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A51741 A reformed catechism. The first dialogue in two dialogues concerning the English Reformation / collected for the most part, word for word out of Dr. Burnet, John Fox, and other Protestant historians ; published for the information of the people in reply to Mas William Kings answer to D. Manby's considerations &c. ; by Peter Manby. Manby, Peter, d. 1697. 1687 (1687) Wing M388; ESTC R30509 77,561 110

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his Tryal pleaded strongly against the Statute that made it Treason to deny the Supremacy and argued that the King could not be Supream Head of the Church When he was brought to the Bar he pleaded Not Guilty but being found Guilty Judgment was given aganst him as a Traitor He received it with an equal Temper of Mind which he had shewed in both conditions of Life and then set himself wholly to prepare for Death He expressed great Contempt of the World and that he was weary of Life and long'd for Death which was so little terrible to him that his ordinary Facetiousness remained with him on the Scaffold It was censured by many as light and undecent but others said that way having been so natural to him on all other occasions it was not at all affected but shewed that Death did no way discompose him nor so much as put him out of his ordinary Humour Yet his rallying every thing on the Scaffold was thought to have more of the Stoick than the Christian in it After some time spent in secret Devotions he was beheaded on the sixth of July Thus dyed Sir Thomas More in the 53d year of his age He was a man of rare Vertues and excellent Parts In his youth he had freer thoughts of things as appears by his Vtopia and his Letters to Erasmus but afterwards he became superstitiously devoted says Burnet to the Interests and Passions of the Popish Clergy and as he served them when he was in Authority even to assist them in all their Cruelties so he employed his Pen in the same Cause both in writing against all the new Opinions in general and in particular against Tindall Frith and Barns He was no Divine at all if you believe Burnet and it is plain to any that reads his Writings that he knew nothing of Antiquity beyond the Quotations he found in the Canon Law and in the Master of the Sentences only he had read some of St. Austins Treatises For upon all points of Controversie he quotes only what he found in those Collections Nor was was he at all conversant in the critical Learning upon the Scriptures he did not care for the new fangled Conceits of the Reformers But his peculiar Excellency in writing was that he had a natural easie Expression and presented all the Opinions of Popery with their fair side to the Reader disguising or concealing the black side of them with great Art that is he did not understand or mistake Popery as Protestants do and was no less dextrous in exposing all the ill consequences that could follow on the Doctrine of the Reformers and had upon all occasions great store of pleasant Tales which he applied wittily to his purpose And in this consists the great strength of his Writings which were designed rather for the Rabble than for learned Men. But for Justice Contempt of Mony Humility and a true Generosity of Mind he was an Example to the Age in which he lived Burnets words pag 356. 1 vol. Second Edition The Bishop of Rochester had been a Prisoner above a year and was very severely used says Burnet he complained in his Letters to Cromwell then Secretary of State that he had neither Clothes nor Fire being then about fourscore years of age If he had kept his Opinion of the Kings Supremacy to himself they could not have proceeded further He would not do that but did upon several occasions speak against it So he was brought to his Tryal on the 17th of June The Lord Chancellor the Duke of Suffolk and some other Lords together with the Judges sate upon him by Commission of Oyer and Terminer He pleaded Not Guilty But being found Guilty Judgment passed on him to dye as a Traytor But he was by a Warrant from the King beheaded Upon the 22d of June being the day of his Execution he dressed himself with more than ordinary care and when his Man took notice of it he told him he was to be that day a Bridegroom As he was led to the place of Execution being stop'd in the way by the croud he opened his New Testament and prayed to this purpose that as that Book had been his Companion and chief Comfort in his Imprisonment so then some place might turn up to him that might comfort him in his last passage This being said he opened the Book at a venture in which these words of St. Johns Gospel turn'd up This is Life eternal to know thee the only true God and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent So he shut the Book with much satisfaction and all the way was reading and meditating on them When he came to the Scaffold he pronounced the Te Deum And after some other Devotions his Head was cut off Thus dyed Jon Fisher Bishop of Rochester in the 80th year of his age He was a learned and devour man says Burnet but much addicted to the Superstitions in which he had been bred up and that led him to great severities against all that opposed them He had been for many years Confessor to the Kings Grandmother the Countess of Richmond And it was believed that he persuaded her to those noble designs fer the Advancement of Learning of founding 2 Colledges in Cambridge St. Johns and Christs Colledge and Divinity Professors in both Universities And in acknowledgement of this he was chosen Chancellor of the University of Cambridge Henry 7. gave him the Bishoprick of Rochester which he following the rule of the primitive Church would never change for a better He used to say his Church was his Wife and he would never part with her because she was poor He continued in great Favour with Henry 8. till the business of the Divorce was set on foot and then he adhered so firmly to the Queens Cause and the Popes Supremacy that he was carried headlong into great Errors So Burnet after his petulant manner is pleased to character this good man pag. 354. 1. vol. But then adds Many thought the King ought to have proceeded against him rather upon that which was a point of State than upon the Supremacy which was matter of Conscienec but the King saith he was resolved to let all his Subjects see there was no Mercy to be expected by any that denyed his being Supreme Head of the Church and therefore made him and Sir Thomas More two Examples for terrifying the rest Burnet ibid. But the Courage and Christian Soul of this Bishop appears in those Speeches which he made in the House of Lords whereof there is no mention in Burnet Which for the primitive Simplicity and Honesty thereof I shall here transcribe out of Dr. Bayly's History The First Speech concerning the Demand of the Smaller Abbies for the Kings Use My Lords I Pray you to take good heed unto what you are doing lest you do you know not what For indeed the things that are demanded at our hands are not ours to grant nor theirs to whom we should bestow them
his Disciples Feet saying Si ego lavi pedes vestr●s c. If I being your Lord and Master have washed your feet ye also ought to wash the feet of one another This was a Precept yet hath the Church altered it lest the simple people should think a Re-baptization in it Why do not Protestants observe Christs Institution of washing one anothers feet before they receive the Sacrament So because the Apostle saith Accepi a Domino quod tradidi vobis c. I have received of the Lord the same which I delivered unto you that our Lord the same night that he was betrayed c. notwithstanding Christs Precept that the Sacrament should be administred after Supper the Church hath commanded it to be received fasting and Protestants do receive it before dinner And where Christ did break the Bread we receive the whole Host Christ ministred sitting at the Table we standing at the Altar Likewise it is commanded in the Acts that Christians should abstain à suffocato sanguine from things strangled and from blood but the Church hath altered it nor do Protestants observe it God commanded the Sabbath or Seventh day to be kept holy the Church hath altered it to the Sunday If then the Church may change things so expresly appointed in Scripture she may also change the form of the Laitys receiving under both kinds and that for divers reasons First That in carrying it to the Sick the Blood may not be shed lost or misused Next That no occasion might be given to Heretiques to think that there is not so much under one kind as under both But why would you have it under both kinds only to pervert and contradict the Practice of the Church For when you have it under both kinds ye believed in neither meaning a real presence in neither Now Sir as concerning the Sacrament of the Altar where you say you have a number of Doctors on your side and we none of ours indeed one to stop your mouth I think it not possible to find Nevertheless whereas your desire is to have one shewed you and then you will recant I will shew you two Ferebatur manibus suis saith St. Austin super Psal 33. I find not how this is true in David saith he literally that he was born in his own hands but in Christ I find it true literally when he gave his Body to his Apostles at his last Supper Again St. Cyprian de Coena Domini saith Panis quem Dominus Discipulis porrigebat non effigie sed natura mutatus Omnipotentia Verbi factus est Caro. What can be more plain than this yet to you it is not plain enough But give me your figurative significative and such other like terms and I will defend that Christ hath not yet ascended no nor yet that he was incarnate Wherefore I can only put you in the number of those whom S. Chrysostom speaks of Audi homo fidelis qui contra Haereticum contendis c. Hear O thou Christian canst thou hope to do more than Christ Christ confuted the Pharesees yet could not put them to silence Et tu fortior es Christo Wilt thou go about to silence him that will receive no Answer Thus much have I said not for you Mr. Cranmer for my hope that I conceived of you is now past and gone but somewhat to satisfie the rude unlearned people that they perceiving your Arrogancy may the better eschew your detestable and abominable Schism Fox pag. 658 659. Thus spake the Bishop of Glocester like a Catholique understanding Prelate After whom Dr. Story saith Fox thus inferred in words Master Cranmer you have made a goodly Process concerning your Heretical Oath made to the King but you forget your Oath made to the See Apostolique As concerning your Oath to the King if you made it to him only it took an end by his Death and so it is released if to his Successors well Sir the true Successors have the Empire now and they will have you to dissolve the same and become a member of Christs Church again it was no Oath for it lacked the three points of an Oath that is to say Justiciam Judicium Veritatem Thus Dr Story ibid. p. 659. Protestants will needs swear the King to be Supream in all Spiritual things or causes whether the King will or no and when they have sworn it they will obey him in such matters so far as they think good when he happens to be a Papist A. What followed after this B. After all this Cranmer made that Recantation which you have heard and retracted it again when he saw no hopes of his Pardon He had this reason to rejoyce says Fox that dying in such a Cause he was to be numbered amongst Christs Martyrs although he had no mind to be a Martyr much more worthy the Name of Saint Thomas of Canterbury than he whom the Pope had falsly canoniz'd meaning Thomas Becker p. 672. A. Of what Church dyed he a Member B. I cannot tell the Church of England being then abolished and Catholique Religion restored by Act of Parliament A. One Question you have not answered what were the Words of his Mission and Consecration both as Priest and Bishop B. That you shall hear by and by Give me leave to observe one or two passages more out of Dr. Burnet A. As to what Point B. As to that Candour and Simplicity which Burnet admires in him page 172. 1. vol. The Story is thus Burnet p. 172. second volume viz. In the year 1551. the fifth year of Edward the Sixth the business of the Lady Mary was taken up with more heat than formerly The Emperors earnest Suit that she might have Mass said in her House was long rejected Yet the State of England making his Friendship at that time necessary to the King and he refusing to continue in his League unless his Kinswoman obtained that Favour it was promised that for some time in hope she would reform there should be a Forbearance granted The Emperors Ambassador pressed to have a License for it under the great Seal it was answered that being against Law it could not be done The two grounds she went upon were that she would follow the ancient and universal way of Worship and not a new Invention that lay within the Four Seas these were her words and that she would continue in that Religion in which her Father King Henry had instructed her To this the King sent an Answer he was then scarce 14 years of age telling her that she was a part of this Church and Nation and so must conform her self to the Laws of it the Laws made by Cranmer Sommerset Dudley c. and that the way of Worship now set up was no other than what was clearly consonant to the pure Word of God that was King Edwards first Common Prayer Book which expresly commanded Prayers for the dead After this she was sent for to Court and
it by their own Authority For saith the Doctor a common Concurrence of other Churches was a thing scarce to be expected and therefore this Church must be in a very ill condition if there could be no endeavours for a Reformation till all the rest were brought together ibid. page 7. B. The design of this Catechism is to shew by the Doctors own Confession that the English Reformation was not the Act and Deed of the National Church or Clergy of England neither in the days of Henry VIII nor of his Son Edward VI nor of Queen Elisabeth but impos'd upon the Nation by the Interest and Power of a few Persons for their own advantage viz. the raising their Fortunes out of Church Lands And when I have done this I shall leave you to think what you please of Mr. King's Modesty the Preacher of St. Warbroughs who in a late thing which he calls an Answer to Dean Manby's Considerations affirms very confidently page 25. He viz. Cranmer in all he did had the unanimous Vote and Consent of the major part of the Convocation the universal Submission of the Clergy and Approbation of the People And a little after But if the Clergy in a National Council and the People in Obedience to them or from their own Inclinations did comply in earnest what an idle Question is it to ask by what Authority Cranmer condemned that Church from whom he received his Mission and Holy Orders when she concurred in all he did and approved nay made all the Alterations in her Liturgy Sacraments and Constitutions that were made c. A. But I pray go on in the method which at first you prescribed to your self and tell us in the Doctors words the History of those who promoted the Reformation under Henry VIII and his Son Edward VI. and then what observable passages you have met with touching the Reformation it self I am satisfied that King Henry by the Doctors Account of him had little thoughts of Reformation whilst he had the least hopes of the Popes complyance in the matter of his Divorce from Queen Katherine B. The chief Apostles under Henry VIII were Ann Bolen Cromwell Cranmer Latimer Shaxton Barlow A. What were the extraordinary Vertues of Ann Bolen B. She favoured the Reformers their chief Encouragement was from her who reigned in the King's Heart as absolutely as he did over his Subjects and was a known Favourer of them She took Shaxton and Latimer to be her Chaplains ad soon after promoted them to the Bishopricks of Salisbury and Worcester and in all other things cherished and protected them and used her most effectual endeavours with the King to promote the Reformation page 171 of his first Vol. second Edition A. What more B. Every Body admired Queen Ann's Conduct who had managed such a Kings Spirit so long and had neither surfeited him with great freedom the Doctor speaks of her cunning behaviour before the King married her nor provoked him by the other extream For the King who was extreamly nice in these matters conceived still an higher opinion of her And her being so soon with Child after the Marriage as it made people conclude she had been Chast till then so they hoped for a Blessing upon it since there were such early appearances of Issue Those that favoured the Reformation expected better days under her Protection for they knew she favoured them page 132. 1 vol. A. But how did this Zealous Reformer behave her self after her Marriage B. This being saith the Doctor one of the most memorable passages of King Henry's Reign I was at more then Ordinary pains to learn all I could concerning it She was of a very cheerful temper which was not always limited within the bounds of exact Decency and Discretion She had rallied some of the King's Servants more than became her her Brother the Lord Rochford was her Friend as well as Brother But his spiteful Wife was jealous of him and being a Woman of no sort of Vertue she carried many Stories to the King or some about him to perswade that there was a familiarity between the Queen and her Brother beyond what so near a Relation could justify Henry Norris that was Groom of the Stool Weston and Brereton that were of the King's Privy-Chamber and one Mark Smeton a Musician were all observed to have much of her Favour And their Zeal in serving her was thought too warm and diligent to flow from a less active principle then Love. Many Circumstances were brought to the King which working upon his aversion to the Queen together with his Affection to Mrs Seymeur made him conclude her Guilty Yet somewhat which himself observed or fancied at a Tilting at Greenwich is believed to have given the Crisis to her Ruin. It is said that he spied her let fall her Handkerchief to one of her Gallants to wipe his Face being hot after a course See the rest page 197. 1 vol. A. Did she confess nothing B. She confessed this odd passage between her self and Sir Henry Norris That she once asked him why he did not go on with his Marriage Who answered her that he would yet tarry some time to which she replyed you look for Dead Mens Shoos for if ought come to the King but good you would look to have Me He answered if he had any such thought he would his Head were cut off Upon which she said she could undo him if she pleased and thereupon she fell out with him page 199. As for Mark Smeton who was then laid in Irons she said he was never in her Chamber but when the King was last at Winchester And then he came in to play on the Virginals She said that she never spoke to him after that but on Saturday before May-day when she saw him standing in the Window and then she asked him Why he was so sad he said it was no matter She answered you may not look to have me speak to you as if you were a Noble Man since you are an inferiour person No no Madam said he a Look sufficeth me ibid. page 199. She seemed more apprehensive of Weslon then of any Body For on Whit-Sunday Morning last he said to her that Norris came more to her Chamber upon her account than for any body else that was there She had observed that he loved a Kinswoman of hers and challenged him for it and for not loving his Wife But he answered her that there were Women in the House whom he loved better then them both she asked who is that your self said he upon which she said she desied him ibid. page 197. A. What is the Doctors opinion of this B. It is certain her Carriage had given just cause of some Jealousy page 206. A. How did other people Censure her B. Her Carriage seemed too free and all people thought saith the Doctor that some Freedoms and Levities in her had encouraged those unfortunate Persons to speak such bold things to her
who had obsequiously applied themselves to her Love Service acknowledging such passages mark this though not sufficient to condemn her as shewed she had made use of the utmost liberty which could be honestly allowed her There was no Evidence against her but the Confession of Smeton and the Calumnies of the Lady Rochfort of which the one was fooled into that Confession by the hope of Life which notwithstanding was not pardoned and the other most deservedly lost her Head within few years after Heylin Hist Reform pag. 264 265. I have added this favourable account out of Heylin to let the Reader see the mistake of that Character which Doctor Burnet gives of him in the Preface to his first volum viz. He being wrought on by most violent prejudices against some that were concerned in that time delivers many things in such a manner and so strangely that one would think he had been secretly set on by those of the Church of Rome c. If ever Heylin were set on to serve the Church of Rome it must be surely in the History of Ann Bolen upon which there is so much depending in reference to the Birth and Title of Queen Elisabeth But the Reader may find him relating her whole Story so favourably I mean this Story of her Misfortunes that Burnet himself could not say more yet whoever compares both Writers shall find I have left out nothing material that may be observ'd here in favour of Ann Bolen Sir Henry Norris was practised with to confess the Adultery says Heylin to which he made this generous Answer that in his Conscience he thought her guiltless of the Crimes objected against her c. and the Lord Peircy took the Sacrament wishing that the same might be his Damnation if ever there were any Contract or Promise of Marriage betwixt her and him Heylin p. 255 256. A. But she justifyed her Innocency in a Letter to the King from the Tower dated May 6. 1536. did she not B. You may find that Letter in Dr. Burnets Records annexed to his first vol. pag. 155. wherein she thus expresses her self But if you have already determined of me and that not only my Death but an infamous Slander must bring you the enjoyment of your desired happiness then I desire of God that he will pardon your great sin therein and that he will not call you to a strict account for your unprincely and cruel usage of me at his general Judgment-seat where both you and my self must shortly appear c. A. What did she say at her Execution May 19. 1536 B. She spoke some words which I am not able to reconcile with that same passage of her Letter A. What were the words B. She prayed heartily for the King and called him a most merciful and gentle Prince and that he had been always to her a good gentle Soveregin Lord She said she was come to dye as she was judged by the Law. She would accuse none nor say any thing of the ground upon which she was judged And if any would meddle with her Cause she required them to judge the best Dr. Burnet 1. vol. p. 205. NOTE In her Letter from the Tower she objects to him his unprincely and cruel usage of her And here at her Death she calls him a most merciful and gentle Prince and that he had been always to her a good gentle Sovereign Lord. I will not say she affirmed at her Death what she did not believe or that she complemented the King as having to the very last some hopes of his Mercy but the Reader may consult Doctor Burnet and try if he can sind ought to reconcile these passages A. Tell us the rest of her Story B. The day before she dyed upon a strict search of her past Life she called to mind that she had played the step Mother to the Lady Mary and had done her many Injuries upon which she desired the Lieutenant of the Towers Lady and with many Tears charged her as she would Answer it to God to go in her name and ask the Lady Mary's Forgiveness for the Wrongs she had done her c. page 204. This ingenuity and tenderness of Conscience about lesser matters this was but a Venial sin perhaps is a great presumption saith the Doctor that if she had been Guilty of more eminent Faults she had not continued to the last denying them NOTE It is a wonder she did not assert her own Innocency upon the Scaffold The Night before she suffered she sent her last Message to the King and acknowledged her self much obliged to him that he had continued still to advance her from a private Gentlewoman to a Marchioness from that to a Queen and now was sending her to be a Saint in Heaven page 204. 1 Vol. A. What were the several Opinions passed upon her B. The Doctor tells you the Popish Party said the Justice of God was visible that she who had supplanted Queen Katherine met with the like measure he means by Jane Seymour Some took notice of her faint justifying her self on the Scaffold as if her Conscience had then prevailed so far that she could no longer deny a thing for which she was so soon to Answer at another Tribunal But others thought her care of her Daughter made her speak so tenderly for she had observed that Queen Katherines obstinacy had drawn the King's Indignation on Lady Mary Therefore she spoke in a stile says the Doctor that could give the King no just offence page 206. He proceeds Some have since that time concluded it a great Evidence of her Guilt that during her Daughters Queen Elisabeths long and glorious Reign there was no full nor compleat Vindication of her publisht For the Writers of that time thought it enough to speak honorably of her and in general to call her Innecent but none of them ever at tempted a clear discussion of the particulars laid to her Charge This had been much to her Daughters Honour saith Dr. Burnet and therefore since it was not done others concluded it could not be done and that their knowledge of her Guilt restrained their Pens But others do not at all allow of that Inference and think rather that it was the great Wisdom of that time not to suffer such things to be called in question therefore it was prudently done of that Queen Elisabeth and her great Ministers not to suffer any Vindication or Apology to be written c. Some Indiscretions saith the Doctor could not be denied p. 207. 1. vel that is 't is confest on all hands that Ann Bolen went to the very brink of Dishonesty A. Is there nothing else of her that is memorable B. King Henry advanced her says Heylin to the Title of Marchioness of Pembroke on the first of September 1532. assigning her a Pension of a Thousand pounds per annum out of the Bishop rick of Durham History of Reform p. 261. The new Queen considering that the Pope
finding that nothing went so near the King's Heart Edward VI as the ruin of Religion which he apprehended would follow upon his Death when his Sister Mary should come to the Crown upon that he and his party took advantage to propose to him to settle the Crown by his Letters Patents on the Lady Jane Grey then newly married to Guilford Dudley Northumberlands fourth Son how they prevailed with him to pass by his Sister Elisabeth who had been always much in his Favour I do not so well understand But the King being wrought over to this on the 11th of June Mountague Chief Justice of the Common-Pleas Baker and Bromly two Judges with the King's Attorney and Solicitor were commanded to come to Council There they found the King with some Privy-Councellors about him The King told them he did now apprehend the danger the Kingdom might be in by the Succession of his Sister Mary So he ordered some Articles to be read to them of the way in which he would have the Crown to descend They objected that an Act of Parliament could not be taken away by any such Device yet the King required them to take the Articles and draw a Book according to them They asked a little time to consider of it So having examined the Statute of the first year of his Reign they found that it was Treason not only after the King's Death but in his life time to change the Succession Secretary Petre in the mean time pressed them to make haste When they came again to the Council they declared they could not do any such thing for it was Treason And all the Lords should be Guilty of Treason if they went on in it Upon which the Duke of Northumberland who was not then in the Council Chamber being advertised of this came in great Fury calling Mountague a Traitor But the Judges stood to their Opinion They were again sent for and came on the 15th of June The King was present and somewhat sharply asked them why they had not prepared the Book as he had ordered them They answered that whatever they did would be of no force without a Parliament But the King said he would have it first done and then ratified in Parliament and therefore required them on their Allegiance to go about it and some Councellors told them if they refused to Obey that they were Traytors This put them in a great Consternation and Old Mountague thinking it could not be Treason whatever they did in this matter while the King lived and at worst that a Pardon under the great Seal would secure him consented to set about it if he might have a Commission requiring him to do it and a Pardon when it was done both these being granted him he was satisfyed The other Judges being asked if they would concur did all agree being overcome with fear except Hales But Cranmer still refused to do it after they had all signed it and said he would never consent to the Disinheriting of the Daughters of his late Master Many Consultations were had to perswade him to it but he could not be prevailed on till the King himself set on him who used many Arguments from the danger Religion would otherwise be in together with other Perswasions so that by his Reasons or rather Importunities at last he brought him to it NOTE The Doctors excuse for this unjust Act of Cranmers importunity the same that naughty Women are said to pretend for their Incontinency If he did this only as submitting to his Princes importunity how came he after King Edward 's Death to Subscribe the aforesaid Letter And to do both after he had said he he would never consent to the disinheriting of King Henry 's Children The Reader may now understand the reason why he answered little or nothing to the Treason objected to him by the Bishop of Glocester because there was too much Truth in it And methinks this excuse which Burnet makes for him does him no service namely that he stood off a good while but at last with much a do was perswaded into this Conspiracy against K. Henry 's Children How does this answer the Character which Fox gives of him in causes pertaining to God and his Prince no Man more stout no Man more constant then he But whether he was in reality so unwilling to this Action is a question which the indifferent Reader may easily resolve Since he could not but apprehend that Queen Mary would call him to an account for the troubles he had brought upon her Mother and indeed upon the whole Church and Kingdom of England For amongst all the English Bishops anno 1533. King Henry could not find such another Person as Burnet confesses to serve him in the See of Canterbury Now as for Mountague Chief Justice of the Common Plea's and the rest of the Judges who at last consented to the advancement of Lady Jane Grey you may observe them scrupling the matter not out of Conscience but apprehension of the Law. All that they desired was to be indemnified from the danger of Law. A. Now go on to relate how he acquitted himself of the other particulars laid to his Charge Heresie Perjury Incontinency B. Although he answered nothing to the Bishop of Glocester concerning the point of Treason yet I remember somewhat in Fox which he reply'd to Doctor Martyn the Queen's Proctor viz. I protest before God I was no Traytor but indeed I confessed more at my Arraignment than was true Martyn returns that is not to be reasoned at this present you know you were condemned for a Traytor Fox page 653. 3 Vol. A. Is there no more in Fox as to that point B. Not a word more that I can find A. Then proceed as to the particular of Heresie B. John Foxes words are these As for the matter of Heresie and Schism wherewith he was charged he protested and called God to witness that he knew none that he maintained But if that were an Heresie to deny the Popes Authority and the Religion which the See of Rome hath published to the World these later years then the Apostles and Christ himself taught Heresie and he desired all then present to bear him witness that he took the Traditions and Religion of that usurping Prelate to be most false erroneous and against the Doctrine of the whole Scripture That he is the very Antichrist so often preached of by the Apostles and Prophets For it was most evident that he had advanced himself above all Emperors and Kings of the World whom he affirmeth to hold their Estates and Empires of him as their Chief and to be deposed at his good Will and Pleasure That he hath brought in Gods of his own Framing and invented a new Religion full of Gain and Lucre. This Enemy of God and of our Redemption is so evidently painted out in the Scriptures by such manifest Signs and Tokens that except a man will shut up his Eyes and Heart against the
Head of the Church of England under Christ as well in all spiritual things or causes as temporal what better Answers in brief could be returned to the Questions of Dr. Martin Cranmer having sworn that the King was Supream Head of the Church of England under Christ as well in all spiritual things or causes as temporal A. But how did he interpret those words as well in all spiriritual things or causes as temporal B. Fox tells you p. 662. viz. After this Dr. Martyn demanded of him who was Supream Head of the Church of England Marry quoth my Lord of Canterbury Christ is Head of this Member as he is of the whole Body of the Universal Church Why quoth Dr. Martyn you made King Henry the 8th Supream Head of the Church Yea said the Archbishop of all the people of England as well Ecclesiastical as Temporal And not of the Church said Martyn No said he for Christ is only Head of his Church and of the Faith and Religion of the same the King is Head and Governour of his People which are the visible Church What quoth Martyn you never durst tell the King so Yes that I durst quoth he and did in the publication of his Stile wherein he was named Supream Head of the Church there was never other thing meant page 662. This is Foxes account of the Dialogue received as he says from a better hand A. Did he answer any thing further concerning the Perjury objected to him B. Fox tells you Others who were present at his Tryal do thus report the effect of Cranmers words viz. while he in this sort made his Answer ye heard before how Dr. Story and Martyn divers times interrupted him with blasphemous Talk and would sain have had the Bishop of Glocester to put him to silence who notwithstanding did not but suffered him to end his Tale at full After this ye heard also how they proceeded to examine him of divers Articles whereof the chief was that at the time of his creating Archbishop of Canterbury he was sworn to the Pope and had his Institution and Induction from him and promised then to maintain the Authority of that See and therefore was perjured wherefore he should rather stick to his first Oath and return to his old fold again than continue obstinately in an Oath forced in the time of Schism To that he answered says Fox saving his Protestation which term he used before all his Answers that at such time as Archbishop Warham dyed he was Ambassador in Germany for the King who thereupon sent for him home and having intelligence by some of his Friends near about the King how he meant to bestow the same Bishoprick upon him and therefore counselled him in that case to make haste home he feeling in himself a great inability to such a Promotion and very sorry to leave his Study and especially considering by what means he must have it which was clean against his Conscience which he could not utter without great peril and danger devised an Excuse to the King of matter of great importance for the which his longer abode there should be most necessary thinking by that means in his absence the King would bestow it upon some other and so remained there by that device one half year after the King had written for him to come but after that no such matter fell out as he seemed to make suspicion of the King sent for him again Who after his return understanding still the Archbishoprick to be reserved for him made means by divers of his best Friends to shift it off desiring rather some smaller Living that he might more quietly follow his Book To be brief when the King himself spake with him declaring that his full intention was for his Service sake note this and for the good opinion he conceived of him to bestow that Dignity upon him Fox proceeds After long disabling of himself perceiving he could by no perswasions alter the Kings determination he brake frankly his Conscience with him most humbly craving first his Graces Pardon for what he should declare unto his Highness Which obtained he said that if he accepted the Office he must receive it at the Popes hand which he neither would nor could do His Highness being the only Supream Governour of this Church of England as well in causes Ecclesiastical as Temporal this was a Chaplain after King Henry's own Heart And therefore if he might in that Vocation serve God the King and his Country seeing it was his pleasure so to have it he would accept that Dignity and receive it of his Majesty and of no Stranger who had no Authority within this Realm Whereat the King said he staying a while and musing asked me How I was able to prove that At which time I alledged many Texts out of Scripture and the Fathers also approving the Supream and highest Authority of Kings within their own Realms shewing withall the intolerable usurpation of the Pope of Rome Afterwards it pleased his Highness quoth the Archbishop many and sundry times to talk with me about it and perceiving that I could not be brought to acknowledge the Authority of the Bishop of Rome the King himself called Doctor Oliver and other Civil Lawyers to advise with them how he might bestow the Archbishoprick upon me inforcing me nothing against my Conscience who thereupon informed him that I might do it by the way of Protestation and so one to be sent to Rome who might take the Oath and do every thing in my name which when I understood I said he should do it super Animam suam And I indeed bona fide made by Protestation that I did not acknowledge his Authority any further then as it agreed with the express Word of God And that it might be lawful for me at all times to speak against him and to impugn his Errors when time and occasion should serve me And this my Protestation I did cause to be inrolled and there I think it remains This says Fox is the faithful Relation and Testimony of certain Persons that were present at his Tryal before the Bishop of Glocester See page 661 662. Reader Remember what Doctor Martyn observes page 60. Hearken good People to what this man saith he makes a Protestation one day to keep never a tittle of that which he intended to swear next day See the Tenour of his Oath to the Pope page 28. of this Catechism A. What did he answer to the particular of Incontinency or breach of his Sacerdotal Vow B. Dr. Martyn objected that being in holy Orders after the Death of his first Wife he married a second named Ann and kept her secretly in the days of King Henry 8. Whereunto he answered that it was better for him to have his own Wife than to do like other Priests holding and keeping other mens wives But the Question is whether other mens vices could be any excuse for him he seems to suppose here every man to be