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A10967 An historical dialogue touching antichrist and poperie, drawen and published for the common benefit and comfort of our church in these dangerous daies, & against the desperate attemptes of the vowed aduersaries of Iesus Christ, his gospell, and this florishing state. by Thomas Rogers. Allowed by auctoritie. Rogers, Thomas, d. 1616. 1589 (1589) STC 21237; ESTC S112075 54,518 126

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Duke of Guize then by the King of Spaine and the inuasion to be sometime vpon Ireland sometime vpon England there somewhile in Sussex at an other time in the North partes T. This declareth an horrible conspiracie and proanes in Princes and Papistes to annoy hir Maiestie and this land But why accordīg to their desire do they not effect their wicked and mischieuous purposes Z. It was some twentie yeare agoe by F. Pais a publique reader of diuinitie at Rome in the praesence of 300. scholars not so few said that the Popes goodwil to this inuasion is tried and knowen and his purse readie but either feare withdraweth or power forbiddeth K. Philip that he dare not venter to bring his armie of Soldiers into England That which father Pais said of the Pope and King of Spaine do I say of them the rest of our aduersaries also their malice is well knowen and their monie redie for this enterprice but they did not hetherto inuade vs not because they would not but for that they durst not their cause being naught their courages did faile them T. So God taketh away their stomackes manie times which band themselues to the ouerthrow of his truth Z. Many-times indeed hee doth so though not alwaies for sometimes hee giueth thē the raines to proceed at their pleasure as he did Pharao the King of Spaine to their greater ouerthrow in th' end T. What was now his preparation at the last Z. Most wōderful whether you respect his nauies vpon the sea or his armies for land his power was so exceeding great as a mightier praeparation was neuer knowen in former times to be made against any Turkes or Sarasins than hee made against Christians The nomber of his ships was great the variety strāge the persons not onely verie manie for multitude but also for state of great reputation so puissant à power and such if either the nōber of natural Spaniards or the qualitye of the viagers be considered as the like came neuer out of Spaine with anye King or without so mightie à power so provided with all Martial furniture for sixe monethes as might haue amazed the greatest Monarch in the world to haue incountred with the same T. What might be the cause of this so rare an enterprise Z. The cause praetended was religiō or to returne vnto the pope his church à great nomber of contrite soules as Piementellie said it was in the King of Spaine à desire of reuenge for the supposed iniuries receaued at the hands of the most valiant and thrice renowned Knight Sir Francis Drake forgetting vtterlie the infinite and grieuous iniuries that himself from time to time hath offered to hir Maiestie by abusing hir subiectes and Embassadors and by inuading hir realme of Ireland and harboring of arrant traitors both to God hir crown But the true cause indeed we shall find to be an Ambitious desire in K. Philip of Spaine to tyrannize in hir Highnes dominions as he doth ouer the Indies Portugals and them of Netherland T. If the ground was so ill the ende could neuer be good Z. Surely th' end was none other but to conquer the whole Realme to remooue our most gratious Soueraigne from the Crowne and regal dignitie to set vp some English or other Catholique for King to bring both our bodies into the Spanish thraldome worser then death it selfe and our soules into the hellish bondage of the Romaine Antichrist Chap. 11. Of the detestable pride in the Spaniards and iust account they made to subdue vs all TIMOTHIE No doubt their praeparation being so great vnlesse which is vncredible they haue left that vice for which they are notoriouslie infamous the pride of the Spaniards could not be litle ZELOTES Their pride was so excessiue as they termed their armie The inuincible armie and our nauie in disdaine Fisherboates They iudged their Fleete so mighty as had there not bin so many shippes by twentie as they had they could easily haue praeuailed ouer vs They thought either that we durst not encounter with them or if wee did we should presentlie be ouercome T. I haue read I well remember foure yeeres afore the appearing of this Fleete that Bar. Mendoza the Spanish Embassader did say vnto Throckmorton the traitor that we should as easilie be ouerthrowen by the spanish power as assailed Z. And about 13. yeares afore that also it was deliuered by Doctor Storie if the King of Spaine would but go about England with his Nauie as Ioshua with his armie went about Ierico that hee should be sure to finde as good successe heere as Ioshua did there T. Some said that a maid called the holy maide of Lisborne the yeare last immediatly past afore the comming of the Fleete did prophesie that the Spaniardes should no soner approach the coast of England but the hartes of Englishmen should faile them and the Spaniardes obtaine the victorie Z. Some say likewise they plaid at dice for our noblemen and knightes and had after a sort quartered the whole Realme as a praie among them-selues T. Others besides deliuer that in one of Don Pedro de Valdez ensignes there was figured a Sunne and a Moone with a Motto in Spanish to this effect Yesterdaie the full but to day the wane not obscurelie therby insinuating the good successe which they promised vnto them-selues by our vtter ouerouerthrow Z. The embroidered garmentes also with strange emblems and the loftie verses diuulged by their fauorites at Colein manifested vnto the opē wide world the iust accompt that both themselues and their adherentes did make to preuaile to ouer-run the whole realme and to supplant the religion the present state Chap. 12. 1 The dreadfull doun-fall of the ambitious proud Spaniardes 2. Gods heauie curse vpon the whole armie and Armado of the Catholikes 3. with the sundrie effectes ensuing thereupon in the mindes of many men TIMOTHIE But pride goeth afore destruction and an hie minde afore the fal said Salomon the wisest among princes ZELOTES That which that worthie Prince deliuered by our experiēce we know to haue betide that proud Antichristian armie of papistes For he that ruleth in the heauens did laugh them to scorne the God of Gods had them in derision and brought euen in the publique view of th' uniuersall world most horrible confusion vpon them all T. Howe declare Z. The whole power of Spaine cōsisted of three partes of the prince of Parmaes forces of one hūdred sail of ships and fortie within two thousand men of a new supplie of fourescore ships of the grand Armado of eight score ships and thirtie and two thousand fighting men In al of ships three hundred fourtie of men not so few as an hundred thousand T. What of that Z. Consider
For so the popes Boniface the eight and Clement the 5 would haue it be T. Then are they of that auctoritie by no right and warrant from God his word Z. By none at all neither yet by any law besides the consideration whereof hath moued some as Cyno-pistoriensis and Duarenus excellent Ciuilians by publike writings to inueigh against that vsurped power and the most part of Lawiers saith Duarenus that are of any accompt are of the same iudgement yea saith the same Duarenus I am perswaded there is none of the sounder learneder sort that can like of this enterprise of Boniface T. Then not onely Gods word but also the best Ciuilians in the vniuersall world do vtterlie condemne this soueraigntie in the Pope of Rome as hauing no strength of reason to vphold itselfe withall which may not à litle strengthen vs that abhorre this Antichristian pride power and supremacie of the Pope Z. Besides they may worke in our mindes à great and vtter detestation of those horrible effectes proceding from th' infinite power of this papall primacie T Name some of them Z. As if Kinges and Emperours be of à contrarie mind vnto the pope in matters of Religion that he may depriue them of their Roialties and quite discharge their subiectes from obeying thē any more T. Publish they such thinges of the Pope Z. That is their doctrine For saith Maioranus The pope of Rome by that fulnes of power which hee hath ouer all Christian Princes he may for the crime of haeresie depriue haereticall Kinges Emperors of their Empires yea and in temporal thinges quite set free the christian people from obedience and subiection with whom agree of our countrie but of à contrarie religion vnto vs Sanders Bristow with him that wrote that infamous Libel against the Christian iustice executed at this praesent in this realme of England T. This doctrine is like the doctrine neither of sainct Paul who was so farre from putting such vngodly thoughts into the peoples mind that from God he commaunded that supplications should be made for all men euen for Kinges which then were idolaters nor of sainct Peter who also said Submit your selues vnto all manner ordinance of man for the Lordes sake whether it be vnto the King as vnto the superiour or vnto gouernors as vnto them that are sent of him c And Kinges in those daies were as heauie aduersaries to the Church as any now liuing And this do saith the same Apostle for so it is the will of God Obedience therefore and subiection vnto our gouernours are the true effectes of à true and good Religion as it was well deliuered by à worthie Counseller vnto good and most louing subiectes Z. If the doctrine be so horrible what is the practise of the same T. That must needes bee al hellish Z. Then from th' infernall feendes do those Buls and excommunications proceede thundred both against the two noble Henries th' one whereof now is and long may he be King of Nauarre th' other the Prince of Condie most vnnaturally of late through poison sent out of this world by which Buls those Princes for their owne partes yea and their heirs too are disabled to gouerne and made vncapable not onely presently but for euer hereafter of anie praeeminence dominion honor and roialty in any land but specially in France their feudatories besides vassals liege people and subiectes are asoiled and set free from al othes of faithfulnes subiection how soeuer made vnto them yea forbidden for their liues to obey them any more and also against the mightie Empresse of Great Brittaine our most renowned Queene Elizabeth the Lordes annointed whereby both hir sacred Maiesty is denounced an haeretick and her people her well affected people and still may they be to her Maiestie charged and vpon paine of the great curse commaunded not to obay hir any more but as discharged from their naturall allegiance due vnto hir by many straight bondes to take vp armes against her and rebell T. Though the Pope like Antichrist himselfe dare embolden yet God forbid that any should bee so bad as to decline from their vowed loyaltie by any Buls from an Italian priest Z. I shall tell you which yet I can neither thinke but with griefe nor speake without horror the Seditions rebellions treasons not intended but entered-into vpon this warrant from the Pope haue bene monstruous and abhominable And one thing besides more horrible then the rest I will not let to vnfold T. What is that Z. Though I can vtter it neither but with griefe of hart yet that you may se another proper note of right Antichrist indeede this is it There is à doctrine resolued-vpon commended allowed and warranted in conscience Diuinitie and pollicie that for the furtherance of the Romish superstition it is lawfull yea meritorious to God the world for à naturall home borne subiect by any indirect meanes to take away the life of his liege Prince the Lordes annointed T. Now blessed be the Lord that thus layeth open the more thē diuelish cogitations of that Romish Synagogue and thrice blessed be his aeternall maiestie for alienating our mindes from such vngodly thoughtes Z. Dauid did but priuily cut-of the lap which was on Sauls garment and he was touched in heart for the same yea said this childe of God being coūsailed to kil his King Saul The Lord keepe mee from doing that thing vnto my Mayster the Lordes annointed to lay my hand vpon him for he is the annointed of the Lord yea Dauid was so farre from killing Saule himselfe or suffering them that would to murther him that he put that man to à shameful death who both by the consent and by the commaundement too euen of Saul himselfe had killed him So litle desire had Dauid by any sinister and treasonable course to maintaine his cause and to aduaunce himselfe T. A worthie example doubtles and proper onely and alwaies vnto them who are of that Religiō which is of God But is that doctrine warranted by the Pope himselfe which you haue spoken of Z. Himselfe hath so allowed the same as by letters written with his consent à Cardinal from Rome hath not onely commended the fact as that which shal merit heauen but animated the villaine also which was to perpetrate the treason to perseuere in those blacke accursed which hee called holy and honorable thoughtes saying by the spirit of Antichrist that he was indued with à good Spirit promising him from the father of all treasons the Pope not only great thinges in this world but also plenary indulgence remission of all his sinnes in the world to come T. Was any so bewitched as to aduenture the committing of so horrible treason vpon such à warrant Z. You are very ignorant if you know not or verie forgetful that I say not vnthankfull if
be God fareth well Z. That Sir Francis Drake was either taken or slaine T. Yet hee was neither taken or slaine but tooke and slew a great nomber and since by the power and goodnes of the Almighty hath slaine and taken and stil doth both take and slaie them Z. That we fled from comming to the battel T. And yet wee chased the Spaniardes as à brace of Greyhoundes would an heard of Deere and whipped them as à man will whip bond-slaues and as vagabondes are whipt about à towne so whipped we them about England and Scotland Z. That of our ships 20. yea 22. were sunke and 15. yea 26. yea 40. taken T. And yet so farre were wee from loosing fortie that wee lost not one yea so farre from loosinge à Shippe that wee lost not so much as à boate nor à Ship-mast Z. That many of our men were slaine and drowned à nomber taken prisoners T. Yet can they name neither do we know any man of marke and reputation that was slaine nor any man what soeuer that came as prisoner into their handes For all are liuing and praest by Gods fauour to aduenture their liues as cheerfully as euer they did for hir Maiestie when shee shall commaunde them Z. This of all is most wonderfull that they no way and wee euerie way were fortunate that their hartes shoulde be taken from them and new courage be put into vs that so manie of their Shippes should be lost and not so much as one boate nor mast of ours from the first to the last to perish that in one day fiue thousand of them and not in nine daies so much as one man to count-of on our side should bee slaine that in a few daies à thousande of theirs should be taken prisoners and not one man of ours come into their handes that their so famous an armie and Armado should by Heauen by Earth by water by fire perish for a great part and ours be preserued and remaine whole sound either to goe against them to their greater ruine or to encounter with any forreine forces that shal assaile vs T. He that seeth not à speciall regard of God towardes vs as to the deere spouse of Christ ward and an angrie countenaunce on th'other side against the Church of Rome as vpon the whore of Babilon described by S. Iohn is verie blind Z. So is he Chap. 14. Of a great desolation at hand of the Papal kingdome gathered from the consideration of thinges past and present TIMOTHIE And I trust the obseruation of these thinges will draw them on who are not so wel affected to that religiō which is from aboue ZELOTES I hope so too I wish it and manie argumentes I haue inducing me to thinke that some more notable ouerthrow the Pope shal againe sustaine ere long it bee T. May I not be priuie vnto some of them Z. It is written that Iupiters priestes in Meroe had with superstition so bewitched the peoples mindes that when soeuer they gaue commaundement men would lay violent hands vpon the kings and gouernors of Aethiopia and put them to the sword T. Who but heareth this and doth not abhorre the same be he indued but with common humanitie Z. Then no doubt poperie which both teacheth defendeth and practiseth euen the murthering of Gods annointed the Kinges Princes and gouernors of Christendome must needes vniuersallie become odious T. Hasten the same for thy names sake O most righteous God Z. At length those Iupiters Priestes by à Prince of an heroicall courage were themselues euen all of them put to the sword and their auctoritie gouernmēt and priesthood quite rooted out and ouerthrowen T. Euen so declare thy iustice iudgmētes mightie God wee beseech thee vpon Baals Priestes of Rome and vpon the whole papacie no whit inferior in impietie to Th' aethiopian priestes Z. That Prince that so rooted them out was hight Erganes The name of him that alreadie hath giuen the deadly blow vnto the state of Poperie in England was one entituled euen by the pope himselfe The defender of the Faith since for his magnanimity and power in suppressing Gods enimies iustlie termed The hāmer of Papistes euen K. Henry the eight of most famous memorie T. O that other Countries and territories yet vnder the Papal iurisdiction had either such Erganes as Aethiopia or such Henries as England had Z. It is deliuered that Italie is fatall to the Polonians T. What then Z. And it is crediblie thought also that the name of Henrie seemeth fatal to the Papacie T. What the Henries shalbe God onelie knoweth and man cannot define but what aduersaries the Henries haue bin and stil are at this houre to the Papacie al the world doth know and the present state of France doth affoord memorable examples in their excommunicate Henries Z. But whosoeuer the persons shalbe for state or name and how vnlikelie in the iudgement of manie to distroy the Popedome sure I am the miserable condition of our euen Christians doth require and the instant supplications of all Gods people euerie where do also craue call for à speedie reformation and they cannot be in vaine T. There is nothing impossible to God Z. Sainct Paul some-time was an enemie of the Church and with commission was sent and went also to murther and persecute the sainctes of God and yet he proued à most zealous constāt preacher of the word afterward himselfe suffered much for the cause of Christ and of an hipocriticall Pharisie became à true professor T. The example is notable Z. We haue mo Paules than one we praise God For Petrus Paulus Vergerius also in his last age à Cardinal of Rome an Embassador of the Popes sent and sent againe for his rare wisedome and faithfulnes in all the Popes affaires into Germanie and Naples vnto the Emperor and that for the rooting-out of Gods people vnder the name of Lutherans an heauy accuser of declining papistes and an earnest writer against such as reuolted frō the Romish faith himselfe in th'end all this notwithstanding forsooke his professiō left his dignities renounced al his spiritual promotions the Pope and Italie and became à zealous preacher and professor of the Gospel of our Sauiour Christ T. And such thankes be to God we heare of now and then Z. Litle did Martin Luther thinke whē first hee opposed him selfe against the Popes pardons to haue bin the subuertor of the whole Religion of Poperie as litle also did King Henrie the eight whē first he delt in that case of diuorcement thinke to haue bin the banisher of the popes auctoritie out of England T. So manie there be now as man thinketh the Popes sure frends which may proue his enimies and they which are his vpholders and protectors now may throw him downe hereafter Z. King Henrie