saying is neither in the Judgement it self nor any thing leading to it So he comes to the Arch-bishop Becket's Case where he notably spends his mouth but like an ill Hound all upon false Hunting and indeed runs riot so far as he is not to be lashed in He fills several leaves of his Book with Encomium's of the Popish Clergy because some of them sometimes did what it was their duty to do which doth not excuse them in the general current of their proceedings commonly to stand for the authority of the Pope and the See of Rome against the Regal power and the authority of Parliaments as they did 20 R. 2. saying They were sworn to the Pope and to that See and they would oppose whatever the King and the Temporal Lords should do En restriaion del Poair Apostoliqué ou derogagation de la libertoe de Saina Eglise In restraint of the Power Apostolick or derogation of the Liberty of Holy Church So he takes much pains to assert the Kings natural right to command his Subjects to serve him upon any emergency and so to make Clergy-men Justitiaries if he see cause for it Which then gives them power of Judicature and I do acknowledge it but it is to be understood of Judicature in such Cases as the Law of the Land allows we know they have been some of them Lord Chancellours Lord Treasurers Lord Privy Seal but can he shew me that any of them judged in Cases of Blood For this Case of Beckett's is certainly misrepresented in Fitz-Stephens manuscript We know there have been heretofore in many Counties Justices of Assize which have been Clergy-men joyned with others in Commission who were not Clergy-men to take Assizes in the County And the Act of Parliament 27 E. 1. c. 3. coming to give power to those Justices of Assize to deliver the Gaols and so to be made Justices of Gaol-delivery and try Felons and Murtherers it provides that if one of them be a Clerk then one of the most discreet Knights of the Shire shall be associated to him that is a Lay-man and be empowered by the Knights Writ to deliver the Gaols of the Shires and chasten and punish whom they shall find to be guilty And this Statute is confirmed 2 E. 3. c. 2. which makes it manifest what the intendment of the Law is in that particular that Clerks must not meddle to judge in Cases of Blood and must hold good even for Bishops who are all of them Clerks As for this Case of Beckets which only stands upon the credit of a Manuscript said to be made by Fitz-Stephens a Monk whom he characterizes for a sober and grave Historian and more solito out of the sweetness of his nature gives me a lash saying It is usual with me to let fall expressions to vilifie Testimonies and Precedents when they make against me and this because I stile it a Blind Manuscript and suspect the Author as partial having been a creature of Beckets and consequently no friend to the King And therefore I give rather credit to the unanimous consent of the Historians of those times who do not relate the passages of that Tryal to be as he makes them than I do to him and his Manuscript I call it a Blind Manuscript because it sees not the light lyes obscure in some bodies Closet Mr. Selden doth not tell where and I dare say our Asserter never saw it though he terms the Author a grave Historian His tale is how at that great Council at Northampton Archiepiscopus laesae Majestatis Coronae Regiae arguitur quia est a Rege citatus pro causa Iohannis neque venerat neque idonee se excusasset c. The Arch-bishop is questioned for Treason against the Crown of the King because he was summoned by the King in the Cause of John that is one John the Marshal who complained that the Arch-bishop had done him injustice in his Court and he neither came nor had sifficiently excused himself upon sickness or any other just reason which might necessarily hinder him whereupon he was condemned to forfeit his personal estate and the Bishops and Barons not agreeing who should pronounce the sentence they putting it off from one to another at last the King commanded the Bishop of Winchester to do it This is his story and one may think it a strange piece of Treason one not to come immediately upon a Summons to attend the King especially if it be true what all the Historians that write of those times have related of this business Gervasius Dorobernensis is an Author as Mr. Selden observes who lived in that age and one of whom Mr. Selden and all Antiquaries we are sure have a good opinion and though our Asserter is confident enough to affirm they all have so of Fitz-Stephen it is of what I do not find that much hath been said by them to shew that nor do I think that any of our Antiquaries but Mr. Selden doth so much as mention him And from Gervasius Dorobernensis we have this relation Rex praecepit praesules Proceres regni apud Northamptoniam una cum ipso Archiepiscopo convenire c. The King commanded the Prelates and Nobles of the Kingdome together with the Arch-bishop himself to meet at Northampton where the Arch-bishop was accused of many things first that he had not fully done justice to one John that had a suit before him then that upon this occasion being called into the Kings presence he neglected to come To this the Arch-bishop made answer That John had all the justice done him that was due to him that he had illegally defamed his Court that he would not swear upon the Evangelists as the custome is but upon an old Song-book which he brought with him But that being upon this summoned he came not into the Kings presence was not upon any contempt but that he was hindred by a great sickness and that he had excused himself by two competent witnesses whom he had sent for that purpose yet this served not his turn but Curiali Iudicio Episcoporum consensu condemnatus est He was condemned by the Iudgement of the Court the Bishops consenting to it that all his personal estate should be at the Kings disposing This now is delivered unto us by an unquestionable known Author who lived in that time Fitz-Stephen and he agree in the matter of the Accusation and agree in the Judgement but Fitz-Stephen lays it to be Crimen laesae Majestatis Coronae Regiae High-Treason which must be for not coming to the King when he was summoned Gervasius saith that he sent his excuse by two witnesses who testified that he was then very sick and not able to come which we all know to be a Lawful Essoine De malo lecti which cannot be disallowed but must excuse nay justifie any bodies absence Now can any body that is master of common sense believe Fitz-Stephens relation who will have this to be
they had a place to go to when 't was fit they should consult apart not that they always did so no more than it doth that the Prelates sate not among the Lords because they sometimes went apart and had a place to go to as well as the Commons We know that 7 Iacobi when Prince Henry was created Prince of Wales they all sate together in the Court of Requests and may do again when the King pleaseth I have now done with this rather curious than necessary Question which I had not touched upon had not Percy 's place in Parliament given me occasion a little to search into it Yet I think it not amiss here to insert the Prayer of the Commons and the form of the Proxy made by the Clergy to Sir Thomas Percy in 21 Rich. 2. memb 6. no. 9. as it is at large upon the Record that the Reader may be able to give a rational Judgment both what his Power was and how the Clergy were represented by him The Commons first pray the King that whereas divers Judgments and Ordinances before time made in the time of his Progenitors had been recalled and made null because the Estate of the Clergy were not present Et pour ceo prierent au Roy que pour surety de sa person salvation de son royaum les Prelates le Elergy ferroient un Procurateur avet povoir sufficient pour consentir en leur nome a toutes choses ordonances a justifier en cest present Parlament que sur ceo chacun seigneur spirituel diront pleinment son avis Sur quoy le dicts seigneurs spirituels commetterent leur plein povoir generalment a un lay personne nomerent en especial Thomas Percy Chevalier sur ceo baillerent au Roy une schedule contenant leur povoir la quelle nostre seigneur le roy receust commanda le dit Mardy estre entre de record en rolle de Parlement de quelle cedule la form sensuit Nos Thomas Cantuariensis Robertus Ebor. Archiepiscopi ac praelati Clerici utriusque provinciae Cantuar. Eborac jure ecclesiarum earundem habentes jus inter essendi in singulis Parlamentis Domini nostri Regis regni Angl. pro tempore celebrandis nec non tractandi expediendi in eisdem quantum ad singula in instanti Parlamento pro statu honore Domini nostri Regis nec non Regaliae suae ac quiete pace tranquillitate regni judicialiter justificand Venerabili viro Domino Thomae de Percy Mil. nostram plenarie committimus potestatem ita ut singula per ipsum facta in praemissis perpetuis temporibus habeantur It is observable in this Prayer the Commons recite Ordinances as well as Judgments to have been made null by reason of the Bishops Absence and comprehended not Judgments alone Now of what Latitude Ordinances were taken whether temporary or otherwise look'd upon as Laws is not very certain Secondly they desire such a Proctor as might have Power to confent to such things as should be done Thirdly they naming a Lay-man who had no Right of his own to sit there and giving the King a Schedule of their Procuration was enough to make their Right be preserved to them without any explicite Consent by their Proctor or perhaps his being so much as present at any Debate But I now proceed to observe how ready our Author is to pick what Advantage he can against the Author of the Discourse of Peerage from the words by him quoted out of the Manuscript History written by the Abbot of Molros in Scotland where the King of England sent Bishop Fox as I remember to treat with the King of Scotland Iames the Fourth then there touching a Match between the Children of those two Princes 'T is a Book to be seen in some few hands and writes of the Parliament in 21 R. 2. The Author of the Discourse pag. 20. tells you that that Manuscript Author blames the Prelates much for the Opinion they gave generally about the Revocation of Pardons but in this as in many other Authorities that make against him our Author curtails the Words and cites no more than makes for his turn The Words at large are these Dederunt ergo locum judicio sanguinis in hoc facto Ita quod dubitabatur à pluribus si non incurrerent in poenam irregularitatis pro negotio memorato unde contigit quod propter istud minus peccatum inciderent in aliud majus peccatum consequentur ut laicam personam constituerent procuratorem pro iisdem qui illorum vice consentirent ad judicium sanguinis dandum in isto Parliamento si necesse foret occasio emersisset The Prelates by this act of theirs gave Allowance or Countenance to Tryals of Blood insomuch that it was doubted by many whether they did not fall under the Penalty of Irregularity by reason of the foresaid business from whence it happened that instead of that lesser Offence they fell into a greater by Consequence in that they made a Lay-man their Proctor who in their Room might consent to a Judgment of Blood to be given in that Parliament if it were needful or occasion had happened I have translated dare locum fudicio sanguinis to give way or Allowance to a Judgment of Blood because it appears by the subsequent Words he meant them so The use the Author of the Discourse of Peerage makes of these Words is to shew that the Canons were not the only Cause that hindred their presence in II Rich. 2. For then when they had no Encouragement from the King or Lords then they ought not at any hand to be present in such Cases but here in 21. when they had any Allowance or Connivence as to the Laws against them then the Canons were neglected altogether His Inference seems to me rational and good Oh! but saith the Grand Questionist they were present in voting the Pardon to the Earl of Arundel revocable Under his Favour I think he is mistaken for the Book warrants no such matter only tells you that they gave a general Vote that Pardon 's granted in Parliament were revocable by the King by consequence whereof some of those who were pardoned in 11. were executed in 21. which Votes I hope might pass though the Parties concerned were not present and this meaning the book seems to enforce For first that Author saith it was a doubt amongst many whether that act did not make them incur the Penalty of Irregularity which would have been none had they personally by their Votes revoked the Pardon granted to the Earl of Arundel Secondly he saith by making a Proctor in that Case of Blood they committed a greater Fault than the former but certainly the making a Lay Proctor was not a greater Fault than actual Allowance and personal voting in Blood which that Author charges them with Lastly they made a
be a Peer os the Realm and his Blood enobled which otherwise would have descended from him to his Posterity and to this present Baron who is since enobled by a later Creation but takes nothing from that Ancestor So then it is clear that sitting in the House of Peers and having a parity of Vote and enjoying many of the same priviledges with the Peers doth not in true and proper speaking make the Bishops Peers no more than 21 R. 2. Sir Thomas Percy sitting with the Peers and Voting with them as Procurator for the Bishops was thereby a Peer His next Argument is That in several Rolls of Parliament they are expressly called Peers which cannot be denied nor doth that make them Peers if the essential parts of Peerage be wanting to them We know that denominations are many times taken up in a large and improper sense for some circumstances some similitudes something which is extraneous unto them yet wherein they agree with things of another nature And so Bishops having place and vote in the House of Peers and joyning with the Peers of the Realm sitting in Parliament in all things with equal power uno excepto saving only in cases of Blood it is no wonder if they are often stiled Peers of Parliament But the Precedents he cites are falsly recited both in the Case of Mautravers and that of Gomenitz and Weston as I have shewed before His third Argument is That they have judged as Peers upon Peers of Parliament But I deny that they judge there as Peers but as called to the Parliament to be Members of the House of Lords as Bannerets were formerly and many principal Gentlemen who were still Commoners and some Officers as the Warden of the Cinque-Ports who was no Peer sometimes and yet summoned up to the House of Lords and all these judged such Peers as were tryed in those Parliaments in which they sate However that Bishops are not Peers of the Realm and so consequently not properly and truly Peers of Parliament though often called so I think will be clearly made out First I must as I have formerly done insist upon the Great Charter which Sir Edward Cooke saith is declaratory of the Principal grounds of the Fundamental Laws of England and which the Statute made 25 E. 3. Confirmatio Chartarum will have to be observed as the Common Law and all Judgements given against it to be undone and holden for nought this Law is certainly to be obeyed and what is done in observance of this Law is most legal And it enjoyning every man to be tryed by his Peers and Bishops being tryed by a Jury of Commoners Commoners are their Peers and they are Peers to Commoners and not Peers of the Realm Peers per eminentiam as I may call them or else Magna Charta is broken and made a Law of no authority 2. To be a Peer of the Realm their Blood must be enobled and their Persons dignified nor can they otherwise be put into the same rank with those who are so which would make but an ill accouplement and they would never draw well together Now Bishops do not sit in Parliament ratione Nobilitatis but ratione Officii as Stamford saith in his Pleas of the Crown p. 153. En respect de lour possession se launcient Baronies anneres a lour dignitées In respect of their possessions viz. the ancient Baronies annexed to their dignities 3. If they were Peers and their Persons enobled their Wives would be noble and have the priviledges of Peeresses being Married or Widows for Husband and Wife are one person in Law but we know they have no such priviledge which shews their Husbands to be no Peers 4. If Bishops were Peers of the Realm and any of them questioned for a Capital Crime in Parliament time they could be tryed and judged only by the House of Peers and by no other Court of Judicature The Lords could not avoid the trying of them themselves indeed any but Peers they may refuse except it be upon an Impeachment by the House of Commons for then they must retain it and proceed in it but not otherwise except they see some great cause for it Pro bono Publico as it is 1 R. 2. when the Commons desired that no suit between Party and Party should be undertaken and determined by the Lords or the Officers of the Council but that the Common Law might have its course except it be in such a business and against so great a person as one cannot else hope to have right done in it The same is confirmed 1 H. 4. which I alledge to justifie the Judicature of the House of Lords upon those who are not their Peers upon special occasion But for trying of their Peers is a duty incumbent upon them which they must perform and any Peer who is questioned may challenge it as his right and it cannot be denied him And therefore 4 E. 3. when they had upon the Kings earnest pressing them Tryed and Condemned Sir Simon de Bereford Sir Iohn Mautravers and other Commoners they make a Protestation that they nor their Successors Ne seroient mes tenus ne charges a rendre Iugements sur autres que sur lur Piers Should not be bound nor charged to give Iudgement upon any but their Peers But we know that they have sometimes turned off Bishops to Inferiour Courts as appears by the Record of it in the Exchequer the same 4 E. 3. Stephen Gravesend Bishop of London was complained of in Parliament by one Iohn de Wymburne for saying That if Edward the Second was yet living as he was informed he was in Corf-Castle he would assist him with all his power to re-establish him in his Throne Sir Edward Cooke saith that by order of Parliament the matter was referred to be tryed in the Kings-bench but the Record saith that the Parliament referred it to the Kings Council and appointed him to appear before them at Woodstock upon Sunday fortnight after Easter and that they turned him over to the Kings-bench to be Tryed by the Chief Justice Scroope and his fellow Judges Whereas had this Bishop been then accounted a Peer of the Realm he must have been Tryed in Parliament the Parliament being once possessed of his Cause and they could not have referred him to any other Judicature So here you have four Essential parts of Peerage all of them wanting in Bishops and the want but of one Essential part is enough to destroy the whole He can be no Peer of the Realm who is at the Kings sute Capitally Tryed by a Jury of Commoners if Magna Charta be good Law which is our All as we are Free-men Secondly He who is not himself enobled cannot be a Peer in equal rank to one that is For all Peers are equally Peers as we may say Peerage doth not recipere magis minus The meanest Baron is as much a Peer as the greatest Duke else they were not Peers it would be
from me and hath much more of reason and something though not much more of civility and fairness in the maintaining of it so as whether or no his reasons will convince me I know not but if they do I will certainly grant it for my Maxime is still Amicus Plato amicus Socrates sed magis amica Veritas The Writer of this Treatise intituled The Grand Question concerning the Bishops right to vote in Parliament in Cases Capital Stated and Argued doth state the Question right that is Whether the Bishops may be present and vote Judicially in Capital Cases which come to be judged in Parliament either in giving the Judgement it self or in resolving and determining any circumstance preparatory and leading to that Judgement Then he sets down some things granted on both sides as 1. That Bishops do sit in Parliament by vertue of their Baronies and are bound to serve the King there From this he infers they have a Right of Judicature which is not denied but the question is as he saith himself what this Judicature is 2 That they sit by the same kind of Writ that other Barons do Upon which he would infer that they are impowered and required to confer and treat of all the weighty affairs that shall be brought before them the King having not limited nor restrained the one more than the other But it follows not because all are called together by the same authority that therefore the same duty is incumbent upon all if there be a higher power that directs what every ones duty is to do when they are come together Now the King acts in a higher Sphere by the Law of the Land and the law and practice of Parliament which prohibits Bishops from meddling with judging of Capital Causes in Parliament nor did they ever do it but in one extravagant proceeding in 28 H. 6. where nothing was regular nor Parliamentary from the beginning to the end which I look upon as altogether insignificant to alter what is so setled by Law and constant Custome therefore the Kings Writ of Summons cannot dispence with that to make that lawful which in it self is unlawful as I have sufficiently proved it And I will now go a little further in it than I did before for hitherto I have only insisted upon the Law of Parliaments as a thing setled in Parliament by the Constituons of Clarendon in Henry the Second's time and the Protestation of the Bishops enrolled in Parliament by the King Lords and Commons 11 R. 2. but now I will deliver my opinion which I submit to better Judgements that they lye still under a Restraint by the Canon Law which by the Statute 25 H. 8. c. 12. which was repealed 1 and 2 Phil. and Mar. but revived 1 Eliz. is still of force where it is not repugnant to the Laws of the Realm which we are sure this branch of it restraining Bishops from judging Capitally is not so far from it that it is confirmed and strengthened by the Law of the Land 3. The third Particular in which he saith all agree is That they have their Votes in Bills of Attainder acting in their Legislative capacity which is as much a Case of Blood as the other and perhaps as much forbidden by the Canon But I desire this worthy Person to consider that the Practice of Parliament is the Law of Parliament and is the commanding Law for regulating the Proceedings of Parliament and that hath over-ruled this Point that in the making of a Law every Free-man of the Kingdom doth give his consent either explicitly if he be a Member of either House or implicitly by his Representative for every Free-man of the Kingdome is there present or represented And it is the Fundamental Constitution of our English Freedome that no man can be bound by any Law but what himself hath consented to now a Bill of Attainder is as much a Law as any Statute Law of the Kingdom Therefore Bishops have acted in a Legislative capacity to judge and condemn Capitally as several Precedents we have of it in Henry the Eight's time but not in a judicial capacity And to say the Canon Law prohibits one as much as the other the Statute of 25 H. 8. clears that point which takes away the force of the Canon in the one not to abridge Members of Parliament from voting in the Legislative way and strengthens it in the other forbidding Bishops to vote Judicially in Cases of Blood Yet if you will have me deliver you freely my opinion in it I think it is an abuse crept in since Henry the Eight's time for before none were judged by Bill but such as had been slain in open War or Tryed Condemned and Executed by Commission and then the proceedings brought into Parliament and there approved of and the Attainder confirmed but under Henry the Eighth several persons were condemned by Bill and the Earl of Strafford lately in our memories which seems now to be authorized by the Practice of Parliament Sir Edw. Cooke tells a story which he had from Sir Thomas Gaudy one of the Judges of the Kings-bench how the King had commanded Cromwel and the Earl of Essex to attend the Justices and know of them if a man who was forth coming should be condemned by Act of Parliament without being heard who after some fencing answered if it were so it could not be afterwards called into question and Cromwel himself was not long after so served but this is by the way Multa quae fieri non debent facta valent I have been a little the longer in these particulars because it will much smooth our way in the following discourse And this worthy Gentleman must give me leave to say That he needed not have put himself to all that trouble of his first Chapter in telling us of the mighty power the Clergy had in the Primitive times in the ordering of Secular affairs which certainly was more by way of Counsel than any thing of Authority by way of Judgement and in a Judicial way And he will avow to me I doubt not that the ministery of the word was a full employment for the Apostles and so for Bishops who call themselves their Successors as well as serving of Tables and other ministerial duties was a full employment for those whom he calls the Treasurers of the Church and therefore they said it for themselves and left it as a Rule for their Successors even to Bishops and all other dispencers of the Word and Sacraments that it was not reason they should leave the Word of God and serve Tables Which it seems was a Non est Consonum by the Law of God just as by the Common Law of the Kingdom a Writ was provided declaring it to be likewise a Non est Consonum and to be Contra morem Consuetudinem Regni that Clergy-men should be employed in Secular affairs This indeed I hinted at then as I gave also some little touch at
Times it may appear plainly that their yielding Obedience to the known Laws of the Kingdom in matters of Appeal appearing and answering in the King's Courts though it were the ancient Usage and Custom of the Realm was the thing that most vexed them and not how far their Presence was required in cases of Blood brought into Parliament in which they were contented to be limited by the Usage of that Court and to afford or forbear their Presence according to that Obligation which was incumbent upon them from the Canons of the Church invigorated by the constant Usage of the Nation If therefore I can make it good that the Bishops had no Right to be present in the Debate and handling matters of Blood and that that was the known Law and the Sense of this Act now before us and of the subsequent Protestation in 11. of R. 2. I shall think my self competently safe though some seeming Precedents and Records should be brought against me for it is the Law must be the Measure and Standard of our Actions and not always Records the Reasons whereof are sometimes obscure and the matter it self many times shortly rehearsed and not always legal I must confess this Author hath much laboured to fix a Sense upon this Article subservient to his Purpose but the more he struggles the more he is intangled 'T is worth Observation that four or five I suppose different Persons have written in the Defence of the Bishops Right to vote in Capital Causes in Parliament and having all of them a necessity to say something to this Law of Clarendon do all of them give different Interpretations of the meaning of it a great Argument of a weak Cause The first whose Title is The Honour of the Lords Spiritual c. I presume being satisfied with the general Sense which was put upon these Constitutions from all times from which it is always unsafe to vary and perceiving that those illegal Priviledges granted to them by King Stephen were by the reviving the Laws of Henry the First abolished doth ingeniously confess in three places pag. 26. at the end of the sixth Chapter and in the same page at the beginning of the seventh Chap. That at Clarendon their Wings were indeed much clip'd yet the Priviledge of sitting and voting in Parliament is left intire to them and tho' they never of late voted in Capital Cases yet they have ever made their Proxies as he hopes to make appear In Chapter the seventh he hath these words We confess as before for that they were Spiritual Persons they were not to sit in Capital Causes and loss of Limb but adds that long before they had exercised this Power By which Words it appears that in the Judgment of that Author whatever their Power and Practice was before yet that now by the Laws of Henry the First recognized at this Parliament at Clarendon that Power was taken away and not since practised That they had such Power before he endeavours to prove out of Compton and Spelman neither of which Authors make good any more than that the Bishop was Assessor with the Earl in the County-court which was only to advise him in point of Conscience not much unlike the Offices of our Surrogates who sit in consistory with the Bishops Chancellor in whom we know resides all the Power That this is so appears by the Laws of Edgar put out by Mr. Lambert who in his fifth Chapter hath these Words Centuriâ—… comitâ—…is quisqueâ—…t antea praescribitur interesto Celeberrimus autem ex omni Saâ—…ia bis quotannis conventus agitor cui cuidem illius Diocesis Episcopus senator intersunto quorum alter jura divina alter humana populum edoceto By which we see 't was the Office of the Bishop to direct the People in Divine Laws as it was of the Senator or Earl to teach them Humane of the same Opinion is Sir Edward Coo. 2 Instit. p. 488. Stat circumspecte agatis Lastly Chap. 8. pag. 32. he mentions the Council at Westminster that in regard they might not Agitare judicium sanguinis they had many times forborn to meddle in such Matters The whole Chapter is concerning Bills of Attainder now whether he meant that in such cases they did sometime absent themselves let himself explain This Author not fore-seeing the Advantage would be made of these Constitutions or else hoping to help himself upon the Power they had to make Proxies doth ingeniously confess the Truth but is deserted by all those of his Side who follow him The Author of the Rejoinder p. 5. tells you that the Constitutions of Clarendon permit the Bishops to be present and vote till it comes to loss of Life or Member which is not till the passing of Sentence upon the Prisoner I believed the loss of Life and Member was the Execution and if they may be there and vote till then they may be present as long as any other for when that is given all go away but if his Meaning be that they should go away when the Sentence is to be pronounced the precedent Words will not bear that Construction so that according to him this is rather an imping than clipping the Wings of the Bishops as the former Author affirmeth Beside this Exposition is contrary to the Votes of the Lords who tell you they must go away when their Lordships proceed to voting Guilty or Not Guilty which is before the definitive Sentence which is always given in the Presence of the Prisoner the other not Vide Iournal of Parl. pag. 258. 15 Maii 1679. in which they explained a former Vote made by their Lordships 13 Maii 1679. in which they had voted that the Lords Spiritual had Right to stay in Court in Capital Cases till Sentence or Judgment of Death came to be pronounced by which you see the House of Lords have disowned that Sense our late Interpreters would put upon the Words of this Constitution though themselves before had given colour to that Interpretation Our third Author intituled The Rights of the Bishops fairly passeth over this Law only tells you that a Bishop pronounced Sentence against Becket in case of Treason as Fitztephen a grave Author saith and farther tells you That though the Prince may indulge many Priviledges to his Clergy as this of not compelling them to vote in Parliament in cases of Blood where by the Canon Law they are prohibited yet that Law must yield to the Law of the Land but how if the Canon Law be part of the Law of the Land what 's then to be done which cannot devest the King of his Right of using his Subjects Clerks or not in any Places or Employments he shall think fit to employ them in or in which he may think them capable of doing Him or the Publick any Service This I confess is plain dealing and I wish it were not too much the Sense of some of our greatest Clerks that let the
Law be what it will it cannot bind the King's Hands from making use of any of his Subjects in what he pleases though the Employment be forbidden by Law This is the Meaning our third Author gives of this Constitution and much good may it do him Our last Author in his Grand Question comes next to be examined in which I shall be more large because in him is concentred what the rest have said and his Cause defended with much Learning and variety of Reading He names the Constitutions of Clarendon and the Protestation in 11 R. 2. as the two main Laws against him The Constitutions of Clarendon which were no more than a Recognition of the ancient Laws and Customs of England not made but revived by Hen. the First and now confirmed by his Grand-son Hen. the Second he considers as the most material and is content this Cause should stand or fall by them He tells you the Constitution in Debate is the eleventh in number of which the Words are Archiepiscopi Episcopi universae Personae regni qui de Rege tenent in Capite habeant Possessiones suas de Rege sicut Baroniam inde respondeant Justiciariis Ministris Regis faciant omnes consuetudines Regias Et ficut ceteri Barones debeant interesse Iudiciis curie Regis quousque perveniatur ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad Mortem After the Words he gives us the Translation of them made by the Author of the Letter in the following manner The Arch-bishops and Bishops and all the dignified Clergy of the Land that hold of the King in Capite shall hold their Possessions of the King as a Barony and answer for their Estates unto the King's Justices and Ministers and shall observe and obey all the King's Laws and together with the other Barons they are to be present at all Judgments in the King's Courts till it comes to require either loss of Life or Member But pray Sir why did you not rather give us a Translation of these Words of your own If the Author of the Letter have made an imperfect Translation why did not you mend it I believe if this Author had found it would have advantaged his Cause some Exceptions would have been taken to the Translation I shall by and by give the Reader a full account of the true Sense of the whole Period but will first make appear the Unreasonableness of the Exposition he makes of the last Clause of it Et sicut caeteri Barones debent interesse judiciis Curiae Regis quousque perveniatur ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad Mortem The Meaning he conceives to be That the Bishops are required to be present in the King's Courts as other Barons are till they come to give Sentence as to dismembring or loss of Life Why he translates Curiae Regis in the plural Number the Kings Courts which is in the singular the King's Court and in this place hath always been understood of the High Court of Parliament in which the other Barons had an Interest to be present as Judges and in which Sense it is very often taken as is made clear by Mr. Petit in his learned Discourse of the ancient Rights of the Commons of England Pref. pag. 45. out of Gervasius Dorobornensis pag. 1653. who speaking of the Election of Arch-bishop Lanfrank hath these Words Eligentibus eum Senioribus ejusdem ecclesiae cum Episcopis ac principibus Clero Populo Angliae in Curia Regis in assumptione Sanctae Mariae and another Author saith it was Consensu Consilio omnium Baronum suorum omniumque Episcoporum Abbatum totiusque Populi Angliae commisit ei Dorobornensem ecclesiam That this was a Parliament we have little Reason to doubt and that it was called Curia Regis See also Inter com T. Hill 17 E. 3. penes remem in Scacc. 29. 32 H. 3. mem 12. 13. in dors rot claus Consideratum fuit in Cur. nostra toto Parliamento nostro c. Wherein Cur. Regis totum Parl. are but expressive of the same thing and not two Courts as I think I very well know that Curia Regis had various acceptations sometime it signified that Court of Justice that at those times followed the King's Person sometime it was taken for Aula Regis where Entertainments and Feasts were made as we read often in our Historians but I take it here to be understood of the High Court of Parliament for the Reasons before touched and many others if any shall seem to doubt of it Next why doth he leave out Judiciis whereas the Words are The Bishops as the other Barons ought to be present Judiciis curiae Regis in Trials in the King's Court viz. the Parliament he renders they are to be present in the King's Courts To help himself under the covert of an ill Translation savours not of that candour justly to be expected from so learned a Person and one that seeketh after Truth rather than Victory but since this Author is a subtile and no loose Writer give me leave to guess at the Reason of it He saw plainly that had he fairly rendred the Words The Bishops as other Barons have Right to be present in all Causes Sentences or Judgments in the King's Court or Parliament till the Cause Sentence or Judgment come to concern Life or Member the Word Judiciis in the plural Number must have referred to other Judgments in other cases and then the latter clause till Judgment or Sentence came to concern Life or Member would have been clearly restrictive as to cases of Blood for to be present at the Judgments of the Court till Judgment is Non-sense except the Words be applyed to different cases Now this Interpretation would have quite destroyed his main Undertaking who at last gives a Sense of the Words not only coincident with that given by the Author of the Bishops Rights to which I have before spoken but contrary to the Votes of the Lords in Parliament who though they seem to admit their Presence in the hearing such a case yet will not admit them to have any part or voice in the judging of it Beside I must needs take notice that 't is a strange Translation of the words Quousque perveniatur or in judicio perveniatur ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad mortem Till they come to give Sentence when the Words more naturally import till Judgment may be fulfilled in the cutting off of Member or Life which is Execution But I shall anon give him a more proper Translation of the Words in the mean time will consider all his Subterfuges and cunning Evasions by which he would give colour to his Interpretation First from the occasion the Author of the Letter pag. 73. had said The Prelates affected a kind of Omnipotency he conceives the Author means in Judicature and I conceive he made that Supposition because he judged it for his Advantage to suppose so
when they might have been others that they were present when by his own Rules they should have been excluded either therefore the general words where they are not mentioned do not enforce their Absence or that they oughtto have been excluded at some other Trials where the Author of the Letter admits they were or might have been present The chief Case he instanceth in is that of Michael de la Pool Chancellour of England who was accused of many Misdemeanours by the House of Commons and as I think he would infer such as Thorp Chief Justice was found guilty of being Capital where the Author of the Letter saith the Bishops were not present yet allows them to have been present in the Case of this Chancellour a parallel Case as he saith with that of Thorp either therefore saith our Author they might have been present in the Case of Thorp or they should have been absent in Trial of Pool This is his Argument as near as I can gather out of his Words put together something obscurely I need give no other Answer to this than to lay before you the words of the Record This Accusation was exhibited by the Commons in 10 R. 2. against Michael de la Pool Lord Chancellour in full Parliament before the King Bishops and Lords and six Articles were objected by them against him The first was That he purchased Lands of the King of great value whilst he was Chancellour the other five as the Record saith were only Quarrels and of little concern To the first and most considerable the Chancellour put in a fair Answer the Commons reply and urge things to the utmost and amongst other things say That whereas by the Popes Provisions a Person was recommended to the Priory of St. Anthonies he the said Chancellour would not suffer him to be admitted till the Grantee had contracted to pay to the Chancellor and his Son 100 l. yearly and then parallel this with Thorp's Case and would have had the Chancellor in the same fault with Thorp for Bribery as a Judg and consequently incur the same Judgment The Chancellor replies and shews great difference between the Cases Upon the whole matter Judgment was given against him pursuant to the Accusation for Misdemeanours only in which the Bishops were and might be present and the parallelling it with Thorp's Case was only in the Management of the Cause by the Commons and no part of the Accusation Neither is it reasonable to believe that which our Author asserts in the same Page that the Prelates were free Agents and might withdraw at some times and be present at others as they saw cause For beside that this is contrary to the express Law of Clarendon which expresly declares that 't is their duty to be present in all Proceedings in Curia Regis which in that place must be understood of the Parliament because they were to be present with the other Lords tho I know that Curia Regis is sometimes taken in a more laxe Sense for all the Courts in Westminster are the King's Courts and unto which they were to give Obedience and Attendance in Cases not prohibited I say over and above this Act at Clarendon it seems to me very unreasonable to suppose that such a Body of Men had liberty to give their Attendance when they pleased without leave of the House or cause shewed why 't was fit they should be absent or that the Author of the Letter meant more when he saith they might have been present than that they were not prohibited by the Law of Clarendon which only had Relation to Matters of Blood But these Men had other Canons to go by when they thought fit as well as those of Toledo and 't is probable enough that the rest of the Noble-Men finding them most constant Factors for the Pope were willing enough to let them be absent upon any colourable Pretence when they desired it Is not one clear Precedent against them in point of greater weight than many dubious and equivocal ones which cannot without great Art be wire-drawn to speak to their advantage Let him consult the Discourse of Peerage pag. 17. The Case of the Earl of Northumberland 7 Hen. 4. Rot. processus cor Dom. Rege in Parl. in 5 Hen. 4. This Noble-Man came into Parliament and confessed before the King and Lords that he had done against his Allegiance in gathering Power and giving Liveries this Fact by the Lords was adjudged no Treason for which he gives Thanks to the Lords his Judges and a day after the Commons do the like where the Prelates are named as our Author affirms and to which I shall speak by and by But in 7 Hen. 4 the same Earl was in actual Rebellion in the North and his Forces dispersed by the Earl of Westmarland but he and the Lord Bardolf fled into Scotland the rest were most of them taken Prisoners This Case came into Parliament where the King commands the Lords Temporal Peers of the Realm to advise what Process to make and what Judgment to render against the Earl of Northumberland and Lord Bardolf Nothing can be plainer than that the King look'd upon the Lords Temporal as those Peers who were proper to give Judgment touching their Fellow Peers who had fled from Trial in a case of Blood The Record goes on the said Lords advised thereupon and gave Counsel to the King Then the said Lords Peers of the Realm by assent of the King order summoning the said Lords to appear at a day given or to stand convicted by Award of the Peers in Parliament The King farther demanded the Opinion of the Lords Temporal touching the Arch-bishop of York who was in the same Treason The Lords Temporal by the Assent of the King and by their Authority declared and awarded the said Earl and Lord to stand convict of Treason for not appearing upon Summons 'T is very clear that this whole Business was transacted by the Lords Temporal without the Bishops and with the Concurrence of the King 'T is not to be believed that the Bishops would have sate quiet had they thought themselves wronged in these Proceedings See the Discourse of Peerage pag. 17 18. I think it hardly possible to find a more clear Record in the Point than this is First here were two Noble Lords defeated in actual Rebellion and fled from Justice into Scotland The King upon this would not so much as consult with his Prelates knowing them by Law no proper Counsellours against Peers in matters of Blood applies himself to his Lords Temporal they order Proclamations by order of the King enjoyning the said Lords to appear at a day certain or to stand convict they not appearing are by Award of the Lords Temporal convicted of Treason and a Year after one is slain the other mortally wounded at Bramham-moor in York-shire Can any thing be more agreable to the Practice at this day against Men that fly from Justice and
are convicted for non-appearance He must have a new way of reasoning who considering that in 4 E. 3. the Earls and Barons are declared those Peers to whom such Judgments belong that in 5 E. 3. the Prelates declared that in a Case where Blood might be it belonged not to them to be present that in 7 R. 2. the Temporal Lords were only concerned in a Case where the Accusation was Treason with many other Cases that in 1 Hen. 4. the Lords are declared Judges in such matters that in 2 Hen. 4. in a like Trial or Judgment the Temporal Lords are all named who were the Judges that now in 7 Hen. 4. the Temporal Lords are again declared Judges and after all this that the Prelates should be deemed proper Judges in Cases of Blood upon bare Surmises and no direct Proof seems to me to savour of a Man wedded to an Opinion which he resolves to maintain when at last tho Precedents confirm what the Law is 't is that must determine the Controversy This I say in Relation to what Mr. Hunt objects This Precedent may in part serve to give answer to those Arguments drawn from the Identity of Names to the Identity of Right The Bishops saith the Grand Questionist are sometimes comprehended under the name of Grands Seigneurs and Peers therefore their Right is equal to all others who enjoy those Names How he attempts to make this good we shall see anon But first let him consider how weak a way of arguing this is we know nothing is more equivocal than Names Many are called Lords who had once that Name as Embassadors Chief Justice c. or such whose Fathers are Dukes so Earls Eldest Sons yet are indeed but Commoners so Baronagium comprehends all the whole Parliament Barons there are of the Cinque-Ports of the Exchequer and of some chief Towns as I have noted before from Mr. Selden so we are not to judg the Right from the Appellation but govern the Appellation by the Right The first Precedent he urges is pag. 96. where in 4 E. 3. an Act passed for Trial by Peers Cotton Numb 6. 'T is agreed unto by the King and all the Grands in full Parliament that tho the Lords had tried some who were not their Peers upon Accusation by the King in a summary way against Law it should be so no more If the Bishops were here comprehended under the Name of Grands so were the Commons too if it should be an Act of Parliament will he hence infer that the Commons have an equal Right with the Lords because they all are called Grands Who were esteemed Grands or Magnates see Matth. Paris in Anno Dom. 1100. Inhibitio ne qui Magnates viz. Comes Baro Miles seu aliqua alia notabilis Persona c. Here you see under Magnates are taken Earls Barons Knights or any other Person of Rank So Milites Comitatuum and Barones quinque portuum are called Magnates inter com brevia de term sctae trin Sct. Mich. An. 34. E. 1. penes rentem Dom. thesaurarij in Scaccario he that desires more let him consult Mr. Petyt's Learned Discourse of the ancient Rights of the Commons pag. 93 94. and in sundry other places I think therefore I may safely conclude this Point That where Grands are named alone there not only the Bishops but the Earls Barons Judges and Commons might be comprehended but where the Grands are mentioned after the Earls and Barons there the Bishops who ought first to be named shall never be taken in secondarily and by Implication Neither is it any thing to our Question whether it were for their Honour to be absent in some Cases as he intimates pag. 100. in the Case of Roger Mortimer but what the matter of Fact was Pag. 112. He would comprehend the Prelates among the Peers because in 4 E. 3. N. 3. The words are All the Peers Counts and Barons assembled in Parliament upon strict Examination do assent and agree that John Mautrevers is guilty of the Death of Edmund Earl of Kent Here he would infer that the Prelates were present at the Examination of that Capital Crime under the name of Peers because at that time there were no Dukes nor others of Superiour Degree to Earls but he doth not consider that the word Peers in this place doth only denote who those Peers then mentioned were Peers viz. Earls and Barons not Bishops as before Magnates viz. Comes Baro Miles c. As when we say a Noble-Man is to be tried by his Peers we understand only those that are truly so and not others that sometimes may be called so this is much cleared by the Record 2 Hen. 4. N. 30. The Lords Temporal by the Assent of the King adjudged Thomas Holland late Earl of Kent Iohn Holland late Earl of Huntington and others Traitors this Judgment was after the Parties were dead and but the second Successor after Edward the third Why did not now the Prelates come in and claim their Right Certainly they would have done it but that they knew the Law and Practice was against them what else is material in this Chapter hath been taken notice of by the Author of the Letter and others so that it needs no further Examination and I may safely conclude that where the Prelates are not named they are not understood Now that in this case the Bishops could not be meant by the word Peers is very plain from the Record it self For the fore-named Iohn Mautrevers being not in hold the said Peers do pray our Lord the King that search should be made for him throughout the Realm and a Reward promised Now if the Bishops were meant by the word Peers alone for Earls and Barons are named witness the Peers Earls and Barons then by Parity of Reason the said Peers should be meant only of the Bishops as if they alone had made the desire for the Apprehension of the said Matrevers and the Earls and Barons had been unconcerned which is absurd See 4 E. 3. Mem. 3. N. 3. Seld. Baron p. 13. Our Author concludes his third Chapter with the Case of Henry Hotspur the eldest Son of the Earl of Northumberland who for having levied War with others against the King was declared a Traitor being before slain in Battel by the King and Lords in full Parliament this was upon Friday the 18th of February upon the same Friday upon that Case and the Petition of the Earl Father to Henry and Examination of his Cause by the Lords as Peers of Parliament to whom such Judgment belonged for the King would then have referred the whole matter to the Judges he was declared innocent of Treason or Felony but only finable for Trespass at the King's Pleasure for which the said Earl gave Thanks to the King and Lords for their rightful Judgment and also at the same time purged upon his Oath the Arch-bishop of Canterbury the Duke of York
one nay some might have been obliged to attend upon one Cause of Summons exprest which were not upon another for if the King had an Occasion of transporting an Army beyond Sea in that case only they that held by the Service of going into forreign Parts together with such as were tied to general Service were obliged to attend and liable to pay Escuage upon their default to be taxed by them who were present according to the Obligation of their Tenure If the Tenure were to go into Scotland or Wales they could not by reason of their Tenure be compelled to go else-where whereas the Attendance at the King's Court ex more was what I take it lay upon every Tenant in Chief holding by Knights Service Ratione Tenurae and was not superseded by King Iohn's Charter but still they that were not present were concluded as to all Acts of the King's Court Baron either in Criminal or Civil Causes as much as in the Court-Baron of an Inferiour Lord the Suitors present may proceed to all Judgments within the Cognizance of their respective Courts where through the common neglect of the Suitors the Steward for the most part gives Judgment by himself Mr. W. who was the first Author of a Lawyer that ran Counter to me makes a distinction between a Parliament and a Curia Regis which I conceive to be without any difference in Relation to the several Powers of the Curia and the Great Council of the Nation except that 't was less in that which is now called the Parliament than 't was in the Curia for he says that to the Curia the Tenants were obliged to come Ratione Tenurae but to the other they could not come but ex Gratia Regis Upon which 't is further observable 1st That he yields that the Commons others beside the Tenants in Chief had as much right as the Tenants in Chief to come to the Parliament before the 49th Hen. 3. for he grants that they too came sometimes before that time ex Gratia 2dly Whereas he supposes that King Iohn's Charter of Resignation was void not being in Magno Concilio though 't was in Communi Concilio Faronum he assignes no reason in the World for it's being void for admit that to the Commune Concilium Faronum or Curia the Tenants in Capite came Ratione Tenurae and to the General Council of the Kingdom ex Gratia which he subjoyns as the Ground for avoiding that ignominious Resignation which he agrees with me contrary to Dr. Brady to have been made in the Curia Regis and not in the General Council of the Kingdom does it follow that because they had no Right to come to the General Council though they had to the Curia that therefore a Resignation in the Curia was not good nay does it not follow that because they had no Right to come to the General Council therefore the King might exercise his absolute Power in such a Counsel as he should think fit to call and might oblige the Nation in any Act of his done by such Advice or Consent Nay rather if there were a Counsel where they might ex 〈◊〉 be present which Mr. W. makes the same with Ratione Tenurae does it not follow that there would be less Obligation upon them from any Act done in the General Council of the Kingdom where they had no Right to be present and so no consent of theirs could be urged to inforce the Obligation than from the Determinations of that Counsel where they were necessary Members But Mr. W. his Grounds for his Belief that the Commons had no Right to come to the General Council of the Kingdom before the 49th of Hen. 3. are two 1st That in the 45th of Hen. 3. only three were ordered to be Representatives for every County the Year I take to have been mistaken by the Printer for the Settlement and Reformation of the Government which he mentions was in the 48th and that he means that Settlement and not one before in the 42d is evident by his citing Si videatur Communitati Praelatorum â—…ronum which is in the Record of the 48th and not in any of the 42d that I have seen But 't is evident by the Record that the three he mentions were assigned for the Electors of a standing Counsel to the King which was to act out of Parliament as well as in but with no Authority in Legislation besides admit that they were intrusted with all the Power of the Counties I cannot find any force in the Argument that because a Representative was then agreed on therefore they had no Right to come before that time in their own Persons But indeed in the 42d of that King there was a Representive of the Commons who were in those times accounted only the Citizens and Burgesses this was pur espargner les Costs des Communs to spare the Charges of the Commous which I use not to shew that all such came any otherwise than two for a place But that the settling a Representative is an Argument that before that time they came in greater Numbers 2dly His second Argument is the Authority of Pollidore Virgil which proves wholly against him for it says that the Populus rarely were consulted with before the time of Hen. I. Adeo ut ab Henrico primo id Institutum Iure Manasse diâ—…i possit Even he allows the Right of the Commons to be a constituent part of Parliament to have been an Institution or a settled Right long before the 49th of Hen. 3. no less than one hundred forty nine Years And in the Case of Godsoll and others against Sir Christopher Heydon my Lord Cook affirmed that he had seen a Record in the time of Hen. I. of the Commons Degrees and Seats in Parliament his words are these En Ancient temps tout le Parliament sea insimul le Separation fuit Par le desire del Commons mes â—…ent obstant ils font forsque un mese ieo aie veiw un Record 30 H. 1. de lour Degrees Seats That the Commons were Members of the General Councils of the Kingdom in the time of Hen. I I think is very plain when we find even at Synods Assemblies for Ecclesiastical Affairs Nobilitas Populusque minor and Laici tam divices quam mediocres But that they then had any Order and certain Seats there I cannot readily believe And indeed we find that in the Reign of King Stephen who immediately succeed Hen. I. 't is spoke of as customary for the Uulgus or Commons which were Infinita Multituto Plebis to come as Members of the Great Council and to intermix themselves with Men of the greatest Quality as 't is usual in Crouds Uulgo etiam confusè permixtum ut solct se ingerente 3dly Mr. W. his third Argument is that where a Record makes mention of Arch-bishops Bishops Abbots Priors
and 2. Ed. 3. forbidding Churchmen to take Cognizance of Matters of Blood 30 33 64. and 169 Statute of Clarendon a binding Law and only affirmative of the old Law 153 Statute of Westminster Anno 1175 forbidding all Persons in Holy Orders Judicium Sanguinis agitare 101 102 157 Stephen Bishop of London tryed by a Common Iury. 27 Stephen King his Charter to the Clergy 140 153 Stratford Arch-Bishop his Case T 283 Succession to the Crown 209 to P 214 Suffolk Duke his Case 13 60. S 284 285 T. TAlbot Lord his Case S 285 Temporal Lords sole Iudges of Peers 40 56 R 276. S 280 Tenants in Capite more than they Members of Parliament before 49th H. 3d. yeilded in Effect by Mr. Hunt 264 to 268. 3d. Part. Tenure in Capite created 78 A a 253 Tenure in Capite Mr. Hunt's Mistakes about it 242 to A a 258 Tenure by Barony inferred no more than a Minor Baron 78 109 118 119 120 Thorp Sir William 32 33 Titles Vid. Succession to the Crown Treason declared by the Iudges in Parliament R 264 265 Trial of Bishops by a Common Iury. 26 27 T 278 279 Trials in Appeals and the reason thereof V 191 192 193 U. UTriusque ordinis consensus explained T 275 276 W. Waver of Peerage T 286 287 Westminster the Council there forbiding Churchmen to meddle in matters of Blood 101 102 157 Cicero de Senectute ult edit tom 4. f. 532. Jani Angl. facies nova p. 186. Habet Rex Curiam suam in concilio suo in Parliamentis suis ubi terminatae sunt dubitationes judiciorum novis injuriis emersis nova constituuntur remedia unicuique justitia prout meruerit retribuetur ibidem Fleta lib. 2. cap. 2. The passage relating to the constituting new remedies must needs here relate to the power of the Magnum concilium or curia in making Ordinances Vid. Jus Angl. ab antiquo Addit p. 40. Ib. p. 39. Jan. Angl. p. 186 189 190. Jan. Angl. c. p. 201. Ib. p. 199. Ib. p. 189. Mr. Hunt's Argument p. 17. Vid. p. 100. 139 to 166. Vid. p. 65 to 70 172 to 181. Dr. Stillingfleet says The King insisted on the receiving the Ancient Customes of Clarendon Answer to Cressy's Apol. p. 100. This received over all the Western Church Burnet's History of the Reformation f. 101. Mr. Hunt's Arg p. 6. Jan. Angl. facies nova à p. 186. to 219. Vid. p. 87 183 184 c. Page 7. Page 25. Page 24. Pag. 13 and Pag. 37 c. Page 38. Page 129. Gr. Qu. p. 1. Seld. Tit. hon p. 730. I edit fol. 19 Edw. 2. Seld. Tit. Hon. pag. 704. Mat Par. p 7. ult ed. Ad id temporis Mr. Hunt thinks that the Tenure made them Barons and that Tenure and Barronies were coincident Seld Tit. Hon. p. 699. and 700. a This I take to be the only true of enobling any body as to the Nobilitas Major Seld. Tit. Hon. par 2. cap. 5. cir finem Vid. Els 〈◊〉 p. 33. b See Mr. Seld. Jans Angl. facies altera ult edit p. 51. Seld. Tit. Hon. pag. 747. Dugd. Baron c Query Whether this Summons gave him other Title than a Minor Baron 7 Edw. 2. 7 Rich. 2. 7 Rich. 2. Vid. Cot. Post. â—…ls edit pag. 344. Seld. Tit. Hon. pag. 690. Part 2. c. 13. Fitstep c. 11. Matth. Paris Anno 1215. Hakewell pag. 4. Pâ—…in 591 c. Seld. Tit. Hon. part 2. p. 743 Cook 's Iuris of Courts Hakew. Mod. p. 135. Dan. Cron. Anno 1133. Rights of the Crown p. 100. Cook 's Preface to his 9th Report sets it out at large Fitst cap. 10 col 2. Seld. Tit. Hon. cap. 5. pag. 706. d N. B. their calling themselves Barons did not make them such who were at first summoned Ratione Episcopalis Dignitatis e Vid. Rot. Fin. 9. H. 3. me 3. 12. E. 2. Funivals c. 18. E. 2. Nevils c. Pet. Blesens yy 2. edit in Quarto or some Lines before see after p. 58 and p. 129. b wrongfully or contrary to the true use Kelway fol. 184. saith That the Convocation is not a part of the higher House neither the Bishops any part of it but sit there as they have Temporal Baronies But he doth not say the Convocation is not one Estate or part of the Parliament which however is but the Opinion of a Serjeant at Law Dr. Heylin's Stumbling-block Prin. fourth p. Kal. p. 594 595. Gr. q. p. 〈◊〉 Gr. q. p. 3. Els. p. 〈◊〉 Gr. q. p. 4. Hist. Coll. part 2. pag. 990. Gr. q. p. 6. Vid. Dan. p. 35. 46. Baker p. 26. 30. Gr. q. p. 6. N. B. Here he makes the whole Clergy to be one of the three Estates Il Nipotismo de Roma p. 37. Pad paolo de materie ecclesiastiche Our Bishops Rights pag. 61. Spel. Glos. verb. Cap. Justic. Co. 2. Inst. p. 26. Seld. tit hon part 2. p. 703. What Dr. Bradies Fancy is in that Particular let him make good if he can Coo. Cawdreys Case Twysden's Vind. of Schism In a Parliament held at Oxford Anno 1136. he grants by his Charter under his Hand That all Persons and Causes Ecclesiastical should appertain only to Ecclesiastical Judges Hon. of the Lords p. 26. Laws of Edg. ch 5. Coo. Mag. Cha. p. 488. Rejoin p. 5. Jour of â—…arl p. 258. Bishops Rights p. 139. 141. Gr. q. p. 19. Gr. q. p. 20. Petit pr. p. 45. Ger. Dorob p. 1653. 〈◊〉 E. 3. Gr. q. p. 20. Gr. q. p. 30. Seld. tit hon p. 703. Gr. q. p. 32. Hoveden f. 543. Ger. Dorob fo 1429. An. 1175. Non licet ought not to be translated it is not convenient as Mr. Hunt would have it and never hath that Signification but when a Law intervenes which makes it as well unlawful as inconvenient for every Law makes the Breach of it inconvenient Linw. lib. 3. tit 29. Ne qui Cler. Vid. Treat of the Nobil pag. 68. supposed to be by Doddridg Seld. tit hon p 704. Cook 2 Inst. pag. 587. Hakewell mod pa. 84. Adsint Fitz. cap. 10. col 12. Co. Ma. Ch. p. 585. Gr. q. p. 33. Gr. q. p. 34. That Edition in qâ—… 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 certainly the best the latter ones being printed from that Copy Pet. Blâ—…n Y y 2. The critically learned Mr. Hunt in his undigested Lump instead of a methodical Discourse pag. 5â—… endeavours to cure the Ignorance of his Readers by telling them that by Principes Sacerdotum Seniores Populi the Bishops are only meant who from the Dignity and Worthiness of their Order are called Seniores a note of Dignity in all Countries He should have done well to have added Qâ—…m Principes Sacerdotum Sâ—…es populi as the first and best Edition of Petrus Blesensis hath it That Senior is a name of Honour he might have learn'd at School but that the Chief Priests and the Elders often mâ—…ned in Scripture were the same â—…ns he hath
the Government of the Church by the Imperial Law but not that I put any stress upon it but meerly to circumscribe the Question and keeping it within limits by a Negative declaring what it was not and an Affirmative expressing what it was how Bishops in Parliament could not Judicially act in Capital Cases Therefore were it all so as this learned Gentleman seems to infer that in France Spain Germany and those Northern Kingdoms which he mentions that Bishops were joyned with the Civil Magistrates in ordering the Publick Affairs of those Nations and that they had a share not only in the Legislative but in the Judiciary part as he alledgeth two Authors to prove it to have been in France it would not be of any signification to decide our Controversie for what is this to us to regulate our Parliaments and to operate on our Laws But first for matter of Fact as to France to which I can speak a little having spent many years in that Kingdom and I have by way of discourse informed my self from the Ambassadour who is here from that Crown who doth assure me that the Judges whom they call Counsellors and not Judges as we do who are Clergy-men as many there are joyned with the others of the Laity never sit in that Chamber of Parliament which trys Capital Causes which they call the Tournelle I believe the same may be observed in those other Countries which our Author mentions and I do not see how it could be otherwise the severity of the Canon Law being so strict in the prohibition of it But as I said before the Primitive Christians had that veneration for the Clergy and especially for the Bishops that they were still joyned with the Civil Magistrate in ordering the affairs both in Church and State The matters of the Church they determined Judicially in Secular affairs whether Criminal or other only by way of Counsel if the Civil Magistrate to whose Province they belonged did not do his part I am sure it was so in England Brompton in his Chronicle recites the Laws of King Athelstane in this particular I cited his very words in the original in my former Letter I shall now repeat them very faithfully in English He saith It appertains of right to a Bishop to promote that which is right both concerning God and the World A little after he addeth He ought likewise diligently together with the Secular Judges to promote Peace and Concord And soon upon it he hath this passage The Bishop ought to be present in Judgement with the Secular Judges not to suffer any buds of wickedness to sprout if he can hinder it His Presence and his Counsel was rather a check upon the Judge than to determine any thing in Secular affairs Sir Henry Spelman is a little more particular in delivering unto us the nature of that mixt Court it is in his Glossary upon the word Comes The Earl he saith did preside in that County Court not alone but joyned with the Bishop he to deliver what was Gods Law the other what was Mans Law and that the one should help and counsel the other Especially the Bishop to do it to the Earl for it was lawful for him sometimes to reprove the other and to reduce him bring him into order if he went astray Then he tells us what the work of that Court was that it had cognizance but of petty matters That the Earl had not cognizance of great mens businesses for such matters are to be brought into the Kings Courts he only judges poor mens Causes Hence it is that by our Law Actions for Debts and Trespasscs are not to be commenced in the County Court if it be for above the value of 40s It seems that in ancient times it was but one Court but each Judge had his proper work the Ecclesiastical Judge to distribute and deliver to them what was Gods Law the Secular Judge Mans Law And so it continued till William the First 's time who first separated the two Courts as appears by his Charter to Bishop Remigius which Mr. Selden relates in his Comment upon Eadmerus p. 167. which he saith the King did Communi Concilio Archiepiscoporum suorum raeterorum Episcoporum Abbatum omnium Principum regni sui In a Common Council by the advice of his Arch bishops and the rest of the Bishops and Abbots and all the great men of the Kingdom The words are Wherefore I command you and enjoyn you by my Royal authority that no Bishop nor Arch deacon presume to hold Plea in the Hundred Court any more upon the Episcopal Laws nor bring any Cause that pertains to the rule of Souls before the Judgement of Secular persons but that whoever is questioned according to the Episcopal Laws for any misdemeanour or fault shall come to that place which the Bishop shall chuse and nominate for that purpose and there shall make answer for himself and not in the Hundred Court but shall according to the Canons and the Episcopal Laws do that which is just and right both to God and to his Bishop This was again confirmed 2 R. 2. and so the Courts came to be divided as they continue to this day But nothing can be concluded out of that large Enumeration of the Bishops being admitted in those ancient times to Publick Councils which was more for their Advice and Counsel and Direction than to act any thing at all Authoritatively and Juridically and least of all to have any vote to determine any thing in Cases of Blood which the Canon Law made a Noli me tangere to them I deny not but before there were Christian Magistrates even in the Apostles times the Ministers of the Gospel did many times interpose and reconcile differences and sutes which many times happened amongst believers as St. Paul saith Is there not a wise man among you no not one that shall be able to judge between his Brethren Nor doth he exclude the Bishops that they may not come in as one of those wise men Yet 1 Cor. 6. 4. he seems to exclude them For he saith If then ye have judgement of things pertaining to this life set them to judge who are least esteemed in the Church Which doth seem to intimate as if he meant not the Bishops for sure they are not least esteemed But doth any man think that they were by this authorized to compel men to submit to their Judgement to punish or imprison or lay any corporal punishment upon them if they would not Indeed I cannot think so Nor do I find that St. Augustine was of that opinion the term he gives to those whom the Author of that Treatise will have to be Ecclesiastical Judges doth not imply so much rather the contrary methinks He calls them Cognitores which denotes rather one that took notice of such differences and would endeavour to compose them than a Judge to determine them which hath made me examine that passage more
me p. 31. taxing me with representing those constitutions very unfairly which is an expression of one engaged in a party and not of one that only seeks for truth but to shew his Reading and Learning as I am afraid that Author doth who raiseth a great deal of dust meerly to blind mens eyes and mis lead them into errours and thus he commends himself for speaking mildly and much good may his mildness do him It is apparent that the Clergy were then very high having gotten a great head by the favour they had found from the Usurper King Stephen where on both sides they served one anothers turns and Henry the Second to bring things again into order call'd that great Counsel at Clarendon where by the Advice of the Prelates and the Nobility of the Realm a recapitulation was made of part of the ancient customs and priviledges under the former King and particularly under his Grand-father Henry the First which for the future he would have to be observed in the Kingdom and thus Propter dissentiones discordias saepe immergentes inter Clerum Iusticiarios Domini Regis Magnatum Regni There were sixteen of those Articles the eleventh was that they should hold their possessions of the King in Capite sicut Barcniam and should be answerable to the King for their Services and should as Barons interesse Judiciis Curiae Regis quousque perveniatur ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad Mortem Here we see the occasion of that meeting at Clarendon it was to remove all causes of difference between the Great Bishops and the Civil Magistrates let us now see what was most likely to displease them it 's not probable it should be for being reduced to stand upon even ground with the rest of the Nobility and great men of the Realm but if in any thing they are made less and abridg'd of the powers which the others have it stands most with reason they should be troubled at that and to be forc'd to walk out of the Judgement-hall after they had cryed Crucifige is a great lessening of their figure I think more than if they had not at all meddled in it But this Worthy Author saith I have made use of the most Imperfect Copy of Matthew Paris and saith in the Vatican Copy and several MSS. it runs thus Debent interesse Judiciis Curiae Regis cum Baronibus donec perveniatur in Iudicio ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad Mortem Now in my opinion this makes more against the sense he would put upon these words which is that they may stay and have a hand in managing the debate upon the Evidence and agreeing upon the Sentence but must be gone when it is pronounced which as I said before I look upon as a greater scorn put upon them as Blesensis saith Quid hac simulatione perniciosius est nunquid discutere definire licitum quod non licet pronunciare For I should think that mentioning in Iudicio in the second part should not have a different constructionthan Iudiciis Curiae in the first part For there the Judicia Curiae which they may be present at is to be understood of the whole proceeding from the bringing in of the Charge against a Criminal person to the pronouncing of the Sentence And can it be rationally thought that Iudicium in the second place should be meant only of the sentence which is the principal part and which the corruption of mans nature doth chiefly lead him unto The Poet saith Qui nolunt occidere quenquam Posse volunt This power of killing and slaying Potestas Iuvandi Nocendi is a pleasing thing and we are naturally angry with what abridgeth us of it So I must conclude this point that it 's most probable the Bishops were most scandalized at this eleventh Article Secondly Let us consider how to arrive at the true meaning of that constitution which must be by comparing the passages of these times together whereby we shall see how they understood it Yoyu have already heard what Petrus Blesensis judged of those who would retain that Image of Judicature how much he blamed them and what menaces of Gods Judgements he denounced against them for the words of that Constitution were not so clear and positive that it gave not Ansam disputandi to those whose Inclinations led them to turn it into another sense and content themselves to play at small Games rather than sit out altogether So the Wisdome of that time to make it yet more plain and take away all ambiguity moved the King to call another Great Council at Westminster in the year 1175. eleven years after Ad Emendationem Anglicanae Ecclesiae ex assensu Domini Regis Primorum omnium Regni where the third Article is His qui in Sacris ordinibus constituti sunt Iudicium Sanguinis agitare non licet unde prohibemus ne aut per se membrorum truncationes faciant aut inferendas judicent Quod siquis tale fecerit concessi ordinis privetur officio loco Inhibemus etiam sub interminatione anathematis ne quis Sacerdos habeat vicecomitum aut praepositâ—… secularis officium It is not lawful for those who are in Holy Orders to act at all in Judgements of Blood wherefore we forbid them to have any thing to do with taking off mens Limbs or to judge of any such thing And if any do such a thing he shall be deprived of the office and dignity of his Orders And we also forbid under the pain of being Anathematized that no Priest shall take upon him the Office of a Sheriff or of a Secular Judge This makes it out plain what the sense of those times was that it was not lawful for them to act at all in cases of Blood and this is as much the Law of the Land as the Constitutions of Clarendon or as any other Statute Law But our Author p. 42. quarrels at this as only standing upon Roger Hoveden's authority and wishes he had produced the whole Canon entire for it Here you have two of our Ancient Historians that liv'd in these times and agree in Terminis upon the relation of what there passed But our Author is not satisfied tells us the Council of Toledo makes an c. and leaves out the prohibition which declares the meaning and extent of their Canon He will have this Prohibition and Sanction of deprivation to attend only upon the latter part that is if they do joyn in pronouncing the Sentence But where doth he find that distinction allowed it is what the Clergy have framed and imagined to themselves to give them some Power Admit we should allow them that it makes it not the more lawful for them there is still a Non licet which is subject to punishment and though the Ecclesiastical Law doth not go to that height to cut off a Member deprive him ab Officio Beneficio yet it may go less in a lower Sentence
not that the thing was true or that the Author of the Letter gave him any cause to take up that Fancy Their Affectation of Omnipotency was not to be freed from that part of the Law of the Land which was agreeable with the Laws of the Church which they were content to submit to but their Desire was to be freed from those they thought were against them to wit to do Service to the King for their Lands to answer to his Justices and Ministers to be subject to the secular Power for any crimes they should commit These were the things they stormed at and were the Ecclesiastical Bondage and the wicked Constitutions Matt. Paris and other Historians of his Time so much exclaimed against because they would have had all their Affairs transacted in their own Courts so that our Author need not have spent ten Pages to prove what no body affirms Much of the Contests between the King and Clergy arose from the Charter granted by K. Stephen Anno 1136. That all Persons and Causes ecclesiastical should appertain only to ecclesiastical Judges which Charter whatever stir they made about it according to our Author's Logick was void for Maud the Empress Daughter to Henry the First third Son to William the First and so right Heir to the Crown was then alive to whom the Bishops and People had sworn Obedience and therefore King Stephen was as much an Usurper as Hen. the Fourth This Charter was the Latis offendiculi the stumbling Stone they could not escape and the meer restoring now at Clarendon the ancient Laws and Customs confirmed to the People by Hen. 1. was what gave them the greatest Disturbance not that they affected any Omnipotency of Judicature at least in cases of Blood insomuch that our Author had no reason to pin a Sense upon the Words of the Author of the Letter to which he had no Inducement from any Words of that Author Having done with the Occasion we come now to his second Enforcement of his Opinion viz. the plain meaning of the Words First he quarrels with the copy the Author of the Letter follows taken out of Matt. Paris and Wendover who notwithstanding in Mr. Selden's Opinion have best preserved the meaning of this Constitution Seld. tit hon part 2. pa. 703. 704. Though I do not grant his Vatican copy following as he saith Gerv. Doroberniensis is better yet for once I am content to follow his copy and admit the Words in Judicio to be inserted which are left out by Matt. Paris yet I think necessarily implyed but shall never yield to his unwarrantable construction of them which in conclusion amounts to this That the Bishops were bound to be in the Kings Courts in all Judgments till it came to Sentence of loss of Life and Member and then they might go out in obedience to the Canons of the Church if they pleased to which they pretended themselves bound in Conscience to give Obedience and that for this Reason the Pope marked this Constitution with a hoc tolerandum the others with hoc improbandum I confess I think the Interpretation of these Words contrary to their natural Sense and contrary to the Opinion and Practise of former times who have always understood them to import that the Clergy ought to be present in all Tryals in Parliament except in Tryals of Blood But before I proceed to make good the true Sense and Translation of these words it will be necessary to explain the Signification of some of them First Quousque usque quo dummodo praeterquam are often times indifferently taken as signifying the same thing and are limiting restraining Particles and used as Exceptions to something which went before 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 till what time till when so far forth except when or the like Secondly Iudicium signifies properly a Tryal at Law a Case a Suit or Process and is not taken for a definitive Sentence except when it is delivered as the Opinion of the Court resulting upon a precedent Tryal had before others in which he that pronounces Sentence hath not or very rarely more than a directive Power and do's not give his own single Opinion but the Sense of others in matters debated Actiones quarum causa in jus quisque vocatur quandoque dicuntur judicia Ut in L. in bon fid 13. de Usuris L. 4. C. tit 32. L. Mora S. in bo fid Theophilus refert in S. 1. de Act. quas Athenienses 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dicebant Budaeus notat in communi Lingua Graeca per 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 generali nomine dicebant litem actionem paenam mulctam judicium to wit the whole Proceedings Iudicium est legitima disceptatio duorum aut plurium coram judice Cale Dict. Calv. Lex juridcirca finem to the same purpose By these Authorities and many more 't is plain that Judicium Judgment comprehends the whole Proceedings in any Cause and not the Sentence only Pervenio signifies to arrive at or the Accomplishment or Bounds of any thing as pervenire ad metam is to arrive at or come to the Goal Ovid speaking of the Return made by the Eccho hath these Words Verba refert aures non pervenientia nostras Words that arrived not at our Ears they came not to the Terms or Bounds designed So pervenior in the Passive Voice must signifie to be arrived at or accomplished in That Judicium in our Case must be taken in the Sense I have given I shall evince from the general Opinion of Lawyers I shall begin with Magna Charta The Words there are judicium Parium and understood of a Tryal by his Equals The Question which is asked the Prisoners after their Plea is not who shall give Sentence upon thee but how wilt thou be tryed and they that give Sentence are not those that try them in criminal Cases nay their appealing to a Tryal by them is accounted a standing Mute The next Authority shall be from the Council at Westminster in the 22. year of Hen. 2. no more than twelve years after the Assize of Clarendon and as Hoveden saith taken out of the 11. of Toledo and summoned as Gervas of Canterbury saith In hoc consilio ad emendationem Ecclesiae Anglicanae ex assensu Domini Regis primorum omnium Regni haec subscripta promulgata sunt Capitula Amongst which this is one His qui in sacris ordinibus constituti sunt judicium sanguinis agitare non licet unde prohibemus ne aut per se Membrorum truncationes faciant aut inferendas judicent That such as were in holy Orders should not agitate or meddle in Tryals of Blood as a thing unlawful for which Reason they are prohibited from cutting off any Member themselves or from giving their Opinions or Judgments that such Punishments ought to be inflicted This Synod we see was not only a Meeting of the Clergy but with them of the Primores Regni
and the Determinations promulgated by their Assent and the Assent of the King for the Lay-men did usually meet with the Clergy in their Councils in those days To which purpose see a Tractate of a late learned Writer in his Iani Angl. fac nov pag. 213. which came not to my hand till very lately Now whether this Agitation of the Clergy in matters of Blood had reference to the ordinary Courts of Justice in which they might not be present or to all in general is not material since it is only produced to shew the meaning of the Word and certainly if it be inclusive as to those Courts it is not exclusive to any other And Agitation in Tryals being naturally before Sentence Agitation in Tryals must extend to Preliminaries Let us now come to the Constitutions of Arch-bishop Langton in Linwood 'T is first found lib. 3. tit 29. Ne Clerici vel Mon. fo 269. ult edit Praesenti statuimus decreto c. Nec Jurisdictiones exerceant saeculares praesertim illas quibus judicium sanguinis est annexum His quoque duximus adjungendum ne scilicet judicium sanguinis in locis sacris tractetur in ecclesia videlicet vel in caemeterio Authoritate quoque Concilii districtius inhibemus ne quis Clericus beneficiatus vel in sacris ordinibus constitutus literas pro paena sanguinis infligenda scribere vel dictare praesumat vel ubi judicium sanguinis tractatur vel exercetur intersit The Sum of all which is that no Clergy-man should exercise Jurisdiction in any cause to which Sentence of Blood was annexed That no causes concerning Blood should be held in Churches or Church-yards Lastly that they should not be interessed where causes of Blood were handled nor should presume to write or dictate such Sentences to be inflicted To the same purpose are the Constit. of Othobon Ne cler advocat tit 7. p. 91. Let him look upon his own Authority out of Hostiensis Protestatio in judicio is meant of a Protestation in a Suit or Process I am sure these are Testimonies more than enough to shew the true meaning of judicium among Lawyers which is the only end for which I have produced them I shall now come to the true Translation of the Words but shall not follow Mr. Selden and after him the Author of the Letter in rendring Universae personae Regni all the dignified Clergy nor shall I allow of his Criticism of Persona or Personatus because for ought appears to me some Clergy-men who were not dignified might by License from the King purchase Lands held in Capite sicut Baroniam and thereupon think themselves exempt from this Law Having thus far cleared the way I come now to the true Translation of the Words themselves which are Archiepiscopi Episcopi Universae Personae Regni qui de Rege tenent in Capite habeant possessiones suas de Rege sicut Baroniam inde respondeant Justiciariis Ministris Regis faciant omnes consuetudines regias Et sicut ceteri Barones debent interesse Judiciis Curie Regis quousque perveniatur in Judicio ad diminutionem Membrorum vel ad Mortem In English Let the Arch-bishops and Bishops and all Persons whatsoever of the Kingdom who hold of the King in Capite have their Possessions from the King in the Nature of a Barony and by reason thereof let them answer the King's Justices and Ministers and perform all Royal Customs And in like manner as the rest of the Barons 't is their Duty to be present at all Debates Process or Proceedings in the King's Court viz. the Parliament till what time so far forth or except when in the Tryal Debate or Process the loss of Life or Member may fall out to be the Upshot or Conclusion of the Case or the matter put in Issue In plain English in all cases where the Issue or Conclusion may fall out to be ended in loss of Life or Member they are by this Law to be absent Now I hope upon Issue joyn'd if the Impeachment be of a capital Crime the conclusion or upshot may happen to be found to concern Life or Member And that this is the true Sense and Construction of the Words I dare appeal to any Man who is so far Master of the Language as not to think fit to consound Moods Tenses and Numbers at Pleasure as this Author seems to do when he reads Curiae Regis the King's Courts which being in the singular Number resers only to the King 's great Court the Parliament the King's Courts in the plural Perveniatur in the Potential Mood when such a thing may be brought to pass with pervenitur in the Indicative Mood when such a thing is brought to pass that is as he erroneously translates till Sentence comes to be given And the Authorities before-cited evidently shew that the Writers of those Ages understood the Law in that sense To which Authorities I shall now add the Opinions of Mr. Selden Sir Edward Cook Mr. Hakewell and Fitz-Stephens a Writer of good esteem with our Author Mr. Selden Tit. Hon. part 2. ch 5. p. 704. explaining these Constitutions of Clarendon saith that the meaning of this in question is That the Bishops were to sit in Judgment with the rest of the Barons in all cases save in cases of Blood Now I hope every man will admit 't is a case of Blood before Sentence and that the Barons sit in Judgment when the Matter comes to be treated of before them Sir Edward Coke cap. de Asportatis Relig. cites the Parliament of 11 R. 2. where by their own acknowledgment they went out before any Debate their presence being prohibited by the Canon-Law Mr. Hakewel in his Mod. ten pag. 84. hath these words Therefore we see the Presence of the Bishops in Parliament in respect of their Baronies is Duousque perveniatur ad diminutionem c. for so even unto our times when Question is had of the Attainder of any Peer or other in Parliament the Arch-Bishops and Bishops depart the House and make their Proctors Here you see they are to depart when Question is had c. As to their making Proctors I shall speak more fully hereafter as also shall shew that the Canon Law both by these Constitutions and before them was part of the Consuetudines Regni yet this by the way appears plainly that the desire of the Cominons in 21 R. 2. that they might make Proctors must have reference to the beginning not the end of the Tryal when the naming them was useless But let me not do him wrong for pag. 33. he touches the Sense I have given but dislikes it viz. That the last Clause is not to be understood of the Sentence but of the kind and quality of the Cause that is they are to be present in the King's Courts till they come to a Cause where Life and Member are concerned This Sense certainly is near
comprehends them all so that our Question being concerning their Rights in Parliament if this be not meant of one it will neither advantage nor prejudice me but only shew how willing they were to break through all Rubs when they could in those times of their Power and the Blindness of the People The whole Sentence by our Author abridged to his purpose is as followeth Illud coelestem exasperat iram plerisque discrimen aeternae damnationis accumulat quod quidam principes sacerdotum seniores populi licet non dictent judicia sanguinis eadem tamen tractant disputando disceptando de illis seque ideo immunes à culpa reputant quod mortis truncationis Membrorum decernentes à pronunciatione duntaxat executione paenalis sententiae se absentent Sed quid hac simulatione perniciosius est Nunquid definire discutere licitum est quod pronunciare non licet In English This doth exasperate the Wrath of Heaven that certain of the Chief Priests or Bishops and Elders of the People notwithstanding they do not dictate or pronounce Judgments of Death yet they handle them in their Disputations and discussions of the same yet notwithstanding think themselves free from Guilt because though they Decree the Sentence of Death or loss of Members they only absent themselves at the pronunciation of the Penal Sentence But what is more pernicious than this Simulation Is it lawful to discuss and determine what is unlawful to pronounce And in the whole Treatise inveighs against the general neglect of the Bishops in performing their Duty not confining himself to any place and seems a prophetical description of the practise of the Inquisition afterward brought in by S. Dominick But if it were referred to the practise of some of the Bishops and Clergy of England probably it may be meant of such as were made Secular Judges or sate with the Earls in the County Court where they perhaps were present at the discussion though not at the Sentence which was left to be pronounced by the Secular Judge till after the time of Edw. 1. See 28 Edw. 1. c. 3. where it is ordained that the Justices appointed to take Assizes in every County where they do take as they be appointed Assizes shall remain together if they be Lay-men but if one of them be a Clerk then one of the most discreet Knights of the Shire being Associate to him that is a Lay-man by our Writ shall deliver the Goals of our Shires Here we see their Power though Justices to meddle in Capital Cases was prohibited nay some Records are in the Tower that when two have been commissioned as Judges for the same Circuit the Commission of the Clerk has been restrained to common Pleas that to the Lay-man unlimited see Iani Ang. facies nova pag. 209. 210. Shall we now believe that what was prohibited to Clerks in Edward the First his Time was permitted to them in the High Court of Parliament in subsequent times I have given my Reasons why I think Seniores Populi could not comprehend the Abbots Priors Lords and Commons yet if any man will contend this was a Parliament then must Seniores Populi comprehend amongst others the Commons and their Proceedings to be in a legislative way in which the Commons could only meddle and in which we deny not the Clergy to have their part so that this doubty Precedent will no way serve our Author's Turn His second Instance to make good his Assertion is taken from the Authority of Will. Fitz-Stephen a Monk of Canterbury in MSS. in Sir Rob. Cotton's Library and some other private hands in which he relates what happened to Arch-bishop Becket in the Contest between the King and him in the great Council at Northam ton called soon after Becket's obstinate Carriage at Clarendon in which Relation among others that Author hath these Words Secunda die considentibus Episcopis comitibus Barenibus Angliae omnibus Norpluribus Roffensis Episcopus quidam alius nondum venerat Archiep. lesae majestatis coronae regiae Arguitur quia se ut supra narratum est à rege citatus ro causa Johannis to wit Iohn the Marshal neque venerat neque idonee se excusasset Archiepiscopi depulsio nullum locum habuit Allegata tamen Johannis supradicti injuria jurisdictione hujus causae propria curiae suae integritate Rex exigit judicium Archiepiscopi nulla ratio est approbata Then after much debate who should do it Judgment was pronounced by the Bishop of Winchester which ended in the Confilcation of all his personal Estate The Sum of what Fitz-Stephen saith which is cap. 10. col 2. p. 21. in that Copy I have seen is this That when the Bishops and Barons of England and many of Nor. Normandy as Mr. Selden thinks were met together the Arch-bishop is there accused of Treason because having been cited by the King in the Cause of one Iohn he appeared not nor gave in a sufficient Excuse To let pass what is materially replyed by the Author of the Letter to this Authority I shall make some Observations of my own not yet taken Notice of First That this Assembly held at Northampon was not a Parliament but a great Counsel summoned by the King soon after Becket's stubborn carriage to his Prince at Clarendon to be advised by them how to humble that proud Man where it was lawful for him to use the Counfel of any of his Subjects of Normandy or others as he thought good who certainly in an English Parliament could not be admitted amongst the natural English Secondly we hear nothing of the rest of the Clergy nor the commons but of the Bishops Earls and Barons but that the Commons had allways right to appear in Parliament is learnedly made good by Mr. Petit in his Tractate of the ancient Rights of the Commons In the next place the relation of Fitz-Stephens is not only different from the relation of other Historians but in it self is subject to many Exceptions For first it is plain he was not accused of High Treason in the case of John the Marshal as he saith which appears by the Judgment of that Council which upon the whole matter reac'hd only a Confiscation of his personal Estate which shews clearly the Accusation was not in that Case for Treason because they here punished him with a lesser Punishment than was due to Treason now 't was not in their Power to change the nature of the Crime but must have either found him guilty of Treason or have acquitted him But the Truth is there was a second Accusation by the King about the same time and in the same Place concerning Accounts to the King of Receits during the Vacancy of the Sees of some Bishopricks when he was Chancellor to which he refused to give other Answer saying He was not cited in that Cause and over and above that he was fully
discharged of all Accounts whatsoever when he was made Arch-bishop but the Heats and Animosities occasioned hereupon made him appeal to Rome which being so immediately after and contrary to his Oath at Clarendon might be called by the Name of Treason in those Days yet it appears plainly that an Appeal to Rome was not in those times look'd upon as a Capital Crime To this Purpose see Spelman's Councils Tom. 2. fol. 119. Concilium Pan-Britan apud Pipewell Congregatis illic Archiepiscopis Britanniae quibusdam Norman Galliae Hiberniae Episcopis Abat c. infra nominat praesente etiam ipso Ricardo Rege An. Dom. 1189. 1 Ric. 1. The King having given the Arch-bishoprick of York Gaufrido fratri suo quondam Lincolniae electo The Arch. of Canterb. Calumniatus est consecrationem illius prohibuit ei ne ipse ab alio quam ab eo consecrationem seu sacerdotalem ordinem susciperet Super hoc appellant ad Dom. Papam coram Rege universis Episcopis Clero Populo chartam Willielmi Regis Bastardi in qua continebatur controversia quae olim vertebatur inter Cantuariensem Eboracensem ecclesias protulit Here you see an Appeal to Rome publickly made and the Appellant not questioned for Treason or any other Misdemeanour and this done in 1 Rich. 1. who was the Son of Hen. 2. But admit this Appeal or rather Perjury in that time had been a Capital Crime his Appeal here hindred the pronouncing any Judgment So that Fitz-Stephen is mistaken in the first Point for he was neither accused nor condemned of Treason in the cause of John the Marshal Secondly he tells you he was accused of Treason because being cited he did neither appear nor competently excuse himself which must be understood to be meant by some other Proctor or Advocate for if he did not appear 't is impossible he should excuse himself any other way for it is clear he was at Northampton Ipsa die venimus Northamptoniam saith Fitz-Stephen cap. 10. co 1. That the Court sate not till the second day after their coming and he made an Appearance on the third is confessed by the same Author who a little before tells you he sent quatuor Milites to give his Answer and the King's Exception was that he did not answer in his proper Person which certainly by Law he was not obliged to do so that here was but a Contempt of one day however they were resolved to proceed for the Arch-bishops Depulsio or answer for himself took not place for so I take the meaning of depulsio to be Archiepiscopi ratio nulla est habita Whether you take ratio for an Account which probably he might give as to 300 l. prerended to be due to John the Marshal or in any other Sense 't was not allowed Lastly you have these words Archiepiscopus autem quia sententiae vel recordationi Curia Regis non licet contradicere sustinuit consilio Episcoporum ad Acta ad mitigandum honorandum Regem solenni manuum ipsius missione quasi concessionis Judicii uti moris est ibi The Archbishop by the Counsel of the other Bishops because he might not contradict the Sentence and memorial of the Kings court submitted to their Acts to the end that by his Submission he might Honour the King and mitigate his Anger and yielded to the Judgment and put in for his Sureties all the Bishops except London of which notice was taken Can any thing now be clearer than this that he both appeared submitted to the Judgment and put in Sureties to perform it and that here could not be any formal accusation of Treason whatsoever the Counsellors might dispute among themselvs So that Fitz-Stephen's Relation as to this matter is not only contrary to the Judgment of the Court which condemned him not for Treason and contradictory to himself who making the Relation as an Historian of what was done in that case where himself was present must be supposed to write what in truth was the matter of Fact and not what was the Opinion or Discourse of others except he had told us so But this proud Prelate being as the King thought not sufficiently humbled by the Judgment aforesaid nor by many other Affronts put upon him by the King's Officers a new Crime as I touched before is found out against him for Accounts to the value of 3000 Marks to which he is required to answer and to which saith our Questionist he gave a dilatory Answer so that the King requires him to stand to the Judgment of the Court But the Answer he gave was this That the King knew well enough that before his Election to the See of Canterbury he was discharged and how the Prince the Barons of the Exchequer and Sir Robert Lucy Chief Justice gave him a Discharge for all Accounts and secular Receipts from the King and so free and clear was chosen to the See and would plead the same no more Was this now a dilatory Answer and not a clear Discharge What doth any Accountant in the Exchequer do more Neither could the Court expect being cited upon another Business he should bring his Discharge in his Pocket But what if this Accusation had been true Was this Treason If every Cheater had been a Traytor the King would have had enow to hang But this Storm went higher for Becket finding himself over-power'd by the King's Party and menacing Words from them comes in his Archiepiscopal Robes with a Cross in his hand and appeals to Rome for which he was blamed and sharply rebuked by his old Enemy the Arch-bishop of York and as Hoveden saith by London and others But by his Appeal he avoided all Sentences could be pronounced against him yet left his Enemies and the King much incensed against him Gervase of Canterbury tells you col 1392. that the King sitting upon his Throne it seems in a hurry for the Words are euntes discernite said going forth Consider what this perjured and contumacious Traytor ought to suffer Itur judicatur They went out and gave their Opinion for this could be no legal Judgment because first it was out of the place where the Council sate and his Appeal prevented all farther Proceedings as it was then held This is the Sum of the Story taken out of Daniel's History upon the Year 1164. as he saith particularly delivered according to the Writers of those Times who those were he tells you in his Preface Hoveden Giraldus Cambrensis Mat. Paris Mat. Westm. Rishanger and others By this Relation you may see the Credit of this grave MSS. Author who hath knit together so many Mistakes and different from the Relation of others of or near the same time But the Bishop is now gone though before his going the King expostulates the matter with him to whom he answered That he was summoned in the Cause of John the Marshal and would answer to no other
Canons when 't is for our Advantage to break them I might now proceed to the Examination of his Iast Head How far the Canon Law is at this day binding But because I would not leave any thing untaken notice of he thinks fit to make use of for the strengthening his Cause I shall speak something to what he farther urgeth He tells you out of Knighton That this Parliament was called Parliamentum sine Misericordiâ and that many Circumstances concurred which might make the Lords willing to admit of their Protestation because their business might proceed better against the King's Ministers He need not have urged Inducements to perswade the Lords to admit of their Protestation except he had first shewed they had Power to have refused it But by this Inducement he insinuates that the Bishops would probably have obstructed Justice against those wicked Ministers about the King What the Accusation was for which some of them were executed I shall let you seek in the Historians of those times being unwilling to rake into that Puddle any deeper I shall therefore leave this Parliament and the mysterious Canons as our Author well calls them and come to the Anti-Parliament to this held in 21 R. 2. where as he saith the King had a Mind to undoe what was done in the Parliament in 11 R. 2. which Intention this Author saith he had kept in his Mind ten Years by being willing to let the Bishops be absent in 11. that he might have that pretence to Question in this Anti-Parliament the things then done An undecent Charge he lays upon the King if it be well considered The Declaration by help of the Bishops that the King's Pardon granted in Parliament in 11. was revocable by the King was the Labour of his Ministers in 〈◊〉 which those Ministers prevailed in 〈◊〉 Measure but their Actions with 〈◊〉 â—…cceeding Murther of the D. of Gloâ—… the King's Uncle bred such a Jealousie and Distrust between the King and his People that I may call it the first Stone which left not rolling till it ended in the Ruine of that poor Prince who continued not King much more than a Year after and was soon after the Deprivation of his Crown deprived of his Life also What Art was used to make that Parliament subservient to their ends I need not tell you One of the first Attempts was what I touched before to make Pardons granted by the King in Parliament revocable at his Pleasure in this the Clergy were very instrumental After this the Commons come to do their Parts and they represent that divers Judgments had been undone heretofore for that the Clergy were not there present and therefore pray they might appoint some common Proctor with sufficient Authority to that Purpose From hence he infers two things First That the Commons thought their Presence necessary because Judgments had been undone for want of it Therefore their Concurrence in Judgment was thought necessary to make a Judgment valid Secondly That they should therefore make a common Proctor This is strange Logick Their Presence was thought necessary and Judgments undone for want of it therefore they ought to be present I think ought to have been the Consequent but the Commons pray that in that respect they should make a Proctor I should think now the true Inference ought to have been The Bishops and Clergy ought not to be personally present in Cases of Blood yet because it is fit they should be represented at least in some Cases let them nominate a common Proctor to be in their stead where their Concurrence is necessary This is Sense the other is contradictory 'T is evident by this Petition of the Commons that matter of Blood was to be treated of for there needed no Proctor for any other use since themselves might have been present And I think it very clear by the Year-book in 10 E. 4. that when Issue was once joyned 't was their Duty to absent themselves For that Book is that the Peer questioned may plead not guilty and then the Bishops to depart so that it is plain they were not to vote after Issue joyned in matters of Blood So Hakewell in his Modus Tenend pag. 84. before cited saith That to our days when Question is had of the Attainder of any Peer the Bishops are to depart Now I take the Law to be all one what â—…ue is joyned in a Capital Accusation so as there be any upon which the Court may proceed to Famination of the Cause and to Judgment accordingly As to our purpose in the case of the 〈◊〉 of Danby he pleads the King's Pardon the King's Counsel or the Commons demur The matter then in Issue upon the Demurrer is whether the Pardon is good in Law upon which the Bishops according to 10 E. 4. are to go out because if the Pardon be found invalid then must Sentence of Death be pronounced against the Criminal for I take the Law to be That the pleading a Pardon in Bar upon an Endictment or Impeachment is a Confession that all the matters contain'd in the Endictment or Impeachment are true and he shall never be admitted to plead Not Guilty afterward But this by the way Our Question is about the Commons Petition that they would make a Proctor which being in matter of Blood the Author of the Letter saith was the only time whether this was Error temporis as one saith the Error of that time or an inconsiderate rash Desire of the Commons as another is not necessary to enquire for it doth not appear that any Capital Judgments had been reversed by reason of their Absence so that their desire fails in the ground of it if they meant of Capital ones for the first Judgment against the Spencers was affirmed in 1 Ed. 3. and the Reversal made 15 Ed. 2. was made null so that the Commons it seems were ignorant in that and might be unadvised in the rest as they sometime have been Beside if he consult Sir Edward Coke in his 2 Instit. cap. de Asportatis religiosor pag. 586. he doth well excuse the Commons in shewing that the Bishops were present at the Charge against the Spencers in 1 Ed. 2. so that the Commons might not know how far the Bishops were conusant of the thing and looking only on the out-side were ignorant of the Act in 1 E. 3. for the Discourser saith there were no more No replyes the Grand Questionist not in his Study but the Commons might know of more for we have not all the Rolls What then This at best is but a Surmise and the two Judgments against the two Spencers were enough to make their Allegation true that divers Judgments had been reversed for that cause though it be not to excuse their Ignorance in not knowing that the first Judgment against them was revived by the Statute of 1 Ed. 3. And it seems strange to me that he that had so much
for he cannot but know out late King chose rather to loose his Life than resign his Power that he never had quiet Possession but a Prince always strugling against him nor had he the acceptance of the People or any thing but force to buoy him up which after his Death fail'd in his next Descendent By what I have said it may appear to any equal Judge that the Laws made 1 Henry 4. were good notwithstanding his pretended Usurpation And as to the thing it self that the Bishops Absence in cases of Blood doth not make a Judgment given void appears plainly by the Case of the Earl of Salisbury in 2 H. 5. who petitions that a Judgment given against the Father might be reversed and assigns for Error that the Bishops who were Peers of the Realm were not present and upon full hearing and debate it was adjudged no Error Now I appeal to this Author whither he can think that my Lord and his Counsel were so stupid as not to urge what they could think of for the advantage of the Earl and the Clergy for whatsoever other faults might be laid to the charge of his Parent the cause appears to be turn'd upon that hinge by all this we may well conclude that the Lords in that Parliament did not hold the Bishops such Peers as ought to be allowed Judges concerning the Life and Death of Noble-men This Judgment our Author hath not thought fit to take notice of which might be equivalent to error temporis for it was either ignorantia or neglectus rei But he tells you Edward the fourth repealed all again in which he is mistaken for Edward the fourth repealed nothing but what concerned the Title between York and Lancaster with some Charters to others I come now to his third head or point Whether supposing that the Bishops absented as he contends only upon the account of the Canon-Law in the times of Popery whether those Laws do continue in force now since the Reformation he thinks they do not In this I shall be very short and against his Reasons which are rather Surmises than other I shall return direct Authorities of Judges and Lawyers in point First he saith the Canon-Law was grounded upon a superstitious fancy that to be present in Cases of Blood brought upon them Irregularity and hath there a large Digression upon the Unreasonableness of the Canon-Law in many particulars I shall easily yield that many of the Rules brought upon the Church by the Papacy are full of Hypocrisie and self-ends but do not think that our Bishops did first forbear from bloody Tryals about Lanfranks time as if this Canon had been unknown in England till then almost 700 years after the first Council of Toledo for Sir Henry Spelman reckons that Canon to be Anno Christi 400. and William the first came in Anno 1066. And in this first Council this Canon is cited but it is more reasonably referred to the eleventh Council of Toledo and the sixth Canon which expresly forbids their medling in Blood 't will yet be about 500 years before Williams Time It is therefore more probable that their forbearance in those Cases proceeded not from any thing brought in by Laufrank but was received here long before from their obedience to the Apostolick Canons which did not only forbid their medling in Blood but in all secular Employments and were carefully observed till Constantine's time who flourished in the year of Christ 323. 'T is likely enough that the Liberty then taken by the Clergy was restrained in Spain by that Council And if our Author please to observe it till they came to be corrupted by Covetousness and Ambition their chiefest Employment was to make Peace between their Neighbours as Chancellors and Arbitrators rather than as Lawyers and Judges In earnest whoever shall consider the intricacy of the Laws of England as they are called the Common-Law will rather believe when they sate as Chief Justices if ever they did so their Seats were among others better versed in the Common Laws than themselves and they sate rather to direct what was equal according to the rules of Mercy than according to the rigorous balance of Justice This certainly was their Office when they sate with the Earl in the County-Court Mr. Lambert in his Laws of Edgar cap. 5. hath these words Celeberrimus autem ex omni satrapiâ conventus bis quotannis agitor cui quidem illius diocesis Episcopus Aldermannus intersunto quorum alter jura divina alter jura humana populum edoceto Here you see the Bishops Office was only to teach the People the Divine Law as the Earl or Alderman did those of the Land His next Suggestion is rather a Conjecture than a Proof to wit that this Canon was never received contrary to himself before or that if it were received it was in diminution of the King's Prerogative and so repealed by the Statute of 25 H. 8. cap. 19. He might as well have said That all the Ecclesiastical Laws as of Tithes Marriages probate of Wills and other Faculties now exercised in the Ecclesiastical Courts are against the King's Prerogative and therefore void What Success an Attempt of that Nature lately had he may easily call to mind But let me bring into his Remembrance what the Statute made in the same Parliament 25 H. 8. cap. 21. hath in the Preamble of it Whereas his Majesties Realm recognizeth no Superiour under God but only his Majesty hath been and is free from Subjection to any mans Laws but only such as have been devised made and ordained within this Realm for the Weal of the same or to such others as by the Sufferance of the King and his Progenitors the People of this Realm have taken at their free Liberty by their own Consent to be used among them and have bound themselves by long Custom to the observance of the same not as to the observance of the Laws of any foreign Prince Potentate or Prelate but as the ancient and accustomed Laws of the same by the said Sufference Consents and Customs and none otherwise We see here the Sense of the whole Parliament That such Laws as had been used and accustomed should be look'd upon as the Laws of the Kingdom and not of any foreign Prince or Prelate Now let him tell me what Laws were common to us with any foreign Prelate except the Ecclesiastical and Canon-Law which having been here used are acknowledged a part of the Laws of the Land by Usage and Sufferance of the People So that we have now a whole Parliament that they did not look upon these as against the Kings Prerogative and so null as this Author would have it but fully confirmed as part of the English Law Agreeable with this is my Lord Coke in Cawdrey's Case lib. 5. 32. b. It is says he Resolved and enacted by authority of Parliament that all Canons Constitutions Ordinances and Synodals
and other Lords who were suspected to be of the Confederacy with the said Henry Hotspur alias Percy This was the work of Friday the 18th of February on Saturday the 19th the Commons give Thanks to the Lords Spiritual and Temporal for the rightful Judgment they had given as Peers of Parliament 5 H. 4 from N. 12 to N. 17. This is the whole Case as to Father and Son Now whether the Bishops were present at all these Proceedings and how far is the Question The Grand Questionist contends they were present at the Proceedings both against the Father and the Son at that against the Son from the word full Parliament which he seemeth to infer must include the Bishops and at that against the Father from the Thanks made by the House of Commons the next day after the acquittal of the Earl First as to the Son It appears plainly by the Historians of those times that he was slain in the fourth Year of the King in the life-time of the Father who soon after broke out into Rebellion so that at the time of Henry's Death he was only a Commoner and consequently not to receive any Judgment in the Lord's House alone nor could he be made a Traitor otherwise than by Act of Parliament so that the word full Parliament must either refer to some particular Act of Parliament made in his Case in which the Bishops might be present and the Commons concur or else the Proceedings were wholly irregular and contrary to their own Agreement in 4 E. 3. Now from an illegal Act no Right can be concluded As to the Earl himself we find him suddenly after in open Rebellion defeated and escaped into Scotland with Lord Bardolf and convicted of Treason by the Temporal Lords for not appearing upon Summons and all this within two Years after Now can it be reasonable to think that the Bishops were present at the acquittal of this very Lord in 5 H. 4. who were not present in 7 H. 4. which was but two Years after nor were present at a like Case in 2 H. 4. N. 30. against the Earl of Holland and others which was not three Years before Neither can any weight be laid upon the Thanks of the House of Commons which was only matter of Complement and performed at another time when the House was assembled upon other matters but seeing them there might extend their Thanks to them also who though they could not contribute did nothing to hinder the Clemency of the Temporal Lords towards the Earl besides at the same time it was accorded by the King and Lords upon the Desire of the Commons that certain ill Officers about the King should be discharged in which the Bishops might be Instrumental and very well deserve the Thanks of the Commons at which Desire of the Commons they might assist and be absent at the rest The Precedent of Iohn Lord Talbot will not avail him he exhibited an Accusation against the Earl of Ormond for certain Treasons by him committed this Accusation was in the Marshalsea before the Earl of Bedford Constable of England The King to put an end to this matter doth by Act of Parliament make an Abolition and Discharge of the said Accusation and Discovery The words are That the King by the Advice and Assent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal and the Commons made an Abolition of the said Detection Whoever denied the Bishops Consent in a Legislative way and had it been otherwise the Commons could not have been I think regularly concerned 2. H. 6. N. 9. The Precedent of the Duke of Suffolk in 28 H. 6. I thought to have passed over being a Case as irregular in the Proceedings as unjust in those that put to death that unfortunate Man Much Art was used by the Court to have preserved him from the Envy of the People A Parliament assembled at Westminster after dismissed into London then prorogued to Leicester that dissolved and another called at Westminister in which the Duke appeared which exasperated the Commons against him But upon the whole Record it appears that no Issue was joyned for after Articles exhibited by the Commons and his denial of them March 14 at the least of the eight first and giving some Answers to others on the 17 th he was sent for again and the Chancellour acquainted him that he had not put himself upon his Peerage and now asketh him how he would be tried who instead of pleading put himself upon the King's Order who caused him to be banished for five Years By all this it appears here were no judicial Proceedings which could not be before Issue joyned so that although the Bishops were present at the reading of the Articles yet this can be no Precedent to entitle them to be present in judicial Proceedings in Capital Causes for here were none at all in this Case and till Issue joyned the Bishops are not bound to withdraw Neither ought it to seem strange that the Viscount Beaumont should make Protestation in the name of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal against these Proceedings which they finding to be extra-judicial in very many Particulars they did not know I mean the Bishops as well as some of the Lords what Construction might be made to their Prejudice for sometimes they met in one place sometimes in another and not always in the Parliament-House to consult of this Business Besides many things pass sub silentio which being questioned would not have been allowed these Observations being added to what hath been said by the Author of the Letter seems to me a full Answer to this Precedent in which the Protestatio is only Protestatio facti not Iuris I have thus put an end to the Examination of this third Chapter and fully considered all his Arguments and Precedents and come now to a view of his fourth and last Chapter CHAP. IV. IN this Chapter our Author hath employed all his Art to assert the Peerage of the Bishops and that they make a third Estate in Parliament in what sense they are called Peers as also that the entire Clergy met in Convocation make a third Estate I have largely shewed before and shall not now repeat I admit they are sometimes called Lords Spiritual tho not so before Rich. II. but Prelates or the like Peers of the Realm Peers in Parliament If by that Appellation you would make them Equals to the Nobilitas Major I think they never were yet have they many Privtledges in respect of their Seats and Episcopal Dignity in the Lords House and by reason of their most honourable Profession have all of them Precedence to Barons I admit also that the Clergy is really a third Estate and that the Bishops in respect that they are the Head of the Clergy may sometimes in ordinary Discourse be called so but are in truth never so exclusively to the rest of the Clergy they all making but one Body or third Estate fully represented
other Cases Now this very Question seems to me an over-ruling ours for if it were then a Question whether they might be of a Committee in Cases of Blood where the Judges were often joyned with the Lords it can be no doubt but that they ought not to be admitted to give their Votes as Judges in the like Cases in their Persons REFLECTIONS UPON Antidotum Britannicum AND Mr. Hunt's late Book and Post-script As far as concerns the Controversy between Doctor Brady and the Authorof Jani Anglorum facies nova and of Jus Anglorum ab Antiquo London Printed Anno 1682. CHAP. I. The true and essential Difference between the General Council of the Kingdom and the Curia Regis maintained against Dr. Brady Mr. W. and Mr. Hunt with a short Account of some Reasons why Mr. Hunt might have spared his Censures upon them who apply themselves to the Study of Antiquities SInce Dr. Brady received a Reply two of my Brethren of the Gown Mr. W. and Mr. Hunt both of Greys-Inn have appeared in print in behalf of the King's Tenants in Capite and will needs have it that these ingrost the Right of coming to Parliament as one calls it or the Magnum Concilium as the other till 49 of Hen. 3. One professes that he never read what has been wrote upon this Subject either by Mr. Petyt or me The other slights it all as a Dispute not worth the Cost and Pains spent about it and grants many of Dr. Brady's Hypotheses but denies his Consequences and so allows him to be a good Antiquary but an ill Logician That there was a Curia Regis or Common Council of the Tenants in Chief such especially as held of the King by Knights Service distinct from the Great Council of the Nation or Parliament In which Curia the King's Tenants granted to the King Auxilia Aids and did act many things in relation to their Tenures Both agree with me directly against Dr. Brady who will have it that all the King's Tenants by Knights Service never met in any Council or Court but thereby it became the General Council of the Nation or Parliament In which since he is opposed by these two learned Authors agreeing with me they have given so much Credit to my Notion that they have prevented that further trouble which I might have given the inquisitive World upon that point If I can free my self from the force of these Gentlemens Arguments or Objections upon those things wherein I differ from them I think I need not fear the empty Thunder of Men of other Professions but may look upon my Notions as sufficiently established Both Mr. W. and Mr. Hunt are Men of much longer standing and greater natural and acquired Parts then I can pretend to yet if I have the good fortune to fall into the Paths of ancient Truth no modern Authorities ought to beat me out of them They both will have it that the Tenants in Chief were the only Members of the Curia Regis which was held for Matters within the King 's ordinary Power and of the Magnum Concilium or Parliament where the extraordinary Power was exercised Against them both before I examine their supposed grounds from Authority this obvious Objection in reason may be urged If all the Tenants in Capite by Knights Service were obliged to attend in the Curiâ either by virtue of their Tenure as one takes it or of general Summons as the other and the consent of none but such Tenants were requisite for passing of Laws in Parliament what reason can be assigned why Laws might not have been made in the Curia and so that have become a Parliament when ever the King pleased to declare it so Can a more particular Summons and notice of Arduous Affairs which is Mr. Hunt's Notion lay a greater Obligation upon them to be present who however were bound to come And if they were bound to come can Absence be reasonably pleaded to free any from the Obligation of what was then agreed on Indeed Dr. Brady who will have it that every full Confluence of the Tenants in Chief by Knights Service to Counsel was a General Council of the Nation supposes that even before King John's Charter and while he thinks that they were to come to Parliament ex More without Summons if but a few appeared it was no General Council which is an absurd Supposal unless there was before that a Law in being that they should not act without a certain number as supposing that forty were to make a full House as now 't is said to be with the Commons for otherwise they who did appear did according to the general Rule of making Laws bind them who were absent through their own default But if we consider how contrary it was to the Usage of those Times to make Laws or insert Clauses or Words idle or unnecessary we shall not easily believe that they would according to Mr. Hunt's Supposal have made Provision for the particular summoning of those for arduous Affairs who were obliged to attend at the Council without such Summons Indeed I am aware that Dr. Brady hath charged me with putting such a sense upon King John's Charter as would imply a needless Provision The Doctor tells us that by King John's Charter the Cause of Summons was to be exprest and from thence he would infer that it was a Great Council there intended for saith he such Provision were needless if there had been but one Cause for which they were to be summoned which he urges as the Consequence of my interpreting that Summons there provided for to have been only for raising such Aids in the Curia as could be imposed upon the King 's immediate Tenants and none else Now admit that this had been to a Parliament and had taken in all manner of Charges to be laid upon the Subject if the raising of Taxes were the only work of a Parliament the providing that they should have notice when a Tax had been required would have been as impertinent and if the Parliament had any other Power this Provision had been as defective as he supposes 't was according to my rendring superfluous For that Summons mentioned in King John's Charter is restrained and limited to the granting of Aids but there is not one word or syllable of making or enacting Laws which is the main business of Parliaments and therefore this must be intended of some Inferiour Counsel and not of the General Council of the Kingdom But if the Charter be taken to be meant only of raising such Aids as lay upon none but the King's Tenants if those Aids branch themselves into Escuage and Tallage here were two Causes of Summons as the one or the other was required or if only such Aid as Escuage was within the Provision still the Cause or the Occasion of raising the Escuage might be different and therefore the cause of Summons more than
casu fieri consuevit Teste Rege apud Lancetost 18. die Octobris 34. FINIS ERRATA PAge 113. line 3. in Marg. read true way P. 117. l. 18. r. Bannerets Ib. l. 21. r. Banneret P. 122. l. 2. r. St. P. 144. l. 8. r. ingenuously So P. 145. l. 31. P. 160. l. 5 after the Word Barony add in the Margine viz. Ecclesiastical Persons P. 174. or 274. T l. 18. r. done P. 204. V l. 2. r. Counsel So l. 11. Ib. P. 212. X l. 22. r. permixtim P. 217. X l. 26. r. de tout le c. P. 220. l. 6. r. taken Other Literal Mistakes the Reader is desired to correct with his Pen. A TABLE of the Principal CONTENTS The Number of the Page being often mistaken through the Printers false counting to one another the Reader is desired where the Figures are wrong to observe the Letter which begins the Sheet A Page Abby of Molross O 206 207 Absence of the Bishops not merely from the Canon-Law 84 N 181 182 Adam de Orlton's Case R 267 T 180 Agitare Judicium Sanguinis prohibited H 101 and N 157 183 Allusion made by the Questionist not solid 165 Appeal to Rome no capital Crime antiently M 173 Appeal of Earl Godwin Q 227 Appeals in Trial V 191 192 193 Appellation ought to be governed by the Right S 278 Apostles their Rule p. 89 how far their Practice to be urged for Example now 133 Apostolick Canons against Clergy-Men their medling in Secular Affairs P 135 216 Arch-bishop Stratford's Case T 282 283 284 Arundel Earl his Case O 208 Assemby at Northampton no Parliament p. 170 171 172. Matters carried there in great Heat and no Iudgment of Treason given M 172 173 Attainders what they are 9 10 Augustine St. his Opinion 94 95 B. BArons how made enobled in Blood and how made 107 to 120 Barons by Blood and by Tenure different 78 118 119 120 Barones Majores who 78 Z 245 246 Barones Minores who 7 8 Barons Peer who 21 107 117 Barones Regis who 107 Z 247 to 250 Barones Regni who ibid. Baronagium and how comprehensive 107 P 202 203 Y 226 S 278 Becket not impeached of Treason from 65 to 70 and from 172 to N 180 Berkeley Sir Tho. his Case 28 29 V 196 Blesensis his Words marked 97 98 125 167 168 R 261 Bishops whether they sit in Parliament by vertue of any Baronies p. 106 108 and how 122 c. T 174 or 274 Bishops not Barons 77 108 19 123 124 125 Bishops how they sate with the Earls 91 92 93 145 P 217 Bishops Service and Tenure a Burthen 106 124 125 Their Tenure offects not their Persons 77 Bishops if a third Estate not capable to try a Peer 128 Bishops the form of their Writs no Argument of their Power 86 129 130 when present always exprest that they were 36 Bishops medling in Secular Affairs forbidden 129 135 P 216. Their Opposition to the King at Clarendon and from what Cause 141 Bishops Power clipt at Clarendon 99 O 144 when to go away in Criminal Cases 161 196 197 even in Acts of Parliament R 265 Bishops Absence not merely from the Canons 8 84 N 181 182 183 190 N 193 O Bishops Protestation p. 5 6 7 translated and explained 41 42 and N 185 to 194 Bishops not reckoned Nobles T 184 or 284 not called Lords till the time of Rich. II. 108 Bishop of Norwich his Case 40 Bishop of Carlile tried by a common Iury T 279 so Bishop of Ely 278 ibid. Bishops Absence no Error 47 Bishops had no Right to be present in the Debate and handling matters of Blood 143 Bishops not comprehended under the name of Peers or Grands if put after Earls and Barons 14 18 to 25 32 Bishops if others named always named where they are present 24 29 32 36 and that before others R 261 Bishops not Peers to Temporal Lords 71 to 99 S 280 Bishops sit in respect of Temporal Possessions 83 yet in the quality of Spiritual Persons T 174 or 274 and S 289 Bishops cannot sit in a double Capacity S 288 289 T 174 Bishops contended to be tried by their own Order T 181 or 281 whence their pretence of Immunity proceeded 153 Bishops to be tried by common Iuries T 277 to 282 Bishops their Equivocation 141 Bishops Messengers of Peace V 197 Bishops chief Employment to make Peace in civil Affairs antiently Counsellours not Iudges p. 89 91 their refusing to give Advice about keeping the Peace 30 31 266 and R 269 Bishops but part of a third Estate 80 to 85 and 126 127 137 S 290 Bishops in France never sit in that Chamber of Parliament which tries Capital Cases 90 Bishops never absent not prov'd Q 228 Bishops no where allowed to sit Inquisitors of Blood V 198 Bishops not summoned to Parliament several times Q 238 Bishops a Question whether they might be even of a Committee in matters of Blood V 199 Boeges de Bayon's Case 25 26 Brady Dr. his Assertions and Fancies condemned Pref. to the 2d Part and p. 189 in Marg. V X A a 204 205 224 227 Burroughs and Burgesses Z 237 238 C. CAmbridg Earl 50 Canons forbidding of Clergy-men to meddle in Capital Causes still in force 87 164 and P 217 to 222 Canons concerning Blood as anciently in England as the Conquest and part of the common Law N 181 182 Capitalis Justiciarius Angliae what Office 137 138 Capitalia placita what Q. 229 230 231 Chancellour when no Peer how tried T 285 286 Charter of King John the Author's Interpretation of it asserted against Dr. Brady X 206 207 against Mr. Hunt Z 237 to 242 Clarendon the meeting there a Parliament 139 Clarendon and the Parliament there considered 99 100 142 Clarendon Earl his Arguments against the pretended Conquest A a 260 to 263 Chivaler who B b 284 Clergy subjected to Baron-Service 112 140 Clergy their Power in Primitive-times 89 their Power in other Nations 90 Clerus never taken for the Bishops alone 126 Commons and Commonalty of the Kingdom where Records and Histories manifestly shew their Presence at Parliament before 49 Hen. 3â—… X 211 to Y 22â—… Commons their Vote in Danby's Case O 98 Commons sometimes meant by Grands R 270 S 279 226 3d Part anciently had their share in Judicature R 266 267 268 Commons always Members of Parliament 172 O 202 sâ—… together with the Lords in the times of Hen. I and King Stephen X 212 and long afterwards O 202 203 204 Mr. W's Grounds for the Belief that they had no Right to come to Parliament till 49 H. 3. answered and turned against him X 210 to Y 227 so Mr. Hunt's p. 221 222 223 Y 235 and to A a 268 Commons their Petition 21 R. 2. p. 11. and O 195 196 Community of Names no Argument of Right S 278 Concordia 4 E. 3. 27 R 263 Conquest disclaimed by William the first 139 A a 260 no Conquest