implieth authority that it is proportionably answerable to the taking away by death c that it is a special use of the keyes given by Christ to the Apostles that the force herof is such as therby a man is not onely cast out of that particular Church wherof he was a member but is cutt off excluded from all churches vpon earth as on the contrary by baptisme wee are entred into communion with al Churches of Christ in the world By these things compared togither we may observ 1. that the church elders may by their sole authoritie give judiciarie sentence that a man shal be excommunicated answerable to the Magistrates in Israel that gave sentence a man should be put to death 2. That the Elders may also by authoritie in particular deliver a man to Satan by the power of Christ which is proportionably answerable to the taking away by death which in Israel themselves grant was to be doon by the hands of the people Thus doo the Elders now chalenge by proportion in the Church that which belonged both to Magistrates and people in the cōmon wealth But because they fear the people they shape them this deceitful proportion that their avoyding the excommunicate person is the executing or putting in execution as they ambiguously speak of the sentence answerable to the peoples stoning of a malefactor in Israel how fitly let al that have understanding judge For whether the people avoid him or not the man is judged and delivered to Satan and so cut off from the church as on the contrary when one is baptised by the minister whether the people keep company with him or not he is made a member of the church and as a man beheaded in Israel was surely dead whether the people refreyned from touching him or no. 2. Agayn they give no more to the people of that Church wherof he is a member then to the people of all other churches that are bound to avoid the excōmunicated person as wel as they 3. Yea they give hereby their people no more power then the Pope dooth to his marked servants for he also wil have the people avoyd such as he dooth excōmunicate and if this be the boasted right and libertie of the people they had as much in the greatest bondage of poperie as now when they are caried thus blindfold by propertions But they tel the people that if any can except against the Elders proceedings they shal be heard I answer First before whom and unto whom shal any man except against the Elders is it not before and unto the Elders themselves And is it meet that they should be judges in their own cases In Israel when any complayned of wrong in the Synagogues or Cities ther was an higher Court to control unruly Elders and to help the oppressed But now 2. or 3. Elders in a Church bearing themselves upon their forged authoritie from Mat. 18.17.20 may be lawless and who shal let them in their proceedings Secondly how should the people except when by these mens doctrine they are not bound to be present at the hearing and deciding of the controversie wil it not be a just blame upon them if they except against a matter which they have not heard discussed Thirdly when the party accused shal except against the Elders proceedings as commonly he wil doo for if he acknowledged himself to have synned he should not need to be excōmunicated may the people now require to hear the case debated between the Elders and him nay they plead in their Treatise on Math. 18. saying But where hath the Lord appointed a rule of further proceeding beyond that of the Elders governours for hearing the brethrens causes and judging between a man and his brother c. And agayn the Elders also are the Churches officers c. so as when they have heard examined admonished and iudged according to the word of God it is to be estemed as doon by the Lord and the Church c. Thus let the mā except what he wil the judgm t is at an end the Lo hath doon it the Church hath doon it because the Elders have doon it and it must be presupposed that they have doon it according to the word of God though the man except never so much and though the scriptures foreshew of judges that were wolves not sparing the flock and latter dayes abundantly confirm the same And thus when a Naboth is condemned by wicked Elders if any except on his behalf they wil take him in a snare that reproveth in the gate perhaps he shal hear it sayd by what authoritie doo you speak are you one of the Church spoken of in the 1◠of Matthew for the Elders have power to deal with him also that shal except and can easily bring him within the compass of a contentious person or an oppugner of goverment and cast him likeweise out of the Church that a man sometime were as good take a Lion by the paw as except against the Elders proceedings Next folow their many questions and other matters imputed unto us wherein we observ how when arguments fayl them for their own cause they seek to darken the truth by casting clowds before the readers eyes 1. First they ask whither in Jsrael the Lord abridged the people of their right and libertie c. I answer No but these men that by wrested proportions give the ministers of the church the power that Magistrates Preists and people had in Israel doe abridge the people of their right as before is manifested And for the further clearing of it seing ther were diverse governours in Israel as the Preists and Levites in the Temple the ministers in the synagogues the Elders or Magistrates at the gates of the cities and these also divers and of unequal power as before is shewed I ask of them agayn whither now the Eldership of every church be proportionable in power and goverment unto al those governours and if not unto al unto which of them 2. Secondly they ask whither the people have any more right and authoritie in the churches goverment now then the people of Jsrael had in those dayes I answer they should not seek to intangle by ambiguitie of terms First we give not to the people goverment as before I have shewed but a right and power to observ and doo al the commandements of Christ touching his prophetical preistly and kingly office by the Elders teaching guiding and governing of them in the Lord. 2. The goverm t in Israel was diverse by Magistrates in the gate by Preists in the sanctuarie by ministers in the synagogues To the Magistracie al Christians are to be subject now as they were then for it is an humane ordinance tending to civil peace and concerneth al men whither within the church or without indifferently The external Preisthood of Israel is accomplished in Christ and now abolished Heb. 7.
a beast to bear rule 6. Here also they doo violence to the Apostles similitude of a body and say when a part of the body is hurt the hand is not used nor sought unto to see withal nor the foot to hear neyther dooth the head take them to consult and determine what to doo but when the head it self hath considered and determined then it useth the help of the hand or foot c. as ther is need and occasion I answer 1. first much abuse may be offred to al parables by wresting them beyond their general scope as is here to this For by this manner of reasoning the Elders as the head have al the wit and the people as the hands and feet have none at al. The Elders as the eyes see al things but the people see no more then the ears For if the people have some understanding and insight into matters as wel as the Elders why should they not be used also in consulting and determining publick things which cōcern al. Vnless the Elders now have such abundance of wisdom as they can afford ynough to al and need supply from none But the scripture tells the contrary saying who is sufficient for these things 2. Cor. 2.16 And what meant the Apostles and Elders of Ierusalem to have al the people with them at their consulation determination of a controversie Act. 15.2 22 23. And why did th'Apostles being the eyes speak to the multitude which it seemeth saw no more then doo the hands and feet to look out men of wisdom for office among them Act. 6.2.3 But what if there be of the people that see more then all their Elders being illuminated as was David by Gods precepts what if the Elders be blind guides as Christ caleth some without understanding as the prophet cōplayneth Then men must leav the blind Eldership and goe to the prudent brethren and they must consult and determine yea without the Elders if these men say true Doe not these things manifest how they have wrested the similitude 2. Secondly it is direct against the Apostles meaning who because of dissentions in the church of Corinth sheweth by that similitude of a body that the chiefest members have need of the inferiour and the head cannot say to the feet I have no need of yow but now the Elders can say to the people we need not your help to judge and determine questions and controversies this gift and duty is ours neyther are yow bound to be present to hear and decide publick causes but when we have judged you shal execute our judgments And if the people agayn should say to the Elders when they are about choise of officers we need not your help or counsel you are not bound to be present when we doo this busynes the feet have no more need of the eyes to goe then the eyes have of the feet to see Were not this to make a division in the body which th'Apostle there condemneth 3. Moreover it is vayn to think that any officer or brother in the Church should so be one special member of the body as that he cannot be an other The Prophets in Israel were Seers and so in sted of eyes in the head but when they looked out vayn things then as the Lord saith the Prophet that taught lies was the tayl Jsa 9.15 The Elders by directing the church in the right way are as eyes to the body by administring the sacraments and censures they are as hands when they are sent on the Churches message they are as feet when they reprove synns they are as the mouth when they are reproved for their synns they should be as ears and so other Christians in their places and imployments And as God hath bestowed his graces upon any so is he to be regarded of al without respect of person neyther should the Elders be minded like Achitophel and take it yll if at any time their counsel be not folowed A man may see that in the Church which Solomō saw in the beseiged citie a poor wise man that delivered the citie by his wisdom though both he and his wisdom were despised A woman in Abel when it was in danger to be spoyled perswaded al the people with her wisdom to cut off Shebaes head and so preserved the city Was she in this action a part of the foot or of the hart and head in that body may we think 4. Finally this their reasoning is one with the Iesuits that exclude the people frō church affayrs The Church sayth Bellarmine bindeth and looseth but by their Prelates not by whomsoever even as the body speaketh but by the tongue not by the hand Thus dooth the Cardinal answer M. Luthers argument and thus doo these men answer ours 6. Yet have they not sayd ynough but they will make it Antichristian servitude to have the people bound to come to the publick ecclesiastical judgements unless perhaps when the Elders call them togither to execute their sentence for then I trow they are bound to come And is not this agayn to divide the body when the head must be present and the showlders with the other parts and members may be absent The Apostle writing to the Church of Corinth how to doo when they came togither for the Lords supper writeth also to them how when they were gathered togither they should deliver the wicked unto Satan We find no difference but they were bound to come to the one as to the other And if they answer they are bound to assemble for to excommunicate him but not to hear him by the word convinced in the trial of his cause they may as wel teach the people they are bound to come to eat the bread and wine in the Lords supper but not bound to hear the word teaching and preparing them here unto We doo so understand Gods law that when it commandeth us any thing it dooth also command us to use al means for the right and holy performance of it and al wil be litle ynough The people therfore that were bound to stone an idolater in Israel were bound by that law thow shalt not slay the innocent to look that he were duly convicted of the crime and now by this law be not partaker of other mens synns keep thy self pure every sowl that is bound to cast out a man condemned for heresie or other syn is also bound to see him convicted least Diotrephes cause to cast out faithful brethren He that stands out to excommunication wil cōmonly plead his cause to be just and complayn that the Elders have perverted judgmēt with what comfort of hart can the people now excōmunicate him if they have not heard the proceedings against him and yet must execute the Elders sentence upon him Let wise men judge whither this be not spiritual tyrannie which the Elders would bring upon the
church the church what should be answered before the magistrate We with signification as before that we would rather suffer wrong then sue at law yet could not hinder them of seeking for their particular right if in so doing the churches right were called in question that then some certayn appointed should answer for the same 3. Those our brethren before they went to the Iudges intreated the help of the Burgemasters the cheif of the City who laboured by perswasion with our Opposites to put the matter to the arbitrement of good men chosen by both sides but they stil peremptorily refused 4. When it was brought before the Iudges they also at first both perswaded unto and nominated two indifferent men to hear the case but when our opposers came before them they refused to stand to their arbitrement The Iudges the second time appointed them with a mulct or forfeit upō those that refused their arbitrement but our adverse partie persisted in their refusal as before and urged sentence of the Magistrates and pleaded that they which build on another mans ground are by law to loose their building which plea they made because the assurance of the ground was made in the name of one man onely now among them whose name was used but in trust for any other might have had the same as wel as hee as was proved before the Magistrate by sufficient witness Now unto these Arbiters appointed did our brethren willingly referr the cause and to them inquiring of the differences were those Articles exhibited which it seemeth those Libellers or their Scribe by some means that wee know not of procured a copy of and so printed them What cause now have these our opposers to find such fault with our giving out those articles which we were constreyned by them selves to doo unless we should have suffred the truth to have bene troden down They rather have cause to acknowledge their own stiff refractary cariage who would not yeild to any good counsel given them by our brethren by Arbiters or by Magistrates til law forced them therunto and so have occasioned many wayes our cōmon adversaries to rejoyce 3. But we have not sayth the Advertisement as we ought handled and justified the causes for which we separated which were annexed at the end of the Treatise on Mat. 18.17 but have gone about also to possess the world with other matters So after they urge agayn this point that we leav the Treatise unanswered which was purposely written upon that occasion and argument I answer 1. We handled and justified the causes for which we separated by word of mouth in much disputing before we left them and this for them was as we ought and sufficient according to the Apostles practise Act. 1◠8.9 And now we are by their importunacie caled to handle and justifie them before the world in writing which whither we doo as we ought the sequel shal shew to the judicious reader 2. It is not we but they which have gone about to possess the world with other matters for the things we charge them with themselves in effect acknowledge and as wel as they can doo defend them But their declaration against us in the Treat on Mat. 18. is defective and the 7. points they article now against us are superfluous and injuriously wrested against us as our answers to them shal manifest The controversie in deed began upon the exposition of Mat. 18.17 but so as we have heard in times past Anabaptists begin controversie upon Mat. 28.19 who have reasoned both from that and al other scriptures against the baptising of infants so these opposites from Mat 18.17 and al other scriptures that we could bring reasoned against the power of the people in judging syn synners We formerly professing the Church there to be Elders and people joyntly they now striving that it is not so but the Elders onely we knew it must be eyther the name or the power of the church that they would have And we never thought them so vayn as to make such a styrr for a name or title we held therfore to the power which Christ hath given to his church for judging of them that are within 1. Cor. 5.4.12.13 Of this when we pressed them they first gave this answer that the Elders had the rightful power to excommunicate though without and against the consent of all the people but not the able power even as David had rightful power to put Ioab to death but was not able because others were too hard for him 2. Sam. 3.39 To which we answered in matters of this life which are external men may be hindred by outward force but in the spiritual administration of the Church not so Gods word by which they administer is not in bonds 2 Tim. 2.9 But if one man onely have the power from Christ he may use it against all the world So upon better consideration a week after they affirmed the Elders to have both rightful power and able power to excommunicate though without and against the consent of all the people And thus was ful power put in the Elders hands of the people they sayd their power and right was as in Israel and in the primitive churches But being asked what that was answer was made it was to be inquired So the poor people are left to seek their right wher they can find it the Elders have ynough they have found that they sought for As Paul to disswade the Corinthians from their errour in denying the resurrection shewed them the dangerous consequences of the same as that if ther be no resurrection of the dead then Christ is not risen then the Apostles preaching was vayn then the Churches fayth was also vayn c. so I held it my duty to shew the people the consequences of the former error which though at first it may seem smal yet is it as a strong fort in the mouth of a country which if the enemy win the whole land is soon lost For if all the power of receiving in and casting out were given to the Elders then our Church which was first gathered and constituted did receiv in and cast out members without Elders was not planted by the power of Christ neyther had they authoritie to set up Elders if they could not agayn vpon desert depose them and if they had not power to judge their brethren much less could they judge their Elders And here came in the gathering of the church by vertue of popish baptisme and of receiving the ministery from Rome as wel as the baptisme and the like which our opposites were and must necessarily be driven unto for defense of their errour And as for the first gathering of this church they sayd an error in the doing overthroweth not the action for Isaak erred in blessing Iaakob in sted of Esau yet the action did stand To which we answered that it was doon by a person
request our help therin and that the Elders would no way aporove therof but would onely permitt our coÌ„ming eyther of our selves or at their request Wherin they also certifyed vs how some of them had charged the exposition of these words Tell the Church Mat. 18 17. Tell the Elders with some other particulars therupon depending to be errour and so were to prove their charge and therfore earnestly requested us to help in that great busynes that the truth might be mainteyned and not by their weaknes injuried and the innocent condemned and that we would help the Lord against the mighty c. And the reason why they thus earnestly requested our help was because M. Ainsworth was so sparing in opposing of Mr Iohnsons new doctrine though alwayes misliking it as they scarse knew how he was minded in the things so loath was he to come to any professed and publique opposition with him whom he rather hoped to pacify by moderation then by opposition to stop in his intended course Besides he was careful not to give any incouragement to the too violent oppositions of some brethren though minded as they were in the things themselves This their letter and earnest request in it notwithstanding we weÌ„t not but wrote to the Church and shewed them what the substance of the letter was desiring by theÌ„ to be informed how things stood with them and signifying withall our vnwillingnes to interpose but upon a dew and necessary calling and that also as much as might be vnder the conditions of best hope of good yssue They as before denyed to approve of our coÌ„ming and would onely permit it and that vnder the terms of jealousy and advantage as appears by that which themselves have published and did oft and earnestly require of us a coppy of the letter before meÌ„tioned with the names of the persons subscribed unto it Which though we judged and still do an hard and extream impositioÌ„ in it self considering they themselves had permitted them to send unto vs and knew from vs whereabout they wrote and had not layd it vpon them to shew them their letter before they sent it yet had we given way to their desires herein had it not been for one phrase in the end of the letter which being borrowed from Deborahs speach against Sisera Iudg. 5 23. and applyed as it was might give offence and minister occasion of further strife which phrase also we reproved in the wryters of the letter and they acknowledged amiss professing notwithstanding they had no evill meaning in it but onely a desire to provoke vs the more effectually to supply their inability against those with whom they had to deal Now for our withholding the coppy of the letter though since that tyme for their importunity we sent it them as also for our purpose of coÌ„ming unto them and the ends therof we will here insert what we wrote unto them in two severall letters thereabout For the former thus If the letter wherof you desire a coppy might further your coÌ„mon peace or procure good to any wee should easily answer your desire but if on the contrary there were the least evill in it wee should hold it our duties to deal with the parties offending our selves and not to discover their sin And loath would we be eyther to minister matter of further scanning amongst you or that any register of unkindnes should come unto you from our hands And the fear of this was in truth the onely cause why we refused to send this letter as they required Wherin if we fayled as we see no cause so to think yet was it the errour of our love and great desire of their peace About our coÌ„ming we thus wrote Our purpose therfore is according to the request of the brethren which have moved us and our duty to send or come unto you not to oppose any person or to mainteyn any charge of errour but by all other brotherly meanes to help forward your holy peace if so the Lords will be which how precious it is unto us we hope to manifest to the consciences of all men then which we know nothing in this world we haue more cause to endeavour both with God and your selves Of which our comming we pray you to accept and to appoint us some such time as seemes to you most convenient Wherealso we shall satisfy you to the utmost both touching the letter and other particulars in all equity yea so farr as we can without apparant sin These things notwithstanding they would not approve but onely permit of our comming as men use to permit of that which is evill and which in deed they could not hinder And so we came vnto them first of our selves and afterwards at the request of M. Ainsworth and them with him being sent by the Church wherof we are and so inforâ—mâ— our selves vpon them for the delivering of the Churches message did reprove what we judged evill in them and that we confesse with some vehemency And in that regard it was that vpon the motion made by Mr. Iohnson for the free dismission of such members with them unto vs as could not there walk with peace of conscience there lying no other cause against them which should also be mutually performed on our part we signifyed as he wryteth that wee little thought they had been so inclinable to peace that if we had so thought we would have caryed our selves otherweise towards them then we did And good cause had we so to speak For neyther is the same cariage to be vsed towards men prosecuting their purposes and perswasions with all violence and extremity and towards them which manifest Christian moderation in the same neyther had we before or have we since found the like peaceable inclination in them to that which they then manifested Which how great greif it hath been vnto us and how it hath even wounded our very harts he onely knoweth which seeth the sorrowes of the hearts of his servants and putteth their teares in his bottel But to passe by these things and to proceed The motion made by Mr Iohnson for a peaceable dismission was by the Church there received with generall assent unto which the Church also at Leyden condiscended and so sent back the Officers for the further ratification of it and for some other purposes tending to the establishing of peace amongst them Wherupon it was also the second tyme by theÌ„ confirmed alwayes in deed with submissioÌ„ to the word of God as was meet and that if eyther they or we minded otherwise we should so signify Which notwithstanding they did not but reversed the agrement of themselves without acquainting vs with the change of their mind or reasons therof Afterwards indeed they gave us knowledge of their purpose as appears in their former letter by themselves published desiring the continuance of our consideration about it as if the thing which was fully agreed upon as is aforesayd and that oftener then