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A19361 A theological dialogue Wherin the Epistle of S. Paul the Apostle to the Romanes is expounded. Gathered and set together out of the readings of Antonie Corranus of Siuille, professor of Diuinitie.; Dialogus theologicus. English Corro, Antonio del, 1527-1591. 1575 (1575) STC 5786; ESTC S116682 133,197 376

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than the othe● Patriarks of Alexandria Antioche bu● that the Bishop of Rome which nowe adayes calleth al things backe to himself is no Bishop at al no nor so much as an elder except he do his duty in ministring the Sacraments and in instructing admonishing and teaching the people That God is the creator of al things God beeing singular good and almightie created all things bothe visible and inuisible by his coeternal word and also preserueth the same by his coeternal spirite according as Dauid witnesseth saying Psal 33. by the word of god the heauens were made and all the power of them by the breath of his mouth And al thinges that God made were as sayth the Scripture exceeding good and made for the vse and commoditie of man and I say that all those thinges proceeded from one beginning Therefore I condemne the Manichees Marcionites which did wickedly surmise two substances natures the one good the other bad likewise two beginnings two cōtrary gods one good another naught Of Prouidence I beleue that al things both in heauen earth in al creatures are mainteined gouerned by gods wisdome Psa 139. For Dauid witnesseth saith the lord is high aboue al natiōs his glory aboue the heauens Who is like the lorde our god who hath his dwelling on hye and yet stoupeth to loke vpon the things that are in heauē and earth The same man saith againe vnto god Thou hast forsene al my ways For there is not a worde in my toung which thou knowest not euery whit O Lorde Also Paule witnesse the same and saith by him we liue Act. 17. moue and be And of him by him and in him are all thinges Most truely therefore and according to the scriptures Rom. 12. doth Austin in the eyghte chapter of his booke concerning Christs Agonie say the Lord said are not twoo sparrowes solde for a farthing and one of them lighteth not vppon the grounde without the will of your father In saying so he ment to shew that euen the thing whiche men take to be vilest are gouerned by the Lords almighty power Ma. 10. For after the same maner doth the truth say Ma. 6. that he feedeth the birdes of the a●re and clotheth the lyllies of the feeld and also keepeth iust account of the heares of our heades Of the Angells both good and bad I admit with the right beleuing church that among all thinges created Angells and men are the cheefe the scripture of God pronounceth of the Angels that he made his Angels spirits his ministers a flame of fyre And againe are they not al ministring spirits sent forth to do seruice for them that shal be heires of saluation And the Lord Iesus himselfe witnesseth of the Diuill that he was a murtherer from the beginning John 8. and stode not in the truth bycause there is no truth in him When he speaketh a lye he speaketh of his owne for he is a Lyer and the father of lyes Therfore we teache that of the Angels some abode still in obedience and are appointed to the faithfull seruice of God and man and that othersome fell of their owne accord and were throwen downe into destruction and are become enemies of all goodnesse and of al faithfull men Of mans creation Concerning man and creation I beleue the doctrine of the scripture that at the first he was created good after the Image and lykenesse of God and the God did set him in Paradice Gen. 2. put all things in subiection to him Which thing Dauid cōmēdeth mightily in the eyght Psalme Also he gaue him a wife and blessed thē And I say that man consisteth of twoo dyuerse substāces in one persone namely of an immortall Soule and a mortall body Of the state of Innocency or of the originall ryghtuousnesse of our firste fathers and of their fall God made man at the beginning after the Image of God in true ryghtuousnesse and holynesse good and ryghtuous but by the inticement of the Serpent and by hys owne faulte he fell awaye from goodnesse and ryghtuousnesse and became subiect to sinne death and sundry calamities And suche as he became after his fall such are al the spring of him namely euen subiect to sin death and sundry calamities Of Sinne I vnderstoode Sin to be the natiue corruption of man deryued and spred abroade into vs all from those oure firste parents wherethrough we be plunged in lewd lustes and turned away from goodnesse but forewarde to all euill and full of all naughtinesse as distrust contempte and hating of God can do no good of oure selues no nor once thinke any But rather the more we growe in yeeres the more do we bring forth corrupt frutes meete for an euill tree in our thoughtes and words and deedes done lewdly against Gods law In which respect being through our own desert subiect to Gods wrathe we be put vnder iust punishmentes in so muche that we shoulde all of vs haue bin cast of from God if Christe oure deliuerer Mat. 12. Gen. 14. in whom mankinde whiche els was lost was restored againe had not brought vs to him againe Of death the wages of Sinne. Therfore by death I meane not onely bodily death whiche we must all of vs once suffer for oure sins sake but also the endlesse punishments due to our sinfulnes and corruption Eph. 2. For we were deade saith the Apostle in oure offences and sins and we were the children of wrath as others are But God who is riche in mercie quickened vs with Christ when we were dead through our sins Rom. 5. Againe like as by one mā sin entred into the world death by sin so also death passed into al men inasmuch as al men haue sinned Of originall sin and of the cause of sinne I acknowledge that there is original sin in all men and I acknowledge that all other sins which spring thereof are called sins and are sins in very deede by what name so euer they be called whyther deadly or veniall Mar. 3. or the sinne that is called the sin againste the holye Ghost which is neuer forgiuen Also I confesse that all sins are not equall though they spring all out of one fountaine of corruption and vnbeleefe 1. John 3. but that some are greuouser than othersome according as the Lord hath sayd that it shal be easyer for Sodome and Gomor Math. 10 than for the city that refuseth the word of the Gospell Therfore I condemne all suche as haue taughte contrarye heereto and specially Pelagius and all Pelagians and Iouianistes who with the Stoikes make all sins a lyke heynouse In this cace I am fullye of opinion with Sainte Austin who alledged his matters out of the holy scriptures and defended them by the same Furthermore I condemne Florinus and Blascus and all suche as make God the author of sin Psam 5. against whom
so vpon remorse of their owne cōsciences at length submit them selues eueriwhere to gods power yeelde themselues wholly vnto him R. Why so P. Bicause that of al men there is not one be he neuer so well fraught furnished with al vvorks either of the lavv of nature or of the lavv vvritten that cā beare avvay the prayse of righteousnes at Gods iudgement so as he ought to be coūted righteous for his weldoings if he want faith which alonely imbraceth the fauour of God R. Al this discourse then ameth at this poynt that we should beleeue that nother the Iewes by the power works of the law written nor the Gentiles by the power works of the law bred in them by nature can passe for righteousnes before the iudgementseate of Gods maiestie So greatly is nature in all pointes corrupted and marred vnlesse it be restored agayne as yee would saye to hir birthright by the operation and benefite of the heauenly spirit For what clennes can spring out of vnclennes or perfectiō out of vnperfectiō But teach me I pray you to what vse the law now serueth P. Out of all doubt to very great and plenteous vses Wherof this is the chefe and most excellent that whereas men ar otherwise blind the law setteth their vices before their eies so as they be cōpelled to acknovvledge them vvhether they will or no. For it serueth vs for a most cleare looking glasse to spie out our spots in R. Euen so is it and that haue I learned by the examples both of other men and also of my selfe namely that vnlesse we looke vpon the law as vpon a glasse all of vs shall become blinder than betles in our owne vices But I pray you when we haue founde out our errours sinnes by the bewraying of the law whence shall we seeke remission or where shall we finde Phisicke for the diseases of our soules P. Out of the gospell or glad tidings of eternall saluation whereby God vttereth his good wil and mercy towards vs. For by that without the helpe or furtherance of the lawe Ro. 2.17 God sheweth his owne righteousnesse I say not the righteousnesse of the Law but his owne righteousnesse to be receiued and imbraced by the hand of fayth and he ingraffeth and ingraueth the same in our mindes by the power of his spirite together with al the companie of vertues as innocencie holinesse clennesse mildnesse honestie godlinesse louingnesse and hope For all these things are drained from him as from a spring that can not be dried into mens mindes And althoughe this rightuousnes of Gods whereof we speake haue hitherto beene wrested aside to the Law alone throgh the ignorance of the Ievves hovvbeit not of all but of most parte of them yet hath it alwayes beene confirmed and proued by most euident records not onely of the Prophets but also of Moises of the lavv it selfe therfore this righteousnes was not in any vvyse inuented by the vvitte and cunning of men R. What can be spoken more playne more profitable or more plentifull than this saying of yours For heereby it is manifest that all hope of saluation both for Iew and Gentile must be reposed in the righteousnesse of fayth and not in the workes of the Lawe For inasmuche as that righteousnesse is Gods righteousnesse and therefore God him selfe is the author of it no doubte but it shall most of all yea and alonely auayle at the iudgement seate of almightie God specially forasmuche as it is not deuized by man but springeth of God himselfe and is set foorth by his worde But what is the meane to inioy this so precious and healthfull righteousnes throughly P. The vvhole atteinement of that righteousnes cōsisteth in faith towards Christ and in the sincere and inwarde feeling and trust of Gods goodnes offered vs in Christ by Christ This fayth beeing brought vs down from heauen by Christ imbraceth the true substantiall holines innocencie or righteousnes vvhich is set foorth in the Gospell And moreouer that righteousnes of the Gospel or of God belongeth to al men without any difference bicause that all without exception haue sinned made themselues thrals to the tyrannie of sin And for that cause they haue exceding great neede of the helpe and fauour of the glorious and immortall God from vvhose good vvil they of themselues are as far of as there is oddes betweene the ovvgliest sinne of man and the brightest glory of God R. Nothing is or can seeme more profitable nothing is or can seeme more pleasant than this doctrine specially to mindes that are cumbered with the tyrannie of sinne or with the accusation of the lawe For it sheweth bothe that the Phisicke of our diseases cōmeth frō god and that the order meanes how to vse it is rased vs by his hande all whiche things are receiued by faith and assured beleefe of Gods good will towards vs and also that the same benefite is cōmon to all people least any man conceyuing an vntoward opiniō of Gods goodnes should set out him selfe frō the function of so gret a benefite Howbeit forasmuch as God hathe determined to make vs righteous holy and his children by the sayd fayth as by an instrument whiche thinke you to bee the neerest for vs to attaine to this fayth Or by what deserts may we wind our selues into gods fauour to earne the same P. I wish you to be better learned in this poynt For no deserts or weldoings of ours which in deede are none at all can leade god to brede faith in vs or to make vs holy righteous to adopt vs to his children but his bestovving of that so great and incredible benefite vpon al men is of his owne mere grace goodnes and liberalitie R. So much the better comfort hope ought wretched men to haue which are in thraldome to sin sith they be sure that their saluation is layde vp in the keping of so faythfull and friendly a creator and father But in what thing resteth this good will and friendship of God P. Euen in the redemption of mankinde wrought by Iesus Christ Eph. 1.4 Gen. 3. 16 whom the euerlasting father had before the creating of all things and before all time appointed to be the reconciler of all things for their sakes which should repose their trust in his bloud R. O saying worthy to be had in euerlasting remembrance that mens mynds may alwayes be cheered vp to giue God continuall thanks in that for their sakes he is a most mercifull father hath voutsafed that his eternall worde should become fleshe to the intent that the treasures of Gods vnmeasurable goodnes should be discouered and laide foorth to the children of Adam Now doo I perceiue that the sayde euerlasting worde beeing become fleshe Iohn 1.18 is the raunsome of our redemption and the very counterpane of the olde merciseate wherewith the Arke and the Lawe inclosed therin were couered howbeit after
while in the meane time our own cōscience wauereth for the thing that is done against a mans owne cōscience cānot be dō without sin Therfore whē thou seest other men vse the libertye of the gospell cōsult with thine own faith before thou folow their exāple deale not with any thing which thou knowest not by the allowāce of thine own cōscience by the record of the holy Ghost to be throughly acceptable to God R. Now I see plainly how great daūger there is in setting out of christen liberty to the shew Chap. 15. when the foūdaciō of faith the feare of God is not layd afore frō whēce the seking of brotherly loue proceedeth But to say the truth Paule your coūtrymen do ouermuch hinder the course of the gospell in our church by holding fast the ordināces of the law and we thinke that suche weakelinges are not to be borne with all Heereupon spring braulinges stryfe and contentions among vs. P. But I thinke the contrary For we that are the stronger and stedfaster sort and are indued with a mightier faith must beare the infirmities of the weker sort charitably cary thē as you would say vppon our shoulders And we must not plese our selues but euery of vs must please other and serue his turne in all goodnesse and hs is bounde by the duetye of charitye to study for his edifying and instruction Whiche thing maye be gathered euen cheefly by Christes example who suffered all things to the intent to bring vnto his father not only the weaklings but also euen his cruellest enemies by ouercomming them with patience Therfore this mediator betwene God and man cockered not himself ne cared to please himselfe onlye but tooke vppon him all slaunder reproch Psa 69. and finally torment and infamie according to this saying which the Kingly prophet hath writtē of him the reuilings of them that reuyled thee are lyght vpon me R. Yea Thinke you that that saying of Dauids is a prophesie of the messias and that the Prophet incorageth vs too patience by his example P. Yea verely For whatsoeuer things are written in the books of our forefathers are written to oure learning that we myght haue hope through patience and comfort of the scriptures For in asmuch as they be the wordes of the holy Ghost we muste beleeue that they be not vnprofitable or vaine but that they make for our instruction R. It is straunge the we should alwaies be occupied in reading the holy scriptures and yet profite so little in these vertues For how many do know at this day that Gods giuing of strength to the stoute is not to the intent they should condemne the weake but to the intent they shuld help them Or who is he also which taketh so abundant comforte by reading the holy scriptures that he fainteth not in aduersity P. These vertues my brother depend not vpon the letters but vpon the spirit of gods word which lies hid in the letters vvhich if you haue not you shall euer stick stil in the bark of the letter And I pray god the author of patience cōfort to teach you by his spirit to graunt you to be al of one mind one towards another after the exāple of Iesus christ as his doctrine exāple require that you may by that meanes with one accorde one mouth glorifie god euē the father of our Lord Iesus christ Whose gentlenes I beseech you to follow in bearing one vvith another and to releeue the weake brethren like as Christ releeued vs bare with vs only to the end to glorifie his father and our glorious god I knowe you haue very many of my countrey men among you which are stil feble weak in the faith but you must haue a care of them after the example of Christ you must set before your eyes the footsteps of that heauenly master who notwithstanding that the Jewes were neuer so vnworthy did yet voutsafe thē such honor for the couenāts sake that was made vnto their fathers that he bare the roome euen of a seruant among them with incredible patiēce Now if the son of god estemed men so much then godlines requireth not only that you should not reiect thē or hold scorne of them but also that yee should be so kindled vvith the spirite of charitie as to receyue them to teache them and to further them more and more to the knovvledge of the libertie of the Gospell by your discrete dealyng For I am vvont too teache that Jesus Christ vvas a minister amonge the Circumcised too keepe the fathers credite in the things vvhiche he hadde promised to their forefathers Therefore Chryste perfourmed all thinges for Gods truthes sake and for the confirmation of his promises R. These things are true in dede howbeit their vnthankfulnes agaynst Gods so great goodnes is the cause that God hath shaken them off and taken vs to be his people P. In deede their sinnes are the cause of their shaking off but the receyuing of you dependeth vpon the incomprehensible goodnes of our most mercifull God And therfore you Romans must not become high minded but rather glorifie God for his mercy bestowed vpon you as you be taught in the holy Scriptures For ye see what the kingly Prophet hath said Ps 18.50 1. reg 21. Deu. 32. Ps 117.1 Therfore will I confesse thee among the Gentiles and sing vnto thy name And agayne he sayth Reioyce ye Gentiles with his people And agayne All nations prayse yee the Lord and all people prayse ye him together Also the prophet Esay confirming Gods eternall ordinance of the calling of the Gentiles saith thus Es 11.10 There shall be a roote of lesse and he whiche shall rise vp to reigne ouer the gentiles in him shall the Gentiles trust Heerby you maye gather that your calling to the participation of the kingdome of heauen is not by reason of the sinnes of the Iewes and much lesse for your own deserts but bicause god of his goodnes wold haue it so Therfore like as he hath shewed his mercy towards vs so also on the other side it behoueth vs to be mercifull to others R. Would God that this lesson might take deepe roote among vs all P. And I also beseech god the author of hope and in whom the trust of all mē ought to be reposed to fill you with al spirituall ioy quietnesse of mind and peace of conscience in true fayth that by beleeuing you may abound in hope through the power of the holy ghost For there is none other way for men to attayne to these ornaments of christian godlines but by the meere benefite of god by the power of his spirite and by the working of fayth R. To the intent wee maye nowe at length make an ende of this our talke I can not maruell inough at this your so free maner of dealing with vs. For you are not ignoraunt how great the dignity and excellencie