vpon your perfection integrity he commeth to such a as terrible Iudge to your confusion where on the contrary we reioyce in his mercy still acknowledging our sinnes our wantes crying calling vpon him all the dayes of our lyâes with the Prophet Dauid and saying if thou O Lord looke straightly vpon our sinnes Lord Lord who shall abide it c. Correct vs O Lord but yet in thy mercy not in thy fury least we should be consumed c. thus we still call vpoÌ the Lord for our deliuery acknowledge our continuall transgressions which are euer before vs as prickes to prouoke vs forward to doe therein our duety that is to aske mercy of the Lord our God who willeth vs to call vpon him in the day of our trouble Vitell. FVrthermore coÌcerning Christophers being at Paules Crosse and the cause why he came there that can my Lord Byshop doctor Grindall declare best For he knoweth he found me in no error and so he there sayd neither had he any law to compell me to come theâher but he desired me to come coÌfesse that I held no such opinioÌ or error wherby the false brute might be stayed which went of me so I accomplished his request therein albeit I coÌfessed that I had in some poyntes bin deceiued by certayne straungers c. now I wish that you would inquire of my Lord doctor Grindall for I thinke he will testify the matter euen as it was Answere COncerning Christopher Vitells being and recanting at Paules Crosse there are many yet liuing that were preseÌt doe verefy what I haue sayd touching my L. of Cant. whom you appeale vnto if y case be so as you haue affirmed then is he worthy great blame to desire any maÌ to recaÌt which is in no error â come to such a famous place as Paules Crosse is Before in the 35. section you confesse that out of the wisedome of the flesh sprang all Christoffer âitells errors and now you affirme that you were in no error agayne in this tractation you confesse that in some poyntes you had bin deceaued by certayne straungers and in an other place you aâouch that by no other mens counsell or bookes you were deceiued such a gift you haue to say ⪠and vnsay to affirme and to deny but the trueth is that you were prisoner in the counter in woodstret by commaundement of the Byshop that then was and there is your name regestred and your comming was not voluntary as you vntruely affirme but coacted by the law Magesârates vse not to desire men to come to publick place to confesse their heresies but the law it selfe doth vrge it and you according to the law for your releasement out of prison did recant at the Crosse and named your error to be Arrianisme whether you did it from the hart that the Lord God knoweth Now consider this man for his credit sake among his deceaued Familye would perswade that such a péece of iniustice was shewed vnto him as he sayth but he is proued a lyer not onely in this but in many other matters verefying the olde prouerb mendâcem memorem esse oporteâ a lyer had neede to haue a good memory And where as you so confideÌtly affirme that you were in no error wheÌ you were at the Crosse the contrarye whereof is manifest I will put you in minde of the disputations and confereÌce that diuers meÌ had with you in Queene Maryes dayes M. Ro. Crowley a reuerent and godly preacher yet liuing who affirmeth that seueral times he disputed with you concerning the blasphemy of Arryus and you coÌtinually denyed Christ Iesus to be God equall with his Father and immoueably you remained all her raigne of that minde and this M. Crowley is redy to auouch agaynst you whensoeuer you or any for you will require to be certafied Also one Ione Agar an olde mayde which wayted on those in office for the Cittye as Mayors and shrieffes did declare to M. Fulkes the Elder and others that you Christopher Vitell whome she named to be hyr cosin had taught her playnely that Christ was not God but onely a good man and a Prophet and that there were men that shee did know liuing that were as good and as holy men as he was and further that Maister Latimer Maister Ridley and others which gaue their lyfâ for Christes cause were starke fooles and did not well in suffering death such wickednes haue you bin the Aucthor of yet now to hould your credit with your Familye you would haue the world beleue that you were in no error but you are worthy the reward of a lyer which is that when he speaketh trueth he is not beleued This man is chosen and found to be the aptest person to be an illuminat Elder in HN. his Family of greatest credit among those deceiued soules a fitter instrument to beare record of HN. and his doctrine then to declare the ioyfull message of Christ our redeemer whome he hath blasphemed denying his diuinitye worthely are they deluded that follow such a deceiuer That man that once hath made shipwrack of fayth good conscience and is possessed with error it is hard to reclayme him but that some spice of that maladye will lurke in him or a worse as is proued true by you you confessed then you were deceaued by certayne straungers and haue you not as great cause to suspect your selfe deceaued now by HN. a straunger in nation and estraunged from God and Christ in his doctrine published contrary to his will reuealed in the holy scriptures if you would consider with indifferency you were neuer so notably deceiued then as you are now for looke into all the workes of HN. what doe they tend to but that he is a prophet raysed vp by God and an elected minister a priest in office by whome God wil receiue all men in mercy With such lyke testimonyes doth he vtter of himselfe and his Familye doe beleue the same I would his credit were not so great with you but that you could coÌpare his saâings with the scriptures and haue an eye vnto âs collections of the same and how he followeth the grossest âraslation of the Bible delighting in that most specially and his allegations applyed so farre from the sence of the holy ghost that a man meanely exercised ân the scripture may playnely see his corruption Many brutes haue bin of you touching your erronious spirite and in deede they that haue truely noted your disposition doe affirme that you could neuer lyke of any publick doctrine which was taught but had alwayes a desire of singularitye such a troubler of Christ his Church haue you bin but blessed be the name of y Lord who hath made manifest your herâsies although you will not scarcely acknowledge theÌ so that the simplest among many thowsandes is sufficieÌtly assâsted by the Lord to bewray and display your manifest impietye and the Lord hath in store of his Church that
your wordes arâ no warrantes ⪠you say I dispise him because he aâfirmeth that he is a Prophet sent of God his person I hate not onely his doctrine and vaine prophesyes I vtterly mislyke and most of all because many of this our natiue countrye of ângland are by him and his vayne prophesies deluded and deceaued and being moued with zeale for my brethren and countreymen I haue bent my selfe with such poore sâill as I haue to vtter his follyes and vaintyes there be many learned in Christ his Church farre better ab e to haue written hereof to whose office it properly belongeth to clense the Church being defiled with heresies yet I take y man to be none ⪠of the Church of Christ that thinketh he hath no office in his Church Yf I dislyke him because hââarth he is a Prophet c. I haue great reason and good warrant so to doe Iere. chap. 23. verse 16. sayth Heare âot the wordes of the Prophetes which prophesie vnto you vaâitye they speake the ãâã of their owne âart and not the ãâã of the Lord we are also warned by Christ and his Apostles not to geue credit to such vaine Prophets and false teachers Peter Epistle 2. chap. 12. There shall be false teachers among you which priuily shall bring iâ damnable heresies euen denying the Lord that hath bought theÌ with infinite places more Since Christ our Lord asceÌded into heauâââ office of prophesing ⪠and foretelling of thingeâ haue ceased in the Church onely the Apostles were ãâã with the spirite of God and by the power of the same spirite foretold of many thinges that should happenâ but it ceased ãâã many haue risen vp and haue prowdly prophessed but they ãâã ben conââned as false Prophetes euen as your HN. ãâã âou say the tyme may come thaâ I shall âinde his prophesies true you put the tyme vncertaine but you haue told your Familye in corners as I am ãâã informed that many of your prophets sayinges should eare thiâ haue bin fulââlled touching the publick receiuing of your âoctrine which are proued false and vntrue although I ãâã beleue it yet I ought not to dispise it you say why I ought to beleue it you render no reason we are forbidden to credite any such as I haue proued In y I ought not to dispise it I pray you shew some cause â tho vanitye tâat be âttereth touching ⪠hiââââference with almighty God ⪠how the power of God coÌpassed him âbout with a ãâ¦ã c. and agayne hâ sayth thâ being of God gaue forth his sound ãâã and spake vnto âe HN. through the spirite of his Loue all thesâ wordes and sayd ãâã there was neâeââny that writ in Christes Church that euer vsed any such vayne and prowde speach I hauâ sayd y it is requisitâ that HN. if he will needeâ haue his new office of a Prophet to be credited that he must worke miracles ⪠which it semeth he doeth as some in your Familye in sadnâs haue tould amongest other matters this is auouched that NH is not ignoraunt in any language no not the learned tongues he hath written an âpistle vnto the Byshops here in ângland in latin I thinke he hath his knowledge and learning by some bequest as a legacy also it was affirmed to me of credit that some of the Familye going ouer into Flaunders to him be tould them of all their message and instructions before they spake such markes and notes you geue out to your Familye to establishe your blinde Prophet You say I ought not to dispise the Dutch language wherein the Lord hath broughâ forth his most holy seruice of Loue. To dispise any language I may not onely in coÌparison of other learned tongues I haue sayd it is rude And was there no seruice of God before among other nations but now brought forth in the Dutch tongue I would that there were no more heresies brought forth in the Dutch tongue but onely this of Nâ but it is knowen to many learned y sundry heresies are written and published in that language to the griefe of God his children You further say that I neuer councelled with the Lord therefore know nothing of his secreates You sat vpon your iudgement seat when you writ this how know you that I neuer couÌelled with the Lord to councell with God wée may as we are taught that is in praying and hearing of his most holy word which I hope in the Lord that euer he will guide me with his holy spirite to doe and performe all the dayes of my lyfe as for your secret Reuelations and Prophesyes I am vtterly ignoraunt of they are things proper to your Familye but not to the Church of Christ. Vitel. MOreouer you writ not right where as you call it his Euangeliâum Râgnâ yet doth Saint Paule say âf ouâ Gospell be âid it is from them that be lost whole minde the God of this world hath blinded c. For it iâ not writteÌ his and you finde fault with the pooâe Family of Loue as though thây dâny it âiâh theiâ mouth keepe it ãâã in their haâtâ but you confesse the Lord ⪠ãâã your mouth and your hart is fâll of bitternes and euen so you deny him with your hart and mouth Aunswere I Haue called a booke which H N. hath published his gospel because it is another and not agreeing with Christ his gospel therfore rightly termed his You would excuse it by saint Paule as though HN. had as good right to wryte and publish a gospel as that shining vessel S. Paul. Whether will you lift vp your prophet so high that with Lucifer he may be cast down as low we are warned not to credite any bringing another gospell he is accursed as sayth the holy ghost there was neuer any godly man since the Apostles time that durst be so presumptuous as intitle any broke and call it a gospell ' therefore your Author hath dealt therin presumptuously and wickedly Now whereas I find fault with the poore Family in affirming denying I would I had not some cause so to doo but where you ad this word poore if it be so you are the cause therof for with your manyfold collections to set out the Authors works you haue in dâede made many an honest wealthy housholder poore as I can testifie and name the parties and you haue beene charged herewith before this time You say moreouer that I confesse the Lord with my mouth deny him with my hart If this be true then am I worthy great reprehention but if it be false then are you worthy the reward of a lyar and slaunderer In deede it is somewhat gréenous vnto you and your patience can scarce beere it that I haue so openly manifested you and your Author yet therin I confesse I haue done nothing but my duety which I owe vnto the church of Christ that the simple may be warned of your suttle snares and deceits wher with
haue bent that poore skill and force I haue to displey these men with their doctrine There are many Right honorable that could better more learnedly haue confuted their doctrine but it is so vayne and childish that simple soules and meanely exersized in holy scripture are sufficiently instructed by the Lord to manifest all their abhommations The simplier sort of these men I take to be such as haue a desire to serue the Lord and yet is their simplicitye caryed away by the Elder sort or stronger men conference in my opinion is the best way to helpe the simple which the Elder sort can noâ away withall least their trecheryes should be espied âdad one of their writers geueth theÌ such a precept in his booke intituled a fruitfull exhortation to the Family of Loue in â sextion But ye shall not contend or dispute with the blasphemers and the tanglers about the scripture nor with the apostates or decliners from vs and our good doctrine or with the selfe conceited wife nor yet with any of all those that bring in variaunce and make breach besides our good doctrine of the seruice of Loue. It appeareth Right honorable by this prohibition of this Elder that conference and disputation is forbidden them especially the Elder sort but the noâces which are not enterid into the secret partes of their doctrine but are caryed away with a shew of pietye and good lyfe which at the beginning is opened vnto theÌ with fly and suttle perswasions that nothing els is sought at their handes but how the man might be made persite in Christ Iesu but after once a step be made towardes them or a tast of this doctrin then bookes are bestowed vpon them which they must reade of HN. as his exhortation his dialog his âpistles the exposition of the Lordes prayer with the Articles c. as they profite in these bookes harder to digest as the Prophesie of the spirite of Loue a declaration of the Masse the holy Lambe the Gospel or âuangâly of HN. c. last of all the glasse of righteousnes which few of this company haue the other bokes more riser printed as is supposed in Flasâders and translated by this Libeller into English as he himselfe confesseth And here I craue pardon in that I haue bin ouerlong to trouble your honor with these repeticioÌs and I would to God that I had no occasion ministred once to name these persons nor this error then should Christ his Church nor no member in the same haue needed to bend their study to publish or manifest the same The Lord of mercy geue your honor all increase of fayth with the trueth of true pietye and continue in you a zeale of Christ his Church with a care y nothing but trueth be taught therein and that the contemners thereof may be put to silence so as our God may be glorified his people edified error and heresies subuerted trueth aduanced which the Lord God graunt for his sonne our Sauiour Christ his sake to whom be honor ⪠and prayse now and euer Your honour to commaund I. Rogers To the Christian Reader CHristian Reader thou hast to peruse at thy pleasure this finale treatise contayning an aunswere vnto Christopher Vitell the chiefe âlder of the pretended âamâlye of Loue and because it was directed to me and aunsereth certaine poyntes of my former boke called the displeying of the âamily Therefore it is very meete and conuenient that since the matter toucheth me neerely and âhargâth me with much vntruth that I defend the cause I first toke in hand which I am verely pârswaded is an honest iust and godly defenâe of thâ puritye of doctrine now taught and pâblicklâ preached which this âamilye spuâne egerly against And although 2. vigilant Pastors haue leaânedly confuted the doâtâine of their Author HN. Yet this little availeth to recall them home to that found profession that some of the once âasted and least they should boâst or vaunt that they haue written or compiled anâthing which should not be aunswered I hâue thought good once agayne to bend my simple study to ânswere this libeller Christopher Vitell whole crâdit amongâst the âamilye is not small Maâuelâ not gântle reader that I being the simplest of many thousandes haue aâuentuâed to meddlâ in these disputable questions more âitter for men of learning and knowledge I graunt but since they haue made their inuectiues agaynst me it behoueth me simply to aunswere wherin I confesse many thingâs are omitted which mâght well hâue bin spoken of and many thinges are briefely touched which should haue bin dilated if leasure had serued me but since I cannot dâe thinges as I would thou hast my goodwill as I could Yf thou wouldest profiâe by reading these conferences it is expedient that thou peruse a little boke called âhe displeing of the Familye the publishing of which boke was the cause that this man being touched therein neerely hath made this Lâbell for aunswere thereunto excusing himselfe of many crimes and as much as in him lyeth keeping vp the credit of their Aucthor HN. whoâe the âamilye would not that he should be touched or blemished no not with a venew but he that listeth to marke how his chiefest schollâr or oldest ângliâh Elder Christopher Vâtel doth with might and maine culleâ and hide all the faultes of HN. as well his âoctrine and foule errors as his corrupt lyfe and conueâsation and how confidently and with a bâasen face he auoucheth that all is false and lyes whatsoeuer is brought forth neuer so probably yeâ with many witnesses thou shalt or it be long haue a testimoniall out of âlaunders of HN his whole lyfe which if the Family here in ângland would be âesoluâd with ââueth shal be vpon any oââasion published in print it nothing blâmisheth our âause although this rude and vnlâarned Aunswere be made vnto this slaunderous Libell but our God therein is greatly magnified that simple men are suâficiently assisted with God his spiâite to confute and ouerthrow this blasphemous doctrine of the Familye so gâosse and absurd it is agaynst all the holy scripture and agaynst common reason And as nothing is more in vaâiance betweene vs then how man is restored vnto that âlisle lost in Adam and his state being regeneâate I haue simply set downe my poore sâill such experience of a regenerat man as I finde in holy writâ feele in my own consciâence And also I haue collected the condition of a regenerat peâson by the doctâine of HN. as neeâe as I could collect by such bokes of theirs as came to my handes wherein if the Familye imagine that I haue not rightly set foâth a âegeneâat man after their doctrine let some of their illuminat Elders if they please set vpright such a one as they will stand vnto So shall the controuersy betwene them and vs soner come to end and tryall which if they refuse to doe then it will appeare that it is not
them patience we beseech thee that they may abide whatsoeuer thy Maiestie hath determined so that euen in tormentes they may witnes thy holy name Graunt vs O Lord our God these our petitions or so many as are expedient for vs thy children for thy deere Sonne our Sauiour Iesus Christ his sake To whom with thee ⪠the holy Ghost be al honor praise glory dominion power for euer and euer Amen A short reply after the order of a proface By the meanes of certayne slaunderous wordes as followeth from C. V. THERE IS NOTHING more necessarye for the reedisying of God his Gospell in a common wealth then foâ euery such vnto whome the Pastorall office is committed With all expedition to beate downe by the aucthoritye of the same word all vpstart heresies And opinions by the which the true Church and congregation Is disquiâtâd ⪠of lâte theâefore as one poore member of the same in a preface To the tituled worke agaynst those which are called the Familye of Loue liking tâeÌ to a Cormorant Fowle was for that I espied By the manner of writinges and imaginatiue prâctise Somewhat slyly couered ouer as the Snake vnder the greene hearbe from their HN. an Onacratoluâ câept in this our natiue Countrye of EnglaÌd through simplicitye But rather I feare me hipocâisie to the bosomeâ of many supposed wise men the more by the meanes of a second Mergus C. V. Whome heretofore by vttered vow at Paules Crosse âecanted as I thinke the same error which he now stiffely defendeth Neuerthelesse sithens which tyme Hath in coâners drawen companyes togethers of the which sâme haue refâained ⪠and others yet tâo many abidiââ I thârefore somewhat to further the goodwil of the Author agaynst that Familye their error and not their pââsons and for the hopes sake which is layd vp in store through Iesus Christ our âord and Sauiâur did by preface ⪠forewarne the vewers of the sayd bâoke to be heedefull of such so pestileÌt a sect who vnder the title of sundry senteÌces of holy scriptuââ Hâue as in a maââ knit fast through the webbe of the Spider Many âely âlyes whose vnstable mindes more wauering theÌ such slender wings haue ben are and will be except the grace of God make them more heedefull so fast tangled that it will be scarce possible to pluck them out I doe once agayne euen as one greatly compelled make aunswere agaynst that which herein followeth by those wâome I hoped their conuersion and not detection whose wordes haue sayd me to be Diueled with the Deuill I doe consider these wordes to bâ sayd to me by the lyke intention as to my L. and maister Christ that he had Belâebub the chiefe Deuill yet wâââe ââue And the reprouers false Their wordes This blasphamous Batman with his slaundering and lyâng blasphemeth the holy Ghost for he nameth the Familye of Loue a Corniorant Fowle And an sereticall sect whereas notwithstanding there is ãâã Catholick Church nor comminasâye of Saintes but the Familye of Loue And herein he condemneth the holy Scriptures the Lawe and the Prophets as also Christ and his Apostles Moreouer he sayth that the Lord his elected Minister HN. is of the seede of certayne sectaries â Whereas his doctrine is altogether agaynst all Sectaries If it be blasphemy to reproue an error then haue I not done well if it be lying to detect a falshode I will reaunswere if slaundering them that slaunder other in one is the fault to this first God his worde doth teach me to defend his Church the Queenes Maiesties lawes her common wealth whereto my conscience aunswereth by the trueth that if you take not better heede you will fall from heresie to treason and so into contempt of your religion Of your loyaltye And true seruice of God of the which take heede for the holy Ghost is iudge betwixt vs both I doe name the Familye of Loue the selfe same as before till I doe perceaue you to be otherwise minded except you vse this policye That when your Religion will hold no longer you will then say we vnderstode not your mindes and so therereby exâuse your follyes You say there is no Catholick Church nor comminaltye of Saintes but the Familye of Loue surely your loue is so secret if we vnderstand it not you much lesse perceaue it but in secluding all that be not of your Family What shall be sayd of all the godly in the world before your HN. whome now to culler doe call the holy name What say you of our gratious Queene Her noble Counsaile the leaâned Byshopâ And disââet preachers of the Lordes Gospell What thinke you of the excellent ouâces both Oxford ⪠Cambridge from the which they are not now to learne of their true loue in god Of your HN. Neither of C. V. Who cunningly hath ioyned together that which we know Christ to be the ouââcommer and C. Vitell the Ioyner to be bât a deceiuer Your Argument must haue an Interâection when you say He condemneth the holy Scriptures the lawe and the Prophetes all which three âââuerence loue and obây ⪠by the Lord God his assistance you ad as also Christ and his Apostles is it enough to condemne any before the cause why ⪠your Vocatiue must haue a Datiue to your selfe be all these except you ãâã the greater heeâe I ãâã also vettrly deny your HN. Hârry Niâholas to be the Lordes elected Minister ⪠otherwiâe then suâferâd to peruert the congregation And also I say to you Chrisâopher Vitell ãâã you ãâ¦ã and while there is yet tymâ ãâ¦ã to God whome in this âtâr you hâue greatly offended your Prince much aâused ⪠anâ many your fellow disorderly ãâ¦ã by your vngodly collections thorow which ãâ¦ã you haue continued too long as to your ease you may thinke So to their payne it may be assured If now your doctrine be agaynst all Sectaryes Then be as good as your word and âly these errors ⪠els as weedes are cut of with sickle and sithe for hiâting the good herbes so must euill membber from a common wealth Fare well Fidem fero mihi fama fuco An Aunswere to a wicked and infamous Libel made by one of the chiefe english Elders of the pretended Familie of Loue. Vitell. Testimonies of Sion of the ââst stone of fouâdatioâ layd therein of âhe iudgement and righteousnes and of the holy priesthood and spirituall oblation through Iesus Christâ brought fourth through the Lordes âlâcââd minister HN. loue Trueth BLessed is he which watcheth for the day of the Lorde which shal come as a theefe in the night Math. 24.1 Thessa ⪠5. Peter 3. For the tyme shall come that the watchmen vpon mount Ephraim shal crye come let vs goe vp vnto Sion to the Lord our god Iere. 31. Mich. 4. Zach. 8. Answere TO what purpose these places of holy scripture are collected I am ignoraunt of because they want dew explication we know that from Sion came the law of
Elders Vitell. NOw for asmuch as there are certayne which make vp themselues slaunderously and reprochfully as ignorauÌt of the promises of the Lord where through they blaspheme the Lord and his most holy service of Loue saying it is the most detestable heresie and so desame and slaunder the Lorde his elected Minister H N. and all those that haue therein their exerciseâ which seeke onely there through and through the lawe of the Lord how they mought liue in that which is godly and manly in all lawfull ⪠and dutyfull obedience both to God and gouernours spirituall and temporall and lyue peaceably and deale vprightly with all men c. Answere WHereas some in the feare of God and loue to his trueth and in discharge of their duetye they owe vnto his Church haue manifested and made knowen to the world your doctrine and behauiour we doe not herein slaunder you wee onely seeke thereby your amendment and conuersion and geue also warning vnto the simple that they may take heede vnto your painted cloakes by which you shadow vntrue doctrine to the peryshing of their soules ãâã are not ignoraunt of the promises of Christ our Lord but to our great comfort we depend thereoÌ neither doe we blasphemâ the most holy seruice of Loue yf you vnderstand by Loue God as often you do confound that word Louââ but when wee speake agaynst the seruice of Loue we meane thereby sucâ seruice and vsages as are vsed âmong you in your priuate coâueâtiâles As for HN. whome you tear me the Lord his elected minister wee dare not so acknowledge him neither thinke him worthy of y name but a sower of heresies almost worn out of vse but now by him reuiued blased vnder new titles and vnaccustoâieâ phrases to amaze the simple And for that he calleth himselfe a Prophet and so is among you accompted wee tell you that the more you extoll him and his calling the more you extenuate the office of Christ Iesus If you seeke onely to serue the Lord can not this be done without H N. or his seruice of Loue Wee thinke that Christ hath left vs sufficient testimony in his word how he will be serued in his church if HN had neuer written And for your dewtifull obedience to Magestrates spirituall and temporall that doth little appeare for so much as you ãâã an Author nor allowâd of by any Magistrate and vse your priuate ãâã forbidden by the Magistrate and both wright speake agaynst ãâã of Christ ãâ¦ã by the publick Magistrate and for your vpright dealing they beâââ now it that are coÌuersant amongst you Yf your priuate dealinges be no ãâã then your publicke declarations I suppose your vprightnes is not greatly to be boasted of Vitell. ANd yet ⪠are complayned of to the Maiestrates with many false brutes and slaunderously reported of where through the Maiestrates are moued to trouble and persecute theÌ yet their aduersaries haue not anything worthy of punishment agaynst them but I see that the tyme is now euen as it was when the Lord Iesus Christ was personally vpoÌ the earth for the Pharesies sayd that Iesus was a breaker of the Sabboth they also found fault with his Disciples because they goyng through a corne fielde pluckâ of the eares rubbed out the corns eat for they were hungry eueÌ so the Family of loue going through a corne field haue pluckâ of eares of corne and rubbed and eaten thereof to satisfie their huÌgry soules the which the enuiers of the loues vnitie haue of pied and are offended at them and haue accused them therefore but other matter they haue not agaynst them and yet they say they are breakers of the law c. Aunswere THe complaynt that good men haue made agaynst you is not to slaunder you but of purpose to haue you and your Family depend vpon the Lord his truth not vpon HN. or any although they boast neuer so much of the spirite of God of trouble and persecution you complayne and yet for your part you are safe inough as for some of your Family whiche haue bene imprisoned and vpon submission released therin no cruelty was shewed if nothing could haue bene obiected agaynst them as you report then was their imprisonment seueritye is it not lawfull to chastice heresies and to punish gainsayers of publick doctrine in deede so you would haue it that euery man might be left to the libertye of hys owne will and so shoulde the world swarine with infinite dissentioÌs and heresies which y deuil doth more busily stir vp now then heretofore It is the gospell and the doctrine thereof that he breatheth out threates against and stirreth vp his to spurne against the same very eagerlye onely because it spoyleth him of his wished pray through the firme faith and confidence ãâã haue in our most tryumphant conquerour Christ Iesus Your comparysons are vneââall because Christ was accused as a breaker of the sabaâth and his Disciples found fault withall that in hunger did rub the eares of corne euen so you as you would gladly haue men beléeue are as innocent of crime as Christ and his Apostles in that you are charged but we tel you plainly we finde faulte with you for satisfying your hungry soules it is for the corrupt meate you haue chosen which in deed is very poyson and wil bring your bodies soules to vtter destruction euerlastingly except ye repent and because we warne you and wil you to be circumspect and take heede of such poysoned meate in your hunger you are waspish aboue measure If that you be hungrye in déede Christ hath meate prepared in his holy word sufficient to quench the hunger or thirst of any true Christian. But you haue chosen meate prepared by HN. which you like greatly and agréeth best with your stomaches but we in the feare of the Lord warn you that you take héede therof for it will bring a surphet vncurable vnto your soules Vitell. FOr which cause sake I am moued to make a short rehearsall by what meanes the Lord of his good ãâã me out of âhinâ ignorance and also made manifest vnto me the life saluation More I haue râcyted the names ⪠of two wâiterâ which haue wâââten agaâist the most holy seruice of loue and agaynst the Lords minister HN. also a part of their slaunderous reportes to the end that the louers of trueth might pray vnto the Lord that he of his gracious goodnesse will geue those slaunderers vnderstanding that they might percâiue and vnderstand their horrible blasphemy against the Lord and so humble themselues repent for I thinke it is all out of ignoraunte blindnes whatsoeuer they haue done whereby they might finde grace at the hands of the Lord c. Aunswere IT were more requisite that you would declare vnto vs what was the cause that moued you first to embrace that wicked sect of Arrius and many yeares became a leader of many pore soules into that
Fideliâas he would haue vs beleeue that Nâ pronounceth and declareth the right state of all what is in heauen and vpon earth what is Gods and mans spiritual and heauenly naturall right and reasonable c. Belike he thought his bookes should neuer haue been perused by any but of such as are drowned in the drowsie dremes oâ this fantastical doctrine One More of âuââer in âââng ââwardes dayes and one ãâ¦ã of Manchester in this our Quéenes dayes tolde of such vayne and friuoloâs matters but they were punished as Lunatikes And whereas your Fidelitas sayth that no such works could be wrought by anye vnlesse the Lord were with him this is as strongly affirmed as the other part is monstrous and vngodly For I praye you examine what are the works that HN. hath so notably brought forth which doth manifest y God is with him His bookes peraduenture you meanâ What his bookes are and out of what spirit they procéed is easely perceiued A simple wit hauing such a guide could deuise agaynst Christ his doctrine as fine riddles as HN. hath published should carry a more shew of truth then his bookes do For schollers and children are able to confute his follies sufficiently they cary such absurdities with them both against the Scriptures of God and against all common reason and nature The kingdome of Israell shal be set vp again the childreÌ of loue shall raigne therin you say but when shall this your prophesie take place you tell vs not In deede Dauid George tolde vs before the like propheây that the true house of Dauid should be erected and the children of loue should raigne therin Why delite you your selues with such speaches For in this worlâ these thinges according to the letter âhall not happen but they are spoken to assure vs of the resurrection and to shadow the ioyes of the kingdome of heauen whereby our harts should be lifted vp with expectation of his promise Vitell. BEhold these be the causes wherthrough the lord hath moued me to minister the seruice of loue vnto other wherein I haue sought only the honor of God and the saluation of al people which hope in god and long for his righteousnes Also I haue through the goodnesse of the lord met with certan good willingnons which haue submitted them obediently and faithfully vnto the lord and his gratious word which also haue followed the couÌcel of christ to the clensing of their hartes and therin doth their light shine before men wherin they seeke the laude of the lord and the saluation of all meÌ Answere WHen you had séene dissention vprores contentioÌ c. in the world then the Lord you say moued you to minister the seruice of loue vnto others you toke the aforesayd ârobles as a fit occasion geueÌ you to begin your doctrine surely you bewâay your selfe in your speach You thought it was good fishing when the waters were troubled and tooke occasion to teach false doctrine when you saw great broiles and tumults in the world But where you affirme that the Lord moued you to do this ⪠wherby shall we know that this your bare affirmation is true onely because you say so but the holy Ghost hath warned vs not to geue credit to such Ier. 14. ver 14. sayth The Prophetes prophesie lâes in my name I haue not sent them nether did I commaund them nether did I speake to them but they prophesie to you a falâe vision diuination vanity and deâeitfâlnes of their own harts Also Eze. 13. ver 3. Wo be to the foolish Prophets that follow their own spirit haue seene nothing We may not beleue euery spirit but try the spirit whether he be of God Iohn 4.1 The Lord moued you not to leue your arte calling and to minister a strange doctrine to the people but the spirit of pride and vaynglory and a desire of singularity puât vp your mind Like as in time past you did as eagerly maintayn other strange monsterous opinions The causes that moued you to spred your doctrine are not sufficient you haue thrust in your selfe into a function and calling nether allowed of god nor ordayned by mân and thiâ your ministery is disobedience to God and the publick magistrate neither hâue you herein fought the honor of God ⪠saluation of al people as you afâirmâ If you had sought God his honor your voice should publickly haue been heard and not in corners In that you haue met with certayn good willing ones which haue submitted themselues c. therin we beshrew you lament that any simple soules are deceiued by your perswasions and in deede it seemeth some such there are that geue eare to your sugred wordes For the poyson of aspes is vnder youre tongue Psal. 14. Why come you not âorth to mayntayn such doctrine as you haue taught why proue you not your doctrin by the holy Scripture Why suffer you your schollers to be troubled and imprysoned but for your selfe you are saâe inough and when they should render a reason of their hope and faith then they vtterly deny your doctrine It séemeth that such a principle you haue taught theÌ to affirme and to deny only keeping their conscience secret Now where you say that your good willing ones or schollers their light hath shone before men wherâby you would heare vs in hand that your pupilâ be men of excellent life as you set them out so do they your life as appeares by their letters so one of you commeÌdeth and prayseth another anâ so must you âéedes do when you want good neighborâ y best way iâ to praise your selues Vitell. ALso I haue geuen forth certayn bookes which are translated word for word as neare as we could out of the bokes of HN. and some of them haue come to the hands of enuyous persoÌs which are diuilâed with the deuill either diuelishly minded for they be slaunderers and liârs and also blasphemers whilest they haue âlaâphemed thâ holy Ghost and hiâ most holy seruice of loue Moreouer they hauââayled at âeuyled condemned despised and blasphemed the Lord his elected minister HN. If this come not out of enuy although they say nay then I know no enuyous spirites And although there be many enuiors of the loue and her most holy seruice yet are theâe two horryble blasphemers of late rysen vp whose bookes arâ come to my hands The one is named Steuen Batman the othâr I.R. But they might both be named with one name Tertullus if they coÌtânue in their lying wherof I must wryte although I haue no pleasure in such workers of wickednes Aunswere THat the bokes of HN. were translated out of Dutch by you we knew before but in distributing them to the Quéenes subiects without any allowance of the magistrate contrary to law therin we tel you you haue not dealt liâe a ârue subiect nor a christiaÌ you complayned of disobedience to magistrates but you your selfe are the most disobedient of
illuminate Elders in the Family sinne not you deny it not but wish y I knew what I sayd you say that they preuayl with God ouer sinne But we deny that any preuayle with God ouer sin otherwise then in the person of Christ. And herein you teach false docârine to the people For your wordes are false that we preuaile with God and Christ ouer sinne Nay we affirme that we preuaile with God by Christ which accepteth vs for his sake and although you acknowledge neuer so much that this is brought to passe by Christ in vs yet we tell you playne that it standeth not with his good will and pleasure so to do but that contynually we should be petitioners to him for grace to keep vnder sinne that sinne raigne not in vs that sinne beare not rule in vs or haue dominion ouer vs as the Scriptures vse to spâake but that we preuayle against sinne so that we extinguish it in our own persons It is a doctrine of Sathan and not froÌ the lord In this and the like doctrine doth your Author and you shew a manifest pâoofe whence your errors are suckt euen from the Pope who teacheth that we may fulfill the law If it be so then may we be righteous by it and haue no neede of christ Such hereticall and imptous doctrine contrary to the scriptures you teach and therfore your Author and you worthely despysed The Pope in his doctrine of Opera superââ ãâã and you with your doctrine of perfection to be wrought in vs in this life do so extenuat the death and passion of our Lord and Sauyour Christ that the poore oppressed burthened sinner loaden and âroning vnder the burthen of sinne can finde smal comfort Therfore the church of christ grounded vpon the Prophetes and Apostles Christ Iesus being the chiefe corner stone of this foundation doubt not in truth and humilitie of spirite to acknowledge still iâ vs while we are in this life a battaile or combat against sinne to striue to fight but not to conquere to tryumph or to preuayle but by faith in Christ in whose person we conquere we tryumph and we preuayle So that to be ouercome or be subdued vnder sin we cannot because we haue a valiant and most victorious conqueror who still imputeth his conquest and victory ours yet so as sinne and the motions therof still remayn in âs to our great exercise that feeling our wââknes our want and our need we âight in our necessitye haue recââse vnto our Captayn our Sauyour and delyuerer But that we in our persons should pâeuayle ãâã sinne as you affirmed is false wicked and damnable doctrine but such fauour hath falsed with you that you greedely embrace this as though Christ or his Apostles had taught it whereas it is against all the doctrine of Christ and his Apostles and against all examples in the scriptures David sayth ãâ¦ã S. Paul sayth Christ Iesus came into y world to saue sinners of y which number I am the greatest if doing our best we must acknowledge our selues vnprofitable seruauntes where is become your doctrine of perfection neuer heard of in Christ his Church our âumayne state and condition is so lifted vp and stast with pride by your doctrine of perfection that penitent sinners find smal grace in whom you impute scarce hope of saluation except they attayne the perfection on whome shall Christ hys death take place to whome shal the vertue thereof extend if none shal be saued but such as be perfect in whome no sinne resteth or remayneth you take away all comfort from sinners to whome the Gospell belongeth and our onely comfort in distresse the effect wherof by this your doctrine is denied miserably do you herein deceaue your setuâs and other They that haue pleasure in sinnâ are seruaunts to sinne as you affirme but to haue pleasure in sinne that sinn raygne in vs or haue dominion ouer vs continually we affirme that they are markeâ and tokens not of the children of good but contrary yet we doubt not to âââirme the remnants the motions lustâ and roÌcupiscence incident to our frayle nature still to lurke in our bodyes notwithstanding we be in the fauour with God and made righteous by Christ his death and passion for so it standeth with his good wil and pleasure that his grace should be made perfect through our weaknes Therefore you with your doctrine of perfection doe extenuate his death as much as in you lyeth We are not in humbling our selues enemies vnto y lord but you by exalting your selues except ye repent will be taken enemies both to God and all good men Your schollers in the Family doe blame vs in their wrytings affirme that we in confessing our imperfections ⪠and sinnes which contynually doe assault vs dayly and hourely We are as they say ⪠Aduocates for sinue and you teaching a perfection are mainteners of righteousnes but more truely may it be sayd of you that you with your perfection are enemies to y grace of God manifest to vs by Christ Iesuâ our Lord and do thereby blaspheme as much as in you lyeth the glory of hys passion and death appropriate only to sinners you may with the pharasies brag of your perfection and obseruation of the law but we comfort ourselues with these and the lyke sayings of holy Scripture Christ Iesus came into the world to saue sinners So God loued the world that he gaue his onely begotteÌ sonne c Behold the lambe of God which taketh away the sinnes of the world c. Vitell. FArther you say they may ioyne with any congregatioÌ or Church and liue vnder the obedience of any Maiestrâte It is true we are obedient vnto all Maiestrates where wee dwell for âhe peaces cause and obserue their politick ordinances which are to a good protectioÌ of their subiectes ââd the land but we consent not vnto any thing which is agaynst God or hys commaundements also we accompâ none vngodly but such aâ obstiâatly blaspheme the Lord hys ordiââunces and despise his most holy seruice of loue although they be ignoraunt of the waye vnto lyfe For we confesse that there is no man righteousnes vntill the Lord deliuer hym from his vnrighteousnesse and through hys Christ make hym righteous and then may he say that the Lord is hys righteousnes Aunswere THat you may ioyne with any Church c. I did affirme beyng led by many reasons so to do for you perswaded many in Queene Maries raigne to go to Masse your brethren in Flaunders which are of your Family do the lyke you also with vs come to Church and ioyne with vs in praier in âeuing thanks in heâring the worde preached c. Yet hauâ you priuate conuântickles and meetings forbidden by the law wherin you shewe not your obedience to the Maiestrates aâ you affirme but your wilfull stubburnes and frowardnes you ioyne with all to wyne all but more iustly you flatter
which only depende on reuelations And you which brag of your Author which is as he sayeâh taught froÌ god his own mouth hath hard y souÌd of his voice Thus miserably are you carâed away by illusioÌs herin you deceiue your selues and many others Out of the wisdome of the flesh sprange all Christopher Vitelles ârrors Note I pray thee Reader that this Libeller acknowledgeth to haue bin in him many errors comprehended in this word âall and anonâ thou shall finde him saying he was in no error In deede the church of Christ hath felt to much expeââence of your heretâcall head fraught full of heresies so that if any newer deuice should by Sathan be stirred vp you are as apte an instrument to broach the same as any that I know in England From no other mans bookes did this man sucke his errors and were you in error theÌ and by the same meanes may you not still remayne in error haue you any further priuiledge now then you had before Of necessity you must sly vnto your perfection that you cannot erre nor sinne there is no ether excuse to be had here is a mistery For you thinke it an absurde thing that your errors spâang from any other fountaine then the flesh of sinne No bookes no conference were meanes to bring you to this ârroâ Loâke well into your selfe and you shall fiâde in âou now more errors and heâ esiâs then euer you held heretofore âou imagined your selfe cleansed and your hâuse swept but now are sâuen morse spirites entered into you as appâareth by your doctrin and you are become ten solde the child of destruction more now thân beâârâ And except you repent your ende will be far worse then your beginning Vitell. NEither âan I blame any man for minâ own sinnes were gâeater and horribleâ in my sight ⪠then all other menneâ for although I had âed certayne bookes of sundry wryteâs yet was I moued to seaââh âhether they were grounded vpon the Loâds promyses or no and humbling my selfâ befoâe the Loâd aâ desiâous to doe his will âo gaue he me to vndeâstand that I knew nothing of all his wayeâ but the troble that I âas in whereout the Lord delyueâed me âs not to be expââssed And iâ the Loâd of his goodnes had not comfârted me with his holy spiâite through hiâ most holy seruice of his loue broght forth through HN. his elected minister I should haue remained without hope of life Answere NOw commeth this Vitell to declare a tragedy of himself which no man can gaânsay being a thing secret and vnknowen to the world For our secret conflictes are troublesome I graunt when our conscience shall pres vs with the greatenes of our sinnes but whether it were so or no who can controll him or els who will beleeue his own wordes speaking so many things contrary to truth already But I must certifie that this is a speciall point of practise in the Family that when any in conference doe require how they could so easily leaue the certainty of doctrine which once they earnestly imbraced then shall you heare them tell you of marueilous conflicts much trouble and veration of minde and could neuer attaine to any quietnes vntill by the doctrine of ââ they found rest vnto their soules But may not this be an illusion of Sathan as otherwise being rightly examined for Sathan is so suttle that if he may get possession of any setled mindes who instructed in godlynes by the scriptures resist his perswasions and so coÌmeth to conslict of minde in such troubles ⪠where Sathan ⪠by the Lord his permission preuayleth then worketh he in his a certayne security or peace and then they thinke all is well when indâde neuer in worse case then so captiued in Sathans tyranny Now this man when he hath set abroad some of his troubles you shall see how he was deliuered by which we may gather what marke he shootes at namely in all troubles and agonyes of minde all must resort to the seruice of Loue set forth by his elected Minister HN. For this man if he had not taken that course he had remained without hope of lyfe certaynly great is the honor wherewith they aduaunce this their priest and prophet aboue all that is called God but my hope is that with the blast of the Lord his mouth which he hath published in the scriptures he shall be confounded and ouerthrowne so low that the fall of him which so exalted himselfe shall be to the comfort of all the Lord his children for whose âake he now beginneth to maniâest this lying Prophet and will I hope rayse vp to his Church men of zelous mindes which will both write and speake agaynst this wicked man of sinne which is in such credit with deceaued people which the Lord in mercy spedely bring to passe to the glory of thy name the comfort of thy church and the spoyle of Sathan and his ympes Vitell. BVt he gaue me to vnderstande there through that he would be merâifull vnto all penitent sinners how horrible sinnes soeuer they had coÌmitted therefore I may say a medicine master getteth gretest prayâe by those that haue the filthâest and corruptest diseaâes as a leprous person and such like âuen so haue I the gretest cause to land the Lord and must confes that he whâch is mighty hath done great things on me and holy is his name Answere NOw after this man hath shewed his conflict of minde and how he was delyuered through the seruice of loue ministred by HN. Now he telleth that by that same he vnderstood that God would be mercifull to al sinners and I pray you did you not know of this mercy but by HN Were you ignoraunt âof the Scriptures before you came acquainted with him his bookes His mercy and compassion is plentifully declared in the gospell which it seemeth you were ignorant of This medicine mâster HN. hath wrought a great cure vpon this man For as one of your schollers haue written in his defence He teacheth with power and it may be the power of Sathan which leadeth men into errors and heresies Although you imagine that this is wrought by the mighty hand of the Lord abusing the words of the âanticle which the blessed virgine did set forth magnifying the name of y Lord thereby Touching your diseases which you count to be cured it is out of dout that you are more full of infirmities and desperate diseases then euer you were although you feele them not For a body that feeleth no sicknes yet infirme and weake is hard to be cured yea irrecuperable as Phisitions prescribe Looke therfore more rightly into your selfe and you that are so whole clene you shall finde matter of corruption in you whereupon the true Phisition of our soules Christ Iesus shall if you acknowledge your sicknes and infirmity worke therby such an alteration in you as heretofore you neuer had the lyke but if you stand
will not ioy nor rest in peace vntill all your errors be disclosed and âou and your fellowes be brought to âumble your selues before the Lord without your HN. which the Lord bring spedely to passe Amen Vitell. NOw must I for want of tyme passe ouer and omit many thinges and submit my cause vnto the almighty desiring him of his goodnes for to try our cause in his ballaunâe of equitye euen with the Loue and trueth for so shall there then be expressed and testified by the light or Christ that Gods honour is declared with the Loues seruice most sincerely Aunswere THis Libel was not long enough but he muââ oâât much matter and so as he sayth submit his cause vnto the almighty c. âut if you did as becoÌmeth a true Christian you should not onely submit your cause vnto the Lord who in patience suâfreth Ipocrites to trouble his Church but also submit your doctrine to be tryed and iudged by his holy word which is a iust iudge in all causes of controuersy For if your protestation shall be admitted without exception theÌ euill doers and blasphemers of God and Christ may haue liberty to referre their cause vnto the Lord but since almighty God hath in earth a knowen Church it is requisite that euery one being required should geue account of his fayth and hope as the scriptures doe teach you would haue your cause tryed in the ballaunce of equitye a truer ballance is not then his law which is without blot or wrinkle if you would abide the tryall thereof your doctrine and your patrone HN. should be found lighter then vanitye it selfe Where you adde with the Loue trueth the Loue you so often confound that you know not your selues the meaning thereof sometyme you wil signifie Christ by that name loue sometime a vertue procéeding sometyme a qualitye of the minde sometyme for the exercise which you priuately vse where to finde the exposition of this word Loue you leue it as vncertaine then it shall be expressed you say by the light or Christ that by you God his honor is declared with the Loues seruice sincerely here is Loue agayne ioyned with seruice which cannot meane as I thinke any thing âlls but God his seruice I take it in the best part if you haue any other more secret misterye therein I leaue to your selues but touching any seruice you doe to God it is Ipocrysye so long as you serue him without Christ or with any other and Christ for he will admit no other to haue place in mens hartes but himselfe he made all he requireth all Vitell. OH what a dauÌgerous tyme is it presently in these last dayes and how vnrightly haue many vnregenerated men set vp themselues to geue iudgement with their good thinking For whatsoeuer euery one mindeth thinketh good and electeth âther falleth to that same prayseth and iudgeth he for the most best and for a righteousnes thereto also he wresteth the scripture according to his will for the scripture is seruiceable vnto euery one euen as he is minded be it whatsoeuer to be high minded in pleasant lustes either to be debased in misery to be merây or sorowfull with sighing either with thankes to be despised and persecuted or to persecute and despise one an other and many such lyke c. Answere OF the dauÌgerous tyme we are not ignorant of and more we tell you that you and your fellowes make the tyme much more daungerous and troublesome with your errors which HN. and you haue raysed vp Now you complayne that vnregenerat men haue set vp themselues you meane by vnregenerat men all others which are not illuminat nor deifâed as your Elders are The children of God for whome Christ dyed whose names are written in the booke of lyfe are regenerate although as I haue sayd before you account none to be regenerat but such as haue no motions of sinne or sinne not but you say that the same vnregenerat men with their good thinking ⪠that same he prayseth and iudgeth for righteousnes but who might worse alledge the same then you who câmmând without reason or cause your Auâhor and his moÌstrous doâtrinâ which hath in it such grosse absurdââyes and most contrary to God and his word and you are they that peâuert the scripture to set vp your Prophet and his doctrine and what is spoken of Christ doe you not wickedly apply the same to your HN. doe you not apply this place of Malarhy chap. 3. which our Sauiour Christ verefied to be propesied of Iohn behold I will send my messenger which shall prepare the way before me Againe Math. 11. he shall turne the hart of the Fathers to the children and the hartes of the children c. doe you not I say apply these places to signifye your HN. and that it is ment by him therefore there are none found such wresters of the scriptures as you And where as you affirme that the scripture is seruiceable vnto euery one therein you shew what reuerence you haue vnto y same for although you such others do abuse the scripture contrary to y purpose of y holy ghost yet are the scriptures y wisedome of God reuealed to man and is a perfit law of righteousnes and not as you vngodly and vnreuerently tearme it seruiceable vnto euery one Your companions the Papistes haue as you doe called the scripture a nose of ware a shipmans hose c. but most wickedly and falsely to both your confusions it is the power of God vnto saluatioÌ Vnto them that beleue the sauour of lyfe vnto lyfe but vnto such as you are which so vnreuerently speake thereof it is the sauor of death vnto death the scriptures doe not maintayne pleasant lustes nor high mindes as you vnreuerently suppose but they are to comfort and lift vp the sorrowfull and broken mindes and to beate downe and correa the hauty and proud stomackes If vngodly men such as you are abuse them to other purposes the fault is in the persons not in the word Vitell. WHereunto euery one wresteth the scripture and defendeth his cause therewith insomuch that euery one thinketh that he for his part hath the most best Behold with such a misery is the man plagued such manner of good thinking and vnprofitable burthen hath he taken vpon him oh that we left all such and gaue ouer our vnderstanding captiue ether suffred it to be pluâkt vnder the obedience of the loue of Iesu Christ and followed after the coÌmon brotherly loue innocently or vndeceitfully and continued concordably in prayer vnto God âl that God receiued vs to mercy released vs froÌ the sin of the ignorant knowledge and established his promise on vs to the laud prayse and honor of his holy name and to our saluation Aunswere YF euery one wrest the scripture where shall wee finde Christ his Church who is led by the spirite of trueth according to his promise thâ greatest wresters of