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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A16183	A large examination taken at Lambeth, according to his Maiesties direction, point by point, of M. G. Blakwell, made Arch-priest of England, by Pope Clement 8 Vpon occasion of a certaine answere of his, without the priuitie of the state, to a letter lately sent vnto him from Cardinall Bellarmine, blaming him for taking the oath of Allegeance. Together with the Cardinals letter, and M. Blakwels said answere vnto it. Also M. Blakwels letter to the Romish Catholickes in England, aswell ecclesiasticall, as lay.	Blackwell, George, 1546 or 7-1613.; Bellarmino, Roberto Francesco Romolo, Saint, 1542-1621.	1609 (1609)	STC 3104; ESTC S121306	104,118	220

non habere Imperialem Ciuilem potestatem ad libitum ex suo appetitu deponendi Regem nostrum That the Pope hath not an Imperiall and Ciuill power to depose our King when he pleaseth and at his owne appetite suggesting that the said oath had no other meaning and that this sense was thrice insisted vpon before hee this Examinat tooke the said oath and allowed of by the Magistrate whereas the words of the oath which he this Examinat tooke for ought that appeared to the contrarie without any equiuocation or mentall euasion whatsoeuer are cleare and manifest viz. That the Pope neither of himselfe nor by any authoritie of the Church or See of Rome hath any power or authoritie to depose the King The oath saith that the Pope hath no power by any authoritie of the Church or See of Rome viz neither Imperiall Ciuill nor Ecclesiasticall whereas this Examinat telleth the Cardinall that he onely sware against his Imperiall and Ciuill power whereby he might not so proceede with his Maiestie 17. With these particular exceptions this Examinate being somewhat troubled desired againe that before he came to the answering of them he might a little as by the way bewayle himselfe and his present estate which he did in manner as followeth saying That it was no little griefe vnto him to be apprehended and cast into prison that thereupon he hoped his former troubles and oppositions against him would haue ceased that notwithstanding as matters are prosecuted and his proceedings interpreted hee receiueth nothing but discomfort from each side that his friendes might haue bene content to haue expounded his oath in the best part and the rather because they perceiued hee found thereby that he had giuen some reasonable contentmēt to the State for the ease of his imprisonment being an old man and troubled with many bodily infirmities and for the auoyding of some further extremities that Cardinall Bellarmine might well haue forborne his Letter vnto him as also his sharpe censures of him as if by taking the said oath hee had fallen with Peter in denying his Master and with Marcellinus who offered a false sacrifice and that thereby he this Examinate had brought in question one of the chiefe heads of faith and foundations of Catholicke religion that hee the said Cardinall might easily haue foreseene that albeit there had beene no copies of his Letter taken before it came to him this Examinate yet that such a vigilant eye is had ouer him in prison as that it is almost impossible for him to haue kept it vndiscouered especially there being such bruites of it cast abroad as there were euen by those that should haue concealed it that likewise the said Cardinall might not onely well haue thought that if it happened his Letter to be diuulged more hurt then good was likely thereof to ensue except he thought it fit to bring him this Examinate into greater hatred then he was before which could not auaile the common cause and to prouoke his Maiestie to some greater extremities then of his most milde and temperate disposition he is inclined vnto but likewise that it was his this Examinates part in all duety to answere his Letter which would be also as it hath now fallen out as impossible his case considered for him this Examinate to performe with any secrecie as it was that his the said Cardinals Letter should come vndiscryed vnto this Examinate that as hee greatly suspecteth the Cardinals said Letter was cunningly opened before it came to his this Examinates hands so he is perswaded that his answere vnto it will be vsed in the like sort before it come to the Cardinall and the rather he so thinketh for that he findeth alreadie the copie of it by skill and practise to be as soone published abroad here in England as this Examinate could dispatch it for Rome which doth greatly perplexe him and what may be the issue of it he knoweth not but feareth as he saith the worst at al hands that notwithstanding come what shall come his hopes being past which were neuer great his libertie restrained neuer to be recouered the graue expecting him which he most desireth no ioyes nor comforts but in his blessed Sauiour he is resolued with patience to expect and vndergoe it that these and many other such courses held with him do oftentimes exceedingly grieue and trouble him in that men abroad and at libertie haue no more care of poore men imprisoned for those causes which they would seeme most earnestly to affect and that thus hauing eased a litle his heart and referring himselfe and his cause to God he will now addresse himselfe to answere all the partes of the obiection aboue mentioned syncerely and truely from the bottome of his heart as becommeth a true Catholicke priest and as he is perswaded in his conscience without any equiuocation or euasion and without regard or feare of any mens persons or of any inconuenience or further danger that might thereby ensue vnto him or of any slanderous imputations which he doth easily foresee will be heaped vpon him of purpose to discredite both him and that which he findeth he must needes acknowledge except he should wilfully denie the trueth or shew himselfe obstinate and peruerse against lawfull authority which his present estate and conscience will not permit 18 And therefore now as touching his this Examinats signification vnto Cardinall Bellarmine that the effect of his oath was Summum Pontificem non habere Imperialem ciuilem potestatem ad libitum ex suo appetitu deponendi Regem nostrum That the Pope hath not an Imperiall and ciuill power to depose our King when he pleaseth and at his owne appetite he will as he saith answere the same not in grosse but by degrees saying first That amongst diuers prerogatiues attributed to the Pope in temporalibus in temporalties this is one which cannot be well denied by any viz. that the Pope is truely lord of all the temporalties belonging to the Bishopricke of Rome Within the compasse whereof there are some who haue included England and Ireland and one especially whose memorie this Examinate doth greatly honour but yet he must needes acknowledge his ouersight in that point Thus hee writeth Without the approbation of the See Apostolicke none can be lawfull King or Queene Admonit to the Nobilitie by Card. Allen 1588. pag. 8. of England by reason of the ancient accord made betweene Alexander the third the yeere 1171. and Henry the second then King when he was absolued for the death of Saint Thomas of Canterbury that no man might lawfully take that Crowne nor bee accounted as King till hee were confirmed by the Soueraigne Pastor of our soules which for the time should be this accord afterwards being renewed about the yeere 1210 by king Iohn who confirmed the same by oath to Pandulphus the Popes Legate at the special request and procurement of the Lords and Commons as a thing most

wordes might seeme to import as much as the Earle desired whereas in deede the authoritie which this authour saith both parts are agreed vpon is not yet determined For Cardinall Bellarmine and his Bellar. de Rom. Pont. lib. 5. cap. 4. side are fully resolued that the Pope hath no such authoritie directly and that consequently he must either haue it indirectly in ordine ad spiritualia or not at all and è contra the authours who oppose themselues to that opinion are as confident that he hath no authoritie in temporalibus except hee haue it directly so as how can it be said they are Carer de authorit Rom. Pont. lib. 2. cap. 5. 8. agreed when both sides are so peremptorie that he hath no such authoritie at all except he haue it saith the one side directly saith the other side indirectly And for his further answere hereunto he referreth himselfe to that which before hee hath set downe in the 63 68 69 76 88 90 and 91 Sections 98 As it was obserued in the 42. Section that all princes for denying the Popes supremacie though otherwise they professe the Gospell are tearmed heretickes by the Romish Catholickes so although they liue neuer so orderly according to their lawes without inflicting any other punishments vpon offenders then are agreed vpon by the Common-wealth they are accounted tyrants if for the repressing of Popish errours they doe at some times giue way to the execution of such Lawes as are made against them And none are more violent herein then such as were borne and bred vp amongst vs in England as Stapleton and William Raynolds if they were the authors of the two bookes intituled De iusta abdicatione Henric 3. and De iusta Reipuh Christianae in Reges impios haereticos authoritate who affirme that all power at this day which is auerse from religion De iusta abdic pag. 11. Rossaeus pag. 106. meaning the Romish religion is tyrannie and that they are tyrants that doe vse their kingly power to the imposing vpon their Subiects of that faith which they terme hereticall and for example of such tyrants one of them alledgeth K. Henry the 8. Edward the 6. and Queene Elizabeth The consequences of which assertions are as Idem pag. 157. well in their opinions as in the opinion of many other that are of that sect that euery such tyrant may be depriued of his kingdome and if neede be murthered by his Subiects yea by euery priuate man if hee haue fit opportunitie after that he is declared by the Common-wealth as some say to be a tyrant or by the Pope as others affirme Whereby all kings and princes that mislike the Popes tyrannie and sundrie his corruptions are by him and his priests infinitely dishonoured and no one way more then by inciting their subiects to rebellion vnder pretence of religion which ought to be the surest band of duety and obedience In consideration whereof it being told this Examinate that it was all one to his Maiestie whether by the Popes doctrine hee were to be deposed from his Crowne vnder either of these false pretences that he is an hereticke or that he is a tyrant and that thereby his Subiects are no longer to obey him but may beare armes against him and offer violence vnto his sacred person as well in the one case as in the other and that therefore it stood him in hand seeing he professeth himselfe to be a true subiect to deliuer himselfe from these traiterous conceits he the said Examinate answered as followeth saying 99 That in his iudgement if it be true as this Examinat beleeueth it is that the Pope hath no authoritie by any Sentence whatsoeuer to depose a King for heresie as before he hath at large declared nor to absolue his subiects from their Allegeance it is also as true a fortiori that hee hath no authoritie by any Sentence or iudgment whatsoeuer so to determine any king to be a tyrant as that thereby his right to his kingdome should in any sort be empeached or his subiects set at liberty to rebell against him or to offer any hurt vnto his person 100 That he knoweth what diuers haue written as touching tyrants wherewith hee saith it is impertinent for him now to intermeddle affirming notwithstanding that in his iudgement no king who in the course of his gouernement doth obserue the lawes established in his kingdome and doth not otherwise afflict his subiects either by violence rapine crueltie impositions exactions or by any other vnlawfull meanes but as he is bound giueth way to the execution of his lawes and onely vseth the ancient prerogatiue of his Crowne can in any true construction be rightly iudged a tyrant though some of his said lawes doe tend to the punishment of Catholickes and to the maintenance of the religion which he professeth diuers Emperours being in their times notable gouernours and promoters of their Empire to the great good of their subiects in temporall causes though otherwise they were great enemies to Christianitie 101 That no King who commeth to his Crowne by succession as being the right heire thereof may lawfully vnder any pretence of tyrannie bee deposed or resisted by his subiects either iointly assembled together or otherwise by any secret machinations or treacheries of manie few or of any one and that as touching this point either of iudging a king to be a tyrant or dealing with him thereupon as is before mentioned he is altogether of Master Blackwood his opinion who writing against sundry traiterous positions of Buchanans tending to the effect before obiected doth proue very sufficiently these points that ensue viz 102 That no subiects can arrogate to themselues Blackuodaei Apolog pro Regibus pag. 56. any part of Regall authority without committing of treason except the same bee delegated vnto them by the King and that then also they are to vse the same authority no otherwise then in such sort and so long as the King doeth willingly permit them That our Kings here in this land are no way obliged Pag. 106. to the people for their kingdome but haue all their power and Empire from God and are onely bound to giue an account to him of the discharge of their office and duetie their kingdomes belonging to them iure haereditario by right of inheritance so as no sooner Pag. 178. is one King dead but the next heire is actually king no ceremonie or Coronation or other circumstances adding more to his right then hee had before That the Oath itselfe which they take at their Coronation being made to God and not to the people doeth not Pag. 221. any way empeach the interest they haue iure sanguinis Pag. 224. by their birth 103 That forasmuch as the kings subiects his Pag. 211. c. Clergie Nobles and Commons cannot assemble together in Parliament without the kings Writte vnder paine of treason by the olde lawes nor when they are

Emperors and ciuill Magistrates were vtter enemies vnto it and sought by all the meanes that possibly they could deuise to haue quite abolished and extinguished the name and memory of all Christianity 64 This Examinate being heere againe demaunded how hee can make it appeare that the point aboue by him specified is not as yet determined by the Church saith That hee is now from his bookes but taketh the same to bee so euident as he feared not in his letter to Cardinall Bellarmine to say that this proposition scil Papa habet potestatem deponendi Reges indirectè The Pope hath power indirectly to depose kings was not yet defined tanquam res fidei formaliter as a matter of faith formally and well remembreth that Couaruuias in the second part of his booke of the last edition at Lyons pag. 504. doth set downe the names of diuers worthy persons that concurre with him this Examinate herein Besides he saith that this doth further appeare by Cardinall Allen where he affirmeth that this proposition or any other equiualent vnto it viz. That Card. Allen against Defence of English Iustice cap. 4. pag 72. the Pope hath power to excommunicate or depriue a Prince in case of heresie or Apostasie and consequently to absolue his subiects from their oath and obedience to him is a meere matter of Diuinitie if not defined saith he for vs yet at the Alan●s ad persecutor Angios sol 326. least disputable in schoole or as it is in the Latin copie Est quidem planè Theologica cum religione Christianá arctissimè cohaerens de quâ si for san non definitè pro parte nostrâ pronunciatum sit posse tamen solere Theologicis argumentis in vtramque partem disputari ipsi quidem aduersarij qui quicquam sciunt ignorare non possunt 65 Here it being obiected that seeing as it seemeth it is not yet determined by the Church of Rome either that the Pope is Dominus temporalium directly or only in ordine ad spiritualia indirectly or that hee hath any such authority at all whereabouts the authors of the two first opinions doe so hotly contend and for that also he this Examinate hath professed before that he Sect. 36. was not bound to either of the said opinions vpon any danger of declining from the Catholike Church but would vse now his liberty albeit in his letter to Cardinal Bellarmine he inclined to his side and that therefore it seemed strange why he is so loth to expresse his mind apparantly and without any circumstances what his sincere iudgement is without respect of any mens persons as touching the Cardinals assertion for the Popes authority in temporalibus in ordine ad spiritualia in order to things spirituall considering what dangerous consequences thereupon may ensue to his Maiestie and the State here in respect whereof this Examinate being eftsoones vrged vpon his duetie towards God and his Allegeance to his Maiestie to deliuer his iudgement touching this point truely and sincerely answereth that because hee is still so pressed in his Maiesties name and in his name also who faith Ego sum Veritas I am the Trueth to deale herein plainely and sincerely and finding that otherwise hee shall not be able to giue such satisfaction as hee thinketh in his conscience hee is bound to doe hee answereth to the premisses in maner as followeth viz. 66 That it is true that none of the said three points obiected are as yet determined that hee must of necessitie acknowledge it to bee subiect to some reasonable exceptions why before it be concluded whether the Pope hath at all any authority to eradicate and depose Kings and Princes c. there is so earnest disputation of the maner how he receiued it from Christ whether directly or indirectly that touching his former inclination to Cardinall Bellarmines opinion forasmuch as the same is more generally receiued hee held it his duetie not to dissent from him in apparance it being the propertie of turbulent spirits to quarrell at things conueniently setled for the good of the Church and against the common rule Malum bene positum non esse mouendum things subiect to some exceptions are not alwaies to be ruffled in especially when they may tend to the preiudice of Christian tranquillity and that he would stil haue concealed his own iudgement to himselfe touching these points had hee not been so greatly vrged as in diuers parts of this his Examination it may appeare to declare it 67 That as it were by the way but very pertinent to this Examinates cause forasmuch as by the premisses it is not onely euident that the points contained in the Oath of Allegeance are left as yet to bee disputed on in vtramque partem as Cardinall Allen affirmeth but is also as plaine and manifest that when Cardinall Bellarmine writ to this Examinate that one of the chiefe heads of faith foundations of Catholike Religion was brought into danger by this Examinates taking of the said Oath hee the said Cardinall was vtterly mis-informed as supposing the same to bee against the Popes Supremacie in causes Ecclesiastical whereunto that Oath as before he hath said had no maner of relation for otherwise it is apparant that his taking of that Oath can no way endanger any head or foundation either of faith or of Christian Religion there being no such heads or foundations yet agreed vpon or laide in that behalfe 68 That therefore as he hath acknowledged his libertie without danger of declining from the Catholicke Church to expresse his iudgement as well of this opinion so much vrged against him concerning the Popes authoritie in temporalibus indirectè as he hath done before of the other viz. that the Pope as he thinketh is not Dominus temporalium directè so this Examinate will now at the last vse that his libertie at this time because hee doeth finde it to be as lawfull for him to refuse the one as the other and doeth thereupon accordingly professe with all trueth and sinceritie that as he thinketh neither of the said opinions is true that what he this Examinate hath before set downe at large out of Cardinall Bellarmine he thinketh in his conscience is sound and Catholicke and cannot be impeached either by the Canonists and those their assistants that lately haue taken their parts so eagerly for the Popes direct power or by the other side who to the same end for his dealing with Emperours Kings and Princes as is aforesaid doe attribute the same vnto him though indirectly and that he is the bolder in this sort to declare his minde concerning the said two opposite opinions because it is not yet defined as hee hath said by the Church whether Christ hath left to the Pope any such authoritie at all to eradicate and depose Emperors and Kings as they contend for preposterously in labouring before it be resolued whether hee hath any such authoritie or not to perswade men in what