assurance is given in matters concerning our Doctrine Worship Discipline and Government and the enemies of Truth and Godlinesse and the work of Reformation for adhering to these Articles of our Covenants our Engagement and Acts of uncontroverted Assemblies relating thereunto in the literall and genuine sense and meaning thereof as they desired in the Conference Answ But if by what they foist-in here beside what was propounded in that Conference as they set it down pag. 40. they mean we should engage to condemn the Publick Resolutions as Contrary to our Covenants Engagements or Acts of Assemblies we think they will not soon obtain that But as to the matter of our adherence to the Doctrine Worship Discipline and Government of this Kirk to which we are tied by Covenants and Engagements and was the thing required in the Conference Such satisfaction hath been offered therein in the Conference according to their explication of their own desire as we wonder with what confidence they call it as they do pag. 40. a shy answer Or how they can expect that the world who knoweth them and us will believe that they are the men adhering to these things and the principles of this Kirk concerning them while we are giving cause of jealousie that we do not or will not stand firm 15. They would make the world believe we impose upon their judgments in the matter of their Protestations pag. 91 92 93. When yet we neither bid them renounce them nor acknowledge the lawfulness of the Assemblies against which they were Only we desired they should not in any Judicatory of this Kirk make use thereof to call in question and annul the Constitution and Authority of these Assemblies Withall declaring that this did not import their passing from them as standing Testimonies of their judgment nor hinder them to make use thereof as a legal defence if the Constitution and Acts of these Assemblies were urged against them Yea nor to make use of them in so far as they related to the Publick Resolutions if they think fit to offer their Reasons against them in an Assembly though we judge they would succumb in that cause Is not this far from imposing on their judgments in this matter To make this Assertion out beside their constant clamour against Subordination which is to be considered in due time they offer 1. That this were a passing from these Protestations as a remedy against the corrupt constitution of these two Assemblies Answ And do they not by our concession stand as a testimony of their judgment against them And what other remedy would they have unless to draw us to condemn these Assemblies 2. That it should make way for the future Constitution and Authority of these two Assemblies Ans If they mean the Constitution of future Assemblies as these were to this whatever our own judgments be there is a sufficient remedy provided in our Offers concerning the future Constitution of Assemblies above mentioned If they mean the future approbation of the Constitution and Authority of these Assemblies in a subsequent Assembly It is also provided that they are free to make use of their Protestations as a legal defence if any such thing be urged against them 3. That it is unequall to submit these things to a Generall Assembly where we will be the plurality and are many wayes engaged for the Resolutions which are contrary to the Covenant and Acts and Declarations of uncontroverted Assemblies Answ That these Resolutions are contrary to the Covenant c. is oftener said than proven and though they say it hath been already declared yet we have not seen it proven nor we believe any body else But this is plain language that they will refer nothing to a Church-judicatory either where we are the plurality or are engaged for the Resolutions and is not this an imposing on our judgments ere there be an Union And is it not fine language for a party because their Mother-church is not of their judgment in what she believeth and is able to prove to be an errour therefore they will submit nothing to her Determination When Prelats excepted this against the General Assembly 1638. they had their Answer and we believe they would not bear this of us were they the plurality Nor did it rellish from the Remonstrants at the Synod of Dort Nay upon this account it is impossible for any Church ever to compose a difference unless they will cede to every party that pleaseth to contradict them And yet we must adde that all this is an unjust clamour as to the matter of Union seing as hath been often told all rational satisfaction and security is offered that they shall not be troubled with those bygone Questions 16. They shut-up their thoughts in these things with a sad reflection pag. 93 94. That it smelleth rankly of a carnall politick spirit to half and divide the things of God for making peace among men though we do not come up to our own professions in that matter of offering equal conditions Answ This we do very easily understand by what they give out of our condescensions among their followers That we are men who do not adhere to these things out of conscience otherwise we would not concede so much We leave so rigid a frame of spirit before Him who knoweth what we are put to suffer in desiring to heal the breaches of a sinking Church And as none but men of Donatus's temper will judge it an halfing of the things of God to lay aside debates concerning things removed out of our way and to forbear the execution of some Acts of Discipline if thereby we may bind-up the breaches of a bleeding Church So this giveth us a compendious account of all this debate about Union viz. That they will neither halve nor abate an ace of these things they hold for peaces sake And indeed upon a serious review of all their Overtures however to allure us to quit the way of administring the affairs of Christ by His own Courts they will allow us an equal number in their extrajudicial Committees whereas now we are granted to be the plurality and however they have of late not acted in the capacity of a Commission 1650. upon the reasons formerly mentioned though we have no assurance how soon they may usurp it again if they find it may serve their turn Yet it will be found they never recede a jot not only from their judgments but even from any of their actings in reference to the Resolutions and their Protestations And so we leave the case of this poor Church in His hands who knoweth how to prove a Physician to her Having now gone through these toilsome passages which cannot but be unpleasant to judicious Readers as it hath been indeed to us to dwell so much on stories and bitter reflections We proceed in the last place to take a view of their judgement in a very materiall Question concerning Subordination to Judicatories and
vile Idolaters Withall if even when a Church is not Gods wife but idolatrous yet her children are bound by that command to plead with her as a Mother before she get an actuall bill of divorce Then certainly a true Church keeping the purity of Religion should not have her nakednesse discovered to the world by divulging the faultinesse of some of her Members or Teachers without dealing with her self to take course therewith And it hath been long since told them in the Observations pag. 17. that Mr. Burroughs was of another spirit who adviseth that we should plead with a Church orderly in so far as may be and by her Judicatories and Ministers which are her mouth and peaceably sitting down when we have discharged our consciences But they have observed no such rule nor moderation Thirdly But to make out the truth of their charge they make a long deduction of a storie That the body of the Ministery had been corrupt under Prelats that the Generall Assemblies had acknowledged this remaining corruption and therefore judging that Presbyteries and Synods were not able or willing to purge themselves they found it necessary for several years to appoint Commissions to try and censure Ministers and Elders as was accordingly done That these Visitations again appointed in the year 1650. were not kept by reason of the war And that since that time few or none have been purged-out by Presbyteries and Synods but many of those who were formerly purged-out are taken-in without sufficient evidences of their repentance Answ As we are very unwillingly brought upon the necessity of vindicating our own and others integrity when we believe the Lord is calling us and our Brethren also to be rather lamenting after Him and confessing before Him our failings and miscarriages for which He is contending with us So we hope we may without vanity say what hath been openly avowed by some of their own side that whatever failings are among us we have generally as well qualified a Ministerie as any other reformed Church they know We are sure this long storie is a very poor proof of their charge and they had better made it out by proving or offering to prove it at least against the particular persons in their respective Judicatories For 1. it is a very unconcludent proof against the present Ministerie of this Church that many of them were corrupt and prelaticall before the year 1638. and that the Generall Assemblies did then and after complain of it For now in so far as we know of this Church few of them are alive or unpurged-out by the Commissions they speak of and other Church-judicatories who were corrupted under Prelacie and no wonder if twentie years make a great change of the Ministerie of a Land and generally the Ministrie doth now consist either of those who were opposit to Prelacie or who have been since planted And if some few of these be in the Ministery who were led away in the time of Prelats as we believe they have proportionably their own share of those on their side So those whom we know of them adhering to the Judicatories of the Church may hold up their faces against all malice and detracters for their sincere renouncing of that course their ability to serve God in the Gospel of His Son and their blamelesse and Godly conversation and we believe many of their opposers would be ashamed to compare with them in any Reformed Church 2. Though we judge it great presumption in them to assert the inability far more the unwillingnesse of Presbyteries and Synods to purge themselves because the Generall Assemblies did appoint Visitations Seing the Assemblies themselves did give no such reason of their deed and they might well take their own wayes of visiting and taking notice of the affairs of this Church to the good liking of the Respective Judicatories and without any such imputation upon them Yet had it been so as they assert in the time when they made complaints of the corruption of the Ministrie who did only in an externall way renounce Prelacy the case must needs now be altered when as is said these men are generally gone 3. Because the Assembly 1650. did appoint Visitations for triall and censure which did not meet must we therefore conclude the body of the Ministerie corrupt Sure their Commission was to try before they censured and may it not as well be supposed they might have tried and yet found nothing like the clamour these men raise And would not the ensuing Assembly have approven them if they had used diligence unlesse also they had cast out the generality of the Ministers as this charge must bear it where they visited This seemeth to us strange arguing that because an Assembly appointed men first to try and then to censure as they found men guilty which imports at most but a presumption that some guiltie persons might be found where they visited for we remember not that either information or accusation against any person or persons within these bounds gave a rise to most of these Visitations therfore the plurality in those bounds must be corrupt and these Visitators could not have given a faithfull account unlesse they had cast them out and that if Synods and Presbyteries have not purged out many since for even the purging of a few will not suffice them therefore they are cooled in their zeal We seriously professe that as we do not omit to search out the faults of Ministers by enquirie at Visitations Presbyteriall or Synodicall as need requires or otherwayes by formal Processe when either there is a scandal raised on them or information or accusation given-in against them And we durst appeal to the Consciences of these our Brethren joyned with us in that work whether we have not been most exact not only in continuing them under Processe were it for years so long as there was any probability to prove any thing against them but in censuring the least thing that we found which yet hath oftentimes been very little after some years toil according to the strictest Rules of Discipline So that we know no cause these Witnesses have to complain of us but that we will not thrust-out men whether we can find them guilty by an orderly way of trial or not If we took pleasure to recriminate we could easily make it appear that they have done lesse these years bygone for purging-out those of their own judgment in places where they have power than hath been done by us in reference to those of our judgement For albeit it be not our way to make such clamours of the corruptions and insufficiencie of men of their judgement as they do of us yet it is known that diverse of them are suspected of insufficiencie and diverse reports of grosse scandals have been vented of others of them of which they have taken little or no notice 4. As for the reponing of some men to the Ministrie who were formerly deposed we believe that these
concerning Censures without quitting our own judgment we may as well repeal these Acts that declare these Resolutions to be the definitive judgment of the Kirk without altering our judgment concerning the things themselves Answ But as we know no such Acts declaratory that the Resolutions are the definitive judgment of this Kirk save only the Act of Assemblie approving them as sound and orthodox So there is no such need of piercing judgments to take up a difference betwixt what we concede and what we cannot yeeld For an ordinary capacity will discern that particular Conclusions concerning Censures may well be repealed and declared of none effect as to execution without encroaching upon mens judgments concerning the lawfulnesse thereof or of the Authority establishing the same And yet a dogmatick Conclusion determined in an Assembly cannot be declared not to be the definitive judgement of a Church in her representative Judicatory unlesse men will either lie against their knowledge and say it was not determined there or against their light and say it was not a lawfull Authority or Representative that did determine it There is but too much Sophistry in asserting we may take off the Synodicall eye without quitting or altering our judgements concerning the things themselves For who Questions but men may be of such an opinion had the matter never been determined or should the contrary be determined but they know this was never urged as the reason or our refusall of that desire but only that we could not condemn the Authority that determined in these matters And however they are pleased to twit us again with our holding these things to be extrinsecall to our Doctrine c. Yet we hope were they of never so small moment they will not have us lie or condemn our own judgements in them And as to their apprehensions concerning our designs which we know not why they repeat so often As we do not readily expect that this or any Reformed Church will be put to the resolution of any such case So we nothing doubt that where-ever there is occasion their judgement will be condemned by all but themselves and we are sure themselves will not allow of it in all cases 9. They make a great noise of the insufficiency of our Overtures concerning purging pag. 86 87 88. though we have better cause to complain that this being no cause of the Rent should therefore not keep up the quarrell Asserting 1. That for all our good words yet we have purged few these seven years bygone Answ But not to insist on what is said before how few of their own judgement they have either censured or so much as put to a triall notwithstanding clamours and flagrant scandals upon diverse of them and how much their division and irregularities obstruct that work in our hands we thought the Question had been not how few or how many we had removed but how diligent or negligent we had been since we must not put out men whether we find cause or not We say it as before the Lord that for any thing we know if there hath been any excesse in this matter it hath rather been in laying aside men upon small causes than in sparing Delinquents 2. They assert that in one Synod more have been brought-in who were formerly censured than have been put out by us all beside these who having been formerly twice deposed are connived at to Preach and Administer the Ordinances Answ It seems they have been unwilling their Pamphlet should want bulk and therefore when they have told us this already where we have considered it they must now tell us it over again yea we look for it the third time in a new dresse where we shall take a new look of it In the mean time if these proceedings of that one Synod which is the sum of all they can say though they will not be so ingenuous but leave the matter so as if possibly the like were done in every Synod have been according to Order and they are ready to give an account to their Judge competent what further can be said of them but that they have done what was the constant practice of this Chutch since the late Reformation And as to these they say are connived at we hope it cannot be charged on us as guilt that deposed men having the countenance of the Civil power do intrude upon Congregations against our heart 3. They assert we are become so backward and slow in this businesse that in the Processes of some we exercise our wits to raise notionall debates to hinder their purging out Ans As to this charge we are content to take their own course of committing the matter to God who knoweth who they are that are faulty in this matter of employing their wits for such ends and who do bend their wits to cast iniquity upon some men while they are no lesse industrious to obstruct the triall of others As we dare say that we are not conscious to our selves of any such sinistrous courses taken by us to obstruct the triall of persons brought upon the Stage So we can truly affirm and they cannot deny it that they have very much exercised their wits in such notionall debates when some of their judgement were brought to triall We are content our whole procedour in these particulars they reflect upon were laid open to the world that they might see what our carriage was in admitting of Witnesses and judging of their depositions And we dare yet again confidently assert that it is a malicious calumnie that any of these are kept in against whom any grosse scandals under which they say some lye are proven or that we have neglected to try scandals under which they lye were it even to continue them under Processe for severall years and to examine so many scores of Witnesses And for the issue of any Processes we know of in suspending of some and removing of others from their present station we know nothing done but what these of their judgment joyning with us did approve of 10. Whereas from the experience we had of their endless contentions in taking waves to prosecute some Ministers which when the case came to befall some of their judgment they said it was out of the way of judiciall Processes it was offered that they should agree upon the strictest rules of purging could be desired in justice provided they be binding to all and to which all will submit This they reject pag. 88 89 90. 1. Because we do not adhere to nor practise rules already agreed upon and say they why then should new rules be agreed upon This which is as easily denied as asserted they offer to make-out partly in that Synodical Visitations formerly agreed upon are now out of use save in very few Synods partly that now we dissent from the Kirk-judicatories their trying of Ministers by way of Inquisition and without a Libell yea and an Accuser too and partly that many of us