place in your sense and applied it to the purpose For my part I finde a Temple even under the Apostasie measured out and an Altar and some worshipping in it Revel. 11. 1. Yea I finde Angels i. e. Magistrates Ministers and other persons of note whom the Lord would use to execute his judgements upon the Antichristian world Revel. 14. 15 17 18. conversant in it and the four Beasts abiding in it Revel. 15. 7. The Temple then which was before the seven last plagues fulfilled was not so shut but some did enter into it and served God therein Yea that John during this time saw it opened in heaven Revel. 11. 19. and 15. 6. And if Sion and the Temple in your opinion be one and the same thing and both note the state of a true visible Church as you seem to think it is plain that before and under the vials there are acknowledged in the Apocalyps visible Churches and the same true and right unto which Christians had accesse and in which they were conversant You must pardon me then if herein I do not concurre with you that none could enter into the Temple or arrive at Sion i. e. that no visible Church could be found into which men might have entrance and admission untill all the vials were poured out I do rather agree with other godly Interpreters who do understand it of those people who yet for their whole body are clean out of the Church viz. the Jews and Pagans but chiefly the Jews of which it seems no full harvest sufficient to make up a Church or Churches shall or can come in untill the vials be fully poured out to Romes utter destruction It doth not exclude those who were already admitted and entered into the Temple as were the reformed Churches of the western world The second thing which you adde is That we have not yet wholly put off our Babylonish Garments Touching which I shall not say much because you expresse not what you mean by these Babylonish Garments nor wherein they are not put off Only two things I do reply 1. That the retaining of some rags of the Babylonish Garments though it be a deformity to a Church can no more keep a Christian company or person out of Sion then sacrificing unto God in high places somewhat after an Heathenish manner could or did put the Church of the Jews out of Sion or Polygamy not warranted by the Lords first Institution of Marriage put Abraham Jacob or other holy men out of the Catalogue of the ancient and godly Patriarchs or the remainder of some sinfull infirmity in a man regenerate barre him of Communion with Christ 2. Those seven Angels which had the last seven Plagues as they came out of the Temple so also they were cloathed with white and pure linen and were girded about the brests with golden girdles Revel. 15 6. Now what are those Angels but types of those instruments which the Lord would use in executing those seven last Plagues And what is the meaning of their coming out of the Temple but that they were persons belonging to some of the Protestant reformed Churches Now surely as the habit of the members was such was the habit of the Churches to which they did belong For how could they come so purely cloathed out of Churches utterly impure These Churches therefore which are our reformed Churches of these dayes had cast off their Babylonish Garments and were clad with fine linen which is the righteousnesse of the Saints The third thing you say is That the time for visible marriage is not yet come untill all enemies be brought down and God only reign and that therefore all visible Church-marriage since the Apostasic taken up before the time being onely founded on the will name and power of man without Gods call must needs be bestial Answ. Concerning this I say first That it is much the Jews excuse Hag. 1. 2. saying That the time was not yet come that the house of the Lord should be built Whenas the time for building it was seasonable enough and nothing letted but their greater care to build their own houses then the Lords house So say you The time is not yet come that visible Churches should be gathered and married unto Christ in visible manner wheâ—as the time is seasonable enough but that many have more minde to disturb the work by venting fancies of their own then to contribute their endeavours towards the work Secondly This is to make Christ to have been a Widower as it were or a Bridegroom without a known or visible Bride an Head without a visible Body a King without a visible Kingdom for more then these thousand years and how long he is like so to continue none can determine For what is Christs visible Spouse Body Kingdom but a visible Church and none such hath been according to your opinion right and true all this time of the Apostasie nor yet is or shall be untill all the vials be poured out Thirdly This is to make all the reformed Churches which since their breaking off from Rome have been erected or are now in Germany France Netherland Scotland Old and New England to be Antichristian and bestial which in all moderate and understanding mens judgement will be thought a rash uncharitable and audacious Assertion Fourthly It may as well be said by you That there is no visible Marriage between Christ and particular Christians before the time as that there is none between Churches and Christ For no particular Christian can be a meet Bride for Christ who is not cloathed with pure fine and shining linen viz. The righteousnesse of the Saints And if no Churches shall be found before that time fitly thus arrayed for their Marriage with Christ what sound reason can be yielded why any single Christians can be so cloathed when as commonly they receive their spiritual birth being cloathing and all in visible Churches where they live Now nihil dat quod non habâ—t None can give that which they have not And if no visible Churches can be found thus arrayed it is not easie to imagine how single Christians should obtain it If private Christians may be so cloathed before that time and so fitted for visible marriage with Christ so also may whole Churches whenas Churches are made up of particular Christians and particular Christians are thus cloathed among other ends that they may be fitted for members of visible Churches But to make this good you referre us to Revel. 19. 7. which how that is understood not of reformed Churches in general but of the Church of the Jews when that Nation shall be converted to the Faith by the most learned Interpreters of the Apocalyps I know you well know And for my part though I will not say as he did Malo cum Platone errare quam cum aliis vera sentire yet I cannot but say That it is farre safer to follow so many godly learned and judicious Divines who have
superstitions and inventions in the room of them Christs Ordinances may and do still remain Christs Ordinances for matter and substance though in wrong hands and abused As the great Seale of the Kingdome is still the right and true Seale though in the hands of an usurping Lord Keeper and imployed to wrongfull ends Obj. But the Pope had another Key given him and other Officers as Locusts Revel. 9. Answ. Let it be so that another Key was given to the Pope viz. when he claimed to be an Universal Bishop Christs Vicar and the Head of the Church under him and so usurped an illimitted power in businesses secular and spiritual and that he had with all other Officers called Locusts viz. Monks Friars Priests Abbats Cardinals and the whole Popish Clergy yet with all subtilty he did retain the Key of Christs Discipline in Ordination Excommunication Suspension c. and made use of it to promote his own Kingdom yea and had for substance some of the Officers ordained by Christ such as were Preachers and Administrers of holy things in particular Congregations though under other names as Parsons and Vicars and not without some corruption in their admission and administration Notwithstanding as amongst all the corruptions under Popery Baptism for the substance remained true and right in as much as such as were baptized were baptized In the Name of the Father Sonne and holy Ghost according to the form by Christ appointed Neither have any taught or affirmed That Baptism under Popery was or is null and to be repealed So for the substance a true and right Ministry might be and was there found viz. such a one as by which men were called and set aside to preach the Word and minister the holy things of God Object There was no other face of Officials among Papists but of these Locusts in Luthers time who himself was a Monk Answ. There was among Papists in and before Luthers time Officials as you stile them which are not to be reckoned among these Locusts but such as the holy Ghost in the Apocalyps doth honour and account of as true and worthy Ministers of Christ though what outward calling they had was from Popish Bishops and Presbyters and themselves were Monks and Friars or of some such Popish order It cannot be denied that many of those which during the Apostasie for twelve hundred and sixty years did stand up by Writing and Preaching to witnesse Truth against Popery were Bishops Priests Monks or Friars as in our England Bishop Grosted John Wickliff a Priest in other Countreys Taulerus a Preacher John Hus and Jerom of Prague Priests Savaralona a Monk and one Sylvester a Friar with many other the like All which notwithstanding that their Ordination was according to the times from Popish Bishops and their order superstitious yet the holy Ghost doth reckon of them as Christs faithfull Witnesses and so his true and lawfull Ministers and not any of those Locusts which came out of the smoke of the bottomlesse pit So Chap 1â— 6 8 9. there are three Angels which in course follow one another preaching the Gospel and declaiming against Babylon and the Beast Who are these now Not proper Angels coming from heaven but rather according to the currant of Interpreters a series and rank of Ministers which were raised up by the Lord by their preaching to make way for the ruine of the Pope and restoring the Church such as by some learned men are named in particular viz. Ockam John of Gaunt Dantes our John Wickliff John Hus Jerom of Prague Luther men that lived in the Church of Rome had their external calling from that Church were of some of their Popish orders and yet are acknowledged to be Angels as well as those of the seven Churches of Asia that is true Ministers of Christ raised sent and authorized by him It doth not then derogate from the truth of an official Ministry if he be a sound Preacher of the Gospel that a man hath been ordained thereunto by a Bishop Popish not only in regard of the Office but in Doctrine also But this acknowledgment of such for Angels doth approve such Ordination good for substance though in some things it be corrupt and defective as before I said of baptizing It is then a frivolous cavil and which by this sentence of the holy Ghost is put to silence that men make against our English Ministers as Antichristian because ordained by Bishops when such so ordained are called Angels and their Ordination is conferted on them by Bishops which were sound in the profession of the Gospel Presbyters and Preachers of the Gospel and in the worke did joyne other Presbyters with them Object But the visible Church it self failed which is the foundation of these Officials and latter Ordinances and so these must needs fail Answ. This is somewhat indeed Nay so much as will carry the cause if it be made good It is not true as is before shewed That the visible Church is the foundation of these Officials or latter Ordinances but Christs Institution and promise but the visible Church is invested with a power and right to use them and that onely and not any other civil or heretical Society and for the Churches good and service they were by Christ appointed So that if there were in those times of the Apostasie no visible Church it may be granted that they failed since there was no Church which had power to use them or for whose service they were to be used But me thinks for you to say That the visible Church hath failed is much one as if you should affirm That the pillars of the earth were broken down and overthrown For the visible Church standeth on as firm a foundation as they that is Gods Ordinance Power and Faithfulness Concerning which point by a visible Church may be meant a company of Christians with their seed joyned together in one place and setled in a right and compleat order for the worship of God and exercise of all Gods Ordinances Now that there hath been such a visible Church all along the Apostasie in any one place or in many places successively cannot I think easily be shewed nor is it needfull for this matter to be proved Next by a visible Church may be meant a company of persons professing the true Religion abstaining from false worship and worshipping God in a pure way though for the most dispersed in sundry places and meetings for Gods worship but in small companies Such a Church of God certainly hath been and shall be perpetual Such a Church of God there was in Israel under their great Apostasie viz. A company that did not bow the knee to Baal 1 King 18. 19. and did in solemn times meet for the main parts of Gods worship as hearing of his Word and Prayer 2 Kings 4. 23. though not for Sacrifice which ordinarily was onely to be offered at the Temple Such a one was there under the Babylonish Captivity
to seek our Sion and to joyn with her in society for the worship of God which Sion if it were not then extant or to be enjoyed the command were vain and their endeavour would be to no purpose Thirdly This conceit and course doth cast a foul blot of gross ignorance or rash presumption upon all reformed Churches which upon their breaking off from Rome have not contented themselves with a bare separation but did also set up evangelical Churches opposite to the Roman for Doctrine Worship and Discipline some lesse and some more pure and perfect So hath all Reformation been practised in Germany France Netherland Scotland Old and New England of late And what man is he or who be they unlesse they can prove themselves new Apostles or Prophets or have the pregnant word of God for it and build not only upon their own conjectural interpretation of prophetical mysteries about which other godly learned are at a stand who will presume to tax and blemish so many famous Churches and so many godly and learned Divines which were their guides and leaders Surely it is not piety to condemn the generation of the righteous Psalm 73. 15. nor humility to slight the consent of so many Churches of God 1 Cor. 11. 16. Fourthly It is well worth the while to scan the time when this call for separation Revel. 18. 4. was given And if all circumstances be well weighed this call was not proclaimed untill God had put it into the heart of some Kings and States to joyn to invade and destroy Rome itself which preparation is intimated before Chap. 17. 16. and was surely about the pouring out of the last or some of the last vials And now being ready to give the on-set on Rome by this voice they are called on to plague her thorowly Revel. 18. 6. At which time this call is directed to such of Gods people as might then be hidden in that idolatrous City or the adjoining Territories by a personal flight to forsake her and those places of danger and provide for their safety Which things considered it is not clear that the time of this call is yet come since we see small preparation made as yet or intended by Christian States or Princes against Rome the Throne of the Beast or Italy his Nest and Fortresse And how long it will be ere this be effected onely the Lord knows I am sure that most accounts that learned men have hitherto made of these things have missed and they are in a mist about the three or four last vials not being able certainly to unfold them So that if you have no other ground for your separation then that call as you produce none other you are in danger to prevent the due time of separation and to do all you do in it meerly upon your own will without Gods call As for the spiritual separation made by Protestant Princes and Churches from Rome in Doctrine and Worship as they had a warrant for it from this call the reasons whereof being such as belong to all times and persons not to partake in Romes sins do sufficiently enforce it so had they pregnant grounds for it also from other general commands to flee Idolatry and set up Gods Worship I may last ask Why you and your company go farther in your practice then bare separation For if by separation Revel. 18. 4. you understand a separation meerly negative to be meant as you needs must to make it serve your turn by what warrant do you on the Lords-day celebrate holy Assemblies and exercise the main parts of Gods Worship by your selves and in opposition to our publick Assemblies which you account bestial For this kinde of separation allows no such practice but confines it self to an abstaining from all communion in the publick Worship if corrupt and so farre as it is corrupt But if it be a positive separation that the godly are called to as your practice doth interpret it then nothing lets but others also may set up Churches for the enjoying of all Ordinances as well as you for some And surely when the Apostle did urge such a call for separation unto the Corinthians 1 Cor. 6. 17. out of Isa. 52. 11. he did conceive that the Christians of Corinth were not onely called barely to separate from Paganish Idolatry but also to join together in the true worship of God Fifthly Here follow some things which I apprehend to be some reasons of this your Assertion touching this point of separation 1. We are yet you say but in our journey to Sion visibly separated and not arrived thither and so may not take on us to set up Sion-like Churches Answ. But why are we but on our journey unto Sion visibly separated when as the Apostle describeth this to be the estate of all imbracing the Gospel that they are come to Mount Sion and the celestial Jerusalem and the same not meerly invisible but visibly separated from the impious world Heb. 12. 22. 2. St John saw many thousands Revel. 14. 1. walking with the Lamb on Mount Sion and the same visible as seen by John during the time of the great Apostasie and before the time of this more publick departure and Reformation And why may not our late reformed Christians be ranged among those thousands and admitted to the same Mount Sion with them since in their Reformation they have endeavoured to conform unto them 1. In bearing their Fathers name in their forehead by an open profession of Religion 2 In restoring an orderly performance of Gods Worship by the Ministery and Church-assemblies as they praised God before the four Beasts and the Elders 3. In ascribing their redemption only to God and praising him for it which is meant by the new Song those hundred fourty four thousand did sing 4. By cleansing themselves from Popish Idolatry as those kept themselves virgins and undefiled 5. By holding forth the practice of holinesse as in the mouths of the other there was no guile 3. Admit that we be but in our way to this Sion what lets but that we may set up and use all Gods Ordinances as well as some in this our journey The Israelites whenas they were but in their way to Canaan had all Gods Ordinances set up amongst them and made use of them more or lesse as their unsetled estate and sudden occasions of removing would give leave What you seem elswhere to conclude to this purpose from the Jews bringing along the Temple-vessels with them from Babylon but not officiating with them in their way shall in its place be considered About these matters you referre me to Revel. 15. 8. where we read that the Temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God c. that none could enter into it untill the seven plagues of the seven Angels were fulfilled From whence it seems you would conclude that we are not yet come to Sion Answ. I wish you had made the argument your self opened the
bent themselves to finde out the mysteries of that Book then any one man though he would be held as singular in this mystical Divinity as Plato was in Philosophy And that which you point unto farther out of Isa. 62. 5. if they both concern one thing and time as you seem to intimate doth much confirm this Interpretation For it directly and expresly speaks of Sion and its restoring as appears by the beginning of the Chapter and what follows which if it had not its full accomplishment in the Jews Deliverance out of Babylon and their Church and Commonwealth restauration thereupon it cannot well be applied otherwise then to the last conversion of the Jewish Nation and to that excellent Church-condition whereunto they shall then be brought Secondly Touching this allegation and all other of the same kinde much used by you I wish that that notable saying of Irenaeus so much approved by learned Divines were known to or regarded by you Omnis Prophetia priusquam habeat efficaciam anigmata ambiguitas sunt hominibus Cum autem venerit tempus evenit quod Prophetatum est â—um Prophetiae habent liquidam certam expositionem All Prophecie before it be accomplished presents nothing but Riddles and matters of doubt unto men but when the time is come and that is fulfilled which was prophesied then Prophecies have a clear and certain exposition According to which most right sentence I say that the mystical Prophecies of the Apocalyps or other Scripture which are but in part fulfilled but specially such as yet are wholly to be fulfilled and so subject to various Interpretations are too too weak grounds to build such lofty opinions and assertions upon as befool all learned Divines over-turn all right and orderly Ministry and turn all latter Christian Churches into Antichristian For who is he that can infallibly say What is meant by the vials poured out on Euphrates or on the Air by the Marriage of the Lamb and of his Bride and sundry other things in the following Chapters as he ought to be able to doe that will inferre and make good such high and destructive Paradoxes as are above-mentioned There are many Prophecies in that Book already in part fulfilled as many things about the two Witnesses the distinction of the first and second Beast the vial poured out on the Sun with divers things Chap. 14 and 16. about which the learned which have searched into those Mysteries do so differ that a man cannot finde from them any sure ground to rest upon It is doubtlesse lawfull and profitable as you and others do to search into the Mysteries of that Book But for a clear and full Interpretation of some things already fulfilled much more of things to be fulfilled we must wait the Lords time to which somewhat doth accord that proverbial Speech That Veritas est temporis filia and his Revelation of them by clear and indubitable events But by these mistakes and differences of learned men as diligent and understanding searchers as our selves we should learn to be moderate and wary how we did peremptorily determine matters so abstruse and upon such our private determinations lay the weight of such notable Paradoxes and strange strains which to doe is rather rash presumption and self-confidence then true knowledge and wisdom Sixthly Now follows your fourth Assertion viz. That the breathing of the Spirit both in Officers and Ordinances which acted in them in the Primitive times is now restrained and as seems to be your meaning hath been restrained ever since the Apostasie so that they were all that while and now are but as a carcase without a soul Answ. If this be so What means have there been all this while for mens conversion and salvation For which the Lord out of his goodnesse cannot but ever make due provision From whence hath proceeded the conversion of thousands which have been wrought on since the Apostasie if not from the Officers and Ordinances that have succeeded the Primitive times and in some measure continued under the corrupt state of the Church and the spirits breathing in and working by them St John saw and that under the Apostasie a hundred fourty four thousand waiting upon the Lamb in Mount Sion Revel. 14. 1. Whence now had these their conversion but from the Spirit in those times breathing in and by the Officers and Oâ—dinances that then were Again S. John saw it seems after this on Mount Sion upon the declining of Antichrist a great number standing by a glassie-sea mingled with fire which had gotten the victory over the Beast his Image his Mark and the number of his Name singing a new Song and praising God for their deliverance Rev. 15. 2 3. Whence had these their conversion They were not I ween Aborigenes a people sprung out of the earth or let down out of the Heavens but surely had their spiritual birth and being from the Spirit breathing in the Officers and Ordinances of those times Lastly Have not thousands in these latter times in the reformed Churches and so are many the Lord be praised unto this day been converted to the faith by the preaching of the Ministers in them And what more ample testimony can there be then this that their ministery is not a carcase without a soul but that the Spirit doth breathe in the Ordinance of pteaching and Sacraments administred by them It may here by you be suggested perhaps that in all these Ages and so now they preached but as gifted men and in that way the Spirit went along with them Not as Ministers by Office Answ. This is but said and not proved and so may as easily be denied as it is affirmed 2. They in all Ages former and latter stood and acted as Ministers by Office were so acknowledged and received by the Churches yea and also Christians converted untill of late that they have been taught a new ungratefull lesson who felt the power of the Spirit working on them by their preaching did look on their conversion as a fruit of their true official Ministry and a seal thereof 3 The Apostle Paul doth produce the conversion of the Corinthians by his preaching not so much for a proof that he was a man sufficiently gifted for the work of the Ministry but as a seal of his Apostleship and as a divine testimony that as he acted as an Apostle in his Preaching so indeed he was and so they were to acknowledge him 2 Cor. 3. 2. 2 Cor. 9. 1 2. If therefore the conversion of the Corinthians were proof sufficient for Paul that he was an Apostle that is an official Minister though extraordinary surely the work of conversion formerly and now wrought by them doth suffice to make good That the Ministers of the reformed Churches have been and are right Ministers of Christ and rightly in office under him Lastly For that of Revel. 7. 1. which you point to of the four Angels holding the four windes that they
should not blow on the earth nor on the sea c. If it be certainly to be understood of the withholding of the Spirit from breathing in the Ordinances for others carry it fairly enough to another sense 1. There is nothing said in that place for the continuance how long the restraint should last much lesse is it shewed that it should last during the Apostasie 2. It may well be meant of a more sparing breathing in comparison of Primitive times not of an utter restraint 3. If it be understood of an utter restraint take notice I pray that the restraint is general and cannot by any circumstance of the Text be confined only to official preaching and Preachers as you speak but as fully reach any Preachers even your gifted men as well as them and so doth conclude an utter ceasing of the Spirit to breathe now or then in or by any means Ordinances or Preachers whatsoever which is grosly false and to affirm it were exceeding derogatory to the Lords free grace and mans salvation Seventhly In the next place it follows that we take a view of your distinction of Ordinances and your opinion about them Touching which you say some are founded more immediately on our spiritual Union with Christ I conceive you mean and the Covanant of Grace and Ministry Baptism the Lords Supper Praier Profession c. 2. Such as are footed on Church-stating such as appertain to officials yea deemed essential to them as Ordination Confirmation Excommunication Admission Absolution c. The first of these have been kept up you say thorow all the time of the deepest Apostasie and are now used rightly and to be used The second have not been alwaies rightly used but it seems to you have been and are so lost that as yet there is no due time or place for their exercise This I take to be your meaning about this point of Ordinances If I mistake it is because the matter is set down somewhat intricately by you Now touching this point we have many things to reply First I would know What Ministry you mean hath alwaies been kept up Whether a Ministry exercised onely by virtue of Gifts enabling men unto it or such as is exercised by virtue of an Office also and right calling thereunto If the first be meant it is a matter in much question Whether such a standing Ministry were ever allowed by Christ and it must be proved before we can receive it Surely if such a Ministry be currant and sufficiently authorized for ministring Word and Sacraments there was no need of an official Ministry and Christ it seems therein ordained a superfluous Ordinance according to that common Axiom Frustra fit per plura quod fieri potest per pauciora It is a vain thing and not beseeming a wise man to use many wayes to do that which may be done by a few If the latter be meant why are official Ministers by you questioned Secondly It may be asked Why you put Profession and Prayer in general in the rank of Ordinances There is a wide difference between Ordinances and Duties As to believe in Christ is a Duty not an Ordinance so to make Profession of the Christian faith is also a Duty which appertains to particular Christians in their own person so to whole Churches in their Society So likewise is Prayer as it belongs to particular men of which Paul speaks specially Colos. 4. 2. Onely publick Prayer as it is performed by the Minister in publick Assemblies for Gods Worship may come under the notion of an Ordinance Ordinances to speak properly of them are those solemn means which Christ hath appointed in his Church according to his sovereign power and good-will to communicate his grace unto us and to perform our solemn Worship unto him as the publick preaching of the Word celebration of the Sacraments publick prayer publick thanksgivings fastings or to provide for the right performance of these things as combination of Christians into Church-societies the election and ordination of Ministers and exercises of Church-Discipline Now profession and prayer are such duties as flow from that natural relation which is between God the Creator and the creature and were owing unto God without any special institution Thirdly You say That the last kinde of Ordinances are essential to Officials an improper yea false assertion unlesse you mean no more then what you said elswhere that they appertain to Officers For nothing is essential to a Church-officer or any other thing but the Matter and Form thereof which doth constitute them The Matter of an Officer are Gifts enabling him to perform it the Form an orderly putting him into that Office by such as have Authority and giving him a right to execute it The Exercise of some thing may properly and onely belong to Officers as preaching the Word and administring the Sacraments to Pastors and Teachers rightly called which yet are not essential to them Nothing can subsist or have a being in nature wanting its essentials A Pastor or Teacher may be such an one in Office and yet letted by sicknesse or some other wayes that for many weeks together he neither preach nor administer the Sacraments Fourthly It is not truly said That some Ordinances are more immediately founded in our Union with Christ For no Ordinances can be said to be founded on our Union with Christ Such things onely can rightly be said to be founded on that Union which as the proper fruit and effects thereof do flow from it to our salvation as Calling Justification Sanctification c. It may be granted that an holy right to these Ordinances and the blessed fruit of them comes and proceeds from our Union with Christ but not the Ordinances themselves of which many partake which have not nor ever shall have Union with Christ Indeed they tend either to bring men to that blessed Union or to nourish and stablish them in it To which purpose in their place serve those latter kinde of Ordinances yea Excommunication it self which is specially ordained for the good of the Elect to heal and recover them if they fall scandalously by cutting them off to the end they may repent and be restored or to prevent their infection by putting scandalous and infectious persons out of their Society But for the foundation of these and all Ordinances it is in the Institution of our Lord Jesus Christ consisting partly in a command for the use of them and partly in the promise of a blessing on the right use of them as for Teaching and Baptism is to be seen Matth. 28. 19 20. and for the Lords Supper 1 Cor. 11. 24. Fifthly It may be granted you That these Ordinances are some way founded on the Covenant of Grace if by founded you onely mean that they are some effects of it For as God by that Covenant doth oblige himself to give grace and salvation to his Elect so by consequence to provide for them all means outward and inward
that should conduce to make them partakers of the Covenant and benefits of it causing them to imbrace it and stablishing them in it But then this is not a thing peculiar to the first kinde of Ordinances but belongs also to the latter which have their use both in admitting men into fellowship with Christ and his Church and maintaining them in it Sixthly You grant That these first Ordinances have never been lost but continued all the time of the Apostasie But what doth this grant avail for any benefit to Gods people all that while or now when you did before affirm that they are but dead Ordinances and have not the Spirit breathing in or by them nor shall have untill the brightnesse of Christs coming Seventhly How doth it appear that those latter Ordinances have been lost as you seem to imply during the Apostasie more then the former 1. The use of them was held up all that while in the Antichristian Church where was Ordination Excommunication Absolution c. and that as Ordinances of Christ as well as Teaching Baptism the Lords Supper c. and since the Reformation have more or lesse been taken up and used in the reformed Churches 2. To that you say they were not alwayes rightly used nor alway in right hands I answer That if that abolish them upon the same grounds those former Ordinances may as well be said to have been lost as having been in many things corrupted and usurped by those who had little right to meddle with them 3. What reasons soever are or can be alledged for the continuance of the first sort are as strong for the continuance of this latter kinde 1. There is for these Christs Institution as well as for those 2. They were instituted not only for a time but to be continued untill the last day Ephes. â— 11 12 13. In the 11 verse there is the Institution of an Ecclesiastical and Official Ministry distinct one from another as some to be such and others to be such So that they that were Apostles Evangelists c. were not properly Pastors nor Teachers Nor they which were properly Pastors and Teachers were not Apostles nor Prophets c. If they were all the same in office and power what should need such an enumeration of so many kindes distinct one from the other verse 12. is specified the end for which they were given namely the perfect Knitting together of the Saints the work of the Ministry the edification of the body of Christ If that then during the Apostasie Christ had any Saints among men to be joyned together any work of the Ministry to be done any mystical body to be edified as doubtlesse he had all these things were to be performed by the officiall Ministry which Christ gave for that end But these things could not be all that while performed by Apostles Prophets Evangelists and therefore were done by other Officials Pastors and Teachers which Christ gave for that end and in some sort continued all those corrupt times In the 13. verse is set down how long this Ministry was to continue even untill we all meet in the unity of the faith and attain to a perfect man in Christ which will not be until the last day of the restoring and consummation of all things 1 Cor. 13. 9 10. Now if Christ did ordain such a Ministry and for such a time he hath surely for the substance maintained and continued it hitherto and so will to the end And if he have not or shall not do so it is either for want of power in him to do it or of love and care for his Churches good either of which to charge upon Christ were sinfull And if this continuance have not been in a successive order of Apostles Prophets and Evangelists which long ago have ceased it hath been continued in an Official Ministry of Pastors and Teachers such as Christ first gave and ordained 3. There is a solemn Commandment for the exercise and keeping up of Discipline untill the coming of Christ 1 Tim. 6. 13 14. There is a streight charge laid upon Timethy to keep that course of Discipline which he had prescribed him in that Epistle Vntill the appearing of Christ Now this command cannot concern Timothy onely who was not to survive so long or to that day But belongeth to the Ministers and Church-officers who in after times were to succeed him in the care and rule of the Church And if Pray continually which you alledge from 1 Thess. 5. 17. to prove that prayer as a Church-ordinance hath been alway continued it being but a command for the continual use of it and that rather of private prayer by Christians in their common course of life then of publick in Church-Assemblies be valid enough to prove your purpose this command of Paul unto Timothy for the exercise of Discipline by him prescribed to be continued unto Christs coming doth necessarily prove the continuance of it in the Church Lastly What you alledge out of Matth. 28. 19 20. for the perp tuity of teaching and Baptism makes as much for the like continued use of Discipline For as the Apostles there are bid to teach and Baptize So likewise are they commanded To teach the Nations to observe all things that he had commanded Among which the exercise of Discipline was certainly one For the maintenance of which his promise is to be present with his Ministers to the end of the world as well as for the continuance of the other Ordinances Now there are many other Scriptures which you point at for proof of this and your other points touching which I wish that you had shewed how the Scriptures pointed at conclude your points For my Logick doth not suffice to conclude the one from the other Eighthly There ensue some reasons as I conceive of them why this second sort of Ordinances are lost First This Key of Discipline was wholly resolved into the Pope I take it that you mean that it was wholly seised on by the Pope and no Discipline was exercised but under and from him Answ. So was it with Teaching Baptism and the Lords Supper and other Ordinances you speak of they were so got into the Popes hands that they were administred and managed by none but those that were authorized by the Pope or by such as under him did conferre authority for the same And if that did not null or abolish Teaching Baptism c. why should it null or abolish Discipline or any part thereof though ingrossed by the Pope and abused by him It was the policy of Satan and that great Impostour under him the Pope to seise into his hands all the Ordinances of Christ that by the shew and pretence of them he might get the credit of Religion and upholding the Christian faith and so the more closely and effectually deceive the Christian world which he could not have done if he had wholly rejected and abolished them and set up onely his own