Selected quad for the lemma: cause_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
cause_n	bishop_n	church_n	presbyter_n	1,664	5	10.2707	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A81350	An apologie for the Reformed churches wherein is shew'd the necessitie of their separation from the Church of Rome: against those who accuse them of making a schisme in Christendome. By John Daille pastor of the Reformed Church at Paris. Translated out of French. And a preface added; containing the judgement of an university-man, concerning Mr. Knot's last book against Mr. Chillingworth.	Daillé, Jean, 1594-1670.; Smith, Thomas, 1623 or 4-1661.	1653 (1653)	Wing D113; Thomason E1471_4; ESTC R208710	101,153	145

our own For as in civil societie we keep not company with such persons as we discover to be guilty of infidelitie or enormous vices because friendship or familiarity with such people slurrieth the honour and reputation of those that make any shew or profession of vertue but we do with a deal of sweetnesse and ingenuitie beare with the faults and frailties of such as are not miscreants at the bottome though notwithstanding their conversation be not altogether free from humane frailties So are we to do in Religion to avoid communicating with those whose errour overthrows the foundations of piety but charitably to teach those who retaining the principles cannot free themselves entirely from all perswasions contrary to truth The Ancients must pardon me if I venture to take notice that they were sometimes too scrupulous and if I may so speak too curious and strait-laced in this particular rejecting oftentimes innocent opinions with very tragical termes and handling such persons as gainsayed them with as much rigour as if they had overthrown the whole Gospel of Christ 'T is a wonder to see how some of them did in a manner sport with changing errours into heresies and all faults into crimes Philastrius Bishop of Brixium who lived in the time of S. Ambrose was among others very hot for he lib. de Haeres cap. 4. Bibl. P P. parte 1. p. 22. cap. 39. reckoned among heresies the opinion of those who attributed the Epistle to the Hebrews to Clement or to Barnabas and to S. Paul and of those who thought the CL. Psalmes in the Psalter were not all composed by David and of those who thought the starres were fastned to the orbs of heaven But none were ever so ready to excommunicate as those very men who keep such a complaining of our quitting their communion upon too slight causes To say nothing here of the lightnings and excommunications of Victor against Asia of Stephen against Africk and divers other Popes as well one against another as against strangers for reasons most an end of very small concernment Let any man reade onely the last Councel held at Trent he shall soon see how liberall they were of Anathema's They were not there content as thunder doth from Heaven to strike the cedars and the tops of the mountains scarce was there any herb in their adversaries fields though never so low and small that scaped their thunderbolts They who doubted whether marriage was a Sacrament or whether the Church can dispense with the degrees established in Leviticus or whether a Bishop be above a Presbyter or whether the reasons that moved Rome to deprive the Laity of the cup were of sufficient validity to that purpose things as every one may see of none or at least very little importance to pietie were excommunicated anathematized as well as they that denyed the divinitie of our Saviour or the truth of the last resurrection And for my part I understand not how it agrees with the mildnesse and gentle behaviour which the Doctrine of Christ doth strictly recommend unto us to have such an inhumane severitie as to be able to beare with nothing to spare no opinion but to make so high a market of the pretended thunderbolts as to let them fly indifferently against the lesse errours as well as against the greatest crimes Well this I am sure of If we would imitate Their examples and justifie our proceedings by the maximes of theirs we might end this question in three words For if he that thinks marriage is not a Sacrament is an anathema to him that holds it is I pray What should they who believe that the Eucharist is not bread but the Creatour of heaven and earth be deemed by those that hold the contrary And if to think that a Presbyter was originally the same with a Bishop give the Church of Rome sufficient cause to curse my communion how much more doth her elevating as she doth the Pope above the Church and above all the Kings in Christendome give me just cause to run away from her But 't is now time we should by Gods assistance clear our own innocence of those crimes which our side is accused of We confesse That Christian charitie is not so active and hot as their zeal Charitie often bears with what it doth not approve of and rejects nothing but what it cannot suffer without hazarding the salvation of our neighbours and our own souls 'T is so farre from excommunicating as the Councel of Trent doth Christians for small errours that I think it would easily beare with in faithfull persons that opinion of the Greeks for which they are so roughly anathematized touching the procession of the Holy Ghost For though I grant it is an errour to believe that the H. Ghost proceeded not from the Father and Sonne but from the Father onely by the Sonne yet if you observe 't is hard if not impossible to understand what prejudice this errour brings to piety and holy life The difference that is between us and such of our brethren as are called Lutherans is of the same nature I confesse 't is as impossible for us to believe as to conceive their Position concerning the body of our Saviour being really present in the bread of the Eucharist But yet 't is possible and I think according to the laws of charity necessary to bear with that in their doctrine which we cannot believe For this opinion in the terms and sense wherein They hold it hath no venome in it that I see It abolisheth not the Sacrament it destroyes not the signe whereof it consisteth it adoreth it not it neither divides nor mutilates it it makes it not an expiatory sacrifice for our sinnes it leaves it both the nature and the vertue of a Sacrament and doth not take any thing formally directly and immediately from Christ either of his substance or his properties onely it would have even the humanity of Christ present in the Eucharist that we may receive the vertue of his death and communicate of his body and bloud as S. Paul speaks 1 Cor. x. in such a manner as they confesse incomprehensible Which hypothesis whiles it goes no further engageth us not in any thing that is contrary either to piety or charity either to the honour of God or the good of men And so it may and ought to be tolerated And this hath been continually our judgement and so declared by the French churches in the nationall Synod held at Charenton in the yeare MDCXXXI by an expresse act wherein they receive such as are called Lutherans into their Communion unto their Holy Table notwithstanding this opinion and some few others of lesse importance wherein They and We differ Oh what a gentlenesse was this excellently becoming Christians worthy to be imitated by all believers in the world and consecrated with commendation to the memory of all succeeding ages a plain illustrious irrefragable testimony of the innocence of our Churches in this particular For

any more queries then are necessary what necessity of an infallible Judge at all The Christian world had no such Judge sor CCCXXIV years for the Nicene Councel was the first General and if They vnderstood Scripture and were saved then when they had no such thing why may not We now And if they were not saved the Church of Rome must blot out many hundreds and thousands of Saints Martyrs out of her Martyrology Till these twenty questions be insallibly resolved it seems to me impossible that any man should have any infallible knowledge of the Church of Romes Infallibility And I am the more confirmed in the necessity of a plain resolution to this last querie because though M. Knot be sometimes hot and positive in grounding all Christian Religion upon the infallibility of the Church I find beside what I said p. 22. Christ and the Apostles intimating the contrary Joh. v. 39. Act. iv 19. xviii 11. 2. Thess v. 21. 1. Joh. iv 1. Rev. ii 2. But to passe by such places of Scripture because I know that they who make profession of devising shifts will find euasions for them and to omit the positions of many Romane Doctours of lesse note who are as high for the non-necessity of an infallible guide as any Protestant can wish I shall onely hint at Lactantius his large Chapter to this purpose lib. 2. de orig error c. 7. beginning thus Quare oportet in ea re in qua vitae ratio versatur sibi quemque confidere suóque judicio ac propriis sensibus niti ad investigandam perpendendam veritatem quàm credentem alienis erroribus decipi tanquam ipsum rationis expertem Dedit omnibus Deus pro virili portione sapientiam c. and rather insist upon a couple of most eminent Cardinals Baronius and Lugo Both these give their opinions very plainly on our side and which I value more their reasons and examples The former hath spent to our purpose a whole Appendix which he prefixed before the second tome of his Annals printed at Rome MDLXXXVIII where appealing to every particular Protestant's judgement concerning the truth of his cause and not once mentioning the infallibility of the Church he goes on thus Ingens sanè vis humanae insidet rationi c. Great is the power of humane reason if it be left unsettered and free in all things And therefore our Ancestors placing great confidence in the force of truth where they contended with obstinate hereticks when they declined and despised all judgement of the Church were so indulgent as not to refuse to try the judgement even of Infidels and expect their determination Such men being Judges the Jews Joseph Antiq. l. 13. c. 6. had the victory over the Samaritans And an heathen Philosopher being by consent chosen for an Arbitrator to whose judgement they were to stand Origen dialog overcame five most wicked hereticks And Archelaus Epiphan haeres 66. a Bishop in Mesopotamia did consute Manes a most desperate Arch-heretick before certain Heathens who were by consent chosen Judges c. The latter though a Jesuite a Spaniard plainly asserteth this non-necessity tom de virtut fidei dis 1. § 12. n. 247. c. And making it good by foure instances 1. THE BELIEF OF THE INFALLIBILITY IT SELF which must be received from some other motive than it self or its own testimony and consequently saith he all other doctrines of Christianity may be believed upon the same inducements not meerly upon the infallibility of the Church 2. CHILDREN or OLD PEOPLE who are newly converted to the faith do not believe the Infallibilitie before they embrace other Articles for they believe Articles in order as they are propounded this is commonly one of the last 3. RUSTICKS AND COMMON PEOPLE at this day in Spain Italy and other Catholick Countreys who commonly resolve their faith no further than their Parish-Priest or some other learned or holy man at the most 4. He asserteth num 252. That IN THE LAVV OF NATURE most believed onely upon the Authority of their Parents without any Church-propounding And also after the law was written most believed Moses the Prophets before their prophecies were received and propounded by the Church for the sanctity of their lives c. And this discourse wa● written by speciall order from the late Pope Urban and dedicated to the present Pope Innocent X. And now my patient Reader to draw to a conclusion as my spare-leaves do for I have unawares detained thee very much longer then I intended when I first set pen to paper for this Preface which was after the following English Apologie was fully printed and that is one reason of its immethodicalness If I have writ any thing impertinent I hope that my brother THE UNIVERSITY-MAN Mr. Knots friend will help to excuse me if any thing that savoureth of passion which I shall be very sorry for as soon as it shall be discovered to me that Mr. Knot will be my Advocate each of them being commonly conceived sufficiently guilty of one or both of these faults and hereafter I may do as much for them And further to encourage M r K. to do somewhat for me I do here assure him That if he shall vouchsase punctually to answer these xx questions which seem to me very necessary to be plainly determined before he can assure any man of the Infallibility of the Romane Church on which foundation he layeth so huge a structure and withall to refute that one argument which I mentioned pag. 18. out of Dr. Jer. Taylors nervous discourse then prove that the Church of Rome is infallible by any one infallible argument for he hath told us that nothing lesse can do it I will be his Proselyte Vntill which time 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 unlesse which I think far the more probable and therefore shall daily pray for it Mr. Knot will be so ingenuous as S. Augustine was to retract his errours in his later dayes and come over to the good Old Catholick Apostolick Faith leaving Romane superstructures For I begin to despair with that Milevitan Bishop of ever seeing while I am upon earth any infallible living Judge in matters of saith and to believe I must as the Jews speak expect the coming of Elias for that purpose having long observed by Mr. Knot 's seven books in this Controversie that Cause patrocinio non bona pejor erit To the Preface p. 8. l. 29. adde That there were Christians in Britain before Augustine the Monk came over is plain out of Eusebius Theodoret Arnobius Tertullian Gildas Bromton and I suppose no man that is not a meer stranger to Antiquity will deny That those Christians had no dependance upon Rome will appear to any who readeth the ancient Histories of Rome or England Platina saith that Antherus the 20 th Pope sate eleven years and made onely one Bishop In a word from the death of S t Peter till the entrance of