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A36143 A Disputation proving that it is not convenient to grant unto ministers secular jurisdiction, and to make them lords & statesmen in Parliament 1679 (1679) Wing D1677; ESTC R15032 30,674 38

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to be supream Magistrates and Judges under and with the King in the House of Lords and to have jurisdiction and lordship proper to Magistrates and supream coercive Judges and to the Nobility Peers and Princes in Parliament this I hold to be extra episcopal to be a swerving from the simplicity that is in Christ and an undue prelation of Pastors above Pastors and a deformity added to the beauty and lustre of simple Episcopacy and it is a cause of more evil than good and upon a just computation of all both conveniences and inconveniences it will be found a truth that Church and State have been both losers that Bishops and Arch-bishops themselves who have had such external honours preeminences and authorities have been losers in their Souls by them and that it had been better for all sides that they had kept in the station and quality of simple Bishops and Divines 36. The Arch-bishops and Bishops with us have three Ordinations first they are ordained Presbyters then they are ordained Bishops then they are ordained Arch-bishops Now these two last Ordinations are rather nullities and corruptions and do suppose that there is a majority and superiority of power in Bishops over Presbyters and in Arch-bishops over Bishops and the next step must be in the Pope over all For to be a Bishop and Shepherd over all the Souls and Shepherds which be in England is a vice of the very same kind with that of the Popes who says he is Christs Vicar upon Earth and Bishop over all the Bishops and Souls which be in the world which is to claim and usurp the office of Jesus Christ and to attempt the doing of that which is absolutely impossible It is indeed more impossible for one man to be Bishop and Pastor over all the Souls and Bishops which be in the world than it is for one man to be Bishop and Pastor over all the Souls and Pastors which be in England Both be alike simply impossible though the one is more impossible than the other And they do both savour of proud self ignorance and gross affectation and self-seeking as though one man could be in a thousand places at once Baptizing Preaching giving the Lords-supper visiting the sick instructing souls and doing all other the acts and offices of a Scripture-Bishop and Spiritual Overseer of Souls Act. 20.28 To the creating of a Bishop or Arch bishop there needs no more but an election and nomination of him to the place as is done by the House of Commons when they chuse a Speaker His office is no more but to be as the Foreman of the Quest If he have not wisdom holiness and Ministerial worth and usefulness answerable to his name he is but an Arch-bishop in name he is rather a post or cypher than a man 37. Also our Prelates do take upon them to be Ecclesiastical Legislators and Canon-makers to all the Churches and to all other Pastors and they constitute them a Lay-Chancellour and require of all the Clergy an Oath or solemn promise of Canonical obedience to them and their Chancellors They call their Chancellor their Vicar in spirituals and unto him is committed the power of discipline and jurisdiction ecclesiastical over all both Clergy and Laity and the Church-Canons are his Law and Rule which being too crooked for honest men to conform to he spares not to excommunicate them and upon a significavit made by him into the Chancery out comes an Excommunicato capiendo and the party must either go to Prison all his days without Bail or make his composition much to his shame or damage or both And Excommunications and Absolutions in the Bishops Court are bought and sold for money and the worst men are spared and countenanced while the best men are harassed and anathematized and accursed from Christ and his Kingdom 38. Now the Bishops being conscious to themselves that this kind of prelacy and domination and jurisdiction is not good and equal but rather like the Popes supremacy over all and those whom the Holy Ghost brands Nehem. 5.15 who ruled over Gods people by their Servants as now the Bishops do by their Vicars Substitutes and Chancellors but so did not good Nehemiah because of the fear of God They I say being sensible hereof do get to be Princes and Lords and Statesmen in Parliament and thereby insinuate themselves with the Soveraign and with such of the Nobles and Gentry as love to be flatter'd and smoothly dealt with and by this means establish to themselves and to their Chancellors worldly and carnal jurisdiction and dominate over their Brethren and become the Authors of Sects and Factions and hinder the holiness the unity and concord of the Churches and rather than they shall not be Lord-bishop and partial and factious and busie bodies in Parliament Church and State must suffer and the common quiet be indangered They will not endure to be upon equal ground with their Brethren as wise and good as themselves as the Pope will not abide to be touch'd in his supremacy 39. I shall add this one word of caution Though it be not expedient that Bishops be made Magistrates and Pastors trusted with the Sword yet it is fit that Magistrates be Magistrates and not Cyphers and that they do not bear the Sword in vain and that they do back the power and authority of the Ministry and countenance and uphold the sacred Office by being a terror to evil doers and a praise and defence to them that do well There ought to be a due temperament of Magistracy and Ministry that we might lead a peaceable and quiet life in all godliness and honesty Though the Sword is not Go●s Ordinance for the conversion of souls yet it is Gods Ordinance for the punishing of vice and protection of vertue outwardly and for the just encouragement of worthy Pastors and the discouragement of the unworthy Anciently God did lead his people by the hand of Moses and Aaron they both made but one hand And it is a Law of universal equity binding all Christian Commonwealths Judges and magistrates shalt thou make thee in all thy gates which the Lord thy God giveth thee throughout thy tribes and they shall judg thy people with just judgment Deut. 16.18 And as there ought to be a sufficient Ministry in every Parish so also there ought to be a due proportion and contemperament of coercive Judges and revenging Magistrates in Cities Towns and Parishes that the people might have both Law and Gospel means for their Souls and means for their outward peace and safety nigh at hand It was the custom in England anciently for the Bishop and the Sheriff who was then called Earl of the County and was supream Magistrate under the King in the County to go in Circuit all over the County the one to teach the people Religion and the way of good living and to visit all the Churches and the other to decide civil Causes and to chastise and correct
not If they were then what discretion could there be in the people to refer all the Causes within the Bishops Diocess supposing it to be of the same extent and bigness with the Diocesses of Bishops in England to one man their Bishop And what discretion could it be in such a Bishop as among us the Bishop of Norwich the Bishop of London the Bishop of Lincoln c. to take upon him the trouble of hearing and arbitrating all Civil causes controversies and differences of the people inhabiting so vast a compass as his Diocess He must do nothing else but meerly hear civil Causes He must be but a Bishop in name How expensive and very inconvenient would it be for all the Christians in any the least Diocess in England much more in the greatest to travel with their Law-Suits to the Bishop of the Diocess His House then must be a meer Westminster hall and all the days in the year scarce the Lords-day excepted must be term-time with him To think that the Apostle ever meant any such thing when he counsels them to refer their matters to a wise Arbitrator is a gross wresting of his words For he wrote to the Church of Corinth which was but one particular Church Is there not a wise man among you He must be a wise man among them one near at hand easie to be resorted to to whom they might refer their Causes And therefore it could not be that the Christians then referred their Causes to a Diocesan Bishop such as ours And if not then the Cause of our Diocesan Bishops will receive a deep wound and it will make way for an unwelcome truth That the Bishops to whom the people referred their Causes were the Pastors of every Parish the very same with our Parish-Ministers and the Rectors of Parsonages These of the Clergy were the fittest to arbitrate the Causes of all the people within their Parish A Parish-Bishop or Minister may with far more ease arbitrate and compose the dissentions and suits of all in his Parish than the Diocesan Bishop can do of all the Pastors and people in his Diocess 3. It is not the intent and meaning of the foresaid words of the Apostle that Pastors should be imployed in hearing and arbitrating the secular Causes of their own people or of the people of other Parishes I will not say it is absolutely and universally unlawful nor will I say it is expedient in no case at all There may be Cases rarely here and there in Parishes so circumstanced both under Christian and Pagan Magistrates in which it may be both lawful and expedient for the Pastors to arbitrate and compose suits and differences among the people But generally and for the most part it is inexpedient For either he will do right or do wrong If he do right it is well if one side be not displeased and fall out with him and take a grudge against him and either turn from him and not hear him or hear him with prejudice and so by this means the Pastor may be an occasion of much sin and damage and damnation to his Soul which prudence and piety and compassion in a Minister doth forbid and will make him watch against If he do wrong then it is hurtful to his own Soul it is a wronging of the Innocent and a perverting of Justice and a scandal to his Ministry Besides He can scarce do it but with distraction If he do it but a little it will be a hindrance to his other work and distract him much more will it hinder and distract him if he should use it and do it frequently And the words of Christ are considerable and worthy to be thought or Luke 12.14 Man who made me a judge or a divider an Arbitrator between you 4. The words of the Apostle may be well understood in this sense either there is besides your Pastor a wise man among you and one that is able to judge between brethren or there is not If there be refer your contentions and civil causes to him Neither go to Law before the unbelievers nor do you trouble your Pastors and Bishops but single out a wise man among you one that is able to hear and decide your Causes and make him Judge and Arbitrator between you If there be not one such wise and able man among you then it is a shame and reproach to you all What Do you call your selves Saints Do you not know that the Saints shall judge the world even Angels themselves Are they no then fit to judge on earth small matters and to decide a petty controversie about mine and thine between Brethren but Brother goeth to Law with Brother and that before the unbelievers This is to your shame 5. When Constantine came to the Crown and Magistrates became Christians the most expedient way had been to have eased Pastors of all those molestations and avocations and lest the Pastor nothing to do but his own part and the Magistrate his part To make the Clergy worldly Judges and Magistrates is no benefit but a burden it is nothing that a wise man should rejoice in but rather groan under as a pressure and hindrance and pray to God to be eased of it and rejoyce in being free from it and at liberty to imploy all the time which was wont to be spent in such Secular affairs in Religious and Sacred exercises which have a more special tendency to Souls good and are most becoming a Pastor 18. Lastly I will set the worthy Davenant against himself who going about to prove that the Bishop of Rome hath no temporal power over Kings lays down this position Bonum spirituale non postulat ut ulla temporalis potestas a Romano pontifice exerceatur And if not by him then by no other Bishop or Pastor whatsoever Non est enim in ordine ad hunc finem aut necessarium medium aut accommodatum aut licitum aut denique cum spirituali censura excommunicationis ullo jure connexum Spiritual good doth not require that any temporal power be exercised by the Bishop of Rome for it is not in order to this end either a necessary mean or fit or lawful or lastly by any right knit with the spiritual censure of excommunication Determ quest 4. And he gives very substantial proofs I am at a loss how to reconcile him to himself But whether he be consistent to himself or not I lay not my cause upon that the other proofs and evidences do overpower my understanding 19 Now if it be manifestly inexpedient to make Clergy-men Magistrates and grant them civil jurisdiction then it must needs be manifestly inexpedient to make them supream Magistrates and to confer upon them the highest jurisdiction which Subjects be capable of as to be Lords in Parliament and to have equal votes with the Peers and Nobility of the Realm and sit as Princes there to be many days and weeks and months from their Flock and to be
if we were upon a high towring Steeple or the t●p of a Pinacle we cannot look upward nor downward behind u● nor before us nor on either hand but we be in extream fear of falling For Gods sake for your own sake for the Churches sake ease us of these burdens deliver us from these snares let us not be pragmatical and busie-bodies you do not love to hear Divines pragmatical in the Pulpit and why should it please you or us to be pragmatical out of the Pulpit We thank you for your love and well-meaning zeal but you would not have us undone by you and Church and State suffer by us and by our standing for worldly honours and preferment We had rather be pure and simple Bishops and Clergy-men than neither pure Clergy men nor pure Lay-men but mungrels between both simple bodies are the most solid and compact Gold and Silver mixt is not so pure and firm as pure Gold We had rather be simple followers of Christ and Peter and Paul and the first and most ancient Bishops than any thing that man can make us Never fear that we shall want honour countenance reverence and due maintenance while we our selves fulfil our name and place and there are men and Christians among us If we want any outward desirable reputation esteem or conveniency God will be to us an alsufficient good and our very wants will be sanctified to our good Let us go to our flocks and several charges whence we came hinder us not Let us not be advanced in wealth in honour in preferment above the rest of our brethren who be equal with us in wisdom holiness and industriousness and many of them do exceed us We had rather dye preaching and praying and visiting and instructing the souls of our people than dye voting in Parliament and agitating State matters there If ●ou need our advice at any time in things pertaining to the Church and which come within the sphere and compass of our calling we are ready night and day to do the best service we can And we desire you will not look upon us as a divided party from the rest of our Brethren and Protestant Divines in the Nation but that you will in all your consultations about Church-affairs use the advice of the most sound and holy and impartial and prudent and experienced Divines in all the Nation and by all means possible keep the Sword and coercive power out of the hands of such as be proud and lordly and usurp over their Brethren and would set us all on a flame and are plain worldly hypocritical self-seeking men and rather Papists and Infidels in heart than sincere Christians and Protestants You need consultation with Divines for your Souls as you do with Lawyers for your Estates and Physicians for your Bodies But as you can make due use of Lawyers and Physicians by advising and consulting with them in all necessary cases without making them Statesmen and Peers and Lords in Parliament and loading them with secular greatness honour and jurisdiction so you may make all due and faithful use of us as Bishops spiritual Pastors and Casuists in Gods Church by using our advice and consultation when there is need without loading us with worldly honours and making us Statesmen and Peers and Lords of the Realm and Lords and Law-makers in Parliament such things be extra-episcopal They will be small honour and comfort to us when we come to dye and give up our accounts to God Bend your endeavours to unite all Protestants and to strengthen the common cause of Christianity Faith and Holiness against the reigning errors and vices of the times and the most malignant distempers of mankind now degenerate and far departed from God If you find us such as we should not be do right and justice and let no mans crimes go unpunished nor any scandal lye upon the Churches by any person or party whomsoever Fidelity to God to you to our own souls and to the Church compels us to make this address and to quit our hands of all such matters as will not stand with sound prudence and integrity The first and best part of wisdom is not to err and do amiss for then there will need no repentance but having erred the next and only wisdom is to repent and reform that God may forgive us and men may have forgiving goodness and charity in their breasts towards us 25. In case Bishops and Clergy men shall stand for their worldly dignities and places in Parliament and plead prescription and the example of their ancestors and the right of their successors and think it hard measure to be reformed the Soveraign with the Nobles and Commons in Parliament should say to them We are Gods Ministers bearing the Sword and are to be a terrour to evil doers and a defence to them that do well We are to correct all disorders and abuses Let every soul be subject to the higher powers If we find you to be out of your place and calling we are to take cognizance thereof and see that Archippus take heed to the Ministry which he hath received in the Lord that he fulfil it Col. 4.17 As we may not forbear to use your advice and consultation both publick and private when there is cause so neither may we call you to counsel and consultation needlesly and avocate you from your Studies and Episcopal and Pastoral work in Prayer and Preaching and Overseeing your several flocks without cause unto you belongeth the power of the Word and Keys unto us belongeth the power of the Sword If you see any misdemeanours in us do your duty faithfully kill us not by kindness flatter us not to our ruine make utmost use of that authority God hath given you in his Church to edification conceal nothing from us and the people which is godly and profitable for us to know spare to reprove no sin which is a sin and which needs reproving do your duty faithfully be prudent be pious be peaceable be diligent and blameless in your place and we shall defend you and be a terrour to all that would harm and oppose you But if it will not content you to be as Peter and Paul and the holy Bishops and Pastors of old but you will needs be usurping the Magistracy and seeking domination and make your Brethren of the Clergy your underlings if you will needs be pragmatical and busie-bodies and neglect the work of Prayer and Preaching and suffer the souls of your people to want due oversight and pastoral care if you will beat your fellow-servants and causelesly fall out with your Brethren and the universal Church we must not wink at such offences but declare them to be crimes punishable by a lawful Magistracy which we are under God We will hear of no plea or prescription against Piety Prudence and Peace Usurpation domination pastoral negligence and unfaithfulness and gross imprudencies are not priviledges but sins and crimes to say they
offenders and offences and execute revenging wrath upon evil doers And by this means there was much quiet and good living and order in the Realm This course is now antiquated and degenerated into another course not so profitable and convenient for good order and publick quiet and that is the Circuit of Judges itinerant twice each year through the Realm keeping their Assizes at one place only and making all the County to come thither and having a Judges Sermon Preached at the entrance of the Assizes Though the Church and Ministry will stand if the Pastors do their duty yet if Christian Magistrates do not their duty in their place and calling they do so far unchristianize themselves and if they protect the evil and punish the good or think that 〈◊〉 pretence of Liberty of Conscience men may be allowed to blaspheme God to teach Atheism Infidelity and Soul-destroying doctrines and ac● the part of Corah and his complices against the faithful Ministers of Christ God will make them know one day that that was not the end for which he appointed them Magistrates and that they be his Ministers and are therefore called Gods and ought not to bear the Sword in vain and to stand by and see the Church wasted persecuted and torn in pieces by violence heresies schisms profaneness and wickednesses and they be like Gallio unconcerned and care for no such things And the truth is it is no ●●ttle that the due execution of the Magistrates office doth conduce to the success of the Gospel and the promoting of the Ministry and of the Word and Work of God upon mens Souls And therefore though I dissent from the worthy Davenant in this That he would have Pastors to be Magistrates and I would have Pastors to be but meer Pastors and the Off●ce of the Magistrates to be an Office by it self and bestrusted with 〈◊〉 persons who are no Pastors and who may intend it and make 〈◊〉 their work yet thus far I agree that it is most convenient and godly that throughout all the Churches there be in every place an heir of restraint a revenger to execute wrath upon them that do evil and to protect the good that these two standing Ordinances of Jesus Christ and of God the Father by him may stand and consist together and walk hand in hand and mutually support and conserve each other for the Glory of God and the good of Church and Common-wealth And this is no Vtopia or Platonick Idea or form of a Common-wealth which is but a fiction or imagination no where to be found in this World But it is obvious and plain to all and needs not so much any new institution as a restauration of ancient practice and a faithful execution of what all sides agree in consistent with the munici●al laws and sa●ctions of this Kingdom 40. If any shall think I have committed inexpediency in writing against inexpediency and have medled with a point that will not abide to be medled with when I am convinced of it I will acknowledg my error Till then I will stand upon mine own defence and plead not guilty Almost imprudent is prudent If any t●x me of pragmaticalness I answer it is pragmaticalness that I write against and I cannot cure the wound unless I search it to the bottom and apply to it suitable Plaisters Pragmatical Divines cannot content themselves to be Divines in common with their Brethren but they will play the Bishops in anothers Diocess and think it well becomes them to immerse themselves in State-affairs If it shall be said that hereby I cast aspersion upon the Government of the Nation and censure the judgment and esteem of many generations of Princes Parliaments Wise-men Divines and Counsellors I answer That if it be lawful for a Davenant to assert in Schools and publish to the world an erroneous position Civilis jurisdictio jure conceditur ecclesiasticis it cannot be thought unlawful by equal judges for another though not to be named with Davenant to assert the contrary and shew the unsoundness of his opinion though with all just reverence to so worthy a man And in doing this I do but expound the true meaning and extent of the fifth Commandment and assert the rights of the Church universal and the consentient judgment of the best and soundest Divines and the due bounds of Magistracy and Ministry and reduce things to primitive order and simplicity according to the pattern of Christ and his Apostles and the first and purest times of the Church FINIS