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A42872 Master Glyn's reply to the Earle of Straffords defence of the severall articles objected against him by the House of Commons Published by speciall direction, out of an authentick copy. Glynne, John, Sir, 1603-1666.; England and Wales. Parliament. House of Commons. 1641 (1641) Wing G892; ESTC R213348 35,221 58

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that must enforce the King what to doe to levie money to use his Prerogative to raise supplies upon his subjects without their consent against their will necessity must be his argument and this warre must be thē occasion of that necessity and without that he cannot suggest to the Kings eare or advise this necessity till this bee brought to passe And now he hath brought it to passe he began in the one and twentieth two and twentieth and three and twentieth Article to perswade the King that necessity hath surprized him by the Parliaments deserting of him that the Parliament had forsaken the King in denying supply and having tried the affections of his people hee was loose and absolved from all rules of government and had an Army in Ireland which he might employ to reduce this Kingdome That he spake these words to the King part is proved by two concurrent witnesses that is that having tried the affections of his people he was now loose and absolved from all rules of government which words are proved by two witnesses of eminent quality that is my Lord of Northumberland and Sir Henry Vane and truly howsoever my Lord in his speech pretends that the most materiall words are proved but by one witnesse it seeming that hee held it not a materiall charge that he counselled the King that he was absolved from all rules of government for my part if your Lordships be satisfied those words were proved I could willingly satisfie my owne Conscience in it and make no great matter to quit the rest for I know not how he could expresse it in higher termes then that the King was absolved from rules of government for then he might doe what he would It is true the latter words touching the Irish Army are expresly proved but by one witnesse master Secretary Vane but are fortified againe with such circumstances as make up more then one yea more than two other witnesses if your Lordships will have the patience to have it represented as it is proved For howsoever it be slighted by him if your Lordships will call to mind the words of Sir George Radcliffe his bosome friend to whom he had contributed without question his advice in all causes the said Sir George Radcliffe expressed it before and told some of his friends supposing that he never should be called in question and that the power of my Lord of Strafford had been enough to protect any thing he had done and out of the aboundance of the heart his mouth spake the King must now want no money if he did no body would pity him now he had his sword in his hand Sir Robert King proves it so My Lord Renula discovered the smoake of the fire that hee had just cause to suspect and on good grounds I am sure and if the Commons of England had not just cause to suspect him as I beleeve he is convinced they had good cause what is the reason this suspition should bee entertained at that time my Lord of Strafford being not then questioned for it and yet my Lord Renula should say Shall wee turne our swords upon our owne bowels shall we bring this Army to turne the points of our blades upon that Nation from whence we were all derived and that was before any conference with master Secretary Vane Sir William Penniman himselfe his owne witnesse and friend sayes at York before my Lord of Strafford was questioned that there was a common fame of bringing the Army into England and there is something in that surely and after all this to produce one witnesse that expresly proves the very words spoken in terminis as they bee charged if your Lordships put the whole together see whether there be not more then one witnesse And under favour my Lord Cottington if you call to mind his testimony I must justifie he did declare that he heard my Lord of Strafford tell the King that some reparation was to be made to the subjects property which must inferre he had advised an invasion upon the property else by no good coherence should a reparation bee made And that he testifies this I must affirme and most here will affirme it and I think your Lordships well remember it and that is an addition to it for if your Lordships cast your eye upon the interrogatory administred to my Lord Admirall and my Lord Cottington that very question is asked so that his owne Conscience told him he had advised something to invade upon the people when he advised to a restitution after things should be settled and so I referre it to your Lordships consideration whether here bee not more then one witnesse by farre It is true he makes objections to lessen this testimony first that this Army was to be landed at Ayre in Scotland and not here and this was declared to Sir Thomas Lucas master Slings by Sir William Penniman and others Secondly that others that were present when the words are supposed to be spoken did not heare any such words For the first perhaps the Army might be originally intended for Scotland and yet this is no contradiction but he might intend it afterwards for England surely this is no Logick that because it was intended for one place it could never be intended for another place so his allegarion may be true and the charge stand true likewise Beside that it was intended orriginally for Scotland what proofe makes hee Hee told severall persons of the designe but I will be tryed by himselfe he told some it was for Scotland he told others it was for England and why you should beleeve his telling on one side more then on the other side I know not though he pretends a reason of his severall allegations that the world should not know his designe but if you will not beleeve him one way why should he be beleeved the other way and if not the other way why the first way For the second severall persons were present when the words were spoken touching the Irish Armie and they were examined and remember not the words but one man may heare though twentie doe not heare and this is no contradiction at all For those persons whom he examined the Lord Treasurer Marquesse Hambleton my Lord Cottington did not heare the words that are proved by two witnesses concerning the Kings being loose and absolved from rules of government and if they did not heare those words no marvaile they did not heare the other and therefore that which hee himselfe pretends to be a convincing testimonie is nothing at all so that his objections are clearely taken away and the single testimonie fortified with testimonies that make above one witnesse and so the words are fully proved But to fortifie the whole I shall handle all these Articles together This designe to subvert the Law and to exercise an arbitrary power above the Law in this kingdome will upon the proofes putting them altogether and not taking them in pieces as my Lord
them upon the bowels of the Kings subjects It is no more in effect Your Lordships have heard him the other day mentioning two Acts of Repeale and I expected he would have insisted upon them but it seemes he hath beene better advised and thinks them not worthy repetition nor indeed are they And if the matter of fact be proved upon the fifteenth Article I am confident he will find the Statute of 18. H. 6. to be of full force My Lords I am very sorry to heare that when levying of warre upon the Kings subjects is in agitation and he charged with high Treason he should make mention of the Yorkshire men and the army now on foot whereby he would insinuate that if he be charged with high Treason then they must be likewise though they lye quartered and have meat and drink with the assent of the people which may breed ill bloud for ought I know From the fifteenth Article he descends to the three and twentieth and that is the Article whereby he stands charged with speaking of words and giving of councell to his Majestie to incense him against his Parliament pretending a necessity and telling him he is loose and absolved from all rules of government that he had an Army in Ireland which he might make use of to reduce this kingdome In this he is pleased to begin with the testimony of my Lord Ranelagh conceiving an apprehension and feare in him that the Army should goe over to England which my Lord sayes is no more but his saying and master Treasurer Vane's I pray God my Lord Ranelagh had not much cause to feare but by the same rule he may lay a charge of unwarrantable feare upon all the Commons for sure the Commons of England did feare it else they would not make an Article of it But my Lord Ranelagh's feare did not arise from a slight cause and he shewed himselfe a good Common-wealths man in expressing it and he is to be commended for it howsoever it be apprehended by my Lord of Strafford For his observation of the single testimony of Mr. Treasurer Vane give me leave to take the same latitude as his Lordship did for he shewes to three or foure Articles what he could have proved as to the Article concerning the Army he could have proved the designe of it by Sir John Burlacy and some others if they had beene here But by this rule and liberty hee hath taken to alledge what he could have showne give me leave to tell you what we might have showne and are ready to shew We could have made it expresse and proved it by notes taken by Secretary Vane the fifth of May when the words were spoken which notes should have beene proved if we had proceeded on the three and twentieth Article to corroborate the testimony of Mr. Secretary Vane and that by two witnesses Wee could likewise have showne how we came to the knowledge of it it being by means unknowne to master Secretary Vane and have made him an upright Councellour and witnesse but we shall prove his intentions to bring in the Irish Army another way when I come to open my owne course and method My Lords hee pretends these words were spoken the fift of May but when they were testified by master Treasurer he did not speak of the fifth of May and yet now my Lord remembers the day and I wonder how hee came to the knowledge of the day unlesse he likewise remembred the words But that my Lord observes is That being spoken then how should he perswade the King that he had an Army in Ireland when in truth he had none there for the Army was not on foot till a moneth after This my Lords is plainly answered and if he had thought of his owne answer he had answered himselfe for he tels you that in April before he had taken a course for the levying of the Army he had nominated the officers giving direction for raising it And the day of the Rendezvous of the Army was appointed the 18. of May And so in his owne answer he makes an answer to the objection and the objection is taken away out of his own confession From that Article he falls to the seven and twentieth Article whereby he stands charged with levying money by force upon the Kings people in Yorkshire he is pleased to observe that all the proofes for the maintenance of that Article is onely the levying of money with foure souldiers by Sergeant Major Yaworth Where he is pleased to disdaine the war because it was so weak yet it was too strong for them God help them that were forced upon pain of life to pay it And whereas he pretends the warrrant was not from him I shall reserve that till I come to the Article and when I come to the proofes I beleeve it will remain fixed upon him And there he left his Statute Treason and now he fals to the second kind of Treason and that was the introductive or constructive Treason He begins with the third Article that is concerning some words that he should be charged to have spoken in Ireland I shal desire that your Lordships would be pleased to look upon your notes how he answers that Article My Lords sayes he I am charged to say that Ireland was a conquered Nation and that their Charters were nothing worth and bind the King no further then he pleaseth therefore I am a Traitor because I speak the truth There was his answer in his collection And for their Charters he sayes he might might very well say so for he intended it no otherwise but according to the validity of them for they were severall wayes questionable and ought not to bind unlesse they were good in law But if you look upon his Arguments he hath like a cunning Oratour omitted the principall part of the Article and that is that Ireland is a conquered Nation and they were to be governed as the King pleaseth the King might doe with them what he lists this hee omits although they be proved by three witnesses and are appliable to his intentions fully yet he could make use of so much as makes for him and leaves out the rest like your Lordships know whom Then he descends to the fourth Article and this concerns some words he should speak upon an occasion betwixt him and my Lord of Cork that he should tell my Lord of Cork he would have neither Law nor Lawyers dispute or question his orders And upon another occasion that he would make my Lord of Cork and all Ireland know that all Acts of State which are Acts of Councel there made or to be made should be as binding as any Act of Parliament This he said was proved but by one witnesse and I extremely marvell to heare him say so for the latter words wee proved by foure or five or six witnesses that is that he would have Acts of State as binding as Acts of Parliament Whereas he
manner of rents were levied by souldiers no such thing but such rents as were designed for payment of the Army he proved by Sir Arthur Terringham the laying of souldiers once for the payment of a summe of mony but sir Arthur being demanded whether it were the Kings rents or comprehended within the same generall rule he could make no answer thereunto Your Lordships remember he sayes he did not know it and therefore probably it was the Kings rents and doubtlesse it was so But if he had produced presidents it could not be an authority for Treason that if people did not appeare to his orders he must levie warre against the Kings subjects and for his extenuation of the warre that the same was of no great danger there being not above five or six souldiers layd at a time I would to God the people oppressed by it had cause to undervalue it I am sure foure or six Musketiers are as strong to oppresse a man as foure thousand so the matter of fact is strongly and expresly proved Besides though there came not above foure or five to a house yet the authority given to the Sergeant was generall he might have brought more if hee had listed and in truth hee brought as many as the estate of the party would maintain And as to the not producing of the Warrant I have already answered it If it were in the case of a Deed wherin men call for witnesses it were something but God forbid that the Treason should be gone and the Traitor not questionable if his warrant can be once put out of the way The next Article which is laid to his charge is for issuing out a Proclamation and Warrant of restraint to inhibit the Kings subjects to come to the Fountaine their Soveraigne to deliver their complaints of their wrongs and oppressions Your Lordships have heard how hee hath exercised his jurisdiction and now he raises a battery to secure and make it safe If he doe wrong perhaps the complaint may come to the gracious eares of a King who is ready to give reliefe and therefore he must stop these cries and prevent these meanes that hee may goe on without interruption And to that end he makes propositions here that the Kings subjects in Ireland should not come over to make complaint against Ministers of State before an addresse first made to himselfe It is true hee makes a faire pretence and shew for it and had just cause of approbation if he had intended what he pretended But as soon as he came into Ireland what use made hee of it he ingrosses the proceedings of almost all the Courts of Justice into his owne hands and so pre-possesses the King by a colourable proposition and prevents their comming over before they had made their addresse to himselfe and then he becomes the wrong doer and issues Proclamations for the hindering of the Kings subjects to seeke redresse without his leave which is as great a proofe of his designe and as great an injury to the people governed under a gracious Prince as a heart can conceive And what his intention was in exhibiting this proposition it will appeare in the sentence of a poor man one David who was censured and most heavily fined for comming over into England to prosecute complaint against my Lord of Strafford It is true that this was not the cause expressed but this was the truth of the matter Your Lordships remember a clause in the order at Councell Boord whereby is set forth the cause wherefore the party is not sentenced which I never saw in an order before nor should now but that my Lord foresaw there was danger in it that he might be charged in this place for the fact and therefore puts in negatively why the party was not censured Clausula inconsulta inducit suspitionem And how defends he this Article he sayes his Predecessours issued Proclamations to hinder the Kings subjects from going over lest they should joyne with O Neale and Tirconnell beyond sea and so it might be dangerous to the State but because they may joyn with Forreiners shall they therefore not come to the King to make just complaint what this argument is I referre to your Lordships judgments Then he pretends a former president affirming that the like Instructions were given to my Lord of Faulkland but was there any that none should come to their Soveraigne to make their just appeale if injured Surely there was never any such Instruction before and I hope never will be againe The next Article is the nineteenth And now when hee had so plentifully exercised his tyranny over the lives the liberty and the estates of the Kings subjects A man would think he could goe no further but see a Tyranny exercised beyond that and that is over the Consciences of men hitherto hee dealt with the outward man and now hee offers violence to the inward man and imposes an Oath upon the Kings subjects and so exerciseth a tyranny over the Consciences of men And setting aside the matter of the Oath if he hath authority and power to impose such an Oath as he shall frame he may by the same power impose any Oath to compell Consciences He pretends a Warrant from his Majestie to doe it but the Kings Ministers are to serve the King according to law and I dare be bold to say and we have good reason to thank God for it if any of the Kings Ministers tell him that any Command he gives is against law there is no doubt but in his goodnesse and piety hee will withdraw his Command and not enforce execution and therefore if there were an errour the King is free and the Ministers to be justly charged with it But there was no Command from the King to compell and enforce them to take the Oath by the power of the Star-chamber to commit them to prison to impose heavie fines and tyrannize over them all which he did in the case of Steward And now one would have thought hee had acted his part when he had acted as much as lay in his own power and yet he goes beyond this he was not content to corrupt all the streames which was not a diverting of the course as he spoke in his answer for he not onely turned the course of the water but changed the nature of it converted it into poyson a legall and just proceeding into a Tyrannicall and Arbitrary government which is not turning but corrupting of the cleere and christall streams to bitternesse and death But yet the Fountaine remains cleere and perhaps when his hand is taken off you shall have the streames run as pure and uncorrupt as ever they did This is it troubles him remove but this obstacle and the work is perfect and therefore now he will goe about to corrupt the streames if hee can but infuse his poyson into the Kings heart which is the Fountain then all is done and now he attempts that and approacheth the
seek if I were to expresse an arbitrary power and tyrannicall government how to expresse it in fitter words and more significant terms than these that the people shall be governed at the Kings will that their Charters the sinewes and ligatures of their liberties lands and estates should be nothing worth and bind no longer then the Kings pleasure specially being spoken upon such an occasion and the words proved by two or three witnesses of credit and quality From thence we descend to Articles that shew the execution of his purpose There be three things a man enjoyes by the protection of the law that is his life his liberty and his estate And now my Lords observe how he invades and exercises a tyrannicall jurisdiction and arbitrary government over them all three I shall begin with the fifth Article that is concerning my Lord Mountnorris and Denwit My Lord Mountnorris a Peere of that Realm was sentenced to death by procurement of my Lord of Strafford who howsoever hee pretends himselfe not to be a Judge in the cause yet how farre he was an Abettor and Procurer and Countenancer and drawer on of that sentence your Lordships very well remember he was sentenced to death without law for speaking words at a private Table God knows of no manner of consequence in the world concerning the treading upon my Lord of Straffords toe the sentence procured seven moneths after the words spoken and contrary to law and himselfe being put in mind of it my Lord Mountnorris desiring to have the benefit of the law and yet he refusing it And then it was in time of peace when all the Courts of justice were open and to sentence a man to death of that quality my Lord of Strafford himselfe being present an author a drawer on of it makes it very hainous Your Lordships remember this Article was fully proved and though he pretends his authority by a letter from his Majesty I shall in due time give a full answer to that so that it shall rise up in judgement against him to aggravate his offence and that in a great measure Here he exercises a power over life his excuse was that he procured a pardon for my Lord Mountnorris but the power was exercised and the tyranny appeared to be the more he would first sentence him to death and then rejoyce in his power that he might say There remaines no more but my command to the Provost Marshall to doe execution To exercise a power over his life and to abuse him afterwards is very high but no thanks to him that the sentence of death was not executed it was the grace and goodnesse of his Majesty that would not suffer my Lord Mountnorris a person of that eminence to be put to death against law But the other was hanged and as appeares against law and though my Lord pretends the party was burnt in the hand yet that was not proved nor materiall and for him to doe this in time of peace when the Courts of justice were open it argues a desire in his breast to arrogate a power above law And in truth I may not omit some observations that my Lord made this day he hopes his Majesty would bee pleased to grant him a Pardon I perceive hee harboured in his thoughts that hee might hang the Kings subjects when he would and then get a Pardon of course for it The Lord blesse me from his jurisdiction My Lords give me leave to goe back againe here is power over the lives and liberties of the subject but he exercised likewise a Tyrannicall power over his estate Your Lordships may be pleased to remember the fourth Article where he judges my Lord of Corks estate in neither Church land nor plantation land and therefore had no pretence of a jurisdiction for it is a lay fee divolved by Act of Parliament to the Crown yet he deprives him of his possession which he had continued for twenty nine yeeres upon a paper petition without rules of law And whereas my Lord of Cork went about to redeeme himselfe the law being every mans inheritance and that which he ought to enjoy he tels him hee will lay him by the heeles if he withdraw not his proces and so when he hath judged him against an expresse Act of Parliament and Instructions and bound up a great Peere of the Realme hee will not suffer him to redeeme that wrong without a threat of laying him by the heeles and he will not have Law nor Lawyers question his Orders and would have them all know an Act of State should be equall to an Act of Parliament Which are words of that nature that higher cannot be spoken to declare an intention to proceed in an arbitrary way The next was in my Lord Mountnorris his case and Rolstone And here I must touch my Lord with misrepetition Rolstone preferred a petition to my Lord Deputy my Lord Deputy himselfe judges his estate and deprived him of his possession though he cannot produce so much as one example or precedent though if he had it would not have warranted an illegall action but hee cannot produce a precedent that ever any Deputy did determine concerning a mans private estate and if hee hath affirmed it he proved it not some petitions have been preferred to him but what they be non constat But though never any knew the Deputy alone to determine matters of land yet he did it To the seventh Article we produce no evidence but my Lord of Strafford cannot be content with that but he must take upon him to make defence for that which is not insisted upon as a charge but since he will doe so I refer it to the book in print where he determines the inheritance of a Nobleman in that Kingdome that is my Lord Dillon by a case falsly drawne and contrary to his consent and though he deprives him not of his possession yet he causes the Land to be measured out and it is a danger that hangs over his head to this day And had we not knowne that we had matter enough against my Lord of Strafford this should have risen in judgement against him but I had not mentioned it now if he had not mentioned it himselfe The eighth Article containes severall charges as that of my Lord Chancellour how he imprisoned him upon a judgement before himselfe and the Councell how he inforced the Seale from him when hee had no authority nay though it were excepted by his Patent that hee should no way dispose of it but he looked not to Authority further then might make way to his will Another concerns the prime Earle of that Kingdome my Lord of Kildare whom he imprisoned and kept close prisoner contrary to the Kings expresse command for his deliverance and in his answer my Lord acknowledges it but sayes that that command was obtained from the King upon a mis-information These things I would not have mentioned if he had passed them over but since he
Throne endeavours to corrupt the Kings goodnesse with wicked counsels but God be thanked he finds too much piety there to prevaile And therefore the next Article is that that charges him to be an Incendiary to the warre betwixt the two Kingdomes and now I shall be bold to unfold the mysterie and answer his objection To what purpose should he be an Incendiary were it not better to enjoy his estate in peace and quietnesse then have it under danger of a warre Now your Lordships shall have the Riddle discovered The first thing hee doth after his comming into England is to incense the King to a warre to involve two Nations of one faith and under one Soveraigne to imbrue their hands in each others blood and to draw Armies into the field That he was this Incendiary give me leave to revive your Lordships memories with the proofes which will make it plaine and first give me leave to note unto your Lordships that his Majestie with much wisedome did in July 1639. make a pacification with his subjects and even at the very heeles of this pacification when all things were at peace upon the tenth of September which was the next moneth but one your Lordships remember the sentence of Steward in the Star-chamber of Ireland for not taking the oath your Lordships may call to mind the language my L. of Strafford was pleased to use of the Scots when all was in quietnesse he then calls them no better then Traitours and Rebels if you will beleeve what the witnesse testifies whom my Lord is pleased to call a School-master And truly admit hee were so because he is a School-master therefore not to be beleeved is a non sequitur And another witnesse one Loftus speaks to the words though not in the same manner but I say the tenth of September when things were at peace and rest when the King was pleased to be reconciled to them by that pacification what boiled in his breast then to the breaking forth of such expressions I know not unlesse it were an intention to be an Incendiary My Lords I must say and affirme and he hath not proved it to the contrary that all this while I am confident there was not any breach of the pacification on either side and it lyes on his part to prove there was But the Parliament of Scotland then sitting and making preparation for their demands in pursuance of the Articles of pacification hee comming over into England in September immediately upon the pacification answers That he found things so distracted here that it was fit the Scots should be reduced by force if they could not be otherwise yet no breach appeares no war was denounced there was no intention of a warre But see what harboured in his breast all the while The fourth of December following my Lord Traquaire made his relation to the Councell of the Scots proceedings and all this while there was no Demands brought by the Scots themselves nor reason of their Demands brought by others though they were prepared yet you have heard his advice was for an offensive warre and that the Demands were a just cause of the war And though he pretends hee said no more then what the rest of the Lords of the Councell concurred with him in I will joyne in issue with him in that and if some of your Lordships be not satisfied you have many noble Lords among you from whom you may be satisfied that it is not so I am sure he proves it not It is true in the proposition of the Demands some of the Lords of the Councell did say that these Demands hypothetically if the Scots did not give satisfaction by their reasons were a just cause of warre but not any Lord of the Councell was of opinion that the very Demands positively without hearing of the reasons were a just cause of warre but himselfe and I beleeve the noble Lords of the Councell their Consciences can tell them and I beleeve will deliver it to the rest of the Peeres that I speake truth For the offensive warre he pretends a concurrence of the rest but it was disproved many were for it upon these termes if they did not give reasons and shew just cause for their Demands and many were against an offensive warre upon any terms and therefore herein he fixes that upon the Lords of the Councell that hee cannot make good All this while his intentions are discovered by a matter precedent but after the breach he discovers his anger further towards the Scottish Nation and makes it his designe to incense the King to this warre My Lords hee is not at an end yet for he confesses himselfe that hee advised the King to call a Parliament and now I come to his work of merit but it was to his destruction and serves to prove this Article directly for to what purpose was this Parliament called Exitus acta probat it was no sooner set but within three weekes a proposition is made for supply towards a warre against the Scots who was the cause of calling the Parliament himselfe and therefore who was the cause of this proposition but himselfe and so the calling of the Parliament is a concurring evidence of his being an Incendiary to put on the warre and it shall appeare anon absolutely that he was the occasion of it though he thinkes there be no proofe of it Did not he goe over into Ireland and by his solicitation there Subsidies were granted by the Parliament onely to maintaine this warre and to shew their ingagement in it and who was the occasion of drawing them on I referre to your Lordships judgements by the circumstances precedent Your Lordships heard his good opinion of the Scots when he began to discourse with the Citizens touching money and their affording of the King supply and seising the mint by giving them no better expressions than Rebels for saith he you are more forward to help the Rebels than to pay the King his owne I know not who hee meant but certainly the Scots were in his thoughts so that from the beginning he incensed the warre against them first hee exclaimed against them during time of peace He alledges in his answer that things were found in such distraction that it was fit the Scots should be reduced by force he gave advice precipitately without hearing the reasons and not concurrent to the Councell for an offensive warre and putting all together I referre it to your Lordships judgement who is the Incendiary for how can it be proved more cleerely unlesse it should appeare under his hand and seale proved by two or three witnesses Now my Lords how comes this to be his designe here the mystery comes to be unfolded Having thus incensed to the warre and ingaged the King to the uttermost and having a Parliament now dissolved without supply he sets up an Idol of his owne creation as a means to draw on his designe and that was necessity necessity is it