and yet you were suffered to go on Mr. Sol. Gen. He tells you of a discourse as he came from the Coffee-House to go to a Dinner whither he was invited by Alderman Wilcox and the discourse was that the King was as great a Papist as the Duke and much more to that purpose vilifying the King The Alderman Wilcox was a man that gave money to buy Arms to bring the King to submission He objects against this and says 't is impossible such a discourse should be and that all this should be talked in so little a time as in passing from the Coffee-House to the Crown Tavern without Temple-Bar Coll. Pray remember whose company it was proved I went in Mr. Solicitor Mr. Sol. Gen. But Gentlemen when you consider how busie a man he was and how ready at talking of Treason you will not think but that this man might talk much more than this but this I mention to do him right it being one of the Arguments he used and to give an answer to it tho' when you consider it I believe you will think it not to need an Answer But I would do him all the right I can and now you have heard it you will consider the weight of it Gentlemen he tells you of another discourse afterwards that does relate to his being here at Oxon. he tells you he had Arms in his House and was ready upon all occasions and he shew'd Mr. Smith his Arms and told him these were the things that were to destroy Rowley's Guards as he said which by the Evidence is made to appear he meant the King by that name his Arms he said were for that purpose That he would go down to Oxon. and there he expected some sport I know not what sport he thinks there is in Rebellion you see what principles he is of that does maintain and justifie the greatest and horrid'st Rebellion that ever was in England and says they did nothing but what they had good cause for He tells Smith that he thought the King would seize upon some Members and with that expectation he came down but he was as ready as the King and would be one in the securing of him if he medled with any of the Members This proof Mr. Smith made and that after the Parliament was dissolved he said that the King ran away and was very much afraid This is proved by Smith likewise and this Colledge did declare after he came to Town Smith proves further that he did wonder the King did not consider how easily his Fathers Head was brought to the Block and for Mr. Colledges part he did declare that he did believe this King would be served so shortly And this does confirm what his other Witnesses have spoken of his words at Oxon. Thus then there are three Witnesses tho' two are enough to convict a man if they be positive to the Treason Mr. Haynes is the 4th Witness and he is as full as any of them I do but repeat it in short you have had it so often canvassed by Colledge that I believe you will easily remember it He did advise Haynes that he should not value the King at all for the King should be called to account for all his Actions he said he would seize the King and bring him to the Block as they did his Father with an undecent expression of that blessed King not fit to be repeated And he said they did intend when they had cut off him never any more of his Race should raign this it was Haynes says tho' there are other matters I would take notice of one thing more and I need not but mention it you will remember it and that is about the Libel of Fitzharris Haynes tells you upon discourse of that Libel he said that every word of it was true as sure as God is in Heaven Now that was a Libel made by a Papist an Irish Papist who hath been tryed convicted and executed for it and the horrid'st Libel it was that ever was Writ And this is the Libel which this Gentleman who is so very conversant in Libels and Books of that sort avers to be as true as God is in Heaven This is the substance Gentlemen of that proof which hath been made to you we have other circumstances to prove that as he came down with that intent to seize the King and as he expected what he calls some sport so he did endeavour to begin the sport he did quarrel in the Lobby of the House of Lords with Fitzgerald some blows passed and Sir William Jennings telling him his Nose bled he did declare I have lost the first Blood in the Cause but it will not be long before there be more lost Thus after he had come down he endeavoured to begin a commotion for from little matters great things do sometimes arise and when all men were possest with an expectation such as he himself did declare he and others came down with an expectation that the Parliament should be attacked a little matter might have begun such a commotion which no man knows what end it would have had Gentlemen this hath been our proof Now the Objection made to this proof by Mr. Colledge is That this is a Popish design to raise a new Plot and cast it upon the Protestants and that these Witnesses are now to deny all the Evidence they have given of the Popish Plot and throw all upon the Protestants This is that he would persuade you to believe but which I think when you do consider a little of it it will be impossible for you in the least to have such a thought For what are the Evidence that have proved this who are they men of credit that have been Evidences against the Popish Plotters and against men that have suffered for that Plot men that still stand to the Evidence they have given and affirm it every word to be true and one of the very men that he brought says that they still stand to it for Turbervile who was one of the Witnesses against my Lord Stafford was tempted by some persons to deny the Evidence he had given against the Papists but his answer was no I can never depart from it I have a Soul to save that was true which I said I cannot deny it If then the Witnesses which he would have you believe to be guilty of denying the Popish Plot do confirm what they have said as to that discovery that objection is taken off and they do stand still to it that every part of it was true and aver the same thing and yet forsooth these men are going about to stifle this Plot. Gentlemen these are the men the whole nation have given credit to the Parliament having impeached my Lord Stafford upon the credit of them for it was upon the credit of Dugdale and Turbervile that they impeached him for there was not two witnesses till Turbervile came in and made a second and upon their
House I should see how he was prepared with Arms and Provision Soon after I met with him and he desired me to go along and dine with him and I did so and there he did shew me his Pistols his Blunderbuss his great Sword and he shewed me his Armour Back and Breast and he shewed me his Head-piece which if I am not mistaken was covered over with Chamlet it was a very fine thing and said he These are the things which will destroy the pitiful Guards of Rowley that are kept up contrary to Law and Justice to set up Arbitrary Power and Popery Colledge What did I say Sir about my Armour Mr. Smith Thus you said It was to destroy Rowley's Guards those were your words that were kept up contrary to Law and Justice to set up Arbitrary Power and Popery After I had dined with him I parted with him A little before the Parliament was to meet at Oxford I met him again and were discoursing of several things what preparations the City were making how they were provided with Powder and Bullets and for his part he would go down to Oxford for he expected a little sport there upon the divisions that were like to be between the King and Parliament Then said I to him why what is the matter there Why said he we expect that the King will seize upon some of the members and we are as ready as he And says he for my part I will be there and be one that shall seize him if he secure any of the members and I believe he did go down says he you know how the City is provided I told him no not so well as he but he told me all was very well After he came up again I met him another time and he told me he went down in expectation of some sport but Old Rowley was afraid like his Grand-father Jamy and so ran away like to beshit himself Mr. Ser. jeff. Did he say If he had not ran away he would have seized him Mr. Smith He said nothing of that but before he said He would be one of them should seize him if he seized any of the members After this he told me that Fitz-Gerald and he had had a quarrel at the Parliament-door of the House of Lords at Oxford that Fitz-Gerald had called him Rogue and said he Fitz-Gerald made my Nose bleed but before long I hope to see a great deal more Blood shed for the cause After this again when there was a discourse of disarming the City that my Lord Feversham was to come to do it he told me he was well provided and if Feversham or any man nay Rowley himself should attempt any such thing he would be the death of him before any man should seize upon his Arms. Mr. Serj. jeff. Did he discourse any thing to you about Arms to provide your self Mr. Smith Yes he did I had an Armour from him Mr. Ser. jeff. What did he say to you about it Mr. Smith He did desire me to get Arms for I did not know how soon I might make use of them I had an Armour from him upon trial he said it cost him 30 or 40 s. I had it upon trial but it was too big for me so I gave it him back and bought a new one Mr. Attorn Gen. Did he tell you to what purpose you should arm your self Mr. Smith No he did not name any purpose but he told me I did not know how soon I might make use of it Mr. Att. Gen. What did he say to you about any one's seizing the King Mr. Smith He told me the Parliament were agreed to secure the King and that in order to it all Parliament-men came very well armed and accompanied with arms and men and he told me of a great man that had notice from all the Gentlemen of England how well they came armed Mr. jones What did he say of himself Mr. Smith He would be one that should secure the King if he seized any of the members Mr. jones When he had been there what did he say Mr. Smith If they had had any work he was ready provided for them Mr. Att. Gen. But pray tell us again what he said of the Kings running away Mr. Smith He said Rowley was afraid like his Grand-father Jumy and ran away ready to beshit himself L. c. j. If you have done with him Mr. Attorney let the Prisoner ask him what Questions he will Colledge Mr. Smith Where was this discourse I had with you Mr. Smith Which do you mean the former part or the latter Colledge The first discourse you talk of what I told you going to Mr. Wilcox's to dinner and when it was Mr. Smith You know best when it was I can't exactly remember the time but you know 't is true Colledge Where was it Mr. Smith As we went along thither we had the first part of it and when we came thither you and I talked till Alderman Wilcox came in and you and I were alone together and several persons that were there were drawn into Cabals two by two Colledge Where Mr. Smith In the room where we dined and you know there was a little room by where some were drinking a Glass of Wine Coll. You say by two and two the company were drawn into Cabals Mr. Smith I tell you most of them were in Cabals two and two together only those two Gentlemen that belonged to the Alderman went up and down and gave Wine Coll. What Religion are you of Mr. Smith Is it for this man to ask me my Lord such a question Lo. ch just Yes answer him Mr. Smith I am a Protestant Coll. You were a Priest Mr. Smith Yes what then and I am in Orders now Colledge That was from the Church of Rome Mr. Smith Yes and that is a good Ordination I came in voluntarily to discover the Popish Plot and was no Pentioner nor received any Sallary from the King I have spent several pounds several scores of pounds but received no recompence And I was the Darling at one time all over the City when I did adhere to what they would have me to do Mr. Ser. jeff. Did not you swear against my Lord Stafford Mr. Att. Gen. Were not you a Witness Mr. Smith at my Lord Stafford's Tryal Mr. Smith In that case I did give a general account of the design of the Papists they did not then question my Reputation and I defie all the World to say any thing against it Colledge Pray hear me Sir if you please the first discourse that you speak of about Mr. Wilcox's being a good man for the Cause and contributing mony this was when we were at Dinner Mr. Smith This was that day when we went to dinner with him you know it very well Coll. Where were the other Discourses I had with you Mr. Smith Which part of them Colledge When I came from Oxford Mr. Smith By the Ditch side by your own House I have
brought back to me and taken away but to day I desire they may be returned Cl. of Cr. Are you Guilty or not Guilty Colledge Those Papers tell me I have a Plea in Law but what it is I cannot directly tell without my Papers Lo. ch just You must mention it and propose it and then we will do what is fitting for us to do in it Colledge I have not that method about me nor can I directly tell it without my Papers but 't is something of Law about the Indictment Lo. ch just You are not bound up to forms of Law For if you propose the matter never so loosely yet if it be a matter of avail and that which the Law is not clearly against you in you shall have Councel and time to draw it up in form Colledge I cannot propose the matter so regularly as if I had my Papers Mr. just jones You are not bound to propose it in formality of Law my Lord tells you only let us know what it is Colledge I have a priviledge in Law I hope you will give me the benefit of it Lo. ch Just We will deny you nothing that the Law gives you but we cannot give you councel It is not one particular case but the common course of Justice is concerned Without a matter of Law arises we cannot assign you Counsel if we would we cannot in Justice till you have proposed the matter which the Court thinks fit to be argued Colledge My Lord Coke says It is the Birth-right of every English-man to have Councel in matters of Law and Lilburne had it upon solemn Argument in his Tryal Mr. just jones What times were those That was before the High Court of Justice Mr. Att. Gen. If there be matter in Law it must be proposed to the Court and they are to judge whether it be a Point fit to be argued and then Councel is to be assigned you and not till then Colledge My Lord I know not but there may be somewhat in Law for me to plead to this Indictment till I have my Papers I can't tell what it is Lo. ch just We know nothing of your Papers what they are you must answer whether you be Guilty or not Guilty Colledge If I had my Papers I would answer to it immediately but I hope I shall not be murdered Mr. just jones Have a care of aspersing the Court. Pray who intends to murder you Mr. Serj. jefferies I remember in Lilburn's Tryal that he speaks of such words were used indeed Colledge My Lord I hope I shall not be deny'd what is necessary for my defence This design is not only against me but against all the Protestants Mr. Art Gen. How long have you been a Protestant Mr. Colledge Colledge Ever since I knew what Religion was Sir I never was any thing else For Gods sake my Lord let me have the justice of the Nation and what by Law an English-man ought to have Lo. ch just You must plead Guilty or not Guilty or you must shew some matter that you will plead that is proper for us to assign you Councel If we should record your refusal you would be judged to stand Mute and Sentence would pass upon you Colledge If I have a priviledge in Law as an English-man I will not forfeit it if I can help it for any thing in the world Therefore I desire I may have my Papers again that I may see if I can plead any thing in Law for if I have a priviledge by the Law before I will forfeit it you shall do what you please with me Lo. ch just You 'll have the advantage of all that matter that is in your Papers after you have pleaded if there be any advantage Colledge Pray my Lord order me my Papers that were taken away from me Lo. ch just They were not taken away by me Colledge They were taken away by the Keeper under pretence to bring them to your Lordship L. ch just I know not how you came by them There came one to me last night that is a common Sollicitor one Aaron Swith and desired he might have liberty to go and speak with the Prisoner I told him I did not understand till he were assigned by the Court that any could justifie Solliciting for a man that is accused of High Treason nor could any be of Councel till they were assigned for a defence against Treason ought to be by plain matters of Proof and Fact and not by artificial Cavils But if you will propose any thing of substance as a matter in Law which the Court shall think fit to be argued propose it and then we will assign you Councel Colledge Is it not my right that I ought to have a copy of the jury Lo. ch just Look you for that now you cited the Opinion of the Judges of the Kings-Bench My Brothers two of them that are here who are Judges in that Court say they know nothing of any such matter But I must tell you you have liberty by Law to challenge 35. by your sight premptorily without shewing cause They are bound to look upon you when they come to be sworn and if you have any just cause you may except against as many more as as you will But now we that proceed upon a Commission of Gaol-delivery are to proceed with expedition there are no particular men designed for a Jury that I know of But when you have pleaded we shall award the Sheriff to impannel a Jury Colledge If the Law allow me the liberty of challenging it does intend it me that I may challenge those persons that I think will do me no justice but where they are strangers unto me if I can have no information about any of them by my own enquiry or my friends I may challenge my friends as well as my foes and should there be any person that has a prejudice against me and I not know it he may chance to be one L. c. j. I hope they will be neither friends nor foes but true men Coll. I know not that my Lord. Mr. just jones This that you say as to a copy of the Jury is unseasonable There is no Jury nor can be awarded till you have pleaded There must be first Issue joyned and that cannot be but upon your Plea of not Guilty Therefore you must plead first and then say all you will Cl. of cr Are you Guilty or not Guilty Coll. My Lord may not I have a pannel of the Jury Mr. just jo There is no such thing in being Coll. I know not what to say to it pray my Lord let me have my papers Cl. of cr You have heard the opinion of the Court you must first plead Coll. I cannot plead first I must lose my life if I must I neither know who accuses me nor what it is they accuse me of 't is impossible I should defend my self if I have not my papers L. c. j. We know not what papers you
into such hands as the Court may have command over they shall be in the Sheriffs Sons hands and you shall have the immediate use of them Coll. If there be any thing else in those papers necessary for my Defence I pray I may have it L. c. j. The Speech is not fit for you what other papers would you have Coll. Another paper there is that is something of Law Mr. Just Jones Nothing but libellous and what is a scandal to the Government Mr. Att. Gen. You are to have nothing of matter of Law but what you are to propose your self Coll. If you take away all my helps I cannot propose any thing Mr. Serj. jeff. To allow you those papers is to allow you councel by a side Wind. L. c. j. Look you the papers of instructions shall be delivered to the Sheriffs Son who shall let you peruse it in this interval and make use of it in your Tryal but it must be in safe custody to be used upon further occasion as the Kings Attorney shall think fit Then the Court adjourn'd till 2 in the Afternoon Post meridiem At 2 a clock the Court returned and Proclamation was made for attendance and for the Under-Sheriff to return his Jury Coll. My Lord ought not I to have a copy of this Jury L. Ch. Just No they are to look upon you as they come to be sworn and then you are to challenge them Cl. of cr Stephen Colledge hold up thy hand and hearken to the Court those good men that you shall hear called and personally appear are to pass c. Colledge Pray Sir let the way be clear that I may see them Cl. of cr Ay Ay. Coll. Pray Sir how many are there of the Jury that appear Mr. Att. Gen. There are enough Cl. of cr Make Proclamation for Information which was done Cl. of cr Henry Standard who was Sworn Richard Croke who was challenged by the Prisoner William Bigg challenged Mr. just jones Do you challenge him peremptorily or with cause L. c. j. If he do not shew cause it must be supposed it is peremptory Colledge I suppose he was upon the Grand-Jury L. c. j. That would be a challenge with cause Mr. Bigg No I was not Coll. Then I do not challenge him I know him not He was Sworn Cl. of Cr. Thomas Marsh challenged Thomas Martin did not appear Gabriel Merry being almost a hundred years of age was excused Robert Bird Sworn John Shorter Sworn William Windlow Sworn Edward Ayres challenged William Ayres challenged And Richard Ayres challenged Charles Hobbs Sworn Roger Browne Sworn Timothy Doyley Sworn Richard Dutton challenged Ralph Wallis Sworn John Nash challenged John Benson Sworn John Piercy Sworn William Weâ—â— challenged And John Lawrence Sworn Then they were counted and their Names in Order thus Henry Standard William Bigg Robert Bird John Shorter William Windlow Charles Hobbs Roger Browne Timothy Doyley Ralph Wallis John Benson John Piercy John Lawrence L. c. j. Mr. Sheriff there are a great many of the Jury that are not Sworn they are discharged let them go out of the Court and so you will make room for the Witnesses Cl. of cr Gentlemen you of the Jury look upon the Prisoner and hearken to his Charge He stands Indicted by the name of Stephen Colledge late of Oxford in the County of Oxford Carpenter for that he as a false Traytor c. proved in the Indictment mutatis mutandis and upon this Indictment he hath been Arraigned c. Mr. North. May it please your Lordship and you Gentlemen that are Sworn this is an Indictment against Stephen Colledge the Prisoner at the Bar for an endeavour to raise a Rebellion within this Kingdom wherein he is accused and the Jury find that he as a false Traytor against the Kings Majesty contrary to the duty of his Allegiance on the 10th of March in the 33d year of the Kings Reign at Oxon. here did trayterously conspire and compass the death of the King and the Subversion of the Government and to raise a Rebellion in the Kingdom and to slaughter his Majesties Subjects to put the King to death to levy War against him and to deprive him of his Royal State and Government and to alter the Government at his own Will and Pleasure and to accomplish this he did at Oxon. here prepare Arms for the carrying on the War and excited one Edward Turbervile and others to arm themselves against the accomplishment of this Design and did declare his purpose was to seise the Kings person at Oxon. and that he was one of those that was to do it and to bring the said Turbervile and other Subjects to his purpose did falsly maliciously and traiterously declare in their Hearing that there was no good to be expected from the King that he minded nothing but the Destruction of his people and Arbitrary Government and to introduce Popery And this is laid to be against the Duty of his Allegiance against the Kings peace and against the form of the Statutes in those cases made and provided The Prisoner you hear upon his Arraignment hath pleaded Not guilty which Issue you are to try and if the Evidence for the King which are ready to be produced prove that which is laid to his charge you are to find it accordingly Mr. Att. Gen. May it please your Lordship and you Gentlemen of the Jury The Prisoner at the Bar stands indicted of a very high crime no less then High Treason and that too of the deepest dye it is for an Endeavour to destroy the King to subvert the Government to raise a Rebellion amongst the Kings Subjects And Gentlemen those Instances that we shall give you and produce our Evidence to for the proof of that are these He laid his Design to seise the King at Oxon. and he did not want his Accomplices to do it but they were not men Gentlemen that were Protestants but men that were Rebels in the late War they were men of such a kidney that he associated himself with and these were the persons that were to assist in this Attempt In order to this he had prepared Arms in an extraordinary manner Arms of a great value for one of his condition who is by Trade a Joyner for if a true estimate were taken of the value of the Arms I believe they were worth twice his whole Estate he prepared a good Horse extraordinary Pistols a Carbine a Coat of Maile an Head-piece and so being armed Cap-a-pee with that design he came hither to Oxon. And you will judge whether these be fit Tools for a Joyner Colledge I beseech you Sir have you any body to prove this if you have not you do hurt to the Jury as well as me to speak it Lo. Ch. Just Be patient Mr. Colledge and let Mr. Attorney go on to open the Charge I will tell you and the Jury too that what he says further then he makes good by proof and Witnesses will serve for
Upon which Colledge told me the King and all his Family were Papists and there was no good to be expected from him Then I replyed the King would perhaps surprize the Parliament or use some stratagem to bring them to his terms Said Mr. Colledge again I would he would begin but if he do not we will secure him till he comes to those terms we would have from him for here are several brave Fellows and many more are coming down that will joyn with it Mr. Att. Gen. Did he name any one Turberv No indeed he did not he himself had a case of Pistols a Sword and I believe he might have his Armour on Coll. Did I discourse who were to joyn with me Turberv No Mr. Colledge you did not name any body to me but Captain Browne was with you Mr. Att. Gen. Were you examined in my Lord Staffords Tryal Turberv Yes I was Mr. Att. Gen. Was this Gentleman sworn to your Reputation there Turberv No not to mine Coll. Pray how come we to talk of such things what occasion was there that I should talk Treason of the King to you was there any body besides us two there Turberv No Capt. Browne was gone to sleep and Lewes was gone out Mr. Att. Gen. It was not at dinner that you talked so Mr. Colledge he says Coll. Had they been at dinner with us there Turberv Yes and we had a Legg of boyled mutton to dinner Coll. Did you stay after dinner Turberv Yes and I lay with you afterwards upon the bed Coll. I thought you had said Capt. Browne went to sleep there Turberv Yes but he was gone too when we laid down together Coll. God forgive you I can say no more I never spoke one word of any such discourse in my life Mr. Att. Gen. Will you ask him any more Questions Coll. Mr. Turbervile when did you give in this Information against me Turbervile I gave it to the Grand Jury Colledge Not before Turbervile Yes I did Colledge When was it Turbervile Truly I can't well tell I believe it was a day or two before I came to Oxon. Coll. Why did you make it then and not before Turbervile I 'll tell you the occasion Mr. Dugdale told me the Grand Jury of London would not find the Bill I did admire at it extremely for I thought every one that conversed with him might be an Evidence against him he was always so very lavish against the King and the Government So then Colonel Warcupp came to me and took my Depositions and then I came for Oxford Colledge VVhat was the reason you did not discover this Treason before Turbervile There was no reason for it it was not necessary Coll. You were not agreed then Turbervile There was no agreement in the case there needs nothing of that I think but I am not obliged to give you an account of it Colledge God forgive you Mr. Turbervile Turberv And you too Mr. Colledge Mr. Att. Gen. Then call Sir VVilliam Jennings Mr. Serj. jeff. Mr. Attorney if you please till he comes I will acquaint my Lord here is a Gentleman that hath not yet been taken notice of one Mr. Masters that is pretty well known to Mr. Colledge now he is a man he must acknowledge of an undoubted Reputation and I desire he may give your Lordship and the Jury an account what he knows of the Prisoner because he is so curious for English-men we have brought him an English-man of a very good repute Colledge My Lord I am charged with Treason in this Indictment here are a great many things made use of that serve only to amuse the Jury I can conjecture nothing else they are brought for I desire to know whether the Pictures produced are part of the Treason Lo. ch just Stay till the Evidence is given and we will hear what you can say at large when you come to summ up your Defence Mr. Ser. jeff. Pray my Lord will you be pleased to hear this Gentleman He will tell you what discourse he hath had with the Prisoner at the Bar. Then Mr. Masters was Sworn Mr. Masters Mr. Colledge and I have been acquainted for a great many years and we have often discoursed I have told him of his being so violent as he hath been several times But a little before the Parliament at Oxon. about Christmass last after the Parliament at VVestminster at Mr. Charlton's Shop the Woollen-Draper in Paul's Church-yard we were discoursing together about the Government and he was justifying of the late long Parliaments Actions in 40 and he said That Parliament was as good a Parliament as ever was chosen in the Nation Said I I wonder how you have the impudence to justify their Proceedings that raised the Rebellion against the King and cut off his Head Said he they did nothing but what they had just cause for and the Parliament that sate last at VVestminster was of their opinion and so you would have seen it Mr. Ser. jeff. What did he say of the Parliament since Mr. Masters He said the Parliament that sate last at VVestminster was of the same opinion that that Parliament was Mr. Ser. Jeff. Pray afterwards what discourse had you about his Colonelship Mr. Masters We were talking at Guild-Hall that day the Common-Council was the 13th of May as near as I remember so I came to him How now Colonel Colledge said I what do you make this bustle for You mistook me and said Cousin how long have you and I been Cousins nay prithee said I 't is not yet come to that to own Kindred between us I only called you Colonel in jest Marry mock not said he I may be one in a little time Mr. Serj. jeff. Have you any thing to ask Mr. Masters you know he is your old acquaintance you know him well Then Sir William Jennings was Sworn Mr. jones What is it that you know concerning Mr. Colledge at Oxford Sir Sir VVilliam Jennings My Lord the first time that I heard any thing of Mr. Colledge was there was some company looking upon a Picture for I knew him not nor never had any word of discourse with him in my life any more then seeing him in a publick Coffee-House But there was a Picture looking on by 7 or 8 or 10 people I believe more or less and I coming and crowding in my Head amongst the rest looked upon this Picture After the crowd was over Mr. Colledge takes a Picture out of his Pocket and said he I will give you one of them if you will So he gives me a Picture which Picture if I could see I could tell what it was it was written Mac a top and there were several Figures in it Then the Picture was shewed him This is one of the same that I had of him and I had not had it long in my custody but meeting with Justice VVarcupp I shewed it him who bid me give it him and so I did The next thing I did
and the Doctor alighted out of his Coach and spoke to me and invited me to come to my old Friends for he told me they had some jeajousie that I was not true to them and he told me if I would come to the King's-Head Club I should be received with a great deal of kindness and never afterwards did I speak with the Doctor a tittle about any Evidence L. ch Just He says you said you would break any one's Head that said you were an Evidence against Colledge for you were not nor could be Mr. Turbervile There was no such thing said by me Mr. Att. Gen. Upon your Oath did you tell him so Mr. Turberv Upon my Oath I did not Mr. Serj. jeff. Did you tell him that other passage when you swore you would not starve Mr. Turbervile No I did not Dr. Oates Upon the word of a Priest what I say is true My Lord I do say as I am a Minister I speak it sincerely in the presence of God this Gentleman did say these words to me which made me afraid of the man and I went my ways and never spake with him afterwards nor durst I for I thought he that would swear and curse after that rate was not fit to be talked with L. c. j. 'T is very improbable that he should say so to you Mr. Turbervile I always looked upon Dr. Oates as a very ill man and never would converse much with him L. c. j. Will you ask him any thing more Coll. Do you know any thing of the rest Doctor Dr. Oates I know nothing of Turbervile further but that he did present this Petition wherein he says he lay under great temptations to go on the other side and accuse some Protestants And truly till I heard he was an Evidence at Oxon. after what he had said to me I did not believe it Mr. Att. Gen. Doctor Oates Mr. Turbervile hath not changed Sides you have he is still an Evidence for the King you are against him Dr. Oates Mr. Attorney I am a Witness for truth against falshood and subornation and it can plainly be made to appear there is subornation against the Protestants And moreover my Lord L. c. j. Mr. Oates you would do well to explain your self Mr. Serj. Jeff. If there be any subornation relating to Mr. Turbervile or any of the other Witnesses that have now sworn against Colledge make it out Doctor Dr. Oates There is my Lord and there will be made further to appear in time to come To my own knowledge as to Mr. Smith Mr. Colledge and Mr. Smith had some provoking words passed betwixt them at Richard's Coffee-House and Mr. Smith comes out and swears God dam him he would have Colledge 's blood So my Lord when I met him said I Mr. Smith you profess your self to be a Priest and have stood at the Altar and now you intend to take upon you the Ministry of the Church of England and these words do not become a Minister of the Gospel his reply was God dam the Gospel this is truth I speak it in the presence of God and man L. c. j. Can you say any thing of any of the other Witnesses Dr. Oates As for Mr. Dugdale I was ingaged for him for 50 l. for last Lent Assizes he wanted money to go down to the Assizes having paid some debts and paid away all his money and so I engaged for 50 l. that he borrowed of Richard the Coffee-man After he came from Oxon. I called upon him to hasten to get his money of the Lords in the Treasury which as near as I remember was ordered him upon his Petition for so I heard And at that time said he Sir I hear there is a great noise of my being an Evidence against whom said I against several Protestants my Lord Shaftsbury and others said I I never heard any thing of it says he there is no body hath any cause to make any such report of me for I call God to witness I know nothing against any Protestant in England After that I met with Dugdale at Richard's Coffee-house and pressing him for the money and he saying he had it not just then but would pay it in a little time Mr. Dugdale said I you have gone I am afraid against your conscience I am sure against what you have declared to me said he it was all long of Colonel Warcupp for I could get no money else Mr. Att. Gen. Mr. Oates is a thorough-pac'd Witness against all the King's Evidence Mr. Ser. Jeff. And yet Dr. Oates had been alone in some matters had it not been for some of these Witnesses Dr. Oates I had been alone perhaps and perhaps not but yet Mr. Serjeant I had always a better Reputation than to need theirs to strengthen it Mr. Ser. jeff. Does any man speak of your Reputation I know no body does meddle with it but you are so tender Colledge Sir George Now a man is upon his life I think you do not do well to affront his Witnesses Mr. Serj. jeff. I do not affront him but now my Lord pray give us leave to call our Witnesses Mr. Smith pray stand up L. c. j. Mr. Smith do you hear what Mr. Oates hath said Mr. Smith No my Lord. L. c. j. Then speak it again Mr. Oates Dr. Oates Yes my Lord I will speak it to his face He said coming out of Richard's Coffee-house they having had some provoking words as I understood when I come in God dam that Colledge I will have his blood and my Lord when I did reprove him and said to him Mr. Smith you have been a Priest and stood at the Altar and intend to be a Minister of the Church of England these words do not become a Minister of the Gospel and he replied God dam the Gospel and away he went L. ch just What say you to it Mr. Smith Mr. Smith Not one word of this is true upon my Oath 'T is a wonderful thing you should say this of me but I will sufficiently prove it against you that you have confounded the Gospel and denied the Divinity too Mr. Serj. jeff. Mr. Dugdale you heard what was said against you Dr. Oates My Lord now Dugdale is come I will tell you something more There was a Report given out by Mr. Dugdale's means that Mr. Dugdale was poysoned and in truth my Lord it was but the Pox. And this Sham passed throughout the Kingdom in our Intelligencies and this I will make appear by the Physician that cured him Mr. Ser. Jeff. That is but by a third Hand Dr. Oates He did confess that he had an old Clap and yet he gave out he was poysened but now my Lord as to what I said before of him I was engaged for 50 l. for Mr. Dugdale do you own that Mr. Dugdale I do own it Dr. Oates I did press upon you to hasten the payment of it Mr. Dugdale Yes you did Dr. Oates And did not you come
Colledge You may see there was an understanding between them then Mr. just jones Did they go accordingly Mrs. Bol. Now and then they have gone to him but they knew his business because they had discourse with him as they said upon the road and they would not go L. c. j. Would you ask her any thing else what do you know more Mrs. Bolron Nothing for I am not one that stirs much abroad Colledge Call Mr. Everard Lo. c. j. What do you ask him Colledge As for Mr. Everard I need not ask him whether he knows him for they know one another well enough But Mr. Everard that I would ask you is this what do you know of Mr. Smith and of this contrivance against me Mr. Everard Mr. Smith I have been to see of late and he told me he knew of no Presbyterian or Protestant Plot and when my Lord Howard was tried that is the Bill brought against him he said he wondred how my Lord Howard could be Guilty and that both himself and I were joyned as Evidence to that Jury only to put a gloss upon the Evidence for says he I have nothing material to say Coll. Mr. Everard Do you know any thing more concerning him what he hath said at other times concerning me Mr. Everard I have told you already what I have heard him say that he thought there was no Protestant or Presbyterian Plot that now of late within this little while Colledge Pray Sir was there not some discourse betwixt Justice Warcupp and you in Lincolns-Inn Walks Mr. Everard Is Justice Warcupp an Evidence here L. c. j. No no. Colledge 'T is all but Evidence of a Presbyterian Plot therefore pray Sir what was the discourse between Justice Warcupp and you what would he have had you done L. c. j. I think it is not material there is nothing of Mr. Warcupp in this Tryal Mr. Everard If the Court does allow of it I will freely tell it Coll. My Lord the Papists design is to make a Protestant Plot to turn off their own and they begin with me but if I should go they would not be satisfied with me they would be at others L. c. j. There is nothing concerning a Presbyterian or Protestant Plot in the case Colledge My Lord if there be no Presbyterian Protestant Plot and others to joyn in it how could I do it by my self 't is impossible I should have such a design of seizing the King and improbable I should speak it Now my Lord this man was sollicited to come in for an Evidence of such a Plot. Mr. Everard That is true L. c. j. I tell you it is not material Justice Warcupp is not concerned in your Tryal Mr. Everard Justice Warcupp would have perswaded me to have sworn against some Lords a Presbyterian Plot but I deny that I know any such thing of them Coll. The Papists aim is not at me only but at others Mr. Ser. jeff. We have nothing to do with what you and Justice Warcupp talked of for example sake my Lord let us have no discourses that concern third persons brought in here L. c. j. Would he have perswaded you to say any thing that was not true Mr. Everard He did not say positively those words but this he said I knew seveveral Lords Mr. just jones Now here is Mr. Justice Warcupp's same traduc'd behind his back in the face of the Countrey and it is nothing to this cause before us Coll. My Lord I desire to know what he knows of these things and that he may speak it out 't is a material thing for me and others Here is a design of the Papists to turn a Plot upon the Protestants they begin with me and if they have my blood who may feel the effect of it next I cannot tell Lo. ch Just Truly I think it not material to your case and indeed 't is of ill consequence to have any man traduced behind his back as Justice VVarcupp is Coll. My Lord Macnamarra told me that that man would have seduced him to have retracted his Evidence upon my Salvation 't is true L. c. j. We meddle not with Macnamarra neither he is no Evidence against you Coll. Macnamarra hath sworn against me at the Old-Baily and at the finding of this Bill but they have laid him by upon some trick or other I desire Mr. Everard may tell what he knows Mr. Everard I would not reflect upon any person nor will I answer it if the Court do not think fit Coll. My Lord this is foul play if I die my self for my Countrey sake I can do it freely and the will of God be done I would have the truth out for the sake of the Protestants Mr. Everard I am very willing to tell the truth if the Court think fit L. c. j. I see not that he says Mr. VVarcupp would have had him swear that which was not true Mr. Ever But this he said if the Court will allow me to speak it Justice VVarcupp said that certainly there was a Presbyterian Plot and such things and that some Lords some of the Protestant protesting Lords must be guilty of it and said he certainly you know much of it You know such and such things therefore you may safely swear it if I knew it so by argument he would first prove there was a Plot and combination amongst those Lords and then said he this you may safely swear Mr. just jones What is this to your purpose Mr. Colledge only Mr. Warcup's name is brought upon the stage when he is not here to vindicate himself L. c. j. Would you ask him any thing else Coll. If he does know any thing more of any of them I desire he would speak it Mr. Ev. Concerning Mr. Haynes he told me it was necessity that drove him to speak any thing against the Protestants and the hard Pay and the Gratitude he did receive from the Citizens Then Mr. Jones acquainted the Court that Mr. Warcup was just come in and desired to vindicate himself But the Kings other Counsel waved it saying there was no weight in it Lo. ch just Where did he tell you this Mr. Ev. In the fields near Grays-Inn Lo. ch just How long since Mr. Ev. About three weeks ago I asked him Mr. Haynes said I I would not draw you from your Testimony in any thing but how can this be congruous to what you have said formerly That you knew nothing by them The truth is said he I will not say much to excuse my self but my Wife was reduced to that necessity that she begg'd at Rouse's door and craved some Salary and Mr. Rouse would not give her any and said he meer necessity drove me to it Colledge He found better pay in another place Mr. Ev. And says he 't is Self-preservation in the next place for I was brought in guilty when I was taken up and therefore I was obliged to do some things to save my Life Coll. Pray my
the Lords and the Bishops upon the Kings back and being asked what he meant to have done with them Why the Bishops and the King and all were to go to Breda These are the things that himself did acknowledge he was the Author of and these Prints he did cause to be made and he is the person that gives you an account that it was but the conception and imagination of Dugdale that Rowley meant the King but Dugdale being called again He tells you after some time that he was under some difficulty to know the meaning of it and then Colledge tells him it was meant the King and so he expounded it to him And so Smith tells you of that same name of Old Rowley again Gentlemen thus I tell you what hath been omitted The Evidence hath been long and therefore we must be pardoned if we can't exactly repeat it This is the Evidence that was done at Oxon. the next is Mr. Smith who speaks of what was done in London and he is an Evidence both as to the word Rowley as to the coming with Arms and as to the declaring to what end he came and what he had done Mr. Haynes he tells you both before and after the same and that I must take notice of to you Mr. Smith does particularly say he used those words which I hope every Honest man and every good man that desires to preserve the Government according to Law will hear with the greatest detestation and abhorrence He talked of the taking away the life of the late King of blessed memory at such an impudent rate that every true Protestants blood would curdle at the hearing of it And this he said not only to Mr. Masters but he justified it to Mr. Smith too In the next place you have Turbervile who gives you all the reasons how he did not only tell of these things Himself but encouraged Him to prepare Himself accordingly and he gave Him a mark a Ribbon with No Popery no Slavery These were marks whereby they were to be known and they were to be one and all as they call it that when such a blow was struck they should be ready to fall in There is one thing more that I take notice of that is what was said by a Gentleman Sir William Jennings which is a confirmation of all the other Evidence that Gentleman who hath appeared to you to be a man of Honour even by the confession of Mr. Colledge Himself and by his own words for he said like an Honest man and like a Loyal man too that He would rather engage Himself in three dangers for the Service of the King at Sea than come in cold blood to give Evidence against a man for his life at the Bar. And yet this man who tells you this of Himself and that very person whom Colledge Himself calls a worthy person hath given you this account that when he told him his nose bled He answered him It was the first blood lost in the Cause but it would not be long e're there was more lost an excellent cause for a man to venture his blood in When he was told of this he began to put it off and to use his own words had a great mind to sham off the business but in truth there was no answer given to it Gentlemen the objections that have been made against the Evidence that have not been taken notice of I desire to take notice of I think against three of them there has been only Mr. Oates and Mr. Oates I confess has said in verbo Sacerdotis strange things against Dugdale Smith and Turbervile I have only the affirmation of Mr. Oates and as ill men may become good men so may good men become ill men or otherwise I know not what would become of some part of Mr. Oates's testimony And in the next place if these men have not sworn true I am sure Mr. Oates must stand alone in the greatest point in which all the Evidence agree that is the Popish Plot. But Gentlemen I must take notice to you that it is strange to me that ever you upon your consciences should perjure three men who positively upon their Oaths deny any such discourses as Mr. Oates speaks of against them I do put that upon your consciences whether you upon the bare affirmation of Mr. Oates in this place will convict three men upon whose testimony the lives of so many as have suffered have been taken away and as we Protestants do believe justly I say whether you will do it upon the bare affirmation of Mr. Oates against their Oaths In the next place Gentlemen I must tell you besides the positive Evidence of these Gentlemen there is a circumstance of improbability in the very words which he speaks of Will any man tell me that after such time as men have given their Oaths as Smith had given his that he was concerned and so had Dugdale and Turbervile too that these men should come and voluntarily tell Mr. Oates they were all forsworn are these men such great Coxcombs as he would have us to believe Is it so probable a thing that any men of common knowledge would do it Do you think a man of that knowledge and consideration as Smith is an allowed Scholar and a man of known Learning and Mr. Dugdale who has been reckoned by all men to be a good Evidence do you take these men to be such absolute Novices that they must seek an occasion to tell him they were bribed off and were forsworn If you can think this and if a bare affirmation against these positive Oaths can prevail Gentlemen upon your consciences be it In the next place 't is a strange sort of thing to believe that Mr. Smith should come out of a Coffee-House where a quarrel is pretended to have been between him and Colledge but Mr. Smith does upon his Oath say he never had any such quarrel with him and that he should fall a damning and sinking against Colledge and against the Gospel that there should be such impudence in the world in any man as to desire or wish such a thing Gentlemen these are strange sorts of apprehensions and men must have very strange thoughts that can strain themselves up to the belief of them In the next place here it is said by the Prisoner Good Lord what a condition we shall be in Here is a Plot put upon the Protestants I hope in God there is no Protestant Plot but I also hope the whole interest of the Protestant Religion is not involved in the Prisoner at the Bar and all will be destroyed if Mr. Colledge dies for his Treasons Gentlemen the question is not whether there be a Presbyterian or Protestant Plot we declare we know of none but whether the Prisoner at the Bar have spoken such words and done such things as are sworn against him And I would fain know what all the discourses we have had about Irish witnesses and