wish_v utinam_fw-la tale_n hodie_fw-la à _fw-la ministerio_fw-la aâ—…verentuâ—…_n four_o because_o the_o lord_n will_v cast_v off_o their_o child_n from_o be_v his_o for_o this_o sin_n as_o calvin_n also_o note_n upon_o the_o place_n the_o promise_n of_o show_v mercy_n to_o a_o 1000_o generation_n be_v chief_o annex_v to_o the_o observer_n of_o the_o second_o command_n and_o the_o institute_v mean_n of_o worship_n which_o those_o priest_n never_o be_v reply_n on_o the_o contrary_a if_o you_o will_v extend_v this_o text_n to_o all_o unworthy_a minister_n of_o what_o sort_n soever_o who_o the_o word_n of_o god_n condemn_v as_o not_o approve_a minister_n of_o god_n etc._n etc._n answ_n we_o intend_v no_o other_o sort_n then_o such_o as_o we_o have_v in_o hand_n the_o unable_a and_o ungodly_a idol_n priest_n of_o england_n and_o therefore_o this_o discourse_n concern_v we_o not_o for_o we_o free_o confess_v that_o it_o be_v lawful_a in_o divers_a case_n at_o least_o for_o a_o time_n to_o communicate_v with_o such_o unworthy_a minister_n as_o may_v be_v contain_v in_o your_o description_n but_o that_o people_n must_v and_o aught_o to_o join_v with_o such_o in_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n and_o sin_n if_o they_o separate_v from_o the_o ordinance_n as_o you_o say_v the_o scripture_n allege_v teach_v not_o this_o so_o evident_o that_o we_o can_v see_v as_o 1_o sam._n 2.12_o 13.17.24_o that_o imputation_n verse_n 24._o they_o make_v the_o lord_n people_n to_o transgress_v do_v not_o depend_v immediate_o on_o verse_n 13_o 14.17_o but_o on_o verse_n 22.23_o where_o they_o be_v charge_v to_o have_v lie_v with_o the_o woman_n the_o other_o passage_n be_v interrupt_v by_o the_o story_n of_o samuel_n and_o his_o mother_n verse_n 18_o 19.20_o 21._o so_o jer._n 8.8_o 9_o micah_n 3.11_o 12._o contain_v only_a threat_n against_o wicked_a minister_n but_o not_o a_o word_n to_o prove_v people_n ought_v to_o join_v with_o they_o etc._n etc._n phil._n 1.15_o speak_v of_o such_o as_o preach_v and_o preach_v christ_n though_o not_o of_o sincerity_n do_v not_o reach_v such_o minister_n as_o the_o word_n condemn_v for_o many_o such_o may_v be_v approve_v minister_n by_o the_o word_n have_v a_o call_v according_a to_o the_o same_o but_o we_o shall_v not_o contend_v in_o this_o case_n wherein_o we_o do_v not_o dissent_v so_o that_o christian_n be_v leave_v to_o their_o lawful_a liberty_n of_o withdraw_a from_o minister_n gross_o wicked_a and_o teacher_n of_o false_a doctrine_n or_o idle_a and_o unsufficient_a when_o they_o can_v reclaim_v they_o or_o remove_v they_o in_o the_o use_n of_o all_o lawful_a mean_n within_o their_o power_n reply_n the_o reason_n whereby_o the_o ancient_a church_n condemn_v the_o donatist_n and_o catharist_n for_o their_o voluntary_a and_o seditious_a separation_n and_o the_o modern_a church_n condemn_v the_o anabaptist_n for_o their_o rent_v from_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n will_v hold_v against_o separation_n from_o the_o prayer_n of_o the_o congregation_n because_o they_o be_v read_v by_o a_o ungodly_a minister_n we_o deny_v that_o we_o teach_v or_o hold_v such_o separation_n because_o read_v by_o a_o ungodly_a minister_n as_o be_v sufficient_o show_v before_o but_o what_o we_o speak_v be_v against_o conformity_n to_o and_o communion_n with_o the_o corruption_n of_o the_o liturgy_n especial_o use_v by_o a_o unable_a as_o well_o as_o ungodly_a minister_n and_o therefore_o the_o argument_n mention_v will_v hold_v against_o our_o proposition_n just_a as_o the_o accusation_n and_o imputation_n of_o donatism_n puritanisme_n anabaptism_n which_o the_o prelate_n cast_v upon_o all_o nonconformist_n and_o man_n studious_a of_o reformation_n will_v hold_v and_o fasten_v upon_o they_o which_o be_v nothing_o at_o all_o reply_n the_o second_o proposition_n where_o the_o whole_a liturgy_n be_v use_v though_o by_o a_o able_a and_o godly_a minister_n it_o be_v not_o lawful_a to_o join_v in_o prayer_n in_o that_o case_n we_o can_v be_v of_o your_o judgement_n herein_o for_o in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o prophet_n and_o our_o saviour_n christ_n as_o great_a abuse_n no_o question_n be_v find_v etc._n etc._n but_o they_o never_o teach_v people_n to_o separate_v from_o the_o holy_a thing_n of_o god_n answ_n first_o we_o must_v still_o mind_v the_o reader_n of_o the_o true_a and_o full_a state_n of_o the_o question_n which_o in_o our_o answer_n be_v of_o join_v in_o prayer_n with_o and_o when_o that_o whole_a liturgy_n be_v use_v and_o he_o that_o join_v with_o that_o whole_a liturgy_n must_v needs_o be_v suppose_v to_o have_v actual_a communion_n with_o all_o the_o corruption_n thereof_o what_o ever_o they_o be_v and_o therefore_o though_o this_o proposition_n reach_v to_o the_o practice_n of_o able_a and_o godly_a minister_n yet_o let_v none_o think_v we_o plead_v herein_o separation_n from_o their_o ministry_n but_o only_o that_o people_n may_v not_o conform_v with_o they_o to_o any_o corruption_n in_o worship_n and_o by_o this_o proposition_n also_o the_o author_n may_v easy_o have_v see_v that_o we_o deny_v the_o other_o which_o be_v weave_v in_o with_o this_o not_o because_o of_o the_o ungodliness_n of_o the_o minister_n alone_o as_o he_o carry_v his_o dispute_n but_o chief_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o corruption_n of_o the_o worship_n together_o with_o the_o unlawfulnesse_n of_o such_o a_o ministry_n that_o be_v both_o unable_a and_o ungodly_a second_o concern_v the_o argument_n it_o run_v as_o full_a for_o conformity_n to_o all_o the_o corrupt_a ceremony_n of_o the_o book_n as_o the_o corrupt_a worship_n itself_o therein_o as_o be_v say_v before_o clear_v the_o one_o viz._n non-conformitie_n to_o ceremony_n show_v a_o reason_n why_o you_o will_v separate_v from_o the_o sacrament_n because_o you_o will_v not_o kneel_v according_a to_o the_o book_n and_o you_o answer_v your_o argument_n here_o allege_v against_o we_o but_o the_o reply_n proceed_v reply_n and_o if_o presence_n at_o form_n of_o prayer_n be_v not_o lawful_a by_o reason_n of_o the_o corruption_n allege_v there_o can_v be_v no_o visible_a society_n name_v since_o 200._o year_n after_o christ_n or_o thereabouts_o wherein_o a_o christian_a may_v lawful_o join_v in_o prayer_n read_v the_o scripture_n hear_v the_o word_n or_o participation_n of_o the_o sacrament_n their_o doctrine_n prayer_n right_n be_v less_o pure_a than_o we_o but_o no_o man_n we_o hope_v will_v be_v so_o bold_a as_o to_o affirm_v the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n within_o 200._o year_n after_o christ_n to_o be_v so_o miserable_o decay_v that_o the_o faithful_a can_v not_o without_o sin_n hold_v communion_n with_o they_o in_o the_o foresay_a ordinance_n of_o god_n answ_n first_o this_o argument_n hold_v as_o strong_o for_o conformity_n to_o the_o ceremony_n as_o to_o the_o whole_a book_n of_o common_a prayer_n as_o be_v say_v before_o second_o this_o be_v a_o dangerous_a kind_n of_o reason_v from_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o faithful_a in_o corrupt_a time_n of_o the_o church_n especial_o when_o they_o be_v decline_v and_o grow_a cloud_n of_o darkness_n and_o superstition_n overspread_v the_o church_n it_o be_v no_o breach_n of_o charity_n to_o think_v that_o through_o the_o iniquity_n of_o the_o time_n the_o godly_a live_v in_o many_o evil_n through_o ignorance_n and_o weakness_n which_o after_o light_n be_v come_v into_o the_o church_n we_o ought_v to_o abandon_v whole_o these_o be_v time_n of_o light_n and_o of_o the_o consumption_n of_o antichrist_n and_o time_n for_o we_o to_o abolish_v his_o liturgy_n and_o corrupt_a form_n of_o worship_n as_o well_o as_o image_n ceremony_n etc._n etc._n who_o do_v not_o pity_v the_o weakness_n of_o godly_a bilny_n and_o other_o that_o see_v some_o gross_a corruption_n be_v yet_o so_o devout_o obedient_a to_o the_o church_n as_o they_o call_v it_o in_o many_o gross_a superstition_n and_o the_o like_a may_v be_v say_v of_o those_o former_a time_n and_o we_o see_v not_o but_o this_o reason_n will_v go_v far_o in_o justification_n of_o communion_n with_o many_o false_a worship_n of_o antichrist_n that_o be_v not_o gross_o idolatrous_a three_o it_o be_v a_o great_a charge_n upon_o those_o time_n to_o say_v no_o visible_a society_n throughout_o the_o world_n can_v be_v name_v since_o 200._o year_n after_o christ_n that_o be_v not_o less_o pure_a than_o england_n in_o doctrine_n rite_n etc._n etc._n it_o may_v be_v that_o as_o general_o church_n be_v corrupt_a so_o they_o contemn_v and_o censure_v such_o as_o profess_v more_o purity_n but_o that_o there_o be_v some_o visible_a assembly_n more_o pure_a may_v be_v conceive_v by_o that_o testimony_n give_v to_o aerius_n and_o many_o orthodox_n christian_n with_o he_o though_o condemn_v for_o a_o heretic_n in_o that_o which_o we_o all_o now_o hold_v to_o be_v a_o undoubted_a truth_n also_o after_o the_o waldenses_n cast_v off_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o will_n
and_o hand_n to_o pray_v and_o preach_v and_o write_v as_o one_o to_o stop_v the_o floodgate_n of_o error_n and_o abomination_n that_o satan_n have_v set_v open_a to_o the_o drown_n of_o many_o soul_n and_o the_o hazard_n of_o many_o of_o the_o sheep_n of_o christ_n while_o we_o be_v contend_v about_o some_o matter_n of_o order_n which_o though_o they_o be_v of_o moment_n yet_o must_v give_v way_n unto_o more_o fundamental_a truth_n and_o oh_o that_o this_o mischief_n be_v sufficient_o lay_v to_o heart_n and_o the_o dangerous_a spreading_n of_o such_o gangrene_n look_v to_o in_o season_n what_o will_v not_o all_o our_o vow_n covenant_n and_o solemn_a oath_n bind_v we_o together_o these_o and_o many_o such_o heart-breaking_a consideration_n we_o doubt_v not_o be_v before_o your_o eye_n daily_o which_o therefore_o we_o will_v not_o enlarge_v only_o give_v we_o leave_v to_o propound_v what_o we_o conceive_v in_o our_o weak_a judgement_n may_v somewhat_o tend_v to_o heal_v this_o distance_n we_o confess_v we_o stand_v far_o from_o the_o mark_n and_o may_v miss_v the_o matter_n but_o if_o we_o do_v let_v our_o well-meaning_a be_v accept_v and_o our_o weakness_n pardon_v two_o thing_n as_o we_o touch_v before_o we_o conceive_v keep_v our_o dear_a brethren_n from_o close_v together_o in_o one_o to_o promote_v the_o public_a and_o general_a reformation_n first_o that_o point_n of_o reformation_n which_o concern_v the_o member_n of_o the_o church_n and_o here_o we_o fear_v the_o distance_n at_o present_a be_v great_a for_o when_o it_o be_v think_v on_o the_o one_o hand_n that_o there_o be_v no_o need_n of_o â—…ending_v godly_a preacher_n to_o the_o ignorant_a and_o profane_a parish_n to_o instruct_v they_o humble_v they_o and_o prepare_v they_o for_o a_o gracious_a reformation_n but_o that_o pastor_n if_o they_o can_v be_v find_v shall_v be_v send_v to_o they_o and_o minister_v to_o they_o as_o they_o be_v if_o they_o will_v but_o join_v in_o the_o national_a covenant_n as_o most_o have_v do_v for_o we_o see_v no_o other_o require_v and_o when_o godly_a pastor_n may_v not_o have_v power_n to_o try_v their_o people_n whether_o they_o can_v examine_v themselves_o discern_v the_o lord_n body_n and_o walk_v according_a to_o christ_n before_o they_o admit_v they_o to_o the_o lord_n table_n nor_o may_v exclude_v they_o but_o upon_o some_o scandalous_a evil_n which_o seem_v short_a of_o that_o which_o even_o the_o common-prayer-booke_n do_v allow_v consider_v in_o what_o a_o state_n multitude_n of_o parish_n be_v in_o england_n how_o full_a of_o malignant_n atheist_n profane_a wretch_n etc._n etc._n we_o must_v needs_o acknowledge_v it_o will_v be_v very_o hard_o for_o the_o godly_a to_o satisfy_v their_o conscience_n in_o such_o church-communion_n or_o godly_a pastor_n to_o minister_v unto_o their_o parish_n in_o such_o a_o state_n and_o therefore_o we_o can_v whole_o condemn_v such_o minister_n and_o people_n as_o have_v be_v gather_v into_o congregation_n if_o there_o be_v no_o hope_n of_o remedy_n in_o this_o case_n second_o on_o the_o other_o hand_n when_o some_o shall_v gather_v out_o of_o many_o congregation_n the_o most_o godly_a and_o able_a christian_n into_o sever_a church_n we_o must_v acknowledge_v it_o may_v occasion_v grief_n to_o the_o minister_n of_o such_o congregation_n but_o be_v there_o no_o middle_a way_n wherein_o according_a to_o god_n these_o two_o may_v meet_v we_o suppose_v there_o be_v if_o the_o lord_n will_v vouchsafe_v to_o help_v his_o people_n in_o these_o few_o thing_n 1_o be_v it_o not_o possible_a to_o obtain_v of_o that_o â—…ver_o renown_a parliament_n not_o only_o such_o liberty_n for_o godly_a pastor_n and_o their_o church_n to_o debar_v from_o the_o lord_n table_n such_o as_o be_v not_o qualify_v according_a to_o the_o former_a description_n of_o the_o reverend_a assembly_n but_o also_o all_o favour_n and_o furtherance_n from_o authority_n to_o purge_v out_o of_o the_o church_n all_o such_o according_a to_o rule_v that_o live_v impenitent_o in_o any_o know_a sin_n and_o scandalous_a evil_n we_o can_v doubt_v but_o that_o if_o brethren_n will_v agree_v with_o one_o heart_n to_o petition_v the_o same_o such_o as_o have_v do_v so_o worthy_o many_o thing_n for_o purge_v the_o house_n of_o god_n will_v also_o promote_v this_o needful_a point_n of_o reformation_n 2_o if_o all_o the_o godly_a minister_n will_v join_v as_o one_o man_n and_o take_v unto_o they_o the_o zeal_n of_o john_n bap._n thunder_v out_o the_o direful_a wrath_n of_o god_n against_o the_o pride_n vanity_n luxury_n profaneness_n and_o late_a swarm_n of_o monstrous_a error_n the_o usual_a tare_n accompany_v reformation_n and_o other_o sin_n of_o the_o time_n to_o lay_v all_o level_n before_o the_o lord_n and_o with_o holy_a calvin_n resolve_v to_o suffer_v their_o hand_n to_o be_v cut_v off_o rather_o then_o to_o deliver_v that_o holy_a seal_n of_o grace_n to_o the_o open_o wicked_a and_o impenitent_a sinner_n how_o will_v the_o lord_n go_v out_o with_o his_o servant_n excom_n and_o cut_v down_o sin_n by_o the_o sharp_a sword_n of_o his_o word_n and_o severity_n of_o discipline_n if_o all_o join_v together_o whereas_o we_o fear_v sin_n and_o profaneness_n will_v outstare_v all_o godly_a pastor_n when_o they_o stand_v so_o much_o divide_v 3_o if_o these_o thing_n be_v obtain_v and_o agree_v all_o godly_a minister_n and_o christian_n which_o be_v the_o salt_n of_o the_o earth_n and_o may_v by_o the_o blessing_n of_o god_n season_n the_o congregation_n wherein_o they_o live_v they_o will_v not_o cast_v they_o off_o or_o withdraw_v from_o they_o till_o first_o by_o public_a and_o private_a admonition_n and_o exhortation_n they_o have_v convince_v they_o of_o sin_n and_o seek_v by_o all_o good_a mean_n their_o reformation_n whereby_o some_o no_o doubt_n may_v be_v gain_v and_o what_o a_o bless_a work_n be_v that_o and_o as_o for_o other_o that_o prove_v obstinate_a and_o impenitent_a there_o will_v be_v just_a cause_n of_o reject_v they_o from_o the_o ordinance_n and_o society_n of_o the_o church_n or_o if_o this_o part_n of_o the_o kingdom_n of_o christ_n will_v not_o be_v bear_v in_o congregation_n with_o how_o much_o peace_n and_o satisfaction_n to_o their_o own_o soul_n and_o to_o the_o conscience_n of_o all_o shall_v such_o godly_a minister_n and_o people_n withdraw_v themselves_o from_o they_o to_o a_o near_a communion_n one_o with_o another_o and_o shall_v we_o not_o hope_v that_o england_n be_v capable_a of_o such_o a_o reformation_n as_o this_o if_o god_n faithful_a minister_n will_v with_o one_o heart_n and_o mind_n endeavour_v the_o same_o far_o far_o be_v it_o from_o our_o dear_a country_n after_o all_o those_o notable_a step_n unto_o reformation_n that_o it_o shall_v stick_v in_o this_o which_o be_v the_o life_n of_o all_o the_o rest_n but_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v so_o that_o either_o the_o great_a one_o shall_v be_v too_o big_a to_o stoop_v down_o to_o the_o lord_n jesus_n in_o the_o way_n of_o his_o wholesome_a discipline_n or_o the_o multitude_n so_o carnal_a worldly_a wilful_a profane_a impenitent_a as_o not_o to_o reform_v themselves_o family_n and_o so_o their_o congregation_n humble_o submit_v to_o the_o rule_n of_o christ_n or_o if_o the_o minister_n at_o least_o most_o of_o they_o shall_v look_v at_o preferment_n honour_n credit_n riches_n authority_n over_o the_o people_n and_o not_o mind_v such_o a_o work_n as_o this_o be_v and_o this_o after_o all_o the_o heavy_a humble_v dreadful_a judgement_n of_o god_n come_v upon_o the_o land_n after_o all_o the_o glorious_a out_o break_n of_o the_o light_n of_o the_o gospel_n in_o many_o part_n of_o the_o kingdom_n after_o all_o the_o protestation_n covenant_n oath_n whereby_o so_o many_o have_v bind_v themselves_o to_o this_o particular_a reformation_n of_o themselves_o and_o to_o further_a the_o reformation_n of_o the_o public_a we_o tremble_v to_o speak_v it_o but_o our_o heart_n can_v but_o fear_v it_o that_o woe_n wo_n woe_n will_v be_v to_o poor_a sinful_a england_n it_o seem_v to_o we_o to_o be_v a_o prophetical_a speech_n of_o mr._n briâ—â—ly_o long_o since_o at_o rest_n with_o god_n when_o lament_v the_o profaneness_n of_o england_n with_o their_o connivance_n at_o popery_n and_o compliance_n with_o the_o wicked_a he_o say_v that_o if_o the_o lord_n of_o host_n do_v call_v for_o they_o mean_v the_o popish_a faction_n to_o rise_v up_o against_o we_o in_o new_a conspiracy_n or_o open_a violence_n and_o with_o they_o all_o the_o crew_n of_o wicked_a and_o ungodly_a man_n in_o who_o we_o have_v so_o delight_v to_o take_v part_n with_o those_o to_o our_o destruction_n as_o they_o it_o be_v to_o be_v fear_v will_v be_v as_o outrageous_a as_o the_o other_o against_o all_o sound_o fear_v god_n be_v it_o not_o just_a yea_o if_o he_o shall_v let_v they_o make_v it_o
lawful_a for_o matter_n and_o manner_n the_o corruption_n of_o he_o that_o use_v it_o according_a to_o his_o judgement_n from_o what_o cause_n can_v it_o spring_v but_o humane_a ignorance_n and_o frailty_n answ_n first_o the_o learned_a reply_o be_v very_o apt_a to_o forget_v the_o term_n of_o the_o proposition_n which_o be_v of_o the_o whole_a liturgy_n not_o of_o some_o thing_n in_o it_o that_o he_o may_v judge_v lawful_a to_o judge_v the_o whole_a lawful_a we_o think_v none_o of_o those_o who_o send_v the_o question_n do_v second_o our_o question_n be_v not_o whether_o the_o minister_n use_v the_o book_n of_o humane_a frailty_n but_o whether_o the_o worship_n offer_v therein_o be_v not_o so_o corrupt_a for_o matter_n and_o manner_n as_o puts_z a_o great_a difference_n between_o it_o and_o the_o prayer_n of_o a_o minister_n that_o may_v be_v subject_a to_o fayling_n of_o humane_a frailty_n we_o doubt_v not_o but_o bilney_n latimer_n etc._n etc._n use_v the_o prayer_n and_o ceremony_n 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think_v that_o will_v not_o ease_v but_o aggravate_v the_o evil_a argue_v a_o reluctancy_n or_o doubtfulness_n at_o least_o in_o his_o conscience_n and_o so_o what_o he_o do_v be_v not_o of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o sin_n rom._n 14._o 2ly_n what_o you_o say_v of_o the_o faithful_a here_o may_v be_v say_v for_o the_o faithful_a in_o malachi_n his_o time_n if_o any_o godly_a man_n come_v with_o godly_a desire_n to_o jerusalem_n to_o worship_n and_o then_o careless_o buy_v and_o take_v a_o corrupt_a sacrifice_n for_o cheapness_n ease_n etc._n etc._n shall_v he_o not_o be_v count_v at_o least_o in_o part_n this_o deceiver_n and_o bear_v the_o curse_n and_o why_o not_o so_o here_o in_o this_o case_n let_v a_o man_n bring_v himself_o and_o never_o so_o godly_a desire_n yet_o if_o he_o
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appear_v by_o the_o reason_n allege_v against_o any_o such_o universal_a church_n as_o institute_v and_o political_a wherein_o the_o seal_n be_v dispense_v which_o reason_n you_o answer_v not_o but_o grant_v there_o be_v no_o such_o catholic_n church_n in_o our_o sense_n pag._n 21._o and_o if_o no_o such_o church_n wherein_o the_o seal_n be_v administer_v as_o we_o prove_v than_o the_o cause_n itself_o be_v yield_v and_o the_o seal_n must_v belong_v to_o particular_a church_n 2_o see_v the_o main_a hinge_n of_o this_o question_n turn_v upon_o this_o point_n to_o what_o church_n the_o administration_n and_o participation_n of_o the_o seal_n belong_v we_o shall_v a_o little_a further_o open_v ourselves_o in_o this_o point_n and_o because_o we_o affect_v and_o study_v peace_n with_o truth_n we_o shall_v free_o acknowledge_v first_o that_o as_o there_o be_v a_o invisible_a church_n and_o body_n of_o christ_n consist_v of_o all_o the_o elect_a effectual_o call_v throughout_o the_o world_n in_o all_o age_n of_o it_o the_o whole_a family_n in_o heaven_n and_o earth_n so_o unto_o jesus_n christ_n all_o the_o visible_a believer_n and_o church_n of_o the_o world_n be_v as_o one_o body_n to_o he_o he_o govern_v protect_a instruct_v all_o as_o his_o visible_a body_n second_o we_o acknowledge_v a_o visible_a communion_n of_o all_o the_o true_a church_n of_o the_o lord_n jesus_n in_o all_o office_n of_o brotherly_a love_n and_o in_o the_o holy_a thing_n of_o christ_n so_o far_o as_o may_v appear_v the_o lord_n have_v ordain_v and_o command_v and_o by_o his_o providence_n call_v they_o to_o exercise_v one_o with_o another_o three_o we_o grant_v that_o all_o true_a believer_n wherever_o they_o be_v have_v by_o faith_n in_o christ_n a_o true_a right_n and_o interest_n unto_o jesus_n christ_n and_o all_o his_o benefit_n whatsoever_o he_o have_v purchase_v for_o they_o but_o here_o we_o must_v first_o distinguish_v of_o these_o benefit_n of_o christ_n whereof_o some_o be_v mere_o 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visible_a believer_n have_v a_o right_n to_o seal_n etc._n etc._n but_o the_o immediate_a fruition_n of_o they_o they_o must_v have_v mediante_fw-la ecclesiâ_fw-la visibili_fw-la now_o here_o lie_v the_o true_a state_n of_o the_o question_n whether_o the_o lord_n jesus_n have_v ordain_v a_o universal_a visible_a church_n in_o which_o and_o unto_o which_o by_o the_o officer_n thereof_o all_o these_o outward_a visible_a privilege_n and_o mean_n of_o grace_n be_v to_o be_v dispense_v and_o immediate_o enjoy_v of_o the_o faithful_a or_o whether_o not_o the_o remote_a right_n but_o the_o immediate_a fruition_n and_o administration_n of_o all_o these_o ordinance_n by_o the_o institution_n of_o christ_n be_v give_v to_o particular_a visible_a church_n and_o sure_o to_o who_o one_o of_o these_o be_v give_v all_o be_v give_v for_o there_o be_v the_o same_o nature_n reason_n and_o use_v of_o all_o ministry_n of_o the_o word_n seal_n discipline_n all_o be_v outward_a ordinance_n privilege_n mean_n of_o grace_n belong_v to_o the_o visible_a church_n where_o christ_n have_v give_v one_o he_o have_v give_v all_o but_o we_o must_v confess_v however_o you_o call_v this_o a_o new_a church_n way_n it_o be_v new_a to_o we_o to_o read_v so_o much_o of_o late_a of_o such_o a_o catholic_n church_n to_o which_o administration_n of_o seal_n censure_n etc._n etc._n belong_v we_o be_v yet_o of_o the_o opinion_n of_o baynes_n parker_n and_o cartwright_n etc._n etc._n that_o have_v against_o papist_n and_o prelate_n maintain_v that_o in_o the_o new_a testament_n there_o be_v no_o institute_v catholic_n national_n or_o provincial_n church_n but_o only_o the_o church_n of_o a_o particular_a congregation_n both_o for_o the_o reason_n allege_v in_o our_o answer_n as_o also_o for_o the_o impossibility_n thereof_o in_o the_o day_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n when_o the_o lord_n jesus_n send_v his_o apostle_n into_o all_o the_o world_n
we_o deny_v the_o consequence_n for_o when_o they_o grow_v to_o so_o great_a a_o number_n they_o may_v fall_v into_o more_o congregationall_a church_n and_o so_o no_o other_o form_n arise_v from_o the_o multitude_n but_o we_o suppose_v you_o mean_v of_o such_o a_o multitude_n as_o be_v call_v a_o church_n and_o therefore_o to_o answer_v to_o your_o assumption_n we_o deny_v that_o any_o such_o multitude_n of_o believer_n as_o be_v here_o call_v a_o church_n be_v so_o great_a as_o can_v not_o meet_v to_o edification_n and_o first_o concern_v samaria_n reply_n that_o there_o be_v a_o church_n gather_v in_o samaria_n will_v not_o be_v deny_v for_o they_o receive_v the_o word_n and_o be_v baptize_v but_o that_o the_o church_n in_o that_o city_n be_v only_o a_o congregationall_a assembly_n be_v more_o than_o can_v probable_o be_v conclude_v answ_n we_o grant_v a_o church_n or_o church_n be_v gather_v in_o samaria_n and_o we_o accept_v your_o reason_n as_o good_a because_o they_o receive_v the_o word_n and_o be_v baptize_v whâ—…e_o by_o the_o way_n you_o grant_v what_o we_o plead_v for_o before_o that_o the_o apostle_n gather_v church_n when_o they_o baptize_v they_o but_o that_o there_o be_v but_o one_o congregationall_a assembly_n lie_v not_o in_o 〈…〉_z prove_v until_o you_o prove_v that_o all_o the_o believer_n be_v call_v a_o church_n or_o one_o church_n which_o do_v not_o appear_v in_o the_o whole_a story_n 〈…〉_z nor_o any_o other_o where_o that_o we_o can_v find_v and_o it_o be_v very_o probable_a that_o as_o philip_n convert_v and_o baptize_v so_o great_a a_o multitude_n at_o several_a time_n and_o gather_v they_o into_o the_o church_n or_o church_n as_o he_o baptize_v they_o so_o he_o may_v gather_v several_a church_n as_o well_o as_o one_o see_v that_o none_o doubt_v but_o that_o congregationall_a church_n 〈◊〉_d a_o ordinance_n of_o christ_n what_o ever_o man_n contend_v for_o beside_o and_o therefore_o be_v the_o number_n of_o believer_n in_o samaria_n as_o great_a as_o you_o will_v have_v it_o it_o prove_v nothing_o reply_n the_o church_n at_o jerusalem_n be_v one_o and_o distinct_a yet_o increase_v to_o 3000_o then_o to_o 5000_o etc._n etc._n answ_n be_v it_o so_o the_o increase_n be_v very_o great_a yet_o so_o long_o as_o they_o be_v call_v one_o distinct_a church_n it_o be_v one_o congregation_n viz._n until_o they_o scatter_v by_o the_o persecution_n about_o stephen_n acts._n 7.8_o which_o be_v evident_a by_o these_o two_o argument_n first_o act_v 2.41_o etc._n etc._n where_o we_o see_v the_o 3000_o add_v to_o the_o 120._o they_o have_v their_o communion_n together_o describe_v 1_o in_o regard_n of_o their_o spiritual_a communion_n to_o be_v in_o the_o apostle_n doctrine_n fellowship_n break_v of_o bread_n and_o prayer_n verse_n 42._o second_o in_o regard_n of_o their_o outward_a communion_n in_o the_o good_a thing_n of_o this_o life_n they_o have_v all_o thing_n common_a and_o sell_v their_o possession_n etc._n etc._n verse_n 44_o &_o 45_o now_o the_o manner_n of_o both_o part_n of_o this_o communion_n in_o respect_n of_o time_n and_o place_n be_v describe_v verse_n 46._o viz._n in_o their_o spiritual_a duty_n they_o continue_v daily_o with_o one_o accord_n in_o the_o temple_n and_o second_o in_o respect_n of_o their_o outward_a communion_n in_o their_o state_n they_o eat_v their_o meat_n from_o house_n to_o house_n this_o latter_a require_v many_o table_n and_o many_o house_n to_o provide_v for_o they_o so_o that_o although_o in_o their_o outward_a communion_n it_o be_v in_o private_a house_n yet_o their_o spiritual_a communion_n it_o be_v with_o one_o accord_n in_o one_o place_n viz._n the_o temple_n where_o they_o have_v room_n enough_o be_v the_o place_n erect_v for_o a_o national_n church_n and_o have_v favour_n with_o all_o the_o people_n be_v not_o interrupt_v therein_o by_o any_o persecution_n we_o need_v not_o step_v out_o of_o our_o way_n to_o reply_v to_o all_o that_o be_v say_v against_o this_o reason_n it_o be_v enough_o for_o we_o to_o note_v that_o they_o daily_o with_o one_o accord_n 〈◊〉_d and_o that_o in_o the_o temple_n which_o be_v not_o ansâ—…ered_v by_o any_o 〈…〉_z 2_o this_o appear_v act_n â—…_z 1_o 5._o where_o it_o be_v evident_a the_o election_n of_o deacon_n be_v before_o and_o by_o the_o multitude_n verse_n 1._o by_o the_o whole_a multitude_n verse_n 5._o and_o this_o be_v the_o last_o church-meeting_n and_o church_n act_n we_o read_v of_o before_o their_o scatter_n neither_o can_v â—…t_o appear_v that_o the_o jew_n and_o â—…recians_n who_o widow_n murmur_v be_v two_o distinct_a congregation_n but_o the_o contrary_n be_v evident_a in_o that_o the_o deacon_n be_v choose_v all_o by_o the_o whole_a and_o for_o the_o whole_a not_o distinct_o so_o many_o for_o this_o and_o so_o many_o for_o that_o church_n as_o it_o be_v needful_a if_o they_o be_v two_o church_n these_o proof_n be_v so_o clear_a the_o inconvenience_n object_v be_v of_o no_o force_n and_o sufficient_o answer_v by_o many_o example_n of_o as_o great_a assembly_n meet_v ordinary_o to_o edification_n as_o beside_o the_o auditory_a of_o chrysostome_n cite_v by_o other_o the_o assembly_n of_o stepney_n in_o london_n yarmouth_n in_o norfolk_n and_o other_o in_o our_o experience_n beza_n a_o man_n not_o love_v to_o hyperbolise_v say_v that_o be_v in_o paris_n there_o meet_v at_o a_o sermon_n 332._o 24000._o and_o of_o a_o synodall_n assembly_n that_o they_o receive_v the_o lord_n supper_n no_o less_o than_o 10000_o beza_n epist._n 65._o reply_n without_o question_v the_o number_n of_o believer_n at_o antioch_n be_v not_o small_a of_o which_o it_o be_v express_o say_v that_o a_o great_a number_n believe_v and_o that_o a_o great_a multitude_n be_v add_v to_o the_o lord_n by_o the_o preach_n of_o barnabas_n etc._n etc._n and_o therefore_o we_o may_v think_v the_o church_n rise_v to_o such_o aâ—…_n bigness_n as_o can_v not_o well_o assemble_v in_o one_o congregation_n act_v 11.21_o &_o 14.27_o answ_n 1_o in_o that_o place_n act_v 11.21_o the_o great_a number_n that_o believe_v be_v the_o fruit_n of_o all_o the_o scatter_a christian_n at_o phenice_n cyprus_n and_o antioch_n for_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o lord_n be_v with_o they_o all_o and_o their_o whole_a success_n be_v sum_v up_o together_o nothing_o say_v before_o of_o the_o other_o place_n 2_o though_o paul_n and_o barnabas_n teach_v much_o people_n yet_o it_o prove_v not_o that_o this_o much_o people_n be_v convert_v to_o the_o church_n 3_o though_o much_o people_n be_v add_v to_o the_o lord_n yet_o do_v it_o follow_v they_o be_v more_o than_o can_v meet_v in_o one_o congregation_n and_o if_o first_o disciple_n be_v there_o call_v christian_n must_v it_o need_v be_v for_o their_o number_n and_o not_o rather_o for_o eminent_a likeness_n to_o christ_n with_o other_o specialty_n of_o providence_n 4_o it_o be_v express_o say_v the_o church_n be_v gather_v together_o act_v 14.27_o which_o be_v not_o mean_v of_o the_o elder_n only_o as_o if_o they_o only_o can_v meet_v for_o chap._n 15.30_o they_o gather_v the_o multitude_n together_o so_o that_o it_o be_v noâ—…_n 〈…〉_z but_o 〈…〉_z to_o gâ—…ther_o in_o 〈◊〉_d place_n reply_n the_o number_n of_o believer_n be_v great_a at_o ephesus_n where_o paul_n preach_v two_o year_n all_o that_o dwell_v 〈…〉_z hear_v 〈…〉_z and_o effectual_a way_n open_v 〈…〉_z the_o 〈…〉_z of_o diâ—…na_fw-la her_o temple_n be_v in_o danger_n to_o be_v seâ—…_n aâ—…â—…ought_v 〈◊〉_d those_o 〈…〉_z burn_v their_o book_n open_o which_o can_v not_o 〈…〉_z great_a danger_n of_o the_o church_n unless_o a_o great_a part_n of_o the_o city_n have_v 〈◊〉_d act_v 19.10_o 19_o 27._o answ_n 1_o be_v it_o so_o that_o many_o be_v convert_v and_o the_o word_n grâ—…w_o mighty_o this_o prove_v not_o thâ—â—_n all_o who_o hear_v paul_n be_v of_o the_o church_n of_o ephesus_n for_o then_o all_o 〈◊〉_d shall_v be_v of_o that_o church_n act_n 19.10_o who_o do_v hear_v the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d jewe_n and_o gentile_n as_o for_o the_o danger_n of_o the_o shrine_n and_o diana_n temple_n to_o be_v set_v at_o nought_o a_o little_a spark_n may_v â—…indle_v such_o fear_n and_o raise_v such_o outcry_n in_o the_o covetous_a craftsman_n by_o who_o the_o whole_a city_n be_v see_v in_o a_o superstitious_a 〈◊〉_d our_o own_o experience_n may_v teach_v how_o soon_o a_o profane_a people_n will_v cry_v our_o against_o a_o faithful_a minister_n before_o he_o have_v convert_v ten_o 〈◊〉_d in_o a_o city_n 2_o that_o they_o can_v not_o burn_v their_o book_n open_o without_o danger_n to_o the_o church_n except_o a_o great_a part_n of_o the_o city_n believe_v seem_v a_o strange_a reason_n as_o if_o believer_n 〈◊〉_d not_o profess_v open_o except_o they_o have_v a_o great_a number_n to_o maintain_v they_o with_o club-law_n open_a profession_n in_o those_o time_n
be_v join_v to_o a_o church_n second_o when_o a_o work_n of_o grace_n be_v require_v and_o desire_v of_o those_o who_o be_v to_o join_v to_o a_o church_n the_o meaning_n be_v not_o as_o if_o we_o allow_v none_o to_o â—…ee_v of_o the_o church_n but_o real_a saint_n and_o such_o as_o give_v demonstrative_a evidence_n of_o be_v member_n of_o the_o invisible_a church_n for_o we_o profess_v according_a to_o the_o scripture_n and_o general_a doctrine_n of_o all_o reform_a church_n what_o ever_o their_o practice_n be_v that_o it_o be_v not_o real_a but_o visible_a faith_n not_o the_o inward_a be_v but_o the_o outward_a profession_n of_o faith_n whence_o man_n be_v call_v visible_a saint_n that_o constitute_v a_o visible_a church_n which_o faith_n so_o profess_v be_v call_v visible_a not_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o certainty_n from_o such_o infallible_a sign_n of_o it_o as_o may_v demonstrate_v the_o hide_a be_v of_o it_o within_o but_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o charity_n which_o hope_v the_o best_a â—…_n cor._n 12_o 7_o in_o the_o weak_a christian_n and_o mean_a profession_n even_o when_o it_o sometime_o fear_v the_o worst_a and_o be_v not_o able_a at_o the_o present_a to_o convince_v the_o contrary_n three_o this_o judgement_n of_o charity_n concern_v the_o truth_n of_o another_o profession_n or_o that_o which_o be_v call_v the_o work_n of_o grace_n be_v to_o be_v regulate_v by_o the_o word_n which_o christ_n have_v leave_v as_o a_o complete_a rule_n not_o only_o of_o faith_n but_o also_o of_o love_n and_o charity_n to_o guide_v both_o in_o their_o act_n unto_o their_o end_n and_o hence_o large_a profession_n and_o long_a relation_n of_o the_o work_n of_o grace_n though_o full_a of_o exceed_a glory_n when_o humble_o and_o prudent_o make_v we_o exact_v not_o rigorous_o and_o necessary_o of_o all_o because_o the_o rule_n of_o charity_n direct_v we_o not_o so_o to_o judge_v because_o many_o christian_n may_v be_v draw_v to_o christ_n and_o have_v a_o seed_n of_o faith_n yet_o may_v sometime_o not_o know_v it_o sometime_o remember_v not_o the_o work_n of_o it_o sometime_o through_o bashfulness_n fear_n want_v of_o part_n nor_o not_o train_v up_o under_o a_o know_a ministry_n not_o be_v able_a to_o profess_v it_o so_o full_o and_o clear_o hence_o also_o to_o keep_v out_o other_o from_o communion_n out_o of_o groundless_a fear_n that_o all_o their_o profession_n may_v be_v in_o hypocrisy_n we_o allow_v not_o because_o no_o man_n in_o his_o charity_n be_v to_o be_v rule_v by_o his_o fear_n but_o by_o the_o word_n hence_o also_o to_o account_v any_o unfit_a for_o the_o church_n because_o their_o heart_n can_v close_v with_o they_o or_o because_o they_o like_v not_o their_o spirit_n speak_v not_o with_o favour_n or_o any_o such_o like_a principle_n and_o yet_o can_v give_v no_o rule_n or_o convict_a argument_n from_o the_o word_n why_o thus_o they_o do_v we_o think_v be_v rigour_n not_o charity_n regulate_v by_o the_o word_n for_o humane_a charity_n do_v not_o make_v god_n church_n but_o such_o person_n which_o from_o god_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o god_n charity_n be_v to_o receive_v and_o therefore_o the_o rule_n be_v to_o be_v attend_v here_o it_o be_v necessary_a to_o look_v for_o a_o ground_n of_o certainty_n to_o faith_n but_o not_o for_o charity_n which_o can_v be_v infallible_o certain_a of_o another_o estate_n and_o therefore_o upon_o a_o hopeful_a supposition_n that_o the_o premise_n their_o profession_n be_v true_a hopeful_o only_o make_v the_o conclusion_n the_o question_n â—…eing_v bring_v to_o this_o narrow_a it_o will_v here_o lie_v viz._n first_o whether_o profession_n of_o the_o work_n of_o grace_n and_o faith_n be_v not_o require_v of_o those_o that_o enter_v into_o the_o church_n second_o with_o what_o profession_n of_o the_o work_n of_o grace_n charity_n according_a to_o a_o rule_n be_v to_o rest_v satisfy_v the_o first_o we_o think_v be_v write_v with_o the_o beam_n of_o the_o sun_n for_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o neither_o the_o lord_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n exod._n 19_o or_o in_o the_o new_a testament_n act_v 2._o and_o in_o other_o like_a scripture_n do_v call_v for_o a_o profession_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n only_o but_o especial_o of_o the_o work_n of_o faith_n for_o when_o the_o lord_n promise_v to_o be_v a_o god_n to_o his_o people_n exd._n 19_o deut._n 29._o it_o be_v not_o with_o this_o condition_n if_o they_o do_v believe_v his_o word_n to_o be_v true_a etc._n etc._n but_o if_o they_o will_v hear_v his_o voice_n and_o keep_v his_o covenant_n which_o in_o a_o prepare_a people_n be_v a_o manifestation_n of_o a_o work_n of_o grace_n so_o when_o the_o apostle_n be_v require_v to_o go_v preach_v to_o all_o nation_n and_o baptize_v they_o and_o teach_v they_o look_v as_o they_o do_v require_v such_o a_o faith_n as_o be_v save_v he_o that_o believe_v shall_v be_v save_v so_o upon_o the_o profession_n thereof_o they_o do_v receive_v they_o as_o also_o appear_v act_v 2.38_o which_o therefore_o can_v not_o be_v of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n for_o that_o the_o devil_n do_v and_o tremble_v and_o profane_a man_n of_o much_o knowledge_n may_v do_v and_o yet_o unfit_a to_o be_v receive_v and_o therefore_o it_o be_v of_o the_o work_n of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o act._n 8.37_o philip_n not_o only_o require_v faith_n but_o a_o believe_a with_o all_o the_o hearâ—…_n of_o the_o eunuch_n and_o upon_o such_o a_o profession_n baptize_v he_o and_o hence_o the_o church_n erect_v by_o the_o apostle_n at_o corinth_n colosse_n ephesus_n etc._n etc._n be_v call_v saint_n and_o sanctify_v of_o god_n in_o christ_n jesus_n etc._n etc._n how_o be_v it_o because_o debito_fw-la and_o de_fw-la jure_fw-la only_o they_o shall_v be_v so_o then_o all_o who_o hear_v the_o gospel_n though_o they_o reject_v it_o may_v be_v call_v a_o church_n for_o de_fw-fr jure_fw-la they_o ought_v to_o be_v so_o or_o be_v it_o because_o there_o be_v some_o that_o be_v true_o such_o among_o they_o and_o so_o in_o concreto_fw-la be_v call_v a_o church_n and_o body_n of_o christ_n not_o only_o so_o for_o there_o may_v be_v some_o visible_a church_n of_o visible_a saint_n and_o yet_o none_o among_o they_o of_o the_o invisible_a church_n unless_o any_o will_v think_v that_o to_o be_v of_o the_o church_n invisible_a be_v essential_a to_o the_o be_v and_o title_n of_o a_o visible_a church_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v from_o their_o profession_n of_o save_a faith_n which_o they_o maintain_v be_v a_o church_n as_o it_o be_v require_v to_o the_o gather_n into_o a_o church_n john_n baptist_n also_o though_o he_o baptize_v none_o into_o a_o new_a church_n and_o therefore_o may_v require_v the_o less_o yet_o as_o he_o real_o promise_v remission_n of_o sin_n by_o the_o messiah_n so_o he_o require_v that_o very_a faith_n and_o repentance_n which_o may_v make_v they_o partaker_n of_o this_o heavenly_a benefit_n and_o therefore_o if_o what_o he_o require_v they_o manifest_v by_o their_o profession_n and_o confession_n of_o sin_n it_o be_v not_o only_o to_o believe_v the_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n but_o a_o save_a work_n of_o faith_n which_o they_o hold_v forth_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v not_o a_o outward_a profession_n of_o faith_n according_a to_o a_o creed_n which_o be_v require_v for_o then_o a_o papist_n be_v fit_a matter_n for_o a_o church_n nor_o willingness_n to_o hear_v the_o word_n and_o receive_v the_o sacrament_n for_o then_o heap_n of_o profane_a person_n be_v to_o be_v receive_v into_o the_o church_n but_o it_o be_v profession_n of_o a_o work_n and_o save_a work_n of_o grace_n which_o be_v ever_o require_v in_o the_o pure_a time_n be_v no_o novel_a invention_n of_o some_o more_o rigid_o incline_v in_o these_o thing_n to_o the_o second_o with_o what_o profession_n charity_n according_a to_o rule_v be_v to_o rest_v satisfy_v we_o answer_v that_o there_o be_v a_o breadth_n in_o charity_n according_a to_o rule_v and_o profession_n of_o faith_n be_v but_o testimonium_fw-la humanum_fw-la or_o a_o man_n own_o testimony_n concern_v himself_o therefore_o as_o in_o the_o most_o eminent_a profession_n potest_fw-la sâ—…besse_fw-la salsum_fw-la there_o may_v be_v hypocrisy_n latent_fw-la it_o be_v no_o divine_a testimony_n so_o in_o the_o weak_a profession_n of_o the_o work_n of_o faith_n potest_fw-la subesse_fw-la verum_fw-la idest_fw-la there_o may_v be_v truth_n in_o the_o bottom_n hence_o man_n leave_v all_o secret_n to_o god_n the_o work_n of_o grace_n wherewith_o charity_n be_v to_o be_v satisfy_v be_v one_o of_o these_o two_o first_o either_o with_o that_o which_o be_v only_o verbal_a and_o appear_v to_o be_v false_a by_o conviction_n from_o the_o word_n or_o second_o with_o that_o which_o appear_v to_o be_v real_a which_o however_o it_o may_v be_v false_a
it_o and_o see_v such_o superstitious_a opinion_n of_o it_o increase_v and_o such_o press_v the_o same_o to_o the_o oppression_n of_o the_o church_n so_o many_o fall_n so_o many_o weak_a one_o stagger_v and_o look_v at_o the_o example_n of_o their_o guide_n if_o now_o when_o all_o be_v call_v of_o god_n to_o rise_v up_o against_o it_o with_o zeal_n and_o detestation_n a_o minister_n godly_a and_o able_a will_v use_v any_o part_n of_o it_o with_o offence_n etc._n etc._n we_o suppose_v we_o have_v cause_n to_o fear_v and_o leave_v it_o doubtful_a whether_o the_o godly_a may_v lawful_o join_v with_o they_o therein_o and_o therefore_o we_o desire_v you_o to_o call_v back_o your_o sharp_a censure_n of_o such_o withdraw_a as_o you_o conclude_v this_o passage_n withal_o or_o else_o we_o shall_v appeal_v to_o the_o reverend_a assembly_n of_o minister_n and_o their_o late_a and_o godly_a directory_n herein_o reply_n five_o if_o these_o and_o such_o like_a scruple_n make_v it_o unlawful_a to_o join_v in_o the_o ordinance_n of_o worship_n we_o must_v hold_v communion_n with_o no_o society_n under_o heaven_n for_o may_v not_o the_o brethren_n which_o hold_v all_o stint_a liturgy_n and_o set_a form_n unlawful_a say_v with_o like_a reason_n it_o be_v not_o lawful_a to_o join_v with_o other_o inconceive_v prayer_n if_o they_o give_v too_o little_a honour_n to_o it_o as_o conceive_v the_o other_o lawful_a or_o sinful_o limit_v themselves_o to_o one_o stint_a form_n though_o conceive_v at_o first_o by_o themselves_o etc._n etc._n answ_n we_o must_v entreat_v the_o christian_a reader_n still_o to_o carry_v in_o mind_n with_o what_o tenderness_n we_o offer_v ourselves_o in_o this_o point_n and_o upon_o what_o consideration_n we_o dare_v not_o whole_o excuse_v and_o clear_v such_o join_n as_o the_o case_n now_o stand_v and_o therefore_o we_o think_v these_o reason_v will_v be_v far_o differ_v from_o the_o case_n in_o hand_n and_o we_o will_v not_o be_v take_v so_o as_o to_o justify_v such_o rigid_a principle_n as_o these_o be_v we_o hearty_o join_v in_o the_o conclusion_n that_o such_o advance_n of_o small_a difference_n will_v indeed_o bring_v all_o to_o confusion_n and_o we_o be_v far_o we_o hope_v from_o any_o such_o meaning_n if_o our_o answer_n in_o this_o or_o any_o other_o passage_n give_v just_a advantage_n to_o such_o separation_n we_o be_v hearty_o sorry_a for_o it_o but_o we_o hope_v what_o have_v be_v say_v will_v satisfy_v the_o ingenuous_a and_o christian_a reader_n reply_n six_o we_o have_v credible_o hear_v that_o you_o hold_v fellowship_n with_o profess_a rigid_a separatist_n without_o acknowledge_v of_o their_o error_n and_o receive_v they_o as_o member_n or_o communicate_v with_o they_o in_o the_o privilege_n of_o the_o church_n though_o you_o profess_v you_o approve_v not_o their_o opinion_n or_o practice_n and_o if_o in_o godly_a wisdom_n you_o can_v see_v ground_n to_o join_v with_o they_o we_o marvel_n you_o shall_v be_v so_o timorous_a in_o this_o particular_a answ_n although_o in_o many_o of_o our_o church_n we_o know_v not_o that_o there_o be_v any_o such_o profess_a rigid_a separatist_n that_o reject_v the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o no_o church_n and_o their_o minister_n as_o no_o true_a minister_n yet_o we_o deny_v not_o but_o some_o such_o there_o may_v be_v in_o some_o of_o the_o church_n whence_o we_o grant_v it_o may_v follow_v that_o we_o can_v have_v communion_n in_o god_n worship_n with_o man_n of_o several_a judgement_n yet_o we_o may_v be_v just_o timorous_a of_o join_v or_o approve_v other_o to_o join_v in_o any_o part_n of_o a_o corrupt_a worship_n in_o case_n of_o scandal_n etc._n etc._n we_o think_v these_o thing_n have_v not_o the_o same_o face_n or_o show_v of_o reason_n in_o they_o and_o therefore_o so_o long_o as_o they_o live_v peaceable_o with_o we_o we_o can_v well_o have_v fellowship_n with_o they_o as_o we_o have_v also_o with_o other_o that_o think_v it_o may_v be_v better_a of_o the_o church_n and_o way_n of_o it_o than_o there_o be_v cause_n in_o regard_n of_o the_o corruption_n thereof_o so_o we_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o approve_v their_o opinion_n nor_o conform_v to_o any_o of_o their_o corrupt_a practice_n reply_n seven_o if_o to_o administer_v in_o a_o stint_a form_n be_v scandalous_a to_o such_o as_o separate_v it_o be_v scandal_n take_v not_o give_v and_o we_o shall_v do_v it_o the_o rather_o that_o they_o be_v not_o confirm_v in_o their_o error_n the_o truth_n be_v not_o prejudice_v needless_a scruple_n occasion_v etc._n etc._n answ_n 1_o this_o be_v from_o the_o question_n for_o we_o dispute_v of_o your_o liturgy_n not_o of_o any_o liturgy_n or_o stint_v form_n 2_o take_v in_o the_o case_n in_o all_o its_o circumstance_n as_o before_o declare_v and_o it_o will_v appear_v scandal_n may_v be_v give_v at_o least_o we_o put_v the_o case_n of_o a_o scandal_n real_o give_v 3_o how_o far_o a_o man_n in_o some_o case_n of_o clear_a and_o undoubted_a truth_n may_v do_v a_o thing_n the_o rather_o for_o such_o reason_n though_o other_o take_v offence_n we_o will_v not_o dispute_v but_o if_o for_o meat_n or_o by_o use_n of_o our_o liberty_n by_o eat_v of_o such_o meat_n as_o another_o account_n unclean_a we_o may_v destroy_v the_o work_n of_o god_n and_o therefore_o must_v not_o eat_v flesh_n nor_o drink_v wine_n nor_o any_o thing_n whereby_o a_o brother_n stumble_v etc._n etc._n rom._n 14_o 14_o 15_o 20_o 21._o how_o dangerous_a then_o to_o use_v such_o corrupt_a form_n of_o worship_n or_o any_o part_n thereof_o so_o much_o the_o rather_o when_o a_o weak_a brother_n stumble_v at_o they_o we_o leave_v it_o to_o the_o christian_a reader_n to_o judge_n we_o doubt_v it_o will_v not_o agree_v with_o the_o rule_n of_o charity_n prescribe_v rom._n 14._o 1_o cor._n 8._o chap._n iii_o 3_o position_n that_o the_o child_n of_o godly_a and_o approve_a christian_n be_v not_o to_o be_v baptize_v until_o their_o parent_n be_v set_v member_n of_o some_o particular_a congregation_n 4_o that_o the_o parent_n themselves_o though_o of_o approve_a piety_n be_v not_o to_o be_v receive_v to_o the_o lords-supper_n until_o they_o be_v admit_v as_o set_v member_n reply_n what_o be_v here_o premise_a to_o prevent_v mistake_n do_v seem_v more_o to_o raise_v then_o to_o abate_v scruple_n you_o refuse_v not_o all_o communion_n with_o all_o that_o be_v not_o church-member_n and_o so_o much_o they_o profess_v who_o former_o have_v go_v for_o and_o profess_v themselves_o separatist_n from_o our_o assembly_n you_o do_v not_o appropriate_v these_o privilege_n of_o the_o seal_v only_o to_o member_n of_o your_o own_o church_n etc._n etc._n if_o you_o mean_v only_o that_o the_o sacrament_n administer_v in_o other_o church_n be_v true_a for_o substance_n it_o be_v no_o more_o than_o you_o will_v confess_v of_o rome_n if_o you_o deny_v not_o fellowship_n with_o they_o in_o the_o seal_n and_o to_o receive_v they_o to_o the_o sacrament_n your_o judgement_n be_v against_o your_o practice_n or_o you_o exclude_v the_o church_n of_o england_n from_o the_o number_n of_o true_a church_n answ_n we_o see_v not_o how_o such_o scruple_n can_v be_v raise_v without_o great_a mistake_n of_o our_o meaning_n our_o expression_n be_v so_o plain_a and_o distinct_a for_o 1_o what_o if_o some_o separatist_n admit_v private_a communion_n with_o such_o yet_o they_o reject_v your_o church_n and_o ministry_n as_o null_n which_o we_o do_v not_o and_o many_o of_o they_o have_v refuse_v also_o such_o private_a communion_n 2_o we_o marvel_n how_o you_o can_v fall_v into_o such_o a_o mistake_n as_o to_o suppose_v we_o only_o allow_v the_o truth_n of_o sacrament_n for_o substance_n in_o other_o church_n when_o we_o speak_v in_o the_o same_o sentence_n of_o receive_v satisfaction_n by_o letter_n or_o otherwise_o concern_v those_o we_o admit_v to_o the_o seal_n which_o plain_o show_v we_o speak_v of_o communion_n with_o such_o church_n 3_o concern_v fellowship_n with_o those_o church_n we_o may_v admit_v member_n of_o they_o to_o the_o seal_n with_o we_o when_o we_o can_v always_o join_v with_o they_o in_o their_o administration_n by_o reason_n of_o some_o sinful_a corruption_n wherein_o we_o must_v have_v actual_a fellowship_n with_o they_o as_o yourselves_o will_v not_o join_v in_o case_n you_o must_v kneel_v at_o the_o lords-supper_n 4_o concern_v the_o dilemma_n we_o answer_v 1_o our_o practice_n be_v not_o cross_v to_o this_o profession_n for_o such_o as_o come_v recommend_v from_o foreign_a church_n and_o give_v such_o satisfaction_n as_o be_v meet_v we_o do_v receive_v and_o such_o as_o have_v whole_o cast_v off_o all_o relation_n to_o english_a church_n and_o live_v among_o we_o we_o have_v look_v at_o as_o scatter_a stone_n till_o they_o join_v some_o where_o in_o a_o church_n and_o themselves_o general_o
english_a church_n and_o we_o deny_v not_o the_o same_o in_o a_o orderly_a way_n as_o they_o also_o require_v testimony_n of_o their_o piety_n if_o any_o do_v but_o present_a a_o child_n to_o baptism_n in_o their_o church_n we_o have_v often_o profess_v this_o and_o by_o your_o own_o grant_n most_o of_o the_o approve_a christian_n among_o we_o be_v not_o member_n of_o the_o english_a church_n have_v renounce_v their_o right_n of_o membership_n and_o commuion_n with_o the_o church_n they_o be_v of_o there_o reply_n three_o this_o order_n be_v observe_v by_o they_o to_o prevent_v the_o imposture_n of_o some_o that_o pretend_v to_o the_o english_a they_o be_v join_v to_o the_o stranger_n &_o contra_fw-la answ_n this_o be_v not_o the_o only_a reason_n of_o their_o order_n for_o his_o word_n be_v all_o stranger_n do_v not_o join_v themselves_o to_o our_o church_n yea_o there_o be_v those_o that_o avoid_v all_o church_n etc._n etc._n which_o plain_o show_v they_o look_v further_a than_o such_o according_a to_o our_o practice_n even_o their_o own_o country_n man_n flee_v for_o religion_n as_o we_o be_v they_o yet_o receive_v they_o not_o till_o by_o public_a profession_n of_o faith_n and_o subjection_n to_o discipline_n they_o join_v themselves_o to_o some_o congregationall_a church_n second_o this_o show_v what_o disorder_n and_o abuse_v of_o ordinance_n will_v follow_v from_o such_o a_o liberty_n to_o admit_v such_o as_o be_v not_o join_v to_o some_o church_n for_o by_o this_o mean_v many_o will_v neglect_v all_o order_n and_o discipline_n if_o they_o may_v but_o have_v the_o seal_n three_o to_o put_v all_o out_o of_o question_n that_o their_o practice_n and_o judgement_n in_o effect_n be_v the_o same_o with_o we_o in_o this_o point_n note_v the_o first_o question_n propound_v by_o they_o be_v these_o infant_n which_o you_o offer_v the_o seed_n of_o this_o church_n that_o they_o may_v lawful_o be_v here_o baptize_v by_o our_o ministry_n chap._n xiii_o thus_o far_o we_o have_v answer_v to_o the_o reply_v make_v to_o the_o consideration_n in_o our_o answer_n to_o the_o 3._o and_o 4._o position_n now_o whereas_o we_o take_v notice_n of_o three_o objection_n against_o our_o first_o consideration_n and_o answer_v the_o same_o it_o please_v the_o learned_a author_n to_o take_v up_o only_o two_o of_o they_o and_o with_o much_o enlargement_n to_o urge_v the_o same_o as_o his_o reason_n against_o the_o position_n and_o to_o apply_v our_o answer_n thereunto_o by_o which_o mean_v our_o answer_n to_o the_o objection_n brief_o set_v down_o may_v seem_v not_o so_o apt_a and_o full_a here_o as_o they_o will_v appear_v in_o their_o proper_a place_n and_o therefore_o it_o will_v be_v needful_a for_o we_o to_o enlarge_v ourselves_o somewhat_o in_o answer_v some_o passage_n at_o least_o in_o the_o reason_n as_o they_o be_v here_o propound_v before_o we_o come_v to_o the_o reply_n reply_n reason_n 1._o that_o sacred_a order_n god_n have_v set_v in_o his_o visible_a church_n etc._n etc._n answ_n these_o word_n with_o all_o that_o follow_v whatever_o they_o may_v seem_v to_o carry_v with_o they_o be_v nothing_o but_o a_o bare_a denial_n of_o the_o position_n in_o variety_n of_o expression_n reply_n for_o first_o the_o baptism_n of_o john_n be_v true_a baptism_n etc._n etc._n but_o he_o never_o demand_v of_o those_o he_o receive_v whether_o they_o be_v enter_v into_o church_n covenant_n etc._n etc._n answ_n this_o we_o have_v in_o substance_n before_o and_o be_v answer_v with_o all_o the_o other_o instance_n in_o this_o first_o reason_n in_o our_o answer_n to_o the_o reply_n to_o the_o first_o consideration_n and_o in_o other_o place_n and_o therefore_o in_o vain_a here_o to_o repeat_v the_o same_o and_o we_o have_v observe_v more_o than_o once_o your_o plain_a confession_n that_o the_o apostle_n constitute_v church_n by_o baptism_n even_o such_o church_n as_o they_o set_v elder_n in_o by_o the_o election_n of_o the_o people_n reply_n the_o second_o reason_n in_o substance_n be_v this_o because_o from_o christ_n and_o the_o constant_a practice_n of_o the_o apostle_n we_o learn_v that_o such_o as_o be_v call_v of_o god_n receive_v the_o holy_a ghost_n believe_v in_o the_o lord_n profess_v their_o faith_n in_o he_o with_o repentance_n and_o amendment_n of_o life_n have_v a_o right_n to_o baptism_n and_o desire_v it_o be_v wrong_v if_o they_o be_v deprive_v thereof_o answ_n we_o grant_v the_o whole_a but_o as_o it_o be_v suppose_v in_o due_a order_n they_o must_v receive_v it_o so_o we_o desire_v no_o more_o for_o we_o grant_v upon_o these_o common_a ground_n such_o have_v jus_o ad_fw-la rem_fw-la but_o not_o jus_o in_o re_fw-mi and_o the_o immediate_a fruition_n of_o they_o reply_n three_o by_o a_o lively_a faith_n a_o man_n have_v internal_a communion_n with_o christ_n by_o profession_n of_o the_o entire_a faith_n join_v with_o conformity_n of_o life_n in_o righteousness_n holiness_n and_o fellowship_n of_o love_n he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o visible_a congregation_n or_o flock_n of_o christ_n though_o no_o set_a member_n of_o a_o free_a independent_a society_n and_o baptism_n be_v a_o seal_n of_o our_o admission_n into_o the_o flock_n of_o christ_n not_o ever_o more_o but_o by_o accident_n of_o our_o receive_n into_o a_o particular_a congregation_n answ_n this_o reason_n stand_v upon_o such_o a_o sense_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n as_o can_v be_v find_v and_o it_o be_v before_o confess_v that_o the_o catholic_n church_n consist_v of_o all_o true_a particular_a church_n as_o the_o part_n of_o it_o and_o therefore_o how_o can_v a_o man_n be_v visible_o a_o member_n of_o the_o whole_a and_o belong_v to_o no_o part_n thereof_o second_o we_o deny_v not_o but_o such_o have_v a_o right_a to_o be_v in_o the_o particular_a church_n and_o so_o to_o baptism_n and_o all_o ordinance_n but_o as_o by_o such_o profession_n they_o be_v not_o member_n of_o any_o particular_a church_n so_o neither_o have_v they_o immediate_a right_n to_o the_o privilege_n thereof_o without_o admittance_n into_o the_o same_o fit_a matter_n such_o be_v for_o a_o particular_a visible_a church_n that_o profess_v the_o entire_a faith_n etc._n etc._n but_o it_o do_v not_o admit_v they_o actual_o thereunto_o and_o your_o own_o expression_n secret_o imply_v as_o much_o when_o you_o say_v baptism_n be_v a_o seal_n of_o our_o admission_n into_o the_o church_n or_o flock_n of_o christ_n if_o baptism_n be_v the_o seal_n of_o our_o admission_n than_o there_o be_v a_o admission_n thereunto_o before_o baptism_n but_o who_o do_v admit_v and_o where_o and_o when_o be_v any_o admit_v to_o the_o church_n but_o in_o particular_a congregation_n can_v any_o be_v admit_v into_o a_o church_n that_o whole_a church_n be_v ignorant_a thereof_o but_o a_o man_n may_v profess_v the_o entire_a faith_n and_o live_v according_o among_o the_o heathen_a where_o neither_o any_o church_n nor_o member_n of_o it_o take_v knowledge_n thereof_o and_o therefore_o bare_a profession_n do_v not_o admit_v man_n but_o make_v they_o fit_a to_o be_v receive_v and_o admit_v into_o the_o visible_a church_n your_o four_o reason_n we_o have_v have_v twice_o before_o and_o answer_v the_o same_o reply_n to_o our_o answer_n of_o the_o first_o objection_n from_o the_o instance_n of_o the_o centurion_n lydia_n the_o jailor_n and_o the_o eâ—…nuch_n first_o if_o where_o the_o holy_a ghost_n be_v give_v and_o receive_v and_o faith_n profess_v according_a to_o god_n ordinance_n there_o none_o may_v hinder_v from_o be_v baptize_v scil_n by_o such_o as_o have_v power_n to_o baptize_v they_o then_o either_o such_o be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n or_o baptism_n be_v not_o a_o privilege_n of_o the_o church_n than_o it_o be_v not_o essential_a to_o baptism_n in_o the_o first_o institution_n that_o it_o shall_v be_v dispense_v to_o none_o but_o member_n of_o a_o congregationall_a assembly_n answ_n it_o be_v free_o grant_v first_o that_o baptism_n be_v a_o privilege_n of_o the_o church_n second_o that_o such_o as_o profess_v the_o faith_n and_o have_v receive_v the_o holy_a ghost_n be_v member_n of_o the_o church_n if_o by_o church_n â—…ee_v mean_v the_o church_n mystical_a consider_v as_o visible_a though_o not_o always_o political_a three_o that_o these_o may_v receive_v baptism_n by_o such_o as_o have_v power_n to_o baptize_v they_o but_o immediate_o to_o baptize_v they_o none_o have_v power_n but_o by_o a_o extraordinary_a call_n of_o god_n so_o to_o do_v as_o have_v be_v former_o show_v but_o it_o will_v not_o hence_o follow_v that_o ordinary_a officer_n have_v such_o a_o power_n want_v such_o extraordinary_a call_n because_o the_o member_n of_o the_o church_n catholic_a have_v right_o unto_o the_o seal_n yet_o the_o immediate_a fruition_n of_o they_o they_o must_v have_v by_o ordinary_a officer_n in_o a_o political_a body_n the_o only_a
of_o right_a and_o liberty_n to_o choose_v their_o pastor_n may_v desire_v the_o seal_n of_o he_o that_o be_v set_v over_o they_o answ_n this_o objection_n be_v easy_a for_o in_o desire_v seal_n of_o he_o and_o submit_v themselves_o to_o his_o ministry_n they_o do_v now_o choose_v he_o however_o at_o first_o they_o oppose_v his_o come_n but_o what_o be_v this_o to_o what_o ought_v to_o be_v in_o a_o orderly_a way_n whereof_o we_o speak_v reply_n these_o proposition_n be_v allow_v for_o currant_n a_o nation_n or_o people_n plunge_v into_o idolatry_n or_o infidelity_n or_o otherwise_o dischurch_v can_v by_o ordinary_a mean_n recover_v into_o a_o church_n estate_n wherein_o they_o may_v lawful_o and_o according_a to_o god_n appointment_n desire_n or_o expect_v that_o the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n shall_v be_v dispense_v unto_o they_o answ_n what_o shall_v hinder_v if_o the_o whole_a nation_n will_v be_v willing_a to_o recover_v themselves_o into_o church_n indeed_o that_o be_v rare_a to_o be_v find_v that_o all_o will_v affect_v such_o a_o recovery_n but_o we_o see_v nothing_o to_o hinder_v but_o all_o the_o nation_n or_o so_o many_o as_o be_v awaken_v in_o conscience_n to_o bewail_v their_o apostasy_n and_o lament_v after_o the_o lord_n have_v especial_o the_o countenance_n of_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n several_a company_n of_o christian_n may_v combine_v in_o church_n so_o as_o may_v best_o suit_n with_o their_o edification_n choose_v officer_n and_o enjoy_v ordinance_n nay_o è_fw-la contra_fw-la our_o protestant_a divine_n as_o chemnitius_n field_n brentius_n whitacher_n luther_n etc._n etc._n make_v people_n power_n of_o elect_v their_o minister_n the_o best_a foundation_n of_o a_o people_n recovery_n of_o a_o true_a ministry_n and_o church_n estate_n reply_n the_o five_o proposition_n rise_v beyond_o measure_n that_o no_o christian_a can_v expect_v by_o the_o appointment_n of_o god_n to_o partake_v in_o the_o seal_n till_o he_o have_v join_v himself_o in_o church_n fellowship_n and_o in_o the_o call_n of_o the_o minister_n we_o conceive_v you_o will_v not_o say_v that_o child_n and_o woman_n have_v to_o do_v in_o the_o call_n of_o the_o minister_n if_o some_o part_n of_o the_o church_n do_v not_o consent_v in_o the_o call_n of_o the_o minister_n must_v they_o separate_v from_o the_o ordinance_n of_o worship_n etc._n etc._n answ_n the_o seem_a sâ—…ellings_n of_o this_o proposition_n will_v easy_o full_a and_o run_v within_o bank_n and_o bound_n if_o it_o be_v receive_v in_o its_o true_a sense_n and_o meaning_n for_o by_o the_o call_n of_o a_o minister_n must_v needs_o be_v understand_v the_o voluntary_a subjection_n of_o all_o church_n member_n to_o his_o ministry_n after_o he_o be_v call_v as_o well_o as_o the_o act_n of_o election_n of_o he_o at_o the_o first_o it_o be_v irrational_a to_o think_v a_o minister_n be_v to_o be_v choose_v over_o again_o whensoever_o a_o member_n be_v add_v to_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o ouâ—…_n meaning_n be_v not_o hard_a to_o conceive_v and_o be_v so_o take_v woman_n choose_v their_o minister_n that_o be_v voluntary_o submit_v to_o he_o be_v choose_v child_n be_v subject_v to_o he_o by_o their_o parent_n the_o dissent_v part_n of_o the_o church_n ought_v to_o submit_v to_o he_o be_v choose_v and_o â—…oe_v if_o they_o remain_v under_o his_o ministry_n and_o so_o in_o all_o other_o case_n you_o have_v or_o can_v suppose_v reply_n here_o you_o say_v people_n must_v join_v in_o the_o call_n of_o a_o minister_n before_o they_o can_v lawful_o desire_v and_o be_v admit_v to_o the_o seal_n and_o another_o have_v zealous_o affirm_v it_o be_v a_o presumptuous_a sin_n to_o choose_v a_o officer_n not_o train_v up_o and_o try_v in_o debaâ—…ing_n disâ—…ssâ—…g_a câ—…ying_v and_o contrive_v church_n affair_n in_o adâ—…nishing_v â—…châ—…ting_a comfort_a etc._n etc._n lâ—…y_o these_o together_o and_o consider_v how_o long_o many_o a_o poor_a soul_n convert_v to_o the_o faith_n must_v be_v compel_v to_o wâ—…t_a god_n ordinance_n answ_n first_o it_o do_v not_o answer_v the_o profession_n in_o the_o latter_a thus_o to_o join_v we_o with_o mr._n robinson_n as_o another_o of_o the_o same_o sort_n as_o it_o be_v for_o such_o as_o will_v glad_o receive_v every_o syllable_n from_o we_o that_o may_v dislodge_v their_o thought_n of_o separation_n in_o we_o as_o we_o be_v hearty_o desire_v to_o be_v assure_v of_o in_o the_o epistle_n to_o this_o reply_n we_o think_v will_v not_o so_o close_o join_v we_o with_o such_o they_o will_v have_v we_o part_v from_o and_o upon_o so_o little_a occasion_n and_o to_o so_o little_a purpose_n unless_o they_o do_v much_o forget_v themselves_o second_o when_o it_o can_v be_v deny_v but_o the_o choice_n of_o minister_n be_v in_o the_o church_n and_o that_o hand_n shall_v not_o rash_o be_v lay_v on_o any_o man_n and_o deacon_n the_o low_a office_n shall_v be_v prove_v and_o then_o minister_v be_v find_v blameless_a yea_o he_o say_v and_o these_o also_o prove_v imply_v that_o other_o also_o shall_v be_v so_o 1_o tim._n 3.10_o what_o fault_n can_v be_v find_v with_o the_o substance_n of_o what_o either_o robinson_n or_o ourselves_o speak_v if_o our_o meaning_n and_o his_o be_v but_o charitable_o take_v if_o his_o word_n be_v overzealous_a to_o say_v it_o be_v a_o presumptuous_a sin_n to_o do_v otherwise_o what_o be_v that_o to_o we_o three_o for_o the_o delay_n of_o ordinance_n if_o both_o these_o be_v take_v together_o in_o most_o case_n it_o need_v not_o be_v long_o where_o god_n afford_v able_a and_o fit_a man_n for_o office_n but_o if_o some_o delay_n be_v and_o that_o a_o church_n want_v some_o ordinance_n and_o can_v by_o communion_n with_o other_o church_n enjoy_v they_o which_o be_v rare_a yet_o be_v it_o not_o better_a to_o forbear_v some_o ordinance_n a_o while_n then_o miscarry_v in_o so_o great_a a_o work_n as_o the_o choice_n of_o officer_n upon_o which_o the_o follow_a comfort_n and_o good_a of_o the_o church_n do_v so_o much_o depend_v the_o demand_n follow_v be_v answer_v in_o this_o whole_a discourse_n and_o we_o hope_v not_o with_o word_n but_o proof_n especial_o in_o our_o answer_n to_o the_o reply_n in_o the_o first_o consideration_n neither_o do_v we_o see_v any_o such_o difficulty_n but_o that_o such_o christian_n may_v as_o easy_o join_v to_o such_o a_o church_n for_o a_o time_n as_o desire_v to_o enjoy_v the_o ordinance_n and_o to_o sit_v loose_a from_o it_o for_o transient_a member_n we_o disallow_v not_o reply_n if_o the_o proposition_n may_v stand_v for_o good_a i_o fear_v we_o shall_v scarce_o find_v that_o ever_o in_o ordinary_a way_n the_o sacrament_n be_v lawful_o dispense_v or_o receive_v in_o the_o christian_a church_n of_o god_n since_o the_o first_o foundation_n of_o they_o answ_n if_o they_o be_v take_v in_o their_o true_a meaning_n and_o in_o that_o latitude_n we_o intend_v they_o we_o see_v no_o such_o cause_n of_o scruple_n for_o what_o be_v more_o ordinary_a in_o all_o true_a church_n then_o for_o people_n first_o to_o choose_v their_o minister_n &_o then_o to_o receive_v the_o seal_n at_o their_o hand_n and_o this_o have_v be_v the_o way_n of_o ancient_a reformer_n it_o be_v true_a many_o corruption_n have_v be_v in_o many_o true_a church_n and_o usurpation_n upon_o the_o right_n of_o the_o people_n in_o choose_v their_o minister_n as_o also_o in_o administration_n of_o the_o ordinance_n themselves_o and_o oft_o in_o the_o constitution_n of_o church_n but_o as_o the_o maintain_n of_o any_o truth_n of_o god_n against_o those_o corruption_n in_o worship_n etc._n etc._n do_v not_o argue_v a_o unlawfulnesse_n of_o the_o ordinance_n in_o such_o church_n but_o convince_v only_o the_o corrupt_a administration_n of_o they_o so_o in_o this_o case_n to_o assert_v the_o right_a way_n of_o church_n elect_v officer_n and_o enjoy_v ordinance_n against_o all_o corruption_n that_o have_v be_v in_o the_o church_n do_v not_o make_v a_o nullity_n of_o the_o ordinance_n themselves_o we_o may_v say_v that_o this_o conclusion_n rise_v beyond_o measure_n the_o objection_n be_v thus_o answer_v we_o leave_v the_o conclusion_n to_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o indifferent_a reader_n chap._n xii_o reply_n to_o the_o seven_o consideration_n the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n of_o stranger_n in_o london_n record_v by_o john_n alasco_n be_v far_o differ_v from_o your_o judgement_n and_o practice_n in_o the_o point_n in_o question_n for_o first_o say_v they_o paul_n testify_v that_o the_o church_n itself_o without_o exception_n of_o any_o member_n of_o it_o be_v clean_o or_o holy_a by_o the_o administration_n of_o baptism_n answ_n we_o confess_v the_o same_o reply_n second_o they_o hold_v communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o one_o with_o they_o answ_n the_o church_n of_o england_n they_o call_v it_o not_o but_o the_o