenth Section sayes it is not smart at all something you have to say and in the verie saying of it you would have us to believe it is nothing Violence say you towards Non-conformists will do no good with them that are a rational willing People to dispute and disobey the Government of Church and State numerous momentous sober and peaceable men sufficiently experienced in the late times in whom no small part of the Nations sobriety frugality and industry doth reside who are not the Wasters but mostly in the number of Getters by plundring the whole Nation with whom Trade will cease the Vitals of the Land expire Money grow scarce Rents fall and all for the loss of those men who rule themselves wholly by that great Principle of Protestantism Judgement of Discretion Nor will there be found Magistrates to put such forceable wayes in execution upon them to the terror of the whole Nation Why do you then insinuate the suspicion of these fears But we understand the figure of your stile in your whole Discourse and do not question by the assistance of God but that the wisdom of His Majestie will obviate all the designs and threats of your Partie in the mean time Pray declare what Violence is either acted or so much as thought of against those so rational so willing so sober so peaceable so momentous People He that pretends a fear in himself where no fear is may well be suspected to contrive evil against his Neighbour whom he pretends to be afraid of Remember this it is no secret propertie of Malice and Sedition but well enough known we have not yet forgot Jealousies and Fears § 13 But if any man say you in your Thirteenth Section surmise That this Representation in your Discourse is a challenge to the Higher Powers and a demand of Liberty and a Threatning if not granted he is much mistaken And why so O say you Rulers themselves must be ruled by Reason or do worse And so must their Subjects too or else all will go ill but which is the Reason Paramount in this case that of Subjects or their Rulers But how doth this rid us of the fears you latelie put us in Rulers must know their People who is ignorant of that and yet it were to be wished they did not know too near and sensibly some of their ill qualities which were better stifled Alas these Dissenters know they should have patience and stand in their stations 't is true but knowing and doing are two things and so is it likewise to stand in their stations in their own Houses and in a Camp Their Discomposure may speak Woe and Misery not Wars and Tumults Marry Sir Woe and Miserie is too much but all our Woe and Miserie hath hitherto proceeded from Wars and Tumults as their original issue and if you assure us of the like Effect we may well dread the like Cause Their sullen Mutinies make no noise though they may loosen all the joints and ligaments of Policy They have not any Convulsive motions though they may bring a Paralitick or Hectick distemper or Atrophy or stop the current of vital blood in the veins of the State O hold Sir your heart runs over too abundantly And is this your Rhetorick of persuading us to fear nothing from this sober peaceable rational and willing People because the Discomposure they are in will bring nothing but Woe and Misery their sullen Mutinies only loosing the joints and ligaments of Policy their momentous issue will bring only a Paraletick or Hectick distemper c. nothing else no not any thing else You cannot surely but smile in your own bosome whilst you use such frightful horrors and dreadful expectations as these to acquit us of fear Do you esteem all these dismal Events upon a Nation as Trifles And are your sober peaceable rational and willing People ready
reaped nothing considerable besides the plundering the Nation to what you expected for your ten Years policie sweat and labour And that very same Authoritie which then did back you did by the just judgment of God so refine it self by casting out their Members which were judged by the rest not pure enough for their Design that at last it dwindled into nothing And you have now lived to see the same Church and State settled again and cherished by the Magistrates to the infinite satisfaction of all honest and sober men which you had overthrown as you thought for evermore And this is the only thing you dread again here expressed by your self in such general words as before we did not but now do wholly understand You fear strifes the consequence of changings the hurrying into extremes the excursion of some spirits the uncertainty and vacillations in Government unfix'd Liberty c. All this fear in one word is lest you be frustrated of your end as you was before And you have very good reason to fear it for why may not the Body of Presbiterians drop into several parts to undermine and ruine themselves after the Victory obtain'd by piece-meals till the last drop left alone dry up or be consumed by other second causes as well as the Body of Puritans then did And therefore you think it better all things rightly considered rather than fight again with so much expence to an uncertain event and it may be become liable to pay for the mischief you have formerly done to entreat the Clergy that they would be pleased out of their own great love and bounty to make you partakers of what they enjoy For it is but a little thing a triste a thing meer inaifferent a very nothing that differences you and them All Sacred Truths All Indispensable Duties All Established Principles All Divine Rules of Sacraments Prayers and Worship All indisputable Verities they all agree in most harmoniously and the other little small indifferent petty things let them not be imposed to the Churches distemper and religious damage Here is the sum and secret of the wise Dissenters They would not be thought yet fully resolved to raise any more Wars because it prospered with them so ill before nor threaten as they did nor exaggerate the weightiness of the Cause as they did but try now for a while some contrary Topick means that for ought they know may speed better Their End indeed which is their own Profit is the same it was but the means to obtain it is new viz. Humble Supplications and that which hinders this Union which in Processe of our late Wars were Fundamental Points and the very Vitals of Christianity yet they must be called in this calmer way Indifferent little things for things that are begged must be called little though they are never so great but when they are demanded by force they must be named Great though never so little The doubt that our Reverend Bishops may justly have is Whether a Condescention to incorporate you into their own Sphere may not prove ruinous to their own Clergy and the whole State for whilst you are below as Suppliants your differences are little but when you are in power they will be then momentous again And so the established Government of the Church must perish by their own good liking § 18 After you have now pretty well seated your self in your own firmament as you think it you utter two words in this Section unto such as you left in a Region below you gaping there for Tolleration and Connivence and in it you deliver us your Rule and in your Nineteenth your Counsel Your Rule is That other Dissenters besides you wise ones although they may have taken in some Principles of Church government lesse congruous to National Settlement be not oppressed but have their liberty yet not an inordinate one but limited by the safety of true Religion in general and of the established order Here you are Lording it already over your Brethren Dissenters whilst you are assuring them that you would not be a means of exposing them to oppression contempt and hatred but would admit their Plea as far as it would goe which you intend to be judge of For if God hath received them say you why should their fellow servants ah humble Soul reject or afflict them causelesly but if your heart after Legislative Prudence shall think and declare that God hath not received them then woe be to them and their Plea This is all the assurance you give of your moderation when you shall come into Power and all the Rule you lay down to us for Tolleration and Connivence leaving us to guess what you mean in particular by this your Tolleration how it 's distinguished from Connivence who should be connived at and who tollerated and wherein may consist this safety of Religion and the established Order by which the Tolleration must be measured But before we proceed further pray let me ask you how comes it to pass that you being but a Part of the Dissenters should pretend any preeminence over the rest of the Dissenters and by what right do you pretend to measure out their Tolleration and Connivence more then they doe yours Doe you think that these Dissenters who ever they be have not the same Plea that you have for their more favourable Tolleration and Connivence which you allot them They have and use the same in your own words and say that consequently their Profession and way is not to be streighned according to your pragmatical and simple Tolleration and Connivence so likewise doe they humbly shew that this their Plea is no threatning to Rulers nor intimation of Rebellion and a little more humbly too then you doe for standing wholly upon that main Principle of Protestantisme the judgment of Discretion there is none of the other Dissenters besides your selves that say That the discomposure they are in shall bring woe and misery that their sullen mutinies shall loosen the joints and ligaments of Pollicy but using your meeker Phrases acknowledge That to abide in their Stations to have patience under grievances to sweeten their Governours by humility and modesty is their best security And they plead with your selves That if any thing hath been amiss in their Practices or Principles that a looking back to former discords mars the most hopefull redintegration All the Excuses which you use for the many enormous Principles and Practices of Presbiterians the very same is the justification and excuse of all the other Dissenters if they have been faulty in the like manner And by all that which is your own Plea may those more innocent Dissenters whether Independents or Quakers c. hope as well as you to be placed in the firmament of the Established order and not to be left below by the meer judgment of their elder brother in iniquity in the dark Regions of Tolleration and Connivence where they are sure to be
reservation you would have said Over all Persons and over all Causes as well Ecclesiastical as Civil then we had understood you but we are well satisfied how Anti-Monarchical Presbiterianism is And if you are so well satisfied in the ancient fundamental Constitution of this Kingdom what means your whole pragmatical Legislative Discourse wherein the factious and seditious Models that you have cast in your supercilious Noddle are proposed as sufficient to persuade the changing the fundamental Constitution of the Kingdom especially of the Church which hath been established by the wisdom of so many Parliaments but the reason of this boldness you ingenuously confess in this Section when you say That as some set their wits a work in framing so do others in evading the designs of such Engagements which are no less than the Laws of the Land in this particular which I could advise you for Conscience sake if there is any Obedience to be paid to the Higher Powers and what they enact to bear more Reverence and Obedience to and not so seditiously endevour their overthrow otherwise you may chance meet with the Goats Fate described in the Poet Rode Caper vitem tamen hinc cum stabis ad aras In tua quod fundi cornua possit erit Then according to your own words The condition of the Dissatisfied because they wilfully and seditiously will be so may without damage or just scandal to any be made such that they shall not long for changes but gladly embrace present things and then the implacably evil minded will want matter to work upon and rest without hope of disturbing the Publick Peace which your seditious insinuation so cunningly endevours when you give us in this Section the Character of the People of England in these words The English in general are an ingenuous and open-hearted People and if unluckie accidents discompose them not they are of themselves disposed to have their Kings in great veneration Is not this a huge piece of Rhetorick to persuade His Majesty that the approbation and exaltation of Presbiterians is his own great Interest if it bears any sense or construction it must speak thus Presbiterians profess much affection to Monarchy and the Royal Family and have the King in great veneration but if He grant not what they demand they will not do it they have stiffly both by Pen and Sword resisted and opposed all Authority and if He will not do what they will have Him it will prove an unluckie accident that shall discompose them and put them quite besides it and then we must expect if not Wars and Tumults as we have had yet Woe and Misery Thus forsooth is established the Kings Interest § 21 In the next place you pretend to demonstrate the Church and Clergies interest and benefit by the Legal Establishment of Presbiterians But here as you did before you bring no argument to the Point but having to deal with the Clergy more in this Section than in any other you lay about you like a mad man vilifying them as reproach unto the Church telling us That the more considerate Sons of the Church do observe and bewail such dangerous miscarriages by Simony Pluralitics Non-residency and Profaneness as threaten a second downfall That if the Church would flourish the Bishops must not be the head of such Ministers as for Ignorance and Lewdness are a scandal and scorn to their Neighbours c. I suppose you mean your selves for the more considerate Sons of the Church and therefore you should have done well to have named who are so guilty and where they are that they might receive their reward but I hope it only proceeds from your malice which is very hot against the Bishops and Clergy witness these your words It is taken for granted that neither Conscience nor Interest will permit the Bishops and Clergy of England to unite to the See of Rome Their Doctrine is too pure and their judgment too clear for a full compliance with Popery Here you imitate Archers who draw back the Arrow that they may wound with a greater force you vindicate their Conscience and Interest their Doctrine and their Judgement and yet most maliciously wound them with your full compliance There are more of this nature which I shall let pass and observe how with the same breath you magnifie your selves saying Presbiterian Ministers are Godly and Learned able and apt to teach the People by experience we know what stiling your selves Labourers in the service of the Lord of the Harvest The chief Shepherds faithful servants Orthodox and pious Ministers Godly and peaceable men preaching only the indubitable truths of Christianity Men of known moderation c. One would wonder at your impudent partiality and your shameless malicious scandals if you did not presently discover your design in them when you say The Religion of any State will sink if it is not held up in its venerable estimation amongst the People By these actions of you and your Party the World doth take notice what men are cast out and why and thinks it is the honour strength and safety of the Church that such men be numbred amongst their opposites who can with Conscience pretend That it is sincerely wished that the Clergie may hold their state in safety and honour that they may never be laid low for want of meet Revenue or Dignity and in the very next Page propose the cutting off some Luxuriances from some of the Highest Order and the sharing among many what is ingrossed by a few Now we fully understand you hitherto I confess I was amazed although I well knew what were the Motives that moved you to procure our late Troubles what could be the chief drift in your design seeing you here sincerely wished That the Clergie might hold their state in safety and honour and that you so often in your Discourse declared that the things of difference between you and the Church were so inconsiderable that you professed you could bear with others in the practice of them although you could not practice them your selves and that you could submit to some things which you cannot approve and that not for unworthy ends but for Conscience sake That you acknowledged also That the Presbiterians generally by which it is evident you are not all of a mind nor ever will be held the Church of England to be a true Church c. and therefore that they did frequent the Worship of God in the Publick Assemblies And that many that press earnestly after further Reformation which it seems is never to have an end do yet communicate as well in the Sacraments as the Word preached and Prayer c. and therefore for divers reasons you lay down you say It may be well thought they would accept reasonable terms and rest satisfied therein O! would you again be fing'ring the Revenues of the Church are these the reasonable terms which your avarice calls a moderation because
any thing which Your Majesty hath thought fit to propose And though we do no way doubt but that the unreasonable Distempers of mens Spirits and the many Mutinies and Conspiracies which were carryed on during the late Intervalls of Parliament did reasonably incline Your Majesty to endevour by Your Declaration to give some allay to those ill humours till the Parliament Assembled and the hopes of Indulgence if the Parliament should consent to it especially seeing the pretenders to this Indulgence did seem to make some Titles to it by virtue of Your Majesties Declaration from Breda Nevertheless we Your Majesties most Dutifull and Loyal Subjects who are now returned to serve in Parliament from those several parts and places of Your Kingdom for which we are chosen Do humbly offer to Your Majesties great Wisdom That it is in no sort advisable that there be any Indulgence to such persons who presume to dissent from the Act of Uniformity and the Religion established For these Reasons VVE have considered the nature of Your Majesties Declaration from Breda and are humbly of opinion That Your Majesty ought not to be pressed with it any further Because it is not a Promise in it self but only a Gracious Delaration of Your Majesties Intentions to do what in You lay and what a Parliament should advise Your Majesty to do and no such Advice was ever given or thought fit to be offered nor could it be otherwise understood because there were Laws of Uniformity then in being which could not be dispensed with but by Act of Parliament They who do pretend a right to that supposed promise put the Right into the hands of their Representatives whom they chose to serve for them in this Parliament who have passed and Your Majesty consented to the Act of Uniformity If any shall presume to say that a Right to the benefit of this Declaration doth still remain after this Act passed It tends to dissolve the very Bonds of Government and to suppose a disability in Your Majesty and the Houses of Parliament to make a Law contrary to any part of Your Majesties Declaration though both Houses should advise Your Majesty to it We have also considered the nature of the Indulgence proposed with reference to those Consequences which must necessarily attend it It will establish Schism by a Law and make the whole Government of the Church precarious and the Censures of it of no Moment or Consideration at all It will no way become the Gravity or wisdom of a Parliament to pass a Law at one Session for Uniformity and at the next Session the reasons of Uniformity continuing still the same to pass another Law to frustrate or weaken the execution of it It will expose Your Majesty to the restless Importunity of every Sect or Opinion and of every single person also who shall presume to dissent from the Church of England It will be a cause of increasing Sects and Sectaries whose numbers will weaken the true Protestant Profession so far that it will at least be difficult for it to defend it self against them And which is yet further considerable those Numbers which by being troublesome to the Government find they can arrive to an Indulgence well as their numbers increase be yet more troublesom that so at length they may arrive to a general Tolleration which Your Majesty hath declared against and in time some prevalent Sect will at last contend for an establishment which for ought can be foreseen may end in Popery It is a thing altogether without President and will take away all means of convicting Recusants and be inconsistent with the method and proceedings of the Laws of England Lastly It is humbly conceived that the Indulgence proposed will be so far from tending to the Peace of the Kingdom that it is rather likely to occasion great disturbance And on the contrary That the asserting of the Laws and the Religion establisht according to the Act of Uniformity is the most probable means to produce a setled Peace and Obedience throughout Your Kingdom Because the variety of Professions in Religion when openly indulged doth directly distinguish men into parties and withall gives them opportunity to count their numbers which considering the Animosities that out of a Religious pride will be kept on foot by the several Factions doth tend directly and inevitably to open disturbance Nor can Your Majesty have any Security that the Doctrine or Worship of the several Factions which are all Governed by a several Rule shall be consistent with the Peace of Your Kingdom And if any persons shall presume to disturb the Peace of the Kingdom We do in all humility declare That we will for ever and in all Occasions be ready with our utmost endevour and assistance to adhere to and serve Your Majesty according to our bounden Duty and Allegiance FINIS §. 15. P. 31. P. 32. l. 1. §. 14. P. 28. l. 10. P. 35. l. 1. P. 41. l. 21. Pag. 41. l. 33. Pag 42. l. 23. Pag. 20. l. 30. Pag. 31 18. Pag. 33 31. Pag 37 15. Pag. 34. l. 9. Pag. 32. l. 24. Pag. 22. l. 16. Pag. 21. l. 15. Pag. 17. l. ●● Pag. ●● l 19. Pag. 37. l. ●