fastidia detergeret Nihil enim fere de illis obscuritatibus eruitur quod non planissimè dictum alibi reperiatur The holie ghost hath magnifically and wholsomlie so tempered the holy scriptures that with euident places he might satisfie hunger and with more darke places might wipe awaie disdainfulnes For nothing almoste is found out of those obscurities which is not found els where most plainlie vttered It were no hard matter to heape vp manie testimonies of the auncient fathers to this purpose but that the va nitie of this answerer appeereth sufficientlie in all our bookes written against the papists in which not onely by the manifest places of the scriptures but also by most euident testimonies of the doctors of the church we confute them in the most and greatest matters of controuersie that ate betweene vs. But what saith our gallant answerer that the councels fathers and anciters of theChurch haue from time to timedeclared the true sense of the scriptures vnto vs hath none of these at any time erred in expounding the scriptures may we safely beleeue them whatsoeuer they say He wil I warrant you deny it except the Pope of Rome do alow their interpretations And therfore this flying from the only scriptures to the interpretation of Coun cels fathers ancetors of the Church is nothing els but an impudent shift to reserue vnto the Pope liberty authority to make what meaning of scripture they please thereby to giue colour to euery fansie they list to father it vpon the authority of the holie scriptures The third cause he affirmeth to be that by chalenging of onely scripture they maie deliuer themselues from all ordinan ces or doctrines left vnto vs by the first pillers of Christs Church though not expressely set down in the scripture c. In deede to deliuer our selues from the burthen of mens traditions the ordinances or doctrines of men we affirme the holie scriptures to be hable and sufficient to make vs wise vnto saluation by faith in Iesus Christ as the Apostles and principall pillers of the Church haue taught vs who haue left no such ordinances or doctrines but they be either expressely set down in the holy scriptures or by plaine and necessarie collection to be gathered out of the same For how will our aduersaries prooue that anie thing is receaued from the Apostles which hath not testimonie out of the writings of the Apostles who can be a sufficient witnes of such de liuerie seeing manie things were of olde referred to the Apostles tradition which euen our aduersaries do not admit to be Apostolical seeing the most auncient and immediate successors of the Apostles as Polyearpus Anicetus can not agree about a ceremony receaued from the Apostles namelie the celebration of Easter what certentie can there be of anie other ordinances or doctines fathered vpon the Apostles without witnes of their writings yea and some times directlie contrarie and repugnant to their writings But hereof saith our aduersarie they assume authoritie of allowing or not allowing whatsoeuer liketh or serueth their turnes for the time and hereof he bringeth example First of the number of sacraments whereof some protestants haue written diuerslie because the name of sacrament is diuerslie taken sometimes largelie for euerie holie signe sometimes strictlie for such holie signes onely as being instituted of God are seales of the dispensation of his generall grace in the new teftament perteining to euerie member of the Church somtimes for al holy mysteries or secrets c. But what doth it serue anie protestants turne whether there be more or fewer signes in number that maie be called sacraments seeing all protestants agree about the things themselues that are set forth in the scriptures to be visible signes of grace inuisible and the name it selfe Sacrament in that sense we speake of when we saie there are 2. 3. 4. or 7. sacraments is not once vsed This diuersitie therefore is but of a terme and that not vsed in scripture therefore it ariseth not of anie interpretation or peruerse vnderstanding of the scripture as our answerer would haue it seeme to be But let vs heare his example Martin Luther saith he after he had denied all testimonie of man besides himselfe he beginneth thus about the number of sacraments Principiò neganda mihisunt septem sacramenta tantúm tria pro tempore ponenda First of all I must denie seauen sacraments and appoint three for the time Marie this time lasted not long for in the same place he saith that if he would speake according to the vse of onely scripture he hath but one sacrament for vs that is baptisme In this sentence how manie lies and slaunders be packed together First he saith Martin Luther denieth all testimonie of man which is false for he alloweth all testimonie of man that agreeth with the testimonie of God expressed in the scriptures and often citeth the testimonies of the auncient fathers for confirmation of the trueth which he taught indeede he alloweth man no authoritie to institute sacraments or to make articles of faith or lawes to binde the conscience of man and he would haue all mans testimonies to be examined and iudged according to the word of God but this is not to denie all testimonie of man but to distinguish true testimonies of man from false An other slaunder is where he saith that Luther in denying all mans testimonie excepteth him selfe which is altogether vntrue For he requireth none other credit to be giuen to his owne testimonie then he alloweth to the testimonie of other Neither doth he arrogate any authoritie to him selfe which he derogateth from other men And namelie in this booke of the captiuitie of Babilon he taketh not vpon him absolutelie to teach euerie point but so farr forth as he did for the present vnderstand of them promising after greater study more diligent inquirie to intreat of diuers of them more certenly euen in this verie place of the number of the sacraments he saith he will admit three onclie for the present time intending to be further a duised whether there be fewer or more to be entituled with that name Wherein our answerer offereth him the third iniurie in translating tria pro tempore ponenda I must appoint three for the time as though Luther had taken vpon him to appoint how manie sacraments the Church should haue or would challenge power to appoint more or Jesse at his pleasure where as his wordes if the answerer did not wilfullie corrupt them by false translation do import no such thing but onelie as farr as he did presentlie see there were no more but three of those that were commonlie called sacraments of the new testament which were rightlie to be called by that name The fourth slaunder is that Luther hath but one sacrament for vs which is Baptisme if he would speake according to the vse of onelie scripture yea this is a double slaunder for neither doth
the Lordes daie Here you cauill that there is no mention of Saturdaie or sondaie much lesse of celebration of either and least of all of the changeing of the Sabbath into an other daie But if it please your Censurship are you ignorant what day of the weeke is called dies Dominicus the Lordsday whether saturdaie or sondaie if it be sondaie as al professors of Christes name confesse here is as much mention thereof as is needfull for the daie into which the change is made Or if that be not sufficient you maie haue further Act. 20. 7. 1. Cor. 16. 2. And whie is the first of the Sabbath called the Lordes daie but in respect of the celebration there of in honour of the redemption of the world by Christ For otherwise all daies of the weeke are the Lordes daies in respect of their creation Thirdlie seeing the Lordes daie was one daie in the weeke vsed for the assemblie of the Church for their spirituall exercises of Religion it is certaine that the change of the Iewish Sabbath was made into that daie except you would be so waywatd to saie there were two daies in euerie weeke appointed by God to be celebrated whereas the lawe of God requireth but one and giueth libertie of bodelie exercise in sixe daies So that the change of the Sabbath daie is sufficientlie prooued out of the Scripture into the Lordes daie The sixt point is about foure Gospells and the Epistle to the Romanes which Master Charke saith to be prooued out of the scripture but yet he quoteth no place of scripture where onelie he saith the inscription expresseth the names of the writers But what a mocker is this you saie Are the bare names of the Apostles sufficient to prooue that they were written by them who can prooue by scripture that these names are not counterfet as in the Epistle to the Laodiceans in the Gospells of Bartholomew and Thomas c. But abide you sir your question hath two branches the one that the 4. Go spells are true Gospells the other that the epistle to the Romanes was written by Saint Paul and not that to the Laodiceans To the former it is answered that they are prooued by other vndoubted bookes of the scripture both of the olde testament and the new secing they declare that to be fullfilled of Christ which was spoken in the lawe in the Prophetes and in the Psalmes To the other it is answered that admitting the Epistle to the Romanes to be scripture the inscription of his name is sufficient to prooue that it was written by Saint Paull And so of therest Although the name of the writer is not materiall vnto saluation when the booke is receiued to be Canonicall as diuers bookes of scripture are receiued whose writer is vnknowne That Epistle which is called to the Laodicians is not receiued and therefore the inscription is vnsufficient as the Gospelles of Bartholomew and Thomas and such like which are knowne to be countefet by the dissent they haue from the other canonicall scriptures Whereas you require one place of Scripture to prooue all the foure Gospelles to be canonicall you declare your wrangling and wayward spirit But name you anie one point of Doctrine writen in anie of those foure Gospells and the same shall be aduouched by other textes of scripture and so maie eucrie point conteined in them if neede were But you affirme that Origen saith he reiecteth the Gospell of Saint Thomas onelie for that the tradition of the Church receiued it not Which is false He saith he hath read the Gospell after Thomas after Mathias and manie other Sed in his omnibus nihil aliud probamus niss quod Ecclesia idest quatuor tantùm euangelia recipienda But in all these we allowe nothing els but that which the Church alloweth that is that onelie foure Gospells are to be receiued In these wordes he affirmeth that he approoueth the iudgment of the Church he saith not that the iudgement or traditions of the Church was the onelie cause whie he reiected those Gospells for he said before they were receiued of heretikes and wherefore but in maintenance of their heresie which is contrarie to the holie scriptures That all counterfet Go spells were reiected by the Church it is confessed but the Church had this iudgement of discretion confirmed by the canonical scriptures against which Epiphanius saith nothing But when Faustus the Manichie denied the Gospell of Saint Mathew saie you saith not S. Augustine Mathaei Euangelium probatum aduersus Faustum Manichaeum per traditionem The Gospell of Mathew was alleged against Faustus the Manichie by tradition August lib. 28. Cont. Faust. c. 2. If you aske me I saie no he hath no such wordes Yet doth he auouch the Gospell of Saint Mathew in that Chapter by testimonie of the Church from the Apostles by continuall succession euen vnto his time against the Maniches but in far other words then you haue set downe in steed of Saint Augustines wordes by which the reader maie once against perceiue how impudentlie and ignorantlie you ailedge whatsoeuer the note booke which was neuer of your own gatheriug because you vnderstood it not did minister vnto you For these are the wordes of the collector of your notes not of S. Augustine Maie not the papists haue great ioie of such a Cenfure defender Yet you triumph like a Iustie champion and aske what can be more euident then all this to prooue our opinion of the necessitie of tradition to confound the fonde madnes of this poore Minister Alas poore defender what waightie euidencethou hast brought to prooue the necessity of tradition which prooueth thee to be a blind beggerlie yet a bolde brocher of other mens notes which thou vnderstandest not thy selfe The seuenth doctrine which is required to be prooued out of the scripture is that God the father begat his sonne onelie by vnderstanding him-selfe Here Master Charke in steede of these darke wordes out of Thomas how the father begat the sonne wisheth cleare and perfect wordes in so high a mysterie which you saie are plaine and vsuall to those which haue studied any thing in diuinitie As though there were no diuinitie in the holie scriptures and so many of the auncient fathers which haue neither this question nor these wordes but that al diuinity were included in the brest of Thomas Aquinas and such doctors as he was That he quoteth a place or two of the scripture to prooue that Christ was the onelie begotten sonne of God you make smal account of seeing the question is of the māner how this generation maybe which the Church de fendeth against the aduersaries And here you insult against M. chark as ignorant in those high points of diuinitie whereas Catholiks know what the Church hath determined herein against heretikes and infidels as though either of both cared for the Churches determination if the one were not vanquished by scripture the other by right reason
warrant of Christ his power receiued by the holy ghost maie as ministers seruants remit or retaine sins we do most willinglie consent and confesse But then they practise this power as seruants when they beinterpreters and declarers of the Lordes will and pleasure and require not that God should followe their sentence or attend how they be affected to forgiue or retaine and so to subscribe vnto their doing for that is an Antichristian vsurpation farre from the meaning of that power which Christ did graunt to his A postles ALLEN Some holie writers vpon this text of S. Iohn in which the order of Christes authorizing his Apostles for the remission of sinnes is described doe dispute of the difference of giuing the holie Ghost then to his Disciples and afterward on Whitsondaie some note the eternall ceremonie that our Master vsed when he gaue them the holie spirit which was by breathing on them that such outward actions might both be an euidence to them of that excellent gift which they inwardlie then receiued and should further be an euerlasting instruction to the Church that Gods grace and giftes be often ioyned to externall elements for the solace of our nature that delighteth to haue our outward man schooled as wel as the inward man nourished These and manie things moe be of profitable remembrance and consideration but not so much to our purpose Therefore let vs see whether the iudgement of the holie Fathers doe not wholie helpe our present cause prouing the Priests ministerie through the holie Ghostes authoritie that our declaration standing on the plaine wordes of scripture with their vndoubted sense maie obtaine inuincible force against the aduersaries worthie credit of the true beleeuers FVLKE If you had expressed what the writers are that thus dispute or discourse vpon this text we might better haue considred how pertinent or impertinent their opinions are to our matter in controuersie S. Chrysost. seemeth to allowe the opinion of some and Euthymius plainely affirmeth the same that the Apostles at this time did not presentlie receiue the holie ghost but onelie were prepared or made capable thereof which if it were true is contrarie to the title of your Chapter I like better of Cyrillus iudgement which thinketh they presentlie receiued the holie Ghost in some measure but not so plentifullie nor with such diuersitie of giftes as on the daie of Pentecost That the grace of God is testified assured and sealed vp vnto vs for the help of our infirmitie by outward signes and externall elementes ioined thereto we know confesse but as for the solace of our nature or delight to haue our outward man schooled I knowe not what they meane It is great mercie of God to beare with our weakenes but it agreeth not with the discipline of the Gospell that we should delight in outward thinges but rather to exercise our faith in spirituall and heauenlie meditations ALLEN We will make our entrance first with Saint Cyrill whoe debating with himselfe vppon the incomparable authoritie and power giuen to the Apostles for remission of sinnes standeth first as in contention with him selfe and with Christs words how it maie be that they being but men should forgiue the sinnes of our soules being sure of this that it is the propertie onelie of the true liuing god to assoile vs of our sinnes against whom onlie all sins be properlie committed And therfore being not of stomake as men be now a daies to denie that which Christes words so plainelie do import he made answere that the Apostles were in deed deified and made as you would saie partakers of Gods nature to worke Gods owne office in the world Qua igitur ratione saieth he diuinae naturae dignitatem ac potestatem discipulis suis saluator largitus est Quia certè absurdum non est peccata remitti posse ab illis qui Spiritum sanctum in seipsis habeant Nam cùm ipsi remmittunt aut detinent spiritus qui habitat in eis remittit detines By what meanes did our Sauiour giue vnto the Apostles the preheminence and power of Gods owne nature Surelie because it agreeth verie well that they should rimit mans sins that haue in themselues the holie Ghost For when they assoile or retaine sins it is the holie spirit that dwelleth in them which by their ministery doth remit or retaine sins Thus he I maruell not now whie this same father termeth the Apostles sometimes protectores curatores animarum corporum the protectors curers both of bodies soules it is not strange whie S. Ambrose should call the order of priestood Ordinem 〈◊〉 Neither that he should terme Officium Sacerdotis munus S. S. The Priests office to be the function of the holie Ghost No I doe not wonder at some of our forefathers that in the admiration of Gods Maiestic which they same to be so present in the execution of so high in office they did simplie and plainely terme the principall Pastours of the Church halfe Gods and not meere men not hauing respect to their persons which be compassed with infirmities as other the sinfull sort of people in the world be but casting eie vpward to the holie and excellent function which they practised by the spirit of God which dwelleth in them and deifieth their persons to make them of habilitie to exercise the workes of God FVLKE Saint Cyrill is farre from that blasphemie to saie that the Apostles were in deede deified and made partakers of Gods nature to worke Gods owne office in the world For ascribing to God that which is proper to him incommunicable to anie meere creature he maketh this obiection how our sauiour did graunt to his disciples the dignitie power of his diuine nature answereth that they were only made ministers instruments of the holy ghost to expresse his power in remitting sinnes by baptisme and repentance whereof S. Chrysostome also saieth vpon the same text that the Priest giueth onelie his tongue and his hand but the Father the sonne and the holie Ghost doth all things in this case I will rehearse the whole saying of Cyrillus that his iudgement maie more fullie appeare vpon this text Et certè solius veri Dei est c. And suerlie it pertaineth to the onelie true God that he is able to loose men from their sinnes For to what other person is it lawfull to deliuer the transgressors of the law from sinne but to the author of the law him-selfe for so in mennes affaires we see it to be done For no man without punishment doth reprooue the lawes of Kings but the Kinges them-selues in whome the crime of transgression hath no place For it is wiselie said that he is implous which shall saie to a King thou doest vniustlie By what meanes then did our Sauiour graunt to his disciples the dignitie and power of the diuine nature because trulie it is not absurde that sinnes may be remitted
awe is not excluded by remoouing the sacrament of penance which is neither the discipline of the Church nor the power of re mission of sins graunted to the ministers of the Church ALLEN It were too teadious further to declare how these externall meanes of working inward grace and remission of sinnes be necessarie for the outward man which is sometimes refreshed otherwhiles bridled by things answerable as well outwardlie to the bodie as inwardlie to the minde It is needlesse also to treat at large how it is necessarie for the one and visible common wealth of Christes Church to agree together in all pointes thereof and be notoriouslie knowne from all other sectes and sortes of peoples that do not professe Christes name by the outward practize of all holie functions by which God hath promised to giue grace remission and sanctification to all his faithfull subiects All these considerations with many the like maie serue and satisfie the quiet peaceable children of Christes Church that haue learned to rest in Christes ordinance though the causes thereof be not to them opened As for other that are euer doubting and neuer settelledin their faith that alwaies be learning and yet neuer attaine to knowledge that had rather vnderstand much then beleeue a litle such fellowes I must not so much instruct as by the scriptures and examples of all ages controlle and confound if I maie Let them therefore be charged that God hath not onelie vsed from the creation of man to bring vp al people that serue him in some especiall waies of outward worshipping but hath also these manie worlds deliuered man from originall and actuall sinnes by externall sacraments and sacrifices not without the priestes especiall procurement and ministerie therein What did circumcision instituted by God in the law of nature commaunded to Abraham and his seede and continued so many ages euen till Christes law tooke place Did it not after a sorte remit sinnes Was it anie other thing but an externall worke in the face of the world Was it ministred by man Did it derogate anie thing to the honour of God which by himselfe for his owne glorie and namesake was ordeined And afterward in the law of Moses which did draw neere vnto Christian vsages by manie actions of sacrifices and solemne rites instituted purposelie to represent foreshew the state of our present Church there we haue plaine proofe of certaine outward orders instituted for procuring remission and pardon of sins not without especiall mention of the priestes ministerie in euerie of the said actions Whereof Saint Paul speaketh to the Hebrewes in these wordes Omnia penè in sanguine mundari ac sine sanguinis effusione non esse remissionem That all things were in a manner clensed by blood and that no remission could be had without blood For so in the 17. of Leuiticus they were charged to absteine from drinking of blood because sanguis animalium propiaculo est the blood of beastes stood for an expiation and cleaning of sinnes And therefore amongst the diuers orders of sacrifice mentioned in the said booke of their ceremonies there be diuers expresse waies by sacrifice to purge mens sinnes some for the Priests sinnes other for the Princes and the third for the common peoples offences And one wait for their sinnes committed of ignorance an other for crimes wittinglie done Finallie some for thoughtes and other some for euill deedes with manie mo diuersities as you maie see in the said booke In all which it is euer expressed that the Priest is not onelie the minister in the said sacrifice as needes must be but also with offering of the said oblations for sinne that he must make praier especiallie for the offenders and euerie of them seuerallie that God maie pardon them of that sinne for which they offer their sacrifice For allwaies after the forme and manner of offering be prescribed according to the diuersitie of the peoples offences it is added Rogabitque pro eo sacerdos pro peccato eius dimittetur ei And the Priest shal pray for him and for his sinne and it shall be forgiuen him And againe Agat poenitentiam pro peccato offerat de gregibus agnam siue capram orabitque pro ea sacerdos pro peccatis eius Let the soule do penance and offer a kidde of the flock or an ewe lambe and so the priest shall praie for that soule and the sinnes thereof FVLKE That the ministery of man in al ages of the Church and externall sacraments haue beene instituted of God as well for the exercise os men in his worship as for the assurance of remission of their sinnes it is euermore confessed of vs and that now also the like be ordained since the comming of Christ in the flesh Wher fore your long discourse to prooue that we neuer denied is vaine except you meane it against the Anabaptistes Libertines Swinkfeldians and such other condemned heretikes That in all the sacrifices of the law that were appointed for sinne the priest is ordeined the minister not onelie to offer the sacrifice but also by praier to obteine remission of sinnes it must be referred vnto the onelie high Priest whereof the Iewish Priesthood sacrifices aultars c. were sacramentall figures and shadowes And therefore by that the Priests had then to do according to the law you do vnfitlie gather that the like is to be donne by Priests vnder the Gospell For that Iewish priesthood is wholie translated vnto our sauiour Christ who hath it perpetual and without anie passing from him to others The ministerie of the Gospel hath no sacrifices to offer for sinnes but to preach the onelie sacrifice of Christs death and the propitiation of our sinne by him and thereof to assure our infirmitie more plentifullie to deliuer vnto vs the seales of our iustification by faith instituted by God the sacraments of baptisme and the Lordes supper ALLEN All which doth not onelie couuince that Gods will was that remission of sinnes should be had by externall sacrifices penance and oblation and that not otherwise but by the priests mediationn but also that there was an order euen then often in thé olde law that man should vtter his sinnes with the greuousnes thereof and circumstances that according to the difference of the faultes the diuersitie of sacrifices and expiation might be vsed and that the priest seuerallie might praie for the remission thereof In all which doing I will not now dispute whether a carnall Iew that then had no further respect but to the present obseruation of those commaunded Ceremonies and sacrifices did obtaine therby remission of sins by which the soule is reconciled to God or els onelie a freedome from some temporal punishment due to the same by law amongst the people or otherwise by Gods appointment but moste sure it is that the spirituall sorte which from those sacrifices did not separate but include Christs blood in respect whereof all
make satisfaction to the Church when there appeereth iust cause so to doe But let vs see how manie vntruthes you do boldlie aduouch which are besides this authoritie First that these Bishops had thought not to haue giuen peace to them that had fallen till the houre of death came But that is not so for they saie onelie they had determined that they should haue performed the penance that was enioyned for a long time vnto them vnto the ful except danger of infirmitie required to giue peace at the point of death Their wordes are these Totheir brother Cornelius Bishoppe of Rome Statueramus quidem iampridem frater charissimè participato inuicem nobiscum consilio vt qui in persecutionio 〈◊〉 supplantati ab aduersario lapsifuissent ac sacrificiis se illicitis maculassent agerent diu poenitentiam plenam si periculum infirmitatis vrgeret pacem sub ictu mortis acciperent Nec enim fas erat aut permittebat paterna pietas diuina clementia ecclesiam pulsantibus claudi dolentibus deprecantib speisulutaris subsidium denegari vt de saculo recedentes sine communicatione aut pace domini dimitterentur cùm permiserit ipse qui tegem dedit vt ligata in terris etiam in Coelis ligata essent solui autem possent illic que hîc prius in Ecclesia soluerentur Sed cum videamus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 infestationis appropinquare coepisse crebris atque assiduis ostensionibus admoneamur vt ad cert 〈◊〉 quod nobis hostis indicit armati parati simus plebem 〈◊〉 nobis diuina dignatione commissam exhortationibus nostris praeparemus omnes omnino milites Christi qui arma desiaerant praelium flagitant intra castra domini colligamus necessitate cogente censuimus eis qui de Ecclesia domini recesserunt sed poenitentiam agere lamentari ac dominum deprecari à primo lapsus sui die non destiterunt pacem dandam esse eos ad praelium quod imminet armari instrui oportere We had decreed indeed long since moste deer brother by aduise taken amongst our selues that such as in the trouble of persecution were supplanied by the aduersarie and fallen and had defiled themselues with vnlawfull sacrifices should doe full penance a long time and if daunger of infirmity did vrge they should receiue peace at the point of death For it was not lawfull neither did the Fatherlie pietie and clementie of God permit that the Church should be shut vp to them that knocke and that aid of healthfull hope should be denied to them that sorrowed and praied for it that departing out of the world they should be sent awaie without anie communicaiion or the Lordes peace seeing he hath permitted which made the lawe that those things that are bound in earth should also be bound in heauen that those things also might be loosed there which were loosed here in the Church But for as much as we see that the daie of another trouble beginneth to approch and are admonished by often and dailie shewings or visions that we should be armed and prepared vnto the battell which the enemie doth denounce vnto vs we should also prepare the people by gods voutsafing committed vnto vs with our exhortations and should gather in anie wise all the souldiers of Christ which call for armour and desire to fight into the Lordes campe necessity compelling vs we haue thought good that peace is to be graunted to them which haue departed out of the Lords Church but from the daie of their falling haue not ceased to shew repentance and to lament and to intreat our Lord and that they also ought to be armed and furnished against the battell which is at hand These are the words of Cyprian his fellow Bishops which you haue abridged at your pleasure if your note booke did not deceiue you to set down that you haue done as the very words of the epi stle Out of which you gather beside that I haue noted before power to inioyne penance and to release the same againe But where you saie they take vpon them cleerelie to inioyne what they list and how long they list that is not so but what is iust and conuenient and so likewise vpon iust cause they release the same or some parte thereof Againe you slaunder them in saying they take vpon thē to pardon after death for there is no such word or matter in all the Epistle They released and receiued them to the communion being in daunger of death but after death they receiued no man to the communion Nay they decreed that whereas Geminius Victor who had made Geminius Faustinus a clergie man his executor contrarie to the decrees of their synods there should be no oblation made for his falling a sleepe nor anie praier frequented in the Church in his name So farre of was it that they would pardon anie man after death when no repentance auaileth The scripture they doe rightlie applie for the establishing of the discipline of excommunication receiuing againe into the fellowship of the Church such as were fallen vpon their repentance as for the sacrament of penance you say wel they exercized discipline without it for such a sacrament they knew not but they claimed no iurisdiction to receiue offenders without good tokens of their repentāce as their words be manifest Where you saie they claimed iurisdiction by their onelie letters to giue them in absence peace pardon of their inioyned penāce as though their letter did resemble the Popes pardons in writing you speake beside the booke for they doe not giue peace by these letters onlie but signifie vnto Cornelius what they thought necessary to be done vpō what reasons left they might be thought to light in loosing the sinews of discipline toward so notorius offenders Your conclusion follow eth not vpon this example Cyprian and his fellow Bishope did vpon necessary cause release the time of penāce enioyned to certaine greeuous offenders and receiued them to the communion vpon certaine perswasion of their répentance therefore the Pope and his popelings maie giue pardon of paine due for sinnes remitted where hone is due and in the sacrament of penance when no such sacrament can be prooued out of the scripture neither doe you rightlie alledge Christes wordes as those holie Fathers did for they alledged them for the discipline of excommunication and absoluing which is necessarie to be vsed in the Church but you to maintaine a tirannical iurisdiction to loose that which other men haue bound without good cause as they did but for manie often times as they did neuer Therefore there is as great oddes betweene their practize of discipline and these Popes pardons as there is distance betweene their ages which is more then a thousand yeares ALLEN And now to make vp this matter for the true meaning of the said text which we now prooue to pertaine to the establishing of the true title of
their aduetsaries it is well knowne that Master Charke and the ministers of the Church are none such neither haue they anie such authoritie It remaineth then that he accounteth the Prince her councell magistrates and ministers of Iustice his aduersaries who indeede haue good cause so to be not onelie in respect of their heresyes but also in regard of their manifolde and almoste infinite practises of treason against the Prince and realme for which some of them haue suffered moste iustlie and not for offering of disputation as this traiterous heretike euerie where moste slaunderouslie doth avowe But nowe for their partes he saith they offere the best surest and easiest meanes that can be deuised or that haue bene vsed in Gods Churches for triall and they are manie in number The first is the bookes of Scripture receiued vpon the credit of the auncient Church of which we are content saith he to accept for canonicall and allowe all those and none other which antiquitie in Christendome hath agreed vpon But this is false for to omit that they receiue for canonicall such as the Church of God before Christ neuer receiued they receiue also such as the greatest and best antiquitie in Christendome receiued not as the Church in Origens time witnesse Eusebius more then the Church of Rome receiued in Saint Ieromes witnesse Ierome himselfe prologo Galeato and Ruffinus in Expossymb more then the Councell of Laodicea did receiue for canonicall as is manifest by the 59. canon The second way of trial is the expresse plaine words of Scripture wherein they must needs be farre superior for what one expresse plaine text haue they saith he in anie one point or article against vs which we doe not acknowledge liberallie as they doe and as the wordes doe lie yes we haue manie but a fewe shal serue for example God saith Exod. 20. Thou shalt not make to thy selse anie grauen image c. thou shalt not fall down to thē nor worship them Againe Matt. 4. Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God and him onelie shalt thou serue Which are moste plaine expresse and manifest against worshipping of Images and other creatures in anie vse of Religion Christ saith drinke ye all of this they be expresse and manifest wordes against the popish sacriledge of the cuppe The 14. to the Corinthians the first Epistle is expresse and plaine against publike praiers homilies lessons in a straunge vnknowne tongue 1. Tim. 4. in expresse and plaine wordes the spirite pronunceth the forbidding of marriage and meates to be the doctrine of deuilles And Heb. 13. Mariage is honourable in all men And 1. Tim. 3. Tit. 1. a Bishop Elder or Deacon must be the husband of one wife beside a great number more But the papists saith our answerer haue infinit texts against vs which we cannot admit without glosses and fond interpretations of our owne A bolde speach as alwaies he vseth but it shall alwaies be founde that if we doe in anie text departe from the grammaticall sense there is necessarie cause why as if it be a figuratiue spcach which is tried either by circumstances of the same place or by other texts of scriptures for the most parte hath the iudgement of the most auncient writers agreing with our interpretation But the most of these examples he bringeth haue nothing in shewe that the expresle wordes of scripture are with them or against vs but by their fonde false vnreasonable collections and such as they can neuer conclude in lawful true syllogismes as for example We haue it saith he for the supremacie expresselie saide to Peter that signifieth arocke vpon this rock will I builde my Church We answere that we might followe the interpretation of the most auncient and approoued fathers that the rocke here spoken of is Christ whom Peter confessed but graunting them that they could neuer euict we confesse that the Church is builded vpon the foundation of Peter the Apostle but not vpon him alone or more principallie then vpon all the Apostles who are all rockes or stones vpon whose foundation as also vpon the foundation of the Prophets the Church of Christ is builded Neither is it possible to prooue the supremacie of the Pope out of those wordes of scripture or anie other But they haue further expresselie touching the Apostles he that is great among you let him be as the younger Luk. 22. We haue no where there is none greater then other among you Neither do we holde that none ought to be greater then other among vs but that the greatest among the ministers ought to be seruant of all the rest and that none ought to exercise Dominion ouer the Lordes inheritaunce yet the primacie of order we graunt euen among the Apostles according to which Iames was president of the Councell at Ierusalem Peter the cheife Aposlle of the circumcision Paull of the gentiles all which will not serue one whit to maintaine the popish tiranny For Paul was nothing inferiour to the highest Apostles But for the reall presence they haue expreslie This is my bodie we haue no where this is the signe of my bodie Neither doe we denie the sacrament to be the bodie of Christ neither doe we affirme that it is a bare signe But that this is a figuratiue speach we haue expreslie This cuppe is the newe Testament in my blood and as expreslie the Apostle speaking of the same sacrament the rocke was Christ which prooueth that it must be vnderstoode in a sigue and after a spirituall manner and so doe al the olde Doctors interpretit as hath beene often shewed We haue expreslie saith he The bread that I will giue you is my flesh Iohn 6. they haue nowhere It is but the signe of my flesh And we confesse as much for we neuer saide that the signe of Christs flesh was crucified for vs but his verie naturall bodie which he promiseth in that text to giue for the life of the world which by faith and the spirit of God is made the spirituall foode of all the elect children of God and without eating of which none can be saued Ioh. 6. 53. But they haue expresly A man is iustified by works and not by faith onelie Iames. 2. we haue no where a man is iustified by faith alone no nor that he is iustified by faith without workes talking of workes that followe faith First we confesse the text that a man is iustified by workes As Abraham was when he offered his sonne and as Rahab was when she receiued the spies that is a man is declared to be iust in the sight of men For Abraham was iustified before God by faith before he offered his sonne whome God did not trie to enforme himselfe but to declare vnto men by the fruites of obedience that Abraham was a iust man euen so by faith the harlot Rahab perished not with the vnbeleeuers when the receiued the spies in peace but by receiuing
But in what asses eares should it so sound when euerie reasonable man must needes vnderstand that there be offences against the Prince and common wealth as fellonie misprision of treason Mayhem and such like which yet are not offences in so a high a degree as treason is The thing in question you confesse that there is something that doth repugne the law of God and yet is no sinne at all if it be without will or consent as the first motions of concupiscence are Another cauill you haue that his authors haue not onelie these wordes but somewhat more as when they saie Sinne is not whatsoeuer repugneth the law of God but c. If Master Chark had denied the rest it were somewhat that you saie but seeing you graunt they haue all that he rehearseth he is without blame and whether it be part of a definition it skilleth not seeing it is part of their affirmation A third cauill is that he chaungeth the place of the negatiue which in framing propositions altereth often the sense as for peccatum est non quicquid he saith non est peccatum quicquid If Master Charkes chaunging in this place did alter the sense you would haue tolde vs of it but seeing the sense is all one the chaunge is no fault Lastlie for repugneth the law of God you say he putteth it is against the worde of God But here by your leaue you make a peece of a lie for in his first answere he saith it repugneth the law of God which when he repeateth in his replie it is against the worde of God it can haue none other sense then before That you will admit as much as the Iesuites in word or sence haue vttered it is as much as Master Charke requireth Now to the obiection against the Iesuites definition made by Master Charke you saie that to prooue that sinne is no act he obiecteth that iniustice is a sinne and yet no act He were a poore sophister that could not espie your paultrie in this place Master Charke doth not prooue that sinne generallie taken is no act but he affirmeth that there is some sinne which is not an act And therefore the Iesuites in their definition haue not geuen the right Genus or materiall cause of sinne Now for iniustice to passe ouer your knauish example of the execution of Campian and his fellowes so innocent and learned men by great iniustice You take vpon you to teach Master Charke an high point of learning Of the difference betweene a vice that is an habite and a sinne that is a singuler fact which perhapps you weene he learned not before yet euerie young sophister in Cambridge knoweth it well enough But Master Charke speaketh of generall iniustice as his wordes are plaine which is a sinne in not doing the thing commaunded because it is a manifest transgression of the lawe of God whoe commaundeth the wholl and euerie part to be fullfilled and is the sinne of omission which you make the second obiection But euerie omission you saie includeth an act which is a grosse absurditie meaning such an act as is sinne For I maie doe a good act while I omit a better the omission of a better act is sinne the doing of a good act is no sinne To tith mint and anise is a good act of it selfe for it was commaunded by God must not be omitted yet was it sinne to omit mer cie and iustice as the wordes of Christ are plaine this you ought to doe and not to omit the other The examples you bring of one resoluing not to goe to Church Helie determining not to punish his children and the watchmen not to sound the trumpet where the determination and resolution as the cause is the principall part of the sinne are foolish For there maie be omission which is sinne where there is no resolution and determination to the contrarie of that which should be done but negligence or forgetfullnes yea there is omission which is sinne where there is no power in vs to performe that should be done as in all the reprobate and vnregenerate and in the regenerate also in part which neither doe nor can in this life loue God and their neighbour in such perfection as the lawe of God requireth There is omission also through ignorance of Godes lawe which is sinne and deserueth stripes and yet ignorance the cause thereof is no act but the lacke of knowledge But being ouercome by scripture and reason you flie to the authoritie of the auncient fathers and first you quote Chrysost. Homil. 16. in Epist. ad Eph. moste impudentlie where by scriptures reason examples he teacheth the cleane contrarie that omission of dutie is sinne though there be no act to the contrary as when Christ shall saie I was an hungred c. and concludeth Nihilenim boni facere hoc ipsum est malum facere to doe no good euen that is to doe euill or to sinne The like he saieth Hom. de virtut vitiis Satis est igitur mali hoc ipsum nihil fecisse boni Euen this is euill inough to haue done noe good Ambrose hom 18 hath nothing to the purpose or if you meane 81. which is translated out of Basils hom which you quote nexte he hath nothing to your purpose but rather against it For vpon the wordes of Christ Math. 25. I was an hungred and you gaue me not to eat he writeth thus Neque enim in his verbis qui aliena inuasit arguitur sed is qui non communiter vsus est iis que habuit condemnatur For in these wordes he is not reprooued which hath laid bolde vpon other mens goodes but he which hath not communicated those thinges which he had is condem ned Basills wordes in Greek are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 For the extorcioner is not there accused but he that doth not communicate is condemned Last of all you charge vs with that definition of Saint Augustine contra Faust. lib. 22. cap. 27. Peccatum est factum vel c. Sinne is something done or said or coueted against the eternall lawe But if this were a perfect definitiō what needed the Iesuites to frame another according to whose definition this of Saint Augustine is larger then the word defined and in respect of the sinne of omission it is streighter then the terme of sinne yet it serued Saint Augustine for his purpose in hand concerning the facts of the Patriarches mentioned in the scripture which were to be praised and which to be dispraised As for Ambrose in the place by you quoted lib. de paradiso cap. 8. hath another definition then Augustine and a more perfect taken out of Saint Iohn Quidest enim peccatum saith he nisi praeuaricatio legis diuinae coelestium inobedientia praeceptorum For what is sin but the transgression of the lawe of God and a disobedience of the heauenlie commaundements This definition of Ambrose is perfect and maketh
peece of Gods worde and traditions are an other peece and this peece must be added to that or els it is not a perfect or sufficient instruction of itselfe for Gods Church The comparison you make of ioyning S. Lukes Gospell to that of Saint Matthew or Saint Paules epistles to them both to resemble your patching of traditions to the written word of God is both odious and vnlike and without begging the wholl matter in question gaineth nothing For the adding of the writings of one Euangelist to another or of an Apostle to the Euangelistes is but the heaping of heauenlie treasure to the further inriching of the Church in all light of spirituall knowledge so the accession of the bookes of the new testament is as it were the vnfolding or laying open of the same diuine riches that was perfectlie contayned in the olde testament for the saluation of all Gods elect that liued vnder that discipline But your traditions as you maintaine them argue an insufficiencie of the holie scriptures which allso you confesse your selfe and are not a more plaine or plentifull application of the mysteries comprehended in them Therefore though you can for manners sake otherwhile forbeare odious speeches aginst the dignitie of holie scriptures yet euen that odious conclusion gathered by Gotuisus must needes follow of your doctrine concerning the insufficiencie of scriptures and the necessitie of traditions That your traditions are Gods word and of equall authoritie with the scriptures you promise to shew more largelie in the twelft article together with certaine meanes how to know and discerne the same Sed haec in dicm minitave Parmeno You haue taken a pretie pause of three yeares long since you were interrupted as you 〈◊〉 in the end by a writte de remouendo But the daie will come that shall paie for all Whether anie cause or matter hath beene ministred by you of odious speeches against the dignitie of holie scriptures Mastet Charke declareth by one example out of Hosius which with all the rest that he saith you omit to answer as trifling speech to litle purpose So whatsoeuer by anie colour of reason you can not auoid by your censorious authoritie you maie contemne and passe ouer But his conclusion seemeth worthie the answer which he maketh in these wordes To conclude it is a great iniquitie to adde traditions or your vnwritten verities to the written word of God whereunto no man maie adde because nothing is wanting from which no man maie take because nothing is superfluous But to him that addeth shall the curses written in the booke be added for euer Against this conclusiō you note in the margent great iniquitie to adde one veritie to another or to beleeue two verities together A fine ieste but a grosse begging of the wholl cause For who shal graunt that your vnwritten vereties be truth and not falsehood falselie by you termed verities vnwritten There is no veritie of matters necessarie to be knowne vnto saluation which is not written in the holie scriptures that are hable to make vs wise vnto saluation But good Lord what a sturre you keepe because M. Chatk noteth in the margent Apoc. 22. ask how this place is alledged against you c. As though that which is true of one booke yea of euery booke of the scripture maie not iustlie be verefied of the wholl bodie and boke of the the Bible Because adding to the word of god argueth imperfection in the word of god Your stale obiection of Saint Iohns Gospell written after the Reuelation is alreadie answered For al bookes of scripture that haue beene written since the fiue bookes of Moses are no addition to the word of God but a more cleere explication of the 〈◊〉 first com mitted to writing by inspiration of God Neither do they teach an other waie of saluation then Moses did but set forth the same more plainlie by demonstration by examples of Gods iustice and his mercie by threatenings by exhortations by explication of his promises by shewing the accomplishment and the manner of perfourmance of them in Christ and his Church And this they do moste absolutelie sufficiently and plentifully to the saluation of Gods people These things saith S. Iohn are written that you should beleeue that Iesus is Christ the sonne of God and that beleeuing you maie haue euerlasting life in his name Here you maie as well cauill that not onelie the Gospell of Saint Iohn or the miracles written in the same is necessarie to be beleeued vnto saluation but all the rest of the scripture also foolishlie opposing thinges that are no waie repugnant but the one including the other For the beleeuing of Saint Iohns Gospell doth not exclude but include all other bookes and partes of holie scripture which teach the same meane of saluation or any thing thereto pertaining But how holdeth this argument saie you no man maie adde to the booke of Apocalips ergo no man maie beleeue a tradition of Christ or his Apostles Maie we not as well saie ergo we maie not beleeue the actes of the Apostles No sir for we make our argument in this man ner No man maie adde to the booke of the Apocalips much lesse may anie man adde to the wholl Bible of the olde and new testament And consequentlie there are no traditions of Christ and his Apostles to be credited as needefull to saluation which are not contained in the holy scriptures Thus we alledge scriptures and thus we argue vppon them not as it pleaseth you to deseant vpon our allegations and to dissigure our arguments But it is lamentable you saie to see the 〈◊〉 dealings of these men in matters of such importance It is verie true vnderstanding you and your complices to be the men that vse such fleightes in 〈◊〉 waightie causes As for our doctrine is plaine without any seame that the scriptures are sufficient to saluation therfore al tradition besides them are 〈◊〉 to that purpose But let vs see who 〈◊〉 sleightes by your iudgement First you aske Master Charke what he 〈◊〉 by adding Who doth adde Or in what sense as though his meaning and sense of adding were not manifest as also his accusation that the I suites the Papistes do adde to the word of God their traditions a necessarie to saluation yet not expressed or contained in the word of God But if God saie you left anie doctrine by tradition vnto the Church and our ancetours haue deliuered the same vuto vs especiallie those of the 〈◊〉 Church what shall we do in this case Shall we refuse it It seemeth dangerous and I see no reason The question is not whether we should refuse anie thing that God hath left but whether God hath left anie such tradition to be beleeued vnto salua tion which is not contained in the holie scriptures But if our ancetours of the primitiue Church haue deliuered anie such tradition vnwritten as left by Christ what shall we doe you
to Christianitie for they will giue all ouer them selues But briefllie to conclude vp the answere to their reason founded vpon Nouatus his principle touching Gods honour thus I saie That neuer derogateth to Gods honour which is agreable to gods ordinance but that priests should remit sinnes is the ordinance of God as is declared therefore the vse thereof doth not derogate any whit to gods honour Againe as great workes and as proper to god as remission of sinnes was practized by the Apostles and yet is vsed by the Bishops of holie Church without all dishonour of god giuing the holie ghost and gods grace by laying on of 〈◊〉 Ergo remission of sinnes may be also practized of priests without all iniurie to God and the onelie right therein FVLKE Whethersoeuer the force of trueth or prouidence of God driue heretikes we haue no purpose to follow them The gifts which god bestoweth on his Church and the ministers thereof with all humilitie and thankefulnes we acknowledge receiue and exercise to his glorie and the benefit of his Church although we arrogate nothing vnto our selues either in them or in any other thing that is proper to God And therefore it is both a vaine and a false complaint that the Church adorned with Gods blessinges is forsaken and a congregation barren of all Gods giftes imbraced All offices of ministerie in the Church that God hath ordained we admit and practise neither will we giue ouer anie thing for all your childish prating whereof we haue warrant to enioie it out of the word of God To your syllogismes I answere thus to the first That to exercise the Power of remission of sinnes in such sorte as it is ordained of God is no dishonour to God but a great honour To the second I denie that anie thing proper to God as remission of sinnes giuing the holie Ghost and Gods grace as it is proper to God was or could be practised by the Apostles or anie mortal man properly otherwise I confesse that remission of sinnes as Christ hath commaunded it may be practised without all iniurie to God and his onelie right therein For further proofe of the forsaid matter it is declared that neither Christ nor his euerlasting Father nor the holie Ghost doe giue ouer vnto man or resigne the power of remission or anie other holie function of the Church but doe themselues continuallie worke all those graces by mans mynisterie and seruice THE EIGHT CHAP. ALLEN FVrthermore we must here consider that what worke soeuer God appointeth man to exercise in his Church either in remission of sinnes or giuing grace of Gods spirit or what other holie action soeuer may in his name be done for the benefite of the people by the ministerie and seruice of man either by the meanes and mediation of any other instrumentall cause we must learne that in these workes so wrought either by man or through other creatures God doth not resigne his right to the waies and workers thereof and giue ouer the wholl title that is due to himselfe in the saide diuine acts For then in deede mans practize should derogate from Gods power and he should as it were succeed God in the right of his proper power and euerlasting inheritance which onelie to surmise as heretikes do were meere follie Christ is by euerlasting right made the head of the Church and he resigneth not this office to anie mortall man For if he did then the partie that should by his graunt occupie for a season the same dignitie were his fuccessour and should holde in like right the same office as he did before But that notwithstanding he hath made his substitute and vicegerent by whom in his corporall absence he ruleth now the Church as he did before in his owne person not giuing ouer his preheminence supreame power therein but now practizing that by another which afore he exercised him selfe in his owne person It had beene a great derogation to Christ that Peter should haue bin Christes heir and successour for then Christ had lost the perpeiuitie an other man gouerning after him in like right and preheminence as he had before But for Peter to rule the Church vnder him in his steade as by his euerlasting right with commission from him that holdeth that soueraigntie for euer by whomesoeuer the Church shall be ruled till the worlds end in earth this I saie is no derogation to God nor his sonne Christ at all but it much prooueth that Christ according to his manhood is the head of the Church for euer because by man in earth he ruleth the same til his comming again the whichman though he be his vicar vicegerent yet he is not his successour Saint Augustine did trimlie allude to the vse of the olde law comparing the ministers of Gods Church to the yonger brethren who were charged to marrie the elder brothers wife when he died without issue in whose name they did practize the worke of mariage and therefore could not call their children by their owne names but by the name of their elder breethren For as they raised seede to their brother and for their brothers honour so the Priests that haue taken vpon them as it were in mariage to gouerne Christes Church and to bring forth children not in their owne names but in the name of their elder brother and her departed Husband As when they bring foorth children in Baptisme as through the wombe of the Church they bring them not forth as for them-selues and in their owne names but in the name of Iesus Christ beeing their elder brother euen so it is in remission of sinnes also in which case Christ resigneth not his authoritie as though he lacked that power him-selfe but practzeth that mightie worke by the ministerie of man which before he exercised in his owne person And as the baptzing not in the name of Peter nor Paull nor Apolle but in the name of Christ the first husband of the Church after whome the Children be called Christianes not Petrianes nor Paulianes doth much set foorth the honour of the eldest spouse so it prooueth and augmenteth Christes euerlasting honour and moste iuste title in remission of sinnes that till this daie no lesse now in absence by the seruice of his Priestes then before when he was present by his owne worde and will sinnes be in his name and faith fullie remitted yea euen the verie function of Preaching the Gospell which they saie is meant by remitting of sinnes although they say most foolishlie therein and against the common sense of all the fathers yet euen that function is Christs still though it be vsed of man in earth FVLKE You are as plentifull in proofe of that which is confessed as you are naked and barren in proouing that which is denyed The title of your Chapter we will graunt you without proofe and according thereunto we are content to decide this controuersie But you will no longer abide by it
in renecessarilie rife for theie of all Christian people doth him confession of euerie of their mortall sinnes vnto h as the same is also prooued by the doctrine of the olie Fathers of Chistes Church THE TENTH CHAP. ALLEN ANd now I must aduertise my louing breethrenof the necessarie sequele hereof which to some I know seemeth so hard and vpleasant that the verie consideration thereof hath driuen manie that haue not felt the sweetenesse of Gods spirit by which euerie of his commaundements be they neuer so rough in apparance are made easie and delectable to the feare misliking and lothsomenes of the sacrament of penance Which as it is for other causes manie much abhorred of the wantons latelie departed out of the Church and of some worldlie Catholikes to that be not so zelouse in following trueth as they be desirous to know trueth so it is most lothed and feared for that in it there is required a distinct simple sincere and plaine confesfion to be made of euerie sinne that is knowne or suspected to be mortall vnto a Priest which is the lawfull minister of the same Sacrament with such diligent and exact examination of our consciences as a matter of such importance doth of reason require This is the great offence and staie that the weaklings of Christes Church do so earnestlie respect and so long they shall be vexed and molested in minde with the sower remembrance thereof as they do not prooue the sweete gratious and incomparable effect ensueing most assuredlie thereon so long shall they stumble at so small a straw as they do not feele the burden of sinne feare the paines of hell follow the quiet of conscience foresee the dreadfull daie of iudgement so long shall they be bashfull to submit them selues to one mans most close secret meeke and merciful iudgement as they feare not the infinite shame open horrible confusion and euerlasting rebuke before God Angell man and Deuill at the seat and sentence that shall be pronounced in the face of all creatures which must fall to them that close vp vnder couer and compas of their conscience such a number of manifold sinnes whereof in that daie both account and confession must be made to their vttermost confusion Finally so long shal mans will and corrupted nature disobey Gods ordinance heerein as he earnestlie and humbly seeketh not by praier at Christes handes the grace and gift of obedience and repentance Fot as the fulfilling of euerie of Gods commaundements cannot otherwise be had but by his speciall fauour so saith Saint Augustine or as some thinke rather Fulgentius Firmissime tene nullatenus dubites neminem hic posse hominem panitentiam agere nist quem Deus illuminauerit gratuita sua mis ratione conuertis Hold this for an assurance that no man can here do penance except he be illumined and conuerted theseunto by his singular mercie Neither doth this Doctour mean of anie otherway of repentance then is vsed for mortal sinnes after baptisme in the sacrament of the Church putting there in a manner by expresse wordes a double sacrament one for originall sinne that is in children onelie and that he calleth Sacramentum fidei that other for sinnes afterward committed which he tearmeth Poenitentiam Penance FVLKE That auricular confession or popish shrift is a necessarie sequele of the power that Christ hath giuen to the ministers of his Church to forgiue sinnes we must now see in what sorre you are able to prooue In which argument though most needfull for your purpose you haue verie litle to saie and that nothing to the purpose in deede either out of the scripture or out of the auncient fathers First you saie that shrift seemeth hard to them that haue not felt the sweetenes of Gods spirit by which euerie of his commaundements are made easie and delectable Here therefore were conuenient place for you to shew where in all the scriptures God hath commaunded men to confesse all their mortal sinnes committed in thought word or deede vnto a priest of your order But now you are as drie as a kixe and as barren of proofe as a pumisse stone of water There be many other causes then you alledge why popish shrift is so burthenous And the principall cause is because it is a tradition of man to clogge the conscience with intollerable seruitude And in stead of al the causes of the contempt thereof that you alledge so long shall euerie Christian man despise your auricular confession as any thing necessary required of him vntill you be able out of the holie scriptures inspired of God to prooue that it is such an ordinance of God as you in many wordes to no purpose doe bragge of before you bring forth the worde of God to prooue it The saying of Fulgentius is verie Godly and grounded vpon the holy scriptures but that he doth not meane of any other waie of repentance then is vsed in your popish Church what argument haue you to shew He putteth there you saie in a manner by expresse wordes a double sacrament calling the one sacramentum fidei and the other poenitentiam the sacrament of faith and repentance This is a strange manner of expresse wordes to prooue poenitentia to be a sacrament because baptisme is so yea it is manifest by his expresse words that he acknowledgeth no sacramentum poenitentiae but baptisine Cap. 30. Firmissimè tene nullatenus dubites exeptis illis qui pro nomine Christi suo sanguine baptizantur nullum hominem accepturum vitam aeternam qui non hîc à malis suis fuerit per penitentiam fidemque conuersus per sacramentum fidei penitentioe id est per baptismum liberatus maioribus quidem necessarium esse poenitentiam de malis suis agere fidem Catholicam secundùm regulam veritatis tenere sacramentum baptismatis accipere Paruulis verò qui nec propria voluntate credere nec poenitentiam pro peccato quod originaliter trahunt agere possunt sacramentum fidei quod est sanctum baptisma quamdiu rationis oetas eorum capax esse non potest sufficere ad salutem Holde thou most stedfastlie and nothing doubt that except those which for the name of Christ are baptized in their owne blood no man shall receiue life euerlasting which shall not be here conuerted from his euills by repentance and faith and by the sacrament of faith and repentance that is by baptisme be deliuered And for them that be of yeares truelie it is necessarie both to repent of their euills and to know the Catholike faith according to the rule of trueth and to receiue the sacrament of Baptisme But for infants which neither can beleeue by their owne will nor be penitent for the sinne which they draw originally the sacrament of faith which is baptisme is sufficient for them vnto saluation so long as their age cannot be ca pable of reason yea it semeth by this saying going imme diately before
but the promise of truth which indeed if it be shewed so manifest that it cannot come in doubt it is to be preferred before all those things by which I am holden in the Catholike Church But if it be onelie promised and not exhibited no man shall mooue me from that faith which bindeth my minde with so manie and great knottes vnto Christian religion Let vs see therfore what Maniche doth teach me c. These wordes declare that setting aside the wisdom of the Church grounded vpō the scriptures which the heretikes would not acknowledge there were manie other things that might iustlie holde him in the Catholike Church among which the name of Catholikes was but one and serued onelie at that time when the Catholike religion was moste commonlie imbraced therefore he denied not that the name of Catholike onelie was sufficient to teach a man to knowe the Church and the trueth by it but acknowledgeth that all these motiues of vniuersalitie consent miracles succession name of Catholike must giue place to the trueth when it is plainlie shewed out of the canonicall scriptures as in the chapter following he vrgeth them to shew out of the gospells of Christ wher it is writen that Manicheus was an Apostle of Christ as his sect affirmed and his epistle pretended As for the reason you alledge that vnlearned men are not able to stand with heretikes in disputation which wil challenge the Church to themselues is of no force for the vnlearned man ought to know the Church by the true notes thereof conteined in the scriptures which is sufficient for to satisfie his conscience although he can not cunninglie auoide all the Sophisticall arguments that the aduersarie bringeth whereas theonelie name of Catholikes can breede no true faith or quietnes of minde which is not obteined by the peoples iudgement but by authoritie of the worde of God And seing the people are commonlie deceiued in many matters of difficultie and moste of all in misnaming of things what assurance shall the vnlearned haue that they be not deceiued in this so weightie a matter and wherein their speach may so easilie be abused But howsoeuer it was the common calling of the people brought you to know Catholikes Catholikes to know the Church and the creede taught you to beleeue the Church rules in Popes pardons then in other articles Thus is your faith builded altogether vpon humane presumptions the ladder whereof is this you beleeue Popes pardons because the Church of Rome alloweth them you beleeue the Church of Rome because it is the Catholike Church you beleeue that it is the Catholike Church because the people commonlie call it so But of Christian faith Saint Paull describeth another ladder faith commeth by hearing hearing by the worde of God preached by ministers sent of God so that against the authoritie of god who giueth both his worde and preachers and by them true faith you haue the generall and common calling of men which giue authority to that companie to be the Church which is surnamed Catholike which company so called may cause you to beleeue what they list and this indeed is the ground of al your heresies if you had gone one step lower that the Deuill inspireth ignorant and wicked men to call his fowle blouse the Romish synagogue by the name of the beautifull spouse of Christ his Catholike Church ALLEN The second cause that mooued me to reuerence the power of pardoning in the high Bishup and to like his Indulgences was the verie persons of them which first reprooued the same In whome because I saw the worlde to note and wonder at other manie moste blasphemous and inexcusable heresies I verilie deemed though I was then for my age almoste ignorant of all thinges that this opinion and impugnation of Pardons could neither be of God nor of good motion that first began in them begate such a number of most wicked cōtentio is opinions as streight vpon the controlling of the Churches power herein did ensue not onelie against Christs officers in earth but against his Saints in heauen against himselfe in the blessed Sacrament This extreame intollerable issue mee thought verilie could haue no holie entraunce and therfore with the other named cause stayed me in the Churches faith euen then when I had no feeling nor sense in the meaning of these matters FVLKE You were a wise young man in those daies when being almost ignorant of all things as you confesse you would follow the iudgement of the worlde in condemning the persons of them that reprooued pardons and were not able to iudge whether they were iustlie condemned of other blasphemous inexcusable heresies Nay at this presēt time as great a cleark as you are taken to be among your friends you are not able to conuince thē of such blasphemous inexcusable heresies as you prate of And yet if you had bin thō as able iustly to haue reproued thē by the scriptures of such monsters as the world did wonder at in them yet you staied vpō a weake staffe except this be a good atgumēt with you heretiks hold manifest false opinions therefore they holde no true opinions Much more wiselie and soundlie you should haue sought the true Church as Saint Augustine teacheth out of the scriptures and thereby iudged of the worldes noting and wondring which because it consisteth moste of wicked men doth commonlie condemne Christ and his Gospell Out of the same scripture you should haue learned who were Christes officers and whoe the limmes of Antichrist what honour is due vnto the saints in heauen and what manner presense there is of Christ vpon earth But as your faith was thē grounded vpō simple sophistrie in supposing that which no wise man will graunt so is it not now much differing from the same although you haue learned with more craft to peruert a few scriptures and to wrest the sayinges of some dctors for a florish hauing no more substance of true faith which is builded vpon the word of God then you had before For if your shameles principle be denyed that you are the Church of Christ then you come back to these beggerlie motyues as in your articles and Bristowes motyues is manifest being not able either to finde the notes of the true Church in the synagogue of Rome nor to iustify the doctrine of the Church of Rome to be builded vpon the foundation of the Prophets and Apostles when triall is to be made by their writings ALLEN But afterwad reading the historie of the pitifull fal of our time and there considering the sinister intent and occasion of the first improofe of Pardons and all the strange endeuours of Luther whose name is cursed to all good men who first in all mans memorie sauing one Wicleffe who was condemned in Constance Councell for the same was so bolde onelie vpon contention and couetousnes to condemne that which himselfe in Conscience knew to be true and lawfull I could not
lack of necessarie discipline to be taken in this life and therefore that Purgatorie bindeth no man but in respect of satisfying Gods iustice which was not answered here before either by our selues or by the Churches correction and enioyned penance FVLKE The cause you confesse to be waightie that the gouernours of the Church should release that paine which Gods hand hath laid vpon the offender for his temporall correction and therefore you must stand vpon it but as long as you stand you bring neither authoritie of scripture testimonie of antiquitie reasonable argument or sensible experience For first the ground of al your disputation is vtterlie false that God punisheth for sinnes remitted to satisfie his iustice And therefore though I graunt your first consideration which is that God punisheth vs for sinne the more because we punish not our selues yet I may not graunt your conclusion the argument whereof is nothing but your asseueration if the Church punish her childrens faults by sharpe discipline doubtles it satisfieth Gods righteousnes For no punishing or suffering of punishment can satisfie Gods iustice or anie part thereof but the punishment suffered by Christ who was beaten for our faults and striken for our offences and therefore his suffering is a full satisfaction for our vnrighteousnes Neither doth Saint Paull speak of anie discipline in the life to come when he exhorteth vs to iudge ourselues but sheweth that the punishment or iudgement which God executeth in this world vpon his children is a cha stisment that we be not condemned with the world as they that neither by doctrine nor by punishment are brought to repentance your next conclusion is that the bond of anie temporall punishment to be inflicted by God him selfe doth not binde man but for lack of necessarie discipline to be taken in this life But this conclusion you your selfe do afterward denie when you affirme that bodelie punishment commeth vpon men for manie other causes then for correction for sinne onelie or a purgation of a mans life past Finallie if purgatorie do binde no man but in respect of satisfying gods iustice so long as it is certaine that Gods iustice is satisfied toward al his elect in the death and obedience of Christ it is out of doubt that purgacorie hath nothing to do with anie of Gods elect to whome Christ is giuen of his father to be wisdome righteousnes holines and redemption that as it is written he that reioyceth maie reioyce in the Lord. ALLEN Consider secondlie that he thatfully is discharged of the bond of satisfaction in this life whether it be iust accomplishing of his due aud deserued penance or by remission of Gods Church and answering otherwise his lack therein the same person must of necessitie be also charged of Purgatory and alpaine in this life which els God could haue enioyned for sinne because this debt of Purgatorie rose vnto the penitent for the answer of Gods iustice and lack of paiment in this life the which being discharged to the honour of God and the reliefe of the partie there remaineth no bond of paine to come For debt is discharged properlie either by remitting it freelie or by paiment iustlie and I speake rather of 〈◊〉 then of other painer enioyned by God in this life because that is euer appointed to man onelie as a recompence of Gods iustice and as due correction for sinne remitted when of all other paines in this world whether it be sicknes or death no man can assuredlie saie that this or that bodelie punishment came vpon anie man as a correction for his sinnes onelie or as a purgation of his life past For somtimes suchthings folow the necessary of our corrupted nature sometimes they be for our proofe and exercise and sometimes for other causes But those kindes of punishments which God laieth vpon man onelie for correction and satisfying for his sins neuer fal vpon him after he be either iudged by his owne teares or the Churches sufficient satisfaction enioyned or els vpon reasonable cause remitted The like afflictions maie continue in anie person after the bonde of them be remooued or maie be giuen afterward but for the satisfaction of his owne sinnes or anie debt proceeding thereof they be not because the debt is discharged in so much that I dare be bolde to saie if anie man were sick by Gods appointment for that cause onelie to satisfie for his sinnes remitted before in the sacrament that he should straight recouer vpon the discharge of the debt which he did owe to God for his iustice if that into mitie were for no other cause but that onelie as it maie be for manie mo wherof no man can casilie iudge FVLKE He that is fullie discharged of the bond of satisfaction in this life by free remission of his sinnes through the satisfaction of Iesus Christ must needes be dischar ged of Purgatorie except you will saie that accomplishing of penance and remission of the Church is of more force then the suffering of Christ and the remission of God For debt as you saie truelie is discharged properlie either by remitting it freelie or by paiment iustlie But God sorgiueth our sinnes freelie and Christ hath paied the redemption for them iustlie as all the scriptures do testifie Therefore there remaineth no bond of paine to come But now you render a reason why you speake of purgatorie rather then of other paines enioyned by God in this life And that is this that purgatorie is neuer suffered but sor satisfying for sinne onely where other paines of this life maie be for other causes Marke how this geare hangeth together First you haue no shew of proofe that there remaineth anie paine due to satisfie Gods iustice for sinnes remitted but the afflictions of this life and now you confesse that they maie be and often are for other causes How prooue you then that euer they be for this pretended cause namelie for satisfying of Gods iustice for sinnes remitted Well let that passe Seeing the afflictions of this life were brought to prooue that there be three diuerse waies of temporal punishment remaining after sinnes be remitted euerie of which waies maie in some cases be released in parte or in wholl by the Popes pardons how happeneth it that we can haue no experience of the Popes pardonsin releasing any man of the temporall afflictions of this life as sicknes imprisonment c You answer that these bodilie afflictions maie be for other causes so flie quite from your holde yet that you may stand in a corner pelt your enemies you turne again say that you dare be bold to say if any man were sick by gods appoint ment for that cause onely c. that he should straight waie recouer vpon the discharging of that debt which he did owe to gods iustice but a pardon wil discharge that debt therfore a pardō wil make him recouer This I confes is boldly said of you But where is the experience shew one man
that euer recouered by the Popes pardon among so many 1000. sick persons as haue receaued the Popes pardon was neuer none sick by gods appointment for satisfying of his iustice onelie But admit he were sick for other causes as welll as for that should not the popes pardon at the least take away some parte of his sicknes namelie so much as was laid vpon him for that cause onelie Let the Pope if he will make triall of his power to the confusion of his abuersaries graunt a generall pardon to all Papistes as he maie easilie do and then let it be tryed whether anie one shall straight recouer of his bodelie sicknes or other affliction or how manie shall be eased in their bodilie or wordly affliction Prouided alwaies that we haue no counter fait crankes that shall step vp sodenlie recouered of that disease whereof they were neuer sick But if you dare be bolde to saie that the Popes pardon can cause anie man to recouer straight vpon the recept of it you must also be bolde to say that the popes pardon can worke miracles for no man can sodainlie recouer of any disease which is not come to the period without miracle if the naturall cause thereof be not first taken awaie But alas who doth not see your miserable startinghole if that infirmitie were for none other cause but that onelie as it may be for manie mo wherof no man can easilie iudge A wretched clout to hide your infirmitie where no one example among so manie thousand as are sick in the world can be shewed So that purgatorie paines and the release of them are grounded vpon temporall afflictions whereof noe man can iudge for what cause they are no man can shew one example of the release of them by pardons ALLEN And therfore not onelie Christ him-selfe as I shall declare hereafter but Aaron also healed in the olde law the infirmities of thousands which came vpon them onelie for temporall punishment of sinnes And in the sacrament of extreme vnction the Apostle Saint Iames affirmeth that our Lord shall vpon the priestes praier lift vp the penitent or ease him of his sicknes whichhe meant onely or chiefely of that sicknes which commeth vpon the partie by Gods hand as a punishment of those sinnes which be remissible in the sacrament for such like means As Saint Chysostome sheweth also a passiing power in the ministers of God Church saying That they maie keepe mans soule from perishing and maie charge him with more easie paine euen at his passing hence besides that they maie ease his bodelie infirmitie also by their holie praiers in the act of extreame vnction in this sense speaketh he thereof FVLKE Said I that no man can shew one example of the release of bodilie afflictions Master Allen sheweth here examples of thowsands healed not onelie by Christ but by Aaron also of infirmities that came vpon them for temporal punishment of sinnes as he will declare hereafter But I replie what miracles Christ or Aaron wrought in his name they be no examples of the Popes pardons by which if he can prooue that anie man receaueth recouerie of his sicknes it is somewhat to the purpose The llke I saie of annointing with oile by which the elders of the primitiue and Apostolike Church endued with the miraculous gift of healing cured manie of their bodilie infirmities but that anie extreame vnction restoreth anie man to health or euer did I vtterlie denie and therefore we will not dispute of what sicknes they heale them Neither doth Chrysostome saie that the Ministers of Gods Church haue such a passing power that they maie ease bodilie infirmitie by their holie praiers in the act of extreame vnction neither hath his words anie sense thereof and therefore you deale fraudulentlie to tell vs of the sense when you rehearse not the wordes Plaine dealing becommeth an honest cause but when neither wordes nor sense can helpe you you must faine a sense which can not be prooued of the wordes which are these De sacerdotio lib. 3. cap. 6. preferring the ministers of the Church before bodelie parents by so much as the life to come excelleth this life for they truelie do beget vnto this life but these vnto that to come And they truelie can not so much as deliuer them from bodylie death nor driue awaie sicknes that falleth vpon them but these have often saued the soule that was stck and readie to perish causing some to haue a gentler punishment suffering some not to fall from the beginning and helping them not onely by teaching and admonishing but also by praiers For not onelie when they regenerate vs but after warde they haue power to forgiue sinnes It anie man sick among you saith he let him call for c. Where the text of Saint Iames is alledged onelie to prooue that they haue power to obteine forgiuenes of sinnes by praier and neither for healing of bodylie sicknes nor for extreme vnction The ceremonie whereof with the miracle whereunto it was annexed was ceased long before Saint Chrysostomes time ALLEN But as I said because no man can well iudge when man is afflicted onelie for temporall discipline or satisfaction or when far other purposes to vs vnknowne the Church of God that vseth high wisdome and moderation in all things medleth not directly in pardoning by her iurisdiction with any such bodily afflictions as god chargeth man with alin this life which maie be to the forsaken as a beginning of their eternall damnation as Saint Augustine saith as well as a temporall correction and therefore not effectuallie remissible in the Church But the bond of Purgatorie that I saie in the Church maie be released and is released at euerie time that man worthilie receiueth a full and plenarie remission of all penance enioyned due to be enioyned by the law of the Churches decrees I do not speake now of the deliuerie of anie person from the paines of purgatory which alreadie is actuallie there or for the Churches power in releasing of their painet after they be in the course of Gods iudgement for the same I am not so farre yet but I speak of the discharge of the bond thereof or some portion of the same now before the partie do passe hence which is a great deale more proper to the Churches power and more easie to be brought to passe then when the penitents soule is alredy in iudge ment there to which place the Churches iurisdiction as some suppose doth not extend If the simple vnderstand me not let him marke my meaning by an example The paines of hell can not neither by God nor man ordinarilie be helpen or released after man be in the same but the debt of Hell which is due for euerie mortall sinne is discharged allwaies at our repentance in so much that the priest in the sacrament of penance with the sinne euer remitteth the bonde of Hell and preuenteth Gods iudgement in the same So if
homini Christtano indulgentia potest dari qui firmiter credat Papam posse dare se posserecipere habeat charitatem in affectu vt sit verè contritus confessus Of the parte of him that receiueth ae pardon it is required that he haue faith in vnderstanding because a pardon cannot be giuen but to a Christian man which steadfastlie beleeueth that the Pope is able to giue and he able to receiue and that he haue charitie in affection that he be truelie contrite and confessed More then this beside the fulfilling of the cause for which the pardon was graunted he doth not require In so much that he alloweth that a man maie receiue a pardon for his father and mother whether they be liuing or dead if the Pope doe so applie his pardon that he which will goe ouer the sea or to S. Iames in his fathers or mothers name shall inioie it for them and the receiuer doth performe as much for them The iust cause of graunt in the giuers is determined by the glosse aforesaid to be the honour of God and the exaltation of faith by such profitable workes as are expressed and required in the pardons as pilgrimage saying of such a praier giuing to such a fraternitie c. in which not the quantitie but the kinde of the worke is to be considered so that for a verie small worke maruelous large pardon maie be graunted if it please the Pope to whome the dispensation of the treasure of the Church is principallie committed for Bishops which are able to giue but fortie daies out of that treasure are but pettie baylies whome if you will accuse for lauishing the treasure in graunting of ouer large pardons you break the Canon lawe which telleth you that you must not call him to an account for his doings ALLEN Neuertheles the causes of giuing indulgencies may be more or lesse reasonable according to the state and varietie of thinges which to the wisdome of Gods Vicar in earth is best seene whome Christ so ruleth in that case that he maie be most beneficiall to his holie houshold in so much that it is not to be doubted but in these daies and in this great contempt of deuout and religious exercises the moouing onely of the people to prayer to holie peregrinations to the obedience of the Church may be a sufficient cause why there should be to praiers said vpon bookes beads or sanctified creatures for such purpose annexed great remission For looke what thinges be moste condemned of heretikes those things must Christian men be induced to reuerence with moste singular zeale religion Neither can there be anie thing in the worlde so necessarie for vs christian men of these times that be so voide of good workes as by deuotion and entire zeale to ioyne with our elders that in the holy communion of Sainctes we may be partakers of their vertuous deedes And that is the verie ende of all the Popes Pardons to make vs in our lake of satisfaction for our sinnes felowes and coparteners of the abundance that was in Christ first and then by him in our holy brethren departed before vs. FVLKE Throughout this chapter hitherto you haue disputed against the power of the Pope and the force of his pardons now it is time for you to coie him againe and to raise vp his pardons which you haue pressed downe so lowe Now the wisdome of Gods vicar is sufficient to iudge the causes of giuing indulgences and Christ so ruleth him in that case that he maie be moste beneficiall to his houshold in so much that it is not to be doubted but in these daies the Popes large pardons for litle workes may be of great force Then belike your former discourse serueth not for these daies that men muste fulfill their penance if they maie notwithstanding anie pardon that a pardon doth not remit anie good worke inioyned in penance that if a man lack power to fulfill this penance he must supplie it with other workes counteruailable or els the Popes pardons shall not be beneficiall to them at all or nothing so much as they seeme to sound But why saie you that in these daies Christ ruleth his Vicar in this case that he maie be most beneficiall to his holie houshold Hath not Christ as great care of his holy houshold the Church in all times and in all cases as in these daies and in this case Yes verilie But Christ hath not alwaies and in all cases ruled the Pope as it might be moste beneficiall to his Church for then his key of iurisdiction should neuer haue erred nor his life bene wicked to the great hurte and shame of his Church that I speake not of his criors in doctrine which you will not graunt as you doe the other Therfore it followeth that the Pope is not Christes vicar in earth appointed for the most benefite of his Church Your principle that thinges which heretikes doe hate must be moste reuerenced is false For nothing is to be esteemed more then the nature of the thing requireth whether it be loued or hated of heretikes The Anabaptists hate the wearing of armour it followeth not therefore that the wearing of armour should be counted a religious thing or more reuerenced then as a lawfull vsage and sometimes necessarie among Christians The verie end of the Popes pardons is well known to be the maintenance of the Popes pride and couetousnes the pretended end is wicked blasphemous derogating from the sacrifice of Christs death which is a full satisfaction and purging of all our sins the participation wherof is through faith wrought in our hearts by the spirite of God and not by the Popes application or coupling of anie Saintes merites with the onelie and omnisufficient sacrifice of Christ. ALLEN Vpon all which it is verie plaine that euerie man can not beneficiallie receiue the fruite of a Pardon this at least being requisite in euery man that listeth to attaine benefite thereby that he be in state of grace aud in earnest intent to continue in the knot of Christ his Church with loue and liking of the holie workes of his Christian brethren and accomplishing at least that small worke which commonlie now is ioyned to the Pardon for increase of Christian deuotion The continuance of which deuotion that more and more decaieth maketh the Pardons to be more common at this daie of late yeares then they were in the primitiue Church when moste men in the spring of Christian religion and feruour of faith sought to satisfie exactlie the debt of the penance or else which was a common case then recompensed it by Martyrdom though S. Gregorie the first of that name more then nine hundered yeare since in the ordering of the slations at Rome is knowne to haue giuen Pardons for yeares or daies in like forme as now is vsed And cleare it is that the thing it selfe being found lamfull no Protestant aliue can euer be able
auncient Church First you saie therfore that the Pope may lawfullie graunt pardons to them that be in Purgatorie whereof you saie there canbe no more doubt then there can be of the other In deede they be both of like certaintie sauing that for this later question it must first be prooued whether there be any purgatory before it be demanded whether the Popes pardons extend to purgatorie Saint Augustine somewhile doubted whether there were any such place and saith it may be doubted of and perhapes be found perhapes neuer be founde other while he vtterlie denieth any third place because he findeth it not in the scriptures neither shal the pope be able euer to finde such fictions in the scriptures The like I saie of his power of application of the merites of Christ or his Saints or that the saints haue any merits for themselues much lesse for other men Wherefore it standeth neither vpon reason nor vpon any meaning of Gods word whereof there can no wordes be shewed including or importing anie such meaning that the Popes pardons should reach to the release of purgatorie paines if anie such were which cannot release the lest paine that any man suffereth vpon the earth That Leo the tenth did excommunicat Luther it proueth no more the Popes doctrine to be true then that Caiphas condemned Christ prooueth Caiphas to haue bin an honest man ALLEN Marie whether the Indulgences take place so often vpon the dead as vpon the liue that is not so well knowen because the persons departed be not in case to make themselues more apt to take benefit thereby then they were at their departure hence And therfore if they were not with singular zeale and deuotion so qualified in the end of their life they cannot now any whit abetter their own case or otherwise dispose themselues to attaine the fruit of those singular remissions And more then that no Indulgence is lightlie graunted but vpon the fullfilling of some appointed worke of pietie and the departed not hauing alwaies in this life such friends as will accomplish competently the worke prescribed by the Pardon nor himselfe now in case to doe the same he often misseth the benefit of the Churches remission which else he might haue had by the meaning of the giuer Whereupon it seemeth to some to be no surer how far the departed may be relieued by the keies of the Church then it is of other holie suffragies and good workes either of priests or priuate persons all which doe assuredlie relieue them that be in Purgatorie but without anie limitation of benefit which whollie is vnknowne to the liuing without speciall reuelation in what state they stand FVLKE Two causes you assigne why it is not knowne whether indulgences take place so often vpon the deade as vpon the liuing The first because the soules there can take no benefite of pardons but according to the merites of their life But this reason is confuted by authoritie of the glosse vpon the first bull of Iubilie which saith that pardons respect grace and not merite which if it be true not the merits of the receiuer but the power and will of the giuer were to be obserued The second reason is that pardons lightlie require some worke to be fulfilled But that worke is neuer so laborious as the paines already by them susteined in purgatorie if we beleeue you which if it will not serue for a recompence or commutation of penance you will hardelie perswade men that saying of such a prayer giuing of such an almes visiting such an Idoll should be sufficient to make the Popes pardon auaileable But it is a pitifull case that poore soules in purgatórie which lacke nothing for their release but such a trifling worke to be performed for them and haue no friend in this life that will accomplish it for them should lie still broiling in the frying panne and be so litle regarded of the Pope that he will not appoint that his clergie at the least of their charitie should take paines for them although they haue no penie for their Pater noster That some among you thinke the profite of pardons is no surer then of other suffrages and workes to them in purgatorie which are auaileable but you know not how much first it sheweth the certaintie of your faith which leaneth vpon such helpes as you know not whereto they will serue you Secondlie it sheweth that you are not agreed among your selues of such articles as you thrust vpon other men to be credited And thirdlie that euerie one among you being not resolued of the Popes keies of iurisdiction some thinke that the Pope hath arrogan the abused his keies when he hath taken vpon him to dzale further in purgatorie then they are perswaded he hath authoritie For certaine it is the Pope hath pretended by his pardons not onelie to release soules out of purgatory but also to giue other men power to release three or foure a peece whome they will choose ALLEN And therefore vpon this consiacration the learned diuines doe teach that the Pope doth and lawfullie maie applie vnto the soules departed by his keies some parte of the Churches treasure which consisteth of Christes satisfaction and other his Saints by which they departed as they haue neede and be in competent termes to receiue benefite by the merits of their head or fellowes maie be released from some parte of their paines but yet they will not charge anie man with necessitie of belceuing that the Pope or Church should vse meere iurisdiction ouer them that be in an other worlde To be plaine for the peoples vnderstanding the meaning is that in a pardon there are two thinges the one is a sentence of absolution definitelie pronounced vpon anie person penitent the second is the recompence of the debt of sinne remitted by the saide absolution through the application of the Churches treasure by the power of the officiers keies Both these two iointlie can neuer be exercised vpon anie person not subiect though the one maie Absolution can not properlie be giuen nor fruitfullie to anie man not subiect to the giuers regiment but the application of the treasure may be made by the keies to procure mercie for them that be not vnder their power but that is not by proper iurisdiction but by aide of request made by iust offers why the partie should be receiued vnto mercie In this sense then the Pope absolueth no man departed absolutelie But onelie offereth in the person of Christ for the reliefe of him that is in Purgatorie to God his mighti iudge there the abundant price of Christs passion and the satisfaction of Saints And no doubt for his reuerence and representing Christes person he is more often heard then anie priuate man offering onelie his owne almes and praier for the soule departed And for that cause in this sense the Popes pardon worketh onelie per modum suffragij as by aide of sute and not by regiment or iurisdiction which
enemie who by all likelihoode was as much a Lutheran as the other and perhapes neither of them both either of religion or of honestie These preachers of Paris most worthy not of the Locrensians rope but ofa much greater torment as procures of so wilfull murther should M. Frarine call vpon with the saying of Christe vnto Saint Peter put vp thy sword into thy sheath rather then the preachers of the Gospell whoe neither drew anie sworde themselues nor euer were authors or councellers to anie man of murther and cruell bloodshedyea to the pope himselfe which vaunteth that he is Peters successour this text should be moste aptlie applied when he not onelie stirreth vp Princes to make wars one against an other but he himselfe also maketh bloodie battelles not for defence of religion but to maintaine his one worldly quarrels not to hold his own right but to inuade other princes dominions Put vp thy sword into thy sheath said Christ vnto S. Peter the sworde of Paull saide Iulie the second shall defend vs when yonder keie of Peter will no longer serue vs. But Frier Luther is called to witnes that it was not the Gospell which the Protestantes tooke in hand to mainteine by these bloodie wars who saied in the assemblie at Lipsia Neither was this matter euer begonne for Gods quarrell neither shall be ended for Gods sake Hereupon follow great outcries but who is witnes that these were Luthers wordes which euerie Papist doth so spitfullie gnawe vpon None but Luthers enimies Emser and Eccius and the Legate yet was there present manie other not onelie his frends but more indifferent persons then his professed aduersaries yet none of them can beare witnes of this speach But admit the words were spoken in the onelie hearing of his enemies doth it follow that they must needs haue no other sense but that which the Papists do most malitiouslie imagine of thé Might not Luther meane of that cause matter which his aduersaries had begone against him or is it proable to anie reasonable mans iudgement that Luther would deny that the contention which he then maintained against the popish heresie was euer begone for Gods quarrell or should be ended for his sake If thē this malitious sense cary with it no likelihood of truth wherto serueth that exclamation O noble sentence c. the rest that follow eth What warres did Euther euer make or mooue that he should be called sorth by Frarine to shew his comission from god for soul doings Yea if at were true that Luther both spake meant as you falsty charge him had bin as great an hipocrite as he was a sincere preacher were those onely word sufficient to carrie away the wholl cause of the Gospell from the Protestants to the papists and to prooue that no other protestant had commission or authoritie from God if Luther confessed he had none See I praie you what weightie arguments the papists leane vnto while they accuse the protestants to haue made warre without iust cause But P. Frarine dissembleth no this aduersaries obiection that faith was well nigh querched and out of the Church which the Protestantes purposed to reforme Neither may we dissemble his answere Christ praied saith he for S. Peter that his faith should neuer faile and wil you saie that he praied in vaine No verilie for we beleeue that S. Peters faith neither in that most greeuous temptatiō against which he was comforred by these words of our sauiour Christ neither in any other to his liues end did euer faile But what doth that appertaine to the pope or popish Church Againe he saith hath not the holie Ghost taught the Church all trueth for which cause he came downe from heauen we beleeue the holy ghost taught al trueth to the Apostles according to Christs promis and vpon the foundation of the Prophetes and Apostles the Church is builded to continue foreuer If the popish synagogue host of the holie Ghost without the foundation of the Prophetes and Apostels who shall beleue that she is the Church of Christ But if your purpose was saith Frarine to reforme the Christian faith when you could not perswade the people by reason did you thinke it the best waie with gonneshot and beetles to driue the faith into their heads You are greatlie deceiued the minde maie be induced by reason it can not be compelled by stripes No sir they neuer had purpose to perswade faith by blowes and battell neither did they euer put on armour for such purpose but constrained by injury and allowed by authoritie to defend themselues Neither did they euer thinke that the vicious manners of men were to be reformed by anie other meanes then by preaching of Gods worde Christian discipline and godlie lawes And therefore to terme them but fling-braines and light Lacke strawes and all their doinges nothing but a bloodie butcherie a heinous wickednes a deuilish dealing an impietie neuer to be pardoned as Frarine doth it is the sentence of a light and lauish orator not of a graue and lawfull iudge What would this man haue tearmed the massacre of Parris and the executioners there of where not in painted words but in moste cruell and lamentable deedes more then ten thousand persons of all degrees ages and sexes were murdered in one daie without anie examination processe or sentence but being called togither vnder the pretence of 〈◊〉 league and marriage But to proceede in our matter you that accuse the papistes saith Frarine for their euill life are the worke men and naughtiest liuers that euer trode on earth And that did Luther himselfe whome he calleth the third Elias plainlie confesse that the manners of men were far more vitious vnder his Gospell then euer they were before vnder the Popedome But I praie you Master Frarine saith Luther so much of all that professed the Gospell which he preached or of some hypocrits whose wickednes was grea ter after knowledge receiued thē it was in ignorance Thé truth is Luther neither flattereth the vngodlie which out wardlie professed the Gospell nor yet accuseth al true professours for the wickednes of some hypocrites What then doth Luthers testimonie make for Frarines slaunder that they which accuse the papists are the worst men in the worlde But if anyof the disciples saith he dare deny this matter the adulterous beds the smoke of burnt houses the earth yet moist with blood theirpurses swelling with spoile beare witnes against thē These generall acusations deserue no answere except they be exemplified by particulers And therfore he calleth forth Martin Luther being readie to charge him if he dare shew his face with rebellion sedition sacriledge impietie heresie and all manner of wicked vices and heinous offences that can raigne in a man by the testimonie of Charles the Emperour Henry the eight King of England and Sigismonde King of Pole in their seuerall edicts and publike writings And as though he had him bounde with inuincible chaines of this
aliquid dictum est sed vbi clara â—â—aperta sune testimonia id facere consueuerunt more quiaâ—â— haereâ—icorum etiam caetâ—rorum It is no maruel if the Pelagians endeuor to wrest our sayings into what senses they will when they are accustomed to do the same by the holie scriptures not where any thing is spoken darkely but where the testimonies are cleere and manifest after the manner indeede of the rest of heretikes These wordes of Saint Augustine doe as aptelie agree to the Papists as though they had bene by name vttered against them as in that which followeth you shall see verified in this Papist whoe both wresteth out sayings to such sense as himselfe pleaseth and also the holie scriptures themselues where they are most plaine and euident against him a right pranek of olde herenkes Note also by the waie that the scripture by Saint Augustines iudgement containeth most cleere and euident testimonies which though they be neuer so much wrested of herenkes yet in the conscience of all that loue the truth they doe manifestlie deliuer true doctrine and confute false and therefore be not as a nose of wax or a leaden rule by which no certentie maie be found or anie sure triall had by them as the Papists doe blaspheme The next quotation l. 3. cont Donat. ca. 15. is vncertaine because of diuerse treatises that S. Augustine did write against the Donatists but I gesse he meaneth his booke de Baptismo contra Donatistas where yet is nothing to his purpose or to anie purpose in hand but that the scripture of the Gospell If it be wholl is the same although it be alleadged by innumerable heretikes according to the diversitie of euerie one of their opinions and so Baptisme ministred by heretikes according to the institution of Christ is the same what opinion soever the heretikes haue of the wordes by which it is consecrated and ministred He saith also that the snares of heretikes and schismatikes are therefore very pernicious to carnal men because their proâ—ting in knowledge is shut from them their sentence of vanitie being confirmed against the Catholike trueth and their sentence of dissention being conâ—â—â—med agâ—inâ— the catholike peace These things are true of obstinate heretikes and consequentlie of Papists but they make nothing against Master Chark or for the triall of spirits which is the question now debated betweene him his aduersarie But that the scriptures are sufficient to beate downe al heresies and to reach all trueth necessarie to saluation and the onelie sure and certaine triall whereby all doctrine is to be examined and adiudged the same Augustine doth plentifullie and in manie places of his workes declare and euen in that same worke de Baptismo contra Donatistas lib. 2. Cap. 2. de vnitate Ecclesiae cap. 2 3. 16. de nup. conc lib. 2. cap. 29. de peccat merit remiss lib. 3. cap. 7. de natura gratia cap. 60. c. Three causes there be saith our answerer of appealing onelie to scripture The first to get credit with the people by naming of scripture to seeme to honor it more then their aduersaries doe by referring the wholl triall of matters vnto it To winne credit by cleauing to the authoritie of God expressed in his holie word written and to honor it by acknowledging the sufficiencie thereof for the triall of all matters of religion that maie comme in controuersie is no shift of heretikes or new teachers but the auncient practize of the best and most approoued Catholikes To pretend these things in shew and not to accomplish them in deed is the guise of hypocrites what religion soeuet they would seeme to mantaine The second cause saith he is by excluding Councells fathers and aunciters of the Church whoe from time to time haue declared the true sexse of scripture vnto vs to reserue vnto them selues libertie and authoritie to make what meaning of scripture they please and thereby to giue colour to euerie fansie they list to teach But Master Charke and his fellowes giuing the soueraigne authoritie to the onely scriptures do not at all exclude councells fathers and aunciters of the Church except it be in case where they teach contrarie to the manifest scriptures of god which doe either in expresse and plaine wordes or els by moste easie and necessarie conclusion deliuer vnto the Church all things needefull to be credited and knowne vnto eternall life as both the Apostle testifieth 2. Timoth. 3. and S. Augustine a worthie Father auncient of the Church consenteth Ep. III. Fortunatiano Neque enim quorumlibet disputationes quamuis CatholicoruÌ„ laudatorum hominum velut scripturas canonicas habere debemus vt nobis nonliceat salua honorificentia quae illis dcbetur hominibus aliquid in eorum scriptis improbare atque respuere si fortè inuenerimus quòdaliter senserint quà m veritas habet diuino adiutorio vel ab aliis intellecta vel à nobis Talis ego sum in scriptis aliorum tales volo esse intellectores meorum Denique in his omnibus quae de opusculis sanctorum atque doctorum commemoraui Ambrosij Hyeronimi Athanasij Gregorij siqua alioruÌ„ talia ita legere potui For we ought not to accompt the disputations of all men although they be catholike praise worthie as the Canonicall scriptures that it should not be lawful for vs sauing the reuerence which is due to these men to disalow and reiect something in their writings if perhaps we haue found out that they haue thought otherwise then the truth is of things by gods helpe either vnderstood of others or of our selues Such one am I in the writings of other men such would I haue other men to be vnderstanders of my writings Finallie in all these which I haue rehearsed out of the workes of holie and learned men Ambros Hicrott Athanasius Gregorie Andif I could so reade any like of other mens writings c. Also Ep. 112. Pauline 〈◊〉 scripturarum earum scilicet quae canonicae in Ecclesia nominantur perspicua firmatur authoritate fine vlla dubitatione credendum est Aliis verò testibus vel testimoniis quibus aliquid credendum esse suadetur tibi credere vel non credere liceat quantum meriti ea admonentem ad faciendam fidem vel habere vel non habere perpenderis What sceuer is confirmed by the plaine cleare authoritie of the holie scriptures of those truelie which are called in the Church canonicall without all doubt is to be beleeued But other witnesses or testimonies by which anie thing is counselled to be beleeued it is lawfull for thee to beleeue or not according as thou shale waigh what worthines he that counselleth those things hath to cause credit or els hath not Againe De doctrina christiana lib. 3. cap. 6. Magnificè salubriter spiritus sanctus ita scripturas sanctas modificauit vt locis apertioribus fami occurreret obscurioribus autem
he quare venerit in carne Christus inueniemus qui eum negant in carne venisse Let vs inquire wherefore Christ came in the flesh and we shall finde who they are which denie him to haue come in the flesh For if you giue heede to their tongues you shall heare manie heretikes confessing that Christ came in the flesh but the trueth conuinceth them wherefore came Christ in the flesh was he not God was it not saide of him In the beginning was the worde and the worde was with God and the worde was God did he not feede the Angells and doth not he him-selfe feede the Angells did he not so come that he departed 〈◊〉 fromthence did he not so ascend that he did not forsake vs Then wherefore came he in the flesh Because the hope of resurrection ought to haue bene shewed vnto vs. He was God and he came in the flesh for God could not die the flesh could therefore he came in the flesh that he might die for vs. And how died he for vs No man hath greater loue then this to giue his life for his friendes therefore loue brought him to the flesh Whosoeuer therefore hath not loue denieth Christ to haue come in the flesh It is manifest now by this discourse of Augustine vppon some particuler causes of Christ comming in the flesh that his cheife and principall offices cannot be excluded in the right interpretation of this text and therefore Master Charke hath rightlie inferred that whoesoeuer denieth the offices of Christ or any parte of them is no lesse confounded by this scripture then they that denie his person or anie parte or essentiall propertie thereof and that by the consent of the auncient fathers exposition without the which also the text is euident of it selfe For the verie names of Iesus and Christ doe comprehende his offices which whoesoeuer denieth although in wordes he confesse his person and names doth make but an Idoll of Iesus Christe whoesoeuer therefore confesseth not Christ to be a Sauiour Prophet King and Priest is not of God but of Antichrist he whosoeuer confesseth not that he is a wholl and onelie Sauiour Prophet King and Priest is of the same spirite of Antichrist that denieth Iesus Christ being come in the flesh or as the vulgare translation hath that dissolueth Iesus For whoesoeuer setteth vp anie other Sauiour Prophet King or Priest in that sense that these offices pertaine vnto Iesus Christ dissolueth Iesus denieth Iesus Christ to haue come in the flesh whoe came to be our onelie Master-teacher according to the manifest texts of scripture which hath taught vs all thinges likewise our onelie spiritual King eternall and high priest whose office both kinglie and priestlie being confirmed to him by an othe passeth not from him vnto anie other in succession but remaineth alwaies the onelie mightie Prince King of Kinges and Lord of Lordes Whoesoeuer therefore derogateth from Christ anie parte of these dignities offices denieth Iesus Christ comming in the flesh and so doe the popish Catholikes or papistes by their doctrine of traditions Popes authoritie sacrifice of the Masse and such like Nay saith the answerer Martine Luther interpreteth this place to be vnderstoode of M. Charke and his fellowes saying That spirit is not of God but of Antichrist which dissolueth Christes flesh in the sacrament It cannot be denied but Martin Luther was in this case to rash and presumptuous in condemning other men for holding this contrarie to that wherein he erred him-selfe But this answerer is too impudent to faigne sayings wordes of his yea and to applie that which he saied further then Luther him selfe doth For first these wordes that are alleadged as Luthers saying are none of his but forged by the answerer Secondlie that which Luther saieth founding to such a matter can not be drawne against M. Charke and his fellowes who maintaine no such absurditie as Luther in that place oppugneth The very wordes of Luther in his booke intituled Defen verb Caenae Accipite c. are these Quare in superioribus dixi hunc spiritum non esse bonum neque per istos fanaticos homines quicquam boni machinari quanquam existimem hos concionatores contra quos haec scribuntur nondum mali quicquam in animo habere Sed bone Deus non sunt sui ipsorum compotes continentes à 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 captiui tenentur Quare eis nimium sidendum non ect Nam spiritus qui Christi carnem dissoluit non est à Deo inquit Ioannes idqque probam spirituum vult esse Hic spiritus verè dissoluit carnem Christi cùm cam inutilem pereuntem prorsus communem carnem affirmat qualis est bouis aut vituli Wherefore I saide before that this spirite is not good neither goeth about any good thing by these fantasticall men the rebellious boures although I suppose these preachers against whome these thinges are now written as yet to haue none euil thinge in their minde But good God they haue no power nor holde of them selues they are blinded and holden captiue by a spirite wherefore they must not be trusted too much For that spirite which dissolueth the flesh of Christ is not of God saith Saint Iohn and that he will haue to be the triall of spirites This spirite in deede dissolueth the flesh of Christ when it affirmeth that it is vnprofitable perishing and altogether common flesh such as is the flesh of an Oxe or a calfe This is Luthers saying now it is certein that M Charke and his fellowes doe neithet thinke nor speake so vnreuerentlie of the flesh of Christ animated with his spirite which they acknowledge to be verie true meate wherewith we are fed vnto eternall life They had some smacke of Nestorianisme therefore against whome Luther vttereth these wordes from which M. Charke and his fellowes God be thanked are free But now commeth our answerer after he hath forged a place of Luther and hammered it out against Master Charke to maruaile that these men can finde so many absurdities vpon one sentence of scripture and first he would aske whether Master Charke thinketh that the Papistes doe exclude Christ when they allowe Prophets to teach vnder him Kinges to raigne vnder him Priests to sanctifie vnder him or no. As though there were no waie for Papists to be guiltie of Antichristianisme except they did exclude Christ altogether whereas it hath bene prooued that whosoeuer doth not acknowledge the wholl and euerie part of his offices is of Antichrist As for Prophets Kinges and Priests to teach reigne and sanctifie vnder Christ is not the matter in question but to teach reigne sanctify beside Christ to claime like authotitie in teaching gouerning sanctifying with him as to be fellow Prophets fellow Kings fellow priestes with him to teach that Christ taught not to make articles of faith to dispense against Gods commaundements to make lawes to binde the
abstinencie from wine and strong drink his dailie excercise of praier and contemplation when he was alone his diligent and zealous preaching and baptifing when the multitudes came to him his free and earnest rebuking of all mens sinnes euen those that were greatest in credit the Pharises the Saduces the high Priests and the King him-selfe All these ioyned together are such arguments of austeritie and seueritie of life as not onelie all antiquitie but all ages past present and to come may worthelie wonder at as for the place the garment the dyet be not matters of so great admiration of themselues neither so wondred at of all antiquitie as he bableth not yet followed of his Mocke-monkes and false Eremites that either the wildernes is their dwelling or the Camels heare their weede or the locusts and bitter honie their diet or anie thing answering to these in hardnes Their Monkes dwell in palaces their Eremites in fine houses neere to cities and great townes their apparell though in fashion disguised yet neither rough nor hearie nor of smalest price their dyet like Princes and noble men the life of the greatest parte of them idle and lasciuious Therefore to their owne shame they may account Ihon Baptist the Prince or first author of their Monkish order whome they follow as neare in austeritie of life as they much come behind him in course of time I trust all reasonable men may now vnderstand what these vnlearned quarrels come vnto when they be discussed and examined howsoeuer they seeme to be bolstred out with impudent asseuerations multitud of quotations false cauillations and vnnecessarie collections In the rest therefore I wil be more briefe because my purpose is not to handle common places of controuersies at large but shortlie to discouer the vanitie and pride of this answerer and leaue such matters to other treatises where they be fullie answered A third example he taketh of our impertinent interpretation about the controuersie of the reall presence in the sacrament which is nothing els but a beggerlie crauing of a matter still in question which can beare no shew of of anie lawfull example except it were cleere against vs that our exposition were beside the text or contrarie to it But peraduenture this fellow will bring some new matter that hath not beene heard of in this cause to conuince vs of absurd interpretations First he saith they haue these wordes of scripture repeated in foure seuerall places This is my bodie If we did vtrerlie denic the sacrament to be the bodie of Christ in anie sense it were somewhat that he saith against vs But we graunt it to be the bodie of Christ in such sorte as Christ did meane by those wordes Contrariewise we shew the one part of the sacrament to be six times called bread after the consecration in the scripture the other part twise or thrise to be called the fruite of the vine yet your gare interpreters the Papists do vtterlie denie the one to be bread the other to be wine in anie sense but monstrous and imperceptible and that against the iudgement of all antiquitie and the plaine wordes of diuerse auncient doctours But all antiquitie to our answerer a great antiquarie as you shall sec by and by are so cleere for the Popish reall presence as no man might without great offence doubt thereof as the wordes of Saint Ambrose and Saint Cyrill are These bookes that he quoteth of lib. 4. de sacram C. 5. for Ambrose and Catech. 4. for Cyrill are not so without controuersie acknowledged to be so auncient as those fathers whose names they beare and yet they saie nothing in this cause of not doubting but we are readie to saie the same Namelia that Christ hauing said this is my bodie no man ought to doubt but that it is his bodie They haue also other wordes to declare that their meaning was not of the popish manner of presence but the spirituall manner of eating of Christs flesh where of the externall sacrament is a figure and similitude as Ambrose de sacr lib. 4. cap. 4. 5. de iis qui my ster init cap. 9. The same Cyrill also though much to be suspected for his antiquitie as verie latelie come into light yet saith in the same place that the bodie of Christ is to be receiued by fatih not as the Capernaites imagined which thought they had been prouoked to the cating of a mans flesh But that same Cyrill saith our answerer in another place prooueth at large that to aske onelie quomodo how it may be is the parte of an vnbelecuing Iewe quoteth lib. 4. in 10. cap. 13. In deed Cyrillus Alexandrinus affirmeth and we subscribe vnto him that to aske how God can doe that he said he wil doe commeth of Iewish incredulitie He saith not that it is a part of an vnbeleeuing Iewe to ask how Christs words are to be vnderstood figuratiuely or properlie carnallic or spirituallie Neither doth he speake in the place alledged of Christes reall presence in the sacrament but of the question of the Iewes how Christ could giue his flesh to be eaten which we beleeue verilie he doth not one lie in the sacrament but euen to infants which neuer receiued that sacrament or els we must exclude them from eternall life according to his words except ye eate the flesh of the sonne of man and drinke his blood you shall haue no life in you But now you shall plainlie see how skilfull this answerer is in all antiquitie whereof he talketh so often and so confidentlie as bayard is alwaies the boldest horsse The same Cyrill saith he speaking of him vnder whose name are caried those my stagogical catechesis is he that wrote vpon Iohns gospell c. whereas the one was Bishop of Ierusalem in Palestine the other of Alexandria in Egypt the one not much nearer in time to the other then the prouinces where they were Bishops are in place For Cyrill of Ierusalem was a verie olde man in the time of the second generall Constantinopolitane councell Cyrillus of Alexandria was president of the third generall councell of Ephesus the first betweene which two Councels there was aboue fortie yeares distance in tyme. By which note of grosse ignorance it is manifest that this scorneful proude answerer hath neuer seene the workes of the one Cyrill nor of the other but one lie the quotations and collections of other men which he vseth as vauntinglie as they were all of his owne reading yea if they be not pregnant inough for his purpose he will make no bones to falsefie their sayings cleane contrarie to their meaning as he dealeth with Epiphanius whome he affirmeth to saie That albeit the hoste seemeth to vs of arounde forme and insensible yet whosoeuer beleeueth it not to be the true bodie of Christ is fallen from grace and saluation whereas Epiphanius saieth expresselie it is of a round shape and insensible as concerning power and yet it is the
her not doth better Whereof we inferre that virginitie is more acceptable and meritorious before God then mariage although mariage be holie No saie our adversaries Saint Paull meaneth onelie that he doth better before men and in respect of worldlie commmodities but not before God If you aske him which of his aduersaries doe saie so he is not able to name one for in truth we neuer saide so not thinke so But that which he saith they doe infer vpon the text that virginitie is more meritorious before God the mariage we doe vtterlie denie and we saie furthet that all the Papists in the world shal neuer be able by lawfull and true arguments to infer so much vpon these wordes of the text or to iustifie this kinde of inferring virginitie is better before God ergo it is more meritorious for the antecedent which we graunt doth not prooue the conclusion which we denie Therefore when out of the circumstances of the text he prooueth that virginitie is better in respect of God as a more excellent gift of God he taketh more paines then he needeth For we confesse as much that he that ioyneth not his virgin doth better not onelie in respecte of worldlie commodities or before men but also that shee maie be holie before the Lord in bodie and spirit c. then he that ioyneth her in mariage but that he doth better in respect of merite reward in the life to come as the answerer saith it doth not follow thereof I meane for the merite As for the reward which God bestoweth of his meere mercie doth not prooue anie merite or desert of the partie rewarded For he which vseth the gift of God well by the power and strength which he hath of God shall of Gods goodnesse not misse of his reward but he cannot therebie claime reward of dutie or of merit neither doth the text alleadged by him prooue any such thing Some Eunuchs haue gelded them-selues for the kingdome of heauen therefore they haue deserued the kingdome of heauen therebie Such licentious kinde of inferring will not onelie make poperie to stand if it were lawfull but also might be able to iustifie all heresies that euer were by scripture But bring these illations or inferrings to the iudgement seate of Logicke and they will easilie appeare to be voluntarie glosles and not true expositions or necessarie collections Yet these new doctors saith our answerer doe contemne and 〈◊〉 all authoritie antiquitie wit learning sanctitie of our forefathers and of all men yea of their owne new doctors and masters when they come to be contrarie to any new deuise or later fansie of theirs Because we may not receiue euerie interpretation or opinion of euerie of the fathers he maketh this hideous outcrie against vs. And yet we are alwaies readie to shew and haue often performed the same that in the most and greatest controuersies the auncient Doctors are against them verie cleere on our side Therefore it is an impudent slaunder that we reiect or contemne all authoritie antiquitie witte c. of our forefathers as it is a ridiculous argument that he bringeth of our dissent from our late doctors and masters as he termeth them because we follow not the error of Luther about the reall presence and the vse of Images as for the number of the sacraments and bookes of the Bible we holde with Luther in his last iudgement when he was best instructed in those cases The order of seruice is free for euerie Church to vse diuerselie as maie serue best for edification The popish Churches haue diuers vses of seruice as Sarum Yorke Bangor Hereford in England they had how manie then diuers orders abroade But Caluine he saith is reiected about the head of the Church in England which is a manifest vntrueth for Caluin is euen of the same iudgement concerning the Princes authoritie in causes ouer persons Ecclesiasticall as is euident in his Institutions that we are in England onelie he misliked the terme supreme heade as offensiue though not euill as it was vnderstood of the godlie and that terme is forborne in England for the same cause and another of supreme gouernour vsed which signifyeth as much as was ment by the other when it was rightlie vnderstoode As for the gouernment of the Church in Geneua Caluine did neuer binde all other Churches to vse the same what other pointes are reiected in Beza he hath no leisure to tell vs. But that all the Churches of the Protestants as he calleth vs in Europe do agree in the chiefe and principall articles of Religion the Harmonie of their confessions latelie set forth in print doth giue ful moste sufficient testimonie Ceremonies and for me of externall gouernment were neuer in gods Church accounted necessarie to be all one in euerie particular Church And some men maie haue their priuat opinions sometime perhapes vntrue yet retaining the vnitie of faith in the chiefe grounds and foundation of Religion with them that dissent from them either iustlie or vniustlie Wherefore our answerers finall conclusion doth not followe that Protestants will haue onelie that to be taken for trueth which they last agree vpon and their wordes must be the one ie proofe thereof whereas the worlde can testifye that the holie scripture is our ground and from thence we challenge the best proofe not refusing any other lawful proofes that wil stand with the iudgement of holie scripture where it is most plaine and easie to be vnderstoode euen without anie interpretations The bookes of the scripture we receiue which the Church of God among the Iewes before Christ and the moste auncient Church of the Gentiles since Christ hath receiued and allowed the sense we take euen out of the same bookes and bring no foreine sense vnto them all writtings of men olde and new we examine according to the same praising God for such helpe as we haue by his giftes in them to vnderstand his word yet leauing to them without reproch such things as proceeded from them selues without the warrant of that worde and this haue all true Catholikes alwaies done and no heretike is able to doe albeit he woulde professe neuer so much to doe To the former slaunders our answerer will haue vs adioyne this that our aduersaries saith he notwithstanding all request sute offer or humble petition that we can make will come to no publike disputation or other indifferent and lawfull iudgement but doe persecute imprisone torment and slaughter them which offer the same Touching anie lawful request sute or humble petition made in due manner to them that haue authoritie to graunt I neuer hard of anie onelie the seditious challenge of Campian is all the request sute offer and humble petition that he is able to prooue was euer made by them for anie such matter before the publishing of this answere of his As for them that persecute imprisone torment and slaughter them which offer disputation which he calleth
testament Sozomenus in the place by you cited after he hath commended the Philosophie or contemplatiue life of the solitarie men in those daies hath these wordes of this excellent Philosophie was the beginner as some saie Elias the Prophet and Iohn Baptist so that it is not so absolute as you sett it downe but as some saie and it is of a Philosophicall studie and life in which if comparison be made with Popish Monkes for one thing which they haue like they haue three things vnlike or contrarie to the profession and practise of those auncient Monachi which might haue some resemblance with the manner of Elias life in some thinges and were more agree able to the example of the sonnes of the Prophets which were students in diuinitie as those olde Monks of the primitiue Church readie to serue in the place of teachers whensoeuer they were called That antiquity onely should let the Prophets to be examples of monasticall life it is your owne vaine collection and as vaine is your comparison of Adam to be a paterne of marted men Abel of sheepherdes Caine of husband men c. For M. Charke asketh what you are able to bring out of the word of God why Elias should after more then two thousand yeares be brough in for a patrone of friers which for so manie yeares could neuer be espied in the Church either of the Iewes or of the Christians As for the estate of maried men sheepherds husbandmen citizens Tentdwellers musitians smithes c. is either necessarie or otherwise commendable then by the examples of those auncients of which some in respect of their antiquitie are not to be followed at all as Cain and the rest of his cursed line who yet were inuenters of profitable artes by the gift of God and not by the worthines of the persons As for the slate of the Munkes and friers such as we striue about is neither necessarie nor profitable to the Church but a great infection and poison of the same Nowe whether Iohn Baptist were a president to Monkes whome Master Chark saith to haue beene an extraordinarie and perpetuall Nazarite whose example is not now laid vpon them that teach in the Church you answere that he doth wilfullie mistake the question for that you affirme not that such extraordinarie austeritie is laid vpon anie man of necessitie but that it is lawfull and maketh no sect when it is voluntarilie taken and vsed You do wilfullie omit the pith of Master Charkes argument who is not ignorant of your pretense of voluntarie but addeth that the seuerall offices of those that teach in the Church are expressed in the word of God and therefore there can be no new order of Ministers by anie title or voluntarie assumption but it is a suspitious sect howsoeuer seuerall persons maie as they see iust cause more or lesse prescribe vnto them-selues some extraordinarie austeritie of life for their priuate exercise or chastisment That Saint Iohns austeritie was for the moste parte voluntarie and not of necessitie of the vocation of a Nazarite it is fondlie proued of you by example of the superstitious sect of the Essenes described by Plinie and Iosephus of which Plinie speaketh verie little but Iosephus at large and in some points of austeritic noteth them to exceede any thing that we read in scripture of Saint Iohn Baptist as of their continuall exercise in labour of their handes their forbearing to spitte in the assemblies of men their forbearing to ease their bodies on the sabboth daie and such like superstitious toies Now the austeritie of Saint Iohn in that he did willinglie and not by compulsion vndergo it maie be called voluntarie otherwise in that it was appointed by the wisdome of god whose spirit directed him it was necessarie and especially for the forerunner of Christ to sing the dolefull song and to call the people to repentance and therefore not without presumption drawne into example by them that are neither led with the same spirit nor called to the same office and so no example nor platforme for the superstitious order of Monkes and friars albeit they alwares kept as great austeritie in deede as they professe in wordes But it is a wonderfull argument for your Monkes that the Nazarites did make a religious vow for their dedication to God as your religious people do also vse For it were somewhat that you saie if you could bring as good warrant for the vowes of your Popish votaries to be prescribed and accepted of God as you bring for the vow of the Nazarites otherwise it maie be said vnto you by God as he speaketh by the Prophet quis requisiuit c. who required these things at your handes which if it were said of those things which in some manner and to some end were required how iustlie maie it be spoken of these that in no manner nor to anie end are by God required at your handes but that Saint Iohn was a Monk of the new Testament and a patron of monasticall life although you confesse it to be more then you were bound to prooue so manie fathers as you name do testifie with one consent And what if he were an example followed of those Monkes that liued in moste of those fathers times is he therefore a patrone to your Popish Monkes of these late daies and new orders it will be more then hard for you to prooue that Now let vs consider your authorities which you affirme to testifie that Saint Iohn was a Monk of the new testament and a patterne of monasticall life First Gregorie Nazian orat de S. Bas. 1. hath this testimonie onelie he compareth Basill with Saint Iohn Baptist as resembling him in some thinges as he doth with Peter Paul Iohn the Euangelist and Stephan except you will saie theese were all Monkes Chrisostome in deed Hom. 1. in Mark. calleth Saint Iohn prince of the Monasticall life but not a Monke of the new testament as I haue shewed before in answer to your preface Neither doth Saint Ierome epist. ad Eustoch saie that Saint Iohn was a Monke and patterne of Monasticall life but speaking of the life of an Anachoret which liued by him-selfe alone in the wildernesse he saith huius vitae auctor Paulus illustrator Antonius vt ad superior a conscendam princeps Iohannes Baptista fuit Of this life Paul was the author Anthonie the beautifier and that I maie ascend higher the Prince or cheefe was Iohn Baptist. Where is Iohn Baptist the Monke or patterne of your Papisticall monkish life when they liued not in the wildernes but in cities populous townes not in caues and tents but in gorgious palaces Although Saint Iohn be the cheife of them that liued in the wildernes the same Ierome in the life of Paule the Heremite whome before he calleth the author of the Anachorites life hath these wordes Inter multos saepe dubitatum est à quo potissimùm monachorum eremus habitari
abstinence and fasting he did beare in his bodie the markes of Christ by suffering imprisonment stoning whipping not of his owne hand but of the persecutors of the Gospell As for mortifying our members and crucifying our flesh be higher matters then any voluntarie exercise and extend much farther in ouercomming our whol corrupted nature which it seemeth you little knowe or practise for al your whipping and tormenting of your selues by your comparing of them to exercises of bodelie chastisement Moreouer the seuerity of S. Iohn Baptists life and of other Saintes of the new Testament the olde mencioned in the scripture fauoreth not your superstitious whippings For albeit they did willinglie sometime abstaine from pleasures that are lawful were tormented by other yet none of them was a tormentor of himselfe And as for the great store of examples that you promise the reader in one Chapter of Marcus Marulus lib. 3. cap. 10. of Saintes chastizing their bodies with whippes there is in deed some store of examples of voluntarie not onelie chastening but also tormenting of the bodie but we haue smal warrant either that they were all Saintes or that anie Saintes in such examples of tormenting their bodies pleased God yet is there verie fewe examples of them that whipped them selues The first is of Frauncis the father of graie friers which being assaulted with the thoughtes of marriage being angrie with him selfe therefore did beat him-selfe verie hardlie with the corde wherewith he was girded But when stripes litle preuailed he tumbled him-selfe naked a great while in the deepe snow and afterward binding to his wholl bodie the shapes of men made of snow he spake vnto him-selfe by the waie of rebuking and said loe Francis here is thy wife loe here be thy children either cloath them that they be not so frozen for colde or els forsake al things and serue the Lord onelie So saith your author at length he tamed the wantonnes of his flesh with whipps and quenched the burning fire of lustes by embracing colde snow with his naked breaste But the holy ghost wiser then Francis prescribeth marriage which he did fight against and not Images of snow which he embraced to be a remedie to quench burning Iust. I. Cor. 7. But of whippers there are three more examples Elizabet anunne of Comagie whipped her selfe certaine houres euerie daie Maria Decegnies that was married against her will by often praiers fasting and whipping of her-selfe mooued her husband to vow chastitie with her where your author saith Naufragium c. she had made shipwrack of virginitie being committed to the waues of Matrimonie but while she leaneth to the board of fasting praier chastisment vnhurt and vntouched she swamme out vnto the hauen of saluation But the holie ghost giueth an other rule to them that be married that the wife be not separated from her husband except it be for a time of fasting and praier and then to returne againe together lest Sathan tempt them through incontinencie and that they which are maried should not seeke to be loosed 1. Cor. 7. ver 10. 5. 27. Beside these there is a Dukes wife of Thuringia called Helizabeth that commaunded her maides to whippe her in her priuie Chamber and these are the goodlie examples of Saintes that vsed whipping of them-selues Manie of the rest are wearing of haireclothes as Thomas Becket Maiorus Bishop of Sarina I wot not where in the I le of Britanie Medericus Eduensis Abbas Lewes the 5. King of Fraunce Cecilia and Radegundis wife of Clotharius King of Fraunce vntill she had obtained the dissolution of the band of marriage by binding her-selfe to chastitie agreeable to the doctrine of the Apostle 1. Cor. 7. as well as white and black resemble each other Edmunde of Canterburie ware a coote of maile wouen with leade Macharius Abbat of Alexandria bare on his shoulders a sacke full of sand A Monke in Saint Hierome being commaunded by his elder caried a great stone eight yeares together twise in the daie by the space almost of fiue miles Hierome to Eustochium testifyeth that he cried often day and night together and ceased not beating of his brest vntill by the Lords rebuking quietnes returned An example more meete to be followed of them that seeke the like cause then any we haue had yet which is confirmed by authoritie of the Scripture Psal. 22. Psal. 32. and 42. Bonifacius Archbishop of the nether Missia ryding barefoot in winter his feete were frozen to the stirop and thowed with hotte water Hospitius Monke of Nuceria vsed an Iron girdle Philoramus a Priest liued enclosed in a stonie denne being bound hand and foot with iron bandes and the last daie of his life confessed if you will beleeue the storie that he omitted no moment of time in which he thought not somewhat of God he had beene better occupied to haue attended on the flocke of the Church whereof he was a Priest or elder Martin a Monke of Massick in Campania had bound his foote in a chaine fastened to a rock but being bidden by the Abbat Benet to beware that the iron chaine did not holde him there more then the chaine of Christ he vnloosed the bandes but would neuer departe further Iohn a Monke stood three yeares vnder a hollow rock of a mountain that his leggs thereby swelled and broke into vlcers Pacomius an Abbat walked barefoot thorough the brambles and thornes and returned into his celle with his feete all bloodie Simeon a Monke tooke a rope from a bucket and wound it about his bodie vntill his flesh were eaten with it and putrified till stinke betrayed the secret then the rope beeing loosed he was expulsed out of the Abbey for his follie but afterward being sought for by his Abbat which was troubled with terrours in the night he was found in a drie pitte in the desart and brought back againe Last of al Sara an Abbesse in Scithia by the space of 60. yeares would neuer looke out at a window to beholde the water that ranne by or the pleasant meddow I praie God she were not worsse occupied within then she might haue beene in beholding Gods creatures a broad And these except Saint Paules chastening of his bodie which he nameth first are all the store of worthie examples gathered as you saie out of all antiquitie and yet Paull being the first Thomas Becket is the next and although there be some of greater antiquitie yet out of all antiquitie you would not haue said if you had read the Chapter your selfe except you care not what you saie You adde further that Saint Hierome testifieth of himselfe by an occasion giuen to a secret friend of his that his skinne was well neere as blacke with punnishment as the skinne of an Ethiopian Epist. 22. ad Eustochium And that Iohannes Cassianus that liued about the same time hath infinite examples of the practize of the fathers in this point Saint Hierome in deede writing to
the noble virgine Eustochium testified how litle he preuayled with such immoderate austerity to subdew the lust of his slesh vntil by importunitie of prayers he obteined rest of his vnquiet minde from Christ. Although his wordes be not as you haue set them downe that his skinne was as blacke as an Ethiopian but his deformed skinne was growen ouer with the hearines or scurffe of an Ethiopians flesh squalida cutis situm aethiopicae carnis obduxerat In the margent you note that we will saie Saint Hierome was noe Protestant I answere although we cannot allow Saint Hierome or any man that by hurting his bodelie health with immoderate rigour of austere life bringeth his natural life in daunger yet doe we imbrace S. Hierome as a member of the true Church of Christ whoe trusted not in any merite of such chaistisment but onelie in the mercie of God by Iesus Christ. The like we say of any examples of godlie men that are brought by Cassianus whoe is not altogether so olde as you make him Your rayling and seoffing at Peter Martyr I omitte as meete for such a Censurer but where you charge him to iest at Saint Basill and Saint Gregorie Nazianzen for hard handling of their owne bodies in cap. 16. lib. 3. Reg. your note boke deceiued you for in his comment vpon the Chapter he hath no such matter His iudgement els where may be to this effect That notwithstanding the examples of the auncient godlie fathers yet it is neither lawfull nor expedient for a man with such rigour to handle his bodie as it be not able to serue him in his calling For as chastisement of the bodie to bring it in subiection is sometime necessarie So weakening of the bodie to make it vnable to serue the spirit in such outward actions as require the vse of the bodie is neither wisedome nor godlines what examples soeuer be pretended For as it is not lawfull for a man vnder any pretense of mortifying his flesh to kill him selfe so it is not lawfull for any man to torment his bodie aboue the strength thereof wherby sicknes must needes follow and death may ensue For against all examples of godlie men that can be alledged to the contrary we will oppose the wisdome of the holy ghost in his elect vessel S. Paul whoe calleth Timothie from such austeritie wherebie his health was impaired vnto a moderate vse of gods creatures Drink no more water saith he butvse a litle wine because of thy stomach and often infirmities 1. Tim. 5. 23. According to the proportion of which rule if many of the examples before remembred were exacted they may perhapes declare a zeale in the persons but such as is not guided by knowledge of Gods will reuealed in the scriptures Where you saie If the Ministers of England would vse this cooling phisick there should be fewer Eatons and Hynches openlie punished or flie the countrie for incest rape you would insinuate that for lacke of chastisement of mens bodies so great enormites breake out and in part it may be true so you touch none but such as are guilty who when they be discouered by your owne confession are not winked at in our Church but openlie punished what discipline soeuer you vse when anie of your Iesuites are ouertaken with such offences The number God be thanked of such offenders among vs is not great how small chastisement soeuer you thinke the Ministers doe vse and therefore no cause why you should amplifie them in the plurall number as though for one Eaton or one Hynch there had beene ten of each sorte at the least Too manie we confesse of one but fewer then one there could not be except there had beene none Howbeit we praise God that so fewe haue geuen such offence in so long peace of the Church and praie God they be the last Yet are they a small matter for you to insult against vs if you looke homewarde where for two you may easilie finde two hundred and for two poore Ministers manie of your great prelates yea your Popes by confession of your owne historians haue not beene behind any examples of incontinencie and filthines But if we will not practise this remedie our selues for contristing or making sad the holie ghost within vs which you saie is our phrase yet you will vs not to impute it as schisme and heresie to them which vse it moderatlie as we maie imagine the Iesuites will being not fooles nor hauing iron bodies but sensible as ours are Hereto I answer that the remedie of incontinencie we learne out of the scriptures and haue no neede of your instruction for such matters if God geue vs grace to practise that which we learne out of his word The phrase whereat you scoffe is not ours but vsed by the holie Ghost him-selfe though in a farre other sense then you ascribe it to vs in which meaning you will sooner be hanged for a traitour then you are able to prooue that anie approoued Minister of ours hath euer vsed the same in speach or writing Among the familie of loue perhappes which are catercosins with you Papistes you may finde such blasphemous abusers of holie phrases of scripture The imputing to schisme or heresie ariseth of the Iesuites profession and practise which in such doinges pretend a greater merit and perfection then God requireth of Christians Otherwise we doubt not but many of the Iesuites can fauour them-selues wel enough in their voluntarie whipping especiallie those of our nation or of anie other except the Spaniardes among whome the reliques of the olde whipping heretikes haue continued so ranke in some that they haue beene seene in England to endure greeuous whipping for other mens sinnes that liked not to suffer such penannce in their owne persons The following of one mans rule you sate can make no diuision because it is but a particular direction of life and manners grounded one the seriptures and practise of the fathers and alowed by the superiours of the Church But here you assume more then wil be graunted for neither is the rule of Laiolas grounded one the scriptures neither haue the gouernours of the Church authoritie to allowe anie such rule and last of all it is so newe that it hath no practise of the auncient fathers to shadow it The first is prooued before the second dependeth vpon the first and the last of the newnes is manifest of it selfe But all this while you haue supposed that Master Charkes reportes of the Iesuites life and vocation were true which is false for there was neuer anie that tooke a vowe to whippe them-selues and much lesse to doe it after the example of a sect called by the name of whippers condemned long agoe Here beside a double cauill is nothing worthie the answering for Master Charke meaneth not that their vowe is to followe the condemned whippers but that this whipping is after the example of that condemned sect in that they wippe and torment
or vnoccupied in the worke of our redemption yea that the godhead did not worke the principall and moste necessarie part thereof it is too too abominable and intollerable heresie Out of the like stinking puddle it proceedeth that you saie that the holie Trinitie being of infinit power to worke their will in all creatures yet would not repaire the world nor remit our sinnes anie otherwise but by the seruice of the sonne of man That the seruice of the sonne of man was necessarie to be vsed it is moste true but that authoritie of the sonne of God was not necessarie for so great a worke as wel as the seruise of the sonne of man it is such an impudent blasphemie as I thinke the Pope him-selfe would condemne it if his opinion without partialitie thereof might be knowne As for the worke of Christes humanitie ioyned in one person to his deitie and the commission graunted to his ministers to remit sinnes are nothing hindred by acknowledging that God onelie doth properlie and absolutelie forgiue sinnes euen when his ministers according to his commaundement doe forgiue sinnes as S. Ambrose saith and all antiquitie doth accord Here it is declared by the scripture that the same power of remitting sinnes which God the Father by commission gaue vnto his Sonne as he was man was also by Christ bestowed on the Apostles after his resurrection THE SECOND CHAP. ALLEN IN what high reputation man hath euer bene with god his maker it is not my purpose now to treat of neither will I make anie tediouse talke though it be somewhat more neere the matter how estimation is encreased by the honourable and most merueilous matching of Gods onelie sonne with our nature and kinde whereof whosoeuer hath anie conside ration he shall nothing wonder I warrant him at the soueraingtie of such as be placed in the seat of iudgement and gouernement for the rule of that comonwealth whereof Christ is the head These thinges though they be well worthie our labour and deepe remembrance and not verie far from our matter yet so will I charge my selfe with continuance in my cause that I will onelie seeke out the dignitie of priesthood touching the right that the order laimeth in remission and retaining of mans sinnes In all which cause I take this a grounde that our Masters messenger stood vpon when his disciples grudged that Christ had his followers and practized Baptisme no lesse then him selfe did which is That no man can rightlie receiue anie thing that is not giuen him from aboue Therefore if it may be sufficientlie declared that the order holdeth by good warrant this their preheminence of pardoning or punishing of the peoples offences and that by commission from him who without al controuersie is the head of the Church then the contrarie must learne to leaue their contentious reasoning and vniust contempt of that order which is honoured by power and prerogatiue proceeding from Christ Iesus FVLKE That God of his meere goodnes and mercie hath vouchsafed man of so great honour that of him selfe deserueth eternall shame it is more reason to wonder at Gods mercie then to insinuate anie peece of mans dignitie or worthines That it hath pleased god to aduaunce some men to the gouernment of his Church vpon earth we haue cause to magnifie his maiestie that disdaineth not our base condition but putteth his honour and authoritie vpon them driueth vs not from them by the excellencie of their nature aboue ours but familiarly inuiteth vs to obedience of his wil that we may attaine to his promis of eternal happines The title of this chapter That our sauiour Christ gaue vnto his Apostles the same power of remitting sinnes which God the father by commission gaue vnto his sonne as he was man we do all agree but that Christ did exercise a more soueraigne authoritie in forgiuing sinnes then he did bestow vpon his Apostles or their nature was capable to receiue it is prooued sufficientlie in the Chapter going before Neuerthelesse I will examin all partes of this chapter and if in anie thing I dissent from you I will shew that you dissent from the trueth And first where you professe onelie to seeke out the dignitie of Priesthood touching the right that the order claimeth in remission and retention of mans sinnes you should haue done better to haue sought and set out the duetie of such persons also to whome such dignity is committed lest as it falleth out in your bastarde Popish Priesthood the dignitie be onelie sought for the labour and duetie almost or altogether neglected The ground you take out of Saint Iohn is infallible and therefore your Popish priesthood doth blasphemouslie vsurpe a pretended power to offer vp our sauiour Christ vnto his father as a sacrifice propitiatorie for the sinnns of the quick and the dead for graunt of which power from aboue you can shew no warrant out of the written word of God the onelie true record of Gods graunt and sufficient euidence for so great an authoritie ALLEN And of two or three places in holie scripture pertaining to this purpose that shall be first proposed which with moste force driueth downe falsehood and most properlie pertaineth to the pith and principall state of the cause which we haue in hand Thus then we finde of Christes wordes will and behauiour concerning the commission graunted out to his holy Apostles for the remission and punishment of our sinnes in the 20. Chapter of the Gospell of Saint Iohn Where the Euangelist thus reporteth that Christ after his glorious resurrection came into a secret chamber where his disciples were together the dore being shut for feare of the Iewes and there after he had giuen them as his custome was his peace and his blessing and she wed him self to their infinite comfort that he was perfectlie risen againe in the same bodie that so latelie was buried he then straight afterwarde to make worthie entrance to so high a purpose gaue them this peace againe in manner of a solemne benediction and therewith said Sicut misit me Pater ego mitto vos Euen as the father hath sent me so I do send you And when he had so spoken he breathed on them and said Accipite spiritum sanctum quorum remiseritis peccata remittuntur eis quorum retinueritis retenta sunt Receaue you the holie ghoste whose sinnes soeuer you shall forgiue they are forgiuen them and whose sinnes you shall retaine they be retained This is the place lo in which the iudgement and rule of our soules with all authoritie in correcting our sinnes in moste expresse and effectuall termes and in moste ample manner is giuen to the Aposiles and their successours Christ him seife doth communicate vnto them the iurisdiction that he receiued of his Father he giueth them in a solemne ceremonie that same spirit of God by which in earth him-selfe did remitte sianes hemaketh them an assured promis that whatsoeuer they pardoned or corrected in mans
holie ghost was God by whose authoritie and proper power they did alwaies since Christs word was spoken remitte the same The which beeing true as it cannot be false that is so agreeable both to scriptures and to all our fathers faith the heresy of our time must needes directly impugne the vertue and power of Gods owne spirit For as the proofe of mans ministerie in this foresaid function induceth the true and euerlasting Godhead of the holy ghost by whome they practize that power so the denial thereof and robberie of priesthoode of this their moste iust claime doth directlie spoile God of his honour and of the euerlasting right that he hath in remission of sinnes So whiles these goodmen seeke to abase man vniustlie they blaspheme God highlie and together with mans ministerie they bring vnto vtter contempt Gods owne authoritie FVLKE Your deifying of popish priests doth altogether weaken the force of that argument which our fathers vsed against the auncient heretikes to prooue the diuinitie of the holie Ghost For it were an easie matter for Eunomius Macedonius or anie other heretike that was against his godhead to replie that by ministerie of God the holie Ghost might as properlie forgiue sinnes as Priestes do by the ministerie of Christ and of the holie ghost yea so farre forth as thereby they are made halfe Gods yea deified and made Gods in deede But you vtter repugnancie when you saie that by Gods authoritie and proper power Priestes do forgiue sinnes Where you make it not proper to God which is common to others with him Therefore you should speake more properlie to saie that God the holy ghost by his owne authoritie and power proper to the deitie doth forgiue sinnes in their ministery men thereto authorized do no more in proper speach and sense but testifie and declare what God doth for which declaration and testification seeing they are the embassadours and messengers of God vnto the world to declare his pleasure of reconciliation or condemnation they are said to forgiue sinnes or to retaine them which they do not properlie but pronounce the sentence of God concerning the remission or retention of mens sinnes And that this was the meaning of the Auncient fathers concerning the authoritie and power of Gods ministers it is moste manifest by this argument whereby they choke the enuier of the holie ghostes diuinitie from which you cutte of all the sinnewes and force it hath to prooue it when you communicate to men that which is proper to God and aduance men aboue the nature of meere men when you deifie their persons by meanes of the giftes of the holie Ghost giuen to them and make them of abilitie to exercise the proper workes of God As for the deniall and robberie that you ascribe I can not tell to what heretikes of this time we detest as much as ye not seeking to abase man beneath the nature and condition of man norseeking to extoll him by robbing God of his glorie and proper effects to magnifie menne to deifie the persoas of men as you do in plaine termes Whereby it is manifest we are as far from blaspheming god or making mans ministerie contemptible which he exerciseth in the name of God as you are from sobrietie thus to iudge if your meaning be of vs or thus to reason if you would defend the argument of the auncient fathers against the auncient heretikes ALLEN But for the readersease and more light of our cause I ioyne thus in argument with them againe vpon the second part of Christes owne wordes and action had in the authorizing of his Apostles Whatsoeuer the holie Ghost maie doe in this case by the proper power of his Godhead that may the Apostles and Priestcs do by seruice and ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost But the holie Ghost properlie and rightlie doth remit sinnes Therefore the Apostles doe rightlie remit sinnes by their ministerie in the said holie Ghost All partes of this conclusion stand vpright and feare no falsehood they be guarded on euerie side by Christes action by wordes of scripture by the Doctors plain warrant and by all reason With all which whosoeuer is not contented but will needes extinguere spiritum extinguish Gods spirit and violentlie take from the Church the greatest comfort of all mans life that in this infirmitie of our flesh standeth in moste hope by his gift in remission of sinnes for which especiall cause the said spirit was mercifullie breathed vpon the Apostles peculiarly before the mare common sending of the same from heauen aboue If all this reason and iust demonstration of trueth will not serue them I will charge them with this graue conclusion of S. Augustine vttered partlie against the Nouatians especallie against the desperate that would not seeke for Gods mercie by the Churches ministerie in the sacrament of penance To be briefe I will speake it in English Whosoeuer he be that beleeueth no mans sinnes to be remitted in Gods Church and therefore despiseth the bountifulnes of God inso mightie a worke if he in that obstinate minde continue til his liues end he is guiltie of sinne against the holie Ghost in which holy ghost Christ remitteth sinnes FVLKE I doe greatlie commend you that you haue such regard of the readers ease and it seemeth you haue good confidence of your cause that you flie not the light of Logicall iudgement by which the trueth shall more plainelie appeere to all sortes of men then by anie discourses at large vnder which many great errors may be often couered vnder sophistical cloudes ambiguity of words which in a briefe syllogisme is soone and easilie espied To answere your argument therefore First I distinguish of your Maior for if you meane by seruice and ministerie the expressing and declaring of the will and pleasure of the holy ghost wherunto they are authorized I acknowledge your Maior proposition to be true whatsoeuer the holie Ghost maie doe in this case by the proper power of his godhead that maie the Apostles and Priestes doe by seruice ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost But if you meane by seruice and ministerie that the proper power of God is communicated to men I denie your Maior as false and absurde For the Apostles and Priests maie not by seruice and ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost forgiue sinnes properlie which the holie ghost by proper power of his godhead may doe for this is a proper power not com municable vnto any creature but a declaration of the will of him that hath such power is the ministeriall authoritie by which men forgiue sinnes Secondlie I answere that your conclusion is deceitfull For your Minor Extreame or Assumption is not perfectlie ioyned with your Maior or Proposition in the conclusion For your Minor is that the holie ghost properly rightlie doth remit sinnes So your conclusion should be therefore the Apostles properlie and rightlie doe remit sinnes by their ministerie
For at this daie the Bishops that be throughout all Christendome how rose they to that roome The Church calleth them fathers and yet shee did beget them and she placed them in that roome of their fathers Non ergo reputes desertam quia non vides Petrum quòd non vides Paulum quòd non vides illos per quos nataes de prole tua tibi creuit paternitas pra patribus tuis natisunt tibi filij constitues eos principes super omnem terram Do not therefore think thy selfe desolate because thou hast not Paull because thou hast them not now present by whome thou wast borne of thy owne issue fatherhood is growne to thee and for thy fathers thou hast brought forth sonnes them shalt thou make the rulers ouer al the earth Thus much out of Saint Augustine By whome you maie perceaue the great prouidence of God that euerlastinglie vpholdeth the ordinance of his sonne Christ Iesus as well now by the children borne from time to time in the Churches lap as before in the spring of our faith by the Apostles sent and appointed in person by Christ him-selfe FVLKE I suppose the title of your booke will admonish you not to restraine this office onelie to Bishops which so often you haue made common to all priestes For Gregory also in the same homyly nameth often times all pastours of the Church to whome the power of binding and loosing doth appertaine which are many other beside Bishops Moreouer inueighing against the ignorance and vnworthines of them that occupied such places which take vpon them to loose where God doth binde and binde where God doth loose he concludeth that then the absolution of the gouernours of the Chuch is true when it followeth the will of the eternall Iudge By which saying and more to the like effect in that place he declareth his iudgement of the kinde of power or authoritie which the Church hath that it is not absolute but subiect vuto the will of God and is an expressing of Gods forgiuenes or retaining not a proper forgiuing or retaining The saying of Saint Augustine prooueth in deede a continuance of the ministery of the Apostles in the office of Bishops but hereof it followeth not that onelie Bishops as they are distinct from priestes haue this power for not onelie Bishops be the children of the Church but all faithfull men to whome the inheritance of the world is like wise appointed ALLEN And here you must know that not onelie Bishops who succeede the Apostles in all kinde of power and regiment but also all other inferiour Priestes to be compted with them as successors in ministring diuerse sacraments as baptisme penance the reuerend Sacrament of the Aultar and such like but looke what power either Apostle or Bishop hath in remission of sinnes in consecrating Christes bodie in baptizing the same hath the wholl order of holie Priesthood by the right of their order and maie practize the same vpon such as be subiect vnto them in all causes not exempted for reasonable causes by such as haue further iurisdiction ouer the people Wherof I will not now talke particularlie the learned of that order know the limits of their charge and commission better then I can instruct them and the simpler sort must seeke for knowledge of their duetie by the holie Canons of Councels and decrees of Bishops made for that purpose I can not now stand thereon meaning at this present onelie to defend the holie order and challenge for it such right as the scripture and Chistes owne word giueth which in this contempt of vertue and religion is moste necessarie for all men to consider FVLKE There is no power or authoritie graunted by our sauiour Christ to preach the word of God or to minister anie sacrament but the same is common to euerie one of the Pastoures of the Church and not onelie lawfull but also necessarie for them to exercise in their seuerall charges Wherefore that ministering of some sacraments is permitted to them and of other denied them it is beside the word of god Againe the word of god that giueth them general power whose sinnes soeuer whatsoeuer you shal bind or loose is directlie against al exempted cases which sauor of nothing but of Antichristian tyrannie As for the cannons of Counceles and decrees of Bishoppes whether you send the simple to learne the limites of their charge can not restraine that Christ hath enlarged and therefore if your meaning were as your wordes professe to defend the holie order and challenge for it such right as the scripture and Christes owne worde geueth you would enueigh against the pride and ambition of the Pope other prelates that exempt anie cases from the Priests power and authoritie which the holie scripture and the expresse wordsof our sauiour Christ doth in such ample manner graunt vnto them ALLEN Therefore vpon our large discourses for this last point I now deduct the particulars to this summe which maie stand for a certaine marke as well for the good to discerne the trueth as for the aduersaries to shoote at whiles they liue Alpower and euery iurisdiction or right of Christs Church remaineth as amplie and in as full force and strength at this daie and shall till the worlds end so continue as they were by Christ graunted first in the persons of the Apostles or other instituted But the power of remission of sinnes was giuen properlie and in expresse termes to the Apostles Ergo the same remaineth still in Gods Church Whereupon it is so cleare that the Priestes at this day haue as ful power to forgiue sins as the Apostles had And this argument of the continuance of all offices and righte of the Church is the moste plainest and readiest waie not onelie to helpe our cause now taken in hand but vtterlie to improoue all false doctrines and detestable practises of heretikes For they must here be examined diligentlie what common wealth that is what Church that is in which Christ doth prescrue the gouernment giuen to the Apostles where it is that the power not onely os making but also of practizing al sacraments hath continued still what companie of Christian people that is wherein the Apostles Doctors preachers ministers through the perpetuall assistance of Gods spirit be continued for the building vp of Christes bodie which is the number of faithful people What Church that is which bringeth forth from time to time sonnes to occupy the romes of their fathers before them It is not good reader the pelting packe of Protestants It is not I saie and they knowe it is not their petie congregations that hath till this daie continued the succession of Blshoppes by whome the world as Saint Augustine saith is ruled as by the Apostles and first Fathers of Religion Surely our mother the Church hath hene long baren if for her Fathers the Apostles who died so long since she neuer brought forth children til now to occupie their roomes and
desirue so much S. Peter him-selfe was reprehensible in his gouernement therefore let vs not maruell that other which be not of so full spirit as he was either maie commit thinges worthie of reprehension amongst the good or subiect to the malitious slaunder of the euill These things are not such high pointes of learning that your aduersaries need not to be ignorant in thē Your distinction as common as it is in the schooles yea hath a good entēdement yet it is vttered in such termes as be coincident For gratia gratum faciens is also gratîs data Although euerie grace or gift of God doth not make a man acceptable or beloued of God yet is euerie grace or gift of God freely giuen and not in respect of merites or desertes and least of all that grace by which we are made acceptable and beloued of God And touching your other point we do not holde that the sacraments or anie other part of the administration of the Gospell dependeth vpon the vertue or vices of men that exercise the same And yet the first reason you vse to strengthen that point is verie feeble For you saie S. Paul did not disalowe the authority nor power of preaching in such as were euill men and taught for emulation and not of sincere zeale of the Gospell Phil. 1. Whereas it doth no waie appeare that he did allowe the authoritie of those men who perhappes were not lawfullie called and so it is most like but reioysed that Christ was preached by what meanes soeuer because God both can and doth conuert the vnlawfulintentes and actes of wicked men to serue to his glorie Some other arguments you vse that are not verie strong but forasmuch as I agree with you in the summe of the matter I will spend no time about them ALLEN And suerlie for our matter beeing of such importance Priests had need moste carefullie to studie how to practize so high a function which is proper to Gods owne iudgement and heauenlie courte For though by Christ they haue vndoubtedly receiued commission aud power in the vertue of the holy ghost when they toke holie orders to forgiue and remit sinnes yet cursed be they by Gods owne mouth if they doe it either negligently because it is the worke of our Lord or with affection of pride and Pharisaical dominion as though they were Lords of the sacraments and Christian Religion and not ministers or seruitours of Christ in his Church Whereof it seemed that S. Ierome in his daies had some cause to complaine nothing reproouing their authoritie but correcting the abuse of their authoritie Penance in those daies was so hardlie obtained that it seemed to S. Icreme that their austeritie grew to some spice of Pharisaicall regiment that would lay importable burdens on other mens neckes and not touch any at all them selues Whereupon he taketh occasion to aduertise them that eucrie power of remission and the office of absolution was properlie Gods and theirs but by ministerie And therefore that their mercie and iudgement ought to be tried and measured by his sentence and not his by theirs These thinges were to be admonished and reprehended then but now the disease lieth on the other side and they offende rather in ouer much lenitie For as both be contemned of the wicked so there is almoste amongst the good none left but loosing now a daies when men had rather be bound in sinne then bound in penance for sinne Therefore the office os binding and loosing requireth truelie good knowledge much discretion zeale and stowtnes in Gods quarell For as it is moste high so surelie it is moste hard and burdenous It pitieth my heart to see it so litle esteemed but much more that it should be lesse esteemed through their ignorance or euill life to whom the keies of remission be committed The keie of remission and retaining sinnes they had of God in their orders but discretion knowledge vertue with other qualities meete for the exercise of that office they must by praier and industrie obtaine lest whilest they profit other men to saluation they become reprobate them selues as Saint Paul said of him selfe in case of preaching But in deede it is not so cömendable for vs as the case standeth now nor so needefull to prie into the Priests bosomes or to vewe their lackes in ministring of this sacrament of penance which if anie be doe lightlie redound to their owne harmes not so mech to mine or to anie other which vse their office to our saluation For though for counsell and comforte and such other respectes a descrete and learned man were rather to be wished for then a worsse yet being assured that the partie is called by Gods Church to the function and hath iurisdiction ordinarie or graunted extraordinarilie by the appointintment of lawfull superiours and if by schisme and excommunication or otherwise he be not suspended from the practize of the said functions I need nothing to doubt for his other lackes but much more for mine owne sufficience or lacke of contrition or some other like want in my selfe why the fruit of the Priests absolution cannot be deriued vnto me as else if it were not my owne default it should by force of the sacrament vndoubtedlie be FVLKE Except you haue no regarde of the propertie of speach I maruell you can saie this function is so proper to gods owne iudgement and heauenly court and yet allowe the iudgement of Saint Ierome that all power of remission and absolution is properlie Gods and mans but by ministerie In which sentence if you would continue we should haue small controuersie with you touching the argument of this first booke of your treatise The wordes of Ierome vpon the 16. of Saint Mathewe are these Et dabo tibi claues regni caelorum Istum locum Episcopi presbyteri non intelligentes aliquid sibi de Pharisaeorum assumuns supercilio vt vel damnens innocentes vel soluere se noxios arbitrentur cùm apud Deum non sententia sacerdotum sed reorum vita quaeratur Legimusin Leuitico de leprosis vbi iubentur vt ostendant se sacerdotibus si lepram habuerint tunc a sacerdote immundifierent non quòd sacerdotes leprosos faciunt immundos sed quòd habeant notitiam leprosi non leprosi possint discernere qui mundus quiuè immundus sit Quomodo ergo ibi le prosum sacerdos mundum vel immundum facit sic hîc alligat vel soluit Episcopus pres biter non eos qui insontes sunt vel noxij sed pro officio suo cùm peccatorum audierit varietates rietates scit qui ligandus sit quiue soluendus And to the I will giue the keies of the kingedome of heauen This place Bishopes and priests not vnderstanding doe take vpon them somewhat of the pride of the Pharises that either they condemne innocentes or thinke that they due loose guilty persons whereas before God not the
Christ gaue them the holie Ghost But Caluinsaith notso but that authoritie to remit sinnes is graunted to be exercised by preaching both priuatelie and publikelie that is to assure men that God doth remit their sinnes and that the giftes of the holie Ghost were graunted to the Apostles that they might be inabled to exercise that high office and function which giftes no man hath power to giue but onelie God neither doth anie man at this daie receiue them in such plentifull measure but that he maie erre of whomesoeuer he be ordeined or sent to preach Neither doth Caluin require that power of not erring but onelie in them that arrogate vnto them-selues an absolute power to remit sinnes as properlie as the holy Ghost doth forgiue them who we knowe cannot erre in binding him that is to be loosed or loosinge him that is to be bounde as popishe pristes doe which yet presumptucusly and blasphe mouslie arrogate vnto them-selues such power and authoritie That it standeth well with Gods houour that mortall men should ren it sinnes and that Nouatus the heretike was of olde condemned for denying the same and that he was the father of this heresy which denyeth the Priests authoritie THE SEVENTH CHAP. ALLEN Now by all our former discourse the right of remission of sinnes sufficiently prooued to pertain to priesthood some will perhaps count it vaine labour to make more declaration of that which is so plaine or further to establish that by reason which standeth so fast on scriptures But if anie so thinke they see net the wyde waies of heresie nor the manifolde shifies that she attempteth euen there where shee maie seeme to be fullie beaten The simple and the sinfullstand moste in her danger that can not in their lack of intelligence compare reason to reason nor gather one trueth of an other and therefore to their mouthes we must chew all meates verie small els there could be no great need of their further information how this claime of remission of sinnes or the vsisall practize thereof could stand with Gods glorie For being answerable to his ordinance it can not but be agreeable with his honour But because in desperate cases our aduersaries haue taught their fellows there to wrangle vncurteouslie where they can not mantaine reason pithelie I will not onelie serue my cause but sometimes pursue their follie though I doubt not but the wisdome of God shal more and more appeare touch ing his meaning in our matter not alonelie by our defence but a great deale the rather by their discontentation Now therefore intending to declare that this preheminence of priesthood doth nothing abase or derogate to Gods aignitie I think it not amisse to match our new doctours of whome I heare often this complaint with other their forefathers that at once both trueth maie fullie be serued and a yoke of aduersaries ioyntlie drawing against the Church and our saluation may be almost with one breath refuted Our yong masters may be glad to grow so high in gods Church as to be reprooued with them who were condemned thirteene hundreth yeares since and though they be so modest that lightlie they list not crack of their auncestours yet we will not defraud them of that glorie nor healpe our cause by dissimulation of their great antiquitie It is their pusillanimitie I know that they will not often in distresse of their doctrine call for aid of their forefathers who were doubtlesse verie auncient and manie of them within the first six hundred yeares In other causes Vigilantius might healpe in some Iouinian would attend vpon them Manes might do them often high pleasure Iulianus the apostata a prince for their purpose Simon Magus one of the Apostles age would stand by them surelie if our aduersaries had 〈◊〉 they would well neere winne of vs by antiquitie And truelie I can not dissemble with them in this cause that now is in hand they haue one patron against vs of yeares very auncient and of reason much much like vnto themselues Nouatus is his name of whome the followers were called of the Church Nouatians but them-selues liked to be called Cathari that is to saie cleane and vndefiled persons Their opinion was that such as did fall into anie mortall sinne after Baptisme could not by anie man or meanes be assoiled thereof and for that they dissalowed the Churches wholl practize of mercie and remission of sinnes in the sacrament of penance nothing dissagreeing from Caluin that condemneth the saying of Saint Ierome as sacrilegious where he writeth that penance is as a second beord of refuge whereby after shipwrack a man may be saued Neither did Nouatus denie but himselfe might haue mercie and giue pardon after mansfall but the Church could not therein meadle as he thought without singular iniurie to Christ and his onelie prerogatiue And that he ioyneth in this matter fullie with our men that they maie take more comfort on him you shall perceiue by Socrates one of the writers of the Tripartit historie who saith thus Nouatus scribebat Ecclesus ne eos qui Daemonibus immolauerant ad sacramenta susciperent sed inuitarent quidem ad poenitentiam remissionem verò Dei relinquerent potestati cuius solius est peccata remittere Nouatus wrote his letters to diuerse Churches that they should not admitte anie man to the Sacramentes that had sacrificed to Diuelles but that they should onelie mooue them to doe Pennance and committe to God the remission of their sinne who onelie can forgiue mans offences And therefore though in some other point Nouatus did ouerpricke his children yet herein they fullie meet in one Epiphanius writeth that he denied saluation to those that did fal to greeuous crimes after their Christendome and therewith did holde that there was but one penance which was done in baptisme after that the Church to haue none How hansomelie he defended this error and vnmercifull heresie ye shall see anone by Saint Ambrose who learnedlie followed and chased him or his followers in an wholl worke written for that purpose In the meane time it were good for the more credit of the man and his cause to note with the auncient Doctors of his daies his conditions his comming vp his proceeding and practizes S. Cyprian who was most molested with him knew him best geueth him this praise Nouatus was a man that delighted much in nouelties and newes of insatiable auarice a furious rauin with pride and intollerable arrogancie almoste puffed past him selfe knowen and taken of all Bishoppes for a naughtie packe condemned by the common iudgement of all good Priestes for a faithlesse heretike curious and inquisitiue them to betraie for to deceiue alwaies readie to flatter in loue neuer faithfull nor trustie a match euer fired to kindle sedition a whirle winde and storme to procure the shipwrake of faith and to be short an aduersarie to tranquilitie and an enimie of peace These were his conditions then FVLKE In the latter
some to be obstinate or dissemblers he may know who is to be bound and who to be loosed which he cānot do by hearing the diuersity of their sins For if their sins be as red as scarlet if they be truelie penitent they are to be loosed and if they seeme neuer so small if they be not repentant nor humblie contrite in heart for them they are to be bound While you seeke to make a difference betweene the authoritie of the minister in the Ghospell of pardoning sinnes more properlie then the priest clensed the Leper you declare that you are not content with the sentence of Saint Ierome nor of so many of the auncient fathers as made the case all alike And where you saie it was not said vnto them as vnto ours whomsoeuer you punish with Leprosie or make vncleane he shal haue a Leprosie you speake beside the booke For this authoritie was giuen to them that they should make cleane or vncleane and whomesoeuer they made cleane he was admitted into the congregation and whomesoeuer they made vncleane he was so accounted of all men Yet properlie they made neither cleane nor vncleane but declared them so to be according to the institution which they had of Gods law in exercise whereof although they erred and so the partie might be receiued or refused according to their error yet was he neither cleane nor vncleane in deede by their sentence but by the work of God and so be sinners The blasphemie that you ascribe to Saint Hilarie I haue confuted before Your distinction of prius natura and quoad nos is foolish sophistrie in this case For except God first worke in our hearts by his holie spirit faith of forgiuenes we can haue but small comfort in the priests absolution That God doth alwaies wörke at the instant in which Baptisme is ministred it is false if Saint Augustines doctrine be true who reacheth that Baptisme may be receiued out of the Church but cannot haue effect but in the Church that is if the partie came from heresie and submit him selfe to the Catholike Church ALLEN And so it is in penance where God the principall and the priest the secondarie or seruisable cause ioyntlie forgiue together For so the words of institution of this sacrament doe moste plainlie conuince whose sinnes you shall forgiue they beforgiuen he speaketh in the present tence as though he would saie as you forgiue them or reteine them ipso facto I forgiue them or reteine them And therefore sauing the honour of the Master of the sentences he had not good consideration when he did holde as some other did after him that first mans sinnes be remitted by God in his contrition and purpose to come to the sacrament and afterwarde the same remission to be declared by the priests and as it were confirmed by his approbation in confession being therein partlie deceiued by the saying of Saint Hierome before alledged whome he tooke perchaunce to haue compared in all respects the office of the olde Priest for the viewe of the vncleane and ours of the new law in the iudgement vsed vpon mans sinnes and partlie as I take it by a sentence of Saint Augustine which compared together the receiuing of Lazarus by Christ and the Disciples loosing his bandes to Christes pardoning of sinnes first and then the priests loosing the same afterward in the face of the Church This to be shorte is a peece of Saint Augustines sentence Quid ergo facit Ecclesia cui dictum est Quae solueritis in terra erunt soluta nisi quod ait Dominus soluite illum sinite abire What doth the Church then to whome it was said vhatsoeuer you loose it shall be loosed Marie she doth that which our Lorde saied loose him and let him goe Wherein Saint Augustine meaneth nothing els but that Christ is the principall agent and that he properlie doth giue life to the soull the Priest for all that beeing his seruant and minister therein and therefore by nature is a latter agent in the same worke which els as I haue prooued ioynilie perteineth to them both for that the effect of a Sacrament commeth not to any man till it be receiued except it be in certaine cases of necessitie where the parties can not obteine the externall rse of the appointed element though they earnestlie desire the same But how the olde Priests office touching the Lepers of the law representeth our sacrament of the priests ministerie in the new Testament and how farre ours which is the truth excelleth that which was but a shadow of ours Saint Chrysostome doth excellentlic declare and therewith fullie may put out of doubt all men that our Priests properlie worke remission of sinnes as ministers in the same diuine action and not as declarers or approouers of that effect which before was wrought by God himselfe Thus he saith Corporis lepram purgare seu veriùs dicam haud purgare quidem sed purgatos probare Iudaeorum sacerdotibus solis liccbat at verò nostris sacerdotibus non corporis lepram verùm animae sordes non dico purgatas probare sed purgare prorsus concessum cst Quamobrem mco iudicio qui istos despiciunt contemnuntque multò sceleratiores ac maiori supplicio digni fuerint quà m fuerit Dathan vnà cum suis omnibus That is to saie To purge the Leprosie of the bodie or ells to saie as it was in deede not to purge but to discerne who were cleane was graunted onelie to the Priests of the olde law but it is fullie graunted to our Priests not to purge the bodilie lcprosie nor to snew who are cleaner purged but vtterlie to purge the verie filth of mans soull Therefore by my iudgement whosoeuer doe contemne or despise them they are much more worthie punishment then the disobedient Dathan with all his companie Thus saith this holie Father with many wordes moe which were worthie all consideration and rememberance in this case if the matter were not so abundant that it may not suffer ouer long abode in one place lest iniurie be done to other braunches of the cause no lesse necessarie to be knowne for full vpholding the truth thereof FVLKE Your argument taken of Christs speaking in the present tense is vaine and of no force to prooue that the forgiuenes or reteining of God and man concurre in one instant For in the latter sentence of reteining the verbe is of the preterperfect tense 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but in the same sense that the verbe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the former sentence which is of the present tence proouing Gods forgiuenes to goe before mans declaration thereof The Master of the sentences is litle beholding to you that doc so flatlie condemne him of error whereas he did write nothing in this point which was not commonly receiued in the Church of Rome in his time and long after For among the articles in quibus Magister non tenetur there is
no fault found with his sentence of the Priestes power in binding and loosing Gratian also declareth that learned and religious men in his time were in diuerse opinions about that point and other concerning this popish sacrament of penance whereby it appeareth that the sentence which you holde was not accounted Catholike nor vniuersallie receiued in their times If Peter Lumbard the Master of the sentences was deceiued by the sayings of Saint Ierome and S. Augustine they were first deceiued themselues for other sense out of their sayings then the master of the sentences gathereth no reasonable man can conclude And it is but one onelie saying of S. Augustine that he citeth not diuers and not onely out of Augustine and Hierome but out of other writers also as Ambrose and Cassiodorus and Gratian citeth maniemore all which you must answere if you wil take part against the two principall posts of poperie Gratiane and Lumbard with all them that take their part But you thinke one saying of Chrysostome inough to wipe awaie all their authorities and reasons and to prooue that the priestes of the new lawe doe purge the fitlh of the soull and not onely declare it to be purged as the Priestes of the olde lawe did of the leprosie of the body The meaning of Chrysostome is that the Ministers of the Gospell haue power not onelie to pronounce declare the penitent sinner to be deliuered from the vncleanes of his soule vnto other men that he may be accepted into the congregation if he haue bene excluded but to assure the penitents conscience in Gods name of the remission of their sinnes wherein he doth much more for the benefit of his soule then the priest of the olde law who onelie declared vnto other men how the partie was to be taken who knew in himselfe whether he were sicke or healed before he came to the priest Therefore where Chrysostome saith It is graunted vnto the priests of the new testament not onelie to trie approoue the soule to be deliuered of the filihines thereof but altogether to deliuer it he meaneth of deliuering by assuring the conscience of the penitent sinner of Gods mercie and forgiuenes whereby he is throughly or altogether deliuered therfrom whereas otherwise it were blasphemous conrrarie to Chrysostomes iudgement in many other places if the wholl act of purging or deliuering the soull from filthines were ascribed to man as the words seeme to sounde ALLEN Now vpon all this foresaid declaration it maie be well vnderstood that our aduersaries haue small reason in reprehending the ordinance of God who is prooued in all ages and diusities of lawes to haue giuen grace and remission of sinnes not onelie by externall elementes and actions of diuerse ceremonies sacraments and sacrifices but also euer to haue dispensed the said benefites by mans seruice and ministerie without all dishonour of his personage or diminishing his owne proper interest and right therein And so much more hath he vsed in the new law of the Gospell the ministerie of the priests and externall sacraments to the procuring of the saied benefites by how much more our law our sacraments our sacrifices and our priests be glorified and preferred in respect of the olde and haue the more abundant blessing of the spirit and Christs blood which by these conduites most largelie flowe to all mens fouls that despise not the blessed benefit thereof Yet if they will not be satisfied herewith because they surmise our new law to be so spirituall that man may looke for nothing at mans handes but all immediatelie of God and his spirit for by him they will be taught the meaning of the scripture by him they will be baptized by him they must haue remission and absolution and at length they are become Anabaptistes and refuse to obey Prelates of the Church and Princes of the world because by God they wil onelie be ruled and punished for their offences Against such proud cogitations as Saint Augustine tearmeth them God hath purposelie to teach humilitie and obedience one to another both in temporal causes and especiallie in spirituall matters perteining to mens sinnes and soules he hath I saie for the nonst not onelie instituted these waies of baser creatures vsed in the sacraments to atteine his grace by but also hath made man the master almost and executor of his meaning in the same whose seruice he vseth so much for our saluation that he sticked not to send his most chosen and dearest euen of those daies of grace and plentifulnes of the spirit to be instructed by man and made readie for his ministerie no otherwise but by man A strange thing surelie and to be well noted for this purpose not onelie of our aduersaries for their confusion but of the good studious readers for their instruction how that Paul beeing prostrate and miraculouslie called by Iesus Christes owne voice was yet sent by Christ himselfe to confirme the authority of his priests to Ananias of him to receiue as well instructions as the sacraments of the Church for his incorporation to the faithfull and remission of his sinnes paste And againe that Cornelius though his praiers were heard and his almes acceptable to god an Angel sent vnto him to declare the same which was a signe of high reputatiō was yet charged to goe to Peter of him not onelie to receiue the sacraments but a so by his instruction to learne what to beleeue what to hope what to loue saith S. Austine The Eunuch might by god himselfe in his owne coun try haue bene schooledor sanctified yet it pleased his maiesty so to vse the matter that by Philip both the sense of scripture the sacrament of Baptisme should be vnderstanded receiued at once So hath God in all ages confirmed the authoritie of his holie priests and ministers so hath he euer checked by his owne holie examples the presumptuous temptation of man who euer hath disdained mans office and ministerie for his owne saluation Therefore let no man maruell why Christ hath giuen authoritie to man to forgiue sinnes seeing he hath from the beginning not remitted ordinarilie otherwise then by mans seruice nor any way ells for the moste parte but by externall acts of ceremonies sacraments and sacrifices that we may learne thereby humility obedience to Gods ordinance by the warrant whereof they all as I haue prooued challenge all manner of interest in the gouernment of our soules FVLKE That God by externall sacraments and by the ministerie and seruice of man hath dispensed his spiritual benefits it is prooued but so that his grace was neuer bound either to the one or to the other but that he maie and hath bestowed the same most freelie according to the good pleasure of his will The fansie of the Anabaptistes that would seeme to looke for all thinges immediatlie from God despising the sacráments and ministerie of man we abhor and detest no lesse then
you We maruaile not why Christ hath giuen authoritie to man to forgiue sinnes whose ministerie he hath vsed in all times both by preaching his worde and by administring his sacraments to dispense his misteries vnto the rest of his Church vpon earth But that God doth not ordinarilie remit sinnes but by the ministerie of the priest nor any way ells for the moste parte but by externall acts we maruel how you are able to prooue it seeing God often times vseth many other occasions then the priests ministerie to bring men to repentance and without all waies of externall acts or sacrifices to assure men of the remission of their sinnes by faith But this admiration altogether passeth the reach of our capacitie to vnderstand how it may be conuinced That all priestes by warrant hereof may challenge all manner of interest in the gouernement of our soules It were much to challenge any interest in gouernment of our soules which is proper to our Sauiour Christ but to challenge all manner of interest in gouernment it sauoureth to stronglie of Antichristian presumption that any Christian should abide it The Apostles in exercise of their calling acknowledged them selues not onelie to be the seruants of God but also of the Church for we preach not our selues saith the Apostle but Iesus Christ and our selues to be your seruants for Iesus Christ. It is a ministerie and not a Lordeship that we must exercise not as temporall Princes who although they may be saide after a sorte to serue the common wealth yet they are so seruants as they are also Lordes But the ministers of the Church in their spirituall gouernement are seruants and not Lordes as Saint Peter testifieth therefore they cannot iustlie challenge all manner of interest in the gouernement of our soules For if they might we should haue many Lordes of our soules and denie God our onelie lorde our Lorde Iesus Christ our onelie sauiour ALLEN Much more might be said out of diuerse holie fathers much out of the decrees as well of Bishopes as Councells the authoritie wherof no Christian Catholike did euer reiect In Lateran in Florence and in Trent Councells Penance is decreed to be a sacrament and of necessitie to all such as fall into deadelie sinne after Baptisme The minister thereof by their holie determination is a Priest lawfullie ordered the remission of sins is in them all challenged to be his right not onelie by declaration that God hath or will pardon them nor by the preaching of the Gospell nor any other waies newlie deuised by the Deuill to delude Christes ordinance and misconstrue his plaine wordes But properlie is the priest prooued to be the minister vnder God of reconciliation and therefore may by his wordes absolue men in the saide sacrament of their sinnes as in Christs owne steade whose honourable iudgement seat byhis commission and the holie ghosts assistance he doth lawfullie possesse And so surelie doe Gods ministers holde this power and preheminence that no power or dignitie of man could euer be so well warranted and approoued by Gods owne worde and practize of all ages and nations christened as this is All the Princes in earth though they reigne full righteouslie can not yet shew the tenth part of the euidence that Gods priests can doe for their title of remission of sinnes and it booteth not mee in this my base state to admonish them though I hartelie wish they would consider it that the contempt of spirituall iurisdiction and the dignitie of priesthoode salleth at length to the difobedience of all temporal power and wicked contempt of ciuil gouernement also as in these disordered daies we may to our great griefe beholde when vnder pretence of religion and Gods worde whereof they haue no more respect surelie then the Deuil him selfe hath they haue disobeied not onelie Peters keies but also Cesars sworde Neither let any man thinke that where the bands of conscience the awe of gods maiestie the feare of hell and damnation the hope of heauen and saluation is remooued that there can be any ciuil obedience long Feare of man is much flatterie of man is more but bond of conscience passeth them both Thiu therefore haue Gods priests made account of their calling and long practised power of remitting and reteining the peoples offences FVLKE Whatsoeuer you can saie out of any auncient fathers will not prooue your intent of shrift and pardons your sacrament of penance is but a young beginner that can shew no auncienter councells for her authoritie then Lateran Florence and Trent the eldest of which is not much aboue 300 yeares olde and yet in the place you send vs vnto Confession is straightlie commaunded but penance is not decreed to be a sacrament Declaration of the pastour by preaching that God wil pardon al penitent sinners you count to be awaie newlie deuised by the diuil to delude Christes ordinance and misconstrue his plaine wordes as though your deuelishand blasphemous witte and tongue were hable to prooue out of Christes wordes your popish shrifts penance and satisfaction to be of Christes ordinance whereas it hath beene the doctrine and practize of all the Prophetes and Apostles to preach remission of sinnes to all that truelie repented and were turned vnto God and by authoritie of their commission receiued from God to assure all such of perfect forgiuenes of all their sinnes To compare the euidence wherby they holde this authoritie with the right of princes wherby they holde their croune so farre to preferre it is a point of antichristian and anabaptisticall presumption For ciuill Princes haue as cleere euidence in the scripture to auouch al their lawful authority as priestes haue to exercise that whereunto they be called Otherwise the particuler calling of euerie priest must leane vpon aiust title as well as the aduancement of princes into their throne and much more or els they haue not so great euidence as you talke of For a Prince being in the throne by what right soeuer he possesseth it is to be obeied But a minister of the Church except he be lawfullie called is not to be regarded You haue great cause to complaine of these daies that vnder pretense of Gods word and religion temporall and ciuill power is disobeied and contemned where there is no such manifest examples of such disobedience contempt as in your popish Northern rebellion and in an hundreth other vile attemptes to wring the scepter out of the hands of Gods anointed and your most lawful Prince vnder pretense in the Deuils name of religion and the Catholike Church But such religion and such a Church as aloweth in Italian Priest to depose anie Christian Prince from his throne God of his infinite mercie deliuer this Ileland and graunt all true subiectes of the same to yealde their faithfull obebience to their Godlie Prince not onely for feare but alfo for conscience Here it is prooued that b mitting sinnes the duety the right of the Priest
scelus suum faucibus contagia funesta 〈◊〉 Dominicorpus inuadunt c. Almoste yet belching out the deadly meates of their Idoles the iawes as yet breathing out their owne wickednes sauoring of the deadelie infection they set vpon our Lordes bodie And immediately before the wordes by you cited Plus modò in dominum manib atque ore delinquunt quà m cum Dominum negauerant They doe more offende now against the Lord with their hands and their mouth then at such time as they denied the Lorde These wordes declare of what kinde of men of what kinde of sinnes of what kinde of confession and of what kinde of satisfaction this Doctor doth speake whose vehemencie tendeth to the maintenance of discipline being in great daunger of decaie by the vntimelie and vngodlie lenitie of some flattering Church men in those daies that would reconcile such vnto the Church by admitting them to the communion which after their moste greeuous fall and deniall of Christ before men had not giuen sufficient tokens and testimonies of their hearty repentance before God without the which the wrath of God iustly kindled against them for their henious offences couldnot be appeased Hetherto therefore for the necessitie of auricular confession we haue seene nothing that anie learned protestant might voutchsafe of anie answere as for the scriptures giuing the Priest so plaine power as wel of binding and retaining as of loosing and remitting doe laie no necessity vpon anie man to confesse vnto them the particularities of his secret faultes nor giue any authoritie vnto the priestes to exact the same I saie not by expresse wordes but not by any necessary illation or conclusion out of the expresse words of the scripture which we holde to be of as great credit as that which is contained in expresse wordes As for the vniforme consent of all ages and the mosie notable persons in the same whereof you make your cómon vaunt can neuer be shewed for the necessitie of auricular shrift no nor for anie other point of poperie though you would make choise of the eldest error that you holde That you take the Churches practize in al ages to be the moste surest way to touch and trie truth by you declare what reuerent opinion you haue of the word of God which our Sauiour Christ saith is the truth wherin he praieth his father to sanctifie al his disciples vnto the worldes end Vnto which rule of truth al practize of mé must be exacted and by it be tried For what mad blasphemie were it to saie that the word of God which was before all practize the onelie trueth of touch hath now lost his credit or the best part thereof if practize of men in all ages be now become the most surest waie to trie and touch trueth by as if the manners of men were alwaies the best interpretation of the lawe That confession hath euer beene vsed of all mortall sins in all countries and ages since Christes time it is prooued by the witnes of moste learned fathers with an answer to such things as out of the Fathers be sometimes obiected to the contrarie THE 11. CHAP. ALLEN I Am the longer in this approoued trueth because I remember what Saint Chrysostome saith And I see by these daies that it is verie true which he writeth Multa arie opus esse vt qui laborant Christiani vltrò sibi 〈◊〉 persuadeant sacerdotum curationibus sese submittere That it is a point of high wisdome and cunning to bring to passe that Christian men which are sicke in soule would persuade themselues to submit in all causes them selues to the priests curing For indeede in Nectarius his predecessours daies there was such an offence arose in the simple sorte and such a tragedie in Constantinople Church by the naughtie fact of a deaton there that their Bishoppe was glad to make the state of penance which then was often published euen for priuat sinnes to be a great deale more free then before Whereupon the people tooke occasion of such libertie and licentious life that when their common Penitenciarie by the commaundement of Nectarius was remóoued they were exceeding loath to confesse or doe iust penance for their sinnes actuall Though that good man condescending to the peoples weaknes meant neuer to take awaie that wholl order wherein he had no authoritie because it is no politike prouision but Christes institution but onely that the penance should not be publike except the party listed of those sinnes which were to the said Penitentiarie confessed in secret Which fact of his though perchaunce it was necessarie for that time yet was not allowed of the writers of the same Historie As a thing saith Sozomenus that brought much dissolute life and alteration of the peoples manners into the Church Yet our aduersaries are in such aistresse for their maintenance of their contrarie assertion against holie confession that they be not ashamed to alledge this mans doubtfull example Which if it were good and to be followed yet made it nothing against shrift which they cal now auricular confession or if it did make against the whole Sacrament euerie waie ministered yet it could not of reason be followed being but one bishoppes compelled act and that disalowed euen of the reporters them selues and prooued to be euill by the practize of all Churches christened to the contrarie FVLKE Chrysostomes wordes by you translated if you had not falsifyed in translation by adding of your owne these wordes in all causes which are neither in the originall Greeke nor in the latine version make but a small shew for the necessitie of the auriculer confession For in that place Chrysostome sheweth how much more difficult the office of a spirituall shepard is then the charge of a bodely herdman by this that the shepperd of vnresonable sheepe may both see the diseases of his cattell and also compell them to take his medicines and diet but the spirituall shepheard cannot alwaies see with what diseases his flocke are infected neither can he compell them but must exhort them willinglie to submit them selues to his cure whereby he meaneth his doctrine of admonition reprehension and such like But because you make mention of a storie and doe not expresse it and yet excuse Chrysostome thereby in any thing that he hath written sounding against the necessitie of confessing before men of sinnes committed in secret as though he durst not fullie set downe his iudgement thereof before the peo ple. I will set forth the storie as it is reported by the Ecclesiasticall writers Socrates and Sozomenus Socrates L. 5. C. 19. writeth thus About the same time it was thought good to take awaie those elders or priests of the Churches which were appointed ouer publike repentance vpon such cause Since the time that the Nouatians were deuided from the Church for that they would not communicate with them that had fallen in the persecution that was vnder Decius the Bishops of the
Church added vnto the Ecclesiastical canon or rule a certeine priest or elder which should be ouer them that repented that they which were fallen after baptisme should confesse their sinnes before this appointed priest And this rule holdeth still vnto this time in other sects Onelie they that holde Christ to be of the same substance with his father and the Nouatians which agree with thē in this faith haue reiected this priest appointed ouer them that repent The Nouatians in deede at the first receiued not this additiō But they which now hold the Churches hauing obserued it for a long time vnder Nectarius haue changed it by occasion of this matter that happened in the Church A certeine noble woman came to the priest appointed for repentance and made particular confession of those sinnes she had committed after baptisme the priest charged this woman to fast and praie cominuallie that with her confession she might shew forth the worke that was meete for repentance But the woman proceeding accused her selfe of another offence for she declared that a certaine Deacon of the Church had line with her This being declared caused the Deacon to be cast out of the Church but a tumult was raised among the priests for they were sore greeued not onelie with that which was done but also because this fact tended greatlie to the slaunder and contumelie of the Church So while cleargie men were in great reproch for these thinges a certaine blessed elder of the Church borne at Alexandria gaue in councell to the Bishop Nectarius to take awaie this priest that was appointed ouer repentance and to permit euerie man according to his owne conscience to be partaker of the mysteries For by that meanes onelie he should haue the Church voide of slaunder These thinges because I heard my selfe of that blessed man I was 〈◊〉 to commit vnto this writing For as I haue often said I haue giuen all diligence to learne of euerie man that knew these matters and exactlie to search them out that I might write nothing beside the truth But I saied vnto Eudemon or that blessed man your counsell Sir hath brought into the Church God knoweth what or no. But I see that you haue giuen occasion that one should not reprehend an others sinnes nor to obserue that precept of the Apostle which saieth Communicate not with the vnfruitfull workes of darkenes but rather reprooue them But of these matters sufficient Sozomenus Lib. 7. Cap. 16. reporteth the matter after this manner About this time Nectarius which gouerned the Church of Constantinople was the first that would no longer permit that priest which was appointed for them that repented And him followed al most al other Bishops Now this matter what it is or whence it began or for what cause it ceased diuerse men report diuerselie I will declare what I thinke For seeing not to sinne at all it is a matter more diuine then agreeable to mans nature and that God hath commaunded to graunt pardon to them that repent although they offend often times and in refusing to confesse sinnes the debt groweth more burthenous as it is like it was thought good among the priestes of olde time that as it were in an open theater vnder the witnesse of the multitude of the Church men should declare their sinnes And for this purpose they appointed a priest or elder of the best conuersation continent of speach wise to whome they came which had sinned and confessed such things as they had committed in their life And he according to euerie mans sin after he had appointed a mulct what he ought to doe or to abide absolued them when they had performed their penaltie by themselues But as for the Nouatians which made no account of repentance needed not this matter But in other sects of heretikes it is obserued euen vntill this time And it is diligintlie obserued in the westerne Churches and especiallie in the Church of the Romans For there is a certein open place appointed for them that are in exercise of repentance For they stand with heauie cheere and as it were sorowing And when the seruice of God is ended being not made partakers of those things that are lawfull for the holie ones with weeping lamentation they cast themselues downe flat vpon the earth the Bishop beholding them runneth to them weeping and likewise falling vpon the earth the wholl multitude of the Church is then filled with mourning and weeping Then first the Bishop riseth vp and lifteth vp the sinners that lie on the ground after he hath praied as it is meetes for the penitents that haue sinned he dismisseth them Then euerie one of them willinglie afflicting himselfe either with fastings or abstinēce from washings or certein meats or with other things that are enioyned thē cōtinueth a seaso so long as the Bishop hath appointed vnto him And at the time appointed after he hath payed as it were a certaine debt he is released of the punishment of fin and com meth into the congregation with the rest of the people These things the priests of Rome obserue euen vntill our daies But in the Church of Constantinople the priest or elder that was appointed ouer the penitent did exercise that office vntill ā certein noble woman being appointed by the priests to fast and pray to God for those sinnes which she had declared while she continued in the Church for this purpose confessed that shee had committed fornication with a Deacon whereof the multitude hauiug vnderstanding was sore greeued for defiling the Church and it was an exceeding great slaunder vnto the whol cleargie Nectarius beeing in doubt how to handle this matter that had happened first depriueth the fornicator of his ministerie And beeing counselled by certein men to permit euerie man as his conscience serued him and as he might be bolde to cōmunicate the mysteries he caused the priest to giue ouer that was appointed for repentance and from that time this custome taking holde hath hetherto continued Now I thinke the auncient grauitie and precisenes hauing begon by litle and litle to fall awaie into a diuerse and negligent custome seeing before as I suppose the offences were lesse both through shame of them which declared their owne transgressions through the precisenes of them that were appointed iudges in this case And for the same cause I gather that the Emperour Theodosius prouiding for the good name grauitie of the Churches made a law that women should not be admmitted to the ministerie of god except they had children and were aboue threescore yeares old according to the expresse cōmaundement of the Apostle and to expell out of the Churches those women that were shorne in the head to depriue such Bishops from their Bishoppricke which did admit any such women The storie beeing as I haue set it forth out of the reporte of the Ecclesiasticall writers now let vs see how sincerely you handle the matter and report thereof at
of the Primitiue Church or to disprooue Beatus Rhenanus which denieth the same accusing both the noueltie and and the tyranie thereof and the danger that mens consciences haue beene in through it beside manie other knowne inconueniences ALLEN But now if you conferre with the Fathers of all ages and of euerie notable Church touching this confession to Gods Priests you may beginne if you list euen at this daie and driue vp both the trueth of the doctrine and the perpetuall practise thereof euen to the Apostles time In the late holie Council holden at Trent both the doctrine is confirmed and declared with all grauitie and also the aduersaries of that sacrament and the misconstructers of Christes wordes of remission to pertaine to preaching of the Gospell not to the verie act of absolution be by the consent of all Catholike states of the Christian world accursed excommunicated It was at Furence also decreed in a most generall assemblie of both the Latine and Greek Church that as wel the whol sacrament of penance as that especiall part which is called confession was of Christes institution In the great councell holden at Lateran there is so plaine charge giuen to euerie Christian to confesse his sinnes either to his owne ordinarie Parochian or to some other Priest that hath by him or otherwise authoritie and iurisdiction ouer the penitent that Protestantes affirme albeit verie false'y that confession was first instituted in the said Councel and this was more then three hundred yeares since And foure hundred yeares before that in a Prouinciall Councell that was kept at Vormacia there is a Canon made concerning the qualities of the priests that are constituted to be confessours and Penitentiaries where it is commaunded that they be such Qui possunt singulorum causas originem quoque modum culparum sigillatim considerare examinare That can particularlie trie out and examine the causes of euerie offender the manner and ground of their faultes FVLKE We are so well accquainted with your often bragges of Fathers and Councells that we neuer start for them seeing we knowe you haue nothing but the drosse of the latter times to cast at vs. For the Councell of Trentes decree we esteeme it as it is worthie being made by a few buckeram Bishoppes of Italie and some other Epicurian prelates of other countries to patch vp rather then to repaire the ruines and decaies of the kingdome of Antichrist In the late Councel of Florence I remember nothing decreed of this matter neither doe you note where we should finde it In the Lateran Councell that was kept litle more then 300. yeares since the Protestantes doe trulie affirme that the necessitie of auricular confession was first imposed vpon men of the Romish Church For in the councell of Wormes which you saie was 400 yeares elder there is neuer a word of confession or confessor but of wife consideration to be had of them that did penance by which are ment open offenders that did open pennance neither are you able to prooue the contrarie Paenitentibue saith the Canon serundum differentiam peccatorum c. To the penitents or such as doe penance let penance be decreed by the iudgement of the Priest according to the difference of their sinnes Therefore in giuing penance the Priest ought seuerallie to consider the causer of euerie one the beginning also manner of the faulies and diligentlie to examine and manifestlie to know the affection and sighings of the offenders also to consider the qualities of the times persons of the places ages that according to the consideration of the places ages or times or according to the qualitie of the offences the groning of euery offendor he turne not his eies from the holie rules Thus sarre the Canon after which follow the rules of penance to be apointed for diuers kindes of offences as for him that hath killed a Priest a pagane his parents or brother or for him that hath slain a man in his madnes or against his will and such like whereby it appeereth that the Canon was made for penance to be enioyned to publike offenders and not to compell men to confesse their secret sinnes ALLEN Which decree is borowed word for word almoste out of the last Canon of Constantinople Councell called the sixth generall which was long before all the forsaid Synodes Their discourse is long vpon the Priestes dutie which shoulde sitte on confessions whome they instruct by these wordes Oportebit qui facultatem absoluendi ligandi à Deo receperunt peccati qualitatem speculentur peccatoris promptitudinem ad reuersionem vt sic medicamentum admoueant aegritudini aptum ne si de peccato sine discrimine statuant aberrent à salute aegrotantis Those that haue receiued of our Lorde power to loose and binde must trie out the qualitie of euerie fault and the readines of the offender to returne vnto vertue that they maie prouide a medicine meet to the maladie lest if they should without distinct knowledge of their sinne giue iudgement they should erre in poruiding health for the sicke person By which Councell kept in Constantinople you maie easelie gather that neither confession was euer omitted by the lawe nor the common Penitentiarie long abrogated out of Constaninople Church And when I name these decrees of so manie generall Councels in diu rfe ages I do not onelie call them generallie to witnesse for my cause which were inough seeing euerie determination there passeth as by the sentence of the holie Ghoste and Christes owne iudgement of whose presence such hotie assemblance is assured but I appeale to eueric holy Bishop Priest and Prince of the world that agreed to the same and were there assembled euerie of which was of more experience learning and vertue or at the least of more humilitie then all our aduersaries aliue But now if you go to trie other the learned writers of all times for the practize of this point then our labour shall be infinite but our cause more strong and 〈◊〉 aduersaries sooner confounded I need not for that practize name the learned schoolemem of excellent capacitie in deepe mysteries because they were so late and because Heretikes can not denie but they are all vndoubtedlie against them and euerie one for vs Thomas Aquinas is ours Dionysius is ours I meane the Carthusian If anie man doubt of Saint Bernard let him reade the life of Malachie whome he praiseth sor bringing into vre the most profitable vse of confession in the rude partes of Ireland Saint Bede is prooued before not onelie to haue allowed confession to the Priest but to haue expounded Saint Iames wordes of confession for the sacrament of pennance and vttering our sinnes to Gods Ministers And he recordeth that in our Countrie of England before his daies confession was vsed to a Priest Whereof as also os pennance and satisfaction there is an example or two in the
from the paine and from the fault some plenarie of al their sinnes some partial of part of their sins some for a number of daies some for many thousands of yeares which euery one that paieth mony for them shall haue the benefit of them or which he giueth to such an hospitall gylde or brotherhoode or to him which saith such a praier or goeth on such a pilgri mage such like wherunto may be added his dispensations absolutiós exemptions lycenses these are the popes pardons of which the controuersy is between vs of which he cānot prooue that there was either vse or approbation no not in the Church of Rome for a wholl 1000. yeares after Christ. And these when he hath saied as much as he hath learned to saie for them out of the decretalls Clementines and Extrauagants you shall finde to be by his their owne determination nothing ells but as they are called in Latine Bullae Bubles great in appeerance but altogether emptie and voide of profit The attention of the gentle reader I do likewise require beccause he may see what good occasion Luther had to seperate himselfe from the Popish Church as from the whore of Babylon which so obstinately defended such abhominable blasphemies which all wise and reasonable men haue either abhorred or as he confesseth beene offended at them And yet let the reader marke how boldlie he calleth this article of the popes pardons an article of Christian faith whereof the Church of god neuer heard for a thousand yeares more since Christs assension before the loosing of Satā out of the bottomles pit when Antichrist was bolde to set abroad al his impieties and to sit not in a mysterie of iniquitie but openlie in the sight of al men in the temple of God and to exalt him-selfe aboue all that is called God or worshiped ALLEN And to be plaine in the matter where sinceritie is moste required two causes mooued me to beleeue like and allow of the power of pardons and indulgencies long before I either knew the commodities of them or had sought out the ground and meaning of them The first was the Churches authoritie which I credited in all other articles before I knew any of them or could by reason or scripture mainteine them Whose iudgement to follow by my Christian profession in all other pointes and to forsake in this one of Popes pardons had beene meere follie and a signe of phantasticall choise of things indifferent which is the proper passion of heresie Neither did I then know that the Church of Christ had allowed such thinges because I had read the determination of any generall Councells or decrees of some chiefe gouernours of the saide Church touching such pardons or because I had by histories and note of diuerse ages seene the practize of the faithfull people herein by which waies her meaning of doubtfull things is most assuredlie knowne but onelie I deemed that the Church allowed them and misliked the contrarie because such as bare the name of Christian folke and Catholike did approoue them and sometimes lamented the lacke of them And surelie for an vnlearned man I count it the briefest rule in the worlde to keepe him selfe both in faith and conuersation euer with that companie which by the generall and common calling of the people be named Catholikes For that name kept Saint Augustine himselfe in the trueth and true Church much more it may doe the simple sorte who is not hable to stande with an heretike that will challenge the Church to himselfe by Sophisticall reasons from the Christians that for lacke of learning can not answere him Well this companie of Catholikes brought me to know the Church and my creede caused me to beleeue the Church no lesse concerning the Popes Pardons then any other article of our Christian profession which though it were not of like weight yet it was to me of like trueth and all in like vnknowne at that time FVLKE Your pretence of plainnes sinceritie is but craft and sub tiltie to deceiue the simple and ignorant that they might please themselues in their blindenes and by your example thinke themselues at ease in their ignorance For what reasonable man will be perswaded that you could beleeue like and allow that thing whereof you know no vse nor whence it came or what it meaned But here you shew what faith is accounted among the Papists a fond perswasion of any thing that is tolde them by their teachers although they neither knowe what commoditie it bringeth nor what ground of trueth it hath nor finallie what it meaneth But howsoeuer it was two causes mooued you whereof you professe that hearing of the worde of God was neither The first was the Churches authoritie which you credited in all other articles before you knew any of them or could by reason or scripture mainteine them So by your owne confession you did as many papists doe beleeue you knew not what which faith would neuer bring you to eternall life which consisteth in knowledge of God and Iesus Christ according to that which is writen that wee might beleeue and be saued But seeing you could neither by reason nor by scripture mainteine those articles to be true which you beleeued how could you be perswaded that this companie was the Church of Christ the piller of trueth rather then the Church of Antichrist the mother of heresies and errors For all swarmes of heretikes challenge vnto themselues the name of the Church and require credit to be giuen vnto them and the more heretikes the lesse care they haue to make any triall of their doctrine to be trueth what had you more to perswade your conscience that you were in the right waie then a lew or a Turke hath which crediteth the companie amongst whome he is bred and borne without examining by reason or the scripture whether those thinges which they teach them be the trueth or no But it had beene a signe of phantasticall choyce of thinges indifferent you saie which is the proper passion of heresie to follow the Churches iudgement in all other points and to forsake it in this one of Popes Pardons Where you saie the phantasticall choice of things indifferent is the proper passion of heresie I know not what you meane except you thinke that heretikes are deceiued onelie in the choise of thinges indifferent or that whosoeuer maketh some phantastical choise of thinges indifferent is an heretike neither of which opinions I trowe you are able to mainteine For though some heretikes make a phantasticall choise of thinges indifferent I suppose it is not proper onelie to heretikes for some schismatikes that be not heretikes make such a phantasticall choise and the phantastical choise of heretikes is most occupied about principall groundes and articles of faith not about thinges indifferent onelie Moreouer I would know whether you account the Popes pardons to be things indifferent or necessarie for the Church for if
they be but thinges indifferent you doe not wiselie to be contentious about them Finallie seeing a companie of heretikes maie erre in one article and teach soundlie in all other as the Arians Donatists Nouatians and such like a man maie followe the iudgement of such a companie in all other points and without follie or signe of fantasticall choise departe from them in that one wherein they erre And therefore your faith was as good as his that beleeueth there is a man in the moone because he heareth manie men saie so whome he dare credit in other matters and is loth to forsake them in this ' one But your Christian profession mooued you to follow the Churches iudgement in all things And what heretike will not saie as much without triall or proofe which is the Church or what is Christian profession Therefore what ground had you that your profession was Christian or your felowship the Church of Christ You confesse you had neither the determination of generall councells nor the decrees of the chife gouernours of your Church nor the practise of the people in diuers ages by which waies you saie the Churches meaning of doubtfull thinges is moste assuredlie knowne but onelie you deeme the Church allowed them So that you because such as bare the name of Christian folke and Catholike men did approoue them had nothing but the bare name of Christian folke and Catholike men to ground your deeme vpon And is the bare and onelie name of Christian and Catholike men so sure a ground to build faith vpon without either the authoritie of the scriptures reason determination of general councels or decrees of the chief gouernours of the same or the practise of the faithful in auncient times then surelie Iet all heretikes content themselues where they are and dwell togither for there they shall haue the name of Christian folke and Catholike men which you account to be the breefest rule in the worlde for an vnlearned man to keepe himselfe both in faith and conuersation with that companie which by the generall and common calling of the people be named Catholikes The rule indeed is verie briefe and you saie in the margent also that it is good But who I praie you prescribeth this rule doth God the author of trueth where finde you it in his worde shall the generall and common calling of the people be the vnlearned mans rule to direct him to the Church which is the piller and staie of truth then surelie the vnlearned Grecians Aethiopians Armenians and other that dissent from the Church of Rome and from the truth it selfe haue a good and briefe rule to holde them where they are for by the generall and common calling of the people in those partes of the world they be named Christians and Catholikes Yea the rule serueth them ten times better then you Papists the forgers of it for they haue the more generall and common calling of the people to be Catholikes in those places then you haue here in Europe by a hundred parts For there no man calleth them otherwise then Christians and Catholikes here you haue God be praised many hundreth thousandes of the people that commonlie call you Papists heretikes antichristians Cacolikes and such other names agreeing to your heresies If you will cauill that by the generall and common calling of the people they be not named Catholikes because you Papistes doe neither so call them nor count them they maie answere you by the same reason that you are not by generall common calling of the people named Catholikes because neither they nor we doe so call you or account you But it is fufficient belike that you call your selues so and the rule is to be restrained to people of these partes of the world and among them to Papists onelie and so it is as good a rule as that aske my fellow if I be a theefe A good rule indeed for vnlearned Papists because draffe is good enough for swine which had rather sleepe in the myre and puddle of ignorance then come to the knowledge of the truth by searching the scriptures in which Christ the waie the truth and the life is to be found and out of which all Christians ought to gather knowledge that they maie be able to giue account of that hope that is in them But Saint Augustine I wene should be author of this rule for vnlearned men although he himselfe were not vnlearned Contra epistolam Manichaei quam vocant fundamenti Cap 4. This is great impietie to faine so absurd a rule and then to slaunder so godly a father to be either the author or approouer therof For Saint Augustine indeed against the Maniches which were a particuler sect of heretikes confesseth that among manie other thinges the name of the Catholike Church did holde him in the bosome thereof but not that the onelie name of Catholikes was a good rule for vnlearned men to know the Church by But protesting to reason the matter with them without anie preiudice and to trie the trueth without anie rashnes as one willing to yeald vnto thē if they can perswade him with trueth so that they shall not require him to yeald before they can giue him a cleere reason without anie darkenes of allthinges pertaining to the saluation of his soule thus he beginneth In Catholica enim Ecclesia vt omittā c. For in the Catholike Church that I maie omitte that moste sincere wisdome vnto the knowledge where of a fewe spirituall men doe come in this life that they maie knowe it but of the lest part because they are men but yet without doubt for the rest of the multitude not the quicknes of vnderstanding but the simplicitie of beleeuing doeth make moste false Therefore that I maie omitte this wisdome which you beleeue not to be in the Catholike Church there are manie other thinges which maie moste iustlie holde me in her lappe The consent of people and nations holdeth me the authoritie begunne with miracles nourished with hope increased with charitie confirmed with antiquitie holdeth me The succession of Priests from the verie seate of Peter the Apostle to whome our Lorde after his resurrection commended his sheeepe to be fedde vnto this present bishoprike doeth holde me last of all the verie name of Catholike Church doth holde me which not without cause among so manie heresies this Church alone hath so obtained that whereas all heretikes would haue themselues to be called Catholikes yet to a straunger that asketh where men meet at the Catholike Church none of the heretikes dare shewe either their owne Church or house Therfore these so manie so great most deare bondes of Christian name doe rightlie holde a man that beleeueth in the Catholike Church although for the dulnes of our vnderstanding or the desert of our life the tructh doth not yet shewe it selfe moste openlie But among you where none of these things is that maie inuite or holde me there soundeth nothing
but much be confirmed in my faith thereby And yet all this while though the matter of pardons seemed to me to be more and more sound in it selfe and as true as the Spirit of God is true who was the author thereof in the Church yet I did not then consider of it as a thing of anie great importance but I conceiued it to be a small matter subiect to a certaine iugling in reason such as wicked men lightlie make their close and craftie entrance by to more mischiefe and further attemptes against the common faith of the Church I could not then conceiue which I after ward so plainlie and now more and more by the better surueie of the cause do perceiue that in this one falsehood there was couertlie conteined the verie pith of falsehood and improofe of the greatest matters which life and faith doth stand vpon FVLKE Your first motiues to this faith of yours were not more feeble then your confutations in the same were fond and foolish You did reade the storie of the alteration in religion that hath fallen in our time But of whose writing I praie you euen of such as were proctors for the Popes pedlarie ware or pillers of his pretensed power which was none other but according to the prouerb before mentioned aske my fellow if I be a thiefe If you had read the storie written indifferentlie without partialitie to either partie you might haue iudged better of the wholle matter Some perhapes are liuing that can testifie of the things that were done publike monuments are extant totestifie the same so much more intollerable is your arrogancie to iudge vpon the onelie sinister report of the aduersaries of Luther of holie and blessed memorie with all true Christians that onelie contention and couetousnes mooued him to condemne that which himselfe in conscience knew to be true and lawfull Like boldnes you shew in affirming that Luther was the first in all mans memorie sauing one 〈◊〉 that despised pardons forgetting the Waldenses that were long before Wiclefe and the Bohemians that were after him before Luther who condemned popish pardons as much as Wiclife or Luther For they condemned the Pope to be Antichrist as much as these did But now let vs examine the storie as it is knowne to be moste true in Saxonie where Luther first found fault with pardons When Pope Leo. 10. had sent abroad his pardons which were preached by Terelius a Dominike frier in such impudent manner that they seemed to serue for no end but the Popes couetousnes and the licentiousnes of the people Luther at that time hauing a zeale of God but not according to knowledge did mildelie and modestlie admonish the people of the deceites and abuses of pardons and pardoners which long before his time were reprooued in the Councells of Latrean and Vienna he complained to the Archbishoppe of Ments to the Bishop of Branderburg to the prouinciall of the Augustine friers and to the Pope him selfe in all thinges submitting him selfe to the Pope and Church of Rome so it were not against the holie scriptures When he could finde no equity nor redresse of these abuses which euen Surius the papist confesseth to haue bene iustlie complained of by him and vniustlie manteined or dissembled by the prelates he proceeded farther as God gaue him knowledge and at length compelled by intollerable iniurie and neglect of manifest trueth and reformation of lise did cast of the Anrichristian yoke of the Popes obedience Now whereas you charge him with contention and couetousnes the world your iudge before maie gather whether Luther if against his conscience he would haue set forth the Popes pardons especiallie at such time as the Pope had great neede of monie for warre against the Turkes might not haue made a more easie waie for him selfe to honour and ri hes then by setting himselfe against them But howsoeuer it was your fault faith was thus confirmed and that to such blasphemous boldnes that without authoritie of the holie scriptures the matter of pardons seemed to you as true as the spirit of God is true and hauing none other arguments to perswade you but that Papistes called them selues the Catholike Church and condemned Luther of manie heresies and write in their stories that Luther was mooued by contention and couetousnes to oppose him selfe against them you nothing doubted but that the spirit of God was author of popes pardons in the Church Beeing now resolued of the substance you were not yet perswaded of the quantitie but thinkeing the matter at the first was but small at length you came to a perfect knowledge how great and weightie it is and how it draweth with it all other waight in so much that the verie pith of the greatest matters of popish life and faith doe stand vpon it If then the pith of the greatest matters of poperie doe stand in Popes pardons and this pith hath no ground either in the scriptures or the fathers of the Church for a thousand yeares after Christ we maie the more easily see that the plant of poperie whereof pardons is the pith is not of Gods owne planting and therefore shal be plucked vp by the rootes ALLEN Thou wouldest not thinke I dare saie into what a summe and abridgment heresie hath by the Deuilles deuise and Luthers seruice drawne her selfe into For by this one false conclusion and for maintenance thereof this man and his posteritie haue taken awaie all penance and satisfaction for sinne haue spoiled the Church of her iust and and moste necessarie discipline controlled Gods owne holie vsage incorrection of his children haue entered into his secrets of the next world and there abandoned the place of his iustice and iudgement for sinnes that be remitted but not enough to his wisdome and will corrected haue robbed the holie Saints of all their merites that is to saie Christ of his giftes and grace whereby onelie they besosoneraigne and satisfactorie haue imbarred the bodie mysticall of Christ of the benefit which the wholl and euerie member thereof should receiue by the satisfaction and holie workes of the common head which is Christ haue broken the communion of Saints and the sweet felowship of all the holie members of Gods Church and the benefit which riseth frometh to other by mutuall participation of their good works and desertes and to be short haue by this one falsehood preached against pardons done iniurie to Christ to his Church to his Saints and to his sacraments and haue mightelie shaken the whole frame of Christian religion and doctrine I doe not here riot in wordes to ouerrunne my aduersaries in talke or to make more of the matter then it is but assuredlie without destruction of all these so necessarie articles of our faith there can no man defend Luthers doctrine against Indulgences I knowe he fumbled at the beginning otherwise then his fellowes and followers to disgrace the same sometimes by holding the pardons to be lawfull but not
profitable other whiles to be deceites but yet inuented for holie purposes now by avouching they could not stand with Gods iustice if they shoulde remitte anie part of the appointed paine for sinnes and else when that there was no paine for remitted sinnes at all whereupon the indulgences should not be needfull but vaine and friuolous with such other inconstant stammering as lightlie is common to them that seeke to vp hold falshood against their owne skill and consciences But his followers as well of the Protestants as Zuinglians and Caluinistes to make the waie of wickednes more easie and plaine haue boldlie denied all penance and temporall paine for sinne remitted whether it be by Christs or the Churches enioyning haue taken awaie Purgatorie haue bereued Priesthood of all power and the Church of all her treasure of Christes copious and abundant redemption Whereupon I cannot otherwise iudge but that doctrine which else can not be refelled but by the waste of so manie vndoubted articles should stande exceeding fast and be grounded moste surelie vpon all these foresaide truthes without the destruction whereof it can not be of anie force ouerturned FVLKE As no man would thinke any such matter if you had not put it in their heades so no wise men can thinke otherwise of Pardons then he did before you tooke in hande their defence sauing that all reasonable men may thinke them so much the worsse because you are able to defend them no better And if all the principles of popery as you saie be contained in the matter of pardons as in a summe or abridgment the children of God maie behold the prouidence of god more clearelie in setting Luther first against them at such time as he knewe no such matter neither had anie purpose but to disswade the moste grosse abuses and palpable impostures which were that time mantained about them alowing the pardons still as good and lawful But for the mantainers of this conclusion you say he and his haue taken awaie all penance and satisfaction for sinne c. Naie they haue established and restored the true vse of repentance and shewed that the death of Christ is the onelie satisfaction for sinnes the discipline of the Church from a batbarous antichristian tyrannie they haue reduced within the limmites of the scriptures and the practize of the primatiue and pureit age of the Church the chastising that God vseth for correction of his children they haue taught out of the scriptures how it is to be taken patientlie as an admonition for amendement not an amends for our misdoing which sauoreth as much of pride as their doctrine doth of humility The secrets of the next world not reueiled in the scriptures they leaue vntil the time of the general reuelation of al secrets and therfore they presume not to allow purgatorie paines for the clensing of those sinnes which the scripture teacheth to be purged by the bloode of Christ in whome all our sinnes are thorowlie punished to the full satisfaction of the iustice and wisedome of God They haue left to the saints al their merits which is nothing els but the grace of God sufficient for their saluation not placing the workes of saints in the place of Christes passion which is onelie of it selfe soueraigne and satisfactorie for all men The mysticall bodie of Christ and the holie cōmunion of saints they beleeue to receiue all vertue and power of life from Christ the head and euery member to exercise that office which by his grace is assigned vnto it therefore they haue done no iniurie to Christ his Church his saints sacraments or his holy Religion but their dutie in purging the doctrine ofChrist his Church his saints sacraments and Religion from error falsehood heresie and blasphemie You tell the reader that you doe not riot in wordes to ouerrunne your aduersarie but if he be wise he will remēber that a crafty orator doth sonest deceiue when he pretendeth moste plainenes What Luther thought and taught at the first of pardons his writings are extant in print to declare in which he confesseth that he did fight in the darke yet it pleased God by the importunitie of his aduersaries to sturre him vp to search the trueth out of the holie scriptures Neither hath Zuinglius or Caluine or anie of the Protestants taught otherwise of repentance satisfaction power of priesthood or the tresure of the Church then Luther did after God had reueiled the trueth vnto him and he openlie preached the same Seeing therefore the matter of pardons cannot stand but vpon the blasphemous heresies which the popish antichristian Church doth teach against the glorie of the onelie redemption of Iesus Christ our onelie and whole sauiour and reedemer it must needs be one of those pestilent poisons which Sathan after his loosing out of the bottomeles pit hath powred forth into the world the defacing of the glorie of Christ and the destruction of manie ignorant soules ALLEN Therefore least any man by making smaller accompt of so litle a braunch of the Churches faith then he should do fall further vnto the mistrusting of other many of knowen importance I thought it good to debate the question of Indulgences which be now commonly called the Popes Pardons though not onely he but also other Prelates of Christendome haue their seuerall right eche one according to the measure of the Churches graunt and his iurisdiction therein In which matter because most men of smaler trauail haue erred rather by misconstruing the case mistaking the state of the cause then for any lacke of sufficient proofe of the matter after it were wel vnderstanded I will studie first clearly to open the meaning of that whereon we stande and then to go through the whole question with as much light and breuitie as I can tempering my selfe as much as I maie from all such 〈◊〉 as the depth of so grounded a conclusion and the learned disputation of Schoolmen might driue me vnto Wherein I am content rather to followe the desire and contentation of the reader then to satisfie my owne appetite which I feele in my selfe to be somewhat more greedie of matter sometimes then the common people whome I studie moste to helpe can well beare and yet if they thinke it anie vantage to knowe trueth and the necessarie Doctrine of their faith they must learne to abide the orderlie methode and compasse of the cause and further I shall not charge them FVLKE You come to late after the vanitie treacherie and blasphemie of pardons hath beene so long set abroad and knowen to the world and bringing no better stuffe then you do to suppose that you shal be able to restore pardons into the auncient credit they had within these foure score yeares euen with the simplest papist in Europe You would make the matter more plausible by communicating the right of pardons to all prelates of christendome as wel as to the Pope whereas indeed your popish Church keeping no proportion aloweth none
in the sacrament of penance there is a power iudiciarie and therefore can not be practized lawfullie but vpon subiect persons and causes not exempted from their iudgement and excepted from their audience In which cases the persons of higher iurisdiction to whome by right and law the cognition of those reserued sinnes belong do sometimes vpon occasion giuen communicate their power to the said simple priestes and do license them to exercise their iurisdiction vpon persons and causes not properly pertaining vnto them as when the Popes Indulgence giueth the sinner leaue to choose his ghostlie father and by him that he maie be assoiled euen from such sinnes as be reserued to the supreame power of the Church In this matter also the Indulgence ioyneth with the ordinarie sacrament of penance and the minister receiueth iurisdiction by the Indulgence to heare and assoile the Penitent of such sinnes as before were not subiect to his peculiar regiment and therefore this is also called a pardon from sinne and the paine for sinne and a full remission FVLKE You haue hitherto held hard that neither the Pope nor anie Bishop can giue pardon of anie mortal sinne but by reseruation of cases it appeareth that the Pope challengeth this prerogatiue that he onelie may giue absolution and pardon in these greeuous crimes that be called cases papall and the Bishop in cases episcopall Now let vs see how this geare hangeth together The Pope hath this prerogatiue in respect of his high iurisdiction for in the sacramēt of penance euery priest by order as we heard before hath as much authority as he Then if these cases be reserued to the Popes iurisdiction this reseruation doth prooue that the Pope taketh vpon him to pardon the most greeuous sinnes by his iurisdiction onelie or els he deceaueth them that seeke for absolution of them at his hands And whereas you would cloake the matter by saying the Popes indulgence doth graunt that the priest in confession maie assoile a man from such sinnes as be reserued to the supreame power of the Church it is to no purpose For the Priest in this case is but the popes deputie to exercise the Popes iurisdiction as you saie as well vpon persons as causes not properlie pertaining to him but by the Popes license whereupon it followeth that the Pope may do in his owne person that which he doth by his deputie but by his deputie he taketh vpon him to remit most deadlie sinnes therefore the Pope taketh vpon him to remit deadlie sinnes by his iurisdiction onelie If you saie the absolution commeth from the sacrament and not from his iurisdiction then shew vs out of the scriptures how the Pope hath authoritie to restraine the grace of sacraments in respect of the person that ministreth them or els your reseruation of cases and exemption of persons will prooue no better then an Antichristian tyrannie For if Christ haue giuen power to euerie Priest to remitte all sinnes as you haue often affirmed vpon the text Ioh. 20. whose sinnes you remit c. what is he but Antichrist exalting himselfe aboue all that is called God which controlleth the liberall graunt of Christ exempting both persons and sinnes from their power without al ground or war rant of Gods word ALLEN That thou be not deceiued herein vnderstand good Reader that euerie Priest in his taking Orders and by Christes graunt hath full power to remit all sinnes and all men of their sinnes that be penitent and yet that this power can not be practized by the law of nature indifferentlie vpon all because this sacrament and none other is iudiciall and therfore profitablie can be extended no further but to them that be of their subiection and regiment Wheresoeuer the Priest consecrateth it is effectuall whomesoeuer he baptizeth he is lawfullie Christianed whomesoeuer the Bishop ordereth he standeth trulie ordered and so forth though they should not herein meddle in other mens cures without speciall licence sufferance or necessitie But no man can assoile anie person at all that is not subiect vnto him either ordinarilie or otherwise because it is an act of iurisdiction and therefore though his power of orders be in it selfe sufficient yet by that onelie he can not absolue anie man but in necessitie except he haue withall authoritie ouer the person and in that case wherein the penitent requireth his sentence which iurisdiction he maie haue either ordinarilie as vpon all those that be of his charge or els extraordinarilie by some special graunt of the superiour as Bishop or Pope as we maie see in the formes and course of Indulgencies diuers times And thus considering of the matter you see that the Popes pardons as they be onelie proper to the act of iurisdiction separated from the power of priesthood and sacramentall confession can not remit the sinnes them-selues neither damnation due for their reward though because licence commeth and proceedeth by them to the inferiour Priestes to remitte sinnes in all cases they maie be called as I said plenarie and most liberal graces and graunts to assoile man both from sinne and the punishment that is due therefore FVLKE You pretend as though you would render a reason why all Priestes haue not equall power ouer all men and to remit all sinnes and for the former you saie somewhat though not sufficient but for the later you saie nothing at all First you confesse that euerie Priest rightly ordered hath by Christes graunt power to remit all sinnes and all men of their sinnes that be penitent But this power can not be practized you say by the law of nature indifferentlie vpon all Then belike Christ hath graunted and they receiued an vnprofitable power for why haue they power to remitte all sinnes and al mens sinnes and yet maie practize the same but vpon some sinnes and some mens sinnes onelie In truth Christ hath giuen ful power to al his ministers according to the measure of euerie one of their charges the Apostles ouer al the world their successors the bishops pastors teachers within the compasse of their seuerall cures and therefore you saie well that God hath so ordered the case that no man maie intermedle in an others cure without licence sufferance or necessitie the Pope then doth wickedlie to exempt anie man from his laufull pastor to whome the charge of his soule is by Christ committed The reason you giue wherfore this power can not be practized vpon all is friuolous because this sacrament and none other is iudiciall For who will graunt you that the power of remitting sinnes in repentance is more iudiciall then in baptisme or in the Lordes supper For the minister ought to haue a iudgement whome he baptizeth and whome he admitteth vnto the Lords table If the children of Turks or Iews be offered to baptisme without the conuersion or consent of their parentes by what warrant shall he receiue them If Turkes Iewes or Gentiles that be of yeares of discretion offer them selues to baptisme
man of sinne and euerlasting paine whome he also punished for the same sinne with temporal paine as a satisfaction to the iustice of God which none could satisfie in part or in wholl but he onelie by his obedience and suffering ALLEN And this iurisdiction and power of regiment he gaue to Peter principallie when he bestowed on him the keies of heauen vpon the rest of the Apostles with him the power of binding and loosing which is moste principallie and properlie meant of enioyning penance or punishing by sharpe discipline the sinners euill life either before they forgine his sinnes or afterward For as the place of the 20. of Saint Iohn properly concerneth the power of pardoning reteining or forgiuing penance for satisfaction in the sacrament by the right of Priesthoode receiued in their orders though it may somewhat concerne the iurisdiction of the high Magistrates also so the place of Saint Matthew rather perteineth to the chastisment of the wicked by the open discipline as they haue the regiment of al our affaires then it doth to the sacramentall remisstion or satisfaction enioyned For ligare there doth signifie some bond of punishment wherewith the partie is tied and charged for his correction and not onelie bonde of sinne wherewith the Church bindeth no man no more then God himselfe doth but euerie man onelie bindeth himselfe in his owne sinnes And the Church or her ministers doe properlie then binde when they punish by their iurisdiction the sinnes committed not for the damnation of them that did fall but for their correction and amendment And the plaine mention of excommunication which there is expressed to be giuen to the Apostles for the chastisment of such as by more gentle admonition will not amend nor obeie the Church doth prooue that to binde in that place namelie importeth power of punishment to be executed on the offenders which way of chastisment is an open exercise of discipline giuen to the Apostles to be vsed at their discretions for the edifiyng of Christs Church Therefore as to binde there is as well an act of the proper power of iurisdiction as it is a function of prie sthoode to be exercised in the sacrament of penance so to loose soluere in that place though it may signifie to remit sinnes in waie of sacramentall confession yet it is more aptlie correspondent so the words that went before of binding which was not sinne but the paine and punishment for sinne whereby it must needes fillow that as to binde doth fignifie to charge that penitent person with some temporall paine so to loose must also meane to dissolue the bande which before was laied on him for present correction FVLKE Christ gaue no more iurisdiction or power of regiment to Peter pricipallie when he bestowed the keies of the kingdome of heauen vpon him then vpon the rest of the Apostles vnto whome he gaue the like and equall power of binding and loosing of opening and shutting the kingdome of heauen as he did to Peter The same thing verilie saith Saint Cyprien were the rest of the Apostles that Peter was indued with the same fellowspip both of honour and of power That the power graunted in the 18. of Matthew pertaineth moste properlie and principallie to the chaistisment or reconcilement of open offendours by discipline the circumstance of place affordeth no lesse as the text Iohn the 20. ratifieth the effect of their message in them that imbrace or refuse the doctrine of the Gospell And that the gouernours of the Church haue power by excommunication to binde and by absolution to loose vpon good ground and cause in both cases you neede not halfe these wordes to prooue it for we doe acknowledge and practize no lesse in the Churches of Christ where we haue gouernement likewise that the Church hath authoritie for triall of the parties repentance to enioyne some exercise of humiliation and to release the same or part thereof beeing satisfied with the manifest signes of repentance and submission it is also out of controuersie But of your sacrament of penance or satisfaction for sinnes by either discipline established Matthew the eighteene or power of remission of sinnes graunted in the text Iohn the twentie we shall neuer be agreed vntill you can make plaine demonstration out of the holie scriptures that either God hath instituted the one or alloweth the other which you shall neuer be able to doe ALLEN For this is a rule moste certein that all the bandes which the Church laieth vpon any offender be medicinable if the partie list to take them and may be loosed by the same power of the Church by which they were bounde before And therefore euer as mention is made in scripture of binding or which is all one punishing of sinnes there is also mention of the like power of loosing for Christ would not giue power to the Church to binde or correct sinnes but much more he would haue the Church resemble himselfe being her head in mercie and therefore gaue her alwaies power to loose that kinde of punishment which shee by her ministers had bounde or inoyned before For these two actes beeing answerable in conference and contrarietie muste necessarilie follow ech other and properlie to the like power and prerogatiue Then the one beeing giuen to the Apostles euen out of the sacrament of penance the other muste needes also by the like right be receiued S. Ambrose rebuketh much the Nouatians because they would haue the Church enioyne penance but they liked not that he should mercifullie release the same againe nor the penitents sinnes neither Dominus saith he par ius soluendi esse 〈◊〉 ligandi qui vtrumque pari conditione permisit ergo qui soluendi ius non habet nec ligandi babes Our Lord would haue the right of losing binding to be like for equally he gaue the power of both Therfore whosoeuer hath not power to loose he hath no power to binde If anie man then list follow the Nouatians he maie holde at his pleasure that it preteineth to the Churches iurisdiction to binde that which she can not loose againe contrarie to Christes expresse graunt made vnto her first in the person of Peter and then in the right of all the Apostles to whome when he had promised as well the keies of order as iurisdiction he said vnto them whatsoeuer you shall binde in earth it shal be bound in heauen and whatsoeuer you loose in earth it shal be loosed in heauen first giuing them thereby authorititie to punish and then to pardon And therefore as the sacrament of penance wherein sinnes be released or retained was grounded vpon the wordes of Christ spoken to the Apostles after his resurrection whereof we talked so much in the former treatise so the power of giuing pardon or punishing out of the sacrament by the vertue of the iurisdiction as the Pope and other Bishoppes now doe and alwaies haue done is founded moste fast vpon this
place of Saint Matthew spoken first and principallie to Saint Peter and then to other Apostles vniuersallie Now if anie list be assured by the Doctours interpretation that the wordes of our Sauiour of binding and loosing doe directlie giue power to the pastours of his Church to punish the offenders and release their sentence of seueritie againe let them read Saint Augustines 75. Epistle where they shall finde much of this matter and thus amongst other thinges spiritalis poena de qua scriptum est Quae ligaueritis in terra erunt ligata in coelo ipsas animas obligat The spirituall punishment whereof Christ spake when he said what-soeuer you binde in earth it shall be bound in heauen do fast binde the soules themselues And Saint Chrysostome disputing excellently vpon these wordes of binding or loosing compareth the iurisdiction of Princes temporall vnto the spirituall power herein and maketh this to excell that as farre as heauen passeth the earth and the soule in dignitie surmounteth the bodie If anie King saieth Chrysostome should giue vnto some subiect such authoritie vnder him that whome whosoeuer he would he might cast into prison and againe release him when he list all men would account that subiect moste happie But he that hath receiued not of an earthlie King but of God him selfe a power that passeth that other as farre as heauen is from the earth and the soule excelleth the bodie I trow him euerie man must both wonder at and highlie reuerence Thus farre said the Doctor acknowledging that as some by Princes grauntes maie prison or pardon the bodies so the Priestes maie punish mens soules and loose or pardon them againe For the proofe whereof he applieth fitlie both the woordes of Christ spoken to S. Peter aud the like afterward to all the Apostles concerning binding and loosing FVLKE Whether all the bands of the Church be medicinable if the partie list to take them Doctors doe dour seing there is a sin vnto death not to be praied for And S. Paul layed such a band vpon Alexander the copper smith that he desired the Lord to requit him according to his workes which could be no lesse then eternall damnation without hope of true and faithfull repentance for which Esaw found no place though he sought the blessing with teares For true repentance is not a matter of mens list but an excellent gift of God That case excepted it is out of question that the Church hath power as well to loose as to binde what or whome soeuer and God in heauen doth ratifie that which the Church vpon good cause doth on earth And therefore to prooue this whereof there is no doubt there needed neither Ambrose Augustine nor Chrysostmes authoritie to be cited except it be to shew how prodigall you are of proofe where there is no neede and howe drie and barren where there is most necessitie vnlesse you will haue your wordes and sayings go without al warrantize as euen in this section that this power or iurisdiction as you call it is giuen principallie to Peter that the sacrament of penance is grounded vpon Christes words spoken to his Apostles after his resurrectiō which of the Doctors affirmeth Contrariwise Chrysostome in the place by you cited as you your selfe confesse doth fitlie applie the words of Christ spoken to Saint Peter and the like to al the Apostles concerning binding and loosing vnto all priests alike therefore no principalitie in Peter For these and such like matters of controuersie the Doctors serue not your true but you would haue the ignorant suppose that as you can cite the Doctors full and direct for manie thinges whereof we doe not contend so in all matters of contention the Doctors are full on your side But if anie papist haue but halfe an eie he will or maie espie your insirmitie though you doe neuer so cunninglie dissemble it ALLEN Againe Saint Cyprian and other holy bishoppes of Affrike which had inioyned long penance to certaine that had fallen in time of persecution from their faith for flatterie or feare of the worlde and had thought to haue giuen them anie Indulgences peace or pardon for that then they called dare pacem which we now tearme to giue a Pardon til the houre of death came Statueramus saie they vt agerent diu plenam poenitentiam we had verilie determined that they should haue done out all their full inioyned penance but now vpon other great respectes we doe agree to giue peace of pardon to those that haue earnestlie done some penance alreadie and lamented bitterlie their former fall But marke well here by what authoritie they chalenge this power and what they doe chalenge They chalenge pardie power to giue penance to the offenders and they claime by right the release thereof Againe they clearelie take vpon them in consideration of the fault to inloine what they list and how long they list and vpon like iust respect by their wisdomes to pardon some peece of the same againe either after death or else if good matter mooue them long before But by what Scripture doe they claime such iurisdiction that they maie giue discipline to offenders euen without the 〈◊〉 of penance onelie by their iurisdiction and right of regiment and then by their onelie letters to giue them in absence peace and pardon of their inioyned penance againe Saint Cyprian and all his honorable fellowes shall answere you in the same place for there they giue a reason of that their proper right Quia ipsepermisit qui legem dedit vt ligata in 〈◊〉 is etiam in coelo ligata essent solui autem possent illic qui hic prius in Ecclesia soluerentur That is to saie he doth permit vs who made this lawe that whatsoeuer we bound on earth should be bound in heauen and those thinges should be loosed in heauē aboue which the Church here beneath releaseth before Let vs therefore be bolde also to answere our aduersaries with the said holie Fathers if they aske vs by what right the Pope or Bishoppe giue pardon or what is that he doth forgiue by his pardon let vs answere for them and for our Mother the Church that they pardon onelie the penance inioyned or other paine due for greeuous sinnes after they be remitted in the sacrament of penance And that they maie so doe by good authoritie we alleadge Christes owne worthines with the named holie Fathers whatsoeuer you binde in earth it shal be bound in heauen and if you loose it in earth before it shall also be released in heauen But vpon this practise of Gods Church I will charge them further hereafter FVLKE This authoritie of Saint Cyprian is no more necessarie then the former of Chrisostome Augustine Ambrose For we doubt not but the Church with the gouernours thereof haue sufficient power by Christes graunt to release such time of penance or parte therof as is enioyned to offenders to prooue their repentance and to
fundation afterwarde to make a florish in wordes and a vaine 〈◊〉 of confirming your foundation As in this cause it had beene moste necessarie if the compasse of your cause could haue borne it to haue first prooued substantiallie that there remaineth temporall punishment after sinne remitted to satisfie the iustice of God Then that the iustice of God not satisfied by the act of Christs sacrifice on the crosse may be satisfied afterward Thirdlie the meane wherby it may be satisfied which you cal the treasure of the Church fourthly that dispensation therof belongeth to the pope these things once prooued the way had beene plainner to bring in the Popes pardons for proofe of which to be good you haue plaide the proctour all this while But these matters must be daintelie touched the compasse of your cause can not abide to haue them thoroughlie handled And therefore it is sufficient to affirme them for other proofe you haue none of them And yet as though you brought with you noe worsse then mathematicall demonstrations you blow the trumpe afore hand to giue more light to the matter the greater ouerthrow to falsehood to driue the cause forward and weigh the wholl state of things And what saie you to the purpose forsooth you tell vs that there be three kindes of punishment of mans sinnes after they be remitted But sir wee beleeue you not where is your demonstration Why Is it not sufficient that M. Allen saith so what an vnrea sonable man are you that will not learne to abide the orderlie methode and compasse of the cause well seeing we muste haue none other proofe of your sayings let vs see what you say first the fruites of repentance which man chargeth himselfe with all are none What those be I know not except it be some superstitious vowes and such like matters but the fruites of repentance which God chargeth a man withal be so necessarie to be brought forth that otherwise the repentance is fained and thereof followeth no remission Againe ciuill punishment is none and yet nothing is more like to prooue that purpose what is it then The first easiest is that penance which is enioyned in secret confession In deed that is easie and such as may encourage men to commit sinnes for which they make so easie satisfaction toties quoties But what is the effect of this satisfactió It standeth for a full satisfaction before God when it is accomplished What alwaie Nay often times if it be any thing correspondent to the crimes Then is there no certaintie in this matter but in steede of a quietnes of conscience a torment followeth vpon it if the sinner be not assured that his penance enioyned will goe for paiement or satisfaction Well when this easie penance is a full satisfaction whence taketh it so great force you answere small workes by force of the sacraments are verie effectuall But to prooue this patch of Poperie to be a sacrament what daie wil you take for that which is the grounde of al your disputation is denied of vs as you know So that hetherto but by petion of principles you get nothing ALLEN The second way of punishment is appointed by the Canons generallie for such faultes as be committed after Baptisme that is to saie by the lawes of the Church or Decrees of Bishops and chiefe Magistrates thereof and is called Canonicall satisfaction Which is much more sparpe and greeuous then the other that in priuate penance is commonlie giuen and a great deale more answerable to Gods iustice and the greeuousnes of the crimes committed And so the Canons were not onelie prescribed as some iudge not right of them for open offences to satisfie the Church and the offence of the people but also euen for secret sinnes as we may perceiue by Saint Augustine Tertullian and other that haue written of penance And this waie prescribed satisfaction by the auncient decrees of Councells which lightlie appointed seuen yeares of penance for euerie deadelie sinne was almost a rule for such as heard secret confessions to moderate their penance by which they lightlie gaue to the penitents euen after the limitation of the saide decrees auncient Canons Now to giue so many yeares or daies of penance signifieth the iniunction or prescriptions of fasts by certaine weekelie thoroughout the said prefixed times or continualfasting from moste meates euerie daie in all those yeares of penance other then would suffice for susteining of nature as bread and water and such shinne diet which 〈◊〉 bodie in this fall of our strength and manners could now scarse beare with this continuall mourning in outward behauiour of countenance speach and apparell and which was the greatest of all necessarie abstinence from the holie sacrament till the said penance was accomplished And this great penance was in the Primitiye Church prescribed by the Canons not onelie for cautell and prouision for the like sinnes afterward to be committed then when the Church had her punishment for sinnes seuerall from the paines appointed by the ciuill lawes for the same but also for the satisfiyng of gods iustice for the penitents sinnes the burden whereof then was counted as indeede it is so intollerable that neither the Church spared to enioyne great satisfaction nor the offenders refused to receiue and accomplish the same with humilitie This therefore is the second waie of punishment or prescription of penance for mortall sinnes remitted or in waie to be remitted by the penance of the partie In which kinde you may account also the seuere punishments which concerne the soull moste although sometimes they are ioyned vnto some corporall afflictions as excommunication suspension degradation such like for al these were vsual in the beginning of Christian daies for correction of sinne FVLKE Canonical punishment as we heard latelie in the next Chapter before was vt satis fait Ecclesiae to make satisfaction to the Church and not to the iustice of God who accepteth a contrite and an humble heart thorough the vertue of Christs death and passion as a full satisfaction to his instice You saie the Canons were not onelie prescribed as some iudge not rightlie of them for open offences to satisfie the Church the offence of the people but also euen for secret sinnes But how is this prooued that you saie you tell vs that we may perceiue it by S. Austine Tertullian and others that haue written of penance If it be as you saie why be not their sayings set downe and we with them that iudge not rightlie conuinced by them At lest why be not the places quoted where we may perceiue such a matter belike the compasse of the cause cannot abide it as also you sate this fal of our strength and manners could scarse beare such streight penance as by the Canons is prescribed You ioyne two things together of diuerse natutes If the strength of mans bodie be so greatly fallen as they are not able to endure such hard punishment
the Church should of dutie initigate the rigor of those Canons and not send men to secke pardons for them Whereas many a man that hath needc lacketh either monie or other occasions to purchase pardons but if the manners of men be so dissolute as they like not streight penance they are more dissolute vnto sinne and so had need of the bitte of streighter penance to keepe them in then the raine of pardons and easie penance to let them runne You repeat againe that this penance Canonicall was appointed not onelie for cautele and prouision against the like sinnes but also for satisfying of Gods iustice But hereof no proofe at all but a bare affirmation ALLEN The third waie of punishment of temporal sinne is by Gods owne hand as when he striketh some by sickenes 〈◊〉 by temporal death or by the paines of Purgatorie which 〈◊〉 a place of temporal satisfaction correction of the soule only in the next life Thus were diuers of the Corinthians cast into infir mites manie striken dead and further also punished in the next world in the place of iudgement there not eternal but transitory because they would not iustly iudge and correct themselues And which is much to be noted for our purpose the Apostles also had authoritie giuen them to punish the offendours often by bodelie vexation and death sometimes that they might thereby make true shew and proofe to all the world that they and their successours had iurisdiction ouer the soules of men whiles they made it euident by manifest signes wrought in the face of all the world euen vppon the bodies themselues which are not so properlie subiect to the gouernours of the Church as the soules of the faithfull be though their bodies to for the soules sake be subiect to the said power And not withstanding the same miraculous force in correcting sinners did cease afterwardes yet the like power ordinarilie to be exercised by giuing penance and seperating from the Sacraments remaineth in the Churches right still And here we maie not thinke that the killing of diuers as well by Gods owne hand amongest the people of Israell in Moset time as of other that died of diseases for punishment of vnworthie receiuing the Sacrament in Saint Paules daics or sleaing of Ananias and his wife by S. Peters hand manie moe perhapes whereof there is no talke in the text we maie not deny I saie that these were all killed either of God or Christes Apostles to eternall damnation but rather for their temporall correction and the auoiding of Gods iudgements to come especiallie where anie of them did repent them of their fault before their deserued death came vpon them FVLKE That God striketh by sicknes or temporal death his children sor their chastisment and example of others it is verie certaine but that he sendeth anie into purgatorie or punisheth for satisfaction of his iustice I must stil denie vntil I see it plainly proued Neither do I finde that the Corinthians which neglected to iudge themselues in this life were punished with anie transitorie punishment in the next world That the Apostles had authoritie to aftlict mens bodies prooueth not that they or their successours had iurisdiction ouer mens soules But their spirituall power is otherwise sufficiently testified as well in retaming sinnes as in casting out of the Church such as teeme by gentler discipline incorrigible Concerning all those that haue bin or be striken with the hand of God with temporall death we leaue the iudgement to him selfe If they did trulie repent before their death we haue sure testimonie that God hath receiued them to mercie But hereof it followeth not that their temporall punishment was a satisfaction of Gods iustice neither-saith Saint Hierome anie such thing ALIEN Now by these three diuers waies of correction for sinnesremitted no doubt the Pardons of Gods ministers must be limited and vnderstanded so that whosoeuer giueth a pardon lawfully he must either discharge the penitent of the punishment which his Ghostlie Father enioyned him or that the olde lawes of most holie Councels charged the like offenders withal or that God himselfe enioyned sometimes in this world but especiallie in the next life where god more exactlie properlie punisheth both for sins remitted not remitted If the pardō be large it taketh awaie the whole pain if it be otherwise it determineth the number of daies and releaseth not all but part of the pennance onelie that is to saic so manie daies or yeares as in the Indulgence is mentioned Whereof no man can now be ignorant if he doe but marke that the penance which the Pope taketh vpon him to remit was also limited by yeares of fasting praying abstinence from the Sacraments and such 〈◊〉 as if your Confessour had giuen you in penance to fast euerie fridaie bread and drinke onelie for some notorius sinnes confessed vnto him then the Pardon for twentie daies would discharge you of so manie daies from your said bond as be named and if it be a free and plenarie Indulgence it shall discharge you of the bond of all the daies or yeares appointed which you haue not before the receit of the said pardon accomplished And this is exceeding plaine for the two first kindes of punishments which we said were adioyned for satisfaction by the Churches lawes and by the confessours prescription For they stood vpon daiet and yeares so the remission of the same must needes keepe the like forme For which cause you shal see often expressed De Poenitentiis iniunctis in the Indulgence And that forme of graunt remission was vsed alwaies in gods Church For S. Cyprian did remit a great peece sometimes De poenitentiis inunctis of the enioyned penance when he gaue peace to such as fell in time of persecution long before they had fulifilled their prescribed penance and so did S. Paull to the Corinthian that had committed incest And so doth Nice Councel prescribe to Bishops that they should or might at the lest Humaniùs agere deale more gentlie with those that denied their faith in the persecution of Licinius that they might pardō them before if they saw cause though seauen yeares penance was prescribed vnto them In which places that the Church now calleth a Pardon or Indulgence was tearmed sometimes donare aliquid in persona Christi to giue or graunt something to the offender in Christes person and so called Saint Paull it sometimes it was called Dare pacem as Saint Cyprin termeth it in manie places of his workes sometimes it was called Humaniùs agere To deale gentlie with sinners or to shew vnto them humanitie and so doth Nicen and Ancyran Councells terme it Licebit etiam Episcopo humanius circa aliquid cogitare It shall be lawfull for the Bishop to deale more curteouslie with them saith the holie Councell FVLKE First you tell vs that the pardon must discharge men either of al or some part of these three kindes of
punishment Secondlie you assure vs If the pardon be large it taketh awaie the whole paine then it followeth that if God punish a man for his sinnes with the goute or anie other bodelie sicknes a large pardon would take awaie the whole paine thereof Surelie if you would become suter to his holines for a large pardō that would take awaie the whole paine of bodelie sicknes you might doe an acceptable deede and be well paied for your paines But if the Popes pardon be not able to take awaie the paine of one scabbe or flebiting you wil hardlie perswade vs that it can take awaie all the paine of purgatorie if it were prooued that anie such paine or place were after this life But if the pardon saie you determine the number of daies or yeares then it releaseth but part of the penāce onlie as you bring exampls of 20. daies pardon but if the pardon determine the number of yeares to an hundred thousand yeares then this explication is insufficient yet you haue an other quirke to helpe it afterward by stretching it into purgatorie your imaginarie prison But the auncient canons neuer inioyned so manie yeares penance nor neuer did anie Catholike Bithoppe graunt pardon of so manie yeares Saint Cyprian as we heard before with his colleagues determined to release some parte of the appointed time vpon good hope of the amendement of the parties and great signes shewed of their heartie repentance and for daunger of present persecution at hand Saint Paull receiued the incestuous person vnto the fellowship of the Church vpon his repentance The Councel of Nice also willed the Bishops in seeing the fruits of repentance ripebefore the time assigned by the Canons to deale more gently with the lapsed persons But all these haue no resemblance with the Antichristian pardons of the Pope which are not graunted vpon like cause nor by a person of like authoritie nor to persons of like qualites nor to the like end nor onelie of penance enioyned but of such as no man would enioyne beside remission à culpa pana or if not for all sinnes yet for some third or seauenth parteof sinnes or else full remission of all sinnes beside 8000. yeares and 8000. Lentes as in the pardon of Clement the sixt confirmed by Leo the tenth it is to be seene ALLEN Whereby we see this pardoning of enioyned penance is an auncient vsage and counted moste holie of all the Church whereof we make this assured ground and foundation of our Pardons and for the trueth of them we make this argument Saint Paul did remit enioyned penance in Christs person Saint Cyprian and al the Bishops of Affrike did remit penance enioyned Nicē Councel giueth licence to bishops to remit penance prescribed by the law Therefore the Pope by their example as in the person of Christ may remit enioyned penance there fore may lawfuilie giue a Pardon The paine prescribed by the law he may release because he is the principal executer of the law the penance appointed by the inferiour priest in confession he may likewise remit because that which is prescribed by the inferiour may by good reason be vpon considerations altered by the superiour especiallie where the Magistrate hath good meanes to prouide that neither the common wealth suffer damage thereby nor the partiē to whome it doth perteine to be loosed or bounde in penance receiue any losse thereby By like authoritie also doth a Pardon change sometimes a sharper longer paine enioyned into some more gentle penance and more fit and needeful workes for the time and state then beeing as his power that is the chiefe gouernour may be exceeding benefi ciall to the worlde in such cases which euer ought to be practized for edifying neuer for destruction For it is to be considered that the high Pastour vsualite graunieth no release of the debt of good workes or the bond of deserued punishment but by prescription of some other holie worke to be accomplished before the partie obteine the benefit of his remission 〈◊〉 when a penitent hath enioyned him to punish his bodie by continual fasting or long peregrination or other exceeding much temporall pain according to the grieuousnes of his desertes the freedome of a Pardon of tentimes turneth the saide due paines enioyned into some easier worke of Christian charitie yet beeing much more to the glory of god beneficial to the Church as the time standeth then the other could be As when the Turke or other enemies of Christianitie doe inuade any Christian kingdome it is more beneficiall to put to our helping hand in with standing his crueltie either by resisting him in our owne person or contributing anie peece of our goods towardes the same then anie priuate Penance that maie concerne our persons Therefore the gouernours of the Church often to mooue the people to such necessarie denotion giueth them a release of all paine due for their sinnes or at least of the bonde of their enioyned penance onelie vpon respect of some smal furtherance in such a good and Godlie purpose FVLKE We acknowledge that pardoning of ecclesiastical pu nishment commonly called penance is very auncient And being graunted by them that had authoritie vpon good consideration is very necessary But it is very yong and new that the Pope should take vpon him though he proceeded no further then pardon of penance enioy nedto release the penance enioyned by the gouernours of other Churches to persons whose repentance he knoweth not for other causes then of auncient were allowed and especiallie for money But now vpon this auncient and accustomed practize of Gods Church let vs see what Antichrist can claime and that is set forth in an assured argument Saint Paull did remit S. Cyprian with the Bishops of Afrike and the Nicene councell doth allow remitting of penance prescribed therefore the Pope by their example maie remit enioyned penance and lawfullie giue a pardon Call you this an assured argument for pardons where there wanteth one leg and that the better leg of the argument to stand vpon Aristotle doth well admonish that in an Enthimeme lightlie the weaker part is hidden and not expressed For this argument euerie man maie lawfullie denie except you adde the Maior that whatsoeuer Saint Paull Saint Cyprian with his fellowes and the Nicene coun cell lawfullie did and allowed the Pope doing as they did maie lawfullie do But then this Maior will be denied and so the conclusion will not holde For the Pope is neither anie gouernour nor yet any member of the Church of Christ. But if he were a lawfull Bishop he might do within his owne charge as Saint Paul Saint Cyprian and the rest with the Nicen councell did and allowed to be done And yet if he were allowed to be a Bishop and would graunt such pardons as he doth to men of other Churches and vpon such occasions as he doth this argument would not defend him because the Minor would not follow
him for neither Saint Paull Saint Cyprian nor the councell of Nice graunted such pardons to such persons and for such causes as he doth therefore he followeth not their example but his owne presumption Yet let vs see how this argument is fortified First the paine prescribed by law he maie release because he is the principall executor of the law But who will allow him anie such principalitie in the Church that is no member of the same Secondlie he maie remit the pennance enioyned by the Priest because he is superiour to all piestes which is nothing but a miserable begging of that which is in controuersie The like is to be said of his changing of penance whereby he challengeth the like authority Although his changing of sharpe pe nance into easie paiment doth bewray what is the end of such permutation money is intended whatsoeuer is pretended Vrbanus the 2. in the councell of Claremounte exhorting men of al nations to the warre of Ierusalem began that release of penance for seruing in that cause which his successours afterward haue vsed as a gaie and gainfull pretense when they were disposed to enrich their coffers and mantaine their priuate quarrels ALLEN The like they do also often to set forward other workes of charitie to the benefit of Gods people as for the relieuing of Hospitals of Churches of high waies and such like Sometimes againe they extende their power which Christ gaue them to edifie his Church and increase religion and deuotion in the people as when thy giue pardon for so manie daies to such as shall receiue the blessed Sacrament faste and praie that heresie maie cease in the Church that the enemies of Christianitie maie not preuaile that infidels Iewes and heretikes maie be conuerted and Schismatikes knit them-selues obedientlie to the fellowship of Chistes folde So doth the Pope for the encrease of zelous deuotion and aduancing Gods honour giue daies of remission or full pardon to such as shall vsuallie haue meditations of Christes passion and death by certaine holie praiers appointed or by visiting places in which there be seene some liuelie sieppes memories and expresse tokens of Christe miraculous workes or his Saintes Thus to helpe vp the dulnesse of praying and seruing God in our daies he geueth grace and pardon to such as shall freauent the Churches at the times of their dedication or on certaine principall Feastes there either to be confessed and receiue the 〈◊〉 sacrament or els to ioyne in praier and deuotion with other the faithful people that thither at those daies haue principall recourse Hereof we haue example not onelie in the storie of the institution of the solemne Feast of Corpus Christi but also in the great generall councell holden at Laterane For this cause also and the like maintenance of holie praier by which the Church of God moste standeth hath he mercifully with singular wisdome giuen a pardon of certaine daies or years to such as should deuoutlie occupie such beades books or praiers in all which things orderlie giuen reuerentlie receiued I see not what can be reprehended of anie but such as are offended with all workes and waies of mercie charitie and deuotion The power and iurisdiction is prooued lawfull the causes why he should exercise his authoritie herein be verie vrgent Gods honour with the peoples commodite exceeding well respected all thinges here do edify and nothing at all destroy all things do stande by good reason nothing can be reprooued either with rea son or good religion FVLKE You tell vs what the Pope doth but neither by what authoritic of the holie scriptures nor by what example of the holie auncient Church He could neuer sit in the Temple of God boasting him-selfe to be God except he had some religious colour to blinde the eies of the world which submitteth vnto his antichiristan power And yet all the world knoweth that monie obtained for hospitalles Churches beades bookes and such baggage all the pardons in a manner that haue beene graunted As for the pretense of setting forward the workes of charitie fasting praing c. is not onelie hypocriticall but also wicked For neither men muste be hired to the workes of charitie and other Christian exercises by pardon of their punishments but exhorted and charged for the loue of God and vpon their duties neither should a sale be made of that which ought to be freelie graunted if the Church had such authoritie For freely saith he you haue receiued therefore freely you ought to giue Therefore though you cannot see in this filthy nundination what is to be reprehended we can see nothing that can be defended where neither the power is proued lawfull nor the causes reasonable nor the end godlie whatsoeuer is pretended nor meanes by the worde of God or example of the Pimitiue Church allowable That not onelie the penance enioyned in the sacrament otherwise by canonicall correction but also such paine as God him selfe prouideth for sinne may be released by the Popes Pardons and that Purgatorie paines may especiallie be preuented by the same remissions THE 7. CHAP. ALLEN BVt now because some may by course of our matter looke that I should declare whether the Popes Pardons may release any whit of that paine which God himselfe putteth the penttent vnto after his sinnes be forgiuen I must somewhat stand hereupon the cause is weightie and much misliked of our aduersaries and some other perchance to that see not so farre into the matter as they should doe before they giue anie iudgement thereof That the gouernours of the Church should remit Canonicall correction and priuse satisfaction with the bonde of penance either enioyned or els which by the lawes spirituall might be enioyned manie will confesse But that their power should reach to the remitting of that paine which Gods hand hath laied vpon the offender of temporall correction that they vnderstand not Truely for this they must be instructed first that the temporall punishment which God taketh on sinners that be penitent though it standeth by the law of nature aud was practized of the laws of nature and was practized of God himselfe before anie mans lawes were made for puuishment of sinnes yet now it riseth prin cipallie vpon lack of punishing of our selues or the accomplishing of such penance as the Church of God prescribeth For if the Church punish her childrens faults by sharpe discipline doubtles it satisficeth Gods righteousnesse and he will not punish bis in id ipsum twise for one fault or if man earnestlie and sufficientlie iudge him-selfe God hath promised by S. Paul that he will not iudge him also that is to saie that he will not correct him with more heauie discipline of this life or the life to come for that signifieth this word iudicare as the Apostle him-selfe doth interpret it Then it followeth that the bond of anie temporall punishment to be inflicted by God him-selfe doth not now binde man otherwise then for the
Purgatory could not at al belong to the iurisdiction of the Church nor 〈◊〉 person therein yet in the life of the party some peece of the debt thereof oral may be released afore hand whiles the partie is in the power of the Church and her discipline ad so it must needs be at euerie time that the Church pardoneth the partie of all satisfaction or anic portion there of recompensing the same by application of Christes satisfaction and his saints For the bond of Purgatory riseth as I haue said vpon some satisfaction and penance to be fulfilled or done in this life the which 〈◊〉 bue either by our paines accomplished to the satisfying of Gods righteausnes or o therwise pardoned there is no debt or bond of purgatorie at all the which is so cancelled by thy Church our Mother that it can not be required of God our father FVLKE The Popish Church 〈◊〉 more sabtillie if shee take not vpon her at all either directlie or indirectlie to heale bodilie sicknes by pardons not because men can not iudge so well for what cause they are laid vpon the diseased but because shee knoweth right well that though shee may in the darke bregg of such a matter yet hath shee in deede no such power nor authoritie neither in the fortaken or reprobate nor in any of Gods elect But the bonde of Purgatorie where of there is neither argument nor experience shee may be bolde to deale with al at her pleasure either in preuenting or releasing Wherein I maruell you make the matter so deintie seeing it is holden on 〈◊〉 side that the Pope hath authoritie by his pardon 〈◊〉 onelie to release some out of the paines of purgatorie but also to spoile all Purgatorie and to leaue it 〈◊〉 Your example of the paines of hell that can not neither by God nor man be helped or released hath an instance in your owne schoole of the Emperour Traiane eased of hell paines at the praier of Saint Gregorie if the tole be true Beside Augustinus de Ancona disputeth earnestlie that the Pope hath power in hell to mitigate or release the paines of the damned or at the lest of some of them and that the Church praieth for that ende Wherfore you agree not with your fellowes nor with the Popish Church which praieth for the deade vt liberentur de ore Leonis de profundo lacu that they be deliuered from the mouth of the Lion and from the deepe lake But be it as you saie yet your argument of the similitude of hell and Purgatorie is of no force because we know certainlie by the scriptures that there is hell but Purgatorie we finde not in the holie scriptures as Saint Augustine saith of any third place But by the scripture we finde the ende wherefore Purgatorie is imagined to be forged false blasphemous against the sacrifice of Christ his death and satisfaction which was once perfectlie performed by himselfe and not committed to the application of any other man ALLEN And this mooued alwaies the Church of God diligentlie to prouide of her tender mercie toward her louing Children that they should neuer departe out of this life in any debt of penance knowing well that the residue not satisfied here should be required at their handes afore God in the next life And therefore though many yeares of penance were prescribed to all such as did notorious crimes yet there was made euer lightlie a prouiso that at the houre of their extremitie they should haue peace and pardon and the Churches blessing in the holie sacrament and so departe free from bond of the Churches discipline as far as in her laie might be also discharged of the temporall scourge in the next life as no doubt they were if their remained no other impediment in thēselues So doth Nice Councell moste mercifullie prouide and so doth Ciprian and other fathers of the Primitiue Church that saw in their high wisedome the temporall paine to come much to hang on the parties satisfaction and the bond of the Churches enioyned penance And euen at this daie prouision is also made that no penance be giuen but vpon condition of his recouerie to any man that lieth at the extremitie of death lest he depart hence Ligatus bounde as Saint Augustine tearmeth it whereby the debt of his enioyned satisfaction might be required in Purgatory And nothing in the world prooueth more the Churches doctrine of purgatory Pardons then doth the continuall concorde and moste agreeable practize of these holie acts of binding and loosing vsed in her gouernement FVLKE The auncient Church in deede not acknowledging that shee had any authority to release any punishment to be suffered after this life determined alwaies the times of Canonicall penance with the ende of mens liues as I haue shewed before now you do acknowledge no lesse But if the Church had power after men were deade to release them of any paines shee needed not to haue beene so carefull in that point as shee was willing to comfort the penitent offenders at their depar ture as for the cancelling of all debt due for the satisfying of gods righteousnes which you did ascribe vnto the Church was the proper office of our sauiour Christ who performed that most necessarie worke to our eternal benefit once for all when he did put out the handwriting that was against vs in decrees and vtterlie abolished it nayling it to his crosse Finallie if nothing in the worlde prooueth more the Popish Churches doctrine of Purgatorie and pardons then the continuall practize of binding and loosing iustlie vsed in gouernement as you doe constantlie affirme it will easilie appeare that nothing in the world can prooue at all your blaspemous heresies of Purgatorie and pardons seeing the right vse of that power can be none other then according to the authoritie graunted by our sauiour Christ of binding and loosing but neither purgatorie nor pardon out of that authoritie in any lawful forme of argument can euer be concluded howsoeuer in loose talke or scribling ignorant men may be caried awaie with the flow of wordes where there is no pitho argument How the practize of pardons of these late hundred veares differeth from the vsage of the primitiue Church and in what sense such great numbers of yeares and daies be remitted by the Popes pardons THE 8. CHAP. ALLEN BVt here we muste note some diuersitie in giuing Pardons and preuenting Purgatorie paines betwixt the primitiue Church of olde and ours of these latter hundred yeares which did moste iustlie rise vpon the alteration of ment manners state of things For in the primitiue Church enioyned penance was so large for euery mortal crime that it might seeme verie answerable vnto the nature of the faulte And doubtlesse it may not otherwise be thought but the spirit of God did limitate satisfaction by the Canons as agreeable in all pointes to the debt of sinnes forgiuen which God
olde lawe to prooue that the Popes pardons extend vnto purgatorie is verie farre fett For the priest hood of our sauiour Christ hath succeeded to the priesthood of the lawe as the bodie to the figure or shadow thereof But purchasing of mercie perteineth not to the ministers of the Church but preaching and declaring of Gods mercie wherein they excell the preaching office of the priests of the lawe in more large plaine and cleare demonstration thereof in Christ exhibited borne suffered raised from deade and ascended into heauen not in the matter of mercie or the onelie meane meritorius to obtaine it which is Iesus Christ. As for the discipline of the Church now is not vnlike to the discipline then neither is there anie cause in respect of Christ exhibited that it should be anie Iooser now then it was then For the grace of God which bringeth saluation to all men hath appeered instructing vs that we should vtterly denie vngodlines and worldlie lustes and liue soberlie iustlie and godly in this world waiting for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of the great god and our sauiour Iesus Chist which hath giuen himselfe for vs that he might redeeme vs from all iniouity and purge vs a peculiar people vnto himselfe zelous of good works Thus the holy Ghost describeth the end and effect of the mercie of God in Christ exhibited chargeing Titus to speake and exhort to these thinges to reprehend with alearnestnes and suffer no man to contemne him There is no cause therefore why the sinnews of discipline in the Church of Christ should be loosened or rather cutte in sunder by the Podes pardons which taketh vpon him to release all time of repentance appointed by the gouernours of the Church vnder pretense of greater mercie showed by Christ then was shewed in the olde law But Maises and Aaron you saie procured mercie and pardon for the people and then you bring in the example of paid no breined for worshipping the golden Image of a calse where Aaron him selse was so deepe in that he was no meete person to make intercession for others But in the example you prooue not anie power or iurisdiction of priesthood which doth ser forth onelie the effect of the praier of the faithfull as Saint Iames suth of Helias that he was a man and yet obteined great thinges by his praier Neither doth Moses pray with confidence of his priest lie office which he had not for Aaron was priest both by the law of nature as the elder and afterward by Gods especiall appointment but Moses praieth vpon confidence of Gods promises which were these that the people shoulde be brought into the lande of Chanaon and that Christ should come of the tribe of Iuda which could not haue had their effect if all the people had beene destroied though a great nation had beene made of Moses He strengthneth his faith also by two other reasons in his praier the one of the glorie of God which should be blasphemed by the Egyptiens if the people were destroyed in the wildernes the other of the benefites of God alreadie bestowed vpon the people which should be in vaine if the people shoulde thus sodenlie be consumed But of claiming it with confidence of his priesthood and requiring it as by his iurisdiction and office there is no mention For what iurisdiction or office could he haue to controll God in his iudgements And therefore it is a horrible blasphemous saying that God in a manner was at that point with them that he would pardon and punish at their pleasures Where your meaning is yet more biasphemous that God should much rather he at that point now to pardon and punish at the Popes pleasure which is nothing els but to exalte Antichrist aboue God when his iustice and mercie should depend vpon that deuill incarnates pleasure Yet for reason to excuse this blasphemie you saie that God maketh as it were meanes to Moses that he shoulde not staie him nor his anger from punishing of the offenders Let me alone Moses saith our Lord and suffer me to be angrie But who is so meanlie exercised in the scriptures that he doth not acknowledge that this speech of God as a thousand more in the scriptures is vttered after the affection and infirmitie of man whereof God is moste free yet condescending to the weakenes of mans vnderstanding often vseth so to speake Of which phrases of speech who so shall conclude as you doe maie inferre an hundred horrible heresies and more The true sense therefore of those wordes is that the people indeede had deserued to be destroied but that he had otherwise determined at the praier of Moses and for those causes which his spirit instructed Moses to vtter whome by this speech he prouoketh and stirreth vp to pretie for the people he was purposed to pardon and spare them not that he euer was of minde to submitt his iustice and mercie to mens pleasure in such sorte as he shoulde be driuen to make meanes to men that he might execute his iudgementes and shew his mercie both which he doth according to his owne moste free wil moste excellent wisdome and incomparable glorie ALLEN So when his sister Marie was punished by a leprosie for enuying at her brothers authoritie he cried vnto our Lorde and said Lorde God heale her againe of this disease and of his mercie so he did inioyning onelie vnto her seuen daies separation Aaron also procured pardon for the people by the like force of his praier and prieslhood when by sedition the people had highlie offended God yea he did as it were limitte and moderate Gods appointed punishment that his wrath should extend no farther but to the deslruction of a certaine number For when God said vnto Moses and Aaron depait you hence from amongst this people for euen now will I consume them Vpon which worde streight the destruction began and grew verie sore a flame of fire pitifullie consuming them But Aaron out of hande with his incense ranne to that parte where the plague of Gods ire wasted moste and there censed vp towardes heauen and carnestlie requested for the people and so placing him euen iust betwixt those that were slaine and the residue that were aliue the wrath and indignation of God ceassed FVLKE Moses by his praier obteined of God that he did heale his sister of her Ieprosie Ergo the Pope by his pardons maie release men of the punishment laide on them by God when in his pardons he vseth not humble praiers but standeth vpon his power and iurisdiction vpon the power of Peter and Paul and in paine of their indignation beside Gods wrath and sometimes moste presumptuouslie commaundeth the angels to execute his pleasure But whereas God enioyned to Marie seuen daies separation you should haue made your argument somewhat more probable if you could haue shewed out of the scripture that Moses by his pontificall iurisdiction released those daies or anie part
pardon of all that was past but made him his substitute in earth and chiefe pastour of all his flock FVLKE If a pardon can not take awaie penance then you recant that you defended before so egerlie If the debt of penance maie be taken awaie by the Popes pardon as you tolde vs oft before he can not iustlie be saide to neglect penance which doth not performe it because that is pardoned which he was content to haue performed if he had not bene pardoned If he be charged for omitting his dutie that performeth not his pardoned penance then were he as good to haue no pardon at all If a pardon serue onelie for them that lack time and space to satisfie then no man can haue benefite of a pardon in this life Beside the pardons are false that promise to all men that goe on such voyage or pilgrimage or saie such a praier or praie on such beades or giue to such a building or hospitall full remission à poena culpa or so manie yeares or lents of pardon de penitentiis iniunctis iniungendis of penance inioyned or to be inioyned Beware therefore left while you vrge so earnesthe the necessitie of penance to be performed you fight against Popes pardons which you tooke vpon you to maintaine And whereas you take vpon you by your aduertisement as it were to inioyne or commute penance where the Pope hath pardoned the sinne you doe in effect make frust rate the Popes pardon as the glosse vpon the bull of Pope Boneface 8. doth shewe where he saith That the Pope declared consistorialiter that his penitentiarie ought to inioyne nothing more then is inioyned in his pardon for ets as he saide the pardons should be made frustrate And whereas you presume to prescribe the change of one penance into another the Pope doth that alwaies in his pardon or els it is not of force as the same glosse teacheth that there must 4. thinges 〈◊〉 as principall to make a pardon effectuall Authoritie in the graunter capacitie in the receiuer godlines in the end profitablenes in the worke Now this worke into which the Pope chaungeth all penanceremitted though it be neuer so small yet being profitable to the honour of God or the exaltation of faith is sufficient without anie other supplie because in a pardon saith he not the quantitie but the kinde of the worke is considered by reason that a pardon principallie respecteth grace and not merite or els it should not be called a pardon For which cause also they that dwelled at Rome and visited the Churches in Rome appointed by the Popes pardon had as great Indulgence as they that came with great cost and trauell out of the furthest partes of Scotland or Ireland If this that the glosse writeth be currant poperie then doth your aduertisement differ from the iudgement of the Popish Charch and of the Pope himselfe But whereas you affirme that Christ gaue the Pharistes in charge to purge their sinnes by almes and that almespurgeth ventall sinnes you speake more then the text alloweth For Christ teacheth not the Pharisies to purge anie sinnes with almes but after he hath rebuked their hypoctisie that were carefull to make cleane the outside of the cuppe or platter when the inward parte of their heart was full of rauine and wickednes he prescribeth them the contrarie practise to purge the inward man by repentance and to testifie the same by almes which is contrarie to rapine spoyling and then all the creatures of God should be cleane vnto them although they vsed no such superstitious washing with water And if it be as you saie that not onely veniall sinnes but also the temporall debt that remaineth for deadly crimes after they be remitted be forgiuen by saying the Pater noster who is so foolish to paie anie monie for a pardon or what meaneth the Pope to make such a bragge of his pardons which can remiit no more then euerie man maie obteine at home by saying his Pater noster As for hearing of Masse taking their rightes if it be no more worth but to make men fit to receiue fruitfullie the Popes pardon they be litle worth sceing the pardon it selfe as in all this chapter you labour to prooue is but of small profite and the Pater nosier saying is as good as anie pardon Finallie where Saint Hilarie Saint Cyrill saie that Christ caused Peter to wipe away the blot of his treble denying with a treble confession neither of them both saie that Christ made him his substitute on earth chiefe pastor of all his flock otherwise then he made euerie one of the other Apostles ALLEN If it stand thus therfore with the partie penitent then the Popes pardon shall vndoubtedly be beneficiall vnto him otherwise either not at all or els nothing so much as they seeme so sound For although it be an old saying quod indulgentie tantum valent quantum sonant that Indulgencies be of as great force and valour as the forme of their wordes do import yet that is not otherwise to be vnderstoode then there where there maie seeme iust cause of graunt to the giuers and not euill disposition in the receiuers For as Adrianus that once was Pope himselfe reasoneth If the magistrates of the Church may not without iust cause giue dispensation cōcerning vowes othes fastes mariages or such like nor dispose the temporall treasures of the Church without reasonable cause then may not surelie the Byshops be lauish of the treasure of Gods house which is much more pretious whereof there can be no man partaker that is an vnprofitable member of the bodie FVLKE If the partie penitent be so qualified as he need not the Popes pardon then it shall vndoubtedlie be beneficiall to him But the Pope will not haue the power of his pardons to be so much extenuated nor his liberalitie restrained to so fewe persons nor to so narrowe a case And that olde saying Indulgentiae tantum valent quantum sonant pardons be of as great valour as the forme of the wordes doe import shall be taken for a good principle in the Popes consistorie when you with your new prouisoes shall be taken for a curious and a daungerous Papist The glosse vpon the first pardon of Iubelie graunted by Pope Boneface the 8. determineth idoneitie or capacitie in the receiuer that he be a member of the Church and purged from the fault Oportet quòd capax indulgentiae sit purgatus à culpa quòd sit in contritione ille ergo est habilis indulgentiam recipere qui est verè penitens confessus It behooueth that he which is capable or meet to receiue a pardon be purged from fault which is brought to passe in contrition he therefore is able to receiue a pardon which is truclie penitent and confessed The like saith Augustinus de Ancona Ex parte recipientis requiritur quòd habeat fidem in intellectu quia non nist
to shewe me the first vser therof much lesse that it was euer controlled by any man that euer was counted Catholike it may be measured according to the necessitie of the time and so as the Church may be most edified FVLK I. The qualification that you now prescribe differeth not a litle from that seueritie of your former exacting of penance or at the least a counterpoise thereof to make pardons beneficiall That the decale of deuotion should make pardons more common in these latter times there is no reason but rather that pardons should cause deuotion to decaie For the nature of men is to be best affected to that which is moste easilie obteined and where there is hope of impunitie to be lesse carefull in offending But you would haue pardons seeme to be as olde as Gregorie the first by authoritie of Pantaleon a Lutheran who could not know what Gregorie did but by relation of other stories why doe you not therefore cite some auncient credible storie that iustifieth as much of Gregory For Pantaleon doth not aduouch what Gregorie did but what the late popish writers ascribe vnto him But though it be not auncient to graunt such pardons yet you saie it is cleare that the thing itselfe is lawfull although of this clearenes you haue as yet made no demonstration You saie further that no Protestant is able to shewe you the first vser thereof If that were true yet thereby pardons are neither prooued auncient nor lawfull But what if Gregorie were named For I will not name Boneface the eight seing you make challenge of Gregorie whome can you shewe that vsed to graunt such pardons before him Although in trueth you are not able to prooue that Gregorie graunted such pardons oranie Pope after him for 400. yeares Your third assertion that these manner of pardons were neuer controlled by any man that euer was accounted Catholike is a sophisticall caption and petition of the principle For manie are true Catholikes that are not so accounted and the Pope with his papists challenge to be accounted the onely Catholikes which of all other are the greatest heretikes ALLEN And thankes be giuen to God the effect of the loue of Indulgences and the contrarie issue of the contempt thereof doe well prooue the Churches good meaning therein For if you view both parties well you shall perceiue more profitable deuotion more Christian charitie more furtherance of common wealthes causes in that side that feareth paines for their sinnes with the Prophet Dauid euen after they be remitted and therefore seeke for all meanes moste humblie by mans ministerie to receiue mercie in one yeare you shall see in these deuoute persons more fruites of repentance then in a wholl old mans life can be found in all the other side that contemptuouslie disdaine or scornfullie deride the moste profitable vsage both of penance and pardons in Gods Church Therefore in so great proofe of the benefite that proceedeth from this kinde of remissions for so Alexander the third aboue foure hundereth yeares since termed Pardons vsed then to be giuen in dedication of Churches and vpon moste assured groundes that it well agreeth both with Gods worde and practise of the primitiue Church and neuer condemned of anie but of such as be themselues worthely condemned of other great heresies and errors the Magisirates will shew mercie still in Christes behalfe and all the holie Byshoppes succeeding lawfullie the Apostles of Christ will giue peace and benediction to such as humblie aske it at their handes and if the parties be worthie their peace by Christes promise shal rest vpon them if they either contemne it or be vnworthie of it then no harme done it will returne to the giuers againe FVLKE Although this argument of the effectes especialie when they are assigned to a wrong cause is no sufficient proofe of the lawfullnes of a thing where an euent is taken instead of an effect yet doe we vtterlie denie this assumpt that more profitable deuotion ' more Christian charitie more furtherance of common wealthes is in them that holde of pardōs then in them that vpon true confidence of Christs satisfaction doe despise them Let the experience of the six yeares of Kings Edwards reigne and the fiue and twentie yeares of her Maiesties moste Godlie and prosperous royall gouernment make triall decide the controuersie in the erection of of hospitalls prouiding for the poore setting vp of schooles and amplifying of the vniuersites relieuing of straungers redeeming of captiues such other workes of Christian charitie fruites of repentance in which although it must be cōfessed to our shame that we haue bene more slacke then our holy profession requireth yet will we giue ouer the aduantage offered of one yeare against fourescore and ten which is an olde mans age and ioyne issue vpon equall time of Queene Maries reigne or any other time of Poperie since pardons haue beene in price Prouided that the maintenance of superstition and Idolatrie in which the worlde hath alwaies beene mad be not accounted a Christian worke or fruite of repentance Ad hereunto that such workes as haue beene done by ours proceeded of a free loue to God and thankefullnes for his mercy not of a seruile feare or couetous desire of reward wherin mē shew the loue of themselues more thē the loue of god That Alexander the 3. who was somwhat aboue 400. yeares ago calleth pardōs vsed to be giuen in dedicatiō of churches remissions it prooueth no more the fulnes of thē then that it is not lawful for the pope to tread vpon the Emperors necke as the said Alexander did vpon the Emperor Frederike before the gate of S. Marks church at Venice But by the same rescript or de cretal epistle of Alexander the third in which mention is made of remissions it appeareth that such pardons were then but new come vp because the Archbishop of Canterburie could not resolue himselfe neither by his owne learning nor by the clergie of all Englands iudgement how farre they did extend therfore was faine to send to the Pope of Rome for the resolution It is in the decretals of Gregory in the title by you named cap 4. inscribed Arch episcopo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Quòd autem consisluisti vtrum remissiones quae siunt in dedicationibus Ecclesiarum aut conferentium ad 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 aliis prosint quà m his qui remittentib subsunt hoc volumus tuam fraternitatem senere quòd cùm à non suo indice 〈◊〉 nullus raleat vel absolui remissiones predict as illis prodesse 〈◊〉 modo 〈◊〉 quib vt prosint propris indices spiritualiter vel specialiter indulsirunt To the Archbishop of Canterburie Whereas thou didest aske me counsel whether remissions which be graunted in the dedication of Churches or to them that confer to the building of bridges doe profit any other then them which are vnder their iurisdiction that doe remit this we will thy brotherhoode to holde that where is
none can be bound or absolued but of his owneiudge we thinke that the foresaid remissions doe profit them onelie to whome that they might profit their owne iudges haue spirituallie or speciallie graunted Also the glosse vpon this decretall the author whereof liued after the Later an Councell saith that it was an olde complaint and yet in his daies verie doubtfull to what purpose these remissions or pardons were profitable remissiones ad quid valeant vetus est querela adhuc tamen satis dubia and rehearseth foure seuerall opinions concerning the validitie of them Some saie they auaile onelie towarde God but not toward the church Secondlie other saie that they auaile toward the Church but not toward God Thirdlie other saie that as they are giuen they auaile both toward God and toward the Church And the fourth saith that they auaile onclie to the remission of that penance which is negligentlie omitted To which the glosse addeth his opinson agreeing fullie with none of them all nor with the later Canonists Among which opinions you haue patched vp your wauering sētence of the validity or inualidity of pardons in this Chapter This diuersity of opinions among the Papists themselues argueth that the doctrine of pardons was verie raw and not halse digested in those daies The agreeablenes thereof with the worde of God and the practize of the primitiue Church when it shall be shewed we shal thinke better of them in the meane time you must bring better proofe out of the scriptures for them then you doe for Popish Bishops blessing out of the 10. of Saint Matthew or ells we shall haue litle cause to esteeme them more then it ALLEN Truelie that holypeace which Christ gaue to his Apostles at his comming into them at his departure from them and ells as 〈◊〉 entreth vpon any holie action signified nothing ells but an agreement and peace of mans soull with God and did no doubt purge them from their dailie infirmities which we call veniall sinnes and the bonde of all paine as it may be thought due for the same that in the presense of Gods maiestie sinne might cease and the parties appeere cleane afore his face that had nospot of sinne in himselfe at all as by the saied peace yet giuen to the worthie receiuers by holie Bishopps ministerie some like effect doth surelie ensue I vse this terme of peace when I speake of pardons not because they are preciselie meant in the action of giuing peace common to Christ his Apostles but because I see the olde fathers lightlie call that peace which we now call pardoning and perchance they did allude to that which Christ willed his Disciples to bestow on euerie householde for a kind of blessing Which no doubt was some great benefite and so great that our Master signified vnto them that many should be vnworthie of it and that the fruite thereof should redound to them-selues Which caused both Bishops of olde for Saint Augustine maketh mention therof to giue their blessings and euerie man humblie to require the same on their knees whereby surelie some spirituall grace was receiued and remission either of veniall trespaces or paine due vnto for̄mer sinnes giuen Let apish Camites here mocke and mow at their Mother as they customablie doe whiles the obedient children the discreete and deuout of Gods Church thinke it an high point of wisedome onelie to consider the maruelous direction of our fathers waies in the doctrine of discipline and awe of Gods relgion FVLKE That peace which Christ gaue to his Apostles was the quietnes of conscience reconciled to god and discharged of all sinnes and the paine due to satisfie gods righteousnes for them and the same peace did Christ send his Apostles to offer preach and wish to all them that would receiue it which if they refused became vnprofitable to them But the Popish Bishops blessing which consisteth in shaking his fingers and murmering some wordes perhapps not vnderstood of the people whome they neuer teach what the peace of conscience meaneth is no better then a vilde mockery of the peace that Christ gaue and willed his Apostles to offer where they became Whereas you alledge Saint Augustine for the antiquitie of the Bishops blessing it is a friuolous matter For he maketh no other mention but that after earnest praierhad bin made for patience and constancie of faith in one that was the next daie with daunger of his life to be cut for a fistula both by the partie himselfe a Bishop and many other Godlie persons then present that they arose from praier accepta ab episcopo benedictione discessimus and hauing receiued blessing of the Bishop we departed How can the superstitious blessing of Popish Bishops be resembled to this but onelie in the name of blessing For here is no requiring of it on knees nor any opinion of remission of sinnes by it but onely a Christian salutation or farewell by praier mentioned which all Godlie Bishops and elders doe in our Church vse euen at this daie speciallie in dimission of a Godlie congregation gathered to heare the preaching to praier or participation of the sacraments or such holie purposes which all Christians do esteeme as it becommeth them without making an Idoll of the minister or trusting in the ceremonie confirming their faith in God by the praior and blessing of his seruants in his name in whome is all their hope trust and ioye reposed That the Bishops beeing the highest ministers of Gods Church and namelie the Pope as the principall of the rest may onelie lawfullie giue Pardons and in what sense the soules depatted may be releiued by the same THE 11. CHAP. ALLEN OF the necessarie disposition of them that should effectuallie receiue benefit by the pardons of the Church and of the right intent of them that should giue the same wee haue already sufficiently spoken And now perchance some may thinke it necessarie that it should be opened brieflie in whome this authoritie of releasing the paines inioyned for sinne doth principallie consist Whereof I shall with better will bestow a few wordes because we shall haue occasion thereby to open the common sense of a wholl Councel both learned and godly touching the matter of Pardons in the iudgement whereof assuredlie proceeding from the holy ghost we may with safetie take our rest Of the lawfull minister therefore of these remissions the scripture in precise tearmes prescribeth nothing though the power of binding and loosing whereupon the matter standeth is prooued properlie to be an act of the keie namelie of iurisdiction and externall regiment which agreeth not to the simple Priestes hauing no further iurisdiction but in the secret court of mans conscience Wherupon as also by the vsage of all ages and by the prescription of the lawe it is prooued that Bishops onely or such as haue their authority for the execution of their office may lawfullie giue remission of satisfactions appointed for sinnes remitted Neither were it
other Bishops are restreined to that measure By which it appeereth that euen in that time which was litle more then three hundreth yeares agoe the large pardons of so many thousand yeares were neither knowen nor thought needfull For if they had it had beene great iniurie to driue men of all partes of the world to seeke for that at Rome which they might haue had neere hand of their owne Bishops Thirdlie you would haue vs consider the care of the Church in purging of corruptions But rather by the sequele we may gather that this was nothing ells but the ambition and couetousnes of the Pope vpon whose sleeue the Councell was pinned to bereue other Bishops of their accustomablie practized power all the worlde of their benefite and to rake vnto himselfe all the profit that might come by pardons as for the shamefull corruptions of pardons and pardoners hath beene an hundred times worsse since that time then euer it can be prooued that it was before ALLEN But he that list fullie to see how litle the Catholike Church liketh the abuse of wicked men in these matters and yet how seuerelie shee accurseth all the contemners of this holie function in the right vse thereof let him reade the Decree of the last generall Councell touching as well the vse of holie pardons as the earnest consideration had of reforming all disorder there in and he shall fullie be satisfied in this article if he haue learned so much as to giue ouer the preiudice of all priuate opinion to the common iudgement of Gods Church Being now thus far in our matter that it is well knowen the Bishoppes of Gods Church principallie to haue this binding and loosing by the keie of their iurisdiction to be exercised in the open court of the Church and that the power of the Bishoppe of Rome not onelie by speciall priuiledges giuen by Christ but also by law and prescription of all antiquities passeth in this point as in all other gouernement the tearmes or seuerall limites of all his brethren it shall not be needefull to dispute whether the keie of iurisdiction onelie separated from the keie of order proper to priesthoode be sufficient to giue remission of inioyned penance by Commonlie it is holden that as excommunication and other like acts of iurisdiction may be exercised by the Bishops Legates or Substitutes being no priests or by themselues being elected Bishops and yet neither consecrated nor ordered euen so many Indulgences be also profitablie graunted Whereof I will not now talke because it is not much materiall seeing commonlie they be not graunted otherwise but of Bishops neither so oft of other as of the Pope and neuer any otherwise but by his or other Bishops authoritie by whomesoeuer the function is executed FVLKE The Councell of Trent vnto which you send vs is as much the common iudgement of Gods Church as the Pope is the head thereof who when he is accused not onelie to be an horrible heretike but also to be Antichrist himselfe will stand to the determination of no Councell but such as he himselfe shall allow The grosse impudent cosenage of pardons being discouered to all the world more then 40. yeares before the Pope Pius 4. not able to iustify before his owne papists that haue but mother witte giueth leaue to those 100. thing pages of Tient to restraine the immoderate largnes of them which few or none doth esteem and to stay the sale of them which none wil voutchsafe to buy O goodlie reformation O great care of the popish Church which being challenged for the abuse of pardons can not finde time to redresse them in more then 40. yeares and in more then 2. yeares consultation in popish Councell Touching the other question it is not worth the deciding whether the keie of ivrisdiction separated from the keie of order can do anie thing seing both those keies in the popish Church are false and counterfet hauing no power to open the kingdome of heauen or to shut it ALLEN But this I know will be required rather at my handes the course of the matter giuing occasion thereunto how farre the limites of the Popes iurisdiction who hath the soueraigntie herein doth extend and whether the benefit of anie Pardon maie perteine to anie person that is alreadie appointed to suffer in his soule the paines of the next life and is at this present in the course of Gods correction in Purgatorie and finallie whether the graunt of an Indulgence may release them there of some peece or all their paines as it might haue done whiles they were in this present life To all this I answer brieflie that the Pope may doe it lawfullie whereof there can be no more doubt then there is of the other of which we haue made the plaine argument alreadie though in the waie meanes of applying the Churches remission or the Saints satisfaction vnto them there may be some diuersitie not such as may any thing hinder the trueth of the cause which of all catholike men is moste certainlie agreed vpon but such as may stirre vp mans industrie in the moderat search of Gods trueth and mysteries For the soules departed and being assured to be saued must needs be of the same body mysticall and felowship of Saints that the faithfull be of aliue therefore they may according to their aptnes more or lesse be profited by the holy works and satisfaction of their head fellow members because in euerie lawfull Pardon there is made by the keies of iurisdiction application of Christs holy merits his Saints in that respect as they be satisfactorie to the vse of their inferiour members that doe lacke that wherein the other doe abound Whereupon it standeth with plaine reason and meaning of Gods word touching binding and loosing that the soules in Purgatorie should sometimes be partakers of this blessing no lesse then other that be yet aliue For the deniall of which catholike assertion Leo the tenth accursed and condemned Luther by his letters patentes as euer since his memorie hath beene condemned most worthely of all good men continuing in the vnitie of Christes Church FVLKE A question meet to be handled by the popes proctor for purgatorie seeing in purgatorie the Popes prison is all his iurisdiction For it is meet that he should beare rule ouer his owne creature But in heauen no man hath authoritie but God because it is the seat of his maiestie and the reward of his blessed and beloued in his sonne Christ Iesus whoe hath opened the same to all faithfull and shut vp the same from all vnbeleeuers of whose will and pleasure he hath commaunded his seruants the true ministers of his Church to be interpreters vnto the world The question you assoile as you doe all other of popery that whatsoeuer the Pope and popish Church hath once allowed must needes be good although it haue no warrant out of the word of God nor testimonie of the
manie suppose doth not extend past the compasse of this worlde and therefore that he cannot exercise the acte of binding or loosing which be proper to his power and gouernment ouer anie in the next life though to make sute for them before God he maie applie some portion of Christes copious redemption and Saints satisfaction by the vse of his keyes which there make forcible intercession though they cannot giue iudiciarie absolution FVLKE If the Pope haue not meere iurisdiction in Purgatorie how could Clement graunt the release of soules to be at other mens arbitrement by his pardon Againe how could he be able to spoile all purgatorie which is affirmed to be possible to his absolute power But for plainer vnderstanding of this mysterie of iniquitie and abhominable blasphemie you consider two thinges in a pardon the absolution and the application which later you saie maie be made for them that be not vnder their power whereof it will follow that all Bishoppes hauing the dispensation of the treasure committed vnto them as well as the Pope maie graunt pardons to them that be none of their iurisdiction which by application maie be profitable to them though they be not by absolution But what is this application You answere it is not by regiment but by aide of sute A grosse deuise to turne a pardon or remission into a sute or request for a pardon when in the pardon there is no wordes of praier or request but of concession and graunt But by this pardon you saie the Pope offereth to God the price of Christes passion and the satisfaction of Saints Then haue we a new oblation neuer before heard of proper to the Pope in graunting of pardons Or if it be a prerogatiue of the Pope that he maie be saide to praie when he doth graunt or commaund and offer a bargen ofre compence where he can doe no more but entreate the iudge to accept it no passe ouer all other blasphemies conteined in this chaffer with god I demaund why the Popes praier should be heard rather then the praier of other Byshops and priests You answere no doubt for his reuerence blasphemouslie applying to the Pope that which according to the volgar translation is alledged to be the cause why Christ was heard of his father You 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 because he representeth Christes person Why how farre is Christ from Gods presence that he hath need to be represented by the Pope The scripture indeed doth often allow that the minister of Christ doth represent the person of Christ vnto men because his person is not visible nor his humanitie present vnto them But that anie mortall man should represent the person of Christ before God and by the vertue of that representation applie the merites of Christ otherwise then he applied by his passion it is straunge and intollerable blasphemie and such as none but a limme of Antichrist would vtter As also it is hòrrible to heare that the Popes keies in porgatorie should make forcible intercession where they can not giue iudiciarie absolution Before we had but two keies the one of order the other of iurisdiction Now commeth in the third keie of suffrage by application which is rather a picklock then a keie because it maketh a forcible entrie where the key hath no lawfull Iurisdiction ALLEN And al this that the follie os manie men so much wondereth at is nothing else but to set before God the Father the death of his owne Sonne and his grace in all Saintes for to procure mercie for their poore breethren in miserie in the next life as the like is done with great pietie in manie other holie actes of religion continuallie practised in the Church for the mutuall helpe one of another And in deede the Church hath vsed these manie yeares to put this clause in such Indulgencies as did in unie parte concerne the departed per modum suffragy as Sixtus the fourth Innocentius the eight and now of late both Pius the fourth and the fifte and all other lightlie in the like grauntes Whereby it is plaine that we are not charged by the Church further to beleeue then that the Pope maie assuredlie release the departed of some parte of their paines or all by the waie of suffrage and sute as other holie workes of Christianitie applied vnto them by their brethren aliue maie doe For it were no reason that priuate persons should as it were communicate and send vnto them their fastes almes and praiers for the release of their paine and he that representeth Christes person should not in Christes name and the wholl Churches applie vnto them some part of the common wealthes treasure to sue for their deliuerie and help to satisfie for them in their lacks This therefore they call a Pardon per modum suffragy as by way of aid of request Which doctrine is most true in it selfe and agreable to the practise of the Church and forme of Indulgences alwaies vsed and maie assuredlie relieue such as departed hence in grace and zeale of Gods house which I count disposition enough in the partie and haue friendship in the world of such as for their sakes will be content to accomplish the appointed worke of the Pardon FVLKE So long as you maie be allowed to saie what you list without profe you may say all this is nothing els but to set before God c. or what you will beside The clause you speake of per modū suffragy hath not bin added of many yeares seing Sixtus the fourth the first that added it liued not 100. yeares before you did wright of this mat ter The cause of this addition was a certaine booke set forth by one Petrus Oxoniensis doctor of diuinitie in the vniuersitie of Salmantica in Spaine containing diuers conclusions contrarie to the Popish Churchs doctrine which by the Archbishop of Toledo Alphonsus Cirillus were committed to be disputed discussed in a congregation of 52. doctors in diuinitie Canon law The first of which conclusions was that deadlie sinnes as touching the fault and the punishment of the other world are put away by only cōtrition of the heart without order vnto the keies The fift that penitēts are not to be absolued before their penance inioyned be performed The sixt that the Pope can not pardon any mā aliue the paine of purgatorie The discussing of these conclusions caused Pope Sixtus the rest to deuise this new clause interpretation of their pardons per modum suffragii whereas before there was neither any such words nor meaning in their pardons but the contrarie to be gathered verie plainlie that the pope had iurisdiction in purgatory in so much that Augustinus de Ancona which liued before this time doubteth not to conclude that the Pope by his absolute iurisdiction may spotle all purgatorie of all those persons which are subiect to his iurisdiction which are all except they that lack merit conditionall and such as may do for them those things for which
pardons are ordeined to auaile and except them that lacke merit sacramentall which are saued immediatelie by the grace of God which is not bound vnto the sacraments But it were no reason you saie that priuate persons should communicate and send to the soules in purgatorie there fasts almes and praier for the release of their paine he that represents Christs person should not applie some part of the common treasure for their deliuery c. I answere wee acknowledge no such communication sending or lending by priuate persons for any such purpose or to any such effect into Purgatorie But if that were graunted yet were it no reason that the Pope where he hath no authoritie should by any colour doe more then a priuate man of the same worthines or merit And when the Pope is a wicked man of life as you will not denie but many haue beene what should his sute or suffrage preuaile whereas if he were twise as great in office as you faine him to be yet where his office extendeth not he should by sute preuaile no more then priuate men of such behauiour That this pardon per modum suffragij is agreeable to the practize of the Church and forme of pardons alwaies vsed you saie without proofe but I haue prooued the contrarie before That you require in the partie to be benefited by this new kinde of pardons not onelie that he departed hence in grace and zeale of the Church but also frendship in the worlde of such as will be contended to accomplish the appointed worke of the pardon you declare that the Popes pardons goe not as Gods pardons without respect of persons but with a necessarie respect of worldlie frendshippe so that the soules of poore men such as lacke frendship in this world are in nothing so good a case as the soules of rich men that with their pens are able to purchase frendship enough in the world So that with you the poore whome Christ pronounceth happie are most miserable the rich euen they to whome Christ maketh the entrance of heauen impossible may haue soonest dispatch out of purgatorie for the old prouerbe was alwaies true in the Popish Church no pennie no paternoster No frendshippe in the worlde no helpe of the Popes pardons for poore mens soules for whome yet the redemption of Christ is as plentifull and effectuall as for the scules of rich men Whatsoeuer the Deuill or the Pope hath imagined to deface the glorie thereof and to make the frendship of the world which is enmity with God to be necessarie for the applying of his moste free grace generall pardon and vndeserued reconciliation A declaration of the Churches meaning touching the common treasure which is saide to remaine in her store for the recompense of such iniovned penance as she releaseth by her pardons with the conclusion of the wholl matter THE 12. CHAP. ALLEN BVt now if you aske me here how it standeth with the iustice of God thus to forgiue the paine and debt of satisfaction which either God or the Church inioyneth for the recompence of the former sinnes especiallie seeing the Catholike Church doth holde that it perteineth to Gods iustice no lesse to punish sinnes with some temporall scourge after it be forgiuen then it doth perteine to his mercy to forgiue the saide sinne and the debt of euerlasting damnation Now if it stand not with his iustice to let a sinner escape whollie without correction or satisfaction then it may much more appeere to be against his iustice also that any power of man should remit release that bonde of satisfaction which Gods instice required and was to the offender inioyned For the answere and perfect vnderstanding of this doubt it is to be knowne and well weighed that in deede no release could be had of such inioyned penance or deserued paine for sinnes past if Gods instice were not otherwise recompensed and the lacke of the parties punishment supplied againe by the abundance of satisfaction made by Christ vpon the Crosse eueric drop of whose innocent bloode and stroke laid vpon his blessed bodie were hable of the infinite inestimable worth and force thereof to satisfie for all debt due to all the sin in the worlde whether it be death and euerlasting damnation or tempor all paine and purgation By which abundant price of his passion and copious ransome the Church for whose sake this precious price was paied doth not onelie holde her selfe to be redeemed from death and damnation and so saued by Christ her head for he is the sauiour of his bodie saith Saint Paull but shee holdeth the ouerplus as a man wouldsaie of so abundant copious and infinite redemption to be a treasure in the house of God to relieue her childrens lackes to release their paines to worke with them in satisfying for their sin and to worke mercie for them also for lack of satisfying for their offences that want being founde in our penance towardes the recompensing of our euill life paste may be supplied by the treasure of Christsdeath that remaineth yet of full force and strength to be applied vnto vs in such our necessities as shal be thought meet vnto Christs Vicar generall in earth other his holie appointed ministers with whome as Saint Paul saith he left the bestowing of gods mysteries For although the holie and precious treasure of Christes paine and satisfaction be of it selfe sufficient to relieue the lackes of all men without exception not onely of those which shall be saued but also for the damned and for the wholl worlde saith Saint Iohn yet no man may be so hardie to claime the benefit thereof otherwise then through such meanes as he hath appointed and by the ministery of such men as he hath placed ouer his householde and familie to giue the Children meat and sustenance in due season not as they shall inordinatlie craue it but as he shall discreetlie finde to be meere for them Therefore where this wise stewarde of Christs holie householde to whome he gaue the kcies of the treasure and sufficient authoritie to fceae and gouerne his wholl flocke where he shall orderlie iudge the offender meete and of good congruitie worthie of grace and mercie there he may pardon and recompense the residue that can not be fulfilled of the partie penitent with some peece of that inestimable treasure of Christs redemption which remaineth in the Church impossible to be wasted and so shall remaine to the vnspeakeable benefit of the faithfull FVLKE This dreame of the Churches treasure the power of dispensing of the same resting infinitlie in the Pope in comparision of a few small crummes left vnto the Bishoppes should haue beene first handled as the foundation of popish pardon if the compasse of your cause and the method of deceit could haue abidden it which if it had beene done manie a one that had seene the foundation to be no surer would neuer haue taken paines to vew the rest of the
there can neuer be anie reason or sufficient cause alledged that innouation of religion should be attempted by force of armes by warre and rebellion by fier and sword by murder and blood shed of good and faithfull subiectes Let this also be graunted for this nothing toucheth the cause of them which to mantaine a law made for religion and to defend them-selues from the crueltie of priuate persons are required by the gouernours of the realme to arme themselues for defence of the King his lawes and their owne liues The lawe of the Locrensians pleaseth him well that the procurer of anie alteration should preach with a rope about his necke wherewith he should be strangled if the audience misliked his deuise The rope had neede to be in wise mens handes where that lawe should be practised or els the Apostles and first preachers of religion in the world might haue bene hardlie handled before they had halfe vttered their message And therefore the Princes and rulers of the word in this our time are wiser then Peter Frarine or Iohn Fowler in not establishing and practising of this Iawe as these men would wish they had But the default thereof saith he hath caused so lamentable an estate of all thinges warres tumults slaughters ruines Churches and townes ouerturned c. Admit these were the effectes as they are nothing lesse of the Protestants preaching what woulde the lawe of the Locrensians haue staied in this case when with the good liking both of the Prince and of the people these preachers haue bene heard and their doctrine receiued It greeueth him that it was free for these preachers without anie feare of the rope frankelie and boldelie to perswade with the people And thinketh he that feare of the Locrensians rope woulde haue restrained them whome the terror of Antichristes fire and tragicall torments neuer discouraged to publish the message of Christ their master Naie they went further from wordes to woundes and blowes they attempted reformation by ciuill warre and rebellion There was a companie of desperate persons that ranne about the strcetes of Parris with naked swordes in their hands and cried out the gospell the gospell as Claudius de sanctes an vtter enemie of the gospell beareth witnes But I praie you M. Frarine were these preachers that so ranne and cried that beside varnished wordes disbursed woundes and blowes If they were not preachers as your author Claudius cannot saie they were how hangeth your talke togither Must the preachers be charged with euerie disorder of their hearers Then let the Popish preachers answere for all thefts murders treasons incests rebellions and other offenses of papists but if anie such desperate persons ranne about as you saie how prooue you that they were disciples of the protestant Preachers and not rather futious firebrands of the popish friers and Sorbonicall teachers by whose seditious sermons they were incensed to murder the Protestants and true professors of the Gospell for how like is it that so smal a number of the Protestants as was neuer able to afford but an handfull of fighting men in Parris would attempt to arme themselues against such an infinite multitude of zealous mutinous Papists as were in that Citie Where the verie Croisters and common porters that I speake nothing of so manie thousand artificers had bene able not onlie to haue withstood their attempt but also to haue chased them out of the citie Notwithstanding if you willneedes vrge your Authors reporte that they were Protestantes why doe you not tell vs how manie they slewe with those glistering swordes At least wise name one whome they wounded with those weopons in their handes when they cried out The gospell the gospell Contrariwise how thirstie of bloode the Papistes their preachers haue beene it is an easie matter to make manifest proofe For that I speake nothing of the horrible massacre most cruellie executed not onelie in Paris but throughout al the realme of France the crueltie whereof would ouer whelme at once and swallow vp whatsoeuer can be fained of the Protestantes seueritie There be manie hundreth witnesses aliue which can reporte that in the latter end of the reigne of King Henrie the second the Popish preachers perceiuing how greatly he fauoured their cause stirred vp the people in their dailie sermons vnto sedition affirming that it was a thing acceptable vnto God and meritorious if anie man should kill a Luthe rane whereupon insued manie horrible murders of which some are perticularlie recorded in historie In the Church yeard of Saint Innocents immediatlie after a sermon when two were brawling as the people came forth of the Church and the one more of spite then of anie cause called the other Lutherane the people streight waie ranne vpon him and pursued him into the Church whether he fled for sanctuary A certaine gentleman passing that waie with his brother which was a Popish Priest hearing that a man should be slaine of the people in deuoureth to pacifie their mindes with faire words to deliuer the pore man from their hands A hedge Priest by and by crieth out that this gentleman was the man whome they sought for which durst defend a Lutherane The people immediately set vppon the gentleman The priest his brother began to speake for him but thereby they were more inraged To be short after they were both drawne out of the Church the gentleman hardlie escaped into the Curats house The poore priest with manie woundes was cruellie murdered saying his Confiteor by which it did sufficientlie appeare he was no Lutherane Not manie daies before that a certaine Sorbonist whom they called the Picardes soule a common trumpet of sedition in those daies to inflame the people against the Lutheranes vsed often to beate vpon this point that it was an holie thing to shed the Lutheranes blood The slaughter of whome as of the Cananites of olde time was verie acceptable to God and that the handes of the godlie Catholikes should so be consecrated Acertaine student which came to heare one of his sermons chaunced to smile vpon his fellow which sat by him an olde woman that espying cried out that there was a Lutherane which mocked the preacher The brutish people no sooner heard that voice but without further enquirie they drue that student out of the Church and most cruellie digged out his eies and dinged out his braines The indiferent reader may reasonablelie by these examples gather what hauocke was made of them that were knowne to be Protestants indeede when vpon so light occasions they that were not knowen nor iustlie suspected were so suddenlie murdered when the Priestlie apparell could not defend the priest who fauoured the Lutherans no further then to speake a worde for his owne brother who was in manifest daunger of beeing murdered while he sought no more but by honest perswasions to deliuer a thirde person from murder against whom there passed no sentence to conuict him of Lutheranizme but the malitious reproch of his