Selected quad for the lemma: christian_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
christian_n	church_n	communion_n	separation_n	1,256	5	10.3360	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A78447	The censures of the church revived. In the defence of a short paper published by the first classis within the province of Lancaster ... but since printed without their privity or consent, after it had been assaulted by some gentlemen and others within their bounds ... under the title of Ex-communicatio excommunicata, or a Censure of the presbyterian censures and proceedings, in the classis at Manchester. Wherein 1. The dangerousness of admitting moderate episcopacy is shewed. ... 6. The presbyterian government vindicated from severall aspersions cast upon it, ... In three full answers ... Together with a full narrative, of the occasion and grounds, of publishing in the congregations, the above mentioned short paper, and of the whole proceedings since, from first to last.	Harrison, John, 1613?-1670.; Allen, Isaac, 17th cent.	1659 (1659)	Wing C1669; Thomason E980_22; ESTC R207784	289,546	380

be_v cast_v upon_o we_o and_o the_o church_n of_o god_n the_o argument_n you_o here_o urge_v be_v two_o we_o shall_v speak_v unto_o they_o both_o and_o in_o their_o order_n 1._o and_o here_o we_o shall_v speak_v in_o the_o first_o place_n unto_o the_o charge_n of_o schism_n that_o you_o will_v fasten_v upon_o we_o reserve_v unto_o another_o off_o place_n our_o answer_n unto_o the_o charge_n of_o perjury_n where_o you_o do_v it_o more_o plain_o and_o express_o though_o here_o you_o may_v intend_v to_o insinuate_v it_o but_o as_o touch_v that_o of_o schism_n you_o plain_o declare_v that_o such_o minister_n and_o of_o this_o sort_n you_o say_v there_o be_v many_o among_o we_o though_o if_o we_o shall_v put_v you_o to_o prove_v this_o you_o will_v never_o be_v able_a to_o make_v it_o out_o as_o return_v not_o to_o that_o canonical_a obedience_n as_o you_o call_v it_o which_o they_o be_v swear_v to_o as_o you_o say_v lie_v under_o the_o blot_n of_o schism_n but_o in_o your_o next_o paper_n you_o charge_v we_o with_o this_o more_o than_o once_o and_o call_v it_o a_o rent_n indeed_o a_o schism_n in_o the_o high_a paper_n we_o shall_v not_o examine_v that_o which_o you_o here_o seem_v to_o take_v for_o grant_v sc_n that_o all_o minister_n that_o be_v ordain_v by_o bishop_n do_v swear_v canonical_a obedience_n to_o they_o which_o we_o be_v sure_o be_v very_o untrue_a concern_v many_o as_o how_o far_o those_o that_o do_v take_v any_o such_o oath_n be_v bind_v to_o obey_v be_v not_o to_o our_o purpose_n now_o to_o discuss_v but_o as_o to_o that_o blot_n of_o schism_n you_o will_v bring_v we_o and_o the_o minister_n of_o these_o nation_n under_o who_o return_v not_o to_o that_o obedience_n they_o sometime_o yield_v to_o their_o several_a diocesan_n we_o must_v speak_v the_o more_o full_o because_o the_o charge_n be_v foul_a 1._o but_o we_o shall_v in_o the_o first_o place_n speak_v something_o of_o the_o nature_n of_o schism_n the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o schism_n signify_v a_o rent_n or_o division_n so_o it_o be_v use_v 1_o cor._n 12._o 25._o that_o there_o be_v no_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o schism_n in_o the_o body_n in_o js._n 7._o 43._o be_v say_v there_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o schism_n or_o division_n among_o the_o people_n because_o of_o christ_n and_o john_n 9_o 16._o therefore_o some_o of_o the_o pharisee_n say_v this_o man_n be_v not_o of_o god_n because_o he_o keep_v not_o the_o sabbath_n day_n other_o say_v how_o can_v a_o man_n that_o be_v a_o sinner_n do_v such_o miracle_n and_o there_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o division_n or_o schism_n among_o they_o so_o john_n 10._o 19_o and_o so_o we_o read_v act_n 4._o 4._o that_o the_o multitude_n be_v divide_v and_o part_v hold_v with_o the_o jew_n and_o part_n with_o the_o apostle_n this_o acceptation_n of_o the_o word_n be_v general_a and_o may_v comprehend_v under_o its_o latitude_n any_o kind_n of_o dissension_n and_o hereupon_o divine_n though_o restrain_v it_o to_o dissension_n or_o division_n about_o matter_n of_o religion_n speak_v of_o a_o good_a schism_n that_o be_v justifiable_a which_o be_v the_o dissolution_n of_o a_o bad_a union_n and_o that_o be_v but_o a_o conspiracy_n against_o god_n as_o be_v that_o union_n that_o be_v among_o the_o jew_n before_o they_o hear_v the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n of_o which_o john_n 10._o 19_o by_o this_o kind_n of_o schism_n afterward_o the_o whole_a world_n be_v rend_v and_o of_o which_o christ_n speak_v matth._n 20._o 35._o for_o i_o be_o come_v to_o set_v a_o man_n at_o variance_n against_o his_o father_n etc._n etc._n and_o hereupon_o gerhardus_fw-la 156._o in_o answer_n to_o bellarmine_n charge_n of_o schism_n upon_o the_o protestant_n say_v denique_fw-la concedimus_fw-la nos_fw-la esse_fw-la sano_fw-la sensu_fw-la schismaticos_fw-la quia_fw-la scilicet_fw-la ab_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la romana_fw-la &_o ejus_fw-la capite_fw-la pontifice_fw-la romano_n secessionem_fw-la fecimus_fw-la nequaquam_fw-la vero_fw-la ab_fw-la unitate_fw-la ecclessiae_fw-la &_o ejus_fw-la capite_fw-la christo_fw-la jesus_n nos_fw-la separavimus_fw-la at_o beatum_fw-la schisma_fw-la per_fw-la quod_fw-la christo_fw-la &_o verae_fw-la catholicae_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la uniti_fw-la sumus_fw-la this_o schism_n be_v that_o which_o be_v command_v come_v out_o of_o she_o my_o people_n revel_v 18._o 4._o and_o of_o this_o schism_n ambrose_n speak_v siqua_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la quae_fw-la fidem_fw-la respuit_fw-la deserenda_fw-la est_fw-la 1._o e._n if_o there_o be_v any_o church_n that_o refuse_v the_o faith_n it_o be_v to_o be_v forsake_v but_o as_o when_o we_o speak_v of_o schism_n it_o be_v usual_o take_v in_o the_o worse_a part_n so_o it_o be_v the_o bad_a and_o sinful_a shisme_n that_o be_v here_o speak_v of_o but_o thus_o also_o it_o be_v sometime_o take_v general_o for_o any_o division_n in_o the_o church_n that_o be_v unwarrantable_a and_o so_o it_o comprehend_v also_o heresy_n and_o so_o the_o word_n heresy_n and_o schism_n be_v sometime_o use_v in_o the_o same_o sense_n 1_o cor._n 11._o 19_o for_o there_o must_v needs_o be_v heresy_n or_o schism_n or_o sect_n that_o those_o that_o be_v approve_v may_v be_v make_v manifest_a among_o they_o although_o strict_o heresy_n be_v oppose_v unto_o faith_n and_o schism_n unto_o charity_n and_o this_o lead_v we_o to_o show_v what_o schism_n be_v take_v strict_o and_o proper_o which_o in_o brief_a may_v be_v thus_o describe_v schism_n be_v a_o dissolution_n or_o breach_n of_o that_o union_n that_o aught_o to_o be_v among_o christian_n consent_v together_o in_o the_o same_o faith_n and_o because_o this_o breach_n of_o union_n do_v chief_o appear_v in_o deny_v or_o refuse_v communion_n with_o the_o church_n in_o the_o use_n of_o god_n public_a ordinance_n therefore_o that_o kind_n of_o separation_n be_v by_o a_o kind_n of_o singular_a appropriation_n true_o and_o right_o call_v schism_n thus_o much_o for_o the_o open_v the_o nature_n of_o schism_n now_o because_o you_o here_o charge_v we_o with_o it_o we_o must_v needs_o tell_v you_o the_o charge_n be_v great_a for_o schism_n true_o and_o proper_o so_o call_v and_o as_o it_o be_v take_v in_o the_o worse_a part_n be_v a_o very_a hurtful_a dangerous_a and_o pernicious_a evil_n the_o apostle_n warn_v to_o take_v heed_n of_o it_o and_o condemn_v it_o in_o the_o church_n of_o corinth_n 1_o cor._n 1._o v._o 10._o 11_o 12_o 13._o it_o be_v a_o work_n of_o the_o flesh_n and_o therefore_o the_o apostle_n prove_v the_o corinthian_n to_o be_v carnal_a because_o of_o the_o division_n that_o be_v among_o they_o 1_o cor._n 3._o 3_o 4._o it_o be_v a_o great_a offence_n against_o christ_n be_v a_o rend_n of_o the_o unity_n of_o his_o mystical_a body_n it_o be_v a_o wrong_n unto_o the_o church_n who_o peace_n be_v thereby_o disturb_v and_o to_o the_o member_n of_o the_o church_n their_o edification_n be_v thereby_o hinder_v and_o to_o conclude_v schism_n open_v the_o door_n unto_o heresy_n into_o which_o it_o do_v oftentimes_o degenerate_a and_o so_o make_v way_n to_o separation_n from_o christ_n and_o therefore_o you_o here_o charge_v we_o to_o lie_v under_o the_o blot_n of_o schism_n until_o episcopacy_n be_v again_o admit_v of_o and_o there_o be_v a_o return_v to_o that_o obedience_n that_o former_o have_v be_v give_v to_o the_o bishop_n shall_v have_v produce_v some_o argument_n for_o the_o make_v out_o your_o charge_n but_o here_o you_o be_v whole_o silent_a and_o think_v it_o sufficient_a to_o insinuate_v this_o so_o high_a a_o charge_n without_o give_v any_o reason_n to_o convince_v we_o of_o our_o guiltiness_n as_o if_o we_o must_v present_o without_o reason_n judge_v ourselves_o because_o you_o accuse_v we_o 2._o yet_o because_o some_o may_v be_v ready_a to_o take_v the_o matter_n upon_o trust_n and_o except_o we_o purge_v ourselves_o from_o this_o crime_n by_o say_v something_o for_o ourselves_o conclude_v we_o be_v guilty_a because_o you_o say_v so_o we_o shall_v therefore_o in_o the_o second_o place_n offer_v to_o the_o reader_n these_o follow_a consideration_n that_o we_o may_v thereby_o clear_v ourselves_o from_o this_o foul_a aspersion_n 1._o that_o though_o episcopacy_n be_v never_o restore_v and_o neither_o we_o nor_o any_o other_o minister_n in_o this_o land_n return_v to_o that_o canonical_a obedience_n that_o have_v former_o be_v yield_v yet_o still_o both_o we_o and_o they_o may_v continue_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o same_o church_n of_o england_n that_o we_o hold_v communion_n with_o during_o the_o continuance_n of_o episcopacy_n and_o with_o which_o we_o also_o do_v hold_v communion_n in_o all_o the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n worship_n word_n sacrament_n and_o prayer_n this_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o paper_n you_o do_v not_o deny_v for_o you_o there_o speak_v of_o we_o as_o

to_o your_o last_o charge_n which_o as_o it_o be_v very_o high_a so_o we_o judge_v it_o have_v in_o it_o as_o little_a reason_n for_o the_o bear_v it_o up_o you_o say_v after_o the_o second_o and_o three_o order_n against_o those_o that_o forsake_v the_o public_a assembly_n of_o the_o saint_n and_o such_o as_o be_v scandalous_a come_v in_o a_o four_o touch_v the_o catechumeni_fw-la in_o the_o first_o order_n mention_v viz_o that_o the_o minister_n when_o he_o catechize_v the_o several_a family_n etc._n etc._n but_o here_o in_o the_o first_o place_n we_o observe_v you_o omit_v to_o mention_v the_o first_o part_n of_o this_o order_n and_o unto_o which_o that_o which_o follow_v in_o the_o two_o next_o order_n do_v refer_v and_o in_o the_o next_o place_n you_o descant_v upon_o this_o latter_a branch_n of_o it_o only_o for_o you_o say_v but_o what_o if_o they_o will_v not_o present_v themselves_o before_o the_o eldership_n the_o minister_n must_v exhort_v and_o admonish_v they_o but_o that_o be_v whole_o of_o your_o own_o add_v yet_o you_o go_v on_o and_o say_v but_o what_o if_o they_o still_o refuse_v their_o name_n shall_v be_v publish_v open_o in_o the_o several_a congregation_n and_o they_o warn_v before_o all_o to_o reform_v so_o you_o affirm_v that_o we_o say_v though_o you_o prove_v it_o not_o as_o we_o shall_v show_v you_o anon_o but_o here_o you_o call_v for_o attention_n and_o say_v mark_v man_n of_o blameless_a life_n and_o knowledge_n must_v be_v warn_v before_o all_o to_o reform_v if_o we_o either_o have_v practise_v any_o such_o thing_n or_o any_o such_o construction_n either_o from_o the_o rule_n of_o grammar_n or_o logic_n or_o common_a reason_n can_v have_v be_v put_v upon_o the_o word_n we_o use_v in_o our_o paper_n you_o may_v have_v call_v for_o this_o attention_n that_o so_o such_o a_o government_n as_o this_o and_o the_o person_n manage_v it_o may_v have_v be_v cast_v out_o both_o together_o and_o no_o where_o tolerate_v in_o the_o christian_a world_n although_o we_o have_v not_o forget_v the_o time_n when_o under_o the_o late_a prelacy_n many_o godly_a and_o orthodox_n minister_n and_o sundry_a know_v and_o conscientious_a christian_n be_v far_o worse_o use_v then_o to_o have_v only_o their_o name_n publish_v in_o the_o congregation_n and_o they_o warn_v to_o conform_v to_o the_o order_n then_o appoint_v in_o the_o church_n the_o minister_n be_v suspend_v from_o their_o ministry_n to_o the_o unspeakable_a loss_n of_o their_o congregation_n and_o the_o undo_n of_o themselves_o and_o their_o family_n and_o they_o also_o oftentimes_o as_o well_o as_o private_a christian_n that_o be_v none_o of_o the_o worst_a member_n of_o the_o congregation_n cast_v out_o as_o unsavoury_a salt_n and_o the_o great_a excommunication_n which_o cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o judge_v they_o no_o better_a than_o heathen_n and_o publican_n notwithstanding_o all_o their_o piety_n and_o knowledge_n to_o use_v your_o own_o expression_n and_o we_o may_v add_v notwithstanding_o the_o very_a great_a usefullness_n of_o sundry_a of_o such_o for_o the_o church_n of_o god_n be_v inflict_v on_o they_o and_o all_o because_o they_o can_v not_o in_o all_o point_n comform_v themselves_o to_o the_o government_n and_o order_n then_o on_o foot_n and_o which_o all_o godly_a moderate_a conformable_a man_n than_o thought_n may_v have_v be_v well_o spare_v and_o the_o church_n in_o those_o time_n as_o well_o govern_v and_o order_v without_o they_o as_o by_o the_o retain_v of_o they_o if_o you_o have_v have_v to_o deal_v with_o those_o person_n you_o may_v well_o have_v call_v for_o that_o attention_n which_o here_o you_o do_v but_o yet_o you_o go_v on_o further_o still_o and_o say_v but_o what_o if_o after_o all_o this_o they_o will_v not_o reform_v but_o continue_v obstinate_a then_o say_v you_o no_o admission_n to_o the_o sacrament_n for_o that_o you_o say_v be_v employ_v in_o the_o four_o order_n and_o that_o here_o be_v our_o excommunicatio_fw-la minor_fw-la but_o yet_o you_o drive_v on_o your_o charge_n high_o still_o for_o you_o add_v but_o that_o be_v not_o all_o a_o high_a censure_n yet_o they_o shall_v be_v cast_v out_o and_o excommunicate_v for_o so_o say_v you_o say_v the_o six_o and_o last_o order_n the_o great_a excommunication_n which_o cast_v out_o of_o the_o church_n also_o and_o judge_v they_o no_o better_a than_o heathen_n and_o publican_n notwithstanding_o all_o their_o piety_n and_o knowledge_n and_o when_o you_o have_v drive_v up_o your_o charge_n to_o the_o height_n you_o conclude_v and_o tell_v we_o what_o the_o upshot_n of_o our_o resolve_n come_v to_o which_o be_v this_o as_o you_o say_v viz._n in_o brief_a all_o wilful_o ignorant_a though_o we_o speak_v not_o one_o tittle_n of_o their_o censure_n at_o all_o and_o scandalous_a be_v to_o be_v excommunicate_a and_o not_o only_o they_o but_o the_o know_v and_o blameless_a of_o life_n also_o if_o they_o persent_a not_o themselves_o to_o the_o eldership_n but_o here_o we_o see_v partly_o prejudice_n against_o the_o eldership_n and_o person_n present_v themselves_o before_o it_o in_o order_n to_o their_o admission_n to_o the_o sacrament_n and_o partly_o your_o unacquaintedness_n with_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o presbyterian_a government_n have_v impose_v upon_o you_o thus_o far_o as_o to_o force_v upon_o we_o such_o a_o construction_n of_o our_o word_n as_o never_o come_v into_o our_o own_o thought_n it_o be_v a_o exhortation_n only_o that_o be_v appoint_v to_o be_v give_v to_o the_o person_n catechize_v to_o present_v themselves_o to_o the_o eldership_n and_o no_o more_o not_o so_o much_o as_o a_o admonition_n in_o order_n to_o any_o further_a censure_n in_o case_n not_o hearken_v unto_o and_o here_o we_o observe_v that_o this_o be_v one_o main_a ground_n of_o your_o mistake_n that_o you_o do_v not_o distinguish_v betwixt_o a_o admonition_n that_o be_v in_o order_n to_o a_o further_a censure_n if_o it_o prevail_v not_o and_o which_o be_v mention_v in_o the_o first_o part_n of_o the_o four_o order_n and_o which_o you_o whole_o omit_v and_o a_o exhortation_n but_o confound_v these_o together_o take_v they_o for_o one_o and_o the_o same_o and_o which_o be_v here_o a_o radical_a and_o grand_a mistake_n for_o doubtless_o in_o a_o thousand_o case_n that_o may_v be_v instance_a in_o there_o may_v be_v place_n for_o a_o exhortation_n when_o though_o ineffectual_a there_o be_v no_o place_n for_o a_o admonition_n that_o be_v in_o order_n to_o a_o further_a church_n censure_n in_o case_n of_o obstinacy_n as_o it_o be_v take_v by_o we_o here_o man_n may_v be_v exhort_v to_o examine_v and_o prove_v themselves_o whether_o they_o be_v in_o the_o faith_n to_o self_n examination_n before_o they_o come_v to_o the_o lord_n table_n to_o grow_v in_o grace_n and_o in_o the_o knowledge_n of_o our_o lord_n and_o saviour_n jesus_n christ_n to_o keep_v their_o heart_n with_o all_o diligence_n and_o to_o infinite_a more_o thing_n of_o the_o like_a nature_n &_o which_o be_v duty_n they_o shall_v apply_v themselves_o unto_o when_o yet_o there_o be_v no_o room_n for_o a_o admonition_n in_o other_o to_o any_o church_n censure_n in_o case_n it_o be_v not_o obey_v nay_o when_o man_n may_v perceive_v there_o be_v not_o that_o care_n that_o shall_v be_v in_o person_n in_o regard_n of_o some_o of_o their_o word_n and_o carriage_n there_o may_v be_v place_n for_o a_o exhortation_n and_o yet_o for_o no_o admonition_n in_o order_n to_o any_o church_n censure_n in_o case_n the_o exhortation_n be_v not_o hearken_v unto_o if_o there_o be_v not_o any_o further_a scandalous_a out_o break_n of_o corruption_n that_o may_v just_o merit_v it_o church_n censure_n be_v not_o to_o pass_v upon_o man_n for_o every_o fault_n nor_o against_o such_o as_o be_v guilty_a of_o such_o sin_n of_o infirmity_n as_o be_v common_o find_v in_o the_o child_n of_o god_n as_o in_o that_o case_n by_o the_o rule_n of_o our_o government_n it_o be_v provide_v against_o and_o yet_o a_o exhortation_n to_o watchfulness_n and_o vigilancy_n in_o such_o case_n be_v not_o useless_a and_o so_o it_o may_v well_o be_v appoint_v by_o we_o that_o the_o minister_n shall_v exhort_v such_o as_o be_v find_v by_o he_o to_o be_v person_n of_o knowledge_n and_o be_v in_o conversation_n blameless_a to_o present_v themselves_o to_o the_o eldership_n that_o so_o they_o may_v be_v regular_o and_o orderly_o admit_v to_o the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o lord_n supper_n a_o ordinance_n that_o be_v not_o to_o be_v slight_v as_o it_o be_v by_o many_o but_o upon_o too_o slight_a ground_n as_o they_o will_v be_v find_v to_o be_v when_o they_o come_v to_o be_v try_v in_o the_o day_n of_o account_n and_o yet_o no_o proceed_n by_o church_n censure_n against_o such_o person_n in_o case_n such_o a_o exhortation_n prevail_v not_o

new_a term_v assembly_n not_o for_o the_o word_n sake_n assembly_n but_o first_o in_o regard_n of_o the_o word_n provincial_a although_o that_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o dr._n ʋsher_n who_o in_o his_o reduction_n of_o episcopacy_n unto_o the_o form_n of_o synodical_a government_n receive_v in_o the_o ancient_a church_n do_v express_o mention_v among_o his_o proposal_n as_o we_o say_v also_o in_o our_o answer_n the_o provincial_a synod_n will_v not_o have_v be_v accuse_v of_o novelty_n but_o that_o which_o you_o be_v here_o offend_v at_o be_v that_o this_o county_n of_o lancaster_n shall_v be_v term_v the_o province_n of_o lancaster_n and_o the_o synod_n and_o assembly_n therein_o convene_v shall_v be_v term_v provincial_a for_o which_o yet_o you_o have_v little_a reason_n if_o you_o have_v consider_v all_o this_o be_v do_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o parliament_n who_o have_v power_n to_o bound_v the_o province_n and_o the_o synod_n or_o assembly_n to_o be_v hold_v thereih_o for_o the_o order_n and_o regulate_v the_o affair_n of_o the_o church_n within_o the_o bound_n set_v as_o they_o judge_v to_o be_v most_o convenient_a and_o see_v that_o a_o synod_n within_o the_o bound_n of_o a_o county_n may_v meet_v more_o frequent_o with_o conveniency_n for_o the_o regulate_v the_o affair_n of_o the_o several_a classical_a presbytery_n within_o those_o bound_n then_o if_o the_o bound_n have_v be_v large_a especial_o if_o so_o large_a as_o to_o have_v comprehend_v within_o they_o several_a county_n as_o former_o the_o two_o province_n of_o york_n and_o can●erbury_n comprehend_v all_o the_o county_n within_o the_o land_n and_o which_o doubtless_o the_o parliament_n consider_v when_o they_o order_v decemb._n 21._o 1646._o that_o the_o several_a class_n in_o luncashire_n shall_v be_v one_o province_n and_o of_o which_o we_o have_v before_o give_v you_o a_o account_n in_o our_o answer_n to_o your_o first_o paper_n if_o you_o have_v acquiesce_v in_o the_o authority_n of_o parliament_n as_o sufficient_a for_o the_o order_n of_o such_o a_o matter_n you_o will_v not_o have_v find_v fault_n with_o this_o for_o its_o novelty_n all_o law_n that_o be_v new_o make_v though_o for_o the_o ease_n of_o the_o subject_n be_v as_o liable_a to_o exception_n in_o that_o respect_n as_o this_o your_o next_o reason_n why_o you_o charge_v our_o provincial_a assembly_n with_o novelty_n be_v in_o regard_n of_o the_o place_n at_o preston_n but_o this_o exception_n be_v prevent_v in_o our_o answer_n unto_o which_o here_o you_o make_v no_o reply_n when_o we_o say_v if_o provincial_a assembly_n be_v warrantable_a and_o have_v be_v of_o ancient_a use_n in_o the_o church_n that_o have_v be_v long_o in_o disuse_n they_o of_o late_o begin_v to_o be_v hold_v at_o preston_n that_o can_v not_o just_o incur_v your_o censure_n and_o certain_o the_o most_o famous_a synod_n and_o council_n that_o have_v be_v or_o that_o may_v be_v hereafter_o must_v be_v all_o accuse_v in_o regard_n of_o novelty_n if_o this_o be_v a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o accusation_n even_o the_o first_o four_o general_a council_n of_o nice_a constantinople_n ephesus_n and_o chalcedon_n those_o be_v all_o as_o new_a in_o regard_n of_o their_o place_n where_o they_o be_v assemble_v at_o the_o time_n of_o their_o first_o meeting_n there_o have_v be_v never_o such_o assembly_n convene_v in_o those_o place_n before_o as_o our_o provincial_a assembly_n be_v or_o be_v that_o meet_v and_o still_o ordinary_o do_v at_o preston_n but_o perhaps_o there_o be_v more_o strength_n in_o the_o last_o reason_n why_o you_o charge_v it_o to_o be_v a_o new_a term_v provincial_a assembly_n when_o you_o say_v it_o be_v new_a in_o respect_n of_o the_o person_n constitute_v this_o assembly_n lay-man_n preside_v and_o rule_a and_o have_v decisive_a voice_n in_o as_o ample_a a_o manner_n as_o the_o high_a and_o chief_a in_o holy_a order_n nor_o do_v bishop_n usher_n as_o you_o say_v or_o what_o we_o allege_v out_o of_o he_o make_v for_o such_o a_o assembly_n but_o here_o 1._o we_o must_v mind_v you_o that_o we_o do_v not_o cite_v dr._n usher_n for_o to_o prove_v the_o antiquity_n of_o provincial_a assembly_n in_o regard_n of_o these_o member_n constitute_v they_o let_v our_o answer_n be_v peruse_v it_o will_v be_v find_v to_o allege_v he_o for_o to_o prove_v the_o antiquity_n of_o the_o assembly_n of_o the_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n for_o the_o order_n church_n affair_n and_o have_v the_o power_n of_o rule_a they_o and_o because_o we_o do_v not_o know_v whether_o you_o be_v not_o so_o fond_a on_o prelacy_n as_o not_o to_o allow_v of_o these_o assembly_n we_o quote_v dr._n usher_n for_o to_o prove_v their_o antiquity_n neither_o do_v we_o conceive_v that_o dr._n usher_n will_v have_v judge_v these_o assembly_n where_o the_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n be_v member_n to_o have_v be_v whole_o new_a or_o the_o pastor_n to_o have_v lose_v their_o authority_n in_o they_o because_o the_o roll_a elder_n be_v admit_v into_o they_o as_o member_n whatever_o his_o own_o thought_n may_v be_v concern_v they_o 2._o but_o as_o touch_v they_o we_o must_v further_o mind_v you_o of_o what_o we_o have_v say_v before_o that_o they_o be_v not_o mere_a lay-man_n but_o due_o and_o orderly_o call_v to_o a_o ecclesiastical_a office_n although_o they_o never_o praeside_fw-la in_o these_o assembly_n as_o moderatour_n and_o further_o that_o we_o have_v prove_v from_o antiquity_n in_o our_o answer_n to_o your_o second_o paper_n the_o be_v of_o such_o a_o officer_n in_o the_o church_n in_o the_o time_n of_o origen_n ambrose_n augustine_n optatus_n and_o which_o be_v so_o clear_a that_o the_o adversary_n of_o this_o officer_n can_v deny_v it_o only_o they_o will_v have_v he_o to_o have_v be_v as_o a_o extraordinary_a church-guardian_n or_o admit_v on_o prudential_a ground_n which_o yet_o be_v but_o gratis_o dictum_fw-la as_o we_o have_v say_v 3._o we_o shall_v now_o only_o further_o add_v what_o be_v well_o observe_v by_o the_o provincial_a assembly_n of_o london_n that_o sutlivius_n a_o prelatical_a divine_a and_o otherwise_o a_o opposer_n of_o the_o office_n of_o rule_v elder_n the_o council_n lib._n 1._o cap._n 8._o say_v that_o among_o the_o jew_n seniores_fw-la tribuum_fw-la the_o elder_n of_o the_o tribe_n do_v sit_v with_o the_o priest_n in_o judge_a controversy_n of_o the_o law_n of_o god_n hence_o he_o argue_v against_o bellarmine_n that_o so_o it_o ought_v to_o be_v in_o the_o christian_a church_n also_o because_o the_o privilege_n of_o christian_n be_v no_o less_o than_o the_o privilege_n of_o the_o jew_n and_o it_o be_v not_o deny_v by_o other_o prelatica_n divine_n but_o by_o they_o hold_v and_o prove_v that_o man_n of_o ability_n which_o be_v not_o minister_n be_v to_o be_v admit_v into_o general_a council_n as_o they_o have_v be_v also_o ancient_o and_o which_o be_v too_o manifest_a to_o be_v deny_v it_o appear_v to_o have_v be_v so_o from_o the_o ancient_a historian_n and_o subscription_n of_o council_n and_o to_o vote_n in_o they_o as_o member_n of_o these_o assembly_n and_o therefore_o however_o the_o roll_a elder_n be_v be_v admit_v into_o our_o provincial_a assembly_n as_o member_n who_o you_o account_v to_o be_v but_o lay-man_n and_o have_v decisive_a vote_n there_o the_o assembly_n shall_v not_o by_o you_o have_v be_v accuse_v of_o novelty_n in_o this_o respect_n for_o you_o see_v such_o as_o be_v no_o minister_n have_v be_v ancient_o admit_v into_o synod_n and_o council_n to_o vote_n there_o as_o member_n according_a to_o the_o old_a rule_n quod_fw-la tangit_fw-la omnes_fw-la debet_fw-la tractari_fw-la ab_fw-la omnibus_fw-la the_o gentleman_n paper_n sect._n iu._n well!_o b●t_n you_o say_v we_o go_v on_o and_o tell_v you_o etc._n etc._n but_o have_v your_o profession_n and_o expression_n for_o peace_n and_o unity_n be_v as_o real_a and_o as_o cordial_a as_o we_o we_o have_v proceed_v no_o further_o in_o this_o way_n of_o rejoynder_n but_o close_v hand_n and_o heart_n together_o as_o in_o our_o last_o humble_a address_n appear_v which_o certain_o may_v have_v find_v a_o more_o ready_a compliance_n and_o merit_v a_o far_o more_o civil_a and_o satisfactory_a answer_n from_o such_o cordial_a wisher_n of_o peace_n and_o unity_n such_o godly_a and_o sober_a such_o moderate_a spirit_a man_n as_o you_o pretend_v to_o be_v but_o you_o have_v require_v we_o shall_v go_v on_o and_o according_o we_o go_v on_o to_o tell_v you_o that_o other_o part_n of_o your_o paper_n be_v full_a of_o darkness_n to_o which_o you_o thus_o answer_v we_o can_v apprehend_v any_o such_o darkness_n in_o our_o paper_n as_o you_o speak_v of_o but_o because_o you_o question_v what_o authority_n we_o have_v from_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n and_o the_o extent_n of_o it_o and_o your_o mistake_n of_o our_o meaning_n may_v perhaps_o some_o

scripture_n and_o that_o the_o word_n of_o god_n alone_o shall_v determine_v this_o controversy_n etc._n etc._n who_o can_v forbear_v laughter_n to_o see_v scripturist_n under_o the_o gospel_n as_o these_o under_o the_o law_n templum_fw-la domini_fw-la templum_fw-la domini_fw-la cry_v verbum_fw-la domini_fw-la verbum_fw-la domivi_fw-la nothing_o but_o scripture_n the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v there_o the_o only_a rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n take_v to_o your_o bibles_n then_o and_o burn_v all_o other_o book_n as_o the_o anabaptist_n of_o old_a do_v who_o when_o they_o and_o their_o bibles_n be_v leave_v together_o what_o strange_a and_o fantastical_a opinion_n soever_o come_v into_o their_o brain_n their_o usual_a manner_n be_v to_o say_v the_o spirit_n teach_v it_o they_o as_o mr_n hooker_n in_o his_o preface_n to_o his_o eccles_n pol._n the_o determination_n of_o council_n and_o father_n and_o the_o church_n universal_a practice_n for_o matter_n of_o church_n government_n must_v all_o be_v abandon_v and_o then_o to_o that_o old_a question_n of_o the_o papist_n where_o be_v your_o church_n before_o lutber_n or_o that_o of_o we_o to_o you_o where_o be_v your_o church_n before_o calvin_n just_o like_o the_o argue_n of_o the_o samaritan_n with_o the_o je●●s_n about_o the_o antiquity_n of_o their_o church_n on_o mount_n gerizim_n record_v by_o joseplus_n per_fw-la saltum_fw-la by_o a_o high_a jump_n over_o all_o the_o universal_a practice_n and_o succession_n of_o the_o church_n you_o can_v make_v your_o church_n and_o church_n government_n as_o ancient_a as_o you_o list_v by_o say_v it_o be_v to_o be_v find_v in_o the_o scripture_n refer_v it_o to_o christ_n and_o the_o apostle_n nay_o high_o yet_o if_o you_o please_v to_o the_o jewish_a sanhedrim_n 1500._o year_n at_o least_o before_o christ_n mr_n henderson_n will_n assist_v you_o much_o in_o th●s_n who_o in_o his_o dispute_n with_o his_o majesty_n aver_v that_o presbyterian_a government_n be_v never_o practise_v before_o calvin_n time_n reply_v your_o majesty_n know_v the_o cammon_n objection_n of_o the_o papist_n against_o the_o reform_a church_n where_o be_v your_o church_n your_o reformation_n your_o doctrine_n before_o luther_n time_n one_o part_n of_o the_o common_a answer_n be_v it_o be_v to_o be_v sound_a in_o the_o scripture_n the_o same_o i_o affirm_v of_o presbyterian_a government_n thus_o he_o make_v you_o such_o defence_n in_o behalf_n of_o your_o church_n but_o thanks_o be_v to_o god_n the_o protestant_a cause_n have_v not_o do_v not_o nor_o we_o hope_v will_v ever_o want_v far_o able_a disputant_n and_o champion_n in_o her_o defence_n against_o her_o adversary_n than_o he_o or_o you_o be_v for_o though_o we_o grant_v and_o shall_v ever_o pay_v that_o reverence_n to_o the_o sacred_a scripture_n that_o it_o be_v a_o unsallible_a unerring_a rule_n yet_o may_v we_o not_o 8._o cry_v up_o scripture_n to_o the_o contempt_n and_o neglect_n of_o the_o church_n which_o the_o scripture_n itself_o teach_v man_n both_o to_o honour_n and_o obey_v we_o will_v endeavour_v therefore_o to_o give_v either_o their_o due_a according_a to_o christ_n institution_n that_o the_o scripture_n where_o it_o be_v plain_a shall_v guide_v the_o church_n and_o the_o church_n where_o there_o be_v doubt_n or_o difficulty_n shall_v expound_v the_o scripture_n as_o say_v a_o bishop_n and_o you_o yourselves_o may_v remember_v what_o you_o affirm_v of_o general_a council_n usher_n the_o church_n representative_a nay_o more_o of_o your_o provincial_a assembly_n even_o in_o your_o answer_n to_o that_o you_o call_v the_o preface_n to_o our_o paper_n that_o there_o be_v in_o they_o invest_v a_o authoritative_a juridical_a power_n to_o who_o authority_n you_o profess_v yourselves_o to_o be_v subject_n and_o to_o which_o all_o aught_o to_o submit_v allege_v 1_o cor._n 14._o 32._o matth._n 18._o and_o act_n 15._o for_o proof_n hereof_o to_o inquire_v into_o try_v examine_v censure_n and_o judge_v of_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n as_o well_o as_o of_o discipline_n and_o tax_v we_o as_o if_o we_o refuse_v to_o submit_v in_o such_o matter_n to_o the_o judgement_n of_o a_o general_n council_n though_o here_o you_o retract_v and_o eat_v your_o own_o word_n cast_v it_o out_o as_o unsound_a and_o hetrodox_n what_o be_v before_o a_o christian_n duty_n to_o practice_v you_o still_o own_o subjection_n in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n and_o discipline_n to_o the_o judgement_n and_o determination_n of_o your_o provincial_a assembly_n though_o you_o deny_v the_o authority_n of_o general_n council_n and_o the_o catholic_a church_n that_o those_o shall_v be_v our_o guide_n and_o rule_v and_o comment_n upon_o the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o tell_v we_o what_o be_v his_o will_n reveal_v there_o touch_v church_n government_n and_o discipline_n say_v we_o not_o true_o that_o you_o seem_v to_o submit_v to_o your_o provincial_n what_o you_o will_v hardly_o grant_v to_o a_o general_n council_n but_o the_o church_n as_o we_o have_v say_v where_o there_o be_v doubt_n or_o difficulty_n may_v expound_v the_o scripture_n though_o it_o be_v tie_v as_o you_o have_v say_v to_o the_o rule_n of_o god_n word_n in_o such_o proceed_n as_o judge_n to_o the_o law_n and_o we_o be_v conclude_v and_o bind_v up_o by_o that_o as_o we_o be_v to_o those_o case_n in_o the_o law_n which_o be_v the_o judgement_n and_o exposition_n of_o the_o judge_n upon_o the_o dark_a place_n of_o the_o same_o the_o church_n exposition_n and_o practice_n be_v our_o rule_n in_o such_o case_n and_o the_o best_a rule_n too_o as_o our_o late_a king_n affirm_v viz._n where_o the_o scripture_n be_v not_o so_o clear_a and_o punctual_a in_o precept_n there_o the_o constant_a and_o universal_a practice_n of_o 20._o the_o church_n in_o thing_n not_o contrary_a to_o reason_n faith_n good_a manner_n or_o any_o positive_a command_n be_v the_o best_a rule_n that_o christian_n can_v follow_v so_o when_o there_o be_v a_o difference_n about_o interpretation_n of_o scripture_n that_o we_o may_v not_o seem_v to_o abound_v in_o our_o own_o sense_n or_o give_v way_n to_o private_a interpretation_n dominari_fw-la fidei_fw-la to_o lord_n it_o over_o the_o faith_n of_o other_o we_o be_v not_o to_o utter_v our_o own_o fancy_n or_o desire_n to_o be_v believe_v upon_o our_o bare_a word_n but_o to_o deliver_v that_o sense_n which_o have_v be_v a_o foretime_o give_v by_o our_o forefather_n and_o forerunner_n in_o the_o christian_n say_v and_o so_o we_o necessary_o make_v another_o judge_n and_o rule_v for_o interpretation_n of_o scripture_n or_o else_o we_o prove_v nothing_o thus_o have_v the_o best_a and_o able_a defender_n of_o our_o protestant_a religion_n defend_v it_o against_o the_o papist_n out_o of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n too_o but_o not_o according_a to_o their_o own_o but_o the_o sense_n which_o the_o father_n unanimous_o in_o the_o primitive_a church_n and_o council_n give_v see_v mr_n philpot_n that_o glorious_a martyr_n in_o queen_n mary_n day_n to_o the_o like_a question_n propound_v viz._n how_o long_o have_v your_o church_n stand_v answer_v from_o the_o beginning_n from_o christ_n from_o the_o apostle_n and_o their_o immediate_a successor_n and_o for_o proof_n thereof_o desire_v no_o better_a rule_n than_o what_o the_o papist_n many_a time_n bring_v in_o on_o their_o side_n to_o wit_n antiquity_n universality_n and_o unity_n and_o calvin_n acknowledge_v as_o in_o our_o last_o paper_n we_o show_v you_o there_o can_v be_v no_o better_o nor_o sure_a remedy_n for_o interpretation_n of_o scripture_n than_o what_o the_o father_n in_o the_o primitive_a church_n give_v especial_o in_o the_o first_o four_o general_n council_n of_o nice_a constantinople_n ephesus_n and_o chalcedon_n which_o contain_v nothing_o say_v he_o but_o the_o pure_a and_o genuine_a interpretation_n of_o scripture_n and_o which_o he_o profess_v to_o embrace_v and_o reverence_n as_o hallow_v and_o inviolable_a so_o they_o rest_v not_o in_o private_a interpretation_n but_o willing_o submit_v to_o a_o judge_n and_o rule_v beside_o the_o scripture_n even_o such_o as_o the_o papist_n themselves_o can_v except_v against_o viz._n the_o primitive_a church_n practice_v and_o universal_a and_o unanimous_a consent_n of_o father_n and_o general_a council_n by_o these_o our_o church_n be_v content_a to_o be_v try_v and_o to_o this_o rule_n we_o bring_v the_o church_n government_n to_o be_v try_v thereby_o and_o on_o this_o score_n your_o presbytery_n be_v quite_o our_o of_o door_n be_v of_o example_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n and_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n whole_o destitute_a ●_o wherein_o as_o the_o king_n have_v it_o the_o whole_a stream_n run_v so_o for_o episcopacy_n that_o that_o there_o be_v not_o the_o least_o rivulet_n for_o any_o other_o which_o you_o be_v sensible_a of_o have_v no_o way_n to_o evade_v this_o rule_n but_o una_fw-la liturâ_fw-la to_o blot_v out_o all_o record_n and_o monument_n