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cause_n great_a king_n lord_n 6,936 5 3.8165 3 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A25869 The arraignment and plea of Edw. Fitz-Harris, Esq. with all the arguments in law, and proceedings of the Court of Kings-Bench thereupon, in Easter term, 1681. Fitzharris, Edward, 1648?-1681, defendant.; England and Wales. Court of King's Bench. 1681 (1681) Wing A3746; ESTC R6663 92,241 70

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a_o way_n of_o proof_n which_o well_o stand_v with_o the_o rule_n of_o law_n which_o upon_o the_o general_a or_o other_o collateral_a issue_n may_v well_o be_v inquire_v of_o by_o the_o jury_n as_o in_o a_o action_n quare_fw-la canem_fw-la inordacem_fw-la defendens_fw-la scienter_fw-la retinuit_fw-la here_o soienter_n be_v not_o direct_o issuable_a but_o it_o be_v provable_a and_o must_v be_v prove_v upon_o the_o general_a issue_n so_o in_o the_o present_a case_n the_o intention_n of_o the_o commons_o upon_o the_o issue_n offer_v by_o we_o and_o refuse_v by_o the_o attorney_n general_n might_n and_o aught_o and_o will_v have_v be_v prove_v and_o without_o doubt_n find_v by_o the_o jury_n neither_o be_v this_o general_a impeachment_n such_o a_o notional_a thing_n as_o the_o other_o side_n will_v pretend_v but_o it_o be_v as_o if_o they_o shall_v say_v we_o do_v charge_v he_o to_o have_v commit_v certain_a crime_n that_o be_v treason_n now_o whether_o the_o crime_n they_o say_v he_o have_v commit_v and_o for_o which_o they_o impeach_v he_o be_v the_o same_o with_o those_o for_o which_o he_o be_v indict_v be_v a_o good_a and_o proper_a issue_n and_o if_o it_o appear_v to_o the_o court_n to_o be_v the_o same_o you_o will_v certain_o yourselves_o take_v off_o your_o hand_n from_o these_o proceed_n this_o be_v all_o i_o shall_v say_v as_o to_o the_o averrment_n and_o if_o we_o can_v well_o get_v over_o that_o i_o take_v it_o all_o the_o rest_n be_v well_o enough_o but_o again_o they_o say_v the_o impeachment_n be_v too_o general_a and_o no_o man_n shall_v be_v put_v to_o answer_v to_o such_o a_o general_a accusation_n and_o i_o say_v so_o too_o neither_o shall_v fitz_n harris_n be_v put_v to_o answer_v to_o it_o without_o special_a article_n yet_o he_o can_v quash_n the_o impeachment_n for_o this_o cause_n as_o he_o may_v a_o indictment_n which_o show_v the_o difference_n betwixt_o a_o impeachment_n and_o a_o indictment_n which_o always_o contain_v the_o special_a 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aver_v the_o crime_n to_o be_v the_o same_o we_o have_v do_v what_o we_o can_v and_o therefore_o enough_o and_o that_o a_o general_a impeachment_n without_o article_n be_v a_o bar_n to_o any_o indictment_n for_o the_o same_o matter_n be_v resolve_v by_o all_o the_o judge_n as_o i_o be_o inform_v in_o the_o case_n of_o the_o lord_n in_o the_o tower_n who_o be_v all_o indict_v for_o treason_n either_o in_o the_o king_n bench_n or_o before_o commissioner_n of_o oyer_n and_o terminer_n and_o afterward_o 5._o dec._n 78._o general_o impeach_v before_o the_o lord_n in_o parliament_n and_o no_o article_n exhibit_v till_o 3._o april_n 79._o and_o yet_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n it_o be_v resolve_v at_o the_o council_n table_n by_o all_o the_o judge_n there_o attend_v that_o after_o the_o general_a impeachment_n before_o article_n they_o can_v not_o be_v proceed_v against_o upon_o those_o indictment_n though_o the_o parliament_n wherein_o they_o be_v impeach_v be_v dissolve_v and_o that_o be_v 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a_o indictment_n for_o the_o same_o offence_n although_o the_o defendant_n in_o the_o impeachment_n be_v neither_o convict_v or_o acquit_v otherwise_o you_o may_v bring_v back_o all_o the_o lord_n in_o the_o tower_n to_o the_o king_n bench_n to_o be_v try_v which_o mr._n attorney_n will_v not_o i_o suppose_v attempt_n and_o it_o be_v observable_a in_o the_o case_n of_o sir_n william_n wishipole_n that_o to_o avoid_v the_o doubt_n that_o the_o party_n there_o shall_v not_o be_v question_v both_o upon_o the_o coroner_n inquest_n and_o the_o indictment_n of_o murder_n it_o be_v rule_v by_o the_o court_n that_o the_o first_o shall_v be_v quash_v as_o insufficient_a so_o careful_a be_v the_o judge_n to_o avoid_v double_a vexation_n in_o a_o case_n compare_v with_o this_o of_o no_o great_a import_n i_o shall_v say_v no_o more_o to_o the_o case_n but_o only_o observe_v how_o scrupulous_a the_o judge_n have_v be_v to_o touch_v upon_o a_o case_n where_o they_o have_v the_o least_o suspicion_n or_o jealousy_n that_o the_o parliament_n have_v or_o pretend_v to_o have_v a_o jurisdiction_n or_o be_v possess_v of_o the_o cause_n i_o be_o sure_a i_o can_v never_o get_v any_o thing_n by_o any_o labour_n of_o i_o in_o those_o case_n but_o upon_o all_o such_o motion_n they_o be_v so_o aware_a of_o what_o may_v be_v the_o consequence_n that_o they_o will_v always_o worship_v afar_o off_o and_o will_v never_o come_v near_o the_o mount_n they_o will_v ever_o retire_v when_o they_o come_v but_o near_o the_o brink_n of_o this_o gulf._n now_o my_o lord_n if_o you_o retain_v this_o cause_n in_o consequence_n you_o charge_v yourselves_o with_o the_o blood_n of_o this_o man_n wherein_o if_o you_o proceed_v regular_o and_o according_a to_o law_n all_o be_v well_o but_o however_o by_o over_o rule_v his_o plea_n you_o take_v upon_o you_o his_o blood_n one_o way_n or_o other_o through_o which_o you_o must_v wade_v to_o come_v at_o the_o cause_n and_o whether_o it_o be_v adviseable_a to_o come_v at_o it_o upon_o these_o term_n i_o leave_v it_o to_o your_o lordship_n wisdom_n to_o consider_v mr._n pollexfen_n my_o lord_n i_o shall_v not_o make_v any_o long_a argument_n there_o have_v be_v so_o much_o say_v before_o i_o but_o i_o will_v fain_o come_v to_o the_o question_n if_o i_o can_v for_o i_o must_v confess_v afterall_a i_o can_v see_v what_o the_o other_o side_n make_v the_o question_n mr._n attorney_n be_v please_v to_o say_v that_o both_o for_o the_o matter_n and_o form_n he_o object_v against_o our_o plea_n but_o if_o for_o the_o matter_n it_o be_v admit_v to_o i_o that_o a_o impeachment_n in_o parliament_n for_o the_o same_o matter_n will_v out_o this_o court_n of_o jurisdiction_n i_o will_v say_v nothing_o at_o all_o of_o it_o for_o i_o apprehend_v that_o be_v not_o then_o in_o question_n ld._n ch._n just_a no_o not_o at_o all_o mr._n pollexfen_n then_o the_o matter_n seem_v to_o be_v agree_v and_o only_o the_o manner_n and_o form_n of_o the_o plea_n be_v now_o in_o question_n and_o for_o the_o manner_n they_o except_v to_o it_o in_o these_o particular_n first_o they_o say_v it_o be_v not_o allege_v that_o there_o be_v any_o impeachment_n upon_o record_n now_o i_o confess_v form_n be_v a_o subtle_a matter_n in_o itself_o and_o it_o be_v easy_a for_o any_o man_n that_o read_v other_o man_n word_n and_o write_n if_o he_o will_v to_o make_v what_o construction_n he_o will_v of_o they_o even_o nolumus_fw-la to_o be_v volumus_fw-la but_o i_o know_v the_o court_n will_v not_o so_o do_v but_o for_o a_o answer_n to_o the_o objection_n i_o think_v it_o be_v as_o strong_o and_o close_o pen_v as_o i_o can_v tell_v how_o to_o pen_v any_o thing_n he_o be_v impeach_v quae_fw-la quidem_fw-la impetitio_fw-la etc._n etc._n what_o can_v that_o quae_fw-la quidem_fw-la signify_v
parliament_n be_v plead_v and_o the_o day_n of_o the_o parliament_n mistake_v there_o be_v a_o general_a demurrer_n and_o it_o be_v resolve_v that_o it_o be_v naught_o and_o judgement_n give_v against_o the_o bishop_n though_o no_o exception_n be_v take_v in_o particular_a because_o the_o day_n of_o the_o beginning_n and_o end_v parliament_n be_v of_o public_a notice_n and_o the_o judge_n take_v notice_n when_o a_o parliament_n be_v in_o be_v and_o when_o not_o that_o be_v a_o sufficient_a answer_n to_o that_o matter_n then_o for_o those_o many_o caution_n that_o have_v be_v give_v you_o what_o a_o difficult_a thing_n it_o be_v for_o two_o jurisdiction_n to_o interfeir_n mr._n fitz_n harris_n be_v much_o concern_v in_o that_o matter_n who_o have_v forfeit_v his_o life_n to_o the_o law_n as_o a_o most_o notorious_a offender_n that_o certain_o deserve_v nothing_o but_o punishment_n yet_o he_o will_v fain_o live_v a_o little_a long_o and_o be_v much_o concern_v that_o the_o judicature_n 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plea_n pend_v in_o a_o superior_a court_n be_v pleadable_a to_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o a_o inferior_a court_n for_o my_o lord_n that_o be_v it_o we_o put_v upon_o they_o to_o show_v if_o it_o have_v be_v plead_v in_o abatement_n it_o will_v have_v have_v its_o weight_n and_o be_v consider_v of_o as_o in_o sparry_n case_n where_o it_o be_v no_o plea_n to_o the_o jurisdiction_n put_v the_o case_n it_o have_v be_v a_o good_a impeachment_n and_o he_o have_v be_v arraign_v upon_o it_o and_o acquit_v if_o he_o have_v afterward_o come_v to_o be_v indict_v in_o this_o court_n and_o the_o prisoner_n will_v not_o plead_v this_o in_o bar_n but_o to_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o the_o court_n it_o will_v not_o have_v be_v a_o good_a plea_n but_o he_o have_v lose_v his_o advantage_n by_o mispleading_a if_o then_o a_o arraignment_n and_o a_o acquittal_n or_o conviction_n thereupon_o not_o a_o good_a plea_n to_o the_o jurisdiction_n then_o certain_o a_o impeachment_n depend_v single_o can_v be_v a_o good_a plea_n to_o the_o jurisdiction_n this_o court_n have_v a_o full_a jurisdiction_n of_o this_o case_n and_o of_o this_o person_n both_o of_o the_o crime_n and_o of_o the_o party_n who_o be_v a_o commoner_n and_o not_o only_o to_o find_v the_o indictment_n but_o to_o proceed_v to_o justice_n and_o this_o you_o have_v at_o the_o time_n of_o the_o fact_n commit_v for_o certain_o we_o need_v not_o put_v case_n for_o to_o prove_v that_o the_o king_n bench_n especial_o since_o the_o statute_n for_o try_v treason_n beyond_o the_o sea_n have_v a_o universal_a jurisdiction_n of_o all_o person_n and_o offence_n pray_v then_o what_o be_v it_o that_o must_v out_o this_o court_n of_o their_o jurisdiction_n for_o all_o the_o case_n that_o have_v be_v or_o can_v be_v put_v about_o matter_n which_o be_v not_o original_o examinable_a in_o this_o court_n make_v not_o to_o the_o matter_n in_o question_n there_o it_o be_v true_a the_o court_n may_v be_v by_o plea_n out_v of_o its_o jurisdiction_n as_o at_o common_a law_n where_o a_o fact_n be_v do_v super_fw-la altum_fw-la mare_fw-la and_o so_o plead_v that_o put_v it_o out_o of_o the_o court_n jurisdiction_n and_o that_o be_v my_o lord_n hollis_n and_o sir_n j._n eliot_n case_n and_o so_o that_o be_v my_o lord_n shaftsbury_n case_n too_o the_o fact_n be_v do_v out_o of_o their_o jurisdiction_n and_o that_o may_v be_v plead_v to_o the_o jurisdiction_n because_o they_o have_v no_o original_a jurisdiction_n of_o the_o fact_n but_o where_o the_o crime_n and_o the_o person_n be_v absolute_o within_o the_o jurisdiction_n of_o the_o court_n and_o the_o court_n may_v original_o take_v cognizance_n of_o it_o as_o this_o court_n have_v of_o the_o present_a case_n i_o will_v fain_o know_v what_o can_v out_o that_o jurisdiction_n less_o than_o a_o act_n of_o parliament_n i_o will_v be_v bold_a to_o say_v the_o king_n by_o his_o great-seal_a can_v do_v it_o nor_o can_v a_o act_n of_o either_o house_n or_o both_o house_n together_o 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the_o prisoner_n stand_v impeach_v by_o the_o commons_o of_o england_n in_o parliament_n assemble_v of_o high_a treason_n second_o that_o the_o impeachment_n thus_o make_v by_o the_o commons_o in_o the_o name_n of_o themselves_o and_o of_o all_o the_o commons_o of_o england_n before_o the_o lord_n in_o parliament_n for_o treason_n be_v now_o in_o be_v three_o which_o i_o omit_v in_o the_o open_n of_o the_o plea_n that_o this_o be_v do_v say_v in_o legem_fw-la &_o cons_n parliamenti_fw-la and_o be_v so_o remain_v in_o plenis_fw-la suis_fw-la robore_fw-la &_o effectu_fw-la and_o more_o particular_o this_o plea_n do_v refer_v to_o the_o record_n for_o the_o part_n and_o circumstance_n of_o the_o impeachment_n prout_fw-la patet_fw-la per_fw-la record_n inde_fw-la inter_fw-la etc._n etc._n so_o that_o it_o do_v refer_v the_o impeachment_n itself_o to_o the_o record_n and_o tell_v you_o this_o be_v among_o the_o other_o record_n of_o that_o parliament_n all_o this_o be_v admit_v by_o the_o 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commons_o in_o parliament_n may_v impeach_v any_o commoner_n of_o treason_n before_o the_o lord_n in_o parliament_n i_o take_v that_o to_o be_v admit_v and_o i_o do_v not_o find_v that_o mr._n attorney_n deny_v it_o or_o make_v any_o doubt_n of_o that_o for_o i_o think_v that_o be_v the_o case_n of_o tresilian_n and_o belknapp_n who_o be_v impeach_v in_o parliament_n by_o the_o commons_o before_o the_o lord_n i_o be_o sure_a my_o lord_n chief_a justice_n vaughan_n do_v in_o his_o report_n in_o bushell_n case_n say_v so_o and_o upon_o that_o impeachment_n of_o the_o commons_o one_o of_o they_o be_v execute_v and_o the_o other_o banish_v in_o parliament_n my_o lord_n i_o cite_v it_o not_o merry_o but_o i_o cite_v it_o as_o authority_n indeed_o i_o do_v not_o go_v so_o far_o as_o to_o cite_v the_o parliament_n roll_n it_o be_v in_o the_o time_n of_o rich._n the_o 2._o i_o have_v not_o see_v the_o roll_n of_o late_a true_o but_o i_o be_o sure_a it_o be_v upon_o the_o roll_n and_o there_o 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it_o and_o it_o be_v not_o fit_a for_o i_o to_o dwell_v upon_o it_o you_o will_v consider_v of_o it_o i_o be_o sure_a another_o thing_n i_o will_v say_v be_v this_o if_o your_o lordship_n shall_v meddle_v with_o this_o way_n of_o proceed_v it_o will_v invert_v the_o law_n in_o another_o thing_n for_o it_o be_v a_o principle_n with_o we_o that_o no_o man_n life_n be_v to_o be_v put_v twice_o in_o danger_n for_o one_o and_o the_o same_o thing_n i_o will_v then_o put_v the_o case_n thus_o if_o your_o lordship_n shall_v proceed_v upon_o this_o indictment_n and_o this_o person_n shall_v be_v acquit_v upon_o it_o i_o be_o in_o your_o lordship_n judgement_n whether_o that_o acquittal_n will_v bind_v the_o lord_n in_o parliament_n if_o that_o will_v not_o bind_v they_o but_o they_o may_v still_o proceed_v on_o the_o impeachment_n than_o you_o invade_v that_o common_a right_n which_o every_o englishman_n by_o the_o law_n ought_v to_o have_v preserve_v to_o he_o that_o no_o person_n ought_v 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and_o time_n will_v produce_v truth_n veritas_fw-la filia_fw-la temporis_fw-la if_o then_o there_o have_v be_v any_o any_o such_o hasty_a proceed_n as_o in_o this_o case_n i_o doubt_v my_o lord_n stafford_n have_v be_v now_o alive_a now_o then_o for_o these_o lord_n that_o be_v now_o in_o the_o tower_n if_o your_o lordship_n do_v go_v on_o in_o this_o way_n do_v you_o not_o open_v such_o a_o gap_n as_o may_v be_v a_o ground_n to_o deliver_v they_o by_o the_o same_o justice_n i_o speak_v it_o under_o correction_n here_o and_o i_o only_o offer_v it_o to_o your_o judgement_n for_o i_o have_v not_o have_v many_o hour_n to_o consider_v of_o it_o but_o your_o lordship_n will_v think_v well_o of_o it_o before_o you_o give_v any_o judgement_n by_o the_o same_o justice_n the_o other_o lord_n may_v be_v try_v by_o another_o court_n this_o i_o offer_v in_o point_n of_o reason_n that_o this_o proceed_n will_v be_v very_o hard_a and_o be_v a_o imprudent_a thing_n if_o not_o a_o illegal_a proceed_n 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grammar_n a_o adjective_n for_o a_o substantive_n but_o i_o take_v it_o to_o be_v as_o well_o as_o any_o man_n can_v plead_v in_o this_o case_n for_o what_o say_v the_o prisoner_n the_o knight_n citizens_z and_o burgess_n in_o parliament_n assemble_v do_v impeach_v i_o which_o impeachment_n be_v still_o in_o force_n before_o the_o lord_n i_o take_v it_o to_o be_v as_o plain_a as_o can_v be_v if_o they_o do_v impeach_v i_o than_o there_o be_v a_o impeachment_n it_o can_v bear_v no_o other_o sense_n my_o lord_n another_o exception_n and_o which_o be_v think_v a_o strong_a one_o the_o other_o day_n and_o strong_o urge_v be_v that_o the_o king_n may_v choose_v his_o court_n and_o they_o compare_v it_o with_o the_o other_o court_n but_o there_o be_v the_o mistake_n that_o run_v all_o along_o in_o this_o case_n it_o be_v no_o doubt_n the_o king_n may_v choose_v his_o court_n for_o his_o own_o action_n and_o suit_n but_o the_o impeachment_n be_v a_o impeachment_n of_o the_o commons_o and_o 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