Selected quad for the lemma: christian_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
christian_n	church_n	particular_a	pastor_n	2,231	5	9.9163	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A45163	Union pursued, in a letter to Mr. Baxter, concerning his late book of national churches published for a fuller disquisition about this subject, by the sober and composed of all sides, in order to comprehension which hath been forming, and a larger constitution of the church to be formed, when that Day of Concord comes, which the gentle aspect of Heaven in God's appointment (and the King's) of so many choice moderate bishops together at this time does presage to the nation, that the Presbyterians and Independants, that have united within themselves, may both be united also with the Church of England / by a lover of Him, and follower of peace.	Humfrey, John, 1621-1719.	1691 (1691)	Wing H3716; ESTC R15748	28,717	40

uncapable of any Catholick Officers for executing such Jurisdiction You say the Head gives the Form to a Society but Does it give the Form when there are no Organs or Officers for Government under that Head when there are no such appointed by him or can be made by Man It is true that the actual making Officers belongs to the Administration of a Government when the Government hath its Denomination and is Organical from the Constitution But where is there any such Constitution declared by Christ or Appointment of his that there should be Organs made for an Oecumenical Government If there be no such how is it a Polity without Government without virtual or actual Government or an Oecumenical Polity without an Oecumenical Government This would tempt a man to come about towards our first Doctrin of Protestants to deny any Church Catholick but the Invisible How can the Universal Coetus of Christian People dispersed through the World without Legislative or Judicial Power be Political Methinks there must be something else more than Head and Members essential to a Form of Polity whether Civil or Ecclesiastical I will tell you therefore over again the Opinion I am prone to as well as I can A National Church may be considered Materially as a Christian People or Kingdom and so are National Churches of Christ's appointment out of doubt as at the beginning acknowledged for He sent out his Officers to convert Nations rather than single Men a●● the Prophets have many Places of the calling of Nat●ons whose Answer to that Call makes them Churches But as a National Church is considered Formally in regard to the Constitution of divers particular Countries as we say the Church of England the Church of Scotland and the like a National Church is and must be as it seems to me of Human Agreement altogether I speak not this I must farther say to dispute with you but to learn of you or for Instruction and in making this out I cannot but in my native apprehension differ from ȳou as to that which gives the Form Being or Essence to a Society Political or as to that which is the ratio formalis of a Nation being a Church You say it is only the Head gives the Form but I apprehend That the Head and Members of any Society considered as in a state before Organization for Regiment are but still the Matter of a Polity but that which gives the Form to it is Consent If a Community let me say should agree upon a Head and not agree upon the Organizing that Head and Members so as to be capable of Government here is no Polity Let me speak closer When a King is Head of his People already as They are a Kingdom I cannot say he is a Head of them as a Church before this Church be made Organical by a Constitution Pray note that and I say then The Consent Agreement or Combination of the Community the Populus Head and Body in such an Order for Government as is proper to it is the ratio formalis in my Apprehension of that Society I know that the Terms of Matter and Form upon which I lay no stress are proper to physical Beings whereas a Polity and such-like things are not Entia physica nor Entia rationis but Entia moralia and so need other Expressions but when I have no better and Entia moralia ad analogiam physicorum concipiuntur I must say That as it is Consent that makes a single man a Member of a Society and does that which a Form does to wit give the Being and Denomination to him of a Member Forma dat esse nomen So must the Universal Consent of Parts to that Order of Superiority a●● Inferiority for Regiment which is in any Society give it its Form and that Order be the Form or Polity it self which consisting not only of Head and Members but of Head and subordinate Organs for that Regiment it is not the Head alone but Head and Body so organized the Head Principally indeed but Jointly that makes it a Political Society You may say that I write here but scatteredly as one that aims at saying something that may provoke you to set me right rather than come my self to any perfect Determination and I care not to have you think and judge so for though I would not put you to trouble willingly about any thing impertinent yet do I expect so much more consideration and farther light from you in the thing as the weight of the Subject and the concernment thereof does require of him that undertook it The Head gives the Form I express as your Judgment In one place of this Book or that which came out with it you say The Head is the Form which seems to me absonant In another place you say The Relative Union between the Head and Body or the pars imporans subdita is the Form which sounds well But the Conception is not so hard yet A Polity is an Order of Superiority and Subjection I have said in a Community The Community here is the Matter and this Order is the Form This is most plain and forasmuch as this Form is introduc'd into the Community by their Agreement while free it is Consent which gives the Form and is the Foundation the Fundamentum Relationis of all Societies And here Sir without interposition of the last Paragraph I though to break off but my Mind I feel is not emptied A Christian Kingdom containing Confederate Pastoral Churches is a National Church with you But what if there be no Confederacy no such Consent or National Confederacy Where is the Form that must give the Being and Denomination of a National Church to such a Kingdom Suppose a Company of Christians with Ministers among them who preach and pray together and yet are not Confederated in the Choice of any of them for a Pastor and Officers for Government Here is a Particular Worshipping Community but no Political Society So in a Kingdom if a King and People be Christian and they have Particular Churches but no Confederacy of these Churches or Pastors in an Order for National Government here is an Ecclesiastical National Community but no National Church Here is a Government which is Civil by the Sword but no Government Ecclesiastical by the Keys There can be no Keys that are National I must say but what are founded in this Confederacy and consequently on Human Institution You may say every King that is Christian may allow of what Particular Churches he please and command a Confederacy But hold a little Religion the Fathers and Reason will tell us cannot be forced The Church Man believes Episcopal Government to be Jure Divino the Presbyterian thinks his to be so the Independent thinks their Congregational Churches alone to be of Christs Appointment and cannot in Conscience submit to a Confederacy of the one Side or the other How shall the King here command Consent or Confederacy to

then confirm this by the proving that it was at his Resurrection he was inaugurated into his Universal Kingdom or make King over the Gentiles or all Nations as Heir of the World That is was then that God said to him Thou art my Son this day have I begotten thee and Christ askt of his Father and he gave him the Heathen for his Inheritance and the utmost ends of the Earth for his possession compare Acts 13.33 with Psal 2.7 8. That it was then and not before then that he received all power in Heaven and Earth as he tells his Disciples Mat. 28.18 and by vertue of that Power commissioned the Apostles to go and disciple all Nations If any can distinguish thus There was a Kingdom Christ was Born to Mat. 22. Joh. 18.37 which is the Jewish Kingdom as being of the Line of David And there is a Kingdom which is Given him as the Son of Man Dan. 7.14 and which was Purchased by the Merits of his Life and Death Luk. 24.26 Phil. 2.8 and consequently there must be a time when it was Received and that must be after his Death and Resurrection upon that Account I say now if any stand upon this and it be Truth which whether it be or no I must still ask you then is there the Access of some Light and Strength to your Notion But that Christ Instituted a National Church Form and that Judaea under Constantine was such a Church in the Execution which are Two Chapters of your Book I do not apprehend the Proof so convincing but that they need both of them your second Thoughts and farther Improvement That which affects me in these Papers more especially is this one thing that you shew so much candour and condescention toward the present Church but without fawning I must confess and with no less serious Frame of Spirit if I can judge than Augustine wrote his Retractations I do not know whether our Church-men who are good will refuse you any thing you offer as pious as prudent or as necessary to Communion And I think you have offered and conceded enough to the laying a Ground for both Parties when GOD and a Parliament shall see it good to come to an Accommodation I will give an Example of what I say to my Reader out of the Fourteenth Chap. of your Book where you have these words The National Church of England is rightly Constituted under one supream Royal Government as the Vnifying Head It is duely Constituted of professed Baptized Christians and Churches as the Subject Matter It hath National Laws which profess their Subserviency to the Law of Christ and the Nullity of all that is against it It maketh none Magistrates but professed Christians no nor Burgesses and Choosers of Magistrates It hath Diocesans that are general Overseers of many particular Churches as successors to the Apostles and Evangelists in the Ordinary parts of their Office It justly maketh Bishops Members of Parliament it being unfit to make Laws for Religion without the Pastors notice and advice It justly giveth large maintenance and honours to the Superior Clergy that they may be a protection to the Inferior and a relief to the poor and keep up Religion from the contempt and scorn of Wordly Men. The King is the just Donor of such Honours and Revenues The Parish Ministers according to the true Legal Reformed Church of England are acknowledged true Pastors as to all the Essentials of the Pastoral Office Word Sacraments Keys Discipline and Ordinations The Inferior Ministers in Tythes and Glebe have a laudable maintenance All Parishes are to distinguish Communicating Members from Non communicating Inhabitants and to refuse the scandalous and unconfirmed not ready or desiring Confirmation And the Offices of Absolution and Burial are fitted to the faithful were Discipline executed Yet our Law for Dissenters Assemblies acknowledgeth them all true Members of the Church of England who agree in the Essentials notwithstanding their dissent in lesser things We use one and the same Translation of Scripture and we all renounce all Humane Vniversal Forreign Jurisdiction These things and all these you approve as commendable and when you concede so much to the Bishops what is it you require of them Why nothing but that Reformation in effect only of some things which they themselves as to the main do seek also and what Ingenuity more than this could be expected from any It is Peace I perceive you would have but Holiness more and when the world lyes in wickedness if you have peace you must be content with so much holiness as can be had You must not expect that National Churches though you will have them Jure Divino should be as Holy as the select people of your Gathered Congregations Sir I am sensible what need we have of Discourses that are bending to one another while such Divisions are got within our bowels as are like to eat our Religion quite out One would wonder to see sometimes two friends that agree so well otherwise as both to go to Church both are for the same Liturgy both are for the present King and ready rather to dye than admit of Popery and yet being rankt into a diverse sort of Companions under the names of Whig and Tory there is a secret Animosity and Unkindness grows within if no open fire of contention break out as if they were born enemies Do but ask one or the other what is the matter between you or what is the meaning of these names Guelph and Gibeline that divide you they can say nothing but themselves are astonished There is nothing but that the Tares are sown in mens hearts by the Evil one while they are not aware is the cause of it And there is nothing but the love of God and our Neighbour which is the effect of Gods spirit with an Act of Parliament for Vnion which must begin that work like to be the cure of it It was one of the deepest fetches of the Popish Plot through Liberty to destroy Agreement And to come to Agree now and preserve Indulgence is the only way to be even with them As the design therefore of your Papers which is National Concord is according to my heart desire and I should be glad to farther it to my utmost so must I take notice more particularly of one Concession of yours to wit of the Divine right of Bishops which others of your brethren will by no means grant There is the Episcopus gregis the Ordinary Overseer of the flock The Episcopus Praeses where there are several Prebyters in one Congregation And besides these you are for a Superiour sort of successors to the Apostles and Evangelists of Divine institution Such Diocesans that put not down Particular fixed Pastors or such Diocesses as Unchurch not our Parishes are not impugned by you I am perswaded now that the most of our present Bishops will allow you that their Diocesses are not Churches infimae specici but that every

it the Paper mentioned look'd again over and improved to that end And I pray God to direct your Thoughts and Labours still that you may so prove all things as to hold fast that which is good The Draught WHereas there are several Parties of Christians in the Nation who must and will ever differ in their Opinions about the Church and Discipline of it in the Question which is of Christ's Institution it is not our Disputes about the Church as particular which are rather to be mutually forborn and every party left herein to their own Perswasion but a common Agreement in what we can agree and that is in the Church as National must heal our Breaches The Catholicks are for one Universal Organical Church throughout the World whereof the Pope is Head according to some and the Bishops conven'd in a General Council according to others That there is a Catholick Church visible on Earth as well as invisible whereof Christ is Head who was on Earth and is now visible in Heaven is received also by Protestants But that this Church is per integrum Organical and under the Government either of a Monarchy by the Pope or of an Aristocracy by a General Council it seems a thing not possible in Nature because neither can an Oecumenical Council ever be called nor any one man be sufficient to take on him the Concernments of the World A Political Church is a Community of Christians brought into an Order of Superiority and Inferiority by an Head and Members organiz'd for the Exercise of that Government which is proper to it But the whole Earth is not capable of any such Order And Councils therefore which are gathered out of several Countries or of Bishops belonging to more Dominions than of one Supreme Power may be had for mutual Advice and Concord but not for Government A Nation Empire or Kingdom which consists of one Supreme Magistrate and People who are generally Christians are capable of such an Ecclesiastical Polity and a National Church Political in England is to be asserted and maintained The Church of England then is a Political Society of all the Christians Conforming or Tolerated in the Land united in the King as Head and organized by the Bishops for the executing those Laws or Government which he chuses for their Spiritual Good and Publick Peace There is this difference between a Church National the Church Catholick and Particular Churches The two latter are of Divine Right and Essential Consideration but the former is of Human Institution for it is manifestly Accidental to the Church of Christ that the whole People should be Christian Not but it is the duty of all Nations Kings and People to become Christians Go and teach all Nations Baptizing them and that Christian Kingdoms therefore as they consist of People that do meet in Particular Congregations for the worship of the True God and Jesus Christ and do exercise that Government which the Pastor hath over his flock by vertue of his Office from Christ and no other than that are of Divine appointment But the Combination of these Churches or the Pastors thereof in an Order of Superiority and Inferiority for the Exercise of a Regiment that is National over the whole body of the Kingdom by setting Bishop in a Diocess and an Archbishop in a Province and then proceeding no farther as to a Patriarchat and General Council but making a stop here and Constituting the Nation thereby one Governing Church independent on any other from aboard this appears of no Divine or Canonical Right but must derive its Authority from an Act of Parliament Distinguish we here of the Government of the Church as Internal belonging to the Spirit and External which belongs to Men And of the External Regiment thereof which is either Formal belonging to the Ministers or Officers of Christ or Objective belonging to the Magistrate so call'd because the matters of the Church in this respect are the Object of his Civil Power Whether the Community now of Christians in England may be united into a National Church under a pure Formal Government we leave to others to dispute that will But that the main Body of the Nation are or may be constituted a proper Political Church National under that Mix'd Regiment which is both Formal and Objective and so exercised by the Bishops as the proper Organs thereof under the King with Authority as Bishops as Ministers without Force is what we hold indisputable and would lay as a Foundation-stone of Peace in the Matter of Religion between all Persons in the Kingdom capable of it The Government of this Church is by Bishops and if their Authority be not received and owned so far as that the generality of the Nation the Nonconformists as well as others yield to it there can be no Union Now when the Government of the Land is a Mixt Government as Politicians tell us on another account why may not the Government of the Church be Mixt too upon this account to wit in that as the King must be a Mixed Person to be Head the Bishops must be Mixt Persons too to be his Officers Mixt Persons in regard to the exercise of both this Objective and Formal Regiment deriving the one from the King as over other Ministers and the other from Christ as Fellows with them that so those that scruple their Submission to them upon one account may be satisfied upon another which by and by will be explained Let the Parliament therefore we have or any other be heartily for the Publick Good and Thriving of England which must be by an entire Liberty of Conscience in opposition to the narrow Spirit of any single Party or Faction and when such a Parliament shall sit about the Business of Union to purpose the Bill should be brought in entituled An Act for declaring the Constitution of our Church of England A Parliament is the Representative of the whole Nation and no doubt but by Consent and Agreement they might upon the account mentioned Make a new Constitution and much more may they Declare the Constitution of it It should be declared then in such a Bill or Act That the Church of England consists of the King as the Head or Pars imperans who in his Legislative Capacity as incorporated with his Lords and Commons is to give Laws thereto and all the several Assemblies of Christians which he shall tolerate as the pars subdita or Body Some Discrimination between the Tolerable and Intolerable is indeed never to be gainsaid by any wise and good man unto whom there is no Liberty can be desireable which is not consistent with these three things the Articles of our Creed a Good Life and the Fundamental Government of the Kingdom It is not for any private Persons but a Parliament with a Convocation to prescribe the Terms of National Communion but we would have all our Assemblies that are tolerable to be declared Legal by such an Act and thereby

to theirs without any Lye Dissembling or Equivocation Neither is there any Adjustment that can atone both sides besides this for the Minister ordained before receives no diminution to his Ministry hereby seeing he yields to no more than this and the Unsatisfied with his Ministry already can be satisfied with no less than this If the Bishop should only Admit a man to the Exercise of his Ministry in the Church of England the Spiritual Power received already acknowledged this indeed would serve the Minister but not the Bishop or those that doubt it If any thing be done that implies the denial of the Power it is against the Conscience of the Minister but when the Power is not Denyed nor Granted neither are offended but both accommodated as much as need be and that is enough If the man be shocked at such a Supposition If thou beest not Ordained he must be set right again at those words that follow If thou beest be thou confirmed and consequently in regard there are really in many places several truly pious People that believe a man no Minister unless Ordained by a Bishop and so scruples his baptizing their Children and the receiving the Sacrament of him the Nonconformist Minister that shall be comprehended by this Act will be bound in point of Conscience for the satisfaction of such as may be of his Parish Conscience I say not thy own but of the others to the yielding to any the like thing as this which is not sinful that his Ministry may run and be glorified and receive no Obstruction upon that account At the end of the Bill there was a Clause for appointing some Bishops and Doctors of the Church to that healing work for which the King after gave a Commission and in the renewal of the same therefore I would beg lastly that this Clause may be put as near as may be into these words following And Forasmuch as the Excellent Government of the Church by Bishops as it was Reformed and Established in Edward the Sixth and Q. Elizabeths days is to be still upheld and several things in regard to the Books of the Liturgy and Ordering Priests and Deacons and the Ecclesiastical Constitutions and in regard to the Exercise of Discipline and otherwise do require Redress Reduction and Improvement In order whereunto it pleased the King to grant a Commission to certain Bishops and Doctors of the Church who have made some progress therein Be it enacted That these Commissioners shall be hereby authorized to call or convene half a dozen of the grave and moderate Nonconformist Ministers who upon consultation with their Brethren shall peruse what these Commissioners have prepared and offer to the said Commissioners in Writing whatsoever they desire farther in reference to Concord and when these Commissioners have considered thereof and perfected the whole as themselves see meet they shall present it to His Majesty to be communicated to a Convocation or Parliament when and how it shall seem best to his most excellent Wisdom There are two sorts according to His Majesty's Declaration before mentioned of Protestant Dissenters One that own the established Ministry the Liturgy and our Parish-Churches The Other that do not or cannot own them For those that cannot they cannot be comprehended and their Case being considered they have Liberty granted they must not be knock'd on the Head For those that can their Case is to be considered likewise and if this Bill without altering any more than thus Tho' if any man would know all things to perfect it he may find them in one drawn purposely up in that little Book called The Samaritan be brought into the House so that it pass with the Grant but of those few things which are contain'd in it together with impowering the aforesaid Commissioners unto this farther business for remedy of more there is so much obtained herein as is manifestly conducive to this end of Comprehension which would be I count a blessed Ground for present Peace as a happy sort of Interim till time brought forth something farther to perfection But both these Acts that for Indulgence and this for Comprehension if the last come also into an Act are yet but Scaffolds tho' so much needful in order to this greater Works the building up such a Church as may be capacious both of the Indulged and Comprehended to live together with the Church-men as fellow-Members of the same Society Political in the enjoyment of the common Peace and Religion of Jesus Christ that so God may be one and his Name one throughout the Nation I will add such a Church as being compacted within its self and strenghtened with such a Union it may be the Glory of our Friends and Impregnable against our Enemies A Magna Charta to this effect in the Reign of the present King which was but spoken of and feared under the last would indeed do our business If there be any Protestant Lawyer so deliberate and wise as to be able to digest so great a matter he may do well to read Mr. Lawson's Politica who in one Chapter of the Extent of a Particular Church goes to prove how easily the Multitude of Christians in one Nation associated and subjected to one Supreme Judicatory may be ordered even as a single Independent Congregation may and he hath many clear things upon it as a man of excelling Skill in that study Sir I am sensible how much the publick and how little your own private Advantage does concern you and therefore I humbly conjure you and beseech you to take this matter into second thoughts because it is one and the same thing as to the main must be thought over and beat upon to bring any matter to the maturity of doing good and the Lord knows whether there be or be not any such kind of Good in the Womb of Providence for this Land There was a Sheet or Half-sheet came out a good many years ago under the Title of Materials for Vnion which were revised and put out again more lately under the Title of A Draught for Accommodation that is National Union National Accommodation If you have read it already it is so much the better because then your Thoughts will be the more prepared to do what I desire of you that is to read over the same again with some deeper Animadversion not barely to confute it or some things in it which is a little Work any other body can do but to take it into consideration so as to examin what is well as what is amiss to approve as to disprove to add what is wanting as to lop what is unfit that is to read it over not for destroying but edifying or to look it over as you would the Trees in your Garden to pluck off the Snails but to cherish the Budds because there is or there may be for ought you know a Blessing in them I do think fit to write this Letter on purpose that I may send with

Union Pursued IN A Letter to Mr. Baxter Concerning his Late Book of National Churches PUBLISHED For a fuller Disquisition about this Subject by the Sober and Composed of all Sides in order to Comprehension which hath been Forming and a Larger Constitution of the Church to be Formed when that Day of Concord comes which the gentle Aspect of Heaven in GOD's Appointment and the King's of so many Choice Moderate Bishops together at this Time does presage to the Nation That the Presbyterians and Independants that have United within themselves may Both be United also with the Church of England By a Lover of Him and Follower of Peace 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 LONDON Printed for Rich. Baldwin 1691. A Letter to Mr. Baxter Concerning his Late BOOK of National Churches Reverend Sir HAving read your Sheets of National Churches which Subject I am much pleased with and concern'd in Regard to the Publick I cannot but desire you who have a more distinct Knowledge of these things than I to endeavour to clear to me this Matter a little farther than you have Your Notion of a National Church to be all one with a Christian Kingdom and to be of Divine Institution is New as I take it That it is the Duty of Nations Magistrate and People to become Christians and that King and People should meet in fit Assemblies for the Worship of the True God and His Son and live as Christians there is no body can doubt But that all such Particular Congregations should combine into one Polity or be Unified in a National Church this is as I think another Business There are two things belong to a Polity the Constitution and the Administration A Polity must be first Constituted that is An Order of Superiority and Subjection agreed upon by a Community which implies a Union for Government before it be Governed according to that Order which is the Administration A Community is with Politick Writers but the Matter disposed for the receiving a Form of Government and a Kingdom turn'd Christian Head and Body are in the first moment of Consideration no other than a Community There must be a Constitution then made by that Community a Constitution agreed upon by Magistrate and People for the Common Good before they be a National Church The State and Church are always distinguished and the placing the Supreme Power of a Common-wealth in a King or in the Nobles or in the People or in a Government that is Mixt does not specifie the Constitution of the Church The Supreme Legislative and Judicial Power of the One and the Other does not lye in the same Subject I pray consider if it do if it does then must a Christian Kingdom and National Church be the same indeed but if it do not then must it be otherwise according to the best of my Apprehension which I desire to be rectified where it is amiss and shall not therefore enlarge and be petulant on this Argument You seem to place the Being of a National Church onely in the having a King and People to be Christian but I am apt to place it mainly as to the Polity thereof in that Combination of King and People in such an Order as is conducive to the Exercise of a Government Ecclesiastical which is proper to it which Order of Superiority and Inferiority being diverse in diverse Nations cannot be of Divine Appointment because the Polity then ought to be the same in every Country That which is of God's Appointment cannot be varyed by Man I am of the Opinion That in Scotland they may do well in setting up the Presbyterian Government and in England the Episcopal and both Nations do for the best Both be True National Churches and acceptable to Christ Now I cannot tell how to make so much Charity good but by reckoning that Polity which is set up in Churches as National to be left to the Liberty of Christian Governours and consequently to be of Human Institution Suppose a Nation should be converted to Christianity by some Independents and they set up their Independent Churches throughout the Land without other Government Suppose the King be of the same mind and so joyns himself to one of these Congregations as a Member and believes that he is to leave all Ecclesiastical Government to such Pastors and meddle not with it I ask you whether such a Kingdom be a National Church or a National Ecclesiastical Polity where there is no Order of Superiority and Inferiority for the exercise of any Government proper to it I ask Whether the very Quod sit or that there ought to be a Political National Government in every such Kingdom by vertue of any Precept or Institution of Jesus Christ can be made good It is I say a Question at least in regard to Independents Whether every King and People are bound to combine and agree upon the setting up any National Ecclesiastical Government at all but rather leave the People to their particular Congregations and Pastors independent on any Higher Power for any other Ecclesiastical Government of Man over them than that Does the Scripture require farther than this I ask on Suppose the Quod sit What shall we do about the Quid sit The Scots are for the Presbyterian Government the English for the Episcopal I cannot abide you should condemn either How will you allow both but by making a National Constitution indifferent And how can it be indifferent if it were not of Human Agreement What may be granted to the one and what to the other and yet Christ's Command of National Churches if there be any be not transgressed I must ask you as an harder Task Again I must ask you about the Catholick Church This is either Mystical the Government whereof is only Spiritual and I have no Question to ask about that Or Visible as they call it the Government whereof is External The Catholick Church Visible consists of Christ as the Head and all Professors as the Body These Professors make up Particular Congregations these Congregations or their Pastors being confederated into Classes or under Diocesans till they come to a general Assembly or a Convocation arise into a National Church independent on any foreign Jurisdiction Now I must ask That forasmuch as all the Churches on Earth cannot be combined under any General Officers for the exercise of an Oecumenical Government whether the Catholick Church on Earth be a Church Political That is Forasmuch as there is no Confederation of Churches National as there is or may be of Parochial Diocesan and Provincial for Government upon which account you do readily disown a Pope and General Council I ask How can you make out a Polity Oecumenical I know you say it is a Church Political because there is Head and Body But How can any Oecumenical Polity Ecclesiastical or Civil be possible to Man Can a Society be Political before it be Organical And Can the Catholick Church be so being even quite

is no doubt but this were a Concession highly Convenient or conducive to this end for I do apprehend as I have said our present Bishops are of that moderation as they would straight yield to it and agree with them But I must say not Necessary because a submission alone to their Government is enough without conceding so much to them when as to the higher End of National Concord it is neither necessary nor convenient but inconvenient as conducive to the excluding multitudes out of it and if it be stood upon to destroy it Sir since I wrote this I have thought good to read over your book again and I will say something more as if I were to begin afresh for there are Persons of Quality and of Parts several that favour the Dissenters who do entertain your Notion of a National Church and Bishops Jure Divino taking your meaning in the strict not my large sense before with indignation looking on it as a building what you have destroyed in your former books and not with the indifferency of Spirit as I do who look on it as an Explanation of those books whether this Jure Divino Point be right or no. Your Title is Of National Church A National Church may be considered in genere or in specie Of a National Church in genere I will account that you have spoken Of a National Church in specie I would have you count that you are yet to speak if you can say any more and I to give you the Occasion A National Church in genere is a Christian Kingdom constituted of a Christian Soveraign Magistrate and of Christian Subjects Worshipping God ordinarily in True Particular Pastoral Churches This is the first Paragraph of your Book and the Subject of your Discourse which you maintain And that which you have said being not as I know by any before said and of such consequence as it is to be said is I will say in my Opinion so Generously said that I cannot but be pleased with it A National Church say you is a Christian Kingdom Right in genere it is so A National Church therefore is of Divine Institution Right again in genere it is so There is no question but God commands all Nations Kings and People to be Christians But we must proceed farther we must not rest here but come to the consideration of a National Church in specie and to this purpose there is another Definition you have elsewhere if it be another which is this A Christian Kingdom containing Confederate Pastoral Churches is a National Church I cannot tell here whether you mean any more in this than in that before but there seems to me some farther light to have came into your mind though perhaps you reflected not on it For by this Confederation you may either understand nothing but that Confederation which is between the Pastor and Members of a Particular Church within themselves or a Confederation of such Particular Churches with others That is the Confederation whereby a Particular People give up themselves to God which the several branches of the Confederation that you instance in do but come to and to one another to walk together under the same Pastoral guidance or the Confederation whereby diverse Particular Pastoral Churches do Confederate for Union under a Superiour Government for their greater common good If you understand the last of these then was you defective in what you said at first If you do not understand the last but the first onely then are you defective as to that which should come mainely into consideration which is the nature of a National Church I say in specie as existing in the Constitution of Particular Kingdoms unto which this Confederation in the last sense is not only Necessary but Essential and to be put into the Definition thereof as without which there can be no rightly constituted Particular National Church in the World We loose our labour to speak of National Churches in the Universal Notion unless we bring the Application down to the Particular National Church in our own Land as you know This therefore we must stand upon In Scotland the Presbyterian Government is settled In England the Episcopal The King is Head of both Nations If the Head alone now were the Form of a National Church then must there be but one Form of the Church of England and Scotland I mean not one Numerical Form which doubtless follows not but one Specifical Form because the Head is but One But the Form of a Presbyterian National Church and the Form of an Episcopal National Church are distinct Forms and do distinguish and specifie two Churches The Form of the Church of Scotland is that Order of Superiority and Subjection whereby the Parish-Churches and Ministers there are subject to their Classes and those Classes to higher till they come up to a National Assembly The Form of the Church of England is that Order of Superiority and Subjection where by the Parochial Ministers and their Flocks are subject to the Diocesan Bishops the Bishops to the Archbishop in regard to which several Parishes do make one Diocess and several Diocesan Churches one Provincial one and the two Provinces with the King make the Church National This Order is the Form of these Churches and the Form essentiates them It is not therefore for any to think that a Man can be a Member of either of these Churches who comes not into their Established Order A man cannot be of the Scotch Church but he must submit to their Presbyteries A man cannot be of the Church of England but he must own Episcopacy he must own it so far as to submit to their Government To go to build up a National Union without this Confederation explicit or implicit is verily but gathering Sand for the building and putting no Lime to it And this let me say with all due respect and without offence is that which you are doing and can but do by making our Bishops and our Church if you intend so to be of Divine Institution when the generality of the Dissenters can hereunto yield no Confederation In your behalf therefore do I distinguish of both these things of a National Church and of Episcopacy in genere in specie In genere in genere indefinito a National Church in genere indefinito an Episcopacy are of Divine Appointment But when we come to the consideration of National Church in specie in specie definita as they exist in the Constitutions of several Countries made by Men and of Episcopacy in specie as existing in our Church of England I will suspend my Belief of your saying so the Matter being so apparent otherwise in the mention of it seeing he that says it does no Service really to the Church the Bishops that are wise if they be obeyed as Established by Law caring little for that but Disservice in this respect that the Dissenters by this means if the thing be stood