Treatisours Good things may be receiued from ill handes If the matter of any prayer be Popish fault it for what it containes not for whence it came what say you against vs in this more then Master Smith your stout Anabaptist saith of our baptizing of Infants Both of them equally condemned for Antichristian Still therefore wee boast of the free and cleare ayre of the Gospell if it be annoyed with some practicall euils we may be foule the Gospel is it selfe and our profession holy neither can we complaine of all euils while we want you SECTION LVI The iudgement of our owne and our neighbours of our Church THat which followeth is but wordes a short answere is too much That all Christendome magnifies the worthinesse of our Church in so cleare euidences of their own voyces you cannot denie and now when you see such testimonies abroad lest you should say nothing you fetch cauils from home Those men which you say complaine so much of their miserable condition vnder the Prelates impositions haue notwithstanding with the same pens and tongues not onely iustified our Church but extold it you haue found no sharper aduersaries in this verie accusation for which you malitiously cyte them How freely how sully haue they euinced the truth yea the happinesse of the Church of England against your false challenges and yet your forehead dare challenge them for Authors So hath their moderation opposed some appendances that they haue both acknowledged and defended the substance with equall vehemence to your opposition neither doe they suffer as you traduce them for seeking another Church-gouernement looke into the Millenaries petition the common voyce of that part I am deceiued if ought of their complaints sound that way much lesse of their sufferings deformitie in practise is obiected to them not indeuour of innouation That quarrell hath beene long silent your motion cannot reuiue it would God you could as much follow those men in moderate and charitable carriage as you haue out-run them in complaint It pleaseth you to deuise vs like pictures vpon course Canuasse which shew fairest at farthest attributing forraine approbation which you cannot denie to distance more then to desert How is it then that besides strange witnesses we which looke vpon this face without preiudice commend it God knowes without flatterie we can at once acknowledge her infirmities and blesse God for her graces Our neighbours yea our selues of Scotland know our Church so well that they doe with one consent praise her for one of Gods best daughters neither doe the most rigorous amongst them more dislike our Episcopall Gouernement then embrace our Church what fraud is this to flie from the Church in common to one circumstance wee can honour that noble Church in Scotland may we not dislike their alienations of Church-liuings If one thing offend doe all displease Yet euen this Gouernment which you would haue them resist to bonds and banishment who knowes not begins to find both fauour and place what choice other Churches would make as you doubt not so you care not If you regarded their sentence How durst your reuile her as a false harlot whom they honour as a deere sister If you were more theirs then we you might vpbraide vs Now you tell vs what perhaps they would doe we tell you what they doe and will doe Euen with one voyce blesse God for England as the most famous and flourishing Church in Christendome your handfull onely makes faces and enuies this true glorie Who yet you say despise not our graces no more then we those of Rome See how you despise vs while you say you are free from despight How malicious is this Comparison as if we were to you as Rome to vs and yet you despise vs more Wee graunt Rome a true Baptisme true Visibilitie of a Church though monstrously corrupted you giue not vs so much Thankes be to God wee care lesse for your censure then you doe for our Church We haue by Gods mercy the true and right vse of the word and Sacraments and all other essentiall giftes and graces of God if there might bee some further helpes in execution to make these more effectual we resist not But those your other imaginary ordinances as wee haue not so wee want not Neither the Chaldeans nor any Idolatrous enemies could make Sion Babylon nor the holy vessels prophane so as they should cease to be fitte for Gods vse but they were brought backe at the returne of the captiuitie to Ierusalem Such were our worshippe ministery Sacraments and those manifold subiects of your cauils which whiles you disgrace for their former abuse you call our good euill and willingly despise our graces SECTION LVII The issue of Separation ALL the sequell of my answerer is meerely sententious it is fitter for vs to learne then replie Where the truth gaines say you God looseth not I tell you againe where God looseth the truth gaineth not and where the Church looseth God which indowed her cannot but loose Alas what can the truth either get or saue by such vnkinde quarrels Surely suspicion on some handes on others reiection for as Optatus of his Donatists Betwixt our Licet and your Non licet many poore soules wauer and doubt neither will settle because wee agree not Thankes are not lost where new fauours are called for but where olde are denied while your Posie is Such as the mother such is the daughter where are our olde our any mercies They are vnthankfull which know what God hath done and confesse it not They are vnfaithfull to God and his Deputie which knowing themselues made to obey presume to ouer-rule and vpon their priuate authoritie obtrude to the Church those ordinances to bee obserued which neuer had being but in their owne idle speculation Your Sequestration and our confusion are both of them beneficial where they should not and as you pretend our confusion for the cause of your Separation So is your Separation the true cause of too much trouble and confusion in the Church Your odious tale of commixture hath cloyed and surfeited your reader already and receiued aunswere to satietie This one dish so oft brought foorth argues your pouertie The visible Church is Gods drag-net and field and floore and Arke here will be euer at her best sedge tares chaffe vncleane Creatures yet is this no pretence for her neglect The notoriously euill she casts from her brest and knee denying them the vse of her prayers and which your leaders mislike of her Sacrament If diuers through corruption of vnfaithfull officers escape censure yet let not the transgressions of some redound to the condemnation of the whole Church In Gods iudgement it shall not wee care little if in yours Wee tell wicked men they may goe to hell-with the water of Baptisme in their faces with the Church in their mouthes we denounce Gods iudgements vnpartially against their sinnes
4. 41. Rom. 1. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 1. Thess. vlt. ad fin Iere. 15. 19. Vide Tremel Iun. Num. 16. Mat. 15. ad fin 2. Chro. 19 2. 1. Cor. 6. ad fin Nulla cum malis Conuivia vel colloquia misceantur simusque ab ijs tam separati quam sunt illi ab Ecclesia Dei profugi Cypr. l. 1. Epist. ad Cornel. 2. Char act of Beast praef Iohns Inquir Ioh. 6. 68. H. Cl. Epistle before Treatis of sinne ag Holy Gh. Neque propter paleam relinquim are am Domini neque propter pisces malos rumpimus retia Domini August Ep. 48. Answ. Counterpoyson p. 2. Counter p. p. 7 8. c Sep. The separation we haue made in respect of our knowledge and obedience is indeed late and new yet is it in the nature and causes thereof as auncient as the Gospell which was first founded in the enmity which God himselfe put betwixt the seede of the woman and the seede of the serpent Gen. 3 15 â—useb hâ—st Eccl Hen Steph. Apâ—l Herod Foâ— Aâ—t monum H. N. his booke Gal. 1. 6. Eph. 6. 17. Colos. 1 5. 1. Tin 1. 11. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Sep. Which enmity hath not onely beene successiuely continued but also visibly manifested by the actuall separation of all true Churches from the world in their collection and constitution before the law vnder the law and vnder the Gospell Gen. 4 13 14 16 6. 1 2 7 1 7. with 1 Pet 3 20 21 12. 2 Iâ—â— 20 24 26 Neh 9 2 Ioh 17 14 16 Act. 2 40 19 9 1 Cor 6 17 Iren. de Valentin l. 1. Ianumerabilâ— multitudinâ—m scripturarum quas ipsi sinâ—erunt afferunt ad stuporem insensatorum Vid. Preface to Master Iacobs and Iohnsons Confer Barr. pass Descript of true visib Ch Nihil autem â—irum fi ex ipsius instrumento aâ—tentur argumenta cum oporteat haereses esse quae esse non possent si non perperam scripturae intelligi possent Tertull. de resur Ibid So Barrow tearmes Mast. Gyff Reâ—ut p. 102. Si Christianus Iudaicae praeuaricanti carnaliter coniungatur a commumone Ecclesiaesegregetur Dist. 28. q. 1 Caue cap. si quis Iudaicae c. 1. Pet. 3. 19. 2. Pet. 2. 5. Sep. Which separation the Church of England neither hath made nor doth make but stands actually one with althat part of the world within the kingdom without separation for which cause amongst others we haue chosen by the grace of God rather to separate our selues to the Lord from it then with it from him in the visible constitution of it In his Preface to the Reader and in his causes of separ defended p. 4 Eiusdem p. 10 Resutat of M. Gyff p 22. 2. Transgress p 51 52. 55. 66 70. 85. 86. c. Inconstancâ— of Brown p. â—o Inquiry into M. White confessed by Fr. Iohnson p. 63. Passag 'twixt Clifton and Smith And concerning the constitution of the Churches c. But the constituting of Churches now after the defection of Antichrist may more properly be called a repairing then a constituting c. p. 60. psal 106. Matth. 23. Reuel 34. Reuel â— 24. Bar. p. 22. 55. Fr. Iohns ag M. H. Act. Mon. passim Troubl and excom pa. 191 M. Spr. p. 1. Fr. Iun. lib. de Eccles. Ratihabitio retrohaâ—â— c. Subsequens consensus Iacob in Leam fecit cos coniuges d. 29. q 1. S. sed obijcitur Barr. ag Gyff H. Answ. Counter p. p. 17â— Colos. 2. 5. Tertull. de Prescript Tu vt homo extrimsecus vitumquemque nosti putas quod vides vides autem quonsque oculos habes sed oculi Domini sunt alti Homo in faciem Deus in praecordiae contemplatur Principles inferences concerning the visible Ch. An. 1607 p 13 Part of Constitution how farr requisite and whether hindred by Constraint D. 〈…〉 Brownists Brow◠〈◊〉 of true Christians Inquir into M. White Answ. ibid. Arist. Pol. 3 c 1. Arist. Pol 3 c. 1 Edesius Frumentius pueri a Meropio Tyrio-Philosophâ— in Indian deportati postea ibi Christianam religionem plantarunt Ruffin l. 1. â— 9. Faemina iâ—ter Iberos 2. Chron. 33. 16 2. Chr. 34. 32. 33 2. Chron. â—5 13 Barr. ag Ciff Brow Reform without tarry Greene wood Confer with Cooper Brow refor without tar Confer with D. And M. Hutch Confer with D. An. Refor without tar Ber. Fides Suadenda non cogenda Counterpois Dixit Paterfamilias seruis Quoscunque inueneritis cogite intrare c. Aug. â—p 48. Pless de Eccles. c. 10 Augustin Quod si cogiper legem aliquem vel ad bona licuisset vos ipsi miseri 〈◊〉 nobis ad fidem purissimam cogi debuistis sed absit a nostra conscientia vt ad 〈…〉 August Epist. 48. 〈◊〉 68. Qui freneticum ligat qui 〈…〉 Quod 〈◊〉 umus sanctum est Bar. and Greenew pasâ—im H. answ Counterp Act Monum Edit 5. p. 1180. Counterp 226. P. Martyr P. Fagius Bucer c. Sixe Arti. 1547 Pag. 1182. Col. 2. 60. Act. Monum Pag. 999. 1000. Act Monum Edit 5. p. 1002. Bar. ag Gyff Conference with Sperin M. Egerton Greenw Bar. Arg. to M. Car. twr M. Trauers M. Chark Browne Reform without tarrying M. Smith ag R. Clifton Principl Iâ—fer pag. 11. Separ To the Title of Ring-leader wherewith it pleaseth this Pistler to stile me I answere that if the thing I haue done be good it is good and commendable to haue beene forward in it if it be euill let it be reproued by the light of Gods word and that God to whom I haue done that I haue done will I doubt not giue me both to see and to heale mine errour by speedy repentance if I haue fledde away on foote I shall returne on Horse-backe But as I durst neuer sâ—t foote into this way but vpon a most sound and vnresist able conuiction of conscience by the word Ier. 23. 32. Ezech. 13. 2. of God as I was perswaded so must my retyring be wrought by more solide reasons from the same word then are to be found in a thousand such pretty pamphlets and formall flourishes as this is Pro. 9. 21. Separ Your pitying of vs and sorrowing for vs especially for the wrong done by vs were in you commendable affections if by vs iustly occasioâ—ed but if your Church bee deepelye drencht in Apostacie and you crie Peace Peace when suddaine and certaine desolation is at hand it is you that do wrong though you make the complaint and so being cruell towards your selues your owne whome you flatter you cannot be truely pitifull towards others whom you bewaile A Treatise of the Ministery of England against M. H pag. 125. H. Amsworth in his fore-speech to his Count. Inqu into VVh Tertul. l. de Orat Tert. l. de praescript So de Virginib Veland That no continâ—ance of time can prejudice
A COMMON APOLOGIE OF THE CHVRCH OF ENGLAND Against the vniust Challenges of the ouer-iust Sect commonly called Brownists Wherein the grounds and Defences of the Separation are largely discussed OCCASIONED BY A Late Pamphlet published vnder the name Of an Answer to a Censorious Epistle Which the Reader shall finde in the Margent By I. H. LONDON Printed for Samuel Macham and are to be sold at his Shop in Pauls Church-yard at the Signe of the Bull-head 1610. TO OVR GRATIOVS AND BLESsed Mother the Church of ENGLAND THE MEANEST OF HER Children Dedicates this her Apology and wisheth all Peace and Happines NO lesse then a yeare and a halfe is past Reuerend Deare and holy Mother since I wrote a louing monitory letter to two of thine vnworthy Sons which I heard were fled from thee in person in affection and somewhat in opinion Supposing them yet thine in the maine substance though in some circumstances their owne Since which one of them hath wash't of thy Font-water as vnclean and hath written desperately both against thee and his owne fellowes From the other I receiued not two moneths since a stomakful Pamphlet besides the priuate iniuries to the monitor casting vpon thine honourable name blasphemos imputations of Apostasie Antichristianisme Whoordome Rebellion Mine owne wronges I could haue contemned in silence but For Sions sake I cannot hold my peace If I remember not thee O Ierusalem let my tongue cleaue to the roofe of my mouth It were a shame and sinne for me that myzeale should be lesse hote for thine innocency then theirs to thy false disgrace How haue I hastened therefore to let the world see thy sincere truth and their peruerse slanders Vnto thy sacred name then whereto I haue in all piety deuoted my selfe I humbly present this my speedy and dutifull labour whereby I hope thy weak Sonnes may be confirmed the strong encouraged the rebellious shamed And if any shall still obstinately accurse thee I referre their reuenge vnto thy Glorious Head who hath espoused thee to himselfe in trueth and righteousnesse Let him whose thou art right thee In the meane time we thy true sonnes shall not onely defend but magnifie thee Thou maiest be blacke but thou art comely the Daughters haue seene thee and counted thee blessed euen the Queene and the Concubines and they haue praised thee thou art thy Welbelouedst and his desire is towards thee So let it be and so let thine be towards him for euer and mine towards you both who am the least of all thy little ones IOS HALL A COMMON Apologie against the Brownists SECTION I. The entrance into the worke IF Truth and peace Zacharyes two companions had met in our loue this Controuersie had neuer beene the seuering of these two hath caused this separation for while some vnquiet mindes haue sought Trueth without Peace they haue at once lost Truth Peace Loue vs and themselues God knowes how vnwillingly I put my hand to this vnkind quarrell Nothng so much abates the courage of a Christian as to call his brother aduersary We must doe it woe to the men by whom this offence commeth Yet by how much the insultation of a brotherly enemy is more intollerable and the griefe of our blessed mother greater for the wrong of her owne So much more cause I see to breake this silence If they will haue the last words they may not haue all For our carriage to them They say when Fire the God of the Chaldees had deuoured all the other wooden Deities that Canopis set vpon him a Caldron full of water whose bottome was deuised with holes stop't with waxe which no sooner felt the flame but gaue way to the quenching of that furious Idoll If the fire of inordinate zeale conceite contention haue consumed all other parts in the separation and cast forth more then Nebuchadnezers furnace from their Amsterdam hither it were well if the waters of our moderation and reason could vanquish yea abate it This litle Hin of mine shall be spent that way wee may trie and wish but not hope it The spirits of these men are too-well knowne to admit any expectation of yeeldance since yet both for preuention and necessary defence this taske must be vndertaken I craue nothing of my Reader but patience and iustice of God victory to the truth as for fauour I wish no more then an enemy would giue against himselfe With this confidence I enter into these lifts and turne my penne to an Aduersary GOD knowes whether more proud or weake SECTION II. The Answerers Preamble IT is a hard thing euen for those which would seem sober minded men in cases of controuersie to vse soberly the frownes and disaduantages of causes and times whereby whiles men are deiâ—cted and troden downe they vse to behold their opposites mounted on high too repiningly and not without desperate enuie so are oftentimes moued to shoote vp at them as from below the bitter arrowes of spightfull and splenish discourses thinking any hatefull opposition sufficiently charitable to oppugne those aduersaries which haue them as they feele at so great an aduantage vpon this impotent malitiousnesse it commeth to passe that this aunswerer vndertaketh thus seuerely and peremptorily to censure that charitable censure of ignorance which as shall appeare in the sequell he either simply or willingly vnderstood not and to brand a deare Church of Christ with Apostacy Rebellion Antichristianisme What can bee more easie then to returne accusations Your Preamble with a graue bitternes charges me with 1. Presumption vpon aduantages 2. Weake and weightlesse discourse 3. Ignorance of the cause censured It had beene madnesse in me to write if I had not presumed vpon aduantages but of the cause of the truth not of the times Though blessed bee God the times fauour the truth and vs if you scorn them and their fauours complaine not to be an vnderling Thinke that the times are wiser then to bestow their fauours vpon willfull aduersaries but in spight of times you are not more vnder vs in estate then in conceipt aboue vs so wee say the Sunne is vnder a cloud we know it is aboue it Would God ouerlinesse and contempt were not yours euen to them which are mounted highest vpon best desert and now you that haue not learned sobrietie in iust disaduantages taxe vs not to vse soberly the aduantages of time there was no gall in my penne no insultation I wrote to you as brethren and wish't you companions there was more danger of flattery in my stile then bitternesse wherein vsed I not my aduantages soberly Not in that I said too much but not enough Not in that I was too sharpe but not weighty enough My opposition was not too vehement but too sleight and slender So strong Champions blame their aduersary for striking too easily you might haue forborne this fault it was my fauour that I did not my worst you are worthy of
whether of doctrine or manners and disclaime all fellowship with the vnfruitfull workes of darknesse whither in himselfe or others So S. Paul charges vs to holde that which is good and abstaine from all appearance of euill so Ieremie is charged to separate the pretious doctrine or practise from the vile From sinners not onely practised by God himselfe to omit his eternall and secret Decree whereby the elect are separated from the Reprobate both in his gratious vocation sequestring them from nature and sinne as also in his execution of iudgment whether particular as of the Israelites from the Tabernacles of Corah or Vniuersall and finall of the Sheepe from the Goates But also inioyned from God to men in respect either of our affection or of our yoake and familiar society whereof Saint Paul Be not vnequally yoaked with Infidels Come out from among them and seperate your selues In all this we agree In the latitude of this last onely we differ I finde you call for a double separation A first separation in the gathering of the Church A second in the managing of it The first at our entrance into the Church the second in our continuance the first of the Church from Pagans Worldlings by an initiatory profession The second of leud men from the Church by iust censures You speake confusedly of your own separation one while of both another while of either single For the first either confesse it done by our Baptisme or else you shall be forced to hold we must rebaptise But of this Constituâ—ine separation anone For the second of sinners whether in iudgement or life some are more grosse haynous incorrigible others lesse notorious and more tractable those other must be separated by iust censures not these Which censures if they be neglected the Church is foule and in your Pastors word faultie and therefore calles for our teares not for our flight Now of Churches faulty and corrupted some race the foundation others on the true foundation build Timber hay Stubble FroÌ„ those we must separate from these we may not Peters is eternall Whither shall we goe from thee thou hast the wordes of eternall life where these wordes are found wo be to vs if we be not found Amongst many good separations then yours cannot be separated from euill for that we should so farre separate from the euill that therefore wee should separate from Gods children in the communion of the holy thinges of God that for some after your worst done not fundamentall corruptions wee should separate from that Church in whose wombe we were conceiued and from betwixt whose knees wee fell to God in a word as one of yours once said to separate not only from visible euill but from visible good as all Antichristian who but yours can thinke lesse then absurd and impious Grant we should be cleane separated from the world yet if we be not must you be separated from vs Doe but stay till God haue separated vs from himselfe will the wise husbandman cast away his Corne-heape for the chaffe and dust Shall the Fisher cast away a good draught because his drag-net hath weedes Doth God separate from the faithfull soule because it hath some corruptions her Inmates though not her commaunders Certainely if you could throughly separate the world from you you would neuer thus separate your selues from vs Beginne at home separate all selfe-loue and selfe-will and vncharitablenesse from your heart and you cannot but ioyne with that Church from which you haue separated Your Doctor would perswade vs you separate from nothing but our corruptions you are honester and graunt it from our Church it were happie for you if he lied not who in the next page confutes himselfe shewing that you separate from vs as Christ from the Samaritans namely from the Church not the corruptions only and not as hee did from the Iewes namely from their corruptions not from their Church His memory saues our labour and marres his Discourse SECTION V. The antiquity and examples of separation YEt if not equity it were well you could pleade age This your separation in the nature and causes of it you say is no lesse auncient then the first institution of enmity betwixt the two seedes you might haue gone a little higher and haue said then our first parents running from God in the Garden or their separation from GOD by their sinne But wee take your time and easily beleeue that this your late separation was founded vpon that auncient enmity of the seede of the serpent with the womans That subtile Diuell when he saw the Church breath from the persecutions of Tyrants vexed her no lesse with her owne diuisions seeking that by fraude which by violence he could not effect Hence all the fearefull Schismes of the Church whereof yours is part This enmâ—ty hath not onely beene successiuely contiuued but also too visibly manifested by the actuall but wilfull separation of heretickes and Sectaries from the Chuch in all ages But I mistake you yours is as auncient as the Gospel What that Euangelium aeternum of the Friers whose name they accursedly borrowed from Reuel 14. 6. Or that Euangelium regni of the Familists Or that Euangelium aliud whereof Saint Paul taxeth his Galatians None of all these you say but as that Gospell of Peace of Truth of Glory so auncient and neuer knowne till Bolton Barrow and Browne Could it escape all the holy Prophets Apostles Doctors of the old middle and later world and light onely vpon these your three Patriarchs Perhaps Nouatus or Donatus those Saints with their Schooles had some little glimpse of it but this perfection of knowledge is but late and new So many rich mines haue lien long vnknown and great parts of the world haue been discouered by late Venturers If this course haue come late to your knowledge and obedience not so to others For loe it was practised successiuely in the constitution and collection of all tâ—ue Churches through al times before the law vnder the law after it Wee haue acknowledged many separations but as soone shall you finde the time past in the present as your late separation in the auncient and approued You quote Scriptures though to your praise more dainty indeed then your fellowes Who cannot doe so Who hath not Euen Sathan himselfe cytes the word against him which was the word of his Father Let vs not number but weigh your texts The rather for that I finde these as your Master-proofes set as Challengers in euery of your defences In Gen. 4. 13. Caine a bloody Fratricide is excommunicated In Gen. 6. 1. 2. The sonnes of God married the daughters of men In Gen. 7. 1. 7. Noah is approued as righteous and enters the Arke In 1. Pet. 3. 20 21. The rest in Noahs time were disobedient and perished What of all this Alas what mockage is this of the Reader and
Where all in a sort ordaine and excommunicate We condemne you not for no true members of the Church what can be more order 〈◊〉 by your owne confusions then the 〈◊〉 Church at Amsterdam which yet you graunt but faulty If there be disproportion and dislocation of some parts is it no true humane bodie will you rise from the feast vnlesse the dishes be set on in your owne fashion Is it no City if there be mud-walles halfe-broken low Cottages vnequally built no state house But your order hath more essence then you can expresse and is the same which Politicians in their trade call 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 an incorporating into one common ciuill body by a voluntary vnion and that vnder a lawfull gouernment Our Church wants both wherein there is both constraint and false office Take your owne resemblance and your owne asking Say that some tyrant as Basilius of Russia shall forceably compell a certaine number of subiects into Mosco and shall hold them in by an awfull Garison forcing them to new lawes and Magistrates perhappes hard and bloody They yeeld and making the best of all liue together in a cheerefull communion with due commerce louing conuersation submissiue execution of the inioyned lawes In such case Whether is Mosco a true City or not Since your Doctor cytes Aristotle let it not irke him to learne of that Philosopher who can teach him that when Clisthenes had driuen out the Tyrants from Athens and set vp a new Gouernement and receiued many strangers and bondmen into the Tribes it was doubted not which of them were citizens but whither they were made Citizens vniustly If you should finde a company of true Christians in vtmost India would you stand vpon tearmes and inquire how they became so VVhiles they haue what is necessary for that heauenly profession what need your curiosity trouble it selfe with the meanes SECTION X. Constraint requisite YOu see then what an idle plea constraint is in the Constitution of a City the ground of all your exception But it is otherwise in Gods Citie the Church why then doth his Doctor shippe parallell these two And why may not euen constraint it selfe haue place in the lawfull constitution or reformation of a Church Did not Manisses after his comming home to God charge and commaund 〈◊〉 to serue the Lord God of Israel Did not worthy Iosiah when he had made a couenant before the Lord cause all that were found in Ierusalem and Beniamin to stand to it and compelled all that were found in Israel to serue the Lord their God What haue Queene Elizabeth or King Iames done more or what other Did not Asa vpon Obeds prophesie gather both Iudae and Beniamin and al the strangers from Ephraim Manasses and Simeon and enact with them that whosoeuer would not seeke the Lord God should be slaine What meanes this perueâ—snesse You that teach we may not stay Princes leasure to reforme will you not allow Princes to vrge others to reforme What crime is this that men were not suffered to be open Idolaters that they were forced to yeeld submission to Gods ordinances Euen your owne teach that Magistrates may compell infidelles to heare the doctrine of the Church and Papists you say elsewhere though too roughly are infidells But you say not to be members of the Church Gods people are of the willing sort True Neither did they compell them to this They were before entred into the visible Church by true Baptisme though miserably corrupted They were not now initiated but purged Your 〈◊〉 Doctor 〈◊〉 vs from Bernard that faith is to be 〈…〉 to bee compelled yet let him 〈◊〉 that the guests must bee compelled to come in though not to eat when they are come Compelled not by perswasions for these were the first inuitationâ— therfore by further meanes Though this conceit hath no place with vs where men were vrged not to receiue a new faith but to performe the old to abandon that wicked Idolatry which had defiled them and to entertaine but that truth which the very power of their Baptisme challenge that their hand But this was the old song of the Donatists Far bee it from our conscience to compell any man to the faith If God did not draw vs and by asweat violence bend our wils to his when should we follow him Either you haue not read or not cared for the practise of the auncient Church and Augustines resolution concerning the sharpe penalties imposed vpon the Donatists would God none of your kindred in his time with his excellent defences of these proceedings SECTION XI Constitution of the Church of England BVt tell vs then what should haue beene done The Gospell should haue beene euery where preached All conuerâ—s should haue been singled out and haue giâ—en a voluntary and particular confession of their faith and repentance I answere you The Gospell was long and worthily preached in the dayes of King Edward enough to yeeld both Martyres to the stake and professors to the succeeding times Were their holy Sermons their learned writings and their pretious blood which was no lesse vocall of no force Afterwards in the beginning of famous Queene Elizabeths reparation what confluence was there of zealous Confessors returning now from their late exile How painefully and Diuinely did they labour in this Vineyard of God How did they with their many holy Partners which had shrowded themselues during that storme of persecution in a dangerous secrecy spread themselues ouer this land and each-where drew flockes of hearers to them and with them Is all this nothing to their ingrateful posterity If you murmure that there was no more take heede least you forget there were so many for vs wee doe seriously blesse God for these and triumph in them All this premised now comes a Christian Edict from the State that euery man shall yeelde obedience to this truth wherein they had beene thus instructed It was performed by the most whose submission what was it but an actuall profession of their faith and repentance And since such was their face who dares iudge of their hearts More then this if euer can bee shewed absolutely necessary in such a state of the Church to the very Constitution and repaired Beeing thereof I do here vow neuer to take the Church of England for my mother We know and grieue to see how scornfully your whole Sect and amongst the rest your resolute Dr. turnes ouer these gratious entrances and proceedings of these two royall and blessed Reformers and whom should he finde to raise his scoffes vpon but that Saint-like Historian Master Foxe Now saies Master Foxe a new face of things began to appeare as it were in a Stage new Players comming in the olde thrust out Now saieth your Doctors Comment new Bishoppes came in as Players vpon the olde Stage of the Popish Church as if the Church were no whit altered
The Motherhood of the Church of England how farre it obligeth vs. THE Church of England is your mother to her small comfort she hath borne you and repented Alas you haue giuen her cause to powre out Iobs curses vpon your birth-day by your not onely forsaking but cursing her Stand not vpon her faults which you shall neuer proue capitall Note only the best Parent might haue brought forth are bellious sonne to be stoned What then Doe we preferre duetie to piety and so plead for our holy mother Church that we neglect our heauenly Father yea offend him See what you say It must needes be an holy mother that cannot be pleased without the displeasure of God A good wife that opposes such an husband a good sonne that vpbraides this vniustly Therfore is she a Church your mother holy because she bred you to God cleaues to him obeyes his commaundements and commaunds them And so farre is shee from this desperate contradiction that she voweth not to hold you for her sonne vnlesse you honour God as a father It is a wilful slaunder that you could not but heynously transgresse vnder her I dare take it vpon my soule that all your transgression which you should necessarily haue incurred by her obedience is nothing so heynous as your vnchariblenesse in your censures and disobedience Conscience is a common plea euen to those you hate we inquire not how strong it is but how well informed not whether it suggest this but whereuppon To goe against the conscience is sinne to follow a mis-informed conscience is sinne also If you do not the first we know you are faulty in the second He that is greater then the conscience will not take this for an excuse But wherein should haue beene this transgression so vnauoidable heynous against conscience First in the want of many Ordinances to which we are most strictly bound both by Gods word and our owne necessities SECTION XVIII The want of pretended Ordinances of God whether sinfull to vs and whether they are to be set vp without Princes CAn you thinke this hangs well together You should here want many of Gods ordinances why should you want them Because you are not suffered to inioy them who hinders it Superior powers Did euer man willfully and heynously offend for wanting of that which he could not haue What hath conscience to doe with that which is out of our power Is necessity with you become a sinne and that haynous Dauid is driuen to lurke in the wildernesse and forced to want the vse of many diuine Ordinances It was his sorrow not his transgression He complaines of this but doth he accuse himselfe of sinne Not to desire them had beene sinne no sin to be debat'd them Well might this be Sauls sin but not his Haue you not sinnes enow of your owne that you must needes borrow of others But I see your ground You are bound to haue these Ordinances and therefore without Princes yea against them so it is your transgression to want them in spight of Magistrates Gaudentius the Donatist taught you this of old And this is one of the Hebrew songs which Master Bâ—rrow sings to vs in Babylon that we care not to make Christ attend vpon Princes and to be subiect to their lawes and gouernment and his Predecessor the roote of your sect tels vs in this sense the kingdome of heauen must suffer violence and that it comes not with obseruation that men may say Loe the Parliament or loe the Bishops decrees and in the same treatise The Lords kingdome must wait on your policy forsooth and his Church must be framed to your ciuill state c. Iust as that Donatist of old in Augustine Quid vobis c. What haue you to doe with worldly Emperours and as that other in Optatus Quid Imperatori cum Ecclesia What hath the Emperour to doe with the Church Yea your Martyr feares not to teach vs that Gods seruants being as yet priuate men may and must together build his Church though all the Princes of the world should prohibit the same vpon paine of death Belike then you should sin haynously if you should not be rebels The question is not whether we shold aske leaue of Princes to be Christians but whether of Christian Princes wee should aske leaue to establish circumstances of gouernment God must be serued thogh we suffer our blood is wel bestowed vpon our maker but in patience not in violence Priuate profession is one thing Publique reformation iniunction is another Euery man must doe that in the maine none may doe this but they of whom God saies I haue said ye are Gods and of them There is difference betwixt Christian and Heathen Princes If at least al Princes were not to you Heathen If these should haue beene altogether stayed for Religion had come late If the other should not be stayed for Religion would soone be ouer layd with confusion Lastly the body of Religion is one thing the skyrts of outward gouernment another that may not depend on men to be imbraced or with loyalty prosecuted these vpon those generall rules Christ both may and doe and must If you cut off but one lappe of these with Dauid you shall be touched To denie this power to Gods Deputies on earth what is it but ye take too much vpon you Moâ—es and Aaron all the Congregation is holy wherefore lift ye your selues aboue the Congregation of the Lord See if herein you come not too neere the walles of that Rome which ye so abhorre and accurse in ascribing such power to the Church none to Princes Let your Doctor tell you whether the best Israelites in the times of Abijah Asa Iehosaphat Ezekiah Iosiah tooke vpon them to reforme without or before or against their Princes Yea did Nehemiah himselfe without Artahshaht though an heathen King set vpon the walles of Gods City Or what did Zerubbabel and Ieshua without Cyrus In whose time Haggai and Zechariah prophesied indeede but built not And when contrary Letters came from aboue they laid by both Trowels and Swords They would bee Iewes still they would not be rebels for God Had those Letters inioyned Swines flesh or Idolatry or forbidden the vse of the law those which now yeelded had suffered and at once testified their obedience to authority and piety to him that sittes in the assembly of these earthen Gods I vrge no more Perhaps you are more wise or lesse mutinous you might easily therefore purge your conscience from this sinne of wanting what you might not perforce enioy Say that your Church should imploy you backe to this our Babylon for the calling out of more Proselites you are intercepted imprisoned Shall it bee sinne in you not to heare the Prophesies at Amsterdam The Clinke is a lawfull excuse If your feete be bound your conscience is not bound In these
necessity but expedience neither essentiall to him but accidentally annexed for greater conuenience These two friuolous grounds haue made your cauill eyther very simple or very wilfull SECTION XXXIX Commutation of Penance in our Church SEe if this man be not hard driuen for accusations when hee is faine to repeate ouer the very same crime which hee largely vrged before All the world will know that you want variety when you send in these twise-sodde Coleworts Somewhat yet we finde new Commutation of Penance Our Courts would tell you that here is nothing dispensed with but some ceremonie of shame in the confession which in the greater sort is exchanged for a common benefit of the poore into a pecuniary mulct yet say they not so as to abridge the Church of her satisfaction by the confession of the offender and if you graunt the ceremony deuised by them why doe you finde fault that it is altered or commuted by them As for absolution you haue a spight at it because you sought it and were repulsed If the censures be but their owne so you hold why blame you the menaging of them in what manne◠seemes best to the authors This power is no more a limme of the Prelacy then our Prelacy is that beast in the Reuelation and our Prelacy holdes it selfe no more Saint Iohns beast then it holds you Saint Pauls beast Phil. 3. 2 SECTION XL. Oath ex officio I Aske of auricular Confession you send mee to our High Commission Court these two are much alike But here is also very absolute necessity of confession True but as in a case of iustice not of strife to cleare a truth not to obtaine absolution to a bench of Iudges not to a Priests eare Here are too many ghostly Fathers for an auricular Confession But you wil mistake it is enough against vs that men are constrained in these Courts to confesse against themselues why name you these Courts onely Euen in others also oathes are vrged not onely ex officio merclnario but nobili The honourablest Court of Starre-Chamber giues an oath in a Criminall case to the Defendant So doth the Chancerie Court of Requests Shortly to omit forraine examples how many instāces haue you of this like proceeding in the cōmon laws of this land But withal you might learn that no Enquiry Ex officio may be thus made but vpō good grounds as fame scandal vehement presumption c. going before and giuing iust cause of suspition Secondly that this proceeding is not allowed in any case of crime whereby the life or limmes of the examined partie may be endangered nor yet where there is a iust suspition of future periury vpon such inforcement Thus is the suspected wife vrged to cleare her honesty by oath Thus the Master of the house must cleare his truth Exod. 22. 8. Thus Achan and Ionathan are vrged to bee their owne accusers though not by Oath But if perhappes any sinister course be taken by any corrupt Iusticer in their proceedings must this be imputed to the Church Look you to your petty-Courts at home which some of your owne haue compared in these courses not only to the Commission-Court of England but to the Inquisition of Spaine See there your Pastor defending himselfe to be both an accuser and Iudge in the same cause See their proceedings Ex Officio without Commission and if your prisons cannot witnes it your excommunications may SECTION XLI Holy-daies how obserued in the Church of England WE haue not lost but cast away the Idolatrous shrines of Saints their daies wee retaine theirs not for worshippe of them which our Church condemneth but partly for commemoration of their high deserts and excellent examples partly for distinction indeede therefore Gods daies not theirs their praises redound to him shew vs where we implore them where wee consecrate daies to their seruice The maine end of Holy-daies is for the seruice of God and some as Socrates sets downe of olde quo se a laborum contentione relaxent for relaxation from labor if such daies may be appointed by the Church as were the Holy-daies of Purim of the dedication of the wall of Ierusalem the dedication of the Temple whose names should they rather beare though but for mere distinction then the blessed Apostles of Christ But this is a color only for you equally condemne those daies of Christs birth Ascension Circumcision Resurrection Annunciation which the Church hath beyond all memory celebrated what then is our fault We keepe these holy as the Lords daie in the same manner though not in the same degree Indeede we come to the Church and worshippe the God of the Martyrs and Saints is this yet our offence No but wee abstayne from our most lawfull labor in them True yet not in conscience of the day but in obedience to the Church If the Church shall indict a solemne fast do not you hold it contemptuous to spend that day in lawful labour notwithstanding that liberty of the sixe daies which God hath giuen Why shall that be lawfull in a case of deiection which may not in praise and exultation If you had not loued to cauil you would rather haue accepted the Apologie or excuse of our fister Churches in this behalfe then aggrauated these vncharitable pleas of your owne yet euen in this your owne Synagogue at Amsterdame if we may beleeue your owne is not altogether guiltlesse your handes are still and your shoppes shut vpon festiuall daies But we accuse you not would God this were your worst The Masters of our Courts would tell you that they would not care so much for this dispossession as that it should be done by such coniurers as your selfe SECTION XLII Our approbation of an vnlearned Ministery disproued YOur want of quarrels makes you still runne ouer the same complaints which if you redouble a thousand times will not become iust may become tedious God knowes how farre we are from approuing an vnleared Ministery The protestations of our gratious King our Bishoppes our greatest Patrons of conformity in their publique writings might make you ashamed of this bold assertion we do not allow that it should be we bewaile that it will be our number of Parishes compared with our number of Diuines will soone shew that either many Parishes must haue none or some Diuines must haue manie Congregations or too many Congregations must haue scarce Diuine-incumbents Our Dread Soueraigne hath promised a medicine for this disease But withall tels you that Ierusalem was not built all on a day The violence you speake of is commonly in case of wilful contempt not of honest and peaceable desire of further instruction or in supposall of some tolerable ability in the ministery forsaken wee doe heartily pray for labourers into this haruest we doe wish that all Israell could prophesie we publish the Scriptures we
must face it out Let any Reader iudge how farre our practise in this hath dissented from our doctrine would to God in nothing more Yes saith this good friend in the most other things our wordes professe our deeds denie at once you make vs hypocrites and your selues Pharises Let all the world know that the English Church at Amsterdam professeth nothing which it practiseth not we may not be so holy or so happy Generality is a notable shelter of vntruth Manie moe you say Popish deuises yet name none No you cannot Aduanced aboue al that is called God surely this is a paradoxe of slaunders you meant at once to shame vs with falshoode and to appose vs with Riddles we say to the highest whom haue wee in heauen but thee and for earth your selfe haue granted we giue too much to Princes which are earthen Gods and may come vnder Pauls 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Eyther name our Deity or craue mercy for your wrong certainely though you haue not remorse yet you shall haue shame SECTION XLV The Churches still retained in England THe Maiesty of the Romish Petty-gods I truely told you was long agone with Mythra and Serapis exposed to the laughter of the vulgar you straine the comparison too farre yet we follow you Their Priests were expelled for as your Doctor yeeldeth other Actors came vpon the same Stage others in religion else it had beene no change Their Ministery and Monuments exposed to vtter scorne Their Masses their oblations their adorations their inuocations their anoylings their exorcizings their shrift their absolutions their Images roode loftes and whatsoeuer else of this kind But the Temples of those olde Heathens were demolished and raced Here is the quarrell ours stand still in their proude Maiesty Can you see no difference betwixt our Churches and their Temples The very name it selfe if at least you haue vnderstood it Kirke or Church which is nothing but an abbreuiation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Lords house might haue taught you that ours were dedicated to God and theirs to the Diuel in their false gods Augustine answeres you as directly as if he were in my roome The Gentiles saith he to their Gods erected Temples we not Temples vnto our Martyrs as vnto Gods but memorials as vnto dead men whose spirits with God are still liuing These then if they were abused by Popish Idolatrie is there no way but downe with them downe with them to the ground Well fare the Donatists yet your olde friends they but washed the walles that were polluted by the Orthodoxe By the same token that Optatus askes them why they did not wash the bookes which ours touched and the heauens which they look't vpon What are the very stones sinfull what can be done with them The very earth where they should lie on heapes would be vncleane But not their pollution angers you more then their proud Maiesty What house can be too good for the maker of all Things As God is not affected with state so is he not delighted in basenesse If the pompe of the Temple were ceremoniall yet it leaues this morality behinde it that Gods house should be decent and what if goodly If we did put holines in the stones as you doe vncleanenesse it might be sinne to be costly Let mee tell you there may bee as much pride in a clay wall as in a carued Proude Maiestie is better then proud basenesse The stone or clay will offend in neither we may in both If you loue Cottages the auncient Christians with vs loued to haue Gods house stately as appeares by the example of that worthie Bishoppe of Alexandria and that gratious Constantine in whose daies these sacred piles began to lift vp their heads vnto this enuyed height Take you your owne choice giue vs ours let vs neither repine nor scorne at each other SECTION XLVI The Founders and Furnitures of our Churches ALl this while I feared you had beene in Popish Idolatrie now I finde you in Heathenish These our Churches are still possessed by their Flamins and Arch-Flamins I had thought none of our Temples had beene so auncient Certainely I finde but one poore tuinous building reported to haue worne out this long tyranny of time For the most you might haue read their age and their Founders in open Records But these were deriued from those surely the Churches as much as the men It is true the Flamins and what euer other heathen Priests were put down Christian Bishoppes were set vp Are these therfore deriued from those Christianity came in the roome of Iudaisme was it therefore deriued from it Before you tolde vs that our Prelacy came from that Antichrist of Rome now from the Flamins of the Heathen Both no lesse then either If you cannot bee true yet learne to be constant But what meane you to charge our Churches with carued and painted Images It is wel you write to those that know them Why did you not say wee bow our knees to them and offer incense perhaps you haue espied some old dustie statue in an obscure corner couer'd ouer with Cob-webs with halfe a face and that miserably blemished or perhappes halfe a Crucifixe inuerted in a Church-window and these you surely noted for English Idols no lesse dangerous glasse you might haue seene at Geneua a Church that hates Idolatrie as much as you doe vs What more Massing copes and Surplices some copes if you will more Surplices no Massing Search your Bookes againe you shall finde Albes in the Masse no Surplices As for Organ-musicke you should not haue fetch 't it from Rome but from Ierusalem In the Reformed Church at Middleburgh you might haue found this skirt of the Harlot which yet you grant at least crept out of Babylon Iudge now Christian reader of the weight of these grand exceptions and see whether ten thousand such were able to make vs no Church and argue vs not only in Babilon but to be Babilon it selfe Thus Babilonish we are to you and thus Sion-like to God euerie true Church is Gods Sion euerie Church that holdes the foundation is true according to that golden rule Ephes. 2. 21. Euery building that is coupled together in this corner stone groweth vnto an holy Temple in the Lord No aduersarie either man or Diuell can confound vs either in our euidences or their owne Challenges wee may be faulty but we are true And if the darknes you finde in vs be light how great is our light SECTION XLVII On what ground separation or Ceremonies was obiected HE that leaues the whole Church in a grosse and wilfull error is an hereticke he that leaues a particular Church for appendances is a schismaticke such are you both in the action and cause The act is yeelded the cause hath beene in part scanned shall be more This I vainely pretended to be our consorting in ceremonies
yet they are twins and that so as eithers euill proues mutuall The sinnes of the Citie not reformed blemish the Church where the Church hath power and in a sort comprehends the State she cannot wash her hands of tollerated disorders in the CoÌ„mon-wealth hence is my comparison of the Church if you could haue seene it not the Kingdome of England with that of Amsterdam I doubt not but you could be content to sing the old song of vs Bona terra mala gens Our land you could like well if you might be Lordes alone Thankes be to God it likes not you and iustly thinkes the meanest corner too good for so mutinous a generation when it is weary of peace it will recall you you that neither in prison nor on the Seas nor in the Coasts of Virginea nor in your way nor in Netherland could liue in peace What shall we hope of your ease at home Where ye are all you thankful Tenants cannot in a powerful Christian state moue God to distinguish betwixt the knowen sinnes of the Citie and the Church How oft hath our gratious Soueraigne and how importunately beene solicited for a tolleration of Religions It is pittie that the Papists hyred not your aduocation who in this pointe are those true Cassanders which reuerend Caluin long since confuted Their wishes herein are yours To our shame and their excuse his Christian heart held that tolleration vnchristian and intollerable which you either neglect or magnifie Good Constantine wink 't at it in his beginning but as Dauid at the house of Zeruiah Succeeding times found these Canaanites to be prickes and thornes and therefore both by mulctes and banishments sought eyther their yeeldance or voydance If your Magistrates hauing once given their names to the Church indevour not to purge this Augean stable how can you preferre their Communion to ours But howsoeuer now least we should thinke your Land-lords haue too iust cause to pack you away for wranglers you turne ouer all the blame from the Church to the City yet your Pastor and Church haue so found the Citie in the Church and branded it with so blacke markes as that all your smooth extenuations cannot make it a lesse Babylon then the Church of England Beholde now by your owne Confessions either Amsterdam shall be or England shall not be Babylon These eleuen crimes you haue found and proclaimed in those Dutch and French Churches First That the assembles are so contriued that the whole Church comes not together in one So that the Ministers cannot together with the flock sanctifie the Lords day The presence of the members of the Church cannot be knowne and finally no publique action whether excommunication or any other can rightly be performed Could you say worse of vs Where neither Sabboth can be rightly sanctified nor presence or absence knowne nor any holy action rightly performed what can there be but mere confusion Secondly That they baptise the seede of them who are no members of any visible Church of whom moreouer they haue not care as of members neither admit their parents to the Lordes Supper Mere Babylonisme and sinne in constitution yea the same that makes vs no Church for what separation can there be in such admittance what other but a sinfull commixture How is the Church of Amsterdam now gathered from the world Thirdly That in the publique worshippe of God they haue deuised and vsed another forme of prayer besides that which Christ our Lord hath prescribed Mat. 6. reading out of a booke certain prayers inuented and imposed by man Beholde here our fellow Idolaters and as followes a daily Sacrifice of a set Seruice-booke which in stead of the sweete incense of spirituall prayers is offered to God very Swines-flesh a new Porâ—uise and an equal participation with vs of the curse of addition to the word Fourthly That rule and commandement of Christ Matth. 18. 15. they neither obserue nor suffer rightly to be obserued among them How oft haue you said that there can bee no sound Church without this course because no separation Beholde the maine blemish of England in the face of Amsterdam Fiftly That they worship God in the Idoll Temples of Antichrist so the Wine is mar'd with the vessell their seruice abhomination with ours neyther doe these Antichristian stones want all glorious ornaments of the Romish harlot yet more Sixtly That their Ministers haue their set maintenance after another manner then Christ hath ordained 1. Chr. 14. and that also such as by which any Ministery at all whether Popish or other might bee maintained Either tithes or as ill Beholde one of the maine Arguments wherby our Ministery is condemned as false and Antichristian falling heauie vppon our neighbours Seuenthly That their Elders change yearely and do not continue in their office according to the doctrine of the Apostles and practise of the Primitiue Church What can our Church haue worse then false Gouernours Both annuall and perpetual they cannot be VVhat is if not this a wrong in Constitution Eightly that they celebrate mariage in the Church as if it were a part of the Ecclesiasticall administration a foule shame and sinne and what better then our third Sacrament Ninthly That they vse a new censure of suspension which Christ hath not appointed no lesse then English presumption Tenthly That they obserue daies and times consecrating certaine daies in the yeare to the Natiuity Resurrection Ascension of Christ Beholde their Calender as truely possessed Two Commaundements solemnely broken at once and we not Idolaters alone Eleuenth which is last and worst that they receiue vnrepentant excommunicates to bee members of their Church which by this meanes becomes one one body with such as be deliuered vnto Sathan therefore none of Christs bodie England can be but a miscelline rabble of prophane men The Dutch and French Churches are belike no better who can be worse then an vnrepentant excommunicate Goe now and say It is the Apostasie of Antichrist to haue communion with the world in the holy things of God which are the peculiars of the Church and cannot without great Sacriledge be so prostituted and prophaned Goe say that the plaguy-spirituall-leprosie of sinne rising vp in the foreheads of many in that Church vnshut vp vncouered yea wilfully let loose infects all both persons and things amongst them Goe now and flie out of this Babylon also as the Hee-goates before the flocke or returne to ours But howeuer these errours bee grosse perhappes they are tractable Not the sinne vndoes the Church but obstinacy here is no euasion For behold you do no more accuse those Churches of corruption then of wilfulnesse for diuers times haue you dealt with them about these fearefull enormities yea you haue often deâ—ired that knowledge thereof might be by themselues giuen to the whole body of their Church or that at least they would take order that it might be done by you They haue refused both What
Tâ—uth Sime reprehendas errantem patere me quae so errare cum talibus Aug. Hiâ—r Fr. Iohnsonin his Anâ—w to T. VVh p. 26. Aunsw ag Broughton p. 17 These Dutch Ch. offend not only in practicall disorders but in their Constitution Gouerament wâ—â—sh p c. Troubl and Excom at Amsterd p. 10. Brown charged with it by Barr. Letter to M. Egert â— Iohnson ibid. p. 194. Fr. Iohnson Inq. Act. 15. 38. Departing â— not going with them Barr. Pres. to the Separation dâ—fend In his obseruations p. 251. VVe doe not there condemne the parish Assemblies as separated from Christ but trâ—ue them not as yet gathered to Christ. So Conser â—â—th Sperin p. 9. Fr. Iohnson Inquir pag. 36. H. Bar. Obseruat 242. No faults disanull the being of a Church vntill contempt of Gods word be added thereunto after due conuiction The faults errors of a Church may be seuerely reproued and conuinced according to the quality thereof and yet the Church not be condemned N. B. Iob. â—4 19. Vulg. edit Câ—pr Epi ad Cornel. Non est maius pechcaatum quam Apostat are a Deo Aug. in Ps. 18. Prou. 6. 12. Iob 34. 18. Ezec 2. 3. Apocal. 2. 3 Thou hast laboured and not giuen in Tertâ—l de Pat Si hominibus Plaâ—â—tâ—r Dominus offenditur sivero illud entimur laboramus vt 〈◊〉 dco piacere 〈◊〉 maledicta debemus humana contemnere confessed by M. Iohâ—s loc seq Inq. of Th. VVhite p. 65. Gen 49. 7. Sep. But I will not discourage you in this affection least we find few in the same fault the most in stead of pitty and compassion affoording vs nothing but fury and indignation Cypr. de sâ—â—â—plic prael Quid facit in corde Christiano luporum seritas canum rabies August Confess l. 9. c. 9. Qualâ—a solet eructare turgens indigesta discordia Seâ— The first action laid against vs is of vnnaturalnes and ingratitude towards our mother the Church of England for our causelesse separation from her to which vniust accusation and triuiall querimony our most iust defence hath beene and is that to our knowledge we haue done her no wrong we do freely and with all thankfulnesse acknowledge euery good thing she hath and which our selues haue there receiued H. Barr. Praef. to the separ defended Causes of separ def p. 12. Confer with D. Andr. Praef. to separ def Gyff refuted touch Donat. Obseruat of M. H. Bar. p. 239. Fr. Iohns Reas. 9 ag M. Iac. p. 74. Iohns ag M. Iac. Except 3. Nota Bene. Ibid. Counterpoys pag. 127. 131. Barr. Confer With M. Sperm as Bar hims hath written it pag. 9 Fr. Iob. 7. Reas. aga Iac p. 64. G. Iohns Praef. to the Pastor Russin l. 2. Eccl. hist. c 3. Aug. Epist. Possid in vita Aug. Euseb hist. eccl Damnis grauissimis caedibus afficiebant armati diuersis telis Socrates l. 2. c. 22. 30. Cypr. l. 2. Ep. 8. Nouati pater in vico fame mortuns nec postea ab illo sepultus Sic Optat. l. 1. Purpurus Donatista occidit sororis filios c. G. Iohns Discourse of troubles and Excommunications at Amsterdam printed 1603 Ibid. p. 5. Discouery of Brownisme Vid. G. Iohns booke Inq. into Th. VVh Discou Same Epist. p. 15 They say Fiâ—â—a â—ponsae Mihi accusatio etiam vera contra fratrem displâ—cet Hieron aduersus Ruffin Bar. exam before the Archb. and L. Anderson Browne state of Christians d. 39 Qui non habet quod det quomodo det vox Donat. Opta l. 1 Barrow supra Fr. â—â—hns ag M. Iâ—cob p. 41. 〈◊〉 2. Sep. The superabundant grace of God couering and passing by the manifolde enormitiâ—s in that Church wherewith these good things are inseparably commingled and wherein we also through ignorance and infirmity were inwrapp ed. Sep. But what theÌ„ should we still haue continued in sinne that grace might haue abounded If God haue caused a further truth like a light in a darke place to shine in our hearts should wee still haue mingled that light with darkenesse contrary to the Lords owne practise Ge. 1. 4. and expresse precept 2. Cor. 6. 14. Gen. 1. 2. Es. 5. 20. VVoe to them that put darknesse for light Es. 59. 9. Deu. 21. 22 23. Sep. But the Church of England say you is our Mother and so ought not to be auoided But say I we must not so cleaue to holy mother Church as we neglect our heauenly father and his commandements which we know in that estate we could not but transgresse and that heynously and against our consciences not onely in the want of many Christian Ordinances to which we are most straightly bound both by Gods word and our owne necessities Mater Ecclesia mater est etiam matris nostrae Aug. Ep. 38. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Nemo per exteriorem violentiam corrumpitur si interior innocentia custodiatur c. â— q. 3. Custodi c. Ad docendum populum Israeliticum omnipotens deus prophetis praeconium dedi non regibus imperauit Aug. l. 2. contr Gau. c. 11. Barr. causes of scpera def p. 6. Brow Reform without tarrying Aug. contr Petilia n. l. 2. Optatus Mileuit lib. 3â— Barr. 2. Exaâ—â—iâ— nation before the L. Archb. and L. Chiefe-Iustice compar with his reply to M. Gyff Art 5. â— Sam. 24. 6. Num. 16. 3. Counter poys p. 230. 2. Chr. 13. 2. Chr. 14. 15 2. Chr. 29. 2. Chr. 30. 2. Chr. 34. Ezr. 2. 3. 2. Ezr. 4. 23. 24 a August Ep. 58 Pastores autem doctores quâ—s maxime vt discernerem voluisti eosdem puto esse sicut tibi visum est vt non alios Pastores alios Doctores intelligeremus sed ideo cum praedixisset Pastores subiunxisse Doctores vt intelligerent Pastores ad officium suum pertinere doctrinam Barr. ag Gyff inueighs for this cause against the Consistory of Geneâ—a Fr Iohns complaints of the Dutch and Fr. Churches Discription of a visible Church cannot make a Distinct. in the Definition of their Offices State of Christians 119. Descript. of vis Ch. H. Clap. Epist before his treatise of sinne ag the holy Ghost Brownists fourth Position Trouble and â—xcom at Amsterdam Fr. Iohns in a Letter to M. Smith Nulla necessitas maior est charitate Hâ—eron Apol. ad Ruff. Fr. Iun. de Eccl. Sed accidunt persaepe tempora quibus aut noua Ecclesia generatur aut altera pars interumpitur scilicet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 et tamen Ecclesia esse non dâ—sinit formà nimirum essentiali adhuc permanente Act 7. beg Cypr. l. 3. Ep. 9. Meminisse diaconi debent quoniam Apostolos id est Episcopos praepositos Dominus elegit Diaconos autem post ascensum Domini in caelos Apostoli sibi constituerunt Episcopatus su Ecclesiae ministros Rom. 1. 8. 1. Cor. 1. 5. 1. Thess. 1. 7. Gal 4. 15. Phil. 1. 2. Sep. But also in our most sinfull subiection to many Antichristian