Selected quad for the lemma: christian_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
christian_n	act_n	church_n	communion_n	1,604	5	9.1682	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A70435	A letter of many ministers in old England requesting the judgement of their reverend brethren in New England concerning nine positions written Anno Dom. 1637 : together with their answer thereunto returned, anno 1639 : and the reply made unto the said answer and sent over unto them, anno 1640 / by Simeon Ash, and William Rathband.	Ashe, Simeon, d. 1662.; Rathband, William, d. 1695.	1643 (1643)	Wing L1573A; ESTC R11945	105,990	100

Scribes and Pharisees to let them alone because they were the blind leaders of the blind but he never forbade to communicate with them in the ordinances of God It is not then for private Christians to withdraw themselves from the ordinance of worship and communion of the Church because such are permitted to deale in the holy things of God whom they judge or know unfit when men joyne in the worship of God with unworthy Ministers they doe not countenance them in their place and office but obey the commandement of God who requires their attendance upon his highnesse in that way and meanes To goe no further then the text you quote Because thou hast despised knowledge I will also reject thee c. Properly the text is spoken of the ten tribes called Israel and the Priests among them who worshipped the Calves which Ieroboam had set up whom the Lord threatneth to reject because they had rejected knowledge being either wilfully ignorant or withholding the truth in unrighteousnesse Whether they were for the present absolutely rejected or the Lord threatens only to reject them we will not dispute This may suffice that it is not to be found either in this or any other Text of Scripture that the people joyning in the true Worship of God with unworthy Ministers do countenance them in their place thereby On the contrary if you will extend this Text to all unworthy Ministers of what sort soever whom the word of truth doth condemne as not approved Ministers of God the Scripture teacheth evidently not onely that the people by joyning do not countenance them in their place and office but that they must and ought to joyne with them in the worship of God and in separating from the Ordinance they shall sinne against God much lesse then do they in such joyning set those Idols and meanes of worship which God never appointed in his Word For the worship is of God and the Ministery is of God the person unworthily executing his place is neither set up by some few private Christians nor can by them be removed And warrant to withdraw themselves from the worship of God because such as ought not are suffered to entermeddle in the holy things of God they have none from God Dumbe Dogs greedy Dogs Idol-sheepheards false Prophets Strangers are unworthy Ministers but they that communicate with such in the ordinance of worship are never said to set up Idols or means of worship which God never appointed The sheep of Christ will not heare strangers in the Lords sense but outwardly they heard those strangers preach if the Scribes and Pharisees were such and by hearing them discovered them to be strangers i. e. false Prophets Some strangers at least of whom our Saviour speaks were of the true Church and of Israel but brought false doctrine tending to kill the soule such strangers none should heare that is believe and follow but as they be tolerated in the Church so they may hear them so long as they bring the truth Unworthy Ministers are no Ministers for themselves but they are Ministers for the people of God that is so long as they be in the place of Ministers the acts of their administrations are of force to the faithfull if they observe the forme of administration prescribed by Christ for Christs Ordinances have their efficacy from him not from them that serve about them and evill Ministers minister not in their own name but in Christs and by his Commission It hath evermore bin held for a truth in the Church of God that although somtimes the evill have chiefe authority in the ministration of the Word and Sacraments yet for as much as they doe not the same in their own name but in Christs and minister by his Commission and Authority wee may use their Ministery both in hearing the Word and receiving the Sacraments neither is the effect of Christs Ordinance taken away by their wickednesse nor the grace of Gods gifts diminished from such as by faith and rightly doe receive the Sacraments administred to them which are effectuall because of Christs institution and promise although they be ministred by evill men Beza de Presbyt et excōmunicat p. 25 26. Ista vero quia nonnulli à sacris caetib sacrament usu propter aliorum vitia ultro abstinent i. e. seipsos excommunicant magnam reprehensionem merentur The reasons whereby the ancient Churches condemned the Donatists and Catharists for their voluntary and seditious separation and the moderne Churches condemne the Anabaptists for their unwarrantable departure from and so renting of the body of Christ will hold against separation from the prayers of the congregation because they are read by an ungodly minister The second proposition Where the whole Liturgie is used though by an able and godly Minister it is not lawfull to joyne in prayer in that case Herein wee cannot be of your judgement for in the times of the Prophets and our Saviour Christ as great abuses no question were found in the Church of the Jews in the administration of holy things of God as can be imagined in our Liturgie or forme of prayer but the Prophets and our Saviour who taught the people to keepe themselves pure and undefiled never taught them to separate from the administration of the holy things of God And if the presence at our forms of prayer be not lawful by reason of the corruptions alleaged there can be no visible society named throughout the world since 200. yeeres after Christ or thereabouts wherein a Christian might lawfully joyne in Prayer reading the Scripture hearing the word or participation of the Sacraments For compare the doctrines prayers rites at those times in use in the Churches with ours and in all these blessed be the name of the Lord wee are more pure then they But no man will be so bold we hope as to affirme the state of the Churches within 200. yeeres after Christ to be so miserably decayed that the faithfull could not without sin hold communion with them in the aforesaid ordinances The prayers of the Minister whether conceived or stinted in a set forme be not his private prayers but the publike prayers of the whole assembly whose mouth he is to God both in the one and the other But you will not say the people ought not to joyne with their Pastor in the publique assembly if ought bee amisse in his prayer for matter or manner or both It is all one to the people in this case whether the fault be personall as some distinguish or otherwise knowne beforehand or not knowne For if simple presence defile whether it was knowne beforehand or not all presence is faulty And if simple presence defile not our presence is not condemned by reason of the corruptions knowne whereof we stand not guilty whether the corruption be through humane frailty or not it is not in us to enquire but rather whether we be called to come and the

16. 1 Cor. 11 16. 14 33. Rom 16 4. Gal ● 22. 1 Thess 2 14. 1 Cor 16 19. Gal. ● 2. Act 15 2. 19 37. 15. 25 38. Eph. 4. 4 5. Acts. 2. 38. 41. Gen 1. 10. Math. 28. 14 20. Robins against Bern. reas discus pa. 77. Lev 2. 13. Deut. 29. 12. 26. 17. 18. Rom. 3. 2 Deut. 4 6. Psa 247 19 20 Neb. 9. 13. Act. 7. 38. Luk. 16. 29. 2 Cor 5 19 11. 2. Deut 33. 3. 10. 8. 30 Robin against Bern P 159. Act 14 22. T it 1 5. Rob against Bern. Act 11 26. In the same verse the same persons are called the Church disciples and Christians pag. 106 107. 211 c. also pag. 51 Ezeck 46. 10 See Lava●er on Ezek Math 18. 20. Ier. 14. 9. Ios. 24. 14 Rom. 10. 14 Act 2. 42 As Christ is that one great Pastor so hath hee generally one fold and flock Iohn 10. 16. Ezeck 34 22 23 which is his Church as he saith And ye my flock the flock of my pasture are men Ezek 34. 31. Aynsw Cant 1. 8. Sure it is that hee is none of Christs sheepe visibly or in respect of men which is without Christs sheepfold for there is one sheepfold and one sheepheard Iohn 10 16. Robins against Bern likelihoods p. 61. Hieron tom 2. Ep. 85. Nec altera Romae urbis Ecclesia alteratotius orbis existimanda est Gallia Britannia Asia c. omnes barbarae Nationes unum Christum adorant unam observant regulam veritatis 1 Cor 12. 28. Col. 1. 21. 1 Cor. 12 13. 1 Cor. 15. 9. Gal. ● 13. Phil. 3. 6. 1 Tim. 3. 15. 1 Pet. 5. 2. Pastores sunt omnes sed grex unus qui ab Apostolis omnibus unanimi consensu pascatur Cypr. de unitate Ecclesiae Etsi pastores multi sumus unum tamen gregem pascimus Cypr. l. 3. Epistola 13. Cum sit a Christo una Ecclesia per totum mundum in multa membra divisa item Episcopatus unus Episcoporum multorum concordi numero diffusus c. Cypr. l. 4. Ep. 7. Iohn 9. 22 35. 12. 42 16. 2. A●●anasius may be for an example Gen 17. 7. Lev. 16. 12. Apo. 1 11. 13. Heb. 16. 10. Rob. against Bern. pa. 127. Rom. 4. 12. ●8 Gen. 12. 3. Gal. 26 7 3 15 16 17 Rob. against B●r. pa. 2●2 See Mr. I. D. Apol. 11. Sect. exam p. 117. I. D. Apol. 5. Sect. exem pag. 61 18. Bucer diss ep 3 pa 43 ep 48. pa. 226. Act. 8. 6. 15 4. Act 8. 12. 14. 18. 12. Acts 2. 41. 4. 4. 5 14. 6. 1. 6. 7 Ezra 2. 36 37 38. Act. 6. 2 81. 15. 2 4 6 22 23 16. 4. 21 18. 28. Act 11. 21. Act. 11 24 26 Act. 13 12 et 14. 27. et 15. 30 34 35. Acts 19 10. 16. 9 29. 27. Acts 19. 19. Robinson against Bern p. 196. Euseb h●st l. ● c. 35 ●at 43. G●ae● 33. Raff 1 hit de Sacra contr de bapt qu 2 3 pag 237 238. A●●ers of the Sacr l. 2 c 6 fol. 211. 〈◊〉 de P●es●y● pag. 79. Act. 14 ●3 Col. 4. 17 1 Pet 5. 2 Act 20. 28 Ioh. 4. 2. 23 23. Mark 9. 15. Act 17 22 23 32. 19. 8. 9 Rob. against ●ern p 151 these Keyes in d. c. In the Corporation the Church there is alwayes the whole power of Christ to residing which you may call officers for the use of it selfe to which it is sufficient that it can without officers use this power for things simply necessary as for receiving in of members by profession of faith and confession of sins for edifying of them by exhortation and comforts in the ordinance of prophesying and so for excommunication Rob. against B. pag. 224. See Rob. against Ber. pag. 130. 131. 132. If you call it consultation in an assembly wherein all have equall power and voyce in determining things some one going before the rest Idem pag 202 Robins against Bern. Coun. debated p 32. ibid. p. 79. 1 Cor. 11 28. 2 Cor. 23. 5. Beza de Presbyt Excom pag. 32 Robins against Bern. pag. 252. Acts 20 28 The Word of God and Canons of Councels will have Pastors so to care for their own flock that they forbid them not to care for the whole Church especially in a time of common combustion The answer of some Brethren pag 12. Publica Dei invocatio non minima pars communis in unâ fide consensionis Beza contra Erastum de Presbyt pap 13. Euseb Hist 5. c. 26. Graec. Cham●●● Panst Tom 2. l. 10. c. 8. Sect. 16. The Churches Plea pag 44. Ap●l pag. 117 298. Orig. in Isa Hom. 6. Qui vocatur ad Episcopatum vocatur ad servitutem totius Ecclesiae Chrysoft in 2 Cor. hom 18. Vniversae curam gerimus See Cham Panstr Tom. 2. pag. 10. cap. 12. Sect. 8 9 10. c. Jun. Animadv in Bellar. contro 5. lib. 1. c. 3. not 3. cap. 7 not 7. Act. 13. 15. Rom. 16 3. 12. Phil. 2. 15 16. 4. 2. ●am 5. 19 20. Act. 4. 26. 40 9 38. 10. 5. 11. 19. 21 1 Cor. 14. 23 24. Esay 2. 3. Ezr. 8. 23. 10. 1. 41. 45. 42. 9. 12. 20. Revel 3. 9 What example have you but grounds for the baptising of infants or where read you of any officer excommunicated by any Rob. against Ber. p. 214. we may not expect examples of any Pastors in scriptures who did thus I. D. Apol. 9. Sect. exam p. 1●3 See I. D. Apol. texts exam pa. 288. Exod 1248. Exod. 447. Col 2. 11 12. Erast so objects against Bern. Sicut a Circumcisione ad Baptismum argumentamur ut probemus infantes esse baptizandos ita etiam licet ab agno Paschatis ad Coenam Domini c. whereto hee truly replyeth Ego vero non negolicere c. at non temere universaliter Beza contra Erast pag. 23. ●ev 12. 23. 22. 7 Exo. 22. 30 Eph. 215. Etiam si daremus nullam legi ab Apostolis excommunicationem non tamen sequeretur ita esse quum satis constet non omnium singularia Apostolorum gesta perscripta fuisse Bez. de Presb. p. 7. Et si de Melchizedeck Iobo quae huc adferuntur non sunt extra controversiam Nam foedere cum Abra. inito non excluduntur ij qui ante erant in foedere sed accensentur foederi Ita autem se habuit Melchizedeck c. omnino enim consors promissionis divine fuit ante foedus cum eo initum Gen. 17. Job vero credens fuit promissionibus foederis de sententia veterum fuit circumcisus etiam haereditarià circumcisione a paterno maternaque sanguine Vt elegantèr scribit author libri de verà Circumcisione qui Hieron ad scribitur Iun. anim adv in Bellar contrav 4. lib. 3. cha 16. not

God to make them disciples and not to preach unto disciples only or members of the houshould The Apostles certainly had authority and preached by authority but they preached not to Infidells and Heathens as to disciples or members of the Church much lesse did they give a portion to them as to the houshold which is the preaching by office which you acknowledge Thirdly if under the power of the keyes you comprehend preaching by office dispensing the seales casting out and receiving againe into the bosome of the Church wee deny the power of the keyes to belong to the Church or community of the faithfull we cannot find in Scripture that Christ ever granted such power to the faithfull as faithfull joyned together in Covenant in those passages which speake of this power the execution of this authority is given to them to whom the authoritie is committed If the power of the keyes be given to the whole Church the Apostles themselves must derive their authoritie immediatly from the Church and not from Christ for the power must be derived from them unto whom it was given but their power and authority was not from the Church but from Christ immediatly And if the dispensation and exercise of the keyes be concredited to the Ministers Doth it hold in all things or onely in the dispensation of the Sacraments and preaching by office Doe they dispense the seales as the Stewards of Christ from whom they receive their authority immediately or as the servants of the Church from which they derive their authority If in the first sense the power of the keys is not in the community of the faithfull If in the second the office of a Minister is not the immediate gift of Christ nor the Minister so much the servant of Christ as of the Church from whom he must receive lawes in whose name he must doe his office and to whom he must give an account We could wish you had explained in what sense you hold the dispensation and execution of the power of the keyes is concredited to the Ministers and by whom For if the community of the faithfull have to doe in all matters concerning the body to admit members and cast them out to make and depose Ministers to bind and loose by authority derived from Christ wee cannot see how in your judgement the dispensation and execution of the power of the keyes is concredited to the Ministers Fourthly That which you add that God will not vouchsafe his presence and blessing to an ordinance but when it is dispenced by those whom hee hath ordayned and appointed thereunto must bee warily understood or it may occasion errors and distractions not a few You know what corruptions soone entred into the Church of God both in respect of Doctrine Worship Offices and entrance thereunto and how ready and apt is the conclusion from your words That Christ hath not vouchsafed his presence and blessing in his Ordinances to his Church But of this before And on the contrary seeing God hath vouchsafed his blessing in his Ordinances dispensed by your selves when you stood as visible Ministers in the congregation and Churches of old England you must confesse did approve both your standings and his Ordinances dispensed by you Secondly as for the Assumption that Pastors and Teachers are limited to a particular charge or society but that flock is not ever one congregationall assembly meeting in one place neither the band so streight whereby they are tied to that one society that they may not upon occasion performe some Ministeriall Act or Office in another congregation or to them that be not set members of their proper assembly For first to dispence the Seals of the covenant is a ministeriall act an act of Office and not an exercise of gifts onely But the Pastors of one Assembly may dispence the Sacrament to the set members of another society upon occasion as you confesse in this and in your answer to the ninth position And if the members of one Church may lawfully upon occasion receive the Sacrament of the Supper in another society from the Pastor thereof then may the Pastor of one congregation performe a Ministeriall act to the members of another and if to the members of another then in another congregation with consent and upon occasion Secondly As the Ministers are exhorted to feed their fleek so is every Christian and Minister to try and examine himselfe whether hee be in the faith but you will not allow this conclusion I must examine my self Ergo no man is debarred from the Sacrament for his unworthinesse or to be tried or examined by others to be observed admonished and brought to repentance for notorious sin No more can it be rightly gathered from the former passages of Scripture that the Minister is not upon occasion to performe any Ministeriall act to any other people or society because ordinarily he is to attend his own flock Thirdly As the Ministers have peculiar relation to their particular flocks so the people unto their particular Ministers unto whom they are ried in speciall manner as to their Overseers who must give account for theirsculs And if this peculiar relation betwixt the people the Minister doth not hinder the people from receiving the Lords Supper at the hands of another Minister nor the minister from performing the Ministeriall act to the members of another congregation Neither doth his peculiar Relation to his own flock hinder him from administring unto others upon just occasion being intreated thereunto As the combining of the people to their peculiar Minister doth not quite cut off their communion with other Ministers so neither doth the restraining of a Minister to a peculiar flock quite cut him off from administring upon occasion unto another people Paul appointeth the Ephesian Elders unto the care charg onely of their own particular flock but so to attend them ordinarily according to the rules of the Scripture that as occasion was offered might performe some Ministeriall acts in another congregation The taking heed unto their flocks which Paul requires in this place doth cōprehend under it the administration of the Word Prayer and Sacrament and if it must be restrained to their owne particular Churches onely it is unlawfull for a Pastor to preach or call upon the name of God in any publike Assembly save his own upon any occasion as these be duties prtaining to common confession or profession of faith Ordinary Pastors and Teachers it is true are not Apostles who are to go from place to place from Country to Country to plant and erect Churches but they are tied ordinarily to one flock as the Text proveth and to which purpose it is commonly cited But that a Pastor is so tied to his flock that he can perform no ministeriall act to any other upon any occasion that it proveth not nor can we find that it was ever so understood by Divines ancient or modern