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A67646 A defence of the innocency of the lives, practice, and doctrine of the English preists [sic], Jesuits, and papists relating to the crimes of murther and treason, vnjustly charged on them by E.C. in his narrative wherein are discouered his grosse mistakes, his wilfull falsifications, his shamefull falshoodes, and his groundlesse vniust accusations of the English papists. Warner, John, 1628-1692. 1680 (1680) Wing W908A; ESTC R221952 27,739 33

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the canon we do not think that God hath giuen vs any leaue to sin In the Glosse when the Action is dubious whether it be good or bad w● must judge fauourably of the Pope If it be of its own nature bad as Adultery or MVRTHER we must own that he sins in it althô there be no man to whom he ought to be accused by reason of the dignity of the first Chair You see sir that the glosse says iust the contrary to what you cite out of it for it says the Pope sins by murther you make it say murther is no sin in a Pope E. C. pag. 6. As yet we haue not proued vpon them their KING KILLING doctrine pray let one quotation supply for all I think it is such an one as is sull home to the Point Suarez l. 6. ad M. B. Regem 1.24 says A King if he be once excommunicated may be deposed or slain by any person whomsoeuer that with impunity Therefor it is past all manner of doubt but that they h●ld it exreamely Lawfull Answer It is past all manner of doubt that you hold it extreamely Lawfull to tell any kind of lyes falsify any Authours you please prouided it may concontribute to charge some odious opinion on Papists how contrary soeuer it be to the Authours you cite Suarez hauing written that Proposition immediatly addes Haec Propositio simpliciter sumpta est falsissima This Proposition absolutely taken is most false What say you Christian Reader is this fair play what cannot these men proue at this rate out of any Authour by making him say what he condemnes condemn what he says What credit do they deserue who discouer so little sense of Truth honesty shame of men or feare of God These are his proofes of our holding Murther to be Lawfull which he doth not 1. because there is not one word cited out of any English Catholick 2. Nor out of any other aliue 3. He falsitys impudently all he cites CHAPTER 6. Catholicks practice no Treason E. C. pag. 7. What was the offence of the Cittizens of Toulouse Auignon when P. Gregory IX Set Lewis the French King to war against them their Earl Raymundus without cause but only that of their Religion where the sayd King dyed at the siege Answ Here are two greate vntruths The first that there was no cause of that war besides Religion There were two wars made vpon the Albigenses The first by Simon Monfort with the forces of the King of France Lewis VIII Soveraign Lord of the Earle of Toulouse for hauing killed an Embassador or Legat against the law of nations The second by Lewis himselfe for their Herely Rebellion So neither war was on the score of Religion purely The second vntruth is that the King of France dyed at the siege He finisht the war vnited those Countryes to the crowne on his way home he dyed at Monpensier in Auvergn See De Serres a Huguenot E. C. p. 7. You giue many instances of crueltys shewed towards Hereticks in Cabrieras Merindol Prouenc Vassy Germany the Lowcountryes c. To all I answer they were rebels stood in open defiance of the Ancient Laws establisht of their Princes commands E. C. p. 7. Pray for the fuller satisfaction in this thing beside D. Fowlis his History of their Rebellions Treasons read the vngratefull be hauiour of the Papists Priests towards the Imperial Indulgent crown of England Answ I will not vndertake to vindicate the actions of all Papists that haue been I speake for those aliue If any here to fore were really guilty of Treason I excuse them not yet the late proceedings against Catholicks althô certainly Innocent yet charged with the most heauy Accusations imaginable ground a suspition that their Ancestors may haue had hard measure in that kind Howeuer if our fore fathers left any blot on their Religion by some illegall attempts Catholicks since haue washt it out with their Bloud And I pray God with all my hart that all Protestants were as faith full to the Royal interest as Papists are In your pages 8. 9. I find nothing worth mentioning but a saying of Aeneas Syluius that nothing is giuen at Rome but for mony not euen jmposition of hands what you cite out of Caramuel that a Priest may kill a Detractor As to Aeneas Syluius he recalled all those writings being made Pope Pius II. This is so fals that Absolution which is one imposition of hands was neuer refused any man vpon score of Pouerty And as for Caramuel that proposition is condemned by Alexander VIII Caramuel hath no credit euen in his own order he is a Bernardin his writings being forbidden amongst them vnder great Penaltys E. C. p. 10. The Pope is called by Papists our Lord God the Pope Answer those words are found but once that in a Glossa which sort of writings are little regarded by our Divines Howeuer you haue no reason to reproach vs with that expression who say the same of all Kings pag. 16. of all men pag. 21. E. C. p. 11. Bellarmin says God hath giuen to the Pope the Power to make sin to be no sin no sin to be sin Answer this imports no more then that God gaue the Pope to oblige by his laws the conscience of the Faithfull in things indifferent viz eating flesh on a wednesday which of it self is no sin but is a sin when forbidden But Bellarmin expressely says that the Pope cannot make Lawfull a thing of it self cuil as Theft or Murther nor vnlawfull a thing of it self good as the loue of God E. C. p. 11. What could stirr the Roman Catholicks vp to that dreadfull Rebellion massacre in Ireland where in cold Blood were murdered aboue 100000. Protestants without the least prouocation but only the Indispensable necessity to kill Hereticks Answer The late King knew other reasons These are his words The preposterous vigour vnreasonable seuerity which some men carryed before them in England was not the least incenture that kinaled blew vp into those horrid flames the despair of discontent which wanted not predisposed fewel for Rebellion in Ireland where Dispayre being added to their former discontens the Feares of vtter extirpation to their wonted oppressions it was easy to prouoke to an open Rebellion a People prone enough to breake out to all exorbitant violence both by some Principles of their Religion the natural desire of Liberty both to exempt themselues from their present restraints to preuent those after rigours where with they saw themselues apparently threatned by the Couetous zeale vn●haritable fury of some men who think it a greate argument of the Truth of their Religion to endure no other but their own The Rebells were exasperated to the most desperate Resolutions Actions by being threatned with all extremitys not only to the knowne heads cheise Incendiarys but euen to the whole community