goe along with us to mantaine in doctrine and practise a necessity even in times of persecution that the Church must meet for the worship of God and execution of Ecclesiastick disciplin among their owne members In this the doctrine and practise of the Scots is according to their setled lawes uncontroverted by his Majestie If the Warner will mantaine that in reason and conscience al the Churches of the world are oblidged to dissolve and never more to meet when an erroneous Magistrat by his Tyrannous edict commands them to doe so let him call up Erastus from the dead to be disciplined in this new doctrine of the praelats impious loyalty The third principle is that the judgment of true and false doctrine of suspension and deprivation of Ministers belongeth to the Church The finall determination of all Ecclesiastick causes by the Lawes of Scotland is in the generall assembly Ans If this be a great heresie it is to be charged as much upon the state as upon the Church for the acts of Parliament give all this power to the Church neither did the lawes of England or of any Christian state popish or protestant refuse to the Church the determination of such Ecclesiastick causes some indeed doe debate upon the power of appeales from the Church but in Scotland by the law as no appeale in things civill goes higher then the Parliament so in matters Ecclesiastick none goes above the generall assembly Complaints indeed may goe to the King and Parliament for redresse of any wrong has been done in Ecclesiastick Courts who being custodes religionis may by their coercive power command Ecclesiastick Courts to rectifie any wrong done by them contraire to Scripture or if they persist take order with them But that two or three praelats should become a Court of delegats to receave appeales from a generall assembly neither Law nor practise in Scotland did ever admit nor can the word of God or any Equity require it In the Scotes assemblies no causes are agitat but such as the Parliament hath agreed to bee Ecclesiastick and of the Churches cognisance no Processe about any Church rent was ever cognosced upon in Scotland but in a civill Court it s very false that ever any Church censure much lesse the highest of excommunication did fall upon any for robbing the Church of its patrimony The divine right of discipline is the tenet of the most of praelats Our fourth challenged principle is that wee maintain Ecclesiastick jurisdiction by a divine right Ans Is this a huge crime is there divine in the world either Papist or Potestant except a few praelaticall Erastians but they doe so If the Warner will professe as it seemes hee must the contradiction of that which he ascribes to us his avowed tenet must bee that all Ecclesiastick power flowes from the Magistrat that the Magistrat himself may execute all Church censures that all the Officers appointed by Christ for the governement of his Church may bee laid aside and such a kind of governors bee put in their place as the Magistrate shal be pleased to appoint that the spirituall sword and Keies of heaven belong to the Magistrate by vertue of his supremacy al 's wel as the temporall sword and the Keies of his earthly Kingdome our difference heere from the Warner will not I hope be found the greatest heresie Our last challenged principle is All the power of the Church in Scotland is legall and with the Magistrats consente that wee will have all our power against the Magistrat that is although hee dissent Ans It is an evill comentare that al must be against the Magistrate which is done against his consent but in Scotland their is no such case for all the jurisdiction which the church there does enjoy they have it with the consent of the Magistrat all is ratified to them by such acts of Parliament as his Majestie doth not at all controvert Concerning that odious case the Warner intimats whither in time of persecutiō when the Magistrat classheth with the Church any Ecclesiastick disciplin be then to be exercised himselfe can better answer it then we who with the auncient Christians doe think that on all hazards even of life the church may not be dissolved but must meet in dens and caves and in the wildernes for the word and Sacraments and keeping it selfe pure by the divine ordinance of discipline The prelats rather then to lay aside their owne interest will keepe the King and his people in misery for ever Having cleered all the pernicious practises and all the wicked Doctrines which the Warner layes upon us I think it needles to insist upon these defenses which he in his aboundant charity brings for us but in his owne way that he may with the greater advantage impugne them only I touch one passage whereupon he make injurious exclamations that which Mr. Gilespie in his theoremes wryts when the Magistrate abuses his power unto Tyranny and makes havock of all it is lawfull to resist him by some extraordinary wayes and meanes which are not ordinarily to bee allowed see the principles from which all our miseryes and the losse of our gracious Master have flowed Ans Wee must heere yeeld to the Warner the great equity and necessity that every doctrine of a Presbyter should be charged on the Presbytery it selfe and that any Presbyter teaching the lawfulnesse of a Parliaments defensive armes is tantamont to the Churches taking of armes against the king These small unconsequences wee must permit the Warner to swallow downe without any stick however wee doe deny that the maxime in hand was the fountaine of any our miseryes or the cause at all of the losse of our late Soveraigne Did ever his Majestie or any of his advised counsellers declare it simply unlawfull for a Parliament to take armes for defence in some extraordinary cases however the unhappines of the Canterburian Prelats did put his Majestie on these courses which did begin and promote all our misery and to the very last these men were so wicked as to refuse the lousing of these bands which their hands had tyed about his misinformed conscience yea to this day they will not give their consent that his Majestie who now is should lay aside Episcopacy were it for the gayning the peaceable possession of all his three Kingdomes but are urgers of him night and day to adhaere to their errours upon the hazard of all the miseries that may come on his person on his family and all his people yet few of them to this day durst be so bold as to print with this Warner the unlawfulnes of a Parliaments armes against the Tyranny of a Prince in any imaginable case how extraordinary soever CHAP. III. The Lawes and customes of Scotland admitte of no appeal from the generall assembly IN this chapter the challenge is Appeals in Scotland from a generall assembly were no lesse irrationall then illegall that
there are no appeales from the generall Assembly to the King as in England from the Bishops Courts to the King in Chauncery where a Commission uses to be given to delegats who discusse the appeales Ans The warner considers not the difference of the Government of the Church of Scotland from that which was in England what the Parliament is in the State that the generall assembly is in the Church of Scotland both are the highest courts in their owne kind There is no appeale any where in moderat Monarchies to the Kings person but to the King in certaine legall courts as the Warner here confesseth the appeale from Bishops lyes not to the King in his person but to the King in his court of Chauncery As no man in Scotland is permitted to appeale in a civil cause from the Lords of Session much lesse from the Parliament so no man in an Ecclesiastick cause is permitted by the verie civil Law of Scotland to appeale from the general assembly According to the Scots order practise the King in person or else by his high Commissioner sits al 's usually in the generall assembly as in Parliament But though it were not so yet an appeale from a generall assembly to be discussed in a Court of delegats were unbeseeming and unreasonable the one Court consisting of above two hundred all chosen men the best and most able of the Kingdome the other but of two or three often of very small either abilities or integrity who yet may be more fitt to decerne in an Ecclesiastick cause then a single Bishop over his officiall the ordinary trusted in all acts of jurisdiction for the whole dioces But the Scots way of managing Ecclesiastick causes is a great deale more just safe and Satisfactory to any rationall man then that old popish order of the English where all the spirituall jurisdiction of the whole dioces was in the hand of one mercenary officiall without all reliefe from his sentence except by an appeale as of old to the pope and his delegats so therafter to the King though never to be cognosced-upon by himselfe but as it was of old by two or three delegats The Churches just severity against Montgomery and Adamson was approven by the King and the parties themselfe the weakest of all courts often for the quality and ever for the number of the judges Two instances are brought by the Warner to prove the Church of Scotlands stopping of appeals from the generall Assembly to the King the cases of Montgomery and Adamson if the causes and events of the named cases had been wel knowne to the Warner as he made this chapter disproportionally short so readily he might have deleted it al together Both these men were infamous not only in their Ministeriall charges but in their life conversation both became so insolent that contrary to the established order of the Church Kingdome being suborned by wicked statesmen who in that day of darknes had wel neer brought ruine both to King and country would needs take upon them the office of Arch-Bishops While the assembly was in proces with them for their manifold and high misdeameanors the King was moved by them and their evill patrons to shew his high displeasure against the assemblyes of the Church they for his Majesties satisfaction sent their Commissioners and had many conferences whereby the pride and contempt of these prelats did so encrease that at last they drew the sentence of excommunication upon their own heads the King after some time did acknowledge the equity of the Church proceedings and professed his contentment their with both these unhappy men were brought to a humble confession of their crimes and such signes of repentance that both after a renunciation of their titulare Bishopriks were readmitted to the function of the ministry which they had deserted Never any other before or after in Scotland did appeale from the generall assembly to the King the late excommunicat praelats in their declinatour against the assembly of Glasgow did not appeale as I remember to the King but to another generall assembly to bee constitute according to their own Popish and Tyrannical principles CHAP. IV. Faulty Ministers in Scotland are lesse exempted from punishment then any other men The pride of prelats lately but never the Presbitery did exempt their fellows from punishment for their civil faults THE Warner in his fourth Chapter offers to prove that the Scottish discipline doth exempt Ministers from punishment for any treason or sedition they can act in their pulpits Ans This challenge is like the rest very false The rules of the Church discipline in Scotland obliges Churchmen to bee subject to punishment not only for every fault for which any other man is lyable to censure but ordaines them to bee punished for sundrie things which in other men are not at all questionable and what ever is censurable in any they appoint it to be much more so in a Minister It is very untrue that the pulpits in Scotland are Sanctuaries for any crime much lesse for the grievous crimes of sedition and treason Let the Warner remember how short a time it is since an Episcopall chayre or a canonicall coate did priviledge in England and Ireland from all censure either of Church or State great numbers who were notoriously knowne to be guilty of the foulest crimes Was ever the Warners companion Bishop Aderton challenged for his Sodomy so long as their commune patrone of Canterbury did rule the court did the warner never heare of a prelate very sibb to Doctour Bramble who to this day was never called to any account for flagrant scandals of such crimes as in Scotland are punishable by the gallows the Warner doth not well to insist upon the Scots Clergie exempting themselfe from civill punishments no where in the world are Churchmen more free of crimes deserving civil cognisance then in Scotland and if the ears and eyes of the world may be trusted the popish clergy this day in Italy and Spaine are not so challengeable as the praelaticall divines in England and Ireland lately were for many grosse misdemeanors But why does the Warners anger run out so farre as to the preachers in Holland The Warner is injurious to the Ministers of Holland is it because he knoweth the Church disciplin in Holland to be really the same with that he oppugnes in the Scots and that all the reformed Churches doe joyne cordially with Scotland in their rejection of Episcopacy is this a ground for him to slander our Brethren of Holland Is it charity for him a stranger to publish to the world in print that the ministers in Holland are seditious oratours and that they saucily controll the Magistrats in their pulpits Their crime seemes to be that for the love of Christ their master they are zealous in their doctrin to presse upon the Magistrat as well as upon the people the true practise of piety the sanctification
the Kings Majestie in Scotland never had never craved any first fruits the Church never spoiled the King of any Tythes some other men indeed by the wickednesse most of Praelats and their followers did cousin both the King and the Church of many Tythes but his Majestie and the Church had never any controversie in Scotland about the Tythes for the King so far as concerned himselfe was ever willing that the Church should enjoy that which the very act of Parliament acknowledgeth to bee her patrimony Nor for the patronages had the Church any plea with the King the Church declared often their minde of the iniquity of patronages wherein they never had from the King any considerable opposition but from the Nobility and gentry the opposition was so great that for peace-sake the Church was content to let patronages alone till God should make a Parliament lay to heart what was incumbent for gracious men to doe for liberating congregations from their slavery of having Ministers intruded upon them by the violence of Patrones Which now at last blessed be God according to our mind is performed As for the dependence of any vassals upon the King King Iames avowes himselfe a hater of Erastianisme it was never questioned by any Presbyterian in Scotland What is added in the rest of the Chapter is but a repetition of that which went before to wit the Presbyters denying to the King the spirituall government of the Church and the power of the keyes of the Kingdome of heaven such an usurpation upon the Church King James declared under his hand as at length may be seen in the Historicall vindication to be a sinne against the Father Son and Holy Ghost which puts in the hand of the Magistrat the power of preaching and celebrating the Sacraments a power which since that time no Magistrat in Britaine did assume and if any would have claimed it none would have more opposed then the most zealous patrones of Episcopacy The injurious invectives which the Warner builds upon this his Erastian assertion wee passe them as Castles in their aire which must fall and evanish for want of a foundation Only before I leave this Chapter let the Warner take a good Sentence out of the mouth of that wyse Prince King James to testifie yet farther his minde against Erastianisme His Majestie in the yeare 1617 having come in progresse to visit his auncient Kingdome of Scotland and being present in persone at a publick disputation in Theologie in the Universitie of St. Andrews whereof also many both Nobles and Church-men of both Kingdomes were auditors when one of those that acted a part in the disputation had affirmed and went about to maintaine this assertion that the King had power to depose Ministers from their Ministeriall function The King himself as abhorring such flatterie cried out with a loud voice Ego possum deponere Ministri caput sed non possum deponere ejus officium CHAP. VII The Presbyterie does not draw from the Magistrat any paritie of his power by the cheate of any relation IN the seventh chapter the Warner would cause men believe many more of the Presbyteries usurpations upon the civill Magistrate The Presbytery cognosceth only upon scandals and that in sewer civil things then the Bishopscourts were wont to meddle with The first is that all offences whatsoever are cognoscible in the consistory upon the case of scandals Ans First the Presbyterie makes no offence at all to come before the consistory but scandall alone Secondly these civill offences the scandall whereof comes before the Presbytery are but very few and a great deale fewer than the Bishops officiall takes notice of in his consistoriall court That capitall crimes past over by the Magistrate should bee censured by the Church no society of Christians who have any discipline did ever call in question When the sword of the Magistrat hes spared a murderer an adulterer a Blasphemer will any ingenuous either praelaticall or popish divine admitte of such to the holy table without signes of repentance The Warners second usurpation is but a branch of the first that the Presbyterie drawes directly before it selfe the cognisance of fraud in barganing false measures oppression and in the case of Ministers brybing usury fighting perjury c. Ans Is it then the Warners minde that the notorious slander of such grosse sins does not deserve so much as an Ecclesiastick rebooke Shall such persons without admonition be admitted to the holy communion Secondly the named cases of fraud in barganing false measures oppression come so rarely before our Church-judicatories that though these thirty yeares I have been much conversant in Presbyteries yet did I never see nor doe I remember that ever I heard any of these three cases brought before any church assembly In the persone of Ministers I grant these faults which the canons of the Church in all times and places make the causes of deprivation are cognosced upon in Presbyteries but with the good liking I am sure of all both papists and praelats who themselves are free of such vices And why did not the Warner put in among the causes of church mens deprivation from office and benefite adultery gluttonny and drunkennes are these in his c. which he will not have cognoscible by the Church in the persons of Bishops and Doctors The Warners third challenge amounts to an high crime that Presbyterian Ministers are bold to preach upon these scriptures which speake of the Magistrats duty in his office or dare offer to resolve from scripture any doubt which perplexeth the conscience of Magistrats or people of Husband or Wife of Master or Servant in the discharge of their Christian duty one to another What ever hath been the negligence of the Bishop of Derry yet I am sure all the preaching Praelats and Doctors of England pretended a great care to goe about these uncontroverted parts of their ministerial function and yet without medling with the Mysteries of State or the depths of any mans particulare vocation much lesse with thejudgement of jurisdiction in politicall or aeconomicall causes As for the Churches declaration against the Late engagement The Churches proceedings in the late engagement cleered from mistakes did it not well become them to signify their judgement in so great a case of conscience especially when the Parliament did propone it to them for resolution and when they found a conjunction driven on with a cleerly malignant partie contrary to solemne oathes and covenants unto the evident hazard of Religione and them who had been most eminent instruments of its preservation was it not the churches duty to give warning against that sinne and to exhort the ring leaders therein to repentance But our Warner must needs insist upon that unhappy engagement and fasten great blame upon the Church for giving any advice about it Ans Must it be Jesuisitisme and a drawing of all the civill affaires to the Churches barre in