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A04208 A Christian and modest offer of a most indifferent conference, or disputation, about the maine and principall controversies betwixt the prelats, and the late silenced and deprived ministers in England tendered by some of the said ministers to the archbishops, and bishops, and all their adherents. Jacob, Henry, 1563-1624. 1606 (1606) STC 14329; ESTC S120767 28,632 54

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think themselues bound in conscience to make this free and voluntarie offer vnto their Calumniators the very propounding whereof is sufficient to all honest and iust mindes that do not willfully shut their eyes against the truth to cleere and free them from all the aforesaid slanderous imputations 4. The Christian and mercifull disposition and inclination of the Lower house of Parliament and of sundry of the Nobles of the Higher house who in a holy Commiseration of the Ministers distressed estates and in a certaine knowledge both of their honest liues and conversations and of the good they haue done in their Ministeries and of their peaceable and duetifull behaviour to all in authoritie haue been earnest and zealous suppliants for them hath been shamefully traduced by the Prelats as though only through the incouragements hopes reposed in them and for this cause specially that they might not be discredited and disgraced in their indeavours and intendments for Reformation the Ministers did stand forth Whereas by these presents all the world shall know and understand that the cause for which the Ministers doe suffer is such as all due thankfullnes and service reserved to the Honorable and Christian indeavour of the Parliament though God should which we hope he will never permitt so far forsake that High and Honorable Court as in steed of being suppliants for the poore Ministers they should joyne with the Prelats in making the most rigorous lawes against them that might be even to bloud yet the Ministers by Gods good grace stand resolved to hold and maintaine their said profession In witnes whereof they publish to the view of all men this offer as a testimony of their confident resolution in the said cause for which they suffer 5. There is such indifferencie in this offer and it standeth upon so just equall grounds that it ought not to be refused of any Christians no though made by Iewes Turks Arrians Papists or any other Heretiks whatsoever Much lesse when it is made by Ministers constantly professing shewing themselues willing and readie to submit themselues in all things to the written word of God and who in all matters except in these Controversies of Religion wherein yet they agree with most of the Churches that haue made a separation from Rome are as obedient to the present State and as unblameable in life and conversation as any other of his Majesties subjects 6. Divers of the aforesaid Propositions are such as that if the Ministers should not constantly holde maintayne the same against all men they cannot see how possiblie by the rules of Divinitie the seperatiō of our Churches from the Church of Rome and from the Pope the supreme head thereof can be justified And therefore for asmuch as in these controversies the Papists and the Prelats goe hand in hand the said Ministers doe in like forme and maner make the like Offer to the Priests and Iesuits promising their reconcilement unto that Sea if they can either by Arguments pull them from the foresaid Propositions or can answer such Arguments as they shall propound in the defence of them in maner and forme before specified in the Offer And therefore it both standes the Ministers upon to make the aforesaid Offer and the Prelats except they will haue all the world to judge them to be frends in heart to Popery to accept of the same 7. The Doctors of Oxford in their answer to the Petition of the 1000. Ministers and G. Powell in his last booke undertake the answer of whatsoever can be objected in these causes ●ook pref ●…g 25.26 and M. Hooker in his Preface before his first booke of Politiks propoundeth unto the Ministers that seeke Reformation the very like Offer and forme of disputation Which bookes were published with the special approbation of the Prelats Wherefore the Ministers having been in such a maner chalenged they can doe no lesse then make this offer which cannot be refused of the Prelats but they will be judged of all the world to offer that which they will not performe 8. The Bishop of Rochester with the consent and by the direction no doubt of some of the chiefest Prelats hath now lately published his Sermon preached in September last before the King at Hampton Court the maine drift wherof is to proue that the office calling of Dioce san Bishops in present cōtroversie is a Divine Apostoli call Ordināce Besids in his epistle to the Ministers of Scotland prefixed before the sayd Sermon he professeth that if there shall an answer be made therunto with modestie and learning nothing shall be more welcome And that to avouch make it good that the said Episcopall calling is unlawfull were a labor worthy the travell and of the Prelats much desired Wherfore seeing the Prelats themselues do offer to bring this cause to a publike triall it cōcerneth us in England also no less then our brethren in Scotland seeing by this course order heere layd downe this question amongst the rest will come to be far more exactly tryed then by any other way hitherto thought on the Ministers haue just cause to tender this Conference nothing doubting but that the Prelats will willingly accept it especially seeing they seeme so much to desire it and in all reason it is like to put an end to all these controversies which haue so long troubled the peace and quiet of our Churches 9. Since the Ministers late troubles there haue been many bookes published in Print against them contayning many shamefull untruthes and abuses wherin great violence wrong hath been offered to Gods truth many grosse and Popish errors haue been divulged and many impostures used onely to deceaue the simple and to blind their eyes that they may not see the truth of the Ministers cause which the Ministers take themselues bound in conscience to answer But being not able partly by reason of their povertie partly by want of meanes of Printing partly for other difficulties to publish so soone as is requisit so many answers except they might haue leaue from authoritie unto so many great bookes as many of them are They haue judged it meet in the meane time to make this Offer wherein if they prevaile gaine the cause they make no question but they shall haue all other particularities yeelded and shall saue that other labor 10. They haue warrant thus far from his Majestie both in his booke called Basilicon doron where he willeth them to presse by patience and well grounded reasons to perswade other men to like of their iudgments and by the Proclamation of Iuly 16. 1604 In which the Prelats are required to doe their uttermost indeavour by perswasions Conference Arguments and all other wayes of gentlenes and loue to reclaime the Ministers which being as yet not done by them can not be performed by a more direct and indifferent course then by accepting such an Offer as this is 11. By direction from
subject only to the authoritie and jurisdiction of the Civill Magistrate to whom at all times they are willing and readie to yeeld an account of all their actions and to humble themselues under their censures for any thing they shal be found to offend in Conforming themselues unto their willes in all things alwayes so farre as they may with a good conscience and where they cannot so doe submitting themselues to all such punishment as it shall please them to impose upon them 15. That if it seeme not good to his Majestie the state for reasons best knowne unto themselues to admit of so indifferent honest and reasonable a Conference yet it would please them to requyre the Prelats to publish a direct and full answer to such bookes as haue upon occasiō of the late stormes been published viz. The Abridgement set forth by the Ministers of Lincolne Diocese The Demands Considerations Reasons proving a necessitie of reforming our Churches in England The old Protestant and New formalist The Treatise of Divine worship The 12 Arguments The English Puritanisme and the Protestation c And that it may be lawfull for the Ministers modestly and directly to reply vnto the said Answers as also to any of the bookes which are lately or haue been heertofore written against them their cause and to publish the same in print with leaue of authority which they under take and binde themselues with all convenient speed faithfully and honestly to performe they protesting heere before Almightie God the searcher of all hearts and the just revenger of all hypocrisie that to their knowledge there hath as yet no material thing been writtē against them in these foresaid Propositions or any other Controversie betwixt them and the Prelats but they are able to giue a reasonable and just reply unto the same and that by those bookes which haue been published against them they haue been rather confirmed strengthened in the sayd opinions which they hold against the Prelats then any way satisfied or answered as shall appeare to all the world by Gods gracious assistance if they may haue permitted unto them that liber tie to publish their writings to the world which the Pre lats take unto themselues 16. That if this most reasonable and just course of composing these controversies be denyed them yet at least they may haue free leaue to publish and to offer to the censure of the whole world nakedly and playnly all those several Arguments Reasons which they haue thought upon for the confirmation of the former Propositions as also their direct Answers to all such Arguments on the contrary side as they shall finde publ●shed in the writings of the Prelats and their adherents In all which they promise to keepe themselues closely directly to the poynts in controversy in so strict a forme that it shal be most easy for the Prelats to giue an answer unto them if so be they be in error in holding the said Propositions 3. Iust Considerations moving the Ministers to make this offer MAny of the Ministers having by reason of their Deposition from the publike Ministerie more cause occasion and leasure to studie these controversies then before doe find that the more they wade into them the more they are confirmed in that truth for which they suffer So that howsoever the intendment of the Prelats hath been by their rigorous extremitie of affliction to make them to force their consciences against conscience to yeeld that so they might rejoyce in their flesh and though the Lord hath surrered their rod to the further hardening of their hearts to ly so heavie upon some of his servants that they haue put forth their hand to injquitie yet othersome by this meanes are so far from shrinking from the profession of that truth which by their sufferings they haue honored that the more they haue sustayned for it the more by the mercy of God they see the glorious evidence of it And therefore in honor vnto that heavenly truth they can do no lesse then in the feare of God make this offer vnto the greatest enemyes therof 2. This cause which the ministers professe and witnes vnto by their constant sufferings being as they are perswaded in theire very soules and consciences a divine sacred truth and being notoriously reviled and blasphemed as a hellish error by the mouthes of the prelats their favourers one saying that he damned the discipline to Hell frō whence it came Vaghan his Con●orie in uses Powel de diap pref others publishing in print that Christ is not the Lawgiver of his Churh all generally calling our doctrine and opinion in this cause Schisme and Haeresie yea Treason and Rebellion they having receaued this grace from God not only to see the truth heerein but to seale and confirm it by their sufferings thinke it a most bounden duty that they owe vnto their Lord and master Iesus Christ whose Ministers and Servants they are by all good meanes to iustifie the same yea though they neither had suffered nor should suffer for it Much more now when as by the providence of God they haue in themselues their wiues and children sustained indured so heavy things for it And a more honest moderat Christian and religious defence or Apology they cannot yeld vnto it thē by making such an offer as this is to the avowed enemyes thereof 3. It is notorious vnto all the world what indignities sianders false accusations and calumniations ouer and besides the other Legall proceedings as they are pretended to be the Prelats and their adherents in their privat speeches publike sermons and writinges lay vpon those Ministers that hold maintaine this cause proclaiming thē to be Obstinat Refractarie persons Enemyes to the King State Notorious manifest Schismatikes Turbulent spirits Chaplin wel in 〈◊〉 Considetions Contemptuous and disdayning the Authoritie of their lawfull Gouernors presumptuous and wilfull Contenders with the Magistrat Impugning his authority in thinges indifferent and Soueraigntie in Ecclesiasticall cause False Prophets Members rent and cut of from the Church of God Runawayes from their Ministery some standing vpon these points of difference not for conscience but for carnall respects som because otherwise they knowe not how to be maintayned but by depending on that faction som to gratify their benefactors patrons and to please their friends som for discontentment and want of preferment som for giddines of innovation som for pride of hart and selfeloue som for hatred of order and restraint of their libertie som for ignorance yet willfull because they will not knowe the state of the question some to retaine the opinion of constancy c. Now it being the duty of every Christian even for Christs sake and the Gospells which he doth professe to cleere his innocencie against such false and impious slanders much more is it fit for the Ministers of the Gospell being thus wickedly traduced so to do And therefore they
the chiefe of the Prelats Consid p●… G. Powell hath published That his excellent Majestie as he loved these Ministers dearliest of all others so he sought the more earnestly to reclayme them by some correction So that either the Prelats heerein haue offered his Majestie open wrong in proclaiming his speciall favor to the said Ministers or else they are not to doubt but in the abundance thereof he will vouchsafe to those poore distressed and chastised favourits of his so much grace as to command that this Offer may be accepted and by his Royall assent to confirme the same 12. The Apologeticall books which the Ministers haue been constrayned from time to time to publish in defēce of their Persons and Cause can not come to the hands scanning of those powers that next under God are most able to relieue them And therefore for the cleering of their innocencie and the justifiyng of their cause which is indeed the cause of God they are cōstrayned to make this publike and solemne Offer by meanes whereof it may come to passe that all men may take notice of the goodnes of the cause and of the grosse wrongs they haue sustained and indured for maintayning the same 13. His Majestie signified to the Committies of the Lower house Supplicating on the behalfe of the Ministers that before mercy there must goe a submission and that if they looke for mercy at his hands they must acknowledge a fault This is that which they desire If it can be proved that they haue offended his Majestie in the least thing they desire no mercy till they acknowledge a fault and submit them selues for the same But it is no doubt far from the heart of so Royall a Prince to require either Confession or Submission wherther is no transgressiō For their owne parts they are perswaded and resolved that that truth for the professing wherof the Prelats proceed so severely against them is most behoofull for his Majestie his Crowne and dignitie and the whole State And that in yeelding heerin in unto the Prelats they should make a breach in that dutie which by Gods law every true hearted and loyall subject in this kingdome oweth both to the King and State And yet if they be in an errour there can be no more direct and likely course used to bring them unto a submission for the same then to haue these poynts freely debated by the acceptance of this Offer 14. When the Ministers consider the dayly increase of Papists their treacheries and conspiracies their insolent bouldnes the continuall broaching of grosse and Popish errours what litle molestation the Papists haue by the government of the Prelats yea what favour they find secretly and under hand what resistance was made to the Lawes intended to haue been made against them especially by some and those not the meanest of the Prelats what light matters are made of their horrible Treasons and damnable opinions what litle execution there is of the lawes against them they haue reason to feare that before they are aware as it were in a dreame if the raynes be in this maner left in the Prelats handes for matters of religion the neck both of his Royall Maiestie and of the whole State shal be brought under the yoke of the Pope that Antichrist of Rome and his divelish jdolatrie And therefore in a serious mediatation of the best meanes to prevent this great imminent evill which lyeth working in a mysterie they cannot thinke of a more direct course then this open and professed Opposition unto the Prelats in the foresaid Propositions wherein if they shall prevaile they shall not onely giue a deadly wound to the Prelacie it selfe but to the accursed Religion of Rome from which at least if it be held to be Iure divino it receaveth both breath and life For who was so simple that saw not that at his Majesties first cōming to the Crowne when the Prelats hangd downe their heads in suspense feare the Papists hearts were as dead as stones and that the very first Proclamation against the Ministers in behalfe of the Prelats revived the Papists againe And that ever since with the increase of the grace favour and authoritie of the Prelats the hopes bouldnes and nombers of Papists haue increased And therefore howsoever the Prelats may mocke children and fooles in imputing the Ministers yet any that wisheth the confusion of that Antichrist may with halfe an eye see where the true cause is And therefore they seeing this except they should be wilfull traytors to God their King and Country cannot but make opposition unto the Prelats in approving the Propositions aboue specified wherein if they be in an error and the Prelats on the contrary haue the truth they protest to all the world that the Pope and the Church of Rome and in them God and Christ Iesus himselfe haue had great wrong indignitie offered unto them in that they are rejected and that all the Protestant Churches are Schismaticall in forsaking Unitie and Communion with them 15. The former Propositions are such that there will not be found as we are verily perswaded in our consciences any one Conformable Minister in this kingdome except he be a masked Papist that will refuse to Subscribe to any one of thē if so be it would please the King and State by Law to urge them thereunto under such penalties as the Ministers are urged to subscribe unto the Articles devised by the Prelats Yea we are out of all doubt that the Prelats themselues if it were pressed upon them by the King and state vnder paine of deprivatiō from their Bishopricks would not stick to avouch vpon their othes that the Ceremonies and Subscription for which the Ministers stand suspended and deprived are wicked and vngodly such as no good Christian ought to yeeld vnto Nay if the case stood but vpon the sauing of their Temporaltyes thereby which else they should loose we doubt not but they would with heart hand subscribe to any one of the aforesaid Propositions Sith therefore it is more then cleere that they haue Offered plaine violence vnto the Consciences of all most all the conforming and subscribing Ministers that even contrarie to their owne consciences they haue proceeded against their poore bretheren because they will not by conformitie subscr●ption renounce the truth contayned in these propositiēs can any blame the said Ministers if hauing not only the said truth on their side but in likelyhood the Consciences of the Prelats also they make such an Offer as this is 15. It is agreeable to common sense and reason and the Bishop of Chichester hath some such thing in his Lectures vpon the Commandements that doubtfull actions should all-wayes giue place vnto those that are out of all doubt question Seeing therefore no good Protestant ever doubted but that it is lawfull enough in it selfe to administer the word and sacraments in common and ordinary civill