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A94295 The due way of composing the differences on foot, preserving the Church, / according to the opinion of Herbert Thorndike. Thorndike, Herbert, 1598-1672. 1660 (1660) Wing T1048; Thomason E1838_3; ESTC R210159 28,326 70

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more against the Rules of the Church then to take such men for Priests Bishops of such Churches as men know not how they behaved themselves in lower degrees Those that talk of the Interest of the People in Ecclesiasticall promotions without supposing this ground do allege nothing but their own dreams to bring their own dreams to pass Having this premised I must needs say I see no manner of inconvenience in that which the Presbyterians pretend for the cheif cause of their distance that is the concurrence of Presbyters with their Bishops in Ordinations and the Jurisdiction of the Church provided it be setled in that form which being grounded upon the Rule of the Catholick Church may tend to restore and advance the common Christianity Now I take the Rule of the Church to be as evidently this as the common Christianity is evident that every City with the Territory thereof be the seat and content of a Church For though it hath been used with so much difference in several parts and times of the Church that those Countries which some whiles and some where might have been cast into fourscore Churches have other whiles and else where been cast into four yet these are but exceptions to a Rule which the Law saith do not destroy but confirm it For in matters concerning the whole the Unity of the whole may as well be preserved by the concurrence of four as of fourscore The Churches that is according to this Rule the Dioceses of England have been constituted and distinguished upon occasion of the Soveraignties in which and by consent whereof the Christianity of the Nation was first planted He that considers with half an eye shall easily see how the conversion of Kent of the East and South and West Saxons of the East Angles and Mercians and lastly of Northumberland produced the foundation of English Churches For of the British foundations in the West parts of the Island from the two Forths to the Lands end the same account is to be kept the Dominion of the Britains being for some time divided into several Soveraignties He that is convicted of this truth which no man can be convicted of but he that considereth the case But who so considereth the case must needs stand convict of it will easily grant me that when the Monarchy prevailed and England came to be divided into Counties the General Rule of the Church would have required another course to have been observ'd For had the Head Town of every County been made the Seat of a Church containing that County no man that survayes the division of the Romane Empire into Churches made without the secular Power as before Constantine will deny That the division so made would have been more correspondent to the primitive forme tending to the Unity of the whole But let no man think that for the love of such a correspondence I have any itch to call in question the Unity of the Whole The alteration is great and must needs produce a great motion to ingraffe it into the Laws of the Kingdom And therefore I am not of opinion to change the Law for hope of amendment with so much appearance of danger to the being of the Whole But I am of opinion that it would be easie to erect Presbyteries that is Colleges of Presbyters in all Shire Towns which have no Cathedral Churches for the Ecclesiastical Government of the respective Counties with and under the Bishops And that so the Rule of the Church would be set on work to the best effect and purpose For those Towns have commonly Churches altogether unprovided of means through the horrible sacriledges that have passed and yet in common reason agreeing with the wisdom of Gods Spirit from whence the Rule of Episcopacy issued ought to be Nurseries of Christianity to the respective Counties And that intent cannot so well be brought to effect as by planting the wisest and those that have most of the Clergie in their lives in the most eminent places with authority next to the Chief over their respective bounds By the ministery of such persons the Offices of Gods service might so be performed in the chief places as might be a pattern for their Country Churches to follow These Presbyters might grow up by education in that discipline of the Clergie which I have recommended upon the experience of the whole Church They might live a Collegiate life in common with the care and inspection of Inferiours together with the charge of instructing or seeing them instructed in the Scriptures The Canon of the whole Church confining all degrees of the Clergie to their respective Churches might be revived by their means The superseding whereof being certainly one of the irregularities of the Papacy hath conduced much to the dissolution of Discipline in the Church For in conscience how can he that is obliged to any Church give account of himself to another to which the first is not subordinate And therefore though the Presbyteries which I propose be not Churches yet may they take account of their respective Clergie and render it to their Bishops The promotion of inferiour Orders belonging unto their account may proceed upon the account which they give The censures that are requisite to pass in foro exteriori may pass them in the first instance and from them being transmitted to the Bishop be either inacted or voided Alwaies with right of appeal to the Synod of the Province in cases of weight and in the intervals thereof to their Deputies To which purpose and in which nature the High Commission ought to be revived For as it is by no means to be allowed that the Bishops negative be any way questioned So is it no way fit that the consent of Bishop and Presbyters both be concluded in one and the same instance As for those Dioceses which are concluded within onely one County there I suppose I need not say that the Chapter of the Cathedral are by inheritance this Presbytery Now these Colleges of Presbyters consisting of those only that shall have run the whole course of their lives in the education and discipline of the Clergie is there any possible pretence of burthen upon them if the condition of single life should be required to qualifie them for their places For this were not to tye any man to single life seeing who will may go forth and be provided of a Countrey Church But it were to maintain the discipline of the Clergie in the most eminent places wherein there is a course proposed to them who imbrace it of ending their dayes in it And the course of a Collegiate life which I propose seemeth a sufficient means and advantage to overcome those temptations which in these dayes may seem too difficult for all the Clergie to undergo As for the means of supporting these Presbyteries wherein the Cure of all Parishes within the Shire Towns is provided for and included It is no difficulty to him that considers with conscience
hath been said it may appear what my opinion will require of the Presbyterians for the condition of reconciling our selves into one Church again Namely in the first place their concurrence to the Act or Decree or Order according to which the Sectaries ought to be tied to renounce the damnable positions which they have notoriously set on foot For if they should refuse this what reason could be alledged why they should be counted Strangers to that infection which they will not exclude As for the other Article of the Creed concerning one visible Church it is evident that they cannot belong to that Church supposing the Premises For it is evident that there was a time when the whole Church was governed by Bishops and that not against Gods Law for then there had remained no Church And therefore for them to break the unity of the Church upon pretence of governing this Church by Presbyters is to break unity unless a part may give Law to the whole which who so do are for so doing Schismaticks And the Church of Rome would have due cause to cast us off for Schismaticks if we should admit this pretense But this is a point the knowledg whereof cannot belong to the substance of Christianity for the reason alleged before And therefore I do not think the Church tied to exact the express profession of it or the disclaiming of the error that is opposite to it On the other side the Church maintaining the Ordinations of Presbyters alone to be meer nullities in themselves can never own their Ordinations without renouncing the Catholick Church yet may it consent in the persons upon their consent to the order which shall be established for the future And indeed what can they challeng by the meer consent of certain Presbyters which the Ministers of Congregations may not pretend to by the consent of their respective Congregations And yet I suppose both parties are agreed not to own them in that Power which the celebration of the Eucharist importeth Let any man that is capable to judg of such matters think upon the madness of the Lancashire Presbyterians without prejudice Of whome I am duly informed that they caused those who were ordained only Deacons in the Church of England to do the office of Presbyters which they had no title to in celebrating the Eucharist And tell me what reason there can be excluding the Ordinations of the Congregations to admit the usurpations of the Presbyterians As for the form and solemnity in which the consent of the Church to their Ordinations shall be celebrated therein I refer my self to the wisdom of Superiors Thinking it would be a great impertinence in the Presbyterians if finding a necessity of submitting those whom they have allready promoted to the judgment of the Church for the condition upon which they are to Minister which without doubt is the principall they should insist upon the accessory which is the form and solemnity by which the power is visibly convayed And thus I think the second great difficulty concerning their Ordinations may be composed But supposing these great difficulties set aside the composing of our first differences about the Order of Bishops and the Service cannot seem difficult if the parties be content to give up their ingagements to the advantage which the Christianity of the Nation may have by it For what reasonable Christian can think much to acknowledge that by reason of those partialities which at length have produced this Schisme the Ecclesiastical Laws of the Land are capable of amendment in those two points On the other fide doth not dear evperience tell all parts that the change of them by force though it must be called Reformation if the Law of the Land call it so yet it is not likely to be that which it is called Besides Consider the kindness which his Majesties return and Gods goodness that hath over-ruled mens hearts in it hath bredde in all parties consenting to it For can we have this before us and not hope that it will be enough to subdue all prejudices and animosities to the interest of our common Christianity Had the peace of the Church never been questioned it might be charity in a discreet Christian not to call it into question by proposing what might be amended because the hope of amendment might not countervail the danger of that Peace But now that unity is not to be had without setling of agreement in matters of difference to propose what may seem best for the Community of Gods Church in the cure of our breaches is not to give offence but to take it away I will therefore premise here one consideration which I mean to assume for a supposition to ground that which I shall propose to this purpose It shall contain that which I observe in the New Testament and the primitive practice of Gods Church pointing out the meaning of it concerning the difference between the Clergie and People in all Churches and the ground of it For though the edict of our Lord in the Gospel be peremptory that who so forsaketh not all things cannot be my Disciple that is a Christian For they who were other whiles called Disciples were called Christians at Antiochia as we read in the Acts yet common reason evinceth that all Disciples professed not to forsake the World which we all profess to forsake at our Baptisme according to the same rate For we see by the Gospel that the voluntary oblations of those who followed our Lord ministring to him made a stock of money which Judas was trusted with for charity to the poor after that his followers were provided for But it is against the evidence of commmon sense to imagine that all those who professed to follow Christ and to be his Disciples were provided for out of this Stock It is true our Lord promiseth in the Gospell that whosoever shall forsake kindred or wife or house or goods for the Gospell shall receive an hundred fold here and in the World to come life everlasting A thing visibly fullfilled in the primitive state of the Church when whosoever was persecuted for Christianity all Christians acknowledged themselves bound to provide for his support Neither can it be said how S. Paules saying that godliness hath the promises of this life and of that which is to come could be otherwise fullfilled when those who had undertaken Christs Cross where subject to powers that did or might persecute Christianity at their pleasure But though all Christians in case of persecution are bound by their Baptisme to leave all they have that they may carry Christs Cross after him Yet it was something more that S. Peter meant when he said Lord we have left all to follow thee what shall we have For though a Net and a Fisher-boat were no great thing to leave yet so firm a faith as to forsake a mans whole course of living casting himself upon the word of Christ for his very being whither here
that originally the indowment of the Diocese was the Patrimony of the Mother Church and afterwards appropriated to Parish Churches by abating the right of the Mother Church upon particular contracts appearing to be for the good of the parts For if the Mother Church have abated so much of her common right when it was for the good of the Parishes Is it not necessary that the Parishes now abate of their property in their respective indowments by Pensions to these Colleges now they appear to be for the good of the Diocese And this I am now bold to profess before the judgement of Superiors be declared because I am confident that by this position I abate not a hair of that Power which the Bishops in England now use But I adde much to the strictness of discipline that is in effect of Christianity by requiring all Ordinations all acts of Jurisdiction in foro exteriori to pass both the Presbyters and the Bishop in severall instances And further then this I extend not the opinion of a divine to particulars but leave the rest intire to the wisdom of superiors And this may serve to show that there is no cause why the difference on foot concerning the Government of the Church may not settle into a change conducing to the advancement of the common Christianity Which will hold till stronger in the other concerning the Service if men take their measures by the common interest of Christianity not by their particular prejudices For I conceive I may well suppose that the Sectaries pretense of praying by the Spirit is content to be buried in oblivion and silence considering that the excesses are evident and horrible which that pretense hath brought forth Besides that no man now stands to that dangerous position That the offices of Gods service are of no effect when they are ministred by such as are not in the state of grace For I presume it is not nor can be supposed on any hand that all whom the Church must imploy are indowed with Gods spirit that is are in the state of grace I suppose further as not questioned on any hand that the publick service of God is to consist of the praises of God by the Psalmes of David and other Hymnes of Gods Church of the reading of the Scriptures of the instruction of Gods people out of them in fine of the Prayers of the Church and in the chief place of the Sacrament of the Eucharist and those prayers which it is to be celebrated with Some of our Sects have been bold to pretend that the Psalter or Psalmes of David are impertinent to the Devotions of Christians as concerning the particular condition of David and composed whith regard to it Whereby they overthrow the foundation of Christianity standing upon this supposition that the old Testament is the figure ad shadow of the new and that Christ hath the key of the writings as well as of the house of David For seeing Christ and his mystical Body the Church are all one the meaning and intent of the Psalmes cannot concern Christ but it must end in his Church But seeing the Church is but shadowed in the Psalmes being part of the Old Testament I can expect no dispute of the necessity of other Hymnes composed under Christianity in the solemnizing of Gods publick service And seeing the question on foot concerns the setling of the form of Gods service by a Law of the Kingdom there can remain no dispute concerning the necessity of a setled Order in reading the Scriptures and using the Psalmes and Hymnes of the Church Nor do I know any man sincerely professing the Reformation that could not wish with all his heart that the whole order and form which shall be setled with the circumstance of the same might be according to the primitive simplicity and naked plainness of the ancient Church supposing the difference between the state in which the Church lived under persecution and now that being protected by the secular Power it receiveth all the World to take part in the service of God For what difference this will inferre in the Order and Rule of Gods service to be inacted by a Law of this Kingdom common reason and the perpetual practice of Gods Church together with the precedents recorded in Scripture must be admitted to Witness These things supposed no man doubts that the form of service now in force by the Law of this Land may be acknowledged capable of amendment without disparagement either to the wisdom of the Church that prescribed or of the Nation that inacted it For what positive Law of man is there that is not Nay what arrogance can it be in a particular person having bestowed more consideration upon it then it is possible that those who had the framing of it should have leisure to do to think that he knows some particulars in which it might be mended For neither doth it follow that it is better to indanger the spoyling of it by calling it in question than to let it rest as it is And that particular person whosoever he is that should think his own opinion necessary to be followed without com-promising it to the publick would justly incurre the mark of arrogance Since therefore that this is the time for such a debate if any change be pretended and that the reasons mentioned afore are of sufficient consideration to oblige all sides to prefer unity before prejudice what remains but that either it be left intire in that State wherein it stands or that nothing be changed without sufficient debate of reason upon the whole what is fit to be changed what not But one thing I must here expresly stand upon because the forme of Gods service which hath been usurped during the Schisme protesteth against the Law in force I acknowledge that the whole Reformation protesteth against the insufficience and defects of the Church of Rome in the course which it taketh for the instruction of Christian people in the duties of their Christianity against the abuses there practised in celebrating the Eucharist without any pretense of a Communion in private Masses and in serving God in a Language which the people understand not For these abuses are a principal part of the ground for that change which we justly maintain to be Reformation The boldness of those that opposed it being come to such a height as openly to maintain that it concerneth not Christian people to know or to mind what is done at the Mass being the ordinary service of God for which they come to Church or what is said But that the intention of the Priest is enough to apply the sacrifice of Christ to all that are present which they think it doth no less to them that are absent and therefore leave us unsatisfied why people should come to Church who need do nothing but say their Paters and their Aves These abuses I do acknowledge But be the World my witness and all that know
or in the World to come is sutable to the promise that followes of sitting upon xii Throues to judg the xii Tribes of Israel The Christians of Jerusalem who parted with their Estates that the disciples might be maintained in their daily attendance upon Gods service cannot be said to have obtained thereby any common ranke in the Church But it must be said that quitting their former course and state of living by quitting the means of maintaining it they became from thenceforth either of the Clergy or of the poor which were allwayes maintained out of the stock of the Church For by S. Paules instructions to Timothy 1. Tim. V. it appeareth that those Widdows which were imployed and maintained by the Church for the common necessities of it were to be taken out of such as were destitute of means to live other wise Herewith agreeth an infinite number of examples in the primitive Church of Godly Bishops Priests and others of the Clergy who taking upon them such professions devested themselves of their worldly goods whither applying them to the property or only to the use of the Church as reserving themselves power to dispose of them in favor of friends or kindred at their death And from the same reason and ground proceed all the Canons whereby it was provided that they should not dispose of the Church goods to such uses at death but of their own well and good For whatsoever their estates were though they renounced them not yet it became necessary for them to live as others of the Clergy lived Who were generally poor when they were promoted and therefore professed to content themselves with meer necessaries because the Church goods of which they lived were due to the maintenance of the poor as well as of the Clergy From whence we may see what truth there is in those sayings of the Fathers which make the precepts of our Lord in his Sermon upon the mount matters of Counsaile For if all Christians be to leave all thinges that they may follow Christ it is certain that they are commanded and not only advised to turn the other cheek to quit a mans Cote to him that takes away his Cloke to undergo the rest of those precepts whereby our Lord describeth the duty of a Christian provided they be so understood as the maintenance of a mans estate in the World and the obligations which it inferreth even by virtue of that Christianity which alloweth the same will require But if there be another estate in the Church of Disciples which profess to follow Christ leaving the imployment of the world for that purpose and therefore to forbear the pleasures and proffits thereof accordingly That strict Rate and that high degree in which they profess to leave the world to follow Christ must needes be meer matter of Counsaile because no man is commanded to undertake that estate but invited to it for the securing of his Salvation who knowes he may be saved without it Whereby it appeares that this estate imports a profession of abstinence from the pride the revenge the lusts and pleasures of the world as well as from the riches of it as well of the humility the patience the continence the meekness and obedience of our Lord as of the mean estate in which he lived But that for the means to compass this end it imports first a profession of renouncing the ranke and estate which every man holds in the world and dedicating himself to the service of the Church and that imployment which tends to the common good of Christians If it should be inferred from hence that the state of the Clergy importing the forsaking of the World at this extraordinary Rate must therefore import the profession of single life as some of the Church of Rome would have it The answer is that it will not follow And the instance is peremptory That the Apostles themselves who thus left the world did not profess it And if by undertaking the Clergy a man was not obliged to renounce his goods As appeares by those Canons which inable the Clergy to dispose of them at death much less doth that estate import a profession of single life being more difficult to perform then to live as a Clergy man upon the Church goods For it is possible for them who have wives to live as if they had them not according to S. Paul No otherwise then it is possible for them who have the dispensing of Church goods to use them as if they used them not The reason of single life for the Clergy is firmly grounded by the Fathers and Canons of the Church upon the precept of S. Paul forbidding man wife to part unless for a time to attend upon Prayer For Priests Deacons being continually to attend upon occasions of celebrating the Eucharist which ought continually to be frequented if others be to abstain from the use of Marriage for a time for that purpose then they allwayes And this is the reason that prevailed so farre even in the primitive times that the instances which are produced to the contrary during those times seem to argue no more then dispensation in a Rule which had the force of a Law when an exception took not place That is when those that were thought necessary for the service of the Church though not fit to ty themselves to live single But this profession was evidently the ground for that discipline which was used all over the Church in breeding youth from tender yeares to such a strict course of life as only use and custome is able to render agreable to mans nature And to this education and discipline all the authority and credit of the Clergy over the people is to be imputed the dissolution whereof is the true occasion of the miseries which we have seen For did the people think themselves tied to depend upon the Clergy for their instructions to admit their admonitions reproofes in matter of Religion that is did the discipline and education of the Clergy maintain them in that authority with the people it is not possible that the pride which hath been seen in setting up new Religions and giving new Lawes to the Church should take place But this authority is not to be preserved without retirement from the world that is from conversation with the People of what ranke or degree soever whither upon pretense of profit or pleasure And therefore being once lost by the debauches of the Clergy before the Reformation it is not to be restored without restoring the ground of it the said education and discipline nor by consequence the Reformation to be counted compleat otherwise Supposing allwayes the Reformation to be the restoring of that Church which hath been not the building of that which hath not been The same education and discipline is by the express Canons of the Church the ground of that title upon which promotion is due to the Clergy in their respective Churches For what is